Podcrushed - Ilana Glazer

Episode Date: January 15, 2025

Actor, writer, and standup comic Ilana Glazer (Broad City, Afterparty, Babes) sits down to face some hard-hitting questions, like this absolute banger from Penn: "why weren't you cooler?" Ilana also shares stories of her early days in the New York alt-comedy scene, and lists some of her favorite "in da clerb" videos. Follow Podcrushed on socials: Instagram TikTok XSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Lemonada Hey, this is Penn from Pod Crushed. Just a quick note before today's episode. We recorded it before the fires in California, which have had devastating consequences for so many people displaced, so many people among them were my two co-hosts, Nav and Sophie. Sophie is currently back in her home in L.A. Nava is not yet.

They are safe. We hope you are safe. our hearts go out to everybody, and we offer today's episode, which was recorded before the fires in the spirit of levity. Hope you enjoy. We were saying goodbye, and he was like, well, I'll see you around. And I said, as he was walking away, thank God. But I do think he heard it.

I was like, hopefully, folkfully. Even and Daniel were like, wow, we thought we were nerds, but you're an even bigger nerd. We are. Hopefully, hopefully. Hopefully. Hopefully, we will see you another time. Welcome to Pod Crushed. We're hosts. I'm Penn. I'm Sophie. And I'm Nava. And I think we would have been your middle school besties. Smoking weed for the first time out back behind the bleachers.

I would never. That's perfect. Welcome to Pod Crushed. That'll make more sense later. Penn, are you aware that your voice is like, I think increasingly being used by AI? Oh my God. Well, increasingly, meaning I've heard it. I've heard it once. I've heard it once.

I've heard it a few times on TikTok, like as like a narration or voiceover, sometimes on ad, sometimes on people's random videos. And then I'll be like, do I work with Penn so often that I over imagine it's him? And then I'll look at the comments on people, be like, why is Penn Badgley narrating this random video? It was, I recently cited on like a very gossipy, slanderous video. Oh, lovely. And I was like, there's, I was like deeply disturbed that they had chosen your voice for it. They sounded very much like you and a lot of people thought it was you.

No, come on. People are narrating this. No, they must know though. I mean, that's like. No, they were like comments where people thought it was you. So it's like also the AI really sounded like you. See, okay, so that's actually surprising to me. I should be having a more outwardly horrified reaction.

I'm not. I'm just containing it all as I always do. But, um, yeah. I think what I'm surprised by, though, is that, is that, you know, the media literacy of young people, especially, is usually so good. I'm surprised that there's people who believe that it's, because isn't that just, that's just a thing now. It's like, oh, you know, people's faces and voices are just being used like skin. I feel like there's been so many times when I've shown David a video, I'm like, oh my God, look at this. And then like two seconds later, I look at the comments, like, oh, never mind, it's not real.

I feel like it's getting so good It's hard to tell You do a little digging And you then realize But like There was one I saw I didn't click on it Because I was not going to

Influence my algorithm to this point But I saw a little A little You know A little icon thumbnail For One where Leo de Caprio now

Was like dancing With Leo de Caprio From the Titanic And it looked really good I'm on board with that AI. You know what I mean? You didn't want that to be in your algorithm? No, no, no, no, because then it just starts getting messy.

Isn't there like a whole, there's like a whole, is it Tom Cruise? Anyway, there's some celebrity that there's like a whole TikTok account of him just dancing. Anyway. Oh, I didn't know that. Yeah, I think it is Tom Cruise. Okay, so good to know. Penn's not super stressed about AI using his voice to narrate slander, celebrity slander. Yeah, I guess you're just going to, like, all people in the future,

just going to have to get really comfortable with things being out there like with who they are to their court they have to know like i know who i am the people around me know who i am what i would do what i would say and hopefully most other people but i mean when you start to put it that way i'm a little bit more concerned i'm like wait for this is really scared am i actually going to be held accountable for this oh yeah well we'll see we'll see where the world takes us won't we we I'm not worried for myself, though, I think, is what I'm saying. Yeah, that's good. You know who I'm not worried for as well?

Who? Tell me. Our guest today, Ilana Glazer, the actor and writer best known for co-creating Broad City. She starred as Alana Wexler. A little bit confusing, but, you know, Alana, Alana, alongside her pal and co-creator, Abby Jacobson. Ilana's got many, many other TV and film credits like The After Party, Babes, most recently, however, a sophomore stand-up special that is really impressing people making its rounds. Human Magic is out now on Hulu. It's hysterical. Alana's hysterical.

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and the legacies they're building every single day. Come be a part of the conversation. Season two drops July 29th. Listen to Legacy Talk wherever you get your podcast, or watch us on YouTube. I just before this was holding my very sick toddler. He's got the flu as well. as Domino. It's been insane. But I have, I don't know that you can really see it, but I have snot on my shoulder and in the spirit of your special and a lot of what you're talking about in parenting. It's been like, on one hand, highly stressful the last, particularly 72 hours. But then on the other, the only thing that's made it stressful are things like, you know, deadlines, jobs, capitalism, that kind of stuff. In the moment, what I'm getting to do,

is I'm getting to hold my four-year-old as he sleeps only on my chest because he kind of he has to be upright he won't really sleep right now laying down and so I was forced at a time when I otherwise would have been fretting about something else doing something else I was forced while my wife napped I was holding him and just I could do nothing but meditate and pray And it was actually a really great way to step into this space. And there's something about what you're talking about in your special now and parenting overall that I think is really is really gorgeous. I totally, the highs and lows simultaneously are like so hard to hold because we're so trained in the system that we live in to think things are one thing at a time, which nothing is. But there are so many layers that, you know, to every moment that we live, that during parenting, it's like impossible.

It's undeniable when in those heightened moments of parenting to reduce life to some narrative that we've taken part in you and I. TV and film like really makes you think that like this one thing happens and it's bad. Especially mine. I think I think especially what I've been doing has done that. I think you've been doing something a little bit. more benevolent and nuanced. I think what I've been doing is yeah but even even me I've been justifying this whole machine you know even if it's feminist and you know whatever or interesting you know in a particular way it's just um you know it's kind of just what you're saying like

about the separation of um capitalism lead stage by the way uh from like the actual humanity we live it's like the kind of it all be good even like um you know lighter military that's like more escapist. It would all be good if everybody at health care. Mm-hmm. Like if everybody in healthcare wouldn't be so,

you know, the evils wouldn't be as infidious. It would be like, oh, well, you know, everything has like light and dark to it, but the fact that like the basic needs aren't met, the fact that Americans, every American's basic need isn't met,

makes the darkness, the bottom out and feels so, so dark. And like, you're like kind of also what you're talking about, Penn is like the, analogous I've been thinking about like the scam that is putting the onus of like

the environmental catastrophe on the people to use like metal straws. Yeah. Yeah. You better use those metal straws if you want to be a good liberal person. And it's like why not those people companies? I'm showing I'm using a glass straw.

