Property Hub - Investment Insights & Inspiration - Get Invested: Part 1 - Sharyn Burgess on financing your future

Starting point is 00:00:00 I get home loans. That's essentially what I do. But I think that it's really just the tip of the iceberg in terms of like getting a home loan is relatively easy. But actually doing it in a way that improves people's position actually makes them sit back and go, wow, that made a difference or it changes their life. When you become a finance broker and a good one, you invest yourself in your clients' lives. right and so they will always come back to you even if it's just for those little questions welcome to get invested on the property hub podcast channel the leading weekly show to help you unlock your full self-health and wealth potential i'm your host bushy martin and each

Starting point is 00:00:44 week i go deep with the best investors experts leaders and founders to find out what it takes to break free from the grind, discover freedom and live by design. Subscribe now and join me and get invested in the life you really want. Let's get started. Hi Freedom Fighters, are you struggling to borrow enough to secure a next property or refinance your home loan as rates continue to rise and you just don't know what you can do about it or what other options you have? If your loan borrowing capacity is now maxed out, what else, if anything, can you do to buy property? Given all of the recent renewed talk of buying property by setting up a self-managed super fund or SMSF, how does this

Starting point is 00:01:28 work and is borrowing through your SMSF the right thing for you? And while we're on the subject of lending, what's important to you and what are the most important things you need to consider when it comes to borrowing money to buy property? And finally, when do you start thinking about your finance for your property purchases? These are all really key questions that you need to consider if you're serious about achieving sustainable success in the property arena. But sadly, many property buyers and investors tend to focus on the property first and foremost and only seriously start to consider how they're going to finance the purchase when they're making an offer. And then the thoughts are generally limited to what's the

Starting point is 00:02:10 lowest rate loan and how quickly can I get it? In my experience, this is the exact opposite of the approach that you actually need to take. As I constantly reinforce, sustainable success in property is primarily a game of finance as well as an elite team sport. So the property is actually the last thing you need to consider after you've got everything else sorted, not the first. Because if you're not clear on what you're trying to achieve long-term lifestyle wise, coupled with clarity on your finance capacity and your achievable and affordable purchase price power then you're not going to be clear on what type of property in what area and what ownership entity is best suited to get you where you want to end up nor what you're actually capable of and when

Starting point is 00:02:54 it comes to your home loan or property investment loans the interest rate on the loan is far from the far can't even get this out it's far from the most important thing that you need to consider as the loan structure and finance strategy will have a massive impact on your capacity, your cost, and your risk. For instance, our investment-savvy know-how finance architects have access to over 40 lenders and over 2,000 different loan solutions to ensure that the daily dynamic changes in lender policies enable you to navigate the maze of ever-changing complexity, confusion, and uncertainty to arrive at a customized solution that satisfies your specific needs and your financial situation. In this way they're very much like your family doctor

Starting point is 00:03:38 who's able to diagnose your condition accurately and then problem solve and triage multitudes of potential treatment solutions before arriving at the best possible outcome for you. As opposed to a lot of banks and solo ex-banker low-rate loan breakers who effectively bulk bill you and then subscribe a blanket one-size-fits-all loan prescription based on the lowest rate which is highly unlikely to be in your best interest or even at the lowest cost. As an example you may not be aware that there's more than a 55% variation across the banks and lenders in terms of how much they'll let you borrow based on exactly the same income and liabilities profile so a singular focus on the lowest rate loan can seriously limit your purchasing power and your

Starting point is 00:04:24 wealth creation. Assuming you've got the equity deposit funds available this is the difference between being able to secure a $500,000 property versus a $775,000 property based on exactly the same income and liabilities position. And that extra $275,000 in property value in achievable purchase price will actually give you an extra $265,000 in your back pocket in 10 years' time and grow your nest egg by a whopping $790,000 extra over 20 years based on average growth rates. just by focusing on maximising your borrowing capacity as opposed to chasing the lowest rate loan. So why would you focus on rate when you're potentially dating yourself out of hundreds of thousands of dollars in capital growth long term? You need to focus on your reach, not the rate,

Starting point is 00:05:17 when it comes to property finance. And your achievable borrowing capacity is just the tip of the iceberg of the things that savvy mortgage brokers will help you to consider when it comes to maximising your capability, minimising your cost and minimising your risk. So to help you get a much better understanding of what's really important to you when it comes to financing your next property purchase or refinancing to reduce your costs, at a time when interest rates continue to rise and your buying capacity is dropping sharply as a result, it's never been more important to get your finance structure and lending strategy right. So I thought it'd be a great time to deep dive on all of this with a five-star award-winning finance broker. And in

Starting point is 00:05:57 this regard, I don't need to look any further than our own know-how property finance team. So today we're going to deep dive with one of our very own in-house senior broker partners, Sharon Burgess, affectionately known as Shan, who's an important part of our know-how family and definitely not one of your typical fly-in, fly-out, low-rate loan brokers in the suits because she puts the heart back into your home loans and the fun back into your funding by giving you all of the know-how that you're going to need to prosper in property.

