Puck Soup - EBUG Panic with Cat Silverman

Episode Date: February 27, 2020

The boys discuss Emergency Backup Goaltender David Ayres and all the controversy his appearance against the Leafs created, and we get into that and other goalie talk with Cat Silverman of IN GOAL Magazine. That plus a full rundown of winners, losers and weird stuff from the trade deadline; how we did on our deadline bets; putting Ranch on your nachos, Chipotle ordering mayhem, farting on an airplane and more. Sponsored by Raycon E25 wireless earbuds!

Sticks and hits and goals and saves and slap shots and goons. We've got sportly commentary to what if you commute. We also cover movies, TV shows, it's and tunes. It's your weekly bowl of hockey and nonsense. I'm Greg Wyshinski of ESPN, home of the XFL. I'm Ryan Lambert from. this podcast, home of stupid bullshit.

Sean McAnneer from the Athletic. And you're in Puck's Soup. Home of what? Home of what? Home of every sports writer other than you two. Sounds about right, yeah. You got it. Home of Katie Strang and Paywalls. Home of the trade deadline happened.

And by happen, I mean the Sabres traded fifth. Wayne Simmons. You can get that in a second. What were our overall impressions of Dea Delos deadline, as we were calling it before the podcast? First of all, I think you were calling it that. All right. I'll freely be the racist here.

Okay, I called the De La Delos deadline. I'm also someone who... Just butchering the Spanish language. Who goes to my local Mexican chain restaurant on Cinco de Mayo. and drinks margaritas in celebration. And your local is chilis? Is that right? Well, here's the thing. I was making a joke because obviously I live in San Jose now.

I am not hurting for incredible Mexican food. I do not have to frequent a Chili's or a on the border or a Don Julio's for any of that shit anymore. But I will say this, that my first, I've often talked to my daughter about entry points in my life to different food experiences because she is a ridiculously picky eater and I'm kind of upset about it. The first Mexican food I think I ever had was Chi-Chi's. Remember Chi-Chi's? Yeah. Yeah. Did they have Chi-Chi's up in Canada, Sean? You know what?

I don't even know if we do or not. It sounds familiar, but it could be just because I see American ads. Well, now I think it's exclusively a solid. also brand. Yeah, I don't think that the restaurants exist anymore. But Chi-Chi's was a place where you could get your, uh, your, uh, your, you know, Anhalada or burritos or whatever. But it was the sort of sampler platter of Mexican stuff where you'd get like two tacos, then you'd get like Spanish rice and you'd get refried beans with cheese on top as your other two little side dishes. And that was my first, yeah, that was my first entry point into Mexican food. And I'm like, this is great. Like, like, this is great. Like, Who wouldn't want fucking greasy cheese on top of mush beans? How great is that? And that took me to the bean burrito at Taco Bell. And the rest is history.

I don't fit the pants anymore. Now, do you do the Pete Buttigieg ranch and salsa mix together as a... Did you see he endorsed that? That's real? First of all, he may need it for his robot parts. So it's entirely possible that that's a fundamental thing that he would. requires. Ranch and salsa on what, like a breedo bowl?

No, like as a chips dip. Hmm. Really upsetting to hear about. Really fucking... Yeah, no. Here's the thing. I understand the need for some kind of a creamy element to elevate

your chips and... Like, like, I'm a big sour cream guy. I think the ultimate bit burrito bowl would have sour cream on it. So if you're telling me that ranch serves the purpose of balancing some heat with a creamy thing, I've got time for it, which is surprising because it's Buttigieg. I will say this.

I don't know if we talked about this on the podcast. Did you see that the, when it was Hockey Week across America that Chipotle did a special day of If you wear your jersey to Chipotle, you got a buy-one get-one-free. Nailed them. I wore a Scott Stevens jersey to a Chipotle in Virginia and got a buy-one get-one breedable for me and my kid. That's cool. We had up here in Canada, we had a thing where if you wore your hockey jersey to a game, you got to play in an NHL game. That was cool, too.

Oh shit, much more on that later. I bring that up because part of the Chipotle thing was that they asked some prominent players what their preferred Burrito Bowl configuration was. And what did David Ayers say, listen, folks, we can do this all day. A couple of, like they asked Hillary Knight. I think they asked Kendall Coyne. And all of theirs made a lot of Charlie McAvoy. All of theirs made a lot of it. And his was, of course, just pour beer over it.

All of theirs was great, except Jack Hughes, who you may remember who is playing in the league this year. His burrito bowl did not have salsa, did not have sour cream. It had vinaigrette on top of his burrito fixants in the bowl. that's certain to explain a lot I'll say this I'd never thought about that that is at least intriguing to me I can I can see where like

that might be an interesting way to eat it I'll never eat at Chipotle so I you know we'll never find out but I respect him for thinking outside the box on that one okay so you're starving right

like fucking you're like One, you need to have sustenance or you'll die. And this desert that you're in, this arid desert that has no other things to eat. Greg, I truly hate Chipotle. Hold on, hold on, hold on. Only has two things. It has a Chipotle on one side of the oasis and a Chick-fil-A on the other side of the oasis. Which one do you go to?

I'm going to checkfil-A every time. Are you kidding me? Even with the moral implications of supporting. Oh, I guess there is ethical consumption. under capitalism. That's right. I forgot about that. Come on, man. Sam, I tried to trap you in your political leanings, but it's no avail. It's almost like I've read a book. That's how much you hate Chipotle.

It sucks. Chippole is truly bad. It's truly bad. Yeah. Okay. All right. Oh, yeah. And now our sponsor, Kudoba Mexican Grill. Folks, no, we don't. They could. They could. They should. Could happen. Yeah. They should. We should definitely dabble in the dark arts of people that hate Chipotle and get Mo's up in there. Mo's pretty good.

I'll say this. There's a hockey connection to Qdoba in the Boston area, you know, who brought a bunch of franchises to the greater Boston area was Ray Bork. And you can do the freaking Gary Thorne thing. Ramabark! There you go. Raymond Bork. It was around the same time his kid played for B.U. And they opened one or two on or around the B.U campus, if I'm remembering, correct?

Exactly. Wow. That's some, I mean, I might ask Ray B work for life advice to know, A, to get traded to Colorado and B, to open up a Mo's, because it's pretty good, except a little heavy on the queso, in my opinion. Where are we talking about? Oh, trade deadline. Trade deadline. Ten minutes ago. Yeah, you know. So let's start with Boston, actually, because you brought them up. I really like this deal for them because I really like Andre Casha, but I do understand. understand the fact that the Ducks traded a guy who averages 47 games per season in his first three years. I think that there's the possibility, to put

it in old Puck Daddy terms, when we used to grade it on the Millberry scale, this would be a three-millberry trade. There is a very good chance that it's going to look really fucking good for one of these sides and not so good for the other. I don't know that it, how's it going to look good for the Ducks?

If Kasha can't play, if you're If he's, if he, if he plays two injury riddled seasons and then, uh, Don Sweeney said, and, and, and the Bruins don't win. And Don Sweeney says, you know what? I totally fucking understand why they didn't want this guy. But then the, then the, is a real, is a real solid play driver. A guy. But then they've been looking for that guy. They've been looking for that guy. You know, is a real, is a real solid play driver. A guy who can play on David Crachie's wing. They've been looking for that guy. for 40 years, it seems like. Since Cam Neely retired. Yeah, exactly. So, like, you know, I think, let's put it this way. Salary dumps in this league often are very, very, very hard to come by,

and you have to take back a shitty deal coming the other way. And they didn't. They retained, what, a quarter of, or a 20% of back as his salary. And, you know, like, they're saving money. for your your Kruggs and your Grizzlicks, and they don't have to pay David Backus or play him anymore. And, you know, if that, like, Christ, we saw a first-round pick get traded for Barclay Goodrow. So if it's like, give us a first-round pick and we'll take David Backus off your hand,

and you get a guy who, he might play 50 games, you know. Yeah, we did, I certainly didn't see the trend of the deadline being. give us a first rounder for our cheap cap hit under contract for another season, bottom six guy. Didn't see that coming. Yeah, the Bruins got that and a guy who's a middle six at least, arguably a top six four. Yeah, but Goodgerow is. Okay, in fairness, Coleman and Goodreau are both like middle six, too, I would say. They're not fourth liners, so.

What do you think, Sean? Yeah, I mean, I agree, I think with a lot of that. I kind of get it from Anaheim's perspective because you're at a point where you're looking towards the future. It's even if the Bruins pick ends up being 30th or 31st, it's easy to sell to your fan base. Hey, we got a first round pick. Maybe sell that to your owner as well if you're trying to show that you're putting some future assets in your pocket. And, you know, if the contract works in what you're doing and you feel like that, It's not, you know, like it's possible that the BACS contract hurts the ducks a lot less than it was hurting the Bruins.

Oh, for sure. A team that needs to. So, you know, I don't hate it from the Anaheim perspective as much as some people did. But from as terms, as far as what Boston did, yeah, it's a bit of a role of the dice when you got a guy with who's had trouble staying healthy. But it's a very smart role of the dice that could pay off really well. let's talk about the two the two old fuckers that moved and the one that didn't uh cobalchuk to the capitals for a third again mark bergeved had a really interesting deadline for me because he did some amazing asset management yes and getting upgrades for covalchuk and scandela and then did some not so great stuff

in pretending that his team was maybe a contender this season and not maybe selling off petri at a really high price for selling off to tar for a really high price. And then Patrick Marlowe goes to the penguins in another little bit of good asset management from Doug Wilson for a third round pick that will become a second if the penguins win the cup, which isn't out of the realm of possibility.

And then Joe Thornt doesn't get traded, which fucking sucked because we all were hoping I mean, look, I think the biggest news of the deadline was that he wanted to go. And there was no trade for him, which is kind of stunning. Like, his words in talking to Kevin Kerr's of the athletic made me think that he just wanted to go

and not play out the string with a real shitty team. And it sounded like he was, do you think he was surprised that he wasn't traded? He was surprised that more better teams didn't want him. I couldn't quite get that for me. I think that was it. I think he went, it sounds like he eventually went to the sharks. and said, I am willing to go if it's to a top cup contender.

Boston or Dallas or Vegas, Tampa, yeah, those guys. And then none of those situations materialized. I don't think it was a sense of the sharks trying to get too much. In fact, I'm willing to bet that they weren't going to ask a ton if they could make it happen. It just wasn't there that the teams that they were talking to either weren't interested or maybe backed out, there was some talk that maybe the Leafs were interested, and then after Saturday night kind of backed off on anything that would be viewed as going for loading up. They could promote a janitor to play center at some point.

