Puck Soup - Making Changes

Episode Date: December 10, 2021

Sticks and hits and goals and saves and slap shots and goons. We've got sportly commentary to what if you commute. We also cover movies, TV shows, it's in tunes. It's your weekly bowl of hockey and nonsense. Puck soup. Hey, I'm Ryan Lambert from EP Rinkside, and it's a new era of Puck Soup, I guess. Yeah, now say who you are. I'm Sean McIndoo from The Athletic.

We did it. And that's it. Yeah, okay. Show's over. Have a good night, everybody. No, wait a second. It says here we have to talk about hockey. Oh.

So even the boss isn't here. Do we really have to? Well, yeah. We should probably, before we start, we should probably explain for anyone who missed the last week's. That's a good point. What's happening here? Yeah, the explanation is he was

Yeah, the explanation is ESPN doesn't let Greg do podcast anymore. That's it. There's nothing else to really say about it. I think that's as succinct as it gets. Yeah, so we soldier on and then Greg is doing a bunch of non-hockey podcasting over on our Patreon. That's right. So if you're not in the loop, we won't roll through all the details again, but check out the, there should be in your feed a special shorter episode from last week that you may be skipped over.

That will explain it to you. And if you heard that episode, then you're already caught up and you're waiting for us to start talking about whatever happened in the NHL this week. which is why we're starting by talking about what happened on AEW Dynamite this Wednesday. Oh, right. Yeah. Just in case you were worried that the absence of Greg was going to result in this not secretly being a wrestling podcast. That's right. So, I mean, this is sort of a backdoorway to talk about how bad the New York Islanders are. But let's put it this way. Both CM Punk and AEW tag team, The Acclaimed, came out and did like a heel stick by saying the Islanders stink. That's right. Because they were in the new arena.

They were in the UBS arena. And that's, I mean, it's as old as time, right? When you're a wrestler and you want to get the crowd against you, you come out and say that the local sports team sucks. But in this case, the local sports team does suck. and that made it probably a slightly less effective tactic. You know, normally you see a wrestler comes out and he's like, you know, the Green Bay Packers stink and the crowd starts booing. They're 11 and 2 at that point.

But at this point, he's like, you know, the Islanders haven't won in this building and there's like murmurs in the crowd. And they're like, yeah, he's got us. My favorite part of the whole thing, though, was like halfway through. He just goes, and, you know, for the many of the many, of you who weren't wrestling fans. Seampunk is a well-known wrestler, and he's considered to be one of the best talkers. So he knows what he's doing in there, and he just halfway through, he goes, yeah, the only

game you guys have won is against the Senators. And that's like me beating. And then I don't know who he said, because I don't watch this show, but I'm assuming the name of the guy he said was someone who's not very good. And it was just like this random drive-by shot at the Ottawa Senators, which I don't know why that made me laugh so much, but somebody in response to that sent me like the picture of the guy with the hat from the courtroom sketch and I think you should leave, which I think that that captures the vibe, you know, there's, you're just, you know, Drake Batherson's just sitting at home watching

AEW and all of a sudden he just randomly run down. The thing about that, though, again, for those who don't know is C.M. Punk is from Chicago, Big Blackhawks guy. Mm-hmm. And that really felt like, oh, I guess you do think you have a leg to stand on. All right. That's interesting. Okay.

CM. But yeah. And then, like I said, the acclaimed came out and said something. Like, their gimmick is that I think they are bad at rapping, you know? Okay. And they're like, listen, listen, you know, something, something. Take more L than the Islanders. and the crowd booed.

But again, that's just like kind of what you're supposed to do. So, yeah, that was anytime wrestling comes up, CM Punk often wears, like, wrestling shirts, or sometimes wears wrestling shirts. But he just as often... He's like a legit hockey fan. He is... Big time, yeah. Arguably, I'd have to think about this,

but I think arguably he might be the most famous person that's ever, like, retweeted one of my random hockey. jokes. That's right. So it's, yeah, good old, see, I'm always trying to get the younger talent over. That's right. He's like, oh, this joke about the 1994 New York Rangers really appeals to me. Exactly. But yeah, the Islanders stink. It's interesting because they did just go on a little run where they at least got four, or they got whatever, like seven points out of four games or something like that? Is that how that, no, five points out of four games, which is better than they'd been doing. Yeah. Which, which is to say they still lost three of those games, but they

got to overtime. And then this is, this is where we point out that those opponents were San Jose, the Detroit Red Wings, Chicago, Ottawa. Yep. Not good. And then back to losing in regulation to Nashville. And if I'm, I actually didn't watch this game last night, but it was like a, they blew it in the third period, right? I think so. I think they were up with seven left or whatever. Yeah, so you couldn't, you couldn't pay me to watch an Islanders Predators game this season. No. In fact, my company has tried. Yeah, I was going to say, the Patreon members have, may feel differently, but yeah, it's good to you. Yeah. We've got an interesting question on the mailbag about, like, what do they do? Because, you know, they're, yeah. I feel,

mile out of the playoffs at this point. CM Punk gave them, that was a service. It was like a chance. I feel like those are not the loudest booze that we're going to hear in that arena potentially this year. It might be a warm up. So, yeah. But yeah.

Speaking of teams that are kind of going through it right now, since we last spoke to you because I was traveling last week and early this week, we didn't talk about any of the stuff with the Canucks, obviously. and we didn't talk about the flyers firing Elaine Vino. Let's start with the Canucks. They're a little more interesting, I guess. What do you think of Bruce Boudreau getting hired? I guess my first thought would be I'm really happy for Bruce Boudreau.

I think that was everybody's first thought. Yeah. He just seems like a good dude. I have no idea if he is or not, but he just kind of has that like jolly energy. And he was a guy that, like, I think he's a, has been a really good coach throughout his career. And, I mean, I remember having this argument, even, even on this show about his, his playoff record or his game seven record and whether that reflected on him as much as it seemed to in terms of his reputation. And I thought he was a really good coach. I thought he got a bad

rap in a few of the places that he, that he had been. And I was hoping to see him get another chance. And then when he, you know, when he left Minnesota and didn't pick up a new job anytime soon, you started to wonder if like this, this is it. I mean, as much as we talk about the NHL recycling the same guys, at some point they do move on from some guys. And Bruce Brudrow is not exactly a young man anymore. And you kind of thought maybe the opportunity isn't going to be there. And then this one came along. clearly part of this was that he took the short-term

contract where you know he's he's not the interim coach but he almost kind of is because he's only got one year after this and if they a new GM came in and decided they wanted somebody else they could do it reasonably

cheaply but well that's the other thing is I think it was Emily Kaplan reported that this is only a this is only like a a a one year deal with an option for next year. Oh, wow. Okay. Who's option? That I didn't say. Because if it's the team option, then that's not a two-year contract. Yeah. I mean, I, and look, it makes sense.

