Prime Crime: Solved Murders - Best of 2022: Madalyn Murray O'Hair Pt. 2

Episode Date: December 28, 2022

When reporter John McCormack went looking for missing celebrity pundit Madalyn Murray O’Hair, he thought it might be more than a simple case of tax evasion. Sure enough, he found a trail of stolen gold, disgruntled employees, and a disembodied torso... But it would still take years to uncover the truth about Madalyn’s tragic last days. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Due to the graphic nature of this story, listener discretion is advised. This story contains instances of gun violence, sexual assault, murder, dismemberment, and gore, and domestic violence. We advise extreme caution for children under 13. On October 3, 1995, three young men drove from San Antonio to Austin, Texas, for a guy's night out on the town. They were hyped. As soon as they arrived in Austin, they went straight to a public storage building. It was an unusual stop for a night out, but they had a plan. One of the men, Jaime Valdez, struck up a conversation with the facilities manager.

Meanwhile, the two others, Joe Cortez and Joey Cardenas, used a skeleton key to bust into storage units. Cortez and Cardenas wanted to find something valuable that they could pawn. The criminals didn't have any grand ambition. They were hoping to make enough money to treat themselves to a few drinks and cover gas for the night. As Cardenas broke into lockers, he smuggled anything worth selling, like a stereo or big-screen TV. But when he cracked into locker 1640, the only thing inside was a large black suitcase.

The criminals grabbed the luggage and headed out. It was so heavy they could barely wheel it away. Once they got to their car, the young men inspected the luggage. As they unzipped the suitcase, the guys realized it wasn't just any old go bag. It was stuffed with gold coins, enough money to change their lives forever. With their newfound loot, they could afford years of rent, booze, and visits to gentlemen's clubs. But the guys weren't the only ones whose fortunes turned. They just stolen a ransom payment meant to free Madeline Murray O'Hare. As the young men

disappeared into the night, so too did Madeline's hope for survival. Welcome to Solved Murders, True Crime Mysteries, a Spotify original from Parcast. I'm your host, Carter Roy. And I'm your host Wendy McKenzie. Every Wednesday, we step into the world of true crime's most fascinating murder cases and tell the tale of how real-life detectives close the case. You can find episodes of Solve Murders and all other Spotify originals from Parcast for free exclusively on Spotify. This is our final episode on the murders of Madeline Murray O'Hare, her son, and her granddaughter. Last week, we covered their disappearance and the clues that identified David Waters as a suspect.

This week, we'll discuss Madeline's kidnapping, her captor's motive, and the legacy she left behind. We have all that and more coming up. Stay with us. Yamava Resort and Casino at San Manuel is California's number one entertainment destination for today's superstars. Catch the Jonas Brothers return to the Yamava Theater stage

on April 30th, the powerful vocals of Demi Lovato on May 17th, and the signature Southern Country Rush. of Eric Church on July 19th. Tickets on sale now at Yamava Theater.com, only at Yamava Resort and Casino, celebrating its 40th anniversary. You win? Must be 21 to enter. In 1998, investigative reporter John McCormick examined the disappearance of the most hated woman in America. McCormick thought the story of the famous atheist could result in a compelling article for his paper, the San Antonio Express News.

After McCormick published stories about the disappearance of Madeline Murray O'Hare, her son John, and her granddaughter Robin, a private detective named Tim Young joined his cause. Though he was only in his 20s, Young already had a solid reputation as a PI. Like McCormick, he knew a celebrity case like this could do wonders for his career. In the summer of 1998, their investigation led them to a Vietnam War veteran, named Bob Fry. Fry told them that the disappearances were actually a kidnapping. The man who orchestrated the whole thing was named David Waters. According to Fry, his two-bit hustler brother Danny was involved in the kidnapping. However, Danny had gone missing. And when Bob started asking

questions about his brother, Waters and an unnamed accomplice tried to scare Bob into silence. Bob knew the two cases were linked. If McCormick looked into Waters and his partner, he'd find out what happened to Madeline Murray O'Hare and Danny. Meanwhile, Tim Young went after David Waters. Through phone records, they already knew that Madeline and Danny Fry were in San Antonio in September of 1995. Now, they just needed to connect the dots.

