Puck Soup - Ironman in the Apple Store

Episode Date: January 26, 2022

Sean and Ryan touch on the racism incidents in the minors, Canucks hires, the Flyers losing streak, Keith Yandle, the Blues, Aaron Dell, and more. Sponsored by Athletic Greens and DraftKings.

Sticks and hits and goals and saves and slap shots and goons. We've got sportly commentary to what if you commute. We also cover movies, TV shows, it's in tunes. It's your weekly bowl of hockey and nonsense. I'm Ryan Lambert from Elite Prospects. I'm Sean McAnew from The Athletic. And we, um, Every week I feel like I'm saying we got to talk about something we don't want to talk about.

And this time it's not the Edmonton Oilers. Winners of two straight. No, it's racism. We got to talk about racism, it says. Not a great week for the hockey world, I think everybody would say. Well, not everybody, I guess. But, yeah, two incidents of, I guess, I guess. guess we have to say allegedly racial taunting or acts or whatever you want to say in the

AHL and the ECHL. Although I guess the AHL one was less recent than this week. It just came out this week. Is that right? Yeah, the suspension was announced on Friday, I think. Right. So, in both cases, someone just kind of made a, like a gesture, I believe, at a, at a black player in both cases. And at least in one of the cases, they said, yeah, you know what, I, I fucked up.

And the other one was like, you actually misunderstood what I was doing, and it's your fault. Yeah, yeah, not a great week, especially after, you know, we get the Willio Re celebration. And we all pat ourselves on the back and, you know, hockey's for everyone. And then pretty quick reminder that that's not always the case. And yeah, I mean, you and I have to talk about it because it's one of the bigger stories of the week and the more important stories of the week. not sure really what to say, uh, beyond, yeah, I don't have much to, to contribute to the, you know, uh, it's bad. Yeah. That's all. Yeah. I mean, I, I, I guess the, the only point I would make is the, uh, the guy, uh, in the ECHL, it's Jacob Panetta, I think is his, is, is how he

pronounced his name. And he, he made the gesture towards, uh, Jordan Subban, of course, the brother of P.K. Malcolm. And has since defended himself by saying that this is a gesture that he makes often and that it was not meant to be a racist, like, you know, people interpreted it as like an ape-like gesture. And he's saying, no, no, it's my tough guy pose. And I do it often. And he's, and that seems to be true.

true. He's put out video clips of him doing it in other games to other people. I guess the only point to make there is that if you've got a gesture, a taunt that you frequently use, that could be incredibly offensive to black players, but that had never occurred to you before and you just have been frequently doing it, that's a pretty good sign that, You're one of the many, many people who still thinks of hockey as a sport where white guys are the default and everybody else is some weird outlier. And, yeah, I mean, I don't, I don't particularly take his defense to be, to be much of a defense, you know, to say, oh, it's not, it's not a very compelling argument. Yeah, I do this thing that is offensive to black people often. this is just the first time that there was a black person around to see it isn't maybe as

airtight, airtight as he thinks it is. Yeah, it's, um, it's just, you know, it's one of those situations where you go, right, like, okay, the thing you're saying may be true, but like, you have to understand, like, it, it, how it comes off, even, even if you don't mean it the way you intend, or, Yeah. It's being taken. You got a, you got to take the, take the hit on this one. Yeah.

And like, intent does matter if, uh, and I say that in the sense that, you know, it would obviously be far worse if he was like, yeah, that's, that's what I meant and, you know. Um, yeah, that's right. So, and intent matters and also people who are accused of, of doing bad things and there's, there's consequences on this. He's been released from the team. They have a right to defend themselves and they have a right to speak their people. and say, you know, here's my side of the story.

I'm just kind of explaining why I did not find his side of the story to be particularly convincing, even if you do take him at his word as many seem to be that he didn't intend this the way that most of us sawed. Yeah, and I think the fact that there is the video evidence that he just does this shit all the time. Like he think, I guess this is like his big bit that he does. Yeah, you know. And others, it's like a Tom Wilson thing.

We've seen him do it. Yeah, that's exactly right, yeah. And so, yeah, I mean, like you say, I guess I take him in his word, but also it's like, like, I'm not, I'm not super convinced that this is like a great thing for you to be, you know, bringing up. Like, I'm actually nice. Oh, okay, man. Yeah.

Well, yeah, and he had that comment where he's like, you know, I've always treated everyone with respect. And, you know, the next sentence, yeah, the next sentence, he's like, and this is the taunt that I do to many people when I'm threatening to beat them up. Yeah. All right. You know, you just, if you just start doing like the Hulk Hogan, like the, you know, one arm straight out, one up and like the biceps, you know. Yeah. Nobody has a problem with it after that. But just something to think about, I guess.

No for next time. Yeah, like I say, I don't really have a lot more to say about it. Like, it's people are going to feel about it, you know, understandably are going to be like, yeah, I don't accept this, actually. And I get that, but also, you know. And the other thing is people, you know, whenever you see something like this, people always want to rush forward and say, well, it's not a hockey problem. It's a society problem. It's a world. Yeah, it is.

but like I'm a hockey writer this is a hockey podcast you follow 100 hockey people on Twitter this is what we're going to talk about when it happens in our backyard and it certainly for all the people who maybe would like

to imagine that that hockey is in any way above this and I can't I can't believe there's very many people like that left but we're not yeah No, that's exactly right. It's, again, it's a situation where it's like, you know what?

A guy did fuck up, obviously. Or two guys, I guess. We're not talking about the Boko Amama one from the AHL. But again, that one seems more cut and dried, like a guy was like, yeah, I blew it. Whereas with this one, there's a little too much of, Now let's hear him out. Yeah, and Andrew Shaw jumped in. I guess they're cousins or something.

He's his cousin, yeah. It's a small world hockey, you know? Sure is. But yeah, so, like I said, I don't think there's a ton more to say about it except you got to use your brain a little bit more, which is a big lift in the hockey world, that's being honest. Exactly. Yep. All right. The other big piece of news this week, and this is way more of a positive,

the Canucks did all their front office hiring, including hiring two women for kind of high-profile roles, Emily Castengay and former Puck Soup guest Rachel Dory. And then some guy named Patrick Alveen is going to be their GM. Who cares, who cares? Yeah. So yeah. Well, even Patrick Alvin is, I think, only the second European GM for Swedish GM. So, yeah.

Yeah. I mean, kudos to Vancouver for not just hiring former roommates of whoever. I mean, it is, it is like Jim Rutherford's right-hand guy from when he was in Pittsburgh. But it's, you know, that's. It's at least a little bit different. We can talk about it a little bit. differently. Like, they clearly didn't just narrow the, the search down to the same, you know, the same

dudes six times and, uh, uh, and just go with that. So, uh, you know what? What's that? We're not, I mean, it's just, it's after whatever it was seven years of Jim Benning. I don't know. We're, I don't know if we're ready for, I think it was closer to nine, but yeah, we're, I don't know if we're ready for like smart Vancouver Canucks, but, uh, maybe, you know, who knows? This could be it. I mean, look, nobody, you know, man, woman, Swedish, whatever, there's no, it's a super hard job

and there's no guarantee that anyone's going to have success. But I'll tell you, if some organizations are looking at everybody and some organizations are still looking at a narrow subsection, then that first group's going to have a pretty big advantage going forward. So let's see how it plays out. You would think. You would think. Somebody, I can't remember who it was, but somebody had a tweet that was like, you know, every time a woman gets hired for a job like this, it's like, here's the list of the like 40 advanced degrees she has.

