Property Hub - Investment Insights & Inspiration - Get Invested: Part 1 - Troyson Bassani on regional buyers agents

Starting point is 00:00:00 The reason why I started Lifebuyers Agency was because I saw a lot of people, property investors in particular, looking to buy in region Queensland in the markets that I was very familiar with, markets that I've been very intimately involved in over the course of my life. And a lot of them I felt this zone lacked a lot of key insight about the marketplace and about some of the suburbs, about some of the better performing assets, to the extent that a lot of people made a lot of buying decisions that were non-favorable to their goals and property aspirations, meaning they lost money or never made money at all. So I saw that

Starting point is 00:00:36 there was an urgent need for buyers that needed someone on the ground to hold their hand and guide them through the marketplace and connect them with the better opportunities in the marketplace, the better quality assets that ultimately get them closer to where they want to be in terms their different property related goals. Welcome to Get Invested on the Property Hub podcast channel, the leading weekly show to help you unlock your full self-health and wealth potential. I'm your host, Bushy Martin, and each week I go deep with the best investors, experts, leaders, and founders to find out what it takes to break free from the grind, discover freedom, and live by design. Subscribe now and join me and get invested in the life

Starting point is 00:01:20 you really want. Let's get started. Hi Freedom Fighters, how did you buy your last property and how are you thinking about buying your next? Are you going to do it yourself or will someone help you? And would you consider using a buyer's agent and if so, how can you ensure that you get a good one? If you've been tuned into the Property Hub for any length of time, you know that I'm a big believer that sustainable success in property is actually an elite team sport and you're only as good as the weakest link in your team and sadly for many property buyers the weakest member is often themselves the person that's staring back at them in the mirror but they just don't realize it the simple fact of the matter is that if you don't have the considerable time experience

Starting point is 00:02:10 expertise and skills required to search select and successfully negotiate a property purchase then don't kid yourself that you can do this major transaction the justice that it actually deserves just on your own. Just because you live in a house doesn't mean you know how to buy an outperforming investment property. In reality this delusion only gives you enough knowledge and false confidence to be a danger to yourself. So let me share a very quick analogy. If you are looking to win the state of origin rugby league final against the blues or the AFL grand final against Richmond or the Ashes Cricket Series against England or the National Netball Competition against the Diamonds, you wouldn't just rock up as an occasional part-timer and as a bit of a

Starting point is 00:02:55 legend in your own lunchtime and by yourself take on the professional full-time skill of the other teams and expect to win. Yet this is exactly what most property investors and buyers actually do. Many try and go it alone. But if you're really serious about wanting to outperform, you get the best possible players in each and every position that all understand each other's position and style of play and how they need to combine to achieve your overall game strategy to ensure they're collectively kicking your goals and helping you win both your property game and your lifestyle season. Now in this context you're not a player more importantly you're the owner and manager of your elite property team, where your role is to set the strategy and then together

Starting point is 00:03:43 with your head coaches of your property strategist, savvy mortgage broker and accountant, like our know-how property team, you need to do this to keep the rest of your professional property team honest and accountable. So your role is then to define the end game and manage your managers because unless you're an expert, you shouldn't be a player. This is a bit of a false economy and a delusion that gets many property investors into trouble and most of them don't even realize it. Now I'm no exception. I didn't trust anyone when I first started in property so I tried to reinvent the wheel on my own and I ended up making a heap of mistakes that I didn't even know that I was making at the time because I just didn't know what I didn't know

Starting point is 00:04:25 until I learned the benefits of surrounding myself with independent and proven property professionals in each and every key position. I then progressively made sure that everyone in my property team was better at their specialist position than I was but I also invested in my knowledge and kept learning enough and continuously asking questions to make sure I knew enough to keep them all honest. Now I'm not for a moment suggesting that you totally outsource your property portfolio and your future wealth by handballing it to others because no one's going to care as much about your money and your property as you do. But the trick is to ensure that you invest in continuously growing your knowledge and becoming familiar enough with each and every

Starting point is 00:05:08 aspect of the property process over time so that you're the owner, leader and performance manager of your elite property professional team. And listening to our Property Hub and other great podcasts is a great way to help you do this. So you're already off to a good start because there isn't an episode where i don't learn something from our great guests even though i've been intimately involved in property for nearly 45 years now so i'm really showing my age there now you may also like to register for our freedom formula fight series and of education information sessions where i share the key property principles and the why what and how of property so if this is of interest just click on the link in the show notes at bushymartin.com.au forward slash

Starting point is 00:05:51 Freedom Formula course to take your knowledge to the next level. Now one of the most important and pivotal players in your property team particularly when you're starting out will be a good professional and proven buyer's agent and the emphasis here is on good and proven because like any rapidly growing profession the barriers to entry are generally pretty low and they tend to attract early on gold diggers chasing the quick bucks who move from being spray painters or hairdressers yesterday, not that there's anything wrong with any of those professions, to being buyer's agents today, which is where their lack of experience and expertise can end up costing you dearly in the long term. But a proven professional buyer's agent can be actually worth their weight

Starting point is 00:06:35 in gold when it comes to sustainable property performance. So how can you avoid the time, stress, headache and potential risk of buying a property yourself, which you'll be interested to know on average takes you over seven months and 90 hours of your precious time spread over an average of at least 12 properties and making over six offers and even then the likelihood that you've secured the best property for your needs is actually pretty slim because you just don't have the time or expertise and chances are you'll join the 42% of property buyers who feel overwhelmed by the process and end up compromising on the property you end up buying just due to continual frustration. With 13% of buyers feeling like they pay too much and 28% feeling heartbroken they

