Puck Soup - Keep Waiting

Episode Date: May 31, 2023

Sean and Ryan talk about the end of the Conference Finals, preview the Cup Final, and then get into all the GM and coaching changes this week. Plus Sean has a quiz.   Sponsored by Athletic Greens (athleticgreens.com/puck), Bespoke Post (boxofawesome.com) promo code PUCK and Gametime (download the Gametime app and use code PUCK)

Sticks and hits and goals and saves and slap shots and goons. We've got sportly commentary to what if you commute. We also cover movies, TV shows, It's and Toons. It's your weekly bowl of Hagi and Nonsense. I'm Ryan Lambert from EP Rinkside. I'm Sean McAnneux. I'm the new general manager of the Toronto Maple Leafs. You and everybody else, right?

Unless I say something that Brendan Shanahan thinks is weird in this podcast, in which case they'll go to their backup plan forad for living. It's a real, it's a real Larry David scenario over there. You sure is. Just little decisions getting made that you're just like, oh, why did you do that? Ah, whatever. But we're going to, I feel like, count that or talk about that a little later on. Um, first I guess, I feel like maybe need to get around to, uh, oh yeah, Vegas is going to the Stanley Cup final second time in, I think, six years.

Yeah. Now, good for them. Everyone seems really happy about this. Yeah. Uh, I, I guess the first thing I wanted to say about this is like, how's Vegas been around six years already? That feels insane. Yeah, that, yeah. I don't like that.

No. And yeah, congratulations to Vegas on, according to the feedback I've been seeing, making it to the Stanley Cup final with all the guys they were gifted in the expansion draft. They got them for free. You can't say that's not true. Jack Eichel, Mark Stone, Alex Petrangelo, like all these guys that they just, that they've had for six years. Nice work, guys. Am I right in remembering that it's six original Golden Knights? Is that what we're down to? I think that's it, yeah. And even that would count guys that they traded for,

as opposed to actually picked in the expansion. Drafted, sure. Who is it then? It's Carlson, Marcia So. Smith, Carrier. Oh, and now I hit a wall, don't I? Well, geez, I mean, if it's, If we're counting Smith and Carrie, I mean, that's clearly the core of Nicholas

Roy, is he? Yep, yep, that's one. And, um, hmm, Mark Andre Fleury is still on that team? I feel like if he had been traded, we would have heard about it. So let's go ahead and say yes. Um, yeah, I can't. Oh, Shea Theodore and Zach White Cloud. Those are the other two.

Yeah. Um, but yeah. It's pretty crazy because, you know, I think we talked about this recently. They had maybe, I think you'd say, outsized success that first year. Good team, but maybe not make it to the Stanley Cup final good. And then, you know, anybody that was like, well, I mean, can they repeat that? The same kind of question we're asking about Seattle. What did they do?

They were like, well, we're just going to go get every all-star that comes available any given summer. They went out and got Patchyer ready immediately. The next year they trade for Lainer. They signed Petrangelo and like traded for Mark Stone. Like they just keep doing it. They almost got Eric Carlson. They did get Jack Eichael.

And it's like, yeah, no, they've done everything they can to set themselves up for this kind of success. And now they're having it, you know? And again, like just without belaboring the point, can we just please please? remember that when they had their initial expansion draft, we all looked at that team and win. They are bad. Like nobody came out of that expansion draft going, holy crap, look at this powerhouse. And I'm saying nobody, like fans, media, Vegas, you could have got like 200 to one odds on them going to the final. Yeah. On opening night. So, I don't know, the revisionist history around this team is

well again it's the it's the you know the stuff they did to make this the success sustainable because you're not getting 40 plus goals out of William Carlson every year right you're not getting well Flurry was 925 930 something like that you're not getting that every year

and so they were like well how can we make this work better and and you know trading for patchy you're ready and, you know, not giving up like nothing for him, but giving up nothing that really hurt their, their extant roster at the, I don't know why we're doing like full Vegas

Golden Knights history here, but it's just like they're willing to do things that other teams are not willing to do in terms of shaking up their roster and they're on their third coach. Things that other teams continually tell us is not possible to do. Sure.

But even beyond that, like, yeah, we don't give a shit. We'll trademark Andre Fleury. Whatever. We'll get a better goalie than that. And then it's like, okay, and surely that better goalie is the one that brought you to the cup final. And it's like, no, that's like his backup to the backup to the backup. Aiden Hill. Doesn't matter.

Bruce Cassidy comes in. Instantly, this team is like, no, we're going to roll. And, okay, let's start with that. What went right for Vegas in this series for you? I mean, I guess you have to start with Aden Hill just because it's sort of, it's the other side of the Bobrovsky coin, right? Where it's like, who would you rather have? A goalie who used to be great and got a huge contract and now he stinks? or a guy who has just never been especially good.

Like he's been fine. Totally. He's been one of the 60 to 70 NHL caliber goalies that are out there at any given year. But that's it. And it doesn't matter because he's played. Like he's not having the Bobrovsky style heater, but he's been more than good enough for a team

that's depending on how you look at it down to their third or fourth or maybe even fifth string. I think, let's see. Who have they used this year? Like, I mean, to start with, do you count Robin Lainer is? Well, I would say he's supposed to be the starter. Yeah. But, you know.

And his injury announcement last year came after the offseason goalie carousel had stopped. So I do count him. Yeah, no, I agree. So Logan Thompson was supposed to be the starter. Well, he was supposed to be the backup this season. But going into the year, they're like, this guy's the starter. And Brasois was in there for a bit. And Aden Hill, obviously, they traded for him.

At some point during the season, I don't remember the exact day off the top of my head or anything like that. But I feel like it was December-ish, maybe. Oh, no, it was before the start of the season. Oh, probably when the Lainer announcement came down there, they were like, oh, you know what? but let's go out and get a goalie. Right. But maybe they didn't use them. And then obviously at the deadline, they go out and get Jonathan Quick for that extra bit of insurance just because they were like, we don't know.

And Quick did start for a while. We haven't seen him in the playoffs really. Yeah, and he started really hot and then just imploded. Right. He had like the one or two good games and everyone was like, uh-oh, the old Jonathan Quick. All the haters. Yeah. Yeah, that's right.

But yeah, Aiden Hill doing it. You know, you can't, you can't knock him for what he's doing here. I'm just going to pull up his run against Dallas alone. He went 939 against Dallas. Two shoutouts. Two shutouts. You can say they made it easy for him. They didn't not for sure.

But, you know, 940. goaltending, you're going to win a lot of hockey games. I don't know how else to say it to you, you know. And, you know, this is a guy who came in. He wasn't even the starter going into the playoffs. Yep. He takes over like halfway through a couple games into the Edmonton series and is just like, no, no, don't sweat it.

I got it. I don't know if you saw this, but somebody posted that it is apparently the second time in history that we have a Stanley Cup final matchup featuring two starting goalies who weren't their team starting goalie at the beginning of the playoffs, which it feels like it would happen more often than that, but only, and the first one was like in some like early 70s matchup, so something that most of us have never seen before. Yeah. So yeah, goaltending, obviously, and then the other thing with Vegas is just the balance of

scoring, you know, the bottom six. Yep. The fourth line, obviously, was the big story in the clincher, but, I mean, it's been pretty consistently, it's not like Vegas is a four-line team in the way that a team like the Cracken are where you're not really sure who is the first line on any given night, but they are getting, they have like the traditional four lines,

but they're just, all four of them are playing well. Yeah, and outscoring the other side. Yeah, and I think it's worth noting that, like, there's a pretty clear delineation on every one of those lines. Like, the first line is very clearly the first line. The second line is very clearly the second line slash the first penalty kill unit. The third line is very clearly, you know, if you, again, like, if you had said, hey, this Vegas top line that went to the Stanley Cup final in 2018 or whatever,

they're going to be the third line, or at least two of those guys are going to be the third line, you know, in their return engagement to the cup final, you know, what else do you want, you know? Because Marcia So is the one who stayed on the first line,

and then it's, Riley Smith and William Carlson are on the third line with in the most recent game Michael Amadio who scored a goal and then Chandler Stevenson and Mark Stone like a couple years ago we were like oh Chandler Stevenson maybe he's like an okay number one center and it's like

it seems like he's a really good number two center you know So so what's not like you look at their four lines and you're not like blown away at all but everyone's well everyone's producing

as far as the basic numbers Dom and his preview points out that you look at expected goals and stuff like that it's a very different story they're not the underlying numbers I guess you would say

don't indicate that these lines are as dominant as the their goals for and against would suggest. And in fact, they suggest that these lines are kind of treading water, which is not bad for a third and fourth line. You can be okay with that.

