PTI - Biggest Takeaway’s from Flagg's Debut

Episode Date: July 11, 2025

Tony Kornheiser and Pablo Torre discuss Wimbledon, Cooper Flagg’s Summer League Debut and The New York Yankees epic comeback Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hey, sports fans, the ESPN app has all of ESPN all in one place. The ESPN app is your home to thousands of live events, ESPN shows, and originals across every ESPN network and service. And now you can check if you already have ESPN Unlimited as part of your TV package for no additional calls. Visit activate.esPN.com to learn how to access your account or sign up, then start streaming in the ESPN app. It's all of ESPN all in one place. Sign up or activate now. Pardon the eruption, but I'm Pablo Torre. It is a Friday evening in the summer, Tony. What does that mean to you?

And Tony Pornheiser, firing up the grill, getting my tea time for tomorrow, hosting PTI with a backup. You know what? I think that as a compliment. That all sounds great. Three great things. I think you should. I think you should take it as a compliment.

It's my great pleasure to have you here. Welcome to PTI, boys and girls. Wilvon has the day off. I'm joined by our great friend, the host of the podcast, Pablo Tori, finds out, Mr. Pablo Tori. A little sparse on the cheers. And we begin today by serving out the week with Wimbledon in the top spot. The gentleman's semi-finals were played today. Top-seeded Yonik Sinner, beat Novak Djokovic in straight sets, as Djokovic played in apparent discomfort. Likely from a fall suffered the other day against Flavio Koboli. And second-seeded in defending champ Carlos Alcoraz lost the set. as is his fashion, but beat a game competitive Taylor Fritz and four sets winning the final set in the tie break.

Pablo, what is your reaction to these results and who do you like in the final? I like Alcaraz in the final, but I want to start with that phrase, a parent's discomfort, because I just can't help but think of Novak Djokovic as having the discomfort befitting someone who must feel like a parent when he's out there with these young guys. Tony, this was supposed to be the last dance. And it's not going to be, it seems. That's the reporting we're getting out of Wimbledon now. And the last time I saw you, we were talking about Jokovic then. The whole idea of him being here, him being the third leg of a tripod with two way younger dudes, Sinner and Alcaraz.

Right? It's unbelievable. And so I want to get to Alcaraz and what he does. He's so creative, so consistent, all of that. But to me, the headline is actually Novak Djokovic is not done yet. And I think we are watching him demand us. to stand up and applaud, as you did the last time that we talked. Yeah, yeah. I mean, the big story today is Jokovic,

and what happened to him a couple of days ago at the tail end of the match with Koboli, and when he was able, when he had that split and he looked like he was in pain coming up out of the ground, and then he served out the match, and, you know, there was a sense, well, he's superhuman, so he's, of course, going to be okay with this. But it was obvious he was in a certain amount of pain. actually in the first couple of sets to me look listless here and there. He dropped the first two sets very tamely. And then after the second set, he had treatment from a trainer in a medical timeout on the court. And he comes back and he wins the first three games of the third set, including a break.

And I think to myself, okay, he's good right now. He runs out of gas. He lost five games in a row to a superior player. It runs out of gas. And he loses a set six to four. And I'll go back to what was said at the beginning of the tournament. where Jokovic said, this may be my last best chance to get to 25 majors. Well, now at 38, and injury prone to a degree over the last couple of years, it does not

look like he's going to make it because Sinner and Al-Karaz are that good. I mean, Taylor Fritz played great today. Al-Qaraz was better. Every important point you said to yourself, I think Al-Qaraz is going to win this point. You know, I mean, you watch it for yourself. He's in a position now. to win Wimbledon three times in a row, a three-peat. If he does that, here is who he joins, Pablo.

He joins Bjorn Borg, Pete Sampras, Roger Federer, and Novak Djokovic. That's the elite level of tennis. That's the celebrity lounge. And we are in the process of seeing two guys who may be a great, they're better than Jokovic. They may be better than everybody. They may be a great rivalry for years.

But hold on the Alka-Rast thing, right? I like to imagine that lounge you just described, because historically speaking, I don't know of a better athlete than Alcaraz when it comes to the guys in that lounge. I'm curious, does this mean that you are moving him into all-time status already? Is this comfortable for you? If he wins three. Yes. If he wins three straight Wimbledons, yes, absolutely. Borg probably got into a similar age.

Yes, absolutely if he wins three straight. Yeah. All right. Let's move to another young guy. looking for all-time status. Cooper Flag had a summer league debut. I know how much you love Summer League, Tony. The top pick in the draft struggled from the floor going 0 for 5 from 3, 5 for 21. Overall, Flagg finished with 10 points, six rebounds, four assists, three steals. What he said might have been one of the worst games of his entire life. So what stood out to you about Flagg's debut there?

