PTI - Knicks Coaching Drama Continues

Episode Date: June 11, 2025

Michael Wilbon and Tony Kornheiser discuss the NBA Finals, the New York Knicks, and Scottie Scheffler. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hey, sports fans, the ESPN app has all of ESPN all in one place. The ESPN app is your home to thousands of live events, ESPN shows, and originals across every ESPN network and service. And now you can check if you already have ESPN Unlimited as part of your TV package for no additional calls. Visit activate.esPN.com to learn how to access your account or sign up, then start streaming in the ESPN app. It's all of ESPN all in one place. Sign up or activate now. Pardon the interruption, but I'm Mike Wilbon. It's National Jacques Cousteau Day, Tony. Are you an ocean guy?

I'm Tony Kornheiser. Oh, yeah. I love to be gasping for air around things that are trying to eat me. Sure. Love the ocean. Okay. No. Let's have full disclosure.

You live partially at the ocean. What are you talking about? Yeah, I like to look at the ocean. I don't like to be in the ocean. I hear you on that. Welcome to PTI, boys and girls. In today's episode, the Knicks get shut down by three teams. The U.S. men get drubbed by Switzerland,

and Brandl Chambley joins us for five good minutes. But we begin today with tonight's game three of the NBA finals. The series has moved to Indiana. The first two games of the series were dominated through three quarters by Oklahoma City. In game one, Indiana bounced back and won on a dramatic shot by Tyrese Halliburton. In game two, Oklahoma City did not take its foot off the gas. Wilbon, do you expect the Pacers to win game three at home? Yeah, Tony, I think I do.

And people have to understand, and they don't, because they are now tied a couple of generations worth to meaningless numbers, and they don't look at the ebb and flow of athletic competition. And it goes back and forth, and sometimes their wild swings back and forth. You can go back to Wilt and Russell, and even their series didn't always swing wildly,

because Russell won them. But then Bird and Magic, and there were series where Michael Jordan would win the series, but up 3-0 against Seattle, they would give up two. And you'd have this all the time

in a series of games, in all the sports. And basketball is even more notable, I think, and it's easy to achieve because so few people control the action, Mr. Halliburton. I believe he will bounce back.

I believe his coach Rick Carlisle, who has been like a wizard, will help him bounce back. I believe human nature will lead Oklahoma City to in some ways say, you know, we got this tonight except you don't exactly have it just yet. And I think all of that will wind up with some close and probably crazy dramatic

pace for victory at home. I just, I think that, yes, that's what I think I think. We disagree. I do not think Indiana will win tonight. And I somehow find myself believing that game three, is going to be a critical game in this series.

I've watched Oklahoma City basically dismantle Indiana through 36 minutes of game one and through 36 minutes of game two. And I give Indiana all the credit in the world for winning game one. But Mike, what I've seen indicates to me that Oklahoma City has figured out Indiana more than Indiana has figured out Oklahoma City.

And I could be wrong about this. I could be. but I think that Indiana derives and starts with, derives everything and starts with Halliburton all the time. And he was held to 13 shots in game two. And Pascal Seacom was held to 11 shots in game two by the best defense in the league. They have to shoot more. They have to score more. Going into this series, they had averaged 29 shots between them.

I don't think that's a meaningless statistic, nor do I think this one is. Halliburton had this fantastic ratio of nine to one assists to turnovers in the playoffs until Oklahoma City. Now in these two games, he's got 12 assists and eight turnovers. That's one and a half to one. So again, I hope I'm wrong, but I think Oklahoma City has figured them out. I do. Tony, Tony, I don't disagree with you in the main. I'm not picking the Pacers to win the series.

I still have OKC winning a series. But tonight, and by the way, I know, that Halliburton reportedly has some lower leg. I don't want to hear that. On the anniversary of the flu game, I don't want to hear about a lower leg. Everybody's got something this time of year. I expect Halliburton will be great,

whether they win or not. I think he will bounce back. Tom Thibodeo is starting to look like a difficult man to replace. Mark Stein and Shams, among others, are reporting that the Mavericks have turned down the next request to talk to Jason Kidd. and Shams reports that the Rockets have done the same with Ime Udoka and the T-Wools with Chris Finch. Tell him what word would you use to describe the Knicks search for a new head coach?

I would use the word arrogant. How dare the Knicks be arrogant enough to just think they can swoop in and get a coach who is, hello, employed somewhere else? What do Udocha and Kid and Finch have in common? they're employed by other teams, playoff teams. They're paid by other owners. So the Knicks feel what? Like we're New York and we're big and we're great

and so you're going to want to work for us and why do we have to pay attention to rules? I don't think it works that way. This is sort of unbelievable to me, Mike. And as you know, I grew up a Knicks fan. But this is a team that won a championship for the last time 62 years ago. And they think that their name is such a big deal that everyone wants to coach there.

