Puck Soup - As The Leafs Blow

Episode Date: June 2, 2021

The boys do a postmortem on (yet another) Toronto Maple Leafs playoffs disaster. Plus, Stanley Cup vibe check, discussing which coaches will end up where, Seth Jones will test free agency, the draft lottery and a thorough discussion on the best and worst of trail mix. Sponsored by Keeps and Brooklinen!

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That's C-A-R-G-U-R-U-S dot CA. Cargooros.ca. Sticks and hits and goals and saves and slapshots and goons. We've got sportly commentary to whatever you commute. We also cover movies, TV shows, it's in tunes. It's your weekly bowl of hockey and nonsense. Part two. I'm Greg Wichenski from ESPN, the worldwide leader and never again falling for the ruse

that are the Toronto Maple Leafs potentially winning the Stanley Cup. I'm Ryan Lambert from the Vailed Prophet Society's Queen of Loving Beauty pageant 1999. Sean McAnew from The Athletic. I didn't get Greg's joke. I've been pretty busy lately, so I've got to be honest, I'm a few games behind, but I've got them all T-vote. So no spoilers, please? Obviously, obviously.

Thanks. All right. I don't want to do the whole show on the Leafs, but... Yeah, neither do I. So... Like, I don't think you've done... As of this podcast, have you done the... Have you done a podcast on this yet?

No. No, I'll do. We'll record the other show tomorrow. Okay. So, how are you feeling about things? I mean, it's a disappointing result. But it wasn't one that was super difficult to see coming. I mean, we basically, we talked it through at some level on this show last week.

On my other show, I literally went game by game on the Thursday morning and predicted exactly how the series might play out. So it's always very strange when something like this happens for certain teams in the sports world, the Leafs certainly being one of them, because it feels like everyone is trying to straddle the line between this is a utterly shocking. result that nobody could have foreseen, but also we all knew this was going to happen. And it leads to some weird coverage and weird takes. But no, it's, look, they were up in the series and they were the better team on paper,

and they should have won, and they didn't. And now we wait and see how it all plays out. The thing that I hated about it the most, besides, you know, obviously being wrong, is the exact thing that you just said. which is that game 7 in particular had this tedious inevitability to it the first period was them trying not to make a mistake and then they made a mistake

and then Gallagher put it in the net and from that point on I mean you could have just ended the game like it just felt so inevitable that they were going to blow it it just was depressing yeah and that first goal sucked too it was fucking horrible Yep. It wasn't good.

Like, the turnover wasn't good. And then Campbell, I mean, I don't think it's the worst goal Campbell's ever given up, as he tried to say in his post game. But, like, it was pretty fucking bad. And I mean, yeah, the thing with that turnover is, it's a turnover that happens six million times per game. Guy turns it over entering the offensive zone. It happens all the time. But because of the result, now we have to trade Mitch Marner, who sucks. So, okay.

All right. All right, well, let's get to it then, Sean. I mean, I don't think that you've, you said your post-mortem was your premortem, basically, on the athletic. It wasn't very thinly disguised. I wrote my post-game, game seven on Sunday, and it ran on Monday, and I've still got people tweeting at me or text. Yeah, are you surprised? Yeah, man, never, never saw it come. in a million years.

What's your, so what's your diagnosis, doctor? Like, what do you do if you're, if you're the Leafs at this point? I mean, I think you probably didn't intend it that way, but I think that's, you just asked two separate questions, which is what's the diagnosis and then what do you do? I don't know what the diagnosis is because I'm not there. The Kyle Dubas and Sheldon Keith and Brandon Shanahan have got a lot more information at their fingertips about this stuff. People like me can sit on the outside and go,

geez, they look tight, they look like they quit, they look like they weren't ready. We don't know that. Hopefully the people making the decisions do. Look, I mean, it is a bad loss on its own, and certainly in the context of what has and hasn't happened over the last few years. There's no denying that.

It's also a loss in a series where the Leafs outscored, Montreal, outplayed them for most of the series, lost one of their best and most important players a few minutes into the series, lost arguably their most important defensemen, if not probably their second most important for the last half of the series. And were one shot away twice in overtime from ending the series. And if that happens, either of them, it's a completely different discussion. I mean, I won't say who were aware, but I had somebody messaged me after game four, and they said, hey, if the Leafs close it out in game five, and it was an if, but they said,

if the Leafs close it in game five, would you be interested in taking part in this thing where we're going to debate, like, is this the best Leafs team of the modern era? Like, since the Cup, is this now the best Leafs team? and my answer was, go to hell, do not contact me until the series is over. What are you even doing?

But, but I mean, that's where, like, if Alex Galchania doesn't make one of the worst turnovers I've ever seen in overtime in game five, the Leafs keep it in the zone and score right there. That's the discussion we're having about this team versus right now where it's like, do you have to blow the whole thing sky high? I think there's at least a case to be made

that the diagnosis is it's a good team. This is an NHL where, you know, hey, bad teams win sometimes, good teams lose sometimes. Being the better team doesn't necessarily always mean. Sometimes the coin just comes up on the wrong side and it even happens a few times in a row. And that's all it is. And you stay the course. You follow the lesson of the two years ago Lightning or the 2011 Bruins or the 2010 Capitals and you stay the course. that that would be a potential answer to the question of what's a diagnosis as far as what do you do

I don't know how you can sell that at this point I just don't know and and you know we're recording this it's early afternoon on whatever day it is today later today Shanahan and and Dubas and everyone are speaking maybe they will maybe that will be the message they'll try to sell and we'll we'll see maybe they'll have some success with it I just don't see how you can like I I really feel like this is one of those things where maybe, even if the diagnosis is there's nothing seriously wrong, you still have to take action as if there is because I just, I don't know how you come back with the same core and have them play through a season, which is going to be completely meaningless, and then go into the playoffs again, knowing everybody is just staring

at you, waiting for it to happen again. Is your, so when you say you want to change things, does that, mean break up the core or does that mean like I was talking to somebody last night who wanted to fire dubus and keef and hand the keys to Jim Rutherford like where do you fall on that that's that seems talking to Steve Simmons over here yeah no I'm assuming that's you message Sean about the best Leafs team ever with Steve Simmons obviously that was he and I we chat a lot and he's he's super positive old buddy's going He keeps me up.

I wouldn't fire Kyle Dubas. I don't think fire Sheldon Keith, although let's be honest. Let's pause on that. Yeah, let's pause on that for a second. Because he... Covered himself in glory the last couple years. I don't think that. No, but he did.

The one thing he did that I can't get past is that he really worked hard to make this, the defensive team that they were in the regular season and that they were in the playoffs. Like, he figured out how to get him to play D. And you can't short sell that. Well, you can. Because some very stupid people are pushing this take that the reason the Leafs lost is that this is a team that tries to beat you six to five. And they don't understand that you need to prevent goals in the playoffs, which is just an unfathomably, like, when you read takes like that. And we had one on the athletic,

and it was Pierre did, did one of these where they talked to anonymous executives. Yeah, we talked to anonymous executives thing. And like I said, the only thing I learned from that is that it is absolutely true that these guys had blinders on and did not watch a single minute of outside their divisions. Not only didn't even look at, I'm not even talking, when I say stats, I don't mean look at the analytics. Look at the stat. The Toronto Maple Leafs, put aside the season in the playoffs of 16 teams,

the Toronto Maple Leafs gave up two goals a game against the Canadians in seven games. There is only one team in the playoffs, alive or otherwise, that has given up less than that, and that's Colorado. Everybody else has given up more goals than the Leafs did. Now, it doesn't. So back to Keefe. But yeah, it's the idea that they're trying to win six to five is anyone who tells you that, tune them out immediately. They don't know what they're talking about. Let's say maybe they did try to win six to five, and they just couldn't put the

puck in the net. Like, that's the only explanation, right? Like, the reason they lost the series, and again, they outscored Montreal in the series. The reason they lost is they couldn't get goals from their top guys. And... But it's not like they lost five to two because they weren't right. No, yes. You know, like... No, I don't want to jump the cue. We'll talk about Matthews from Martin in a second. But like, on Keefe, he was out-coached by an interim coach. Who's games six. Doucharm has no idea what he's doing. Dude, what a fucking joke that they end up winning the series the same way Claude Julian would have coached them. Stacking five guys in the blue line and letting Carrie Price carry the

load. Like, you fire Claude Julian for what? He would have eeked into the playoffs and did the same damn thing this guy did. But here's the funny part about that is literally almost every single one of their like playoff heroes, the guys who either set up or scored the important goal. were guys he didn't have on the fucking roster to start the series. Fucking incredible. He's like, oh, we think that guy sucks. Oh, now we have to put him back in. And he would be like, Paul Byron.