Young discovered that Waters had purchased a Cadillac in San Antonio, during that same month. This was a huge find, but Young's investigation didn't stop there. He unearthed David Waters' criminal past, and it wasn't pretty. Water's rap sheet extended all the way back to the 1960s. He spent the better part of two decades behind bars for various crimes, assault, burglary, forgery, and murder. Tim Young also searched for Waters' unnamed.

accomplished, the second man who intimidated Bob Fry. He discovered the man's name, Gary Paul Carr. Carr was a biker and heavy drug user who had met Waters at Joliet Prison while he was doing time for armed robbery, rape, and kidnapping. The two became friends and later partners in crime. After discovering who may really be responsible for Madeline's disappearance, Tim Young worried they were getting in over their heads. David Waters and Gary Carr were hardcore, violent criminals.

Young wanted to take everything to the police for their own safety. John McCormick disagreed. They had an agreement to work together for the newspaper. If they went to the police, Young would ruin everything they had worked for. But Young refused to listen. In early August, 1998, he delivered a digital. detailed report to the Austin PD with everything he'd discovered. But McCormick had nothing to worry about because the Austin PD did nothing.

Even more disheartening, Young got the same response when he went to the FBI. For reasons that are unclear, the feds greeted Young's evidence with silence. While Young considered his next move, John McCormick had a deadline. On August 16, 1998, he published a damning article that laid out the details of the crime and mentioned Waters' name in association with kidnapping, murder, and theft. Considering that Waters wasn't technically under investigation, tying his name to the murder had the potential for serious legal consequences. It was within Waters' right to Sue McCormick and the paper for libel.

Instead, he agreed to be interviewed. viewed by various media outlets. Waters wanted to tell his side of the story, so he sat down with local reporters. Mr. Waters, if you say you didn't steal the $600,000 in gold, why are you wearing an Armani outfit with a Raymond Wilde watch? Why don't you answer me this? If I stole that money, why is my bank account emptier than a strip joint on a Tuesday afternoon? In the accusation of homicide?

Brother, Texas is the last place I'd be if I committed four murders. We got a little thing called the death penalty here, and Governor Bush is its number one fan. Any thoughts on John McCormick? He's just doing his job, selling papers. Hey, I wouldn't be surprised if he's trying to use Madeline's disappearance to get himself a gig at one of those cable news networks. I think I heard Ted Turner calling his name. The interviews were bizarre. Even more bizarre was that after McCormick's article was public.

the authorities still refused to look into Madeline's disappearance, but Tim Young didn't accept defeat. Some time later, Young managed to get in touch with Madeline's estranged older son, William. William had filed a missing persons report two years earlier. However, since then, he hadn't heard from law enforcement. Through his evangelical ministry, William had become close with prominent Republican lawmakers. He reached out to a Texas congressman, and almost immediately the FBI called up Tim Young. The political pressure got the FBI to stop dragging their feet.

Young met with agents in San Antonio and reiterated everything he had already given the FBI. Waters and cars, rap sheets, the phone records, the gold coins, everything. The FBI likely acknowledged that there was some pretty solid circumstantial evidence linking the two ex-cons to Madeline's disappearance. However, there was one major problem. There were no bodies yet. On October 2nd, 1998, McCormick came across a story from the Dallas Morning News. The article described a cold case murder from three years earlier. A man's body was discovered near the Dallas suburb of Seagoville along the Trinity River. The victim's head and hands had been removed, likely to obscure the victim's identity.

Unfortunately, the killer's plan had paid off. There were very few clues that pointed to a suspect, and the victim was unidentifiable. As McCormick read the article, he wondered if maybe, just maybe, the victim was Danny Fry. The body was discovered right after Danny disappeared. Perhaps David Waters and Gary Carr had murdered Danny in order to tie up loose ends. McCormick convinced the police to do a DNA test. Soon after, law enforcement finally found results. On January 30, 1999, the San Antonio Express News published a shocking article.