If you're a guy like, like Boudreau, you probably feel like you've got to take anything that'll get you behind a bench. Yeah, absolutely. So I see why he did that. But, you know, I guess there was, it sounds like they talked contract with Claude Julian but he wouldn't go short on the con he wanted at least three years so you know that that's great now the bigger question is is that the right hire is this the guy who who's really going to turn the team around and short term the results have been good but we see that a lot

with new hires and it doesn't necessarily mean anything for the long term. I don't know. I feel like... I think so. I definitely think so. Yeah, I mean, look, what's the problem with the Canucks this year is they're not getting enough out of their best players?

And I think, you know, look at, look at Boudreau's history everywhere he goes, right? Like, scoring goals isn't the problem, you know? And I guess my point is that, like, you know, you. You know, you can't rely on the guys the Canucks have on the blue line to be good defensemen. Like, that's just not what they're going to do based on their talent level and their track records and all that kind of stuff. So, you know, if you need to start winning four, three games, I feel like, you know, that's kind of Bruce Boudreux's whole deal. like at a bare minimum and then, you know, they're going to control the play and that sort of thing. Again, that's just kind of their track record.

And do I think the Canucks are good? No. Do I think they're going to make the playoffs? No. But if you're trying to get the most out of your guys, I don't, I can't think of too many coaches better than Boudreau, right? Yeah. And, you know, he's considered a player's coach. And I guess the other thing to say here is, like, I think Travis Green is a good coach, but it had become very clear that they were going to make a change to the point that.

And they needed to. And they needed. Yeah. Sometimes, you know, you still need to move on from even good coaches. And that's just the reality of sports. And especially once you start seeing reports in the media about they're talking to this coach or that coach, you know, better to make them more. move down. The one thing that was strange about it was the fact that they fired the coach and the GM and then hired the new coach before a new GM, which maybe links into why Brudrow's contract

is a short one. But that's strange. You know, a lot of people noted that that's kind of being done out of order. One wonders then if this is them doing the Carolina thing where basically all front office decisions are now made by committee, you know? Yeah. Or by the owner, which is what scares you if you're a Vancouver fan because they're not, you know, there are very few owners in all of pro sports that you want having any sort of hands-on thing, and I don't think this is one of them.

Right. Yeah, no, I obviously agree with that. You know, Aqualini's situation has not been good. And, like, a lot of, you know, what we heard was, you know, they were actually pretty convinced that the team was going to be good this year and blah, blah, blah. And in the past, you know, GMs have been fired for saying, well, I'm not going to do the thing. The owner just asked me to do. That would be an insane thing to do.

You know, so you always do. do wonder how much autonomy anybody they bring in to be the GM is going to have, especially because, and this is the other thing with them, they just brought in Jim Rutherford to be like, what is it, president of hockey office or something along those lines. Interim GM. Interim GM. Which, you know, if you're going to have somebody oversee a fire sale, I think that's fine. I don't know that Jim Rutherford is going to get conned or anything.

you know, whereas, you know, I feel like Jim Benning definitely would have. With that having been said, you know, again, like whoever they bring in is just going to be like,

oh, yeah, I'm like, how much autonomy do I really have? Yeah. And it's, you know, I like Jim Rutherford,

partly because he's one of those old school GMs, who still makes a lot of trades and it which is always interesting from the outside but i mean he's he's old school and the emphasis is not on the school in that sentence so there's right you know it's i could see looking at this going all right here's this organization we need new blood we need new ideas what do we got let's bring in a coach with a thousand games and a GM who's in his 70s and it's just kind of like, here we go. This is classic 200 hockey men stuff and, you know, what have you.

But what I like about bringing in Rutherford is two things. First of all, he's got enough of a reputation that if you need somebody to push back on an owner, he's a guy who can do it. You know, a guy with two cup rings on his hand with, you know, GM of the year and he's all this stuff who can just say, you know, I'll walk. You know, I don't need this. you know that's that you know his reputation is solid and then it it opens the door to them much like in Montreal potentially with Jeff Gordon to to bring in somebody younger you know somebody who is a set of fresh eyes and have them not learn on the job but do the job with some protection from above where they're not you know they're not the top of the org chart um as far as

answering for whatever moves they make. So that's one way it could go. Obviously, they could bring in somebody else, recycle a name. Jim Rutherford, I mean, the talk about how, you know, all the options are on the table leads me to believe that it's not completely out of the question. Jim might just say, you know who I've hired as GM is Jim Rutherford? Well, so I saw yesterday, and I don't remember where I saw this, so I apologize. I might have been. But like, I don't follow anybody who would just make shit up. So, you know, it was basically a thing of like he's going to look to hire a younger GM to mentor and that kind of thing

and that to me I was like hey wasn't that the freaking idea in Pittsburgh and then he stayed there for like six seven years is that do I remember that correctly I and so yeah I guess that's the point of concern you might have

is like you said he might just decide you know it was perfect for this job actually I know just the man his name is Jim Rutherford and yeah. I don't know. Like I think I think, you know, now when they hired him in Pittsburgh and he was the old man then, like, again, seven, eight years of past since then, right?

So that maybe gives you a little more hope that he'll actually bring in someone to do the more day-to-day stuff and he's the ideas man or whatever. And again, like if you end up just sitting around a table with a, with a hockey ops department and making decisions that way rather than like, I'm Jim Rutherford and this is what I think we should do. I don't think that's the worst thing in the world. But, yeah, you know,

it'll be interesting to see what they do. And I get the feeling that they're not going to, whatever. I don't think they're going to, like, make this decision tomorrow. I think they're going to make this decision. Yeah. They've bought some time now.

Maybe you have a trade deadline. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, and you know what? Great job by Stan Smil in the four days that he was interim GM. He did do the thing where they were like, so could you make a trade if you wanted to? And he was like, yeah, why not? Very funny to me.

Anytime that happens where it's like you're clearly just a seat warmer because I guess an NHL team can't go without an even interim GM for one day. Do you think other GMs like call him up when they hear that? Do you think anyone's like, hey, Stan, am I got a deal for you? Yeah. Elias Patterson for, I still remember, like, I, this, the, when the Leafs, like, a week before they hired Brian Burke, when everybody knew they were hired, like, for months, everyone was like, yeah, Brian Burke's coming to Toronto. And like a week before an interim GM, Cliff Fletcher traded Carlo Colovacchio and Alex Steen for, Jesus, I can't even, I'm drawing to play. I think that was the Lee Stempenyack.

Yes, that was it for Lee Stempenyak. Like two young former first round picks. For a guy who had shot like 18% the year before, yeah. And who was just, and, you know, Steen ended up being a real good, you know, middle six player for the blues for a long time. And then like three days later, they're like, yeah, Burke's here. And it was like, did we have to make that trade last week? Right. Because maybe that happens again.