Ryan, was it last week's show where we said that the only reason to not have those guys in the lineup was so that he could add them later in the series and look smart? And try to look smart. Yeah, exactly. And that like, and it worked. People are singing his prey. He made the adjustments of putting his good players in the lineup, and now he's going to come back. He's going to be the coach for the next few years in Montreal. Well, he speaks French.

But in Keith's case, like, it does disturb me a little bit that they just stacked the line and played that kind of hockey. And on top of being unable to keep the Leafs head straight for the last three games of the series, he also had no answer. That's right. how to break through that front. And that's kind of disturbing. Like, Kyle Dubish should be the GM beyond this season. I'm like a little nervous about Sheldon Keefe being the coach, to be honest with you.

So here's the end. Look, I mean, Sheldon Kee's been the coach for a year and a half. Most coaches get more than a year and a half. Get more time. And two fake seasons, by the way. Two fake seasons. By the way, I would like to retroactively agree with Ryan that this season was fake. I know I maybe didn't say that strongly enough

during the year, but he was absolutely right. Whoever wins the cup, especially if it's Montreal, has to have an athlete. 100% fake. Shouldn't even hang a banner. Here's the thing on Keith. I won't even defend him, but on one of the two things you just said, should he have found a way to adjust? Look, this is the NHL.

If you do the five guys across the line system and you do it well with players who stick to it, it's really hard to beat that. That's one of the problems in the NHHA. This isn't a Leafs thing or a HABS thing or anything. This is almost any team, if they commit to it, can not completely shut down, but largely shut down any other team by just doing that and sticking to it. Now, you still got to score at the other end,

and it doesn't guarantee anything. But I'm not going to beat him up for not cracking a code that no NHL coach has cracked in the 25 years that this has been, how the game is played. What I will put at his feet is the just utter garbage starts that the Leaves had in both games five and six. They didn't look great in game seven, but I really feel like the slow start in Game

seven actually said a lot more about how Montreal was playing than it did Toronto. I thought Montreal came out and looked good, looked really good at making the other team look bad in Game 7, if that makes sense. Game five for the Leaves coming out that flat, maybe on some level you can understand it. It should never happen in the playoffs and it should never happen for a team that's trying to close out a playoff series when they've never done that before. But they had just won three games and four nights, taken the lead in the series. You know, it's looking good. You're back home.

Maybe you don't quite have the intensity right out of the gate. But to have it happen again in game six is inexcusable. And if I'm ever going to contemplate, making a. coaching change, that's the piece that I want to know. That's where you're do best or your Shanahan or whoever, you're sitting Sheldon Keith in a room and going, what the hell happened between the end of Thursday night's loss and Saturday when you guys came out and don't tell me it was the crowd. Don't tell me it was 2,000 people because if 2,000 people threw you off your home game, we never had a chance to win the cup because we got to go through Vegas or

Tampa or wherever it is where there's going to be 20,000. that sound like 40,000. So if that Montreal crowd was part of it, we were dead in the water to start with. That's really what I want to know. I want to know that. And the other thing with this coaching staff is, is what the hell happened with the power play?

And whether that's, and yes, it's the, the Leafs are like most NHL teams. The head coach doesn't run the power play. In the least case, it's Mani Melhotra is the coach. I don't think he will be back because the power play was such a mess.

But Sheldon keeps in charge. of it. Ultimately, like he's, it's his, it's his coaching staff. And the thing that's interesting to me is this story, I don't even know if I call it a story, but this thing that has come out this morning where there have been these whispers that they, that they asked Mitch Martiner to switch positions on the power play and that he refused, that they tried to either move it. And part of the reason I don't necessarily put a lot of stock in it is I've heard stories that they tried to move into the point. And I've heard stories that they tried to move him down deep to the net. And it's, you know, it's, you know, it's, you know, it's, you know, it's,

you know, can't be both of those. But he normally plays the sideboards. And the story is that they asked him to do it and he refused it. I actually didn't see that story anywhere, but then his agent showed up this morning and said that the story that people didn't even really know wasn't true. And it came up again in the interviews today. I'll just say this. If the Maple Leafs asked Mitch Marner to move positions on the power play and he refused.

And so they just kept rolling out the same power. play at 10% then yes, go ahead and fire the coaching staff. Because what the hell are we doing? 23-year-olds don't get to decide who plays where. Except here's the thing. When you empower 23-year-olds the way that this franchise has in acquiescing to his contract demands and everything else?

I mean acquiescing to his contract. They could play it like fucking Columbus and be like, no, you're taking $6 million and then he goes for two years and says, fuck Toronto, I'm out of here. Maybe. Maybe. No, you know what? The contract is a disaster in hindsight. I don't mind saying that, but the reason for that is,

and as far as Ryan's point of what should they have done with the contract, what they should have done is say the amount of money you're asking for would reset the marketplace entirely for our phase. We're not going to do that until we see what Braden Point gets and Miko Rattenon. And if they get 10 million, you'll get 10 million. In fact, maybe you'll get 11 because if you think you're a little bit better than those guys. but if they get seven and eight million, you're not getting 10 and a half. That's what they should have done in hindsight.

And I get that it's very easy. But it's very easy to say in hindsight. It's a hard situation to negotiate. I don't envy Kyle Duvah's, you know, especially when Martner's agent is out playing games in the media and making it public and all of that. I don't blame the Leafs for that. At least I don't think that was an easy thing. The power play thing, if that happened, that's an easy one. Mitch, we want to move you to the point on the power.

play. I don't want to. Cool, duly noted. You're playing the point on the power play. Or, no, I'm not going to. Okay, you're not on the power play anymore. Or are you sulking? You're not in the lineup anymore. And how do you think that's going to play in Toronto? It wouldn't, if, and this is why I don't, I don't buy the story. Or at least I don't buy it the way it's being presented. Maybe they went to him and said, how would you feel about playing the point? Are you comfortable with that? And he goes, you know what? Not really, actually, I really don't, I really feel uncomfortable playing that. And they go, okay, and they don't make a change. But that's on the coaches. It's not, you can put a lot of stuff to defeat Mitch Marner, but if he doesn't decide how the power play works, and I, if what is

happening that I suspect could be happening, which is that maybe somebody on the Leaf staff who's feeling some heat is floating this story out there to transfer it to the players, then you know what, that person maybe shouldn't be part of the plan going forward. Yeah. And I think, I mean, unless they're unaware of sort of what public sentiment is, the coaching staff would have been supported if they benched him on the power plate. Yes. Yes. And I mean, the worm turned on Mitch Marner with the contract thing. And then, and then, you know, everything after that, I don't think he's, he lost golden boy status. But specifically, Ryan, you mentioned Matthews and Martin before. I struggle, right? Like, they were going up against a real good checking line. No doubt about that. Like, to know when Gallagher know what the fuck they're doing. They were going up against a goalie that was pretty locked in, and they certainly weren't doing the things from a patient's standpoint to increase their opportunities to score. I mean, Marner himself said that, that they were too hasty with the puck and not waiting for screens and shit like that. I want to give them the benefit of the doubt because I like them both, and I don't like the idea of constantly blaming one line for the loss of a series, especially when they were the only line that even had a sniff offensively in the,

game seven and maybe even game six at times. But I also think that like this team doesn't win until they figure out how to get more than one fucking goal in a seven game series. Sure, but like who the fuck else? Like look at the entire rest of the raw. And this is, this is ultimately the point here, right? Is, uh, I said it in fucking January or whenever the season started was, you know, Kyle Dubus, listen to all the dipshits in Toronto who said, oh, they don't know how to win.

