Puck Soup - Double Fired

Episode Date: March 31, 2026

Sean and Ryan talk about Brad Treliving, the Golden Knights coaching change, potential awards winners, and more.

I'm Ryan Lambert from Elite Prospects. I'm Sean McAnneux from The Athletic. And folks, anything happened this week? Any kind of big news stories occur that maybe affects some people on the show more than others? Any news stories happen that maybe drove another one of the people on this show insane immediately? No? Okay, great. Well, then the podcast is over.

It was pretty quiet. Pretty quiet last few days. Yeah. Which one do you want to do first? We got John Tortorella hired in Vegas after Bruce Cassidy gets the gate. Let's do the Leafs. Let's get it out of the way. Let's do the Leafs.

All right. Well, Brad Trill Living last night, like, I would say 15 minutes before the Leafs game, maybe. As they were doing the pregame skate, they just... Yeah. He was in the press box and a big cane came in and just hooked him around the neck. And now it was about an hour and 15 minutes before. Hour 50. Okay.

That makes all the difference in the world. The biggest game of the Leaf's second half, which is saying absolutely nothing. But yeah, and apparently the story is that kind of the decision had been made. And I guess either they were worried it was leaking out or Trilliving himself said, look, if you're going to do it, just do it. Or some combination of both. Which I can respect. Yeah, I can respect it, but also...

Did we say, did we say, True Living fired? Yeah. Like, did we set that up at the top of the... Brad True Living got fired, folks. It's the Maple Leafs. Nobody ever is unaware of anything that's... It's true. You have no choice.

We will peel your eyeballs back and make you watch. What is it? Due to Vico treatment in Clockwork Orange. Is that what it is? Okay. Good. Something like that. Yeah.

Certainly that combination of letters and whatnot, but I might be getting the exact name wrong. Haven't seen that in a while. Oh, well. I do love the idea that Keith Pelly, the guy who, the president and CEO of MLSC. Yeah. Not of the Leafs themselves because, you know, there's the Leafs need a president of hockey. that's a different job. But I love the idea that he is so,

he is such a tough and intimidating sports guy that even people who are being fired still feel like they can bully him into, that's good. That's a good sign for good old Keith. Yeah. Anyway, I mean, we talked about this last week when we said about coaches getting fired

and stuff like that. But this felt like a, inevitability. And... I mean, it should have felt that way. I'm not sure it completely did in Toronto, just because...

The human shield of the coach? Well, that and Pelley is such a, like, empty shell of a suit that it's like... It wasn't impossible to imagine him getting essentially tricked by a smooth-talking GM.

Lucky for him, Toronto did not have one of those. Yeah. He had a GM who was like, you know, you can actually fire me early. Oh, okay. Good play, good gambit. That's good negotiating, man.

Good job, Brad. Oh. So, but it should have been obvious. It should have been of it. Like Brad Tillup Trilliving did not do a good job in Toronto. He had three years. Nope. That's not a ton of time, but it's enough time to make.

to make an evaluation. So this should not have been a hard call. The timing is, on the one hand, look, if you're, if you've made up your mind to do it, do it now rather than wait till the end of the season, that gives you a couple weeks head start on the process, whatever. On hiring Peter Chiarelli or whatever, yeah. Don't even, Ryan, don't, don't, don't even joke.

It's going to happen, brother. But obviously it also raises the question of if you were going to do it now, why not do it a month ago? Why not? Why did you let Brad Tre Living handle the deadline? I don't know. I think you got to make the decisions when you make them. And it's not like they were obviously going to fire True Living and then hire a full-time GM. So I think whether it was him or some interim,

whoever at the deadline, I don't think honestly makes that much of a difference. Well, I'll say last night I did see, I think it was a Vancouver reporter, say I had heard that Truliving tried to make a couple of deals that he was told he was not allowed to make at the deadline. All right. Well, I mean, there were, yeah, and there were reports, again, that Pellie is, was, was kind of, of hands on at the deadline. Yeah. Who knows what that means? I have, you know, I think anyone who's worked in the real world has had bosses that really wanted

to be involved and really came in and, you know, maybe got their hands on things they shouldn't have, but they really wanted to. And we've also had that exact same scenario where it was easy enough to trick a guy. Like you give him an unplugged laptop and tell him to type and he just goes in a corner and, you know, plays NHL 2005 with GM mode turned on and gets very excited because he just traded for Sidney Crosby. And you pat him on the head and go about your business, bud. Yeah. So. I'm super stoked for the Keith Pellier. Can you tell? Can you tell that I'm really buying into what this guy is selling? this this to me

it's always good when there is like a boogeyman above the GM that like fans can really target and go no this guy's the problem right this is this is the uh when it was Kyle Dubus and Lou Lamarillo and you would just go they would sign some some shitty guy and people go fucking Lou Lamarillo and then they would sign some like mediocre like AHL guy with upside there go Kyle's done it again folks

You know? Yep. So this is actually great news for whoever they hire as the next GM. Because we can just go, anytime there's a thing that I don't like, I can just go, Keith Pelley is fuck me one more time. I can't believe it. This is the worst thing that ever happened to me. I hate this guy.

Yep. Well, the fun thing is, is Pellie apparently had to, after sitting down in a bunch of closed door meetings with various people. on the team, which I actually don't mind. I've seen some people kind of roll their eyes at, like, how many meetings do you have to have to find out that Bradshire Living's not doing a great job? Sure. I don't, you know, I don't mind, I don't mind the boss sitting down one-on-one with people and, you know, getting some honest feedback.

Yeah, that's like his job. No, his job is shaking the Maple Leafs until millions and millions of dollars fall into Rogers' pockets. Mm-hmm. And that's it. great news yeah um but this this idea that after doing all that he had to then go hat and to like the rogers bosses and be like can i please fire the gm who's done a terrible job and they're like we'll consider it and then eventually came down from the mountain with a tablet that said go ahead it's a great it's a smoothly run organization and they're super well positioned

for success in the future. Well, okay, so I did want to talk about that. The headline in The Athletic this morning, I think said something along the lines of Brad Trill Living took the Maple Leafs backwards. And I think there's no denying that that's all he did, right? Like, there's no, like, kind of even moral victory. Oh, they made it to the second round, that one, whatever. Like, that's who fucking cares, you know?

they don't have Mitch Marner. They got older, slower, and worse. They made a bad coaching hired that obviously hasn't worked out. And worst of all, nobody fought Radco Gudis. You know what I'm saying? Like, this is just, it's not just that he made the roster worse or emptied the cupboard of picks and prospects and all that. It's that he did all that And also the vibes are fucking horrible

Yeah, he he did all that in the name Of addressing what he perceived to be a problem And I don't necessarily think too many fans would disagree with that perception But completely failed to solve that problem Yes Like just absolutely Did not Move the needle

one bit. This is like me taking a sledgehammer to my house and you're like, what are you doing? And I was like, you don't understand the plumbing in my house is terrible. I have to do this. And then like, when I've finally burned the house to the ground, you're like, hey man, can I use your bathroom? And I was like, I don't have running water in my house. Yeah, I was going to compare it to like, there's a flickering light in my house. And so I just decide, well, I, look, I kind of know how electricity works. I'll just get in there with a pair of pliers and maybe a screwdriver and I'll figure it out. And then I get like zapped across the room by all that voltage. And then I'm like, oh, well, look, if you're just going to electrocute me, electrocute me already. What are we doing here?

