Property Hub - Investment Insights & Inspiration - Get Invested: Part 1 - Angus O’Loughlin on Fast Fame vs Property Prosperity

Episode Date: March 21, 2025

Many investors are chasing fame or fortune, while missing the most valuable currencies - relationships and reputation. Angus O'Loughlin joins the show to discuss. To be successful, we need to dispel the fallacies of fame and learn that quality is more rewarding than quantity We need to look beyond the ego stimulating allure and superficial fake news ‘noise’ of fame to the genuine fulfillment of doing what you really want to do, not what you should be seen to be doing. Angus O'Loughlin understands this better than anyone. He has worked in the entertainment industry for over 15 years, across TV, radio, and podcasts right across the country. Spending years behind the microphone across Australia as a dedicated radio guy, he’s been the host and worked on some of radio’s biggest shows, including National Nights, the Capital City Breakfast Radio and National Weekends,  and he used to host the national nightly Hit 30 show. At the height of his fame, made the decision to step away from the constant 24/7 demands of radio and being in the public eye, to get some time and space back to focus on the quality rather than quantity of life with the establishment of his own awesome studio ‘Sessions in Progress,’ where he now records and distributes podcasts for others while also co-hosting two great podcasts of his own. In this episode we’re going to unpick the learnings from his journey with fame, fortune and beyond, before deep diving into his personal property investment journey next week. Connect with Angus https://sessioninprogress.com.au/ Find your Freedom Formula Success in property starts with your 'why', and then the 'what' and 'how'. Let me, Bushy Martin, lead you through it! Sign up for my Freedom Formula program. The first session is absolutely free, and it only takes around an hour! Find out more https://bushymartin.com.au/freedom-formula-course Subscribe to Property Hub for free now on your favourite podcast player. Take the next step - connect, engage and get more insights with the Property Hub community at linktr.ee/propertyhubau Book a personal solutions session with Bushy to go deeper on your specific property needs or challenges Continue the discussion with likeminded investors and experts on The Property Hub Collective Facebook group Get a copy of Bushy's book, Get Invested, for FREE, and find out what it takes for you to invest in living more, working less Get all Property Hub info here linktr.ee/propertyhubau About Get Invested, a Property Hub show Get Invested is the leading weekly podcast for Australians who want to learn how to unlock their full ‘self, health and wealth’ potential. Hosted by Bushy Martin, an award winning property investor, founder, author and media commentator who is recognised as one of Australia’s most trusted experts in property, investment and lifestyle, Get Invested reveals the secrets of the high performers who invest for success in every aspect of their lives and the world around them. Subscribe now on Apple Podcasts, Spotify and YouTube to get every Get Invested episode each week for free. For business enquiries, email [e-mail] omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

I was only by association famous, and I'd use the word famous with inverted commas. People only wanted to know me to know what it's like to interview Taylor Swift. So people weren't asking me about my dog, which was prevalent on my Instagram, or they didn't care about my shoe collection. They just cared about if, you know, I was going to be interviewing Justin when he was in Australia next, and can I give him the gift? My mum said, give with warm hands, not cold. So she was a person who got me onto the property ladder at a young age.

And that's really solid advice. Give while you can. And that can be time, by the way. That doesn't have to be money. You know, I'm not too busy for people who want to have the opportunity for me to learn from them and them from me. Welcome to Get Invested on the Property Hub podcast channel. The leading weekly show for Australians who want to learn how to unlock their full self, health and wealth potential. I'm your host, Bushy Martin, and each week I go deep with the best investors, experts,

leaders and founders to find out what it takes to break free from the grind, discover freedom and to live by design. Subscribe now and join me and get invested in the life that you really want. Let's get started. Hi, Freedom Fighters. Deep down, have you always wanted to be famous? Do you seek fame or fortune or maybe a bit of a combination of both? You want to be popular, well-known, widely recognised and applauded for your accomplishments, activities, abilities, expertise or opinions?

Come on, deep down you know you do. For some reason, from a very early age, most of us are attracted to the bright lights of fame and stardom, thinking that if we achieve it, then we'll have it all and life will be easy, luxurious and without a care in the world. And this idyllic dream and escape from reality is becoming ever more appealing as we try to live and survive through the rapid escalating pace of our current metacrisis that's rapidly increasing the divide between the few haves and the many have-nots. Their social, political, technological and economic upheavals are emphasising their differences and making things harder, all while fundamentally altering the way we process the world. and with always on social media increasingly dominating our attention and drowning us with FOMO images of the perceived rich and famous living it up with the best of the best in some sort of fantasy dream world

where the best of everything is at their fingertips as money flows freely and life is easy, fun and carefree our fascination with fame and the assumed fortune that goes with it seems to be getting worse. But is the perception of fame as a solution to all of our problems really fit with reality? Is our faint magnetism more like moss being drawn to a flame that ends up burning us?

Or is just the lure of fame the lights of an oncoming freight train? Our current global metacrisis is amplifying these effects with the fear of the constant background noise of societal instability making it ever harder to trust, to risk and to hope. As we continue to dream of our faint oasis, that's much more merely a shimmering mirage that always seems to be just beyond our reach. So do you really think that becoming famous

will be the answer to all of your current and future problems? Well, let's have a look at the stats. Because the odds of becoming famous are exceedingly rare, with fewer than 1% of us achieving any kind of stardom or A-list celebrity. And according to a study by mathematician Samuel Labisman, less than one in 10,000 of us achieves any form of sustainable popular awareness or recognition beyond what's been reduced from our 15 minutes down to 15 seconds of fame now that we're all the stars of our own self-obsessed reality TV show

through the lens of our own iPhones. And does fame actually bring you fortune? If you somehow manage to defy the odds and achieve any lasting fame does this automatically go hand in hand with having a fortune and being wealthy? Most likely not. A recent study by the Queen Mary University of London revealed that only 2% of actors and entertainers make a living from the profession and 90% are out of work at any one time.

