Purple Insider - a Minnesota Vikings and NFL podcast - Another sign Max Brosmer is starting and Thanksgiving Day reaction

Episode Date: November 28, 2025

Matthew Coller talks about the Vikings signing Desmond Ridder, another sign that Max Brosmer is in, a concerning O-line injury report and Thanksgiving Day game reactions Purple Insider is presented by FanDuel Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See https://pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Hey, everybody, Hey, everybody, welcome to another episode of Purple Insider, Matthew Collar here. and the show is always presented by Fandul. Happy Thanksgiving to all of you. I am incredibly grateful and thankful on this day. To all of those who listen to the show or watch the show or support the newsletter, Purpleinsider. Dot football.

Make sure you go check that out. There's going to be a little Black Friday deal over there on Friday. So check out Purpleinsider. Football. We got some notes about the Vikings. We got some Thanksgiving reactions, five questions from Vikings fans who have emailed or direct message me, and I haven't gotten to it yet.

And also, Mani Hill does not take a day off from picking the schedule, no matter the holiday. So he is coming up shortly as well. Let's begin with the Vikings notes. Desmond Ritter signed to the practice squad, which more or less confirms that J.J. McCarthy will not be playing for the Vikings on Sunday. They needed an emergency quarterback. And Desmond Ritter was also here earlier this year. John Wolford, though, will very, very likely be the backup quarterback.

McCartney was limited again in practice on Thursday. Again, all signs have pointed for days to Max Brosmer being the guy this week. But he may be short a couple of offensive linemen, Donovan Jackson and Chris Adirisaw still did not practice on Thursday, which makes it very much up in the air if those guys could play on Sunday. So welcome to the National Football League potentially here, Max Brozmer. even if either one of those guys plays, you're talking on a limited basis with they're trying to battle through their injuries, not ideal in any way against a very, very good

Seattle Seahawks defensive line. So Justin's school, Blake Brandel on the left side of the offensive line, a good thing that one of Max Brosmer's major skills is getting rid of the football quickly because he is going to likely need to do that. We will wait until the Friday report officially comes out. No practice on Wednesday or Thursday for Derrissau is not great. Jonathan Grenard was still limited. That's not ideal either.

He's been battling the shoulder injury trying to come back and he's been in practice but has not practiced in full since he had the injury. And Dallas Turner also on the injury report with a hip, that's not ideal either, just considering that he has done a good job in filling in for Jonathan Granard in these last few games. But he was still limited, so did participate to some extent in practice. but that might be something to keep an eye on because in terms of backups, they don't have many behind Dallas Turner.

That's why when he's filled in for somebody, he's pretty much had to play the entire game, although Eric Wilson has kind of become an edge rusher of sorts as well, despite being undersized. But he's been the outside linebacker at times. I guess he would probably take the most of the reps if Turner was banged up. But I don't know that he's at risk of missing the game, but did show up on that.

injury report as being limited today. Let's talk about Thanksgiving Day games here. I mean, the Green Bay Packers pulling out a win against the Detroit Lions, a great football game overall. Unbelievable halftime show with Jack White and Eminem showing up and Jack White Rock in the House with the blue guitar. It was, it was great. It was great.

It was exactly what you would hope for from a halftime show. That was a major highlight. But also, Jordan Love played great. Micah Parsons played great, and all of a sudden, Matt LaFleur, two weeks ago, is being asked about his job security and now the Green Bay Packers look like one of the strongest teams in the NFC. It just kind of shows you about how we can overreact to one game here, one game there, but the reality is the Packers are one of the best teams in the NFC. I think what you really see from Jordan Love is under the right circumstances, when he's on fire, there are very few quarterbacks that are better than Jordan. love when he's really cooking. And he made some incredible throws down the field, some short area stuff, like a little outrout touchdown that he had in the game. And then,

you know, they finish off the game not giving Detroit another chance with a great throw off his back foot. I mean, the unfortunate truth for all of you Vikings fans is that Green Bay once again is going to be in the playoffs and they're going to have a chance to compete for the Super Bowl. And I also think that when we have these arguments about Jordan Love, Dak, Prescott, a number of quarterbacks that are very, very good,

but maybe not perfect. You know, even Jared Goff is another one of them. I think the frustrating part about those is that quarterbacks like this kind of have ups and downs. And Sam Darnold, who the Vikings are going to face on Sunday.

We saw that even last year in his greatest season, where there will be ups and downs. It's not going to be every single week. The guy is just a megastar, and he is flawless and he never has a bad outing or makes a bad mistake. But when they are clicking, like Jordan Love was against the Detroit Lions, it was as good as you will see quarterback play.

