Pop Culture Happy Hour - Our dream TV workplaces

Episode Date: August 10, 2026

We spend the majority of our adult lives at work. We also see so many depictions of working life on TV. So where’s the fictional place we’d like to work? We’ll talk about Ted Lasso, Game of Thrones, The Muppet Show and The West Wing.If you want more workplace shenanigans, check out these episodes: ‘Widow’s Bay’ is an island in the screamThe final course at ‘The Bear’ was both sweet and savory‘The Paper’ is an ‘Office’ spinoff where journalism takes the lede  Connect with Pop Culture Happy Hour:Letterboxd / FacebookOur weekly newsletterSupport public media with NPR+ and enjoy perks for over 25 podcasts like this one. This show’s perks include bonus episodes and sponsor-free listening. Learn more at plus.npr.org.See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for sponsorship and to manage your podcast sponsorship preferences.NPR Privacy Policy

I've been doing this show for about 16 years, and I sort of feel like I've already worked at the Muppet show. So I don't know that that would really be a new horizon for me. Yeah. Honestly, though, it's not that bad. That's true. Growing up, we all saw workplaces on TV. And whether we knew it or not, they were teaching us what our lives would look like for most of the time, right? How and where we would be spending most of our waking lives.

But, of course, not all workplaces on TV look the same or felt the same. So we were wondering, here's the topic, what fictional TV workplace would you like to work in? And why? I'm Glenn Weldon. And joining me today on NPR's Pop Culture Happy Hour are our co-host, Linda Holmes. Hey, Linda. Hello, Glenn. And Stephen Thompson.

Hey, Stephen. Hey, Glenn. Also joining us is the co-host of NPR's Daily Economics Podcast, the Indicator from Planet Money. Waylon Wong. Hey, Waylon. Hi, I heard we were talking about the labor. market. My favorite topic. It's kind of are.

In a way. Yeah. All right. So, Linda, kick us off. What TV workplace would you like to work in? Yeah, so I thought about this quite a bit. And I made a few decisions about the bounds of my thinking, which would be I gave myself complete freedom to pretend I was qualified. So I didn't go around thinking, like, well, I guess I could work, you know, at some show that was set at a magazine because I'm a writer and stuff like that.

Like, I didn't, you know. I decided that even if I would be totally inept, I could do whatever I wanted. And I chose to approach it as I want this workplace more than I want this work, right? So what I came up with is I would work on Ted Lassow for Richmond AFC, the soccer slash football team. Now, if you know me, I don't know very much about soccer slash football. I would have to learn. I'd be willing to learn. My real thinking was I think I would enjoy being around people who are involved in such an energetic endeavor as a sports team. I have a lot of spirit. I have a lot of team spirit. I enjoy being a hype person for other people. I think I've been a hype person for some of the people on this call at times. Love doing that. Love doing that. And also some of the people that I feel I would be working with are the kind of people I think I would enjoy working with. For example, I would have so much more patience than someone like, for example, Glenn, with Ted himself and his relentless

optimism, I would find this charming. I would find this charming. The big, big boss is Rebecca, who's a nice person. So I feel like you're not ultimately answering to any sort of snake or nasty person. And many of the coworkers are just people I think I would enjoy hanging out with. I think I would enjoy, you know, spending my time around the people who are in that office. I got to sit down and have a long conversation with Coach Beard. I think that's the dream. I think that's my destiny. I feel like this pick is all about being around good people.

It is. I think that's right. It's a show made up of good people. I thought about, you know, there are other shows, you know, that are also about good people, you know, parks and rack and shows like that. But I don't want to work in government. So I decided I would rather work in sports. So that was my thinking. Yeah, I wouldn't want to work there, but it's not because I don't want to be around, you know, cheerful people.

I count Stephen Thompson as a friend. So, you know, I'm totally fine with cheerful people. It's that the boundaries between work and life are tissue paper in that place. And this is a problem with a lot of television workplaces, actually. So many. Everybody is up in everybody else's business. It would be a little too much for me. And I think the thing is I grew up that way.