Coming at this from the opposite direction there's approximately 56 million millionaires worldwide now and the percentage of these who are famous is under less than 5% or about one in 20. So there certainly seems to be a massive chasm between fame and fortune. Now, if fame doesn't bring you fortune, does it at least bring you happiness? Well, according to most research, fame generally seems to make people less happy, not more, exposing you to a myriad of challenges and problems you've probably never even thought of. While most of us like to be known, once you become recognisable to a large segment of the public,

which is what fame is you quickly lose all your personal freedoms with studies showing that fame results in your loss of privacy the constant pressure of being in the public eye along with relentless scrutiny and criticism of everything you do an exposure to a sea of superficial grifters paparazzi and a host of addictive temptations so be careful what you wish for because fame tends to act as a volume switch and magnifying enabler of all our character traits both good and bad just look at the tragic lives and premature deaths of many of the famous and while I've never been famous I did work very hard to become a well-known as as possible to all and sundry in the little old town of Alice Springs in the Red Centre of Australia while I was living and working there

back in the 80s and 90s in order to promote the profile of our architectural firm so I got involved in a myriad of local associations and committees and was constantly on the local TV radio and the newspaper to ensure that I was perceived as a creative thought leader so that I was top of mind for all building and design work and in no time flat it got to the stage where I had to hide at home to disguise myself before I went shopping for fear of being barreled up by a complete stranger to talk about one issue or another and I copped abuse and had my car keyed and I quickly learned to detest it and avoid it like the plague and this is not even a scratch of what real fame would entail. So from where I sit, you can have it. It's all yours. So I don't know about you,

but I think fame's got hairs on it. I'd much rather focus on the fortune side of the equation where wealth funds my time and anonymity fuels my freedom so that I can do what I want, when I want, with who I want. And when I talk fortune, I'm not talking endless dollars here. What I'm really saying is how much is enough? How much is enough for you to live your version of your ideal lifestyle, because anything beyond that is superfluous, and chasing endless money for the sake of money is just another way to stay unhappy and work yourself into an early grave. All you need to do is get clear on your ideal lifestyle and how much it costs a year, then invest in building an income-producing asset base and nest egg that fuels your level of lifestyle income.

For example, a very comfortable debt-free lifestyle income of between $120,000 and $200,000 a year for a couple, that allows you the time and freedom to do most things pretty easily, can be funded from the income-producing nest egg of between $2.4 to $4 million, based on that 5% net return. And this only equates to around two to three growth properties if you're investing for 15 years or more. And while 15 years might seem like a long time in our instant overnight everything world, I can tell you firsthand, it goes by in a flash. It's why I love property as the best, easiest, safest and most affordable vehicle to achieve this here in Australia, because you can combine the power of leverage with the law of compounding to build your wealth over time. So

you just need to give yourself plenty of another form of TLC, the tender loving care that results from embracing time, leverage and compounding. So do yourself a massive future favour and get invested sooner rather than later. And property is both accepting and agnostic. It doesn't matter who you are or where you are, and it doesn't discriminate. If you've got the time, the equity, the capacity, and the mindset, anyone and everyone can do well in property if you do it properly. So if you want to learn your why, what, and how of property to achieve your lifestyle goals, whether you're an inspiring investor or an existing investor where it just isn't working properly, feel free to join me on our recently released Freedom Formula

program by clicking the link in the show notes, which is where I actually met today's guest as he's an expert producer and has an awesome podcast production studio in Melbourne. So before we pick his brains, my humble advice to you is to avoid the allure of the wafer-thin here-today-gone-tomorrow trappings and tribulations of ephemeral fame, and instead, just become famous to the very few that really matter to you, while you focus on getting invested in building your wealth by stealth as the safest, easiest and most affordable way of funding your version of financial freedom and sustainable success. Yes, this is boring and it's not very sexy, but as someone once said, if what you're doing is exciting, you're not likely making

much money. Well, building wealth is like watching grass grow or punch dry, because this is exactly the point. If you've invested in the right asset in the right way, you can get out of the way and let your investments do their thing and fund your future, while you put your limited time into your family, friends, career, and what's really important to you. Now, if you don't believe me on any of this, then I suggest you have a good listen to today's guest. He's had more brushes with fame and the famous than I've had hot dimmers, alongside his own national notoriety and popularity. I'm talking, of course, about Angus O'Loughlin. As you're about to hear, Angus has worked in the entertainment industry for over 15 years across TV, radio, and podcasts

right across the country. Spending years behind the microphone as a dedicated radio guy, he's been the host and worked on some of radio's biggest shows, including National Nights, the Capital City Breakfast Radio and National Weekends, along with a stint as breakfast host of good old Adelaide's SAFM, though I've spent many years listening to. And he used to host the National Nightly Hit 30 show

and, or as he told everyone at the time, I'm after Hamish and Andy. Now, this is a man with over 32,000 Insta followers and nearly 60,000 Twitter or X followers who, at the height of his fame, made the courageous decision to step away from the constant 24-7 demands of radio and being in the public eye to get some time and space back to focus on the quality rather than the quantity of life and put his energy into new and evolving podcast programs that build on his years of content development. over 20 000 hours of audio editing and digital asset creation with the establishment of his own awesome studio sessions in progress where he now records and distributes podcasts for others while also co-hosting two great podcasts that include gets on a podcast for wine lovers who know nothing about what's in the glass and i i think it's just an excuse to drink more wine as well as listen able that he also co-hosts with Logie winning Paralympic gold medalist six-time

Australian Open winner and world champion basketballer Dylan Alcott when nothing is off limits with all things disability because every one of us whether we admit it or not has them and he even finds time for his growing passion for you guessed it property investment so today we're going to unpack the learnings and the goss from his journey with fame fortune and beyond, before deep diving into his personal property investment journey next week. So welcome and let's get invested, Angus. Mate, what an introduction. Thank you very much, Bushy.

An absolute pleasure to be here and a lot of lies and mistruths. You've given me way too much of a high platform, but thank you very much. I don't believe that for a second, mate. Having spent some time with you on a couple of occasions now, you're clearly a very humble guy which is quite quite rare for someone with 15 years in radio to be perfectly honest given my limited exposure to that end of the equation but mate uh i guess sort of to kick things off for those that have been living under a rock and haven't come across your uh vocal vocal brilliance um what do you do differently and why do you do what you do mate well i would say 99.9 percent

of the audience would have no idea who i am um which is perfectly fine with me uh because sort of my job was to highlight others um whether they're in the seat across from me or whether it was the artist or the celebrity that i was interviewing i kind of came into my career recognizing that you know being a good spotlight on somebody else was a great way to kind of get credit yourself and i i feel that's kind of how my career uh in radio went and um and you know even in, you know, becoming a podcast production studio, you know, that's our job is to try and make the best conversations possible now. Yeah, it's been an interesting journey, certainly.

And it's, yeah, one that's had a lot of travel across Australia. I'm from a place called Janjak, which is close to Torquay, which is close to Geelong, for those who might not know it. And I went from my beautiful mother all the way up to Cairns, then to Townsville, Tasmania, Sunshine Coast, Adelaide, Sydney, Adelaide, back home to Melbourne. So quite a journey over those 15 years in radio, and I find myself ironically not in the podcast studio today.

