Podcrushed - [Rerun] Sebastian Stan

Episode Date: January 1, 2025

To celebrate his new film The Apprentice, we're doing a special holiday rerun of our episode with Sebastian Stan! Penn and Seb reminisce about heartbreak during their time on Gossip Girl and how acting forces them to question things. Sebastian also shares how it was to learn English through acting, and the group ponders how to navigate friendship and competition in the entertainment industry. Follow Podcrushed on socials: Twitter Instagram TikTokSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Lemonada We have another holiday rerun for you. Don't go anywhere because you will like this one. We have a for the new year, Sebastian Stan, a new man. Check it out. I just was like, that's it. Like, be a fucking bull. Like, charge into it.

Like, you have to charge into the storm. Don't run away from it because it's coming anyway. So you might as well get into it sooner than later, you know, and then you'll figure out a way out. This is Pod Crushed. The podcast that takes the sting out of rejection, one crushing middle school story at a time. And where guests share their teenage memories,

both meaningful and mortifying. And we're your hosts. I'm Nava, a former middle school director. I'm Sophie, a former fifth grade teacher. And I'm Penn, the middle school dropout. We're just three beehis who are living in Brooklyn. Wanting to make stuff together with a particular fondness for awkward nostalgia. Well, I struggle with nostalgia.

I'm here for the therapy. All right. We're back. We're back. It was a long two weeks. I'm sorry, I'm looking at... Wait, do you want to tell the listener what's happening right now? Nata is partially covered by a blanket.

It's like a white furry blanket. It probably makes me look like a Yeti. What's funny to me is that it's neither obscuring you entirely, nor is it. Is it fully keeping the sound in? So I'm not sure that it's doing what it. That's what David told me to do. He said to sort of cover the mic. Nav's under a blanket.

That's where she's been on hiatus. Yeah, just two weeks under a blanket. Just to keep you all up in it. You guys were both on hiate. Like you both had vacation. I've been working. Yeah, right. I don't have anything like notable.

Nava, as always, the star student. I'm just going to run with that. I've been working this whole time. Never take a day off. We're back from hiatus, except for one. Guess who? Nova, give the people what they want. For the love of all that is good in this world,

what did you do this week? How was it? This was a very Sebastian Stan heavy week. So normally for the podcast episodes, I watch at least one piece of meat, like a film or TV show that our guest has done. And I watched one of Sebastian's. And he was so good that I just like spent the whole week

binging stuff that Sebastian has been on. Honestly, I'm like, I can't think of what else I did this week other than watch Sebastian Stan like movie, TV. Navistans, Sebastian. Apparently. So how was your two weeks? I spent the hiatus in Italy. I was with my parents in Florence for two weeks, which was blissful. Not much to report, you know, lots of pasta, lots of pizza. But actually right before I left, my kid neighbor was like, what are you doing later today? And I was like, not much. She's like, are you working today? She kind of cornered me into it.

And I was like, no, I'm not working today. It's Saturday. And she was like, I was wondering if you could just look after me all day. I was like, what? Okay. That's so sweet. It was actually so cute. So she just came over and she like she ate lunch at my house. Yeah. It was really cute. I mean you must you must already kind of like be friends, right?

Yeah, yeah. We know, I know her family. Not that well actually. Like we just met a few weeks ago, but it was really cute. That's really sweet. That's really cute. Remind me of something on you. Paco.

Paco. Season one vibes. Yeah. What about you, Penn? Well, me. So I'm back in New York now, home from London. I'm back with my family, just constantly with them and dogs, and trying to pick up my phone as little as possible, and I've really enjoyed that.

Welcome back to the U.S. Thanks, Blanket. And you know what? I can't believe nobody's mentioned this. Do you see the hat I'm wearing? You're wearing a pod crush hat. I'm wearing a pod crush hat. Wow.

There's video. Guys, I was wearing this hat a lot in London. Okay. Because my hair was so long and hard to wrangle. There were days where I accidentally wore the shirt and the hat. Oh my gosh, that's embarrassing. Yeah, I've been rocking the merch. So you do like this podcast.