Yeah. God. You don't have the guts to fight your fire. Get out of here. It's not even like you don't have the guts to do it. It's just like, okay, Brett, you can just resign. You know, he's doing the, I can't quit, you fire me. How about we're doing it on my terms?

But of course, I mean, as much as I'll criticize Pelley, he can't really say that because obviously true living will just turn around and leak it to the media and then it's, then you're getting ripped for how do you let this leak out in advance of, I don't know. So let me ask you. Everybody looking out for themselves. on even on the way out the door. Yeah, of course. Let me ask you this, though.

What do you think the edict is for the next general manager of the Toronto Maple Leafs, whoever that may be Peter Chiarelli? I think that if there is an edict, that that's probably a bad place to start. Like, the edict should be we're going to hire the best guy with the best plan. if you're narrowing it down to start with saying we will not rebuild, we want to be in the playoffs next year. So therefore, we will only seriously consider candidates who tell us that that's a realistic option. You're already starting with an 02 count. Sure.

Now, it absolutely might be that still. I mean, this is Toronto, the difference between making the play. and not is a big deal. Although I got to say, like, this is one of these things that bugs me being a leaf fan is you can feel the dial being turned right now to, ha, ha, the dumb leaves aren't going to do what they need to do because they love that playoff money

and they love those TV ratings and they got to sell jerseys and it's all about the bottom line. And it's like, yeah, haven't you guys spent the last however many years telling us that actually, the Leafs don't care about winning because they already make so much money. And so they don't need to win and that's why other teams are better. Like, which way, it's the same deal as like, you know, Leaf fans are too demanding, but they're also dumb sheep who fill the building.

And so both ways are the reason that the Leafs will never win anything. Like, this team makes a ton of money. It would make a ton more money if they could win. It's just a question of, are they like, Can they pass the, what's the marshmallow test of, you know, are you willing to wait a year or two in order to maybe build something that can be a sustained winner long term, or does it have to be right now? And that's the same thing that front office is in all sorts of sports,

in all sorts of markets, big and small face. But it's going to be an interesting question. And I mean, honestly, they don't. don't have their next couple of draft picks, so that complicates it. You know, I mean, you can't come in and go, like, we're just going to rip it to the studs and pick first next year. Well, I got bad news for you. You're not going to. Well, the thing, no, yeah.

The thing is, I don't, I don't know that it's up to them. I think it's up to Austin Matthews. Because if he's sitting there going, fuck, man, another GM, the team stinks. It's not getting better anytime soon. like some kind of a huge reworking of the roster, in my opinion. You know, like, does Austin Matthews not just go, fucking get me out of here this summer? Like, I think it's, you know, again, we've had the, the insiders talking about the possibility of that even before the GM got fired, even before they were like, I guess they're not technically mathematically eliminated, but they're eliminated from the playoffs, you know? Like, wasn't this a discussion around the Olympic break that this might happen?

Because it was just trending in that direction. Yeah. Well, I mean, he's, Osamaathies, his two years left on his contract. Yep. And then he's a UFA. So he's no, I mean, God knows you and I have had more than our share of conversations about the Connor McDavid scenario. I got to eat my own dog food here, man. Yeah, the chickens are coming home to roost.

The leafs are in the exact same situation. maybe worse with their guy. So, you know, that's, that is, that, that's part of the question. And it was, you know, the, the Racco Goodus thing plays into that, not so much in the response or lack thereof. I mean, maybe Austin Matthews cares about that. Maybe he doesn't. But just in the fact that it,

because it ended his season early, it sort of started the process early. There have been a lot of talk that, you know, he's going to get to the end of the sea, and then in April you start having those conversations. Well, I mean, they could have been having them now, although now the people who will be part of making the decision are 2BD right now. Yep. So I guess to wrap this part of it up, what, give me on a 1 to 10 scale, I suppose. of like your optimism for the Leafs and, you know, maybe who you think is going to be in the running for this one.

Yeah. It's the optimism thing is tough, honestly, because, and this is me, this is, this is fan, Sean, not analyst or, you know, whatever else, pundit. just purely as a fan, I got to tell you, man, I do not give a shit about these guys anymore. I could not, I could not be less interested

in any of this. And you can't say they didn't earn that. Let me, like, what times the Blue Jay game tonight? I'll watch, I've been, you know, I'm watching other games, not just because it's my job

to watch games that matter, but because, like, what do I want to watch a, what do I want to watch a Leafs game? And so it's tempting to turn around and based on that go, oh, my optimism is zero. But look, they're in better shape

than a lot of teams have been. They are far from a worst case scenario right now. As far as talent that they do have, resources that they have, the attractiveness of the job,

which, you know, frankly, is probably an advantage. I mean, yes, there may be some really good candidates who would not pick up the phone if they saw 416 area code, but an awful lot would. So, you know, my optimism is maybe closer like a three or a four out of ten than a zero. But again, like this whole, we're right back to this,

this is a big billion dollar corporation. It's structured that way. There's committees and there's panels and there's boards and nobody knows who's allowed to actually make a decision. And I don't know. I mean, I don't think they're going to get it right, but I also, you know, I can't be completely sure that they won't get it right enough.

Who do I think? I mean, there's kind of two options. I think one is you go out and you get an, experienced GM. Obviously, Doug Armstrong's name has come up already. Oh, that would be funny, man. The other way you could do it is you get a experienced or at least a, like a well-known figure in as president of hockey ops, basically the Brennan Shanahan. Yep.

And then you recreate the early years of the Brennan-Shannahan era, which were a great secret. success in the sense that, okay, now you can bring in guys, but you also do have the ability to bring in whoever this year's version of Kyle Dubas is the younger guy, fresh set of eyes, that kind of new approaches, that kind of thing, who can kind of be hidden behind the bigger name. You can't, I don't think you could hire a Kyle Dubas, and again, I'm talking like the 2015 version in Toronto and just have him be the guy. Yeah. You need that, you need somebody to be the shield.

So I don't know. I mean, who knows what they'll do? It would be cheaper to just hire a GM, and maybe that's Keith Pelley's main concern. I don't know. It'd be great to see the penny-pinching era of the Toronto Maple Leafs. Well, we've kind of already seen it. Like, that's all reports have been for the last year that there's been a lot of that.

I mean, this is... Well, I meant in like full force, though. You know what I mean? Like, there's spending to the cap and then there's cheaping out on a GM and a coach and all that kind of stuff. Coach still has his job, by the way. I mean, the coach has fired the second the season ends. Dead man walking, yeah, for sure. You're not losing anything by keeping Craig Burube for the next eight games.

I don't understand why that's an issue for some people. You're losing roughly six to eight more games, I would say. But sure. Got to improve that Bruins draft position, you know. I honestly, at this point, just finish seventh last and just give the Bruins their pick. I almost feel like it's better to take your medicine now. Because remember, if they, it's not like if they finish bottom five, they're not giving up a pick anymore. It just means the Bruins pick and then the Flyers pick kick forward a year with no protection.

So now you've, you know, I'd. I'd almost rather just give the pick to the Bruins. Now the Flyers own your pick next year. Maybe that gives you one year to see if we can get back into the playoffs at least and look like a team on the way to a cop. And then if not, then you can do the full tear down. Because at least you have your full, you got your picks back. Right.

Yeah, I don't, I mean, they were always going to give the six or seventh pick to the Bruins. Anyone who thought otherwise was maybe not paying attention to this team. They're not going to, they weren't going to fall enough to pick top five on their own. Probably not. What did you think of the game last night, by the way? Boy, they were really mad at that one guy. Oh, they taught him a lesson. Yeah.