I would have loved for your YouTube audience to at least see what the podcast studio outputs can be, but we had a client extend another hour. So the podcast studio, thankfully, is booked. So you find me with one of our other microphones and a webcam here today. Well, if they tap into the Property Wealth program and the Freedom Formula program that you've helped me produce, mate, they'll get firsthand an indication of the quality and the background of the facility. So that's an extra encouragement for them to do exactly that. But I guess, you know, given that extensive background, what attracted you into this sort of overexposed whiz-bang world of radio and entertainment in the first place, mate? yeah i was one of those um kids uh always kind of you know class clown vibe i wasn't super academic

i was when i tried to be it all just came down to the application i just knew i wasn't enjoying it um from a mass perspective i think i've got like an 84 or something score so it wasn't anything to be snobbed at but it um it also could have been better had i tried but you know funnily enough my worst score was drama because I took the absolute mickey out of the experience I had fun with my friends I made jokes at my own and others expenses just to get class laughs um and my teacher probably lost you know handfuls of hair having to deal with some of the shenanigans we'd get up to in that class but I think I honestly got the worst score possible in theater studies and drama but I find them to be probably my most important classes for my career, which is ironic because

maths and science and history got me nowhere. But that sort of idea of theatrics and trying to make people laugh and entertainment became, you know, a really formative part of my career. So yeah, I guess it, how did I get there? I went all the way through school without an idea of what was next i do have to say this because you know it is important my dad was in radio for 40 years okay um but we have a very you know uh separate relationship he left mom um when he was when i was three so i don't really have any memories of dad well i don't have any memories of mom and dad um and then some memories of dad as a child but you know pretty absent father i'm sure he'd admit to that i haven't spoken to him in years text me on the i said congrats on the

birth of my son and daughter and those are the last two text messages I've got from him and they're copy and paste um but to be fair um when I finished school I had no idea what the direction I was going to be he was up in Cairns uh he was doing the breakfast shop then a radio station and um I went up there and you know every Sunday for an hour handed out you know icy cold cans of coke on the street in this sort of black thunder um and then after about two months uh put together a show reel, sent it off to Townsville, which was the hub of the radio network at that point and time. And yeah, this guy called Bruce Turnbull called me up an hour after emailing it to him and

said, I've just had someone quit as a promotions coordinator four hours down the road. And I took that and that was, yeah, I was 18 years old or yeah, 19. And that was the journey from there, flipping sausages to, you know, hosting some pretty cool shows. what uh i'm just sort of honing on on the uh relationship with your dad there for a second given i you know i didn't realize he'd spent his career in radio uh did you get into radio do you think slip streaming on what you saw your dad doing uh yeah i never saw my dad doing radio okay um yeah i we went and visited him in those kind of once once a year for school holidays once

a week. We would go up to, he was in Mackay, Rockhampton and Cairns and we would visit him for a week and I would see him behind the microphone, for example. But yeah, it wasn't the example of listening to my dad every time he was, this is before the internet. It wasn't before the internet, but before, you know, streaming, et cetera. So I couldn't listen to dad in Torquay when he was in Cairns, that opportunity in podcasting exists. So no, I think my personality certainly tended towards that career choice and i definitely give credit that the door was opened um for me to sort of see what that career would be like um but yeah i definitely give credit for the the door open um but that idea of nature and nurture both of those were without you know that

i guess in some way shape or form unless you believe in you know the idea of passing down some sort of inherent genetics of personality traits yeah interesting i'll probably gain a little bit further on that exercise then what if any impact do you think the the absence of your father in your life generally has been to who you are and who you'd become yeah great question um i certainly when i became a father i knew that that was something that I wanted to really be great at, um, still learning, you know, um, yeah, it's very hard juggling the business. I started a business when my daughter was seven months old.

And, um, as you know, when you're starting up a small business, it's pretty tough and labor intensive. Um, yeah, definitely want to be a great dad, uh, and definitely want to be there, you know, for my kids for a long time, their relationship with my partner, Emily, um, is my fiance. say um that's super important because i know the dynamics of what a broken household can look like um but yeah i really got there's a couple of male influences that i've always given credit to um there's a guy called steve cooper who was one of mum's friends husbands and he really took me under my wing from this farm rural aspect out in belbray so i used to ride sheep and you know herd

cattle and work with him in the queen victoria markets he had a he still has a you know he's passed away now but there's a meat shop there that i worked at spruiking from the age of 11 and 12 yep and then there's a guy called daryl cotton who's a old uh entertainer who's in a band called zoot yeah i i'm old enough to remember yeah well daryl cotton was um my mom's best friend at the time's husband and so i grew up with him as well you know and his family so i had these two sort of um very different personalities and and daryl wasn't a rock star he was one of the kindest most gentle and softly spoken people um but i had this these two really important and my grandpa was the main one uh he passed away when i was 13 but i had these male influences and i think

where i was lucky was i had i didn't just have like one personality type of my dad to look up to i had three very different men um who i took three very different lessons from i think over that period of time yeah no interesting again in that context you probably had an opportunity to uh almost without being aware of it pick and choose who you wanted to become based on on different role models rather than thinking there's only a one-size-fits-all to being a man and and what that means yeah definitely um i learned the power of having daughters from steve he's got three daughters uh and so he kind of took me under the wing of him being a son but i saw a man like a manly man yeah um really fall to pieces when speaking about the love for his kids and his

daughters um daryl uh so many things i learned from him but you know one of them was he was traveling he was in his cotton keys and morris um band that went around the country and he hated travel and he's he rushed time to get to his kids so he would walk in the door at 4 a.m after driving three hours after the gig with some balloons from the venue just so he could wake up with his kids and i didn't actually just think about it i didn't really think about it from father's perspective i just kind of noted those things and then my grandpa was huge um he was the biggest influence my mom's side grandpa they moved from warwick to bill which is country victoria um to talk to be close to mom to support her um when i was about eight or nine maybe a bit younger

um and yeah he was the guy that you know disciplined me um but also gave me this sort of love and respect and he was that person that i just would have done anything for so yeah i was able to pick and choose um certainly um and yeah i don't know if i you know my my dad i don't think he had any of those traits, you know, he wasn't meant to be a father in my opinion. And I just didn't get the opportunity to see what some of those positives were, unfortunately. Interesting.