My parents worked at my school. So I'm very accustomed to that. So I think it doesn't alarm me. much. Slippery work-life balance has been a big part of not only my adult life, but my childhood, because my parents worked together and worked together doing something they deeply loved, doing nothing but writing about something they deeply loved. Work as an all-consuming passion is definitely made it hard to look at a lot of fictional TV

workplaces and think this would be better than what I'm doing now. Linda, did you think about what job you might want within the organization? That's a good question. Well, I did, and I was a little bit limited by my lack of knowledge of soccer slash football as well as my lack of athleticism. But that's part of the onboarding. Putting that aside, I think I might be good in the kind of like marketing and PR departments. As I said, I'm a good hype person. Social media?

Yeah, it's creative. So I think I might find myself sort of over on the Keely part of the team. Although, listen, there are a lot of. lovely people in that office. I could probably find my way into doing something useful, which is also how I approached coming to NPR. He said, put me in, coach. I really did. I sort of did. If you don't know what you want me to do, I'll figure out what you want me to do. I think that's extremely fitting. I think we're going to learn a lot about each of us on this episode. Speaking of Stephen, hit me. Where would you work?

Well, one place that I strongly considered was 30 Rock. Being around funny people, being around creative energy, had a lot of appeal. And then I kind of paused and thought, like, I kind of have worked in one of the professional environments that is actually closest to 30 Rock. And it was very exhausting. I worked at The Onion for 12 years. I have been in rooms full of professional funny people. It can be extremely exhilarating. It can be extremely exhausting, including hitting that deadline, time and time and time.

time again. So ultimately, I decided to opt out of 30 Rock and into an even more stressful, even more exhausting, even more kind of emissurating environment. But for, I think, some very sound reasons. I went with the West Wing. Okay. You sweet sumitra. I know. I know what you're thinking, Linda Holmes. Again, it's politics. It's a bunch of speechifying. It's a bunch of... You hate meetings. You hate meetings. You hate meetings. I hate meetings. I hate meetings. I hate meetings. Great meetings more than anything on earth. But hear me out. One, you have the ability and power to change the world for the better.

This is very meaningful work. Of course. According to Aaron Sorkin. Running the U.S. government is meaningful and does entail the power to make the world a better place, even if you choose not to pursue that option. Two, you are surrounded by plucky dreamers. You are surrounded by people who believe in, in. a better world. Look, I understand how that has its limits, but it does have its appeal. Three, you only have to work those long punishing hours for a maximum of eight years.

This is limited term employment before you get to run off and live the rest of your life as some rich layabout like George Stephanopoulos. Yeah, or just a cushy consultant. Yeah, exactly. There is ultimately a second chapter that is not televised, that is you collecting a big, fat paycheck for spouting the conventional wisdom, Circa, when you had that. That's true. Four, every problem, no matter how complex, is solved with an impassioned speech. And I think the simplicity of that, the ability to kind of talk your way out of real complex problems, I understand the appeal of that. And five, and perhaps most important for this conversation, there is no environment on television or on earth in which the opinions of 53-year-old white men carry more weight.

You're just writing like free college on a napkin at a bar and being like, look at me. Saving the world. My work is done here. Hold on, everybody. Stop. A man is talking. That's true. It does work that way.

I have to say, like, first of all, much of this is very cynical, Stephen, and I'm very disappointed in you for just wanting your future as a lobbyist or whatever you would be after this. But as you know, I do understand the surface appeal of hanging around in Aaron's work and world. If I were going to do that, I would have chosen sports night, which I also consider. But that show is always on the brink of being canceled. Who wants to do that? But I simply think, as stated, your low tolerance for attending meetings would make this completely impossible. because ultimately your low tolerance for meetings springs from the part of your personality that thinks the absolute worst thing for someone to say to you is, I need to talk to you.

And you know what happens a lot if you work in the White House and you have a position of responsibility? Someone comes up and says, I need to talk to you. And sometimes it's stressful. And they say, I need to talk to you later. And that would ruin your entire day. Oh, yeah, that's true. That might actually kill me. Yeah, that might actually kill you.

