Predictive History - The Story of "Civilization", "Secret History", "Game Theory" and more - Dante #7: Hell Cantos 10-19

Episode Date: August 22, 2026

Watch on YouTube: https://link-to-youtube.s.gy/dante07

Good morning, a few announcements before we start class. First of all, I would like to make a series of apologies. There are a lot of people watching online, so I thank everyone for taking the time to watch these videos online. And some of you have been complaining about the sound quality as well as the video quality. First of all, I want to thank Carol and her team for making all this possible. but I need to remind people that this is an academic facility. This is not set up for a YouTube live stream. So I apologize if this is not up to par,

but Yale, the Yale Beijing Center was not set up to be a YouTube live stream facility. It was set up to an academic exchange facility, okay? That's point one. Point two is I made many factual mistakes yesterday. I've been making a lot of factual mistakes. throughout this course. So to be honest of you, this is actually my first time

reading the Divine Comedy info, okay? I've taught the Vine Company for the past four years, but it's always, I skip through sections that I think are important so that I can teach it because my strategy is to teach to learn. So I basically learn what I need in order to teach. And that's been very unfair

to Dante. So if I'm making mistakes, it's because a lot of this material is new to me. And so I see teaching as a process of co-creation, of co-discovery. So thank you

for your patience and for your understanding. And again, what we're trying to do is we're trying to understand Dante thematically rather than factually. I hope that after class you do go and review what we've learned and make sure that you understand

what's going on and also to fix a lot of errors. And my third apology is that I got emotional yesterday and I think a lot of it is that when I teach, I have a lot of goals in mind, I have a plan in mind, and I get very impatient when I lose focus. I like feedback. I like to be challenged, but sometimes when I am challenged too much, I get a bit frustrated. Okay, so I apologize for that. Okay, so before we're being class, I want to address an issue from last class. No, actually, first, before I begin, are there any questions?

questions from last class that you have. Okay, all right, so I want to address an issue from last class, which is the idea of lust, okay? And we never really reach a satisfactory resolution to the problem, the sin of lust. Why would lust be an issue? And again, we have to assume that Donnie knows what he's doing. So unless we are able to do,

to explain to ourselves clearly and explain to others clearly, we have not arrived to the solution. Okay? So, Edward, when we were talking about lust yesterday, okay, you had a very interesting comment. Can you repeat that comment? Do you remember your comment about Picarda and Francisco, the parallels? You may not remember it, but... Oh, that was you? I'm sorry, I'm sorry, Jay. Okay, could you repeat that? So there seems to be symmetry with regards to the looping. I don't know. It's like the ex-programmer in me is thinking like with Picarda, she's stuck in the loop, right, in the lower levels of heaven. And then where in hell, we see that people in lust in that hurricane, tornado, as well as the people that are gluttonous.

They're also stuck in an endless cycle, right? So I just appreciated that symmetry. Yes, okay. So the key to understanding, the idea of lust, is to appreciate the symmetry in the divine comedy. You also need to appreciate the totality of the divine comedy in that he's presenting a complete vision. Okay?

So we know from paradise, we know from paradise that Dante's, ultimate message is to live a life of faith, hope, and love. He goes on to define these three concepts as faith is the imagination, to believe that God does exist, that heaven and hell exists, and that God loves us, okay? Without these things, it's hard to understand the world and arrive at truth. Hope is the idea of arrogance where you have to believe that you do matter and whatever you do impacts the universe. That's why people like Rachel, Roof, Beatrice, Rebecca are next to God because these are individuals who had no power, who had no status, but they chose to live a life of goodness

and as a result, God rewards them the most. Okay. Love is action, right? To not just be passive, but to be active, to believe that injustice anywhere is injustice everywhere, okay? And so in other words, what Donnie is really saying is to live a life of love and imagination. That is the ultimate message of the divine comedy.

But now we have to reconcile this message with, the theology of the Catholic Church at this time, and how people understand the world at this time. Now, in this time, there are the seven deadly sins. And now, what's interesting is that Dante does put four of the seven deadly sins in infernal, right? They are lust, gluttony, greed, and wrath. Okay, so these four, he does put in the infernal. But there are three others that he does not actually put in the infernal.

He will put them in purgatory, but not infernal, okay? And they are envy, pride, and sloth, okay? Basically, laziness. All right. Okay. So we need, so what Darnie does is he replaces, these things with other things, okay? Basically, envy, pride, and sloth are not

in the inferno. You're not punished for these things, but you're punished for fraud, violence, and treachery. Okay? Not only of that, but he separates the infernal with geographic

dividers. Remember how they crossed the Acheron River in order to access the inferno, but then they also have to cross the river sticks to access DIST, which is the capital city of Inferno, okay? But even when we go inside DIST, we'll find that they're actually also major geographic dividers as well. So what Donne is suggesting is that the more you climb into hell, the greater the climb,

Okay. So we need to think about what the difference is amongst the different sins. And I mean, the most basic difference is lust, gluttony, greed, and wrath, there are things you do to yourself, okay? And violence, fraud, treachery are things you do to other people. That is the clearest difference. And what this matters is that if you, with violence, fraud, and treachery, you are. disrupting others' capacity to live a good life. All right.

So that's point one. Point two is, traditionally, these things, the seven seven deadly devisions are an expression of the eagle, right? It's like too much. You are, you want things too much. You are expression of eagle too much. And that's why you have the seven deadly deadly

deadly sins. But we already said that in paradise, arrogance is key to hope. So how do you reconcile this economy, right? And the answer is that what Dante is going to do is show that you have these things, lust, glutton, greed, and wrath, because you don't have enough ego. Does that make sense? Not enough will.

All right? Not enough. will and desire all right so if you we read divine comedy and you look at these four circles lust gluttony greed and rap it's like they don't have enough ego they don't have enough will they don't have enough hope okay but did you have a question Jor well that's that's quite powerful to me because um you're saying that it's a spectrum like ego free will imagination is a spectrum. Yes. And it goes, it goes on the paradise side, positive, and the lack of it causes odd with death. Right. Okay. Okay. Yeah, exactly. Okay. So let me give an example to illustrate this with

will, okay? Sorry, with lust. So again, the story of lust is Francisco, who is married, but she falls in love with her husband's brother. And they have this illicit affair. The husband finds out and kills both with them. And what Francisco says is that, oh, what motivated me is I was reading these romance novels, and I was so enraptured by the plot, by the idea of falling in love of someone else,

that I just did it, okay? And if you know your literature, you know that this is the plot line of Madame Bovary, right? By, yes, right? That's exactly the plot line, okay? This, you know, very bourgeoisie woman, she's bored, she reads this romance novels, and that's why she starts an affair. Okay, so this is how he depicts lust. But normally we depict lust as maybe the most common example is you really like a woman and you, you know, pay her a lot of money, right, for sex, prostitution, right?

So this is a very different conception where in the normal understanding, prostitution, it's the expression of your ego. It's like, see, I have a lot of money. I can buy you out. Whereas with the Francis' story, it's not enough will and desire. It's like you are escaping your life, right? You're falling in love with an idea as opposed to a person. Okay? And now, to further illustrate this further, I'm going to give you three examples.

And then what I want you guys to do is to rank them according to sin. Okay? The first example is you love a woman and you give her, I don't know, a million dollars to sleep with her, okay? Basically a million dollars. Second is you fall in love with a beautiful actress, okay? Like who knows? Like just anyone, okay? I don't actually know famous Hollywood actresses.

Jennifer Lopez, maybe, okay? All right? So you spend the rest of your life writing love letters to Jennifer Lopez. Okay? I seriously don't know that many Hollywood actresses. And the last thing you do is, okay,

we are living in an age of AI, so you buy yourself an AI wife, okay? A robotic wife. Right? Now, I want you guys to use your image and tell me, like, all of these three, which one is the worst? In Danty's opinion,

which one is the object worse? Yes? I think probably the third one because you don't really need to like that much of that much of like a strong will to process like a sex robot and

and the second one will be the second like the second like Severe will be maybe like keep writing love letters to the the Hollywood actress because it's just like you're not really taking the actions right you're

just like writing the love letters and uh least the simple one is just to like to hire a like a prostitute to pay her a million dollars at least you're like you're like you're not care positive million dollars man oh yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah all right okay yeah okay any other interpretations or opinions yes i think the first one of giving the million dollars is the worst sin and then the love the love letters is the second sin and the AI wife is the third thing okay so explain your logic i think the the million dollars is the worst sin because you can directly negatively affect someone else because with the other two like writing the love letters they're just receiving your praise with the AI wife it's more damaging yourself

whereas the first one you're kind of coercing someone else into doing something bad so it could affect her future capacity to love or have a connection okay anyone else yes i think the if your friend love is a actress i mean no matter what uh he or she is a celebrity right so it doesn't mean this celebrity cannot be love but because love is very well right so you can love love love anyone want this is real true love i suppose but ai wife is different because AI is not real person. So I don't think the love can be produced, you know, if you just fall in love with something.

And also your love with some people give them dollar. I think it's all right unless you just, you don't only want sex. You want to have comfort. Maybe it's okay. Just like you give you money to your wife, right? Right. Anyone else?

Yes? So in Dante's time, these are my opinions. In Dante's time, then they would see lust as natural and natural. And natural lust would lead to marriage and reproduction. Yes. And so if God is love, you could not bring God into the number three, the robot's relationship. So that would be the worst. Yes.

And there's a possibility that you fall in love with the prostitute and get married, or Jennifer Lopez falls in love with you and gets married and has babies, and that's good God's eyes. Right, exactly. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Good. Number three, yes. Anyone else? Yes? Yes? So it's like the triangle theory of love. It's either errors, which is passion with the body, and then there's friendship, which is connection with the soul and then commitment or something, which is leads into marriage. And so in that triangle, the prostitute fulfills the body part. So it's not as bad. It's one aspect of love. And the letters for Jennifer Lopez is the soul connection or friendship aspect. But I think the word, is the robot one because it's neither all three yeah good okay right the obvious answer is number three okay um and how and how we know is we can actually go back and and like use these three acts

criteria faith hope and love okay and i mean there are different formulations you provide both of you provide really good formulations but the main reason is you basically give it up on yourself right think about it you marry a robotic wife that is despair You don't take yourself seriously anymore. Right? You are so lonely. You are so humiliated that you're like, you know what? I'll just go and marry a robotic wife.

Just keep myself company. Okay? So for Dante and for the Catholic Church as well, number three is the worst possible sin. And it's expression, yes? Can we say that sins that impact others are worse? So like the robotic wife is only concerning yourself, but giving a million would be abandoning yourself and also the other's life because because she has a million, then she's going to go into life of like spending and all. So concerns two person, which I see as worse.

Right, right, right. You're right. So it's conditional, okay? We're assuming that in number one, she's a prostitute and she just agrees, right? Like she's willing to do this. We agree. but if she's been coerced to do it, then obviously number one is a lot worse, right?

And we'll actually go into that as we descend into hell, okay? So, but we're assuming, like, this is not impacting the other person, but thank you for that, yes? Can we also say it's three because it inspires the least imagination? Exactly, right?

Yeah, so again, we have to think about the totality of the divine comity, right? We want to live a life of faith, hope, and love. And living a life of faith, hope, and love means taking yourself seriously, okay? Like, don't be passive, be active. And number three, it's basically giving up life, okay?

And that's why lust is a problem. Because lust is like you're escaping into a fantasy, right? Francisco's escaping into a fantasy. If she really loved the husband's brother, they were just eloped together, right? But it's not like that. It's like, you know, what she's doing is she's reading a romance novel, and she's trying to project her fantasies onto another person, right?

And she doesn't really care who that person is. She has absolutely no feelings for that person. And when she does that, she's not taking herself seriously enough. She doesn't really have faith, hope, and love. Does it make sense? So that helps us explain why lust is a problem

and how it fits into the larger Dantean cosmology. Any questions? far I continue. All right. My next point is this. For the next two, three days, we will finish the inferno. And the inferno is very different from paradiso. So think of paradiso as ultimately, sorry, this is fine. Okay, thank you. Vision, okay? Or the Apoculips. So in, thank you, so, so So in the biblical tradition, in the religious tradition, the populace means revelation, what God shows you, what the vision is. So think of Pyridizo as Dante's last will and testament. He's telling us what is vision for the universe is, for the future, for us is, okay?

The inferno is different. The inferno is what we call prophecy. And you're like, wait a minute, aren't the same thing? Okay, today, yes, they are the same thing. But back then, prophecy is very different from vision. Prophecy is a critique of the present. Right? If you read the Bible, all these people, Isaiah, Jeremiah, Ezekiel, they've come down to criticize the Israelites.

To criticize to, like, say, you guys are sinning, okay? If you don't sin, God's going to come and punish you. That's what prophecy is. Not one of like fortune telling, but one of social critique. So that's what the inferno is. It's fundamentally a social critique. And so what I want to do today is basically we did inferno and understand it ultimately as Dante criticizing his society, the people around him. And also what I want to do is I want us to think about do his criticisms of

foreign society apply to us today. Okay? What this is important is that there's a really good reason why the Comedilla, okay? At this time in history, when Donny wrote, it's called La Caboendida, but later on people apply the word divine to it, meaning it is the word of God. Okay? Because autonomy dies in year 1321. And in year 1321, when he dies, people don't really understand what this is going on, right?

Because we have in paradise Peter lambasting the Catholic Church. We also have Beatrice, in her final words, cursing humanity. Right? You guys are hopeless. We sent the Savior to you. ignoring him and you're all going to burn in hell okay and this is very much part of prophetic tradition right so if you're reading this in the year 1321 you um just don't know what's going on but this happened something happens in your 1357 that convinces that everyone that Dante is a

prophet do you know what happens in your 1337 in italy can you guys guess I'm pretty sure you know what it is. Come on. This thing kills a lot of people. The Black Death, okay? And how would they interpret the Black Death? Divine retribution. Divine judgment.

Okay, you understand? What happens after Black Death is the Renaissance, right? When they fully embraced Dante. You guys understand the sequence of events. 1321, Donnie dies, and he's cursing humanity. and says, like, the heavens curse you, right? And it was like, well, you know, so what? 1357, the black deaf, where at least, okay, at least a third of Europe dies.

Can you imagine that? A third of Europe dies. Some places, it's even half or three-quarters of the population. Okay, this is a complete disaster, okay? the worst possible calamity to befall on humanity at this time. And so you can only interpret this as divine retribution or judgment. Okay. All right.

And Dante knows it's coming, right? Because all prophets knows it's coming. That's why they're so angry, right? They're like, you know, if you just read the Bible, whether it's Isaiah or Daniel or, just any of the prophets, okay? They're really, really angry because they know it's coming. They know God will have his vengeance,

will have his retribution, okay? But this again, it's a paradox for us because if Dante knows it's coming and he's very angry, but he also says that God is all loving, all forgiveness, all mercy, how can we reconcile this paradox? What's the logic of this?

Yes? That God is trying to show humanity something? No, he's not trying to show, right? Because a third of humanity will die. What's going on here? This is punishment? We just said that if you love someone, you don't punish someone. Okay, let's use your imagination, okay? Let's just say we're a parent and we have a child for whatever reason, okay? We don't know why, but for every reason, this child has become a drug addict and he or she commits a lot of crime in order to feed his or her drug addiction.

If we truly love our child, what would we do? Yes? Send him to the rehab. Sending to the rehabilitation. Okay. Okay. All right. Any other suggestions?

The person has, you- Kick him out. Call the police, right? Because he or she has stolen all money, commit on crimes in order to feed his or her drug addiction. He or she belongs in jail. Okay. Is this retribution? Is this vengeance or is it love? What's the difference? Love. But why's it love? You're trying to control the amount of harm they have on other people. Okay. Any other? This, uh, you're bringing

up the, the good Samaritan issue in the Bible where like the person who like, uh, helps them is actually enabling them and the person that like ignores them, maybe, makes them realize on their own, their errors and fix themselves. Okay, right, okay. So the logic is this. The logic is like, if you truly love someone, you want what's best for that person, right? You want that person to live the best possible life.

That's what love is. And if the person is like, has a drug addiction, that person cannot live his or her best life. She has to do something about it. Okay. And like enabling it, sending him or her to rehab, that doesn't really solve the problem. Okay. What you have to do is basically let him or her hit rock bottom before he or she can lift herself up.

Okay. Does that make sense? Okay. So apply this to the Black Dev. Why would God unleash a Black Dev? God didn't do this, but I'm saying like, why would people think it's God? Humanity is, humanity has a lot of problems and God needs to make us reach rock bottom. to realize our problems and fix them ourselves.

Right, okay. So that is the message of the divine harmony, okay? And it's the inverse of Catholic Church. The Catholic Church is, don't screw up and you go to heaven. And if you screw up, you go to hell, okay? So it's a high risk situation. For Dante, there is no risk. God will forgive you always.

But because God will always forgive you always, that gives you responsibility. to live your best life, okay? To live a life of faith, hope, and love. And if you cannot live that, if you want to live that, you cannot live that, then God will intervene in a way that permits you to live that, okay?

So another saying this is society has become so corrupt, has become so evil, so sinful, that an ordinary person like Dante cannot live a life of faith, hope, and love anymore. In that situation, there will be divine judgment. Okay? There will, God has to intervene because if God truly loves us,

God needs to ensure that we have the opportunity to live a life of hope, faith, and love. All right? Yes. We're a video professor. And I also want to make me, we call it memory that you know if the uh for example family member just being you know in the sick bad right and keep waiting for death and at that time you know i think other people just didn't don't believe in money they believe in god because only the god can can you know

can give him back or can just you know let him recover so maybe god is try to tax people and just let them to know that uh what if chasing forward money the power is useless in front of the uanis right just like you know the uh So right now, we can call COVID-19, right? So maybe. Okay. All right. Okay.

So to start off our discussion of Dante as a prophet, okay, as a social critic, as someone who is telling people that divine vengeance is coming, this is a comment from YouTube. It's the same person who commented about Peter in the coin, okay? It's a very good comment. So we're going to read it to, to like, understand. than Don is a prophet, okay? Carol, could you read, please? Sure.

It is wild. How many people in this lecture treat Dante like a harmless academic monument, completely missing why he was a true hero for the people? Dante Aligari was not born into absolute luxury or the elite upper class. As a son of a low-level money lender, he had to completely hustle his way through his academics,

using sheer intellectual genius to break into elite, philosophical, in geometric circles. He was also a hardened combat veteran who fought on the front lines as a cavalry man for the Florentine Army at the Bloody Battle of Camp Aldino in 1289. He was a champion who used his hard-earned political power to protect ordinary citizens from a corrupt predatory establishment. In 1300, he was elected as a ruling minister of Florence and immediately passed bold laws to strip the corrupt local Franciscan inquisitor of his power,

stopping the church from weaponizing heresy checklist to extort bribes and plunder the financial purses of wealthy families. Dante even sacrificed his own personal life for the law, voting to exile his own best friend to keep the peace and prove that justice belongs to the people, not political factions. The papal establishment struck back with absolute malice. Pope Boniface the Eighth leered Dante to Rome on a fake diplomatic mission, while secretly launching a military coup that tore down Dante's home,

seized all his assets and locked his name into the infamous book of the nail registry, sentencing him to be burned alive at the stake. Forced into a brutal 19-year exile as a hunted fugitive, Dante never backed down. He proved that the ultimate weapon against a blood-soaked political apparatus is radical, uncensored love and spiritual freedom. He used his poetry to expose the rulers who financialized, grace, putting corrupt popes in hell while they were still alive, while preaching that the entire universe is actually powered by its decentralized, unbannable divine love that no empire can ever trap behind a pay wall. The institution was so terrified of his message of human

deliberation that in 1329, Cardinal Bertrand de Bouget sent armed men to dig up his dead body and burn his bones to ashes, forcing local Franciscan monks to hide his skeleton in a wall for centuries. Dante was a rogue insider who gave up his wealth, his status, and his safety to shield the divine spark and build an eternal escape hatch for humanity. Okay. So of course there's a bit of exaggeration in it, okay? But the essence is very much true. He is, he was a prophet, and this is the life of a prophet, one of constant alienation, persecution, and exile. And there's no other way. He chose to live a life of faith, hope and love. And when he cannot do that, then he knows that society is unjust.