That story probably hasn't finished yet. I'll be interested to see how that folds out in the years to come, mate. But sort of jumping back into the cut and thrust of the radio world, you know, having spoken to you a few times and spent some time with you and done some Google stalking, you've clearly interviewed and spent time with some of the world's biggest stars. I'd love for you to share some of the goss that you are able to share in terms of who

sought out and why, and what are some of your most memorable moments during that time, mate? Yeah, it's more of an interesting one to look back on than I was in the moment. So the main show that had that sort of prolific artist and celebrity was The Hot 30. uh i got rebranded um when i took over but it's 7 till 10 p.m um across 56 stations across the country yeah and one of the foundational pillars of that show we sort of cemented when i first went there was we need to have an interview every night and so look most of the time jessica malboy would be you know the guest and we'd have you know some of the rappers coming through and or illy or you know um justice crew you know you would not always have the big celebrity every

night, but it was sort of one of our foundations of the show was to sort of have a celebrity interview or an artist interview, preferably. But in amongst that, you know, you've got all the tours of people coming to the country. So when Robbie Williams is here, you chat to Robbie Williams. When Pink's here, when One Direction, you know, I got to meet Beyonce. So you kind of anyone who is the big star, every network sort of gets with the big, big stars. They get one, maybe two opportunities for interviews yeah and luckily knights would get that opportunity um because you were the national

show so instead of going to you know melbourne breakfast or sydney breakfast it would go to the show that's going to hit 56 stations um so i was very lucky that you know we would at least get one of those boxes and you know so i would get the chance to you know have a riff with taylor swift for 20 minutes it's pretty cool yeah i love it if you sort of look back on this the people you've had a chance to rub shoulders with uh and you've probably seen some good bad and ugly amongst all that uh what what have you taken away from that mate um yeah you know you sort of said it in the intro a little bit it's it's not as luxurious as it seems you know sometimes uh radio sorry a music network you know like universal music a big company or sony or whoever it was would be

bringing this artist out after they've just hopped off a plane so you know you'd have an artist who landed at midnight went to bed at 2 a.m and they're being dragged to the radio station at 7 a.m and they're exhausted and you know they've got to perform the night after or that night and they're just being pushed into um studios and around the place so a lot of the time you know i would like i would luckily be the end of those interviews sometimes and i said luckily but i it would usually be a bit more relaxed and I'd try and do that tone and feel with my interviews anyway. But, um, you kind of get that off the mic moment because they didn't have to be rushed to somewhere else. And, you know, I'd chat to many artists and they'd be like, I'm just, you know,

I was in Japan yesterday and I didn't, I didn't go out. So I just, my hotel, not for, you know, lack of want, but because if I did, I was not sleeping. So, you know, it was, it was some I water, I, you know, I recognize that I was like, okay, that maybe that's not the life that everyone thinks. So, yeah, it wasn't as great as it was, unless you were the big star and you could just, you know, I saw, you know, Pink had the opportunity to have a fair bit of downtime or come a week before and have a bit of a holiday.

Yeah, I love that. I know you've shared with me previously how impressed you were with um taylor swift and how her whole i mean that there's an empire there that's built around that whole like oh the story the other story a little bit though it was really interesting actually yeah well it's a it's one of the best systems i've ever seen um so i'd interviewed taylor swift on one of her tours um the reputation tour and she'd come back a couple of years later for the next tour and i had a friend at universal music and she was just it was she called me about 9 p.m and she's like man i'm at the office i'm putting together these sheets for taylor's team

can you just help me and save me 30 minutes of research what did you talk about with taylor last time you spoke with her and i was like what do you mean she's like i just need to write some things down what did you do and i said oh well we um she's a cat person she's got um famously massive into cats and so i had the rspca bring some cats in and she named them monica and chandler from friends and they immediately got adopted yep as i told her that she's like thank you so much and anyway i was like oh that was weird and then um it all kind of made sense a couple of nights later when we're at taylor swift and um we there's about 15 of us got this opportunity to meet taylor's mom and she takes you on a behind the scenes tour so you get to go onto stage and

under the stage and see the costumes and that's all really lovely and then you go up to this private room and then taylor comes out and we were the first group so you kind of stand in your radio network so like nova's over there and kiss is there and we were sca and i was standing with my um housemate and music director ego and i think uh irene who's um what was one of our bosses at the time yeah and she comes around the corner and she goes angus it's so good to see you again and i was like oh hi she's like um oh my god i've been dying to ask you did those cats get adopted and i was like oh yeah they did get adopted and she referenced something else and just you know and it not to seem inauthentic because if i didn't know that behind the i

watched her then do the room and do that to everyone and the way that she made people feel was unbelievable people were just like taylor knows me she remembers me um and so i really admired that. And I knew, you know, what my friend was doing from, you know, the Australian division of the record label. Um, and she obviously was just around the corner from the curtain, just looking at her cheat sheet and going around. But the way that she made people feel was incredible. And the other great thing that she does is, um, she asks you for a photo. Um, because she knows, she knows every single person who walks past her wants a photo with Taylor Swift, like everyone. And so she then says, Hey, Angus, can we take

a photo together and then you pass the phone to someone and they snap a pic. So it takes that idea that you want to ask her away and I just thought that was super clever. That's just a very good system and yeah, like I said, I don't want to take away the authenticity of what it was. It was just, if anything, researched and well executed. But I think underneath all of that, yes, you use the word system and it's It's a good system, but that would only be driven by genuine care

in wanting to know and make other people feel comfortable. That's from my outside looking in, whereas I'm sure you would have seen plenty of the opposite end of the spectrum. And again, I don't want you to mention any names here because that's not what – No, it doesn't matter. Yeah, no worries. But tell us a little bit about that other end because the perception

of a lot of people in that space where it's it's all about me uh generally and and their world if they're not that way when they start it would be very easy to become that way because everything becomes that that focus everything you do say think where go uh becomes something to talk about talk to us a little bit about some of the the uh other interesting exercises at the at the other Yeah, well, the worst interview I ever did was a guy called Jeremy Renner. He's an actor. He plays Hawkeye in The Avengers. Oh, yes.

Also recently had like a bad snowmobile accident or something, got run over by a snow clearing machine. But, yeah, big actor. Was also the Bourne that wasn't Matt Damon, if that's a reference to anyone. Okay. He was, so I found this out on the back end and I don't think it matters. but he was you know brought out to australia to promote a film called hansel and gretel witch hunter so jeremy had filmed this this is the backstory i can tell you what happened so first

of all you have to go watch the movie we go to a private screening not with them you watch it at you know um some private theater you get your notes you go and then you go to the hotel and it's just a hotel room with the sydney backdrop of the opera house we used they used it all the time yeah and they just you get 10 minutes and everyone you walk outside and 15 were there and you know it's just the same sort of system it's a junket we call it and um he i it was hansel and gretel so i walked into the room dropping pieces of bread so that was my thing all the way to my chair and i sit down and he's there with a co-host um he's sorry you know he's movie star you know co-star um she was lovely and he goes cool hansel and gretel good joke

and then anyway i was just like oh man like straight away i was like oh this is going to be tough and then they hit record once everything's set and uh it was just a brutal interview um just one or two word answers really tough just no rapport um he made his co-star feel like she had to make up for all of his she was obviously there going this guy's been a dick um and then the backstory i walked out of that going what an arsehole let's still stay to say today uh and the backstory to that is that um he had everyone had bad interviews everyone who like walked out was like that was the worst interview we've all done um but what had happened was he actually filmed that movie years before Avengers.

