Plumbing the Death Star - Is Harry Potter a Good Wizard? (Feat. Sophie Kneebone)

Episode Date: June 5, 2016

In which our heroes get attacked by the dark lord, have our mum jump in the way, and survive with only a scar as we ask is Harry Potter a bad wizard? We throw Harry Potter in a canal, wonder how useful troll knowledge actually is, and try to rationalise Dumbledore’s reasoning. Jackson wonders why everyone is super open about horcruxes, Zammit argues that Harry's only power is being present, and Sophie just loves Harry Potter and doesn't want to lose. So attend Hogwarts, go to your classes, and see how different things would be without the Boy Who Lived. The only rules are there are no rules.Want to help us separate our soul a bunch? Head to http://www.patreon.com/sanspantsradio and for as little as $1 a month, we can put our soul parts in gems and cups.And don’t forget to purchase your copy of Plumbing the Death Star Vol. 1 right now available at https://audiobooksontape.com/shop/plumbing-death-star-bonus/ and vote for us in the Podcast Awards here http://www.podcastawards.com! Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

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where we ask the important questions, like, is Harry Potter a good wizard? No, I don't think he is. You can't just jump right in with a no. No, end of episode. Move on. And now for the world's shortest podcast. See you later, guys.

I don't think he's that a good wizard, because I don't even think he's that good of a leader because all really he does is he's there and he gets his mates to sort of do it, but he doesn't convince his mates to do it. He's the kind of guy who's like, you know, he calls you up, he's like, hey, look, so I had to get into the city, so I drove in the city and I parked in the underground car park and I don't have any money to get into the city, so I drove into the city and I parked in the underground car park and I don't have any money to get out. So if you want to come and pick me up, that'd be great. And maybe pay for the underground parking as well so I can leave.

Okay, all right. I enjoy that analogy, but I'm going to add a level of, hey, look, I drove into the city to save your grandma who was being murdered by an evil person and I saved her life and also all of humanity but now i'm trapped in the car but but that's over and it turns out i left my wallet yeah i feel like i feel like like doing the good of saving someone's grandma is enough to negate not having enough spare change for okay okay i guess what we've got to do is we've got to take every... Is it episode? No.

Book in Harry Potter, and we have to... What would happen were Harry not there? Great, yeah, yeah. Okay? Well, they'd just be called the Philosopher's Stone and the Chamber of Secrets. The Children of Hogwarts and the Philosopher's Stone. The People at Hogwarts and the Chamber of Secrets. The People and the Philosopher's Stone.

Some wizards and the Philosopher's Stone. So. Other people and the Philosopher's Stone. Some wizards and the Philosopher's Stone. So, okay, in the Philosopher's Stone, Harry Potter finds out that there's a Philosopher's Stone. Quirrell has Voldemort on the back of his head. Correct. Okay. Spoiler alert. He's had that for a long time.

I don't even know how that... Did Voldemort grow there? Or was he just there one day? He was possessing him. And the longer that Voldemort kind of feeds off someone's soul, because the last little wisp of Voldemort that he's able to enter out of people's body is one particular Horcrux, right? So essentially he was using Quirrell as a Horcrux, is my understanding.

And so he was like feeding off him and was eventually able to like take enough of a human form so that he had a face. If he carried on feeding on Quirrell, would Quirrell's face have disappeared? I guess so. Would Voldemort have? Because, you know, like in the Chamber of Secrets where Ginny's, like, pouring her poor little pubescent heart out, which is super creepy, but anyway.

I'm so unpleasant about that. It's unwholesome. Yeah. And, like, at the end, his outline is starting to become, like, more solid. I think it's like that. That's scary because that means that, imagine an alternate path the Harry Potter books take

where Voldemort never leaves Quirrell and Voldemort is just like this guy with backwards hands and feet. I was going to say, how scary. Where Quirrell hunched over like a unicorn and eating it. Is he scooping the blood into the back of his head? No, he's drinking the blood. What's going on there? So he's drinking the blood to gain immortality. No, hang on a second.

Yeah, see? It protects you from natural death. Oh, okay. I like that Voldemort in the first book is like, kind of like head, he's covering all bases. He's like, I'll grab the Philosopher's Stone. That's one. But there's also unicorns, so I'll hoe down on that. Plus I've got the Horcrux thing going. I've got a lot of options.

I've got my fingers in a lot of pies. You can never have too much immortality. Try out everything before you settle on one. Why not? So if Harry Potter wasn't in

Floss the Stone it's fine. No, no. Quirrell would have just got to the mirror and been like why can't I get it? And then Dumbledore

would have been like oh hey Quirrell oh Voldy in the back of your head. Or would Quirrell have just been eaten by Fluffy? Nah, because he got through it because he playedirrell. Oh, Voldy with a blackie head. Or would Quirrell have just been eaten by Fluffy? No, because he got through it because he played the harp.

Oh, he did. I knew that. But actually. I feel like we need to go from earlier in the book. We need to go from the start. I mean, if Harry Potter wasn't there, then Voldemort wouldn't have the whole, like, you know, I hate Harry Potter.

That's true. But let's assume. He wouldn't have been vanquished in the first place. So if we go all the way back to that night in July. And it's just a fine wizarding world. If the prophecy had been made and then there were no babies, you would have been like, oh, well, carry on with world domination. I guess never mind.

I like that. Prophecy. Everyone's like, no, we just won't get pregnant. It's fine. Got you good. All right. Well, let's say Voldemort tried to kill Harry Potter. Lily Potter?

Yeah. Seek. Jumped in front of it kill Harry Potter. Lily Potter? Yeah. See, jumped in front of it. Harry Potter, instead of getting taken by the wizards, fell in a canal or whatever and floated away. Or like the Dudleys. Baby Moses style. The Dudleys moved, right? And it's just like they just didn't bother telling Elvis.

Exactly. And so he's like, where? They're in Brazil or something. Damn, Muggle's not complaining their change of address. Exactly. And so he's like, where? They're in Brazil or something. Damn, Muggle's not complaining their change of address for the last time. You know, he's

outside the front taking down all the lambs and he knocks on the door. He's like, mmm. Like knocking on the door and like

this totally different couple over there kind of help you. He's like, what the fuck? I am so sorry. I've made a terrible mistake.

Let me check the address. Yeah, this is Privet Drive. We're going to go to you to the gym. Check again. 3, 4, 3.

Maybe we'll check the next door neighbors. But yeah, so Harry Potter's in a canal or whatever. Or Brazil. So that means that the troll in the dungeon, that's what I'm thinking of here. Because that happens and Hermione and Ron don't sort it out. In fact, Hermione and Ron probably never become friends.

Yeah, well, I mean, the troll in the dungeon is really more of a device to get the three of them to become friends and, like, put aside their differences. Which, sidebar, their main differences are, oh, that girl is so smart, we hate her. Damn frizzy-haired woman. So clever. I like that at the start of the Harry Potter,

from memory, in Philosopher's Stone, Hermione and Neville are like real good buds on the train and then she just kind of like abandons him for Ron and Harry. Poor Neville. She's always good to him though. Like she's the one that like, because she's so good at magic, she can like always do the anti-bullying. So when he gets like, someone puts like the leg anti-bullying. Yeah, that's true.

Someone puts the leg locker curse on him in like, when is it? Is it like book three? Yeah, I think so. I think it's quite early. It would be early because this would be more advanced magic for them to know. Fuck, I love Harry Potter. And he comes hopping into the common room and everyone's like, bah, never want to lose that. And Hermione immediately is like, let's undo this with my magic i loved it like in a modern school right like somebody beats the

shit out of a kid everyone's not like oh idiot everyone's like fuck there's a lot of problems with this school in harry potter everyone leg locks neville and they're like what a fucking idiot i know like what a horrible thing to do to someone like completely restrict their mobility mad i moody even though he's not mad i moody yeah turns malfoy into a ferret yeah and instead of them being like fired fired you're fired that's what is wrong with you they're just like none of that really no wonder it's pretty mad about it though she does but not mad enough yeah yeah yeah like that is probably like imagine if you like picked up a child and started throwing it around the room like that's what he's doing

i would love the idea of malfoy in like some like dark you know sort of night terror he's like what happens if i am a ferret who dreams he's a man am i a man dreaming i'm a ferret or a ferret dreaming i'm a man this whole time existential crisis like that's gonna mess you up like he's gonna wake up in a cold sweat sometimes remembering the time he was a ferret in peril well yeah you could transfigure something into a human that would be very advanced i don't know maybe it's not possible yeah how weird is that that's real scary maybe humans are too complex to turn a table into a man see what happens oh god it'd be like a half table half man i was imagining turning like a chimp into a man i

was like we'll just go one step up like a table already kind of close from what i know about transfiguration that would be easier right because they start off in first year doing I think it's matchsticks

into needles is the first thing that they do because it's like a very similar thing they're just changing some surface stuff and so like

you wouldn't be able to like it would be harder to change like and then yeah then they graduate to like from like snails into

like animals with vertebrae and stuff like that yeah they go rats into cups so if they can do rats into cups. So if they could do rats into cups, they could theoretically do cups into rats.