Yeah. But they're, you know, they look like at the surface, they look like they're kicking doors in and doesn't, it hasn't been that way. Like on the one hand, you go, well, you know what? Who cares? It's like, you don't win playoff rounds on expected goals. You win based on what you actually do.

true, but as far as predicting whether it will continue into the final, it's a little dice here. Yeah, for sure. With that having been said, though, you know, the way they handled their business against Dallas, like,

and this is the other thing, I guess. The way I feel like they probably match up against, against Florida, we'll talk about like the actual Cup final. I just think

there are ways to look at it where you go like, oh, the matchups here could really, you know, you put stone on the on the second, whatever,

you know, like you, both teams can juggle and move things around and that kind of thing, but like, you know, can Stone shut down Kachuk,

can Barkoff shut down, Eichel, like these are really good, these should be really good head to heads. And then I guess I would say I like Vegas's bottom six better than Florida's. But, you know, but to your broader, to the broader point, what right for Vegas for me is, uh, their forward depth really, really showed up in, in this series and, and, um, I don't know.

I, it's hard to, it's hard in a series that went. how it did to be like, oh, you know, Dallas really gave him something to think about. This was a classic, like, this was a six game series,

but it's like, yeah, but like, really, was it, was it the way people talk about a six game series being sometimes, you know?

Well, I mean, the first two games were overtime, right? I mean, they could have gone either way, and then the game three was, uh,

sort of the blowout and then games four and five are close. So, I mean, you could argue that Dallas maybe I don't think you could argue Dallas deserved a better fate I think you could argue that they deserve better than being down 3-0 but yeah I sure would have got interesting if they had won game six

but oh of course yeah and then then they could have been like the Boston Celtics you know exactly just absolutely shit the bed in their chance to make history or whatever. Obviously in the NBA, did you see what the stat was all time for teams down 3-0 in the NBA? Was it 0 in like 150 or something like that? That's exactly what the number was. And now it's 0 in 151 because the Celtics were like,

well, we're not going to show up for this one, sorry. I'm sure, you know, obviously it's happened, what, four times in hockey now, three? Four. Four, yeah. Twice in the modern era, really. Yeah, what you would call, like anything resembling modern hockey. So, you know, we talked about what went right for Vegas.

What went wrong for Dallas for you? I mean, Jake Ottinger wasn't what they needed him to be. I don't know that I'd say he was bad. but he certainly, he was the second best goalie in a series where he was playing against Aiden Hill. Yeah, Jake Ottinger 877 in this series. Yeah. That's not good enough. And again, we sort of said with Aden Hill that it was, they played well in front of him.

I don't think Dallas played well in front of Jake Ottinger. I would agree. But, I mean, didn't we say, I mean, even after, I think, after the first round of the playoffs, a lot of us looked at the goalies that were left and we went, you know, Jake Othonger is like the only, really reliable guy left. And he didn't, it's been a very weird year for goaltending in the playoffs. So he wasn't that guy. And I don't mean, he didn't need to be like 2002 against Calgary, Jake Ottinger,

where he looked ridiculous. No, but if they get 9-10 goaltending in this series, they probably do force a game seven or flip a couple of results, right? Like the games where, again, the guy's 877, that's given up a lot of goals. And not all of them are like game six, right? Like where it's like, oh, Dallas just didn't get off the bus or whatever for that one. It's more, you know, they were in it. And with, you know, getting one extra save, the whole series is different on any given night.

Three overtime games in the series, you know? It's tough. Yeah. You can't win with 877 goal tending. The other thing that I think you're going to remember from this series as, well, I was going to say as a Dallas fan, probably not. But the thing you're going to remember about Dallas, maybe as an outsider, is Jamie Ben being an idiot in game three

and getting himself suspended, although they won the two games he was suspended for. Yeah, I wouldn't have put him back in the lineup for game six. Well, he, I mean, just one of the dumbest suspensions of all time. So, which is unfortunate because he really had a nice kind of redemption arc of a season. Yeah, for a guy that we've all, you know, that's been focused on the contract and, you know, the age and all of that. but yeah, certainly he, if you were doing a stock up, stock down thing based on the series, Jamie Ben did not look, did not come out of it looking great. No, for sure.

Jason Robertson did. Jason Robertson came back. That was the nice thing to see for Dallas. But if you want to talk about what weren't wrong for the stars, I'm just going to read you their goal scoring leaders in this. series. Jason Robertson, five. That's a good start.

Yeah. Tide to Landria, too. I know who that is. He's the guy who scored two goals in that one game earlier. Robei Hints, one, Joe Vavealski won, Miro Heiskin, and one. Luke Glendening, one, nobody else scored a goal in that series. Nothing from Sagan, nothing from Domi, nothing from Wyatt Johnston. nothing from

I don't know well, De Donov got hurt so maybe that's not fair to put that on him but like nothing nothing from Marchman nothing from Faxa like

and up until I think it was I think it was that game six game or game five that forced game six the one the stars won four to two where Delandria

scored twice the they didn't have a single goal from someone who's not on their top power play unit. You're not going to win a lot of fucking hockey games like that either, right? 877 goaltending, you're going to struggle.

Not getting any depth scoring except for in one game, you're going to struggle. Especially when the team you're playing is getting that depth scoring. I mean, that's just, yeah. But, you know, someone asked us in the mailbag last week, like, what's different about the stars this year? Because last year we were saying, oh, they're a one-line team and this kind of stuff. And they were, you know.

And what was different in the regular season was they got that 30-goal season from Jamie Ben. I don't remember the other, but like they got a lot of like, you know, 15 goals from a guy that you wouldn't expect it to have scored 15, 22 from another guy, that kind of thing. And even against, um,

against Edmonton. It felt like they were getting the, or Seattle, I mean, rather. It felt like they were getting the, the depth scoring that you wanted, you know? Johnston had three goals. Max Domey had two. Mason Marchman had two.

Dadaunov, Ben, Sagan, all had one apiece, you know, and it's like, you don't need all your depth, especially when your top line is as good as they are. just on any given night really. You don't need your depth guys to score three goals a game or whatever. You get two goals out of your top line, one more goal out of your other lines,

and you're usually in pretty good shape, you know? And they just, it flat out didn't happen in this series. They got depth goals in one game in this series. That's it. We should probably say Ryan Suter also did not have a great postseason or great series, especially like this is one of those, you know, very often, I can tell you from first-hand experience, if you suggest that a player has not been great, the fans of that team descend on you to say that you clearly haven't watched the games because if you watch the games,

he would see that that guy who had no points was actually awesome. And was a minus eight or whatever. Yeah. He actually kicked ass. Ryan Suter, like, watching the games, certainly watching the highlights was not kind to him.

No. Because, man, he just seemed on every goal like he was just, like, unplugged controller. Yeah, look. And like... Doing some awful stuff. He was getting too many minutes. This is a classic guy

where it's like, well, you know, he's Miro Heiskenin's pairing partner or whatever. And you're like, yeah, but, you know, should he be getting the kind of minutes he's getting in this series? No, I think everybody would agree. The answer is, let's see, what was his average time on ice in this one? It was 22, almost 23 minutes, 22, 43 a game. You can't have that happen. The guy's like my age. almost, you know?

Yeah. And like, again, you're saying the highlights. Yeah, if you, if you take out, it's a classic thing.

Well, if you look at all the goals that's got scored against him, he looks bad. That's true, you know? Like, I'm sure he did other stuff

that they liked, but the end result is, there's two more years of this guy, and he has a full no move. Hmm? I, you know, you're right you had ever been bought out twice like had both buyouts

on someone's books at the same time um yeah probably yeah you gotta think like a David Clarkson or somebody like that or uh no he actually never did get bought out is that true didn't he got he got shuffled around yeah and wound up back on the Leafs I think at the end of it I think that's true and we all had to pretend that that made sense

we're like, yeah, that does give them more cap space. But you want to talk about buying out Ryan Souter? I just did the thing on cap-friendly. His cap hit 783 the next two seasons, and then it goes up to 1.4 of the two seasons after that, if they buy them out. That's eminently affordable, I would say. Yep.

Although, you know, it was a really funny buyout when I was doing my little, like, what will this team do? It's not that Carolina has a lot of big decisions to make this summer, but like next summer, Aho, Teravinen, Natchez, like a bunch of guys, Seth Jarvis, a bunch of these guys need new contracts, and they got to free up some money. And I was like, boy, that Yesperi Cockneyemi deal doesn't look so good. If you click buy out his deal for, I mean, obviously you're paying him until. 2037. But like next year, 1.1 million and then max of 8.22 basically the entire rest of the contract. Is he one of the under 25 deals? Is that where okay. Yeah, he's 22. So he would cost like next to nothing to buy out, but you would be paying him until like almost 2040. So, you know, it's not great. But I,

I was just laughing about, like, how little money you get if you get bought out before you're 25, I guess. But we'll talk about Carolina in a second. Anything else you think the stars might do this summer? Obviously, they have some stuff to look at, not only with, with suitor, but like, do they do it with Jamie Ben? I mean, I can't see it coming off of the season that he just had, and he is your captain. We talked about it, the suspension, and that didn't make them look good, but I can't imagine. Well, I shouldn't say I can't imagine, but. I can imagine it, yeah.