Let's see if the ducks ever do that again, knowing that they will have to fight one time, three seconds into the game, and then play. And that, a completely normal game for the rest of the. No, you're not, you're not, look, I understand you're not wanting to be charitable to the Maple Leafs that this. point in time, but you're not going to tell me there was that other scrum where a guy took his helmet off? Yeah. Well, I mean, there's... No further question.

The one guy... The one quasi-tuff guy did rough up a linesman, so that's... That's good. And then they came back in one. And I did... My only regret with Brad Trillivan being fired is that that was the entire conversation after the game for obvious reasons, which means we didn't get to... here like John Tavares or William Deland or whoever talk about like the moral victory

of coming in and getting two points and how that was their revenge and all this other crap uh that would have been fun yeah I agree I'll give you I'm gonna give Max Stowe me a little bit of credit he did seem like the one guy who actually that Justin Bourne had a great tweet where he said, you know, we're going to find out, and this was before the game, we're going to find out if the Leafs want to clean the room or if they just want Mom to stop nagging them to clean their room. And I think Max Domi actually seemed like a guy

who kind of wanted to clean his room. Remember he's apparently good friends with Awesome Matthews and all that stuff. Right. Whereas everyone else, it was just like, I, oh, right, a scrum, I got to go in there and like rub a guy's face and make sure I'm seen to do that.

Yeah, this is like the mandatory meeting, like attendance is mandatory, but you can't stop me from looking at my phone the whole time. Mm-hmm. Yeah. So, yeah, like, it's, this is a tough one because it just felt like it was a long time coming. And there's not really much to get fired up about here because of that, right? Like, you can't, you can't get, why they wait so long? We know why they waited so long. You know, like.

it's this is just the business that they had to do they did the business and the real interesting thing is what happens next. So I can't get too fired up one way or the other about Brad for living. I can't, you know, I'm not like a genius for saying the day they hired him. I don't think this is going to work out. You know, like I saw what happened in Calgary, all the stuff. And again, you have to say some of the stuff that. went bad in Calgary, not his fault. Guys just didn't want to play there for a bunch of different reasons.

I get all that. But just like didn't build a particularly competitive team and either stop. And so this means, of course, that he'll be out of a job maybe as many as three months before getting another GM kick. Yeah, but see, the thing is, Leif's G. Leafs, GMs and coaches don't get hired. Like, Toronto is the last place you go. And then you fail so utterly that... What about Kyle Dubus, though, you know?

Yeah, Kyle Dubus was young. And Sheldon Keefe. Those are the two young guy. And, I mean, Keith. How the devil's doing? Oh. Aren't they hot right now? Yeah.

Just in time to really move out of that top, like, six draft position or whatever they were in, you know? Sure. But yeah, let's move over then to another team that's really making some big moves at this time of the year. The Vegas Golden Knights, Bruce Cassidy out, John Tortorelli, in with eight games left in the season. I was just sitting down in my seat at the NCAA regionals when this happened. And the whole press box was like, huh? And I think that's basically everybody's reaction. Yeah, that was pretty kind of nailed it.

Yeah, it's a stunner. Primarily because of the timing, right? I mean, coaches getting fired with eight games left on playoff teams. That being the key qualifier is quite rare. Certainly is, yeah, of course. Now, the fact that it's Vegas doing it, I don't think was super surprising. Yeah, when we talked about coaches getting fired,

I think what you said was Vegas wouldn't do it, but also they might and like only because they're Vegas. Yeah. And I'm not completely sure Tortorella doesn't get fired in the next four days. Like I wouldn't bet my life on that because, yeah, it's, this is a, I think I wrote in the newsletter. Like every single team in the league, and we've touched on this before,

but they're always going on and on about identity and culture. And it's always the same. Every one of these teams is trying to build the exact same unique identity as every other team in the league has. Yep. And then their culture is just winning. You know, like whatever. You got to say Vegas has an identity.

They certainly do. There's no two ways about that. might be the only team in the league. And I think, I mean, you could argue the two Florida teams, I think, as well. But where you could say, I could write a couple of bullet points describing this team's identity, and you would know who I mean. Now, is it the right one? Is it a smart one? Well, I mean, they've done a lot of winning.

But, yeah, it's tough. man, this is a cutthroat team and I guess now we see. You know, you never know what's going on fully behind the scenes and all of that but I mean, Bruce Cassidy's a real good coach.

Yep. But when you're despite Bruce Cassidy being a really good coach and despite having a roster that on paper looks like a contender and certainly looks like it should be in having no problem with that terrible division this year,

they weren't headed in that direction. So, yeah, I mean, I guess maybe something has to change. And look, if you're sitting there, if you're Kelly McCrimmon going, man, if we're losing the first round, I'm firing Bruce Cassidy. Well, I don't know. Do you make the move early and try not to lose in the first round? I guess the question is only if there's an upgrade. And they, you know, Pete DeBore is on everyone's list.

Can't do that in Vegas, presumably, because he's the guy you fired to bring in Cassidy. It'd be funny if they did, but. Well, I mean, I think you could make an argument, the three, the three best candidates. Yeah, a million percent. Cassidy, DeBore, and Gerard Gallant. And it could be, and Tororell is only an interim coach. we could have four Vegas Golden Knight coaches

as like the leading coaching candidates in the summer after Vegas hires Rick Bonas away from Columbus for $8 million a year on a seven-year contract and then fires them two weeks into the season. I remain fascinated

with the fact that Vegas continues to operate this way and yet players love going to Vegas and signing long-term contract. and being like, this is where I will raise my family. And it's like, dude, are you not paid any... They knifed Mark Andre Fleury.

What do you think they're going to do to you after two years? Well, first of all, they sorted him, and we all remember that. That's good point, yeah. But it's funny the thing you said about something needed to change. Because I... This was my immediate reaction to... to this coach firing. Look up their record after the Olympic break.

It was one of the worst in the league. And then look up their stats after the Olympic break. They were ninth in all situations expected goals percentage, dead last in shooting percentage, and third last and save percentage. And it's like, okay, I know it needs to change here. You said Bruce Cassidy is a good coach, not good enough.

He didn't sell the goalies, maybe try stopping 88% of the shots instead of 86. Yep. 88 gets you into that like mid-tier conversation. They 862 save percentage in all situations, and that probably includes some empty netters or whatever, but 862 in all situations since the end of the Olympic break and before last night. I cracked it. I know what the problem is here, you know? You just, and then it's tortarella, right?

a guy who you think him and Mitch Marner are going to get along? I mean, look, the whole everybody hates playing for Tortorella thing is overblown because. It is. Sure it is. Also, I don't know. Marner might do fine with him. I mean, he's going to remind Marner of what he grew up with. And Mitch Marner did great under Mike Babcock, right?

That ended well. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. Okay. Mitch is a guy who, like, if there's one thing he loves, it's honest, direct feedback. You know, if you've got criticism of him, just look him right in the eye and tell him, and he definitely won't cry. No, he responds well to it.

You know what I'm fascinated by is, and it's not locked in yet, but an Oilers Golden Knights first round series. Mm-hmm. is going to be so interesting because you have two teams that both had kind of the same two problems. Our goaltending stinks and were not sold on the coach, right? I mean, you listen to some of the comments in Edmonton the last little while about Chris Knoblock. Clearly, there's questions there. So, you know, at a very high level, the same two problems for both of these very similarly situated teams. And one team went out and got a goalie and kept the coach.