They, you know, they're, they don't have the veteran presence. They don't have the guys who are hard to play against. Let's fucking go out and get them. And he goes out and, you know, like Joe Thornton, sure, that's fine. You kind of roll the dice with a, with a locker room guy who also happens to be one of the greatest playmakers of all time. That makes perfect sense to me.

But like Wayne Simmons, you know. And, yeah. And what's his name from Bogosian, right? They got Zach Bogosian to this summer. I got to say, Zach Bekoshin was good in this series, though. It was good. He was good for the last year. A lot of the other guys you're naming weren't.

But my point is, these are not guys who fuel any kind of, like, offensive output, is my point. It's a Blake-Colman-Barkley-Gudrow League, and they went the other way on it. Yeah, no, well, because, well, right. Like, they say, like, oh, well, Blake Coleman and Barclay-Gudrow, are good at defense. So, like, obviously, that's who they should have gone out and gotten. It's like, yeah, those guys are, like, signed, though. You know what I mean? Like, you don't just go, well, look, this guy is like what the dime store version of, everybody said last two years, two years running. Wayne Simmons is cooked. What did he fucking do this year?

He didn't do shit. And it's like. He was last and goals scored above a replacement. Yeah, he wasn't. And worst off is, they traded speed for experience. they looked slow and just uncreative in the series offensively beyond the top line. Greg, what you just said is true, except they didn't trade speed for experience. They traded speed for cap space in terms of giving away Kasperi Kappanin and Andreas Yonson. And then with very limited cap space, well, no, they needed four or five guys. And what they did was not necessarily a bad plan. I mean, yeah, it would have been great if they had gone and got some 25-volved scorers,

but they had like $5 million to spend. Instead, what they did is they basically put a sign out saying, does anyone want to come play for Toronto for a million bucks a year at the most? Because you're from here and you'll do it at a discount. And they got five guys who were willing to do that and probably more than that that they said no to. but it's it's they didn't have the caps and I said like when they when they were making these these moves and look they got a first round pick for caspari cap and that was pretty pretty nice move got next to nothing for yonson but okay I remember saying at the beginning of season like

there's not a lot of scoring depth here there's like four guys five if you consider zach hyman of a good offensive piece and during the regular season he was and after that it's it's a lot of question marks and so you know what happens if somebody gets hurt and then you go into the playoffs and yeah sure enough one of your key guys gets hurt right away which which which is getting completely ignored in all of the breakdowns because it doesn't fit either side of the the well I think it gets ignored because they they won the next they won the next three games so it's hard to really like point to that and saying that they got fucked by it well except then there's two games to win the series that both go into overtime and you're

one goal away I agree the game player you's not you felt the loss of John Tavares the Absolutely. Like, without question. And I do think that puts a huge asterisk on the series. Game one, they were flat that entire game and I don't know that you can blame them. But also, it's, you know, I think we can say both things. We can say they were really badly hurt by the fact that one of their star players got injured and also say that the way the roster is constructed was in a way that while losing a star player will hurt any team,

it would really hurt if it happened to the Leafs and sure enough it did. And there wasn't any. Any sort of backup plan that was possible, let alone in place. Right. Well, anyway, my larger point, though, is they go out and they get all those guys. And it kind of works, I guess. Like, you know, they got, let's say they got some important goals from Wayne's at, like, some hot, you know, notable goals from Wayne Simmons. Although maybe they just stand out in the mind because Wayne Simmons contributing offensively was so rare anyway.

But, you know, I said it at the deadline. fucked up so bad. They gave up so much for guys who only contribute defensively. And, you know, they, they traded for guys who were not healthy. And it's like, yeah, it's crazy. Nick Falino didn't fucking help your offense. Who could have seen that coming? You know, like, you didn't have to be a genius to think that, you know, they were just kind of doubling down on, again, the same kind of guys that, like, the media wanted them to. get because they were too easy to play against. And those guys didn't do shit in the playoffs.

And part of that was they're clearly not healthy, but also, even if they were healthy. How many goals is Nick Folino contributing to your fucking cause? You know? Well, he was also hurt, though. Well, that's what I just said. He was clearly hurt, but also, yeah, it's, here's the irony of it, is that starting pretty much at the final buzzer of the Columbus series, last year. Kyle Dubes did everything with this team and this roster that he had been urged to do by the

exact same voices who are now going to say that he didn't do any of it and needs to be fired because of it. Yeah. You know, this idea that he never went. Yeah. He did exactly. down the checklist of what the 200 hockey men said that you should do at this point, which is, okay, you've got your skill, now you're surrounded by grit and compete and heart

and know how to win in the playoffs and literally go out and get the guys who just beat you in the playoffs to come be on your side this time. And now not only did it not work, and not only has he potentially lost some standing with the people who's out there who saw him do it and said it wouldn't work, but all the people who told him to do it are now going to act like it didn't happen, and he gains nothing with them anyway. So maybe it's ultimately, maybe it's a big lesson in just not trying to please the critics because some of them are going to stay critics no matter what.

The last thing I will say, though, on Kyle Dubas, and this is again reacting to some of the stuff that's been thrown around there about, can we please put to rest this idea that this guy is Mr. Analytics? Mr. Make the decisions based on the numbers and the spreadsheets and the calculator. And like I don't fully know where this can. I mean, certainly when he took the job in Toronto, the bar in Toronto had been set very low. In fact, in the sense of how fluent you had to be, like if you knew anything, you were immediately the smart. artist guy who had worked in that front office in 10 years.

I literally think half of this is just because the guy wears glasses. And so people have just decided he's like some bookish. But the thing is, Kyle Dubas is, and he's a smart guy. And he knows, yes, he looks at analytics and he's built up and, you know, all that stuff the way that pretty much any smart person running an NHL team has. But this guy is a rink rat. This guy, since he was a kid has been around Ranks and Junior and working his way up, he's not a just look at the numbers guy and again if you if you see that if you see somebody saying

that disregard everything they're saying about the leaves because they don't know what they're talking about because whatever his flaws or successes or whether you should stay or go or whatever it is at least describe the guy accurately he looks at numbers of course but he's also he's very much an i-test guy and he spent the last year doing i-test 200 hockey men things uh you You don't go get Wayne Simmons if you're only looking at the numbers. Because the numbers say Wayne Simmons. There were no analytics that said Zach Bogosian is the guy that you need to get that. Right.

And, you know, like we'll get to it in a minute with like the Seth Jones, or not a minute, but a little while from now with the whole Seth Jones thing, where it's like, oh, you know, well, they have internal numbers that are better than the public numbers. And like, that's true. But also like, remember when they, when Tampa said that when they signed Dan Girardi of like, you don't. understand. He's actually really fucking good. And then the second Dan Girardi's off the team, they win the Stanley Cup. That's crazy. I mean, I'm sure there's other factors involved. But no, I don't think so. I think that's the only one, Greg. All right. The last thing I want to know before we move off the Leafs is for Sean, because I mentioned it to Ryan, but I want to hear your take on it. Where are you on Matthews and Marner? Like, you mentioned the 2010 Capitals situation. I think there's definitely a parallel to be dry. on as far as like you either stay the course or lose your minds and change your philosophy

and start trading off the core. Where are you on Matthews and Barner right now? I mean, the capitalist comparison is a good one. I've, I mean, I've been pointing back to that. I've said this many times, I think, on the show, that one of my favorite pieces of hockey writing ever is that Japer's Ring piece that looks back at that loss and all the decisions that came after it and how the organization basically overcorrected to a massive degree and how it potentially cost them a few years of legitimate contending and could have cost them their chance at a cup if they hadn't if they hadn't bounced back in 2018. So I think there's a lot of that here. The one thing that's interesting about the 2010 capitals is if you look back at that

team, they, when that loss happened, a lot of people were saying, you know what, you can't win with Alexander Ovechkin, trade Ovechkin. They didn't trade Ovechkin. A lot of people were saying you can't win with a Nicholas Baxter type guy. Trade Nicholas Baxter. They didn't trade Nicholas Baxter. And eight years later, they win the cup

and Alexander Ovechkin gets the Stanley Cop and hands it to Nicholas Baxter and it pays off. Here's the thing, though. Yeah. They didn't keep Alexander Semen. They didn't keep Mike Green. They didn't keep the core exactly as, is and say we're powering forward. What they did is they sat down and said, who actually is the

core and maybe who looks like they are, but they're not. And that is, I think, the decisions that you have to make with, whether it's Marner or Nielander or whoever else on this team, you've got to sit there and go, okay, are you in the Ovechkin-Bastrum category or do we maybe have a couple of Alexander Simmons in here where they're grouped in as the core, but they're actually not a indispensable part of what it is we're trying to build here. And that's a much harder question than somebody like me can find an answer to. But I think that's what the team has to do. The only thing to say about that is like they offloaded Semen, you know, real quick.