Whoa. Oh, no. So we could do a table man. How great to imagine you do cups into rats and there's a rat infestation. Somebody makes an anti-magic zone and it's just like cups. I was like, I don't know what the fuck that is. I like in Transfiguration,

the way it works in Terry Pratchett's books. So there's a scene where this bad witch turns a man into a frog. But because of conservation of mass, there's more man than there's frog. So there's like a frog and just this floating pink ball of the rest. God, that's good. So Quirrell just wouldn't get the Philosopher's Stone? I'm pretty sure. Because what else does Harry Potter have an effect in the Philosopher's Stone?

Well, okay, in the, he, Hermione does. Neville's going to get bullied to shit more, though. Yeah, okay, so wait. So in this scenario, we're at Hogwarts. Yeah. Like, Harry Potter still exists somewhere. In a canal. Yeah, in a canal in Brazil.

Voldemort is still, like, everything is exactly the same. Yeah, it's just Harry Potter's gone. Right, okay. Well, see, I'm struggling with this already because, like, you know when the Dursleys, like, tried to take Harry to the little shack? They found him. They found him. So, like, they'd find him.

But what if the Dursleys didn't know? Well, like, I feel like Dumbledore would find Harry. I don't know. Does he have a chip? Like, a magic chip? Like, when you chip a dog? They've got, like, some kind of magic sensor thing. I think it's in book seven maybe because when the Death Eaters

take over the Ministry of Magic, they like, oh, yeah, they use that to, is it that that they use? No, they use the underage magic tracker. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. It's the same thing. They use that to, they like mess with that. In my head I'm like they mess with the code. I'm studying programming so I'm like obviously they mess with the code. Because I'm studying programming so I'm like, obviously they mess with the code.

They hack it. Kind of. Yeah, they kind of do. So when Harry was a baby, Vernon was like, nah, you know, the sister-in-law wizard bullshit, I want none of this. They went to like an underground sort of, you know, black market wizard dealer who's like, put this collar

on Harry. Put this collar on Harry and no one know where he is. Alternative. No wizards are going to bug you. That requires you to be a better wizard than Dumbledore, which nobody is. What about invasive surgery to make him a squid? Okay, I'm on board.

Invasive surgery to make little Harry a squid. Like they just cut out his magic part. Yeah, they just pop him open. A couple of ice picks. Open up his ribs like a door, and then they pull out the magic liver or whatever's in wizard. It's like the appendix or something. Yeah, exactly.

Turns out that's what it does. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Just lobotomize him. Michael's always like, what is this for? Bizarre. Wizard's like, that's where it all is. All right, great. It's all right.

Fine. Let's assume that all of these imperfections aside, just want everyone to know that I'm not completely on board with this I just picked an EO they just popped his magic out whatever necessary or he just popped out a squib just like a quirk of genetics

and Harry's a squib instead they'd still let him in but he wouldn't do any magic he'd just get a job like Filch they'd be like we need somebody to, I mean, he would still be a squib and they'd still love him. How great would that be if Dumbledore comes to him and is like, you're a great whipp- oh, no. You're a squib. You're a squib, Harry.

A what? A squib. And not even a very good one. Not a thumping good one. Anyway, happy birthday. Bye. Have a nice life. Sick scar. And I'll thank you. Harry's's like i don't know what the fuck today was

but i got a cool rat snake and i'm happy with this so in the philosopher's stone dungeon what are the challenges and what does harry actually achieve because the only thing i can think that he does is he flies his broom real good and gets the keys he does the broom pretty good that's true actually like he doesn't do a whole lot like like ron and hermione do a lot um they take the brunt of they do like like ron literally gets knocked over the head and exactly harry potter just like why didn't ron jump off the horse just saying why didn't he just maybe it would have like forfeited the game or something like maybe you don't know how to play wizard chess. Look, I don't. I mean, this is McGonagall's giant chess board, so.

I fucking love that scenario where Dumbledore's like, everybody come into my office. I'm making a dungeon and I thought it would be sporting if I let all the wizards at my school, all the teachers. You each get one. The rules are there are no rules. Oh, my goodness. There are no rules. Just like a sly smile. The rules are. They're on it.

Like a wink at the super facets. McGonagall just puts a hand in his hand. He's like, god damn it. Snape's like, finally, my turn. Did he get Quirrell to make a troll? Yeah, he did a troll. Quirrell brought in a troll, but the troll had already been smashed by Quirrell when he came through first.

And so they get to a room where there's an unconscious troll, and they're like, phew, thank god Quirrell was here. Is it the same troll Quirrell had brought in? No, it's a bigger one. He just has access to trolls? Yeah, he has a special knack with trolls. That's a direct quote. What the has access to trolls? Yeah, he has a special knack with trolls. That's a direct quote. What the fuck?

Is that how Dumbledore, no, I did it so much where I call Voldemort Dumbledore. Is this how Voldemort found Quirrell? It's a syllables thing. Like through trolls? They met in a forest in Albania, so yeah, probably. So when Quirrell was out like. Just there, yeah. Frolicking with trolls.

Voldemort was like. I love the idea of Quirrell's job interview, where Dumbledore's like, do you have any special skills? And Quirrell's like, trolls. You're a troll? Fuck, I am chocked as a troll. Welcome to Quirrell's Emporium. I just honestly can't imagine a scenario where that helps.

Do you want a troll? Do you want two trolls? No, I don't. I'll send you three trolls right now and I'll bill you later. I feel like at the end of this year

you're going to need a troll Mr. Tumbledore and he was right. He was right. He was right. I was like, man, thank God. That turned out for the best.

I like how easy it is to get a troll into Hogwarts. Yeah. Like two trolls. Yeah. Like fucking Sirius Black struggles to get in,

but they're like, ah, whatever, a massive troll? Wouldn't he get into a dungeon? I mean, a bathroom? If Quirrell has a knack with trolls and then a troll

just pops up into a bathroom, isn't Dumbledore going to be like, oh, it's troll boy Quirrell over there? Yeah, actually, wasn't there an investigation

into how the troll got in there in the first place? At the very least, Dumbledore should have been like, you know, when Quirrell comes in, troll at the dungeon!

Dumbledore should have been like, well, you've got that knack. Yeah, yeah. Do you want to go and talk? No, because he faints. He faints in there. I'd be sus. Does he fall backwards or forwards? Oh, in the movie, it's a gaffe because he falls,

I think he falls forwards and then when it pans out and you see the shot again, he's falling the other way. Ah, that's funny. Yeah, yeah. I just think if he falls backwards, that's on Voldemort's head. You know, there's an amazing part in the first book, and I don't know if you know about these, but there's this incredible bit where it's just like a couple of lines

at Christmas time. They're talking about the Christmas holidays, and Fred and George bewitch two snowballs, so they follow Quirrell around and, like, hit him in the back of the head. And so Fred and George have been, like, bewitched snowballs to pummel Voldemort in the face. How good is that? It's so good.

That's why he goes and kills one of them later. Because of the snowball. I always thought it would be real funny if you were just walking behind Quirrell. You know when you've got a mask on your face and you're kind of like... And Voldemort's tongue just poking out from behind, two bandages.

Two little tongues. And you're like, what? What the fuck? Who do you tell? No one. You take that secret to your grave. It's like the idea of Quirrell feeding tiny grapes to Voldemort in the back of his head.

There you go. Where would the grapes go? Am I getting it? It's for me, when you feel. He's trying to like, is that your mouth? I'm like biting his fingers. I don't like that because that implies that there's like two throats. Well, there is. Yeah. I don't know if Voldemort needs there's like two throats. Well, there is.

Yeah. I don't know if Voldemort needs to eat so much as he exists on like souls, I guess. Again, pouring unicorn blood down into the back of his head. So, okay. Who sorts out the floppy? They do it by playing music. So Hagrid gives Harry a flute for Christmas, like a little wooden flute thing.