A DNA test confirmed that the mangled body found in Dallas three years earlier was Danny Fry. Unfortunately, the monumental break in the case did nothing to motivate the Austin PD. They likely felt McCormick did not have any definitive proof connecting Danny to David Waters and Gary Carr or that Danny had anything to do with Madeline's disappearance. However, there was one person inspired to come forward by McCormick's DNA article. David Waters' ex-girlfriend, Patty Joe Stephens. The DNA revelation sent shivers down Patty Joe's spine.

To her, the walls were closing in, and she feared Waters might come after her next. Patty Joe went to the FBI's Austin office, where she met the special agent on the case, Donna Cowling. According to author Ted Dracos, Cowling had an easy manner, a kind of understated choice. She was able to use that to connect with people who may have been too scared to talk. Agent Cowling could see the fear in Patty Joe's eyes. She fully understood the potential violence Patty Joe might face if she talked. After all, Waters was a convicted murderer. After some gentle persuasion, Cowling convinced Patty Joe to tell her story despite the danger.

And as Cowling listened to the frightening detain, tales, she knew that Patty Joe would be instrumental in building a case against Waters and Car. Cowling's investigation next letter to an IRS agent, Ed Martin. A 30-year vet, Martin had been assigned to Madeline's tax case. After reading McCormick's article and speaking with private investigator Tim Young, he believed Madeline's disappearance involved more than just tax evasion. In early 1999, Cowling and Martin partnered up and agreed that they were going to be the ones to take down David Waters and Gary Carr.

Their plan was simple. Get the suspects on something besides murder and use that to leverage information regarding Madeline. It didn't take the agents long to discover that both men had an affinity for guns. And as ex-convicts, it was illegal for. for them to possess firearms or ammunition. They raided Waters' and Cars' homes on March 24, 1999. David Waters' birthday.

Happy birthday, David. We have a warrant to search your house. Good luck. The only thing you're going to find here is a couple of dirty magazines and some Rocky Mountain Tallboys. That effect. You know, you could do us all a favor and just give us the gold you took. Or maybe the weapon you used to kill Madeline?

I don't know how many times I got to tell you, morons. I don't have no gold. Look at this place in an exactly Buckingham Palace. Whoa, boss, take a look at this. David, David, David, what's with all the ammo? You're thinking about Robin Fort Knox? While the feds weren't able to find a gun in Waters' possession, they did find a small cache of ammunition.

According to author Ted Dracos, Waters was in possession of almost 120 rounds of various caliber bullets, including those for a 38, 9mm automatic, and a 357 magnum. All of which were in clear violation of his parole. While FBI agents arrested David Waters, Ed Martin paid Gary Carr a visit just outside of Detroit. And despite not having a search warrant, Martin easily convinced Carr to let him and his team into his apartment.

After reading Carr, his Miranda writes, Martin started asking questions about Madeline. Carr claimed that he and Waters were hired to make them disappear. According to Carr, Madeline wanted to get away from the IRS. At one point during the search, Carr asked to go to the restroom. When he came out, he was shocked to see an agent holding up a 22-caliber pistol. The agent asked if it was his and Carr didn't deny it. Carr's gun violated his parole. Worse, it was his third strike.

He was now looking at life in prison. Martin wanted Carr to confess to the murders before Carr was detained and had a lawyer. Once that happened, it could be impossible to get Carr to open up. So he continued asking questions and tried to seem empathetic. He convinced Carr that complying could shave off a few years from his inevitable prison sentence if he told the truth,

and Carr folded. He outlined the entire kidnapping and extortion scheme. Sadly, he also confirmed that Madeline, John, and Robin were in fact dead. But he said Waters planned all of it.

He claimed he hadn't committed the murders. He just followed Water's orders. To top it all off, he drew them a map to where he and Waters buried Madeline and her family. Coming up, the people versus Gary Carr. I knew about investing, but I really didn't know how to go about it.

Meet Corey, a Walthfront client. With Wealthfront, it could put money in, and it would automatically distribute it into a diversified portfolio. Then it starts to compound. The compounding compounds on the compounding. Just let it run, and it's great. Over 1 million clients trust Wealthfront. Get started at Wealthfront.com.