Exactly. And then there, I guess there was also some talk that maybe teams felt like Marlowe was a better fit because he's a speed guy. And you can always fit speed in your lineup versus Thornton's game is not that. And it might be a little tougher to adjust to a new situation. I get the sense that he struggled with this. He eventually decided he'd go to a leading contender, and then none of the leading contenders actually stepped forward, which has got to be frustrating on a few levels,

especially when this did legitimately seem to be something he was really going back and forth on for a lot of the year. Yeah, and frustrating, too, because I bet if he, last summer, declared that he was going to play another season, but not in San Jose, he'd be on a team right now. He'd be on a contender right now. Like that's, probably. And maybe even, and we don't know the behind the scenes,

but if he had gone to them earlier in the year and said, hey, this is something I'm looking at because, you know, the shark's been out of it for a little while now. If there have been more time to lay groundwork or what have you, maybe, but also maybe not. But yeah, it's, it's got to be tough because I'm sure he legitimately did have a tough time.

Like, do I want to pack up and go? I've been here, you know, what is it, 14 years going on? it is a big move and to actually get yourself kind of over that cliff of saying, yes, I'm willing to take this leap and then find out that it's not there. That's got a mess with you a little bit. Yeah, that sucks. It's a bad situation.

It sucks. And I know that we all would have fantasy cast to them to Boston, obviously, for the storybook of it all. But like, you think about the needs of the Colorado Avalanche and their maturation as a contender. and the fucking Obi-Wan stage wisdom that Joe Thornton could bring to that team at this point

that would have been good fit. Cool. I'm very surprised Colorado didn't do more. And I know, like, maybe they were in on, maybe,

Chris Crider was target A, and there wasn't really a plan B, but I mean, just, they're so good and they have so much cap space.

And they've got, you know, They're good, but they're not so good that they don't have room to add. And I'm just, you know, Joe Sack. I've been down the road once before of ripping on Joe Sackick for having a quiet deadline when they were bad three years ago and kind of got the last laugh on me there. So I'm not going to go all in on them here. But I was really surprised that they didn't do more than what they ended up doing, which is virtually nothing.

Yeah, my thing, go ahead. Oh, I was going to say. All right, you go. Yeah. So what I was going to say is, like, I think their issue is that they don't have any glaring weaknesses, like a lot of the teams in the Western Conference in particular did, where, like, you could look at the Oilers and go, well, they need NHL wingers, and they went out and got them. And, you know, you said, you would have said Vegas needed a more solid situation in goaltending. They went out and got it. What does Colorado super duper need?

Depth defense, maybe, a depth center, maybe. but like nothing where you're like, oh, this is the thing Colorado absolutely positively has to go out and get to be competitive. I think they can be competitive against any team in the Western Conference probably. And if, you know, given the prices we saw for a lot of stuff, not just at the deadline, but in the days leading up to it, you know, I can see where they didn't want to necessarily plunk down all that stuff. You know, they didn't need to improve as much as a lot of other teams in the West did. I think there's a couple of subsets at the deadline as far as the teams that did or didn't do business. And I think that Colorado falls into the, we're going to get a few guys back from injury after the deadline,

and that's our trade kind of vibe. Like when Cadreys comes back, it's going to be a huge boost and Calvert's hurt too. And like there's I think there's a certain amount of that. I think I think St. Louis was in that boat, obviously, with Tarasenko coming back and a few others. And then there were some teams that just like, we're like, we're going to put it on the guys to figure this out. Like Nashville was one of those teams that I don't think did any business because. I don't know. They got Corbynian holes or I think they're really loaded up now.

I mean, I prefer to think of that as the Matt Irwin trade, sir. But no, no, you know what you say? So like, I think in Colorado's case, if cry, was there, they would have done it, because I think he's a very specific kind of player. But I didn't think that there was a desire to do much more than Nemestikoff because they are going to get a bunch of guys back from injury like in the next month. And that's fine. It's just, it's the kind of thing where, we can say this about a bunch of teams, but it better

work. If they go in, they lose in the first round, a lot of people are going to look back at a quiet deadline and go, we were holding a bag full of cap space and we didn't do it. anything with it. That's true, but I'd also think that they could make that concern go away pretty quickly in the summer, considering all the assets and cap room that they have to figure out their shit if they need to. Patrick Marlow to the Penguins is really interesting. I wanted to bring this up, Sean. The Leafs are such a fucking hurricane of chaos at all times that it's hard to, it's like covering Trump. Like the minute you put your hand on something that you think is important,

then all of a sudden another problem pops up, right? Um, I feel, I feel like the Patrick Marlow thing hasn't really been talked about that much this year, as far as his removal from the locker room and maybe some situations that otherwise might have been tended to by daddy spinning out of control. Do you think that's overrated or do you think there's something there? I mean, there may be something there, and he was obviously a very popular, influential guy in that room. would it have made that big a deal? I mean, I think as a Leifes fan, a lot of us look more at the cost that was involved in removing his contract from the situation. Trading a first, which not only does it cost you a first, that it's top 10 protected, but I mean, that could be the 14th or 13th pick in the draft this year very easily. But also an asset you could have potentially moved during the season to address other needs. and that's not a, you know, Patrick Marlowe signed a dumb contract that was put in front of them.

By a great general manager. Yes, by a phenomenal GM who never made mistakes. Bring them right back. But it's, yeah, I mean, I guess I would just say that a lot of the stuff that you might have issues with in the Leafs Room this year is a carryover of stuff that people have whispered or wondered about for a few years now. So it's not like these guys were busting their tails every night, and then Patrick Marlow left, and now there's this perception that guys aren't working hard enough. I mean, the team's not winning, so there's always that we immediately all go to,

oh, they're not competing hard enough. But, you know, even the idea that they're not winning, what are they, they have one of the best winning percentages in the league since the coaching change. Yeah, but even that, that was a 20, 20 game bump, and then the last 20 games, they've come. kind of crash it back down. So, yeah, I mean, you're right.

But my point is just that a lot of this is just the natural stuff. And maybe it is surprising that the Marlow thing didn't become a narrative on its own. But, you know, like, remember, he was around for the last few years and he was the big father figure. And then, you know, the Austin Matthews thing in the summer happened. That was, you know, Marlow wasn't, wasn't there. I didn't have anything to do with it. But that was, you know, in theory, if his leadership was going to, that we would have seen that then. So, yeah, it hasn't really been something that's caught on in Toronto is a big thing.

Maybe if the penguins go deep in the playoffs and the Leafs are sitting at home, maybe it still has time to latch on. What they should have done was the Brooks Orpick thing. Trade him to Carolina. He gets bought out. Bring him back for the league minimum. There you go. And everybody's happy. Everybody's happy.

Well, you need a Brian McClellan for that, sir. And I mean, look, all the success San Jose had once they got Marlowe, like, how do you not make that argument. I think Marlowe, I can easily see Marlowe being the playoffs, old, old guy gets his cup. I mean, the penguins are real good. And, uh, and that could definitely happen. Colvichuk to the capitals is just fun. I'm just, I'm just, I'm just happy.

Yeah, it's cool. I'm happy it happened. You know, I feel like, I feel like it's, it's partially, yeah, they could definitely use some more secondary scoring, but I also feel like it's, let's do OV solid. Let's, let's get his boy in here for a little bit and see what happens. I fucking love that. Yeah, I think it's rad that they made that trade. And, you know, now Kovilchuk's on the cap for, what, five different, four different teams?

Four different teams, yeah. That's also awesome. You know, I think, yeah, I don't think that Kovilchuk necessarily fixes what's maybe wrong with the caps on a, you know, holistic level. But like, you know, like you said, they needed someone else to. can put the puck in the net. And he can maybe do that if they put him in a position to succeed. So by the way, is there anything more peak NHL of just like, just cannot get out of its own fucking way, then Alex Ovechkin becomes the eighth guy in NHL history to score 700

goals? And the window to promote that is roughly 15 minutes because a fucking Zamboni driver beat the Leafs on a Saturday night in Toronto. Holy shit. They can't get a break. Like the Ovi story should have been around for 70, like until the trade deadline, that should have been the only thing we were talking about. Better luck, better luck when you get to 800 next year. Right.

Jesus. He's got a pace to him. But congrats to Obe, man. That was beautiful. I'm happy it was a legit goal and not like one rewarded on review or something later on. I will say, how funny is it that it was from the opposite of the Oveatchkin spot? That was, I thought that was so funny. Like, because I was walking the dog when the goal got scored.

And so I was like furiously reloading Twitter, looking for the highlight. And yeah, it was like, it was one of those things where I was like, oh, is this one of those, they flipped the video to avoid the copyright? Then no, they didn't. He just did it from the opposite side of the ice. By the way, teachable moment for all of you hockey parents out there, I watched that game with Vivian. because she is a Devils fan, such as it is. And we learned a life lesson, which is that it's okay to root for things to happen for the other team, but still ultimately not want them to do well.

So she was kind of like booing, Ovechkin scoring the 700th. I'm like, no, you don't understand. This is really great. And we can still root for our team and hope that it does well, but we can also be happy for him because we're watching history happen. And I think she finally got it. Especially because the devil's won that game. And won the game.

Right, exactly. So now what a teachable moment for a young burgeoning hockey fans to understand that dynamic. So yeah, congrats to Obie. That's fucking great. And it's going to, again, like, if you thought that the coverage of the Zamboni driver playing goal was robust in the, the United States. Wait till Russian rock star threatens Gretzky's all-time record happens. My God, fucking, you would not, you will not believe the goddamn coverage hockey is going to get in the United States. By the way, on one of the trade deadline broadcast, they did start bringing up the,

well, I mean WHA goals, playoff goal. I was, I was so happy because me and you, Greg, said that's exactly what was going to fucking happen. Yep, it's, it's, yep, break, great glass for, great glass, a break glass for caveats is what's going to be at some point. Jean did, oh, but also on TSN, they did copious amounts of Spangler Cup coverage, which I thought was also, if you're, if you're doing a trade center drinking game, Olympic roster normally is ahead, but Spangler Cup is definitely on the board somewhere. So that was good. Did you watch, Sean, did you watch both shows in Canada? I stayed on TSN, which is not necessarily a comment on the quality of either show so much as just my own laziness. And I tend to like their deadline coverage.

And then like my remote control fell six inches away from my hand. And that was... That's it. The game over. That's it. That's the decision you're done. By the way, we have Apple TV. And I have to say that the most annoying thing in the world is how small that control.

is and how quickly it can disappear in your couch. Yes, we have a similarly, it's maybe a little bit bigger, but our Samsung smart TV has a very small remote as well. Very annoying. It falls through the cushions of my couch with the rapidity of Lubman from Watchman sliding into a sewer. Why bring this up to me? I'm having a nice day.

I'm going to hear about this stupid show again. Um, was, oh, here's a thing. I think sports net's actually gotten a lot better. Uh, the big, the gap was established at a time when all of your friends that you wanted to hang out for eight hours with were on TSN. And Duffy, I think is like the MVP of MVP's to that end because you just like hanging around Duffy. Um, but also now Ferraro and LeBron and McKenzie and all that. Well, they had LeBron. Damn.