Well, not everyone, Jay Wright didn't want to coach there. Mike, I think if they get one of these three guys and one of these three guys wants them, going to have to do it by trade. And this, you know, they're not going to swoop in like a pack of birds. And this leads me to the thing I've said for the last two days about this story. Okay? Why would you want to go work for Dolan? Why?

He just fired a guy who took his team. to the conference finals for the first time in like over 20 years. And why would you work for a guy like Leon Rose who just let his former client go down the drain? By the way, I love it that you made it 62 years, but it's been 52. I'm sure your friend Clyde Fraser, who often watches us, is saying, Tony, you were there.

Don't make it 62's long enough. It feels like 62. I'm sure it does. It's like 62, I wish. I'm not going to disagree with you on any of that. And as a matter of fact, I'm going to applaud you because your depiction of New York arrogance, I know it's confined to this one thing. That's the way most of us feel about New Yorkers all the damn time.

They're so arrogant, they look at the world and say, well, yeah, you just want to be here. Yeah, that's what I think of you people all of my life, and it is more than 60 years. But I was so well done by you. I'd hug you if I was there. I got nothing to add to that. Because I think you slayed that just now. You killed it. Golf clap for the U.S. Open.

You're right. Thank you. And they got to go to Plan B. You know they had a Plan B. They do. You know they got some Plan B. They do. Of course.

Let's turn to baseball and the intriguing possibility that Paul Skeens of Pittsburgh could win the National League Saw Young with a losing record. Skeens is 4 and 6 at the moment, but his ERA is 1-88, second in the National League to Coddai, Sena of the Mets and Skeens has the top whip and the top batting average against. Wilbon,

could you see Skeens winning the side with a losing record? Yeah, yeah. Because over the last 20 years, Tony, as you and I have agonizingly talked about on this here show, we were writing columns about it slightly before that. People have won the side with like 11 and 10 and 13 and 10. The voters today, just like the two generations I tried to rip earlier in this show already, of people who are upset with certain numbers. Well, one of them is not winning and losing. The voters today, they're not our age overwhelmingly. There might be a handful of people left.

Winning and losing is secondary to them. They are impressed with numbers that show other things. We were impressed. I've always been impressed with earn and run average. Not as much as winning the damn game. And they're impressed with war and they're impressed with whip and they're impressed with things that were not used to judge Sandy Kofax.

and Bob Gibson. And those are the things I care about. But I don't vote. They vote now. I used to. And yeah, so yes, the answer is, I believe now somebody's going to go 12 and 12. And Skeens is great. He deserves everything he gets.

His team doesn't even try to come in with offensive players or change the philosophy. He's in purgatory. But yeah, a team with a losing, a guy with a losing record is going to win his side. It's going to happen. This is where being as old. as we are, doesn't really help us. Because the Cy Young now is not the Cy Young then. And by then, I mean that period of time where pitchers always went nine and everybody won 20. In 1978, four guys in the American League won 20 or more games. Okay? So it was Jim Palmer, Ron Guidry,

Mike Caldwell, and Dennis Eckersley. The last time two people in the majors won, just two, won 20 games was 2019. Mike, last year, nobody won 20 games. Tarek school bowl, great pitcher, Chris Sale, they won 18 games, and they each won a sigh as a result. I'll give you this one number on schemes, because I agree with you. Eventually, it's going to go to somebody.

First of all, his team stinks. The Pirates don't hit. They score the second-leased runs in all of the majors. In his last eight starts, Mike, he's given up nine runs in 53 innings, and his record is one and four. So what's he supposed to do? What's he supposed to do?

Let's take a break. Coming up, the U.S. Open T's off tomorrow at Oakmont. Should we expect more of the same out of Scotty Schaeffler? We're going to ask Randall Schambly of the Golf Channel. Speaking of Pittsburgh, we're also asking why Rory has struggled so much after losing his touch with the driver. Don't fire up the pirates as they come to Riggly for four games starting them. I don't do that. I'm just saying.

But he's going to go skiing. We're going to go bury bonds. He's going to bail. We're the last people on earth who believe in Ws. Nobody cares about W. A PTI investigation has revealed that the U.S. Open tees off tomorrow at Oakmont in western Pennsylvania, which is where we find Golf Channel studio analyst, Mr. Brando Schambly. Brandon, let's start with this.