Starting point is 00:06:27 So she's also going to answer all of your pressing finance questions after unpacking her own personal journey. So I'm really excited to get you on, Sian. So welcome and let's get invested. Thanks, Bushy. I'm excited to be here. Thanks for the invite.

Starting point is 00:06:42 Me too. You've been one of my best sources of feedback on the podcast over the years, Sian. So to actually have an opportunity to get you on and now talk it through, we're going to have a lot of fun given the conversations that we have each and every week. So to kick things off, Sian, where I always start with this, as you know, here's a bit of a run through for those

Starting point is 00:07:07 who don't know you, what do you do differently and why do you do what you do, Sian? That's a really good question. um essentially i do uh i get home loans that's essentially what i do but i think that's uh it's really just the tip of the iceberg in terms of like getting a home loan is relatively easy but actually um doing it in a way that improves people's position actually makes them sit back and go wow that made a difference or it changes their life um that's i get a lot of fun out of it and why I do what I do look there is a lot of passion there's a lot of satisfaction in terms of

Starting point is 00:07:50 like getting to the end and having somebody go thank you so much you changed my life and knowing that I was a small part of that and then there's another part of me that really likes to stick it to the banks and go you told me I couldn't do it and I did so I love it I love it a great person to have on your team when you're going up against the makes that that's for sure and the results you've got for uh borrowers over the years has been sensational in that regard uh shan and what i'd like to do now is circle back and do a bit of a reader's digest on your own uh journey in life so far and talk a little bit about what you've invested your time energy money over the years and why and how's this actually all led you to where you are and what you're doing today

Starting point is 00:08:36 you know it life is such an amazing things and i think you can just fit so much into it if you really try to um my investment journey has been so far and so wide but i think it actually really started i'll show my age here i think it really started back when i was really young and we had all the one and two cent pieces um it wasn't in the day of um pennies and so forth not that far back but um i was i was saying so i'm i'm showing my age now saying that but anyway let's move on um i had the ice cream bucket you know that was full of one and two cent pieces and it was just like chain fodder to my parents for me it was like i would sit there and i would play bank tellers with my brothers and i was in my element and i thought all this money it was probably like two

Starting point is 00:09:26 dollars fifty but all this money what can you do with that and you know like you can shift it you know so for me the concept of all of that started really really early where I invested all my time and my energy over the years it definitely has changed I've always been very active in investing I've always done it what's really important though it hasn't always been in property there's properties always been there but you know my twenties, I actually spent traveling the world on cruise ships because I felt it was the most efficient way to see as much of the, the, the world as I could. And I would work for eight months on two months off. And in that two months, spend a month at home and then a month inland in

Starting point is 00:10:16 a country that you can't see on a cruise ship because you only go to the external, you know, geographic locations. So there was always this, I guess, this dedication to exploring and being curious and giving that energy and that time and there's nothing greater than travel to open your eyes and and really broaden your horizons so as far as that goes and the resilience that goes with that travel piece is also a character building as far as that goes other if you sort of look back on on the journey up to that point how do you think your upbringings affected who you've become and what you're doing look i think affected me hugely um my uh in in particular my father but my parents are avid investors um they are fully retired now and they still hold

Starting point is 00:11:12 investment properties but um my upbringing was very much um then you then don't teach you they teach by doing not teach by actually verbalizing or sitting down this is what you can put here and and that sort of stuff. So it was very, very different. Uh, it wasn't like a learn from learning. It was a learn from watching. Um, and this is where hindsight's so amazing. I could look back on my childhood now in today's economy, we spent every holidays, every single school holidays, we were away. Granted it was in a tent or a caravan, but we were always away. Dad was always at work but we didn't live extravagantly but I also grew up on 30 acres in the middle of suburbia and we never really needed or wanted for anything and so when my hindsight I look back and