I would be surprised if they went in that direction. Yeah, but like you can't trade him because he's got the no move, like a full no move. Yeah. Man. And Tyler Sagan's an awful lot of. bonuses so it's because I mean that you well Sagan's also signed for another like three years beyond Ben or two years beyond he's got four years after this one so yeah so that's that's a problem which is yeah yeah it's uh it's not it's not great all the way around um but it feels like

there's just that little extra step they need to take to really ensure that this keeps rolling, because I think everybody would agree. You look at your hints and your Robertson and obviously Heisken and Nottinger, and you're like, yeah, if those are like your three or four best players and they're all, you know, 24 years old or whatever. To have. I mean, if you're going down the list saying, all right, you get to, you get to, you get start with a forward defenseman and a goalie from any team in the league.

Like, Dallas is not very far down that list. Yep, totally. So if you're taking them as a three-man unit, they might even be one. If it's like, you have to take one forward, one defense, and one goalie. Yeah, that's what I mean. It's like, who else are you going to take, really, you know? Posternak, McAvoy and Swainman, maybe. I'm trying to think.

There aren't too many teams that have like that classic trio that everybody says you need to build around. I guess the only knock is that Robertson is a winger and not a center, would you say? But like, again, you have hints. He's a center. Yep. Go nuts. But even like, you know, Wyatt Johnson, everybody thinks that kid's going to be really, really good. Maverick Bork, he played, I think, one game in this series.

but people think he can maybe be a legit player. I don't know. There's a lot to like here, but also, you know, can you do another two years where you're like, yeah, and we're paying both Jamie Ben and Tyler Sagan, $9.5 million or whatever it is. I don't know.

Like I said, they have some interesting decisions to make, they could bring back Domi, I guess. I think they probably like that. Domi, right? Yeah, I mean, I think it's, yes, but also, like, he was sort of set up to hit free agency this year. For sure. You know, as far as where he going to Chicago and be in the deadline rental.

So you kind of see where it goes. But, I mean, they're in decent shape. And do you put, like, do you look at anyone in the central other than Colorado as being ahead of Dallas heading into the offseason? Probably not, no. I think so. Even leaving aside the fact that they went to the Western Conference final, obviously, I guess the only team you would say is Minnesota,

and they have an interesting summer ahead of themselves too. Yep. So it's going to be really interesting to see how they, again, like undergird the success and try to, you know, ensure that, they can keep doing this. Because again, are you really going to be counting on Jamie Bendapod another 30 next season? I don't think the answer is yes. Well, I'll say that.

Or at least not definitively, yes. Yeah, I mean, you don't want to go in with that being part of the plan. Exactly. But like, yeah, wow, I'm looking at it now. Wyatt Johnson had 24 goals this year. Not fucking bad for a teenager. Nope. Not bad.

And it's not like he shot 25%. 15's a little high, but you know, you take that for sure. Yeah, they got 21 from Sagan. They got 12 and 68 for Marchment. Marchment is interesting because I don't think he had a great playoff at all. And they gave him a decent size contract. I don't know. I think he can keep it up and maybe even be better next postseason, honestly.

but there's a long time between now and then, so I don't want to get too far ahead of myself. So yeah, there's your stars post-mortem. Why don't we, since we last spoke, folks, we also had the end of the Carolina, Florida series. It ended like, you know, 12 hours after this episode finished, or last week's episode finished recording. So we got to talk about that, too.

Three nothing at the time, so I'm pretty sure we probably already talked about it as if it was over. Yeah. Now, here's the thing, though. Rob Rindamore, his theory is, did we get swept? Yeah. But did we like get swept? No. Right.

So. And as many people have pointed out, that was a, both, yes, the point he was making was completely valid and B, the sort of thing that, like, if any other. coach in the league other than him and maybe a couple other guys said that they would be getting ripped apart. Yeah, it's just the thing where it's like

what the kind of the thing you said about Dallas where it's like yeah, three overtime games in that series. Was it a four to two series? Sure. But look at how close they were. You know, two bucks bounced their way. We're talking about this completely differently. All true. But no one wants to hear

that shit after you get swept. You know? It's just like, right, you didn't win a single one of these, man. And look, who's a bigger

Hurricanes believer in general than us to? There probably aren't that many, right? Like, we think they have a really good thing going here. We like a lot. There's a lot to like about this organization,

I think we would both say. And yet, it's just like, after you get swept, you cannot say, yeah, but actually that series was really close. that's insane. I'm sorry. That's ridiculous.

Oh, well. Yeah. I don't, like I said, I don't like when people say it about a six, a six game series. Were you really that close? You only won two out of six games. That's not that close. This is, you know, the, the Lambert approach, it's all about who wins, man. Winners find a way. That's exactly right. I just, you know, I just don't want to hear it, basically. We can talk about it more broadly, but just like, boy, we were right in every game. Yeah, right up until the final score, like the clock ticked down to zero. It said, you lost every one of these, brother.

I'm waiting until I hear what happened in the handshake line. I think we all need to know. Oh, man. They might, the amount of respect they might have gotten. Scale 1 to 10, how much? Easy seven and a half respect level. Minimum. That's the floor.

Yeah. But yeah. Do you make anything of this thing where Carolina has now over their last 12 in the conference final? I don't because that dates back to like 2009 or something like that. So like, no, I don't. But like, is it funny? You bet it is. Yeah.

Someone told me that stat. Like, I guess I hadn't thought about it. Like, oh, yeah. You know, Carolina. that they weirdly make it like make it to the conference final with significant significant frequency this is five since 20 or 2002 I think uh yeah would be that's probably better than the vast majority of teams in the league we always say that like the playoffs like yeah go ahead playoffs are different than the regular season apparently the third

round is different from the second round and they just need to figure out how to win in round three. And so this was going to be my question to you. Is this a classic example of a New York Islanders of a few years ago style high floor low ceiling team as currently constituted? And I think the answer to that is that you can't answer without looking at the injuries. Like that has to factor. And again, going back to the Brindamore thing,

Like, yeah, they lost in four, but literally one goal in those first three games potentially change the course of that series. And they were missing two and at times three pretty good forwards. I'm not going to give him the credit for Patchy already. Like, yeah, they were missing him, but he played four games this year. So I think we said that last week. But they went out and traded for him knowing that they weren't going to get him until the second half. But okay.

Even then. Like, Svetnikov was big. The other thing, though, that will be part of the conversation with Carolina is, as many people were quick to point out, when we got this matchup in the conference final, was that these are the two teams that didn't do much at the deadline. and now you look back at Carolina and go this was a cup worthy team and the only help that they added up front was Jesse Pliarvi. Yep. Who did nothing for them at all, including in the regular season. And I liked the bet that they could get something out of him.

But it didn't cost them very much or whatever. No, not at all. And whatever. But yeah. But that was all they did. And you look back and say maybe one more goal would have. And they, you know, they didn't know Svetchenkov was going to get hurt. They did know Patcheretti was out.

So, I mean, they could have, you know, certainly that was a known quantity. But. And, you know, we'll probably never know what may or may not have been on the table. They may have sat down and said, guys, we're. we're staying the course. Like, this is the plan. Or maybe not. They were reported to be right in on Tim O'Meyer and, you know, probably some other guys. And sometimes they just, the deals fall through.

But that is one of those things with the benefit of hindsight. And obviously, if they win the series and they're in the final right now, we're all singing their praises like, hey, man, they didn't, they didn't break up the mix. They didn't. They found a way. Yeah, all that. You know, they didn't, they kept the room and all this stuff. But instead they got swept, you know.

Yeah. Tough luck. Did they tell? Well, again, they didn't get like swept, swept. They got swept. So it's actually very different. They also have an interesting summer because they don't have a lot of guys to resign who are like NHL players at this point. Although they do have to figure out what they're doing about Jordan Stahl.

Because his deal's up and he's 34, 35 years old. and yeah, it'll be 35 in September. And, you know, he's not the Jordan Stahl of Old. He's still a good player, but he's not the Jordan Stahl of Old. And what does that cost you? You know, because, as I mentioned, they got to resign, like Ajo is eligible for a new deal July 1. Terra Vinen, same deal. Nature's same deal.

Like, they could start setting the table for, you know, the next five plus years this summer, even though they don't have a ton of pending free agents that you're like, well, you've got to lock that guy in, you know? Speaking of Puli, he's their only RFA forward. But what they do got to do is they got to find a new goalie setup maybe,

because apparently they're perfectly amenable to bringing back both Anderson and Ranta, but also, you know, what does that cost you? What do you do with Kachetkov? And certainly they have been very fluid in their approach to goaltending. Yeah, what do you want for this guy? We'll give them to you, no problem.

And have been right about the moves they've been making very consistently. Like to the point where, it does make you wonder if they have cracked something that other teams haven't as far as. Yeah, it's the Aden Hill thing where it's like, oh, that guy's having success in the postseason? Wow. Yeah. Okay.

You know. Not that Freddie Anderson is like a fourth string goalie under normal circumstances. But, you know, it's just every year it's like, oh, yeah, would your goalie do this here? He went 9.15. Don't sweat it, you know? Mm-hmm. So, yeah, it'll be interesting. to see what their summer looks like.