So, I mean, I hope you enjoy the speechifying because you're going to hate a lot of the rest of it. I have a question. Do you count a walk and talk as a meeting? Because if you could put all your meetings into walk and talk format, maybe that would be more tolerable. Honestly, that is a significant improvement, in part because when you were walking around, you eventually reach a destination at which point that meeting would end. and I think it would feel less like I'm trapped in a conversation. Exactly, because it's like a car trip. You're not looking at each other in the eyes, right?

Because you have to see where you're going. So you can actually share real feelings. It's a whole day if I need to talk to you. I'm talking about a four to eight year prison sentence, followed by a lifetime of the cushiest work on Earth. See, I would just not go to prison. Like Linda, I'm a little leery of the Sorkin quality here, Although we have to acknowledge that as Linda referred to, there are eras of Sorkin.

And this is a good era of Sorkan. Yes, it's an idealized Washington, D.C. But there are cynics on that show. There are bad faith arguments that people make, but they're always cast as the bad guys. They're constantly shown to be in the wrong. They get called out usually in a pretty sanctimonious speech. But later on, he moved with the newsroom, he moved to Hectoring. I will take sanctimonious over Hectoring any day.

And in the pilot episode, Sorkin is also letting us see. that this is Bartlett's ego. Like, he loves rubbing someone's face and how wrong they are. And that is a character trait that is also a character flaw that gets mined a lot on that show. And later with the newsroom, that layering went away because the mission statement of that show was, you know, the news got it wrong. Here's how I would have gotten it right. Yes. Man, that show is insufferable.

I would walk into the ocean rather than work in the newsroom. Yeah, you'll notice that I did not mention the newsroom or Studio 60. See, also, eras. Like Taylor Swift, the man has Aaron. All right, well, thank you for that, Stephen. We're going to take a quick break, and then we're going to come back with My Pick and Waylon's pick. And we are back. Waylon, what fictional TV workplace would you like to work in?

You know what? It's time to play the music. It's time to light the lights. It's time to play the music. It's time to light the light. It's time to meet the moppits on the mopper show. And you know who could cue up the music? Who could light the lights?

Me, Whalen Wong. I would like to work at the OG Muppet Show, which, you know, then I was thinking about, you know, what is my ultimate dream? And my ultimate dream is to meet the Muppets and to hang out with the Muppets. This is like all I think about. And so I think working at the Muppets show would obviously put me in the orbit of all these Muppets. I think that, you know, in the show, Scooter's Uncle, O. owns the theater. And so he's kind of the gopher. And so I think that I could replace Scooter. And then I already thought this through. And then he could get promoted to do kind of bigger,

better things, right? But I could be the one, you know, like making sure that Rita Moreno gets from the green room to the stage. I'm keeping Miss Piggy's dressing room stocked. I am making sure that Kermit's water glass is filled. You know, I've got a headset on. And I think I'm very organized. I'm an order Muppet. I was going to say, I was going to ask. I'm an order Muppet all the way. I'm Prairie Dawn. I'm Prairie Dawn of Sesame Street, like directing the school playing, getting really upset when, you know, like Ernie forgets his lines. So I think I would really keep things moving along at a very efficient pace at the Muppet show. And I think I would prove my value. And then hopefully, this is like the longer term plan.

If I'm a really good employee, then they'll take me along when they do the movies. And then I would get to be on the set of Great Muppet Caper, Muppets take Manhattan, Muppet Christmas Carol. So I basically just want a career with the Muppets. I think you're the only one who came up with an arc. How do you bring down Scooter? What is your plan to destroy? No, she doesn't want to bring down Scooter. She wants Scooter to get promoted.

Yeah, because I think Scooter, I love Scooter. And I think, you know, Scooter definitely has a place in the Muppet universe. So it's like I would just do the grunt work that Scooter gets hired for. And then he could get promoted to do other stuff. You know, maybe he wants to be on stage, whatever. And then I would just be the one fetching things. So you want to be the underling of the Neppo baby. Well, later on the Muppets inherit the theater after Scooter's uncle dies.

Well, yeah, and she'd be working with everyone. When you're the production assistant, you get to work with everybody. And I feel like they would treat me really well. Like, can you imagine Kermit being a toxic boss? Obviously not. You know, Miss Piggy, maybe. No, he's not a toxic boss. It is a toxic workplace.