And one team went out and got rid of the coach and kept the goalie. The complete opposite scenarios. And now they're, knock on wood, going to play in the first round in a series where... It's certainly looking. The losing team will be. be disaster. It will be utter disaster for whichever one of those teams goes out in the first round of the playoffs in the weakest division in recent memory.

Yeah. Can't wait? The other thing is, the other thing is about Vegas, though, is that, like, they lost arguably their best defenseman for the year, like, right, you know, in September or whatever, I think they announced it. Like, it was a lot, it was before the season started, certainly. And, um, they didn't do anything about that. Well, I mean, they, they did went out, they got Rasmus Anderson, who has not been good there.

Nope. Beyond that, I mean, I don't know really, like, how do you replace a guy like that? Petriangelo is. Oh, yeah, for sure. But, like, like, I mean, that is a pretty big. It's a pretty big drop, but yeah, I hear you. Like, that is, I do feel like we almost skip over that a little bit too much when we're talking about Vegas. There's not a ton of teams that could lose their best defensemen.

But we'll see. And apparently, I don't know if you saw there's a few mentions today of Mark Stone being pretty beat up. You know, Mark Stone pretty beat up? That never happens. Are you sure? Well, but to the extent that, and I can't, I think it may have been Drager, apologies if I'm misattributing, but suggesting that maybe even, like, this could be a situation where he's going to just do whatever he can the rest of the year, and then next year might be a question mark.

Wow. So, yeah, I mean, it's, you know, all the more reason to grind while you can, you know, and you never know what's, as a team, I'm saying here, you never know what's, you never know what's, what next year is going to look like. But, oh, well. Luckily, I don't care anymore, so it's... Yeah. No, it's, it's, uh, it's inter, you know, like, the thing with Vegas was that they really did build a lot of their team around, like, guys who were either at or approaching, uh, like, free agent status, which means we're dealing with a lot of, like, 27,

28, 29 year old guys a lot of the time and occasionally like a, a youngster like Jack Eichel, who was like whatever, 25 when they got my thing. 26 with a broken neck. Yeah. Yeah. And so you look at the average age on this team and you're like, maybe they don't have that many years of really being able to keep doing this left. I know, you know, we can make all the, all the comments we want about like how ruthless they are.

But let's see, three guys, four guys have full no move. A couple have full no trade. I'm sorry, not a couple, five have full no trade. And one, two, three, four, five more have partial no trade. And they're all like 28, 29, 30. I mean, obviously, like veterans are the guys who get those, obviously. But here's the thing that is, what do you think is going to happen? if the Golden Knights decide,

I don't know, pick whichever one of those guys you want. They just decide, you know what, we're going to move on from Thomas Hurdle, a guy that I forgot was on the Golden Knights. Yeah, well, and, you know, they're going to move on. And he's like, I have a no trade. Do you think Kelly McCormons going to be like,

oh, okay, my mistake? Or do you think Kelly McCormon's going to be, like, start mailing him, like, fingers from his fans. family members until he agrees to leave. But, I mean, the fact that the fact is that 15 players on this team have some form of movement protection. And again, it's almost all their most expensive players, right? The, the move, a couple of them are actually expiring this year, Anderson, Riley Smith,

Brandon Sodd. But again, it's just a complicating factor. You can only, how many of those do you think they could, they could, plausibly move over the next like three three years let's say it's not 15 it's not 12 no and so you know I we it is going to be interesting at some point to see what the Vegas market looks like with a rebuild or with a if they have to rebuild yeah at least yep no we haven't got there yet I mean you know if the NBA is there and everything who knows but that's that's that's for well down the line Anderson's such an interesting one right because when they trade it for him we all

went, oh, okay, so seven-year contract incoming, of course. He certainly seemed to feel that way. And he hasn't been very good there, and they have not signed him. And they gave up a lot to get him, but you wonder, do they walk away or do they, I don't know. We'll see. It's certainly interesting. The other thing I wanted to quickly say, though, is you said they didn't go out and get a goalie. They went and got Carter Hart and that like he sucked and then got hurt.

Okay. So. Well, I mean, they did try. But it's not like you, I mean, you know, it's not like they just had like a Logan Thompson sitting around that they could have. Yeah. No, and I mean like. Autographs literally at their draft. The thing that the thing that kind of is part and parcel with the ruthlessness of it all is like you will make a mistake on that.

front sometimes. You know what I mean? Like, you will pick the wrong goalie to keep. You will send a guy away. I mean, look at the Leafs with Bobby McMahon, right? Like, top five player in the league since they fucking traded him, Bobby McMahon, you know? And you're going to make that mistake sometimes as you're selling things off. And honestly, it's probably not even a mistake all the time, except if you're trying to be

competitive. Because, like, was, let's pretend Bobby McMahon was on Vegas and they had traded him. Was Bobby McMahon, given the makeup of their roster, going to get the opportunities he's getting now? No, so that's why he's doing that. Remember Ryan Donato? They put him on Chicago. He scored 30 goals out of nowhere. He was like, what the fuck happened?

I don't know. He got an opportunity and got lucky. And now, you know, he made a bunch of money. Good for him. So that's all kind of part of that for sure. But again, I just keep circling back to like, Eichl has an extension that kicks in next year. And it's $13.5 million.

And he's going to be 30 years old. Wow. Okay. You know, Mitch Marner, new contract, obviously. Mark Stone's only got like a year left after this one. So maybe, like if we're saying he's, you know, hitting Robida Island or whatever, like, that sucks, but he's also 33 and has a long history of injury problems.

So you live with that. Hurdle's 32. William Carlson's 33. Petrangelo's 36. Shea Theodore's 30. Noah Hanifan's going to be 30. Bradine McNabb's 35. You know, Aiden Hill is going to be 30.

And at a certain point, like you say, they have to pay. pivot off this. And then what happens with this franchise? I don't know the answer. Very interesting to think about. And yet, despite everything we just said, if we're sitting here in two months doing a Golden Knights Lightning Stanley Cup final preview, like, would you really be that shocked? Yeah, I would.

Really? I'm not that I would. They beat the crappy Oilers. They rolled the ducks with the map. The goaltending stinks. They got to an exhausted Dallas stars, and now they're in the final. And Jack Eichel is the consmite candidate and, you know, all the, I could see it. It's the goaltending problem for me.

Like, I just, I don't trust Aiden Hill. And I don't think they've trusted Aiden Hill, like, since they won the cup. But they were just like, well, we gave him all that money. He's got to be the guy. Mm-hmm. So. And, look, I mean, yeah, I've. Goalie wins a Stanley Cup for me.

I'm giving him pretty much whatever he wants to. I get it. I'm not saying like they shouldn't have done it, although, you know, hindsight's 2020. You know what I'm saying, brother? Mm-hmm. Anyway, I guess that's it. I don't, you know, like Tortorella, I think, again, like, vibes-wise, you just go, really, that's the guy you're picking?

But if you're, if you're mad, at the team for underperforming. It's funny because like you go, okay, usually the way GMs think in this league is like, okay, the team wasn't responding to the kind of hard-ass coach. He had to go. Let's bring in a more like player-friendly guy.

This one, they were like, team wasn't responding to the hard-ass coach. Here's an even harder-ass coach. The next. Hardest of all possible asses. Yeah, the next guy they're bringing in is Arleigh Irmi, if I can continue making fucking Kubrick references on this episode. Like, are you, like, are you fucking kidding me that this is the move?