Starting point is 00:12:05 go how did you do that that's phenomenal how did you do that so it was more by watching what they did and how they did it quietly in the background and then you know taking that on board and kind of going okay well what can i do with this so it's definitely and still impacts me today yeah i love it that's uh that osmosis exercise that sort of seeps into your pores without you being aware of it uh has a profound uh long-term impact and let's circle back now so you you travel the world in the in the the cruise ships uh there's a there's a big distance between there and and becoming a philanthropist let's fill in the gaps and take us through that part of the journey there's a few little gaps in there maybe maybe a few years um okay i um

Starting point is 00:12:53 one of the jobs that i started on on cruise ships i i am um technically i'm trained as an esthetician so i was skin specialist so i started working on cruise ships um as a fitness trainer or a skin specialist and um that got me in to that sort of industry i ended up being the um day spy manager. Now, when we talk cruise ships, we're talking 10,000 people cruise ships, like big ones. And so I ended up being the day spy manager for a number of years within that environment where I had like 30 staff and so forth. When that sort of was getting to the end of that, I didn't really want to go back to, you know, on the tools per se. I wanted more. So I ended up buying um an elabash a franchise um based in coolum in um queensland right near noosa

Starting point is 00:13:47 and um i thought this is going to be amazing i can nail this i've run day spas on cruise ships i'm going to be incredible um fast forward into a really really crash course into business cash flow management and what it actually takes to um you know manage stuff so you know you hire or fire are and also keeping everything afloat. So that was fun. I did last a few years and I did sell it as a profit, but it didn't come without its pains and tribulations and learnings as well, I admit. By then I already had my first daughter. She was about three when I sold the salon. And so I went, actually went back and worked for another salon. I just wanted to like be a mom. Does that make sense?

Starting point is 00:14:39 I wanted to go back, be a mum and go to work, go home and tune off. I just needed this brain space to sort of make all that extra noise stop. And so I did that for a few years. I moved around the country, ended up in Western Australia, ended up divorced. And throughout all of that, I worked for one of Australia's largest banks. So I was quite fortunate to transfer from one side of the country to the other, helped that particular bank grow their branch network. I realized my childhood dream. I started out as a bank teller, which was fun.

Starting point is 00:15:22 I literally got to play with money every day. But they wanted me in the lending space very quickly. So I didn't stay very long in that role and ended up becoming a lending manager and helped them expand their Western Australian network. And I did that for about almost 10 years until I had my son and went on maternity leave and again started asking that question. There has to be more. Like, do I have to go back to the nine to five? Please tell me that I don't have to go back and do this anymore. So I went digging as to what I can do.

Starting point is 00:16:03 And then from there, I started loan processing. I had a few networks. Even when I worked at the bank, I found that the products, the loans that people could choose from was so limited that I needed a broker on call for all of those clients that I couldn't look after with that bank. um and so very quickly uh fell into becoming a loan processor for a network of brokers now i just want to jump in there shan because so that people listening in uh may not understand fully what a loan process does uh because it's not just uh filling in forms and and and paperwork because there's an enormous amount involved in the loan processing piece and in fact i i firmly believe that it makes or breaks a broker in that context because a lot of brokers will try and do

Starting point is 00:16:55 it all themselves and try to, as a single person showed, try and do end-to-end and they just either don't have an offer, they burn out and crash and give up. But the process on loan processing is a fundamental part of the whole equation in terms of result you get from the bank and the client experience. So as you can see, can you talk a little bit more about that so that those listening in understand the pivotal part of the loan processing part in the overall equation? Yeah, absolutely. And it's so true what you said. A loan processor will make or break the broker and how they can look after their clients. I quite often joke and say that a loan processor is the right arm the left arm and the heartbeat of the broker so if they're not amazing

Starting point is 00:17:44 then the broker will not be amazing even if they can do the job but essentially what is the role of a loan processor once the once the actual loan that you need even as far as any structuring that's required is isolated from the broker then the loan processor does all of the let's call it admin work or the cross in the t's dot in the i's this in our current climate where brokers are actually governed by bid or best interest duty there's a lot of requirement requirements as the due diligence is huge in what we do and the actual amount of work you can take to to write a loan can actually time-wise be quite crippling um so loan processes are there to actually help that journey. Essentially, the broker has to outline a process and has to set

Starting point is 00:18:41 up systems and everything for the loan processor to do that part of the job. But when it's done correctly, the actual loan processor can actually make the whole process fly through faster and ensure the customer journey ends with a nice big happy smile and let's call it a five-star google review rating that's the journey and that's that's what they aim for um do we all hit the mark yeah it's fine and i think you know sharing that's really important because you you've had lived it and and and been breathing that alone processing exercise for quite some time which is which is how i met you uh but and once you then transition into becoming a broker in your own right,

Starting point is 00:19:28 you've also been pivotal in building our own loan admin, loan processing team in-house, which has made a massive difference to the lives of the team but also the clients that now enjoy that end-to-end service with a complete team that are specialists in certain parts rather than relying on one person to try and do it all. So that's really important. Sorry, I jumped off the tangent there, but coming back to it, so you got into loan processing.