Oakmont is so hard, and it is deliberately hard. Over the last nine U.S. opens, they are only 27 players in 20. total, finished under par. How does it look this time to you? And are you a fan of restoring the challenges of punishing U.S. opens that you get at Oakmont? Yeah, I think this might be the most pugnacious Oakmont that we've ever seen. You could go back to 2007 when it played firm and fast. But even when I go back and look at the video there, the rough here looks like it's denser, meaner, and more brutal. So, you know, if this thing dries out, I've heard some people talk about winning scores of, it sounds crazy, but I've heard people talking about winning scores of

double digits over par. I don't think it'd be that bad, but if you want to see 20 underpar, you better turn the channel. And yes, of course, there should be some restoration to keep the punch into these golf courses. This course was built on the legacy of being pugnacious. You don't want this place sort of coddling players. And, you know, when I came out on tour eons ago, every golfer kind of looked like me, you know, they were five foot nine, about 155 pounds. Now they all look like speed swimmers. There's. There's 6-3, 185, and they hit the ball, you know, forever. So you want some punch to the golf course, and Gil Hans did the restoration, and I think

they've done it. One of those guys you could be describing is Scotty Schaeffler, and Tony and I play this game over the decades of who's usually associated with Tiger, who you got, Tiger or the field, and now it's become who you got Scotty or the field. Brando, I'm taking the field still. Am I wrong? Does Schephler's game set up that well for all? Well, you know, Tiger, even at his best won about 40% of the time, mind-boggling figures, because

3% will get you in the Hall of Fame. But the field was always the better bet. So, yes, the field's the better bet this week against Scotty Schaeffler. Having said that, last time I looked at the odds, they were a little better than 3 to 1. They were approaching 2 to 1, which is certainly Tiger Woods territory. But I think the question is, which five guys would you put in a bucket as an aggregate to challenge Scotty Sheffler? I think this could be Scotty Sheffler's 2000 U.S. Open Week. He could win by 10, 12, 15 shots. He's sneaking up on that.

The last few tournaments, he's won by 80s, one by five. You know, he's winning by multiple shots, and he's not exactly played his best. So the field's a better bet, but I wouldn't bet on any group of five players in the aggregate to beat Scottie Sheffler this week. Let's move to another big name who's involved in his own little drama right now,

and that would be Rory and his driver and the struggles with it. I mean, he won, he won, he won, and then the driver is like he's, you know, some weekend player. Randall, what's going on with that? And do you expect him to get it fixed by tomorrow? Yeah, I mean, we talk about how poorly Roy's been driving.

And imagine if Steph Curry played four or five games and couldn't make a three. Well, he dribbles well. He does everything else well. We did to make a three. It sort of sets everything up. And it sets everything up for Rory. Rory's immensely talented in every other aspect of the game.

But he's driven the ball. just atrociously, and it's mind-boggling because he drove the ball so beautifully at Augusta National. And there's been people saying wrongly, but nonetheless saying that he's the best driver of the golf ball over the last three or four years. That's not right. It's Scotty. But Rory's certainly one of the best. And it sets up his whole game. But he's just been driving it. He's been hitting around 40% of the fairways, making big numbers. But to me, it's not so much the form that's off as, to me, it's the focus. If you've heard what Rory's been saying in the media center about how it's hard to go out, practice three or four hours, that he doesn't have any clear goals to sort of aim at over the next

three or four years. I was saying last night on the show, and look, Rory's everybody's favorite interview, he's loads of people's favorite golfer. I certainly love him. But if you're a coach and you had a quarterback saying that kind of stuff, you'd bench him. You're like, you know, you've got no direction. And, you know, you're going to let the team down without that kind of focus. So I understand it. You know, if it were me, yeah, I'd want to take a victory lap for a year maybe. I don't know. But we don't tune into sports to watch people do normal things. We We tune in to sports to have our minds blown. And we have a guy in Rory, who I was joking, he was put on this earth like Michelangelo was

put on this earth to carve stone. Rory was put on this earth to play golf. He's the most mind-blowing, gorgeous, lyrical golfer that we've seen in the last 20-30 years outside of Tiger Woods. And to see him fall off this precipitously, it's tough to get your arms around. We'll get you out of here on this. I mean, Mike and I feel the same way about Rory. I mean, we thought once you win the Masters, you're going to win six or eight more majors, like they're just going to roll out to you, and it hasn't worked.

But I will say this, eight of the nine winners at the U.S. Open at Oakmont. Eight of the nine are multiple major winners. That's impressive. What does it take? You've been there. You've probably played Oakmont. What does it take to win at this golf course? Yeah, everything is what it takes.

So, you know, everybody loves Augusta Nash. for the rolling fairways and the difficulty of the greens. So if you imagine Augusta National with 30-yard-wide fairways and 5-inch rough protecting the holes, that's kind of what you have here because it's difficult to find another golf course with as much roll in the fairways,

with as much undulation and speed on the greens. But you add more difficult bunkers here, more difficult rough, and that's kind of where you're at. So it's asking you for the hardest thing to do in golf, long and straight shots, and then high and soft iron shots. And then to keep your wits about you when you're facing oblivion, because bunkers, you know, shots are going to roll up under these lips of bunkers. Guys are going to get in these ditches out here, which are everywhere,

and they've got 18-inch fescue in it. So you're going to have to keep your wits about you. Dustin made one double bogey en route to winning here in 16. On-heel didn't make one. To trespass around this place without making big numbers is exceedingly difficult. You've got to be great, but you've got to keep your wits about you. Randall, great pleasure. Thank you so much. Thank you so much. Appreciate it. A real pleasure talking to you both. Congratulations on a long, awesome career. Michael, I hope I see you back in Scottsdale. Tony, you should get there. It's a beautiful spot.