That was a. Lebron. And, yes. Yes, they had a trade, they had the main table, the journalist table, and then a barber shop set up in the back where LeBron was talking about all the trades. I think sports that's gotten a lot better because they got rid of some of the people that maybe people didn't necessarily want to spend eight hours with. And they bumped up the Jeff Merricks and the Chris Johnsons of the world to have more prominent roles. The thing they did this year that I thought was interesting from what I saw, like I think Kevin B.X is a real. a real up-and-comer in this media thing. Like, I feel like he's somebody that I enjoy listening to.

He doesn't take it all that seriously, but he's got some fucking fire in his belly about shit. So having him on in those panels. He's been excellent, and I did not really see that coming. Yeah. He wasn't a guy that struck me as someone who's, but he has been really, really good. Like, he's on the intermissions in Hockey Night Canada,

and, like, he talks, and you're just like, damn, this guy makes a lot of sense. Yeah. It's the college hockey guys, man. They're really good on TV. And then on top of... Right. And then on top of that, he's also kind of funny, too.

Like, he's got a little bit of a wink to him. So he's real good. I like the player panel they put together outside of Chris Rstieg, who I didn't think was all that good and had some dumb things to say. But the other thing that SportsNet did that I thought was interesting was they had Bissinette on, who I guess bought on the other spit and chicklets guys, just like as sort of a surprise. I found that to be a thing where like, if you're SportsNet,

I don't know why you didn't plant your flag harder on having that group on your show, or at least best than out on your show. I didn't even know it was fucking happening until the day of the deadline. It's kind of weird how they didn't promote it more, because I'm sure they would have had more than a few people tuning in that, you know, wanted to watch that. Maybe. And then, yeah, I mean, I can understand why you might not necessarily want to associate yourself with that particular group. but if you are going to anyways,

then you might as well lean into it. You might as well lean into it. Yeah, exactly. Well, anyways, at TSN, we, of course, simulcast the whole thing on ESPN, and we watched that, and it was great as usual. And five tables, we counted.

The main table, the analyst table, the trade breakers table, Dave Feschuk at the journalist table. And then, the one where they talk about tweets and stuff, I think, was also a table as well. And it was a really good show also partly because for once we got the trades spread out through the day. Yeah.

It wasn't just four hours. Oh, hell yeah. It wasn't four hours of dead air and then everything comes in. And plus there were a lot of trades. Like, I think it was the busiest single deadline ever just in terms of volume, which is like it was great. Like, this was an enjoyable trade deadline. Most trades and tied for the most bodies that moved with 55. So, very busy.

A lot of which were players you have never heard of, especially when you go back and kind of look over the list because it's sort of like, was there really 30 trades? And then you look and you're like, oh, yeah. Sir, I will not have you besmirch the good name of Etulocetarian, who as you know. Definitely a real guy. went with Chase Priskey, who I believe is a NASCAR driver for... Chase Prisky, defenseman, Quinnipiac University. Would have been a Hobie Baker finalist last year, but, like, had to go up against Quinn Hughes and Cal McCarr and stuff like that.

And Adam Fox was the other kind of elite college hockey defenseman last year. I could go on, but, you know... Well, thanks, Bucci. Eric Walla and Lucas Walmart. He wishes he had the kind of passion for college hockey that I... do. Quala chalky. Eric Kuala, Walmark,

Lusatarian, Prisky, all go to the Florida Panthers in exchange for Vincent Trocheck. Trocheck, I talked to somebody familiar with the Panthers organization. Fucking stunned Trochuk was available. I guess he's not been the same guy

since he had his ankle injury. But definitely the bell of the ball as far as teams wanting them. The only guy that I think the coyotes were really sniffing hard around was Trocheck. But to nobody's surprise, Nobody's surprise. Eric Tolski gets the front office to ante up big for a guy that I think could really work out well in Carolina.

I still don't get that from a Florida perspective. It's only just because we all figured they needed help on the blue line. So if you're going to, like I think, like most of us, when we first heard that guy was on the block, your first thought is they shouldn't move him. And then you think, well, if you're going to get a big piece on the blue line, you've got to move something to get it. And maybe that's their piece that they can offer. back and instead they kind of do this mostly futureish, you know, down the line, which is a

strange thing to do when you're like one point out of a playoff spot that your team desperately needs in that, in that market. I have three theories. The first is I believe Chris Johnson and his report that they want to cut payroll because they spent, you know, like, fucking, fucking $15 million on the coach in the goal he left here. It's such, here's the, here's my theory. Dale Tallinn was like, oh, I got a sell low on a top six winger. Let's go.

And they got a guy who was on the outs, a guy who's, what, 24, 25, Lucas Walmart. He's not like a young guy, but everybody thinks of him as a prospect. And then two guys who maybe chase Priskees in NHL are two, three years from now. And that's the weakest part of their prospect pool is defense. So not a bad bit of his business there. I mean, you know, they got a lot of guys who were like, over the last few years, they've gotten a lot of guys who were like the seventh best defenseman in college hockey right before they went pro.

And, you know, you're Mike Mathesons and Ian McCausions and that kind of thing. And it's like, yeah, I mean, we've seen these guys before. I'm not, I don't know, man. Hey, theory number two, Quinville hated him, which I think is something that Elliot touched on. I think that probably, you know, hey, that was one of the rumors around the Riley. Smith thing was that the coaches didn't like them. But even then, like, it's,

how much, much your coach hate you to move a guy without getting, I mean, they got some help for now, but, like, typically, it was like with the, with, the Pajot thing, which I'm sure we'll talk about, where, you know, Trots is like,

I don't care about the draft picks and, you know, I had Islander fans go and see Trots doesn't care. And it's like, yeah, but he's a coach. The coach will always take somebody to play tonight over what's something for two years. He doesn't care down the line. He wants to wait tonight. And, you know, if Quenville hates the guy so much that he's like, you know what,

trade this guy for stuff for a few years from now. I don't know. I just want him out. That'd be a pretty big, big shot. Theory number three, so he's part of the core, right? And you're not dealing Barkoff. You're not dealing Huberto. You're not dealing Ekblad.

I feel like this is there at Alex Semen trade. I feel like this is the, look all you motherfuckers, like, we can, we can trade one of you if you don't all do this playoff thing kind of thing. So like 12 years from now when the Capitals win the Cup or the Panthers win the cup behind this, we can go see it was because they got rid of Semin fucking seven years ago. Trocheck Seven, yeah. I'm always fascinated by the whole, like, we're sending a message that like, you know, or you see this a lot this time of year.

Like, we got to see down the stretch, you know, who wants to stay here. here, you got to know that your players actually do want to stay there first. Like, you know, look, I would hate to get traded to a good team. That would suck for me. Like what a threat that, oh, really, I got to go play in front of more than 11,000 fans who are cheering for the other team. Like, now, a lot of people would love living in South Florida. But, you know, but you sent the guy, like, Carolina is pretty nice too, man. It's not like you sent him to Ottawa. It's, uh, that, that would feel more like a message. But that's like, that's why I love that Nashville situation where it's like, we're sending a message to our players.

They got to get it done. Also, no one fucking wanted Craig Smith and Granlin at all. Right. You mentioned Jean-Gabrielle Pajot, a conditional first rounder lottery protected a second. And then my favorite conditional pick of the entire day, a 2022 conditional third rounder, if the Islanders win the cup this season. Yeah. Pier Dorian doing work. Yeah.

Being that guy who won't do the fantasy football trade unless you throw in like one more thing. I'm going to need your kicker. Your backup kicker. Somebody pointed out to me, like, how great is it that, like, in this NHL age of parody, that we had a trade where there was a conditional pick protected for being in the top three of the draft and a conditional pick linked to winning the Stanley Cup in the same season. Yeah, right? Those are the extremes.

I love it. This trade looked a lot better after they signed. him, I guess, because it goes from being a rental to a contract. But, I mean, I hear the style already, and I agree. I am not the biggest Paggio fan. He's fucking singing for his supper with that shooting percentage this season. That's the big concern. It's like Ottawa put him in a position to shoot 19% or whatever he's at this year.

Like, they really, really, really were like, we need you to drive the offense. And you're a guy who, what, came into the season with a career high of like 16 goals or something like that? And yeah, he's scoring a lot this year. Can the Islanders really afford to put him in that same kind of a position? I don't know. That having been said, I do like Peugeot. I think he's a really good 200-foot, you know, lower-end middle-six-forward. I guess that means third line.

But I think he's a guy who can be like a solid second-line center on a good team. and, you know, like, in a pinch, basically, and not necessarily, like, he should be entering your season as your number two center. He's a number three on a good team. The thing that gets me a little bit is, you know, because I express surprise at the price on this. And I'm here in Ottawa, so I've seen my share of Peugeot playing. And he's a decent player. I'm not, he's not a bad player. But, you know, I've had Islander fans going, well, he's a, he's a 200-foot guy who can play in all situations. And it's like, yeah, you know, on Ottawa, he can play in all situations. Because Ottawa doesn't have any players. That doesn't mean he's an all-situations guy on a good team. Now, you know, Bear Trots is a very good coach. He will figure out the best way to use this guy. I just would not have given up a first-round pick in a very good draft in a year where I'm far from guaranteed to make the playoffs. So, you know, this could end up being a pick.

in that 10 to 15 range, I would not give that up for, to rent John Gabriel Pajot, and I would not give that up to have the right to sign him to a $5 million deal that goes until he's 33 or whatever. Which you could have done, you could have done this summer if you really wanted him. Yeah, that was the, like, that definitely felt like kind of a PR, not that Lou is really thinking about PR necessarily, but that seemed like a thing of like, well, yeah, it was a lot to give up, but we got him for five years. And, you know, he's 27.

He's not 29, which is, I think, another, like, kind of a positive about this trade. Like, if he was two years older, I would have said, oh, my God, like, what are they doing? Ryan Lambert throws him into the sun, right? That's the thing. Yeah. But, like, well, especially if you're talking about a page. Like, I wouldn't sign a fucking Taylor Hall at 30 years old. I definitely wouldn't sign a J.G. Pajot at that age, right?

because it's just like, you know, his marginal value is going to decrease so much over the next three years, let alone six, you know. But, yeah, I don't hate it as much as a lot of other, quote, unquote, smart people did. And I don't know if that makes me smarter than them or me insanely stupid. But, like, I think he's a guy that, look, the Islanders just needed guys who can, like, be an NHL forward. They do not have a lot of them. So he checks that box for them. Did they give up a lot? Yeah, but.