Well, don't tell anybody, but yeah. Just keep it between us. Guys, you know who I told about my podcast? Sorry, our, our, have to train myself, our podcast. My old friend Sebastian Stan, have you heard of this guy? Maybe. Sorry, I'm swooning right now. What did you say?

No, no, that's the blanket. You're losing consciousness. She's feeling faint. You think you're swooning. swooning, but it's just the blanket. Sebastian Stan. He's having a bit of a moment. He's doing a lot. He's Emmy nominated for his performance as Tommy in Pam and Tommy.

A starring role in Fresh on Hulu a little while ago. He's got two upcoming movies, one by the name of a different man. The other is an Apple original called Sharper, where he's playing alongside Julianne Moore. Also, I don't know if anybody is aware, I got this on Wikipedia. He plays someone by the name of Bucky Barnes in these little shoestring indie movies, by a company called Marvel. It's about a gang of crime fighters, I don't know.

But finally, Sebastian and I first met on Gossip Girl, where he played Carter Basin. Also, Sebastian grew up in Romania and Austria and moved to the States right before eighth grade, and he opens up about his experiences trying to fit in at a new school in a new country. You're going to love this conversation. Don't go anywhere.

Don't go anywhere. We'll be right back. Does anyone else ever get that nagging feeling that their dog might be bored? And do you also feel like super guilty about it? Well, one way that I combat that feeling is I'm making meal time everything it can be for my little boy, Louis. Nom Nom does this with food that actually engages your pup senses with a mix of tantalizing smells, textures, and ingredients.

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So he's a lamb-peelaf guy. Keep mealtime exciting with NomNum, available at your local pet smart store or at Chewy. Learn more at trynom.com slash podcrushed, spelled try-n-o-m.com slash podcrushed. Why do we do what we do? What Makes Life Meaningful? My name is Elise Lunan, and I'm the author of Honor Best Behavior and the host of the podcast, Pulling the Thread.

I'm Pulling the Thread, I explore life's big questions with thought leaders who help us better understand ourselves, others, and the world around us. I hope these conversations bring you moments of resonance, hope, and growth. Listen to Pulling the Thread from Lemonada Media, wherever you get your podcasts. I just want to go on record and thank you so much for coming on, man. I know your time is limited. Let's just jump right in. No worries. From what I gather, you moved to the U.S. during this time of middle school, right?

So I'm just curious, what was it like for you then? And maybe what is your relationship to it now, of what it was adjusting to a new culture, you know, a new kind of schooling? All that that comes with. Well, the first thing that I remember the most when you say that are Jankos. do you remember the jeans yes

the big wide leg yeah the wide leg the big pockets in the back I remember that a lot and then I remember music comes to mind a lot like MTV was still going on and I remember always watching that

when I came home from school and Green Day I was a big Green Day fan like Tool and offspring like those bands but it was yeah it was a little weird because I came to the U.S.

when I was 12, it was 95, and, you know, it took a second to kind of acclimate. I mean, I always felt kind of behind in a lot of ways. You remember American Pie? Yeah. I mean, the movie, yeah, of course. Yes. So I remember there was a scene when I watched the movie. They were like fucking with the foreign exchange student or something.

They were like, say this. And that kind of happened. Really? Yeah, it was an interesting time. my first grade in America was eighth grade. My stepdad who I, you know, who I grew up with in those years, was the headmaster of the school. So, like, I really was pretty screwed because I,

because no one would ever hang out with me. Oh, Sebastian. I mean, I had, like, I had, like, four friends. One was a Bosnia Exchange student. Then it was my friend Vincent. But it was, I was sort of a kryptonite. You know, I was, it was because the headmaster's kid, you know, you just didn't want to. But I also had 120 kids in my high school.

So like my grade was 12 people. Wow. So the 11 others were like, yeah, no, he's the headmaster's kid. I heard you say in an interview, Sebastian, that acting kind of gave you this nice respite. Because in the rest of your life, it was feeling kind of like you didn't know what to do, what to say. say, you're learning the language, but then in acting, you had somebody just tell you, do this, be this way, say this thing. Yeah, well, I think because of the language barrier, like, I wasn't, like, a very confident

kid, like, I wasn't engaging, you know, I wasn't the one going out there and kind of starting conversations and stuff. Like, I guess, so that's probably what I refer to is more that, you know, I didn't have to figure out, like, what the right thing to say was. I could just follow, like, a script. Yeah, and then in the script, of course, everything is written for you. The only thing you can do spontaneously is how you feel, which is quite liberating, I think. Acting boiled down to its essence is a pretty profound thing.