Okay. And it hadn't been green lit. So it, you know, it was a straight to DVD vibe, but it never got released. Yeah. Um, but then when he became an Avenger and that becomes a billion dollar film, the producers of that film or the creators then go back to the studio and go, look, we've got Jeremy Renner as the star of this film. Yeah.

It's already made, you know, there's no budget you need. you know whatever let's get this down okay so yeah part of his contract is that he has to do a worldwide um publicity tour so for a movie that he did four or five years earlier probably made it you know four or five years earlier was ready for release three years earlier he's now getting you know danced out onto the street so i get where that comes from but you've got to you know we all know what it's like have a bad day you've got to you know rock up and do your job um in some respects you know obviously yeah just being a bit angry about that situation isn't enough to ruin 15 you know radio station shows days i watched him on the today show as well it's horrific

karl stephanovic bombed as well so that made me feel better well i i've got to say it's you know for someone who willingly participates in that industry and you would know what you're getting yourself in for you know you know what it takes if you're going to have any longevity in the game It seems sort of fairly short-sighted and a little bit arrogant from where I sit. Oh, it was both of those things. Yeah. I mean, he screamed arrogance. He screamed like he didn't want to be in the room.

And I think that was the message he was trying to send to the movie company, you know, before they probably flew to Asia to do the same. And no doubt he gave the same responses. So, yeah, that was one of the toughest interviews I ever had. But I was glad to see not one person had a great experience with Jeremy Renner. Yeah, interesting. What about your own experience, Matt? I mean, you'd play it down, but, you know, you've become quite well known in the time and the shows that you were part of.

How did that affect your own freedom and what you did and when you did it? Yeah, you know what, I actually positioned myself accidentally quite well. So if there was any sort of level of notoriety or people stopping me on the street, which did happen, and especially in young audiences because that's what the Hit 30 and the Hot 30 is known for is targeting One Direction Justin Bieber fans back when they were the biggest thing in the world. But I would only – it took me a while to realize, and I was completely fine with it even as a 24 to 28-year-old

the time I was on the show. I was really fine with it. I was only by association famous, and I'd use the word famous with inverted commas. People only wanted to know me to know what it's like to interview Taylor Swift. So people weren't asking me about my dog, which was prevalent on my Instagram, or they didn't care about my shoe collection. They just cared about if, you know, I was going to be interviewing Justin

when he was in Australia next and can I give him the gift? So it's funny, you know, you rattle off some of those Twitter and Instagram stats. They actually used to be much bigger. I had over 110,000 ex-followers now on Twitter, and I had about 45,000 Instagram followers. So that decline of followers is just because I wasn't taking, because every night I would post a photo with a celebrity. And if you're a huge fan of Harry Styles and he's in the country, you probably follow me because I'm going to be posting photos with him.

So that's why I was getting followers. And I was fine with that as well. When all of those dropped off, I was like, great, that's fine. And I'm sharing the people that, you know, were never there for me anyway. So I positioned myself like that. And I actually looked back and I was like, that's fantastic. Because it was never about me. And I meant that in the show as well.

Like it had to be about the music. It was a music show. And my bosses would be like, the star of your show is your music. You're playing songs before anyone else. You're getting exclusives. It's about the music, the artists. And, you know, I think I did a good job of that. Uh, and I think, you know, that's sort of where that notoriety might've came from.

Notoriety, yeah. Popularity, whatever. Yeah. You know, I think that's spot on. Do you think, um, uh, that humility that you bring to the table in a, in a industry that's, you know, for the outsider looking in as generally associated with big egos, uh, is, is that something that that you found uh challenging at times and and is perhaps that part of the reason why you decided to take another direction talk to us a bit about your thinking around that

no i'm a different person um having kids changed me uh when i was 31 i reckon i just sort of discovered who i was so the way that i kind of talk about um ego or humility is i think quite measured and i think i've had a good experience enough with it to kind of be able to you know articulate it and i do that in the way of when you're hosting a show like you know the hit 30 and you've got you know they tell you it's an audience over a million people you get a lot of hate and the hate isn't directed necessarily at you it's directed at the disappointment of somebody who didn't have the experience that they were looking for and a lot of the time it's just they didn't win tickets to something and they've tweeted

that you know there was a point that we did a hashtag bump the beaver my first show nights was called the bump and we had 1.1 million tweets so it's one you know obviously there's a bunch of people um entering you know under the school desk at all times of the day because it didn't matter it wasn't one entry per person it was just like a random draw and when that ended i just got this huge on it was my first year and i got this huge onslaught of hate and you know the real bad stuff that you hear about and i just had i kind of worked through it myself that this was their way of saying i'm angry and i want you to hurt because i'm hurt and so what i had to do um and i can't remember who taught me this um but i had to build an ego up so the reason that you have to

build an ego up in those shows i truly believe is because you need to have something to break before you do yeah so you know i am me now if you were to say something mean to me i would probably wear that on my you know you know i'd probably bleed but back then if you said something mean to me you would only come into the armor which is the ego yeah and unless something really badly penetrated that i was protected and behind it now that doesn't mean i get to become an asshole. Um, but it certainly does mean that I need to wear a bit of pride in what I'm doing, be a little bit more existential about, um, who I am and a facade because at the end of the day, radio is a performance. You know, when you listen to your breakfast show in

the morning and they talk about the time every morning, you trip, oh, you know, I was on the way carrying, you know, coffees and I tripped on the gutter and it went all over my shirt and then i had a meeting with you know lindsey fox every single part of that is is like dramatized so what might have happened is they tripped up the gutter had a coffee in their hand nearly got her in their shirt and then met lindsey fox but because it's our job to be entertainers everything is dramatized yep um and so it is a performance when you are doing these shows And so, you know, there is this sort of piece about it that you do need to sort of have a little bit of an ego, I believe, just to protect yourself. And then, yeah, over time, you know, when that show ended and I went into, you know, SAFM Brekkie and then I did National Weekends, especially over that National Weekends period, I was hosting that with Dylan, who I've got the podcast with.