It's glass. Glass. Now it's glass. You have a glass. You have a glass. You have a glass straw if you want. You know, and it's just like, no, the possible companies should definitely stop, but at least be taxed, you know? So it's like, I don't know, but honest, I refuse to hold you accountable my friend. Hard left. We always start at 12 years old. And you are, and by the way, that is part, it's not entirely because, but the fun dynamic between us three co-hosts is that I dropped out of middle school. I didn't finish middle school because I was working. And then these two were teachers and administrators at middle schools. Hold up. Hold up. Hold up. I got to swallow that for a second. What happened with anything with high school? Did anything happen?

I went to high school for less than a month. This is very George Harrison, by the way. He dropped that at 14. Wow, you started working. That's cruelly. Okay, I just needed to process that. Okay. Go on. Sorry. But I really want to hear. We want to hear. I think because you were, you seemed to be such a student of the craft of comedy and writing and the way that you speak about your family life seems to you know it seems like they were very encouraging there was um uh uh you know you were given a camera very young by your father so i'm just oh and then there's also your brother where it seems like you guys are making a lot of stuff together so we just want like a like a snapshot of elana at 12 how how you were seeing the world how

the performing arts were beginning to influence and shape the way you saw the world and your role in it, all of that? 12. In Nava, it's so sweet that you guys worked with 12-year-olds. So thank you. All good for doing that work.

And also, Penn, you're talking about my brother, it's like so much of my childhood and my sense of comedy was organized around my brother Elliot, who was also a comedian, a writer and performer. So he was 16 at the time, and I was 12. when I was 12

and I think we were starting to be friends again while he was going through puberty he was like bye you know what I mean we had like in early childhood we were making all these sketch videos then as he was going to puberty he's like no no no get away from me and then when he was like 16 and I was like I was pretty um forward thinking for my age so I like I could hang like a 16 year old no big deal

no not not really but um but we were like starting to be friends again and i think this sense of like punk comedy was starting to take shape in the city alt comedy it was called at the time um where you know it started off in film as like mumblecore and this sense of like awkwardness with like michael fara and joan hill you know and and oh yeah shock app um interest development like that was so, I mean, she wasn't, they weren't, they weren't emerging yet at that time. But like, I just mean that they were kind of the leaders of that movement in comedy. And, uh, so there was this alt scene happening in New York City. And it was, in my mind, it was the upright citizens for upright citizens brigade TV show, strangers with candy.

Oh, yeah. And, um, and, uh, Stella was this comedy group of date. made up of David Wayne, Michael Ian Blath, and Michael Showalter. Well, that's right. They had a Comedy Central show, didn't they? Or they, for a bit, they had something. To be real, the show was not as potent as their YouTube videos, which are now, like, scrubbed from the Internet.

But there was, like, you know, making comedy on the Internet and having any alternative besides clubby stand-ups that were, like, you know, stand-up clubs that were, like, a particular thing. misogynist and racist as punchlines you know just as I'm not even saying like they were all this or all that that was just sort of the vibe like a harsher vibe and i said now and then when i was 12 years old and comedy central was like and uh building up this this like wave of comedy of UCB strangers of candy yeah and um and what did i just say well stella was happening not on comedy central at the time but having more stand-up on TV and just to know being on Long Island and knowing that's happening in the city was so exciting and buzzing inside of me. And my brother and I really had our like eyes on the city, our eyes on this all comedy theme brewing and growing, which then eventually became kind of mainstream comedy, like

awkward and, you know, women leading the, um, the, the comedy wave um so i was like starting to i guess like make videos with my friends my brother and i weren't making me sketch videos anymore we did that more as like little kids and i remember getting like a a video recorder what do you call it a camp order and um yeah filming my friends and we weren't even doing sketches as much but i was like starting to document but i was also into music at this time too i was a drummer and And I was really, it was such a great way to get, to be like obsessive and also get loss, you know, like with yourself, like, just like playing drums. I was like, as you like heard in my special, I was in jazz band, really obsessed.

And like was playing drums for hours and hours by myself and with friends. And I would say at 12, what really like picks me is I was depressed. I was really depressed when I was 12. I like, okay, I also covered this on my especially got big titty's young. I was like my body was like a woman. You know, it's not a girl, not a girl, not you're a woman. And it was, I was uncomfortable and I didn't know what to do with it. And I wasn't having fun with it.

I was like really scared of it and getting attention on Long Island. there's such a fucking aggressive energy, you know what I mean? And where I grew up, everybody's a fucking tough guy or whatever. And there was just this really aggressive energy where I just started looking to the city. Somebody at this point was like this vehicle that was like a little train car on the Long Island Railroad. I wanted to like ride into the city and never come back because I felt, I felt weird there. There's so much rich stuff there, but I want to circle back to you being a female drummer. I don't know why for some reason, because I'm not that young, but not old enough for this to have been my thinking, but I couldn't picture a female drummer growing up.

And then I had a friend, her name was Carmel Bolkin, who was a female drummer. And I couldn't then picture anything cooler than being a female drummer. But in your special, you talk about jazz band being like its own kind of birth control. And I'm just curious, is that just like a funny thing or were you genuinely like not a cool female drummer? Why weren't you cooler? No, because I'm a nerd because I'm like really a nerd. I'm very anxious. I'm very, it's almost like productivity is like the thing I can focus on. I'm less anxious now. These past few years like post-proud city having a kid. I'm like coming into my like body more in a way that I'm embarrassed to say because I'm 37 years old. You know what I mean? I wish I was one of those people who was like all up in my own like shit, you know, like younger. But. then I wouldn't have the, like, sort of comedy toolbox that I have, so whatever. I feel like Ilana on Broad City never would have existed then.

