Puck Soup - The Week to End the Streaks

Episode Date: October 29, 2024

Sean and Ryan talk about Steven Stamkos returning to Tampa, the ends of long winning and losing streaks, contract extensions, and more.

I'm Ryan Lamber from Elite Prospects. I'm Sean McNeer from The Athletic. And it's been an interesting week in hockey. Let's put it that way. Mostly because we're finally starting to get news. Mm-hmm. You know? First couple weeks of the season is just like, oh, can you believe these games that happened?

That's basically all you're saying. Wow, this guy's scoring a lot of goals. Who's the guy from Utah scored all those goals? That guy. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, he doesn't do that anymore. No, he doesn't.

Dylan Gunther finished. Utah, well, you know, the less said about how their night went, the better, I think, is what they would say. We'll get to that in a minute. But first, I think the big news, or the big story, at least, it's not really news, I guess, is Stephen Stamcoast goes back to Tampa for the first time. He's on a different team now. I don't know if people heard about that. But, yeah. Probably should have made a note of that.

And, well, the Lightning ended up winning that game in overtime. Stamcoast had two assists, the famous thing that he does really well. Yeah. And I don't know, it was, I'll tell you, that's great game. Really fun to watch. Tampa also had a goal called off, I think, in the second period, maybe. But they won in the end, and, you know, Nashville keeps, keeps struggling.

But, you know, it feels like the Preds are turning things around a little bit here. You're going to lose to Tampa sometimes in overtime when there's like a five-minute break where you got to cheer for the guy who played for the team for 16 years or whatever, you know? But, yeah, I guess I don't have too much to say about it. It's nice to see, you know, that was a great video that the Lightning put together, as you might expect. but what were your, I know you didn't watch the game because the loops were on, but... I mean, the whole thing was well done. It's always potentially a little bit tricky when you're welcoming back,

the former star that you sort of walked away from. And in this case, largely as a team choice as opposed to, you know, the John Tavares situation, which is a... where you got a very different reaction in Tampa. It's nice. They did the video. I mean, every team is super good at doing those videos now. And this obviously a case where, unlike some other returns, it was deserved.

You know, I don't think, I still don't think we need to do this every time a third-line winger comes back after a year. Yeah. But Stephen Stalk goes, obviously, you do it. Great reaction from the fans. and all of that stuff, and then you sort of move on. Do you buy into this idea that Stamcoast sort of needed to get this out of the way, and now he can get back to producing, which he hasn't done a whole lot of?

Yeah, I guess I don't, because, like, what if this game was in January, you know? Yeah. It just so happens that it was relatively early in the season, but, you know, schedules lined up a little differently, and we're having this conversation about Stamcoast and Nashville as a whole in December or whatever. That's a whole different thing. I think it matters in that game where, like, you know, he took the first shift. They all cheered for him.

And then, you know, he got the little celebration at the first media timeout. and then everybody like then you can calm down a little bit and focus on just playing the game itself and all that kind of thing. But like I can't imagine that, you know, whatever, two weeks ago when they're playing Vancouver or whoever, Seattle, he's sitting there going. Yeah, but I got to get this Tampa game going first. What do I care about playing this Tuesday night game in Edmonton, you know? Well, the good news is he tripled his point total on the season. Yep. From one all the way up to three.

That's exactly right. So if he keeps doing that, like a week from now, we're talking one of the all-time greats. Yeah. We're, um, it's interesting because, well, first of all, I want to say this about this game. I, as you people may know, I know Sean knows this. I don't watch games with the volume up too loud. I don't want to pay attention to the commentary too much, you know.

I just want to watch the game or whatever. but I was because, you know, the specialness of the situation or whatever you want to say. I was interested to hear what commentary was having to say. And it's just such a reminder of how fucking good at his job Ray Ferraro is. Okay. Where, you know, he's talking about Andrew Brunette and he's and Boba Kuzan is, uh, which who's in, I can never remember, um, is talking to him about like, hey, didn't you guys play together in, in Atlanta? and he's like, yeah, can you believe we're still both allowed to be in the sport? It's unbelievable.

He's like, down in Atlanta, we ended a lot of careers prematurely, you know. But like just the way he's talking about like, you know, breaking down plays on replay, it's like very high level, like what he's explaining, but also he makes it very simple. He's just the best. He's so good. I know he just got inducted into the BC Hall of Fame. And, you know, he deserves a little more than that quite free. Exactly. Wow, you're putting the, you're, uh, Ray Ferraro in the hockey Hall of Fame.

He needs to be. He's so fucking good. All right. He's so good. He's in all the video games, too, you know? I mean, that is a big, that should be a big part of any. I don't play those video games anymore. I have no idea who the commentators are. You could tell me. They changed it a couple years ago. I can't remember who the play-by-play guy is now. It's not, like, Doc. It used to, it was Doc Emmerich for a long time and now it isn't. It's like maybe Andrew Walker or somebody like that. I feel like my most recent memory is like when Jim Euson was doing it. Yeah, that, I mean, that was a long time ago.

That was a long time ago. Yeah, it was Ray and Doc for a good long while. And I think maybe Ray's, I haven't played in like two years. Wasn't Darrell Ray the guy for a little bit too? I'm imagining that. I think you might be imagining that. What they should do is like the NBA 2K games where like there are different announce crews for different days. Like just sometimes they're like, oh, this is a national TV game. Here's a different announce crew. It's a fun mix them up. But anyway, I wanted to say this too about the Stamcoast thing because Mark Lazarus, your colleague at the athletic, tweeted this. In quote tweeting the lightnings like, we love you, Stephen video.

He says, you know what? it's bad to let homegrown franchise pillars leave if they want to stay. Kane should be a Blackhawks, Stamco should be a bolt. And I say this knowing full well that the penguins are pretty screwed, but their fans still get to cheer for Crosby and Malkin every night. It's interesting that he picked those three examples. Because I feel like those were three franchises in very different stages of where they're at. when the decision to re-sign or not resign those players was being made.

Right? Like, when Kane walked, it was like, oh, no, we've been dog shit for like three years. We've been horrible men. Yeah. And, you know, obviously it was lined up with Jonathan Taves. Hasn't played in a few years. We already let Duncan Keith walk, Brent Seabrook, like, long gone. Like, all the, all the, all the,

poor guys in that group had washed out and Kane was like the last guy standing. Stamco's, you know, the lightning are aiming to be pretty good. They're not a cup contender, I don't think you'd say. But like, they're aiming to still be good. And they replaced him with a similarly productive player. I think

Gensel and Stamco's are objectively two very different styles of player. But like, you know, they're both going to score 40 goals this year or whatever, you know, like that's the expectation. And then Crosby and Malkin, it was just like kind of if Cain had come up for a contract extension two years earlier, Kane and Taves and all that, you know, where it's like, well, we got to resign them. We're only two years removed from being. But people forget, like, how close they came to not resigning Malkin especially.

Yes. It was kind of figured that Lattang might be linked in there. don't think Crosby was ever at risk. No, right, but that was Crosby, if I'm remembering, right, wasn't it kind of Crosby going like, what, are you going to let these fucking guys walk out of your mind? Well, that was the rumor is, yeah, that he, he put a thumb on the scale a little bit. It is interesting because, you know, Stamco's wanted to stay in Tampa. Yeah.

But it wasn't like he was sitting there saying, I'll take anything. I just want to be here. Right. You know, he still wanted his. his reasonable number. Kane in Chicago, it's a little tougher to say.

I feel like Kane would have taken less to stay in Chicago. Yeah, probably. But again, how much is less? But the thing in, like, it felt like, I guess the point I'm trying to make is it felt like in Chicago, Kyle Davidson and the Hawks were basically saying, no, it's time to move on. Price is irrelevant.