Amen. You can catch more of Randall on Golf Channel's Golf Central Live from the U.S. Open starting at 7 Eastern. We'll take one last break, but still to come, Show Hay's timeline for getting back on the mound. Could be moving up, Wilbon. And what does the U.S. men dismal loss to Switzerland last night mean for the team's future? You don't believe me when I tell you how great it is here, but you'll believe, Brando, hopefully. Come on out. I do. I've been there. I've been there. I just haven't had corn chowder and fills like you were talking about.

Big Finish is brought to you by Stable. Keep your engines healthy. Start with Stable. Happy time, people. Happy 66th birthday, Mike Davis. Who? Mike Davis, the former outfielder for the Oakland A's and Los Angeles Dodgers. Davis played 10 seasons, hit 259 with 91 homers.

But that's not why we are saluting him. We're saluting Davis because in game one of the 1988 World Series, with the Dodgers down one run in the bottom of the ninth, Davis went in as a pinch hitter and drew a two-out walk from Dennis Eckersley. Then he stole second. That doesn't matter. What matters is that the walk prolonged the inning so that Kirk Gibson could hit one of the most famous home runs in World Series history. The I don't believe what I just saw walk off home run.

One of us got on a plane and left the Seoul Olympics and flew to L.A. to watch those games in person, while the other one of us went with his pals on vacation to China. Wasn't it even in the United States when the rest of us couldn't believe what we just saw? Wonder if people want to match up that description of who's who? One of us is smarter than the other one of us. Happy anniversary. Cleveland baseball on this day 16 years ago. Cleveland beat Kansas City on an assist from a seagull. When a single dissenter by Shinsu Chu deflected off the bird,

got past Royals outfield and Coco Chris for the winning run in the bottom of the 10th. It became a wing-assisted walk-off of sorts. Crew Chief Mike Riley explained that a ball hitting a bird is in play wherever it lands. In 1983, Dave Winfield threw a ball. that killed a seagull in Toronto. An exhibition game in 2001, Randy Johnson threw a pitch that killed a dove. Birds are drawn to baseball fields because there's shelter in the rafters and snack scraps and insects on the field to eat. Now you got me thinking all sorts of bad thoughts about birds.

Remember those doves at the Sol Olympics at the opening ceremonies and what happened? Didn't work out well for them. Didn't work out well. Now, I remember that. Happy trails to last night's game for the U.S. Men's Ns Nets national soccer team. Switzerland scored four times in the first 40 minutes of last night's friendly in Nashville, and that's all it needed, as the U.S. didn't even record a shot on target. Fans booed as the U.S. lost its fourth straight home game for the first time since 1988. It should be noted that the U.S. was fielding what amounted to a C squad against Switzerland's A team,

but that's also part of the problem. The country's top players need to gel with just one year until the start of the World Cup, and now just days until Sunday start of the Gold Cup. Anxiety is running high, Tony, in your favorite of all sports communities, the soccer community, over our chances next summer, just saying. We'll see, we'll see.

Let's go to the big finish. Aaron Judge, hit a 469-foot home run in a win at Royal Stadium last night. Are you impressed? No, I'm impressed by Aaron Judge of the million things he does, these stupid numbers on home runs aren't part of that. Shohei threw 44 pitches over three simulated innings yesterday.

Is that significant? Significant because it gets them closer to pitching, but his manager said he's not pitching before the All-Star game. Stop it. Kevin Durant's business partner in the Suns were reportedly running through possible trade scenarios. Your thoughts? Rocket spurs, heat, T-Wolves, Nicks. They're all sported in the conversation.

Houston? Kind of like that. Robbie Ray of the Giants can join. Join Max Fried at 9-1 tonight. Do you like his chances? Yeah, he's playing the Colorado Rockies. They're no good. Last one, the Oilers, have not yet decided

whether to start Stuart Skinner or backup. Calvin Pickard, choose for them. Skinner. He was pulled after allowing five goals in game three. I'm putting Skinner back in there. Boers can win this game. We are out of time. We'll try and do better the next time.

Brian Wilson, rest in peace. I'm Mike Wilbach. Same time tomorrow on Knuckleheads. you can get the podcast on the ESPN app or Apple Podcasts. And now. BTII.