But yeah, I don't, I mean, look, the Canucks, it can't be any worse than it has been. So it's not Jim Benning anymore. That's an upgrade. Big W. Yeah. So I guess the question is, you know, like, are they in better shape now than the flyers are? because I look at that flyers roster and I go, uh-oh, this is a similarly dire situation,

but with the added thing of like, they don't have anybody on the roster who's sealing is Quinn Hughes and Elias Patterson, right? Like, that's the real issue. Like, the Canucks have guys they can theoretically build around. Do the Flyers? Like, legitimately? I don't know.

I don't, I mean, I guess, Your view on Carter Hart would be part of that. Yeah, that's true. Like, I think long-term I like him more than I like... Demco. Why am I blanking on his name? The Canucks goalie. That's your Demko.

That's your Demko, yeah. But... Yeah, long-term, I like him better than Demco, I guess, just because he's younger and, you know, has a similarly strong pre-NHL track record. But... Yeah, no, the Flyers have a way to... to go. I mean, I, I, at

Proverrov, maybe is the guy that you might say would be... Yeah, and maybe connect me or somebody like that, right? Maybe, yeah. The one thing that the Flyers do have that the Canucks don't, and I'm getting, I'm getting ahead a little bit here, but maybe I, you know,

it's worth thinking ahead. They do have a legitimate star in the last year of his deal in Claudeau. That if you're going to go full rebuild, is that something, like, I mean, the Canucks, you can sit there and go, well, you know, they should tear it down. They should.

But then you look at the, like a lot of teams. They can't, yeah. The cap hit. And you're like, well, where, who are they going to move? Who's somebody going to give them? Whereas Giroux's a guy that the last year of his deal, unrestricted free agent. And still a real good player where, you know, some team somewhere at the deadline when that $8 million cap hit is now no longer all that honorous because you're only paying a fraction. and the flyers can retain and all that stuff.

That could be a really attractive piece. Now, he's got an old movement clause. Who knows whether he'd want to go. Who knows whether, you know, he may even be extended between now and then. It's tough to say. But that's kind of the one move where you're looking at saying, like, they could jumpstart things by making a move like that, whereas the Canucks don't really have that ammo.

Yeah. It's interesting. only so far insofar as this is going to shock people. I think why would they resign Juru, right? Like what would be the upside there? He's got to be in his mid-30s, 33, 34, something like that, and he's not going to be chief, right? So, like, again, like, what would be the point?

You know, if you're looking at this going, well, you know, I kind of think that we're maybe not going to be very good the next few years, especially looking at that defense. Like you said, Provorov's good, ish, maybe, in the right situation. Sanheim's good. Maybe in the right situation. And then everybody else, you're like, yeah, I guess I don't really rate any of the, like Ryan Ellis, I guess, has signed long term as well.

But he can't stay healthy. I still like Sean Couturee, but he's a guy that, like, you are, I always, and I did this just a few minutes ago when you start talking about the Flyers of young pieces. I'm like, oh, well, I mean, Couturier, and then... Oh, he's going to be like 27, 28, right? He's 29. Oh, shit. Yeah. Well, there you go. You know, he's not... And he just signed long term, right? Like, over the summer. Yeah. Am I right about this? Yeah. So...

The one interesting thing that I look at, because as we're talking, I had the cap-friendly page up for Vancouver and Philadelphia. Between those two teams, they have one draft pick in the next three years that isn't their own pick. So, and that is, the Canucks own the Jets third round pick this year from the Nate Schmidt deal. That's it. Vancouver doesn't have anything else. Philadelphia has nothing.

They have not acquired a single extra pick in the next three years. They've traded away a couple of second round picks. So it's... I was just going to say, I would be shocked if they hadn't also been active on the trade front. They do have all their first round picks, both teams. teams, which is good, especially Vancouver because they haven't the last two years. But it's not like, you know, some teams kind of see this coming and start laying a bit of the groundwork, or you'd think even just accidentally you would acquire a couple of picks along

the way. But it's very, it's very rare that you look at a cap-friendly page and go to that draft tracker and you just see nothing but that team's logo 21 times. And that's what we got here with the flyers and almost with the Canucks. So there's work to be done for sure. Yeah, and the other thing again is like in both cases, much like the Islanders, it's like, yeah, they're not making the playoffs this year. Come on. Yeah.

What is it? The Flyers are in a 10 game losing streak right now. Is that right? That does sound right. It hit double digits, yeah. Yep. So lost their 10th a couple nights ago. Yeah, the dog crap.

And they're in Vegas tonight, so that's a good, that's always a good place. No, no problem. But then they've got Arizona tomorrow night. So that would be either, that's your end of the losing streak, or that's your broad-bottom. Yeah. Because that's the other thing about the Flyers is they were like, we had to make all these, we were crap last year, we have to make all these changes to the roster,

make everybody more likable or whatever. We get Jake Voracek out of here, which, you know, fine, that's whatever. They should have done that. And, yeah, they're, they're. they're still this. And, you know, does somebody want Cam Atkinson or something like that? I don't know. Maybe.

But, yeah, they remade their whole blue line. And all of the Smarty Pants' analytics types didn't like what they did. And all of the Watch the Games crew thought it was good. Oh, that's interesting. Yeah, that works out again. Well, I guess what we haven't mentioned with the Flyers is Mike Yao coming in as the... Oh, yeah, Mike Yo, is... Oh, yeah, Mike Yo, yeah.

He stinks. He's the bad coach. Yeah. It's interesting because, again, yeah, he was just like, he's the interim because he was an assistant already. So I don't think they are going to go with Mike Yo as their long. I would really hope for the flyers' sake that they don't go with Mike Yo is their long-term solution because he isn't one, you know. Like he just doesn't it. Let's put it this way.

the St. Louis Blues fired him and then immediately became the best team in the league and won to stand the top. Right? Like that's what that's the Mike Yo experience. Oh, do you need to get more out of a roster? Fire this guy. Because here's the thing. Like Cliff Fletcher, you're right.

He's interim coach and you didn't get the vibe that this guy is the long term answer. But Chuck Fletcher did seem to kind of indicate that he's comfortable with him for a while now. Like there's not, this isn't like a guy who's necessarily been given the reins for, like, just hold tight for two or three games while we bring in somebody. It, like, maybe could be the rest of the season or whatever have you. Which is fine. You're trying to be bad. Yeah, probably. And, but he made some comment about, like, you know, Mike Yo knows about turnarounds.

And I, I, you know, me and probably a lot of other people tweet at the same joke, which is that, well, you know, Mike Yo was part of the greatest turnaround in NHL. He played a key role in the greatest. And I actually had just further proof that there is no joke you can make that is more on the nose that somebody won't take it the wrong way. And like, I had angry blues fans tweeting me and they're like, what are you talking about? His role was getting fired. And I was like, yeah, that is, that is exactly the joke. Thank you. Yeah.