And we did a lot of that through COVID, so a lot of like isolated shows and all of that sort of just naturally faded. um and yeah i just kind of discovered who i was especially when i became a dad i was like cool well you know i'm a bit more back to you know there's no shield in front of me at the moment if um yeah i can bleed yeah and i get that i think the the resilience or that that the extra layer of skin that you need to be able to develop rejection uh because because you are right up the the bullseye of a fair bit of rejection based on what you've said you know that that that expectations weren't met so you're the you're the donkey to pin the tail on because that's convenient uh that that's pretty useful life lesson but i think something that uh you know

also stumbled across when i was uh google stalking you mate uh you wrote a couple of really good stories send us two years ago about how your life in radio is really only as good as the next show and you can be uh at the top of the pops now and gone tomorrow at the drop of a hat and and you see that the amount of movement you see in radio uh what what was that like to deal with uh before i sort of get into why i stepped away yeah it's um it's tough and you know only this week um a bunch redundancies hit SCA, the company that I worked at for 13 of the 15 years in radio, and a couple of good friends ended up losing their jobs. I've had a few over the last couple of years that have lost theirs. And yeah, I'm happy to talk about my pivot and me kind of foreseeing a change,

kind of tea leaf stuff, but it was pretty obvious once you kind of step away from it. But yes, it is cutthroat. And I saw people lose their jobs. I saw shows get cut in front of me. I actually had this really interesting experience. My first year in that night radio show, the Hit 30, it was on Today FM, so it was based out of Sydney. So I was in Sydney on George Strait, beautiful studio, big office, huge stuff, like three levels, hundreds of staff, big buzz, atmosphere. They had this sales bell on the wall, which was always ringing.

It was actually an inconvenience that someone was sitting there, you know, quarter it was ringing all the time and we had kyle and jackie on the morning which was the number one show um still is in sydney but it was on today fm at the time we had hamish and andy before me and then it was um nights and this you know we were number one and it was untouchable and then after that first year um kyle and jackie are defected over to another radio station called kiss they'll actually launch the radio station Yep. And I watched a bunch of really talented creatives lose their jobs year after year.

It went, the first show was, to be fair, no good. Even on paper, you were like, what is this show doing? It was Jules Lund, who I love. I love them all, but it was just a wild show. It was Jules Lund, Sophie Monk, Mel B from the Spice Girls. Wow. And Merrick Watts. Okay.

Here's a glass from hell. Yeah. And I mean, it didn't matter who it was really going to be. It was never going to work. Like the first show was just going to be, you know, to the slaughter. Because Colin and Jackie O did exactly what, you know, people thought they couldn't do. And that was take their whole audience over to a station that was fourth, make them number one in the first book. Yeah.

It was really, but then I saw that show get fired. Then I saw Dan and Maz, who were really good friends at the time. They got fired straight after. Then Rove and Sam Frost got fired straight after. then it was grant denya um ed cavalli and m russiano yep and i reckon it was m russiana before it and axed axed and i just watched show after show get axed yeah um and yeah i was just i just stayed in my little spot and i remember even just hearing from the bosses just like don't cause trouble. Like, you know, that's what you didn't want to do. And, um, you know, I was lucky

that every eight weeks I would get rated across five different markets. So even though Sydney was bombing everywhere and, you know, the night show is not going to say that, you know, Melbourne might be good or Adelaide might have a great book or Brisbane. Um, so I certainly witnessed a lot of, you know, cuts, um, happen. Um, and I think watching that, I just kind of always, it never happened to me but i thought it was inevitable um yeah so certainly um certainly it's just part of the parcel and it's you know sometimes you do get a good wage because you understand you know it's finite it's like afl players you know let's just go yeah yeah exactly the last cycle try that there's you know a cynical part of me that says well look uh the actual owners of those

stations a lot of musicians they don't want you to become too popular because then you can start dictating the terms and negotiating a better playing field so if they chop and change and they only they build you up and then then catch off quickly enough and keep churning uh then profitability wise that's a that's a pretty good model uh i might be right off the mark with that oh look i think it's a mixture of things i think you're not wrong um i think you know the other part of that is that you know they should have just paid kyle i think kyle wanted two million dollars more yeah um for his next contract um and i think it ended up costing sca hundreds of 100 or 200 million bucks out um so not a great return i think it also like you

know comes back into investing in that talent they they've done all the hard works kyle and jackie i was on the show before me you know it'd be a decade earlier doing hot 30 yeah um you know they've been nurtured through the system and they were asking for obviously what they were entitled or two because they're on $100 million 10-year deal now. So they certainly weren't on that money back then. So it also comes down to just, you know, investing in, and this goes for any business, investing in your talent and making sure that the conditions and what they are is good.

And, yeah, like it's like any business. You know, your talent can get poached. It's like have you put in enough work to make sure that they feel like this is the home? Yeah. So it can work a bunch of different ways. it can be yes your point it can also be the other side if they could have been treated better yeah love it love it uh slight shift in direction now because i'd you know basically as a communicator

uh both behind the microphone and behind the scenes uh you know what what's your view on why getting the message out there is important for everyone and and given we're in a current a world where, you know, everyone on an iPhone is a journalist, basically. What's the best way to actually break through in the camera environment? You got any thoughts on that? Yeah. Yes. Quality is the most important thing.

So, you know, going into that idea of why I pivoted, I was on air with Dylan Alcott. He's a man in a wheelchair. He was my first real experience with disability firsthand. And I'd had like people in my life who had had disability, but I'd never really lent into it. And, um, you know, we'd finished our first radio show together. We went across the road to get a beer. IJ walked in between two cars to the pub and Dylan's like, Hey mate, where am I going?

Yeah. Uh, and I was like, Oh yeah, of course you can't squeeze in between these two cars down this gutter. So we went across the pedestrian crossing. I'd picked the pub across the road. First thing, two steps up to it. So anyway, Dylan's like, no dramas. He does it all the time, got him up the two stairs. He needs to use the bathroom, goes into the bathroom.

It's basically a storage unit. There's kids' chairs, excess toilet rolls and chemicals. He has to wade through that to get to the, you know, access bathroom. And this podcast was formed. I just said to Dylan, that's really interesting to have the beer. Like, what does a blind person do in this case for the same scenario? And he goes, well, you should ask someone who's blind. And I was like, good point.

um and so he has this great quote i use it all the time and reference him of course but he says i'm not the disability dalai lama like i don't know what it's like for somebody you know to live with the experience of having a stroke um so i said to him his book is called able his um his biography uh and obviously listenable um is a term you could use about audio forms and so i said what to be called this podcast listen able and of course like disable um and then he he said yes and we started recording this podcast and you know all of a sudden i just felt this real community vibe because i'd gone from creating you know you get eight talk breaks an hour on radio and you're on air for three hours a day yeah it's a lot of talk breaks and even though you don't lift the

whole load you've usually got a co-host it's a lot of talking and it's just quantity you're just throwing quantity at the speakers yeah um and like i said you've got to extra you know make things more extravagant because it's not the truth and you want people to be entertained at certain you know people listen for 15 minutes if they get a dud story you you know they'll go check out the other station yeah so all of a sudden we're making this quality content you know this really well thought out you know investing in the guests coming research and you know you do that to an extent with radio, but, um, you know, I just was really invested in these stories and wanted to give them the best chance of finding an audience.