You need to go because we need to, this needs to become Connor Bredard's team or whatever the future of the rebuild looks like. Versus in Tampa it was almost like, you know, if he had come back and said, I'll take $4 million, they probably do it because they were just looking at it completely heartlessly as a business transaction. And at some point, Stephen Stamcoast at number X is better value than Jake Gunsell at number Y.

so you do that instead. I don't know. I saw some people use that as a jumping off point to, like, should there be some sort of franchise player? Yeah, like discount. 20% off your... Which is something that, by the way, I think a lot of hockey fans may be misunderstand a bit

because it's a concept that comes from the NFL, but it certainly is not in the NFL something that it's just used to, like, allow beloved players to stand. stick around. Like it's, I mean, you see teams like using the franchise player tag on their punter. And you're like, well, right. It's just another way to control the players is what it is in the NFL, really. And also that would, I mean, it's never going to happen. It would create money outside the HRR system. And that's, that's like not what owners will do. Right. Because that's something people look at and say, you know, maybe maybe one number doesn't count on your books or maybe one number

counts at a lower I don't know and then it gets into this whole I see a lot of people saying like you know but it should be like it has to be a guy that you drafted and then it's like oh man okay but haven't we killed trading enough already without saying that

if you you know acquire somebody that it's you lose all these benefits yeah I no I I think that's just it's much like the you know they they should account for state tax rates and it should be take home pay is what counts against

the cap and all this. It's just like you're you're talking about something that's straight up not going to happen in the, you know, in the current economy of the NHL. You know, maybe things change in a certain way with this new CBA. But like I don't think owners are too anxious to like make it so that you can have even $5 million per team outside the system. Look, this is a solution to a problem, but it's a problem for the fans. That's exactly it.

Yep, that's right. The NHL isn't, what is the NHL care? Yep. If this was something that was making a GM's life difficult, then, you know, maybe there's something to talk about, yeah. Get all of these guys in a room and the seven of them that are allowed to talk would put their hands up and say we've got to change things. But if it's just the fans, sorry.

Yeah. The other thing with that, though, too, that you absolutely have to mention is like retaining Kane, retaining Crosby, retaining Malkin, to a lesser extent retaining Stamcoast, because, again, the team is staying competitive. Like, Chicago was horrible when they let Kane go. Mm-hmm. and the idea of keeping Kane was we're going to keep pushing for the playoffs, right? Like, you weren't going to have Kane around on a rebuilding team.

He wouldn't have accepted that because he's so used to winning or whatever, right? I mean, I don't know, though. I mean, like... Well, okay, let me... Yeah, go ahead. I mean, just to, like, there's this thing that I invented where I say that hockey players just like their stuff and where their stuff is. Yeah. And so maybe that's part of it, right?

Did he want to go? Like I think that most of us were looking at Kane staying in Chicago as sort of a, all right, this is, he's going to stick around and be like the bridge from one era to another. He's going to be the mentor. He'll be the guy who'll teach Connor Bardard how to be a superstar in this league and in this market. And he'll do that understanding that he's not going to win a cup doing it, but he's got three all. ready and he retires as a Black Hawk played his whole career on one team, et cetera, et cetera. That was the scenario that I think a lot of us were envisioning and that Kyle Davidson seemed to just shut down and say, no, we're not doing that.

Yeah, I think that, look, the way they're still bitching about it, about this whole thing in Chicago kind of implies to me that like, and the way they're trying, like, the locals are trying to be like, this rebuild's got to end. And it's like, have you seen this team this year? They're not even close to being competitive. And you don't want to do the Detroit thing of like, well, what if we just go sign Ben Chirot and Adam and Andrew Copp? That'll help us get out of this rebuk. If you get Jeff Petrie too, then you're...

Okay, well, now we're having a different kind of conversation, you know? But you see what I mean? Like, people are mad that they let Kane walk because it was a tacit endorsement of we're going to tank. And now they all love Connor Badaard. And they're trying to make, you know, Kevin Korsinski be like, you know, Duncan Keith 2.0 or whatever.

I mean, I'm sorry, if you're a Chicago fan and you're mad that they tanked. I don't know. Well, this is what I'm saying. That's how you got Connor Bader. That was the only way that that was going to play out. So, but you're right. They did such a total tear down.

Like, we have seen, I was going to say more subtle. That's the wrong. word. But we have seen more nuanced tear nails versus the Chicago way of doing it, which by the way, I'm not even, I'm not saying that as a criticism. I think there's a, there's a, an element of it where it's like, look, man, don't like pick a lane and, and go. And they, they picked a lane, which was tear the entire thing to shreds and hopefully win the lottery. And they did. But I can't imagine there were too many people realistically looking at that. that team going year two is the big lead forward. Now, year two should be the year that you don't finish bottom three. I don't think that's unfair. So, I mean, the season might be a disappointment in that sense so far.

Yeah. And look, like, he's already, Badaard's already complaining in the media about, like, I'm sick of all this losing. And it's like, well, you know, this is what you signed up. Not that he signed up to be on Chicago in the middle of a rebuild. But, like, if you're the number one pick, that's just kind of the situation.

you know um which is you know i i what else is he going to say right like right of course if he says anything that even suggests that he's like look i i know the situation uh we'd we'd like to win but we understand it's it's not going to happen a ton now everyone's going well can you build around this guy is that a winner's mentality yeah well that's the thing when when you lose you make it You make it acceptable to, like, who fucking believes that? You know, like, who is, who is watching San Jose and, like, William Macklin's like, you know what? We're losing again. I'm like 22 years old.

I think it's acceptable to lose all these kids. That just straight up isn't happening, right? Yeah. So, I don't, you know, I don't know, like, what the, what the solution is here. But like I said, like, this is the, we're looking at what the penguins are doing right now. people are about to get fired, it feels like. I don't know if you saw this yesterday, but like, did you see what the lines in practice were?

In Pittsburgh or Chicago? No, I did. In Pittsburgh. I'm going to try to, I might not get the second line right, but I remember the first line was Malkin Crosby and Raquel as the top line. They finally put the band back together. Like, that's how desperate it is. Okay.

And then the second line is, oh, God, it's Kevin Hayes. Yes, Opoly-Yarvi, I can't remember who the third guy was. But it's like that level of a guy. And it's like, well, this is your problem right here. Like, you think Kevin Hayes being on your second line is going to. Why don't you load up the first line and then you do it? And it's like, oh, okay. Oh, that's why we weren't doing it.

Right. So, like, you know, I've been, I say this about coaches when I think, you know, their time's getting up. Like, this is a guy who doesn't have any answers at this point, right? Mm-hmm. But I'll tell you this. Like who, how, I don't think there are many coaches on earth who are going to be like, I got it.

Here's the answer. You know, like I just come in and I tell Kevin Hayes to start playing like it's 2014 again. And, you know, I tell you a employee, Arvi to shoot 20%. Yeah. We're good. You know, maybe tell the expensive goalie not to be a minor leaguer. Yep. Might want to pull them aside.

But like, this is the thing is like, if you have Crosby and Malkin and Latang on the roster, not to mention Eric Carlson, a guy they went out and got specifically to extend their competitive window. And at the time, that was a move I liked, you know. Again, I guess I didn't foresee Jari being this bad. But, you know. It's, it is, it's a mess right now. And it's, I'm having an interesting week because I'm, working on a piece that I do every time, every year around this time, tied into Halloween, where it's like which players are having the scariest starts.

It's basically a chance to dump on guys who've had a bad first month. Yeah, get them. But as part of that, like, there's certain guys that are obvious picks, and then there's other guys where I've got to sit down and look at a team's roster and go, okay, who's off to a bad start that you wouldn't have expected that? Because obviously, you know, you can pick some fourth liner and be like, oh, he has no points. but you know that that's you're looking for somebody where there were some expectations and it's there are some teams where I sit down and I'm like all right damn I only pick one yeah they've got

two good players both those players are pretty good and everyone else on this team is like ugh like there's not they're they're just what did you expect what did we expect from this roster that uh and and Pittsburgh is one of those where you're just looking now that you're just looking now down the, you're like, did we think Kevin Hayes was going to blow the doors off? Again, I think you were kind of counting on a Tristan Jari bounceback season, and if anything, he's gotten worse. So, like, maybe that's the, you know, I think I had Pittsburgh making the playoffs. I look like a fucking idiot already. Well, that's, no, nothing new.

I can't remember. I'm trying, I'm thinking how much to insult you, because I can't remember if I had them. Sure. I may have as well. But, like. Let me look up my. preview. Oh, it says here, Kevin Hayes is going to blow the doors off. 58 goals, Kevin Hayes, it says here. But, yeah, it's, again, it's just a thing of, like, this is kind of what they signed up for when they were like, we got to bring everybody back.