People are, people get it is my experience. People are with it. They're very chill when they misunderstand things. Hockey fans are so cool. Yeah. Speaking of getting it, and this is actually a good ad transition, because if you're not sure what to get as a gift or stocking stuffer this holiday season, today's sponsor, Manscaped, has the tools to guarantee you win this year's stocking

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boxers and a shed travel bag. So again, if you want to get 20% off and free shipping, go to manscaped.com with the code Puck20. Be the balliest gift giver this year with Manscaped. Okay. So the other thing, the other big news this week, I guess, is that it's Board of Governors' time and I guess the big bit of news out of that is that the NHL is doing what it's calling like the Respect Initiative or something along those.

Respect is definitely in the name. Yeah. I think in all caps, even. Yeah, to indicate, I believe, that it stands for something. What does it stand for? I don't know. But yeah, so that's... The gist of it is, I guess, is that, you know,

they're going to do more education and training around, like, I guess, reporting misdeeds, misconduct, you know. But, you know, that's one of those things where it's like, yeah, we have all these ideas and, you know, we'll let you know about them later. It's basically, you know. It's one of those things where, and, you know, what does respect mean? It's sort of, it seems like is there catch-all for many of the issues. that we've been talking about in this sport in this league over the last couple years.

There's going to be a training component that everybody will have to take over the coming months in the league, and then they're going to release more details at that point. And I don't know. I don't know that there's a ton to say about it right now, partly because we don't know exactly what it is, and also because they've only announced it. and this is the sort of thing where it's... It actually, it says here they partnered with a group called the Respect Group, and they put out a statement about how excited they are to work with the NHL.

Right, and this is, you know, Kim Davis is involved, and the other piece of this is that Sheldon Kennedy is involved, which does give you potentially some hope that this is going to be more than just, you know, like we all remember the whole hockey is for everyone thing that was an actual. to great much fanfare and much back patting and then doesn't seem to have actually changed or done anything. So,

how that works. Yeah, like, I mean, I think this is the sort of thing where, you know, we, we all want the league to do something.

We all agreed that the status quo wasn't acceptable. So they're doing something. And you don't want to knock them for that. But at the same thing, time they have earned absolutely zero benefit of the doubt in advance when they say they're going to do something, you have to see it. And this is the first step towards seeing it. So we can give them some time.

But I don't think it's at all unreasonable to say until we actually see this working in the months and years to come that we're not going to give any, you know, There's no round of applause yet. And in fact, I even saw, I think it was Pierre in his piece today said, you know, well, some of us are cynical. I don't even think it's being cynical. I think it's just being reasonably aware to say that this league often, you know, this league and this sport and, you know, this culture loves to say they're going to do something

and then not actually do it. So this could, this time could be different. You know, Kim Davis is. is a smart person who, if she's allowed to, can drive this in a good direction. Sheldon Kennedy being involved is a good step. So this sounds like it would be a good thing if it goes the way that they're describing it, but we're under zero obligation to give them any advance credit for doing that before they've actually shown it to us.

Yeah, that's exactly right. And I don't know. Again, like, we are, I think, going to be skeptical of any NHL-related business like this just because even if they follow through on everything, they say they're going to do, what actually changes, right? Because you would go, well, look, I would expect that if there's a sexual assault perpetrated by someone who works for an NHL team, that there wouldn't be a big meeting about how, you're going to cover it up or whatever.

And then obviously, you know, everything happened. So like, I don't know, it's a, it's a tough, it's a tough situation. And again, like good, good for them for actually recognizing that they need to do something about it. But like recognizing that is not the same as doing something about it. So. And it's, look, I mean, this is. It's hard work to change cultures and to do this sort of stuff. So even if their hearts are in the right place and they legitimately want change and not just a PR win, that doesn't mean it's going to happen. So let's wait and see.

You know, I'm not going to do the, you know, I'm glad they announced it. But this was the, this is the easiest step in the road to getting there is to do. just say you're going to do it. So good for them for doing that, but they got a long way to go. Yeah. Let's, in fact, on the little outline I have, we had Olympics last, but, hey, this is a good place to say Olympics stuff because it's related to the Board of Governors. As we're recording this, we don't know what they're going to say about the Olympics on the league side, because that's going to be announced later today at the B-O-G meetings. And so we can talk about everything else.

It might be the decisions coming soon-ish, but it mostly seems like it's in the player's hands a little bit. And the first bit of player news we have on this is that Robin Lainer's like, oh, fuck it, I'm not going. Yep. Which, and he gave his reasoning. And I think, well, I mean, when he made it, And part of it, if people didn't hear it, was, you know, he said that to go to China and what happens if you test positive while you're there?

That still seems to be an open question. What does the quarantine look like? What happens if you test positive on the last day? Do you get to fly home or are you now, does everyone go home without you and you're stuck in China for two weeks? And he felt like from just a mental health perspective that it wasn't the best for him. so the question is who else might be feeling that way and will we see it's not going to be zero I don't think so other guys yep I don't think so especially you know the the NBA obviously they they did their whole their Olympic thing this past summer and a bunch of guys sat out like

Steph Curry didn't go I think LeBron didn't go right so and again, understandably so. I don't think anybody's sitting there going, you know, why wouldn't they go? And that kind of thing, like, everybody gets it. But, yeah, I just, it's interesting to me that the differences, obviously the playoffs take place, or the Olympics take place in the NBA off season,

whereas obviously that's not the case in the NHL. And in fact, that provides probably more disincentive, you know, to like, yeah, fuck it, I bet I should stay home then. Because it's going to be a lot of NHL teams hoping that their players make that decision. Yes. And, you know, again, like it's been said a million times. So for a lot of these guys, it's a situation where they're like, I played my whole life for this. On a recent show, didn't you say somebody that it wasn't it Stamco's had never played

in the Olympics? Yeah. Right? So like, yeah, you go, okay. Of course, like, you know, Stephen Stamco is one of the better players of his generation borderline Hall of Fame or you might even say. He is maybe going to want to bolster his Hall of Fame reputation with a gold medal or just to say he played in the fucking Olympics would be a big, deal for him. So I get all that, but at the same time, you just, do you want to be stuck in China for two, three weeks in the middle of the season? Do you want to also risk injury?

Do you want to, you know, potentially deal with the jet lag that comes from flying across the international dateline and all that kind of stuff? Like, there's a lot of reasons to not do this now. And it, like I said, the number of guys who opt out after. after Robin Lainer isn't going to, like, Robin Lainer will not be the only one. Let's put it that way. Yep.