And then all of a sudden, you know, the podcast launched really well. Um, and I was being told I had a million or 800,000 listeners every weekend across the country on this radio show. And this podcast had, you know, we did launch very well with about 45,000 or 50,000 downloads. Um, we released four episodes at once. Yep. And, um, I was getting all these DNS of people about this podcast, which apparently had an audience that was 5% of the pod, the radio show.

And I just went quality sort of wins. And so that's where the sort of podcast space came into real fruition. Even though I'd been on podcasts, technically all my radio shows had been put into podcast landscapes. I never really invested the time into them. And then all of a sudden I just had this firsthand experience of, um, making an impact um directly and yeah that's that's sort of where i wanted to i found myself leaning towards listen able and then i had this idea for wine podcast um got some and you know that's that was

a slow burn by the way so i use this example of a graph we had no downloads in our first realistically like you know really unsuccessful downloads in the first year but you would have given up if i didn't have a podcast studio and the ability to edit everything you wouldn't do it financially made no sense yeah um and now it reaches like 1.5 million people on instagram a month you know 10 000 plus downloads and we've got a couple of great sponsors um and it's uh it's not an equality you you build a community therefore and a message that that people want and need to hear uh so so there's a there's a there's a whole level of fulfillment that goes with that that's way beyond just entertaining people for 15 seconds uh and i know you know like you i i was talking to

myself when i started getting vested uh back in i think it's 2016 i started the podcast and i for a long time i i didn't think anyone was listening to be honest that was probably a good thing because i was trying to hone their skills and learn how to actually communicate in a way that was going to engage people and get some interest uh but that is that old exponential curve it doesn't matter what we do mate if we keep doing things long enough and the quality is good enough then then exponential growth increases in the skills you bring to the table and in this this case the audience that then chews into it uh i don't think it gets much better than that for me is is that your mission for sessions in progress so where are you going to take it yeah so originally i thought

um so listen able when we launched the business um like yeah i launched my business uh which was the umbrella session in progress and ListenAble was a show underneath it. I just thought all I was going to do was be a creative genius that made podcast ideas up out of my head, found sponsorship, and that was happy days. Because ListenAble was doing well, we'd had a sponsor tap me on the shoulder and say, we want to look at a long-term sponsorship. So I launched with that, which was very happy. And then we actually were sponsored by Dan Murphy's at launch for a year

forgot some. Definitely didn't get their return on investment. Apologies to Dan's for that first year. They'd happily sponsor it now, I would presume. But I just thought that was what I was going to do. And then all of a sudden, a company, a disability technology company called Remarkable hit me up and said, look, we're going to launch a podcast. We listen to ListenAble. We love what you do. Is there a chance you could help us with mine? And I was like, ah, yeah, I mean, I guess I can. And then I remember they said like, we'll pay you, you know, this amount of money.

Yeah. It was like, you know, more than $10,000. And I was like, yeah, of course I'll do that. Um, and so, yeah, I, that was, that was it. And then all of a sudden I was making that podcast. We're on season four with them now. Um, but there was a couple of taps on the shoulder to make other companies podcasts. And then I just realized that, you know, the difference in podcast productions,

Cause there's a few of them, not a lot around, um, but I knew that I can do the production piece. I can make everything look and sound good. But what my real skill was, was all of those interviews I did every single night I interviewed someone. So I've got an interview. It's like 1174 interviews, um, in a hard drive. And that was my skill.

I got really good at it. And I would have people come into the studio that weren't really good at it. Yeah. So what I would do is like, hey, here's a new approach to your piece here. And they found huge value in that. And, you know, not to say, I would say most, if not all, of the production studios in Australia are led by production people. So they know how to make audio sound good and video to sound good. But when they want to put their hands in the content, you know, what are you going to do?

So that's where I found what Session in Progress was. And that's where sort of I bring the value. and we've got a great little team that helps bring in that production factor as well. I still work with the guy who worked with me on the Hit 30 who made all of my big sounds. He's an imaging producer. It should be called a sound designer and he creates

all of our sounds and we've got this great workflow. So I've got the great people around me. The difference is I'm just trying to make people look and sound their best. Yeah, I love it. As an incubator for people to get their message out there, It's a really, uh, and again, you mightn't be seeing it yet, but I've experienced it. So I know firsthand, uh, how well you do it.

Uh, and the art of the interview and that that's an art and a science all by itself that very few people get right in my view, because it's most of the times it's all about the interview and not about the guest, but that's where it doesn't work. But, but, you know, reinforcing what you've said a couple of times there, you're always about the person you're talking to or the music and you're just a facilitator and the enabler, that's a position that not many people get to or recognise, mate. But, yeah, before I switch into the fast-forward

that every podcast asks you and gets you to do the tap dance, what, if anything, do you struggle with, Matt? um fine management um business really struggle with the business stuff if i could look i'm okay at it now i'm in year four if i could pick myself up now and take me back to starting that business at the start we would be formidable force only because i would have learned four more years of of knowledge over the time not i'm not a formidable force now but some of the you know practices that i now put in and um you know i'm still implementing different changes and workflows to make it better for our clients to make it better for the production i put a new camera in

the studio you'll have to check that one out bushy yeah um but you know we've always trying to be better but i i just didn't not like we started i looked at cameras i don't know tech stuff that much i knew you had a new audio i knew i've edited every single interview i've ever done So I knew Adobe and I knew some of those programs. But I thought when we launched the business, GoPros, and they do, they're shooting 4K. That's going to be high quality image for our videos. And the first time Dylan and I sat in this tiny little studio together

in this co-working space, and we had a guest there. We had three GoPros I bought, $1,200. And one on the guest, one on Dylan, one on me. and about 34 minutes in, they all go, peep, peep, peep, peep, overheating. Oh, no. Because they're meant to be, you know, bloody in windsurfers' hands and on the side of rally cars and, you know, going on skateboards in a hot room, stationary, not getting any sort of cooling.

I've still got those GoPros. They have not been used since that recording. I couldn't return them, unfortunately. I did try. But also because we're an accessible podcast company, Listen Able, you know, is the foundation of the idea of this, which is everything we do is filmed. If it's not filmed, even if the client doesn't use it, I'll provide a transcript. All of our videos that we provide for social edits have captions.