When society is unjust, then God will eventually have to intervene, okay? And that's why in Pirodiso, in this place of grace and mercy and love, Peter and Beatrice will go on this tirade against humanity, okay? It is a promise of divine judgment. all right and so we will what we'll do today and tomorrow and we will focus on what's going on in florentonty society to make dante uh demand divine vengeance retribution okay not only is he a prophet telling people that divine retribution is coming but he's also a messenger of god an angel who is demanding from god divine divine divine retribution and judgment okay all right so we're gonna pick up from inferno where did we end last time okay so so so so let's let's do number

ten okay all right but are there any questions about this before we start reading again the goal for today and tomorrow is figure out what's going on in foreign society to make Dante so angry at the world okay what does he feel so bliss all right okay all right so let's let's okay can so ten now by a narrow path that ran between those torments and the ramparts of the city my master moves ahead eye following oh high's virtue you who lead me through these circles of transgression at your will do you speak to me and satisfy my longings can those who lie within the supokers be seen the lids in fact have all been lifted no

guardians watching over them and he to me they'll all be shuttered up when they return here from jehesephat together with the flesh they left above within this region is the cemetery of epicurus and his followers all those who say the soul dies with body and so the question you have asked of me will soon find satisfaction while we're here as will the longing you have hid from me okay okay we've crossed the river sticks and we are now in the city of this which is the capital of hell And so we are now meeting the worst offenders. These are people who have not only sin against themselves, but they've sin against others, especially God. And the first people we meet are the heretics, okay?

The people who have misled people from God. And their punishment is they basically lie in these tombs, and they're burning to death. And Virgil says the main heresy is the Apiricus and his fathers. The Apircharians believe that there is no soul. There's no heaven and hell. So all that means is while you're on earth, just have a blast, man. Have a feast. Eat the best food.

Have sex every day. Wear the best clothes. Just enjoy yourself. And for Dante, this is this pure. Heresy, okay? He hates his idea. Because if you think about it, why he hates his idea is that it completely removes the need for faith, hope, hope, and love, right? If there's nothing after this, why have faith? Why have hope? Why have love? Okay, so for Donda, he takes great offense at the Ipecureans, and everyone that's burning here are the Epicureans. Okay? All right, let's keep on going. Line 19. And I, good guy, the only reason I have hit, my heart was that I might speak briefly and you long since encouraged me in this.

O Tuscan, you who pass a life across the fiery city with such seemly words, be kind enough to stay your journey here. Your accent makes it clear that you belong among the natives of the noble city I may have dealt with so vindictively. Okay, so Dante and Virgil are talking and then someone overhears them. This is Kavacante, who is someone that, Dane knew very well, okay? Cavacante. And Capaconte hears Donnie's accent and says,

hey, you must be from Florence. Let's talk, okay? All right. Keep on going. Line 28. This sound had burst so unexpectedly out of once a polker that, trembling, I then drew a little closer to my guide. But he told me, turn around.

What are you doing? That's for Anata, who has risen there. You'll see all of him from the waist up. My eyes already were intent on his, and up he rose his forehead and his chest as if he had tremendous scorn for health. My guide, his hands encouraging and quick thrust me between the spokesers toward him, saying,

your words must be appropriate. When I draw closer to his poker, he glanced at me, and as of indistain, he asked of me, who were your ancestors? Because I wanted so to be compliant, I had no thing from him. I told them all. At this, he lifted up his brows a bit,

then said, they were ferocious enemies of mine and of my parents and my party, so that I had to scatter them twice over. If they were driven out, I answered him, they still returned both times from every quarter, but yours were never quick to learn that art. At this there rose another shade alongside, uncovered to my sight down to his chin. I think that he had risen on his knees. He looked around me just as he longed to see if I had come with someone else,

but then his expectations bent, he said, in tears. If it is your high intellect that lets you journey here, through this blind prison, where is my son? Why is he not with you? So this is very important, okay? So I'll explain what's going on. Dante is talking to someone, and then someone else over here, and this person has Cavicante.

Sorry, I misspoke, okay? The first shade is not Cammer Conte. The second state is Cammer Conte. And Cavacante knows it's Dante. And Cover Conte says, if it is your high intellect that lets you journey here, where is my son? Okay?

What is important is that the son of the Shay, his name is Guido. And Guido and Dante are competitors. They're both poets. They're trying to be the best poet in Florence, right? And what Guy and what Covert County is saying to Dante is, hey, if you are able to make it here with your poetry, then where's my son? Right? He's at least equal to you. It doesn't make sense.

All right. So let's see what Dante says. Line 61. I answered, My own powers have not brought me. He who waits me there leads me through here, perhaps to one your guido did disdain. His words, the nature of his punishment, these had already let me read his name. Therefore, my answer was so fully made. Then suddenly erect, he cried,

What's that? He did disdain. He's not still alive? the sweet light does not strike against his eyes. And when he noticed how I hesitated a moment in my answer, he fell back supine and did not show himself again. Okay, so this is a really crucial scene, okay? So imagine what's going on.

Kabakante asked Dante, where is my son? And Dante is like, God disdains him. And then Kabrikane is like, then my son is dead. And Donnie knows for a fact. that his son is not dead, okay? But Donny does not correct him. All right?

Do you guys understand what's going on? Here's the question. Why is Dante doing this? Okay, let's imagine if you're you, right? Like, you meet the father of your friend, and your father says, why isn't your friend, and the father says,

why is it my son with you? What should your answer be? Maybe just tell him the truth if I were a friend. Yeah, just something like he's living a great life back in Florence. That's why he couldn't be here, right? But instead, Dante kind of lies and says, well, your son is kind of dead. Oh, what do you do that?

Yes? I mean, so that the father knows that the son is not in hell because if he was dead, I mean, because he is in hell, So if his son were dead, then he would know if he would be in hell. That's a generous explanation, but it's, you're still lying. You know he's alive back in Florence, right? Why would he do that, yes?

Oh, he's in hell. Go with the flow, right? I know this too. Like as he, as we descend, you know, further we descend. He, his responses seem to be more pious, more cruel. Okay. All right. So let me tell your story, okay?

This happened in China where there were two students at Qinghua University, or was it Piggy University? I can't remember, okay, but one of the top universities in China. And they're best friends, and their roommates. And one of the girls receives a graduate offer from Princeton University. Okay. Okay. And she's not in a dorm. It's her classmate who gets it. Okay. So what does a classmate do? They're best friends. They've been dorm mates for the past four years. They're both aspiring to go to the Ivy League. One of them gets in. The envelope comes to the other person. What does other person do with that envelope? Can you guys guess? She's forced it away.

Isn't there like email now? I understand. I'm saying like before in the 90s, okay? Why would that happen? Jealousy. Yeah. But like, but like, let's explain this, okay? Let's feel like this.

They've been living together for four years, right? They're at the best university in the world. Regardless of what happens, both will aspire to both will live great lives, right? Even if they say in China, they're still going to be great people. They'll be rich and all that. Yes? I think it's the fact that it's harder to accept

the person you are the closest with who are equal to you in every way at least in your eyes suddenly got so elevated out of you so there's also an allegory that if a craps is trying to climb out of the body other crabs will grab him down no okay I understand that

that's that that's correct yes I understand but I'm saying like what sort of culture what sort of environment would create that right because in theory right you would want the best for your friend you like if you receive the envelope you would open it

and you'd be like oh my god my best friend got into Princeton let me tell the whole world let's organize a big surprise party for her right that's what you should naturally do so what's the question I'm asking is like what's of culture what sort of environment what's of society would make someone

do that yes a culture that oh sorry sorry you you and that you're okay That could be meritocracy, because if you think you provided the same efforts, then if someone has something you... It's a meritocracy, okay? It's the meritocracy. This is the key.

Yes. Okay? And how do we know it's a meritocracy? Because we live in it, okay? We know exactly what happens in the meritocracy. All these students, but did you? Just to add, I think that was what I was trying to say also. You see this a lot in sibling rivalry.

Yes. Because the closer you are to another person, the more. more it impacts you their success they're so so you know right so a meritocracy is a high pressure winner takes all unforgiving culture right don't and gido are competing to be the best poet in italy and right now who who's part in the lead no the other guy okay right you understand That's why he tears up that envelope. He's like, screw this. You understand?

Okay? So there's a lot of things going on, and that's why this is a great story, because it shows you how sinful Dante is, right? He's full of fear, anger, and hatred. But at the same time, it gives you a glimpse into the larger Florentine society where only the best or appreciated everyone else is discarded. Right? And it's no different from today because back then it was a bit of a meritocracy, but today it's also a meritocracy. And do you guys like living in a meritocracy?

Probably not, okay? I mean, I don't, but I mean, you could. So do you guys understand this? What's going on? Yes? It's a culture of winners and losers, right? Whenever in a pure meritocracy, it will be hierarchical. And obviously, by numbers, sheer number of souls being happy, you'd have less of it.

Right. Okay. And ideally, you would live in a society of community, right, where people are helping each other. But here, in Florence at this time, it's winner-take-all. It's, yes? But meritocracy gives equal chances to, relatively can give equal chances to people who were not born, who didn't win the birth lottery. And also, you could say it has high efficiency. Yes, yes. That's what you. what you were taught. What's, yeah, but yes. I see some quite interesting parallels between the meritocracy argument and how we saw in Paradiso, the arguments against logic. Because it's this idea that, oh, we have this system and through logic or pure meritocracy,

we will come to some ideal solution, but we see both with meritocracy and the idea of logic that we don't, there's something deeper there. Yeah, I mean, like, okay, I mean, like, let's think about, how schools work nowadays, right? Kids go in and they compete against each other on tests. And if you do it on tests, you're smart. If you don't do it on test, you're stupid. And the smart kids are funneled into elite universities

where they can be against more people, then they are funneled into life where they compete against more people, right? Are these kids happy? Probably not, okay? So then you ask yourself, what's the point of this? Yes. So what would be the opposite of meritocracy?

You know, what would be, what other system would you put in place rather than meritocracy? Okay. Um, well, what are some other options we have? Because to me, intuitively, the opposite of meritocracy is like nepotism or favoritism or, uh, you know, like, you know, birthright. and that stuff. Okay. So yeah, you're right. Okay. So one possibility is the aristocracy, right? Where you have nobility in charge and they're in charge forever. Why would that be a bad system? Yes. Because power is inherited. So you have to win the birth lottery in aristocracy.

Some nobility is passed down to blood and you cannot, other people cannot have a chance. Okay, so there's no social mobility. Yes? Yeah. I mean, if the same people are in power, and then the parents always like give their same values to their children and nothing will ever change. So there will be no like mobility, social mobility, no like change basically. So are you saying we have social mobility in a meritocracy? More than in, more than an aristocracy. Okay.

I suggest going to an elite university and like just doing a study of like how many rich kids. there are there, okay, as opposed to, like, poor kids, yes? Yes, isn't half of all elite universities, like legacy? Yes, I appreciate that, yes. And are you calling that a meritocracy,

then? It seems like that's a problem, right? Like, yes? Yeah, I was just going to say meritocracy. That's why it's just a label, right? It's whatever we want to call it. It's just using the same stick to measure society, like money, like all these prestige and all that, right?

Okay, so, so, okay, we have a situation where basically half the kids at these elite universities, but not at Yale, right? No, not a Yale. So, at least half the kids there are legacies. So it's basically an aristocracy or an oligarchy, okay? But how are they different from previous nobility? Yes? I feel like in a meritocracy, people value their own personal skill more than where they come from and like the connections that they have. For example, in a meritocracy, we value education.

We value people who have skill and talent. And we value like critical thinking and problem solving and all these skills rather than like who you're a family. family is and what your birthright is. Is that really true? Yes. So I think meritocracy is like an upgrade from aristocracy, which is purely legacy. So like right now in America, elite university, if you read Columbia professors, the excellent sheep, it talks about the problem with meritocracy that kids in elite universities think that they earn their place by hard work.

But I also learn about educational philosophy and research. that social economic status have a better, bigger impact on the kid's IQ than the IQ itself. Like, you know, on the kids' academic performance, then their brain powers and everything else combined. And so therefore, meritocracy today, it is still, in a way, affected by aristocracy. But if you truly believe in meritocracy, you'll be like, oh, I earn all this because I worked so hard. and you didn't know that your parents actually also gave you the birth lottery. Yeah, so that's the first problem of meritocracy, okay? Yes, I know meritocracy is about feariness,

but why is it then that we live in a point in history when there's never been much more inequality and lack of social mobility, okay? This is just, I'm like, it's true. There's just, like, this time in history, the year we're living in now is the most unequal in human history. Okay? And a lot of the reason is that people who've been from,

So they deserved it. Right? So there are much more likely to increase inequality because they think that is this fear. Whereas before, nobility, at least they were embarrassed about it, right? Okay? That's the first problem.

Second problem is, I don't mean it's actually true that the meritocracy people care about skills and talent. I think in meritocracy, people care more about credentials. Right? And sometimes credentials and skills are not the same thing. Okay. So again, we're just thinking about our context and how to apply it to Darnage context.

Okay. But regardless, one major issue at this time in history in Florence is a competition among people so that they think that they're all enemies. Even friends think they're enemies. Okay. And this antidote illustrates that. right and I mean this I mean like what Donnie did is it is it pretty bad well it's cool right I mean it's no different from the classmate ripping up that Princeton offer right and just like

hiding it from her classmate it's pretty cruel and that's the idea here where this competition is leading people to the greatest cruelty like the father is dead man the father is burning and Yeah, it's a killing him twice. Excuse me? It's a killing him twice. Yeah, right? Because, like, your only consolation if you're burning in hell is, well, at least my son is doing well back in Florence.

He's still a great poet, right? Because, like, obviously, him asking the question just shows him how proud he is of his son, right? If you, Donna can get here, well, so get my son. Right? So it's his love for the son. And that pisses dante. I was like, no, you know, your son is also burning hell. Thank you very much.

All right. But you see how this one story is just revealing to us a larger social context. Okay, all right. Let's keep on going. Line 73. But that great-hearted one, the other shade at whose request I'd stayed, did not change aspect or turn aside his head or leaner bend. And taking up his words where he'd left off. If there was slow, he said, to learn that art that is more torment to me than this bed.

And yet the lady whose ruler here will not have her face kindled 50 times before you learn how heavy is that art. And so may you return to the sweet world? Tell me, why are those citizens so cruel against my kin and all of their decrees? Okay, so now Donny's left Cavicante, because Carvercantate is in despair, right? And now he's talking to Farinita. And Faranita is also contemporary of Dante, and Faranita is an aristocrat who, who led Darnie's enemies to conquer Florence. Remember, at this time, Florence is in the civil war between the Ghibelians, who are aristocrats, nobility,

and the Gwelves. The Gwelves are merchants, they are the middle class, and Darnie belongs to the Gwelf's. So this is a class warfare, and the Ghiblins are supported by the Holy Roman Emperor, and the Gwelves are supported by the Pope. Eventually, the Gwelves themselves will fracture between the black Guelves and the white Guilines.

Okay, but the Farah Nita, he is a gibbling, okay? He's an aristocrat, okay? All right. Can you keep on reading? Line 85, to which I said, the carnage, the great bloodshed that stains the waters of the Arbia Red have led us to such prayers in our temple. He sighed and shook his head, then said, in that I did not act alone, but certainly I did not have joined the others without cause.

But where I was alone was there where all the rest would have annihilated Florence had I not interceded forcefully So this is a very famous episode from this history where after the Ghibelins take over Florence They want to kill all the Guelves. Okay? They want to kill all the families of the Guelves and Destroy all the property of the Guelves and Verenita he intervenes and says no we can't do that because this is Florence we are first and foremost citizens of Florence and then we are gibilins, then we are partisans. Okay. So, so he hierarchically saves Florence and Donne is picking him homage here. Okay, keep on going.

Line 94. Ah, as I hope your seed may yet find peace. I asked, so may you help me to undo the knot that here has snarled my course of thought? It seems if I hear right that you can see beforehand that which time is carrying, but you're denied the sight of present things. We see even as men who are far-sighted those things, he said, that are remote from us, the highest Lord allots us that much light. But when events draw near or are, our minds are useless.

Were we not informed by others, we should know nothing of your human state. So you can understand how our awareness will die completely at the moment when the portal of the future has been shut. Then, as a penitent for my omission, I said, will you now tell that fallen man, his son, is still among the living ones? And if a while ago I held my tongue before his question, let him know it was because I had in mind the doubt you've answered. Okay, so here Dante is so embarrassed. He tells Farinita, I can't go back to Cavalcante and apologize, right?

But could you do it for me, please? Okay. So again, it shows you how problematic Dante is at this stage in his life, right? He's full fear, hatred, and envy. Kim on going. Line 115. And now my master was recalling me so that, more hurriedly, I asked the spirit to name the others who were there with him.

He said, more than the thousand lie with me. The second Frederick is but one among them, as is the cardinal. I name no others. With that, he hid himself and pondering the speech that seemed to me so menacing. I termed my steps to meet the ancient poet. He moved ahead, and as we made our way, he said to me, why are you so dismayed? I satisfied him, answering him fully. And then that sage exhorted me.

Remember the words that have been spoken here against you. Now pay attention. And he raised his finger. When you shall stand before the gentle splendor of one whose gracious eyes see everything, then you shall learn from her your lifetime's journey. Following that, his steps turned to the left, leaving the wall and moving toward the middle along a path that strikes into a valley whose stench as it rose up disgusted us.

Okay, so, you know, Virgil sees the anguish in Dante's face, and so Virgil asked what's wrong, and Donne explains, well, because I lied to cover content, told him his son was dead, and Virgil is like, focus on your mission, Dante, okay? You are about to meet Beatrice, focus on that. All right. All right, let's go to 11, please. Conto 11. along the upper rim of a high bank formed by a ring of massive broken boulders, we came above a crowd more cruelly pent. And here, because of the outrageous stench thrown up in excess by that deep abyss, we drew back till we were behind the lid of a great tomb, on which I made out this inscribed. I hold Pope Anastasius and ties to leave the true path by Fotinus.