And, you know, the situation as far as the league is concerned is, I mean, look, the league has not wanted to go to the Olympics all along. They've been clear about that. Right. Well, so that's interesting, only in so far as, you know,

if there is an Olympics they want to get involved with, one in China that makes, uh, that potentially makes hockey a popular, sport in China. That would be the one to go to, right? Unlock whatever, one and a half billion people market. You would think, although I don't know if that's the NHL's level of vision or if they'd

prefer to be in North America and just bump a TV rating a little bit. But yeah, I mean, you would think, which is why it somewhat surprised me that over the years they never seemed, you know, I remember when they didn't go in 2018, I was saying, well, yeah, we all know in 2022 they're going to go because it's China because of the reasons you just said. And the league has not wanted that, it seems. The players do. And the league, you know, as a concession that was negotiated initially agreed to go, but they have left the door open. And basically from the reporting on. Yeah, they basically said, oh, we'll do everything in our power.

We'll do everything in our power. And that does leave the door open to say, you know, we can't go. And there's various exit clauses and that sort of thing. It doesn't sound like at this point they're moving towards doing that. It seems like at this point, it's still resting on the players to make the call of do they actually want to go or not. And it's still a fluid situation because, you know, we're probably weeks away from getting to points of no return as far as a decision. but that a lot can change in a few weeks. You've got a new variant out there.

There's the political situation is shifting around. We will see. I mean, I get the sense that the league would love it if the players said, you know what, we've changed our minds. Yeah, of course. But I don't feel like that's likely at this point, but it's, I don't know. It was a few weeks ago, right? We were talking about this.

And I said that in terms of the percentage chance of them going, I felt like I was drifting south of 50-50. And Greg said 100% still was his view. And that's why he's off the show. Yeah. And we didn't like it. And I told him never to question me again. And he didn't get the message.

And so he's gone. That's right. But yeah, I still don't feel great about it. Just with all the factors. No, me neither. You know, the league doesn't want to go. The players will wait and see. COVID could still wreak havoc on this whole thing.

the politics of it could still blow up. There's a lot of ways this could go wrong. But in the meantime, we're putting out our Olympic rosters and Tom Wilson's on Team Canada now. So we got that's the best. Maybe that's it. You just announced that Tom Wilson is on Team Canada and everyone will be like, you know what, forget it.

That's right. We don't need this. We're all set, actually. We're good. The other thing to say is they're going to let China play. Is that the most fucking insane thing you've ever heard in your entire life? Yeah, I mean, I get where they're, it's the host nation and you want to give the chance for there to be a moment where, you know, maybe, maybe they pull off their own miracle on ice and, you know, which in this case would probably be like scoring a goal against. Not losing by 30 to Canada.

Yeah. But it also. Because again, like the thing, you know, you're not allowed to run up the score in the NHL. If you do that, that's classless. That's being a bad guy, whatever. But in international competitions, they love to do it because they get to go, well, I mean, cold difference matters. And if we don't put up 40 on these guys who are in like, you know,

the second division, KHL at best, the U.S. is going to do it. And if they do it and we don't, we're actually going to look bad. So we have to do it. And we're actually being very honorable by doing it. And I don't know what the tiebreaker situations are. I don't think that really comes into play just because it's a three-game round-robin and you're playing each other so there shouldn't be ties. But yeah, I mean.

You never know. You never, never know. Let's really hope that we don't see that. Because, yeah, you're talking about a situation that could get ugly. And, you know, and also you're talking about a situation where, okay, what's the alternative, right? What is what does it look like? What is Canada trying not to run up the score on China look like?

Are we just dumping the puck in from the red line? It looks like a three-on-three overtime where they realize they're not going to get near the net, so they leave the offensive zone circle back in. But they're just doing that without even looking for it's Connor McDavid. Remember when you would like in TechMobile try to run out a whole quarter with Bo Jackson? That's right. That's basically going to be him, just going end-to-end the entire time. I mean, it's going to be grim.

But I do predict that we are going to see Olympic records shattered for scoring because of this. Because this is just a country that has never played hockey at a high level before. 20 years from now, we're going to look back and be like, you know who has the third highest career scoring and Zach Hyman That's right 37 points 36 of which came against China

Yeah especially because like I don't remember Who's coaching team Canada I guess it doesn't really matter Could be you and they'd be fine Cooper isn't Because it's Canada You just your hardest job is saying

Oh I guess it's the McDavid line is up now And then you go okay Now Crosby's line is up That's pretty That's it. That's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's all you got to think about. Um, yeah, but by the way, I, I, I, I, I just want to close this by saying, congratulations in advance to China on their two one win over Canada and everyone who is finding and clipping this in the future to, uh, play back my prediction that, like,

Zach Hyatt would have 30 points after a, uh, after they, after they, after Canada outshoots China, 140 to six. Yeah. And, uh, and, and, uh, and Carrie Price or whoever is like, look, I fell asleep in the middle of the game. It's not my fault. Yeah, exactly. That those two pucks bounced in from like what otherwise should have been an icing.

But I will say this. If Canada does, you know, even let China score a goal, I think this is the perfect time to have a symposium about what you're doing wrong at the international level. And you know what it's going to be? Spoiler alert. Not enough toughness. Not enough toughness. That's why they're, that's why they got to bring Wilson over Marner, right?

Why Ryan Reeves should be Canada's 13th forward. That's right. That's right. All right. Let's talk about another really grim situation. And that is what's going on with the Arizona coyotes. It was reported earlier this week that they still owed the city of Glendale a bunch of money from, I believe, last season and then earlier this season.

Am I right about that? Yeah. Basically, they haven't been paying their taxes or their rent, which is just shocking. You know, I know we were all stunned when we heard it, but luckily, it turns out there was an innocent explanation. It's just human error. They plum forgot.

Yeah, we've all been there. You know. Human error. Human error, I think, is the term they use. And it's like, do I believe that? Look, I can't imagine that they're like, you know what, let's just not pay our taxes and see what happens. Yeah.

But also, I can definitely see that happening. So now what? Well, and remember, like there was the story at the beginning of the year that Katie Strang wrote where she went into detail on a lot of the dysfunction with this team and that was a big part of it. was them stiffing everyone on on bills or you know that not paying their their bills and then calling up small businesses and that and demanding that the price be cut and this and that and so I saw somebody say that the human error here might have been that somebody applied standard coyote's business practices to somebody who could actually push back on them and could actually do something about it right you know the

The IRS doesn't tend to negotiate. Yeah. And in this case, you know, because it's the city here, but, you know, it's not like, they don't send you like an invoice the beginning of the year and then that's it. And then, oops, I forgot, you know, the, the envelope fell down behind my desk and the wall and, and I never saw it. They, they reach out multiple times and apparently did in this case. And even though there is already a pretty fractured relationship between the team and the city, I'm imagining they didn't, as a first resort, go public with this. So, yeah, no, I mean, the coyotes have assured everyone that, you know, they've already paid, according to some reports, they have paid the tax part of the bill now, but maybe not the rent piece. And I don't know.