Starting point is 00:07:22 didn't actually end up getting their ideal property which was according to a home.com survey. So what's the answer? A good proven and professional buyer's agent. Your valuable time, your money and your future wealth is just not worth trying to buy DIY, particularly for first or second time property buyers or for those that are only buying property occasionally every two to three years. What you buy and where you buy it are absolutely mission critical to your immediate and long-term success, not just how much you buy the property for. For example, if you're going for growth and just a 3% difference in the growth rate between two different locations will add more than $800,000 to your nest egg on a $400,000 property purchase over 20 years. Now that's a 75%

Starting point is 00:08:13 increase just by buying the right property in the right location because 80% of the growth comes from the location not from the property itself. It's for this reason that I've interviewed and continue to interview buyers agents on the show because I want to help you to learn the ins and outs of the property buying process and to expose you to a range of buyer's agents who will ultimately help you to identify the right approach for you as well as the right buyer's agent to suit you who's not only experienced and expert at what they do but just as importantly are the right fit for you because you need to listen to your gut intuition on this because a buyer's agent or other property professional may be the best in class but if your highly tuned BS indicator is

Starting point is 00:08:55 going off like a Geiger counter near a nuclear reactor. And you need to honour this and go with your gut. Everyone's different, so you need to keep looking until you find a professional that not only does right, but feels right, and is aligned with your values, your goals, and your personality. Now, if you need help in selecting the best buyers agent and rejecting the rest, feel free to email us at hello at knowhowproperty.com.au. That's H-E-L-L-O at knowhowproperty.com.au, which we'll include in the show notes and also put in the subject header questions to ask before engaging a buyer's agent and we'll email you the copy of the 37 questions that our know-how team asks potential buyer's agents to decide if they're worthy of further consideration because it's all

Starting point is 00:09:43 about getting a good proven professional buyer's agent who's an expert and specialist in their location and the property type. And today's guest is another example. Troyson Bassani is the founder and head of research at Life Buyers Agency, who specialise in securing property in the North, Central and South East Queensland regional property markets, which are actually opportunity areas that are getting a lot of increased attention in recent times. To date, Troyson and his Life Buyers Agency have helped secure over $150 million worth of property across the central Queensland region for both interstate, interstate and international buyers. So this week we're going to dig into Troysen's personal journey and then next week we're going to deep dive into

Starting point is 00:10:29 the pros and cons of regional markets and the role of buyers agents in these areas. So welcome and let's get invested Troysen. Well sheath thank you for having me I'm super excited. Yeah likewise too mate. I've sort of been quietly behind the scenes tracking what you're up to in your neck of the woods uh but uh choice and for those who don't know much about you at this point in time can you sort of kick things off by sharing what you do differently and most importantly why you do what you do hey what i do differently well i suppose i'll start off with why first and then i'll get to what and what i'm doing differently so why i do what i do which is how what i essentially doing is I help property buyers, investors and home buyers navigate the regional

Starting point is 00:11:20 Queensland property market. That's what I do. And why I do that is over the years before my time in real estate and before I became a buyer's agent and operated the business that I have to date, I saw many investors and home buyers find it difficult to navigate the regional property market. And in fact, many of them lost money, many of them had a lot of regret, and many of them have bought secondary assets, you know, and missed out on the opportunity that comes with buying, you know, the better quality assets in this marketplace. And this is just something that I've observed over my time, just having, you know, visibility of, you know, what properties are being purchased in different marketplaces, what people are talking about in different forums as part of

Starting point is 00:12:08 a lot of hotspot areas and what people, you know, are talking about around with friends and family at the barbecue table. You know, I've just come to see that there is, there was a huge forced shortfall a lot of property investors had when buying property in Queensland. So I thought, hey, let's create a service offering that adds value to a lot of these people looking to buy property in this marketplace

Starting point is 00:12:32 and hopefully, you know, alleviate some of the downside risk that comes with that. But at the same time, while we mitigate that downside risk, find other ways to maximise the upside potential. And by us holding people's hand through the marketplace and connecting them with the better quality assets, we believe that creates the upside potential needed for someone to get ahead in their property journey. Yeah, I love that, Troyson. Now, where I always like to start with these conversations, Troyson, is to do a bit of reader's digest of your life journey so far.

Starting point is 00:13:07 So I'd like to sort of circle back as far as you'd like to go and talk us through what you've invested your time, energy, and money in over the years and why, and how has this then led you to where you are and what you're doing today? Thanks. Well, funny enough, I am someone that Alex Famosi would say that has invested in the SME 500, not the SME 500.

Starting point is 00:13:31 I've spent a lot of time developing myself and fire-tuning my craft, becoming a master in my field. I tried to master the art of what I do today. But prior to going into real estate, I did graduate from university in Cairns and followed up with a double degree in business management and entrepreneurship. So I have a very entrepreneurial spirit. In fact, prior to getting into real estate, I attempted to do a number of other business ventures that didn't work out just because I was entrepreneurial in nature. So I went off to university, did a double degree and then went into the corporate world and spent a bit of time in tourism. In fact, where I worked for a big Australian tourism operator, spent a lot of time traveling the world in the sales field and tried to pitch the tourism product we have and get on the ITOs, itineraries for inbound tour operators or FIT travelers that were traveling to Australia. So I spent a lot of time doing that, and really that time really built my network in the book world, but at the same time really fine-tuned a lot of the marketing, sales, and branding skills that I feel as though I didn't get from university.

Starting point is 00:14:49 Even though I did a business degree, I felt that what I learned out in the real world really just built on what I've learned at university. So I spent a bit of time in sales and tourism, and then I actually went into corporate finance. So I spent a number of years working as an analyst finance for an indigenous private equity firm in Cairns and what we would do is basically acquire small business ventures and we would go out and raise capital to then scale them up. So the goal would be to 4x or 10x the turnover of those assets and obviously provide returns to our investors that invested in those businesses. So my job was to look for those opportunities and then obviously raise the capital as well. So, behind the scenes, doing the financial plans, the business plans, and putting together the pitch and the value proposition to pitch to investors. And, yeah, we've got a number of, you know, over the years, book businesses off to the ground. Up north in Far North Queensland, we bought a lawn mowing business that we scaled to, you know, basically a tier one civil construction business over a five-year period.