And so he takes that in and plays it. But when he gets there, there's already a harp. In the movie it's playing itself, but in the book I don't think it is. Honestly, it doesn't matter. It doesn't matter who solves each kind of thing because it doesn't really matter, Harry or no. In fact, if Harry isn't there and no one goes and follows Quirrell

it still is going to lead up to Quirrell in front of the mirror yelling at him being like I don't understand how this works Dumbledore comes down and is like you're under arrest

call the wizard cops this is a citizen's arrest there are no wizard cops that's another problem I have with Harry Potter but I've expressed that before. Where are the ground level wizard police? They're the auroras. They're not.

Auroras are like detectives or bounty hunters. What about basic wizard crime? Basic petty wizard crime. I suppose maybe the magical protections against that stuff is much better than what we have. You've got wizard alarms, which are heaps better. That's scary. Yeah.

That's some Big Brother 1984 shit right there. Wizard surveillance. So I guess in Harry Potter 1, the Lost of the Stone, or Sorcerer's Stone, depending which country you're in, Harry is superfluous. He's not needed.

Yeah, he's kind of useless. He doesn't really do anything. Take Harry Potter. He kind of just sorts himself out. Eventually, like, Quirrell ain't going to work out the mirror riddle. Yeah, I think the thing to remember though is that this is the first part

in like an ongoing like thing that was foretold by fate you know we can chalk that up to useless though yeah

just give it you give it to us we're ticking it fine ticking that box bam alright alright

chamber of secrets six more to go you can lose one that's fine. Yeah, yeah, it's fine. No one cares about the first one. What happened? It's a freebie, it's a freebie.

Yeah, yeah, exactly. Chamber of Secrets. Chamber of Secrets. Alright, alright. So, okay, Hermione figures it out. Yep. She figures out that it's a basilisk. Yep.

The only thing I can think that Harry does is that he pulls the note from her hand. Ron doesn't think to. Ron's just like, oh, that's sad. Bloody hell. And Hermione's, I wish I would play. What's a shame?

It's me, Ron Weasley. Bloody hell, Harry. I don't like spiders. I don't like them. I don't like them. I can't handle it. Okay, the thing in Chamber of Secrets is that Voldemort

is specifically after Harry this time. That's true. He's not after a thing. He's actually after Harry. So Harry kind of needs to be there for the impetus for Voldemort to do that. Is it after Harry? Isn't it just Malfoy, senior, being a dick?

He wants him, but once he finds out from Ginny that Harry Potter is at the school, then he's like, bring me Harry Potter. All of his actions are guided by wanting to lure Harry down there. So what would happen if Ginny was just sort of like, no, it's pretty cash at the school. Yeah, what would happen if someone else had got it? I mean, the thing is that Lucius Malfoy passes the diary to Ginny purposefully, I guess, to get to Harry, maybe?

Lucius's actions there seem like spur of the moment. Like he had the diary. He's like, oh my God, I can. Yeah, it's true. Because he's more like trying to get rid of it because he gets in trouble for it later. He gets in trouble for it later. So he's just trying to get rid of it and he hates the Weasleys.

So he's trying to make them look bad. Not fair. Everyone hates the Weasleys. They're gross. They're poor. There's a lot of them. There's too many. Are they Catholic?

Is there no wizard contraception? Come on, guys. Christ. That is a really good question. Why did no one get pregnant at Catholic? There's too many of them. Is there no wizard contraception? Come on, guys. Christ. That is a really good question. Why did no one get pregnant at Hogwarts? I mean, maybe they did. We just didn't hear about it. I feel like...

Hogwarts uncut. Just a little bit of a Cuccio fetus. I mean, there's definitely... I imagine you just could sort it out, though. There's definitely some hanky-panky going on at the Yule Ball in the bushes. Oh, my God. Yule Ball is like a fuckfest. Yeah.

Everybody's giving it to everyone. I'm pretty sure Snape has ruined some, you know, just like, just drink this concoction. Oh, God. Some wizard plan. The plan, baby be gone. This is fine. But I'm sure with William.

Madame Pomfrey, she's very discreet. That's what the mandrakes, the screaming things are. Ah! Yeah, that's what they're for. Eat mandrake, no babies. So with the Chamber of Secrets, because with Tom just Tom Riddle. How does Tom Riddle know about Harry Potter? Because Ginny's like

yo, there's a Harry Potter on here. Because Ginny loves Harry Potter. She's going to be crushing him. That's fine. Because he's still Voldemort. No, but didn't Voldemort write that diary when he wasn't Voldemort? Yeah, but it's a horcrux, so it's still a bit of Voldemort. It's a blank diary. It's not like Voldemort was like, Dear diary,

tomorrow I'm going to split my soul into seven pieces. But when he splits his soul into seven pieces, he's a list. But he split his soul before he met Harry Potter. No, but they're all him.

I understand this, but then how does Horcrux's work when you split your soul? Are you still telepathically linked to your other bits? I imagine so, yeah. I think you're still fundamentally like the one. It's pretty much quantum physics, basically,

like two things being able to exist in the same place at different places at the same time. That's like a very detailed explanation of quantum physics. Fair enough. All can see. Okay, so if Harry Potter's not there, maybe. Because Voldemort still doesn't like Hogwarts. Voldemort's still like, no, fuck this shit up. No, actually, Voldemort is like,

Hogwarts is the only place I ever felt at home. That's why he wants a job there so badly. He comes back there. Yeah, it's really sad. I mean, we should all feel really sorry for him. We should. There's such interesting parallels drawn between Voldemort and Harry. Their early childhood was actually quite similar.

You know, both orphans and both lost. But Harry Potter was not like both killed cats and dissected them. Because it's all the choices that you make. Because in the first book, the sorting hat is like go to Slytherin. Harry's like, no, I don't want to be evil. And that sets him on the path for his whole life. So Harry would be like, yeah, I'll be evil. Yeah, that's what it is.

I'll give it a go. It's the intersection between fate and control. But isn't Voldemort like killing cats when he thinks he's still a muggle? I'm pretty sure he's killing cats. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. He's fucked from the beginning. But it's all choices. He decides to kill a cat.

Yeah, he figures out as a kid that he has these powers and he's like, I'm going to use these to mess with people. Whereas poor Harry's like, I just want to get away from the bullies. Imagine a flip of that where Harry's like, I'll kill the dursleys. Yeah. That'll do.

I'll free this snake. That's the thing is that Harry was in, I'll kill the Dursleys. Yeah. That'll do. I'll free the snake. That's the thing is that Harry was in these circumstances. He's being abused, basically. He lives in a cupboard under the stairs. He could have easily been like, these people deserve to die. I think I can make that happen. But he wasn't. At no point did he choose to do that.

That is the key difference. He just hassles that grape. Love Harry Potter. He just hassles that grape a little bit. And he's too much of a goody two-shoes. And he's like, oh, I can't use magic or I'll get in trouble. What the hell is wrong with Dumbledore? Not a rebel.

He's like, this child is kept in the worst state, but no, this is fine. Yeah, I know, right? Like, whatever, this'll do. Character building. It's all part of my plan. My father hit me, and I turned out fine. In my day, I didn't even have a cupboard

Dumbledore your day was like the 1890s Like yeah it was a different time Move on But he still had a thing for As in Voldemort still did not like Dumbledore But even with Harry Potter So without Harry Potter He's still going to be like

No no Let's unleash the basilisk And let's just ruin Hogwarts Because the basilisk is there to try and Like the basilisk Was put there by Slytherin Himself Slytherin

Slytherin What a champ God that's so hard to say Slytherin Slytherin Slytherin To get rid of Pure blood

And so you need a parcel tongue To be able to tell the basilisk Kill the non-pure blood So that's a good point That's a negative point Against us Jay-Z Because nobody

But Harry Speaks parcel tongue So even if they got down there It'd just be Ron In front of the snake door that's a negative point against us, Jay-Z, because nobody but Harry speaks Parseltongue. Yes. So even if they got down there, it'd just be Ron in front of the snake door being like... They wouldn't even be able to get down there because you have to speak Parseltongue to get down there. Yeah, that's a good point. You have to say open in Parseltongue to the tap.

I do like in that when they're realising it's a basilisk and all that kind of stuff, and the teachers are like, oh, nah, the fraud can take it. It's fine. They were sending him to his death. They were going to let him die. Yeah, super convenient.

It's like this buys us a bit of time, also gets rid of this dickhead. At that moment, they know Lockhart's a fraud. But they're all just like, oh, here you go. It's like, why? I love Lockhart. I love that he's like, here's an exploit in my bullshit wizard world. I'm going to use it. That's pretty good.