Client was paid $1,000 for their testimonial, creating a conflict of interest. outcomes vary. Investment management and advisory services provided by Wellfront Advisors LLC and SEC registered investment advisor. Investing involves risk to principle regardless of the strategy used. Has performance does not guarantee future results. Now back to the story. By the spring of 1999, the long arm of the law was finally closing in on David Waters and Gary Carr. Both had been arrested on parole violations and authorities were building cases against them for four murders. Madeline Murray O'Hare, Robin Murray O'Hare, John Garth Murray, Annie Fry. Despite the circumstantial evidence tying waters and Carr to the Murray-O-Hare murders,

one essential piece was still missing. The bodies. In an effort to avoid jail time, Gary Carr drew law enforcement a map to where the Murray-O-Hairs were allegedly buried. Even as he handed over the directions, he maintained that he didn't have anything to do with the murders. Supposedly, the only time he'd been out to this dump site was when David Waters took him there to ensure heavy rains hadn't uncovered the bodies. A few days later, around Easter weekend in April 1999, a massive search launched in the remote Texas Hill country in the center of the state. FBI agents used ground-penetrating radar, high-tech infrared cameras, even cadaver dogs. Dozens of agents spent the weekend examining the area on Carr's map, inch by inch.

Despite all of this, the feds came away empty-handed. This wasn't entirely unexpected. The Muriel Hairs had been missing for nearly four years. The area they searched was prone to flash floods, which could change landmarks Carr had remembered or bury the bodies under even more soil. If the Murielhawares were there, the hill country wasn't giving them up easily.

Still, the search wasn't the only iron the FBI had in the fire. While authorities couldn't charge Gary Carr for murder without the bodies, they had more than enough evidence to try him for kidnapping and extortion. With any luck, the truth would finally come out in court. In May 2000, Gary Carr's trial began in Austin, Texas. Even though Carr was being tried for kidnapping and extortion, it basically became a murder trial in absentia for David Waters. Carr claimed he had nothing to do with the murders.

He'd only acted as security for the Muriel Hairs, while David Waters helped them leave the country to avoid the IRS. It was the same story he'd spun for federal agents the day he was arrested. As the prosecution called witnesses to the stand, this alibi sounded thinner and thinner. Craig Eder, the Murray O'Hare's tax lawyer, testified that the family wasn't looking to flee anywhere. In fact, the IRS had knocked their tax bill down from $1.5 million to less than $50,000 in the summer of 1995, weeks before Madeline went missing.

Despite this timeline, the defense still asserted that the Murray O'Hairs had tried to run. They pointed to the fact that in September 1995, John had asked Ellen Johnson, the new head of American atheists, to open up a bank account into which he could send hundreds of thousands of foreign dollars. He took 600,000 of that to a jewelry store and exchanged it for gold coins, ultimately only picking up $500,000 worth. Though he was meant to collect the other $100,000 in coins, he never claimed them. The defense argued this money funded the family's flight from the IRS. The prosecution, on the other hand, believed this money wasn't to flee.

It was a ransom. It did seem like some of that money made its way to Carr and waters. Gary Carr's ex-wife, Charlene, stated that at that time, her husband bought Armani suits and silk ties, despite being unemployed. Charlene claimed she'd secretly recorded him admitting the three Muriel O'Hare's were dead and that Waters murdered them. If Charlene's startling testimony wasn't enough to convince the jury, the prosecution still had one more ace up their sleeve.

Waters' ex-girlfriend Patty Joe Stephens. Patty Joe faced an uphill battle. For one thing, she was terrified of David Waters and Gary Carr. Waters was a violent man who had already knocked some of her teeth out. For another, the defense was hell-bent on discrediting her as a criminal and a deviant. Before the trial, the defense tried to enter a sexual photo of Patty Joe into evidence. They wanted to paint a picture of her supposedly degenerate character. During her cross-examination, they characterized Patty as a thief and an unreliable drug user.

Unfortunately for them, this strategy backfired. Okay, you have used methamphetamine? Yes. You have used heroin? Yes. You have never told the prosecutors that you have used heroin, have you? Yes. Was that only after or was that just recently?