Again, like, I just, I'm not saying that, that Tortorella is even like a bad coach. Like, I've long since abandoned that, that kind of position. I just don't like, I don't get why this is the higher. Yeah. Well, I mean, if Tortorella has a reputation of being a guy who, who doesn't have a long shelf life. And again, that's a little iffy because he was in Columbus for a while.

He was in Columbus for a really long time. Yeah. So, but, I mean, if you're going to bring in a guy with the eight games left in a season, you're not too worried about, you know, to borrow from Dave Nones, I don't think they're too worried about year four on this one. Mm-hmm, totally.

Worried about game four. And, yeah, maybe Tortorella can... just gets their attention. I don't know. It's tough to say. Do you think Tortor else the coach opening night in Vegas? I do not. Wow.

I just, I guess what, I guess the reason why is I feel like there's going to be a lot of teams turning over their coaches this summer, you know? And in that case, why not, why not look at all your options? And if you're doing that, does he want, does he then go,

well, I guess I'll stick around and, you know, go through the whole process, like, re-interview, basically. I don't think that happens. You know, that's basically my little take on that. So. Okay. I guess it wouldn't surprise me, but I, I mean, it's going to depend on how they do. Yeah, of course. I mean, it's, if they.

And again, I don't think they're going to do well. Who knows? Yeah. Tortorella does seem like the kind of guy who'd love Vegas, like just the, you know. I think he goes at home and sits in like a dark room. Like, I don't. He's going to, like. Now he's going to sit in a dark room that's vaguely illuminated by neon lights in the distance.

That's right. Yeah. And just pet his dog. Guy loves dogs. And hey, me too, you know. There you go. All right. why don't we take a break and we'll come back and we'll talk about some awards stuff.

All right, we're back. And like I said, we're going to do awards talk. And what I guess what's been interesting about the last little while here is awards that felt like they were kind of locked up don't anymore. And then other awards just went from like, yeah, we're pretty sure to guarantee no question about it. And I guess the number one award on that front is. the Calder. Right? Matthew Schaefer's

winning this thing. Ivan Demandau, you had a great season. Take a fucking hike, man. We don't want to hear from you. You see what this kid's doing down on Long Island?

It's crazy. And, you know, this is what it feels like to me with Matthew Schaefer. He is going to get the Bobby Orr treatment of, clearly this is one of the best defensemen in the league as a rookie.

We cannot, give him the Norris. However, next year he will be in the Norris conversation, regardless of whether he's good. Forever and ever. Yeah. He's going to get some Norris votes. Oh, for sure he is, yeah.

I wonder, I think the only thing left is going to be, does he win unanimously? And I guess my message under fans would be like, just be cool about that, man. There's 200 voters. And many of them live in Montreal. Some of them might live in Montreal. And that's never been a problem for any other awards votes before, right?

No. I'm trying to remember. No, I guess Montreal voters have always been really normal about stuff. Yeah, they're cool. So, I don't know what, like, when he gets 198 out of 200 votes, can we maybe not do the burn somebody at the stake thing. But I do think the people who vote against him should have to write columns justifying it. That's kind of the only reason you do it, right?

Yeah, but they don't always do the columns. They should have to do the columns. Mandatory column. That's what I'm saying. Like, if you go against the grain that hard, like, you should have to explain yourself. It's that simple. And, you know, I'd like. I'd love to see someone try to make the argument that he wasn't the best rookie in the league this year.

Is there ever been a unanimous winner of the Calder in the... I have no idea. I'm just trying to think who... I can't imagine. I don't think so, but... I cannot imagine, but... You're with me on this one? It's Schaefer, and, you know, we could have said that like 40 games ago?

Yes. Okay, great. What about... This is the other one that feels kind of luck. up until last night, quite frankly, the Vezna. Okay. Feels like everybody has really coalesced around Ilya Sorokin, no problems here. And then he goes and gives up many goals last night.

Yeah, that was not great. I mean, I think if the Islanders, I think the Islanders probably have to make the playoffs, even though it's, you know, obviously there's nothing in the award description that mentions at and not even in like the hard trophy kind of way. But it's still the GMs who vote on this. They are very much winner-brained. I could see, you know, if he misses the playoffs by a point or makes it by a point, I could see that making a big difference.

I'm not saying it should. But that might make the difference between this is up for grabs and it's not. It's interesting to me because I look at like who the other. candidates would be, and it's really just Andre Vasselowski, and maybe Logan Thompson, but it doesn't look like the caps are going to make the playoffs, so you run into the same problem.

Shisterkin's been good, but obviously not there's no chance. I honestly feel, though, like being a good goalie on a last place team might get you votes beyond being the same goalie on a team. Yeah, I get what you're saying. You know what I mean? Like, I'm not saying it makes sense,

but Colorado guys are are splitting the both the votes and the net too much. Yep. And like Jeremy Swamen, I guess, could be in the conversation. But it's

he's kind of in the same boat as Sorokin and that he's been great. Um, and his team's been kind of mediocre. Right. And then you also wonder about,

does the Schaefer bump like hurt or help Sorokin. You know, like, oh, what a great pair they've been. They're kind of like co-MvPs of the Islanders. Or how hard could it be to be Helia Soroka? You're behind that Schaefer kid. You've seen this kid play? I'll just say if we're already, and it's different voters, but if we're already discounting

Ilya Syroken because of Matthew Schaefer, then he better get some Norris and hard votes. Sure. Because that's an insane thing to say about a teenage rookie. but yeah, you might be right. Did I say, God, somebody tweeted it out that the Islanders have saved like 60 more goals than expected this year. And Sorokin has 54 of those. And that was before last night or this is after last night's.

He gave up seven on 28. Like, he was running away with it until he had the worst game of. maybe anybody all season of like he played almost the full game. And now he's three goals behind Logan Thompson for most saved above expected. But yeah, it felt like I said, like until last night, if they had, you know, the extra two points in the standings, we'd be talking about them maybe a little bit differently at this time of year, blah, blah, blah, blah. It felt like it was sewn up. Now it doesn't. Are there any other awards you feel like, you know, let's all go home, we're all set here?

Of the awards that I care about? Sure. No, I wouldn't. I don't think there are. And I think that's cool. The Norris is, I mean, it's kind of been Kail McCars all year. Now, he got hurt last night. We don't, at this point, no how seriously.

They were up. I don't think that would affect. 37 to 1. Well, I think if he missed, like, if he were to get shut down for the rest of the season, and there's no indication that's likely. But that could, I could see that opening door back up a little bit more for the Quinn Hughes and the Zach Werenski seems to be getting a kind of a late push. Zach Werenski does seem to be the guy who has, I don't even want to say like,

he's worked his way back into the conversation, because he was in the conversation last. year as well, right? And if we're saying that it's some sort of a combination of Hughes, McCar, Werencki, that's basically what it was last year, wasn't it? Trying to remember. Yeah. I don't remember if those were the exact three finalists, but they may have been. Werenzki definitely was.

Yep. So, you know, it's interesting because, like, I, To me, I feel like the McCar talk has actually kind of dropped off recently. For mostly because I think the Werenski talk has picked up. But again, they're not going to make the playoffs it looks like at this point. But like Mo Cider, like that guy really deserves a lot of like, they're not going to make the playoffs so he won't even get. But like he deserves borderline MVP conversation for me. And it's not going to happen.