He's the hero we deserve. So without Harry Potter. I think the basilisk. Nobody else speaks basilisk. So even if they're like, we can stop the basilisk, they can't go down there and they're not going to get the sword. Well, the sword isn't. Yeah, only a true Gryffindor can pull this sword.

Neville could have, I guess. Neville does in book seven. Neville could have slaughtered that basilisk good. Well well because the prophecy could have referred to neville that's the thing it's all choices so like the prophecy could have easily referred to neville but voldemort chose to go after harry because no not because interestingly um lily was muggle born so really felt like neville's the pure blood one so voldemort should have been like, ah, yes, this is the true wizard, but for some reason he chose Harry. Interesting.

Funny, because I feel like Neville, early on, was such a wuss that he would have just faltered. Yeah, exactly. Like, lucky, kind of, that he went for Harry. Or the books would be like, Neville hides here. But Neville could, like, Mr. Magoo his way to kill a basilisk.

But how's he going to learn? If Neville had gotten the Gryffindor sword and closed his eyes in a squawk, which is a look me in the eyes and tell me that isn't a Neville move. I mean, that's pretty much what Harry does. Yeah, it kind of is. I was like, oh, my God. But tell me that's not a Neville move.

Yeah, but Neville's not going to run in the door. The other thing is that Harry wouldn't have been able to kill the basilisk without forks because forks comes down the phoenix and pecks out the basilisk's eyes so then Harry can open his eyes. And so Dumbledore says something that's like, only someone who is truly loyal to me could have called Forks to you or something like that.

Would Dumbledore have sorted out the basilisk eventually? It would have killed a lot more students. No, he's not a Parseltongue. He couldn't have got down there. Yeah, it would have fucked up Hogwarts. You don't need Parseltongue. Yes, you do. You just need to catch the basilisk. No, you need to be down tongue. He couldn't have got down there. Yeah, it would have fucked up Hogwarts. You don't need parcel tongue. Yes, you do. You just need to catch the basilisk.

The basilisk chops off into the Hogwarts proper. You can just stab him as he comes out of the metal. Harry can hear the basilisk through the walls, so he can track where it is. He can chase it. No one else can. I mean, like, if Hogwarts was like, we're going to go, okay, get all the students out.

Get in, like, the equivalent of magic exterminate. Yeah. Okay, we lay down traps. We catch the basilisk. Dumbledore has the sword. But you're forgetting about fear. Oh, man, that's a cool film. People would be too afraid.

Yeah. People wouldn't do it. Think about this. You've got your band at Hogwarts. It's basically like an aliens film. Oh, yeah. So you've got these high-level wizards, all with protective gear,

so you can't take out the basilisk. And, of course, every time someone's left alone, they just turn to stone. That would be a good movie. That's pretty cool. I'm calling that i get chamber of secrets i reckon you know like even if domedore sorted it out so many kids are dead like so many kids are dead that he's probably like i can't open hogwarts for another year because i'm on the land one of my favorite things about chamber of secrets is how many many creative ways JK Rowling came up with

for someone to not look at the same size directly. Like there's like a puddle of water. Looking through a ghost. Looking through a camera. Looking through a mirror. Looking through a ghost just works. You'd think just in probability. The bass look, she got one.

Yeah, exactly. Or at least Aisha got more. It was a shit bass look. She got Moaning Myrtle like years and years beforehand. But yeah. I like the way that snake snuck up on Moaning. And knocked on her door. That's fun.

Because she's like, there was a knock and then it opened. And you're like, the big snake. I don't know if he knocked. I think she just hears a noise and goes out there. Just sizzle tail. Or did Moaning Myrtle just not hear the like, of the big chamber opening? She was so distraught. It's fine.

What does a basilisk eat? Rats. Yeah, rats. But it got so big. But it's roosters. The call of the rooster is fatal to it. That's why all the roosters die. So it's eating roosters.

The roosters? Are there roosters at Hogwarts? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Hagrid has chickens and like he mentions at some point in Chamber of Secrets, ah, bloody foxes are getting the roosters. At Hogwarts? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Hagrid has chickens and he mentions at some point in Chamber of Secrets, bloody foxes are getting my roosters or something like that, but it's actually Ginny Weasley. She's slaughtering roosters? Yeah, yeah, he makes her.

Fuck. Yeah. That's fucked up. It's really fucked. She's like 11 years old. She really just slaughters roosters? Yeah, yeah, yeah. The basilisk comes out and like.

How does she slaughter them? She does it. With like a knife? Because the basilisk can't because the call of it is fatal to it. Yeah, yeah. I don't know if they don't go into all the detail, but she does it. I like that Hagrid looks at her and he's like, these roosters with their heads clearly cut off.

Foxes. I think he just doesn't want to admit it. So many foxes. Also, like even with... Why foxes? You're living next to a magical forest. Yeah, yeah. It could be anything.

Centaurs are hunting again. No, foxeses i don't know if he actually says foxes to be honest mate i think he's just like something's killing my roosters that makes more sense but even with harry there like even if we take chamber of secrets with harry there uh the sword is given to him by hogwarts yeah so he's just kind of a vessel yeah forks pokes out its eyes yeah he stab He stabs the book, I guess. Like, I'm giving you Chamber of Secrets, but, like, Harry Potter in it, he's helped a lot.

Yeah, he's helped a lot, but ultimately he's the one that does everything. Like, the defining quality of a Gryffindor is bravery, and so he's brave enough to be like, everything's fucked, I'm going to keep going. That is true. So I guess his wizarding power for Chamber of Secrets is that he's there?

Yeah. There and brave, but it's still my point. Yeah. Fine. Prisoner of Azkaban. Prisoner of Azkaban. Alright, this one hinges on Harry because Sirius Black would not be trying to get into Hogwarts if it wasn't for number one, trying to get Harry, but also

trying to get Scabbers to stop Scabbers aka Peter Kripetigrew from getting to Harry. So we take Harry away. So Harry is in Brazil or being lobotomized or a squib or whatever. In a canal down the river. We've got to just change Sirius' motivation. So his motivation now is to get Scabbers. Because he'd still need to go in.

Because that's what he wants is now. So that's the sort of story we have to kind of take some liberties here. It's not hard to go in and just stab a rat. So it's not hard to go in and just stab a rat But Peter Pettigrew wouldn't be living as a rat If it wasn't for Voldemort trying to kill Harry Because what happened was Voldemort tried to kill Harry Sirius knew that Peter Pettigrew had been the secret keeper So he went after him and then Peter Pettigrew was like

Bah, you killed Lily and James Bam, blows up the street, blows up himself But you could still assume Voldemort killed Lily and James after him and then Peter Pettigrew was like ah you killed Lillian James bam blows up the street blows up the cell you know Lillian James it's just that Harry ended up in a canal so like that's awesome

but like Harry still had to exist for that to happen yeah yeah yeah that'll happen it's just before book one like literally a week

before he got picked up down the canal just down the canal maybe he drowned he's decided to go to Durmstrang instead but no one knows no one noticed exactly he's fine he's decided to go to Durmstrang instead, but no one knows. No one knows.

Exactly. He's fine. He's under an assumed name. Yeah, yeah. So that all happened. That's fine. So now Sirius is like, where's Harry Potter? But it's not hard to kill a rat. That's something that I think about Peter Pettigrew all the time.

Is he a rat? Worry. To be honest, without Harry there, they would have succeeded. They would have killed the rat. But no one knows. Sirius Black is the only one that knows. Yeah, Sirius is,. They would have killed the rat. But no one knows. Sirius Black is the only one that knows. Yeah, Sirius is, and so is Lupin. Lupin's like, that is, then Snape comes and fucks everything up because of Harry.

Well, Lupin only knows about it because of the Marauders. No, no, no. Lupin only knows about it because of the Marauders map, which he gets because of Harry because he confiscates it off Harry. So Lupin this whole time has thought Peter Pettigrew was dead. But the Marauders map is held by the Fred and George. The Fred and George, yeah, and they give it off Harry. So Lupin this whole time has thought Peter Pettigrew was dead. But the Marauder's Map is held by the Fred and George. The Fred and George, yeah, and they give it to Harry, and that's how it enters into the story.

So it wouldn't be outside their own possibility for another teacher, i.e. Lupin, to grab it off Fred and George. Potentially, but the stakes wouldn't have been as high. Correct. Like the Marauder's Map was significant because Sirius was trying to get in, and so Lupin is like, I can't believe we'd have this object that's so necessary for these investigations. God, you idiot!