Starting point is 00:19:59 Talk to us about the journey from there. So I got into loan processing. I worked for a broker directly and I learned so much in that, not necessarily how to do the job, but I learned so much in terms of how not to project certain things to clients, what I didn't want to happen. So what I found is that I spent a lot of time protecting that broker in terms of the client-customer journey. I was so hell-bent on making sure that that customer was happy and they were communicated with, whereas the particular broker that I worked for wasn't. So I didn't last terribly long with that particular broker and then fell pregnant with child number three. and um so i decided to contract myself out to the rest of the world and was very quickly inundated

Starting point is 00:20:56 um by a bevy of brokers right across the country um screaming out for that niche um service and that that niche help um of somebody who actually knew what they were doing but cared about the customer journey so and then hence why i landed um with know how finance originally as a loan processor and um i don't i don't want to say that i would never have become a broker what i do want to say is i wanted to become a broker but i had this perception that um i had young children by that stage you know my youngest was a baby baby and um i don't necessarily think that the world would have accepted me with a young baby like did I need to do late nights did I need to do weekends what did that mean for my children but I'm a mum here and there was this conflict of

Starting point is 00:21:50 thoughts and emotions and is this even achievable will anybody actually like me and my journey with know-how finance and in particular another senior finance architect Luke Howell was actually pivotal in actually breaking down those barriers that I had built around for myself to become a broker. Yeah, I love it. Right from the first time that Sonia and I had the opportunity to meet you, we could see massive potential. And as you know, we're not one of those breaking firms that goes 24,

Starting point is 00:22:27 seven days a week and expects people to not have a life outside of it. In fact, quite the reverse. We want to make sure that Big Rock's supporting it first and then if you're happy, then the experience with the clients and the time you have available is going to be a good one. So I'm glad you grasped that opportunity because, you know, you've grown immensely within the group over that time. And, you know, we talk about the finance breaking piece

Starting point is 00:22:57 because you're really swimming in a pool that's dominated by men in particular. You know, it's an ageing industry really. Yeah, there's a lot of older guys, ex-bankers, gray-haired, bald, and running around in suits. How has breaking into the field as a female, has that created any challenges for you? Or on the flip side, there's probably some advantages in that as well. Can you talk to us about that? Yeah, absolutely. I'm one of those people that always likes to think that perception is deception.

Starting point is 00:23:34 so i can look at something and i can perceive it and then i can kind of go is this real is it in my head um and and bushy you and i we sat at a uh a function in sydney for brokers and i just there was a broker up on stage and i thought that is everything i do not want to be um and it was about this perception that even i had as a broker and i'd already been in the industry for years and I still had this perception that, you know, maybe they weren't trustworthy or maybe, you know, that they were all about the money or how much they could make. And it was something that I think it actually almost prevented me

Starting point is 00:24:17 from becoming a broker because I was so dead set against not being that person because it went against my core values and my beliefs that I thought I cannot do this. um so um there definitely is um a male it definitely is a male-dominated industry 100 percent um i don't necessarily think that all the males that are within that system are necessarily anti-women um yeah so i i definitely think there might be a very small percentage that are women don't belong here they belong in the kitchen for example but um I hope not.

Starting point is 00:24:58 Surely men didn't marry by now. Yeah. Well, they might be one of those old ones. But I think for the most part, it is simply just a perception. And women perceive that, that because there are so many men, it's not for women. And perception is deception. It's just not real.