Starting point is 00:15:54 And now that's building bridges, but from, you know, doing mowing lawns to building bridges in the space of five years. and we 15X'd their turnover over that time period as well, which was really good. I actually then went off and after I finished the work, spent a bit of time playing semi-professional rugby league. So I spent a bit of time playing in the Queensland Cup here in Queensland and would travel all around the state playing semi-professional rugby league. And I think that really set me up and learning the discipline

Starting point is 00:16:28 or what it takes to be a successful athlete or to be in a high-performing team. And I found a lot of those things that I did in the semi-professional rugby league space was really transferable into business. It was really transferable into business. And even to this day, a lot of those habits are still in me where maintaining an equilibrium between health and lifestyle

Starting point is 00:16:51 and well-being, all of those were the key things that affect how you perform in the rugby league also affects how you perform in business. So I've really adopted a lot of what I've learnt in playing semi-professional rugby league over the years and implemented that into my business. Unfortunately, that didn't work out. I had aspiration to be a professional athlete

Starting point is 00:17:11 and I really wanted, my goal always as a kid was to play for North Queensland Cowboys. Having grown up in North Queensland, I looked up to people like Matty Bowen, Jonathan Thurston over the years and always wanted to put on a Cowboys jumper but I was never good enough to get there. But what footy actually done for me was at the time when I was very interested in pursuing a professional career, I had a couple of really nasty injuries.

Starting point is 00:17:37 So it was a few setbacks. I actually done my knee. So I ended up doing my knee at a completely tall ACL, had a knee reconstruction, decided to go through the rehab process, a small setback, a little bit come back. And then the following season, I broke my tip and failed. So now I have 17 screws and two titanium plates in my hand. So at the age of 26, my rugby league career was all but over.

Starting point is 00:18:06 And at that time, I actually, I was almost a blessing in disguise because I really developed, I suppose, a more abundant mindset of, you know, wanting to achieve more things in life. I wanted to have financial freedom. And at the time, you know, while I was injured, I started to let my appetite in property and I learned the game of property, learned the game of finance, learned the game of abundance. And that's where, you know, coming in and listening to, you know, the people like yourself over the years and others in this space to really build

Starting point is 00:18:35 my knowledge base and let my appetite to then, you know, test the waters. And property was always a huge passion of mine. In fact, my initial goal was that I wanted to be a property developer. You know, I saw from, you know, going out and tackling the corporate world and being an entrepreneur, I really had aspirations to be a property developer. But when I looked into the world of property and the world of becoming a property developer, the first thing I noticed was that number one, you need to have cash in bank. And number two, you need to have a large asset base to leverage from. And at the time, I didn't have either. And I thought property was going to be the right vehicle to help me get to where I want to be one day, which is being a

Starting point is 00:19:13 developer. I'm not there yet, but the journey to date has led me to be not far off that as we speak. But aside from the university and the corporate experience and the real world jobs that I've had, I've also spent a lot of time in professional developments. I've invested in Bob Anderson was my mentor for a couple of years. Ben Handler was my mentor for a couple of years. I've done public speaking courses. I've done financial modeling courses. is I've probably spent outside of university an additional $50,000 or $60,000 in professional development

Starting point is 00:19:49 just investing in myself to get to a point where I now have enough value that I can offer to other people in charge of these. Yeah, I love that. And again, you're warming my heart because I'm a lot older than you are and I'm still learning everyday toys. And that's going to be a lifetime journey for me

Starting point is 00:20:09 because it keeps you sharp. there's always something you can learn from someone else and I love the the energy that you have to keep pushing you forward and I can see why you would have been a good rugby player because the patience and the persistence and the daily habits where you need to continue continuously challenge yourself against others to perform in that very competitive environment yeah I can see There's a spirit there with you that is a burning fire, Troyson, and that in itself is quite motivational and inspirational to others. But a couple of things, because you unpacked a lot that you just shared with us there, there's a couple of things I wouldn't mind honing in on if we can. You mentioned briefly that there was a couple of businesses when you sort of dived into the entrepreneurial world that didn't work.

Starting point is 00:21:02 because I you know I often find that we learn more from our challenges our problems and our issues than we do their the successes can you sort of unpack a little bit that for us what happened and and what you took away from them yeah so probably the first business that I had was more of a novelty thing it was like this was what I was passionate about at the time and I was passionate about rugby league and and I saw a need for I suppose casual rugby league attire So I spent about six months really developing a business where we would create casual rugby league attire like polo shirts, pocket shirts, casual pants, because I found that when people would go to games, you'd have the diehard rugby league fans that wear the colours, the scarves and what have you. but then you'd have probably your more subtle fans and you'd have, I suppose, more...

Starting point is 00:22:02 I felt there's the difference generally between white-collar professionals, how they support their team, and the blue-collar professionals. I found that the blue-collar families and the blue-collar supporters, they were like, we'll wear their colours, you know, and wear the heart on their sleeves sort of thing.

Starting point is 00:22:17 But whereas the white-collar professionals, they were more subtle, but they dressed nice in classy boots. William shoes and a nice casual polo shirt so I thought if I could create a product that would appear to that market I thought it would get some really good traction like really nice polo shirts like what they do over in the states you know and then you'd came for that sort of market um and have it obviously well finished uh tailored really high-end material and and at that time uh I went down a rabbit hole and as I said spent about six months in Spencer and

Starting point is 00:22:52 and i really fell over when when i got to because i was very uncreative person right and i like to think about the future and i try and bring the future and the present but i think where i lacked was then when i got to the nitty-gritty around the product itself like i saw what the product was capable of and the value proposition and it had a lack of place and it was the ideal client for but what i wasn't able to do and execute was getting the product like you know finding the suppliers going through the process of tailoring you know that the the quality of it you know figure out what's the best bottom what's the best you know cut all that sort of things where i really fell over so um i when i look back and i think about that time i probably would have been someone

Starting point is 00:23:36 that will really benefited from someone who has done that business before me you know someone that is someone who's done an apparel business or street wearable or clothing business to really lean on their knowledge to fight out well i've got an amazing idea i've conceptualized it i know i know it could potentially work but creating the product itself is where i fell over and um that was a big one yeah well i i think the good news there for me uh is that firstly uh you've got the creativity to identify the opportunity which again a lot of people don't But more importantly, because ideas are cheap, actually, you have the mental fortitude and the persistence to actually make something happen and take some action towards doing it. And that pretty much trims out 95% of people who come up with great ideas.