It would be better to delay dissent so that our senses may grow somewhat used to this foul stench, and then we'd can't ignore it. So said my master, and I answered him, do find some compensation, lest this time be lost, and he, you see, I've thought of that. My son within this ring of broken rocks, he then began, there are three smaller circles, like those that you're leaving, they range down. Those circles are all full of cursed spirits, so that you're seeing of them may suffice. Learn now the how and why of their confinement. A very malice that earns hate in heaven, injustice at the end, and each such end by force or fraud brings harm to other men. However, fraud is man's peculiar vice, God finds it more displeasing, and therefore the fraudulent

or lower suffering more. Okay, so they're just sitting down to hell, and they will first enter the circle of violence. And there are three different types of violence, okay? Violence against others, violence against yourself, suicide, and violence against God. Okay? That's the circle of violence, and then they'll go even further down to the circle of fraud. Okay, so what Virgil tells Dante is that fraud is worse than violence. Can someone guess why that be the case?

Why wouldn't Dante's framework, fraud is worse than violence? Like violence is like you kill someone, right? But what's fraud? Fraud is just you lie to someone. Why is that different? Yes? because fraud impacts the imagination of someone and you like destroy a part of their reality for like to something that's not even true so when you when you when you kill someone they're dead but when you when you like lie to someone you kill their perception of reality which is even worse because they can't experience life as it is but They like have to live up to a lie.

Exactly. That's exactly correct. Yes. Okay. So did you want to add to that or? Okay. All right. So again, the framework, right?

Donnie wants us to live a life of faith, hope, and love. But for that to happen, you have to have faith. But if you are lying to you all the time, right? Or people are cheating all the time. That makes you question reality itself. That makes you question your own faith. And so that's problematic. whereas if someone does violence to you it's like well you know the guy's an ass or whatever okay

okay let's let's keep on going line 28 the violent take all of the first circle but since one uses force against three persons that circles build of three divided rings to god and to oneself and to one's neighbor i mean to them or what is there as one can do violence as you shall now hear clearly violent death and painful wounds may be inflicted on one's neighbor his possessions may suffer ruin fire, and extortion. Thus murderers and those who strike in malice, as well as plunderers and robbers, these in separated ranks, the first ring racks. A man can set violent hands against himself or his belonging, so within the second ring repents, though uselessly whoever would deny himself your world, gambling away, wasting his patrimony, and weeping where he should instead be happy.

One can be violent against the godhead, one's heart denying, but spieving him, and scorning nature, and the good in her. So with sign, the smallest ring has sealed both Sodom and Khorst and all those who speak in passionate contempt of God. Now fraud, that eats away at every conscience, is practiced by a man against another who trusts in him, or one who has no trust. This latter way seems only to cut off the bond of love that nature forges,

thus nestled within the second circle war. Okay, so again, here explains it, right? The problem with fraud is it destroys, people's capacity to trust. But trust, there can be no love. Okay, that's why it's worse than violence. Okay. Uh, keep on going. Line 58. Hypocrisy and flattery, sorcerers and false of fire, simony and theft and bariters and panderers and like trash. And in the former way of fraud, not only the love that nature forges is forgotten, but added love that builds a special trust. Thus in the tides circle where there is the universe's center, seat of dis, all traders are

consumed eternally. Master, your reasoning is clear indeed, I said. It has made plain for me the nature of this pit and the population in it. But tell me, those the dense marsh holds, or those driven before the wind, or those on whom rain falls, or those who clash with such harsh tongues, why are they not all punished in the city of flaming red if God is angry with them? And if he's not, why then are they tormented? Okay, so, okay, so the last three major circles are fraud, uh, sorry, violence, fraud, and treachery. Why is treachery the worst possible sin?

Uh, yes? Because, uh, society-wide, uh, treachery will have knock on effects because if you're treacherous to someone else, then they're more likely to do it to someone else and Exactly. Exactly. That's idea, right? where love is a virtuous circle, but treachery is a vicious circle. If you betrays by someone else, your first instinct is you will portray another person, right?

It's a chain of events. That's why treachery is the worst possible because it is altering the very fabric of reality itself. Okay? Fraud distorts your perception of reality. It makes you misperceive reality, but treachery makes you want to shape reality against God. And that's why it's the worst possible sin. Okay, doesn't make sense? All right, let's keep our going.

Line 76. And then to me, why does your reason wander so far from its accustomed course, he said, or of what other things are you now thinking? Have you forgotten then the words with which your ethics treats of those three dispositions that strikes at heaven's will, incontinence and malice and mad bestiality? And how the fault that is the least condemned

and least offense God is incontinence. If you consider carefully this judgment and call to mind the souls of upper hell who bear their penalties outside the city. You'll see why they have been set off from these unrighteous ones and why when heaven's fensions hammers at them, it carries lesser anger. Okay, so Donniss is asking, like, why is hell partitioned in this way? And Virgil says, well, because of incontinence, malice, and mad viziality, okay? Incontinence is basically, you're not taking yourself seriously.

You lack will, right? That's why lust and wrath and greed and gluttony are outside of the capital city. They're not that serious. You're just doing harm to yourself. Whereas if you go into this and you see heresy and fraud, it's malice to other people. Okay. That's why they have to be punished separately. Okay.

Let's keep on going. 91. Oh, son, that heals all sight. That is perplexed. When I ask you, your answer so content that doubting pleases me as much as knowing. Go back a little to that point, I said, where you told me that usury offence divine goodness, unravel now that not. Philosophy for one who understands points out, and not just in one place, he said, how nature follows. As she takes her course, the divine intellect and divine art, and if you read your physics carefully,

not many pages from the start, you'll see that when it can, your art will follow nature, just as a pupil imitates is master so that your art is almost God's grandchild. From these two are to nature, it is fitting, if you recall how Genesis begins, for men to make their way to gain their living, and since the user prefers another pathway, he scores both nature and herself and art, her follower. His hope is elsewhere. But follow me, for it is time to move. The fish is glitter now on the horizon, all the weight is spread out over chorus. Only beyond can one climb down the cliff. money money lenders punished? Why are users punished?

Why are bankers punished? And Donnie comes from a banking family, by the way. Right? His father was a money lender. Why are What's the problem with users? Yes. Maybe because fraud. Because the banker always keeps

telling the line. No, no, it's not fraud. It's something else. What is it? I think in the Bible, it was a sin to lend money and everything because it doesn't produce any actual good. It's like using money to make money. so you don't actually pay or work hard, you know, to earn your money. Right, exactly. Okay.

So do you understand this idea, right? Faith, hope, and love is that you are part of the creation process. You are a co-creative of God. But with money lending, you're charging interest. So you are basically exploiting other people's capacity to co-create with God. You're not doing anything. You're just charging interest. Does that make sense?

That, yes? So I, my initial guess was that it was really, to like the Jewish ability to lend money where the Christian had a prohibition against it. But you just said that Dante's family were money lenders. So can you reconcile the difference that Dante is now committing his father to hell, essentially? Yeah. So this is like really interesting. But if you contrast, if you just look at everyone from Donnie's life, okay?

The vast majority of them are actually in hell, okay? some of them in purgatory this is exactly one his great-grandfather who is in heaven and that's a great thing about Dante right he's like don't think about family don't think about friends think about god's justice think about what god's will is think about things objectively if you can go beyond faction if you can go beyond family then god's reasoning will make sense to you yes i think that's what Jesus also preached him exactly he told all his disciples that they should all leave their families behind and start a new life where they are not bound to their yeah right and like if you think about the greatest act of faith hope and love at this time in history is to leave your family behind right

because like at this time the only thing you can depend on is your family right so so so so what both Jesus and donner are saying is is live a life of justice and God will support you. And that's a life of faith, love, and hope. Okay, all right. All right, let's keep on going. Conte 12. The place that we had reached for our descent along the bank was Alpine.

What reclined upon that bank would to repel all eyes. Just like the toppled mass of rock that's struck because of earthquake or eroded props, the a ditch on its flank, the side of Trent, where from the mountain, from which it thrust down to the plain, the rock is shattered so that it permits a path for those above. Such was the passage down to that ravine and the edge of above the cracked abyss. There lay outstretched the infamy of Crete, conceived within the counterfeited cow, and catching sight of us, he bit himself like one whom fury devastates within. Turning to him, my sage cried out,

perhaps you think this is the Duke of Athens here who in the world above brought you your death. be off you beast this man who comes has not been tutored by your sister all he wants is coming here is to observe your torment so this is the monitor and of course the person who kills the monitor is Theseus who becomes the first king of Athens okay

that's just a mythological reference it doesn't really matter for the story keep on going line 22 just as the bull that breaks loose from its halter the moment it receives the fatal stroke and cannot run but plunges back and forth So did I see the Minotaur, I respond, and my alert guide cried,

Run toward the pass, it's better to descend while he's berserk. And so we made our way across that heap of stones, which often moved beneath my feet, because my weight was somewhat strange for them. While climbing down, I thought, he said, You wonder perhaps about that fallen mass watched over by the inhuman rage I have just quenched. Now I would have you know the other time that I descended into lower hell, this mass of boulders had not yet collapsed. But if I reasoned rightly, it was just before the coming of the one who took from this the high circle of splendid spoils that on all sides the steep and filthy valley had trembled so.

I thought the universe felt love, by which some believe the world has often been converted into chaos. And at that moment here as well as elsewhere, these ancient boulders toppled in this way. But fix your eyes below, upon the valley, for now we're near the stream of blood where those who endure others violently boil. O blind cupidity and insane anger, which go to us on so much in our short life, and steep us in such grief eternally, I saw a broad ditch bent into an arc so that it could embrace all of that plane, precisely as my guide had said before. Between it and the base of the embankment raised files of centaurs

who were armed with arrows, as in the world above, they used hunt. On seeing as a scent, they all reigned in, and after they had chosen bows and shafts, three of their number moved out from their ranks, and so far off one cried, What punishment do you approach as you descend the slope, but speak from here, if not, I draw my bow.

My master told him, we shall make reply only to Sharon. When we reach aside, your hasty will has never served you well. Then he nudged me and said, That one is Nessus, who died because of lovely deonir, and of himself wrought vengeance for himself.

In the middle, gazing at his chest, his mighty Sharon, tutor of Achilles. The third is Folas, he who was so frenzied. And many thousands wheeled around them out, their arrows aimed at any soul that thrusts above the blood more than its guilt allots. By now we had drawn near those agile beasts.

John drew out an arrow with the notch. He parted his beard back upon his jaws. When he uncovered his enormous mouth, he said to his companions, have you noticed how he who walks behind moves what he touches? That souls are not accustomed to. do that. And my good guide now near the centaurs chest, the place where his two natures met replied, he's indeed alive and so alone it falls to me to show him the dark valley. Necessity has brought him

here, not pleasure. For she who gave me this new task was one who had just come from singing hallelujah. He's no robber. I'm not a thief. But by the power that permits my steps to journey on so wild a path, give us one of your band to serve as our companion and let him show us word forth the ditch and let him bear this man upon his back for he's no spirit who can fly through air then sharon wheeled about and write and said to nesses then return and be their guide of other troops disturb you offend them off now with our faithful escort we advanced along the blood-red boiling ditches banks beside the piercing cries of those who boiled i saw some who were sunk up to their brows and that huge centaur said these are the tyrants who plunged their hands in blood and plundering here they lament their ruthless crimes

here both Alexander and the fierce dionagius who brought such years of grief to Sicily. That brow with hair so black as Esolino, that other there, the blonde one, is Obitso Veste. He who is indeed undone, who was in the world above by his fierce son. Okay, all right, so they are in the first place of violence, and these are people who commit violence against others. And so for their sin, what's happening is that they are drowning. in a boiling lake, okay? And they ever try to get out of it, centers come and shoot arrows at them.

Okay, that's what they've done to other people, okay? Now, inside this boiling lake is accident of the grate. What's problematic about this? Why would this be paradoxical? What's the paradox here? When you think of an accidenta grade, who else do you think of? Genghis Khan. Genghis Khan.

Who else? Napoleon? Napoleon, who else? Hitler. Okay, guys, this is year 1300, okay? So let's not go too far. They don't even know who Gansk Con is at this time, okay? But I'm saying like in the year 1300, if you think of Ex-Endler the Great, who do you think of?

Caesar. Julius Caesar, right? Where's Julius Caesar? He's in limbo. I don't understand what's going on here. Why is Ex-Ingler Great in the Circle of Violence, but Julius Caesar is in limbo? they did the same thing right they're both great conquerors

they killed a lot of people for their own personal glory why would actually be in here the circle of violence and the julius caesar is like in limbo why would that happen

yes I mean my guess is like if Dante has Virgil as this guy Virgil cannot like see Caesar in heaven because Virgil was appointed by Augustus, the adopted son of Julius Caesar, to write the Inuit, right?

So, like, if he, like, sees Julius Caesar in one of the worst circles, then that'd be, like, pretty problematic. Exactly, okay, yeah, right? Because if Virgil is the great poet, and we will learn in paradise that the Roman Empire is what gives rise to Catholic Church and is part of God's will, Yeah, that makes sense, put Julius Caesar in limbo. But this raises another question. Where's Augusta Caesar? Okay? We'll ask Chatschipiti.

Let's ask Chachapit. All right. Just, just Google this. Like, where is Augusta Caesar in the Divine Comedy? Oh, wait, wait, sorry. Before we do this, can you guess where he'd be? Yes? Not lower, right?

Because who's more important? Julius Caesar, Augustus Caesar. I would think Augustus Caesar because Augustus Caesar is the one who create the Roman Empire, right? Which then becomes a Catholic Church. So where should he be? At least purgatory, at least limbo, possibly even in paradise, right? But let's figure this out, okay? Again, logically speaking, we just extend your logic, right?

He should be somewhere nice. Whether it's limbo or purgatory or even paradise. Where is... But where is August Caesar located in the divine comedy? Does he appear? Because of Caesar is one of most important historical figures, right? The greatest emperor of Rome, the man who created the Roman Empire. Where is he?

Where is he? I think he's in limbo. No, no, no, no. I'm asking you where in the divine comedy is. If we're looking for divine comedy, where can we find Augusta Caesar? In Conto 1, I think. Does it? No, I'm saying physically.

Like, where is he situated? Where does he say purgatory? We see Julius Caesar in limbo. We know he's there. We see Socrates in limbo. We know he's there. We see Alexander Great being born alive in the circle of violence. We know he is there.

But where is our guy's Caesar physically in the divine comedy? He's nowhere, guys. He does not exist physically in the divine comedy. But he does, he is reference in the line coming by who? Virgil is what keeps the memory of Augusta Caesar alive. But August Caesar has disappeared, right? So this is a huge problem. We know he's undergrade because it's written here.

He is burning circle of violence. We know Julius Caesar is in limbo. We don't know where Garza Caesar is. and the only time August Caesar is mentioned it's because Virgil speaks him out right, it's only Virgil that's keeping alive the man of Augusta Caesar this is very confusing right

okay so again it's meant so the subversive comedy first and foremost it's meant to be subversive it's meant to undermine our traditional understanding all things okay so do you think how do you think

how do you think Donnie feels about Augusta Caesar Well, just Can you explain? Conflict. The only reason I can think of that he's not there, other than when Virgil mentions him, is Dante cannot decide where to place him.

Yes. I mean, during Augustus, Jesus was killed. Yes. It was Augustus. No, it was not Augustus. It was Tiberius. Oh. Was it not during? Yeah, it was Tyberius. Okay, Taber was something.

Yeah, but it was during Augustus that Jesus was born, right? And what the Catholic Church teaches you is that without Augustus, then Jesus could not have been born, and the way could not have been paid for Christianity to arise, okay? So Jesus was killed during Tyberius, and Jesus was born during Augustus. Okay. Yes?

I think like Dante naturally don't like Augustus because it's uh because August is the one who ordered Virgil to write the A year, right? And it's also August the one who promotes piety, which is what Dante like disagree with. Right. So, so the greatest act of faith, love and hope is poetry, right? Virgil is a divine prophet, divine poet. That's how he's able to do this because God wielded its soul. Augustus Caesar, what he did was he took this gift of poetry, which is divine. He corrupted it to serve the ends of empire. And that's why Augustus is not mentioned, or sorry, he's mentioned, but he's not,

he's not given a place in divine comedy. Because what Donnie has done is he has, he has, he has, he has, He has basically cast him to a place worse than hell, which is annihilation. Okay. He is beyond the universe. God has forgotten him. God has cast him away from this universe. There can be absolutely no redemption for him.

Okay. God wants to forget about him because his crime was so great. It is the greatest crime in the world to try to corrupt. the message of God to serve your own political ends. Does that make sense, guys? Because, like, again, you have to explain to me

where Augustus is. He's not in the mind comedy. And he is one of the most important historical figures ever in history. Yes? But isn't Virgil then, like, I mean, he's part of this, right? Because he wrote it down. Like, he could refuse to write down this poetry that goes against God.

So, I mean... Right. That's why Virgil is in hell, right? But he's only in Limbaugh. Right, but he's still in hell. Right, okay? And also, like, remember, what Donnie's trying to do is he's trying to awaken the reader. You understand?

Because at this time in history, everyone is reading the Inniad. Everyone loves the Inniad because, you know, you're sort of forced to love the Inniad. And so he needs to. to take people away from the Indianian. It has to be a process of slow discovery, okay, an epithy where Virgil is probably the villain here, okay? And as we go on, we'll recognize this, but not at this stage. Does that make sense? It's a journey. Okay, it's not only a journey from sin into virtue, but it's also our journey from the darkness into the light. Okay? All right. Does it make sense, guys? All right. Let, let, let, let, let, let, let, let,

Let's keep on going. Line 115. A little farther on, the centaur stopped above a group that seemed to rise above the boiling blood as far up as their throats. He pointed out one shade alone apart and said, Within God's bosom, he impaled the heart that still dribs blood upon the Thames. Then I got caught sight of some who kept their heads and even their full chest above the tide, among them many whom I recognized. And so the blood grew always sat shallower until it only scorched the feet. And here we found a place where we could forge a ditch, port a ditch, a ditch.

Just as you see that on this side, the brook continually thins, the centaur said, so I should have you know the rivulet. Along the other side will slowly deepen its bed until it reaches once again the depth where tyranny must make lament. And there divine justice torments Attila, he who was such a scourge upon the earth, and pyrrars sextus to eternity. It milked the tears that boiling brook and laughs from Rainier of Coronado, Renier Pazzo, those two who waged such war upon the high roads.

Then he turned around and crossed the fort again. Conto 13. Nessus had not yet reached the other bank when we began to make our way across a wood on which no path had left its mark. No green leaves in that forest, only black. No branches straight and smooth, but not at gnarled. No fruits were there, but brewers bearing poison. Even those savage beasts that roam between Tchuschina and Cornetto,

beasts that hate tilled lands, do not have faults so harsh and dense. This is the nesting place of the foul harpies who chase the Trojans from the strutphates with sad foretelling of their future trials. Their wings are wide, their necks and faces human, their feet are taloned, their great bellies feathered, they utter their laments on the strange trees. and my kind master then instructed me before you enter farther know that now you're within the second ring and shall be here until you reach the horrid sand

therefore look carefully you'll see such things as would deprive my speech of all belief from every side I heard the sound of cries but I could not see any source for them so that in my bewilderment I stopped I think that he was thinking that I thought so many voices moaned among those trunks from people who had been concealed from us therefore my master said if you would tear a little twig from many of these plants the thoughts you have will also be cut off then i stretch out my hand a little way and from a great thorn bush snapped off a branch at which its trunk cried out why do you tear me and then when it had grown more dark with blood it asked again why do you break me off are you without all sentiment of pity we once were men and now are arid stumps your hand might well have shown us greater mercy had we been nothing more than

and souls of serpents. As from a sapling log that catches fire along one of its ends, while at the other it drips and hisses with escaping vapor. So from that broken stump issued together both words and blood, at which I let the branch fall, and I stood like one who's afraid. My sage said, winded soul, if earlier he had been able to believe what he had only glimpsed within my poetry, then he would not have set his hand against you.