Yeah. And when a guy gets hired like this is like, now you might remember him playing 600 AHL games and you're like, oh, okay, I guess so. Exactly. So we have to put him in charge of the $100 million budget. Yeah, that's right. That's right. It's absolutely true. So yeah, that's fun.

I don't really, I mean, you know, I know Rachel a little bit, obviously, and she, you know, she did like a graduate thesis on, like, player development, I believe. Yeah. Which, hey, boy, the Canucks could use that, couldn't they? They sure couldn't. And, yeah, I don't really know much about Emily, you know, apart from she was an agent for many years. she got Antoine Roussel the big contract out of Jim Benning. So like this, you know, finally the Canucks are... So she owes them.

Yeah, that's exactly right. But yeah, and then Patrick Alveen is, of course, you know, a 200 hockey man in that, yeah, he played a bunch of games in Europe and stuff like that, but also, you know, really put in the work for many years under Jim Rutherford. and it's not surprising that Jim Rutherford is hiring a guy that he knows from work, you know. But it seems like he's got a good head on his shoulders. I don't know. He was the interim GM in Pittsburgh when Rutherford stepped down last year or two years ago or whatever it was. Briefly. I don't know.

Did he make any moves or any? I don't think so. I think it was, I got the impression it was a short. stint. Yeah. It was only like a month or two, maybe. So not exactly the Jeff Gorton, you know, 40% of all current Bruins he acquired in the two months he was on the job.

But still, you know, Patrick Alvin isn't not experienced at this, I guess you would say. It's pretty, it's pretty fun, you know? Yep. And... Nice to see. Vancouver being run competently. Or, you know, I guess we would hope so at this moment.

And now, I mean, it's an interesting time to bring in your new front office because a month ago, we would have said, yeah, it's, you got to, there's got to be a reset button. You've got to not start over, but, uh, you make some big moves in Vancouver. And now you're kind of looking at it in the, in the Boudreau era going, uh, maybe, who knows? Let's, let's see what they do. I don't, I don't think any new GM comes in and starts making blanchev. Blockbusters in week one, but it'll be interesting to watch at Vancouver, and now we actually can watch them because they have people in place to make those decisions.

Yeah, it's, you know, obviously Alvin's new job here is he's turning over a big chunk of the roster in the next two years, like almost everybody, except guys maybe you wouldn't want around like Oliver Ekman-Larsen, like you don't want that guy. Tyler Myers is another one. Did you watch the Canucks Oilers game last night? No, I didn't. Boy, the last, like, the last 10 minutes of regulation and the overtime were bad. Like, two teams actively playing to not lose, basically.

Including, there was a breakout in overtime. Pucks on Tyler Myers' stick. He just dumps it in a three-on-grade. I saw that, yeah. I saw a lot of confusion on Twitter. Did I just, did somebody just dump the puck in three on three? Yeah, he, he looked like he was at the end of a shift or something. Like he, now, you know, this is maybe like a Tyler Myers thing,

but he wasn't exactly a fleet of foot out there at the end of that shift, it looked like. But, yeah, everybody, like, even on the broadcast, the Canucks broadcast, they were like, all right, if you say so, dude. It rocked. So, yeah, Patrick Alvin has to try to trade someone. Look at the puck management on this guy. You know, he's going to make some moves there. The Tucker Pullman contract is still a long-term commitment.

But, you know, like you say, they have a coach now. They have some, obviously, some very solid key pieces in place just in terms of, you know, a youngish player who's really good at every position. But there's also the J.T. Miller trade rumors and that sort of stuff. So I guess we'll see is the big takeaway from what the Canucks are going to do now. Like at least they have a way to move forward. Yep. Which, again, not too common these last almost a decade.

but very exciting times in Vancouver which you know who would have said that six months ago or whatever whoever was playing the Canucks that's right folks I gotta tell you I'm getting older and when you get older they're like oh you gotta take these supplements you got to have these vitamins I don't like doing that

but then Athletic Greens sent me a sample box of their their product. It's a, it's a supplement powder. And I gotta tell you, it tastes pretty good. And it makes me feel like I'm doing all the healthy stuff that doctors have been frowning at me about for the last couple of years. I've had it for a few weeks now. I like how it tastes. I don't usually like how these things taste. I like how athletic greens taste. And, you know, it's got, it's got a nice, a nice, a nice flavor to it. And it also makes me go. I'm actually being so healthy right now. So what is it? You get a single scoop every day, and that scoop contains 75 high quality, vitamins, minerals, whole food sourced superfoods, probiotics, and adaptogens. I don't even know what adaptogens is.

It sounds very fancy, though, doesn't it? And so you just have one of those a day, and you're sitting pray, folks. You will get better gut health. you'll support your nervous system, your immune system, your energy, your recovery, your focus, and your aging. And folks, I was just saying about aging, wasn't I? So it goes to tell you.

So here's the thing. It's lifestyle-friendly whether you eat keto, paleo, vegan, dairy-free, gluten-free. It has less than one gram of sugar with no GMOs or other chemicals, artificial, anything. And again, it tastes really good. It supports better sleep quality. It supports mental clarity and alertness. And it costs less than $3 a day, if you can believe it. It's cheaper than getting all the different supplements yourself.

And it's, like I said, it's easier to do than having to take a bunch of different supplements every day. To make it easy, Athletic Greens is giving you a free one-year supply of immune-supporting vitamin D and five free travel packs to take with you on the go with your first purchase. All you have to do is visit athletic greens.com slash podcast. Again, that's athletic greens.com slash puck to take ownership over your health and pick up the ultimate daily nutritional insurance. Okay, well, we just talked about a team that finally seems to have some amount of positive direction. And now we can talk about a team that is the opposite of that. That there's nothing.

It doesn't seem like there's anything good going on there. And that is the Philadelphia Flyers currently on a 13-game losing streak. That's right. A team that already had a 10-game losing streak, and that ended in December, and if you were like, well, at least that's as bad as it can get. Guess what? Tough to have a 13-game and 10-game losing streak in a 43-game season. Like, I would think that's very statistically unlikely. But, hey, the Flyers are all about defying the odds.

But if you ignore those two stretches, they're actually over 500, so. Hey, okay, now we're talking. Don't act like Chuck Fletcher hasn't made that argument to somebody at some point. That's right. They stink. They're really bad. I don't think anybody thought they would be this bad coming into the year. I didn't, I don't, I didn't have them as a playoff team or anything like that.

But, yeah, they, you know, it's a tough sell there coming into the year. year. It's been reported in a few places that, um, you know, they didn't want, they didn't want to come out of the pandemic going, hey, folks, we're, uh, we're, uh, going to be intentionally really bad this year. Yeah. Um, I don't know that it's better to be unintentionally really bad, personally. Uh, I don't know that I, like that would be, that feels worse. Yeah. Yeah. I, I, I think that's right. Um, so yeah, it's, uh, it's, uh, I don't know. Like, they're at a real crossroads just in terms of

they have some players who would carry some value in the trade market. But also, like, maybe not as many as you would think for a team that just spent the better part of the last decade being at least vaguely competitive. Yeah. And not a lot as far as pending. UFAs, which is, you know, like, Claude Jure is the big one. He does have a no movement clause, so that limits you. Other than that, the only two real decent-sized names, and that's even stretching it, is Martin Jones, who, according to, I think it was Elliot, could have already been in Edmonton if the price wasn't a little too high, which surprises me that there's,

any team that need a goaltending would think that that was the answer. And then the other one is Ristelan, who Chuck Fletcher went and made a big deal for in the offseason. Traded a first round pick for this. Yeah. Yeah. And, you know, we talked about a lot of this stuff last week just when we were going through the whole league and we sort of hit on the flyers. Like, he hasn't been bad, but do you, you're not going to get, you wouldn't think, that level. of a package back for him now.