I guess I don't really have too much else to say about them. So do you? No, I don't think so. I mean, it's, uh, if they're off. They're already well into their offseason, so. Yeah, it's been going on a while. So yeah, why don't we take a break? We'll be right back and we'll talk about the cup final and all that kind of stuff.

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It's good matchup. It's cool. Really fun matchup for sure. I guess the first thing I want to talk about, though, we hear it all the time. Rust, is that a problem? You know? And sometimes it feels like it's a little overblown, but with the Panthers getting like a week and a half off.

And to be fair, Dallas getting five days off. Yeah. It does feel like a little bit of a... I feel rusty. I feel, yeah. And we always say, and this applies more when it's, you know, if the final was starting tonight, and like Dallas was being thrown right,

or sorry, Vegas was being thrown right back into it. You typically say that it hurts the team that's been off early in the series, but it helps them later in the series because they get to rest up and get healthy. And yeah, they're rusty to start. But over time, that extra rest ends up helping them. I feel like recently it hasn't been as,

pronounced. Like, I feel like we've been in this situation a few times. The one area that it does make you wonder a little bit is is Brobowski. Because on the one hand, he's an older guy, hasn't had a full workload in a while. So, you know, this, all this rest should be great for him. On the other hand, this guy is on an all-time heater

for the last two and a half rounds. does this hit reset on this and we go back to the regular Barbarovsky or do does it, does it keep going in which case is it even a hot streak at that point if you can take 10 days off in the middle of it? That'll be interesting to watch. Certainly if we go out in the first game and Barowski gives up four goals on 30 shots and looks so-so,

that's going to make me go wait a second. This is, you know, the Panthers are certainly, they're not just writing a hot goalie, they're a great story, all of this, but the goalie has been a huge part of that. And if there's a sense early on that maybe the break has diminished that,

that tips the scales pretty significantly, I think. Yeah, I think that's about right. It's, it's tough because, like, they could, they could just come out, game one, absolutely beat the shit out of, out of Vegas. And you go, well, I guess the,

rust isn't a thing. But if they're bad, that's what everybody's going to blame it on. Right. Which isn't, you know, it's not a bad thing to blame things on because in theory it goes away, right? Sure. You know, if you go, oh, we're rusty, so, you know, maybe you burn the tapes a little bit and forget about it. But, yeah, it's, I don't know. I mean, if you're going to be rusty from 10 days, then you would think you'd be,

At least a little bit rusty from five days, too. Yeah. Could be nothing. Put it this way. The NHL has certainly made so that fatigue will not be an excuse for anyone. No kidding. The big delay is one thing, but the fact that I think there's only two situations where it's like game, night off game. It is, this is awful.

It's really insane, man. like why it's going to be so hard to get any momentum going in this series just as a fan I don't even like I'm not talking about sure for a team I think of it more like

hey do you remember what night the the cup final game is on like you know your game three when's game four I have no fucking idea could be it could be tonight it could be three nights from now I don't know for people who don't know I guess

The games are scheduled for the third and the fifth, so that's, you know, game, night off game. Then the eighth, then the tenth, so game night off game, but with two days off in between. Then the 13th, 16th, and 19th. So if this goes to game seven, they're going to play three games in like eight days or whatever, nine days, which is rare in the NHL. And, you know, it's travel time and all of that. No, not anymore. It's not like they're fucking taking the train.

No. I mean, it is a decent fight. So they've got the extra day basically every time the teams travel. And then, you know, the other thing is it's, especially if it comes down to a long series, we get no games over the weekend. They go Friday night right to a Monday, those classic hockey nights. Not even like the weekend afternoon games

that many people, I don't think there's, I think every game starts at eight, which is at least they've got that nice piece of consistency. But game four is on a Saturday night, and that's it for weekend hockey, which, yeah, maybe it's, I know every time, every time they put a game on a Sunday afternoon,

late in the playoffs, half the people complain because they're like, hey, man, I want to be outside barbecuing and not watching hockey. So you got your wish this time, but holy smokes, is this, if this goes seven, it's going to, I don't know, we're going to have about four different shows where we're having to talk about this series. It's true. It's weirdly true. It'll at least be, it could be three, right?

Is that last game? Is that a Wednesday night? I think it's a Tuesday actually. It's a Tuesday, okay. Just barely, though. But again, this is like the Tuesday, like three weeks from yesterday. Right. Man, is it?

You know what? I'm willing to commit to this. If there's a game seven on a Tuesday night, that week's show will be on Tuesday. There you go. Make that happen for you. We'll try to. Yep, that's right. we've only got three weeks to shift the schedule.

So I guess let's get into the series itself, matchups and all that kind of stuff. I kind of talked about it a little bit earlier. But Vegas has three lines where you're like, oh, it's like two really good guys on that line, you know? And I don't know, like, what do you think the matchup situation looks like? because obviously Florida has two really good lines

and then one that they could easily like heat up. Like Lundell and Rinehart, those guys could get something going. But, yeah, I mean, Reinhardt's a pretty good player to have on your third line. Same with Lundell. Lundell, this is a guy that like, had a nice season for himself, I feel.

And then that fourth line for Florida really is where it kind of falls off. Not that you look at a fourth line matchup and say this is... This is going to make her break the series, yeah. I mean, put it this way. If Paul Maurice is doing any sort of a job, it shouldn't have much of an impact. But it's, you know, if you just compartmentalize each of the matchups in this series, the two fourth lines is the biggest gap that you're going to see because Florida's stinks. but that's okay.

They'll ride the top six primarily in the top nine and should be okay. Their top six is really fucking good, man. When Matthew Kachuk is on what you would consider technically your second line. Yeah. I feel like you take that. I feel like you're sitting there going, we're in pretty good shape. This guy who's like the king of hockey at this point. Just, man, so good.

Yeah, he's been phenomenal and super clutchy. Absolutely. You can't, like, if you were like, okay, what's a thing that Matthew Kachar, or anybody needs to do to take a star turn from like, oh, he's a good hockey player that everybody, universally agrees had a great season to this guy's on, you know, TNT, NBA on TNT and all this kind of stuff and is generally seen as like kind of a crossover star that you just don't get in this league very often. Yeah, he has been the, like you couldn't, you couldn't script it better

than what he's done. We always talk about the breakout star of the playoffs, but this feels like he actually is. We actually is. We actually. are seeing it. It's not just wishful thinking. So good for him. So, I mean, all you other unhappy players out there thinking about forcing your way out of your lame Canadian market. All you're going to do? Worked out. Get traded to your other team and score like four overtime playoff goals.

That's right. You know? But it's funny because I think he's got actually three and not four, if I'm not mistaken. but there is a category that we do in Name Pat Falun. Oh, and I forgot to say earlier, Sean has a little game coming up at the end of the show, so stay tuned for that. But in Name Pat Falun, one of the categories that I came up with is like guys who scored more than one overtime playoff goal in their career.

And the list isn't as long as you might think. There really aren't that many guys who have done it more than once. Conchuk did it twice in one series. God, he rocks. He's so fucking cool. Twice in one series and then. Twice in back to back games.

Another one with five seconds left, which, I mean, it's not an overtime goal, but it was. Effectively, yeah. But yeah, twice in back to back games. He did it in games one and two against Carolina. It doesn't get any better than that. And certainly not fourth O'Don. You almost never get it. And then meanwhile, if, you know, the other breakout star and not to the same degree,

but it's kind of been the Jack Eichael show a little bit in Vegas where this guy famously never made the playoffs suddenly has never lost in the playoffs now. It's true. Guy's been in the NHL for eight years and he's never lost a playoff series. And it's crazy, right? because these are both guys obviously Ikel

that trade was like middle of last season or even maybe relatively early last season yeah like end of November I want to say but he didn't play for them until like February

or something like that if I'm ballparking it correctly but just two teams that made huge bets on star forwards who were like discontented in their previous markets

but also Also, like, we're not going to be given up for next to nothing, like a Max Patchy, you're ready, or even a Brent Burns was, right? Like, they, both these teams went out. They said, we need a mid-20s star forward. And these guys came out and fucking delivered. Here's a fun thing. So cool. Do you remember when the Eichel trade went down?

Obviously, the way that played out over that summer. He had been, you know, he had made it clear. He was going to be moved. There was the whole controversy with the injury and the treatment plan. And it dragged into the season. And lots of teams were in and reported to be in and out on him. But do you remember who the other team that was at the time reported to be the finalist alongside Vegas for Jack Eichel? It wasn't, it wasn't Anaheim, was it?

No. They were mentioned quite a few. They were mentioned. The other team that, again, again, reportedly, and there's some disputes on this for sure, but the report was it was down to Vegas and the Calgary Flames. Oh, that's right. And who were the Calgary Flames, again, reportedly,

dangling as part of that trade was Matthew Kachuk. So you want to do a what if. Imagine if the Buffalo Sabres had decided to trade Jack Eichel to Calgary for Matthew Kachuk. I mean, you're talking four franchises now, just absolute seismic changes as far as what happens. The other thing I guess you would have to say is about this matchup is not only did both teams make big bets on star forwards. Both teams are coached by first year coaches with their new teams, obviously, not like rookie coaches. who they kind of gave up on a guy that had a lot of success for them to get these new coaches.