Starting point is 00:24:29 But I also admire the fact that you got to a point of recognizing, hey, this isn't going to work. So rather than continue to bash your head against a brick wall and get a blood nose, but also recognising the need. What I'm hearing with what you've shared with a number of your experiences so far is the need to surround yourself with people who've either done it and also can communicate it to you and are open to sharing that with you so that you can then learn from that and navigate the pathway much more effectively. So some really good learnings there, mate. and it tells me a lot about you in relation to the resilience that you bring to the table and your focus on making that happen. On a similar line to that, I just want to dive into that time when we had those injuries during rugby

Starting point is 00:25:21 because I can imagine that would be very crushing to you because you had this vision of a future playing professional rugby and everything that goes with that. to have those dreams shattered and pulled away from you very suddenly really would I imagine would have been crushing to your soul can you talk us through how you're feeling at that time and and then what was it that gave you the the ability to rise above that and and then pursue something else without that hamstringing you for the rest of your life so I've seen a lot of Aussies who all hit a wall like that and they almost fold over and give up

Starting point is 00:26:06 and then just sort of saunter through life without really taking advantage of the fantastic opportunity we enjoy in the greatest country in this planet. Can you share with us some of that? Because I think there's a lot of learnings in that as well. Yeah, well, Wushi, I was one that generally like someone who wants to pursue a professional athlete career will generally be a high school superstar.

Starting point is 00:26:33 They'd be identified by, you know, rugby league club or an AFL club, whatever their chosen sport would be. And then from there, they go into pathways and academies and generally, you know, they're in the system and play on a league level,

Starting point is 00:26:45 you know, by 20 years old. So I decided after school to put education first. So I went after school and really focused on getting my degrees. And that was my priority at the time. I played a little bit of rugby league just sort of for fun on the weekends, but that was my priority at the time.

Starting point is 00:27:05 And then when I went out and after I finished university, got a job, and I was like, oh, I want to try and give footy another crack. And by then I was sort of early 20s, 23, 24, and started playing local rugby league up in Queensland. And from there, I really took it seriously. I really focused on how I perform each week, preparation for games, getting my body right,

Starting point is 00:27:27 mentally right. and I found I was getting results on the rugby league field where individually I was performing very well. And from there, I started to capture the attention of the semi-professional rugby league clubs and those semi-professional rugby league clubs offered me opportunities to go and play for them. And meanwhile, I was doing this at the time,

Starting point is 00:27:45 just playing at local rugby league in Queensland, in a very cushy, awkward job. I was earning in excess of $120,000. Yeah, I was well-educated. I was one that probably had great aspiration too um to to do things in the corporate world as well and i did have aspirations to to to achieve things there but i i really needed to just pass the itch that i had which was you know i need to try and at least give spug league one crack and and i actually i actually put my full-time job i had

Starting point is 00:28:19 the world i relocated my family and my my wife and my my young boy from queensland to central queensland and rockhampton to pursue a rugby league career and i went from a twenty hundred twenty thousand dollar job down to working for one of our you know corporate partners that were one of the sponsors for the club that i was with which was central queensland capris and they had a partner sponsor for the endeavor foundation so i spent a couple of years working as a support worker, you know, as a disability support worker, and I really didn't have time working with a lot of people that I suppose that didn't get the same cards dealt with,

Starting point is 00:29:00 the cards dealt that we got dealt, you know, unfortunately. But that really, at the time, I suppose, when I did get my injuries, they gave me perspective, right, that the people that I worked with really gave me perspective on life to show that, hey, you know, I've got a busted knee or I've got a broken leg, but it could be much worse, right, because I didn't have to look far to see, you know, what bad cards other people had been dealt in life. And that really gave me the perspective needed to just go,

Starting point is 00:29:31 just get over it, Troy, you know, like it could be worse off. Quit crying your soup, you know. And to be honest, it was a blessing in disguise because it allowed me to focus on real estate and probably doing something that was my true purpose which was you know helping people in this space but when i think about was she you know that how i felt at the time was yeah i was shattered you know obviously i upped and moved my family i quit a job that was going really well i had big money to make this jump right and and you know you always hear these cliche stories about people you know having a crack

Starting point is 00:30:11 and and just putting themselves in a position to win and then they go on to do these great things but you know i didn't end up with the cliche story uh but you know when i think about it that's all right you know because when i think about that more deeply which i'm actually grateful that i did spend the four years doing my university degree getting my education out of the way because then i have i had something that i'm not i'm not i didn't have some that would fall back on what i had capability to then you know dig myself out of the hole that i was in whereas i find a lot of young people you know particularly those who pursue a career in sport they don't have that capability to to start a business or to to you know get a good corporate job after they

Starting point is 00:30:52 become injured or uh you had some uh some things that didn't work work out well in life so i was lucky in that sense yeah i love that mate uh it's something that i uh would also like to touch on because I've had the real privilege and pleasure of working closely with a number of Indigenous people over the years, and some of them are my best friends, mate. I worked in Central Australia and Alice Springs and Darwin for a long time. And what I really enjoyed there was that,

Starting point is 00:31:28 and I don't want to generalise here, but there is an ability of Indigenous people to see things very differently from others. There's almost a spiritual awareness and an intuition that is embedded in your psyche and your bones at a level that's way beyond anything that we see in the European descendants that now inhabit a big part of the country. I'd love for you to share how that's worked for you