The odds were, I think maybe you would have said, like, two, three years down the line, you're like, oh, shit, this is bleak. Mike Sullivan's about to get fired. And, you know, that train's just pulling into the station a year or too early, you know? But every time we say that Pittsburgh fans were always like, no, he just signed another four-year extension. This dude's under contract for 30 years somehow. Yeah, I feel like we looked it up last week, and it's through 27 maybe. So it's not as long as you think, but it is also still like three, four years. That's a chunk of money for your...

Now, who signed the extension? Was that did Dubas given the extension? No, it was, it was Hextal. Okay, so that makes it a little bit... How long ago did Hex? still, how long an extension was it? It was, I, again, we talked about, we literally just talked about this last week. I don't, so.

I don't listen to the podcast, uh, up to an including as we're recording it. So smart. Um, I want to say it was the, like the start of the 22, 23 season or like the off season before that. And he still had two years left on that and it was like a three year extension or something. So like his original contract is, maybe supposed to be up this year or next, and then he tacked another two or three onto the end of it.

So that's how that works. Good work by Mike Sullivan. Hey, man, big salute, brother. Forget about Mike Babcock resetting the market for salary. How about Mike Sullivan resetting the market with no, actually, I can't be a lame duck coach for two years. I need an extension. And that way, Sidney Crosby knows that if I bench him, you guys are going to stick

by me. That'll definitely happen. That's right. Yeah, again, I don't think it's Mike Sullivan's fault what's happening in Pittsburgh. It isn't his fault, but would you fire him if you're Kyle Dubas, knowing that there's just nothing else? Yeah, I mean, if you don't fire the coach, you're the one who's in trouble, the guy who, like, kind of rebuilt the roster. You think, but after 15, 15 months or whatever? You didn't have to re-sign Malkin and Lattang.

He didn't have to trade for Carlson. Did Dubos, was he the one who re-signed Malkin? Yeah, that just fucking happened. Okay. Didn't it? Wasn't it last, like, not this past summer, but the one before it? I thought it was the year. I thought it might have been the Hextal year.

I'm going to look it up now. Okay. Well, I was about to, but I'll let you do it. He was signed in 2022, so Dubas was still with the lease at that point. Yep. That was that long ago? Yep, because he's in year three of a four-year deal. Huh.

All right, well, then I take it all back, Kyle. I don't remember things too good, you know. Sill, you know. But he did make the deal for Carlson. He did make the deal for Carlson. You know, he certainly, I mean, he re-signed Sid, which nobody... No, yeah, you have, I mean... Imagine you don't sign Malkin and Latang and trade for...

Carlson and then you're like, yeah, well, let Sid walk though. Fuck it. Trade Sid for a second round pick. Start the rebuild. That's right. Honestly, like, it'll never happen in a million years. But what do you think? Like three first round picks for Crosby even now?

Yeah. If he gets the right team, you probably could. Yeah. Probably could. Call up Nashville. Hey, you guys have three first round picks this year. You want to give them all to us for Sidney Crosby? I think Nashville would fucking do it.

I think Nashville's into collecting franchise players that will, they're Yeah, we'll take a couple of stinky contracts off your roster. That's an easy sell to me if I'm Barry Trots. Let's make this happen. Okay. A, we mentioned the Sharks mere moments ago. They finally win a hockey game. Good for them.

Got it out of the way quicker this year than last year. That's right. Well, I saw an awesome stat over the weekend. I don't know if you saw this. They are the only team in the history of the NHL to open the season without a win in their first nine games. two years in a row. That's depressing and impressive given how terrible teams used to be in this league. Yeah, the capitals and what have you, yeah.

Now, say that, did you say without a win or did you say nine straight losses? Because I'm wondering if anyone got saved by ties back in the day where teams were strong. Yeah, I think the way I saw it phrased was without a win, but I didn't dig deeper than that. That's pretty bad because, I mean, it used to be that there were a couple of teams every year that were just absolute garbage. Well, good for them. Got it turned around. They certainly did. For people who didn't see, they entered the third period against Utah last night.

Utah was hosting, so this was a road game for San Jose. They entered the third period. down 4 to 1 with under 5 minutes to go in the third period a goal from Fabian Zetterland 17, 18 seconds later something like that, I'm not doing the math correctly

15 seconds later, nope, 25. There we go, we did it. 25 seconds later, Michael Grandland scores and then about a buck 25 after that, Tyler Toffoli scores. It's a 4-4 game, a buck 26 into overtime. On the power play, Alex Wendberg wins the game.

Tough for Michael Kesselring to take that hooking penalty. They scored seven seconds after the power play started. But they did it. They won a game. Utah? Looks like they're in a bit of trouble all of a sudden. That might be the worst loss in franchise history. Tough to argue, man.

Yeah. These guys did lose 4-0 to the Ottawa Senators. They've lost four straight, including last night's overtime loss. So. Yeah, it's starting to feel like maybe that's less of the feel-good story that we thought it might be. Do you know how many, so they're 4-4 and 2 right now? Do you know how many regulation wins they have? I do not.

Opening night against Chicago, that's it. Oh, okay, one. I think that's the same number of healthy defensemen they have. So two things could be linked. You're not telling lies, brother. But yeah, the wheels kind of fell off for them pretty quick there. That sucks. But that's what happens when you lose two defensemen for months.

We'll talk about that in a second. But first, I do want to talk about the other streak that ended last night. Now, Sean, this was the game you were watching. Winnipeg finally loses after winning their first eight games. And what did they? Didn't they end last season with like a shitload of, uh, of wins in a row? They ended last regular season.

Well, obviously. Yeah, so they were 8 and 0 to end last regular season. And then they went 8 and 0 to start this regular season. So that's 16 straight regular season wins, comes crashing down, lose 6-4 to the Leafs last night. A game I was flipping back and forth. They felt like they were never really in this one.

They were never, like the Leafs kind of dominated the first two, periods, but then you were sort of waiting for the Leafs to start Leafsing, and they did in the third period, and it got to 5'4, and then empty net goal. John Tobarez, hat trick for the captain. Yeah. The former captain, oops. I forgot about that. Yeah, that's true. Well, he's got the amulet now, though, so it's...

Basically the same thing. Yep. It is I liked seeing First of all From a Leafs perspective They had lost three in a row The concern was beginning to rise in Toronto

So this helps quiet a little bit of that But You know Myrtle had an article Like how nervous should we be about this Right? Yeah About various pieces of

Yeah Where things were going wrong But correct me if I'm wrong Don't the Leafs just start kind of shitty every year? Isn't that just like their whole thing? That's part of it is that like the last four years in a row. They basically started like five, four and one. Yeah.

But, you know, this is, and then at the end of the year, there are four points out of home ice and they lose game seven on the road. So, like, part of it was kind of like maybe this is the year that things are a little bit different. It's a new coach and all that stuff. Yep. Yeah. They'll get hot in the middle of February. when nobody cares and

and they'll be fine. But it was more, you know, just some bad habits and some old familiar issues starting to surface. But the bigger thing here is that, as some people may know, one of the few records that I actually care about is many, many, many years ago,

I watched The Leafs open to season 10 and 0. and establish the NHL record for longest win streak to start a season, which I acknowledge up front is a totally fake stat that, you know, it was one of those things it wasn't a record until some team did it and then we pretended anyone knew about it. But I have ever since then, like, I'm like the 72 dolphins waiting to pop the champagne court when somebody loses. And I think, I want to say the Sabres tied it at one point early.

in the cap era, but that's fake because, you know, they had shootouts and stuff. And I believe this is the second or the third time that some team has started getting close and the Leafs have shown up and broken the street, which I enjoy tremendously. Defend what's ours. Defend our territory. Defend pretty much the only good thing this stupid team has ever done in my entire life. So, yeah, the champagne got popped last night. Ladies and gentlemen, we got them, et cetera.

The record stands for another year. Yep. Hey, finally something goes the Leafs way, you know. We just never hear about these fucking guys. But yeah, I don't know. Let's pivot to the Jets here. You know, they win eight games in a row. I think a lot of us kind of expected them to take a step back.