I think, obviously, you would say the Bruce Cassidy's success that they're having in Vegas right now is a little more predictable, a little more easy to see coming down the pike. Maybe not to this extent. Like, yeah, we're riding Aiden Hill into a Stanley Cup final. but, you know, we've said it a million times. Who's the most mid-coach in the league historically? It's Paul Maurice. We thought. And I'm going to let you know a little secret.

I still think. But you can't say it's not working, right? Like, he has, I would say he hasn't had to make a ton of very difficult decisions in this, this post season. And look, like when you when you roll through the second and third rounds, you, like,

the job's done for you, right? You don't make lineup changes when you lose one out of your last nine games or whatever it is. So that, like, that, that aspect of it is easy. But, you know, he made some tough decisions,

especially in the Bruins series, where he's like, we're going to go to Bob, we're not going to go back to Alex Lyon, like, even though Alex Lyon's arguably the reason we made the playoffs and all that. I think it takes a little bit of balls to do that. So, like, I'm not trying to detract from him. Like what he's done in this postseason. I'm just saying, broadly speaking, who would you rather have as a coach, Bruce Cassidy or Paul Maurice?

I think everybody outside of Boston maybe would be pretty unanimous in their choice. Yeah, no, I would imagine. But again, just interesting that both these teams made big bets behind the bench and they both kind of worked out. And made big bets on guys coming in with a track record, you know, like not the new guy, not the new fresh set of eyes that, you know, they kind of went back to the old. Boys Club a little bit. For sure they did. Yeah, absolutely.

So, yeah, I mean, if you're looking at patterns here, two teams that made big, bold moves, two teams that had unexpected goaltending absences, because Spencer Knight is sort of the forgotten guy in Florida, but that was part of their story. two teams that didn't I mean Florida sort of had Vegas's season last year

except they got in by a point instead of just barely missing and then the coaching thing and you know that's and the other thing and I kind of joked about it before but man if you're a GM around the league you're probably not loving

the fact that this is potentially shaping up to be the Eichl versus Kachuk, two young franchise players who forced their way out of the team that drafted them before their second contract could be, you know, second long contract would kick in. That could be interesting. We'll see. You know, we always say it's a copycat league. We're usually talking about GMs, but we'll see if any players want to take a lesson from that.

but to be determined. Yeah, right. Man. I guess we're going to see if anything like that shakes out this summer because there's a, we'll talk about it in a minute. There's a lot of changes going on behind the scenes, off the ice. A lot of teams are making changes this week. But I guess the one last thing I want to talk about relatively quickly in terms of the matchups is Sergei Bavrovsky, Aden Hill.

Stanley Cup final goalie matchup, everybody was predicting. So tired of just whatever team has the best, most established superstar goaltender. That's right. Yeah. Boy. It's great. Look, I guess the question is, you know, if you're talking about like blueprints and making changes and that kind of thing, obviously you're not looking to spend $10 million on a goalie where you're like, oh, I'm pretty surprised he's doing well in the playoffs.

You don't want to, you don't want to be in that scenario. But with that having been said, the idea, do you, do you think this leads to any kind of like, maybe we don't need to make like a huge investment in our goal tent? Like, just having a perfectly okay guy is enough. It's, because again, it's a copycat league and that kind of thing. Yeah. Or, I mean, in the Vegas sense, having three or four perfectly okay guy. even Florida.

I mean, you know, Alex Lyon is going to get a cup ring if they win and well-deserved. He's the guy who got him into the playoffs. For sure. There is, I mean, it's, I find this, I know some people love this stuff. I find it very frustrating as a fan because we're about to go into the off-season and it's all going to be about trades and free agencies and who's going to do what to their roster. And certainly around goaltending, there's a part of you now that's like, does it even matter? and or does it matter in a way that can be at all predictable or meaningful to us or is it literally just going to be you know what you get to april and then whoever gets hot gets hot and that's that's it well i'm so here's why i here's why i bring it up who is the goalie that went to the last three stanley cup finals and won two of them yep andrew vaseliski and is great three years in a row and then get shelled this year

The notorious playoff juggernaut that is the Toronto Maple Leafs forwards. It happens, I think, is what you would say. But I am really, I'm really interested to see where they go in terms of, like, they being like every other GM in the league, in terms of this isn't a great free agent goalie class, I don't think, off the top. my head, I can't think of anybody where it's like, damn, okay, that guy's hit in the market. But with the idea being, oh, yeah, all these goalies, they're relatively interchangeable, except for maybe two or three guys. How does that affect the market?

I think that is actually pretty interesting. You just, you don't know. Let's see here. Who are some free agent goalies? You don't know what I really find it interesting for is not even the free agents, but the Winnipeg Jets potentially having Connor Hallibook available. Sure. And you're just wondering, you know, if you're Kevin Shevolday off and if you have decided

to explore that move, man, you've got to be churning for Florida here, right? Like, yeah, you guys, you need the 30-something former Vezina winner. That's the piece that you need. That's right. Whatever salary, it doesn't matter. If he gets hot in the playoffs, it'll be worth it. versus Aiden Hill where it's like, or you could just get the third string off the San Jose Sharks

and that'll be good enough somehow. Okay, here are some notable UFA goalies. Gustafson, Braswa, Samsonov, oh, no, he's an RFA, who am I thinking of, is Varlamov, sorry. Yes. I saw their names back to back. Aidan Hill, this guy's a

UFA this summer. Corpus Sallo's a UFA this summer. So Tristan Jari So like there are guys, like name guys Freddy Anderson we already mentioned There are like name guys out there that you can You can probably talk yourself into You could talk yourself into it

Yeah, but it's I don't know Maybe what you taught, maybe the lesson here is you talk yourself into A coach who's known for working well with goaltenders because it's, I mean, the impact of coaching on goaltenders is maybe something we haven't explored enough because Bruce Cassidy, obviously, that was always his reputation. It gets the most possible out of a goalie. And you're seeing it now. You're seeing it now. And then, you know, you look at the, you look at the Panthers.

I mean, not so much Paul Maurice, but remember Francois Lair? Remember him being like the goalie whisper? Guess what team he worked for now as a consultant or something like that? I don't think he's their coach, but he's in Florida. Yeah, they have like that goaltending brain trust down there. That's right. You know, we all made fun of and you know what? It's worth, you know, and this is a classic thing.

Maybe it doesn't matter and we're just. flailing for ex- right. If I had said to you on April 1st, how's that brain trust working out in Florida?

Oh, it is it? Look, Pulitzer Prize winning journalist Sean Jintilly wrote a piece at the start of the playoffs

where he ranked the 16th playoffs teams based on how much confidence you had in their goaltending. Mm-hmm. And he had the Florida Panthers

16th out of 16. And I can tell you, I went back and I revisited that And I went down into the comments and not shockingly, it's just filled with people being angry and complaining about how clearly Sean has never watched any hockey. Because that's the only way anyone could ever have an opinion that you don't agree with because of their team not being high enough or their guy being behind this other guy.

I couldn't find anybody objecting to the Panthers being 16th. Like not one person is like, you know, Bobrovsky, this guy's vestin. Not one person. Not one. And here we are. Yep. Here we are. Now, Sean, as a Canadian, do you, are you, like, legally obligated to be mad about the fact that this is being played, you know, in Las Vegas and Miami?

I don't, I feel like we got that out of the way last round. Yeah. It's like, you know, Vegas being the northernmost team in the conference final was. Very funny. It was very funny. I will say, though, surprising to learn that Vegas is farther north than Raleigh. I was very surprised at that, yeah. So I don't know.

I haven't decided yet if I'm supposed to cheer for Vegas because they're the northernmost city and hockey is a game for us northern folk, or if I'm supposed to cheer for the Panthers because they're a member of the original 26. and not one of these. Johnny come lately. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, it's, I mean, I don't care. I think it's kind of cool.

Like, do I think all this stuff about growing the game is like being kind of purposely overstated? You bet I do, you know? Well, it's just frustrating because, like, it feels like that gets brought up as an answer to something that, like, there's all these weird conversations. where people are like, oh, the TV ratings are going to suck. And then someone else is like, this grows the game. And it's like, those statements can both be true. Like, you guys aren't actually arguing with each other. You're just...

Yeah. And again, I got news for you. First of all, if you're talking about ratings, you're a loser. What do you care? Second of all, the ratings are going to suck anyway. Chicago, Boston. You know, like, name two teams that are big draws. Pittsburgh.

get them in there, whatever. Ratings are going to be like good. You know, they're going to get beat by like two to one, three to one by the NBA finals. Oh, sure. Yeah. And so to get all worked up about like, oh, the ratings suck. Well, first of all, you don't work for the NHL.

What do you care? And second of all, you can't, you can't, the difference between a point six and a point eight or whatever these are going to draw. Like, all right, I guess who gives a shit? It doesn't, man,

again, as a wrestling fan, you hear about ratings fucking constantly, and it's just like, why do you care? It doesn't make sense to me. But yeah, so I think it's kind of cool.