Starting point is 00:32:00 and how that's distinguished what you do in relation to what you've done and what you're now doing. Yeah, when I was playing sports, it was like a six, what was it, Aberdeen Institute, something like five or six. Yeah, it was like an additional instinct, you know, where I could see things playing out before they were even ruled in real time before they happened. So that allowed me to really excel in the sporting arena

Starting point is 00:32:26 was that additional instinct that I found. But that heightened awareness, I think it's really transferable in business now as well, like the kind of business that I think is ingrained in our bones as Indigenous Australians to look for the good in people but look for the – it's a really good bullshit detector. yeah exactly well anchor detector where yeah you know we're able to to just have a i can really sense what how people feel and what their intent is uh just by engaging with them and i think that's where that additional sense or that you know built-in instinct comes from our 60 000 years ingrained in my bones it's just that's that state of consciousness yeah and it's really helped me identify wankers that that's you know really good bullshit detective that's yeah that you beautifully said mate uh you know my life partner sonia uh she's not indigenous but she she has the

Starting point is 00:33:39 same sort of quality and i find it's a very rare quality uh she she can almost by osmosis just sense the good from the bad and and within three seconds of meeting someone uh she can tell me whether they're people that are worth spending time with. Whereas I sort of, whether I've become blind to it or just not as in tune with that intuition as she is, but it's a skill and a quality that I think is underrated and has the sort of subliminal potential to mean big things. And what you're doing and what you're achieving

Starting point is 00:34:20 is a first-hand example of that choice and that there's no question about it. So I really appreciate you sharing that, mate. And I guess it's sort of allied to that to some degree. I'd love for you to share, you know, what elements of your upbringing generally across the board have had the biggest influence on who you are and who you've become? Well, I grew up in a small Indigenous community, right?

Starting point is 00:34:50 And to be honest, I believe I won the parent lottery in this indigenous community because I come from a place where 90% of the population is unemployed and is scraping the bottom of the barrel of the social and economic spectrum here in Australia. I'll suffer from abject misery and squalor. But I was one of the ones that I believe won the parent lottery because my parents were working-class, you know, where I'll probably say we're average middle-class family but just happened to be located, you know,

Starting point is 00:35:27 in a discreet Indigenous community. And that really set me up, I believe, you know, for a good life. And me, looking back at my upbringing, I had food on the table, I had a roof over my head, I had a shirt on my back. You know, on the weekends, I wasn't getting up to mischief. I was out in the boat fishing, hunting, camping. So from an upbringing point of view, like, I had a magical upbringing, you know, and being Indigenous as well, you're not only part

Starting point is 00:35:58 of your immediate family, but you're part of the community and you're part of a large extended family. So, you know, me spending a lot of time with my cousins growing up, you know, creeks and in the bush, chasing birds with shanghai. I remember all those things. And I think what that allowed me to do, that upbringing really allowed me not to have any baggage as an adult. I think I went through my teenage years and my adulthood now with no baggage, no emotional damage, no baggage that will really shape how I think and how I feel. So when I went out into the real world, I didn't have this baggage that was sort of, you know, this dark stain or really holding me back.

Starting point is 00:36:42 So I was very proactive, I looked at things optimistically and not pessimistically and I always then looked at things from a place of abundance and not from a place of scarcity because I think I grew up in a home that made me feel like I had abundance and that really had a critical role in shaping my life. But when I look back, I certainly do believe that I did in the Parrot Watery because people that have the life that I have are meant to from where I'm from.

Starting point is 00:37:20 You know, obviously the unemployment rates, the life expectancy, the health issues, you know, that's really plaguing Indigenous Australians and majority of people that I've worked with unfortunately haven't had the same trajectory that I have. But when I look back at it and reflect on it, it's because I believe I just won that Parrot Watery in my community and that's really shaped me to be that yeah i love it man i really appreciate you sharing that because you know sitting here and and and talking with you your uh energy and

Starting point is 00:37:52 vibration is very infectious and and you know that i i get to very occasionally meet people like you that that are quite magnetic uh in that context because there's a there's a burning fire inside that that he is is uh gonna ignore any external influences because you're focused on where you're heading and what you need to do to get there mate so word i love love that fire within and something else that um i'd like to sort of uh touch on briefly is because every one of us has struggles in life mate uh i still do uh by the way uh given uh everything you've done and doing is there anything at all that you that you struggle with and what is it and and how are you looking to overcome it well i think this is just the creative side of my brain bullshit yeah

Starting point is 00:38:44 you know the entrepreneurial side of my brain one of the things i really struggled and my wife hates this about me to be honest and and she's really good at at fixing this problem of mine i think it is a problem of mine which is i find it very hard to be present you know it's like i read i believe because i'm always thinking about one two years down the track three years four years thinking i need to achieve this i need to achieve that yeah i become so focused on you know the event or the outcome rather than focusing on the here and now and and you know perfect example i said oh joy you know your son is winning an award at school do you want to go and i'm like oh i totally what about that you know like i've got all these things on my on my in my

Starting point is 00:39:31 calendar of what i need to do business personal development but here i was not you know putting in this most important thing which was you know my being there for being present when my son was winning in a school-based award so i find that that's one of my biggest struggles is being present being in the here and now but you know my wife is one of those people where she is very present uh she's not a big picture thinker she is always living in the now and she's really get really reigning in it and really brings me back into the present and yeah if i've put it down to the biggest thing i struggle with is being present because she i don't know it's just maybe just the type of person i am how i'm hardwired the creative brain that i have and obviously when