But its incredibility made me urge him to do a deed that me deeply. But tell me who you were so that he made to make amends, refresh your fame within the world above, where he can slow return, to which the trunk. Your sweet speech draws me so that I cannot be still and may it not oppress you if I linger now in talk. I'm the one who guarded both the keys of Frederick's heart and turned them, locking and unlocking them, with such dexterity that none but I could share his confidence. And I was faithful to my splendid office so faithful that I lost both sleep and strength. The whore who never turned her harlot's eyes away from Caesar's dwelling, she who is the death of all and vice of every

court, inflamed the minds of everyone against me, and those inflamed, then so inflamed but gusted that my delight, honors, turned to sadness. My mind because of its sustainable temper, believing it could flee disdain through death, made me unjust against my own just self. I swear to you by the peculiar roots of this thornbush, I never broke my faith with him who was so worthy with my lord. If one of you returns into the world, then let him help my memory, which still lies prone beneath the battering of envy. Okay, so now we are in a forest, and these are people who have killed themselves.

They've committed suicide. They've committed no other sin, but suicide, okay? And what's happened is they've been transformed into trees. So they don't think their bodies seriously, so now their bodies are now just trees. And what happens is that the harpies come and eat the berries that they grow. They feel this eternal torment. And then Darnie talks to one of these trees, and this person is a person that Darnie knows as well, and he's a historical character, and he was a counselor to a king who was accused of treason.

He was virtuous, he was talented, but once he was accused of treason, he was innocent of treason, but he kills himself in despair. Okay? Why would this be a problem? Why would this be a sin? Why is suicide a sin? Yes? So firstly, you're abandoning all of faith, hope, and love.

And secondly, similarly to treachery, I think, society-wide, it damages other people and could therefore affect other people's potential to love and connect in the future. Exactly. That's exactly correct. Yes. first of all, you are supposed to live a life of faith, hope, and love. And this is the opposite, right? Where you just don't believe in God anymore. It's basically rejecting God and says, you know, like, this is so hopeless, even God can't save me.

Okay? The other thing is, like, you become a bad role model to other people as well. You show that you, who is a very virtuous, talented person, you of all people, should have faith, hope, and love. And by abandoning yourself, you abandoning God and you abandon society as well, okay? All right, so thank you. Excellent. All right, let's keep on going. My mind, because of its disdainable temper,

believing it could flee disdain through death, made me unjust against my own just self. I swear to you by the peculiar roots of this thorn bush and ever broke my faith with him who was so worthy with my lord. If one of you returns into the world, then let him help my memory, which still lies prone beneath the battering of envy.

The poet waited briefly, then he said to me, Since he's silent, do not lose this chance, but speak and ask what you would know. And I, do you continue ask of him whatever you believe I should request? I cannot. So much pity takes my heart. Then he began again. In prison spirit, so may this man do freely what you ask.

May it please you to tell us something more of how the soul is bound into these knots and tell us if you can, if anyone can ever find his freedom from these limbs. At this, the trunk breathed violently. Then that wind became this voice. ye shall be answered promptly when the savage spirit quits the body from which it has torn itself that minot sends it to the seventh maw it falls into the wood and there's no place to which it is allotted but wherever fortune has flung that soul that is the space where even as a grain of spelt it sprouts it rises as a sapling a wild plant and then the harpies feeding on its leaves cause pain

and for that pain provide event like other souls we shall seek out the flesh that we have left but none of us shall wear it. It is not right for any man to have what he himself has cast aside. We'll drag our bodies here. They'll hang in the sad wood, each on the stump of its vindictives' shade. And we were still intent upon the trunk, believing it had wanted to say more when we were overtaken by a roar. Just as the hunter is aware of chase and bore as they draw near his post, he hears the beast, and then the branches as they crack.

And there upon the left were two who scratched and naked, fled so violently that they tore away each four, bow they passed the one in front now come death quickly come the other shade who thought himself as though was shouting after him lano your legs were not so nimble at the joust of topo and then perhaps because he'd lost his breath he fell into one tangle with a bush behind these two black bitches filled the wood and they were just as eager and as swift as grey hounds that have been let off their leash they set their teeth in him where he had crouched and piece by piece those dogs dismembered him and carried off his miserable limbs. Then he who was my escort took my hand,

he led me to the lacerated thorn that wept in vain where it was bleeding, broken. O'iacobo, it said, the Santo Andrea, what have you gained by using me a screen? Am I to blame for your indecent life? When my good master stood beside that bushp, he said, Who are you who through many wounds

must breathe with blood your melancholy words? And he to us, of spirits who have come to witness the outrageous laceration that leaves so many of my branches torn, collect them at the foot of the sad thorn. My home was in the city whose first patron gave away to John the Baptist. For this reason, he'll always use his art to make it sorrow, and if along the crossing of the Arno,

some effigy of Mars had not remained, the citizens who afterward rebuilt their city on the ashes that till I had loved to them would have travailed in vain. I made of my own house my gallows place. Okay, let's move on to count of 14. I'm sorry we're going too fast, okay? But again, we're trying to finish the non-compancy, and we're trying to develop the major themes of it, okay?

So the next few contos are extremely important. And here again, we're trying to figure out what is wrong with Florence. Conto 14. Love of our native city overcame me. I gathered up the scattered boughs and gave them back to him whose voice was spent already. From there we reached the boundary that devised the second from the third ring and the sight of a dread work that justice had devised. To make these strange things clear, I must explain that we had come upon an open plain that banished all green things from its bed.

The wood of sorrow is a garland around it, just as that wood is ringed by a sad channel. Here at the very edge we stayed our step. The ground was made of sand, dry and compact, a sand not different and kind from that on which the feet of Cato had once tramped. O vengeance of the Lord, how you should be dreaded by everyone who now can read whatever was made manifest to me. I saw so many fox of naked souls all weeping miserably, and it seemed that they were ruled by different decrees. Some lay upon the ground flat on their backs. Some huddled in a crouch, and there they sat, and others moved about incessantly. The largest group was those who walked about, the smallest, those supine and punishment, but these had loosed their tongues to tell their torment. above that plain of sand distended flakes of fire showered down their fall was slow as snow descends on alps when no wind blows just like the flames that alexander saw in india's hot zones were when fires fell intact into the ground on his battalions for which wisely had the soldiers tramp the soil to see that every fire was bent before new flames were added to the old so did the never-ending heat descend with this the sand was kindled just as tender on meeting flint will

flame, doubling the pain. The dance of wretched hands was never done. Now here, now there, they tried to beat aside the fresh flames as they fell, and they began to speak. My master, you who can defeat all things except for those tenacious demons who tried to block us at the entryway, who sat giant there who does not seem to heed singeing. He who lies in scorns and scowls, he whom the reins can't seem to soften. And he himself, on noticing that I was querying my guide about him cried. That which I was in life, I am in death, through Hovey, where out the smith from whom he took and wrath the keen-edge thunderbolt with which on my last day I was to be transfixed. And if he tired the others one by one in Montibello at the Suti Forge while bellowing,

oh, help, good Vulcan help, just as he did when there was war at Flegre, and cast his shafts at me with all his force, not even then would he have happy vengeance. then did my guide speak with such vehemence that i had never heard him use before o capania is for your arrogance that is not quench you're punished all the more no torture other than your own madness could offer pain enough to match your wrath but then with gentler face he turned to me and said that man was one of seven kings besieging thebes he held and still it seems holds god in great disdain despising him but as i told him now his maledictions did well as honour or ornaments upon his chest and now follow me and take care do not set your feet upon the sand that's burning hot but always keep them back close to the forest in silence we had reached a place where float a slender water course out of the wood a stream whose redness makes me shudder still as from bullet came pours a brook whose waters then are shared by prostitutes so did the stream run down across the sand its bed and both its banks were made of stone together with the slopes along its shores so that I saw passageway lay there. Among all other things that I have shown you since we first made our way across the gate,

whose threshold is forbidden to no one. No thing has yet been witnessed by your eyes as notable as this red rivulet, which quenches every flame that burns above it. These words were spoken by my guide. At this, I begged him to bestow the food for which he had already given me the craving. A devastated land lies in mid-sea, a land that is called Crete, he answered me. under its king the world once lived chastely. Within that land there was a mountain blessed with leaves and waters and they called it Ida.

But it is withered now like some old thing. It once was chosen as a trusted cradle for Ria for her son, to hide him better when he cried out she had her servant's clamor. Within the mountain is a huge old man who stands erect, his back turned to Wadamietta and looks at Rome as if it were his mirror. The old man's head is fashion. and a fine gold. The pure silver forms his arms and chest, but he is made of brass down to the cleft. Below that point, he's of choicest iron except for his right foot, made of baked clay, and he rests

more on this than on the left. Each part of him makes up the gold is cracked, and down that fissure there are tears that drip. When gathered, they pierce through that caverns floor, and crossing rocks into this valley from acron and sticks to flag thon, and then they make their way down this tight channel. And at the point past which there's no descent, they form coxitas. Since you're to see what that pool is, I'll not describe it here. And I asked him, but if the rivulet must follow such a course down from our world, why can we see it only at its boundary? And he, to me, you know this place is round, and though the way that you have come is long, and always toward the left and toward the bottom, you still have not completed all the

circle so that if something new appears to us, it need not bring such wonder to your face. And I again, Master, where's Fledg-Thon and where's leaf, you omit the second and say this reign of tears has formed the first. I'm pleased indeed, he said, with all your questions, yet one of them might well have found its answer already when you saw the red stream boiling. You shall see leaf. But past this abyss, there are where the spirits go to cleanse themselves where their repented guilt is set aside. Then he declared, The time has come to quit this wood.

See that you follow close behind me. These margins form a path that does not scorch, and over them all flaming vapor is quenched. Okay, all right, so two comments, okay? The first comment is that clearly the geography of hell really matters, okay? If Donny is going to spend a lot of time describing how these rivers glow, how hell is constructed the way it is, then it clearly matters.

But again, I don't have the knowledge of the occult of rituals of magic to fully appreciate why this matters. Clearly, if you visualize this, there is symbology at work, right? At this time in history, it's very common for people to engage in magic, basically using symbols, using chants, using rituals, in order to summon angels to summon demons. if you were to, again, draw this out, if you were actually to act this out, then that gives you insight into how these things work. But again, I'm not, I don't have any expertise in symbology, in the occult, in magic. I don't enough to comment, okay? So if you really want to send Dante, then you need to do a lot more research into the occult. That's point one. Point two is, what is strange about this canto is, for the first time, we are meeting a non-human who's being punished, right?

Throughout the inferno, we met humans, and they could be mythological or real, but they're being punished. And for the first time, we are meeting a non-human, a giant who's being punished. And what is his reaction to being punished? And in this And in this, it's violence against God. Everyone's running. There's like fire and brimstone being held, being rained down on them. So they're trying to dodge all these missiles.

And how does this giant feel about all this? Anyone? What is his reaction? He's crying. He's not crying. He's happy, right? Or rather he's trying to appear chill. Yeah, he doesn't care, right?

So what's a message here? You have a giant who's like, ah, whatever, man. Like, missiles are being rained on me. I don't care. Who cares? And the other humans are like dodging. The humans are dodging or running away. What's going on here?

And again, this is the only time when we have a non-human human being punished. And the entire scene is like, he's his complete apathy. And Virgil says, oh, you're so arrogant. What's the message here? Yes? I just guess maybe the great men do want the people care about them, but Danting do not care about him. It means that they're nothing. So maybe this is correct punishment for those great guys who think they're great, but actually they're not.

Yes, yes? Maybe because hell should only impact humans, you know, because the human is seen, or Danty sees the human. as the middle of the universe basically yeah so god doesn't really care about giants cares about humans more so what is the function of hell what does hell exist to force reflection yes okay so what's going on here is if you just analyze the text what is suggesting is that only we humans can be punished because only we humans can create our own path to redemption.

Does that make sense? The giant will not be redeemed. He doesn't really care, right? But we are being punished because at the very heart of who we are, we are a divine spark. That can never be extinguished. So even though it feels hopeless,

even though you've given up hope, there's still that spark in you and that's why you're being punished be to force reflection, to force you to recognize divine spark in you. And that's why the punishments are constructed the way they are, to show you what your sin has caused, to show you to visualize the sin for you, okay? All right.

And again, when Virgil talks to these people, what they always say is, talk to Dante so that he will read about you, so that he will be remembered, okay? And so even though you think you are in hell, remember, there are still people who remember who you are, and that is your path to redemption, right? The fact that regardless of how low you've sunk, remember, there's still people who remember you, there's still people who love you. Once you believe that, that is your path to redemption and salvation. Okay.

So for Donnie, what's really important to understand is that we're our own redemption and salvation. Okay, any more? Any questions or comments? All right, let's move on, okay? This is Canto 15 of Inferno. Conto 15. Now one of the hard borders bears us forward, the river mist forms shadows overhead

and shields the shores and water from the fire. Justice between Wissund and Bruges, the Fleming's in terror of the tide that floods toward them, have built a wall of dikes to daunt the sea, and as the paduans along the brenta built bulwarks to defend their towns and castles, before the dark dides fall on Currantana. Just so were these embankments,

even though they were not built so high and not so broad, whoever was the artisan who made them. Okay, so here in these lines, what Donne is revealing is that the geography of hell matches that of the geography of Italy. Okay, right? So this is clearly, he's trying to say that this hell that I am describing to you, I'm actually describing Italy at this point in history.

Keep on going. By now we were so distant from the wood that I should not have made out where it was, not even if I turned around to look. When we came on a company of spirits who made their way along the bank, and each stared steadily at us as in the dusk. Beneath the new moon men look at each other. They knit their brows and squinted at us, just as an old tailor at his needle's eye.

And when that family looked harder, I was recognized by one who took me by the hem and cried out. This is marvelous. That spirit having stretched his arm toward me, I fixed my eyes upon his baked brown features so that the scorching of his face could not prevent my mind from recognizing him. And lowering my face to meet his face,

I answered him, Are you here, Sir Brunetto? And he, my son, do not mind if Brunetto, Latino lingers for a while with you and let the file, lets the file he's with pass on ahead. Okay, okay,

so this is a very important passage in the Vancommon, okay? So let me explain what's going on. They are in the circle of violence, and these are, this is like the worst people. These are people who've committed violence against God and nature, okay? And so their main crime is homosexuality, basically. Salami.

And Sir Bernardo is very important because he's essentially Dante's teacher and father. This is a person that is dear to Donny's heart. Only Beatrice is actually more dear to Dante than Sir Brunato. And you can see in their words how affectionate they are towards each other. So Sir Brunetto, he is a homosexual, he's condemned to this circle, and he's running with other homosexual. in the circle.

And the thing is, if you stop, if you ever lie down, you rest, you're condemned even more, okay? So what he's saying is, like, Dante, I love you so much. I'm going to stop and be punished even more so that I can talk to you. Right. So this is showing the affection between Serbrenato and Dante. But this race is a really huge problem for us. Does Dante really think homosexuality is a problem? it's a sin, right?

This is, does Tony really believe this? So again, this is Sir Brunato, the person that Donny loves like a father. And Sir Pranato loves him like a son. And they've always been very close. And you would imagine that Dante would put him in either purgatory or in paradise. and he doesn't do that. He puts him in infernal. But knowing that, but he puts,

but Sir Brunetto was a virtuous person who really only, who only did one thing, which is like he was a homosexual. That was it, okay? That was the extent of his sin. And for that and for that only, he's condemned to run around with other homosexuals for all the eternity.

Okay, this is a huge paradox. Yes? I think it's because homosexuality cannot bear children. And so in that sense, you don't have the hope for the future because you don't have a future generation to remember you or to contribute to the creation of God. And so that's why Sautomie is such a big sin. Okay.

And so how would you compensate for that? What did he do to compensate for the fact that they didn't have children? What did he do to show that he had faith, hope, and love? Yes? Through education? To me? Through education? For education?

And what else? Can you get his guess? Well, he taught Dante, right? So... What did he teach Dante? Faith, hope, and loss. Like, what was he teacher off? Like, at this time in history.

Huh? Well, maybe poetry? Yeah, yeah, right? He was a poet. Right? So, yeah, okay, I understand. He doesn't want to have children. And that shows his lack of faith, love, and hope.

But we already said that poetry is always the expression of faith, love, and hope. Yes? Well, I think him being in hell just shows that it isn't Dante who puts him in hell, but it's the Catholic Church, and the Catholic Church says that homosexuality is a big sin, but Dante wouldn't say that, so it's not him who puts people in hell, right? It's the Catholic Church. But it's Donnie who put Beatrice in heaven. Do you understand?

So why would Donnie do that? Why would Donnie put Beatrice in heaven and then put his teacher, his father figure, in hell? And again, I mean, the only crime, the only sin that Surbarnanto is being accused of his homosexuality. Yeah, he was a homosexual sexuality. But do you really, really think Donnie cares that much about homosexuality? Yes? It was a boundary you couldn't cross and disagree with at the time. And so just like if he would just mention that homosexuality was fine, then his.

work would have been destroyed do you think homosexual was common at the time in history nobody it occurred or in some texts okay guys okay I hate to say this okay all right I'm sorry um this might get me bad on YouTube okay but if you look at every society okay regardless if it's in China or Italy at this time if you look at the elite okay I'm talking like like the nobility the elite okay Homosexuality was really, really common, guys. Really common.

Okay? You would not find me in a society where a wealthy society where they lead did not practice homosexuality in some form. Yes? And especially during the Hellenistic period that it is actually a greater

way to show your intellectual ability to have another male partner tend to have a wife because a wife is uneducated. You can have a soul. to so talk with her but you could with a younger boy and so that's why uh yeah the writer of uh the picture of dorian gray um Oscar Wilde really wanted that kind of yeah because he expired to the greek so yeah so right homosexual is very common i'm an elite and uh so what sir pornozo did he did nothing

wrong but just do what what all the elite did um not all they lead but not all they did But like, it was pretty common, man. It was really common, okay? Like, if you go to, like, Yale, okay? No, I have that. Well, yeah. Like, oh, yeah. Okay.

But, yeah, it's a common thing, okay? And among the elite, it's not a big deal. So, again, we have to figure out why this is happening. All right? Okay, all right. So, we'll do that after the break. Okay. Welcome back.

So to summarize what we learned this morning, remember that Dante is a profit. He's basically trying to create an allegory of hell to represent Italy, right? That's why he's focused so much on the geography of hell. He's describing a way that if you are Italian, you just recognize the geography right away. So hell as an allegory for Italy. And we know that ultimately, as a prophet, what Donnie is trying to convey to his audience is that, You either repent or you will be judged.