I think they just lost that map, I guess. Like they had it as kids and then they were like, what did you do with the map? Fred and George have it now. Yeah, I know, right? How did they get it? They got it from Filch's office. Filch had confiscated it at some point and then he hadn't been able to figure it out. They explain this when they give it? They got it from Filch's office. Filch had confiscated it at some point,

and then he hadn't been able to figure it out. They explain this when they give it to Harry, which I guess is in book three. I know, poor little squibby Filch. He gets it right. Nothing's good for Filch. The thing I love about Filch is how much he loves his cat. He can't be all bad if you love an animal that much.

I think Filch is just bitter because the Wizarding World shits on squibs. He's like, I can still learn potions or fly a broom. They're like, clean the castle. Yeah, yeah, it's so true. You're talking like Hermione being like, rights for Dobby, rights for squibs. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, that's an ongoing theme in all the Harry Potter books

is that like every living creature deserves basic respect, right? Except for squibs. Except for squibs. But like this is the thing is that Filch is bitter and awful because he's treated so badly. And so people become what's expected of them a lot of the time. I love with Spew when Hermione's like, yeah, we're going to do that. At the end of that book, she just kind of forgets about it.

She gives up. She goes back to it later on. Well, she talks about it in book seven. No, book six because they're not at school in book seven. Is it book five or book six where they're talking about their career options? I don't remember. No, it's book four, actually. Okay, so she brings up spew again.

Well, that's when she creates. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. She gets distracted, I guess. Maybe it's book five when they're picking their seventh year subjects or something because she says something like, she brings it back. It's like a long time later and she's like, I don't know, I just really like to do something further with spew,

like when they're talking about their career options. House elves do like it, though. though well you mean being house elves what you mean being yeah yeah yeah they love it like they enjoy it like come on he's not like is it what do we need a spew well hermione's um i don't know that they one of my favorite parts in book four is when sirius is living in the cave and they go and talk to him and they have this really good conversation about like um Ron's like god Sirius check out all these dumb spew stuff that Logan's doing and Sirius is like now hang on a second there's some actually actually some weight to this come down Ron you idiot what's going on yeah yeah yeah because he's

like I don't know he just said something cool about like um you know what does he say it's something about how like that thing of everyone people become what you kind of what expectations you put on them so everybody told the house elves that they were terrible and so they were like yeah i guess we want that yeah yeah it's also like it's also like you have to treat every living creature with respect like you even if even if a house house place place like only wish in life is to serve humans, that's fine. But you don't get to treat the house elf like shit because of that. I think that's the point. I like that I'm only trying to stop the Hogwarts house elves.

But they're treated quite well comparatively. But I guess you've seen Dobby and Meachums? Screechums? Moochie? What's the one that is an alcoholic? Meachums? Winky. Winky, that's the one that is an alcoholic? Mechums? Winky. Winky, that's the one.

I always assumed there was some kind of terrible wizard elf war and the house elves are like the losers of that war. Because they're so powerful that I'm like, what happened? At what point did the wizards win that war where the house elves were like, servitude is fine.

So I think in Prisoner of Azkaban, like Harry makes it worse. He kind of does. Oh, I think that's a pretty big call. Because if Sirius and Lupin had gotten together and just killed Peter Pettigrew. No, no, come on. We're forgetting about one of the most important moments in all the Harry Potter books, which is the moment where Harry thinks

that it's his father who has cast the Patronus to save them, but then realises it was actually him and jumps out to do it himself. And that's what saves Lupin and Hermione and everyone from the Dementors. Yeah. Shit. Yeah, without Harry Potter. So, okay, first off, without those two dickheads, I'm sorry, Harry Potter, you would have had, yeah,

Pettigrew would have gotten killed, which means Voldemort wouldn't come back in the next book because he needed the Bloodthirsterven. Yeah. So, yeah, Pettigrew would have gotten killed, which means Voldemort wouldn't come back in the next book because he needed the Bloodthirster. Yeah. So, yeah. But also, Huckbeak dies and that's well said. Also, Harry saves Pettigrew's life, which saves Harry's life later on in Book 7.

That's true. Because of all that courage and valour. But without him saving his life, he would never have gotten to where he was. I feel like Voldemort's a pretty canny guy. He would have found a way. At least maybe a couple more years, though. Giving him some time.

He's a wily. Voldemort's wily. He's slimy. He's sneaky. He's a slippery eel. Sometimes on the back of guys' heads, it's fine. But if Pettigrew had... I guess he has more servants, though.

So he could probably still figure out a way back. And better that he comes back to life earlier with a servant that is fundamentally in the debt of Harry Potter, which ends up saving everyone, than for him to come back a couple of years later with a servant that's fully able to serve him and help him stay in power. I still think without Harry Potter there.

Even with Harry Potter there, what does Harry do? Is it just that he's there again? He's just there again. And he stops. The question we're asking is, is Harry a good wizard? Sure, he's the chosen one. Magically or good as in good intentions? Like a good wizard.

Like a technically good wizard? Yeah, like he's got good spells. Well, yeah, I mean, he does a huge Patronus. Yeah, he's got technically good wizard yeah like he's got good spells well yeah i mean he does a huge patronus yeah he's good at like he gets rid of like a hundred dementors that's very advanced it's like he's clever in one area he's like got like one it's like one guy who's like i just am amazing at like biology everything else whatever but that's my talent it's like we're all with the trolls yeah exactly like look Harry I'd love to hire you

we just don't get that many dimensions around here it's actually not really much because they work for us but it's a stag so much symbolism that's great that it's symbolic like sweet, but on a practical level, Harry, she's not really a functional skill.

I mean, how are you with, like, transfiguration? Like, that's useful. Yeah, like if you got one into a cup, that'd be really useful. So I think without Harry there, I would argue that it would be a lot better. But with him there, what does he kind of do? Again, it's because of Hermione that they get the time turner. It's Dumbledore who decides the plan.

Harry flies Buckbeak. Hermione and Ron can't fly Buckbeak. That's true. He's got an affinity with Buckbeak. That's an essential part. That's an essential part. But also his flying skills in general. It's much harder than broomstick.

You're right, he's a talented broomer. Yeah, exactly. That's a good point. That's an essential part. But also his flying skills in general. Like it's much harder than Brimstick. You're right. He's a talented broomer. Yeah, exactly. That's a good point. Okay, no fair. So they wouldn't have been able to save Sirius Black without Harry. It's a kind of win-win for both. Because without Harry there, things work out well, but... But they work out better with him.

Should we call this one a draw? All right. I think we'll call this one a draw. Hey, we're neck and neck. Yeah, I know. It's exciting. All right. Book four.

Book four. Without Harry there, everything goes off without a hitch. Because Harry Potter shouldn't have at all been in the Triwizard Tournament. So he just lost a lot of problems. I mean, it would be a shit story. It would be pretty boring. Honestly, it would have just been a great episode of Friday Night Lights, but it's all about wizards.

Exactly. Wizards. Wizards. Wizarding. Wizarding. Would Dumbledore have still turned it into a portkey? Probably not. You mean Voldemort?

How does that happen? Right? I just assume Dumbledore's an evil person at heart. I don't know why I do, but I do. He had like, I love Dumbledore because he had that time in his teenage years where he was all like, the greater good. And like he could have turned, like he could have turned into evil. Like how even in his teenage years he was still an old man.

Dumbledore, the greater good. Radical. Dumbledore, you're 15. I know. Too cool. It's cool because like Grindelwald is like The evil version of Dumbledore Right

Because they were both Kind of equally matched And then he turned And Dumbledore Chose the good path As someone So I have this problem With the wizards

Where I'm like Why didn't they stop the holocaust Okay Whenever I ask this question People are like Oh they were too busy With Grindelwald Is Grindelwald

As somebody who Clearly loves Harry Potter As dearly as you do Is Grindelwald Enough of a problem That it would distract the wizards from saving the millions of Jewish people that were killed in World War II? First of all, this is assuming that the Harry Potter universe is the same human universe that we live in.

So there wasn't a World War II? Well, I don't know. I mean, like, are we assuming that, that it is our universe as well? I suppose. Go through every single book and see if there is a hit or miss. Has anybody referenced Adolf Hitler? Well, the wizards don't even fucking know about Adolf Hitler. That's a problem with wizards.

I think it's pretty safe to assume that it is because, you know, there's lots of like muggle references and they're all the same as what we have now. So, I mean, I don't know. Like if they had, then we wouldn't know about it because you muggles don't know about the wizarding then we wouldn't know about it because you muggles don't know about the wizarding world

I think the wizards just were like well maybe maybe you know what that sounds like the wizards did what they could

and like maybe the death toll would have been higher true maybe there was also evil wizards but that's like saying like right now right

there are so many fucked things going on in the human world and why aren't we all flying off to other countries and solving this problem? Like, surely one wizard against the Nazis could have gone in and been like, What about the world's most wealthy people?