And, you know, you can't do much better than 16 points out of your first eight games, in my opinion. So, I don't know. What do you want to say about these guys? Like, they're not playing the best hockey, honestly. Like, if you take a look at all the underlying numbers and stuff like that, they're like whatever. I haven't looked since last night's game, but like they were around like 48 after they beat Calgary,

if I'm remembering right? 48% of the expected goals. And, like, you know, you can get by on that if you have elite goaltending, which, of course, they do. I don't know that we're expecting them. to run 44% on the powerplay all year, which is what they're at right now. They're shooting 14.2%. That's not going to continue.

But they're a pretty good team roster-wise. They're not like world beaters or anything, but you look at them and you go, yeah, these guys have it a little bit, you know? And the other thing, and I've mentioned this like three or four times in columns in the last little while, just because it surprised me to see it and remind myself. They finished last year with the same regular season record as the Florida Panthers.

Exactly same. Yeah. And, you know, nobody, when the Panthers won the Stanley Cup, nobody anywhere went, oh, that's a surprise. That's not a team that I had really high in my cup rankings.

Everyone went, yeah, sure. Panthers. Absolutely. you know, championship worthy team. And here's the Jets with the exact same record. And a lot of us, and I'm including myself here, looked at them coming into this season going, eh, they'll drop down.

You know, probably third or fourth in the central, depending on no one Nashville does. Yeah. Probably still a playoff team. And yet it was essentially the same team, didn't make any big changes over the summer, that had just put up 110 point season. Right.

And I think, you know, looking back at my own stuff, I'm sort of like, did I just get a little too cute with this? Was I just a little too ready for Colorado and Dallas to be the teams and kind of chew Winnipeg out of the way? Obviously, a lot of their fans would say, yeah, that's exactly what was happening. But we're also nine games into the season. Yeah. Well, the other thing to say about it, I think, in terms of just like hedging your bets a little, is the extent to which Conor Hellebuck could keep being 920, right? Like, that's the question is, like, arguably his best season in terms of not save percentage,

but like goals, I think goals saved above expected last year was the best season he ever had. And this is a guy who, you know, if he continues another two, three years on this trajectory, he's probably a Hall of Famer, two-time Vezna winner. I think another two-time, um, Like, Vezna finalist. Like, this is one of the best goalies of his era, if not the best, quite frankly. And, yeah, last year was his second highest goal saved above expected in his career. And so, like, the idea, nope, you know what?

I take it back. It was the first 39.35 goals saved above expected. So the idea that he could still be elite. and quote unquote only save 20 goals above expected right like that I think that was kind of what I was baking into the the idea of like what's he going to do but through seven starts he's already at like four point seven goals saved above expected so like he he's still fucking doing it you know that that's basically what it boils down to um but again that's kind of it seems like it's sustainable. So I don't know what to make of the Jets now.

It's, yeah, I mean, you never bank on goaltending, just in general, but if you're going to, this is the guy you do it on. That's right. So, yeah, we will, I guess we see where it goes now, because we've certainly seen this before where a team has, you know, good team, bad team, you know, they have the big win streak and then the loss comes and that loss becomes three losses and suddenly you've canceled out most of what you gained. But you know, you'd rather have the eight wins, in my opinion. I will run the numbers, but I think you might be correct on them.

Okay. Mentioned the injuries on the blue line in Utah. Sean Dursey out four to six months after shoulder surgery. That's pretty much the whole season, unless he like really kind of accepted. accelerates his recovery, and it feels like why would you do that if things keep going the way they're going now? John Marino, a bit of a shorter timeline, lower back surgery, three to four months. Those were announced at the same time, which had to be a really fun press release to type up. And, yeah, that's, you know, devastating for a team that, you know, part of their whole selling point this offseason was we rebuilt the blue line.

You know, Jersey obviously had come in the previous summer, if I'm remembering right. But, you know, they trade for Marino and Sergeyev at the, in the second day of the draft. And I believe they also signed Ian Cole over the summer. Like, this was supposed to be a new look defense. And, you know, now they, foe, I don't know. Yep. And I'll say this, watching that Tampa game last night, they were really saying J.J. Mosher's name a lot. Now, is that a good sign or...

Well, I thought he had a pretty good game. I haven't run the numbers, but I thought he had a pretty good night. Active, if nothing else, you know. Getting the puck deep into the attacking zone and what have you. So that's all you're looking for. In St. Louis, Robert Thomas, fractured ankle, will be re-evaluated in five or six weeks. Yeah. Tough.

Very tough. Blue's off to a big piece of that team was off to a decent start Decent start I think is the exact right way to put it they are five and four right now You know what looks great for them is Broberg So again you you make a big splashy move like that and then it works Was it I think it must have been 32 thoughts I heard them saying like A lot of teams are watching St. Louis to see if these offer sheets workout.

Okay. So what we're basically hoping for is Philip Broberg, like, ninth in the Norris voting and Dylan Holloway, you know, 60-point season. And if we can get that, we will have more offer sheets. Holy shit, it worked, kind of an idea, you know? Yep. But, yeah, that's tough. You know, I don't have a ton to say about the Blues.

I think they're an okay team. that, you know, if Joel Hoffer slows down a little bit, they'll come back to Earth and, you know, probably be the team that I expect to miss the playoffs. But they're, you know, they're in kind of a weird part of their competitive cycle, let's say. That sounds right. Hey, speaking of, the New York Islanders announced Anthony Duclair is out four to six weeks with a lower body injury. Now, do you know all the, do you see all the drama that's going on with their roster situation? Well, I saw some comments by Patrick Waugh. Yeah, that's exactly.

Which he seemed to suggest that Lou LaMerello was the one setting the roster. Right. Setting the lineup, I should say. The GM sets the roster, but usually it's up to the coach who plays. They had sent down Pierre Angball famously at the beginning of the season. There's a guy with, what did he have, like four years left, five years left, three million bucks. He's not good. You know, a classic.

classic thing, who could have seen it coming, you know? Yeah. And let's see here. Pierre Engval has four years including this one. So three after this season. Three million bucks. 16 team no trade list. Tough bounce.

They had sent him down. With the Duclair injury, they had called him back up. And Patrick Ward did not seem to be especially happy to have to put him in the lineup. I wasn't getting like picked them up at the airport vibes from Patrick law on that one. I'll drop them back off if you want. Yeah. You know. And look, if you're flying from, uh, from UBS Arena to Bridgeport, that's kind of, you know, that's, that's not good for the environment, man.

That's, it's like a 45 minute drive. Just get in your fucking car, you know. Hell, you can probably take the train. Might have to change it once or twice, but, hey, that's why they have Grand Central, right? But yeah, so like that's interesting that they're kind of maybe in a little bit of a feud. I saw a couple Islanders fans being like, oh, Patrick Wall is going to quit again. This is a good. Once again, like how do I time this to be the most devastating franchise?

Yeah. And then they also gave Matt Martin a contract after, didn't he have a PTO or something during the summer? Yeah, they broke up their identity line. And now they've got two-thirds of it back. And I wonder how much of that has to do with we're 500, and we don't really seem to have a few, like a lot of answers here for how we're going to be good. They have 21 goals in eight games. That's probably not enough goals, you know.

You don't add goals by bringing Matt Martin into the fold, though. I'll tell you that. You don't. But also, I mean, Patrick Gua obviously was a goalie, but this is the guy who played in the 80s and 90s. He's going to like that sort of, you would figure. You know, the energy brings in that sort of because he's sitting there thinking about something Chris Nileon did in 1987. That's right.

Flip the switch, so. So that's tough. And then one last bit of injury news has happened last night in, what was it, like a huge loss to Columbus. I guess I missed the final score here. But, yeah, 6-1 was the final. Connor McDavid looks like he jammed his ankle or something like that on, you know, a play that you see a million times. Yeah.