God's judgment will be swift, puto, and harsh. And no one listens. So in 1357, came in Black Death to wipe out around a third of Europe, even half of Europe at certain places. And so what we're trying to do is we're trying to figure out how Dante perceived his period at this time. And there's certain things about Florence that made it unredeemable. And what we're trying to figure out as well is our time, okay?

Like today. Do these things apply to today? So the first major characteristic about hell is it's factionalism, right? So whereas Virgil is essentially the Pope of hell, he is the authority figure, there are many factions who do actually listen to him. And there's always infighting going on. So there's a lot of factualism going on in Florence at this time. And the same is happening today, right, where you have wars going on, right? Second major characteristic of Florence is the intense economic pressure to succeed, right?

All that matters is success and achievement. And today we call this the meritocracy. And in a meritocracy, there are certain things that become common, and yet at the same time, they are inhumane. For example, the most obvious is just to apologize, right? So remember the scene where Dante lies to Cavalcante and says, your son is dead and burning in hell. And he causes tremendous despair to the father,

and Don A recognizes he did wrong, and rather than apologize, he runs away and tells someone else to tell him on his behalf, okay? So there is an almost incapacity to apologize. So let me ask you this question. Let's go back to the example where at Qinghua in the 80s or 90s, there are two classmates who are good friends. One gets in, the other receives the envelope,

and rather than tell the friend just throws the envelope in the garbage. And do you think that other person ever apologize in her life? Probably not, okay? I'm guessing not. But why? Why can she just apologize? Yes? Because she probably has a huge

ego and she feel like she's superior. She should be treated as equal to the other person. And she justifies what the, well, her deed, yes. Okay, yes, go ahead.

I mean, if she apologized, then the other girl would know that she would have got into Princeton in the first place. Well, eventually she found out, right? Because I'm like, you know, 20 years afterwards. 50 years afterwards, does she ever apologize? Probably not, but why?

Yes? Like, she knows what she has done is not, it's evil, it's not good. And it kind of like, she's saying like, I know it's bad. But it was evil, right? But if she doesn't apologize, it probably makes her feel better.

We're like, I don't know. Well, go ahead and then Carol, yeah? Maybe she can't forgive herself. So she can't forgive. So she can't say sorry to her roommate. Okay. Carol.

I think she feels she's wrong. in the first place. So why does she have to apologize? She was wronged by the world. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. So the thing about, um, I mean, the American Caucasus is like, first of all, you become the center of the world, right? But also like, you're keeping score everywhere. Doesn't make sense. So not only do you care about that other person's grades, but you also care about, hmm, does that person have a better house than I do? Does a person have better children than I do? You're always keeping score, right? And one way to keep score is how much wrong did you do, right?

Everything is a test, everything is a scorecard, right? So if I apologize, that means I'm not in this person's debt. I now owe him or her a favor, right? Rather than seeing an apology as rectifying a wrong, I see it as forcing myself to go into someone's debt. Okay, doesn't make sense. And that's why people don't apologize in a very, in a metacocracy.

But the other thing that's even more troubling in a meritocracy is and it's you delight in others' pain. You think about this, where, you know, you are at school, and for the past year, you delight in others' pain, okay? So for the past, for this entire year,

there's one student in the class, usually a girl, but she scores 100 on every single math test and you get like I don't know 80 85 on the final test on final exam she gets M70 and she is distraught

she's crying she's going bizarre how do you feel no you don't I put it you don't emphasize maybe she cheated on a previous test no no but I'm saying what is your emotion what is your emotion at this time

well I mean my emotion maybe depends on how it doesn't act to it no it doesn't it doesn't depend how you feel what is your emotion I'd be like finally finally okay you understand finally okay she finally failed right every single day the seizure is like oh she's the best in the world and like just be like her and then she's trying to screw it up okay so delight in others pain and we see this in the vying comedy where donna is crossing the river sticks right and this is the um

circle of wrath where people are angry and they tell each other apart. One of Dante's enemies from real life, Philippio, Argentina, he falls into this lake and the other souls are tearing them apart, okay? Literally tear him apart and Dante is ecstatic, right? So rather than feel pity, like, great, man, okay? And you know, it's not a good look, but what Donnie is doing is he's trying to be the problems and consequences of a meritocracy. What a meritocracy ultimately is, imagine a race, okay?

Imagine a race, and everyone's running as fast as they can. The person next to you trips and falls and breaks his or her ankle, right? What you should do as a human being is stop and help that person get up, but you don't. You just smile and run on. And you take the light and that other person falling down. And I mean, we live in China, we see this every single day, right? Unfortunately, where if you have, if you're a parent and you have kids, you put your kids through this incredibly harsh system, right?

And you see your child unhappy, and you see your child under a lot of stress, and quite honestly, a lot of them will develop psychological issues, but you keep on going, but you think that if I fall behind, I'm dead. Okay, so that is the first major issue. But now what Donnie is going to do is he's also going to be another issue, which is homosexuality. Okay? Homosexuality. And this is really confusing for us, right?

Because we've all seen Brobeck Mountain, right? We all know that for the longest time, homosexuals were persecuted in society. They had to hide. their love was forbidden. So isn't being a homosexual an act of faith, hope, and love? What does Donnie have against homosexuals? And you

can't be like, well, he's just a product of his times because as we said in his class, we have to assume that Donnie is perfect and that he is timeless. So what we need to figure out is what is the problem with homosexuality? And also, we need to be careful because

if I say anything bad about homosexuality, I'm pretty sure next time I'm at Yale, I'll get stoned to death. Yeah. So, yes, yes. You think I'm exaggerating, but I'm not, yes? So I actually had this conversation with my husband about this because I have a lot of gay friends

and I think they're the best in the world. And he's like, yeah, but there are problems with homosexuality. So we had this debate. So if anything I say, it's my husband. Okay, don't blame me, don't stone me. But he said that the actual problem with it, it's kind of the same as greed and all that other things, is that after you go through with all these acts or love or whatever, it brings to no fruitation of, because what essentially

sex is, at least the way God intended for Adam and Eve, is that you are supposed to be fruitful, multiply, and occupy the earth. But if you, you are gay or homosexual, then you essentially cannot, unless you adopt a kid, right? Like in modern family. But then he's saying that, And you go to all this act and love. And you don't appreciate the other gender, which is a different perspective. So if you are gay, you are men, you like the other man. Then you don't actually understand the women's perspective in the world. So in that way, you are in love with your own kind.

You're in love with men's perspective. And then that way. Okay, that's great. That's brilliant. Thank you so much for sharing that. But let me ask you this question, okay? It sounds the way your husband has defined homosexuality. It sounds like homosexuality, solomity,

sodomy belongs in the upper circles, like lust and gluttony and wrath, because you're not hurting anyone. All you're doing is you are not fulfilling your true potential as a human being. But in this circle, which is a circle of violence, right? The circle of violence, you actually have to hurt someone, right? So the question then is like,

how does homosexuality actually go about hurting other people? people. Yes? Well, it hurts women because it denies femininity in the world on earth because all the girls in this class are looking at you like, what are you talking about? Well, because it's normal. Yeah? In the Christian view. Maybe because, you know, I've met for in love as men, there's no result because there's no children. The problem with the argument is,

is you're saying that essentially the only purpose of a relationship is reproduction. Yeah, yeah, exactly. Okay, yeah, Jay and then Edward? In Dante's time, was there a lot of grooming going on? Like, did he, I'm just wondering from Dante's perspective, what did he see that made him structured this way? Exactly, okay? So there must be something about Dante's understanding of homosexuality

that made him resent it. Okay? Exactly. And he'll tell us in the next two contos. This is one point to him. he'll spend the next two condos on it. Yes? Maybe through the historical lens, when it's a man and a woman do it,

there's kind of like the ying and yang go together. Whereas when it's two men, the act is probably more graphic and more violent because you have two masculine energies. Right. Okay. Yeah, so, yes? I wonder if I have to do with elite circles,

where they think two men are superior to women, so they refuse to, so it's kind of almost the same as ego or arrogance that women are inferior. So it's making Eve kind of the sinful, the corrupt weak. Yes, yeah, very good point. Because we see in paradisio that the upper echelons of heaven were fully occupied by these women. And now we're getting into kind of like the depths of hell and then we're seeing things like. Think about all these gay men that you've met in your life. What are they obsessed about? Yes? Maybe because so mate.

Because if men, no more about men. Like gay man in their day, like what are they obsessed about? Yes? Could be pride. Excuse me? Pride. What do you about pride? Like they want to show.

they're part of this tribe and they want to like they're proud of it okay they're proud of being homosexual okay no sorry sorry let's let's go on my one yes six

they won't have a lot of sex yeah okay but what do they do every day uh yes I'd say they're but they would be obsessed about finding other gay men okay

yes yeah because it's difficult to no it's not there's not the 5th half sex okay you're gay man not in today well but back then probably uh not back then either okay it was actually pretty simple appearance yeah yeah if you meet a lot if you meet gay man okay the thing about them is like they're really obsessed with their parents much more so than woman right i mean is that a general

statement have a joke that if you find guy truly hot and sexy chances are he's gay because they they care about appearance more than straight men and and so this is like the same argument Is he gay or is he just European? Like, caring about your appearance is not something that you can just define as inherently gay. I don't think there's a logical correlation between that. If you care too much about your parents and all you care about your parents, what word would we have to describe you? Narcissus.

Yeah, narcissists, you understand. Remember narcissists? The narcissists, right? The Greek legend of this man so in love. love for himself, he looks at himself every single day. Okay? That gives us a clue as what Darnan's issue of homosexuality is. You're just looking at yourself every single day. And so, like, when you actually meet someone, like, what are you looking for in that person? Yourself, right? Okay. So that's Darnie's problem. But if that's by itself, okay, the other question then is,

why is he in the circle of violence? Because you're not actually hurting anyone. You're just like being narcissistic, right? Okay, all right. No, no, okay, like, that's a question we want to answer, okay? But, but yeah. Okay, let's keep on reading. Counto 15, line 34.

I think we're 31. Oh, 31. Okay. So this is Sir Brunato, who is the teacher and father figure to Dante. And again, he is in the circle of violence because of his violence against God. He's a homosexuality. He's a homosexual, which goes against God in nature. Verse 31. And he, my son, do not mind if Brunetto Latino lingers for a while with you and lets the file he's with pass on ahead. I said, with all my strength, I pray you stay. And if you have half,

You'd have me rest a while with you. I shall, if that please him, I go. O son, he said, whoever of this flock stops but a moment, stays a hundred years and cannot shield himself when fire strikes. Therefore move on. Below, but close, I'll follow, and then I shall rejoin you

company who go lamenting their eternal sorrows. I did not dare to leave my path for his own level, but I walked with head bent low, as does a man who goes in reverence. And he began, What destiny or chance has let you hear below before your last day came and who is he who shows the way there and the sunlit life above i answered before my years were full i went astray within a valley only yesterday at dawn i turned my back upon it

but when i was newly lost he here appeared to guide me home again along this path and he to me if you pursue your star you cannot fail to reach a splendid harbor if in fair life i judged you properly, and if I had not died too soon for this on seeing heaven was so kind to you, I should have helped sustain you and your work. But that malicious, that ungrateful people come down in ancient times from Fiescelay, still keeping something of the rock and mountain. For your good deeds will be your enemy and there is cause among the sour sorbs. The sweet fake is not meant to bear its fruit. The world has long since called them blind, a people presumptuous, avaricious, envious, be sure to cleanse yourself.

of their foul ways. Your fortune holds in store such honor for you, one party and the other will be hungry for you, but keep the grass far from the goat. For let the beasts of Fieselais find forage amongst themselves and leave the plant alone, if still among their dung it rises up, in which there lives again the sacred seed

of those few Romans who remain in Florence when such a nest of wickedness was built. Okay, so this is a direct reference to the Inniad, where Ineus visits his father in the underworld to receive his prophecy. And this mirrors that, okay? So again, this is a hudence in the fact that Suburrnato really is a father figure to Dante. Okay, keep on going. If my desire were answered totally, I said to Serpento, you'd still be among, not banished from humanity.

Within my memory is fixed and now moves me, your dear, your kind paternal image when in the world above from time to time, you taught me how man makes him. eternal and while I lift my gratitude for that must always be apparent in my words okay so he's being very explicit here right you're my father you my teacher everything I know is because of you right and he's saying that if I could I would have you still among us but he can because he wrote this thing okay so this is a huge paradox for us keep on going line 88 what do you have told me of my course I right, I keep it with another text for comment by one who understand if I may reach her.

One thing alone I'd have you plainly see, so long as I am not rebuked by conscience I stand prepared for fortune, come what may. My years find no new pledge in that prediction. Therefore, let fortune turn her wheel, as she may please and let the peasant turn his medic. At this, my master turned his head around and toward the right and looked at me and said, He who takes note of this has listened well. But nonetheless, my talk with Sarah Brunetto continues, and I ask of him who are his comrades of repute and excellence. And he to me, to know of some is good, but for the rest, silence is to be praised. The time we have is short for so much talk.

In brief, know that my company has clerics and men of letters and of fame, and all were stained by one same sin upon the earth. Okay, all right. Okay, so this is again very problematic. And he's saying that with me are men who are cleric. and men who are poets and men who are extremely successful, okay? So this is a huge problem because regardless of your achievements, you are still stuck here just because you happen like other men.

All right? This is very paradoxical. It is very, it is very, it is not something that we've ever seen from Dante before, okay? This doesn't make not make any sense on the surface. Come on going? No, nine. That sorry crowd holds Pritian and Francesco de Corso, and among them you can see if you have any longing for such scurf.

The one, the servant of his servant, sent from the Arno to the Bakiglione's banks, and there he left his tendon strained by sin. I would say more, but both my walk and words must not be longer, for beyond I see new spoke emerging from the sandy bed. Now people come with whom I must not be, let my tasoro in which I solely live be precious to you and I ask no more. And then he turned and seemed like one of those who race across the fields to win the green cloth at Verona. Of those runners, he appeared to be the winner, not the loser.

Okay, all right. So in next canto, Kahn 16, we will meet three really distinguished Florentines. These are aristocrats, and they're extremely virtuous. And back in Florence, everyone praises them. But again, just because of their homosexuality, they are condemned to the circle of violence. Okay, let's read. Conto 16. No sooner had I reached the place where one could hear a murmur like a beehive's hum of waters as they fell to the next circle,

when setting out together three shades ran, leaving another company that passed beneath the reign of bitter punishment. They came toward us, and each of them cried out. stop you who by your clothing seem to be someone who comes from our indecent country ah me what once i saw upon their limbs once new and old once that the flame seared in it paints me still as i remember it when they cried out my master paid attention he turned his face toward me and then he said now wait to these one must to these one must show courtesy and were it not the nature of this place for shafts of fire to fall i'd say that haste was similar for you than for those three. As soon as we sit still, they started up their ancient whale again, and when they reached us they formed a wheel, all three of them together. As champions, naked oiled, we'll always do each studying the group that serves him best before the blows and wounds begin to fall. While wheeling, so each one made sure his face was turned to me so that their necks opposed to feet in one uninterrupted flow.

Okay, so these three individuals are the three most distinguished members of the Florentine Nobel They are so distinguished that even Virgil admires and respects them. Okay, come on going. Line 28. And if the squalor of this shifting sand together with our baked and barrens features makes us in our request contemptible, one said, then may our fame incline our mind to tell us who you are, whose living feet can make their way through hell with such assurance. He in whose steps you see me tread, although he now must wheel.

about both peeled and naked was higher in degree than you believe. He was a grandson of the good Guadrada and Guido Guerra was his name. And light his sword and his good sense accomplished much. The other who behind me trampled sand, Tagayo Aldobrandi, one whose voice should have been heated in the world above. And I who shared this punishment with them with Jakopo Rusticucci. Certainly more than all else, my savage wife destroyed me. If I'd had shield and shelter from the fire, I should have thrown myself down among them.

I think my master would have sanctioned that. But since that would have left me burned and baked my fear went out against the good intention that made me so impatient to embrace them. Then I began. Your present state had fixed not scorn but sorrow in me and so deeply that it will only disappear slowly. As soon as my Lord spoke to me with words that made me understand what kind of men were coming toward us, men of worth like yours, for I am your city. And with fondness, I've always told and heard the others tell of both your actions and your honored names. I leave the gall

and go for the sweet apples that I was promised by my truthful guide, but first I must ascend to the center. So may your soul long lead your limbs, and may your fame shine after you, he answered then. Tell us if courtesy and valor still abide within our city as they did when we were there or have they disappeared completely for Guigalmo Pociere who only recently has come to share our torments and goes there with our companions has caused as much affliction with his words newcomers to the city and quick gains have brought excess and arrogance to you of flora and so you weep for it already so I cried so wait so the words access and arrogance okay access and arrogance also access

and arrogance. These are, this is the current state of Florence, okay, axis and arrogance. Okay, keep on going. 76. So I cried out with face up race. The three looked at each other when they heard my answers, men will stare when they have heard the truth. If you can always offer a reply so readily to others at all three, then happy you who speak at will so clearly. So if you can escape these lands of darkness and see the lovely stars on your return when you repeat with pleasure i was there be sure that you remember us to men at this they broke their wheel and as they fled their swift legs seemed to be no less than wings the time it took for them to disappear more brief than time in tics to say amen and so my master thought it right to leave i followed him we'd only walked a little when roaring

water grew so near to us we hardly could have heard each other speak and even as the river that is first to take its own course eastward from Mount Viso along the left flank of the eponines, which up above is called the Aquaceta, before it spills into its valley bed and flows without that name beyond Forley, reverberates above San Benedetto Delpe as it cascades in one leap where there is space enough to house a thousand. So did we hear that blackened water roar as it plunged down a steep and craggy bank, enough to deafness in a few hours. Around my waist I had a cordis girdle, and with it once I thought I should be able to catch the leopard with the painted hide, and after I had loosened it completely, just as my guide

commanded me to do, I handed it to him, nodded, and coiled. At this he wheeled around upon his right and cast it, at some distance from the edge, straight down into the depth of the ravine. And surely something strange must hear, reply. I said within myself, to this strange sign, the sign my master follows with his eye. Ah, how much care men ought to exercise with those whose penetrating intellect can see our thoughts, not just our outer act. He said to me, now there will soon emerge what I await and what your thought has conjured. It soon must be discovered to your sight.

Faced with that truth which seems a lie, a man should always close his lips as soon as he can, to tell it shames him even though he's blameless, but here I can't be still. And by the lines of this my comedy, reader, I swear, and may my verse find favor for long years. That through the dense and darkened air I saw a figure swimming, rising up enough to bring amazement to the firmest heart, like one returning from the waves where he went down to lose an anchor snagged upon a reef or something else hid in the sea, who stretches. upward and jaws in his feet. Okay. So now they will descend down to the circle of fraud.

Now, okay, so let's see on this. Sir Brunetto was in the last canto, and this creates a paradox, right? Why would Dante put such a man he loves in the circle of violence? And that creates a paradox. But now, in this kind of paradox, the paradox is. the product strengthens because these three individuals are the best Florence has to offer. Okay, they are the best of nobility and they are also suffered with Sir Brinato. So clearly Dante wants us to think about what's going on here.