Yeah, they gave up a lot. They might feel like this is their only real kick at the can in the next couple of years. Well, to me, that's even more of a reason not to trade away your first round pick if you think that there's that level of urgency. I wrote a thing a few years ago where I talked about the types of really bad contracts and one of them that seems to come up pretty often. I called it the shiny new toy where you acquire somebody and then you've got to sign them. And at that point, like, you can't, you can't trade for a guy and then turn to his agent and be like, I don't know if we're really, like, at that point, you pretty much have to give them exactly what they're asking for. So I don't, I don't love the trade or the contract, but I will point out that it's, there's, there's, I think other than the initial signing bonus, I don't think there's any bonuses on the deal. Like, there's not blanket, no movement or anything.

So this will be a deal that can be moved or even bought out or maybe it's an expansion bait. a few years. Like, there's, this is, this is not something they're necessarily stuck with if it goes bad. There's, there's ways to get out of this, especially when you're Lou Lamarillo and you can just disappear. Oh, and you have, you're schooled in the dark arts of making guys disappear. And I don't mean in like the swamp. I mean like in the minor leagues or what have you. A couple more, what are your thoughts on the trade that didn't happen, the Pirezi deal? Man, that would have been a real fucking good thing for the wild. That was a jaw dropper with that.

Yeah. When that got reported, I was like, God damn. Yeah, I was like, God damn, Lou's never doing it now. No, I agree. Everybody was like, oh, why didn't it go through? And I said, it's because it leaked. That's why. Absolutely.

I don't know if it made it there. You, I guess, would have seen it on TSN, but the interview with Duffy and Lou Lamarillo. Yeah, he pretended his audio went out. Yeah. Like, Duffy asked him about the trades they made, and then he was like, look, I know what you're going to, I know you're not going to answer this, but I got to ask, like, Zach Preeze, was that a thing? And Lou was just like, I can't hear him anymore. Era, my audio kicked out. It's so good.

On the conference call, one of us had to ask. So Craig Custin, so the Athletic asked about the prez-e deal. And Lou said, Erra, I know that you have a job to do, error, and you are looking for information, error. But that is not anything that we would ever discuss publicly or share information error about. And that's it. No follow-ups. I really wonder if that happens in the summer because apparently they talked about it last summer and then it's sort of when it was Paul Fenton and then it revived recently. And I knock GMs a lot because I roll my eyes whenever some GM acts like trading a third liner for a third round pick is too complicated.

And I go, we don't have time to put that deal together. This one actually would have been pretty complicated. So I'll actually allow it if this only came up in the last few days. I wonder if they go back to it in the summer. And, man, I, I, I wouldn't want either one of those contracts. So that's, you know, and I just finished saying, oh, I don't know about Paggio's deal. But yeah, they clearly, if you can, if, if Zach Pryze's contract could be on the move, then pretty much anybody's can be.

So I still like him as a player, but, oof, that, I feel like the Islanders might have dodged a bullet there, but only temporarily. Let's tell a couple more things. Wayne Simmons, what the fuck? I don't understand. Well, the same is like five of seven or something like that. So, you know, they're just peeking at the right time and they, you know, you've got to incentivize the guy, you know, all that fucking horse shit. And then they go out and lose very easily to the avalanche.

Well, they lose easily. They played a real good game against the avalanche, but they didn't win. Ten points out of a playoff spot now. it's here here's my question with that like I I get that there's a logic to it that says we we can't we can't just stay still and we can't sell again and start over again on the reset so that leaves one option which is let's you know I think there were six points out of the playoffs on on Monday let's take a run at this thing let's see what happens but A I'm not you know is Wayne Simmons then the guy that you go out and get uh and

geez, I feel bad for him. Like you're waiting around to see what contender you're going to get traded for. You know, like, hold off. Cancel those May vacation plans because I'm going to go chase a cup somewhere and then you're on your way to Buffalo. My question is, is this a GM saying, you know what? My team, my roster, my fans, everybody deserves to at least play meaningful hockey down the stretch and that's what we're going to do, which I could kind of get behind? Or is this a GM saying, if we miss the playoffs, I'm getting fired. So I got to try to make the playoffs.

Do something. Whether it's the right thing or not, that's what concerns me if I'm a statement. Speaking of trying to make the playoffs, Andreas Athanasiou and Mike Green to the Oilers. I mean, the most predictable thing of the deadline was Ken Holland dipping into it. Oh, and Tyler Ennis too, sorry. Yeah. The most predictable thing of the deadline was Ken Holland dip it into the Red Wings pool to pull out some shit. If you're trying to improve your team, what better place to shop than the worst team of the era by a mile?

negative 190,000 goal difference. Andreisand at the CEO is going to turn everything around for you. Yeah, Mike Reince got like a minus 50 F in the CEO the same deal over the last two years. It's crazy. Yeah, and like the big knock on both the dry side of land, McDavid lines is they don't play defense and you can say it's because they don't have to. And it's like, well, we're going to go out and get maybe the worst defensive forward in the entire league because he's fast.

And like, you know, they instantly scored. with him. And like I do like it in the sense that you can say what you want about him. Athanasi who is definitively an NHL winger. And you can say the same thing about Tyler Ennis. And that was what the oilers. Yeah. That was what the Oilers needed. And people have been saying it for

two fucking years. The Oilers need NHL wingers. Well, Ken Holland went out and got them and didn't spend a lot to do it. No. And that, because that was the thing that got me when I, Ken Holland has been sending signals for the last two months that he wasn't going to spend big. He was the first round pick probably wasn't in play. You know, he wasn't going to move prospects. And I was kind of sitting there going like, yeah, I get that. But also look at the Pacific right now.

If you're not going to take a swing now, when are you going to do it? And he actually, I think, did a pretty reasonable job of walking that line of taking. You know, and it wasn't a big swing. Like, you know, when you're looking at the guys they have, you're sitting there going, like, no, man, you're like, go out and get a first-line winger. Okay, who? Like, there weren't any. Yeah, the only one you could make the argument for was Chris Kreider.

And he didn't get trained in anywhere. And he didn't get moved. And even that, I think you're kind of stretching as far as what, so, I mean, the guy just, the guys weren't out there. And so he went for guys that are maybe not, not big names or not even big numbers or big production, not necessarily first-line guys, but guys that have a chance to fit in with where he wants him to play. And he didn't give up much to do it.

Like, I thought that was pretty reasonable work. I thought he did a great job, especially, you know, even Mike Green, like, very limited utility at this point, but they just needed a guy who could play on the power play. And it could move to pass the puck up ice, which he could still do. And, and, you know, they've had injuries on the back end, and now they have injuries up front, too. So, like, he went out and addressed all those needs for, like, a fourth, a fifth round pick, whatever it was.

And we joke about the Red Wings being so, you know, so bad. But sometimes when a team is so bad, like, how do you even evaluate the decent players they do? Correct. Yeah, Mike Green's not having a great year, but he's playing for the Red Wings. Correct. Put him on a real NHL team. Maybe, maybe not. You get more than you expect.

Yeah. It was good. It wasn't she really bad. Finally, Robin Leonard of the Knights is fucking great. Oh, my God. Such a good trade. And I don't know why more teams don't do this. I mean, Tampa did a lot of really good business, I thought, at the deadline.

the Boghian depth move is fine, whatever. Coleman, I like, and Goodrow, it's a bit of a pump and dump by San Jose, but I think he's a good player. But if Vasleski goes down, guess what, you're fucked. Vegas not only gets rid of the Malcolm Suban problem because he's not an NHL goalie, but then gives themselves a hell of an insurance policy if Flurry isn't Flurry, but last night you look like Flurry. So this is a really good bit of business here for Vegas. I like this a lot. It's the thing of like, hey, Mark, or Mark Andre, I don't know what the fuck they call him.

Flower. Flower. A flower. This guy's going to take your job if you don't start putting up shutouts almost every night. And he was like, oh, fuck, I better start doing that then. So that's exactly what he did. And it's, you know, I think like that alone is, you know, I've said all year, like, Vegas is the best team on paper in the Western Conference.

And the problem was that Florey suddenly, because he's 50 years old, couldn't make a save anymore. And Suban sucked. And so they were like, oh, why don't we go get the goalie who almost won a Vesna last year? Why don't we go get that guy for almost nothing? Yeah. And they didn't give up a ton, which it's a fascinating thing because I do. I like the deal a lot. And yet it's also one where, like, their big deadline move may have been that they just added a guy who might not even play for

them during the playoffs. If everything goes well, he won't play. And you'll be left sitting there going, if they've given up more for him, then you'd be sitting there going, oh, was that the right play? Like, what's the opportunity cost of making that move? But that doesn't really feel like an issue. I do think goalies being how they are and just this sport being what it is, they do potentially put themselves in a situation where, you know, what if Flurry struggles,

but he doesn't get shelled? But he's not great. Like at what point do you, you know, does it become a controversy? Does it become a thing where he's looking over at the bench? And yeah, that could happen. But you know what? I'd rather have the good goalies is a better. Yeah, exactly what you were about to say.

Like, it's, that's a better issue. And credit to the Knights for not shying away from what could have been a difficult situation at the expense of improving their team, which is what they ended up doing. Who won the deadline? I'm going to go Pierre Dorian for the first. fourth straight ear. I don't know if that guy could put together a winning team, but I know he could sell shit at the deadline.

Like, he does a good job when he's, and whether it's big shit, like, like, Matt Duchain, or if it's little shit, like the stuff that he moved this time, I think he does a really good job. I'll go here, Dorian. I don't give a ton of credit to him for the smaller stuff. Like, I think any GM can look at a bad roster and salvage a couple of good pieces that you're not going to sign and flip them for a third. round pick, but I thought he did really, really well on the pageau deal, like, like, far better than I would have imagined. Even if you like it from an Islander's perspective, that was phenomenal from a Senator's perspective. So I do like what he did.

My vote would maybe be Carolina. Yeah, we didn't mention Batman and Shea. Yeah, I mean, they gave up, you know, one rental, but two guys would term. didn't, you know, they gave up a first. They gave up some value, but also didn't gut themselves. This wasn't like an all-in situation. So I'm going to say Carolina, with the big caveat that they better trust those goalies because it's not like they've got a big safety net while they wait for guys to get healthy. And the fact that they didn't, you know, they weren't the team going out and getting Robin Lennar has the potential to backfire significantly.

but until that happens, I like the rest of what they did. Yeah. I think it's Vegas. They, like I said, they're the best team on paper in the Western Conference. They're super deep. They're super skilled. And they were like, oh, we have one problem. And it's the worst problem you can possibly have is not having a goalie and being a good team.

And so, like, I think, even though I really like what Edmonton did, I think Vegas just kind of put themselves. in a position where it's like, oh, we're going to walk to the Western Conference Finals now. If, you know, as long as, because now, now, like you said, they, they have a fail safe where if a goalie fucks up, well, they have another goalie who's potentially really good. And you know what? You never, you never judge this stuff based on one game, but how fascinating was it that you see both Vegas and Edmonton kind of try to stake their claim to the Pacific and then they play right away.