Yes. All right, because I told them that, correct? Yeah, well, I've got to admit, you know, there are things that I didn't really think was everybody's, business because I didn't really consider them to be pertinent to this. But it's not because I was trying to hold myself out as an angel. Patty's willingness to talk candidly about her past made her seem more trustworthy, not less. And she revealed some truly frightening things in her testimony. According to Patty, Gary Carr and Danny Fry frequently spent time with her and David Waters at

their apartment in Austin. In August and September, 1995, the three men began acting suspiciously. Waters stopped staying at the apartment and Patty would go days without seeing any of them. Then around September 30th, they returned, acting like nothing had happened. Obviously, something had happened. Like car, Waters started buying expensive clothes, cars, and gold jewelry.

Waters made Patty rent a storage unit and told her he was hiding half a million dollars in gold coins inside. Danny Fry, on the other hand, seemed nearly sick with anxiety. Patty told the jury that Danny had planned to head back to Florida. Patty even helped him pack gifts for his daughter. However, several days after the trio returned,

Patty arrived home to find Danny had left, without his things. Carr and Waters both claimed he'd gone off somewhere with a guy, but Patty couldn't believe he would leave without his daughter's presence. In the following days, Patty grew even more suspicious. She found a shovel and a saw in the back of David's car. Danny Fry's daughter called her, demanding to know where her father was.

Danny's brother also called, but spoke with David Waters. Around this time, she found the shoes. And so, anyway, I look in the bag and there's this wash cloth sitting on top of three pairs of tennis shoes and it's bloody and... The washcloth is bloody? The washcloth is bloody. The tennis shoes are bloody. Where on the tennis shoes, ma'am, did you observe any blood?

Well, on the... Well, when I just looked in the bag, I observed blood, you know, just like smeared and sort of splatted, you know, and just, you know, like up to here, you know, just sort of up to there on your shoe. like someone had stood in a large puddle of liquid? Well, yes. I mean, for all three pairs to have remnants of blood like that, I thought, you know, it just almost made me sick.

But anyway, David jumped up and, you know, nostrils flaring and said, get away from there, don't ever look in there again, or, you know, something to that effect. Patty was nearly certain that three pairs of bloody shoes belonged to Waters, Carr, and the now missing Danny Fry. On top was her own personal handkerchief, soaked in blood. At that point in 1995, Patty didn't want to admit she thought something terrible had happened to Danny,

so she kept what she'd seen to herself, hoping it wasn't true until she saw a reporter John McCormick's article on the missing Murray O'Hare's in 1999. The article was a wake-up call, A headless body found on October 2, 1995, had been identified through DNA as Danny Fry. McCormick traced the connection of Fry's murder to the disappearance of the Murray O'Hare's and the missing $500,000 in gold coins. Patty knew she had to come forward. Not only could she provide a timeline and witness testimony, she also knew David Waters' motive.

Okay, and can you tell you? Tell us, ma'am, what Mr. Waters' reaction was after reading that newsletter published by the O'Hare organization. He was furious with her and not being melodramatic, vowed revenge. Can you be more specific about whether or not he made any threats of harm to Madeline or anyone else? He often spoke about, you know, because she, you know, he had a genius IQ and he considered her to be true intelligentsia. And so it was sort of an ego thing with him. And he just had these fantasies about separating her from her money because she's so cleverly. He felt that she was like a televangelist and would get people to send her money and send her things.

That all of her money came from just that sort of activity, you know. It wasn't earned. It was just taken from people who, that she convinced of a particular philosophy. And he often, I mean, he, you know, I know we've all read about the snipping off the toe, but he would actually say things like that. Miss Stephens, we must assume for purposes of the record that the jury has not read anything that they are to consider in this case. So if you could repeat the testimony you just alluded to, please, ma'am? Well, he would say, you know, he would sort of talk about how he would like to hurt her, how he would like to, you know, he'd like to torture her, you know, snip off her toes, take pliers and pull her toes off, you know, that kind of thing, which, you know.

Was he saying this in a rather humorous or kidding manner, or did you take it as serious? Both. I mean, you know, there's a kind of, you know, an ironic wit, you know, that you can look at things that are absurd and they almost seem funny. But yet at the same time, I mean, he was truly furious about this. And I think, and again, I reiterate, you know, he had a sense of vengeance about after this newsletter appeared. and it was like there was a calm came over him about Madeline. I mean, there was something. I think he really wanted to prove a point to her face to face.