So I'm starting to lean Werenski on this one, unlike which way the voters will go. I don't have a vote, but I think the voters are going to go like, you know what, two years, one year we could kind of discount as a fluke, two years in a row for Werenzki. Okay, big dog, you earned it, you know. Yeah. It's very interesting.

If they get into the playoffs, it's not even that people treat the Norris as like a, you got to get in the playoffs. But if in any world where the Blue Jackets make the playoffs, that is also a world where the Blue Jackets are playing a lot of high-profile games down the stretch, winning, presumably most of those games. You would certainly imagine Warensky would be a big part of that. Like, you know, the recency effect kicks in, especially for going,

we'll kind of get to this with the heart as well. But I think sometimes when a guy's been the favor of it all year long, voters just kind of shut off and they're like, yeah, all right, he's a lock. But sometimes they get a little bored of guys. I think it's happening a bit with Nathan McKinnon. Oh, we'll get to that discussion in a minute for sure. That could help Werenzki.

Yeah, maybe this is in play. And it wouldn't be on dessert, like, to be clear. I'm not, this isn't like, no, he's been great this year. To find somebody, you know, just because, like, he would be a very worthy recipient. And again, it's like, it's that thing of like the vibes might screw him because they're losing a lot down the stretch. And if they don't make the playoffs, he maybe doesn't win it.

But it's, you know, we're talking about razor thin margins at this point, aren't we? Well, let's see here. They are currently in the playoffs, but the senators and the Red Wings and the Flyers are all two points behind with a game in hand. So, you know, who do we think is trending up? Who's trending down there? Could determine who wins the Selke or the Norris. But now since I said Selky, you have any thoughts on the Selky? Not really mainly because, like, in past years where I have voted, that's always the hardest one.

Of course it is. And it's one word. Like, you have to really sit down and dig through some stuff. and because I usually don't vote, I haven't done that yet or at all. Well, you know, it's one of those. Nico Hyshow who thought would be the guy or Sam Reinhardt.

And I don't think it's either of them. Is it just, is it Nick Suzuki? Is he going to kind of get the, hey, Montreal's cool and you're a good two-way player? Yeah. I'm looking at forward, like, war numbers on evolving hockey right now. And Nick Suzuki is ninth among forwards in defensive wins added above replacement. And everybody ahead of him, you know what?

I say that. Sam Reinhart and A2 Lister Rinen are both ahead of him. But that team's not making the playoffs where we're off that, you know. I'll just read you the guys ahead of him. Noah Cates, everybody knows who that is from the Flyers, of course. Jordan Cairo, which is really funny, considering how he gets talked about. Jack Drury, Yoel Kiveranta, two guys from the Avs, Cole Perfetti, Lister Rinen, Reinhardt, and then Kyler Yamamoto. So I'm thinking, come on down, Nick Suzuki.

This is probably your Selke to lose. And, like, he's a really good player, so that's fine. Especially, look, they don't have their safety blankets, right? We all, they had, they were walking around in a daze these voters all summer going, we don't get to, we don't get to vote for Patrice Burjorn anymore. Cut to a couple years later. What do you mean we can't vote for, for Barkoff? Oh, no.

I throw a vote at him. Why not? I mean, look, we've seen... We was not on the ice for a single goal against this year. It's, well, what's funny is we've seen a lot of people in the mailbag recently kind of bring up the idea that when he comes back, like, and the, and the Panthers return to the playoffs next year, how much heart love does he get? Because people are just like, I've seen them with and without him. Without him, they are dog shit. With him, they win Stanley Cups.

This is the most valuable player in the world I think that's like an actual conversation that will take place It's like Well if you look at last year But that you know that's a year from now Just funny to me Okay What are we what are we missing here

The heart I guess Yeah we have For player awards The heart And I think this is This has gotten really interesting in the last week Well, it, so again, this feels like people are getting a little bored of McKinnon. McDavid hasn't quite taken over, and so now Nikita Kuturov is the name that seems to be getting a lot of attention.

And not, you know, can't argue a ton. He's potentially going to win the scoring title again. But, yeah. It's a race. Is it those three guys? I mean, we're not doing a goalie this year. We certainly are. I don't, I mean, I don't think there will be defensemen who get votes.

Schaefer, Werensky definitely will. I mean, McCarrow will get a couple, but, you know, he's got, he's got McKinnon on the team. Quinn Hughes, maybe. But I don't think there's a winner. there, right? No, no, no. Rasmus Dallin is another one that maybe you'll get Norris votes and probably will get some hearts because he'll be viewed as the best player on a great story.

Most Sider, I think, has faded out of that conversation. So it's going to be a forward. Those are definitely the three best and most productive forwards. The only thing that I'll say is, you know, at this point it doesn't look like the sharks are making the playoffs, but fucking Macklin Celebrini just doesn't go away, man. 101 points now for him at 19 years old. Yep. Oh, man. Yeah, that's, again, that.

You know what? I say that there are two points out. If they make it. With two games in hand on the Predators. If they make it, he does. move up ballots. I don't think he wins it, but I think them making it is the difference between him getting a few fifth place votes and him getting a few second and third place votes. Yeah, that feels correct to me.

But nevertheless, pretty interesting that he just, he refuses, much like the sharks themselves, fucking refuse to go away. No, no, we're still here. All these teams in front of us aren't that good, you know? Um, so yeah, it's, uh, it feels extremely up for grabs in a way that, again, like even, even a month ago, you would have said it's not. Mm-hmm. What's funny is like Kucharov in particular really seems like everybody's decided we're probably going to make this guy the guy. We've decided McDavid sucks. Oh, he only has 124 points in 74 games.

What a bum. You know? If he had, I'd say, look, he's not going to get to 50 goals in all likelihood, but like if he had 50 goals, there'd be a conversation to be had. But McKinnon's ahead of him in that front as well. He's like, yeah, he's up seven goals in fewer games. But yeah, it just feels like we're getting a lot of, like, what, like, everybody, is finally deciding to give their flowers to the Tampa Bay Lightning.

You know, we haven't talked about it yet. It feels to me like the Jack Adams is pretty much sewn up for John Cooper. Yep. But I don't know. Let's just do the Jack Adams then. Do you think it's sewn up for John Cooper? I don't think it's sewn up. I think the problem with the Jack Adams is there are so many teams that fit the mold of what that award usually is,

which is to say most. surprising team, ideally led by a coach who's new on the job. I just think when you go, the season has been so unexpected. There's been such a shakeup as far as playoff teams coming in and out that I think, you know, if you were just going to vote on it based on, like I was having this conversation last week. I did the, I did a Sabres podcast with our old buddy, Dwayne, the distress Sabres fan. Rock Johnson. Who's doing, who's doing a lot better these days, by the way.

remember that? Remember he called into the radio station? Yeah, yeah. Kind of had a little meltdown. And they were like, well, it's got to be Lindy Ruff, right? I mean, Lindy Ruff checks every box that this award usually goes to. And it's like, yeah, he kind of does. But so does Dan Mews. So does Rick Pless.

Oh, yeah. If they get in, although, you know, with half a season, that's tricky. Whoever gets in the West in the last spot probably gets some votes, especially if it was San Jose. Brian Worssovsky, yeah. Joel Quinville checks a lot of the boxes of what this award usually goes to. Marco Sturm, all of that.

So, I mean, there's such a crowded field that I wonder if this isn't one of those years where it's like 80% of the voters, well, no, let's say 70% of the voters go the traditional route, and they all split their votes, and 30% just vote for the best coach and vote for Cooper.