I mean, you don't always get there on camera necessarily, but I was also 12 when I was really digging into it. You were already working when you were that young? Oh, yeah, man. So you moved to America. I moved to L.A., which was like moving to the America of America. I moved to, I was working, I was being cast already. I mean, I had an agent, a manager, all that stuff. I had my sag club when I was 12.

Oh, wow. But what got you in acting? Well, I was very lucky. I had my mom who was always very supportive. And then even when I was in Europe, you know, she would take me to these like cattle call auditions when I was younger. And then I booked this one tiny job that really, was not a great experience.

It was like this weird Michael Hanachy, like, TV show in Austria, and I just had, like, one scene and one episode or whatever, and I just hated it. And then after that, she just sort of, like, kind of, like, do what you really want to do. And then it wasn't really until I was 13, 14 in high school. I was, and I went to a small high school. So, like, we didn't have a lot of kids to, you know, play sports and then, like, do theater and all that. Like, everybody was encouraged to do everything. So I ended up through a friend kind of like trying out for the school play. And then I went to like this acting camp,

Stajor Manor. And then that really kind of like became fun. And by that point, I was 15. So it was all in high school, basically. It happened pretty early. But did you ever have dreams of doing something different? Could there have been a different path for you? Oh, yeah. I was like I loved astronomy and like space and and i still to this day like get very uh weepy about space travel and stuff like i yeah there was a there's a trilogy of books that i was like i remember being obsessed with it was like red planet blue planet green planet it was all about like the how humans were going to colonize mars and i was obsessed with that i just thought like the idea of like us like moving to another planet like i don't know i get like a weird zen thing about it

Navampen love talking about life on other planets. Yeah. On another podcast, yeah. We'll invite you back for just like that. Let's get pulled in right now. Sebastian, we have a couple of questions that we ask every guest. So one is if you can share about your first love or crush and first heartbreak, because for many people it is at that time.

Absolutely. Absolutely. I went to, I won't embarrass her. She's got a family now, I think. It's got children. But it was stage door manner, you know, like this camp was this magical camp in the Catsville. It's still there. It's like that's where I met my manager who I've been with for 25 years plus or whatever.

And it was this awesome, like, acting camp. And I met this girl there who I ended up losing my virginity to. But I was too scared to tell her that I was a virgin when it was happening because I wanted her to feel that she was safe. that at least there was one person out of the two of us that knew what they were doing. But years later, I did tell her that I was like, I was a virgin to. And she was like, I knew. But anyway, I was like, oh, okay. But so it was really at that camp when I was 15.

And what happened was, we met at this camp, and then she and I went back home. And then we kept in touch for an entire year of long distance, like sending VHS tapes. and because there was no cell phone like you would have to call the house and ask to speak to and then we met again one other year at that camp and she wanted to go to NYU

and I was going to go to NYU too I talked my parents into coming with me to visit NYU at the same time that she was talked to her parents if was NYU and we stayed at this hotel called the Hilton Hotel we told our parents that we needed money

I don't know how we did did it because we basically got our parents to give us money and then we rented a hotel at the hotel room at the Time Hotel, which was in Times Square, and that's when we lost our Virginia together. Wow. An epic story. I guess you really wanted to know that. That's very, that's, well, we said crush, but thank you.

Yeah. No, it sounds like this is your first love. Yeah. That was 100% from a crush, but I asked him love. I did. I said love or a crush, but that's a really significant experience. Yeah, that is really significant. And it lasted for a long time.