While Waters had a well-documented hatred for Madeline, his feelings were probably not his sole motive in kidnapping her. The other was much less personal. Money. Throughout the trial, the prosecution had continually admonished the jury to follow the money, meaning the $500,000 in gold coins. The prosecution contended that Waters and Carr had forced the Muriel Hares to give them this money, but this was hard to prove.

While David and Gary had bought designer clothes, jewelry, and cars, the value of these things was much less than half a million dollars. When the FBI raided their apartments, they found no stacks of cash or luxury goods, and no investigation found any evidence of hidden bank accounts. So nobody knew where the money had gone. Except, after months of searching, the prosecution thought they had found the answer. In late September 1995, David Waters asked Patty Joe Stephens to rent a storage locker. And on October 3rd, that locker was robbed by three young men with a skeleton key.

Joey Cardenas, Jaime Valdez, and Joe Cortez spent the next several years riding high. Mr. Valdez, you spent $120,000 to $140,000 on renting apartments, clothes, and three cars? Mostly went to the strip clubs. And you spent $1,000 a night at the strip club? At least. The testimony went into great detail about how he saw. spent the cash, but by the end of the questioning, it was clear all the money was gone. And of course, you don't get any kind of receipt or proof that you spent your money there, do you?

You could go ask them. I'm sure they still remember me. Half a million in gold had been squandered on three young men's benders. Waters and Carr had kidnapped, imprisoned, and most likely killed three people for nothing. On June 2,000, the jury reached a verdict in Gary Carr's trial. They found him guilty of extortion and money laundering, but not kidnapping. The problem was the missing bodies. Though Carr had led the FBI to the spot where they were supposedly buried, the Murray O'Harris had yet to be found.

Some of the jury believed this constituted reasonable doubt that Madeline, John, and Robin were dead. Even with the lesser counts, the trial still managed to put Gary Carr away. He'd previously been convicted of violent crimes, so under the three strikes rule, he was sentenced to life without parole. Several months after Gary Carr's trial, in September 2000, a grand jury indicted David Waters for kidnapping, robbery, and extortion of the Murray O'Hare's. However, according to author Ted Dracos,

Waters had no desire for his case to go to trial. Waters was already serving a sentence in a notoriously harsh Texas state prison for stealing while employed by the American atheists. There, inmates often worked in sun-baked fields overseen by officers on horseback. If he accepted the federal charges, he would do his time in a much nicer facility without the threat of hard labor. Plus, Waters was unlikely to convince a jury of his innocence. He'd already been convicted of murder decades earlier when he and three friends beat a 16-year-old to death in a drunken fight. So he submitted a plea deal.

He'd get 20 years in federal prison for conspiracy. In return, he just had to tell them what he knew about the missing Muriel Hairs. The truth, this time. Coming up, we finally find out what happened to Madeline, John, and Robin. Now back to the story. In January 2001, Waters met with federal agents to outline his version of the events. At first, just like Carr, he admitted to everything except the murders. For those, he placed the blame squarely on Carr.

Authorities knew that Waters was a habitual liar with a blatant disregard for the well-being of others. They didn't believe his initial confession, and four days later, they finally got him to crack. Waters admitted he'd planned the killings all along. With this confession, the detectives were finally able to piece together the sordid final weeks of one of America's most polarizing families. Sunday, August 27, 1995 is most likely when the first crime was committed. That afternoon, Madeline and John were working at the American atheist headquarters

when David Waters, Gary Carr, and Danny Frye arrive. No, you can't have water. Stop asking. Mom, the poor gardener spending his weekend at work. Yeah, well, so are we. But we have AC. It's 100 degrees outside. Unbelievable. If he asks skin, he's fired. Delivery for Madeline O'Hare. That better be my pericomo bread box.

That's been three weeks already. On the ground, now! $50,000 wasn't enough for you, David. Nah, this time I want everything. You got caught the first time. What makes you think you're not going to screw it up again? Because, Madeline, everybody hates you. Except Robin, that is.