Starting point is 00:25:22 And there's a growing force of women that are coming into this industry. I do think that the industry hasn't come a little bit forward yet in terms of making it a little bit better for women. And what I mean by that is that women, we're the ones that bear the children. We're typically the ones that then take the time off for the maternity leave to do at least those early stages of child rearing. It's very difficult for men to breastfeed. So, you know, that falls to us. um brokering when you become a finance broker and a good one you invest yourself in your clients

Starting point is 00:26:01 lives right and so they will always come back to you even if it's just for those little questions and the having the inability to just say sorry i can't take that call now i'm off to have a baby it doesn't it's not quite congruent with the actual industry as yet um so i think that might actually put a lot of women off however um there are a growing number of larger brokerages that are actually bringing on a huge force of women because they um they understand that women get it they get it from all facets uh they understand it's tough it's tough the juggle it's tough it's real um and they have the ability to uh be a whole lot more empathetic to somebody's situation and, you know, maybe be a little bit more invested

Starting point is 00:26:51 into getting that loan across the line for them as well. I totally agree. I mean, as you know, Sonia and I really believe in a diverse and varied workforce so that we're getting different views, different skills, different approaches. And I think you hit it on the head, the level of care that I see you bring to every person you help uh and and what i love about the way you approach the whole exercise is if you whatever reason uh might be a circumstance or a bank issue where you can't get a result for

Starting point is 00:27:27 them then uh that's not the end of the equation you're not like one of these i can't help you see later uh you're helping them you're putting them on the plan you're giving them a definite approach and that level of empathy and understanding and then the genuine care that goes with it i think is the thing that really separates you and and the ability let's let's not forget this one either that yourself and and my good wife Sonia that your ability to uh multitask is probably not the right word it's a bit hackneyed but to juggle a thousand balls at the same time and and still come through with a smile on your face is is quite awe-inspiring uh versus guys like me who are very good at doing one thing at a time but nothing more and makes a massive difference so thanks

Starting point is 00:28:13 for sharing that like what i want to do now though before we sort of go into the air in a bit more detail uh is it can you share with us uh any challenging events in your life uh and that have brought about your greatest learnings and and best changes shan there's so many there's so so many it's really hard to pick one um i i i will pick one though that i know affected you as well bushy so um but i have we we had a client um who passed away earlier this year and um to full disclosure the client was only 55 he he shouldn't have died now the you would think that the impact of actually helping his wife get an understanding of their finances he had life insurance in place financially she's okay she can actually sit

Starting point is 00:29:11 back now and mourn the loss the sudden loss of her husband um how it impacted me was not just the actual passing of somebody what what took place and and how he died he um his only symptom was he was tired very very tired now in today's like manic life right and the end the universal energy is quite manic how often do we say we're tired you know i'm so tired or you know and we work a lot i'll just squeeze in some more work tonight i'll work on sunday and then i'm going to do this with the kids and of course we're tired um he's for a long time and I want to say a long time, I can't comment on how long, that's his only symptom. He was super tired. And then he suddenly died of acute myeloid leukemia. Now, their story is their story.

Starting point is 00:30:11 How it impacted me is, I say I'm tired every week. Somebody will ask me, how are you feeling? Oh, I'm so tired. I've got to get ABC done. The kids have got this. I slept two hours last night. And I was like, hang on a second. It's like, pause. I need to pause here. What impact is my lifestyle affecting me? And am I on top of that? I'm not too far off the age where he passed. Do I want that to be me? What steps can I take now? and so it was it made me pivot very quickly in terms of um investing more time in me and my health and if that's if that's the impact it's had on one person then a life gone has had a positive result oh great it had a massive impact on myself i i couldn't believe it shan we both knew a particular family extremely well and you know the shock was just and it did it was a bit of a wake up call for me as well in that sense it's like wow he just he shouldn't be gone why is he gone

Starting point is 00:31:20 it just seemed very unfair actually at the time for such a great guy so always the good guys that it happens to and yeah I really appreciate you sharing that share because it is a bit of a wake up call for us to say well hold on we really do need to tune into what's going on not ignore not she'll be right mate which is the old strength that a lot of us end up suffering from but there's there's also something else that that uh i'm going to put you on the spot here but there's something unique uh about you that that took me a long time before i was even aware and this is how well you manage the situation do you mind sharing uh uh the challenge you have around your hearing side of the equation because that's something that I'm in full awe and respect of how you

Starting point is 00:32:07 maneuver through this whole exercise. Yeah, I think that's a big one. So I have a hearing disorder. It's called otosclerosis. Essentially, it's the little bones inside, in between your ears and your eardrums. The cartilage gets eaten away from hormonal changes, could be from a variety of factors and then the bone fuses together which means the these vibrational sound doesn't get from your ear to your eardrum um it's generally it's genetic and it's generally um adult onset so it's not something that happens in children it's something that happens in in adults and um so i was 28 uh and had a six month old baby and within the space of two months, went almost completely deaf from perfect hearing right up until that point.