And this is all happening against a background where the city has already said, like, this is your last year here in this arena. You're done after the season. And they were like, like part of the report the other day was basically something along the lines of, we also don't want to be like caught holding the bag and they leave. And we never hear from them again. Exactly. Once they've played their last game and they packed up and they've left, there's no. leverage for them to actually have to pay. So this is,

this, this was a chance to apply some pressure earlier. And, you know, I don't think there was ever a realistic chance that, you know, the headline on the story was, or the hook on it was, the coyote's going to get kicked out of their own arena in a few weeks.

I don't think that was ever a possibility. At the very least, the NHL could kind of forward them some money to pay the bills. But this is a mess. Like they're, and clearly the coyotes are on the move out of their current arena. The question is where to and how does that resolve itself? And I'm still not sure.

Like I know there's some confusion over at the end of the season. They're not in this arena. So where are they going to be? Because everybody still seems to want everyone who has a say still seems to want them to be in Arizona. But who knows? And of course, this is also happening. it was only a week ago that we heard that there was talk of moving them to Houston

and everybody was just completely shocked and offended. How, yes. Why would anybody imply that this NHL team that doesn't have an arena figured out for next season would be moving anywhere other than the great state of Arizona? Just terrible, terrible, unresponsible. Oh, wait, whoops, they're not paying their bills. And, yeah.

So I don't know. Like opening night, 2022, where are the coyotes, do you think? So I saw somebody yesterday go, you know, there's a little Coliseum in Massa County, Long Island, that could potentially play host. And it's like, God, can you fucking imagine if the last NHL team to ever play there was the Arizona Coyotes? That would be. Like a Coyotes Jets game. in April, just really running out the string.

Yeah. Oh, man. Yeah, that's, I mean, there's rinks everywhere. Yeah. And so, like, you know, I think people have floated the idea that they just kind to make it a traveling circus around the greater Phoenix area, where they just, like, play basically anywhere they can, or they can get a skate in. Yeah.

I mean, it's not like you need a 20,000 seat arena to. hold the the demand to see this team. That's right. No, I was actually surprised at how okay. Like it hasn't been good, obviously. They're near the bottom of the league.

But like, if you had said to me, oh, they're drawing like 3,000 fans a night, I'd have gone like, fuck it, of course they are. Absolutely. But it's like up around 12, 12 and a half, something like that, which again, not good, but like not as dismal as I would have thought. That's for sure.

Yeah. they're ahead of a few teams, including San Jose, which is a little bit, yeah, that was, that was surprising. But, you know, that's also one of those things of, like, are the local restrictions and issue? Like, I don't know the answer to that. But the other one, obviously, is some combination of every city that has ever been rumored to be getting an NHL team, Houston and Kansas City and Wisconsin, whatever.

Like, they'll figure it out kind of an idea. Because that is, that is worth noting, is that there are multiple AHL teams that play in, like, NHL-sized arenas. And could something be worked out that way? I don't know. Probably not. I have no idea. But that is the other issue is that, you know, there are huge ranks that don't have an

NHL tenant at this point. Yeah. And I guess it's worth noting that there's been one franchise move in the last 20 years in the NHL, which is more stability than the NFL, more stability than the NBA, even with Major League Baseball. So even though Gary Betman, when he first came in, there was a bunch of movement that he probably couldn't have done anything about. And he sort of got this reputation as this guy who was moving all the teams to non-traditional markets. in the 20 plus years since it's been very stable. But the one time we did see a move with Atlanta in Winnipeg,

it happened fairly quickly. Like it went from, there are rumors to this is happening towards the end of the season quite fast. So typically in other leagues we've seen it, you know, it can be a multi-year process. You can have, you know, yeah,

this team's going to move three years from now. in the NHL, it doesn't necessarily have to be that way. It can be quite quick, or at least it has been once before. So who knows. Yeah, I, you know, the things that you're legally required to say is like, I feel bad for coyotes fans. And I definitely do, because this is a really shitty situation that, you know, it doesn't seem like they're going to be able to resolve it. I don't, let's put it this way. don't see how if you're a coyotes fan, you're at all convinced this team is staying in Arizona.

Because, you know, if you, if you're like, oh, yeah, we'll only play for like a year or two on Long Island or in Houston or whatever, but then we'll be back. I'd be like, you expect me to fucking believe that? Mm-hmm. If they sell one extra ticket over what they average in Arizona, why would they come back ever? I think the big question is going to be, if it comes to that, if they are anywhere else next year, you need to see a shovel in the ground on a new arena in Arizona. Before the end of this season. I would say before the puck drops in someplace new, for sure.

But before the end of this season would be much better. And then even then, it takes a while to build that. But yeah, if it's a case of we're going somewhere else, or even if it's somewhere else within Arizona, But we're doing the, we don't have a full-time home and not just plan, but like I say, underway. At that point, it starts to feel like a lost cause. Yeah. And like, again, you're not allowed to say this. Like, but like, I don't know.

Is that a viable market really? How many years have they been there? They moved there in 96, right? 96. So it's been 25 years. 25 years of this. and I know that people will say, you know, the team's never been good. So can you really judge a market?

But at some point, yeah, you can. Yeah, there are a lot of like, yeah, I mean, like obviously the Islanders spent a lot of time not good, not drawing, et cetera. But like, you know, that was all, that's also a market that's, or a region that supports two other teams. whether you want to say like Rangers fans would ever give a shit about, or certainly Devil's fans would ever give a shit about the Islanders, fair enough, but, you know, and there have been bad, there have been bad times in traditional hockey markets like Boston when I was in college. Chicago, yeah. Well, yeah, exactly.

And now, like, those are unquestioned, like, bastions of the NHL, like, how could you ever imagine a situation where they don't draw? and they spent years not drawing. And so, yeah, you know, when the coyotes made the playoffs, they sold a lot of tickets, right? I think that's the thing to say. But, you know, part of the issue is that it becomes a chicken and an egg thing, where you're going, okay, well, you know, we've been bad,

and that's why we don't draw, but we can't afford to spend because we don't draw. Yeah. And also, it's all well and good to say, you know, if a team's not winning, they can't really build a fan base. But you've had 25 years of not winning. So how much rot is in the foundation of whatever fan base you would be? Yeah, why would anybody ever believe that the coyotes are good, even if they're good for a single season? Yeah. Like we're sort of seeing maybe a test case of that in Florida with the Panthers right now, where they'd seem legitimately really good.

I guess we wait and see how that turns out. But, no, I mean, I feel like it, you could fill a book with. takes about the coyotes not being viable and needing to move from the last two decades that turned out to be wrong. So maybe it happens again, but I just... It's a tough sell at this point, for sure. I mean, it's one thing to be not particularly viable when you have an arena and a lease and all these other commitments. Like right now, there doesn't seem to be anything holding them in place.