So do you, do you treat it as a sunk cost and just get what you can? Do you not trade him and sign him to an extension? Do you let him walk? I mean, you can't let him walk, you would think. But, I mean, if I'm Chuck Fletcher, and I know that my, my seat is getting hot, presumably. Am I really going to trade a guy that I just traded a first for and get, like, you know, a second or a third or whatever? I don't know.

Yeah, I mean, you got to think that he, you know, at some point, you say that he's certainly not going to be part of the solution for you, right? Like, he's 27, he's coming off of a contract where he makes almost five and a half million why, you know, obviously he has, you know, had like three good seasons his entire NHL career or whatever, but like, why would he want to take a pay cut, right? And so, you know, if you're the Flyers and you're looking at it and you're, even if you're saying we got to do a soft rebuild because we're the Philadelphia Flyers and we don't tank, this is not a guy where you're like, and obviously we have to keep Rasmus Rist

Ristoline. Yeah, unless you're the GM that traded for him and you're going, I, you know what, if this guy stinks, I'm getting fired anyway, so I might as well extend him, hope he turns it around, and then it's the next guy's problem. Oh, man. Which is, you know, it's going to be the next guy's problem is unfortunately how a lot of GMs think, so I don't know if Chuck Fletcher would be any different. Yeah.

You know, at some point you got to wonder what the plan is. here because they're in the classic like team that uh that went through a rebuild on the fly somewhat recently like this is a classic case for for teams like this where it's like we have a bunch of guys who are like 30 and we have a bunch of guys who are like 22 and we have like four guys who were between those agents yep and and the and the other problem is a lot of their guys that are in that zone, right? Like that, the guys who would, in theory, be your core are all kind of having not great stretches.

Right. You know, the guys that two years ago, you would have looked at this team and said, all right, they've got their, at the time, veteran corps, which would have been like Claude Jureux and Jacob Voracek and guys like that. And then the young up-and-coming corps would have been Travis Kineckney. Ivan Provarov, probably Sean Couturier, you'd still count in that group, and Carter Hart. God, he's almost 30. Yeah, he is.

29 years old. Exactly, and has a huge extension kicking in. And all of those guys... With a full no move. Yeah, all of those guys have kind of plateaued. You know, Brovrov is still pretty good, but, you know, Kinek had that big year a couple years ago. He hasn't got back there. Couturee, kind of the same.

Carter Hart, a little different. I mean, he was terrible last year and he's been much better this year. But like, that was supposed to be the safety net that if we didn't get there with the Giroux tier, then we weren't going to have to do a full tear down. And now you got those guys and, you know, in some cases, in big contracts. And I don't know. You really have to make a hard decision of do we have a foundation in place or do we not? and I don't know if they do. I'm pretty confident that they don't.

And my real issue is, like, when they hired Chuck Fletcher, I was like, oh, the brilliant architect behind the, like, whatever, through 2017 Minnesota Wild? Like, who gives a shit about that era of the Wild? Like, they're just a nothing. You know, they're, like, a team. Yeah, obviously, like, they have some good players. But, like, even that was like, well, we have to give,

some unconscionably bad contracts to like Ryan Souter and Zach Peres, who are, you know, good players, but certainly never guys who were like, oh, you can't win without those guys at the top of your roster, you know, like they're not like true difference makers, just really solid good players for a long time, you know? And so, like, the guy whose idea that was being the GM of a team that was, that was, I would say, already clearly in decline, that was always a tough sell for me.

So, you know, I, I don't know, I don't know what you do. They're, they're definitely in a situation where, like, I'm, I'm, if I'm, Chuck Fletcher, I'm like, well, call me on literally anybody on the roster. I don't care. Yeah. And call me soon. Don't wait until the offseason, because I don't know

that I'm going to be here. That's right. That's going to be the other question. I mean, clearly, they're, you know, they've already done the coaching change. Mike Yao was the kind of the interim guy, but he's one of those interim guys with NHL head coaching experience. So sort of first chance to nail down the job. Yeah, and then he was 13 games straight, so I'm going to say that he has not. So I'm going to say, maybe not so much. And they're brought in Torchetti now, who's like been an interim coach like four different times.

that's an interesting little side note. But yeah, I assume that they're going to make a move in the offseason. I don't know. They keep saying that the Yao is the guy for the rest of the year. And I mean, every time you hired interim coach, that kind of has to be it. But I mean, I don't know. How many games can you lose in a row before you go? We just need somebody different.

Well, the number is at least 14. 20? Yeah. But what is it? I don't know. I guess we'll find out. Yeah, it, like I said... Or maybe you just keep going and get that get Shane right.

Oh, I mean, yeah, this season's obviously a lost cause. Like, if I'm the Flyers, I'm like, fucking lose 50 games in a row. What do I care at this point? Um, but at the same time, like I said, the Flyers don't tank. Even, even when, you know, like, they got James Van Reams like second overall a million years ago or whatever. But it's like even then... When they finished dead last. Yeah, and even then they were like, we didn't mean to do that.

That was a mistake. And then they kind of bounced back pretty quickly as well. So, you know, if you want to say a rebuild on the fly kind of works, you know, good luck, I guess. But I don't know. Like I say, I look at this roster and I go, yeah, like half the guys you would say are like, you know, the best players on the team are like 32, 33 years old. like, what does a rebuild on the fly look like in that case? Because usually when you're rebuilding on the fly, you're like, oh, it's not working with this group of 28-year-olds. You know?

Like when the penguins rebuilt on the fly, I don't even think Crosby had turned 30 yet. Right? And so, like, yeah, I look, and it's like, okay, well, Cam Atkinson, he's signed for another few years, but like, is he going to be part of the solution? I don't know. And if that's the case. yeah like I think he has a no trade of some kind but I at least go give me a call on Cam Atkinson

give me a call on yeah like you said Travis Connecting you're not hanging up the phone on anybody on any literally anybody yeah so yeah it's tough but there is good news

in Flyersland this week Phil Kessel or Phil Kessel Jesus I read the wrong line of the outline here. Keith Yandel. Don't get their hopes up. That's right. Every Flyers fan just, we got Phil Kessel?

That would be great news. I don't know. I don't know. Keith Yandel breaks the Ironman record for the NHL, which is crazy. To play 900, whatever, straight games is an insane accomplishment. Yep, especially, I mean, you know, it's one of those records that it's weird to compare across eras because, you know, the game is everyone is just so much bigger and faster these days. We also have better, in theory, medical care for these guys, but it's still, I mean, you look at his career page and it's just going back to 2008, I guess, would be when the streak started. Yeah, yeah.

That's pretty wild. And almost ended last year. Remember, with the start of the season with the Panthers, it was going to be, he was going to be scratched. Yeah, and everybody on the table was like, fuck you, he's playing. Yeah. He got in at the last, and then played the full year. So good for him. Yeah, and like a player who, you know, it's a classic case of a player who got maybe like overpaid by one and a half million dollars.

and everybody was like, fuck this guy. Yeah. But like a good player for a long time, and I have a brief Keith Yandel story. One time I wore, I had to take my computer to the Apple store, because it was all messed up or something. And I was wearing, like,

I have a hat from when the NHL came back from the 94 lockout, and it said game on. Do you remember these logos? I do. Yeah. So I have a hat of that, which is, I think, a very funny hat because it's like, yeah, don't ask where the game

went for, like, the last six months. Just know that it's back. And so I was wearing that hat and a guy, like at the genius bar or whatever, was like, oh, the NHL, huh? I just had an NHL player in here recently.

buying speakers? And I was like, who do I know that's like a south of Boston NHL guy? And I'm like, what team does he play for? He's like, I don't remember, but it's not the Bruins. And I said, could it be the Florida Panthers? And he goes, uh, maybe, yeah, I don't know. And I was like, is it, was his name Keith? And he's like, oh, his name was Keith?