Starting point is 00:33:03 And look, I'm happy to talk about in between because it was such an emotional time and gave me so many lessons. Fast forward, how do I function now? I have implants in my skull that put in bone conduction hearing devices and I learned how to lip read really fast. Um, but essentially now I've got my hearing lifted up to about the, you know, 55, 60% mark. So I can function in most scenarios. Um, like this is perfect. If you put me in a busy cafe, I might miss some bits and pieces.

Starting point is 00:33:43 Hey, I really struggle. You put me in a bar or restaurant, I've got no clue what people are saying. So sometimes that's better, don't you think? Yeah, yeah, it probably is. I just think, and I think the really important thing here is that, you know, that's really life-changing for people to go from normal hearing to, I don't know how long the process took, and you've got a young family at that point in time, there's a lot of people who crumble under that pressure.

Starting point is 00:34:12 What I love about the way is that you've just absorbed that as part of, you know, your life and how you live. and I think while you've had some hearing challenges, I think you're an even better listener now as a result of that exercise because your ability to infuse and pick up what's really being communicated rather than just the loudness of the sound is second to none as far as that goes. So, no, I'm sorry to put you on the spot with that, Sian, but I think people would appreciate that and no one would know.

Starting point is 00:34:46 In talking to you, you just wouldn't know that that was even a thing. Uh, but, uh, um, full respect on that score. I, I now want to sort of pivot into where your property journey, given that a lot of the, uh, audience, uh, love to hear about, uh, people's property journeys. Can you sort of walk us through that starting with why did you decide to buy property and, and what initially triggered your interest? Um, I think it comes back to my childhood, been watching, um, my father. So my father is, uh, was, um, still alive, but he's retired um he was a builder so he's a carpenter um and one of those old school you know 70s builders where they build the house and then sell the house so not necessarily a developer

Starting point is 00:35:27 um but watching watching all that happen um and when I worked on cruise ships a lot of it most of it was pre-9-11 so um the exchange rate I got paid in US dollars and brought it back and exchange rate was two for one so it was great i come back and um after the first couple of years on on trips my my father sort of sat me down and goes well what are you going to do with all that money and i sort of went i might go to norway for a couple of months you know like you know and he's like ah okay maybe you might need to think about this a little bit more and that was about as much guidance as there was and that's okay because it was enough for me to kind of go do i need to think about this some more like do i need to okay maybe i'll think about this some more

Starting point is 00:36:19 um so i thought okay i'll do this i'll get on board so i bought my first house it was in southeast queensland i paid eighty one thousand four hundred dollars and um how long ago is that san roughly oh i look it's over 20 years ago yeah um But what the interesting part is that I always remember is that I had over $50,000 per deposit. So I really didn't need to borrow a huge deal. And I walked into the bank. I won't say which bank. I said, oh, I'd like a loan.

Starting point is 00:36:57 Okay, no problem. And so they started their criteria and they sent off the application. And then they said, look, we need you to come back in. And I said, okay, great. But I'm flying out back to, you know, wherever next week, you know, like, can we do it now? Well, sure. and they said look we're okay but we'd like to know if you've saved this money in the last eight months being out at sea but you've been doing this for two years where's the rest of it

Starting point is 00:37:21 what yeah and i was like yeah and i was like okay would you like me to bring in my photo album because i'm like investing in seeing the world and i will never forget the look on the lady's face she sort of went okay fair point that's approved you know but there was this there was you know there was this pause and then she sort of went oh okay but it was a really foreign concept like that the process at the bank is nothing like it is today so it's a long time ago but the the foreign concept of that if you can save that in such a short period of time why do you not have so much more even 20 plus years ago there was this foreign concept of actually investing in life actually doing stuff. Banking money is good, but I never look back on those times with regret of

Starting point is 00:38:13 like, oh, maybe I should have saved an extra $10,000. Yeah, exactly right. Take us a bit further then. So that was the first property. Can you sort of share a quick summary of where your property journey went from there and particularly sort of dive into any challenges or issues you had along that journey and how you overcame them, if you don't mind. Yeah, I think the working overseas was probably one of the biggest hurdles that I had to, I was actually convincing banks that I was good for the money, given that it was overseas income. I then very quickly, probably eight months later, purchased a second property and had

Starting point is 00:38:56 a very, very similar deposit, very, very similar experience. but I could see that I wasn't really taken seriously I was very very early 20s you know but from a real estate agent perspective and then from the bank perspective was like really who is this girl I didn't profess to be some massive investor it was just one of those sort of let's call it an accidental pathway it was an accidental intentional it was something I wanted to do I was always going to do it but I was accidentally doing it at that time it was like oh, this will be good. I'll buy another one. When we fast forward a few more years from there and then when I had baby number one, I thought, okay, I'll take some time off. I'll buy some time