And Vegas, like, just throws it right in the dustbin. Yeah. Shut out. And it's kind of like, yeah, all right. So round one. They've been playing at like a 60% expected goals share since the DeBoer hire. And then they were like, oh, and we went out and got a goalie who had like a 920% the last two years.

And shout out to also the Alec Martinez trade. I like Martinez better than most. So that was a good point too. No, no thanks for me. I don't know why they did that. Alec Martinez haters can fucking stick it in their ear. And speaking of sticking things in your ear, the Racon. E25 earbud, my friend.

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It feels like a fever dream. I haven't heard about this. I talked to Kat Silverman of Ingole magazine and Elite Prospects about David Ayers, eBuggin, goaltending in the NHL, and this is an insightful conversation, and we'll be back after it to talk about the Ayers thing. All right. Listen, so we've talked about the David Ayers situation on Puck Soup. I wanted to get an expert opinion.

What it, okay, let's peel back some layers of this onion. What is your opinion overall on emergency goaltenders? I think it needs to be revamped and not just, because of the David Ayers situation. I think that was a good example of why. But, no, I think, you know, Kyle Dubus said, oh, if we'd won that game, how embarrassing would that have been that we beat this guy

who clearly was not playing at any kind of professional level one? They lost because they lost to a very good forecheck, but David A. had no business being on an NHL ice ice, because I'm happy for him, but I think it was a cute story. It's not a story that I want to see more than once in a lifetime. And the way that the system is currently set up, that's exactly what we would see in a number of cities,

because there really is no oversight as to who gets picked as the e-bug, right? So I think it's kind of a messy system, but it's not the worst thing. It's not the worst thing that any dog is going for right now. Right. Oh, yeah. And on the laundry list of things to fix, I don't even know where it falls. And like you said, I mean, it's not as if there isn't some ancillary publicity benefit to it. But you said, you mentioned the word oversight.

And, you know, my next question was going to be if you had any insight as to how to refine the system. I imagine oversight would be one thing you'd look at. That would be the first thing I looked at. I think the way they, you know, we've seen, I think it was Marty Biron was upset because there's only one eBug at the game. And I think he was pointing to the. Mike Smith, Cam Talbot, goalie fight, and saying, oh, you know, what if, what if, what if David Riddick and Miko Koskin started to fight? And, like, they got ejected to you. Then, then who goes in as the second e-bug? Do they trade off goalies during the period? And, like,

I think you can still go with one guy. I think that was a little dramatic. But I think oversight is, is how you fix it, right? At the start of the year, you have to submit the list of guys that serve as your e-bugs for the year, because teams do have them. They have rotating guys that are scheduled. I think you have to submit it to Kay Whitmore before the season starts, just like you have to submit your goalie gear. He has to approve it. And if you

don't have one of those guys there at the game, you get fined. And it's such a super easy fix. And that way he at the very least takes a look and says, hey, you're the Toronto Maple Leaf. You have, you know, 600 former U-S. former pros living in the area.

Why you have a Bamboni driver who played D. 25 years ago? Like, why is that your e-dogs? This is a very good point. That would have been such an easy way to fix that. So you like that a little bit better. Right. I was going to say, you like that a little bit better than, you know, one of the alternatives they're talking about. And I think this one's fraught with red tape when it comes to the relationship between the NHL and the Players Association,

is the idea that each team would carry their own. And I think that speaks to more of the, oh, my God, an employee. of the Leafs is playing the Leafs kind of conspiratorial thing versus anything else. Would you be a fan of that sort of roster expansion, like have a third stringer, or do you think it's overkill? I think if you carry a third stringer, you run into play issues, right? And I mean, the Arizona Coyotes had three guys for a little while earlier. This year, they picked up Eric Comrie, and there really isn't a great way to balance three

goleys. Like, look at the New York Rangers right now. Well, they had Shestirkin before he wrecked his car, and they had Gorgeev, and they had Henrik Lundquist, and they had to scratch a guy every night, which means that you may not even be a potential backup for a game for a week or two, and that just runs into play issues there. But I think you can, within that list of guys or girls, I mean, Shannon Zavidos would probably be a better easy. Oh. And there was that moment where it looked like she was going to be one for the Oilers that one year.

And that's, it's, it still sort of baffles me that she wasn't. But, you know, you look at an in-between of carrying a third goalie and what we have right now, which is part-time employees that are practiced goalie slash e-bugs. Like, you pay these guys to show up for, what, there's 41 home games a year. so each one shows up for 15, give or take. You have three of them. I think that math works out. I'm not good at that.

You have them show up for practices. It works kind of like a part-time job. You don't pay them. You know, I've seen proposals, pay this roster, third goalie, 50 or 70K, pay them 20K for the year, pay them 15K for the year to show up for a handful of practices each month and two or three of the games for the month and rotate. between the three of them and that way you get that third guy there, but you're not running into safety issues because right now I think that's the biggest thing is we say, oh, the ebugs aren't

very good. It's these beer leaguers, but they're basically playing for free. They're showing up to the rink for free and they're getting to watch a game, but a lot of them show up for practices too, and that's a volunteer thing. So, ideally, that's the easiest way to fix it without getting blowback from the Players' Association by having a guy who's a part-time employee. But I don't know if, I don't know if Kay Whitmore can even take on that much more. I don't know what all exactly he's, because he's in charge of overseeing all the equipment regulations

and all the goalies. Right. So maybe you have to beef up the league's entire goaltending department, which means acknowledging goalies, which the league doesn't like to do. Ouch. The last thing on airs, like you said, it kind of was stunning how little credit Carolina got. You know, I think there's like three teams in this league that could do what they did in that game. Like Dallas could and the Islanders could because of the systems they play.

And then Carolina, as far as shot suppression and puck control, obviously, could be one of those teams too that does what they did in front of airs. That said, from a goalie's perspective, is it kind of rough to have somebody who, some rando who drives a Zamboni come in and win a game like that and make some stops? Does it feed the goalies or overrated trope to have David Ayers do that? If you're stupid, it does.

We saw so many people say that, and I think so many of them were saying it in a tongue-in-cheek way, because anyone who watched that game did not see David Ayers win that game for Carolina. They saw the Carolina 4-check win that game, and they saw Toronto implode. Like, that was an abysmal effort from Toronto. And when they did put some decent shots on him,

two of those three went in. And so I think it's absolutely fair to say that, you know, maybe two or three teams in the league could have won that game, which is, I've seen a lot of people saying that Toronto is the one that's causing the biggest fuss about this eBug thing. I think they, if anybody's happy about the current system, it should have been Toronto. They had every opportunity to win that game and they didn't. If anyone should be upset, it was it was Carolina because they had to play that game, pretty much giving out like Stanley Cup final level effort just to win that game.

Right. And then also having an employee of the other team between their pipes, which is the other issue. You mentioned the Rangers. When they couldn't put their own employee in, right? Right, exactly, exactly. I bet Brenda Moore could have played. He seems like the kind of guy that has the flexibility. I wouldn't want to shoot a pocket at him.

He scared me. No, right? Exactly. You mentioned the Rangers. How much do you think Hank has left in the tank? Like if he was going to somehow part ways with them this summer and go on, off on a new adventure, what do we think about him as a, is he like in, like, is he platoon level goalie right now, or could it be the guy somewhere else?

Uh, that's, that's a tough one. Because I think like, every, every goalie wants Henrik Lunkwist to be ageless, right? Like, none of us want to think about him declining. And, and his numbers this year have shown that he still has something left in the tank. That's, that's not a very good team he's playing in front of. and he's still putting up better numbers than we've seen guys decline and we've seen what those numbers look like

and he's not doing that. But I don't think he has any more those 60 game a season, 35 shots a game seasons left in him. But I don't think he should have to either. No, exactly. Exactly. As a tandem guy,

look at what Chicago did this year. With Corey Crawford and Robin Lainer, that type of tandem, I think he'd thrive, just not behind Chicago's defense, because that's firing pin into the fire kind of situation there. So you're clearly in the workload management camp. Oh, for sure. Yeah. The carry prices of the world shouldn't be a thing. The Freddie Anderson's of the world shouldn't be a thing. He doesn't get a break in a really, right? Right, right, exactly. Yeah, exactly. And I think that's probably the smart, the smart. take. Who wins the Vezina right now if you had a vote?

Ooh. Let me rephrase that question. What's your mileage on Ben Bishop? Do you think he's real good or you think he's a product of a system? Kind of the product of the system there? My problem is that the guys who are performing the best this year are almost all exclusively on tandem. And I think that at some point there does need to be like a workload threshold. Like a guy who plays under 40 games probably shouldn't

be in consideration for the Vesna, no matter who they are. And, you know, Darcy Kempir was a big name and he missed two and a half months of the season, so I don't think he can really be in contention anymore. Jacob Marchstrom was a huge name. I think he may at this point no longer be in contention. Tuka Rask has been. been a pretty decent name in there.

A shared time, like you said, with Halak. Pretty good ones. And that's a tough to tell where he'll finish up. Connor Hollybuck's probably up there, right? I'd say so, yeah. He's been a little, it's tough because with him, it's a recency bias thing. It depends on how he, if he finishes the year,

like he played in the middle or if he finishes it, like how he started, which was we were wondering if he was even going to finish with a 900 safe percentage. He put up a couple games with a little. like Martin Jones' numbers there. Speaking of numbers, how much stock do you put into goals saved above average as a stat? As a part of the bigger picture, a decent amount. If it's the only number I'm looking at, not a lot.

But it just sort of enhances. You know, you see a guy with a 915 save percentage versus a guy with a 925. If they've played a similar workload looking at their goals saved above average to see how close it is. can tell you a little bit more about their workload. But by itself, it's none of the goalie stats are, that's what's tough. None of the goalie stats are very good on their own. Right, except for the ones that, like,

I remember talking to Mitch Korn about that and hearing, like, there's legions and gallons of goalie stats behind the curtain in the NHL that we're not privy to, that probably are better evaluators of goalies than anything we work with on a daily basis and doing this gig. They're pretty good. I've gotten to see a couple of them behind the curtain, and they're much more contextual, and they give us pretty good, like, one of the guys who works behind the curtain for one of the organizations sent me, quietly sent me some data on Jack Campbell versus Jonathan

Quick, and it pretty much reaffirmed that even though the proprietary data that we have publicly showed that they had similarly somehow bafflingly easy workloads that the year's actually been pretty tough on them just based on when you

when you add in pre-shot movement that's what adds it that's the context we're missing but yeah the publicly available data is it just doesn't tell us much it's got to be an unfair thing though

to measure Jonathan Quicks pre-shot movement because that dude never stops moving Except for this year he kind of does That's the problem He has stopped moving this year And that's That's not the way he should be That's it's funny

Like it's at the same time The way he should play And the way he can't play So that's kind of a weird A weird dichotomy With quick Same percentage has been on a roller coaster Since the 05 lockout

We had a few years after the lockout Where it was crazy low as the new rules kicked in. Then we had a few years when it crept back up. High watermark was 2016. What it was back up at 915, league average. So far, the season we're down at 909. Where are we on goaltending in the league right now?