Yeah. That's right. That's right. My husband says, and it's exactly correct. It's almost like I blacked out, and Alana Wexler was my, like, subconscious, finally, just seeking pleasure and just getting pleasure. Because it's true, because the real me was, like, eating savvy and freaking out every night at like deadlines like it took so much to construct this carefree character and I wouldn't say I

I wasn't a cool drummer but I wasn't like a fuck you drummer I was like oh I want to be really good and I was like what were you playing I played drum set but I played but I mean like like what kind of of music was it was it like was that jazz or was it you know I would just like play maltavis albums I'm not joking my special like literally just to play Miles David's albums, like, from start to finish, you know, just... And you can play those drums? I was really good. I was really fantastic.

Wow. That's amazing. I'm really impressed. Infini, like, I loved orchestra percussion, like a fucking nerd. I honestly, like, I always wanted to do comedy. Since I was, like, seven or eight, I was like, I held this, like, secret in me. I'm like, I'm going to be a comedian. I remember the first time I said it out loud to my dad. I was like, I mean, I think I was like... 15 or something, you know, and like, but like from like seven years old, seven or eight years old, I knew it. But like at about 12 or 13, like music was so, it was almost like, you know, I did, I did theater in school, but it was the immediacy of the production of music. You could just get together and play. It was so, so productive and kinetic and generative, you know, so prolific. I really, I really loved that.

that and um yeah so it wasn't like uh this is like i don't know what this is and i wish i knew her name but my i took my cousin to the harry styles concert because she loves harry styles and she was pointing out this drummer to be and this this bitch is rad she's fucking playing to madison square garden and she's a mom and she's so cool and like maybe i could play what she's playing but not with that fucking attitude she was like light and just like poppy and having fun. I would be like dissociating, like making sure I was like doing a good job. Yeah. I think it's my anxiety that makes me not truly cool. But it makes you successful. Yeah. And I think I think that being true to yourself is the deepest cool and trying to be cool is like super fucking lame. So that's my,

that's my, um, my practice. That's so true. Um, I, I, I lived in New York City at my 20s and I, in my early 20s, before I got married, I lived with a few different girls who became like my best best friends. And one of them, Shearing, who's still a best friend of mine today, introduced me to Broad City while we were living together in New York City

in our early 20s. So it really was formative, I feel like. And something I've noticed across a few of your projects is I feel like you've depicted friendship so beautifully and in a way that I don't see in that many other places. And I'm wondering about your friendships. at this time in your life, like 12, 13, 14. Did you have really close intimate friends or did that happen more in adulthood?

Delicious question. They're still my best friends. Eden Reek, now Davis, Daniel V.C. and your Richelor. I mean, we were just like, get us out of here. And we were like queer and weird and artistic, L.O.L. not autistic. I don't think. While we certainly display neurodivergent, some of us,

I don't think any of us are autistic, but we were very artistic. But, no, these, I still have my best friends from that time. And damn, do we still remember that most minuscule details of being so awkward and such losers? And you know what? Actually, I take that back, not losers. Huge fucking nerds, but like always winners, honestly. I'm thinking about this, like, the dichotomy between winners and losers as we. prepare for such an extreme display of losers coming up this year, 2025?

Losers are, it's all from the inside. Like, people can be winning on the outside with money, with houses, with, you know, a girlfriend or a boyfriend or whatever, and still want more not be satisfied. And, like, losers could be billionaires who just can't get enough, can't get enough. can't get enough money can't get enough whatever you know and like that's that's the thing about these best friends my babies they're we've always been true to ourselves and we've always been like whatever like I we've always known that if we weren't cool in middle school like that's not actually what cool is everybody's like pretending and faking it and we would laugh so hard and so

much at the like weird mini society we were and we went to school We graduated with 3,000 kids, like a big old gen pop, gen ed situation out in Smithtown, Long Island. And also the women, I had those were my, like, my babies. And then I had my like now and then girlies, Kara, Andrea and Jenna, who I'm also still close with. We were not going to any attention education-wise. So it was really like our education was social and I proudly, I proudly will claim that me and my best friends always knew that being true to ourselves was the truly cool thing. However, we were like depressed, we were not even close to hooking up, L.O.L. We weren't kissing anybody. You know what I mean? The boys were gay and like fucking.

harrowing experience for them on Long Island in the 90s scary stuff and we were like, we'll get out of here. You know what I mean? And we've been friends for 30 years. Daniel, 37 years. That's amazing. I feel like

that's kind of rare to know at that time like, oh, the actually cool thing is to just be ourselves and this other thing is a mirage. And we talked to one other person so far on the podcast who said something similar. Lisa Kudrow said the same thing.

She knew at that time. But I, how did you know at that time? I just feel like that's, that's so rare. Part of it is my brother Elliot leading me and who's also gay. So like he was holding this being gay while everybody, everybody is saying the Xler and that's so gay. And like he just knew like, no, that's wrong. I'm cool. You know, his instincts and leadership.

But I think it was because we were making each other laugh. so hard that it's like if other people are not saying how fucking money we are and how fun it is to be us then something's off here you know what i mean i don't know i guess it was just like a instinctual and and comedy was the thing that like above the not quite fitting in and not um uh not yeah above that not fitting in it's like music and dance and comedy and the arts is the that transcends whatever situation you're in to, like, reveal a deeper truth. Stick around. We'll be right back. All right. So, let's just, let's just real talk, as they say for a second. That's a little bit

of an aged thing to say now. That dates me, doesn't it? But no, real talk. How important is your health to you? You know, on like a one to ten? And I don't mean the, in the sense of vanity. I mean in the sense of like you want your day to go well right you want to be less stressed you don't want it as sick when you have responsibilities um I know myself I'm a householder I have I have two children and two more on the way a spouse a pet you know a job that sometimes has its demands so I really want to feel like when I'm not getting the sleep and I'm not getting nutrition when my eating's down I want to know that I'm that I'm being held down some other way physically you know my family holds me down emotionally spiritually but i need something to hold me down

physically right and so honestly i turned to symbiotica these these these these these these vitamins and these beautiful little packets that they taste delicious and i'm telling you um even before us i've done ads for these guys it was a product that i uh i really really liked and enjoyed and could see the differences with um the three that i use i use uh the the what is it called the liposomal vitamin C and it tastes delicious like really really good comes out in the packet you put it right in your mouth some people don't do that I do it I think it tastes great I use the liposomal glutathione as well in the morning really good for gut health and although I don't need it you know anti-aging and then I also use the

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Like, what would empower that person? What would, what would, you know? I mean, like, I really, let me talk about this, my special. I struggled with anxiety and depression for, Like 20, 22 years. Like truly, like, in Broad City, we decided to end it. It was not like, it was a decision from the inside out, which was really hard, but what we had to do for ourselves personally and creatively. And I feel like I kind of got out of this.