Why aren't they giving all of their money to starving countries? That's true. I was going to argue, why aren't we helping out chimp problems? But it's not quite the same. What? Because wizards and humans are kind of a different species. In a way. I mean, yeah, fair.

It's a completely different thing. Yeah. So it'd be like us helping out like chimp wars. Chimps don't give a shit. We don't give a shit. No, I mean, I guess fair. I guess fair. I don't know.

I don't know if that's the same. I just think that like one wizard, assuming there were no evil Nazi wizards. That's what I'm reckoning there was. Could sort out a concentration camp. Look, Dernstrom, we're probably just full of Nazi wizards oh wow, yeah, I didn't even think of that I forgot Dernstrang was the thing that was like a Hitler youth school I mean, actually

I'm pretty sure there's an interview with JK Rowling somewhere that kind of parallels the Hogwarts war like the war in book 7 to Nazi Germany the what's the word I'm looking at parallels the Hogwarts war, like the war in book seven, to Nazi Germany. Okay. The ideologies, I guess, behind it are the same,

of this particular kind of human, which is bizarre because we're all humans and we're all the same, but these people in particular should be crushed down and eradicated. That's what the Death Eaters were trying to do. That's true. So really the Death Eaters are like- They're Nazis. They're magic Nazis.

Yeah, between Nazis and- Correct. Yeah. So, I mean, if the question is would the Wizarding World have cared, then I think yes because they cared enough to have a war about it in the Harry Bonny books. That's true. But would they care enough about muggles?

Because I don't think wizards care much about muggles. Not a lot of wizards do. That's the whole thing. But when the wizard war is happening, they're like, hey, Prime Minister of Britain, they're coming. And the Prime Minister's like, what?, they're like, hey, Prime Minister of Britain, they're coming. And the Prime Minister's like, what? And they're like, bye. They're not like, they're coming.

Do you want to join forces and sort it out? They're just like, you have guns, we have wands. I don't know. Sort it out. Step a wand to a gun, there you go. Because, I mean, the thing with wizards and, I mean, yeah, wizards and muggles is that intellectually they're the same. They just have different tools, right?

So, like, humans have technology and, yeah, wizards and muggles is that intellectually they're the same. They just have different tools, right? So like humans have technology and like these kind of things that we've created with the resources that we have at hand and wizards have magic and so they use those tools to their disposal. So the whole point is that like humans and muggles and wizards are the same but a lot of wizards see muggles as like less. So like for example in book four when the riots happen at the Quidditch World Cup and like the death easter like, whoa, let's mess with these muggles because like less. So like for example in book four when the riots happen at the Quidditch World Cup and like the death easter like, whoa, let's

mess with these muggles because they're just, yeah, they're not real people. And the good wizards are like, what the fuck, man? Like they're people. Leave the muggles alone. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, so that's a mungo thing. And other ones like Hi-Fi are like, yeah, they're not people. Good. I think there's still a lot of

bonding that we need to do between the two great peoples of this land. Book four, I think Harry makes things worse. Yeah. A lot. I'm almost willing to concede this right away because Voldemort literally takes parts of Harry to come back in. Exactly.

And someone like Pettigrew is like, sir, can we just use like any human parts? And Voldemort's like, no, Harry. Harry is what I need. So, yeah. Cedric would be alive. That's an alive Cedric. Yeah, who cares about Cedric?

He's so boring. Oh, I do. Cho does. Dreamy ass. Cho does. Oh, Cho. She's so boring. They're all so bland.

They are. Who is Cho? What? Why are they bland? Describe Cho's personality bland. They are. Who is Cho? What? Why are they bland? Describe Cho's personality. Yeah, exactly. What does Cho even do? Like, she's a good Quidditch player, I guess.

Well, everything is from Harry's perspective, right? Yeah. So really, Cho could be very interesting. Harry just didn't notice. Yeah, it's true. Yeah, he was going through a puberty. Harry's a piece of shit. She's so pretty.

Oh, my God. Yeah, that's a good point. Yeah. Harry and Ron are so rude when they go to the yule ball in that in that oh they're awful they're the worst people they're like oh uh ron is the worst what are the names of the the twins have have something and pavadi paddle is in gryffindor and padma paddler is in raven and they're like yeah yeah yeah let's go and then they just kind of ignore them yeah they're the she's like waiting to dance and Ron's just like, no.

He's like, I want to dance with Fleur Delacour. Yeah, they're so silly. And they're so, the thing I love about it is that the whole time Hermione is reminding them that they're being idiots. Like Hermione gets huffy so many times because she's like, oh, you're so stupid. Please be nice to your dates. She's like consistently reminding them that, you know,

Hermione is so great. She is. She she's a champ she's a great character she should have been the champ yeah right hermione in the chambers exactly hermione hermione and the philosophical quandary of maybe she wouldn't have been um all right. Book six. Book six. Wait, we skipped book five. We did. Oh, yeah. What happens in book five?

Book five is when Harry's super angsty. Oh, yeah. And there's like a whole page that's just like capital letters of him yelling at the start. Harry, you are a stupid. No one understands me. I mean, to be fair, like Sirius has just died. Yeah, hey. Not Sirius.

Sirius dies at the end of these. Cedric has just died. I mean, it's just witness someone die.ius has just died. Yeah, hey. Not Sirius. Sirius dies at the end of these. Cedric has just died. I mean, it's just witness someone die. That's pretty far. It's rough for him. Does anyone give him counselling? There's no counselling at Hogwarts. You really should have.

Fucking Dumbledore. I've said this before. Dumbledore's a bad teacher slash headmaster. Yeah. Like, a student died and you're like, Voldemort is back. Yeah. And see, that says to me that Dumbledore still retains a little bit of're like, Voldemort is back. Yeah. And see, that says to me that Dumbledore still retains a little bit of like the greater good. Like that's still kind of his mentality the whole time.

Rather than just be like, let's not make it an issue. It's like, look, a student has died. Everyone, let's go meet your new counsellor. Yeah. He's talking it out. There you go. Harry, we've got one just for you. No, but it's because wizards have this room, Benny.

Like, okay, so think about Quidditch, right? Yeah. Quidditch is a sport that people will die in. Yeah. Right? It'll happen, but wizards don't. It's like when Harry falls off the broom in, like, book two or something. Yeah, and he breaks his arm.

He breaks his arm. Yeah. Everyone's not like, let's stop playing Quidditch. Oh, my God. They're like, Harry, you could have died. What? And Quidditch is still playing behind. Yeah, like, they're just willing to accept that death is probably going to happen.

Yeah, it's true. Plus, I guess wizards are more, like, they're tougher. Maybe, yeah. Like, they can fix injuries faster and things like that. So maybe those things aren't as big a deal. Yeah, so maybe they're, like, which is stupid because there are muggle-born wizards in the muggle world. They're like, no, death's a big deal. Yeah, yeah.

There's also, like, so much more scope for accidents i think with like you know like young wizards who can't control magic and that kind of stuff like they yeah yeah like hogwarts is a scary place you just gotta just nut off or get off the pot yeah yeah that's not the phrase at all get off the pot what what part of my um Okay, so book five. Book five, okay. Well, no, the DA. The DA wouldn't have happened without Harry. No, yeah, that's true.

Because it's Hermione and Ron's idea, but they're like, Harry, you need to lead it. And Harry, he leads it. He leads it well. Yeah, he does. He does a really good job. But then he also abuses power of privilege. Really? Yeah, he makes out with his student.

That's not on Harry. Ooh, interesting. Not on HP. Interesting student. Yeah, that's not on Harry. Ooh, interesting. Not on HP. Which one, Ginny or Cho? I'm more worried about how he like, oh, no, she kisses him, actually, and he just doesn't know what to do. And he accepts it. Because she's like crying at the time.

She's like, I miss my boyfriend so much. Oh, yeah, and he's like, well, okay. That's a new one for HP. This is a perfect example of where, like, there's a fucking great bit, and I think it's in book five where, yeah, it is, where Hermione and Harry are talking about Jo. And he's like, I just don't understand what she's doing. And Hermione's like, well, she really likes you,

but she's really sad because she misses Cedric. But she also feels guilty about liking you because she really loves Cedric. But he's dead, so that just makes her feel sad again. And all this anxiety and guilt and fear is all well and good. And there's like so many layers to what she's feeling. And Harry's like oh my god shit

this is so good and in mind it just does that like ugh pay attention I kind of think Harry's pretty useful for this one because I think if Harry doesn't start Dumbledore's army then what's her face just kind of like walks all over and Dumbledore's army then what's-her-face just kind of like

walks all over everyone. And Dumbledore's army is so important later. Yeah. In the last book and everything. Like it completely shapes Neville's character.