Was she also your first heartbreak? What happened was 9-11 happened, and everybody in the city had just like was in another planet, you know, like everybody that had been there and experienced it and even surrounding it, you'd feel it. But it was around that time. And it was just, it was actually a pretty mutual kind of, it was sad, but it was a pretty mutual, like, we need to experience more things. So it's quite poignant. But Penn, don't worry. I've heard a few times since. I mean, I've had a couple of daggers out of my heart

had to pull, even in the times that we knew each other. Yeah, I'm not concerned. I'm not concerned. Pretty sure you and I shared a nice New Year's Eve, Chad one time, didn't we? About a couple of daggers in our hearts. By the way, in 2000, I don't know if Penn remembers this, but, I mean, I don't know why he would. Like, I remember seeing you at auditions in Los Angeles

when it was probably 2006 or something. So this would have been right before a Gossip Girl? Before a Gossip Girl, for sure. I remember seeing you, like, in L.A. when we were doing pilot season and, like, kind of like a weird, like, some Warner Brothers, like, you know, network tests or something. Camp. Warner Brothers Camp. Yeah, Warner Brothers Camp.

Do you remember your first? impressions of each other on the set when you worked together on Gossip Girl? Penn? I was traumatized to be on that set. Really? I was scared. Well, first of all, I knew Chase, right? Yeah, you knew Chase well.

I did, but, like, otherwise, I didn't know anybody. I mean... I don't know that you and I would have had scenes together much, because your storyline didn't interact with mine. I know, but you were very nice. But I was legitimately scared to be on that sex because it was just, gossip girl was everything. I mean, it was, like, I felt like it was like the new sex in the city.

I mean, that's how I always thought of it. Ten, recollections of Sebastian. I recall that you were friends with Chase because Chase kind of had this tight-knit circle of like a handful of actors. And at this point, I guess you guys all lived. Sebastian, did you live in New York then? Where did you live? You lived in L.A.

I did. I was living in New York. No, I was always in New York, yeah. Yeah, and in that sense, I think you did have a bit of a different vibe from, like, an actor coming from L.A., you tend towards a, like, a self-deprecation that was very charming, because, like, you're, like, a very tall, handsome, talented individual, which are those markers that we just see being, like, should equal confidence, but you had a different vibe to you.

I was always charmed and always thought nothing but good things really Oh, you're very kind I do This has become the most awkward question ever to work No, but really man

I mean really Because I just I just remember you being like There was just something very very funny and charming about how like I don't know

just the kind of charisma you could exude, but also be extremely self-deprecating with kind of like a very interesting hard edge on yourself, which I know can translate into, as an actor, turning that hard edge into characters who turn hard edges on other people, you know what I mean? But like, I didn't ever see you turn that on anyone else.

It's just like, it was like interesting. I always wanted to know more about you. Oh, I appreciate that. That's why we brought you on this podcast. Wish fulfillment for Penn. When you used to go to auditions, like I'll say this. Like I feel like, I don't know. Like you either, were you a person that like just was like,

I'm going to ignore everyone that's here and just focus on my thing and then pay attention. I happen to always kind of like, for some reason, I'm so freaked out by everyone else that I was like, I might as well just pay attention to what's going on. And so that maybe, I don't know, but some people are very like, no one's going to bottom it you know you know i to be honest i'd been doing it already for 10 years so i was in my mind i was about to check out i was like all right yeah i'd been on like four failed series i i was honestly thinking about just playing music and getting a job as a waiter as gossip girl came around

and i was i was pretty disillusioned with especially the audition process auditions for me then and they continue now when i when i do have them it's my least favorite part of the the entire apparatus of what we do. And there's a lot to what we do that can be less than what you want to do, you know? I'm actually not an inherently competitive person, but I saw everyone just as competition, you know, as like... Of course.

It's so terrifying. It's just like, it really is actually like the worst because all you're looking at every other guy there who's literally made to be like you because you're all going for the same role. You know, and it's really like, oh, that's not what I'm like. Yep, he's like that, not like me. Hmm, that's cool.

Or it's like, then you go the opposite where you're like, I'll just be friends with everyone. And then it won't feel as bad if one of them will get it, you know? Yeah. And we'll be right back. All right, so let's just real talk, as they say, for a second. That's a little bit of an aged thing to say now. That dates me, doesn't it?