And I said, was it Keith Yandel? He's like, yeah, that sounds right. And so I tweeted, like, at the Florida Panthers account, like, is Keithy Andal in here buying speakers? And they were like, yes, he was. He said he confirms that that was him. So. Yeah. I missed to buy a day.

Real journalism. That's right. That's right. I'm a journalist. Right on. But, yeah, that's the only Keithy Andal story I have, I guess. But, yeah, he rocks. He seems like a great guy and all that kind of stuff, too.

So, like, you know, again, his teammates were like, how dare you even think about ending this Iron Man streak? So, but the reason I bring up Phil Kessel, of course, is that Phil Kessel is like 20 games behind him also on his own Iron Man streak. Yeah. By the end of the year, we'll almost certainly break what was the record. And then you know that the second Keith Yandel, like, comes down with COVID and all that kind of stuff. Kessel's like, I'm never getting COVID. Yeah, that's the other. Give me COVID.

That's right. Phil Kessel, I mean, he doesn't go outside ever. Well, no, he's got the movie room in his house. Why would you ever need to leave? Yeah, just, yeah, as long as the hot dog vendor outside of his house doesn't get it. He's safe. Yeah, no, Keith Yandel breaking the record is a nice story. Phil Kessel breaking the record will be a very funny story.

Yeah, because. The guy who's. whole reputation is for being fatten out of shape, breaking the one and only high-level endurance record in the sport will be great. I hope he gets to a thousand on the nose. Yeah. Oh, absolutely. Like, because, you know, if you're, if you're this far clear of nine, he's not clear of 900 yet, but like, if the record is going to be in the 950s, maybe even more than that, like, there's no reason not to be like, it's got to be at least a thousand. Yeah. Keep going, Phil.

Yeah. And, you know, I think back to remember when I was around the time the Leafs traded for him, it might not have been like the exact year that the Leafs traded for him, but they were like, oh, you know, Phil, would you do this summer? He's like, oh, I was like fishing all summer in Florida. And they were like, oh, did you get on the ice a lot? And he's like, no, I sure didn't. And then he went out and scored like 35 goals. Yeah.

He rocks. We fucking love Phil Kessel on this podcast. But yeah, so shout out to Keith Yandel. That rocks. South Shore guy. We love it. Honest answer, did you, before, like, this week when this became a thing, did you know, like, if you had been asked on the spot the name of the guy who held the old record?

I got to tell you, I couldn't pull it now. Okay. All right. Good. He's Doug Jarvis. Doug Jarvis. Which I knew because Doug. Doug, yeah, Doug Jarvis was a Leafs draft pick who was then traded to the Habs before he ever played and went on to become.

Well, like many players on those Habs team, we have no idea if he was good or not, but he won a lot of Stanley Cups. Sure. So that's why he's in the Hockey Hall of Fame and you're not allowed to even say, hey, wait a second, should this guy be in the Hall of Fame? Well, he's not in the Hall of Fame and he was on the 70s Hap. So maybe that answers the question of how good he was. That's right. The main thing with him, it was that. He was one of the first guys to win the Selke when it was like a new award.

And he wasn't Bob Ganey. And he also, famously, his career highlight was when they made him pose with that, like, knight in a suit of armor for the record. When he was like wearing his Hartford Whalers jersey, that was, and he's like pointing at the knight and the knight's pointing at him. That was fantastic. That was back when this league knew how to market at superstars. I was just going to say, like, we got to get, we got to get Yandel a suit of, no, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, we got to get him in a picture with Robert Downey Jr. Right?

Right. Like, this is, this is similar. It will, it will, it will, of course, cost the flyers, it will cost the flyers, it will cost the flyers, 15 million dollars to make this happen. Yeah. But, but. We're just waiting for, uh, Robert Downey Jr.'s people to call the NHL back. I'm sure that's, that's, that's, that's, that's how to us. happening any minute now. That's right.

Yep. The best we can do is the guy who does his voice in the cartoons. We can get that guy. We can't get an RDJ. We're going to try to get... You know what was interesting

to me this week is the St. Louis Blues... Well, okay, let me frame it this way. in a mailbag column for EP Rinkside this week, I was asked which team in the Western Conference I feel like has the best shot against the Colorado Avalanche who are on like an unbelievable hot streak. They're 18, 2 and 1 at home.

A bunch of those are in a row. They're into the classic situation of like, oh, they have like two regulation losses since mid-November or whatever, you know, like they're just playing like we all figured the Colorado Avalanche could, basically. And so which team of these three do we feel like has the best chance to beat them? St. Louis, Minnesota, or Nashville. And I still don't. I still don't believe in Nashville.

Well, so I'm interested in your argument on the other two. I agree with you that I don't believe in Nashville, but Yossi Soros is the great equal. are there. To the point, well, so, like, here's the thing. You know what, Minnesota's underlying numbers, not that impressive. Like, even though that's their reputation, they're not, like, where they were last year with the, with the, with the underlines. St. Louis, actively bad underlines right now, like, sub 50%, which is, again, like, not what their reputation under Craig Barubi is, right? Like, oh, you know, say what you want about the, the, the talent level. at various points in the lineup, but, like, they play a great team game, and then, you know,

they don't, you don't get anywhere near their net. Not the case. And so, that has become such an issue that, um, there is a bit of a goaltending controversy in St. Louis. And, uh, the reason why is, uh, Jordan Binton is having, uh, up until recently, a mediocre year, but then, like, in the last game or two, uh, like, you know, it's gotten down to, oh, this is like one of the 10 worst seasons by a goalie in the league this season

by goals saved above expected. So, at the same time, Billy Huso is playing out of his fucking mind. He's like, like, one of the best goalies in the league. And so there is a legitimate goal-tending controversy brewing in St. Louis, which I don't think anybody would have predicted coming into the year. No.

And, and I mean, it's just, Jordan Bennington, I mean, you live by the, nobody knows what's going on with gold-tending sword, and maybe you die by it too, because three years ago, he was some fourth stringer called up from the miners. Yeah, he was an AHA journey. Yeah. And now, and now, and he just signs

a $36 million contract this summer. And he's 901. Do you know a Billy who, Usos save percentages this season, like ballpark? I know it because I'm looking at it. It's 943. Yes, that's right. 188 goals against. Like, this is dead Pocera Hasick numbers.

But here's the other thing. He's got 13 games played this year, is the entire rest of his NHL experience was 17 games last year. And he sucked. 893 save percentage. Yeah. Three plus goals against average. He was bad. Well, so to your point, though.

If you have a 943 save percentage and your GAA is like 1.9, the team in front of you is giving up a shitload of shots. You know, and that's part of the problem, right? Like, what would you have said about Jordan Bennington like coming, you know, coming off the Stanley Cup? Had a great year, but kind of a systems goalie, right? They've gotten... Yep, you could have. They've gotten a little bit worse. on that front, most of his time with St. Louis,

and the results for him have, I would say, gotten increasingly middling. You know, 927, the year they win, the copies, lights out in the playoffs. 912, the year after that, solid, but not spectacular. 9-10 last year in a fake season, where he only played against the Central, which was, let's say, spotty in terms of quality. there were obviously some good teams mixed in there, but then there were some pretty rotten ones too.