Other than probably the NHL's desire to not have them. move to a potential expansion market where they're going to take a big chunk of money off the table. Yep. But I mean, at some point, you've got to say the NHL just reasonably can't expand anymore, right? Like, what are we going to, you know? Oh, yeah, here comes Quebec City. They paid a billion dollar expansion fee and, you know, they're the 33rd team in the NHL, and that means we need another one.

And at some point, you just run out of markets. I mean, at some point you do, but. Especially for this. Like, maybe, like, the NFL could reasonably expand to 40 cities and people would be like, yeah, this rocks. I love it. Yeah. I mean, the flip side is all these owners losing money and in the COVID times and everything. At some point, someone's going to call up Gary Beppin and go, you know what?

You know what it would be nice? 600 million more in expansion fees. Sure. So we'll see. You know, Ryan, speaking of linens, I don't know. I hope we were speaking to linens. This ad is pre-recorded, so that transition probably didn't work. But I tried.

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All right. One last thing that we got to talk about, I guess, is the Department of Player Safety had a busy week. And I, you know, I imagine that Sean has more to say about this than I do, just given who was involved or whatever. But six games for Jason Spetsa for kneeing, Neil Pionk. Two games for Neil Pionk for going knee-to-k with, with Rasmus Sandin, right? It was Sandine. Yep.

One of the few Rasmai that aren't on the Buffalo Sabres. So I can, I'm never, I'm never quite sure which Rasmus I'm talking about. So that's why I had to check. But yeah, you know, I think they got, it's rare that I say this, but I think they got them both absolutely right. I'm curious to hear your take on that. Yeah, no, I think you're about right there. The Pionk one, I mean, it's a needy hit. They're bad. They're dangerous.

They're worthy of suspension. They also tend not to be premeditated. It's more, you know, sloppiness where you realize you're out of position and you kind of go make a reach for a guy. And it's a dangerous play. And it injured a guy who's an important piece of the Leafs this year, a good young. young defenseman. Historically, that tends to get you a couple of games, and that's what it got them. The Spetsa thing was significantly different.

The fact that it was against the same player who had just thrown the knee-on-knee hit shortly after certainly would lead one to believe that there was some premeditation there, and it was just, I mean, it was a need of the head. It's a very unusual play. but it's a different category. And I get why some new fans are saying, you know, how come, you know, our guy gets three times what their guy got and this and that, because it was a very different play.

And it was, you know, I said this on the other show. There's really only two views, I think you can have of this. The first is to say that Jason Spencer was just trying to throw a hit. The player he was trying to hit was dropping to the other. and that's why there was the collision with the knee and it was just an attempt at a clean hit gone bad, which I think would be a very charitable view, to put it mildly. And the other view is, no, he was trying to knee the guy in the head, in which case it's got to be a big suspension.

Like, neighing someone in the head can't be one or two games. There's extremely limited precedent, but there was the, who was it? was it James Neal on Marchand? A few years ago. Neil on Marshand, yeah. And that got five games. And the other piece of it is, you know, I know a lot of Lee fans are saying, and apparently the Leafs organization itself, that that game was a gong show, the rest loss control.

Pionk, when he needs Sandin, did not get a penalty. If he gets a penalty there, if they give him a major, kick him out of the game, or even just penalize it, that lowers the temperature. and then maybe the Spetsa hit doesn't happen. And all of that's probably true, but none of that should affect the suspension. You can't give a discount on suspensions after a referee misses a call and say now it's open season for payback. I mean, that just... That's right.

So, yeah, it's like it stinks for Spetsa because he seems like a good guy and, you know, he's a likable guy and this kind of late career renaissance as like the, The Maple Leaf's giggly grandpa is is kind of cool. But yeah, it's, it, you got to sit for a while when, when you do something like that. And, uh, I, I can't sit here and say, you know, cry about Tom Wilson or whoever else is the latest to throw a headshot. And then when it's a guy on my team, kneeing somebody in the head causing a concussion, suddenly start parsing freeze frames to find out why it's, it's not so bad after all. Let me ask you this. I was thinking about this. I'm like, I feel like we've seen a ton of knee-on-knee hits this year.

Am I wrong about that? There's definitely been a feel like there was another one in the next Jets game that actually did get a penalty. And yeah, maybe where's, I don't know if it's the kind of thing where once you notice it, you just, you notice it everywhere, even if it's not. But yeah, there does seem to be more of those because there was a time, you know, that I'll do my classic thing. here. There's a time back in like the 90s where there was an epidemic of these things. And you had like the

Brian Marchments and guys like that that always seemed to be doing it. And it always started a big brawl. And it feels like there's been less of it. But yeah, like I mean, the league is so fast these days that it's it's kind of. Yeah. I think like among the things that are considered dirty and and suspendable and all that kind of stuff, I think like to your point earlier, I think going knee on knee, like, is such a, like, I didn't, like, when guys go, I didn't mean to go knee on knee with that guy, I feel bad about it. Like, I think that's the one where I'm always like, you know what, I buy that. That checks, that checks out for me a little bit more. There's certainly like two versions, right? There are ones, and again, this is, you know, the, the marchments of the world who had a

reputation for it. There's one where, like, the body stays in place and the leg comes out. Yeah. And then there's the ones where the, whole body goes and you, you know, you see them trying to hit with the shoulder, but the guy dodges and then, and then the knees hit. And it's still, you know, it's one of those things where it's like, if, if, if you go to throw a hit in this league, it's on you to throw it clean. And if, you know, if you end up making knee on knee contact, but it is, it's a tough one because it can be accidental. It can just be sloppy, but it can also have, you can blow it someone's ACL. Like, You can end someone's season.

So, you know, and there has to be a strong penalty on it. But, yeah, it was very strange that Sunday night Leafs Jets game where, I mean, no penalties handed out. And then it got, you know, it got ugly with the, you know, a couple of fights and there's trash talk between the benches. So, yeah, I mean, that's what happens when referees let things snowball. What did you think of Jacob Truba, those two hits? I'm on the record of like

I think it should be the I-IHF rules of like if there's any head contact that's got to be it because like I think that it's a situation where they you know clearly you've never played hockey before kind of takes start coming out let's say but like Jacob Truba hit these guys right in the fucking heads and you can say he didn't mean to, and it's like an unfortunate consequence of playing a contact sport and all that kind of stuff. But look, if we're going to take concussion seriously, and we should, then, you know, I think you've got to start, you know, if not suspending guys, like, you know, it can be a totally innocent headshot, which sounds like insane to say.

but let's say that's a thing that can happen. I think you're going to start being like, look, you know, you might not have meant to do it. It might not have been the primary point of contact or whatever. You know, like all that stuff just feels like DOP's trying to find a way to maneuver out of having to suspend guys for that. And, you know, for me it's just like, yeah, we're talking about, like, like, again, everything we know about concussions, we're talking about guys fucking lives. It's not, you know, like, you get your knee blown out.