I do psychoanalysis. I do therapy three times a week. Uh-huh. Three. All right. And that has really been a huge part of how I have gotten out of anxiety and depression, but also, like, just life events and life and coming into my own. So for me, like, it's such a, it's such, it covers so much of my life being depressed and anxious that I'm kind of like, why not have it? It's so part of my experience that, like, this, this question doesn't, um,

I can't even undo it because it's just such a big part of my life. And I'm like, how could you not be? Like Penn, you know, with our kids, my kiddos, three and a half and boon's a little older. But like this is about the age when they're going to, when they start understanding death and then they ask questions. And I feel like 12 is about the age when you start like holding the darkness in the world and that some people aren't going to like you. The puberty thing was really hard where I was like, I am uncomfortable. here you know like that was really hard but like to start understanding how the world works and that it's like really fucking unfair like um I couldn't even undo the depression in my mind I don't think

it would be a way to not make that kid yeah I feel you there and that's I guess yeah my question was missing probably more context of the reason I was asking it I mean first of all I was very depressed I mean my those years 12 to 20 were absolutely by far and away the darkest of life And working. I mean, I could, I could unpack. Like, you know, for me, like, I was just thinking in contrast to you, like, we're finding art in our little, like, cocoon of a world to be, like, actually outward-facing, selling that art is wild.

It's not, wild. And getting judged for it. Yeah, I mean. Oh, my goodness. My sense reflecting on this time, as we do hear a lot. And then just the way that I see things. Like, you know, and I hope this sounds. sensitive and empowering to anybody listening who struggles with it because i have too to me like

you know depression is is often a very very sensitive response to the reality of the world right of our of our culture and stuff and so to me it wasn't some you know i don't mean it in a way it was like what would she have needed to do to not be depressed what would that person Ilana at 12, 13 growing up coming into yourself, you know, like, but I guess then it just goes immediately into all the social and political things. I don't know. Like because also as you were like talking, I'm like thinking like in my head, I'm like, well, maybe if I had more of an outlet for art and it was like more, um, seen, but like, no, I don't

think so. I'm thinking like I also like didn't know what to do with my body. I was a nerd. I wasn't like hooking up with people. Maybe if I were and having fun with the experience, that would be, would have been healthy and more fun. I think honestly like my parents were so supportive and our home was so safe. But also there were limitations there. Perhaps if they were able to see that I was depressed and hold it, it would just not be this weight I was carrying, but rather the way things are, the way things were for me at that time, rather than this like giant rock I was carrying like under my shirt everywhere. You know, I think that probably is it. And I don't think it's, um, I don't understand how anyone can get through this world without periods of depression. And now that

I'm out of it really, really was genuinely in it for, I would say, from like 11 to 302 or 33. Like so for like 22 years, now that I'm out of it, when I'm sad, it's a different feeling than feeling depressed. Depressed with there's like a 30 pound blanket on you. You know what I mean? And it's like, it's really a different, um, sensitivity. than normal sadness. Then maybe I'm wrong. Maybe people do get by in this world feeling their sadness and moving through it

rather than having periods of depression. But I don't never met anyone. Extremely emotionally healthy people seem to. I mean, you almost indicate that your husband seems to be all. I mean, I don't want to, I don't know. But like, you know, you speak about them in the special where it sounds like, I think there are some of those

emotionally sound and incredibly No, but he is so struggled with depression and anxiety but no, no, no, no. But like he's very emotional and very in touch with it. I think it's not about

not having the feeling. I think it's about your relationship with the feeling. You know what I mean? I think that's like where the health can come because we all know we experience sadness, of course. But like, I think it's like the way you relate to these feelings, you know, and a big part of it. And it's something I really, like a big part of my psychoanalysis has been confronting the feelings because I find, and especially like doing literally doing standup or like talking about my standoff special, but literally doing standup, I have had, I feel so privileged.

to be in this psychoanalytic practice to talk through the feelings of like, okay, I step on stage and I'm anxious. And when I want to like not look at that anxiety, it's like, here, bitch, hello, hello, bitch, hello. And it's like knocking on my fucking door. But when I like say to myself like, this is crazy. I'm a little nervous because there's like 2,000 people out there. That that is intense. Like I'm taking in their energy. Of course I feel like a buzz and my heart and my body feels like excited and my heart tracing and I can just you know and then it'll like I'll just move through it and then I'm like present for the people but I used to be like no bitch go what are you doing go do the material you know and it's like but my relationship with the feelings has

changed with a lot of like focused effort and um and that is how I've moved through it and actually beyond it. Yeah. Just to circle back to where we started, I was thinking about what you said about these sort of like the fossil fuel companies having so much responsibility,

but we tell people to like buy their metal straws. I feel this way a little bit about depression. Like it's very nuanced and of course as people there are healthy choices we can make that where we can help ourselves and there are practices that lead to more happiness and practices that lead to more depression. But also like we live in a world

where we're faced with like existential threats and we're aware of it. So like yes, there have been climate catastrophes and civilizations have been wiped out, but probably people didn't know they were coming. We live, like, you know, there's like stuff on the horizon that we're aware of. Like, how does that affect the human mind? Other people don't know, but we're starting to learn about that.

There's like microplastics in our food. We've learned that the U.S. diet is so processed that even when we eat the same amount of pasta as other countries and walk the same amount of steps, we get fatter. There was just a study released about that. Like, there's just all this stuff that's happening that's also connected to our health. Yeah. So I actually think that probably most people do experience depression. that's out of their hands.

Like there are some things that are in your hands and some things that are out of your hands, but it is like all the onus is on you. But there are things that are like, you could be doing everything right and your gratitude and your mindfulness and you're meditating and you're walking and you're eating healthy

and you're depressed and you don't know why. And there's all this environmental stuff that you're connected to that is out of your hands and like your institutions are failing you and you're not part of a healthy community. Like all of these factors are important too. So I think most people do experience depression

because I think it's a little bit inevitable because our world isn't very healthy right now. A hundred percent. And I actually think that when people are in denial of these realities, it's one thing to put them on pause and take a break and take rest. But to actually be in denial, I think that you're unhealthier and it like builds plaque on your heart or something. I could not agree more.