Okay? Why are these four individuals who commit no other sin other than homosexuality? Why are they in the circle of violence? And in the worst part, right? Because they are committed violence against God. All right. Yes? It could be seen as... Yeah, go ahead.

It's fine. Go ahead. I think it could be seen as violence because it could lead to the end of humanity. And I'm thinking of this because if we're a reflection of the universe and if we engage in homosexuality, that would mean the universe could engage in that.

And if we tend it to the end of times, then it's the end of humanity. Okay, yeah, sure. That is the explanation that's offered, right? But again, does that make sense to you? It has to make sense, right? Yes? Yeah, actually, I don't think it makes sense.

I'm not gay, of course, but, you know, I'll still believe that if you have free will and you have love and why, you can't just be a homosexual. I mean... Yeah, so, again, it's a problem for us, right? Why is homosexuality so bad? Okay, all right, so let's figure this. out. And again, to read Dante, you have to weed with your imagination, right? You have to use your imagination. So let's use your imagination and ask yourselves. If we were designing this circle, right, violence against God, who would we put in this circle? What is the worst thing in life

you can do and which would offend both God and nature? What is it? To me? No, that's violence against yourself, right? There are already three crimes. Violence against others. Violence against yourself. And then violence against God and nature. I'm saying, like, what is probably the most unnatural act we could ever do? Incest.

Exactly. Incest, guys. You understand? There could be bestiality having sex with animals, but that's not as bad as having sex with your sister. Okay? You understand this? Now, let me ask you this question. Besides homosexuality, what else is pretty common among the elite?

Incess is pretty common among the elite, right? Because they want to maintain the bloodline. Because they want to maintain the purity. Do you understand? Okay? So this is implicit here. It is violence against God and nature. People commits incest have to be here as well.

But they're not mentioned, which forces us to imagine. they're here okay now let's feel up this okay let us use our imagination figure out what is connection between homosexuality and incest what is it what's a problem what is a connection yes in sex is having sex with your own kind and so it's homosexuality with your own kind like your own gender right and so what are you doing society what do you do with other people you exclude Exclusion, you understand. It's exclusion. The purpose of this is to exclude other people. The elite only want to maintain their privileges and block social mobility. This is the violence against God and nature. Okay?

Social mobility. Okay. And openness, right? Homosexuality, it's the expression of self-love and self-indulgence. It's the expression of access and arrogance, right? We are so superior to you. We will only have sex or our kind and of ourselves.

We refuse to associate with any of you. Right? And then over time, what happens? If the elite engage in homosexuality and incest, what happens now? Extinction, because with incest, your weaker gene gets combined and you have a lot of, yeah. Okay, yes, exactly, okay? So this threat, yes? I'm just, just push, I just kind of deducing, just pushing this logic further.

So if the elite only engages in homosexuality, then, They don't reproduce. They get to appoint, you know, who they, who will inherit their power, their wealth, and then so on and so forth. So it's a much more kind of controlled way of propagating power, wealth, and all that. Yes, right. Okay. All right. So let me now, now let's do compare and contrast, okay?

Let's think about a society in which the elite don't practice homosexuality. And let's think about a society in which they do practice homosexuality. Okay? All right. So, I mean, again, we can generalize and say that as a society rises, okay? There is less homosexuality. And as society declines, there is more homosexuality. Doesn't that make sense?

Right? If a society is poor, there's less likely to be homosexuality. If a society is rich and declining, there's more likely to be a homosexuality. to be homosexuality. All right? And the example of this is now just Western culture. If you just turn on TV,

homosexuals are not persecuted, right? They are celebrated. Right? Before, you know, in America, you had a gay politician, Peter Buttigieg. Before, it would blow the imagination that any politician would be like,

would say, proud of it and please vote for me. Right? It blow the imagination. Now, but you know in 2020, when Peter Judge ran for the Democratic nomination, his homosexuality made him very popular. All right?

So my question to you is, what's the difference? What's the difference between society where homosexuality is persecuted and a society which celebrates homosexuality? Yes, you first. Because before, homosexuality meant exclusion, whereas now I think it's more, way more inclusion, where we see as they're way more open-minded and they're open to engage in any culture, philosophy. Yeah, but that's a good thing, right? But I'm asking you why Donnie would think this represents a society in decline, right? Because he clearly lamenting about Florence, right?

He's clearly, he says that Florence right now is a city of excess and arrogance, right? and homosexuality is a very important part of that. So I'm trying to figure out why that's the case. Why is it that you embrace homosexuality, it makes your society much more open, but it causes you to decline? That's a paradox, right? But it is historically true.

Look at the fall of Rome, yes? I think at the time it didn't make your society more opened. I think it's only applicable today. So before it was exclusion, whereas now the whole aspect of it changed. I think could you repeat that? I'm not sure I'm not sure I know you I think at the time of Dante

Homosexuality was about exclusion so it was more of a negative aspect whereas today it's more about open-minded and so before it wasn't about openness So you think homestrike sexuality is a good thing it's good for society

I'm saying it changed so before it was like against open-minded and now it's more open-mindedness and now it's more open. So I'm just asking a question, which is, like, what Donnie is saying is that homosexuality is a sign of social decline? There's lots of homosexuality today, everywhere in China and the United States.

Is it a good thing or a bad thing, do you think? But I just think the definition changed. So if you think it's a bad thing and this thing changed, then you can't just say it's a bad thing today. The definition of homosexuality has not changed, right? it's still sex between two guys. How does that change? So, yeah, go ahead.

So, yeah, I think I understand his question that he thinks that homosexuality today represents openness instead of closeness and exclusiveness. So then he shall be elevated because it's a good thing to embrace. But I will argue that if we look at the France Olympics in the past few years, so homosexuality or like the elevation of this,

and transgender and everything as well. That it actually deprives of women or the other sex more because what happens with the French Olympics the other year? That's why J.K. Rowling got into this huge thing too. It's that the man boxer who changed to be women and then he beat up all the female competitors so no one won the female female champion for boxing was a man. Basically, so he excludes and actually, you know,

deny the actual the natural right i understand but i'm sure trying to figure out why homosexuality would cause society to decline yes could it be that when society is arising there's like a natural order and a natural law that everyone follows but when the society is falling it's like i can't remember who it was but i remember hearing someone once say that like homosexuality is the ultimate act of contrarianism and it's like when you start rejecting all of the sort of natural laws. So it's not really just about the homosexuality. It's that if you adopt

this mindset where there is no natural law, it will extend into basically the breakdown of morality. So why is this breakdown of natural law? Why do people not follow natural law? Yeah, go ahead. Actually, I don't think

homosexuality means that they're embracing everything and openness. I think it actually means the opposite. There's a book called The Closing of American Mind, which is basically saying, if you open and, like, embrace every culture, in the end, you're not, not, you're actually, like, exclusion.

Okay, yes? I'd like to say from Dan's perspective in regards, like, the homosexual is the bad thing of the society. I would say maybe it's, I mean, the homosexuality albeit the law that God gave us. So like, for example, initially when the war has been created, why we have two genders, like male and female. That means there is naturally that there should be attraction between male and female to make sure we can alive and the civilization could be continued, right?

So if people are homosexual, they are kind of prevent this natural law. that given by the god to proceed you know okay let me answer this question okay let me answer this question homosexuality today is celebrated homosexuals before was persecuted the percentage of homosexuals homosexuals in society did it go up or down I think it's pretty similar okay to understand there were lots of homosexualities before it's yes so I have a I have a few comments first of all I think uh Meta metaphorically, homosexuality can be described as violence against love. It's physical in the sense that it's not celestial, it's not emotional, but it's physical.

That's why we need not only celestial love, but also fleshly love. And that's a divine order. And in that sense, homosexuality is a rejection. of the female appeal and also the order of love on the flesh on the physical level.

But I agree with some of the comments that said homosexual is as bad as as bad as incest in causing more exclusion because

from the genetic point of view, although I do have some reservation about genetics. From genetic point of view, homosexuality actually results in the distribution of the wealth

from the elite more to the for the people who can procreate. And if the elite choose not to engage in bisexual sex, then it will cause more fair distribution. Whereas incest is the attempt.

for the elite to create, to concentrate the wealth in more homogenous gene, which is bad for society. Okay, all right, so let me ask you this question, okay? How does Donnie feel about the elite? What does he think about the elite? This nobility.

How does he perceive the nobility, do you think? Intitled? Yeah, they're entitled. Are they a good thing or a bad thing? Of course. They're a bad thing. They're a bad thing. So what is, so what do you do with them, get rid of them?

What would you do? You, you try to make them humble again? You make, but like, how do you make them humble? Okay, okay, like, like, like, I don't want to spend too much time on this, okay? So let's feel on this, okay? First of all, how does starting feel about nobility? And then the question then is, I want to focus on is, why is it when society's on the rise, there's less homosexuality, but when societies are in decline, there's more homosexuality.

I mean, like, there's more open outward homosexuality, right? The percentage is probably say the same, right? But as societies are on the rise, the elite would not practice their homosexuality in open, right? They would hide it, they would still get married and have children. Now they're just practicing it out in the open. What's the difference? Yes, you, you, then you?

I think there's two things. First, it's about needs. Once you have everything you need, then you try to seek something else. So when a society has access to food, protection, and, et cetera, you try to engage in something new that could be homosexuality. And also, it could be due to a dating aspect, because if a society is very well-constructed and becomes very competitive,

then you have a really low chance to access to the 1%, 5% above. and so you just engage in your own gender. Okay. Yes, you? Yeah, I agree and I think it just refers to the aspect of hope in a declining society. If you don't have kids as a homosexual, then you say that you don't have hope in the future. Okay, okay, all right. So I want to change your question, okay? Okay, imagine you're at Yale.

Okay, you're a freshman at Yale, okay? And you know the answer, so you and I won't participate, okay? But imagine you're at Yale or Harvard or Princeton. And in 1960s, you go into Yale, and the president is addressing you, right? What is going to say to you? You're saying, you're at Yale to do what? In 1960s or 70s or 80s or 90s? Exactly, right?

Change the world. Better humanity. Service humanity, right? Today, when you're at Yale, Harvard, of Princeton, the president says what to you? If you're at university, you know the answer. What's the answer? Be yourself. Be yourself.

Your identity is what matters. Right? Am I wrong here? Be yourself. Celebrate yourself. That's why Saudi declines. Do you understand? That's what probably.

That's why homosexuality is a problem because it's not the act itself, it's the attitude. Like, be yourself, indulge yourself, love yourself. Don't worry about other people. Don't worry about your responsibility to society. Don't try to change the world for better. Just celebrate yourself and be happy. And if you're not happy, complain about it. Celebrate yourself.

Am I wrong? Okay? Okay. That's what Donnie is saying here. He's saying that homosexuality, like incest, it represents like an inward churning, right? A narcissism that is extreme. So yeah. Yeah, go ahead. Yes? So does he say that it's not real love? No. No, you can't love yourself.

Or like other men. But like what he's saying is like when you love a love, man what you're really doing is loving yourself it's a narcissism right because narcissists saw himself in the mirror and he wanted to like have sex with him himself that's what homosexuality is it's narcissists having sex with himself but and I'm not saying that's right I'm just saying like like this is how Dante perceives this okay all right yes why is Dante neglecting the narcissist aspect in heterosexiety

because as we see today there are people who focus on looks to attract women and so just pointing out the narcissistic aspect in homo-sic sexuality would be neglecting the this aspect in the other side. Right.

Yes. Okay. That's a really interesting question. And unfortunately in hell we don't have narcissism as sin. Why not? Okay, the answer is, um, at this time in history, what Donda is trying to do is he's trying to, he's trying to change, um, the idea of the ego, right? So, um, the Catholic churches teach you,

teach you that ego is bad. Self, self love, it's a worst sin, with the worst evil. Right. And what Donne is saying is that if that's your attitude, you can't actually go and change the world for the better. You have to believe that. that you are so good. God loves you so much that you will have the power to change the world for the better. Okay?

And and that's why the three sins, sorry, there are two sins, envy and pride. He actually doesn't list in inferno. He will list him in purgatory, but not inferno, okay? So

that's what Donnie is trying to do. He's trying to tell us that self-love is good thing but self-love as expressed with other men is a bad thing okay because it's self-indulgent right so homosexuality by itself is not bad the act isn't bad but the attitude of it is bad which is like like all I care about is myself I'm loving myself I'm celebrating myself that's the issue okay does that make sense all right all right so I make this comment right and so what Donne is saying is

that nobility is not good or bad. It's how the nobility behaves that's good or bad, right? Nobility is behaving towards a betterment of society. They're good. But if there are behaving like narcissists, that's bad. That can only mean the destruction of society. Because at this point in history, it is not possible to imagine a society without no nobility, right? You can't have communism.

No one's going to imagine communism at this point. And think about how unfair that would be, right? This family has been generations, and you should take it from them? So Donald would never suggest that. What he's suggesting is that nobility have a distinct responsibility to the rest of society,

to contribute, okay? And when they engage in homosexuality, it just shows that they have a better society. They don't even care about hypocrisy anymore. They can't even bother to demonstrate propriety and leadership to everyone else.

Does that make sense? So to confirm that what I'm saying is correct, what we're going to do is we're going to read Paradaiso 16. Okay, so Dante has an amazing way of marrying himself, creating symmetry. So we are in, we were inferno 16. We're not going to jump to Paradiso 16, where Dante is going to talk to his great-grandfather. And his great-grandfather is going to share.

the story of his family and the story of Florence okay so this is the early days of Florence when the elite working hard to build a greater Florence and you can compare contrast these two contos okay so so let's read Paradiso 16 Paradiso XVI if here below where sentiment is far too weak to withstand error I should see men glorying in you nobility of blood a meager thing I should wonder for even where desire is not awry, I mean in heaven, I too felt such pride. You're indeed a cloak that soon wears out so that if day by day we add no patch, then circling time will trim you with its shears.

My speech began again with you, the word that Rome was the first city to allow, although her people seldom speak it now. At this word, Beatrice somewhat apart, smiling seemed like the woman who had coughed. So goes the tale at Gwynover's first fault. So did my speech begin. You're my father. You heartened me to speak with confidence. You raised me so that I am more than I. So many streams have filled my mind with gladness. So many in such gladness that mine must rejoice that it can bear this and not burst. Then tell me, founder of my family, who were your

ancestors and in your boyhood, what were the years of records registered? And tell me of the sheepfold of St. John, how numerous it was, who in that flock were worthy of the highest offices. as at the breathing of the winds a coal will quicken into flame so i saw that light glow at words that were affectionate and as before my eyes it grew more fair so with a voice more gentle and more sweet not in our modern speech it said to me down from that day when ave was pronounced until my mother blessed now by giving birth eased the burden born and bearing me this fire of mars had come five hundred fifty and thirty more times to its lion there to be rekindled underneath its paw My ancestors and I were born just where the runner in your early games, hers comes upon the boundary of the final ward. That is enough concerning my forbear's. What were their names from where they came of that silence, not speech is more appropriate?

All those who at that time between the Baptist and Mars were capable of bearing arms numbered one-fifth of those who live there now. But then the citizens now mixed with Campi, with the Chetaldo and with the Figlini, were purred down to the humblest artisan. Oh, it would be far better if you had those whom I mention as your neighbors and your boundaries at Galuzzo and Thresbiano, than to have them within, to bear the stench of Aguilione's wretch and Sineas' ridge,

whose sharp eyes now on bearer tree are set. If those who in the world go most astray had not seen Caesar with stepmother's eyes, but like a mother to her son been kind, the one who has become a Florentine trader and money-changer would have stayed in Semi-Fonte, where his father's peddled. The counts would still be lords of Montemurlo, the Cherokee, would be in Acone's parish, perhaps the Buendomante in Vadegreeve. The mingling of the populations led to evil in the city,

even as food piled on food destroys the body's health. The blind bull falls more quickly, more headlong than does the blind lamb, and the one blade can often cut more and better than five swords. Consider Luni, Ubizalia, how they went to ruin, Sinigalia follows, and Kusi, too, will soon have vanished. Then, if you should hear families undone, you will find nothing strange or difficult in that, since even cities meet their end. All things that you possess, possess their death, just as you do, but in some things that last long, death can hide from you whose life is there. short and even as the heaven of the moon revolving respiteless conceals and then reveals the shores so fortune dust with florence therefore there's no cause for wonder in what i shall tell of noble florentines of those whose reputation's time has hidden

i saw the ugi saw the catalini filippi grechi ormani alberiki famed citizens already in decline and saw as great as they were venerable delarka with delus and Ardingi, Sondayari, and Bostiki. Nearby the gate that now is burdened with new treachery that weighs so heavily that it will bring the vessel to shipwreck. There were the Ravignani, from whose line Count Buito comes, and all who since derived their name from the illustrious bellichoni. And Delapresso knew already how to rule, and Galliayo in his house already had the gilded hilt and pommel. the stripe of viree had mightiness already as did the joeki gali and barucci for fountain zocati and those who blush for the bushel and the stock from which spring from kalfucci was already mighty and sidzi and ariguchi were already raised to high office oh how great were those i saw whom pride laid low and the gold balls in all of her great actions flowered florence such were the ancestors of those who were the ancestors of those who now whenever bishop sees are vacant grow fat as they sit in church consistories.

The breed so arrogant and dragon-like in chasing him who flees, but lamb-like, meek to him who shows his teeth or else his purse, was on the rise already, but of stock so mean that Ubertin Donato, when his father-in-law made him kin to them, was scarcely pleased. Already, Capunzaco had come from Fiasole down to the market, already citizens of note were Judah and infangato I shall tell a thing incredible and true the gateway through the inner walls were named for the della para all those whose arms bear part of the fair and sign of the great baron he whose memory and worth are honored

on the feast of Thomas received nightfoot and privilege from him those he whose coat of arms has fringed that ensign has taken sides now with the populace The Gualtarotti and the importuni were there already were the borgo spared neighbors it would still be tranquil there. The house of Amadei, with which your sorrows began, by reason of its just resentment which ruined you and ended years of gladness,

were honored then as were its close companions. O Buondamante through another's counsel, you fled your wedding pledge and brought such evil. Many would now rejoice who still lamented, if when you first approached the city God had given you unto the river Emma. But Florence, in her final peace, was faded to offer up unto that mutilated stone guardian upon her bridge a victim. These were the families and others with them, the Florence that I saw in such repose that there was nothing to have caused her sorrow. These were the families with them I saw her people so acclaimed and just that on her staff the lily never was reversed,

nor was it made blood red by factious hatred. Okay, so here Donnie's great-grandfather is recounting the glory of Florence and explaining why Florence ultimately declined. Okay, so for the grandfather, what's the main reason why Florence declined? If you talk to any old person, okay, it's always this reason. What is it? what led to the clan of florence access and arrogance no no maybe that's dante but here it's different

this this is the great grandfather and he's like this is why florence went down yes people screed towards materials and like money yeah but but where did i come from where this materialism come from chase for power what cause yes factious hatred no Oh, what's causing this materialism? What's causing this hatred? Come on. I mean, like, you just talk to your grandparents, right? And your grandparents were like, yeah, before this was a great neighborhood, but then what happened?