I like, look, I went to the Frozen Four in Tampa a few months ago, you know. It's nice going to the rink and you could wear shorts if you wanted to. You'd be perfectly comfortable. You know, that's cool to me. Yep.

All these people, oh, it sucks, it sucks. And Christ, I went to, I went to Arizona to see some, some games earlier this season two in January. And it was like, oh, it's 70 degrees out. This is great, you know. So this is what I'll, from now on, as a full. fledged, I've been to multiple games in the south now. Give it a whirl. You'll like it.

And then you'll go, oh, I, you know, I guess this isn't like Ontario or whatever, but it's pretty nice. Nothing wrong with this. Yep. And that's the strongest defense you'll ever get from me of, like, Gary Bettman's expansion plan. But it's not, it's not that bad, folks. You got to get over it. Yep. What's your pick?

I think I got to go Vegas in six. That's going to be my official number. Yeah. I picked Vegas in five, actually, just because I'm being a contrarian dink. But since you said Vegas and six, let me go with Florida in seven. There's your little peek behind the scenes at how the prediction game works, baby. Yeah, you just got to. Fight me on enough radio shows and podcasts, and I will cover every possible base.

That's right. Literally just every single outcome. I'm like in a Florida sweepier. Yep. Do you hang up? You're like, did I say that? Uh-oh. It's going to be a good series, though.

I am looking forward to it. Anyhow. Yeah, no, this is two just fun teams, two teams that kind of seem to be willing. Was it Bruce Cassidy? Did you see his quote about how things went in game five for them? No.

He was like, oh, you can't, we turned it over 25 times. Like, I think they got credited for 25 giveaways. He's like, we turned it over 25 times.

You can't give it away 25 times against the coyotes. Yeah. And then he kind of caught himself. Yeah, he's like, no disrespect, though. Yeah. But, yeah.

That's cool to me. Thank you for things. Just sitting there like, dude. We almost made it through a whole week without somebody, without something bad happening. Yep.

That's right. But yeah, just two teams, they'll say fun stuff out there. You know, get things a little spicy for the, for media day and all this. Yeah.

I like it. I'm in favor. but, you know, obviously there's a lot of wait and see here. And we'll be waiting until July. 85 hours from now, I think it is. And honestly, that is not that far off. But anyway, yeah, why don't we take a break and we'll come back and we'll talk about all the coach and GM changes that are happening this week. And, yeah, stay tuned.

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All right, a few last bits of information here. As of a, I don't know, like half an hour before we hit record, I want to say. The Predators made it official. John Hines out, Andrew Brunette in as head coach. Did you know that Andrew Burnett scored the first goal in Predators' franchise history? I got to tell you, I didn't until someone said, it 58 times in the last 24 hours. Yep.

But yeah, cool. I mainly remember him from his Minnesota Wild Days, obviously. But yeah, no, classic situation. They're bringing a guy back. This is a guy obviously the new GM, Barry Trots coached, and a guy who had a bit of success. He had one season there. It's not like they're bringing back it below.

former. Yeah, this isn't David Legwond, right? Yeah. Well, that's... Is he beloved? I don't know. You feel like he probably is? He probably.

I feel like David Legwant probably works for the predators already. But it's interesting in a couple ways. It's interesting from the New Jersey perspective, right? Because when they hired him last year, a lot of us went, ah, okay, there's the Lindy Ruff replacement. And even as the season was going well and it became apparent that Linda Ruff was not getting fired, it was sort of a question of, is there still going to be a succession plan here?

Right. Obviously not. And, you know, the Lindy Ruff wanted to keep coaching. And so, you know, there was kind of a deal in place that if the job doesn't open up,

we'll let you go look somewhere else. And they did. What was interesting to me about this is the Barry Trott's comment about Brunet being like an offensive style coach, which you almost need. never, ever hear these days. Like, there is, I've made this point before, but, like, in the NFL coaching carousel, there is always this talk of this guy's an offensive guy, this guy's a defensive

guy. And you never hear that in the NHL because everyone's a defensive guy. So, you know, the fact that, you know, to the extent that Andrew Burnett being an offensive guy means that, like, he traps 98% of the time instead of 100. But it's still, it's interesting to hear, especially hear Barry Trott say that, a guy that was notoriously viewed as he's probably sitting there going, I got the defense part of it. Yeah, I'll take care of that personally. I mean, that was it. But it was, it's,

I think it's good hire for Nashville. I guess the other piece of this is we didn't know Nashville had an opening until a couple of days ago. They let John Hines in hindsight, I guess, twist in the wind for a while. now, does he drop in on any of the openings out there now?

I don't know. But clearly they were waiting to see if this was a case of we're okay with the guy we have, but if something better comes along, we will make a move. And they felt that something better did come along. So apparently, from what I've seen and listened to the last few days, because there was a perception that, like you said, They were just letting Heinz kind of dangle out there and weren't really giving them. But apparently that wasn't the case.

They were apparently pretty upfront with what you just said. Like, we like you, but like, you know, is there someone better out there? Maybe. Sorry about that. Which, like, maybe that's not how I'd want to run my business, but, you know, I don't want to run a business. So what do I know? And also, I should say, I've said it on the podcast, of times before, I'm sure. I'm not a John

Heinz guy. I don't think he's getting much out of the teams that he has coached, you know? So, like, Brunette, a guy I made this illusion earlier, I guess, in the playoffs.

But, like, it's interesting to me that the devil sucked, you know? And then they got him to be on the, behind the bench, and suddenly they were insanely fucking good. And I just wonder how much of that was him and how much of that was, you know,

Jack Hughes coming of age and just kind of having a goalie get hot and, you know, all this stuff that you would kind of say went right for the devils this year. Yeah. How much of that was him? I think it's mostly that other stuff, but he certainly, I mean, his last two stops. And obviously the fact that Florida is going on this run. without him diminishes that a little bit, but pretty good success the last couple years. So we'll see, see if you can keep it going in Nashville.

Yeah, and the other thing to say. But not a terrible one to go in. I mean, got a goal. I was just, I was just about to say that. It is a tough job. It kind of depends on what they want to do. Like, will this be a rebuild or rebuild on the fly, I should say, or retool. if you want to put it that way,

or are they kind of going to stay the course with this group? Like, they could go in a few different directions here, and I don't know that it's necessarily a bad decision to just stick with what they have going for them right now, except that it puts a lot of pressure on Yossi Sarros to be like a world-beat and goalie every season, and I don't know how sustainable that is.

Sure. with that having been said, you know, they did start making some moves that could rejigger the roster a little bit and move things around. They got out from under an onerous deal or two, and they don't have a lot of money committed after next season. So, you know, they have more flexibility than I think a lot of people might expect. But also, boy, the top end of that lineup is expensive and not. good.

So it could go either way. But I'm very interested to see this for sure. This could be really interesting in, again, maybe a not great central next season. We'll see. But to your point earlier, apparently the Rangers were honing in on Peter Laviolet. go by the capitals. But now Heinz being on the market, they were like, let's think about this. And do you know why that is? I'm struggling to figure it out, so I would love some sort of

They say it's all about who you know, Sean, and who Chris Drury knows from college, they were teammates in college, is John Heinz. Well, there you go. That's clearly the most important is to know, because I mean, I certainly know, as I think back to the dudes I hung out with in college, I feel like I could make pretty smart hiring decisions around them 25 to 30 years later. Well, you say that. Which would be not hiring any of them ever for anything. You say that. How many of your college buddies do you do a podcast with?

It's a fair point. It's fair point. Just putting it out there. Just saying. You know what? Okay. Good, good point. So maybe this is the one guy where Chris Drury is allowed to hire.

Yeah. Possibly just to be a podcast co-host, but, you know, Coach is, NHL coach isn't a bad fallback position, I guess. Yeah. So, yeah, I guess we'll see on the- The Peter Labielent thing has not, like, because he's been available all along. Yeah. And I think, I think maybe it was Larry Brooks, like, said a couple days ago,

Like if Lavalette's your guy and you feel good about it, what's the holdup? And it certainly suggests that the holdup is that they don't actually feel that good about it. Or they were waiting to see on Heinz. If you're waiting to see on John Hines, then Peter Lavilette is not your guy at all. Well, here's the thing. I think neither of them is a particularly good choice. Like, who your guy should be should be neither of those guys if you're waiting on either of them, right? If you're like, man, we just really need a John Hines to shake loose.

Like, I think neither of those guys should be the guy you hire. Obviously, they're going to hire one of them in all likelihood. Yeah. And like Lavilat's been around forever. He's had success just about everywhere. Yeah. He's a good coach. But, again, like, it could have hired him weeks ago at this point.

Yeah. It's true. It's really true. but you got to hire somebody at some point, right? Like, you can't, you can't, like, with all your pending free agents and stuff like that, you can't be like, yeah, we're just waiting to see. Wait, so are you saying it's a bad idea to fire somebody and only then realize that there's nobody better available out there?