And that's enough for him to kind of split the field and win. Yeah, I guess the way I was thinking about it was along kind of those lines of like, everybody is going to kind of get those votes. Or the other way to think about it is if nobody really stands out as like the traditional Jack Adams winner, do the voters just go, well, fuck it. Let's just give it to the best coach. He deserves it, Lifetime Achievement Award. won it and all of that stuff.

Yeah. And like, that's kind of why I was thinking, like, it really feels. And again, there was a lot of conversation about this, like, I feel like maybe a month ago. Just everything kind of coalesced around that. You know, like, we're locked in here. It's John Cooper. Look at how good the lightning are after they kind of had a little bit of a, an iffy season last year, by their standards. And yeah, Buffalo, but also, like you said.

the penguins, the ducks, go down the list. So let's just, let's not fight over which, like, PDO case, you know, deserves it, which team that won a bunch of overtime games deserves it. And let's just give it to the guy who we probably should have given two or three of these two already. Mm-hmm. So that's why I think it feels a little more sewn up than, you're probably right that it's not that sewn up. But anyway.

And a lot of it really does, like we've said on a few of these awards, well, you've got to make the playoffs. This is one where you really do have to make the play. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So, you know, Dan Mews is a leading candidate if the penguins make it by one point. And if they miss by one point, forget it. He's a bum. He's a bum. Yep.

You're not going to get anything. Let's do GM of the year. And then we'll move on. Who do you got? I mean, what do you think? GM of the year really does come down to playoff success. Yeah, of course.

They vote on it after two rounds. I mean, Bill Guerin would be the leader in the clubhouse, but can the wild get through two rounds? I can't even remember the last time somebody was a finalist without being in the final four. Yeah, I think you're right about that. I think it's happened a couple of times, but it's rare. But just purely, I mean,

I wonder if Dubus gets some, I mean, he's made a ton of moves. He's been super active and his team's better than anyone thought. You could see that. I mean, people are bored with Jim Nill, you would think, but maybe not. Pat for Beak would get, I think, a lot of consideration. Not only, like, he's kind of got the rare young team, but also a team that made some big moves in the offseason. Like, it's hard to win GM of the year doing a patient rebuild. Because then what did you do this year if you were patient?

But I could see him. And then, I mean, the lightning win the division, then Julian Breezeboe probably gets a ton of a, like, you know, it just comes down to... I don't know about Carolina. I mean, Tulski... uh got got sassy he got sassy he got sassy with the season so i don't know if that's you don't want to you don't want to make you don't want to make dad angry by taking the side of the

lippy kid so sorry eric yeah i again it's so it's so hard to tell i think i think we can carve out central division winner as guaranteed like not just mcfarlane's tough though because Like, I mean, first of all, half the fans still think Joe Sackick's the GM there. Yeah. So I would say probably, I don't think it's half the GMs think that, but there's probably five or six that still think, they're still calling Joe Sackick, wondering why he doesn't pick up. Mm-hmm.

And it's viewed as like, well, I mean, he's had McCar and McKinnon. I mean, did go out and get Martin Natchez. Maybe that's, maybe that's the move that wins it for him. Yeah. And again, it's really this award in particular is based on two or three years of success and not just one. But you know what's interesting about the Central in particular is that, speaking of two or three years, that's how many years in a row Jim Nill has won this award already. So if the stars win, does he, it'll probably be a finalist, but like, would they allow themselves to just be like three-time GM of the year consecutively? Yeah.

June nil, I wonder. At what point are you just like, hey man, we're all really bad at this, give it to the same guy? The other guy that I did mention is that I'm really curious to see, especially if they were to win their division, like in the playoffs, which could happen. Does Yarmal Kalka Lining get votes, given that he really, in terms of the roster, did not do much of anything? Right. A little bit of, you know, supplemented a little bit at the deadline, but it didn't, wasn't the GM in an off season. You hear about like how he just completely changed the culture of the place and just, yeah. And very obviously the GM switch was the turning point of that season.

But can you win GM of the year when your biggest move is Luke Shen? I don't think you can, but that brings up the thing that we brought up, I think, a couple. a week's of weeks ago, the Kevin Adams case. Kevin Adams, yeah. And I still think somebody, I think

it was, I think it was Dwayne was telling me that they had heard that Kevin Adams was not eligible, that like they may have changed to actually

tell, you can only vote for actual working GMs, but I hope that's not true. And if it is true, I hope somebody votes for Kevin Adams anyways. Yeah, why not? Are they going to take their vote away?

There's the GM. They get a vote. Do it, Tulsa. Double down. Yeah, absolutely. A little poop disturber. All right, you want to talk about some of the recent NCAA signing, Sean? I know you're very familiar with all these guys.

I want you to tell me who's good and who's not. Well, you got Hayes-Hunley. He signed with the Leafs. All I really know about him? Who did he sign? Wait, what's the other signature on that contract, buddy? It says Brad for Living. Uh-oh.

Says here. You faxed it in, right? Yeah, I'm just going to watch the beginning of the Ducks game, watch the fights, and then I'm going to definitely send this on back in. All I really know about him is I'm fairly certain he's like a big boy. Yeah, 6-3207. They went out and signed him. It's interesting.

What's that? Does he have snot? What does that mean? The snot. That's what the Leafs need. That was Brad Trillivings version of Truculence. Oh, I guess. I guess I didn't know this one.

Yeah. I mean, he must. But I, but I think Fragral Living got a little confused here. This guy's about 32 years old and 6'3, you know what I mean? Yeah. It's a little confusing. They would have given up a first round pick for him if that had been. Yeah, you're absolutely right about that.

The other, the other, I did the Hayes-Hunley one mostly as a joke, but the big name signing here is Porter Martone. Signed with the fly. and did you hear all the quotes they were giving out about how good college hockey was for him? No, I did not. Okay. So Daniel Breyer was like... Is this the Frank thing or... No, no.

I guess we can talk about the Frank thing too if you want. But, okay, just real quick, for those who didn't see it, Frank said on a show over the weekend that some scouts he talked to told him, that he thinks like the top teams in the NCAA can, you know, could compete meaningfully with NHL teams. And no, that's not true. That couldn't be that I watch a lot of college hockey. He has since said that he basically misspoke and he meant, what the scout had told him is HL teams and that he had just.

Even then, I don't, I don't think so. But okay, sure. It's a little less wacky of a. Yeah, for sure. I didn't hear the follow-up. good note by you. But no, Porter Martone, first of all, Danny Breyer was like, this kid did such an unbelievable job in college, like, and Michigan State did a really good job of, like, making him a better

hockey player, a more responsible hockey player, that kind of thing. But I think the quote was, you know how like NHL players over the course of the season? They lose weight because they're just working out so much, basically. Um, Porter Martona was the opposite in college. He, like, put on four or five pounds and cut his body fat by three percent. Wow. And he's like, you know, you just spend so much time in the fucking weight room in college because you only play two games a week and they're on Friday and Saturday or Thursday and Friday or whatever, you know. So he was like, college hockey rocks.

And I, and when I read those quotes, I was like, that might just. about do it for Major Junior is like the place where first round picks play. The second, I think based on Martone and a couple other guy, McKenna, to a lesser extent, just the way that those guys were able to be very productive players in college hockey at relatively young ages and develop physically as well as develop their games and not have to ride the Buster, to Saskatchewan for 14 hours and, you know, live on a, on college campuses and all that kind of stuff and all the perks that go with that, I think that's a wrap on Major Junior being the destination in the development period, or a pyramid, I should say.