Before this was a lovely neighborhood and everyone got along, great. But then? Maybe something about the young people? No, what happened, guys? Maybe people became selfish? No. Someone new came into the neighborhood. God damn immigrants!

This is not a political correct class, okay? Why is immigration bad? When is immigration bad? It puts into conflict people with different cultures. Okay, yes, it creates a cultural clash. Yes. What else? Professor values your whole is different. Exactly, okay? Your values change. Before these old families were dedicated to helping other people around them, helping their neighbors.

But when you have people with so many values come in, like, that are different from yours, what's your only solution to this problem of immigration? Like, exclude them, so you have your own society, communities? Okay, so exclusion, but I'm saying how do you unite the entire city? For what? To be more conservative. No, the old people, yes? Assimilation, maybe.

But how do you assimilate them? Oh, your stuff is cool too. We accept everything. Like, everything's cool. Well, sell about. So materialism. Money. Do you understand? If you have immigrants come in, everyone shares different values. The only value that you have to create, to unified society, is money, right? And money leads to the separation of selfishness, right? That's why you can't no longer be, change the world. Because that's Western imperialism. It has to be, be yourself. Except with yourself, okay? And how do you do that? Go make a lot of money. So this is a pattern throughout human history.

Okay, you think that, oh, look, isn't it great that if you work hard, you can be a trillion there? No, it's not. I mean, how about contributing to your community? How about working hard to create families? How about making a safe and more society? Right? But you're not taught that.

You're taught just go make a lot of money and be yourself and celebrate yourself. And if you want to be gay, great. Does it make sense? All right. So again, this is not politically correct, okay? But again, we're trying to examine why society's decline. And so you have, Donnie saying you have immigrants, you have homosexuality, you have factionalism, you have veganic pressure, okay?

And are they true today? Yeah, they're very much true today. So according to Dante, we are very much society in decline. Does anyone want to argue against this? Like, I don't be seen as brainwashing you, okay? Do you want to argue against this? Yes, thank you. Well, with immigration, I want to point out that, for example, with World War,

War II in Europe when many people are persecuted, they came to see the United States as the promised land and where you won't be persecuted. So a lot of the best scientists and intellectuals and whoever it is went to America. So immigration can create kind of more vibrancy in society. Sure, yeah, that's a great argument, yes? The population decline.

So, like, you bring people because your culture doesn't make enough children to finance your society. Yeah, but why is your population declining? I don't know. No, you do know why population is declining. It's because... It's too expensive. People make less kids. Well, come on, man.

It's a lack of social mobility. Yeah, lack of social mobility, homosexuality, uh, narcissism. Okay, do you understand? So, publish decline. is a symptom of society decline and immigration is just a short-term remedy it's not a long-term solution uh yes um population could also decline because the cost of raising a child is increased yeah exactly but that's also a sudden decline right where you can't even where you can't even can only can only afford to have families okay uh yes maybe because the people just uh do not

believe in god because they believe in money and money can help themselves right but yeah the lack of religion right okay uh Okay, but I'm saying like argue against Faunter, okay? And what Carol says is, yeah, but immigration allows for more vibrancy, allows for more creativity, right? And also, like, if you don't let an immigrant, your society is going to decline in further, even faster. Yes?

Anyone else to argue against this? In more developed economies, immigrant workers are often a cheaper source of labor. But is that a good thing? Like, you know, let's bring in poor people to exploit. I mean, like, I mean, really? For the capitalists, it's a good thing. Right. I'm sure it is.

Any other arguments against this? Yes? I think it helps with unity in the world. Because, like, if every culture is represented in every country, then it creates unity and we all move together towards one path. Exactly. So you look at the World Cup, right? America right now is supposed to know World Cup.

You go to every stadium, it's packed with different cultures, and they're all celebrating together. Right, so multiculturalism, sure. What else? Yes? Yeah, like multiculturalism kind of brings you different perspectives so that you can actually debate between values. You kind of examine truth from different lenses and perspectives, so it gives you maybe it might get you closer to the truth.

So that's why I think the Pope actually last month, met with the Muslim leader so the two of them had a talk so it's like be more embracing of a different religion culture perspective right okay so makes everyone much more tolerant right much more open that's great okay so um that's all great but how to explain to Dante the lack of creativity in our world today why is it in today's world No one is able to write the divine comedy. I actually can't remember the last good book I read or the last good movie I saw.

I literally cannot. Yes. For our needs and we stop suffering and so we don't need to engage in anything difficult. Also because of technology, everything is simple for us. And so it's just we have nothing to talk about or no energy that can make us create stuff. Okay. You're absolutely right. Yes? I think people right now are too material and not spiritual enough. Yeah, but why would that lead to a declining creativity, right? Because in theory, if you can make $1,000 dollars writing a divine comedy, why don't you go write it? Right? Yes?

People lost their love. People are hopeless and they just care about a job, about money, but not about a spiritual thing. Yeah, yeah. People have, yes, go ahead. I think I think I want to add on to that because people are not only too materialistic, they're also, like, we haven't been this spiritually away from ourselves, from our inner world. I mean, this is the, we've never been like this because you see all the religions and all the Buddhism, all that thing, about dating back in thousands years ago, but now, like, I don't, it's a small portion of the society who will still talk about this, I think. Right, exactly. Okay. So this is really interesting because if Dorothy were to come today, look at our. world, he'd be like, this is a lot worse than my world, man. Because regardless of how bad things were

back then, at least they had roots, right? At least they had family and community, a sense of, like, each other. Whereas today, we are all rootless, right? We have no history. We have no culture. We have no tradition. If you say these things, then they'll say, you're racist or you're a bigot. okay i mean right okay so it makes you really think about what is really valuable in society okay so let's go to kennel 17 please canto 17

behold the beast who bears the pointed tail who crosses mountains shatters weapons walls behold the one who stench fills all the world so did my guide begin to speak to me and then he signaled him to come ashore close to the end of those stone passageways and he came on that filthy effigy of fraud and landed with his head and torso but did not draw his tail onto the bank. The face he wore was that of a just man.

So gracious was his features outer semblance in all his trunk, the body of a serpent. He had two paws, with hair up to the armpits, his back and chest as well as both his flanks have been adorned with twining knots and circlets. Now Turks or tartars ever fashioned fabrics more colorful in background and relief, nor had arakhani ever loomed such webs. as boats will sometimes lie along the shore with part of them on land and part in water and just as there among the guzzling germans the beaver sets himself when he means war so did that squalid beast lie on the margin of stone that serves as border for the sand and all his tail was quivering in the void while twisting upward in envenomed fork which had a tip just like a scorpions my guide said now we'd better bend our path a little till we reach as far as that malicious beast with crouches over there. Thus we descended on the right-hand side and moved tens paces on the stony brink in order to avoid the sand and fire. When we had reached the sprawling beast, I saw a little father on upon the

sand some sinner sitting near the fissured rock. And here my master said to me, so that you may experience this ring in full, go now and see the state in which they are. But keep your conversation with them brief, till you return, I'll parlay with these beasts, to see if he can lend us his strong shoulders. So I went on alone and even farther along the seven circles outer margin to where the melancholy people sat. This bondancy was bursting from their eyes, the side them that their hands kept fending off at times the flames, at times the burning soil. Not otherwise do dogs in summer, now with muzzle, now with paw, when they're bitten by fleas or gnats or by the sharp gadfly. When I had set my eyes upon the faces of some on whom that painful fire

falls, I recognized no one, but I did notice that from the neck of each a purse was hung that had a special color and an emblem, and their eyes seemed to feast upon these pouches. Looking about when I had come among them, I saw a yellow purse with azure on it that had the face and manner of a lion. Then as I let my eyes move farther on, I saw another purse that was blood red, and it displaced a goose more whiter than butter. And one who had an azure pregnancy, and one who had an azure pregnancy, so inscribed as emblem on his white pouch, said to me, What are you doing in this pit? Now you'll be off, and since you're still alive,

remember that my neighbor, Vateliano, shall yet sit here upon my left-hand side. Among these Florentines, I'm Padua, and I often hear them thunder in my ears, shouting. Now let the sovereign cavalier, the one who'll bring the purse with three goats come. At this, he slewed his mouth, and then he stuck his tongue out like an often. that licks its nose and I afraid that any longer stay might anger him who'd warned me to be brief made me back from those exhausted souls I found my guide who had already climbed upon the back of that brute animal and he told me be strong and daring now for our descent is by this kind of stairs you mounted front I want to be between so that the tail can't do you any harm as one who feels the cord and fever near and shiverous with his nails already blue the sight of shade enough to make him shudder so i became when i had heard these words but then i felt the threat of shame which makes a servant and his kind lord's presence brave i settled down on those enormous shoulders i wished to say and yet my voice did not come as i thought see that you hold me tight but he who other times and other dangers sustained me just as soon as i had mounted clasped me within his arms and propped me up and said

now geryon move on take care to keep your circles wide your landing slow remember the new weight you're carrying just like a boat that starting from its moorings moves backward back so that beast took off and when he felt himself completely clear he turned his tail to where his chest had been and having stretched it moved it like an eel and with his paws he gathered in the air i do not think that there was greater fear in fethon when he let his reins go free for which the sky as one still sees was scorched on poor icarus when he could feel his sides unwinged because the wax was melting his father shouting to me that way's wrong that Then was in me when on all sides I saw that I was in the air and everything had faded from my sight except the beast. Slowly, slowly swimming, he moves on. He wheels and he descends, but I feel only the wind upon my face and the wind rising. Already on our right, I heard the torrent resounding there beneath us horribly so that I stretched my neck and looked below. Then I was more afraid of falling off, for I saw fires and I heard laments at which I tremble. crouching and hold fast and now i saw what i had missed before his wheeling and descent because great torments were drawing closer to us on all sides just as a falcon long upon the wing who seeing neither lure nor bird compels the falconer to cry

on me you fall this sense exhausted in a hundred circles where he had once been swift and sets himself embittered and enraged far from his master such at the bottom of the jagged rock was gurion when he had set us down and once our wake was lifted from his back he vanished like an arrow from a bow okay so two points the first point is that to descend from the circle of violence the circle of fraud okay and and quite honestly the circle of fraud walk you pie about a third of the divine comedy okay we're kind of 17 there's 34 contos in inferno we're halfway through So most of the time we'll actually spend in the circle of fraud as well as the circle of treachery. What takes them down to the circle is a beast called a garyon. The garyon has the face of an honest man, a very good-looking man that you trust,

but it has the tail of a scorpion, okay, so it can sting you at any time. So that's what fraud is. Fraud seduces you in you believe something and then stings you. Okay, that's the first point. Second point is that while Virgil is taming the garyon, Dante is

looking around and he meets these money lenders who are buried in the sand. What traps them in the ground are these purses of money, right? So this is a fitting punishment because in life, they trapped or enslaved others with debt, right?

With interest. So they're getting a taste of their own medicine, and that's what hell is. The pain that you cause unto others, you yourself will feel for all of eternity. All right, so any questions before we move on? Are we clear? Okay, so that's circle violence. Now we descend to the circle of fraud, which is, majority of the divine comedy. Okay. Inferno 18. Inferno Canto 18. There is a place in hell

called Malibuja. So Malibuja is the name of the circle, okay? The circle of fraud. And there are different ditches for different frauds. Okay. Made all of stone the color of crude iron as is the wall that makes its way around it. Right in the middle of this evil field is an abyss, a broad and yawning pit, whose structure I shall tell in its due place. The belt and that extends between the pit and that hard, steep wall space is circular. Its bottom has been split into ten valleys. Just as where moat on moats surrounds a castle in order to keep guard upon the walls, the ground they occupy will form a pattern, so did the valleys here form a design, and as such fortresses have bridges running right from their thresholds toward the outer bank. So here across the banks and ditches,

ridges ran from the base of that rock wall until the pit that cuts them short and joins them all. This was the place in which we found ourselves when Geryon had put us down. The poet held to the left and I walked at his back. Upon the right, I saw new misery. I saw new tortures and new torturers filling the first of Malaboujay's moats. Along its bottom, naked sinners, moved to our side of the middle, facing us beyond that they moved with us, but more quickly, as in the year of Jubilee, the Romans, confronted by great crowds, contrived a plan that let the people pass across the bridge, for to one side went all who had

their eyes upon the castle heading towards St. Peter's, and to the other those who faced the mount. Both left and right along the somber rock, I saw horned demons with enormous whips who lashed those spirits cruelly from behind. Ah, how their first strokes make those sinners lift their heels, indeed no sinner waited for a second stroke to fall for a third. And as I moved ahead, my eyes met those of someone else, and suddenly I said, I was not spared the sight of him before. And so I stayed my steps to study him. My gentle guide had stopped together with me and gave me leave to take a few steps back. That scourged soul thought that he could hide himself by lowering his face. It helped him little, for I said,

you who cast your eyes upon the ground if these your features are not false must be vanadico cacanamico but what brings you to sauce is so pecan and he to me i speak unwillingly but your plain speech that brings the memory of the old world to me is what compels me for it was i who led gisola bella to do as the marquis would have her due however they retell that filthy tale i'm not the ball and who weeps here indeed this place is so crammed full of us that no so many tongues have learned to say Sipa between the Savina Renno if you want faith and testament of that just call to mind our aphoricious hearts and as he spoke a demon cuddled him with his horse with and cried be off you pimp there are no women here for you to trick I joined okay so so these are pimps right these are people who've sold their sisters or others to wealthy men. And Vinatko is one of them.

And for their punishment, they're being whipped around by demons, okay? Which is what they did in real life to their sisters or to their daughters. Or they're just pimps. Okay? Um, keep on going. Line 67. I joined my escort once again and then with but few steps. We came upon place where from the bank, a Rocky Ridge ran out.

We climbed quite easily along that height. and turning right upon its jagged back, we took our leave of those eternal circlings. When we had reached the point where that ridge opens below to leave a passage for the lash to my guide set, stay, and make sure that the sight of still more ill-born spirit strikes your eyes, for you have not yet seen their faces since they have been moving in our own direction.

From the old bridge we looked down at the ranks of those approaching from the other side, they too were driven onward by the lash. and my good master though I had not asked urged me look at that mighty one who comes and does not seem to shed a tear of pain how he still keeps the image of a king that shade of Jason who with heart and head deprived the men of Kolkis of their ram he made a landfall in the Isle of Lemnos after its women

bold and pitiless had given all their island males to death with polished words and love signs he took in Hipsipoli, the girl whose own deception had earlier deceived the other women. And he abandoned her alone and pregnant. Such guilt condemns him to such punishment. And for Medea, too, revenge is taken. With him go those who cheated so. This is enough for you to know of that first valley and of the souls that clamps within his jaws.

Does anyone know the story of Jason and Medea? Jason and Medea, Jason is of the Argonauts, right? And with Medea's help, he is able to retrieve the golden fleece. So he takes Medea home to Greece. They marry together. They have children together. But then in order for Jason to climb even higher, he marries a princess and betrays Medea. So what does Medea do?

Do you guys know the story? Can you guys guess what she does? Did she kill her kids? Yeah, she killed her kids. Yeah. It's, I mean, a Greek tragedy. It's such a, yeah, but she killed her two young kids as to avenge her betrayal. Okay.

All right. So, yeah. Okay, keep on going. Line 100. We were already where the narrow path reaches and intersects the second bank and serves as shoulder for another bridge. We heard the people. line in the next pouch and hurt them as they snorted with their snouts. We heard them use their palms to beat themselves.

And exhalations rising from above stuck to the banks and crusting them with mold. And so waged war against both eyes and nose. The bottom is so deep we found no spot to see it from except by climbing up the arch until the bridge's highest point. This was the place we reached. The ditch beneath held people plunged an excrement that seemed as if it had been poured from human privyce. And while my eyes searched that abysmal sight, I saw one with a head so smeared with shit. I could not see if he were lay or cleric. Okay, so let's feel this, okay?

What do you do in real life that will warrant you basically awash in shit for all of eternity? You're just basically swimming in shit, drowning in shit for all of eternity. What did you do in life? What was your problem? Anyone? we have the punishment right which is you just you know swim in shit your what what did you do in real in real life to warrant this like like shit on other people like put other people in like such a situation so no i mean me uh sure um bullshit right oh yeah yeah right flattery bullshit bullshit

Yes. You're just BSing other people all the time, okay? So now you're just drowning in it. Keep on my way? 118. He howled. Why do you stare more greedily at me than at the others who are filthy and I? Because if I remember right, I have seen you before with your hair dry and so I are you more than all.

You're Alessio Intermine of Luca. Then he continued pounding on his pate. I'm plunged here because of flatteries of which my tongue had such sufficient. at which my guide advised me, see you thrust your head a little farther to the front so that your eyes can clearly glimpse the face of that besmirged, bedraggled Herodan, who scratched at herself with shit-filled nails, and now she crouches, now she stands upright.

That is Tyas, the harlot who returned her lover's question. Are you very grateful to me by saying, yes, enormously? And now our sight has had its fill of this. Okay, all right. So another major characteristic of deciding in the client, of course, is fraud, right? Fraud. It's just like you can't trust each other anymore, right? Is fraud an issue today? Yeah, it's a huge issue today, okay? Yes? Did you know that 80% of all, uh, In general cases in Haidien are internet fraud.

Yes, okay. The internet, right? And now we have AI. We have deep fake. It's all done. Yeah, exactly. AI, right? So we live in a world of fraud.

Like it's literally not impossible to tell what is fake news. Right? It's really hard. Okay. And it's really hard now to trust. trust other people. And so this is also a symptom of a society in decline. Why is this a problem?

Why is this a problem? Yes? A lot of wasted energy. People wasting your imagination, defrauding people, and people wasting their imagination trying not to get cheated. Yeah, it's impossible to work together, do you understand? Right? It's impossible to make promises.

It's impossible to make contracts. It's impossible to cooperate anymore, okay? yeah okay let's keep on going canto 19 as Simon Magus O his sad disciples Rapacious ones who take the things of God

That ought to be the brides of righteousness And make them fornicade for gold and silver The time has come to let the trumpet sound for you Your place is here and in this third pouch We had already reached the tomb beyond And climbed onto the ridge where its high point hangs just above the middle of the ditch Oh, highest wisdom, how much art you show in heaven, earth, and this sad world below,

how just your power is when it allots. Along the sides and down along the bottom, I saw that livid rock was perforated. The openings were all one width and round. They did not seem to me less broad or more than those in my handsome San Giovanni were made to serve as basins for baptizing. And one of these not so many years ago, I broke for someone who was drowning in it and let this be my seal to set menstruate. out from the mouth of each hole there emerged a sinner's feet and so much of his legs up to the thigh the rest remained within both souls of every sinner were on fire their joints were writhing with such violins they would have severed wights and ropes of grass

as flame on oily things will only stir along the outer surface so thereto that fire made its way from heels to toes master i said who's that shade who suffers and quivers more than all his other comrades, that sinner who's licked by redder flames. And he to me, if you would have me lead you down along the steepest of the banks, from him you'll learn about his self and sins. And I, what pleases you will please me too, you are my lord. You know I do not swerve from what you will. You know what is unspoken. At this we came upon the fourth embankment.