Starting point is 00:40:14 you're in the game of property you're always looking towards the future or what markets are going to do how assets are going to perform so i've built in these ingrained habits i think as well and and they can often be bad habits when you have other well good and bad i think the key thing there because i because i'm listening to you you and i are very similar mate uh i'm always i used to be an architect so i'm always creating the future and always got a vision of what the future looks like and and like you my uh good wife sonja slaps me around and keeps me in the present and it's that synergy between both of you that i think creates a better whole for everyone and and your your kids are going to benefit from that because i think you actually need both i don't

Starting point is 00:40:56 think either is wrong it's just it's just you've come together and it's it's that play interplay between you that that creates a better result at the end of the day and and what a great foil uh to have someone there who's able to sort of bring you back to the here and now and so you can enjoy the journey and not always be focused on the on the destination so i love you uh sharing that mate i now want to turn to your and my favorite subject which is property and i I want to talk a bit about your property journey. So I'd be interested in starting with, you know, why did you decide to think about property

Starting point is 00:41:30 and what triggered your interest at the camp? So what initially triggered my interest was that where I grew up, right, they have a home ownership rate, Indigenous Australians have a home ownership rate of about 1% or 2%, right? and then the district Indigenous community where I grew up, 99% of the housing that is there is Department of Public Works, it is public housing, it is state and federally owned. So not a lot of people have, you know, the Australian dream of owning a home

Starting point is 00:42:07 and not a lot of people have an access or pathway to own their home as well and that's obviously a state government and federal government failure in terms of Indigenous policy and development around homeownership and the provision of housing, but that's another topic altogether. But that's where my actual interest came from, Bushy, was that I saw a need for there to be Indigenous homeownership, right, and I saw an appetite for Indigenous homeownership in Indigenous communities across Australia

Starting point is 00:42:41 because there are a lot of people that are working, a lot of families that are doing quite well, A lot of people that are basically middle-class families but living here in public housing. But there isn't a pathway to home ownership. So where my interest came from, well, someone needs to solve this problem, right? Someone needs to come up with an ecosystem or a way to – a pathway for Indigenous Australians to become homeowners

Starting point is 00:43:10 in their own discrete communities. and i remember when i spent a bit of time in the uh private equity company i was working for it was actually a subsidiary organization to one of noel pearson's companies so yeah and um he uh sooner founded cape deal partnerships yep so cape deal enterprise the indigenous private equity divisions was a subsidiary company to that but i was lucky enough to be associated with a lot of people at a policy level you know corporate level within his organization and i remember sitting one around the table and we were talking about indigenous home ownership and i was just you know part of the conversation and one of the you know big policy uh conversations that came up was

Starting point is 00:43:53 that we need more indigenous property developers you know i think if we have more indigenous property developers that could really solve the problem here because they could you know number one um identify the opportunities where they're that are prime for development number two create product and number three connect customers with the product right and what he does that and i was like damn i i don't know any indigenous property developers or uh i can't really think i've been to most indigenous communities across queensland and i know a lot of people i can't really think of anyone that is capable of even doing that and then i was like well why don't i just give it a crack yeah and that's where the initial interest came from she around real estate uh was that need

Starting point is 00:44:34 for Indigenous home ownership. And that's when I was like, well, before I even come back here and do the important work that needs to be done in Indigenous Australia, I need to go out and cut my teeth in the real world. I need to know how developers do it in the real world. So then I can transfer those skills back here and apply it into this context. And that's where that interest came from and that desire.

Starting point is 00:44:59 And that led me on, yeah, a six, seven-year path to where I am now. and the buyer's agent, you know, game that I'm in now is just part of the process of one day becoming a developer and building the expertise and the resources I need to one day solve the, you know, what's really close to my heart, which is the Indigenous ownership of that. I love that vision, mate. So let's get nitty-gritty on your personal property journey so far.

Starting point is 00:45:29 And again, it's early in the scheme of things. And I'd like you to start with, you know, what, if any, initial fears you had around purchasing property yourself and how did you overcome those? Because a lot of Australians want to get into property, but are too scared to jump off the cliff. So can you share and sort of think back to how you, what were you thinking and feeling at that time and take us through that? Yeah, my biggest fear, well, she was when I started, my journey was the unknown. you know and it was more or less around like i did i what i didn't know everything i needed to i suppose why i didn't know everything about the marketplace i didn't know everything about real estate and it was that fear of the unknown that really placed an element of doubt

Starting point is 00:46:19 in my head around you know is this even right for me should i even do this yeah is this is there high off in the end if i were to go down this path and and how i think i overcome that the fear of the unknown was that i made sure i did everything i could to control the outcome you know i i like created i cut made made calculated risks that makes sense yeah i looked at things because i heard ray dalio one day say you need to look at your investments from an asymmetrical point of do right whether whether upside needs to be degraded in the downside and basically that's what i that's how i overcome that initial doubt so having you know the fear of the unknown was just getting all the information i could about the marketplace about real estate

Starting point is 00:47:08 and then stacking those that information in my favor to then make a informed decision you know rather than make a decision from a place of uh fear doubt speculation i was making a decision from an element of facts or a place of confidence and then using the information I had. And obviously, I had some deficiencies in the information that I had. You know, a lot of data that's out there is lagging. It's old. You're listening to different people's perspectives as well.

Starting point is 00:47:37 So not all of it's right, but I took what I could at the time and try and use it to make the best decision I could. Yeah, I love the way you're sort of value stacking on the positive side rather than let the negative sort of drown you in the process, If people rely on the mainstream media, they just drown themselves in negativity and then wonder why they don't do anything. But by focusing in on people like Ray Dalio and the principles that he puts on the table around property and other allied players and getting into that mindset that enables you to say, here it is, other people have done it, I've got the confidence, let's have a go. So talk us through what your personal property journey looks like to date

Starting point is 00:48:22 in terms of the good and the bad and what you've learned from what you've done so far. Well, the good and the bad. For me, the good is that I've got three properties under the portfolio at the moment, plus the PPR. Yep. So four in total. And they've all been good in their own right, you know.