And this just totally resonates with me. How could you not be depressed? And we're seeing warfare on our phones, and we're, you know, causing it by having the phones in some cases, in the cases of the Congo. It's like, it's, it's, it's, it's absolutely depressing. Also, the most, the most infuriating part of it is that it doesn't have to be this way. Exactly. And the oligarchs who are hoarding wealth of a constructed currency are like, unfortunately, it's the only way things are. And it's like, no, actually, it's like literally constructed and you're holding tight to this construct because you blame to be so thrilled to be in your position.

Meanwhile, these are miserable people who are anybody wreaking havoc, wreaking destruction, talking about trans bodies and policing black bodies. Why do you care? You're in a private gent here and there. Why do you care? Because they're actually unhappy with themselves. And there is a bottomless dirt. They're depressed too. You know what I mean? They're depressed too. And like we all, this like global consciousness we've been building for the past few years. Like I really believe genuinely that the majority of people want the same thing, you know, want basic human rights for everybody because everybody would feel just like chiller. You know, I have access to health care. I've had access to health care for since Barb City started. I mean, I always have if I, you know, under my parents,

send than if I needed, but I mean, I've had health insurance in television for, you know, for many years now. But it really bothers me that I see people on the street who I'm like, that person definitely does not have health care and is going to go to the ER and find a host of problems because they don't have access to normal doctors appointments. It's not only, it's not just bothersome, but it's like weighing me down and sad and upsetting. And also, costing me it is more expensive for New York City not to have you know preventative health but like our system is set up this way it's set up to profit off of sickness to profit off of this imbalance that I really I really feel most people disagree with and I have hope that we can write our way

into, I mean, W-R-I-T-E, write our way, write a new script into a new world. It's just, it just sucks how hard it's going to be. You spoke, I mean, yes, yes, yeah, amen to that. I mean, you spoke a moment ago about global consciousness. We've been building last few years, and then a few other things. To take that and just circle back to your adolescence real quick before we get into the rest of your career, you know, you've referenced, I mean, it sounds like there's almost, these two churches or a twin church

which, well, it's a synagogue that contained a few things, was your Judaism and comedy. But I'm curious specifically about spirituality inasmuch as you thought about it at that age, which I think like, or existential, you know, however you want to frame it. I mean, at that age, those questions do really matter,

you know, like what are we doing here? What is the purpose of life? And if there is, what is it? you know, like, and there's just many things that you've, I mean, it's the title of your special human magic, you know, so I'm curious at that age how you saw that, how were you thinking about those kinds of questions? Well, at that age, I was ramping up my paper school attendance to get ready for my comic stuff. Of course.

Of course, yeah. And, you know, actually I was talking about our kiddos pen at the age that they're at now that they're going to start asking me as like, oh, my God, these heavy questions. And when I was like four years old, I remember asking my dad these questions. My dad was the one who can handle it, asking him where babies come from about death, thinking about like space staying up in my room being like, what? It just goes on and on. And at 12, I think it was this new actual. an expanded ability to hold that, which was also part of becoming depressed. I'm finding my way back to like really practicing my Judaism. I've been practicing Shabbat for a while. As I like

mentioned in my special, I'm just like turning off my phone, you know, and for 24 hours like really reset my humanity and my relationship to it. But I always loved Hebrew school, even when it was annoying. And I'm still best friends with Annie Friedman. She was, uh, I have a lot of best friends from home. And, um, sweet. I love that. Yeah. Yeah. I feel so, so lucky about that. And, um, and, um, and, uh, my friend Annie, who I'm like, really, um, oh, uh, you know her too, friends. Jonas is her son. Oh, okay. Yeah. So we, uh, even when Hebrew school was annoying, it was very funny. It was like this, you know, it's like, so, so, so, Jewy and like

such a like there were such like jokes happening in my first special I talk about this crazy role playing thing they did they they surprise a pogrom is like a raid a like raiding Jews like in the Holocaust

it did a yes they did a non-consensual pogrom Holocaust play I call it my first special crazy shit and and and like it was like

it was like They, you know, there was like always such a layer. And I was just saying to Annie, she and I were cracking up at like a school thing. And I was like, this is like full synagogue giggles. Like it was always fun just for like the pressure cooker of a comedy context, even when it wasn't like spiritually enlightening. But I always liked the practice of like these, you know, considering my ancestors and these ancient.

text that like or sometimes just like words and then when you like stop and think about the meaning it's like oh my god it's so interesting um so i think it was like inspiring to me as the writer and as an anxious person it's always nice to have rituals and um i think also like you know comedy is such a uh jewish and jewy area there was some like merging of that inside of me as I started to, like, know that comedy was what I wanted to pursue. And so many of my, how many heroes were Jewish, you know? I, like, grew up watching Seinfeld, Mel Brooks. I always love The Daily Show was starting when I was about 12 years old.

I love John Stewart. I consider Whoopi Goldberg Jewish. I don't know. That's just me. She was always my hero. And, you know, so that was, like, sort of, like, starting to build at the foundation of my identity. before we move right into your career there are two classic questions that our listeners know we ask people and they would be upset if we didn't ask you one is what were what was going on for you

around that time adolescence around crushes you mentioned a little bit you said you weren't kissing you weren't hooking up but what was happening nothing absolutely nothing bone dry oh crushes No, I had totally crushes. But, gosh, I'm thinking, um... Was there, like, a first crush at that point? Danny McKenna. Danny. He was everybody's crush.

Oh, my gosh. He was the sweetest boy. But that's more elementary school. Like, maybe I still had a crush on him in middle school. I don't know. I was, like, kind of, you know, I was also, like, feeling my queerness, too. I liked girls. I was like, really.

And boys that I was, like, um, Um, not really, um, not pursuing anything, but like desperately wishing and not even knowing, like, um, but it was possible because like, my friends and I, we were just like, we were happy hanging out and like surviving. But, um, yeah, I was, gosh, hanging in Canada, but that was like more, that was more not really for middle school. I definitely had crushes, but there was nobody like burn into my. brain. I remember more just being like, um, things getting more physical, noticing everybody's body is not able to like locate what my feeling was about those bodies, being so, um, so like, um, uh, like electrified, but like not knowing how to channel the energy with my own body. It was like a very, um, frustrating time, I would say. The other classic question is just for an embarrassing story.