I don't, I feel like Mike Green stuck around until the point where it was like, well, he's going to be super expensive and he kind of isn't that good now. You know what I mean? Like, I don't think, I don't think they bailed on Mike Green, you know, because they're like, he doesn't fit. I think they were like, but the point is eventually, like, you know, he's not.

Yeah. The point is not all of those guys got to carry forward. And it's, and that's the reality of how, how it works. And so I think it's, you know, I don't think you go into the season and say,

we have to trade Mitch Marner. But you answer the phone. If somebody calls, yeah, of course. that is same with any of these guys. I don't, you know, Tavares has a no trade. There's virtually no realistic scenario where I think you're going to trade Austin Matthews unless there's something else going on behind the scenes, we don't know.

But if it comes to Marner, even Nielander. And Nielander played good in this series, but nobody on this team has accomplished anything that should make them untouchable. Like there's nothing that anybody on this team has done that makes it offensive to even suggest that the team could move them. So you answer the phone, maybe you pick up the phone, make a few calls, see what's out there, and see if it makes sense. And you don't do it because you have to do it, but if it makes you better,

yeah, that's where you need to get. Do you want to hear my hot take on this? Absolutely. Go ahead. You asked Tavares to waive for the expansion draft. Yeah, I wish, it's funny you should say that because when we were talking about Marner, I'm like, what's the bigger sin, giving Tavares the full no move or the martyr contract? It's the Tavares contract, no question.

Yeah, absolutely. You want my even hotter take? Yes. Find a way for the Kings to take a huge chunk of Dowdy's salary and trade for him. No, thanks. That's not going to work for me. That was just for you, baby. I know where you are on Drew Dowdy.

Yeah, that's not going to fly. His contract actually Like I would love him on the Leafs But his contract is ridiculous Like he signed for like seven more years Yeah no It's the Brent Burns thing It's you know

You can go down the list There's a lot of There's a lot of 30 plus defensemen Who are assigned for a really long time And a real lot of money Because of something Tavares would never waive them Tavaris would never waive

The no move would he No but once you ask him To do it Well then okay Now it's now we're having a different conversation About what's the future of the Toronto Maple Leafs look like and does John, like, you're, you're basically signaling to John Tavares, we don't feel like you're like super important to the future of this franchise.

You know what I mean? And, well, he's, yeah, and I mean, like, what do you gain? $11 million. You gain in $11 million. You gain the ability to get three good players. But no, you don't, you don't gain that by asking him to wave because he's not, Seattle's not taking him. Like, there's, there's so what's like, you start the, the process of, of pressuring

him to leave for somebody else. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yep. Well, this is, this is the kind of loss. Speaking of guys who haven't won in the first round ever, John Tavares, this is the kind of loss that just is, it sets a number of dominoes in motion. I can't even imagine what's going on behind the scenes. It's just you pull your hair out thinking about it. Speaking of pull your hair out, today's episode of Puck Soup is sponsored by Keeps. What is keeps? Keeps is an incredible brand. to help men with their hair loss. Two out of three men will experience some form of hair loss by the time they are 35. More than 50 million men in the U.S. suffer from male pattern baldness, and there are only two FDA-approved medications that can prevent hair loss, and Keeps offers both. I've got a buddy of mine that uses Keeps,

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slash puck soup to get your first month free. Keeps.com slash puck soup keeps. Welcome to the Puck Soup sponsorship family. Of course, kind of. We've done a lot of the leaders. for me, I think. What? Yeah. What's going on? Yeah. I wish you'd, we'd had that a week ago.

I'm stoneballed right now. So, where were you? All right. Playoff vibe check. Colorado's going to win the cup? We all agree? Yeah, it looks that way, doesn't it? Jesus Christ.

And they are, they are, see... What a bummer, by the way, that there's no kind of, like, intrigue about the final four receding, like we know what the brackets are. It's going to be Colorado against the winner of the north, which, you know, and then the central and the central and the east play each other. But the abs are just like, the abs look like they're on one of those runs. And I would include the 95 Devils in this conversation of teams that are just so locked in to what they do well that it's hard to imagine a path in which, outside of like

a catastrophic injury, a path in which they don't make. By the way, it would have to be multiple. at this point. Yeah. They're so good. They are. Somebody pointed out to me, now I got to remember,

which I think it was the 90, was it the 99 red wings. Yeah, I'm just looking at this. 99 red wings had won two straight Stanley Cups. They had that crazy trade deadline where they loaded up on all sorts of veterans. They go into the playoffs. They sweep Anaheim.

round one. They go up against Colorado. They win games one and two, so they've won their first six straight, and then they lost four straight, and they're out, which is just a way to say it can still turn on a dime. Like there's, this is, and I get that was 20 years ago, but that was 20 years ago in a league with a lot less parity than now. And so, uh, I don't think this is over, over, but holy smokes, Colorado looks good. They do indeed. Um, I want to give a vibe check shout out to Tampa for the start of their series. Well, I mean, they haven't looked good, and yet they've won two close games. You know what I mean?

Like, I think that's the big kind of takeaway here. And I don't think they necessarily have to look good. You know what I mean? I mean, if they can beat Carolina without looking good. Well, that's what I mean. They have the talent at every position that you go, yeah, I guess it kind of doesn't matter if they're like outplayed. They have like nine guys who can just turn any opportunity into a goal or, you know, prevent one at the other end. And that's the end of that.

You know what I mean? Like if like Stephen Stancoast is their third most important offensive player, maybe even fourth, you might say, you go, well, then I guess. I guess that's about that. And especially now with like injuries seem to be mounting for Carolina too. It's, yeah. I mean, I'm so, I'm so hesitant to say this because,

what was it, two weeks ago we were talking about McDavid versus Matthews. Wouldn't that? Well, look where we are. Yeah, sure. I mean,

I know it's way too early, but Colorado versus Tampa for the Stanley Cup. Let's go. be insanely good. Like, that's, and there's a million different ways it could bounce that we don't get there. But it's very hard for me as a hockey fan, especially now that I don't have a rooting interest in any of the teams left, it's very hard for me not to look at the way this could shake out goal. Av's lightning would be, like, when was the last time we had just the two best teams in the league

or something very, very close, just slug it out in a final. Like, it doesn't have a- Chicago, Boston, maybe? Yeah, is that the last time? Chicago, Tampa, you could maybe say, like, I, you know, there's, there have been a few, but yeah, it's...

Do you, I mean, like, I... Not often. I'm with you on Tampa, but, like, this Boston team pretty good, too. I mean, it's not... Yeah, they, they look real good. I mean, you know, they lost most recent, the most recent game,

but what, you know, I don't watch those games and go, oh, boy, the Islanders are giving them a lot of problems. They just didn't get a couple of problems. And I don't watch those games and say that Boston's as, like, juggernaughty as Tampa could be, right? But, like, I still think that they'd give them a good series, too. That's kind of a clash of styles. I mean, Boston's so good defensively. Not to say Colorado isn't it as well, but I think that'd be an interesting clash of style. So I'm with you, Sean.