Starting point is 00:48:44 but they've all had you know some downside to them as well and from from a good perspective you know when i look back at those acquisitions that i've made um from a good perspective you know i can say they're all in really good locations right so that was really big focus of mine is getting that part of the process right which was selecting the location location does 80 percent of the heavy lifting and that was i think some of the good that came out of you know the existing properties that i have yeah some of the bad things is obviously just dealing with the day-to-day uh things of you know holding an investment property you know tenant disputes uh maintenance wear and tear unforeseen weather events that cause damage as well so

Starting point is 00:49:28 this is sort of the not so sexy side of asset ownership as well it is the bad part of owning assets but you know the upside as i said before is i think a lot better than the downside but yeah i'm not gonna certainly um you know be ignorant to the fact that there is no downside and this is you know some of the bad things that come you know having properties under your portfolio and then the ugly side is we'll see i i haven't really you know um come across the ugly just yet like with the like my own existing journey i've only been in the uh what one or two one cycle now yeah what are you investing in the last five years so i'm in the early stages of a cycle right um when my properties are located so if you ask me that question in

Starting point is 00:50:17 another 10 years i probably have a lot of money but this stage i don't well what i love about what you've just shared as well is then because i say to this to people all the time it's not a matter of if you're going to have a major issue with a property it's a matter of when that occurs and then planning for the worst and expecting the best and having contingencies in place to accommodate that when it does happen. Because as you and I both know, there's no such thing as a perfect property and there's no such thing as a stress-free, no-issue journey in property. But if we've identified that there is going to be an issue at some point, we don't know when it is, no one knows when it is, and then we've at least got fallback plans to cover us in that, whether

Starting point is 00:51:02 it'll be people resources rather than make sure then we're going in with the right expectations and and not expecting a perfect trouble free journey on the way mate so i love love you sharing that uh mate um if we uh sort of look back on your life so far uh if you were starting out again would you invest in anything differently do you think i started out again well see my my strategy bushy was that i wanted to buy well-located properties that sat under their intrinsic value that had renovation or development potential in the future yeah so gave me multiple exit strategies as well when it did come time to potentially liquidate those assets i could really i could develop them i could renovate them i could force value i could manufacture equity

Starting point is 00:51:52 and those sort of things but when i look back like the properties that i bought have all been put through that asset selection criteria right uh today but when i look back at it now i probably should have chucked in a smoky in there like a and it probably is a smoky one's probably going to be my next purchase right yeah okay one that one that isn't on one that isn't aligned doesn't have the same alignment to the ones that I already have, right? So it is a lot different in terms of strategy. This one might just be a buy and hold, right? Just pure location focus might even be negatively geared,

Starting point is 00:52:32 but it doesn't have the multiple strategies around renovation, development, just a buy and hold. I might look at throwing in a property that's just high cash flow, high yield as opposed to just that one strategy. So I think what I need to do when I think about it now is diversify my strategy, which is throw a couple of other different asset types into the portfolio and not sort of, yeah,

Starting point is 00:53:01 just have my asset focused on one particular strategy and one particular asset type. Love that. I love that, mate. That's a great segue to sort of jump into your future vision of what your ideal lifestyle looks like and what investment strategy are you going to pursue to attain and maintain this long-term.

Starting point is 00:53:20 Can you share that with us? Yeah, absolutely. So, you know, I mentioned, you know, one of the big things that I needed to do was build my capacity, really cut my teeth doing mainstream developments if I want to then take that back into doing the important work in Indigenous Australia, which is, you know, getting to Home Runge.

Starting point is 00:53:39 So that's why I acquired those properties that have that renovation development potential so I could cut my teeth on assets that I don't, right? and do that. So I feel as though those assets are well-positioned to get me to my end goal of becoming a developer or just building my capability as a developer to then go on and solve all the problems

Starting point is 00:53:59 that I want to solve in the marketplace. So those assets that I bought are aligned to what my broader vision and goal was, which was learning the game of development, cutting my teeth in development. They're not going to make me, you know, a multimillionaire or billionaire by all means, but I'm going to make money from them. No, we'll see that's for sure.

Starting point is 00:54:23 But at the same time, what I'm going to get is more for them, which is the education that will come from, you know, adding value and doing those developments that I can then use to go on and do bigger and better things. Yeah, I love it, mate. And I love that long-term vision of yours because I think there's a massive and need there in in what you've shared with us and the and the self-determination that's going to come out of that uh will be uh or inspiring in terms of what it'll do for the people who are

Starting point is 00:54:55 able to take advantage of that mate so i've got full respect and admiration for what you're doing uh it's a it's a an area that hasn't really been touched and and again like you touched on before It's a whole topic on its own, but the welfare approach of governments in particular and the fact that it's really crushed the ambition by creating generations of welfare-dependent exercise. And again, I don't want to jump into this too much, but I did a lot of work in communities up in the Territory and in Western Australia during the days that I was an architect. And I was continuously frustrated by the drip feed that governments would put into communities that would enable them to be perceived as doing something without actually doing anything to really help the people and give them the opportunity that they needed to take control of their own lives. So, mate, full respect for what you're doing in that regard. I know, having spent a bit of time with you already now, that you were just the person to make that happen

Starting point is 00:56:06 and to do it well for everyone's benefit. So I really enjoy the fact that you're happy to share that with us now, mate. So, mate, what I now want to do is switch into what I affectionately call the ambush or the bushfire lightning round, which is where I ask you four fast questions that everyone wants to learn your thoughts on. And the first of those is a personal question, really. What's your favourite song and why?