And then this year, 901, he's down to 901. That contract not aging well, and it's whatever, six months old. I don't know what you do if you're St. Louis, right? Because do you go, well, you know, we'll dance with the guy who brought us here? Or do you go with the hot hand and you go, yeah, we have a $6 million backup right now? I think that's what you kind of have to do short term. I mean, I don't know if it's a

goalie controversy in the sense of, you know, hey, are we seeing a passing of the torch or whatever, if anything, just because given the contracts, if it's anywhere near close, Biddington has to be your guy because you're locked into him. But for now, I mean, you got a guy in an all-time heater, you've got to ride that guy.

Just like you did with, you know, with Jordan Bittington, when he came came in, it wasn't quite the same situation, but, you know, you ride the hot hand. And if that, if that makes your, you know, you do have to manage the egos and the personalities. But, yeah, I mean, I don't know how you, you see teams face this sort of thing from time to time, but it, for it to be this stark is pretty, pretty unusual. I think you got to ride the hot hand for a little bit and it probably won't stay hot for very long. And if it does, all the way into the playoffs,

then that's a nice problem to have. That's right, yeah. The thing about it is, you know, you always hear, oh, goalies are so competitive. And, like, even if they're, like,

oh, you know, publicly they're going to say, like, oh, of course, I'm rooting for Villy to have a great season. I want the team to do well, all that kind of stuff. You know, Jordan Bittington's a little bit pissed off

about this, of course. But at the same time, you're just going to go, hey, his save percentage is 42 points higher than yours, Jordan. So I don't know what the fuck to tell you, man. And the reason you're making $6 million a year is because at some point you got handed the keys to the car instead of Jake Allen. Yeah.

And, you know, so you can't turn around now and sulk and say, well, you know, I'm the veteran. I should get to keep the net because that's how you got here. And to be clear, like, I have no indication that that's what Bennington is doing. But I'm just saying, like, like I said, these guys are competitive. and they want to be starting every single game if they possibly can. But at the same time, like, even through that lens, Jordan Bittington has to go, like, well, Jesus Christ, I mean, look at them. He's stopping, like, almost 19 out of every 20 shots he faces. So what am I going to say?

Yep. Yep, it's, yeah, I, man, I don't know. the it's it's if we have seen guys get hot like this and stay hot a whole year yeah you know it's not like you know when it when a shooter starts shooting 30% you okay you enjoy it for a week or it'll come back to we or it could last until the next game you just you really never know with goal tending and um yeah i mean not not just jordan bittington but craig barouba has his uh his job in St. Louis because he made the call to go with the young goalie who was hot over the established guy, so I don't see why he wouldn't do it again.

Yeah. I don't know. It's tricky because, again, like, you look at the blues and you're like, yeah, there are, you know, there are several games above five. They're not several. They're like 10 plus games above 500. They're very comfortably in a playoff spot. It would take kind of a.

miracle for somebody to overtake them, even for third, and maybe not for third, but for a playoff spot, certainly. I think they're third by points percentage, I don't know about, because like Minnesota's playing really well also. Yeah. But, yeah, to circle back to the thing about, like, who's coming out of the central, like, given that the abs are playing like this. I think you would say probably

Minnesota has the best chance in a longer term sense, but in a seven-game series, like, do we really trust Capo Cochanan and is Camp Talbot still their goal? I mean, like, Jesus Christ, like, that's kind of the point. Yeah, he's been hurt and not playing as much lately. But, like, that's kind of the point, though,

like, oh, like, Cam Talbot is our, is our, like, reliable veteran. And it's like, yeah, perfectly good goalie for a little while there, but I don't know. So, like I say, I think that, that Soros is kind of the guy just because there's, you know, at least like a 12-month track record on this at this point, versus who-so. It's, like, been 12 games or whatever, you know. So, yeah, I think, look, we all agree. The Colorado Avalanche are certainly the class of that division, if not the class of the West, pending a Jack Eichael return, obviously.

But, yeah. Oh, speaking of which, did you see the Vegas game last night? Vegas, Carolina. I don't watch hockey, right? Oh, that's smart. Why would you? Yeah. It's a freaking Tuesday night.

there's got to be something on better than that. But yeah, that was a, Vegas, Carolina was a real fun one. And Stanley Cup final preview, question mark. That was what was going through my head the whole time. I don't know. This is, I mean, the answer is probably not, because this is the NHL,

and there'll be at least one mediocre team that goes on a heater. But, yeah, there's games like that where you go, this would be. Yeah, it's going to be. Pretty fun matchup. Let's be honest, but... Yeah, exactly. But yeah, no, that was a really fun game.

Remember a few years ago, speaking of the Predators, when it was like, oh, Predators Jets, what a series that's going to be? And it was pretty fun, but it didn't live up to the hype. Yeah. If Vegas and Carolina can play at that level again, boy, we would be very lucky, cup final-wise, but we'll, we'll see. I'm still on the theory that we're going to get Colorado, Florida, and it will be their

redemption after ruining hockey in 1996. This will be their, they will undo that and usher in a new era of high-flying offensive hockey. Hey, that would be great. I'd love that. That's definitely not going to happen. I don't believe you at all. I think you're

lying to me, but Yeah, that would rock. Like, that's the thing is there are so many fun teams in the league this year. Tampa, Florida. I think the Rangers are really fun, even if, you know, we would say the way they're playing is not sustainable, or the way that they're winning, I guess, rather, is not sustainable long term, except to say they have a great goalie, obviously. Carolina is really fun.

Pittsburgh, freaking between the legs goal last night and between the legs, like, 35 foot assist? Oh my God. Oh, did somebody on Pittsburgh score between the legs goal? Was it Crosby? Was it which one of their high-skilled players pulled off this ultra-r move? Hey, you know what? Let's keep tying it together.

It was South Shore guy. There it is. Brian Boyle. He's from Hingham, Massachusetts. Wow. This is like, it was a fantastic goal. I'm not knocking him. him, but the, like, do you remember the first time you saw that move?

Yes, I do. Years ago, like, you were blown away, and now six foot seven, bottom six guys can do it. It's crazy. Yeah, he's like my age almost. Yeah. Like, and here, like, imagine 10 or 20 years or whatever it is from now when, like, that's, like, that's going to be like this Svetnikov goal is going to be like that. Just every random guy can.

Yeah, okay. Yeah. that movement in Arsenal. Like a guy scores a goal like that and you're like, sure. Another Thursday night in the NHL, huh? And we should say, of course, that none of that really counts because it was against the Arizona Coyotes. So there's that. Hey, everybody, it's ad break time.

And this week's sponsor is Draft King's Sportsbook. Four teams remain in the NFL playoffs. And that means only four teams left for you to bet on it. Draft King Sportsbook, an official sports betting partner of the NFL, counting down to Super Bowl 56, new customers can get 56 to 1 odds on any team. Bet just $5 and get $280 and free bets if your team wins. Not a new customer. You can still experience the conference championships with same game parlays,

where you combine multiple bets in the same game for bigger payout. The more legs you add, the more money you can win. Draft Kings is safe, secure, and reliable. And best of all, you can deposit and withdraw your cash whenever you want. Download the Draft King Sportsbook app now. Use promo code Puck Soup and get 56 to 1 odds on any NFL team. Bet just $5 and win $280 and free bets if your team wins. That's promo code Puck Soup for 56 to 1 odds at Draft King's Sportsbook,

an official sports betting partner of the NFL. Must be 21 years old or older. New Jersey, Indiana or Pennsylvania only, new customers only. Minimum $5 deposit and $1 wager required. One per customer restrictions apply. see draftkings.com slash sportsbook for detail. Gambling problem, call 1-800 gambler. Speaking of South Shore guys, now that we know all the Olympic rosters,

Maddie Baneers, of course, also from Hingham, Massachusetts. He and Brian Boyle from the same town, isn't that fun? Now that we know all the Olympic rosters, are you maybe a little more psyched about it? Because I think the last time we talked about it, we were just like, yeah, I guess I can't wake up at, at four in the morning to watch the Czech Republic play if there's not going to be an NHL player involved. Yeah.