Yeah. I guess he does teach kids how to do a Patronus. Yeah. His one skill came in here. Yeah, that's true. That's true.

If only he taught them to play the broom as well. That's Harry Potter's two skills. The two things he's quite good at. Yeah. I guess you also taught them to be there. You know, Neville was there at the end.

That's true. He's like, all you have to do is just kind of be in the right place at the right time. Just rock up. Just rock up and hope for the best. Works for me. The thing I love about Harry as a protagonist is that he's so flawed like all of the characters in harry potter are flawed but all of harry's flaws come from like his best qualities so like one of his predominant traits is loyalty right but that's actually what drives him to have

that saving people thing where he's like like all logic leaves his mind he's like i must save them and he doesn't think things through and it causes him to fuck things up. That's true. Everybody's, like, skills in Harry Potter also end up fucking them good. Yeah. That's all right. Yeah. Yeah, I guess it's a two for two. Two for two. Good.

All right. Book six. Book six. Half-Blood Prince. Half-Blood Prince. Yeah. Yeah. Okay.

I don't remember Half-Blood Prince. He doesn't. Harry. So Harry gets Snape's old Potion book. Harry fucks up A lot in book six Like even I struggle with the whole Shit I can't remember the name of the

Curse. The one that is just Septum Semptra It's just like scribbled in the margin and he just like Does it and it just cuts real quick Harry no You don't just do a curtsy, right? But then I guess that's the wizard equivalent of saying a swear word when you're a kid and you don't really know what it means.

It's more like the wizard equivalent of finding a gun and just being like, does it work? Bang, bang, bang, bang, bang. Worked good. Yeah, like not understanding what it is yet. Jesus, it does. Saying a little bit about Voldemort, at least he practiced on cats first. That's true.

Harry's like, nah, straight on Malfoy. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Whoops. Although Malfoy was trying to put the Crici out his curse. That's true. Harry at that point, so he panicked. Nah, fair, nah, fair. So, you know.

I guess no cats are going to try and curse you. Yeah, nah, fair. Hey, self-defense. Yeah. What else happens in book six? Oh, God. It's one of those books that you just kind of like. Yeah, there's a lot of exposition in book six.

That's what book six is all about. Because you find out about the Horcruxes and stuff. And so there's all like Dumbledore taking Harry on the journey. So like the reader wouldn't find out about all of this backstory to Voldemort without Harry. So he's kind of essential. Would Voldemort, Dumbledore still die? Yes. But Dumbledore would have found out all anyway about the backstory.

Yeah, he would have, I guess. Yeah, but there's a lot about the, oh, my God, what's the word? The prediction, the prophecy. There's a lot about that. In our world, the prophecy is like, there's a lot about that actually well the prophecy is like and then it fell down a well yeah the prophecy is like ah two great wizards one evil the other in a canal um actually harry potter's sort of essential for book six i just realized because who's making dumbledore drink that poison otherwise oh yeah that's true he had to be there

but kind of pointless because it was already destroyed. Oh no. Oh yeah, good point. It wasn't destroyed, it was just taken. Yeah. But Dumbledore didn't know that. He didn't know it. He still would have gone to do that anyway. But instead, he would have just been like, look, look, look, ah! Because he doesn't want to drink it. But then he would have just died.

Like, Harry had to get him out of there, so he would have drunk it and then just died. Like, he wouldn't have had control of his faculties to grab the locket and get out again. That's just a dead Dumbledore. That said, I reckon Dumbledore would have at least gotten someone to come with him. He would have, yeah. He would have, what, taken Neville? Is Neville like our pseudo Harry?

Our pseudo Harry, yeah. And Neville would have done a lot. Please don't take me. Please don't make me do it. Harry has to apparate. Apparate? Apparate. make me die Harry has to apparate Apparate? Apparate I've never been able to Apparate

Apparate Yeah Neville wouldn't have been able to apparate back Oh that's true Because Harry apparates back In book six At the end there Why can't Neville?

Because he's useless? Yeah because he's no good at magic Really should have been a squid Super brave And like the loveliest guy But like Just not bad Talking about good or bad wizards Yeah He's a bad wizard, like, the loveliest guy. But, like, oof. Talking about good or bad wizards. Yeah.

Hey, what can we say? Yeah, and talking about people with, like, special skills. Herbology, bravery. Exactly. That's Neville's resume. It would have taken someone. If he took a fellow teacher or something like that. Yeah, that's interesting.

I don't know why he didn't try and brute force it, though. Like, he could have just been, like, faculty. You're coming with me. Like, if there's enough of us, surely. We don't need to just didn't try and brute force it, though. Like, he could have just been like, faculty, you're coming with me. Like, if there's enough of us, surely. We don't need to just be me and the students. Yeah, all of them. Why didn't McGonagall go? Yeah, right?

She's an amazing wizard. Literally anyone. Yeah. Well, because this is a mistake that Dumbledore makes, that he admits later that he was too secretive about it, you know, that he was all like, Harry, only you must know about the Horcruxes. And then he tells Ron and Hermione, but even in book seven where everyone's like, Harry, what is going on?

He's like, I can't tell you. Dumbledore told me not to tell anyone. And then later on it's like, you probably could have told people. Yeah, like it might have helped you out a little bit, Dumbledore. Like if instead of being like these three students which probably are going to be like, hey, we're closing out Hogwarts because Jesus, why are we trying to keep it open? But yeah, like people are flawed. Like trying to keep it open? Yeah, yeah.

But yeah, people are flawed. Dumbledore is flawed. Yeah, he makes a mistake. He's an idiot. Cool, yeah. He makes a mistake and then Harry makes the same dumb mistake. I'm talking to us. Harry's an idiot.

He should have told everyone. I don't know. You can't just have a flawed protagonist and be like, the story sucks because I'm flawed. I think that makes a really good protagonist. See, if you got Neville, Neville would have blabbed. Neville would have told everyone. Dumbledore would have been like, don't tell. Right, I won't.

As soon as he stepped out of his office, Bouldermoy! Guess what, everyone? Bouldermoy's! Horcruxes! Sorry, a what? Oh, let me explain! Voldemort's asking after Horcruxes as a child,

and everyone tells him but like if somebody comes to me and they're like had a super hypothetical well if I wanted to have Horcruxes

what would I do? What would be the human equivalent of like that kind of magic? Like some kind of internet shit

like something really fucked If I was to kill a guy how would I get away with it? Yeah Hide their body Yeah So like say I wanted to kill a guy, how would I get away with it? Yeah. Hide their body. Yeah, yeah.

So, like, say I wanted to make, like, a nuke at home. Yeah, I'm going to be more like that. What would be involved? This is just, like, for a mental exercise. Yeah, like, full off of the call. Just extra homework. Well, just to make a nuke. Uh-huh, uh-huh.

And where would I get them? At least, like, a dirty ball? Just wondering. And what are the risks? Yeah, yeah. All right. And how exactly, what are the steps to doing it? And you, like, literally write it down.

Yeah. And then when the nuke went off, you'd be like, yeah, that's on me. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm willing to cop that. Yeah, because I should have thought about it for even a second. I reckon, I think we've got to give Harry Potter books seven. I think. Yeah. without him.

Everyone rallies. Wait, who do we decide on? Did you just sneak past book six without me admitting that it was your point? No. All right, fine. I'll concede book six. I'll concede book six. Really?

Because we were going to concede. Yes. Really? Ha-ha. Too late. Shit, I take it back. Only because I wanted to talk about book seven because it's my favourite one and I know that that's a controversial opinion throughout. So book six, that's us?

Somehow? Somehow? No, I'm taking it back. I changed my mind. You shouldn't have questioned it. Damn it, damn it, damn it. Yeah, okay. No, fair.

Harry Potter's necessary for book six. Book seven, like, come on. Everyone rallies around him. He leads the entire wizarding world. What does he do in the Bible Hogwarts? Dead. He dies. He walks out prepared to die.

What if he's not there? What? Then Voldemort, like... Because, I mean, really, the whole war is happening because Voldemort wants Harry Potter. Like Harry Potter, like, Go over and check him. I don't want to touch him.

You do it. Is he dead? Chop off Harry's head, Voldemort. But it's so good. It's like the Dark Knight, you know, like, Harry, you come out here or I'm going to kill everyone in this castle. Like, it's that kind of, like, ethical dilemma, I suppose. Like, would you give your life to save a whole lot of other people?