But no, real talk. How important is your health to you, you know, on like a one to ten? And I don't mean in the sense of vanity, I mean in the sense of like you want your day to go well, right? You want to be less stressed. You don't want it as sick. When you have responsibilities, I know myself, I'm a householder, I have two children and two more on the way, a spouse, a pet, you know, a job that sometimes has its demands. So I really want to feel like when I'm not getting the sleep and I'm not getting nutrition, when I'm eating's down. I want to know that I'm, that I'm being held down some other way physically,

you know, my family holds me down emotionally, spiritually, but I need something to hold me down physically, right? And so honestly, I turned to symbiotica, these, these, these, these, these, these vitamins and these beautiful little packets that they taste delicious. And I'm telling you, even before I started doing ads for these guys, it was a product that I, uh, I really, really liked and enjoyed and could see the differences with. Um, the three that I use, I use, uh, the what is it called liposomal vitamin C and it tastes delicious like really really good comes out in the packet you put it right in your mouth some people don't do that I do it I think it tastes great I use the liposomal glutathione as well in

a morning really good for gut health and although I don't need it you know anti-aging and then I also use the magnesium L3 and 8 which is really good for for I think mood and stress I sometimes use it in the morning sometimes use it at night all three these things taste incredible. Honestly, you don't even need to mix it with water. And yeah, I just couldn't recommend them highly enough. If you want to try them out, go to symbiotica.com slash podcrushed for 20% off plus free shipping. That's symbiotica.com slash podcrushed for 20% off plus free shipping. The first few weeks of school are in the books, and now's the time to keep that momentum going. IXL helps kids stay confident and ahead of the curve. IXL is an award

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Like, my junior and senior year of high school, I worked at this movie theater in Congress, New York. It was called Cinema Six. And, like, I was the Usher, and it was sort of like a really great thing because you would, Friday, Saturday night, you, you know, you'd be there for, you know, the rated our movies. But I remember many times, like, being embarrassed. I think at one point, I think I asked for a girl's number or something, like, while I was working there. And it didn't go very well. I was like, you can have free pop. Let me sweeten the deal.

What I feel like I'm finally recalling in my mid-30s, I just always felt this compulsion to be older, you know. Like, you really feel like you need to mature. I mean, even as you said before, like, you're trying to tell. your girlfriend that you're not a virgin because somehow we all feel that we need to be in more control than we are we need you know we're just we're constantly making these projections because we're so we're actually all so kind of like sweet and silly and insecure in the inside to a degree and there's just i just like there's not a lot of acceptance and young people

of like hey this is actually a nice time to be that way you have plenty of the rest of life to be quite serious and do your taxes and raise children if you know i mean like Like, and it's a curiosity, I think, we're exploring on this show. It's like what characterizes this time of life and why can it be so uniquely painful? And yet we always remember it with such, I mean, like syrupy, sweet nostalgia, even though often at the time it's like all you wanted was to just get on with it, you know? Well, I think it's a really, and again, looking at today's world, I mean, you know, with social media, It's like, it must be so confusing.

You're already looking at your peers for acceptance and you're looking at them for guidance and you're afraid, like you said, to sort of own your own truth because you feel like you're going to be backed into a corner, you're going to be cast out. And now you've got this sort of social media thing, which must be so confusing for people

because how often it conflicts with how they really feel consumerism in America, you know, capitalizes so much on this particular age group for so many things, you know. Yeah, they're preyed on. So if you're a teenager and you're listening to this, like I would say, like, count yourself and give yourself more credit here. Like everyone's after you to sell you something, to take over what you want because you're passionate. You're young enough at that point where you're going like, I feel this. I feel this. And then tomorrow you might feel differently.

And then it's emotions and you're going up and down. You're trying to understand what they are. And then like you've got all these things kind of trying to capitalize on that. And that makes me kind of sad. Because it's like, I mean, you know, if you think about having kids one day, you want to, you want to be able to like steer them the right way. And when they get to that age group, you fear that it's like, oh, my God, they're going to have to just, you know, navigate over these hoops that society is throwing at them

nonstop. Yeah, that really resonates. I was just thinking yesterday I like finally got on TikTok. I haven't had it for all this time. And I was like, you know, scrolling, whatever. And I just felt really sad. I feel like in our society, there's no longer space for stillness. It's like stimulus, stimulus, stimulus. And young people themselves are like now the product. Like they sometimes commodify themselves. I think not knowing that that's what's happening. And, you know, these platforms sell your data to other companies. So like you're literally, you are the commodity. like you are the product that's being sold and there's like 12 year olds on these platforms

and now a word from our sponsor TikTok Oh it's true I mean I actually By the way I just I don't say this is like a weird like attention to myself But I did turn 40 like last week

And it's interesting Congratulations 40 and so it's like It's interesting when you're 40 You start to kind of like The bullshit really starts to kind of drain out Now I kind of get to sort of start over in a lot of ways. One of the things I said to myself, I was like, you know, I basically have limited now.