I know, right? 9.09, same percentage on average for the league. Where are we on goaltending right now in 2020? I don't think that goaltending itself has fallen off. I think shooters are finally getting smarter. for a long time there, I think, starting in right about the mid to late 2000s, we saw a lot of goalies that were starting to break down film. They were starting to go to specialized camps where they were learning situational shots.

They were learning how to react to all sorts of systems, and they were scouting their opponents, they were scouting the shooters. And I think it was Jonathan Quick, who ended up helping out Penn one of those fantastic players here being pieces about Elie's 19. and he knows like every good sniper in the NHL and he knows where they shoot and how they shoot and where they pass and what their stick looks like and and shooters were like yeah the goalie makes himself look big he made a timely save like I think he made himself looked up there and and finally we've seen like I think it's Joe Pavelsky is one of the guys who who goes out to some of those goalie camps in the summer and volunteers is like a shooter tutor we get guys. Oh no kidding. Is that right? and they shoot. Oh, that's so cool.

I think it's him don't, it may be like, stamp coats are one of those, but it's one of those guys who is very good at shooting has been going out and and offering to take shots on goalies during their goalie camps and sort of seeing the other side. They're doing what the goalies did for five or ten years.

We see, I think it's Connor Garland, who told me this past year, that he's watched tape on every single goalie. I was talking to him about, you know, is there a disadvantage to not knowing the starter until the game. And he was like, no, I've watched tape on every one of the goalies in their system. So regardless of who gets the start, like, I know exactly how they're going to play.

So it doesn't make a difference to me. And so there are still a few dinosaurs that don't do that. And we're seeing their numbers drop. Brad Richardson is one of them. He notoriously does not watch film on goalies. But a lot of shooters do. A lot of the guys that we're seeing really good numbers from are watching. And so I think it's kind of that give and take.

You know, I think goalies are going to respond to it really well, and they're going to creep back up, and then the shooters are going to respond to that. But that's kind of where we are right now, I think, is the shooters are catching up. That's really interesting. All right. I was reading your Twitter.

I noticed the other day that you said that you officially caught up on Love is Blind and has there ever been a messier show? Or did you write Messier? Messier show. there hasn't been one right I fucking love it now I my wife Ruby has

binged a lot of it I actually only watched the first couple of episodes to kind of get a sense of it and I've just been traveling and stuff I know the thing I find fascinating about it is twofold one the fact that it's like it's like it's like

different phases of reality shows but all one big show like the the the freaky gimmicky meeting together thing and then you like live together and then there's another thing. I've never seen a reality show that kind of mixes different stages of a relationship together as one show. You know what I'm saying? That was kind of neat to me.

The other thing that I find fascinating is that the fucking success rate. My God, like I was reading some article about Love is Blind and like they had so many people couple up that they didn't even use all of the people that coupled up. They just, they had like their pick of the litter of people that coupled up because so many of their couplings were successful. Why do you think this show had worked? Well, they had to pick some train wrecks, right? So like, what do you think, first of all, what is it about the show that you found fascinating? And two, what do you think it is that that made it effective? Ooh.

I mean, I found it fascinating because it's so messy, right? I don't actually watch a ton of reality TV. I think that's the last reality show that I watched before. this was unless we're counting the Stanley Cup playoffs. How did you, how did you, how did you stumble into this then? Um, a couple people had texted me about it. And I was shocked when I, because I tweet about some of the Netflix shows I watch here and there and I get like no pickup on it because I've been, I'm a TV fiend.

Like when, when my daughter goes to bed, I usually go for like a five mile run and then I park myself on the couch and like don't move until I fall asleep. And so I've burned through like English language Netflix, Netflix, Spain. I'm on to like the Finnish language Netflix. And so, but I don't do the reality TV shows. And like usually when I tweet about them,

nobody cares. Like I'll tweet about sort of a minute. It's like a Finnish show and like nobody cares. And I tweeted about love is blind. I was like, no one's going to care. And everybody else who follows me for hockey has watched this stupid show.

And I think it's because the characters are both there are both messy characters and wholesome ones. Like there's this couple Lauren Cameron and they're so wholesome and they look like Serena Williams and Alexis O'Hannian and they're like there's nothing wrong

with either of them. They're perfect. And like, and then there's Jessica who like keeps getting drunk. She fed her dog wine on the show. Right, and there was an entire article written about whether you could feed a dog wine just to get to the point of saying don't was the article that I read. I was super confused when I watched it. I just, my mouth, my jaw dropped.

I felt like that was like feeding my child wine, which I would not do. Why do you think that it succeeded in so many couples? I think that there has to be some level of, like they didn't, pick anyone who's truly unattractive. But I think, first off, I mean, everybody's coming and do it with the same mindset, right?

Like, in Siri, everyone who's on there wants to get married. So there hadn't, there weren't really people who were like, hey, we have this great connection, but like, I'm not looking to date right now. Right, right. Oh, we have this great connection.

They're just to marry me. Right. And so, yeah. I think it's that. And, I mean, getting to know someone without seeing them is it's not something I would personally do I don't know, but there's something

to like, you know, it reminds me of sort of like, you know, the late night phone calls with somebody, you know, where you could kind of like get together that way. That's kind of exactly what it. Some people were like, I don't understand how they can do that. Like they aren't touching each other. I'm like, I'm not a very touchy-feely person. So I was like, actually,

that looks perfect having a wall between me and the person I'm dating fantastic like give me that but no I think it's it's that like-minded like everyone who went on there very clearly knew that the other people there were also looking for a serious relationship and the other people there were very seriously looking for an emotional connection not just like a quick hookup and so I don't know that that would be my guess

I don't know how many of them also figured, you know, oh, I'm on a reality show, I'll be more open-minded. Right. I don't know. Like I said, I personally would never do it. I'm baffled by the people who didn't. As perfect as some of the couples seem like,

I kind of still don't trust them as people, because, like, that's what they did. But, no, it's, I think it's that combination of, like, you said, there's so many different shows all rolled into one, and there are some decently likable people on there to go with the really messy, like, alcohol dog feeders. Well, that's the thing. Like, the lack of inhibitions is very interesting, because usually that's alcohol-fueled, but like you said, most of that booze is going to the dogs.

So it's a really different dynamic that we normally have. I'm going to her too. All right, Kat. Hey, where can people find your stuff? They can find me at Engel magazine. They can find me an elite prospect. They can find me on Twitter. I'll apologize in advance.

Like I said, I treat a lot about really bad foreign language Netflix shows, but the more power to you them, if they want to find me there. Awesome. Thanks so much for your insight and your time. And maybe the coyotes will wise up and make you an ebug down the line. Everybody kept asking me that. That was the number one message I got when the ebug went in. I got like 40 messages from people asking, would that have been you?

And I had to keep telling everyone, no. Like, my goalie mask is not regulation. There's no way they'd let me in the game with that. Well, damn. Get up the spec so we can see you in an NHL game. Thank you so much. Our thanks to Kat Silverman for joining us to talk about the ebugs and goalies and such. She says, boys, that maybe.

One of the ways that they tweak the system is a better filtering of potential e-bug candidates, which I think is a lot smarter than some of the other nonsense that we've heard. Like, teams should carry their own, like, third string goalie, basically, which... But has anybody actually proposed that? Like, is anyone seriously suggesting? That was a big talking, one of the talking points on. sports net on or i was going to say tsn i didn't watch the sports net deadline show yeah no that was definitely something that's proposed and i mean that's great

and all but like the minute that gets proposed uh watch the fucking nchel drop that on the negotiating table for cba talks in a millisecond right well yeah expanding a roster i think it was mike johnson said like you have a guy you pay him like 80 90k a year and it comes out of the hockey op side right not the player's side that that that that That makes more sense, like that's, for lack of a better term, like the bullpen catcher. They will define that as expanding the roster by a spot. They completely well. Oh, of course they would.

They would, but that's, that was what the idea was. Point is, yeah, I mean, like you just. And apparently it was what the NHL, to some extent, already proposed two years ago and then decided it would be, you know, there's too much cost associated with it for something that's going to come up every few years at the most. but that's one option is kind of the bullpen catcher where you get a guy who's he's part of your coaching staff or he's part of everybody but he's somebody who's in his 20s or 30s and has recent experience and isn't in his 40s and driving a Zamboni I that that seems that seems reasonable but as far as like the the you know how do you filter these guys how do you pick them part of the issue here that I think a lot of people don't recognize is under the current rules, you can't have somebody who has any pro experience. That seems strange. That's insane. You can't have somebody, like, they're like, why isn't it somebody who's like played in Europe or played in it?

Because my understanding, as it was explained to me, was that if it's somebody with pro experience, that then becomes a situation where under the CBA and the rules, it has to be a PTO, it has to be like a trial contract. Yeah. It then goes under the cap and how to even manage a cap, like it's split between two teams. It would be a nightmare. And so it sounds to me like at some point,

the league just went, ah, screw it. This is almost never going to come up. Just do it. Just no pro guys allowed. But it seems to me like it would be relative, like if they feel like this is worth changing, it would be relatively straightforward to put like an exception in there.

It says, emergency goal tenders don't need a PTO or any of the rest of this stuff. And that way, it's the same system. except your emergency backup is like a 26-year-old who played in the ECHL last year and not a 42-year-old who plays beer league. That seems kind of reasonable to me. I don't know.

I could see a team that had both goalies injured and had the Carolina situation where they had to call up to AHL guys getting around the contract limitations by faking two minor league goalie injuries and then bringing in some ringer. I could see that happening. Well, but I mean, I don't know what a ringer is. Like, you could, you could say, you know, nobody with NHL experience, nobody with even a HL experience if you want. But there's a huge gap between, you know,

NHL quality goaltending and reckless. Guys that are available. And the other piece of this is that, you know, and I know, you know, a lot of people are frustrated that anyone's even talking about maybe changing the rule or doing whatever. Like, this was the guy that was available in Toronto, which is the most populated hockey player plays. Yeah, because I was watching that game on Saturday night and I was telling my girlfriend, like, the fact of the matter is that somewhere in that building just watching the game, there were four goalies who were better options than this guy.