Okay, so let me divest myself very early on of my prejudices. Okay, I am philosophically opposed to make something out of nothing. Summer League NBA games are nothing. NFL exhibition preseason games are nothing. They're just nothing. There was nothing short of Cooper Flagg scoring 60 points that would in any way influence anything he does in his NBA career from this point.

And by the way, on the court with him are mostly guys who are not going to ever play in the NBA. This is not a real game. a workout, so we're not going to take anything from it. But I did, thank you for letting me get that off my chest. I did watch 15 to 20 minutes, and two things did stand out to me. One thing was, I'm not sure Cooper Flagg handles the ball as well as he might think he handles the ball. Even guys like this are quicker and more physical on defense,

and he's going to have to learn to protect the ball as he dribbles up the court. That's one thing. The second thing is how lithe, L-I-T-H-E, how live. how live Cooper Flag is. I mean, he soars up there. Like when he completely stretches out, he looks like a teradactyl. He's going to be very hard to guard.

Well, your last comment about the, I believe, Mesozoic era brings me back to the first thing you said about yourself, which is that you don't like making something out of nothing. I pay this as a compliment. I believe you do that better than anybody in this business, and you've been doing it for your business. whole career. So with that compliment being paid, making something out of nothing, I want to get to Summer League, right? Which I agree. Tony, I've been, I'm old enough to remember at this point,

Markell Fultz impressing me. I'm old enough to remember Ben Simmons impressing me, right? Fellow number one overall pickser, I'm like, hey, we got something. And it turns out to be, of course, the smallest, most vanishing, literally vanishing of samples. But the thing you said about Cooper Flagg not being as good at dribbling as he thinks he is, the question. to me is not, does Cooper Flag think that? It's does Jason Kidd know that? Jason Kidd's whole plan is we got the future. The future looks like seven feet tall dribbling. He wants seven foot pistol, Pete Marevich. You can get him. Cooper Flag is going to be thrown into a situation where he'll have every opportunity. Is that best for him? That's fascinating to me.

No, I agree with that. But I mean, if down the road, I mean, because I think he'll adapt, I think he'll understand the defenders, you know, and how quick they are and how strong they are. If down the road he's Kevin McAil or Tim Duncan, that worked out pretty well, wouldn't it? Let's go to baseball. And last night's Yankees Seattle game. The Yankees were down five-nothing. They'd been no hit through seven innings by Brian Wu. Jazz Chisholm single to open the eighth, and after a second hit in a sack fly, Wu came out with the score 5-1. Jin Carlos Stanton then hit a pinch hit home run to make it 5-3. The Yankees tied the game at 5-5. And the ninth, they won it. 6-5-10th on an Aron-George sackfly with a very close play at the plate.

Pablo, what's the word you would use to describe this win? Love playing this game in the A-block. Proustian. Tony, it reminds me of my childhood. This is a throwback. I am used to the Yankees feeling both rich and blessed. Lucky and good. And this season, here's a statistic.

Yankees were 0.35 all year when trailing through eight innings. Of course, over 23 when trailing by three runs or more at any point in a game this season. So it has been bad. Okay, this season has felt like, ah, beginning of it was, oh, look, postseason, let's get there. Feel confident. Now it's everything feels like a for sale sign. I don't feel attached to anything necessarily. But this game, in a microcosm of a season, is like, I just need a feeling like this

because it's been so brutal for the last two months. I know how much you like the Yankees, and I know how old you are. I'm double your age. So my word here is Yankeiness, and it's a hyphenated word. It's not a real word, but it should be. Because, Pablo, long before you were born, I watched the Yankees do this. My whole youth was spent watching the Yankees be great, watching Mantle and Berra and Ford be great,

watching Maris and Quebec and Richardson be great, you know, watching them dominate the American League, and then, because you didn't have interleague play, dominate the National League team in the World Series. Yankees won 27 World Series. The next team is the Cardinals with 11. That's domination, Holmes. This is what I saw as a kid,

and I was a Mets fan, so I hated it. They had better players and more better players than everybody else had. And not only that, but when they traded for somebody or acquired somebody, that guy got better on the spot. Reggie Jackson was great in Oakland, greater with the Yankees. Don Larson couldn't beat anybody. He was 3 and 21 one year in Baltimore. Comes to the Yankees.

Those are a perfect game in the World Series. Yankeiness, that's what it is to me. Yankeiness. This is a paleontology. You're taking me back historically farther than I can actually remember. And I think most people can actually. you put a name to any of those faces, God bless. I can't.