I maybe open Instagram like once, twice a week at this point. Wow. I don't even know what that application does for me anymore. Like, I think the point was, you know, bringing attention to certain voices in certain kind of charities or certain kind of purposes that don't get the same attention. And for that, I'll stay on. I'll try and figure out a way to kind of like, you know, partner there and keep, keep making it for that. But outside of that, like, you're right.

Like, I don't have TikTok, but, you know, I open the thing and, you know, it just ends up being sort of wasted time. People have to be really careful. I just read somewhere that there was these lawsuits, like, because there's the suicide rate and all these things like parents are afraid of. And I don't, I'm not surprised because I don't think these companies are really factoring any of it. that in? No, I mean, we know they don't care about you. We know that they're not. We know that their profit is their motive. Like, it's not even, that's an objective truth that we have to just contend with. The one thing that I do think is positive about TikTok, about social media, is that it does feel like people who, who have stories to tell, people who have

talent, there is opportunity for them to share those stories with a wider audience, which I think is really special. We have a house guest right now, and she grew up in Iran and then moved to Australia when she was like a preteen as a refugee. And she was telling me that she watched this one movie over and over again because it's about this Italian girl who moved to Australia. And that was the closest thing to her own experience. It was the first piece of media she had seen where there was a girl who was not from Australia trying to navigate being in Australia.

And I was just thinking like, how sad that that's the only piece of media that you had and still how much of an impact it had on her and how today there is a Muslim girl wearing a hijab on TikTok who's hilarious telling her story, you know, there's many of them telling their stories and there are many more opportunities for people to connect with those stories no matter how niche their experiences.

You know, they don't have to be white, they don't have to be straight, they don't have to be whatever list all the majority groups. I think like the way that people use it, like part of the ways that people use it can be really positive. challenges that the platforms are based on an addiction model. I mean, that's like studied, proven. I think I've probably even mentioned this on a previous episode, but I think maybe it got edited out, so I can say it again. There was like a week where... We'll edit it out again,

don't worry. Yeah, yeah. We'll just keep cutting this, this tidbit. There was like a week where Instagram, which is owned by Meta, Facebook, had, they had like received the results of a long, a long, longitudinal study of the impacts of the platform on young people. And it was basically, I don't remember the exact details, so we'll have to fact check this, but it was like if young people spent more than an hour or two hours a day, it had very real consequences on their mental health. It was proven that it was damaging. And that same week, Instagram had an internal mandate to try to keep young people on the platform for like three hours a day. And so, like, they knew that that would cause mental health issues and they were like losing

young people to TikTok. So they had an internal mandate to like, how do we keep them on longer? So to me, that's evil. That's just like plain evil. Like you have the information and you're doing something really evil with it because you need money, you know, and so it's an addiction model, it's a profit model. Need money, want. You want money. Yeah.

So there are wonderful things happening on the platform and the creators of the platform are making you addicted. Yes, yes, I'm glad you put that in. Especially like you're talking about these teenage years, like they're so incredible in a way and I actually feel like when you're a teenager, you don't get to enjoy them.

Yeah, that's true. And it's like this wonderful time deep down where you get to, really find out about yourself and what you want, what you like. Yeah, no, I mean, my stepson is 13 and, you know, it's interesting being a parent of someone that age because spiritually, emotionally, psychologically, there's a plasticity and a resilience that somehow also characterizes this period where it can be so tough, but you almost like don't have anything else to compare it to. So you're just kind of like, you're in the trenches

of it, you're in the weeds of it, the aspects of it that are hard. And you kind of just like get by better than maybe adults would be faring with that level of i don't know like volatility you know i i see kids that age as being quite brave and as you said before we by the way the background here on navva and sophy sophy used to be a fifth grade teacher navva used to be a middle school director and then also worked at the u.n researching the effects of media on youth as one aspect of her work um so that's that's that's that's part of why they're here so that I'm not just rambling

about nonsense but you know it's a time that requires courage and just being is courageous I was telling Penn and Sophie that I took

a generous amount of work time this week to watch a lot of your like films to sort of prepare so I watched fresh I'm going to keep you a lot for as long as I can. Unless you act up. Beginnings and endings?