We turned on keeping to the left ascended into the narrow perforated bottom. my good lord did not let me leave his side until he brought me to the hole that held that sinner who lamented with his legs whever you may be dejected soul whose head is downward planted like a pole my words began do speak of your able i stood as does the friar who confesses the foul assassin who fixed fast head down calls back the friar and so delays his death and he cried out are you already standing already standing there boniface The book has lied to me by several years. Are you so quickly stated with the riches for which you did not fear to take by guile, the lovely lady, than to violate her? And I became like those who stand as if they have been mocked, who cannot understand what has been said to them and can't respond.

But Virgil said, tell this to him at once. I'm not he, not who you think I am, and I replied as I was told to do. At this the spirit twisted both his feet and sighing, and with a despairing voice he said, What is it then? You want of me. If you have crossed the bank and climbed so far to find out who I am,

then know that I was one of those who wore the mighty mantle, and surely was the son of the she-bear, so eager to advance the cubs that I pursued well above while, here I purse myself. Below my head, there is the place of those who took the way of simony before me

and they are stuffed within the clefts of stone. I too shall yield my place And fall below when he arise The one for whom I had mistaken you When I was quick to question But I have baked my feet A longer time has stood like this upon my head Than he to stand planted here with scarlet feet

For after him one uglier in deeds will come A lawless shepherd from the West Worthy to cover him and cover me He'll be a second Jason Of whom we read in Maccabees and just as Jason's king was soft to him, so shall the king of France be soft to this one. And I do not know if I was too rash here, I answered so.

Then tell me now how much gold did our Lord ask that St. Peter give to him before he placed the keys within his care. Surely the only thing he said was follow me. And Peter and the others never asked for gold or silver when they chose Matthias to take the place of the transgressing soul. Stay as you are, for you're rightly punished. and guard with care the money got by evil that made you so audacious against Charles. And were it not that I am still prevented by reverence for those exalted keys that you had held within the happy life,

I'd utter words much heavier than these because your avarice afflicts the world. It tramples on the good, lifts up the wicked. You, shepherds, the evangelist, had noticed when he saw her, who sits upon the waters and realize she fornicades with kings. she who was born with seven heads and had the power in support of the ten horns as long as virtue was her husband's pleasure. You've made yourselves a god of gold and silver. How are you different from the idolaters save that they worship one and you a hundred? Ah, Constantine, what wickedness was born and not from your conversion from the dower that you bestowed upon the first rich father?

And while I sang such notes to him, whether it was his indignation or his conscience that bit him. He kicked hard with both his souls. I do indeed believe it pleased my guide. He listened always with such satisfied expression to the sound of those true words. And then he gathered me in both his arms, and when he had me fast against his chest, where he climbed down before, climbed upward now, nor did he tire of clasping me until he brought me to the summit of the arch that crosses from the fourth to the fifth rampart and he and here he gently set his burdens down gently because the ridge was rough and steep and would have been a rugged pass for goats for there another valley lay before me okay so this is another one of donnie's um tyrants against the church

against church corruption okay so the crime the sin that is being punished here is simony okay what simony is it's very common at this time for the church to sell holy relics to people and this was very profitable right because think about it right it's the church so and a lot of this a lot of these relics were fake but even if they weren't fake you shouldn't do that right you shouldn't sell holy relics to the highest bidder what is the Martin equivalent of simony selling offices to me setting offices selling offices well they did do that back then as well

Okay, so that's not the same. But someone else selling a simony, yes? Maybe taxes. Taxes. Can you explain? Well, you pay taxes and in turn, the state promise you that you're safe and, yeah, you have a better life. Okay. So, simony is a crime.

The church, even the church condone simony, right? because Simony is named after Simon Magus, who is the first heretic in the Catholic Church. So Simony is a bad thing. Everyone knows it is a bad thing. They kept on doing it. So I'm saying, so in our modern world, what would the equivalent be of Simony? Selling credentials. Excuse me?

Credentials? Selling credentials. Yeah. That's a really good example, right? Selling diplomas. Right? And do universities engage in some diplomas? No, no, no.

It's actually not just that. How do universities engage in selling credentials? Do you guys know? Increase the tuition every year. No. They received. Yeah, they receive donations. Yes, okay, yeah, right.

Okay, so donations, but also like summer school, continue education. Like there are lots of ways in which universities sell, their credentials, okay? Any other examples? Yes? Luxury items. So like very expensive bags or like symbolic items which don't hold value, truly? Right. But so the idea of someone is corruption, right? You're just abusing your power and profiting it from it. So if you're a luxury goods retailer, I mean that's not corruption, right? So it has to be like a trusted authority. it could be university could be government uh it could be the church okay anyone any other examples

all right uh that's fine let's yes cryptocurrency can you can explain well right the holy relic is in itself well if if capital you know if the richest people on the in the world agree that something is of value and you assign value to it you give it an authority the rest of society would follow similar to the holy relic. I assigned this relic. I don't know. I don't know if that makes sense. Right.

Yeah. So I think your example is the very best, okay? Because what's the equivalent of the church today? It's universities, right? They have the most authority. They're the people who, they are the most trusted institution. And the fact that, you know, if just give them a donation, they're going to fast-trust.

your child. If you're probably new, Stanford, there's a huge case in Stanford about this, right? There are lots of examples. Okay, but again, Ye would never do this. Okay, let's go like Inferno 20. Inferno Canto 20.

I must make verses of new punishment and offer matter now for canto 20 of this first canticle of the submerged. I was already well-prepared, prepared to stare below into the depth that was disclosed where tears of anguish sorrow bathed the ground. In the valley circle, I saw souls advancing, mute and weeping at the pace that in our world holy processions take. As I declined my head still more, I saw that each amazingly appeared contorted between the chin and where the chest begins, they had their faces twisted

toward their haunches and found it necessary to walk backward because they could not see ahead of them. Okay, all right. So this is funny, okay? But like, the punishment in is that the people walk around and their heads are twisted backwards. So they only see behind them. They can never see in front of them. What was their crime in life or was their sin? What do they do? This is ironic, right?

These are people who are going to look behind them. Fortune teller. Exactly, right? These are fortune tellers. These are people who lie to you, who defraught you and tell you that they could see into the future, and they will give you their future. And as punishment, they can only look backwards.

Okay. Keep on going. Line 16. Perhaps the force of palsy has so fully distorted some that I've yet to see, and I do not believe that that can be. May God so let you a reader gather fruit from what you read, and now think for yourself how I could ever keep my own face dry. When I beheld my image so nearby and so awry that tears down from the eyes,

bathed the buttocks running down the cleft. Of course I wept leaning against a rock along that rugged ridge so that my guide told me. Are you as foolish as the rest? Here pity only lives when it is dead. For who can be more impious than he who links God's judgment to passivity? Lift your head and see the one for whom the earth was opened while the Thebans watched so that they all cried,

Amferos, where are you rushing? have you quit the fight, nor did he interrupt his downward plunge to Minos, who lays hands on every sinner, see how he's made a chest out of his shoulders, and since he wanted so to see ahead, he looks behind and walks a backward path. And so Teresius, who changed his mean, when from a man he turned into a woman, so totally transforming all his limbs, that then he had to strike once more upon the two entwining serpents, with his wand before he had his manly plumes again.

And Arons is the one who backs against the belly of Teresias, errands who, in loony's hails tilled by the Carraisei, who lived below, had as his home, a cave among white marbles from which he could gaze at stars and see with unimpeded view. And she covers up her breasts, which you can't see with her disheveled locks, who keeps all of her hairy parts to the far side,

was Manto, who had searched through many lands, then settled in the place where I was born, on this I'd have you hear me now a while. When Mentos's father took his leaf of life and Bacca's city found itself enslaved, she wandered through the world for many years. High up in lovely Italy, beneath the elves that shut in Germany above Tirolo lies a lake known as Benaco. A thousand springs and more, I think, must flow out of the waters of that lake to bathe pinino guard of valcomonica and in its middle is a place where three the bishops of verona bresquia trento may bless if they should chance to come that way fesciera strong and handsome fortress built to face the brescians and the bergamasts when the circling

shore is at its lowest there all the waters that cannot be held within the bosom of binocco fall to form a river running through green meadows. No sooner has that stream begun to flow than it is called the Mincio, not Benaco, until Gvernolo, where it joins the Po. It's not flowed far before it finds flat land, and there it stretches out to form a fend that in the summer can at times be fed it. And when she passed that way, the savage virgin saw land along the middle of the swamp and tilled and stripped of its inhabitants. And there to flee all human intercourse, she halted with her slaves to ply her arts, and there she lived, there left her empty body. And after what the people of those parts collected at that place, because the marsh

surrounding it on all sides made it strong. They built a city over her dead bones, and after her who first had picked that spot, they called it Mantua. They cast no lots. There once were far more people in its walls before the foolishness of Casalori was tricked by the deceit of Pinaumonte. therefore i charge you if you ever hear a different tale of my town's origin do not let any falsehood gull the truth and i o master that which ye have spoken convinces me and so compels my trust that others words would only be spent coals but tell me if among the passing souls you see some spirits worthy of our notice because my mind is bent on that alone then he to me that shade who spreads his spirit down from his cheeks across his swarthy shoulders when Greece had been so emptied of its males that hardly any cradle held a sun. He was an auger, and at allus he and Calcus set the time to cut the cables. His name's Eurypolis.

A certain passage of my high tragedy has sung its soul. You know that well enough who know the whole. The other there his flanks extremely spare was Michael Scott, a man who certainly knew how the game of magic fraud was played. fraud was played. See there Guido Bonati, see Asdente, who now would wish he had attended to his cord and leather, but propense too late. See those sad women who had left their needle, shuttle and spindle to become diviners. They cast their spells with herbs and effigies, but let us go. Kane with his thorns already is at the border of both hemispheres and there below Saviée.

Torses touches the sea Last night the moon was at its full You should be well aware of this But there were times when it did you know harm in the deep wood These were his words to me Meanwhile we journeyed Okay so this is about the fortune tellers Okay, they are condemned to always walk

With their head Churn backwards So they can never see in front of them They're going to see behind them And Dante spends a lot of time talking about all these fortune tellers and sages of integrity. Teresius is a really famous, fortune teller, the most famous oracle in Greek mythology.

The man who told Eidipus that he, in fact, did kill his father and slept with his mother, okay? Carisius. Why is Donnie spending so much time on the fortune tellers? What is this problem with fortune tellers or oracles? I mean, isn't he an oracle? Sorry, go ahead. Yeah, I think that's why the Bible speaks against

this kind of fortune telling. It's one of the biggest sins. It's because you denied yourself a free will. Because once you have been given, oh, tomorrow you will die or whatever. And you're like, oh, you're going to self-fulfill that prophecy. So like whatever the fortune teller tells you, kind of sets your path, and you don't have the free will to live up your life anymore.

Okay. That's one possibility, right? Just to deny you free will. Right? Because if, if you remember the story of Oedipus Rex, right? He was told, his father was told, your son will kill you and marry you. your wife, he became so

afraid that he abandoned his son or had he tried to have his son killed, which then set in motion this prophecy. And then when Oedipus was adopted by another world family

in his teenage years, he heard this prophecy and he ran away from his father, which then completed the prophecy because on his way to Thebes, he would get in conflict with his father, with the king, his father, and kill him. And then he'd go and solve the riddle of the sphinx, and then which would allow him to marry his mother, okay, and become king of thieves.

So this, so the idea of free will, right? You can choose whatever you want. It's hampered by these prophecies because then you're just a great, a pawn in the game of the gods, right? Okay, like this prophecy is the idea like the gods want things to certain ways. way and that's why they give you this prophecy in order to manipulate you into behaving the way that they want okay yes any other explanations for why he really done it really doesn't like these fortune tellers he doesn't really like that like the idea of fortune telling yes if you're a big fortune tell if

you become a famous fortune telling the net effect is you using the total amount of imagination that that you know your popularization or your kind of the people that you preach to have. So it's restricting the level of creativity, imagination, that God ultimately wants to grow, not strict. Sure, yes, exactly. And also, a lot of these Fortune Talas are doing for profit, right? They often do it to make money, yes.

Yeah, because Fortune Tarot just keep telling you that everything is fake. It's fixed. You can't change. So it means that there's no fair rail, and you can't just choose what they want, and you just listen. So some people may be against this and some people agree with that. But whatever you agree or disagree, the French and tallying just try to, you know, disturb you and change your original will.

Okay. Yes. Anyone else? Have you guys, do you remember the book of Exodus when Moses gets in a fight with the priest of the pharaoh? And they have like this magic contest. Can you talk about that, Carol? Is it when they were leaving? And so they had against the ten gods of the pharaoh? Is that what it is? Before they leave?

Yes. Of the gods? Okay. So basically Moses was like, yeah, Israelites have to go out of Egypt. And the king of Egypt was, I know, we're going to slave for you, free labor. So then they put up the contest between the gods. So there were the ten plagues. So each plague was against each god of the,

the Egyptians. Yes. Okay. So there's actually quite a few of these contests in the Bible. Okay. The prophet to prove himself, he must go to war with other fortune tellers, with other diviners to prove that I am truly the messenger from heaven. Okay. And to do that, I'm sure that every one of you is fake and false. Does that make sense? So Dante, I mean, there are many motivations, but one major motivation is that Dante is trying to prove that he is the ultimate prophet, showing that every other fortune teller is just a fraud. Okay, doesn't make sense? Okay, so then let me ask, yes?

It's a part in the passage where Dante actually has a, for me, he has a kind of unusual reaction. He feels kind of sad looking at the creatures with their head backwards, right? Yes, but that's Dante's reaction to everyone, right? It's like, I pity this. Okay. And it goes back to the idea of Aristotle, like, why is important to watch what you're, theater. Like, why is it important to go to theater? And why is theater? Yes? You see the tragedy of yourself in them. Yes, exactly, right? This is part of something called the catharsis process.

He is in hell to purge himself of his fear and his pride and his anger. And the way you do that is by spitting other people. And this is what creates the catharsis and allows you to be a new person. I mean, back to the laccomedia, right? Initially, Dante called this lucka media. it was only afterwards that it was proven to be divine right right so i'm wondering if he's kind of worried too like if this is i'm only doing like you know i if i'm not fully channeling channeling the divine here will i end up in the same situation sure sure but but he's pretty confident that that he is the true prophet okay otherwise he would not be writing uh the deline comedy um what proves that he is the true prophet to dante if you're a fortune teller and you

predict something right then that shows you are the true profit but don't do that so how does don't prove he's the true prophet and he's able to convince a lot of people he's a true prophet how before the plague came well yeah well he died before the plague right the beauty of his poetry right Does that make sense? It's so beautiful that you move to tears and you are convinced that he must be the prophet, right? Because otherwise, how else could he have conjured up such beautiful poetry? Okay? Let me ask you this question and we'll end because we've been going a long time and we'll sort of finish Divine Comedy only the next two days.

So in our present day, what kind of people will be convinced? condemned to hell with their heads turn backwards. And I don't know the answer, but I'm just curious as what, who you might think would be condemned to hell with this sort of punishment. I don't know the answer, I'm just asking you guys, who you think might deserve such a punishment. We don't have fortune tellers today, right? But what kind of people? There are a lot of fortune tellers today. Actually, fortune telling is quite in vogue now. In Asia, and China, yeah.

Yes. I think fake news, so like media, newspaper, like in a way to move public opinion so that it fulfills the prophecy that the media wants. Yeah, yeah, yes. People within it agenda, I guess you can call it fake news, people within it, the larger agenda, trying to make something happen,

and then they're using all these channels for communication. They're restricting imagination, right? Yeah. The concept of restricting people's imagination. to capture them into one reality that we want to happen. No, no, I happen to agree. I think very influential journalists today that clearly have an agenda, they are the modernly equivalent of fortune tellers, right?

Because the way that you would influence a king is you would bribe a fortune teller to tell him what he wants to hear. And that would cause him to do what you wanted. And that's what journalists, podcasters, YouTube celebrities, but not me, of course. That's what they do, right? So, yes? It goes back to imagination.

If your act of broadcast, whatever the content that you put out, is it a net positive or net negative on imagination, on people's ability to think for themselves, right? Right. And how would you differentiate between good and bad? No, no, people's ability to think for themselves, not necessarily good or bad, right? right, if I inject something with emotion and I try to push it, push it, push it, force-feed it to the larger population, that's going to be similar to fortune teller. Yes. I think people that are bad are those who trying to convince you into believing something without letting you even question it or just letting you know that you are being influenced by them. and your imagination is influenced or even narrowed down by them

into believing something fixed that they want you to believe. But like you said, that's why I think you are not this kind of person because you never like don't let us to imagine for ourselves and propose our own arguments against or not against you. Okay, thank you for that. Any more comments? Yeah, because there's a hardwood. always make a lot of films and all of the blockbusters just try to keep telling you some kind of the you know to predict the future for example like Terminator or some kind of films like that avatar or you know maybe yeah okay that that gives you a possible explanation right not the not they're like trying to convince you this is what going to happen they give you a possibility so do you think that's also a fortune teller in a way

that it's okay all right so so so so so i don't spend too much time on on this on this idea and also i'll get into trouble because you guys will name names and then he'll interview me he'll like shout up me for an hour okay but like um we have looked at a list of a sliding decline okay are there any major things that are missing from this list that that that you want to point out so for example the idea of a meritocracy which is an intense competition for few and fewer resources. You have access and arrogance, pride,

fraud, you have the lack of social mobility, lack of openness, homosexuality, incest among the elite because they want to exclude everyone else, right? Too much self-love, too much self-indulgence, too much individuality, too much immigration, yes? I feel like extreme wealth inequality. Yes, exactly.

Great. extreme wealth inequality yes self indulgence self indulgence yes not being able to express one's own opinions yes censorship exactly

exactly that's very important yes I want to write this down okay sorry censorship I mean the fact that when we talk about homosexuality like you know I'm nervous about being cancelled on

YouTube right I'm being stolen at death at Yale. Yes. Increased. Yes. Yes? I think censorship is a problem, but, like, in some, well, you can actually say whatever you want, like think whatever you want, but the fact that you cannot change anything.

No, you can't. No, you cannot. No, you cannot. If you, if this were at Yale and I said, you know, homosexuality could be, you know, homosexuality could be bad, I've been in a lot of trouble. I get fired. I'm not joking here, okay? You cannot say what if you want.

You just can't. Yes? Decrease trust in social institutions. Yes. The media, the government. Yes. That's really important, okay? The breakdown of authority.

Yes. Exactly. The breakdown of authority. This is really important. The reality is that today, there are no institutions that can be trusted anymore, right? Right? Before in the United States, you had Congress, you had science, you had the military, you had universities. Now, none of these users are trusted. Yes? To that point also increased bureaucracy, like bureaucrats having a lot of power. Yes, okay. Yes. Maybe postmodernism. So like the annihilation of all the trusted authorities before like the cancel culture movement.

Instead of building up, we call this post-truth. Yeah, post-truth. Yeah. Right. You can't even talk about what's true or not. Yes? I would say directed education, so giving one definition of what it means to be successful. Exactly, yes.

A narrow definition of success, yes. Yes? Degradation in the aesthetic standards. Okay, great. Vince, we are totally screwed, okay? All right, so that's it for today. I'll see everyone tomorrow.