So I thought that was interesting. What should Flyer fans expect, like, can he actually make a difference at the NHL level? do you think down the stretch or is this more of a evaluation, get your feet wet kind of deal? I think it's kind of the latter. He's an extremely good player, a player who can make a lot of stuff happen in the offensive zone, but he's also 19 and he's never played professional hockey before, you know? Like, how many, let's put it this way. Maclin Celebrini as a rookie, I would say, had a better season at a younger age than Porter Martone did.

And Celebrini was 17 and won the Hobie Baker walking away. I don't think Martone – well, you know what? I know. Martone is not even a top 10 finalist. Should he be? That's a different question. But he's not one. And it took Celebrini a year to become what we now know Macklin Celebrini to be at the NHL level, right?

like a full year in the NHL. So if I'm a Flyers fan, I'm very excited we got this kid signed. He's a really exciting prospect, a great college hockey player, but maybe not like a tippy, tippy top of the elite level college hockey player. And how does that translate to pro hockey? It usually doesn't mean you hit the ground running and score six goals in your last eight games or whatever. You know, temper your expectations for this year, and then we'll see what happens. That would be my advice to you.

And then, you know, just a bunch of like less exciting signings, your Hoyt Stanley's and your Jonathan Kastanias and Matt DeMarsico all this. Yeah, just wasn't going to move the needle with any of these guys in particular, but good for them for signing. They're all basically everyone I'm seeing here is NCAA signing in. in the NHL, good players, you know. Nobody where I'm like, oh, I wouldn't have done that, you know, so. Oh, you know what? I wanted to talk about this as well, with respect to Porter Martone. So you remember James Hagan signed an ATO with Providence?

Bruins fans are furious about this. Why is he got to try out? And it's like, that's not really what it means. Okay. But this has been like a big talking point in Boston. and so I just want to clear the air here a little bit. We talked about it last week, and Sean brought up that by signing an ATO with Providence,

he remains eligible for the Calder Cup playoffs, which the Providence Bruins, I think, have already clinched an appearance in. He's playing every game you see the quote from his coach down in Providence. He's actually doing better this game than he did last game. Every single game, this kid's improving, this kid's getting it more and more. And he could, if the Bruins feel like he's ready and the playoffs roll around, they could sign him to a contract and he could play for them in the playoffs.

No problem. But, A, if the Boston Bruins don't make the playoffs, but B, if they feel like he'd be better served playing whatever, 20 minutes a night in the H.L versus 14 a night in the NHL, it keeps the option. open. Porter Martone can't do that. And it looks like Lehigh Valley's not going to make the AHL playoffs anyway. They're right around the border, I think. But they're not a great team. So that's the difference.

That's why the ruins did that in Porter Martone probably had a little more negotiating power because he's coming off a phenomenal rookie season in college hockey. And Hagen's at a very good sophomore season in college hockey. So that's the difference. to like kind of delineate that a little bit if I could. And then one, I got one last thing for you here, Sean. There was a, there was a poll or a survey from Eschelon Insights. Which of the following professional sports leagues do you consider yourself a fan of?

And they, they said, the five options you were given were the NFL, Major League Baseball, the NBA, the WNBA, and the NHL. And they gave you them in random orders. You were allowed to pick more than one if you liked him. What percent of people do you think said they are NHL fans? 10 percent. No, it's more than that. It's 26. Wow.

Okay. Hold on. Was that? Could you, so you could vote for multiple? Yes. Okay. All right. They're not trying to.

Had to pick your favorite sport. Although, yeah, that's still... Okay. Interesting. What did the rest of it look like? Well, this is why it's interesting. No surprise here, NFL number one, 69%. Nobody else even close.

Major League Baseball has overtaken the NBA as the number two most popular sport right now. 47% say baseball fan. 40% say the NBA. then that big gap between the NBA and the NHL, 40 to 26, and then really kind of starting to nip at their heels a little bit, the WNBA, 18% say they're WNBA fans. Wow. Pretty surprising.

That's an interesting mix of ones to ask about, like, Yeah. I'm saying if you're going to include the WNBA, I'm surprised you wouldn't include college sports. at least, assuming you're keeping to team sports. I mean, you could argue, I'm not even suggesting the NHL is that far ahead of the WMBA. It's just kind of the traditional big four. I wouldn't be shocked if they limited to that.

But yeah. Okay. Well, I'm seeing if I can pull up. Record revenues, man. I'm seeing if I can pull up more data from, because this is just like a guy tweeted this, you know? but yeah, I thought that was really interesting. By the way, actually the number two or the second from the bottom sport isn't the WNBA. It's none of these, which was cited by 21%.

And these are self-identified sports fans that are just like, I don't like anything. It's difficult for me to find, yeah, it does say sports fans here. That's honestly pretty cool. I want to hang out. Well, maybe they would... There's a lot of people who only watch college. There's a lot of people who are sports fans, but they watch golf. They watch...

Or they watch soccer, yeah, yeah, yeah. Soccer for sure. Yeah, that's another one. I'm surprised they didn't have their auto racing, which I don't even know if that gets counted as a team sport or not. But... Yeah. Yep, there's lots of sports out there.

I mean, honestly, these days, yes, you want a big audience, but it's about how much can you squeeze out of the audience you have. And that's what the other. NHL's doing well, and that's why nothing will ever change. That's right. Yeah, I just thought that was pretty interesting. So, yeah, that's it.

We're done here. Why don't you, Sean, say some plugs, and then we will stop doing this podcast. You can find me at the athletic newsletter just went out, got the podcast tomorrow with the guys. Might also have a Leafs GM search column tomorrow. We'll see how the rest of today goes. and then later in the week I've got a theory about how we can make sense of this stupid nonsensical season. I've actually figured it out. We've just all been looking in the wrong place.

There's a very simple way to figure all this stuff out. Oh, excellent. Keep an eye out for that. And then for me, head over to elite prospects. I just recapped all four days of the first weekend of the NCAA tournament. had a nice little time doing that. And more NCAA tournament coverage coming your way. When they announced the Hobie Top 3,

I will do my annual who will win and who deserves to win column. Where I see the mind of the voters like few others, Sean, I think. And I can say these guys are chunking it. These guys are blowing it big time. but it's not hard for me to pick out what the who the guy that they're going to say deserves it is versus who actually deserves it. So I'll have that and I'll have Frozen 4 preview. Oh, by the way, Frozen 4, Michigan, Denver, North Dakota, Wisconsin. Do you know what those four teams have like in common apart from they're going to be in the Frozen 4 this year?

So that was going to be my answer. Okay. Well, the answer is, in fact, those are the four teams that have won the most national titles in college hockey. One, two, three, and four. They're all represented. So not a lot of mixing it up this year, it seems. But I thought that was interesting. Yeah.

So that is cool. Yeah. And then, like I said, stay tuned for all that. Frozen Four is not this coming weekend. it's the one after that. So we'll have plenty of coverage. And that will, that'll do it for us. Thank you so much for, oh, Patreon.com slash pox soup,

all kinds of bonus episodes. It's the end of the month. So we did bonus episodes, including one where me, Sean, and Greg, looked into the crystal puck. This was a listener choice. And we predicted what would happen in the NHL one year, five years, 10 years, 25 years and 50 years. Oh, and I think I missed three years as well.

So a lot of future Fognostications and that kind of thing. Only one of us predicted the end of the American century. But, you know, that's it. Thank you so much for listening. Have a good one, folks. Bye, bye.