Feel pain. Listening to myself, talk to you. No, that's because you're in my suffer zone. Is that what it is? Oh, dear God. And I watched Pam and Tommy. What's up, Rose? Hi, Tommy.

They're all here. Are they? Even Vince? Believe it or not. And I was telling them that you, I mean, who am I to give you a compliment? and everybody knows so you're incredible. But you are such a chameleon.

That's what I couldn't get over. It was like you didn't feel like the same person in each film. I felt like you were really lost in each role. And I was honestly blown away. And especially your performance in Pam and Tommy. Like I understand why you're nominated for the Emmy. It's incredible. So I don't know how you would know this,

but like how do you do that? Like how do you lose yourself so much in each role? I worked hard. I definitely don't want to minimize that. I quarantine really helped me in a way. specifically with Fresh and then also Pam and Tommy, like Fresh I had these two weeks in Canada where I couldn't leave the apartment I was in. And then all I was doing was just like working on it nonstop.

And the focus of that really taught me like, oh, you know, you don't always get the same chance because you have family, you have things, life and stuff pulling at you. But that time was really, really helped me out. And then similarly with, you know, I had another sort of couple weeks before we started, right after that, before we started the Pam and Tommy show, and all I was doing was just morning till night. And I think, you know, it was an interesting learning lesson, but, yeah, I don't know. In both Fresh and Tommy, you have these moments where you, like, have, like, freakouts, you know,

like violent scenes or aggressive scenes and, like, you're, like, really, like, fully. like screaming. It's like a full body performance. And I was just wondering how is that for you as an actor? Like what impact does that have on you, Sebastian, the person, having to embody those like really extreme intense moments? I don't know. It's like weirdly I don't, like you can't think about it in the moment. Like it's like a bizarre thing that happens because with everything, with every job, you sort of have a couple of those days where you know they're coming and you mark them on the calendar and you're like, oh, God, like this day, I'm going to have to like cry or like this day, it's going to have to be whatever crazy. And you kind of just pace yourself as you get

closer and closer those days. But the truth is on those days, you just sort of have to kind of just say, fuck it and like go there, I guess. And, and I find that the more I've kind of like analyzed it or something, the more I have a harder time getting there. So I just, I just sort of feel the sort of like the call and the pressure in the moment, it'd be like, well, this has to happen now. And like, you know, then it will just go there. But I've noticed that it also helps when you have the right support system, the right people that you can feel comfortable with, a director who can kind of hold your hand as you're starting to overthink everything. And then if it's the right earned moment because the script has built up to that, then you have confidence that

you're not sort of like overdoing it or anything like that. You know, you're just, you're like, okay, like this is required of me now and I've earned this moment. I can go there. I'm okay, you know. I read a quote where Lily James was saying that that scene were all the lawyers in the room are like disregarding her and being rude to her, that she, that person had a hard time distinguishing it. Like her body didn't know the difference between like Pam and Lily. And I was just wondering, it's like playing an aggressor. And I've asked Penn this question privately. Like playing an aggressor, does your body know the difference? Like, does that stir up any feelings for you? I think you asked on another podcast. Oh, did I? Yeah. Yeah. Not privately.