And when she calls the office and no one answers, she'll come here, looking for you. And she'll be mighty surprised at what she finds. Water's theory about Robin was right on the money. When she tried calling the offices and no one picked up, Robin headed straight over in a panic. There she was kidnapped along with everyone else. Next, the group drove to the Murray O'Hare House to search for valuables, anything they could sell for a quick buck. They also told the family to pack their things.

They'd be spending a few weeks away from home. Tell me where we're going and what exactly you want. This isn't necessary, David. Just be straight with me. You'll find out everything in due time, Madeline. And if you try anything, you'll find out a lot sooner. He's right, Mom. They have no reason to hurt us.

We just need to do what they say and give them whatever they want. I trust him. Everything's going to be fine. That's what you think. I think these hair-brain jackals mean to kill us. Madeline's instincts were correct. Everything was not going to be fine. Carr, the most violent of the group, sexually assaulted Robin in her bedroom.

This sexual violence would continue throughout the kidnapping. At nightfall, the group piled into a cargo van and John's Mercedes and hit the road. After a two-day drive, they checked into the Warren Inn, a motel residence in San Antonio, where they rented a two-day. two-bedroom unit for all six people. It's unlikely that Madeline, Robin, or John were restrained at the Warren Inn. However, they were always guarded by at least one of their kidnappers. Just as he had at the Murray O'Hare home, John seemed to place his trust in the kidnappers.

He genuinely attempted to cooperate and appease them, hoping that this behavior would be rewarded. And in a sense, it was. Waters allowed Madeline's son to accompany him on errands, specifically to pick up Madeline's medications at the pharmacy, and even to grab drinks at a nearby restaurant. Other than these rare trips, the only excitement came in the form of Nintendo tournaments between John and David. The group spent 28 long, hot, excruciatingly boring days in the motel.

But even under these deplorable conditions, Madeline never lost her bite. Next time he lets you out, call the police. Hell no, Mom. He sees everything. It's 5.30, case o'clock. I want to see a doctor. I'm going to have a diabetic stroke if I spend another minute in this dump.

You've got your prescriptions, Madeline. And once I get my money, you'll be free to go. I don't believe you. And I don't want Mexican today. I want Long John Silver's. What in the world is Long John Silvers? What does it sound like, smart guy? It's a fish place.

You see an ocean out that window, lady? They also have fried chicken, David, which I know you like. I don't give one iota what he likes. I want two orders of popcorn shrimp. You keep eating like that and you really will have a diabetic stroke. Madeline probably would have been twice as biting if she knew what waters really had in store. The family was doomed from the... moment they were kidnapped.

In fact, Waters eventually admitted to law enforcement agents that he had always planned on killing the Murri O'Hairs once they got their money. And just before John went to pick up the gold coins, the group moved to a different motel. This time they crammed into two small rooms at a nearby La Quinta Inn. The new accommodations served the kidnappers' plan perfectly. With rooms on the ground floor, they wouldn't have to drag hands. heavy corpses down a flight of stairs. Also, they could park their cargo van right outside the door without arousing suspicion. After John received the coins and handed them over in late

September 1995, Waters drove the loot to Austin and placed it in the storage locker. Meanwhile, Kar and Fry bound the Murri O'Hairs by their wrists and ankles. They told their captives they were being tied so that the captors could make a clean escape. And sadly, they were right. John, Robin, and Madeline wouldn't make it through the night. When Waters returned from Austin, the kidnappers took John into the second room. Even with his limbs bound, John still fought for his life. And it required all three men to subdue him. They eventually suffocated him by placing a bag over his head. Next, one of the men strangled Robin. At the time of her death, she was only 30 years old.

Around the same time, the other two men strangled Madeline. Within minutes, the woman who would become a fixture on the TV screens of millions of Americans lay dead in a San Antonio motel room. The killers wrapped each body in blankets and loaded them into the back of the van. After crashing for the night in Waters' apartments, They drove straight to the storage locker to dismember the bodies. But once they arrived, Waters and Fry wanted no part of the butchering, so Carr agreed to do it all himself in exchange for $25,000 from each man.