I don't think it's toxic. There is too much chaos in that workplace. Too many Gonsos. Too many Louisiana's, too many crazy habies. There's only one. Gonezo. There's a lot of chickens. I guess I'd have to wrangle the chickens as the PA. That would be hard. Link Hogthrob? You'd have to work with Link Hogthrob. I mean, come on. He's a really good actor, though. Pigs in space. See, here's what this workplace is like. Somebody makes a fat joke to Piggy. Piggy responds with a physical assault. Everyone is in the wrong there. This is a toxic work environment. You need a scooter. You need a Kermit. You need a Sam. Who is HR? Who is HR? It's probably Robin. Robin's probably the HR. Robin's Asia, but Robin's like a child. It's probably Sam the Eagle.

You know who I think it is? I think it's Janice. Oh, maybe. Janice is so spacing, though. She's so mellow. No, she's so mellow. She just makes everyone feel more calm. I will say, I only have one hesitation about the Muppet show as a potential workplace

for me, which is, well, I've been doing this show for about 16 years as of this summer. And I sort of feel like I've already worked at the Muppet Show. So I don't know that that would be. really be a new horizon for me. Having worked at pop culture happy hour, I think I've already had the Muppet show experience. Amazing. Yeah. Honestly, though, it's not that bad. That's true.

Who's the New Zealand of Pop Culture Happy Hour? This is like 30 Rock, but with explosions. Crazy Harry. Crazy Harry is like exploding things. Like, this is not a healthy workplace. You got a guy throwing fish. Yeah. Imagine getting to work alongside Roeux.

Rolf the dog. Imagine. You're speaking my language here, Wailin. You're in the show business. I get it. And you also get this rotating, like, you get to work with like Paul Williams and Rita Moreno. Oh, yeah. Elton John, Raquel Welch.

Yeah. If it's O.G. Muppet Show, you've got some really impressive people in those years. All right. That's a pick, Wailen. I'm not going to, I can't get with you. I think it's really toxic. I love that pick. My workplace is the Citadel, which is the home of the maister.

from the Song of Bison Fire Books by George R.R. Martin on TV, that's Game of Thrones, House of the Dragon, and a Knight of the Seven Kingdoms. Maesters are this world's scientists, healers, scholars. It is, and the citadel itself is kind of a university slash secular monastery, a monastery dedicated to science and medicine. But it's also a school. Now, downside. It is not a very progressive institution. And it is also exclusively male, which I think that would be a short. for me because, you know, I, where have I worked? I worked in bookstores. I've worked in the nonprofit world and I worked in public media. My bosses have tended to be women and if I can be gender essentialist for a second, broadly speaking, I think it just makes for a healthier, emotionally healthy workplace. It is a very political institution because it has to be to survive in this very cruel and brutal world where things like, you know, intelligence and empathy and compassion,

they get viewed as weaknesses. Look, I have a very very, artisanal blend of softness. I'm a soft boy, and the softness of my ilk would not be welcome in the world of Westeros. So I would go to the indoorsiest of all indoors places because the world itself is not a great place for indoor kids. I would go to the Citadel. Now, we've only glimpsed one aspect of the Citadel in Game of Thrones, the character of Sam Tarley, who was played by John Bradley. He goes there to study and enters as a novice. And what we saw him doing there was mostly just, you know, emptying bedpans. And look. Got to start somewhere. Is that my dream job? No, but, you know, shout out to the healthcare workers who do that extremely necessary, biologically necessary job every day. But you got to remember, this isn't the real world. This is oldie-timey fantasy, faky times where cleaning out chamber pots is like you would just be part of your day, right?

It's like running errands. It's like emptying the dishwasher. You get through it. It's just something you do. But you're choosing from all of the televised worlds, you're choosing one in which you empty chamber pots. In fantasy murderland. It's part of the deal. I think you'll be really drafty, too.