Exactly. And so, you know, and you can criticize, I think the Leafs, if you want for, you know, the fact that he was one of the guys that's in there. rotation. But if that's the level that's available in Toronto, what do you think it looks like in some of the other markets where there's not a lot of hockey players around? Like I was talking to one of the beat writers at the athletic who was talking to the front office of the team that he covers. And he said that they were basically like, man, if people are mad about Toronto, thank God this didn't happen here. Because if they saw who we have available some nights, they would lose their minds. Because they just, you know, they've got. They've got

real, have a real hard time finding anyone. So like I don't, I think you can still have the emergency backup concept. In fact, you need to because it would be ridiculous to expect teams to have three NHL quality goalies around at all times, but still bump up the quality somewhat. Or maybe, you know, maybe you don't even do that. Maybe all you do is say, okay, we're keeping the system exactly as it is, but every team needs to have their own guy. So at the very least, if you bring a guy in and he gets shelled, you don't get to complain that it was the other team's pick or the other team's employee even.

I mean, we shouldn't be allowed to team employees. That's the obvious rule change. It's like maybe don't have the guy be a guy who works for the organization. And he's wearing like a t-shirt of that. Like, you know, it's just. But hold on. Like that's the tricky part because, you know, if you are dealing with locally based, like, goalies,

um, the chances, like Scott Foster is a Blackhawks fan. Right? Even if he's not, there's Amboni driver. And like, whoever you pluck from, from Ontario, chances are very high. They're going to be a Leafs fan. So if your concern is like, even in Ottawa, that's a good deal. Some fucking dusty road swerve where, you know, he's going to pull off his jersey and there's a Leafs T-shirt underneath. And we all know that it's going to happen. Yeah.

And we all know that anybody, like, they're not going to go in there and start letting in goals on purpose because they help the home team. But it's, it's one of these things where the perception matters too. And, you know, it's, it's just a kind of. kind of thing where like I get that everyone loves this story. I love it too. It's fantastic. David Erz is great. I love that he's done his media tour. How amazing is it that the NHL in this situation lucked into a guy who is so good on TV and like says such a great story and like is willing to do all this stuff. It's fantastic. But it's like to me this feels like just like as a parent. It's like when your kid's like, hey dad, watch me do a backflip down the stairs and like before

you can stop them, they do it, and they land it. And you're like, all right, two things. Number one, that was awesome. And number two, don't do that again. Because the next time you do it, you're going to land on your face, and it's going to be a disaster. But you didn't this time, and we're going to tell this story forever, because that was great. Like, you can have both those feelings at the same time of this was amazing, but next time, there's a good chance it won't be. And let's consider that as well. What if those stairs only appeared twice in a span of like 50,000 games? Right. That's the thing.

It's still, the worst case is going to happen eventually. I agree with you. Like, I know there's a lot of people going like, is this really that high on the NHL's list of problems? No, of course it isn't. We've spent how many hours on this show talking about all the problems the NHL should be fixing. I've got a long list. You know, emergency backups isn't in my top 10. But because it just happened and because people are talking about it, eventually this is going, this situation is going to come up again.

It probably should come up more often if we hadn't all just for some reason agreed to exempt goalies from concussion protocol and all that. And, you know, if we actually did pull guys out of games. We'd be seeing this more often. Even if it was just guys coming in for a few minutes, eventually someone's going to come in in a key game. And it's not going to be a David Error story. It's going to be they gave up five goals on six shots and everybody is flipping. And I don't mind that for once it feels like the NHL is at least thinking about solving an obvious inevitable problem before it happens rather than waiting for it to happen and then going into scramble mode and probably overreacting, which is how they usually deal with issues. I think the real issue is that it's not that it won't be a David Airst story.

It's that it won't be a Carolina hurricane story. like there are three teams in this league that could do what they did with it with an emergency goal yeah Dallas the Islanders and Carolina and Carolina you know played like Stanley Cup level puck possession of defense unbelievable they look fucking incredible and they should just play aers every night now because they'll never lose again they they were that good and then and then the other component of that equation is that you won't always have a team that quite frankly will fold the minute you fucking punch them in the mouth on the other side of the ice that gets frustrated that easily. So, so, you know, that's, to me was the story. And that's why I found the

Christopher Steig argument. He compared it to like, what if the Dallas Cowboys, all of their quarterbacks were injured and then like they had to play with some guy from Dallas, like some plumber as their quarterback. Well, you know, you know what they would do? Not throw the fucking ball. They would just run the football for the rest of the game. That's why the comparisons to other sports don't really work. Like goaltending is so unique. But that's what Carolina did. Carolina just ran the ball. Like Carolina just changed the way they played to compensate for that goal to enter.

And that's why at the end of the day, the ebug thing to me is so overblown is that it is one game. Freaky things do happen. You can change the way that you play in front of that goalie where it is, it's not the same system and setup as you're going to have. So if we're acknowledging that the next time, it like, if the Maple Leafs. If the Maple Leafs is. scored 10 goals to win that game, or the Maple Leafs they just won that game, period. Everybody would be furious.

Like, not just the hurricanes, like, the floor of panthers would be out of their minds. Yeah, but like, shit happens. Like, well, there have been more teams that played in a fucking blizzard in the last 10 years than played with an emergency goalie. I mean, and like, but to, but to your point about like, only three teams could do that, I disagree. The fucking Chicago Blackhawks, what, two years ago, who were terrible,

they got a backup goalie to stop, what, 7 of 7, 9 of 9, whatever it was. Like, backup goalies, or emergency backup goalies, I mean, have a really high collective save percentage in the last five years. You know what I mean? Like, they're... But we know, like, this is getting into like the Joe Haggerty argument that, no, these guys are really good and... Oh, they definitely aren't really good.

They are. First of all, they aren't. And second of all, and that's no knock on any of those guys. But, and second of all, like, even if they were, that's not the argument the NHL wants to make is like, no, actually, there's no discernible difference between our $10 million goalies and part-time purely got. And we touched on that with Kat. Is that really what Haggurty wrote? Like, because that's the most fucking Boston-towny bullshit take on this that I could possibly imagine. Well, his argument was that many of these, well, I think he said most of these guys.

He said all of them and then he downgraded it to most. And I think it's even that. Joe McIntyre played six games at Boston You, he's got to be better than most of your fucking NHL goalies kid. No, his argument was that many of these guys are practice goalies in the NHL, so they have, if they were terrible, I mean, if they were just

absolute sieves, they wouldn't be practice goalies. Yeah, like he had history against the Leafs. That's another thing that happened in the game. So, I mean, I'm just saying, like, my argument is if, if it happens again and the goal that comes in and gives up 10 goals, If you're okay with that and you think that would just be part of the like crazy unpredictable, then okay, then keep it as is. You're right. It's not going to happen often. But if your version is, hey, it's a great story when the guy does well. But if the guy does poorly, then I'm going to be complaining with everyone else is going to be complaining. Then no, like let's find a better way to do it. We don't have to overhaul the whole thing. But it doesn't mean that you hate fun if you're sitting there going, you know, maybe 40 something year old show. shouldn't be playing against professional athletes in their prime in meaningful games where they can get either embarrassed or hurt, which would be another worst case scenario.

You know, the guy gets plowed into by some forward driving the net and he's next to, you know, a 42-year-old freelance Zamboni drivers getting hauled off in a stretcher. The NHL gets killed for that, like absolutely destroyed everywhere. And again, rightfully so. So, you know, I feel like this was, this was an amazing story. and part of the reason it's so amazing is that it felt so unlikely. And the fact that it's unlikely is a good reason to maybe take some steps to make sure it doesn't happen again in this exact way. But I think it's unlikely because it never happens.

Like we're talking about like the Haley's comment of hockey shit. Well, I mean, it's now twice in the last three years. And like I said, if we ever actually get serious about, hey, maybe that goalie who just lay on the ice for five minutes holding his head should come out of the game. it maybe becomes even more common at that point. Like if it's never going to happen, then you know what, just change the rule and the new rule won't ever come into play and we got nothing to argue about. But it is going to happen again at some point. Not necessarily, you know, maybe it's a Scott Foster game and the game doesn't even really

matter and it's two weeks to the end of the season and it's six to two in the third period. Or maybe it happens on Hockey Night in Canada halfway through a, game with crucial playoff implications, or maybe it happens on the final weekend of the season in a game that's a de facto playoff game. Like, there's, who knows? I would just, I would, I am happy that the league sounds like they're at least considering talking about a problem before the worst case happens. That's a nice change.

And, you know, I'm, I, I think there's ways we can tweet this so that it works better. I just don't see it as a problem. Yeah, who cares? It's like, we got on the fucking today. show because of this. Yeah, but you got on the Today show because people hear this and go, oh, that guy probably got shelled and then the twist is, no, he played well. If he gets shelled, you're not on the Today show.

Because as Ryan pointed out, the two times that it happened, the guy played really well. I mean, if you think it's likely that, if you think it's more likely than not that these guys are going to play well, then okay. But we keep say that. But the reality is that it never happens. And when it does happen, it turned out great twice. So now we got to fix the problem.

I mean, you guys are both smart enough to know that two partial games is not a sample size. You hang your hat on and go, this is how it's going to go next time or most times. Like, come on. Like, the NHL dodged a bullet. They got an amazing story out of it to either, I don't know if it's their credit or if it's just David Ayers doing it on himself, but got all sorts of great media coverage. It's awesome. It doesn't mean it's going to go this way next time.

And if you're okay with the alternative, then, all right. then we take our chances. But to me, the very best case scenario is the next time this happens, the guy plays well again, in which case, like, you're still not getting on the Today Show because they go, yeah, we've seen, we've seen that story already. We did that a few years ago. And the worst case is pretty bad. So I don't, the pros versus cons here for me is leans towards just, just changing.

But isn't there a certain amount of like your shit out of luck if you guys get hurt? Like, if you lose your top two centers during a game, you just lost your top two. centers are not you're not pulling a 72 year old guy to come out of the crowd that's part of this too is like I don't understand this idea that like we have to come up with a way to get a third string goalie if you lose both your goalies I'm sorry that's just bad luck you're kind of fucked like yeah the penguins there's nothing to stop you from carrying a third goalie there's nothing in the rules that say well you can't you should be doing it all year exactly fucking fucking if you it's so like if the penguins lose crosbie and malkin during a game they're not called up fucking

Matt Cullen out of the upper deck to come play. You're just fucked. No, but they're also not pulling 40-something-year-old beer leaders out and putting them in a prominent spot. I just said Matt Cullen. No, I'm kidding. God has asked. Matt Cullen, you're on notice.

That's it. It's fucking over for you, dude. Oh, fuck. E-Bugs, baby. Well, there you go. The e-bug sensation. A couple other things awesome that the hurricane. found a way to sell the T-shirts and benefit the Kidney Foundation for Ayers.

That was really cool. And like you said, I always crossed my fingers on these things because I'm sure he'll get milk chick ducked at some point, but a really good ambassador for hockey at the very least during these last 48 hours. And, you know, part of this is I've heard people say, like, well, how come this wasn't such a big story when it was Scott Foster, which, first of all, it was a big story. That was a huge story. It was a huge story.