Starting point is 00:39:44 off. I'll sell one of these properties and then that could fund that time. Except no, I have this inability. I sold the property, but still went and worked anyway. And then I used the money to buy the business. So again, still investing just in different spheres. I have since purchased and sold or not sold a multitude of properties around the country. My biggest challenges, I think, at each sort of moment in time have always been a little bit different. Some of them might be borrowing capacity issues because I had recently changed from a sole trader to a business person or my ABN was only in place for 12 months

Starting point is 00:40:35 or I'd had a baby and was technically on maternity leave. So there was all this roadblocks, I guess you want to say, that even I had to overcome for myself. But perception is deception. There was always a way to get it done. and it was always what's the price I was willing to pay to get that property because sometimes it wasn't always as streamlined, it's as smooth as I want it to be.

Starting point is 00:41:04 But working through those challenges, it definitely, I get it. Somebody comes to me with a scenario, I'm like, you know what, I get it. Let's do this. This is what it looks like. Exactly right. And having the experience early on and starting to understand

Starting point is 00:41:20 that there are a whole heap of landmines that you can be stepping on in the lending space without it even being aware of it. And sadly, common sense doesn't come into the thinking when it comes to the equation. So starting to see that firsthand, I can now see why, you know, as a broker helping others, the optimism and the ability to solve problems

Starting point is 00:41:46 by manoeuvring and navigating in such a way that's always going to get a result is a big part of the resilience that you bring to the table as far as that goes. So I'll pull on that. Now, I just want to sort of check in on your memory here, can you remember what your investment strategy was when you first started and has this evolved over time and what's it look like now and why?

Starting point is 00:42:08 That's such a good question. It definitely has changed. I want to say at the beginning it was I was investing because I could. Yeah. And I thought through osmosis of my raising that it was the right thing to do. Now, I'm not backtracking on that, but that literally was the strategy. It was, this is the right thing to do. I can do it.

Starting point is 00:42:31 Why not? I can do anything. You know, at each hurdle, there's a different, and I think what's really important for anybody to understand is that life changes. You know, if I'm allowed to swear, shit happens, right? And so it's, and it's all okay. It's just that we're, what are we investing in at this moment in time? How are we doing it? And I think we fast forward to now and how I invest now.

Starting point is 00:43:03 It's a lot more strategic and I don't always mean strategic as in we're sourcing the property in this location. I mean, in terms of life, I have a couple of criterias that for me, if I'm investing in anything, even if it's investing in actually trying to persist and teach one of my children something, it has to make sense. It unequivocally has to make sense what you're doing. So if you're doing it because you think you need to do it, it doesn't really make sense. So there's no strategy there. And the other thing is that, is it going to give me a 2am problem? So if it's going to give me a 2 a.m problem it's not the right choice i love it and then i go find something else it's

Starting point is 00:43:48 it's just a not a no it's just a pivot 2 a.m problem i'm out that is awesome shan i yeah the 2 a.m problem we've just you've just coined that uh that's that's the the latest shanism that we're going to do the equation so that absolutely brilliant i love that um let's jump into the future uh now if we can i'd love for you to share uh what fulfillment freedom and financial independence means to you you know financial independence to me can be really just nailed down into two words choice time it's what do i want to do with my time now that doesn't necessarily mean stop working it doesn't necessarily mean work like a fiend it doesn't necessarily mean that anything other than what am I choosing for that time of my life

Starting point is 00:44:43 and does this give me that choice? It's really simple. So choice time. Everything comes down to choice time for me. You're the place, Ed. Well, let's put some shape around that picture of, as you know, I'm a massive fan of living by design. So I'd love for you to share your sort of vivid picture

Starting point is 00:45:02 of what your life vision and ideal lifestyle looks like then, Shan. Yeah, you know, I think this changes as well all the time. And as a mother of two of my children are still under the age of 10, so I still have youngish children. So I've got a little ways to go before the perceived freedom of children, if that ever actually happens. But for me, first and foremost, I'm giving myself about another 18 months and I want to be mortgage-free on my personal owner-occupied home loan.