I honestly can't say. If anything, I may be a little less just because before we saw the, you know, you're thinking, well, maybe there's this guy, maybe that guy, you know, who knows, they'll probably still pull something together. It's got a few neat names on it. And they did. But when you sort of see it, you're like. A few. Yeah, I still think of. The operative term.

there, yeah. Like, I'm, I'm not staying up to watch Eric Stahl or, you know, there's, there's guys. I mean, like, I'm very interested to see Joshua Sam play on this stage. They found a lot of guys who used to play from Montreal. That's, that's one of the big market inefficiencies Canada was trying to exploit there. But personally, I am kind of excited because of all the college hockey guys, right? Like, half the Michigan roster is going. a bunch of guys that play for the Boston teams, who I've seen play a million times, are going, that kind of thing.

That's pretty exciting. I'm not going to lie to you about that. But also, unless you're like a college hockey sicko like me, like, why would you give a shit about, oh, wow. The, like, fourth best guy on Michigan is going? This is crazy. I love it. Yeah, or, like, you know, your team's,

you know, some prospect on your team is there. That's cool. Yeah, that rocks. But are you going to clear your schedule and be like, no, no, I'm going to be late for work today because it's 7 a.m. I'm sitting down for three hours. I will be watching my team's third round pick. Absolutely. Yeah. No, it, like I say, I, last time they went without, um, without the NHL, obviously there were like four college guys and now there's, or maybe five, but now there's like 20 and it's like, okay, I can get down with that as a college hockey fan, but otherwise, not so much. I don't know. The thing that, like you said, Josh Hosang going is interesting because, you know, he's only on that AHL deal. And much like- Although apparently was going to get or was strongly considered for an NHL deal with the Leafs during one of the COVID,

outbreaks and but did not get that deal because they knew he was in the running for the Olympics and they don't want to jeopardize that. So that it wouldn't, if he plays well, I would expect that we, we might see him in Toronto down the stretch. That's what I was going to say is, you know, like this has big Eric Stahl trying to, like playing for a contract energy. And, you know, it worked for a couple of guys last time. I feel like I, you know, maybe maybe more college.

players where people were like, you know what? Let's get him in the NHL now. He looked great. Ryan Donato is a guy who kind of springs to mind instantly. I think he led the Olympics and goals last time out. And, yeah, now he's no longer with the Bruins.

And in fact, I think he's on his fourth organization already. Right? Because they traded him for Charlie Coil, if I'm not much mistaken. And then they let him go to the sharks and now he's with Seattle, right? Is that the, I don't know.

But anyway. Sounds right to me, yeah. Point is, you know, let's just say success in a no NHL Olympics is not maybe a harbinger of great things to come, but, you know, I think the fact that there's going to be more college players this time out will make it feel like a more North American tournament, especially because they're playing on. NHL-sized ice. So that will also, I think, up the entertainment factor. When they play on the Olympic-sized sheets, I'm just always kind of like, there's too much room out there. You know what I mean? Yeah, it always, I know people always say, like, you know, whenever you talk about low-scoring,

someone's always like, oh, we should go to the international ice surface. Yeah, have you seen the goal scoring? Usually a tell. The finish league or whatever. Yeah, that's usually a tell that they don't watch international hockey other than like when it's, Canada against the U.S. in a gold medal game. And it's the best players in the world. And you're like, wow, why is everyone so fast and skilled?

It must be because there's 10 useless feet of ice on either side. Yeah. The international ice is not. Well, the thing is that's not the useless part of the ice when you play on an Olympic-sized sheet. The useless part of the ice is the middle of the ice. You don't get anywhere near it. Yeah. So.

That too, yeah. So, like, that's the issue. And, like, you know, I think there is. there's a case to be made that, like, power plays are probably more effective on international ice, just because you have that much more space out there and the defense is going to collapse a bit more and that kind of thing. But, yeah, five-on-five play on international ice, I know you're not supposed to say that or whatever, but it is.

So the fact that, again, they're playing on Olympic ice in Beijing, I'm a little more up for it now, for sure, because of that. but, you know, for all I know, they played on, on NHL size ice in South Korea as well, and I, you know, I don't, and I just don't remember that, but, yeah, there's a, there's much more of a reason to tune in. And, you know, also because, um, guys who are more recently in the NHL, I would say, you know, uh, but, yeah. Um, the other, the other thing that, uh, that happened yesterday. yesterday is Aaron Dell just elbowed someone in the face at a thousand miles and out.

Well, no, he was standing still. The other guy came in. He was standing completely still and he just more kind of dropped his shoulder into him, which is a move he has done before. Yes, he did it to Mark Stone earlier this year. Yeah, so. But not good. Yeah, a long-term injury to Drake Batherson, apparently, like, obviously won't be playing

to the All-Star games. that he was supposed to, but also, like I said, long term. We're talking maybe months until he's back on the ice. Yeah, I mean, I don't, they haven't really given a timeline that I've seen, but the fact that, you know, after the, I did, the All-Star game is still two weeks away. And the fact that after the game, they're like, yeah, he's definitely not playing in that. Right. Suggests that it's long term.

He was having a great year. Would have been his first All-Star game. And an ugly look, if you didn't see it, if you're wondering, like, how could someone hurt that bad by a goalie. It was, he's basically cutting around the net. Dell doesn't really do anything crazy. He just kind of stops and kind of braces himself for impact. Yeah, you know, kind of gets the elbow out there.

But it's more the case that you just, as a player, it's drilled into you that you can't touch the goalie. And so nobody, you know, you're always trying to avoid the goalie and you assume he's trying to avoid you. and in this case the goalie doesn't avoid the contact and he hits him Batherson's not expecting it at all and he goes into the boards feet first in a way that look like it could have caused a serious injury and apparently has so yeah I mean just not something that you can do and especially you know as a goalie

like if you want that protection that you know I can't be touched pretty much anywhere on the ice which is how the rules work you can't be out there initiating contact. Like this, and this wasn't one of those things where sometimes you see, you know, the goal he goes for the puck, you know, two guys realize they're going to collide and they, you know, they might brace for it and maybe one guy gets, gets set better than the other guy. Like he went looking for the contact. Yes.

And he said after the game. Yeah, he basically said, like, I was just trying to slow him up and give my divit. Well, yeah, I don't think he was out there trying to hurt somebody, but it's like you just confess to intentional interference, which is what he's now got a hearing for. And probably by the time people hear this, we'll know what the suspension is. But it'll be, it's extremely rare for goalies to be suspended for on ice incidents. Yeah. Never happened.

Yeah, it goes back. I mean, since the Hextal days, I think someone said the last two were in 2007. Yeah, that sounds right. So congratulations to Aaron Dell for doing something that. Yeah, 15 years in the making, this latest goalie suspension. And, you know, I hate to be one of these guys, but it's like, you know what? If he wants to fuck around, somebody should be allowed to let him find out, you know? Like, the next time someone crashes into Arindale, I'm not going to be like, oh, this is an outrage.