And wait, I have one other thing is that I was really obsessed with Freddie Prince Jr. In seventh grade. I haven't thought of that name in a while. Like magazine clippings, L.O.L. like analog. Like obsessed. And he actually was like Danny McKenna,

Danny, L.O.L. like Dan. But like when we were kids, Danny, he was like Dan. He was just so hot, Freddie Prince Jr. and so sweet looking, too. He's very sweet, bro. It's true. I do know him, fun?

No him, know him, no. I don't know him. But he seems really nice. He does. He and Saramchild Galler seems so nice. Yeah. Both of them. So, I don't know.

So I was really, really excited about him, but didn't really know how to deal with that. And an embarrassing story. You know what? From middle school. Oh, from middle school. like kind of a little later. I just told my husband it's right and we were dying.

And my sweet husband, Penn, you've met him, David. He is so, he really does love me for who I am. But like, I mean, literally, quarterly. I'm like, are you sure, you know? And so there was this guy, Greg, but I won't say his last name, who I worked with at this golf club, this like crazy. I couldn't believe that, like, private clubs were a thing. You know, I was, like, catering at this club.

It's, like, Long Island Golf Club. The food is, like, garbage, right? The shrimp is, like, frozen shrimp, and it's, like, you know, like mozzarella sticks. And these people are paying $30,000 in 2002 to be part of this, like, golf club and Mississa Club, Mississa Club. Crazy. I was like, y'all are getting scared to town, but I was, um, catering for a day. Yeah, truly, it's like, pulling on the floor, and you're putting it back on the tray. So, not me, but one.

One would have. Greg was, like, older than me. He was in, he was 22 or 16. And then, and we were just, like, really, like, liked each other. And he was so funny. And he was, like, a stoner Jewish guy. And I was just like, I liked it. And then we, the summer was over and I was like, oh, my God, I'll never see him again.

And it wasn't like, I would not. I was scared. I was not going to be like, what's your number? I was like a nerd. And I was like, that'll be dangerous. So I like didn't get a number. But I was at the pizza shop with patio pizza. It has become a Trump hub, which is really a lovely thing about my town. It's gone Trump and Q and on. So it's a hub for Trump lovers, self-Trump merch, this pizza place. Oh, wow. Yeah. But at the time we were really committed. They're committing. Really committed. Like, yeah, it's just, it's a snake and he can't tail. But I saw Greg and, I'm dealing people with Daniel and Eden. And I was like, oh, my God, oh, my God. And we were like, hey, and we were excited to see each other.

And then he was like, yeah, well, we were saying goodbye. And he was like, well, I'll see around. And I said, as he was walking away, thank God. But I do think he heard it. I was like, hopefully, hopefully. Stephen and Daniel were like, wow, we thought we were nerds, but you're an even bigger nerd. We are. Hopefully, hopefully.

Hopefully, we will see you another time. Yeah. That's okay. It's fully, hopefully. That's great. Very cute. And we'll be right back. In the late 90s and early 2000s, Asian women were often reduced to overtly sexual and submissive

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slash podcrushed. Alana, your special is amazing human magic is incredible. Thanks so much. Thank you very much. The Aladdin labor, that bit, took me out. I don't even have a question. It just, like, took me out.

And but thinking of you as, like, a real person going through that experience is also, like, yeah, I, yeah, like I said, I don't have a question, but it, it is like, that's crazy to imagine. Let me, like, tell your listeners who have yet to watch human magic who are just going to be dying to watch it after they listen to this. Yeah. So I was, I had three false alarms before I really went into labor and gave birth. And this one particular false alarm, I was, I, because it seemed like maybe I was in labor, I went to the hospital. Wait, what is it that? Yeah, I went to the hospital and then they did a sonogram and the baby was breach. And Penn, your right domino is a doula, so she would know about the following.

But I was like, is there any like natural non-invasive way to get this done to spin this baby around? because the way the hospital does it is barbaric. Barbaric. The way that we leave women high and dry in this medical system, the way that we like literally beat them up as health care is so psychotic and backwards. It is so sick. Our world is so sick. Our poor little sweet little planet.

So what GOMino would know is something I had to Google, which is a method called spinning babies, where you just go up, play down. And I was face down, ass up, chilling with Aladdin. And the next day, I actually did start going into labor. And then when they did the sonogram, the baby had spun in the correct position from 20 minutes of me doing doggy style. I spun his baby around and avoiding this, like, absolutely violent alternative.

But, yeah, I was, like, watching Aladdin during this time, and my daughter has since become obsessed with Aladdin. And they're just too hot. They're just too hot. They're so hot. They're so hot. It's the one that's emblazoned in my mind of all the Disney films. I both want to be and be in both Aladdin and Jasmine. Right?

And then to be on them. Okay. You're too far. I'm also attracted to. He's like a bye guy, you know, and I'm loving it. And it's weird. It's their doing, you know? Yeah, they did that.

Watch the word abs. Alana, I'm so curious because I feel, okay, I am a mom too. I have a baby who's just over one. And I feel like, thank you. Thank you. Yeah. Well, once I became a mother, I felt this like push and pull between two simultaneous feelings. one is like in this voice in my head that's like shut up about motherhood like you're you're cooler

and you're more multifaceted than that and there's other things going on and nobody wants to hear about it and then there's this other that's like no like screw anybody who doesn't want to hear about it this is literally like how the planet continues but nobody actually has said to me stop talking about motherhood but it's like an inner thing that I feel this struggle with and I feel like you have been in things, you've created things, your special is about parenthood. And I wonder if you've ever had that feeling and how you deal with it, how you combat it. Um, yeah. I mean, I'm full-lipped-out. And, yeah, we, uh, you know, it seems like we're all roughly, roughly the same age and, you know, as, um, and the other thing I was going to say women, we were so, like,

abused in our teens but like men suffer just as much and I'm also like just starting to change my like vocabulary around um you know people are like white men white men and it's like this is just that it's it's a class war it's not a race war the race war is like a construct like white men are getting fucked over too you know what I mean like absolutely fucked over and like you dehumanize one group but everybody feels less human like we were saying before about like the suffering and health care. It's like if everybody were taking care of, it would just be like a, a chiller, this planet would be a chiller place to be. So all that to say that like we've been so spoken down to mishandled, violated as women, everybody, like, you know,

misogyny used to be an acceptable punchline period. And where little girls being like, oh, I guess that's funny. You know what I mean? So I think that a lot of the, and exactly, like, moms are perpetuating humanity. The entire system we live in is to make like five guys think they could create life. It's actually that they are deprived of, they feel deprived. Who wants to do it? Who wants to even carry around? this growing thing for 10 months. It's like, you want to give birth so bad? You know what I mean?