You might not be able to play again, but like, you know, you're going to be able to live a long, relatively happy, comfortable life. You know, that is not the case with, with concussions. So that's my big point of concern with all that kind of thing. And I don't think it's realistic to ever. expect the NHL to go down the road of like, yeah, we will actually suspend for any head contact

or anything. I mean, the problem there partly is even the international rules that everybody loves to cite has quite a few exceptions built in. Like, it isn't any head contact is a penalty. It's any head contact is a penalty except for the following types of head contact. Right. But like, I think anybody would say it's a more rigorous standard. Absolutely.

than what the NHL brings to the table. So that's kind of my, again, like, you know, people are going to say I never played the game or whatever. But like, that, first of all, that is true. You got me. But also, like, I don't know. I think that if you're sitting there going, look, sometimes you're just going to get your fucking brains knocked out of your ears. So that's just a fact of life. It's like, oh, that sounds like that sucks, actually.

That sounds like something I wouldn't want to defend. You know what? That is what I think the case is because the two hits the Truba through were both hits that, you know, they generated debate. The league didn't suspend on either of them. I don't think there was a penalty on either of them. I don't think so either. Clean hits by the letter of the law, but certainly ones that, you know, people were debating. those are hits that even a few years ago would have been squeaky clean to everybody's view.

And we would have loved them. And we would have, hits like that would have been used to promote the game. Like that would have been in the commercials. And I, you know, tune in to watch the Rangers and big hitter Jacob Truba. And you never know when he's going to lay somebody out. So I guess in one sense it's progress. I'm increasingly of the opinion that I still have yet to see any kind of proposal for a rule banning contact to the head that feels practical to me in a league where you're still allowing big open ice hits. I just don't see a way to say we want to have those.

big collisions in this game. We want that to be a part of the game, but we don't want anyone to ever get hit in the head. Not just in the sense of, you know, there will be guys that break the rules and, you know, that kind of thing. But just how you have it in general. And this is the same. The NFL's struggling with the same thing,

where they want to have those big, they want the safety to be able to come over, be able to come over and wipe out a receiver, but they don't want the receiver to not get up. And how do you do that? And I'm increasingly not. convinced that in the NHL that we can

do that. I think... Yeah, it does seem like an impossible like tightrope to walk. It feels like at some point the decision has to be either we have big hits in this league and sometimes you will get the results that we saw this week with guys getting

hurt and it sucks and but we accept it as part of part of the game or we don't and we do something to say, you know what, do we even need like the one or two big open ice hits a game or a week that we even see these days? Or do we say, not that we make this a non-contact sport, but do we change the rules to say that, you know what? No, we don't need somebody coming across at full speed to wipe

somebody out. And I don't know. And very clearly, the NHL's answer today is door number one, which is big hits, occasional injuries. We want to keep it as safe as possible. But that's still going to result in in scenes like we saw this week. I don't know. I feel like there's a case to be made for both of those arguments. I just am increasingly convinced that there isn't a middle ground where we keep the big hits, but we don't have guys getting hurt like that. Oh, did you see in the Boston Globe this morning there was an article about how the Bruins need to add toughness

because people are taking runs at Patrice Bergeron? I saw your tweet about that. Big time chef's kiss. And you know what? I was shocked, and I didn't read the article. I only read the paragraph that you, that you grab. You're fine. But I was shocked that there was, there was no mention of Sean Thornton, like, directly in there. Like, there was a mention of Zadano Chara. Okay. But I mean, it's... I don't think, I don't think even Luchich came up, but Chara definitely got, got brought up. And for those who didn't see it again, it was just like, Patrice Bergeron's taking a freaking beating

out there. And if the Bruins were tougher and it's like they got fucking Nick Folino this summer, like they didn't not get toughness this summer. I don't know. Like, fucking, where's Derek Foreborton all this? But I guess Derek Forborton is too high scoring a defenseman

to, you know, sit in five minutes in the box. If Terry O'Reilly is still around. That's right. Yeah, that's where we're at with safety in the league is people are still going, you know, if the Bruins only had so-and-so, they'd be in great shape.

So, yeah, it rocks. But I think that's the show. Because that's, I mean, the Bruins, when they had Sean Thornton, nobody ever got need in the head. Oh, wait, no, that's exactly. No, no. That's exactly. And, oh, and that's the other thing, too, is remember when Sean Thornton, who was it, Brooks Orpick, maybe? It was the same game, wasn't it?

Wasn't that the payback for, or was it later on? No, because Neil wasn't on the, oh, shit. You know what? I was thinking of works. It might have been. It might have been. Or it was certainly like that same Penguins team, more or less. It may have been a different game, but I think that was the payback.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. When Sean Thornton was like, I'm going to fight you. And the guy was like, no, I don't want to fight. I don't think that's true. And then Sean Thornton was like, well, I will fight you anyways. And everybody was horrified. Like, can you believe that the. fighter guy did fighting.

That's horrible. And we made him like come out and do the press conference and cry and say that he wasn't that sort of player. And like meanwhile, and he did exactly what we all wanted him to do. And when he got the 20 games, he, much like Jason Spetz, it was like, but I've been a good boy this whole time. Yeah. I played however many years in the league.

And I've never been suspended. I never got a fine. And it's like, my first time for everything. Tough shit. So yeah Anyway, I think that's the show right on that note Yeah, that's right Next week we'll have special guest Sean Thornton in studio

To to wail on us Yeah Absolutely beat the hell out of us for no reason Well, I guess the reason would be all the stuff we just said Yeah, yeah, that's it If you want to sign up for Elite Prospects Premium You can do that with the offer code I love EP, all one word.

And that gets you an extra three months tacked on to your annual subscription, annual only will get you that 20% off. So yeah, that's about it for me, plug-wise. Yep. You find me on the athletic, as well as on the athletic hockey show with Eden Mendez. I don't really have anything specific to plug my most recent post was me trying to build a roster of guys who had the exact same number of goals and assists. So in case you're wondering how much I've got going on in terms of the ideas, well, there you go. That's right.

Next week, guys who are only one goal and one assist off from having the exact same number. Making notes right now. All right, thanks for listening. Check out the Patreon. You know, that's where all Greg's stuff is going to be from now on. It's hidden Greg. It's stuffed in the attic. The occluded Wachinsky.

Check it out. We're going to have a lot of stuff on the Patreon from now on. So thanks for listening and we'll see you later. Bye-bye. Sticks and hits and goals and saves and slapshots and goons. We've got sportly commentary. To what if you commute But we also cover movies, TV shows

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