Yeah. But it's not good that they sent him back to, uh, to Edmonton for further evaluation. Not at all. So, so it's, they're in the middle of a three game road trip or they, a four game road trip. Yeah. And we're, we're recording this Tuesday morning. So who knows maybe more information has come to light, uh, by the time you hear this. But at this point, we know nothing other than.

what Ryan just said, which is sent back to Edmonton for evaluation, which is not good. That is, you don't get sent home with a minor injury. Even if it was an injury where, you know, oh,

we know he's not going to be able to play next game. I will just send him home early. That typically doesn't happen. It's usually when they're concerned that there is something bigger going on. It is worth noting that the final game of this four-game road trip is in Calgary. So, you know, basically he could miss the Nashville game

and then like, you know, just again, make the drive or whatever. If you wanted to, if everything kind of checks out and they're just being super cautious, which I think is a good idea with a player of this caliber and this gravity for your organization. But couldn't have come at a worse time, in my opinion. The oilers are, go ahead, sorry. Well, I was just going to say the play that it happened on.

It was a nothing play. You'd see it a hundred times again. And I really hope that in a few hours I'm not eating these words. But it didn't look from both the play itself and the reaction. It didn't look like a significant injury. And I say from both because we've certainly seen guys have. have plays that didn't look like anything at the time that turn into something serious.

But very often you kind of can tell that the player can tell that something's wrong right away. Not even in the sense that they're rolling around on the ice, you know, banging the ice or, you know, something that they're in a lot of pain, but just that feeling of, oh, oh, that, you know, I felt a pop, I felt something that I shouldn't have felt.

And you sort of see them head off that way. And you didn't get that sense with McDavid. Like he went awkwardly in the boards, sort of like slid around and then he seemed more annoyed than anything when he, yep, on the way off the ice. So in theory, that's a good sign.

But the fact that he got sent back is, is maybe not. So we wait and see. And I mean, I don't, I don't care what team you cheer for. Like, fingers crossed that,

that he's okay. I do think the responsible thing at this point is for the Oilers to shut him down until the Four Nations Cup, though. Smart. But yeah, I was about to say that this comes at an extremely bad time for the Oilers. They are sub-500. They're four, five, and one right now.

Says here, they are how many points out of it? I've got to do the math really quickly. There are only two points out, but they have two extra games played on Vancouver. So that's not good. And out of the division, I should say. And this is maybe the most galling part of it all, honestly. They have the third worst goal difference in the entire national hockey league. The sharks number one with a bullet, negative 19.

The Flyers, negative 14, the Oilers negative 13. The Penguins, negative 12. Those are the only team in negative double digits. Predators, Utah, the ducks, et cetera, all come next. So, like, they are keeping some extremely bad company. I don't know what the solution is. They already did the fire the coach thing in November last year, you know. And it worked.

It did work, but... They're clearly not going to do that this. I think the solution is you look around and go, guys, we were here last year. And again, they were there last year. They recovered. They played great the rest of the way. No problem. Except that they ended up five or six points back.

of the Florida Panthers, which meant they played game seven of the Stanley Cup final on the road, and they lost. So these bad starts do potentially have consequences. Who knows? Maybe things work out differently if they have a few more points in the bank. So I'm not saying it's nothing, but there's a difference between nothing and panic. And I don't see panic here. Yeah, I mean, maybe you panic if the diagnosis on McDavid is, you know, a month or whatever. Well, it's, it's, yeah, I mean, but.

then, you know, it's almost the opposite of panic because what the hell are we supposed to do? Yep, sure. I'll tell you what you do. Trade Leon Drysidl, you get some draft picks, try again next year. That's right. That's what you do. Contract hasn't kicked in yet, so it's fine. Smart.

Another thing I wanted to talk about here in this early season where there's no news or whatever is have you been keeping up with, like, who leads the league in goals right now? and like how much that's changed hands? No, I have not. So I'm going to read you from the bottom of the top 10 up. Okay. Well, okay. So there are a bunch of players tied with six goals for 10th.

You got names like Artemi Paneraan, Casey Middlestadt, Mark Schifley, Matt Dushane, Brandon Hagel, Leonhardt, Leigh-Nielander, Braden Point, Jordan Everly, David Pasternack, Dylan Gunther, Paul Cotter. Paul Cotter's, you're like, wait, that can't be right. The other guys, you're not, like, super surprised to see that they've scored six goals. You go one above that. You got three guys tied with seven. Sam Reinhardt, who's off to, you know, another great start, scoring goals in Florida.

Ivan Barbashev, you're like, wait, really? Yep. That's strange. And Tage Thompson. Okay, we're back to normal. That's okay. You got another bunch of guys tied with eight. Nikita Kutchev.

Oh, okay, sure. That's an MVP-style guy, you know? Kyle Connor. Yeah, he certainly has it in him to score a bunch of goals. Excuse me. Sam Bennett. You know, again, just a guy who's having an insanely hot start famously, you know. Cole Caulfield.

That's fun. Yep. Nice to see him take a step. Ross Colton? Now, we just got some bad news on Ross Colton. He's going to be out for a while. got hurt last night. I was going to let everyone catch up a little bit.

Yeah, but he's got eight goals in ten games. Big salute. But your current leader, and this is in total goals, not goals per game, he's played three extra games than Kutrov and Connor. Right now, the Rocket Richard leader through 12 games is Nico Heeshire with nine. That rocks. Yeah, that does rock. I love this race.

Because like the other day, they were like, Cole Cawfield, time for the league leading goals. And I was like, the small goals boy is doing it. We love this, you know? We do.

And yet, like every day, he's just a different guy where you were like, no fucking way that guy's one of the top goals scorers in the league. And then you look and you're like, yeah,

Ross Colton, eight goals, same number as Cole Field and Sam Bennett. Yep. What? And no Austin Matthew, no Leandro,

Drysidal. Yeah. Drysidal, like I said, is one of the many guys tied for six, with six, I should say, tied for tenth. What's, what's Matthews up to? I want to say five, probably. Brutal. He's, yeah, he stinks. Yeah.

One of the worst goal scores we got. He does not have five yet, says he. Wow. In fact, I think we should triple shift him until the Four Nations Cup. I think we just got to wear him out. And I don't think he should play. He's 4-4-8 and 10 games. He's shooting 8.5%.

I'm going to go out on a limb here. I bet that number comes up a little bit. You know what? I think there's a good chance you're right. You know, the Cole Cawfield thing reminds me of one of those weird stats. Do you want to take a guess when the last time the Montreal Canadians, the storied Montreal Canadians, had a 40-goal score? Is it Rocket Rashar?

Do I have to go back that far? It is not. No, they did, you know. I'm going to guess like the, when they won, like around when they won the cup in the early 90s. It was the year after that. They have not had a 40-goal score in 30 years. 40 goals, not 50, not 60. 40 goals. It was Vincent Danfuss that year.

The year before, Brian Bellows in the cup year had 40. The last time they had someone score more than 40 was Stefan Rishay. Jeez, man. the end of the 80s, 89-90. So it's just a weird thing. Like, you would think, I mean, like, the Blue Jackets have had a 40 goal scores since then. Like, it's a strange thing. But maybe this is the year that ends.

What did I just see about Vincent Dampus this morning? I saw his name floated across Twitter, and I was like, wait, really? Let's see if I can find this really quickly. Was it about him having, like, 1,200 points? and nobody Yeah, so here it is Thinking about that Ren Levois wrote an article

This is the title Translated from French By Google Hall of Fame Vincent Dampoose gets help From Jeremy Roanick I guess the argument is If Jeremy Roanick's in the hall

Why isn't Vincent Dampoos? Yeah They didn't put Vinnie Dampus In a freaking video Or a movie A movie video game scene That, I mean, this is, and look, man, I love Vincent Dampus, or Vincent Damp House, as I called him for his entire rookie. Yeah, sure.

You know, we didn't know how to work back there. Great underrated player, but this is the downside when you have guys saying things like, we have to put Pierre Turgeon in the Hall of Fame because he's got the most points of anyone. Because eventually you work your way down the list and you get, like, I think if Vince Delfus isn't the, leading score among eligible players, not in the Hall of Fame, he's like within two or three spots. Yeah. So at some point, you know, it's like, and maybe that's where the Roanick thing comes in, because I think Roanick had right around the same number of points. And it's like, guys, you do, like at some point somebody has to be that guy.