You want to, like, claim that you can create life. It's really, you know, such a sham. But I have that sensation, too, but I think a lot and do a lot of work on remembering what an elaborate scam it is to devalue us. And devalue everybody in their own elaborate, you know, interesting, compelling little narrative. But the way that moms are devalued, I've been talking about this doing press for human magic. Well, let me just finish the answer here. The way the moms are devalued is the most ludicrous because we are the reason humanity is here. So, you know, it is my job as a comedian to make it funny. And it is my job as someone who's telling stories to make the story interesting

and forward moving. I am really interested in mom shit. I want to know about what's happening with your titties what's happening what happened here with you know what I mean I want to know what happened about the birth how is it all doing now I want to know it's just like interesting to me and mom or not I love bodies and like it's like finally an opportunity when you're um when you're entering parenting to be able to like talk again remember your 20s like hooking up with people people are like talking about and it's interesting you're it's like free flowing and that kind of stops people partner and it's like, oh, I guess we're not talking about sex anymore. Yeah. And then like with having kids, it's like, oh, again, you get to talk about your body, you know, in terms of each other's bodies

and experiences. And if you're partnered, like, how's that going or whatever? Um, so I love it. I love I love humanity. Um, but I feel that too where I'm like, oh, who cares? Who, who, this is boring. I'm like pigeonholing myself, but I just know it's a fucking lie. It's just such a lie. I find other stuff boring you know what i mean like i find that's really interesting and it's not what i'm putting out isn't it going to be for everybody because if it were it probably wouldn't be actually good you know so um it would have no lines around it defining it so i don't know i talk myself out of that self-doubt but i have it well if i can reflect back yeah it's as well said and a beautiful question or point to sophie but you know i also think you

You, Ilana, it's an interesting thing where you, this is going to make me sound really lame, because I'm going to say street cred twice now. You have... Did you say it earlier or you're about to say it twice? Well, I'm about to say it once, so that will make it twice. Okay, okay, great. My brain overlaps, it's, I live in many times at once. I love it. You have so much street creed that I think that you could, you could theoretically talk about boring mom's shit if it were boring and if it were just shit.

it's not for a very long time and people would come along the ride come along on the ride with you and at the same time what you're doing is not it doesn't feel to me you know i mean i'm a father i'm a parent so it's all very relatable to me too but i actually think um for the reasons that you're you're talking about it's it's kind of important to make this stuff feel more kind of relatable to everybody because it surely is it surely is you know thank you and and you're one of those people who's finding a way to to do that i think thank you i really appreciate that it's funny about street cred to um street kid street cred street cred street cred now that's it up more than you um is that like i don't think of myself of that way and i sure of course yeah oh gosh i've been like really um

but like in a way like my husband is like he he has said oh there was a period of time where we were talking about he's like cash in a little bit and that's kind of what he's talking about cash in not in a not in a money way but in a like personal peace way which I do think sorry like in a sense on well sorry I'll let you finish before I comment no no this is a conversation well I think what I know it's not it's an interview maybe For you. No, of course. No, I, it's like, I hear you on that. But I think, yeah, for you, I think of it for myself, but specifically for you and what it sounds like your husband is saying is, it's like, it's like, again, it sucks that we have these words like cashing in and capitalize on or like take advantage of. But there's, you've built something. I mean, and to, and to experience the, maybe security, might not. not be the right because I'm not even saying financial security but yeah but to like but you've built

something and it's hard to build something it's very hard to build something and to have it be both very successful and and well liked and well liked by a pretty diverse sort of like demographic and for that to stick you know and for you to be like you know for you to be like making quote unquote mom jokes I mean that's not what you're doing but it's like making mom jokes, the same person who was half the team that created in the club, you know, like that's really, there's just a lovely evolution happening there to me. Yeah. Thank you. Thank you so much. I, well, even before you were like talking about the difference between our careers. And like, the cashing in thing is like personally, in a personal

peace way. And David was like totally right about that. I'm like thinking about my therapy and like talking about a sense of deprivation. And then going back to the beginning, which Sophia and Nabi promised would be looking to Luke is that it is about like the sense of deprivation

these billionaires have. You have billions of dollars. Our system and like you're just lucky. You're not really worth that money. You're just lucky that you fell into that spot in a system. Like nobody's literally worth a billion dollars. You know what I mean? But for these people who are lucky enough to be in this system where they got the seat,

you remember musical chairs, they got the seat where they're the billionaire. And they're still miserable and blaming trans people and finding a way to terrorize black women and imprisoned and rule women's bodies. That's a sense of deprivation that I've, I have since I've been working on. It's taken me a lot of work, and it takes, like, a lot of resources, money and time and effort. And I, like, I don't, um, I've now, like, arrived at my creative engine, separate from my sense of deprivation. And while David was saying cashing in, it's like, that was at the time, but, like, that wording doesn't even, like, work anymore. And it's also funny, pen because you were just talking about, like, that happened.

fullest system. All the words you're saying, it's all like so forced to be capitalized on. Like it's, we don't even have a vocabulary outside the system because this is the world that we're in right now. Although I do think it is changing and we are changing it. We are responsible to change it. But like the words that we have for it don't even, uh, capture the context we're trying to fucking live in. Um, but it's taken a long time, you know, and that, and that, um, sense of deprivation isn't, uh, isn't truly productive. Yeah. I have so many directions I want to go in.

I'm going to go in two different directions, but just really quickly, just a little button on what you were just saying. Um, I also think that having extreme wealth just reflects, maybe not bar none, but for the most part, I think just reflects also that you love money. So you like organize your life in a way where you can create, you're also good at it. I mean, you have to have like a certain skill set to generate wealth. and maybe that's not something to be ashamed of or whatever, but or vilified. But you have to organize your life in a certain way to be able to generate great wealth

and pass a certain amount like great wealth doesn't do much for your life, but it does like destabilize the society around you for you to have it. So I would say that I think it is a vice to accumulate a lot of wealth. But in any event, so I think it does reflect that. If you have a lot of wealth, you also love the accumulation of wealth and you're good at it. Um, then the second thing that in a totally different direction, Penn mentioned in a club, and I can't even say it the right way, but it's been making a resurgence on social media. I don't know if you've seen that.