Starting point is 00:56:37 Well, I wish you had. The list is pretty big. But whenever someone asks me that, the first song that comes to mind is Neon Moon by Brooks and Dunn. um it's a country song you know uh neon and the reason why that comes to mind is because mom and dad played that routinely on a sunday afternoon when i was growing up and the reason why they played a routine on a sunday afternoon is because that's when they would do the spring clean up the house and you know the big country fan would play you know

Starting point is 00:57:12 the country music, Alan Jackson, George Strait, Dukes and Darn. Neil Moon was always a favourite of mine. And to this day, you know, it is one when I go for a run, I'm listening to Dukes and Darn, Neil Moon when I'm in the gym. I'm listening to Neil Moon when I drop my son off to school. We're blasting that song and he's singing it now as a seven-year-old. So my favourite song to date. But I do have a lot of interest in other music genres,

Starting point is 00:57:43 but country music is right up there for me. Yeah, what I love about music, Troyson, is that it takes us right back to a time and place. So I've got a song list that if I want to be in a certain mood, then I'll put those songs in because I know it's going to take me straight back then and I can feel and remember vividly what was happening and how that continues to make me feel, mate. So I love that you said that.

Starting point is 00:58:13 Next question is a bit of a different angle. What superpower do you wish you had and why? I wish I was a genius. By that I mean like I'd have the ability to solve the world's most complex problems and provide the answers to the most existential questions that men don't have answers to. So I wish that was my superpower because that's one that would benefit everybody.

Starting point is 00:58:48 Mankind would benefit the human race if someone solved humanity's problems and had the level of genius to do so. So my superpower would be that I wish I was that genius. Yeah, I love that. I mean, it's a massive responsibility that you'd have on your shoulders if you did have that ability. And if we look at the history of civilization to date,

Starting point is 00:59:13 those that have put themselves in that position have often had a pretty challenging life as a consequence. Albert Einstein, classic example of that, I guess, in that sense. So I love that. And on a similar topic, I guess, if you could have coffee or a drink with anyone, either alive or a dead historical figure, who would you choose and why, Troyson? I'd choose Jesus. Yep.

Starting point is 00:59:42 And the reason why I would is to ask those existential questions. Who is your father? Like, why this, why that? you know uh what's the bigger picture here like ask those really big existential questions because sometimes like i'm a big thinker we'll see uh i can tell you that i find myself going down these round holes of us you know looking at things from a world point of view or universal point of view not just sort of focusing on my own little bubble i like to think big as well and i think having by having sit down with Jesus will certainly be an interesting conversation

Starting point is 01:00:25 and I think one that will, yeah, fill that void, I suppose, in my mind. Yeah, yeah, I love it. That's, yeah, absolutely spot on there. The last question in this round, and you're going to get another chance in part two next week, Troyson, but what would be the title of the book that was written about you if your worst enemy wrote it? Now, I don't think you're going to have too many in these,

Starting point is 01:00:51 but if your worst enemy wrote a book about you, what would the title be? The title would be Arrogant and Had an Easy Life. And the reason why I say that, Bush, is because people, they only see what's on the outside. They don't really see what's been done behind the scenes. yeah so they see that you know i've got a nice house i've all of these properties i've got a nice car i've got a successful business but they don't realize you know the work that i've done

Starting point is 01:01:24 behind the scenes to become the person that has all those things what um i've you know what does it be do have you know i've become the person you know i've done the things i've done those things now i have those things whereas people they just want to have things without becoming the person without doing the thing, to have the thing that they desire, right? Yeah. So I think my walk would be, yeah, arrogant and had an easy life, but they wouldn't know that I've been like a duck with his feet under the water going like this, you know, paddling along.

Starting point is 01:01:58 Yeah, 100%. Smooth as anything, but, you know, underneath the water, the legs are warm like crazy. I 100% agree. You and I spoke in the green room about luck because I've had the same comment for many years uh twice and i it's all right for you bushy you're lucky you know yeah well no i'm not lucky i've worked 10 times harder than you and i continue to work 10 times harder and it's when hard work meets opportunity that that you can classify it as luck uh but uh i know

Starting point is 01:02:30 for sure and i i can tell from what you've shared with us already how hard you work and how hard you continue to work on both yourself and everything you do uh to advance that and i think you know that again that's a great inspiration to those that are listening in because it doesn't matter what circumstance you're in or what situation you find yourself in if your mindset's right your approach is right and you're prepared to do the hard work and develop the habits and the daily disciplines that are going to take you from where you are to the vision the clear vision of where you want to be and again what i love about what you've said you've got that creative spirit and that very clear vision of where you're heading becomes both the magnet and the compass that's

Starting point is 01:03:09 going to enable you to go through all the inevitable speed humps along the way to get there but it's also guiding you because every decision that you're making and as you've shared with us again today is based on well is what I'm doing now going to take me closer to or further away and where I want to end up so mate absolute gold on what you've shared I really want to thank you for taking the time to share the ins and outs of your personal journey so far and and while we're talking about it that if anyone listening in would like to ask Toyston or any other property professionals any further questions on the property approach and approach to life generally or you'd like to discuss anything we chatted about with other like-minded investors in a very safe

Starting point is 01:03:51 relaxed and no pressure environment I want to encourage you to join us on the Facebook site at the Property Hub Collective which you can click on the link in the show notes and we look forward to connecting with you and continuing the conversation there. And we now look forward to continuing our deep dive with you, Tristan, in next week's episode, where we're going to unpack the pros and cons of buying property in regional versus city locations, and regional Queensland in particular, alongside the ins and outs of buyers, agents, the good and bad. So remember to always get invested, and we look forward to talking to you again then, Tristan. Thanks for having me. We shall look forward to catching up again soon.

Starting point is 01:04:31 stay tuned for part two of this interview next episode thanks for tuning in to get invested on the property hub podcast channel your home for property investment insights and inspiration and don't leave yet until you've taken the next step towards living by design by getting my award-winning book get invested absolutely free when you sign up at knowhow property.com.au or bushymartin.com.au and finally make sure you subscribe to property hub to get your weekly dose of Get Invested Inspiration along with every episode of Realty Talk, Australia's leading property show

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Property Hub - Investment Insights & Inspiration - Get Invested: Part 1 - Troyson Bassani on regional buyers agents

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