I'm going to be like, you know what? I'm honestly surprised it didn't happen last night, especially since the game was like 5-0. It was, you know, and it was a Saber's Senators game. So, yeah, who cares really. There was a lot of talking by the senators. And, you know, I'm not saying that as a put-down because at the end of the day, what can you really do? Yeah, like, I mean, back in the 80s and early 90s, when stuff like this happened, you know, you put Craig Burrero. Rubay out there and he ran the goaltender and, you know, drove him into the nander of the boards

the next chance. And then the brawl broke out. That's not how hockey's played anymore. So I'm not really sure what the senators could do. But yeah, they clearly had an issue. And then he's going to get suspended and rightfully so. Some breaking news here is Chuck Fletcher is having his like state of the team press conference as as we speak.

It will be closed decision. It will be Clod's decision as to whether he gets moved at the deadline. But as far as everything else, quote, we're looking to aggressively retool here. Everything is on the table. Okay. Okay. I love it.

But then the chairman and CEO of Comcast is saying he does not see this as a three, four, five year rebuild. That's right. So maybe everything isn't on the table then. Yeah, we'll see how on the table everything is, I guess. is the point. Yeah, and also Ryan Ellis and Shaw Gatorier out for the season, apparently. Oh, boy.

Yeah, that is the other thing we forgot to say is it was pointed out that they have had a lot of injury problems. And so maybe the results to some extent are a little not, you know, they wouldn't be, like I said, they wouldn't be this bad, but they'd still be bad. They probably wouldn't be a playoff team. And at that point, like, you know, what do I always say? Like, if you're not a playoff, like, if you're not even remotely a playoff team, like, shouldn't you just try to be as fucking bad as possible? I don't know.

But, yeah. So, a lot of Flyers news, and isn't that so fun? Yeah. So, one other thing. You know the one thing that is maybe just a little bit interesting on this? I just want your two cents on it. Like, because you're right. I mean, the idea is, okay.

you're bad, then be as bad as possible. Win the lottery and get Shane Wright, who is, you know, projects as a very good player. A Patrice Bergeron type is the comparable that most people would throw out there. Okay. Not bad at all. Nope. But, but if you win the lottery this year, that means you can't win the lottery next year because of the new rules. Which means you can't get Connor Bedard, who projects as a, the next Connor McDavid level like megastar.

Like is there a part of you that is kind of like, maybe we don't, maybe we don't do the tank now. Maybe we do the tank next year and we go for that guy rather than potentially, you know, win this year and then. Yeah, I guess the point is that like they've made it such that the odds that you, like finish last and win the lottery are quite remote, you know? Yeah. But I mean, if you're going to buy, if you got to buy a lottery ticket, I mean, don't you want to buy for the powerball, not for the local?

Yeah, of course. Maybe that metaphor doesn't work, but no, yeah. I just, why would you, why would you buy for the megabucks that we have here in Massachusetts when the power ball jackpot is, you know, a half a bill? billion dollars. Yeah, of course, absolutely. With that having been said, it's like, you know, it's just a situation where they can't help but be bad this year, right? Like, it doesn't make sense for them not to try to trade everybody because, like, what's the point of keeping them if they're all going to walk this summer? Yep. Or next summer, you know?

No, that's fair. Like, it's a, they really, you know, this is, this is the hazard of being like the Montreal Canadians and never really committing to a full rebuild and being like, you know what, we have the guys in the room, we just need to add a few more supporting veterans around the veterans we already have, blah, blah, blah. And then it's like, oh, and then we are accidentally like one of the five worst teams in the league every once in a while, you know? And I, you know, I don't, I don't know.

Do you want to say that like trying to be bad is better than accidentally being bad? Or better or worse? I wouldn't say it's worse. But if your thing is like we got to keep ticket sales high and all that kind of stuff. Like if you have a different, like if you have business goals outside of the hockey goals, that's a different story altogether. Anyway, we do have obviously some sad news this week is Clark Gillies passed away, and obviously, like, I'm buddies with Justin Bourne, so I know how important he is to a friend of mine. But as we've discussed many times, I'm not super up on, like, everything to do with hockey history.

So I don't know, I guess, you know, how big of a deal, you know, Clark, like, I understand, like, for the Islanders or whatever, but like in the bigger picture. So, Sean, I'm hoping that you can, you know, regale me with some classic Clark Gillies anecdotes here. Yeah, well, I mean, not so much anecdotes. That's, that's Merrick's territory. But he was, I mean, he was a crucial member of that. Islanders dynasty. And, you know, there's a reason. And look, he wasn't, he wasn't Mike Bossy.

He wasn't Brian Trajee. It wasn't that level of star. But he was, you know, as we all love this narrative that there are some guys that you just need who aren't that superstar level, but you still need them for the team and to serve their role and their purpose. And whether that's true today, maybe back then it certainly was. and he was just that guy for that team. He was the almost literally the prototypical power forward as far as what we came to think of that being in the 80s. The Cam Neely, Rick Talk at Wendell Clark, Brennan-Shannahan guys. Clark Gillies was that guy.

Like, he wasn't an enforcer because he wasn't just there to fight. He was a real good player. But if you wanted to fight, he'd fight. And if you need, you know, if somebody needed to go out there and settle down Terry O'Reilly, that Clark Gillies was one of the few guys in the league of. could do it. And so he would play very often on a line with Bossie and Trachier and back in an era where how much room those guys got had a lot to do with what the consequences would be for going too close to them. And Clark Gillies was that guy. And, you know, like I say, real good player.

This wasn't, you know, this wasn't an enforcer. This was a, not at all. Yeah, this was a guy who, you know, fit very well on that first line. ended up going into the Hall of Fame. I know a lot of people kind of feel like, you know, should he have been in? Should he have not? And in a way that unfortunately kind of, I think in a way, has led some modern fans to think that this guy wasn't a great player.

And he absolutely was, whether he was Hall of Fame level or not. He was an absolutely great player. Crucial piece of that team. There's no way they win four cups without him. There's a reason why even with all of those legendary superstars that Clark Gillies was arguably the most beloved of anyone on that team in that fan base. And also, by all accounts, just an all-around great guy, you know, did a ton of charity and community work. And just with his passing this week, just a flood of people telling their stories of being around

him and just sounds like a great guy. And just our condolences to his, you know, friends and family and especially Justin and his family because this, you know, very, very tough to lose, by all accounts, it sounded like a great guy. Yeah, absolutely. Speaking of Hall of Fame controversies, we'll leave you with this. Sean, what was your take on the Hall of Fame in baseball? The inductees came out yesterday, and it was just David Ortiz. Yeah, well, you know, the baseball writers have been very clear that they won't induct anyone who was convincingly linked to steroids.

So I'll just take a big sip of water now and look at who they did induct. Of a protein shake from the Dominican Republic. Yeah. Oh, look. It's David Ortiz who. If I'm remembering. Right. Yeah, that was the reason he just went.

Yeah. He got released at the age of 27. transformed into one of the greatest power hitters of all time at the age of 28, concurrent to failing a PED test because he drank a protein shake. Yeah, okay. I'm good with that. I mean, look, obviously, I think we can, the whole debate over, you know, should people be voting for Barry Bonds or Roger Clemens has been done to death. But I think this makes it very clear that Barry Bonds and Roger Clemens are not in the Hall of Fame,

because of PEDs. They're not in the Hall of Fame. They're not in the Hall of Fame because they are linked to PEDs and they were both jerks. And David Ortiz is one of the most beloved guys ever. So he gets in even though he was also convincingly linked to performance enhancing drugs. Yeah. It makes no sense.