Yeah, yeah. I guess. But without Harry Potter, like, it would have just stormed Hogwarts. But I reckon Hogwarts would have been all right. It's a lot of kids. A lot of small student death. Well, but actually, like, it's implied that Voldemort has the power to, like, fully storm Hogwarts.

But then they kind of do at the end. But they're not prepared for it. No, I reckon I just thought it through and I reckon you need Harry because it's implied, like, Voldemort gives them a timeline, right? They're like, Harry, give yourself up to me by midnight. Otherwise, I'm going to, like, murder the fuck out of everyone in this castle. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And so it's implied that he can.

No, that's just a threat. That's just a threat. I reckon he could have. I mean, it was enough for Harry to be like, yes, I'm going to die. They try. They do, but they're taken by surprise. Like, they're not organized. They're not, like, coordinated.

But how many Death Eaters are there? Like, is that all of them? He's got a bunch of Death Eaters A couple of Dementors A few Giants And a Snake And a Snake And a big old Snake

And Voldemort himself Like Voldemort himself Is like a very Very powerful weirdo What if like One of the people Who went up and got Like Neville's

Like great on him He makes a speech But if I'd been Neville And he'd been like Oh come and give me a hug I would've been like Grab the sword The hug doesn't happen

In the book I'll give you a snuggle Voldemort Clapsap grab the sword. The hug doesn't happen in the book. I'll give you a snuggle, Voldemort. Clap, clap, clap, clap. Prison chink. Prison chink. Book seven also has one of my favourite moments in the whole series, which is Molly Weasley being a total badass. That is good.

She is awesome. And being, not my daughter, you bitch. Oh, so good. I just love Voldemort. He's so happy. He does so many little moments and it's so i love i just love voldemort so he's so happy he does so many little moments and it's the best he's like he does a little like stupid laugh he's so happy when my boy gives him a cuddle he's so if i was in that school i'd be like i'm getting a snug i'm getting a snug from

voldemort i don't care how do you give up he's giving out cuddles. Can this guy be that bad if he's giving out cuddles? No. You guys are idiots. I do love, though, in the film, it's just how you destroy the U-Wand. Snap in the room. Yeah, yeah, right. Yeah, sort of. You got it. I think the U-Wand is another problem. So without Harry, who's got the Elder Wand?

Why do you always call it the U-Wand? Voldemort's wand is made of U, right? His original wand. Yeah, it is, I'm pretty sure. Okay. It's the Elder Wand. So who would have the Elder Wand if Harry wasn't there? Malfoy? Yeah, I guess so.

Malfoy would just probably escape with it. Because Malfoy has it and then Harry disarms him. And so, yeah. And so it belongs to Harry. So, yeah. I like that. It's either Crabbe or Goyle accidentally. Malfoy would have died in the Room of Requirement if it wasn't for Harry.

And so I guess the wand would have just been burned by the fire. That's pretty good. Yeah. Yeah, actually, that's great. Problem done. Kick. Sort of. Yeah.

Yeah. Fuck. Oh, man, book seven is so good. Just so many sad deaths. I still reckon Hogwarts would have been all right. No, I don't think so. I think it would have been destroyed but that's fine Because Voldemort gave them an out

Voldemort gave them the out He was like I'm going to let you guys survive if you give me Harry Potter If Harry Potter hadn't been there As that like you know I want him that badly To let everybody else leave Then maybe he would have just destroyed the castle and everybody in it He might have magic nuked it to be fair Yeah yeah yeah

It's not a bad thing Got rid of the snake Finally Magic nuked it, to be fair. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's not a bad thing. Got rid of the snake. Finally. I mean, I guess. Yeah. Plus, you still got, like, Durmstrang and Bo, but there are other wizards.

They don't have McGonagall, though, who is just the best. Yeah, that's true. They don't have McGonagall. There's a lot of good wizards that they lose, and that's a shame. Yeah. Miss Sprout, Flitwick. Yeah. But also, Gyrdek. Filch. Yeah. yeah and that's a shame yeah miss sprout flitwick but also gertie filch yeah even filch like doesn't he kind of like uh he does something doesn't he like in my head he's like fighting with a mop

maybe i'm making that up because i wanted to throw a Norris at people yeah yeah yeah like a kind of like it's like one of those fan theories that you're like well that's worth worthless but interesting kind of like the it's like one of those fan theories that you're like, well, that's worthless, but interesting. Kind of like the Marty McFly's diabetic. Have I heard that? No. He only drinks Diet Pepsi. He eats like this candy in the second one that's like a known candy of diabetic.

It's like evidence towards it, but you're like, oh. But there's a fan theory that Flitwick is actually like a spy and that he is a goblin, but he's really like a Gringotts spy because it's Warwick Davis who plays both. So they're like, he just makes himself look different because he changes his look lots over the course of the films. Well, that's because they got a different actor in the first ones, didn't they? It's always Warwick Davis. They've just made him look different.

Really? Yeah, because he has like black hair and like a bald head. Well, even if it's like the look changes entirely. So they're like, maybe it's just like a really good shape shifter. Yeah. Yeah, Goulash said it was like a totally different actor. Yeah, exactly. But then you're like, again, it's a theory.

I mean, again, this is the movie. Like in the books, there's never any mention of Philip X's appearance changing. That's true. So, okay. Oh, book seven's tough. And I know if we make it a tie, then we just tie. I think without Harry, though, I mean, to me,

it's like the Battle of Hogwarts happens, and that's fine. I reckon it still could have... Let's go back a bit then, because I reckon the Battle of Hogwarts could go either way without Harry. Yeah. Horcruxes though. Okay. We'll take some down.

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, that's true. Well, I mean, Harry doesn't actually destroy that many of the Horcruxes overall. Only for us. He destroys the book. That's true. But we already talked about the book too. And then he, what's the next one?

The ring. Well, Dumbledore does the ring. Yeah. And then he What's the next one? The Oh yeah The ring Well Dumbledore does the ring Yeah And then The like Amulet

Yeah the locket Well Ron Like they find the locket But then They lose They don't lose it They can't break it They wear it for ages

But then Ron actually Destroys the locket That's true But then they might not All be together For Harry being like, I'm going to go kill the Horcruxes. Ron might be like, I'm going home too high. Well, he does.

He does. He fucks up for a while and then he comes back again out of loyalty. That's true. I mean, and like they needed the sword, which needed to be Harry to pull the sword out. Plus, Harry himself is a Horcrux. Yeah. Also, will they get the sword because Snape was so in love with Lily that he gives the sword to Harry?

And so Snape would have been like, I don't care if it wasn't for Lily. I love this random woman, but I'll give you the rest of the kid. There you go. Malfoy's sick. They do. They need Harry. They would have had that. It's really funny to imagine he's like, all the Horcruxes destroyed,

and they're like, but Harry Potter. Voldemort, just like the end of that, everybody's dead. Voldemort just goes to like a canal. I mean, of course. Harry's the fucking seventh Horcruxes destroyed and they're like, but Harry Potter. Voldemort, just like the end of that, everybody's dead, Voldemort just goes to like a canal. I mean, of course, Harry's the fucking seventh Horcrux, or the eighth Horcrux, he's like an accidental one. So yeah, of course we need Harry, he's a Horcrux. Voldemort can't be destroyed without Harry's, like, that bit of

soul left in Harry being destroyed. So we're like, I think we lost, like 4-1-2. Yeah. But also like, the question was Is he a good wizard? Which we kind of didn't even really talk about So I'm just going to go ahead and say He's a fine guy and necessary

But there are better wizards I would definitely argue that Hermione is a much better witch than Harry is a wizard She's better at everything Again like we were saying before You just plug Hermione into Harry Potter's place she's so good Harry Potter like whatever

but Harry is much more flawed which makes him more interesting he's a better protagonist so the plot of Harry Potter couldn't have happened without Harry Potter we did it we did it guys it took us one hour and four minutes but we got there.

We got there. We got there. And on that note, I've been Joel. I've been Jackson. Gosh. Oh, I'm Sophie. Thanks for having me, guys. That's all good.

Ah, Harry Potter. Yeah, that was the best hour. That was fun. If you think this show is worth at least a dollar, why not donate to us? Own each step with Peloton. From their pop runs to walk and talks, you define what it means to be a runner. Whatever your level, embrace it. Journey starts when you say so.

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From their pop runs to walk and talks, you define what it means to be a runner. Whatever your level, embrace it. Journey starts when you say so. If you've got five minutes or 50, Peloton Tread has workouts you can work in. Or bring your classes with you for outdoor runs, walks,

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