Here's where it comes. I would have access to a world of knowledge, including forbidden knowledge, which is, as we all know, the best kind of knowledge. And look, each maister gets a link in a chain that they wear around their neck of different metals that signify each field of study that they've mastered. For example, black iron chain is the study of ravens, which sounds pretty random until you remember that. Now I get why you want this. The Ravens are like, you know. You want a charm bracelet? Ravens are telecommunications.

Bronze is astronomy. Look, if astronomy is just like recognizing patterns, I'd be down with it. But I'm sure there's azimuths that need to get calculated. So maybe I'd skip the bronze. Copper is history. I could deal with that. Gold is mathematics and economics. I'm not getting a gold chain.

Iron is Warcraft. I mean, I could fake it. I played the game. Silver is medicine. I could do that. And Valerian Steel. Here we go. Valerian Steel link.

is for studying the higher mysteries, which means magic. So I would ensconce myself in the locked vault where all the forbidden books are kept. I wouldn't get much sun, but it's not like I do anyway. And, you know, Linda, you and I grew up in the Delaware Valley. I could wear a chain. We grew up very close to New Jersey. I could do it. I could. I could pull it off.

You could. I think I could. I think I could. That's me. I just find myself thinking about the fact that this is a world in which a relative, good and merciful death is having your head chopped off. And that's where you would like to work because the Muppet show is too toxic. And there's not even indoor plumbing in this world.

Yeah, you know what? You'd be part of the old and timely faky times. It would all be kind of of a piece. I really don't think you would like it, Glenn. I really don't think you'd like it. The Citadel is a beacon of knowledge and critical thinking in a world that desperately needs it. People would come to us looking for, looking for, well, I mean, one of the jobs the people from the Citadel have is they're the scribes of this world. I could do that.

I could totally write stuff for people. Well, wouldn't you rather do Name of the Rose then if you're looking for like monastery, cool literary monk types to hang out with? Yeah. Yeah. If I could be Sean Connery, I mean, just in general. Then yeah. I'm also thinking about the dentistry of it all. You know what?

I really like modern dentistry. You know what I'm also thinking about, Blent? Are you taking your husband to Westeros? Well, see, these are the things. I mean, it has an advantage. Because I don't think he's going to Westeros, buddy. I'm trying to imagine. I think we could sneak him in, you know?

Sure. He's like, you know, the maxtures are kind of left to their own devices. Well, until they get murdered or whatever. Yeah, yeah, you know, I still think it would be good, and I like the accessorizing. So, buddy, we want better for you. I think it would be great and I would have access to a world of knowledge where I could work my terrible will. I support you in whatever idiosyncratic career you want for yourself, including Master of Forbidden Knowledge, because I do think that sounds very cool. Yeah, see?

Because what I was thinking was, well, maybe it would be like the news station on the Mary Tyler Moore Show or WKRP or WNYX from News Radio. And I'm like, well, that's not even, you kind of do that. It's not even a fantasy. I know, because I was thinking about Mary Tyler Moore. Then I was like, I already worked in the news. I thought about all of us. Why would you do that? And then I thought maybe the dragon fly in from Gilmore Girls or the Stratford

in from Newhart. But that's dealing with people. Oh, I thought about the antique store in Gilmore Girls because I don't want to work for Loreline, but I was like I would work for Mrs. Kim. Sure. Oh, see now again, Mrs. Kim. Yeah, that's a good idea. It's a little toxic, too.

No, I think Mrs. Kim and I would actually get along really well because I grew up evangelical. It sometimes just takes a little bit. balance to figure out, like, what could you tolerate and what you couldn't tolerate? Because I would probably have fun at Cheers, but I don't want to work in a bar. Yeah, right. Well, I think we've learned just a little something about each of us as I thought we would. But now we want to learn a little something about you. I'm sure everybody, you know, I asked this question at a July 4th party, and I got a host of different answers.

So we want to hear from you. That brings us to the end of our show. Wayland-Mogg, Linda Holmes, Stephen Thompson. Thank you so much for being here. Thank you. Thank you. This episode was produced by Liz Metzger. Lenin Sherburn and Mike Katzif and edited by our showrunner Jessica Reedy and Hello

Kimman provides our theme music. Thank you for listening to Pop Culture Happy Hour from NPR. I'm Glenn Weldon and we'll see you all next time.