Most people can't. Later on, we'll talk about the Patty Duke show. Let's take a break. Coming up, the Dodgers have lost six straight. We will ask Tim Kirchon, what's wrong with them? We'll also ask him about Alex Breggman's return to the Red Hot Red Sox. You put on the pinstripes and you got better. I don't know if that's still true. But historically, the Yankees can win a game like this.

Other teams don't. Yes. They have and they can. I'm worried it's the facial hair thing. You change the rule. Now the sort of like cosmic symmetry is thrown off. I'm just worried. Pardon the interruption is brought to you by one a day.

Let's stick back into baseball with our great friend making his second appearance of the week, which could be a PTI record. ESPN MLB analyst, Mr. Tim Kirch, until let's start with this. The Dodgers are back on the field tonight. They're against the second place giants. The Dodgers have lost six straight games. What is happening there? Yeah, this is pretty bad right now.

They've been outscored 43 to 10 during those six games. And against the Brewers, who are pretty good, by the way, the Dodgers went one for an 18 with runners in scoring position. So all sorts of things are going wrong. But the biggest thing is, and no sympathy required, but they've had 15 pitchers on the disabled list, including three fists of their starting rotation. And now Max Muncie, who's been one of their hottest hitters, he's on the injured list also, and yet the Dodgers are still five games ahead in a pretty good division.

So once they get healthy, I have every faith in them that they will be the best team in baseball going into October. But right now they've got to get healthy first, and they've got to start to get some hits with runners in scoring position. So Tim, the Dodgers losing six in the first. in a row. The Red Sox winning seven in a row. Alex Breggman coming back. He had that left quad, excuse me, the right quad injury. He could walk on that quad after the season. Do you think the Red Sox might let that happen, letting Breggman go? Well, he can opt out of the contract.

Scott Boris is his agent, so that is always a possibility. But I don't see them trading him for fear of that opt-out because, as you said, they've won seven games in a row. They're back in the wildcard race. They're back in the division race. Suddenly, they look like a dangerous team. So I think the most likely thing is, if he opts out, the Red Sox will try to resign him after the season. He really likes it there. They really like him there. It's a perfect fit in a lot of ways, but that contract is such that he can get out after a year, and he very well might. But I think the really want to keep him long term. I want to talk about youth for a second here, Tim.

The arms in particular, Jacob Mizorowski, was great against the Dodgers this week. Paul Skeens due back on the mound tonight. How enthusiastic do you allow yourself to get about these young arms, knowing, of course, the arm issues that so many of these guys out of having? Yeah, it's discouraging. It's almost inevitable that every really good young pitcher that we see eventually is going to have a major arm injury. As we've said, there are three leagues in the major leagues, the AL, the NL, and the IL, and that's not going to change anytime soon.

So I'm just going to enjoy it while these guys are healthy. Paul Skeens has made 42 starts and has a 1.95 ERA. That is historically low. Jacob Mizorowski has been ridiculously good. His first 11 in the big leagues, he didn't allow a hit. So let's just watch these guys enjoy them with the understanding that someday, like all pitchers, with the max effort they have on every pitch they throw, eventually they're going to get hurt. I will just refer back to something you said a couple of minutes ago that the Dodgers have 15 pitchers, you said.

15 pitchers hurt. I mean, that's remarkable. We will get you out of here on this. The Major League draft is this Sunday. Now, baseball draftees, they have a longer gestation period than NBA draftees or NFL draftees. But are there any names we should know, and I'm pretty particularly interested in this because my staggering, stumbling Washington Nationals, I believe, have the first overall pick. Right. The guy I think you should keep an eye on is Ethan Holliday, who, of course, is the brother of Jackson Holiday, the lead-off hitter for the Orioles, and the son of Matt Holliday, who was a really good player for a long time in the big leagues. Ethan is a high school shortstop. He has the highest ceiling from almost everyone I talked to, in this draft. There's a chance someday he's going to be a 35 to 40 home run guy. And even though

people think someday he might have to move to a corner position, third base or first base, he's a shortstop right now. And, you know, range is minimized in the big leagues now. Positioning is done by the data more than anything else. I think he's going to stay a shortstop for a while. And the nationals have been known over the years, at least when Mike Rizzo was there, to go with the highest ceiling with the number one pick. I'll be curious at Sunday. Let's take one last break. Oh, I'm sorry.

Thank you. Tim is here so often. I didn't feel I'd even have to thank him anymore. Thank you, Tim. God, how rude. How rude. Yeah. Yeah.

Let's take one last break. Still to come, A's reliever Mason Miller sets a new mark for fastest pitch of the season. And should people have a problem with 59-year-old billionaire Bill Ackman and getting into a pro doubles draw. What exactly would the problem be?