I mean, it makes sense insofar as, you know, like here's the thing. Here's my big take on it. Like, I am... Barry Bonds is one of my favorite baseball players ever. Obviously, I grew up in Boston at, like, Roger Clemens' height of his powers. So, you know, like, I have fond memories of seeing him pitch a couple of times as a kid as well, like, going to Fenway and seeing Roger Clemens fucking go ape shit on, like, the California Angels or whatever. With that having been said, I, of course understand why baseball writers who, like, boy, if you think 200,

hockey men are bad. Like, baseball writers are the worst. And so, like, I, I, of course, understand why baseball writers are like,

yeah, fuck these guys, right? I get it. I don't agree with it, but I get it. But here's the thing. If you're going to put

David Ortiz, a DH, a designated heir pretty much exclusively in his career, how the fuck is Edgar Martinez not in the Hall of Fame? Come on, man.

That's... Doesn't make sense. Yeah. Oh, no, he is it. It doesn't. My bad. I was going to say, okay, that's why I'm pausing here. I'm like, he did he get in?

I forgot about that, yeah. Okay, he is. But it was a big... It was a big deal. But it was a big question that he was going to be in because... Yes, that's what it was. Yeah. And then Ortiz gets in, but yeah.

So I guess Edgar Martinez kicked open. That was me furiously Googling at the back of the back of it. Yeah, no, because I was like, wait a second. Now that I'm saying all this. But who was it? Oh, it was. on this podcast. I also forgot Mark Recky got put into the hockey Hall of Fame, and this is a sport I cover. Remember? Yeah. Because I was like, man, what are we going to put fucking Mark Recky in there next? And I think you were like, yeah, like three years ago.

Yeah. Wait a second. Yeah. Well, and the other interesting thing, though, about baseball is like Bonds and Clemens, as well as Kurt Schilling, are now off the ballot, which is to say they're done as far as the baseball writers. They can. get in through there's a veterans committee, but this isn't like hockey where you can be Roji Vashan and 30 years later you just get in. You get 10 chances and that's it and so now those guys are gone. They are off the ballot.

Her chilling, there's at least a little more of a case that he's a borderline guy. I think absent the PED and even being dickheads stuff Clemens and bonds, it's like come on, what are we fucking doing here? Yeah. You know?

Yeah, no, I mean, like, Schilling was not linked to performance-ehancing drugs that I'm aware of, but if we're going to do this based on character, he's obviously a complete lunatic right now. Yeah. And that's made on its own be. Even when he was playing, everybody was like, oh, yeah, he's a bit of a fucking psycho, though. You know what I mean? Like, he wasn't, like, he wasn't this guy who, you know, developed a reputation after he left the game. when he was playing, everybody was...

I mean, no, look, I of course understand that it's made it a lot worse, but what I'm saying is, even at the time, people were like, yeah, this guy's like a little bit, let's say he's a colorful character. You know? But yeah, like his case, like as a pure Hall of Famer

is certainly more borderline than Bons or Clements who were like, you know, two of the best average. now off because he and he was interesting because he said last year like last year was his ninth year he got very close i think he was like yes he did a handful of votes away and then he said take me off the ballot because he was having a twitter meltdown whatever yeah his his stick that he does now and they were like no we're not that's not how this works but i guess his his numbers dropped a lot so i think a lot of writers were like all right well screw you then we're not going to put you in so um i'm sure he'll be on fox news tonight complaining about how he

got canceled and, you know, et cetera, et cetera. But, uh, congratulations to David Ortiz. Yeah, David Ortiz. Squeaky clean. Here's the thing. Squeaky clean non-ED using. I don't care about whether these guys did start. I don't give a shit.

I really, truly don't. Um, and so like, I'm glad David, David Ortiz seems awesome. He seems great. So. Yeah. He was fun as hell. Yeah. There was no.

And like, you know, I, speaking, speaking of the fucking 2004. Red Sox or whatever, I went to Game 1 of that World Series. I don't remember if David Ortiz did anything in particular in game one, but like he was a fucking monster that playoff run.

And if, like, even if that was all he did, and I think he ended up hitting, you know, 500 home runs, all that kind of stuff. But like, even if that was all he did, people, in Boston, like, they'd retire his fucking number, right? Yeah.

And, but like, yeah, like I said, he hit 500 career home runs or something. So you go, well, uh, what, where are you going to say? Like, there's no reason to keep him out. So yeah, that, like, I'm not from a baseball perspective. No, you'd have to be, unless you're going to, like, galaxy brain yourself into not putting any DHS in there, which would be stupid. That's right. Yeah. And he also had, the thing, the thing about Ortiz is also, he had like one of the most insane,

last years of any superstar in sports. I just pulled up his stats. Age 40, he had 38 home runs after he had 37 the year before. So like, not, this is an average.

Lead the league in RBIs, led the league in slugging, led the league at OPS, like just and I think if I remember right, he had said before the year, like, I'm going to retire. This is my last year. And then he just went out and had, as good a year as he had ever had in his life, And then it was like, yeah, no, I said I was retiring.

I'm gone. So, I don't know. Yeah, I mean. Don't know how he was able to perform that well into his 40s. It would be a mystery of this. He'd been a professional, like, he'd been in the major leagues on some level since 1997. So, like, he had been in, he'd been around for a really long time.

And, like, you know, a prototypical player of his era where, like, he drew a shitload of walks, all that kind of stuff. He led the league in walks in two. 2006. So, you know, like he, he, you couldn't make, you couldn't make an anti-Hall of Fame argument against this guy, especially once Edgar Martinez got in, which I'm just now learning. Not based on his on the field results at all for sure. Yeah, absolutely. So, yeah. Anyway, that's it. We're done. I don't, I don't have any more Hall of Fame takes. All right. That's. I will say, we are off next week. I'm going on vacation.

You're not allowed to make me podcast. Don't think I signed off on that. I filed it with HR, so, you know. Oh, okay. But yeah, so no show next week. I'm sure Sean will figure out something to do with a mailbag. Doesn't have anything to do. I wouldn't assume that.

So yeah, we'll see in a couple weeks after the All-Star break and all that kind of stuff. So yeah, if you want to read my writing that I'm doing this week as I frantically prepare for vacation, you can go to E.P.Rinkside.com, and if you want to sign up for an annual subscription, use the code I Love E.P. They'll tack up a few months on at the end there for you. Absolutely free of charge. Isn't that nice? Very good. And you can find me in The Athletic. I got a few things already up for this week. And I think I'm going to bring back the grab bag this week. I haven't done one of those in forever. And I'm going to do that. And listen to me with Ian Mendez on the Athletic Hockey Show.

And check out, if you're not on the Patreon, consider getting on there because we had a fun restaurant draft yesterday that I'm just looking at now. People seem to have enjoyed. That's nice, yeah. And speaking of the Patreon, Greg wrote something on there about, he was on Hockey Night in Canada in 2009 defending the auger, the honor of blogging. That was quite funny.

Which, what an insane time capsule clip that was. I watched that. Like, I have no recollection of this happening, but it's bizarre. And me and Sean Gentile are doing a stick to sports today or tomorrow. and me and Sean Gentile and Greg did a stick to soup last week and yeah there's a lot of podcasts on the Patreon now and just announced that Top Chef is coming back at the beginning of May

so me Greg and Greg's wife Ruby will be doing our weekly recap show or at the beginning of March I said May it's March so starting in a few weeks we'll be doing that as well so check it all out thank you for your ongoing support. We'll see you in a couple weeks. Bye-bye. Oh, bud.