Like Colorado, Tampa, I mean, would be in an incredible series on several. fronts. And to your point, Ryan, like, that's why I picked Tampa in the Florida series, although Florida was kind of a sexy pick for some people, because they just, they just have so many guys that know how to do this. Like, there's just, it's incredible. I mean, and not to go back to the Leafs comparison, but you look at the Leafs, you look at the lightning and you see how many players make a play when necessary. Like, you're fucking Alex Coloren's of the world. And players like that, I mean, they've just got so many of those guys in that roster that in close games, you're just confident someone's going to do something. It's, it's incredible how well put together that team is. Yeah, they're really good. That's another one of a big hot takes for this episode. They're really good? Yeah, the Tampa Bay Lightning, the Rainley Stanley Cup champions who've recently had the greatest regular season of all time.

Yeah, they're good, my opinion. What did you think of, I mean, by the time we, people hear this, I'm sure game two will be said and done, but what did you think of the Vegas thing with starting liner? Why do that? I mean, I guess, like, I said it at the time, but I was like, unless the only reason that it's acceptable to start Lainer over Flurry is that Flurry is kind of old now. And then DeBore kind of said as much like, you know, he just played a bunch of games right in a row, you know. That's it.

That has to be what it is. That has to be. And there's got to be like a conversation that took place internally where Flurry was like, look, I can't do 28 games. Like I can't be every second night for two months. So they're going to have to pick their spots. And you're probably maybe hoping that against Minnesota you get that spot. They didn't. So now, or you're hoping that against Minnesota you get some rest.

They finish the series early and get a few days off because that works too. So if you're going, I mean, if you're sitting there going, we're going to have to use Robin Leonard at some point against Colorado unless we beat the avalanche quickly. What are the odds of that happening? Probably not great. So if it's going to be a long series, we've got to get the guys some rest at some point. It might as well do it in game one.

With that being said, Robin Lainer was not the problem. He gave up a million goals. No, he was not the problem. The Colorado Avalanche were the problem. Right, exactly. Yes. And also, I think this is true. I think they were a little preoccupied with Ryan Graves for that,

not really that clean hit early in the game. and they spent the entire rest of the game chasing them around and it got Ryan Reeves suspended. And, but, like, multiple guys took runs at graves throughout the game. And I couldn't help but think it's like, hey, maybe, you know, you can get away with this in the regular season, but this is the fucking playoffs and you're playing the Colorado Avalanche. You can't really. Although that, didn't that happen, like, come when it was, like, already 4-0 or something? Yeah, well, I mean, it was, it was 4-0 pretty quickly.

But, like, even before that, they were really making sure they, they, they, they, You know, they made a run at him every time he touched the puck. So I think they were a little preoccupied with that. But again, you know, it's mostly just the Colorado Avalancher fucking real good. Where are we on Jets Montreal? Boring. I will be sleeping through all the late games of that series. You're not here for Connor versus Kerry?

You're not down for that? I don't yeah no it's gonna be two boring fucking teams that aren't very good yeah it's not I mean to go from McDavid and Matt versus Matthews to the fucking Jets versus Habs is just uh it's it's a it's a real actually it's not Dr. Pepper we got you Dr. Skipper kind of kind of vibe um I I don't know I think the Jets win the series Montreal is kind of coming together in an interesting way but I still think the Jets the Jets aren't gonna like grip their sticks too tight and do dumb shit, and they're deep at forward. So I think they'll probably win the series.

Yeah, I mean, I think the game plan for Montreal is going to be pretty similar to what it was against Toronto. It's, you know, the Winnipeg is somewhat similar team. Deep top six, blue line. Ify? You know, iffy. Great goaltending. You know, you didn't look at the Leafs and say they had a Connor Hallibook, but Jake Campbell played great in that series.

series. Like, Jay Campbell was, uh, other than the one goal in game seven, he was, he was real good. So you're, it's, it's not like you lit it up against a, uh, C minus goalie and now you're facing a Vezina guy. It's, uh, it's, it's pretty similar. It'll be an interesting series in the sense of Montreal is going to try to do the same thing. Um, whereas for Winnipeg, it's very different, right? Winnipeg, you just finished playing a team that had the two best forwards, arguably on the planet and not much else. And now you're playing a team where it's like, all right, let's shut down their big guns. And you're looking at the roster going.

Ooh. Okay. So it's a big shift for Winnipeg. And it's also that, like, Winnipeg's been off forever now. And Montreal is hitting the ground running. It'll be interesting to see how that all plays out. So, I mean, I think it's going to be, you know, it'll be an interesting series. Obviously up here in Canada, it'll be a big deal.

I've, obviously, said, yeah. Oh, yeah. Oh, of course. It's two Canadian teams. It'll be made to be a big series. Let's put it that way. Well, it's, I mean, the two teams left in the country playing each other in playoffs. Of course, it's going to be a big thing.

And Montreal is a huge market. And Winnipeg's a very easy team to root for. Like this is, whether they had played Toronto or Montreal, even more so if they had played Toronto. Like, it would have been the great, like, that's the easiest baby face to book that you could ever ask for against a heel. And it'll be not quite the same with Montreal, but pretty. close for a lot of fans. I think there'll be a lot of fans, you know, in Ontario and East and who maybe haven't seen a lot of the Jets this year who are going to watch first couple games of this and go, okay, this, you know what, there's some interesting stuff going on with

this team. So we'll see. Hopefully it's a better, I mean, you know, hopefully it's a better series. That Toronto-Montral series, just taking away all the history and hype and everything wasn't a great series to sit down to watch. So hopefully we get a good series. something different here, but I think it's, I think it could be, it could be a fun series. I know this is going to sound crazy, but I'm actually rooting for Winnipeg to go all the way. Because if one of these dumb Canadian teams is going to win the cup, let it be before we get the rights. So I'm all for it.

And I've always said, like, everybody makes such a big deal out of it every year. Oh, Canada needs to win the cup. Who's going to be Canada's team? And there is no Canada's team. Everybody in Canada hates every other team. with the only possible exception that maybe we could get behind Winnipeg. So this would be the year to do it. And look, and here's the other thing.

And this is, I don't have a way to say this that doesn't sound like sour grape. So just let it sound like that. Please don't let the Montreal Canadians go and win the Stanley Cup by putting five guys across the blue line and shutting down Toronto, Winnipeg, Colorado. Like that would just absolutely talk about the worst possible. result for the league. Like, please don't let that happen. Let's, let, I hope, you know, let, let Winnipeg or whoever show that they can break that code the way the Leafs couldn't and, or let Montreal have to shift and, and, uh, play

differently. Let's just get some, but there's so many fun teams left. Um, I hope whenever comes out of the north is ready to play some fun hockey and not just try to shut it down. Now, I forgot to mention this before. Ryan, are you willing to give yourself over to Carrie Christ? Are you willing to admit that he's elite and that all those NHL PA polls that we used to make fun of that said he's the guy you want to start game seven? We're actually correct because I've done that.

I've gone over to the other side. I may I cope it. Yeah, somebody, that Carrie Price is pretty good. Somebody said the thing about like, well, you know what? Maybe it is just a clutch thing. But also, like, I don't think you can say the Canadians played this way in the regular season. season in front of him.

They were like, okay, well, we're playing Toronto. We got to have, we got to make sure that we're tackling everybody who comes across the blue line with the puck. And like, they kind of made Kerry Price's job. Like, he made, he made some good saves. Don't get me wrong. He was good in the series. But like, do you really have that hard of a job against, against the Leafs in the series?

I don't know. He made some big saves. Like, there were definitely some. Yeah, no. And where it really was like, like, if you're going to use this to bolster the carry price narrative, it's that game six overtime. Because the Leafs dominated that overtime. He wasn't making like crazy dive across the crease saves every shift, but he had to be really, really good. And yeah, I mean,

like I say, Jack Campbell, or Jack Campbell by the stats, played every bit as well as Carrie Price in that series, which is amazing because if you had said that before the series, you would have said the least you're going to win. They need Kerry Price. Win easily, you would have said. Yeah. But it didn't work out that way. But, I mean, yeah, Carrie Price versus Connor Hallibuck is going to be interesting.

I was going to say fun. Maybe not the way goaltending works. Yeah. But it's a matchup. It's going to be. How do you guys feel about 7-2-1 games? Because that's what it feels like we're going to be heading for. I mean, I like,

like it on the puck line from a betting perspective. You love it if you're a Montreal fan. You just, you'll take that. Winnipeg, you probably not. Was there a guy in Montreal that really, like, won your respect during that series besides price? My little friend Colcafield was really frigging good when they gave him the chance to actually play. I thought he was great. He's scary every time he touches the puck.