He can buy the tournament. What is, come on now. Well, the sanctity of a pro doubles tournament is walking. Happy time, people. Happy 27th birthday tomorrow, Shay Gilgius Alexander. The Canada native was drafted 11th overall by the Charlotte Hornets in 2018 out of Kentucky. The Hornets traded him to the Clippers on draft night.

Gilgis Alexander played one season with the Clippers, averaging nearly 11 points a game. The Clippers then traded him to Oklahoma City as part of a move to acquire Paul George. How do you like that deal now? Gilgis Alexander is the MVP of the league and he's holding the championship trophy. By the way, that trade didn't just send Gilgis Alexander

to the Thunder. It also sent a draft pick that turned out to be Jalen Williams. And Paul George isn't even on the Clippers anymore. He's in Philadelphia. Yeah, this is the trade that defined this NBA season. the question of his that's going to define every NBA season for the next like 10 years. Steve Bomber wanted Kauai Leonard so badly that he would give up anything to get the guy that Kauai Leonard wanted to get, you know, in the deal for him.

Sam Presti, the Fender GM just made out with one of the greatest halls in the history of sports. 100%. Happy anniversary, Babe Ruth. On this day, 111 years ago, George Herman Ruth made his major league debut as a 19-year-old pitcher for the Boston Red Sox. Ruth pitched seven innings to earn the win as Boston beat Cleveland four to three. Days earlier, the Red Sox had acquired Ruth from the minor league Baltimore Orioles. The Orioles offered to send Ruth to the Philadelphia A's and the Cincinnati Reds with both teams to climb.

Ruth spent the first five years of his career primarily as a pitcher. Years later, after being traded to the Yankees, Ruth became a full-time hitter and the greatest hitter baseball had ever seen. I'm surprised Paul George wasn't involved in this deal also. You know, Babe Ruth, we've talked about recently because of Otani. Is Otani better in terms of the two-way thing? Here's what Ruth is unquestionably historical at still. He is the first, Tony, I believe, celebrity athlete in American history.

Do I have that right? Just the level of fame? The way that he sort of set the template for every future athlete is still remarkable to contemplate in retrospect. Yes. Happy trails to last night's game for the Braves. Atlanta fell to the Athletics. in 11 as Tyler Soderstrom knocked in the winning run with a walk-off single.

Earlier in the game in the ninth, A's reliever Mason Miller through the fastest recorded pitch of the season, striking out Sean Murphy on a fastball clocked at 104.1 miles per hour. He also threw two pitches at top 103. The fastest pitch ever recorded in baseball history is 105.8 thrown by Robles Chapman of the Reds against the Padres back in 2010. So I asked Tom House, who is the foremost expert on throwing things in the world at this point, Max Felocity for a pitcher. He says on my show, 118 miles an hour. He sees that being the ceiling, and he thinks that we're not that far off from 118 miles an hour. That would be an incredible,

incredible thing to see. From 60 feet, six inches? Coming in at 118? Really? That's like a jet plane. Get out of here. That's too much. Let's go to the big, finish. Yankee starter, Max Fried, will not pitch in the All-Star game and will be replaced by teammate Carlos Rodan. Is that okay with you? You know, again, Rodin doesn't make me feel confident when he pitches, but he has a pretty good season, which is also the story of this Yankee season. The Mariners faced Herrick Scoobel and the Tigers tonight. What do you expect? I expect Scooble to pitch great. I mean, every time I've seen this guy, he's pitched great, so I expect it again. Andy Rodden has a problem with 59-year-old billionaire Bill Atman,

getting a wild card into a pro doubles tournament to you. I agree with Roddick. It's the most ridiculous thing in maybe professional tennis history. I'm also glad for the content. The video, it's the opposite of Rudy. Whatever you think the opposite of Rudy is, it's Bill Ackman. Inter-Miammy, meanwhile, host Nashville SC tomorrow night. He's smelling another two-gold game for Leo Messi.

Okay, so he's had four in a row. Why would anyone think it's going to stop now? I don't. Last one, the final participant in the home run derby in the field will be Jazz Chisholm and the Yankees to see a good selection. Yeah, sure. I mean, look, you know I'm a partisan on this subject, but I am going to be most interested in Big Dumper. I want Big Dumber on my television, Tony. Will Bond doesn't like the Home Run Derby.

I like it a lot. We're out of time. We're trying to better than next time. I'm Tony Corrin. Hi, sir. And I'm Pablo Torre. Thank you for watching. Pablo Torre finds out is my show.

It's a podcast. It's on the Internet. Tony knows about it. But now... You have a podcast, too?