Huh, well, that's interesting. You know what, why not? Let's get to that now. It comes out this morning after probably a week plus of, of people being like, well, this is obviously going to fucking happen. The Leafs are about to hire Bradtree Living to be their GM.

Yeah. It's a pretty underwhelming choice, let's just say. It feels like the safe choice. It feels like the one that, you know, is sort of top of mind everywhere. And God knows, I've certainly come out of this impressed with Brad

True Living's media management skills because holy smokes did he rocket to the top of every list awfully quick. But... Well, with the track record like that, all that postseason success, how can you not be lining up around the fucking block? All the things, and by now everyone has seen the point made dozens of times, I'm sure that you look at, you know, you fire Kyle Dubas.

Theoretically, over the playoff track record, True Living doesn't have a great playoff track record. One playoff round win in nine seasons, I think was the number. I think it's two wins in nine years. So you fire the guy who's got one win in five and never made it out of the second round, and you get a guy who two and nine never made out of the second round. You've got the Austin Matthews situation coming up, the franchise player who needs a new deal.

Worked out great for True Living last time that happened. for living had the Johnny Goodrow situation, lost him for nothing. You have the situation where a lot of people say you've got to trade a Marner or Nealander. You bring in the guy who had to trade a star young winger last year. And at the time, everybody thought he did fantastic, but, you know, that star is now about to potentially win a Conn Smyth. And, you know, I think you look back on the trade itself was probably an A plus trade under the circumstances, but the, A, the fact that the circumstances became what they did, and B, the fact that he then threw massive contracts that the guys he got makes it look not great. Yeah. So, I mean, I don't hate the hire, but it's, it's. underwhelming, let's just see you.

And, you know, I had sort of... You kind of have to be underwhelmed. I had sort of suggested that, you know, when you looked at both the track record of the Leafs and of Maple Leaf Sports and Entertainment, I had sort of hinted that, you know, something unexpected could come out here. This is for all, as much as people roll their eyes at the idea that, you know, the Leafs are some sort of dream job or whatever, that, hey, there were, you know, could they pull a rabbit out of the hat?

as they have done in the past on various hires. Nope, no rabbit. Just a recycled GM who did a reasonably good job, mostly, at his last place. We'll probably do a reasonably good job in Toronto. Doesn't feel like they got creative. Doesn't feel like they went outside the comfort zone. And we should say, according to Elliot Friedman, the press conference for this is tomorrow.

so let's wait and see because you never know, right? I mean, Brandon Chanhan might hear something at that press conference that makes him change his entire strategy. Yeah. It's funny. When it started coming out like, oh, it looks like this is actually going to happen,

a couple of people retweeted an old, a tweet I had from 2019 that guys, as of like summer 2019, guys that he had a, and then bought out, accounted for 10% of all NHL buyouts over the previous four summers. Okay. Yep.

From 2016 to 2019. You know, if you're looking for good news, I don't know that he's the guy you want managing a tight cap, which the leaves have, but he's maybe a guy you want not having a lot of cap space going into free agency. Well, so it's funny because like some of these deals, it's like, okay, who cares? Like you're buying out Lance Boma, whatever, you know? But Troy Brower, that's a classic, oh, he's like the fourth best free agent on the market. We'll give him $6 million. Not included on the buyout list is James Neal, a guy who he traded and immediately was like, oh, P.U. Get this fucking guy out of here.

And traded for Milan Luchich instead. And obviously we all know how that all worked out. So, yeah, like you say, him not having money to throw around is probably a good thing. But at the same time, some money's probably going to shake out at some point in the next year or three. So who knows? The other thing is also, according to Elliot, that he, I believe the term, well, I actually didn't hear what he said,

but as it's being reported, that he said it was more likely than not that Sheldon Keefe might stay as coach. Wow, okay, that's interesting. Yeah, that apparently, according to him, Shanahan had told GMs, told potential GMs that he liked Keith as a coach and would like to see him stay,

but that it would be up to the GM. and shockingly enough none of those GMs went you idiot that's a terrible take you definitely should change coaches they all went yeah you're right guy who's hiring for this job so yeah crazy you boy in a million years you know night the least get eliminated from from the second round guy comes to you in a time machine he's like I'm from three weeks in a future, he takes off all the silver, like, jump suit he's wearing and all that. He's like, I'm from three weeks in the future, whatever it's been. Kyle Dubas out, Sheldon keeps staying. Yeah. You would have been like... God, imagine...

You just spray painted that jumpsuit at Home Depot. This is a fake time machine. Yeah. Go back like a week before that, you know, and the Leafs beat the lightning. And you're like, hey, man, I wonder what the future will look like in a month. Are we in the Stanley Cup final? Well, no. But, oh, well.

Oh, I guess we should talk about the Leafs assistant coach getting hired in Washington. Yes, that was next on my list here. Spencer Carberry, to the capitals. Sean, I don't know anything about this guy. Yeah, neither do I. We barely heard this guy's name until the offseason. And apparently he was interviewing all over the place. He was the guy who, his thing in Toronto was the power play.

Yeah. Among other things, obviously. but he was the guy who got credit for a power play that was very, very good. I think second only to Edmonton. And Edmonton had the best power play probably ever. Yeah. So, fair enough. Not really fair to compare it.

Among actual hockey teams made up of human beings, the Leafs had the best power play. So, yeah, full credit to him. A weird situation that a team's assistant coach is interviewing all over the place. And meanwhile, well, I guess we all thought Sheldon Keith would be gone. And you would think the Leafs would maybe want to talk to their own guy, but I guess not. Or we'll see. But, you know, good young hire. Roll the dice.

Take a shot at him. Sure. Makes, you know, I certainly don't hate it for Washington. And I should point out that the last time a Leaf Assistant got hired and I was like, I don't really get it. It was Dave Haxstow in Seattle. That worked out okay. Sure, yeah. It's really cool how everyone that works for the Leafs is considered an idiot right up until they're available to be hired somewhere, and then they're like the top candidate for every job.

Yeah. The Dunst cap comes off. The graduation cap comes on. This guy is one of the smartest people we've ever seen. What do they call that? A mortar board? Yes. That is.

That is what they call. Pretty good. And then, hey, one last Leafs-related thing, I guess. fucking God, I love talking about the Leafs. It's the best. Fun, right? Yeah, it's so cool. Kyle Dubas to Pitt, that could be, Pittsburgh,

that could be made available or official later today, tomorrow, something like that, or you could hear, oh, that's not happening. Yeah, it's weird. Seems like a real shitter get off the pot kind of a situation. I keep seeing, like, tweets come by on my timeline that make reference to, like, Dubas and the Penguins, and then I got to, like, scroll back and be like, oh, did I miss it? Did it happen?

And then it hasn't happened. And all of them are like, now, as we know. And it's like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, what? As we know, he's thinking about it. I didn't know about this. And they're like, oh, yeah, sure. This, it's, I guess the other bit of news that we should talk about that is kind of related to this is the senator's ownership apparently being in limbo or something worked. Like a lot of people are making, and I have no insight information on this, but a

A lot of people are like making vague references to something weird happening or, you know, some sort of drama going on in the background. But there has been a thought that Kyle Dubas is maybe holding out for the Ottawa job looking at a situation where, first of all, that was the team he watched growing up, which people put way too much stock into when you're talking about stuff like this. But maybe it matters a little bit to him. But also to think he can go in with new ownership, new mandate, good. young team,

a bunch of guys signed on cheap deals, which is, I'm sure, will be interesting to him. But if that's, is it related at all? Is it a case where he's kind of like, hey, man,

I can't wait around forever while other jobs get snapped up. And so he takes Pittsburgh, or does he say no to Pittsburgh? And if so, you would assume maybe Ottawa. I'm sure Pierradorian's watching that pretty closely. Yeah,

no kidding. I'll say this, if he takes the Pittsburgh job, that is a tough one to get out of what, you know, all the little binds they're in. You know, like he'd be taking on a real challenge because you got to, you got to stay competitive while Sidney Crosby is staying and playing and all this kind of stuff. So you're sort of handcuffed to, hey, I've got three expensive. ish stars. You've got to build around them. But that said, you've also got ownership with nice deep pockets. It's established, you know, there's certainly a lot worse jobs out there.

Absolutely. And the bar has not exactly been set super high. So I'm sure that fan base would be, at least early on, would be pretty welcoming. Yeah, for sure. for sure. It'll really be interesting to see how all that shakes out just because this is one of those things. It would change the landscape of the Eastern Conference kind of dramatically, in my opinion,

to have the Sends maybe lose out on a candidate they otherwise might not have gotten to look at versus, you know, the penguins. I will tell you right now, just as a Leafs fan, oh, I got my fingers crossed for the penguins and do it. I don't want to see him in Ottawa, man. That's, yeah. I do not need to see that team make that upgrade in the front office. And, you know, like Pittsburgh going kind of from the outhouse to the penthouse, as they say, where maybe maybe not the penthouse given Kyle Dubes hasn't had a ton of postseason success. But the outhouse to like the ninth floor, maybe, you know, that's solid. You take that.