And I think Vincent Daffoos is a good place to draw that line. Draw that line, yeah, yeah. Let's see here. Career, like, top. scorers who are not in the Hall of Fame. But but, but, but, let's keep scrolling here. Yeah, so Roanick had 1216. Dampoose had 1205.

Yeah, and Bernie Nichols is right ahead. Bernie Nichols is right. And I think that is it. That is the. Yes, that's right. Everyone who has more points than Bernie Nichols and Vincent Danfuse. And is either still playing or in already. Yeah.

Yeah, that's right. And of the guys who are still playing, every single one of them is going into the Hall of Fame. There's no – well, maybe Copatar is not – Well, okay. So can you name the active players who are ahead – who basically have more than 1,200 career points? You just said Copatar. It's the closest to – Well, yeah, Copatar – because I was looking at the list.

and Malkin and Kane we talked about and is there anyone else? Nope, that's it. We're not counting Yager. Next, not counting Yager. Next closest guy is Stephen Stamcoast and he's 65 away from

Dampoos. And he'll get into it by year four at the rate he's going. Yeah, that's right. After that, Claude Jureu, who's not even close, so just goes to show. It's hard to get 1,200 points.

By the way, Since we talked about Stamcoast being back, we should mention Mark Andre Fleury back in Pittsburgh tonight. That's right. That'll be a nice, another nice video. So in this case, not his return. Yeah, he's been gone a long time now. But his last game. His last game in Pittsburgh.

Until the Stanley Cup final. Just to celebrate, they are putting the Crosby and Malkin line back together. Yeah, and they're going to light them up. Oh, yeah. Crosby's like, I'm going to just destroy this. We're going to tell him it's game two of the second round in 2012 or whatever. It would be a real playoff atmosphere. Nightmare.

Yeah, memory on standby to come save us. By the way, I saw people asking this the other day. We were talking about it too. Crosby is 120 points behind Mario Lemieux for the all-time leading scorer in Pittsburgh history. Isn't that crazy? It is crazy. Obviously, Mario had a lot of different things that held him out of the lineup at various points in his career, et cetera, et cetera. But the fact that Crosby can is almost certainly going to pass that number.

It's a double amazing stat because the fact that Crosby could catch Mario feels insane. Yep. Because Mario had, you know, 1,700 points. He was one of the all-time. Ace all-time. But then you'd flip that back and you go, you know what Mario Lemieux didn't do? Play a thousand games.

Right. He only played 900 games. 915, it says here, yeah. And he's eight all-time in scoring. Like, good Lord. Yeah, he missed four seasons in his early 30s. He missed that guy a healthy 1500 game career. And he's, it's him and Gretzky,

neck and neck. And I don't think we're even talking about Ovechkin catching any goals records because Oh, no, no, no. Lemieux was more of a natural goal scorer than Gretzky ever was. Good Lord. Isn't that crazy? Wow. Which, by the way, is why don't even come at me with the, well, maybe is Crosby actually better than Mario? No. No, he's not. Peak of his powers, never, ever ever. You could argue careers. You could argue, like, whose career would you want, want the guy who's healthy, locked in.

Played one free cons. Crosby wasn't completely healthy as whole career with the concussions, but relative to. Well, that's the thing, too, is, like, Crosby would probably, you know, if he didn't, when he, when he got those, like, the really bad concussions back in what the, the, 2011 was. Yeah, 2011, that's right. When he had, though, when he was dealing with those, like, he missed a hundred-something games, like, over a three-year period.

Yep. And it's just like, yep, if he has those, he's already blown past Mario Lemieux. Like, it's not even close because he was back then, like, I'll pull it up here. Back then, he had 66 points in 41 games, pre-concussion, comes back from concussion, 37 points in 22 games, another concussion and a shorten, lockout shortened season, 56 and 36. And as I... Like that's an insane scoring rate for that era. And as I've learned...

159 points and 99 games. As I've learned from many Alex Ovechkin fans, when you're calculating someone's career totals, you have to go back and backfill every game they missed for any reason and give them credit for goals in those games too. Well, no, I'm just saying, like, if he had played those games, we're all right, like, two years ago we talked about when Sidney Crosby passed Mario Lemieux was the Penguins all time.

leading score. That's all. Yeah. That is true. Although, you know, again, with Ovechkin, like, he missed. People always say he had the 0405 lockout. He was still under contract in Russia. That doesn't count.

His rookie year in the NHL would have been his rookie year. Yeah. But they still, you know, the 11, 12 season. He lost half a season to lockout. 1213. Yeah. That's true. He did too.

And then he, the COVID and the shortened season. And the shortened season. But Gretzky missed his first year because of the WHA. So it probably all comes out in the wash. Unless Ovech can pass them, in which case it doesn't come out in the wash and Gretzky scored marbles. Because you have to also count the WHA and playoffs and preseasoned. Yeah, of course. And you know what?

Why not throw the Olympics in there just to be sure? Let's talk quickly here about a number of extent. that were signed in the last week, and then we'll get out of here. Number one, I think this was a classic puck soup curse situation, where pretty soon after we logged off, Paul Maurice signed what is being called a multi-year extension in Florida. Hard to fucking argue, huh? It kind of is. I mean, we just, we talked about Mike Sullivan getting extensions, and you never know when perceptions change.

And certainly, I think, Mori. Maurice had changed so much that we all went from like that was one of the worst hires ever to maybe not. But yeah. I think Maurice was one of, we always talk about it, one of the lame duck coaches. Was he expiring this year? I believe he didn't have a contract for next season. Absolutely get it done. Yeah.

Well, I mean, get it done regardless. Like not only obviously they won the cup last year, but they hit the fucking ground running this year and won a bunch of games without, uh, without Barkov. and Stampton, well, first of all, not Stamcoast, Kachuk. But Kachuk maybe missed four or five or something like that. And Barkov missed more than that. And they're the best team in their division. It's crazy. And also, he's so funny.

I mean, that's half the, that's half the damn reason to hire. Have we seen any numbers reported for what he got? No, no numbers, no years. Yeah. Just multi-year-al. You're right, because you've got to be careful. A lot of times with coaches and GMs, not a lot of times, but sometimes with coaches and GMs, they get kind of cute on,

we've locked him in in an extension, and then you find out it's either one year, or they've added one year onto an existing one year, so they call it a multi-year, but it isn't. I'm just curious, because I mentioned Babcock in passing earlier, and he's a guy that, remember when he signed with the Leafs, it was like he's going to reset the coaching market. This is, he views it as his responsibility to get coach's salaries up into a new.

And then it kind of didn't really happen. Like some other guys signed for higher numbers, but I don't feel like we really did reset the coach market. Yeah, no. Thanks, Rod Brindamor. But yeah, I mean, Florida, we can use this, I guess, as an excuse to talk about the Atlantic as a whole. I'm going to just read you how many teams currently are at or below 500 in the Atlantic.

Detroit, Montreal, Boston, Buffalo, Ottawa. All of them at or below 500. That means only Florida, Tampa, and Toronto are northern 500. And Toronto just over by virtue of the win last night. There's a lot of 500 teams in the league in general. And I think, was it, yesterday? At one point, five or six teams in the Atlantic were all exactly 500. Yes.

I mean, this is just Gary Bettman's dream season. Just a bunch of loser teams that are bad still getting to be 500. Yeah, so, I mean, Panthers... Eight total teams in the league are 500 right now, dead even 500. Panthers are running away. Well, not running away with it. In fact, pretty close to Tampa by points percentage, but... You...

You called them the best team in the division. I don't think that's controversial. Tampa will see. I'd like to see Tampa stick around a little longer. Totally. How worried about Boston are you? Well, Brad Marchand scored that goal. Everything's fine now.

What are you talking about? Okay. Yeah, I mean, look, all the stuff we said last week about, like, you know, the center depth never really getting filled in as filled in as it should be. and like Charlie McAvoy just kind of doesn't seem like he's popping this year. Like they have the goal tending. They have elite players at multiple positions. But to me it boils down to like it's not just the they never filled in any center depth thing.

It's like how many guys do the Bruins have on their roster that they drafted and developed who are like not who are younger than David Posternock? It's not a big list. So that to me is the big kind of. scary aspect of this is like they don't have any kind of a safety net if Marshand goes goalless for however many games. Yeah. And you got the Senators dead last in an 18 division, but also tied for fourth in terms of points percentage in the division.