That's exactly right, yeah. I don't watch enough Montreal that I'm like, right. recognizing every player every time. They touch, you know, like when you really are familiar with the team, you don't, you know, you know exactly who it is. Caulfield's obviously because he's a smaller guy is recognizable, but I didn't, I didn't know him on site. And yet every time he touched the puck, I was like, that must be Caulfield. Because he looks a half a step faster, more dangerous. And Nick Suzuki also as well was.

Yeah, I was going to say Suzuki really impressed me in that series. Nick Suzuki is interesting because remember like a month into the season, we're all talking about this guy being the next great legend. and then the rest of the year he wasn't, he fell off, and he came back for this series. So the future looks okay in Montreal with those two guys. Kot Kim Miami was fine. Not quite at that level, but he was good, and he got, you know, he produced. So, yeah, I would say those guys and then, you know, a bunch of guys that I did,

like I would go long stretches and then they'd be like, and Eric Stahl comes in, I'd be like, Eric Stalls on one of these teams? Oh, yeah, okay. But the young guys, young guys were good. Yeah, they have a real weird roster in that way where it's like, yeah, we have a lot of really good young, exciting guys. And then we have a bunch of guys who are like 52, I think. And that's it. Those are the only guys we have on the roster.

And by the way, all the guys who are 52 are also not very good. And we're going this series against Toronto Maple Leafs. How's that sound? All right. Well, I hope we get to see a lot of Cole Cawfield and Nick Suzuki, because otherwise this is going to be, fucking snooze fest. Speaking of snoozing, today's episode of Puck Suit is sponsored by

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Do check them out. They've got amazing products. You're right, Lambert. It was in a few moments. It was about 20 minutes. Seth Jones, not resigning with Columbus. He's going to test out free agency. let the trade derby begin.

I don't know how you can do this again if you're Columbus. I think you probably have to trade him before the season, no? Yeah, of course. Yeah, they're going to trade them with the draft. Who wants them? Where does he go? Philly? Half the teams in the league want them.

There will be lots. Even more than half, quite frankly. And they are probably going to have to commit to a new contract even before. the season like they're going to trade for them and then be like oh and we also signed him for seven years at nine million per and it's like oh that's that's the question

that hasn't really been answered yet and it maybe won't be publicly but that's going to really determine like Seth Jones says I'm going to play out the season and I'm going to test free agency now he's saying that while he's property of the Columbus Blue Jackets

is he willing to sign a long-term deal with whatever team trades for him, or does he really feel like he wants to get to free agency? And he's saying, look, go ahead and trade me if you want, but I'm going to free agency. I'm not good. Because if that's how he feels,

that changes the market significantly. And much to the detriment of what the bluejacks would be trying to get. Whereas if he's just being polite saying, you know, I want to go to free agency and it's just code for I don't want to be in Columbus anymore, but trade me to the Rangers and I'll gladly resign. term, then, yeah, it's going to be, there'll be a bidding war and the NHL GMs love them some

Seth Jones and they'll pay up to get them. Yeah, they do. Yeah, and I wonder, you know, I think everybody wants to be the bell of the free agent ball, but can you still be that under the flat cap is the question. Well, and coming off two straight, not very good seasons, one of which kind of went under the radar because he played a lot of minutes in that one overtime game. And then the other, like, everybody brought, like, it's broadly acknowledged even by the player himself. Oh, I suck shit this year.

I was really fucking mad. Yes, he did. He did. So, you know, it's funny. I talked to, I talked to him recently for a story. And he, he said he sucked shit. A lot of interesting theories about what's going on in the, in the, he did not do that. He did not, we did not talk about the deep state, uh, this time.

you know, he said he wanted to get traded to Washington so he could storm the capitals. Just kidding. No, he said that he gave me the song and dance about Columbus. Like he gave me the whole like, I wish more people would know what it's, how great of a market it is, and it's a great place to live. And, you know, I wish we stopped, you know, losing free agents and the whole thing. And then like a week later, it comes out that he's like, yeah, I'm going to leave. Yeah, well, he said it out like, it was the first time he'd ever said it out loud. and he was like,

that doesn't sound right. He said it, and Greg was like, really? And he just, like, took that away and was like, thinking about it in the shower.

I was like, yeah, you know what? Wish convinced me. I'm out. You know what? Maybe. Yeah.

Oh, it's my fault he's leaving? Oh, shit. All right. Well, I'll try not to talk to Oranski, Columbus fans. I'm sorry,

the fifth line. We refer to you by your, your baptismal name. Yeah, it's going to be interesting to see what the Derby, what for him is. And like you said, it's really going to be dictated as to whether or not he goes someplace in signs or if he goes someplace temporarily.

Is he a leafy solution, Sean? I mean, he'll be mentioned a lot in connection with the Leafs because it's the Leafs. Realistically, they don't have a ton of picks and prospects to move. I don't think you're like trading Mitch Marner for. Seth Jones, although who knows, I'm sure someone will throw it out there, and they don't have cap space, so unless it's... Will? Will throw it out there?

Has, has thrown it up there? Many, many times already. And the real reason he's going to be connected to the Leafs so much is, of course, that he's the perfect, like, 200 hockey men player, where it's like, the analytics say he's not very good, and then the, you know, all the, all the GMs who didn't graduate from college, but still somehow run a hundred million dollar into corporations. They're all like, he's actually really good and you guys don't know what you're talking about.

Okay. Wow. Like that's why he's being connected to the Maple Leafs because this is the kind of move that a little dweeb like Kyle Dubus would never make, you know, that kind of shit. Wait, we're his glasses. He does. All right.

I mean, spoiler alert, the Leafs are going to be connected to every major name that is even vaguely mentioned for the next. They are every year, but especially this year. So be ready. Okay. So we have right now in this league, we have four coaching vacancies. We've got the coyotes, the blue jackets, the Rangers, and the Cracken. We could also have Buffalo, because Don Granato is serving on an interim basis.

Right, and they've interviewed half the league at this point. Right. Yeah. I think at this point it's fair to consider them a vacancy. That's a vacancy, yeah. And I imagine that Montreal, by virtue of winning around, will keep Dusharim around is what we believe. So we'll take them off the board. And then obviously Travis Green stayed and the whole thing and who knows who is going to get fired.

But we assume that these are the things. Yeah, you assume no one else is going at this point. Dallas Aiken's apparently sticking around in Anaheim. Yeah, in perpetuity, as is Bob Murray. What the fuck? All right, so those five teams, where does Rick Tocket end up from those five teams? You would, obviously not Arizona. I mean, apparently anywhere he wants, considering he seems to be viewed as an absolute elite tier coach,

at least as far as we're told based on the interest. Does that make any sense to you, by the way? No, it doesn't. He was the beneficiary of outstanding goaltending, and his offensive teams always blew. Yeah, and like, I think we've talked about it before, but everybody seems to get the, well, it was Arizona kind of treatment. You know what I mean?

Like, look, did he get, did he have any results at all there? Well, no, of course not. but also like it was Arizona. So like even getting close to having results is an incredible accomplishment. And he deserves to be considered one of the greatest coaches and, you know, all that shit. I don't know. I would see also Bradshire Living. Yeah.

Terrible. If we're going to put him anywhere, Dave Tippett. I would say Columbus would be my bet on him. That feels like a blue collar type of hire. You know, you can sell him. He probably doesn't cost you a lot of money Another great Columbus feature So I checked in on the

Joel Cuenville to the Cracken Scuttlebutt I don't know if you had heard that at all I had seen I hadn't Rumor and innuendo that Joel Quinville might leave Florida to go to Seattle

Because he's got a relationship With Ron Francis Because it's a new challenge Because maybe there's a little friction With him in Zito in Florida I've already done everything he could have been asked to do in Florida. That's right.

Well, it's Florida. They won two playoff games. I checked in on it. I didn't find any indication that that's true. I kind of found other indications that it wasn't. So there might not be anything there, but that'd be super fun. Where do the crack and go? That's a head scratcher, man.