Starting point is 00:45:37 I'm pretty darn close, but I'm fiercely holding onto it and fighting for it, tooth and nail. And for me, that doesn't necessarily mean we stop paying our mortgage. It still means we keep putting that money, but we're then invested into something. Again, it's choosing. We choose to continue to pay what our mortgage would be at whatever the applicable interest rate. I don't care if it's 6% or 2%, whatever it is, and then we choose what are we going to invest that in. what life looks like in the future um i would like to think that i am very close or on the water somewhere like literally where i can put my feet in the water um surrounded by the right

Starting point is 00:46:19 people and the right people the ones that lift you up and can give you a really good laugh and i'm in a position to have choice time live the life i choose whether that's travel or whether that's not. Financial freedom provides that and I can actually help and support others and my children to do the same. I love it. I love the way you've used properties as a vehicle along that journey to actually assist you with that choice time exercise at different points. So it's not all about just locking property away forever. The things that you've been able to do yourself and your family as a consequence of selling a property here and there to free up funds to do other things. That choice time equation is a really important one that people

Starting point is 00:47:11 would take away from that conversation. If we sort of have a look back on that whole journey, then what's been both your best and your worst investment and what have you learned from each of those, Sharon? I don't really know what my worst is. I don't really live in the past. i i do i'm a forward sort of thing um i think probably one of the worst investments was um hearing aids and i know that's an odd thing to pick they are abominable things um that really just don't help the heart of hearing very much at all they just make things louder um and look the best was the best advice i ever got was start now start now and figure it out as you go you know and i sort of went well what do you mean start now like it's not ready like it's not

Starting point is 00:48:03 perfect and they were like you cannot learn to drive a parked car sharon start now and learn as you go and it really is like you kind of go well that makes sense um you know so that's probably the best advice that i've taken on board i love that that's uh really good advice for everyone listening in as well but if we look back then and you were starting out again would you invest in anything differently and i'm not just talking about property he's talking about whatever you invest your time energy money in would you have done any of that differently do you think again, I don't live too much in the past, but I would probably, um, choose to invest in myself a little bit sooner than what I did. Um, the journey of the hearing loss, um, you know, it,

Starting point is 00:48:53 you, everyone sees the end result now and goes, oh, wow, you're amazing. You can, you wouldn't even know. Um, but that was a very, like a 10 year journey. And I had to wait for modern science to catch up and i did retreat to society i retreated from all my friends all my family my marriage broke down not because of my hearing i had but um it probably didn't help because i was just a shell of who i could have been and it's it's probably emotional if i talk about it too much but the journey to actually find me again in amongst you know people who understand what that's like, it's, um, it's life altering, you know, and it probably took me way too many years to actually stand up and go, you know what, screw you all. I have

Starting point is 00:49:45 hearing loss, learn to deal with it because they weren't learning to deal with it because I hadn't learned to myself. And I think if anything that I could change, I would try to learn to invest in me a little bit sooner. That's, I had the courage to sort of stand up and, and bypass that period. um faster i am who i am because of that journey and and like you said i'm an avid listener because of that journey so i don't begrudge it but if i was to change anything that i invested in it would i would actually invest in me and my mental health sooner yeah it's extremely well said and i really appreciate you sharing that shan that's uh easy for someone like me to sit here and say this but i uh having had different health challenges early on uh while it's really

Starting point is 00:50:37 difficult i guess it gets you to question yourself and your own worth and anybody else that goes with it uh during during that time uh i can confidently say looking in now that the resilience and the the strength of character you have as a consequence of working through that and and being forced to really have a look at yourself and who you are and then work through that to rekindle that level of self-belief is, you know, not many people actually face with those challenges and come out the other side like you have. So, you know, I really commend you for the way you've taken it on board and the confidence that you now portray and the way you communicate despite all of those things is is second to none as a consequence so look i'd really uh thank you for being open and

Starting point is 00:51:31 and um uh be prepared to to share that a lot of people shy away from that exercise but i i think those who really understand that respect you even more as a consequence so thanks for sharing your story stay tuned for part two of this interview next episode Thanks for tuning in to Get Invested on the Property Hub podcast channel, your home for property investment insights and inspiration. And don't leave yet until you've taken the next step towards living by design by getting my award-winning book, Get Invested, absolutely free when you sign up at knowhowproperty.com.au or bushymartin.com.au.

Starting point is 00:52:13 And finally, make sure you subscribe to Property Hub to get your weekly dose of Get Invested inspiration along with every episode of Realty Talk, Australia's leading property show for red-hot property investing news and insights direct from industry leaders and influencers. Remember to always get invested in your knowledge and I look forward to seeing you next time.

Property Hub - Investment Insights & Inspiration - Get Invested: Part 1 - Sharyn Burgess on financing your future

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