Because why not? Yeah, the Senators, that was a tough weekend because they had, who was in Vegas on the ropes, looked like they were going to win that game. and end up losing, and then they lose a tough one of Colorado. Like, four and four. Vegas looks like killers, man. Vegas looks like killers. Four and four for Ottawa, though, but could have very easily been six and two,

and we're all talking about here it all is. You know, this is it. They finally got, and just a 36-hour window changes that. But, yeah, Vegas is. And like with Buffalo, too, they win three in a row. People are like, oh, we're feeling it. We're feeling it. They fucking, again, they did it against Florida,

but they fucking blew it last night. That was rough. I don't know if you saw the Dalline thing where I, fuck, who was it? He just turned around and like slashed a guy in the face, gets a stupid penalty. Florida immediately scores on the power play game runs away from him. That's the end of that. But they were looking good for a little while there. That was another game.

Good old Detroit. Hanging right around 500. I saw a headline, and I think it was the Detroit Free-Defamation. press over the weekend that was like, they're looking like a playoff team. These guys are? Are they? Are they really? You can tell they haven't made the playoffs in a while because they watched this Detroit

team and they were like, they're putting it all together, you know? You might want to watch the playoffs and see what an actual playoff team looks like before we call these Detroit Red Wings, a playoff team. But, yeah, I just think the Atlantic is a fascinating division because, you know, for as interesting is like, you know, the top of the Pacific is like the kings are weirdly successful. Obviously, the central is like four, three of the five best teams in hockey are in the central right now.

Just the way the standings are working out. Something like that anyway. And like, standings wide. Yeah, Winnipeg, Dallas, Minnesota. Yeah. Not even counting Colorado who are still digging out. Right. And then, like, you know, the top of the, top of the metro, New Jersey, New York, Carolina, and whatever, and Washington weirdly hanging around, too.

How about Columbus a game over 500? Wow, good for them. It's fair, man. But, beat the Oilers plus eight goals differential. That's right. Again, most of that was last night, but that's fine. You know, they don't, in the final accounting, they don't go, well, we got to take this one game where you absolutely beat the shit out of your opponent. We got to take this off the books.

You typically don't say, yeah, but if we disregard the game where they beat the crap out of the Stanley Cup finalist. Yeah. But the Atlantic is just like, you know, there are two teams where you're saying, yeah, no problems there. Tampa and Florida, you got it. You guys are doing great. But like, I just said, Toronto, the third place team in that division just had an article this weekend. What's wrong with these fucking guys? You know, like, it's so funny to me.

But anyway, I mentioned some extensions here. We got one for Vegas. Extend Shea Theodore, one of the last remaining original misfits. Seven years, 7.425 million. Checks out for me. Yeah. Good player. Good team.

These sort of long-term commitment that a loyal franchise like Vegas is happy to make. Yeah. Yeah. So when he's on the Calgary Flames in three years, you know, we're all going to feel great about it. But yeah, no, did I just say Calgary because that's who they played last night? I don't know. But yeah, just like I never know how to take a long-term extension in Vegas, really. But you can't argue with the results so far this year, you know.

It lines him up with Noah Hannafin contract-wise because Hanoffin got eight. great this year. No, but I think at some point you kind of just go like, okay, those are your top two defensemen once Petrangelo retires. Well, Petrangelo still has like two years left on his deal, I think. But yeah, you know, I got nothing bad to say about this deal other than it takes him until he's like 37, which is never where you want to be. But six, seven years from now, who knows what the fucking league looks like,

who knows what it looks like in Vegas with the roster and everything. So, dude, you know, you just did a bang on impression of every GM signing a seven-year contract. Thank you.

Hey, who knows? The point is I saved, I got him to drop the cap hit by $50,000 this year, so. Well, you know, if seven years from now

the salary caps $15 million or whatever, who gives a shit about seven and a quarter or whatever it is, 7.425? You're just, and for a 37-year-old,

you're like, yeah, that's just what 37-year-olds get paid in the league these days. I don't know what to tell you, you know. Good player, good extension. I like that one.

Another one I really like. Very similar number here. Alexis Lafrenier. Seven years, 7.45 million to stick around in New York. Stop me if you've heard this one before. I'll do the exact same reaction I've done. Lord knows how many times. I do not understand why a first overall pick entering his prime

just having a breakout would lock in for seven years. I do not get it. And every time I say this, someone's like, oh, so you would say no to 50 million? Well, no, but I wouldn't say no to 5 million. So where's the line? Like, why didn't he take a million a year then? If we're, you know, just saying that he should take any number

that's life-changing money. So I... This is going to look so good for the Rangers in a year, let alone four or five years. You just said, I don't know what the league's going to look like. Yeah, the cap's going to be a lot higher. And top six, probably top three wingers, are going to be making a lot more than seven million.

Well, let me start with this. I really like how he has played with Artemey Panarin and Vincent Trojeck. Right? Like, once that change got made, he took off like a fucking shot. He's an awesome player with an MVP caliber guy on the opposite wing and a veteran center who is signed for, I don't know, five or six more years, I think. Artemi Panarin's contract is up in two years, including this one. So after next season, his contract is up. I do wonder what that means for Lefrenier because we've seen him play with Mika Zabanajad and it didn't really work, you know?

We've seen him play with, look, Philippeitel and, and, uh, and, uh, and Cabo Cago, those guys are having great, uh, seasons as depth guys. Like the underlying numbers are like in the 60s. Those guys, the bottom six in New York is going psycho right now. It, it's awesome to see that, to watch them play. They're just playing really good hockey. But I don't think you can sit here and argue that like those guys were when he was being extremely productive, you know, um, but,

that having been said, he's only playing with Panarin and Trochec at five on five. He's still on the second power play unit, Lefrenier. So the idea that like, let's say maybe Panarin goes away or, you know, he's three years from now, he's not what he is today or last year or whatever. Maybe you can move Lefrenier up to the top poplar. powerplay unit and you move Sabanajad or whoever off and, you know,

he finds that extra level of production. I don't know that you're super needing him to be more productive than he already is at 7.45. But just the way people are now talking about him, he's in his ascendancy and all this.

I wonder what the ceiling is if this is how they're going to keep using him. You know what I mean? Like five on five with the top line, second power play, I can't remember off the top of my head what he had last year, but I want to say he had like 29, 30 goals and like maybe 35 assists or something. Again, I like the player. I like the contract a lot.

Yeah, 28 goals, 29 assists last year. I don't know how much, the way they're using him, I don't know how much more you're getting out of him than that right now. But I mean, you presume that if Panarin leaves, he moves way up the lineup. Is he not? I mean, is he not your... Well, right, you know, like he would be...

That's what I'm saying is he would probably move into the top powerplay unit to replace Panarin, even though obviously they play on the, you know, they play on the opposite wings from each other at five on five. But, you know, is the... And look, I'm not even saying, like, don't break up the Rangers top power play unit. It's been fairly successful, right? Like, we can all agree that that's, like, one of the reasons. They've been as good as they have in the regular season the last few years.

But, you know, it's just one of those things where I, again, I wrote a whole article about how this is a great contract for a very good player. I'm just curious what you think his ceiling is if they're going to, like, Panarin has 15 points in, in eight games. Lefranier is eight points in eight games. Yeah. Right? I think his ceiling is probably, with this sort of usage, is probably point-of-game player. And as the usage increases, as he continues to earn trust, I think. Yeah, he only plays 18 minutes a night.

That's weird. He's 23. Just turned 23. Yeah, he's been, what, yeah, that's the other thing, too, is like, you know, there was a lot of talk about, like, oh, is he a, but, like, I think, I think you can more say, Kako is, is the bust of the high-picked range. Don't say that. Don't say that. He's only been, he's only had nine years.

He had a really good shift on the checking line in the playoffs last year. Dude, if you watched the games. This is Lefrenier's fifth year in the league. Yep. Right? 79 points or 79 goals 156 points. There aren't,

I think Stutz was the only guy in that draft class who has been more productive. And obviously he's in a totally different situation where they're like, fucking play 14 minutes. it's a game on the top power play unit. What do we care? We stink, you know? Whereas the Rangers are going for it. They don't want to, you know, use a kid in a high leverage situation.