I don't know what. I still think Paul Maurice ends up there. That's still my prediction. Like, he leaves the Jets after this run and goes. and it's a new challenge. He is never leaving the Jets. He is never leaving the Jets. Any other coach would have been fired 15 times over with Paul Maurice.

But the Jets, ownership specifically, from what I understand, is just like, well, he's a genius. He's the greatest hockey coach in the history of hockey. So he's, like, the extent to which Seattle would have to make it worth his while to leave Winnipeg now, I can't imagine. Especially because, like, they're, you know, they're ostensibly a smart organization, and this is a coach speaking of not really having results. Yeah. So who ends up in Seattle, then? I'm starting to think that the Gerard Gallant thing just is too perfect, and maybe either one or both sides don't even want that to happen.

If I'm Gerard Gallant, I don't want to do that again. Yeah. It's the expectations just maybe get unreasonable. But he's the best coach out there. Yeah, him or Boudreau, right, or the two that you go well. Boudreux, it doesn't seem to be, yeah. I think Boudreux ends up in Buffalo. That's the possibility, yeah.

I think Galant ends up with the Rangers. Yep. I think the coyotes go with some assistant or H.L coach probably. Um, or talk it ends up in Columbus. Yeah. Or, yeah, I like talking to Columbus.

Right. But the other thing to say is with, with Boudreau to Buffalo, they would have to want to spend money on that. And I don't know that they. No, that's true. You know, like I think, is it going to cost a fortune to get Bruce Boudreau?

Like, this guy desperately seems to want to get back in the league and there doesn't seem to be a ton of interest. Is he, like, he's, he's not going to be a top tier. You know, who's even cheaper is Don Granato, where, you know, maybe, maybe you want to say you have a little bit of proof of concept there, but also one of the nine college coaches they've apparently talked to, you know? It's actually only two or three, I think. I know, I love the Don Granado story. Like, I love that he came in and was like, we're going to open it up and be creative and stuff. I don't know how you possibly sell that.

How do you tell a roster that, hey, we're turning a new page. the expectations are going to be high, but this guy coached you to 400 hockey, and that was good enough to... I mean, in Buffalo, that's like all-time great record, though. Yeah, I know, but that's what you got... That's the perception.

You've got to change. Let me run it back. Here's what I think, actually. I think Tocke goes to the Rangers. I think Dave Quinn goes to Columbus. Follows John Davidson. Mm-hmm. Yeah.

I see where... Yeah. I can see that. And I don't know who goes... to the Cracken, man. I'm really, I feel like it's going to be somebody who's already coach him, but if it was one of the guys that's just kind of out there, I don't know where they turn. It's very weird. Very weird that they've waited this long to name somebody. I don't know. Very odd.

All right. Moving on, a couple things real quick. As we're doing the show, big news in the world of college basketball, Mike Shoshchevsky is going to retire. Really? I didn't see this. Jesus. Yeah, Mike Shishvsky, the man himself. Boston Celtics. Just kidding. To run the Celtics, I mean, he's going to retire. Maybe you didn't see that news this morning.

What? Danny A. retiring Grand Stevens upstairs. And Brad Stevens is taking over, right? Yeah. Yeah, Shchevsky's going to retire after the 21, 22 season. Okay. So plenty of time to join the Celtics, then, it sounds like. 74 years old.

Yeah. Man, I hated this guy when I was at Maryland. Sure. Yeah. You constantly You fucking owned you He owned us so bad So that was one big piece of news

That dropped The other big piece of news that dropped It's much more relevant For the three of us Is Bronz Stromen was released by the WWE Yeah Get these hands on some unemployment checks Um

I really think He should just work harder Isn't that what he told all the independent guys Who were Had no money during the I just work harder like he did. Just, it's easy. So I'm sure he'll be fine.

Oh, yeah. I'm sure he's really made great inroads of all the indies having, you know, besmirch them. I feel like, I feel like there was a moment when they could have really turned him into a Hogan-esque giant. Yeah, they didn't want, they clearly didn't know what the fuck to do with him from like day one, basically. Like once, right. No, let me, let me amend that. Once they had him start talking, they were. were like, uh-oh.

You know? And like, they just couldn't, they couldn't, like, do anything with that. And, and, you know, I think, um, obviously not maybe the greatest in-ring performer, but, like, just kind of an exciting, one of those big guys where it's like, well, it's, like, fun to watch him do incredible feats of strength in the middle of the ring. You know what I mean? Like, in much the same way as, like, you know, uh, the big show. And especially when he was.

But the thing with Bronstroman is he should only ever be a heel. He should only ever be a heel because he's big and scary. And like when you're like, and he's actually really nice. It's like, no, I don't think so. Are you saying that having him tag team with a child didn't play into his scary monster? I will. You know what? Let me take that back.

When they did the Mix Tag challenge and he was with Alexa Bliss and like lifting up cars for her for some reason, that was really funny. But like you can't. You also can't have him be like a comedy face either because, again, he's too big and scary. So, like, you know, that can be like a fun diversion for your little Facebook show that they did for a little while there. But he has to be big, scary, mean guy. And he was like, I'm really mad at you for, like, saying I'm stupid or whatever the fuck. And it's like, this doesn't, this doesn't work.

Who's this working for? You know, so, like, I'm shocked only in so far as they, uh, it seems. like he moved a lot of t-shirts for them. But, yeah, like I said, they didn't seem to know what they were doing with them from, like, day one. I think, I wish that they had given him more of a face run and made him more of a Kool-Aid man, you know, breaking through walls. And, like, when he flipped over the ambulance and stuff, it was, like, you could have jerry-rigged a bunch of amazing strength things for him to do. And famously, when you have a big guy break through a wall in professional wrestling, it goes great every time. It does shock the world.

That's for sure. But yeah, Bronz Strumen released. And Alistair Black. Well, and Alistair Black was a weird one because they just started an angle with him. Yeah, he just had him like got on TV again. Yeah. Yeah. Strange.

I don't know. They're doing some weird shit over there. They added a bunch of, like, notable people to their board of directors, including Nick Conn. Former, yeah, well, Jamie Horowitz used to run Fox Sports. And the guy who invented first take. Right. And then I think Erica Nardini is on the board, too, from Barstool.

Like, there's a bunch of real big, interesting media people, and there's speculation that it's kind of like gearing up to Vince, maybe selling the company. Yeah, well, that would explain getting some pretty big, I'm assuming Braun Stromen was getting a shitload of money for. from them because he was like in movies and stuff at this point. So, yeah, I mean, that, that would make sense. You get, you get some of the expenses off the books. You load up on like, oh, we're like a content company.

And here are the people who prove that. And then off you go. Off you go. All right, one last thing before NBC, right? Like, that's what we all think, right? That's possible, right? Kind of feels that way. All right, before we move on to the final stage of the show,

So, 2021 draft lottery is tonight as we do the show from 16 to 1 as far as the odds. Rangers, stars, flyers, flames, Blackhawks, Coyotes, Senators, Canucks, King, sharks, red wings, blue jackets, devils, cracking, ducks, sabers. Ryan, I'll start with you. The draft lottery winner you'd like to see and the funniest draft lottery winner. The answer is Arizona for both of them. They don't have a pick. Correct. Now, why are they in the draft lottery?

I'm not really sure. For anyone who doesn't remember, coyotes have lost their first round pick as punishment for the whole draft combine things, and yet they are still in the draft lottery for some reason. And if they win, they just pick again. Yeah, and my real hope is that they win and then they win again. Like, they have like a 3% chance to, they have like a 3% change.

to win at all. And so like a 3% chance of a 3% chance is like a really, really small. But like how fuck? Because yeah, like they, if Arizona wins, they're like, well, we just do this all again. And this is going to be, of course, on live television. So there's like, uh, we got to load all these ping pong balls back into the hopper. And off we go. Like that rules.