Everything that we put in is trying to be accessible. And our practice is trying to teach our clients about these things called alt text and video descriptions so that everyone can enjoy the conversation. If you want to go back to that idea of how do you build and, and, you know, a large part of your audience can't either see or hear your podcast. Exactly. And if you want to have, and you know, let's say it's not the person who's deaf or hard of hearing who can't hear your podcast. It's the friend of theirs who wants to share the story with them that they can't relate to because there's no facility for them to be able to enjoy that conversation together. so um you know when a gopro or your camera your video asset breaks down to 34 minutes with a high level disability man called noah callan who's using a computer program to speak

it's a pretty big fail so i would like to learn i'd like to learn from um those mistakes and uh go back and put myself in that seat but i can't um yeah so yeah i uh i definitely take that on well we've had a few I'm getting better though I've had a lot more than you have uh in that context because uh compared to you I'm a rank amateur mate but uh but I now want to switch into what I affectionately referred to as the ambush round or the bushfire lightning round where I just hit you with four questions that the audience will always loves to hear responses on the first of those if if you can have coffee with anyone either live or dead uh who would you choose and why? It would be a sentimental one. It would probably be my grandpa.

Passed away when I was quite young, 2009. I would like to just catch up with him. I think just to tell him about my family and where I'm at, he'd be super proud. I'm an atheist, so I don't believe in an afterlife, but I do believe I carry on some of his legacy, so I don't believe that he's not with me in some sort of spiritual form um so yeah it would definitely be there and my grandma recently did pass away but i'll give grandpa the coffee this time yeah all right uh back in the investment arena for a second

which we'll we'll dive into in part two uh what's the western the worst and the best piece of investment advice that you've ever received man this will lead into next week's episode um my mom said, give with warm hands, not cold. So she was a person who got me onto the property ladder at a young age, and that's really solid advice. Give while you can. And that can be time, by the way. That doesn't have to be money.

I'm not too busy for people who want to have the opportunity for me to learn from them and them from me. And the worst piece of advice, oh, financial. Is it financial advice? It doesn't have to be. Invest in anything, really. Okay. Worst piece of advice I got was to buy a car in Townsville for $200.

I drove it unregistered, not knowing that it wasn't unregistered, and it was the drug-runner car. I lived in a Backpackers in Townsville called Adventurers Backpackers, and the guy who was leading the country sold me the car for $200, and he'd been using it to sell weed out the back. And cops went and found this car very quickly. And it wasn't so much that I was, I actually got away with it scot-free. But it was the fact that I just threw 200 bucks.

And it's nothing to do with investment. I just, $200 was so much money to me then. And my mate, CK, was like, this is the greatest thing you're ever going to do. It was a Sandman. It was a cool car with flowings. Oh, I love the Sandmans, man. Was it yellow? No, it was white with flames up the side.

Oh, of course it was. Of course it was. Yeah. And I should have known there was no key to start it. You have to put two wires together. I'm not kidding. I thought it was registered The worst piece of advice was driving that thing around

I mean, just even if Imagine if I was involved in an accident No insurance, no That's gold I would have been very lucky Mate, I want you to put on your tights and cape What superpower do you wish you had and why? Flying would be pretty cool

Yeah uh i'd use that in the fact of just the ease of getting around i'm in melbourne 45 minutes each way and i catch a train every day um only because it's five minutes slower door to door than driving at peak hour and trying to find a drive why would you trying to find a park in collingwood crazy not to yeah no good so yeah i catch the train so just to be able to leave the studio jump up in the air and end up at home let's sound fast as well like superman that'd be pretty sweet and also just the flexibility i've got friends in you know i've been able to travel so i've got friends on the sunshine coast gold coast adelaide imagine just being able to pop

in for lunch a nice boozy lunch in adelaide at a place called tea chow uh and then coming back here and just you know trying to pretend like i'm doing some work in front of some of the team members i'd be nice love it nut cracker uh last one of these uh what's a sort of personal happy habit a rewarding ritual or daily discipline that that you've employed over the years that's contributed most to your success do you think and i don't lean into and we actually had a podcast guest on yesterday who was the opposite of this i don't lead into hustle culture um as in the grind yeah maybe if i started the business in my 20s i would um but the one thing i've maintained in my since you know probably 20 years old is i go to the gym um i go to the gym when i'm hung over

reluctantly, even if I lift a couple of weights, I'll go to the gym most days. I try and go four to five times a week. And I don't think it's for me. I don't walk out of there on top of the world on dopamine, but I just think it's a great way to start my day. And if I really broke it down and I couldn't do it for a month, I would see the results around the gut section and just my mental health, I reckon, around just getting up, setting that routine, and going for it.

That's probably it. But I don't do the last bath. No, I'm right with you. I'm a grumpy bastard. If I haven't done some form of workout or something a couple of days or in a day, I miss it. Well, I've got a picture of you up in the gym, Bushy. You're the inspo.

Sure, mate. Yeah, I don't want to look like that. No, you're the after. You're the after. Mate, look, I really want to thank you for taking the time to share your quite interesting, very inspiring story so far, mate. Before we close, for those who are listening, who'd like to potentially explore something confidentiality

about your personal situation or you've got any blockages or challenges that you have in relation to property and investment generally, feel free to book in with me for a personal solution session by clicking the link in the show notes, where you'll have my complete, dedicated, and under my attention for a full 60 minutes. But more importantly, we now look forward to continuing our conversation with Angus next week's episode, where he's going to unpack the nitty-gritty of his personal property journey so far. So remember to always get invested in your knowledge and your network, and we look forward to getting invested with you again then, Angus.

Thanks, Bushy. I'll also say, for a guy who just said he puts a spotlight on everyone else, there's been a spotlight on me for the last 40 minutes. So thank you for letting me speak so much. If we were doing a property podcast together, I would be asking you all the questions as the expert, but I appreciate the opportunity. It's been great, man.

I've really enjoyed it. As I say, I am pretty particular about who I get on the show, mate. Thank you, mate. I've got a bit of a no-wanker policy. Let's put it out there. And I've spent quite a bit of time with you now on what you've done for us with Sessions in Progress and really enjoyed your humility

and the way you entertain us, mate. So keep up the great work. See you next week. Thanks, mate. Thanks for tuning in to Get Invested on the Property Hub podcast channel, your home for property investment insights and inspiration. Make sure you subscribe to Property Hub for free.

Get your weekly dose of Get Invested inspiration along with every episode of Realty Talk, Australia's top online property show for red hot property investing news and insights direct from industry leaders and influencers. And finally, I'll see you next time.