I was like, I was there for sure. She's kidding. You know, I remember I was looking at your show and like you've explored all those sort of complexities of someone who has these obsessive tendencies, but then like, you know, they're human too. And but I would say that you're, you're nervous system ultimately doesn't really know like that it's not real like it can't like it's just you know it's just reacting and you know i think you're you always sort of have to you're you know there's a bird's eye view of the situation that has to be there to be like i you know it's like meditating i don't know if anybody meditates here or whatever but like when you meditate they say you're watching yourself in the experience and i think there has to be something like

that so that you can still measure it out because otherwise it just becomes like all over the place it's like it's this balance between somehow letting this this nervous process take over you while having enough of a rational mind left over an analytical mind to to be it's a very very strange like threshold to straddle multiple hours a day i've learned like if you go you know once you go home i think sometimes it really does help to do the opposite, you know? And I think it does help sort of your friends, your family, like you kind of have to have those things that can always anchor you in a way. Stick around. We'll be right back.

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what would it be? Oh, my God. It's always about self-doubt, right? There are many things I doubt of myself on and tortured myself to no end for that I later on realized I didn't have to. And I guess, like, I would, if anything, I would pass on, would be to ask yourself whether this here problem is really a problem. And, and, or is it just, it's okay, you know, like maybe you've, maybe you are just the way you are and that's okay. And

that doesn't have to be like everybody else. And, you know, like, I heard this great thing recently the out of podcast. It talks about like the difference between cows and bulls, bulls in a storm. And apparently cows run away from the storm, but bulls actually charge into it. And I just was like, that's it. Like, be a fucking bull. Like charge into it. Like you have to charge into the storm. Don't run away from it because it's coming anyway. So you might as well get into it sooner than later, you know, and then you'll figure out a way out. I love that. Are those the only two options?

Could we get together with the other cows and figure out a way to handle the storm? To handle the storm? Sebastian, this was so great. Thank you so much for your time. Listen, thank you for having me. It's so nice to see you again, Pat. It's been a long time, but you look just as young as you always did. All the best and don't be a stranger.

And so nice to meet you guys. and thanks for having. So nice to be, Sebastian. Today's story is a fun one. It's quirky, and it even features a little bit of witchcraft. It's called pool ties. Take it away, Penn. In fourth or fifth grade, so this would have been 2003-ish, I think.

The heartthrob in my class was Holt. I had a really big crush on Holt, and these were the early internet years, so I'd sometimes poke around and find some love spells and alike online, I think this particular idea was pretty much all me. So our elementary school class had one of those postcard-sized things with every student's class picture, each one about the size of a stamp, as well as the teachers. You know what I'm talking about? So anyway, something told me that I needed to cut out Holt's picture and put it in my sock.

I walk around with this kid's picture underneath my foot for the better part of the day, I suppose. And then I go to my swimming lesson. Now, by this time, I've forgotten all about Holt's picture. I change into my swimsuit in the locker room. I walk out onto this big Olympic-sized swimming pool. It's very legit. And I dive in. I jump into the pool.

I happen to look down, and I see this kid's face sinking. His sweet postal stamp-sized face just looking right at me, falling out of reach, and I panic. I spend a few whole minutes at the start of my lesson, jumping down, trying to grab this little cutout photo. The pool here was probably about like eight feet deep. I had goggles and everything, but I don't know if you've ever tried to grab something off the floor of a swimming pool. You know what I mean. Things become elusive down there. And finally I gave up. Sometimes I think about that little photo, turning up in the pool filter or something, like a stamp size, dough-eyed fifth grade boys portrait. Amongst all the scrunchies and bobby pins

and whatever else ends up in the ocean, killing the dolphins. Bye. You can catch Sebastian Stan in the upcoming film, A Different Man, or you can follow him online at Sebastian Stan. Podcrushed is hosted by Penn Badley, Navacflin, and Sophie Ansari. Our executive producer is Nora Ritchie from Stitcher. Our lead producer, editor, and composer is David Ansari. Our secondary editor is Sharaff and Twistle. This podcast is a ninth-hode production.

Be sure to subscribe to Podcrushed. You can find us on Stitcher, the Serious XM app, Spotify, Apple Podcast, or wherever you listen. And while you're online, be sure to follow us on socials. It's at Podcrush, spelled how it sounds, and our personals are at Penn Badgley, at NAVA, that's NAVA with three ends, and at Scrabble by Sophie. And we're out.

See you next week. Stuff in his portrait in my sock, sticking his face to my foot. Killing the dolphins with Holton, killing the dolphins. Dolphins with Holton, the shame I have carried my whole life for killing those dolphins with my foot.