And everybody in that draft year basically had a really fucked up development where it's like, you know, if you played in the OHL, you probably missed a bunch of games. And you probably couldn't practice very much in your draft year and all that kind of, or the summer after your draft year. and then you come into the league, 56 games, season, all this, like it's, and then LeFranier's only being used at five on five, this is about as productive as you could expect a player to be, basically, given all the circumstances.

But if you're doing like a redraft of the 2020 draft, is he first still? Yeah, I don't know. You know what, I'm wrong. Lucas Raymond has more. has more points in fewer games than the front of year does. And what did Lucas Raymond just get? Yeah, that's exactly right.

Pretty similar. Yeah, I don't know. I'm just saying if I'm a player, I'm going to my agent, like, give me three years. And then let's see where we're at when I'm a 90 point guy. Yeah, I mean, it takes two to tango, right? Like if the Rangers are like, we're not giving you three years, you know, like. Well, then you say, okay, if it's seven years, I want 10 million.

I get it. But look, they have their own, they have their own different negotiation going on with a guy who maybe wants to play a little fun in games with term and big money. So, yeah. Anyway, one last extension here to talk about. We got another one, folks.

It's another deferred money to reduce the cap hit contract for Jake McCabe, Five years. Time to pretend I understand what that means. 4.51 million, but he's actually getting paid 4.7 or something like that. Pretty fun. I love these deferred money because, you know, he currently lives in Ontario. From what I understand, they pay taxes up there.

It's first time hearing of it. Yeah. And I don't look into that. And then, you know, when he retires, he's going to move to Florida or whatever. And now I don't have to pay taxes on this. That's right. And the tax people will be like, ah, darn it. He's got, he's got like shell corporations, you know?

Yeah, exactly. I don't know what's going on. Decent deal. He's been a good player. Good player, yeah. It's certainly not a crazy cap hit. The term is a little too much, but. Well, he's bringing that number down.

He's bringing the number down. The one thing is, this is now, I think the leaf. have got like 15 of their guys on this year's team signed through next year. Okay. That feels like a lot, especially for a team that we're told is like, this is it, man. Last chance. Well, I'll tell you what feels like a lot. I get what you're saying, obviously.

Next year I'm not super worried about. How about 2028 when they are paying Morgan Riley, Chris Tanev, Oliver Ekman-Larsin, and Jake McCabe combined $20 million against the cap. Yeah, that's basically as somebody, one of the beat reporters, tweeted out yesterday. They're like, this is, they've got their blue line for the rest of the Matthews Prime. This is it. This is what they got. And look, Ekman Larson has been really good for the first month.

Surprisingly good. But how are you going to feel about that three years from now, you know? Yeah. because this is the other thing. And how's Brad Trilliving going to feel about it? You know what? Pretty good because he's going to be either on a beach or in some other front office going. Yep. Not my problem.

This is the other thing, though. To that point, Sean. Morgan Riley, currently 30 years old. Chris Tannov currently 34 years old. Oliver Eckman Larson currently 33 years old. Jake McCabe currently 31 years old. So not only, like this isn't locking up your top four of your, your, your, your top four of your defense for another four years.

And like, they're all 27. Yep. You know, the idea that the wheels are, we've been saying the wheels are going to fall off on Chris Tannav for, for four or five years now, just given his injury history, you know? Mm-hmm. But like, I don't know that I want to be paying, you know, guy who gets hurt all the time, Chris Tanev,

four and a half million bucks when he's like 37, 38 years old. Nope. Same with Oliver Ekman-Larsen. Jake McCabe, obviously, a little younger, but like, it's just the... And clearly the plan there is, well, you won't be because they'll be on LTIR, there'll be this or that. And I do, I have over the years gone from thinking long-term contracts are death to, you know what, these things are easier to get out of than maybe we gave credit for. So maybe I should calm down a little bit. But, anyways, I like Jake McCabe.

And unlike some of those other guys, like, it really does feel like this is a discount. Oh, yeah, for sure. He could have gotten five plus on the open market. Absolutely. I think so. So, yeah, I like the player in Toronto. I think, you know, since he got there, he's been very good. You know, for, again, for his role, you're probably not going to find too many fourth defensemen

who were better than Jake McCabe. And especially, you know, at the, is Chicago eating like half his cap hit or something like that? It's been a bargain. Yeah, Chicago, so they gave up a first in order to get Chicago to eat half the cap hit. That's right. So he's been fantastic value. He's probably been the best value on the team as far as.

Two million bucks to be that good. Yeah, absolutely. But it's not two million bucks anymore. Nope. And it's not ending this year anymore either. that's the, you know, look, what does Brad True Living love more than giving someone a contract he later buys out? Mm-hmm. Boston pizza?

Maybe that's it, you know? But anyway, yeah, I like all the extensions signed this week. How many weeks do you think I can say that in the history of NHL hockey? That is extraordinarily rare. Four extensions, one for a coach, three for players. and every single one I'm like thumbs up no problems for me again come come talk to me in like four or five years

maybe I feel different but oh wait this is just come in a Leafs X-10-5 million fold down trade clause they would too something and yeah and like Bradcher living at the press conference he had like spirals in his eyes and was saying something about an amulet

so by the way can I just say one thing before we finish yeah absolutely Darrell Ray was the voice of in the late 90s. Late 90s. That's how far back we got to go. I thought it was three years ago, but it was 1999.

Okay. I feel like I was playing NHL face-off in NHL 2K at the time. I had moved away from the EA model. The 2K game is, I think the last 2K game, one of the better ones ever in NHL hockey history. That was back when the 2K game. games got too good and EA was like, we gotta shut this down. Well, I mean, they really did it because the football game was eating Madden's fucking lunch.

The football game was so fun. Oh, my God. Did you ever play the football? Like, I know you, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Did the NBA game do the NFL thing where they had like the highlight shows at halftime from around the league? Yeah, I'm pretty sure they did. It's so good. I would like play the game just to get to halftime and have like little computer Chris

Berman. Can I tell you what my favorite? aspect of those games was was like the trophy room for like when you passed various milestones. Yes. Yeah. And like you, you know, you could, you could be like, okay, I'm, you know, I'm only like 12 touchdowns away from, from Tim Brown's record or whatever, you know, I don't, Jerry

Rice, I guess is probably the all-time receiving touchdowns guy. But yeah, I just remember being like, this is what it's all about, man, the fucking trophy room. And like, even the NBA 2K games now, like, they, they do a really good job of like, you can look up a crazy number of like all-time leaders and single-season leaders and stats and like chase those numbers. That's what makes it fun to me. And then the NHL is like, I'll tell you who the top five in all-time goals is.

How does that sound? And you're like, yeah, I guess that's fine. I don't know. Whatever. You got it. Why don't we have you do the plugs and get the hell out of here? You can find me at the athletic. I've got my scary starts piece coming up, and the weekly ratings are back on Mondays,

and they're far better than those scoundrels on Friday. And I have a podcast with one of those scoundrels on Wednesdays, the Athletic Hockey Show with other Sean Gentilly and Frankie Carrado. So check that out. And then for me, you know, go over through E.P.Rankside.com. You can sign up using the code I Love EP. Get 15 months for the price of 12 when you do that. And yeah, the Puck Soup.

Patreon is patreon.com slash puck soup. We do all kinds of bonus episodes and all that kind of stuff. You can check that out too. You'll have a good time over there. Me, Sean, and Greg just recently did an episode where we drafted full rosters of players. And every round we had to draft a different jersey number that was selected at random. by a random number generator. So like if, you know, 51 came up, we'd be like, uh-oh, you know.

And I'd not to give too much away, but there was a point where 99 did come up. And Sean got Wayne Gretzky and me and Greg had to get the other two guys who were 99. Spoiler, man. Don't tell him who I took. Well, you know, I think the one is... I got first pick of the 99s. Yes, that's right. You're just going to have to guess how that played out.

That's right. Okay, thanks for listening. folks, and we'll be back next week. See you later. Bye-bye. Bye-bye.