But, yeah, I guess we'll wait and see. And, God, by the time people are listening to this, all of these hires might have been made official. Who knows? But we'll find out. Let's move on, finally, to Sean. My nice friend, Sean, has texted me late last night, like 9 o'clock last night.

I have a quiz for this episode. And it's not a particularly creative. of one, but it's one that it's very straightforward. It combines two of my very favorite things. The first of which is the best thing for any podcast, which is remembering some guys.

We love that, don't we folks? And the other thing is I'm going to steal your game that you stole from the NBA, one of our favorite games to play, which is who he play for. we're going to play a little game that I call

who he work for. Okay. I am going to give you just some familiar names from the hockey world, and I want you to tell me of these two remaining teams, so just Florida and Vegas, who he worked for. These are all guys who might be about to get Stanley Cup rings.

And you will get a point if you pick the right team, and you will get bonus points if you can tell me what this person does. Got it. All right. So let's start off easy, I would assume. Roberto Luongo. Florida Panthers, obviously.

Florida Panthers, yes. You know what he does? He's got some insane job title, like chief officer of goaltending excellence or something like that. He is a senior advisor to the GM, but also heads up their goaltending excellence group. So good, good for him. Speaking of, of goalies, what about Sean Burke?

Remember him? He was like the goalie whisperer going around. He was with Montreal, I think. I believe he's with Vegas. Yes, he is with Vegas. And do you know what he does in Vegas? Is he just the goaltending coach? He's the goalie coach.

Yeah. I'm kicking ass so far. He's due already. This quiz too easy. Yeah. How about this one? This is a former player, but also a former head coach, and a guy who used to show up in like every head coaching vacancy. You always heard about him.

And that's kind of stopped. But John Stevens, who he worked for? Worked for L.A. for a long time. I'm going to say Seattle, Florida. I'm going to say Florida. That's incorrect. John Stevens is an assistant coach for the Golden Knights. Wow.

There you go. This one is, this one is, my. Probably my favorite of the whole group. And if anybody read my call on this morning, they've already seen this, but I know you don't read. Sean Thornton, beloved tough guy former. Oh, I know he works for Florida. Okay. Does work for Florida.

Did, in fact, finished his career with the Florida Panthers. Do you know what he does for that team? Oh, he's like a community organizing kind of a guy, I think. Do you know what he does? No. He is the Florida Panthers Chief Revenue Officer. What?

No disrespect to any of the other guys on this list. But that's a real job. Yes. That's like a that's a C-suite job. To the point where when I saw his name listed, I was like, oh, it's a different Sean Thornton. Sure, of course. But then you go to their pay and like he's there

with like his mushed up face and everything. in a suit and tie. He's their chief revenue officer. Hell yeah, Sean Thornton. Until last season, from 2018 to the end of last season, he was apparently their senior VP

of hockey operations. Okay. Says here on elite prospects. What a website. Chief. Get off elite prospects. That's cheating. You're not allowed. I just pulled it up because I was like,

what was the, I knew he worked for their front office. So I was like, how did he ascend the corporate ladder like this? And the other thing I wanted to see is, does this chief revenue officer for a company worth like hundreds of millions of dollars, does this man have a college education? Yeah. But of course, he played for the Peterborough Peets. It's, and look, we can all make our jokes about being the revenue officer for the Florida

Panthers, but this is, like, he's even on the website, like, he's listed with like the real management guys. I thought that was cool. Oh, by the way, I looked it up earlier. David Legwin, you know what he does now? He doesn't work for the Predators. He owns the Sarnia sting. Okay. All right. Hey, speaking of real jobs. Yeah, good for him. All right, a couple more for you. This is a familiar name who could be about to get a Stanley Cup ring. Craig Cunningham. You remember him? He was the... Yeah, you're overstating things when you say he has a familiar your name. I don't really know who that guy. Well, here, here's why he may be familiar because he was

the coyote's prospect slash A. Scheller who had like a cardiac emergency. That, okay, sure. A. A few years ago. And, uh, and, uh, and actually, uh, not only very nearly died on the ice and in hospital afterwards, but I believe even had a leg amputated as a result of all that. Oh boy. He is now potentially on the verge of, uh, of getting a Stanley Cup ring. Very nice story. Do you know who he work for? who he work for, who he work for. I guess I'm going to say he stayed in the desert, he went to Vegas. He is.

He's a pro scout for the Vegas. Okay, great. So that's pretty cool. I'll give you a couple more here. Longtime NHL defenseman Brian McCabe, who he worked for. He works for the Panthers. He played for the Panthers, so I'm assuming he works there now too, yeah. Always a good assumption.

Do you know what he does? Is he an assistant? coach too? He's not. No, he's front office. All right. He's their director of player personnel. All right, great. Sure. That's kind of cool. A few more here. Well, this

one's just fun. Wildly successful former NHLGM, Paul Fenton, the Minnesota Wilds. One year, right? Wasn't he one and done? No, I don't think it was one and done. I think it was a couple beyond, at least, at least two maybe.

I don't know. I don't remember now. It's pretty quick, though. Yeah, it sure was. And went out pretty dramatically. Who he worked for. Give me Florida. Why not?

Yep. He is a senior advisor to the GM in Florida. He's like, okay, rule number one, don't go to a Super Bowl parade. Yep. That's going to get you in trouble, brother. Rule number two, you're going to look for, you're going to look for lizard-like. actually given the number of lizards that are crawling around Florida, maybe that's...

I was going to say he's just out on the side of the highway that runs through the Everglades. Like, look at this one. Whoa. And finally, let's go. I got a bunch here, but let's just do one last one. Because I'm guessing you could probably figure out who Gregory Campbell works for. Yeah, Florida.

He's their HLGM, by the way. But how about a guy who made me change my Twitter avatar Not that long ago. Longtime NHL defenseman, Sylvan Lefeb, maybe better remembered because was it Columbus? He was coaching in Columbus, and he got fired because he wouldn't get vaccinated in the COVID season.

He's back. Who he worked for? I'm going to say he also worked for Florida. Florida's got a ton of these guys. He's the associate. I just heard not vaccinated, and I was like, I have a guess. Yeah, you know what? Good, good call.

Yeah, Sylvan. The Florida Panthers have got a ton of guys. Their director of amateur scouting is Shane Cherla. Wow, look at that. The long-time tough guy. There's a whole log list. Anyways, that's my game. That's a fun one.

Now we know. That's your game. That's my quiz game. What about your plugs? Read me at the athletic. There it is. I have a bunch of stuff. I have my Stanley Cup final rooting guide

where I go in and tell all 30 fan bases which team they should cheer for. And if you disagree, it's too bad. This is mandatory. If you're like, I don't...

Vegas should cheer for Florida? Is that right? Yep, that's right. Yeah, if I say like the, what you think is wrong, you need to find me on Twitter and be like, I don't like that team. And then I'll go and adjust the article

because it's, This is a very serious entertain. Yeah, I really need to know. Yeah, and I'll be on with Mendez tomorrow for the podcast. And my guess is he will know something about whatever is or isn't going on with this senator's ownership thing and Caldubis. Maybe depending on timing, we might even get to react in real time to the Brad Trilliving press conference. What a world that would be.

And then for me, Eprinkside.com, use the code I Love EP when you sign up for an annual subscription. They will give you three extra months for free. And now's the time because draft guide out next week. Locked in. See you there. Next week. Hundreds and hundreds of pages detailing more prospects than you could ever fit in your head. The people who do this stuff for us are geniuses.

I don't know how they keep all this. straight. I don't like, I'll give you an example. Someone, uh, someone, uh, someone published a photo, uh, the other day on a story and it was like the wrong guy. And it's just, you know, some random guy who plays for like, whatever. I don't even know what, just some random Canadian junior team. And like three people were like, I think that's the wrong guy. I think that's the wrong player. Like they can identify on site whether a player is the right player for some random junior team. Really, uh, really cool stuff. So, yeah, these guys are locked in and they will give you all the good information you need.

Again, use the code I Love EP, and you'll get 15 months for the price of 12. And then Patreon.com slash pox soup. You can hear all the bonus episodes. Me and Sean are about to do a mailbag over there. Yesterday we recorded a very scientific breakdown. Would you say so, Sean? Really in depth. Extremely, almost disturbingly scientific.

Mm-hmm. of exactly how fake every Stanley Cup from 1983 to present was and how much those fake cups were ultimately worth. And let's just say a little guy named Gorp Grinchminsky was not too pleased with me about one certain Stanley Cup rating. Let's put it, fakeness rating, I should say. So yeah, you can check all that out and stick to the same. sports and everything else we do over there, all the bonus episodes.

It's all in there. So patreon.com slash puck soup. Thank you for listening. Enjoy the Stanley Cup final a week or two from now. And we'll talk to you next week. Bye bye. Bye bye. Sticks and hits and goals and saves and slapshots and goons.

We've got sportly commentary to what if you commute. But we also cover movies, TV shows. and tunes. It's your weekly bowl of hockey and nonsense. Park Sue.