But also he didn't want to do this. Like he made the choice that he didn't want to be front and center, which is fine. And David Ayers is comfortable with it, which is also fine. That's the most hockey shit imaginable. I just had the most incredible thing of my life that will ever happen to me in this sport happen. I'm mad about it. I'm going to go hide. Yeah.

But, you know, whatever. Like not everyone wants to be it. You know, like whatever, sure. But Eres is great. His wife is fantastic. She cracks me up. Sean. My goodness.

Oh, he means like for interviews. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. The whole thing is just, it has just been, has just been great. Like it really has, this is going to be something people are going to remember for a long time. And yeah, I don't feel the need to cross my fingers to try to recreate it. But that doesn't mean you can't enjoy what's going on now.

There you go. All right. Last thing today, as you know last week, the big gimmick was we all. made bets on the trade deadlines. That's right. And I'd like to know how some of those trade deadline bets worked out. The initial response from Sean, Ryan, was that we both lost money. Yeah, I think that was a guarantee.

I'm not completely sure that's true. Let's go through it. Okay. Okay. All right. So we'll do this quick. If you missed the show last week, I basically gave the guys, I think it was seven things to bet on. and they bet imaginary money.

I think, I would say that the person who missed the show last week, Ryan, was the person who thought that you always agree with me in fights with Sean. That was the thing that happened. Anyways, go ahead, sir. Yeah. So question number one was the over under on the total trades. I said it at 29.5. The previous year had been 32.

So I was anticipating a little less action than usual. That was wrong. We had more action than usual. I don't even know what the final number was. This was, like, from the moment we recorded, it was well into the 30s. So that was over by quite a bit. And you guys both bet the under. Greg, you had $20 on the under and Ryan, you had $25 on the under.

So you both started off on a losing foot on that one. In fairness, I did take the over and Leif's Lightning the other night, so I won on that one. There you go. Which Eastern team would make the most trades? You guys, I gave you a series of odds. Greg, you took the Rangers at 9 to 1. Ryan, you took the Devils at 5 to 1, who I had is my favorite.

And neither one was very busy. The Devils, I think, made three deals. The Rangers only made the one. Ottawa, I think, right? Well, you know what? Ottawa made five deals. The Canadians made five deals. Remember, this is from like the Thursday

when we recorded. Right. But at least out of the teams I gave you, you know who actually made the most deals? And this is pretty stunning, given that they had what felt like a very quiet deadline. But the Toronto Maple Leafs made six or seven trades, depending on if you count the Robin Leonard stopover,

because they made a bunch of minor leave. Like a bunch of HL stuff or like Kelly Rosen, there was a Ben Harper trade. So even though a lot of people are like, oh, the Leafs didn't do anything, I think they were actually the busiest team. And they would have cashed in at 15 to 1 for you. But you both lost on that one.

So I'm down 40 right now, I think, according to the sheet in front of me. You're down 30 because you had 20 on the first question. Oh, I was just already jumping ahead to the next bet that I lost. Okay. So in that case, yeah, because you both missed again on the Western team with the most trades. Greg, you had the Wilde who I don't think actually ended up making any moves. They didn't make a trade. They were trying to make the prezze.

Ryan, you put 15 on the Hawks at 8 to 1. They made three deals. But I believe the busiest team in the West would have been the Golden Knights, who I have down... Oh, I think it's... I would imagine it's the ducks. Yeah, I would say Anaheim probably had like six or seven. You're right.

I missed the ducks on my list. The knights did have five, but the ducks were all over the place. Again, some of those are small deals. But the ducks who I had at 9 to 1 would have been your winner there. So you're both in a hole, but you're going to start digging out here. Yeah. How many trades will happen involve a first round pick? We set the over under at 2.5.

Greg, you bet the over. Ryan, you bet the under both for $10. The over came in. Oh, hell yeah. There it is. There were the Pajot, the Cache, Shea, Goodrow. There was like seven, right? Yeah, there were a lot.

Of which some had happened before we recorded, but there were at least four. So well over on that one. How many goalies who have played at least one NHL game this year would be traded? I set the over under one and a half. Greg, you went, actually, you both went over. Greg for 20, Ryan for 15. It did go over. You had, in fact, you could argue it went over just based on Robin Lennar being traded, maybe twice.

But Suban was in that deal. It went over in the Louis Doming, Zane McIntyre. Well, Hutchinson had been traded too. He was already on the book. So you were, again, comfortably over there. So I'm down 10 right now. I don't have the running total, but yeah. I do in front of me.

I'm only down 10 right. Yeah. Next one was what will be the biggest deal in terms of players and picks involved? Set the over under at four and a half. And Greg, you bet the over for 20. Ryan, you went under for 10. The over cashed in on this. Just barely.

It was the Trojanic deal. I think the only one they cracked five. And there were quite a few at four. So again, another over. And then the last question. Well, Don Waddell told me that they were going to throw in Chase Prisky. before the podcast last week. So that's...

Inside information, man. That's how you do it. Yes, dude. You're talking to Don Waddell about all this? Come on. All right, I'll shut my mouth. Last one. Last one.

How many players who have played in an all-star game would be traded? We set the over under two and a half. The previous year, it had been two. Greg, you went under for 10. Ryan, you went over for 15. This one went over by a mile. Wow. Wayne Simmons.

Trowcheck. Covalcher. Mike Crean, who was a guy we hadn't really thought about, and Patrick Marlowe was another one. And Parizet would have been another, but he didn't get trade. But that one went over by quite a bit. So I don't know what kind of, what your totals look like in front of you. I'm plus 10.

Okay, see, I'm not doing the math as we went along. So I'm going to go ahead and say that you're in the negative on that one. Yeah, I think that's a safe bet, but, you know, hey. All right. Yeah, I kind of did a. Quick version, Greg, I wound up with you even, but maybe you ended up. Wait, so what, 2040, I lost the last one. You lost 2010-10.

Oh, no, you're right. I am even. Yeah. So you wind up even and Ryan ended up minus 35. So Ryan, please send me $35 in the mail. Oh, no. And once again, the house always wins. I didn't even take any juice from you guys on this.

That was very, very kind. All of a sudden, it's rounders. What's happening? here. I got a big over here, too. This sucks. I know. My God.

Jeez. Butch Vig, he means. Super producer of Nevermind and garbage albums. Yeah. But I do, I do owe you guys a bunch of free drinks. And then, so. Oh. Yes.

Yeah. Where's my gin and tonic? That's my go-to casino drink and my go-to plane drink when I happen to be, you know, flying in a place where I actually get a, I have a lot of drink vouchers. So if you see me out of plane, let's come over and say, hey, Greg. No, don't do that. Don't ever talk to me on a plane. I don't even talk to the people next to me on a plane.

Yeah. Oh, two things about planes. I flew back from Bristol next to you a gentleman who won, ate a cheese sandwich and a can of Pringles and farted the entire way during the five-hour flight back west. Living the dream. That was a freaking mirror, it sounds like, just kidding. It was just toxic. And then also he watched a parasite on the plane. And that was the good part because I could watch him watching Parasite.

I haven't seen it. Don't see anything. I'm not. Got to the big twist in the basement. He paused Parasite and said damn and rewound Parasite to see the big twist the second time. Oh, respect. This guy's living the dream, in my opinion. What, farting all over the plane and watching Parasite?

Yeah, can't beat it. Do you ever fart in a plane? Like, I would never fart on a plane. I just could, I just would, I don't know what I would do. I'd go to the bathroom. or something. I could never do it. I would feel so embarrassed and so bad about it that I could never do it. I literally

refused to believe that you have never farted on a plane. That is lying. Hey, I've never farted on a date. I've never farted on a plane. I have control of my fucking bowels. This is going to be the new do you recline your seat. This is going to take over Twitter for the next two weeks with people giving boring ass takes about how they behave

on airplanes. Yeah. People lying. Oh, I've never, I've never farted my whole life. The thing about the reclining seat thing is that it completely obscures the real issue, which is don't eat goddamn stinky food on the plane. Like anything that has like a salmon. Like don't bring a fucking salmon on the plane. Like, that's the easiest thing to do. There's a billion places in the airport where they sell food that doesn't stink. Go get yourself a fucking anti-Ans or some shit.

Don't bring some stinky food on the plane. That's the easiest thing to do. I would rather sit behind a recliner 10 out of 10 times than sit next to somebody eating a trout on a plane. Yeah, how'd they get that grizzly bear into first class. Yeah, exactly. Well, obviously, we know it's an emotional support grizzly bear, sir. So that's probably how. Do you see the picture of that mini horse that got on a plane?

Yeah. That was cool. That was cool. Look, I'm in favor of, you know, beating the system however you can. If you want to get a mini horse on the fucking plane by saying you need it to like chill out, I respect that. That's cool. Right. Yeah.

Just being a little friend on there. And you can hide your drugs in it. Like a drug mule. Well, it's a drug mule. No, it's a different thing. Lil Sebastian, the drug mini horse. That's the show for this week. Our thanks to Raycon for sponsoring it.

Our thanks to Kat Silverman of Ingle magazine for smartening it up. And our thanks to you, the Puck Soup listener. I'm Greg Wushinsky, VSPN. Me, Emily, and Chris Peters sat down for an all-31 team review of the trade deadline that's on ESPN on Ice the podcast. Thank you to everybody who listens to that podcast. Our numbers were up 15% year over year, which was really good news that we got while

we were in Bristol. And then also, you could read all of our trade deadline coverage on ESPN.com. and my column of the wish list will run on Friday, I don't know when you're listening to this, but it ran on Friday, and we'll be focused on the e-bug issue. Sign up for the Puck-Soup Patreon and the newsletter on that. I did an extra one this week.

Basically, it was a live blog of the whole day of the trade deadline. I think I started at like 930, 10 o'clock, and went right on through past four. So check it out. it was fun. So thanks. Bye. I had a busy week at the Athletic. Lots of Zamboni driver coverage, including what for me is the ultra rare same day that night reaction post. So if you would like to know what a lifelong Maple Leaf fan was thinking

on Saturday night in the immediate aftermath, you can check that out. I also took a look at whether that game, where that game would rank among the worst leaf loss as ever. Had some trade deadline stuff. Got the grab bag this Friday. A whole bunch of stuff. Go check it out. And then check out all the other trade coverage that is on that site because there was a ton of it.

And it was very good. Good stuff. All right, everybody. Thanks to listening to our dumb podcast. Patreon bonus episode. The Supply will be coming up this week and also mailbag. And we will talk to you soon. Bye.

See it. Bye. slap shots and goons. We've got sportly commentary to whatever you commute. We also cover movies, TV shows, it's in tunes. It's your weekly bowl of Hagi and Nonsense.

Book 2.