I think that's so cool. And it would rock if it happened because it would just fuck up. And, and of course, piss everybody off. And the added bonus, of course, going, oh, Arizona, you could add the first pick, but the guy, the alpha brain himself couldn't figure out how to not tamper in the NHL combine. Oh, well. Yeah. The thing I'd like to see is the Red Wings winning, where they finally win the lottery and get the first overall pick in a season where there's no consensus franchise player in the draft. Yep.

And then the funniest thing, one, of course, would be the Rangers win again, and it's the same deal where, like, some dude, you know, picks a ball and then he, like, drops it on the floor and then it's ineligible, then he pulls the Rangers ball or some shit. Some Rangers win that involves chicanery. I would just say the only other thing I'll add to that is having one of the teams from 12 down win, because everybody knows that the league changed the rules so that you can only move up 10 spots. but what a lot of people don't seem to realize is that doesn't start this year. That's next year. It starts next year. Being the NHL, they identified a problem, they solved the problem, and then they delayed the solution to the problem. So I would love to see, like, Philadelphia win, and people are like, oh, tough break, what do you mean they're number one?

And then flip out because they didn't actually read the press release all that closely. All right. To finish off the show, we got an overrated, underrated, favorite, least favorite. I will give you the options. You tell me which one you'd like. wrestling finishing moves, Tom Hanks movies, non-hockey sports traditions,

movies of where the soundtrack is better than the film, and in honor of Sean Leahy, who I just had lunch with the other day, boy, there's a name drop. Trail Mix ingredients. I like trail mix ingredients. Me too. It made me laugh too. I agree.

Sean, did they have trail mix in Canada? We do, yes. We just call it. highway I don't know I'm going to say they just call it mix Yeah exactly

All right All right Ryan favorite Trail mix ingredient Well I think Typically we start with Overrated Trail Mix

Oh shit I'm sorry Yeah there's a reason Why it's spelled that way That's right O-U-F-L-F Overrated trail mix ingredient Um I guess I got to say

Coconut Because I don't really like it Hmm The little shreds of coconut not. Yeah. That's it. I don't have anything enough for more to say about that.

Yeah, I'm going to, I will throw my vote in for any, I mean, really any of the, like, little dried apricots or stuff. I'm not a big fan of that. And also the raisins, but, like, they're like the white raisins. Like, come on, you don't, we don't get, they're raisins. We don't need to get fancy. Do you mean the gold? Golden raisins?

Like, yeah. Sure. Okay. Well, I didn't know if you meant like the yogurt-dipped raisins, you know what? Yeah, those are also bad, though. Oh, I totally agree with you. Anything in the raisin family. I will go with raisins as overrated.

As you'll see in a moment, there are many other fruits berries, yeah, that are better than raisins that you could get in there. underrated trail mix ingredient Ryan peanut just a peanut just the humble peanut fucking really good George Washington Carver over here huh wow

that's impressive I'll go similar cashew yeah there you go glue glue guy for the trail mix glue guy he's totally right

don't don't actually don't actually put glue in your trail mix but no forically yeah the Alex coloren of nuts as they say The Phil Hartman of a good...

Underrated for me is cranberries. Like, dried... I mean, you know, cranberries, I don't know what you call them. Like, are they dried, I guess? Yeah, they're raisins, but they're cranberries? Yeah, it's all dried fruit in there, yeah. Yeah, they're fucking phenomenal. And, like, if you swapped out every raisin and a trail mix for a dried cranberry,

then you're doing yourself pretty good. Well, we'll get to that in a minute. I have something else to say about that. Uh-oh. Uh-oh. favorite trail mix ingredient. The humble Eminem. Not bad.

Not bad. You know, I'm going to go with the granola. Just, you know, solid. It needs to be in there. But the Eminem's good, too. My choice is the humble Eminem. And if only because we're doing this in honor of Sean Leahy and Sean Leahy, infamously along with setting the temperature to our rooms at a,

37 degrees would also take all of the M&Ms out of the trail mix that we have in the room And then what, put them aside to eat later or Put them in my pocket

And they melt there Feels good on my thigh Yeah, it's like Sean, I didn't even know you were on the call That's good It's like It's like when you were kidding You just eat all the

All the marshmallows out of the lucky charms That's just good game planning That's right What are you to do? Let your sister get to it first Get out of here Ew, girls are gross. So, all right, Eminem is definitely my favorite.

Least favorite, and I don't like where this is going, Lambert. Least favorite for me has to be dried fruit or raisins, which I guess is technically a dried fruit, because often it is the replacement for the M&M, especially if you're getting into dried berries and stuff like that. Buddy, I'm trying to have a slightly healthier version of M&Ms here. I agree. It's hard to argue with that logic. That's hard to argue. My least favorite is peanuts because it will make one of my children die. But, you know, but Brian does make a good point on the raisins, too.

You really raise the stakes on that one. Yeah. But you feel bad. So. Not having it as your least favorite now. Not really. Yeah. I don't have to worry about these kinds of things. No kids, so it's fine.

Yeah. Yeah. So I think my least favorite from the trail mix that I eat, and by the way, for those I don't know, like Trader Joe's for all your trail mix needs. They have the best trail mix of anything. I don't like dried bananas. I don't think it's, of like all the dried fruit, they're terrible, but you don't often see them in trail mix. So I have to go with a common trail mix ingredient. and while I love cashews and I will tolerate peanuts,

I feel like when it comes to like filler ingredients, the almond is an overused trail mix ingredient and ultimately not amongst my favorites. So I would say least favorite almonds, even though I'll eat them. Also extremely damaging to the environment, the almond takes a lot of water to produce an almond. Wow, they're like the Bitcoin of nuts.

sounds like. You know what? Great way to put it. Perfect. Yeah. Thank you. What's the doge coin of nuts? It'd be something, a nut that Elon Musk invented. Macadamia. It's got a fun name. All right. On that note, that's Bucksoo for this week. Thanks everybody for joining us. I'm Greg. Wysinski. You can read me on ESPN.com. My column runs every Thursday. I didn't get a chance to promote it because I wasn't on the show last week, but if you want to, if you haven't seen it, I wrote a story upon the Vancouver Riot kissing couple and what they're up to these days that ran last week. Still kissing in the street. It's crazy. Traffic's going around. People are being at them. They had a baby together in the street. They didn't leave at all. Yeah. Yeah. It was wild. But yeah, it was a real fun story to report. And you can find it on the ESPN.com. And also check me out.

daily these days, Jesus on Daily Wager on ESPN2. I would hope if that's the freaking name of the show, Daily. Oh, Daily, well, I'm not on it daily. Okay, what if it's the Bill Daily Wager? Is that something? Then it's all advice given off the record and on background. That's right. The NHL is thinking of doing that.

Okay, all right, great. I wonder whether I heard that. I've been told to take Tampa on the puck line, sources say. Okay. All right, guys. E.P.Rinkside.com. You can read all my stuff. I just, we couldn't, we didn't think of it in time for the first round, unfortunately.

But for the second round and beyond, I will be doing what should this team do with its roster now that it's been eliminated from the playoffs for every team that is eliminated for the playoffs. Oh, wow. Would that have been good to think about two weeks ago? Yeah, definitely. Is it too late to change that? Sure is. So check that out. Also, what we learned is on there.

Also, the power feelings is on there. And, of course, if you want to sign up for a year's subscription, use the code. I love EP, all one word, and you will get an extra, I believe, three months for your troubles. So check that out. And then also check out the PuckSoup Patreon. Yes. Yes, sir. Greg perked up because he's like, that's the one I make money on.

Perfect. That's true. I'm not going to lie. You can find my stuff on the athletic. If you have not, you can read my Monday pregame seven slash postgame seven post about the Leafs and join in the almost 500 comment therapy session that it's turned into. I will also have an emergency Maple Leafs-only mailbag tomorrow, and today my annual draft lottery power rankings went up. Wow.

All right, there you go. Good to see Leafs coverage on the Athletic. Finally. Mm-hmm. Anyways. That's fuck's in for this week. To go check out the mailbag on the Patreon, and we thank you for listening.

Take everybody. Bye. See you. Bye-bye. It's in goals and saves and slap shots and goons. We've got sportly commentary to whatever you commute. But we also cover movies, TV shows, it's in tunes. It's your weekly bowl of hockey and nonsense.

Box two.