When he was done, Carr loaded the remains into three 55-gallon metal drums. At some point over the next few days, Waters and Carr drove Danny Fry to an unknown location. By this point, they also felt they could no longer trust their accomplice. He was too absent-minded and ran his mouth to his brother and daughter. One time he'd fallen asleep while guarding the Murray O'Hare's with his loaded pistol sitting on the nightstand. They couldn't risk any more mistakes. So water shot Fry in the head,

then Carr mutilated his body, dumping his headless and handless body on the riverbank. Waters and Carr then returned to downtown Austin to get the storage drums, which now included the hands and head of Danny Fry. A short time later, they drove 100 miles west of San Antonio to a pre-arranged burial site at a sprawling ranch. There, they dumped the Murray O'Hare's remains into a pit, covered them with gasoline, and set them on fire. Finally, they covered the burnt corpses with soil. For a time, it seemed like Carr and Waters might actually get away with it, and for a time, they did.

Even years after Carr and Waters were arrested, there was rampant speculation about what really happened to the Murray O'Hare's. Had they been killed, or had they split town to live high on the hog in New Zealand? It wasn't until January 2001, when David Waters and a group of FBI agents in forensics' experts made their way to a sprawling Texas ranch that the world would finally know the truth. David was able to lead them where cars map couldn't. Every time I complain about working late in the office, I think back on the summers I spent on a ranch just like this. Now that was hard work. Breathing pretty heavy, David. Need a sip of water. I'd rather have a beer. If I was you, I'd drink up as much country air as you can.

going to be a while before you breathe it again. We got something. This looked like the place, David? Then dogs look pretty sure of it. I need evidence bags, shovels, and this entire area blocked off. You know, lots of people call this part of Texas God's country. It's a shame the devil mucked it up. After locating the bodies, authorities could finally put an end to the speculation

surrounding the Muriel Hare's disappearance. Still, the resolution felt anticlimactic. Maybe because the killers got what they wanted. As promised, Waters was sent to federal prison in 2001, but died of lung cancer only two years later. And as of 2022, Carr is serving a 50-year sentence in federal prison. Today, the American Atheist's organization is still active, though far less influential than during Madeline's lifetime.

After all, few could succeed Madeline Murray O'Hare. Throughout her life, Madeline was a domineering, iconoclastic, and wildly controversial figure. But many weren't surprised that such a public figure found herself in such a violent situation. Initially, Madeline's successful crusade against prayer in public school felt ethical and virtuous to many. But after her victory and the publicity that came with it, she was happy to assume the role of a villain, one who engaged in a non-stop string of lawsuits that became increasingly frivolous.

Always confrontational and outspoken, she became unnecessarily antagonistic. She appeared on every talk show, radio show, or public forum where she could earn a buck and get some publicity. She even toured with a notorious, Christian Huckster, giving a platform to and earning money from the sort of person she'd spent years fighting. But even as her reputation came into question, she always had the courage to stand up for

what she believed in, and she did so by following her instinct, the one that made her the most famous atheist in America. Unfortunately, she surrounded herself with people she didn't care about, and they felt the same way about her. In the end, her malaise, cynicism, and selfishness left her vulnerable to a cold-blooded killer like David Waters. For Madeline and David, greed was an equally powerful motivator, and ultimately Madeline's early achievements were overshadowed by her kidnapping and murder.

But no matter how one felt about Madeline Murray O'Hare, most agreed that she certainly did not deserve her fate. Thanks again for tuning into Solved Murders. For more information on this case, amongst the many sources we used, we found ungodly, the passions, torments, and murder of atheist Madeline Murray O'Hare by Ted Dracos, extremely helpful to our research. You can find all episodes of Solve Murders and all other Spotify originals from Parcast for free on Spotify.

We'll see you next time. Solve Murders is a Spotify original from Parcast. It is executive produced by Max Cutler. Sound design by Michael Langsner, with production assistance by Ron Shapiro, Nick Johnson, Trent Williamson, and Carly Madden. This episode of Solv Murders was written by Ben Honani, Joe Gera, Molly Quinlan, and Tony Goodman,

edited by the Parcast content team and Giles Hofseth, fact-checked by Claire Cronin, researched by Mickey Taylor and produced by Freddie Beckley. The amazing cast of voice actors includes Kai Jordan, Drew Lawn, Melissa Medina, Cameron Nekod, and Julian Smith. Solved Murders stars Wendy McKenzie and Carter Roy.