And if you have, I was curious if you have a favorite one. Yeah. Actually, I was not aware of it until this. And I still haven't seen what, can somebody explain to me what the moment was or what it's Are you? You're not on Instagram, Penn? He is on Instagram, but I am, but I don't go on and hardly ever. His ghost, the ghost of Penn Badgley is on Instagram.

We're on his account. Yeah. No, we're actually not. It is him, but, okay, Alan, I want you to explain it, but I just want to tell you my favorite one. I don't know if you've seen this one, is a little rat, like a real rat, on it up against a wooden beam.

Have you seen this one? No. Okay, I'll try to find it and send it to Alcundit to a publicist. It's this rat. It looks like it's in like studio 69 in the 70s, finding it's like having it's like sexual awakening against a wooden beam. It's amazing.

That is so funny. Doing like a bear scratch, maybe. Yeah, it's like doing a little bear scratch against a beam. It's amazing. That's so cute. Okay, so Lucia on Yellow, who just won her 78 Golden Globe last night for Hacks, which she co-created with Paul Debbie Down and Jen Sacky, who all worked on Broad City. Paul Nuccia were there, because Jen was actually writing on A Good Place and Perks and Rack. So Paul Lucia were in the Brad City Writers' room with us, all five seasons, and really me and Abby's partners in making Brad City.

Licea, we just would come with stuff to the writer's room. You know what I mean? Madonna, Rihanna, Alana, I just was biking to the writer's room and it just hit me. And I brought it in and then we were like, okay, it's him. And then Lucia was like, and this is like, I think when we had our, I think this happened after Yass Queen, when we had our like Yass Queen episode, we like learned what cultural appropriation was. You know, we were like, Y'all queen,

and then it was like, wait, this is from drag queens and young queer people of color in the city. We just didn't even know the root of it and the history and, you know, whatever. And then, like, in learning that, we started, I think, just making fun of ourselves a little bit more.

And Lucia brought in this, like, I mean, to us, it was, like, kind of gross. Or gross as in cringe, where she was just, like, laughing as she's pitching this, like, cringy phrase that Alana's like, into clurb, we all fans. And then we put it on Abby to be like,

what? And then, but we're all like, with Alano, wanting this to be reality. Yeah. And she's, she's like, Abby's like, what? And Alano's like, in the club, we are, we all fam. In the club, we are all family. Are you racist? As though Abby's racist, we're not appropriating. Like, so, like, slang that anybody is using.

It was like so fucking silly. so silly. But then it like came, it popped back up from, oh, you know, it was Brooke and Connor, Brooke and Conner's podcast, Foner, and then also this girl Maggie, these comedians just like doing it and popping it all again and doing a Broad City rewatch. They brought it back? Yeah. Yeah. Maggie Winters and Connor, um, from Burke and Connor. And, um, you know, the thing, like, even if it's, um, misguided or problematic, it's just like so, like, it's like, open-hearted and inclusive and it was really funny.

Hocking Kamal Harris and Usher did it. Is that your favorite? Wild. Carrie Washington and Bobby D. Robert De Niro. That is hysterical.

I was like, I don't know who Bobby D is, but I was just, Bobby D. It has been so sweet to watch. I'm like, my favorite one is a rat. It's so funny. Robert.

I do want to see it. They're all. Okay. They're honestly all valuable. Yeah. Wow. But just to be clear, is there any reason for the recent resurgence other than that? Was there not, was there like a...

I mean, I think like cycles of time. I think that it's like, you know, while it was happening, I think people watching Brad City were like, what the fuck is going? You really hadn't seen... Newportachia like that. And then, and at the time, like, I remember, like, you know, college kids who were writing papers. on it or whatever.

Now it's been, it aired first in 2014. So now it's been 10 years since it aired, five years since it ended. And I think, you know, there was a girls rewatched podcast and I think the same one rewatched Bard City. And just girls feels different. Like,

holy shit. Like what, you know, speaking pen of your experience as an even younger person, but like that was and before girls. And then Lena, the way like, what was like, what was like what the media you know kind of did to her

and used her as was so crazy and she's like well sorry I'm a fucking genius I'm gonna go write more shows bye you know but um to see women young women be free in that way and you know like women with young women

with money like still having like the same struggles you know that people who were broke did being disrespected by boys and shit and then brown city like then it just kind of came back up where i think people are like damn that shit was forward thinking you know forward thinking we were like we didn't really realize like the um we also like identity politics was not what it was then as it is now

but we weren't like we are feminist queer jewish we like kind of were but it was kind of just a joke And, like, we were increasing our awareness around it and fusing that in the show. But at the time, it was just, we were just being who we were. There's a bit from the show that I think about so regularly. I don't know why. It's like there's so many funny ones, but this one just comes to mind all the time is when you guys are in, you go to Beacon's closet and you're trying to sell your clothes and the girl is so, the person behind the counter is like so judgmental.

And that is so real and still persist to this day. Anytime I, which is actually kind of often that I do bring my clothes to like Crossroads or Buffalo Exchange or something like that. It's so embarrassing. Sometimes I'm like get my husband to do it. I'm like, you stay at the counter. I'm going back here. Alana, we do have a final question.

If you could give your, if you could spend time with your 12 year old self, what would you say or do? I would say, girl, you are. perfect. Do not change a thing. You got this. You know who you are, what you got to do. Even if you are, you know, even if you doubt it, that's part of your process. It doesn't matter. But I'm telling you, you can have no fear, no doubt. You are perfect, right in this moment. And for the rest of your work. Gorgeous. Thank you. Thank you so much for giving us your time today.

It's just so fun and such a like good meaningful conversation. Oh, thank you. We're really appreciative. You can watch Alana Glazier's new special human magic on Hulu now. And you can follow her online at Alana. We are so excited that you can now listen to Podcrush, ad free on Amazon music. In fact, you can listen to any episode of Podcrushed ad free right now on Amazon Music with an Amazon Prime membership. I have one caveat, too, which is just that I have a little puppy sleeping on my lap,

and at some point he's going to wake up and I'm going to have to mute and open a door and let him out. Yeah, well, at some point can we see the puppy? Yes. Definitely. Can you see him? Did I angle that correctly? Sort of. I don't even seem like to see a long, beautiful, shiny fur back.

How gorgeous. He's really beautiful. He is gorgeous. And he feels like a $16,000 Aramez bag. He feels... I guess that's what he's made out of. He's made out of great leather. He's made out of great leather.