And that is what I'm sure every Vikings fan is being made nauseous to think about, is that team going into the playoffs and having Micah Parsons come through and end a game the way that he was able to do against Detroit. just another incredible performance from him, some sort of other record that Micah Parsons has set. I mean, the Dallas Cowboys giving the Green Bay Packers a team in their conference, that player is absolutely ridiculous. It was still a good game for Jared Goff,

but I think what you see is Frank Regnow is coming back, which was a shock to everybody. If you hadn't heard that, you'd be like, wait, wait, what did you say? Yeah, Frank Ragnow is coming back to that team, but it's a week too late. I mean, because now the Detroit Lions, They might not have room for another loss the entire rest of the season. And you could see in this game that their interior offensive line play has really killed them.

I mean, Gibbs is great. Jameson Williams is great. Amun Ross St. Brown got hurt. La Porta's out. Their injuries have been a major, major issue on the offensive side. But that interior offensive line has just been problematic in Green Bay was able to take advantage in Parsons and that D-line and the pressure they create in Green Bay. Kind of feels like it's built for the playoffs. Again, I know that's not what anyone wants to hear,

but giving them Parsons, that was the megastar talent that they were missing all along. And I think it really showed on this day. I also think that those folks who were looking at Detroit saying, hey, they may regress. I thought that they would regress and still be really good. And I think they are a good team. But I think they also exactly regress the way that people thought.

You lost your offensive coordinator. now your head coach has to call plays and your offensive line loses a couple of guys, Zitler and Ragnow and it's not the same and that has really, really showed for the Detroit line. So now they're going to have to fight tooth and nail to get into the playoffs. Probably not a place that they expected to be in their timeline

coming off a 15 win season. But here they are after that. Dallas, who is on the Viking schedule. By the way, the Vikings had to play both of those teams, Detroit and Green Bay. I think what we're seeing is two teams that it might be very important to at the end of the season. It might be very much still in the race on Christmas Day for Detroit. And it might be the Green Bay Packers fighting for the division at the end of the year

and the final week of the season against the Vikings. So those will be likely, I think, two very motivated teams that they will be going up against. And with Ragnow back, that should be a factor in the way the Vikings played against them previously. now Dallas and Kansas City another great football game just fireworks everywhere big time quarterback play but I'm watching this thinking about the Vikings in two weeks playing against the Dallas Cowboys and I can't help but think how are they going to stop C.D. Lamb and George Pickens Dallas is playing a lot better football than I think anyone would have expected them at this point to be playing after they kind of fell down there.

They were in a pretty bad rut Looked like, oh, it's going to be another wasted year. Quinn and Williams is destroying things on the interior for their defense, and it is totally changed who they are. And now Pickens and C.D. Lamb have really come alive with their chemistry. They're running the football very well. That's one where, you know, the Vikings, I think maybe three, four weeks ago, you're looking at the schedule and saying, well, you know, all right, Dallas,

it's a winnable game. feels a lot less winnable after the way that they played against Philadelphia, coming back to beat them from down 21, and then hanging on against the Kansas City Chiefs. Not saying that Dallas is a perfect team and their defense is still vulnerable, as you saw. Reddy Stewart, a former Viking third teamer in training camp, is out there playing a bunch of reps for Dallas.

So they're still not a great defense. And if J.J. McCarthy is back, he will have an opportunity to get. get the ball to Justin Jefferson. We saw it with Rashi Rice. We saw it with Xavier Worthy, that Mahomes was able to make a lot of plays to open wide receivers. But they are playing much better defensively than they were earlier in the season.

And those two wide receivers. I mean, I think it could end up being kind of like we saw against Philadelphia with Devante Smith and A.J. Brown. It was just very hard for the Vikings to guard either one of them one-on-one. That's what they're going to look to do. I also wanted to say that I've been very impressed. with Brian Schottenheimer.

I thought it was a little unfair when he got fired, or I'm sorry, but he got hired for folks to talk about just what a, you know, cheap hire, Jerry doesn't care, that kind of stuff. And like, I get it, I get it. But we never really know how good someone's going to be until they're in that job. And for him to guide them through the Marshon-Neiland tragedy and then get them back on track still, a team that is under so much scrutiny all the time, to revamp that offense, to get them pushing the ball down the field to those receivers and

make it plays. It's been impressive. It's been a very impressive coaching performance from Brian Schottenheimer. And he deserves a lot of credit. And the last thing is now, Kansas City kind of needs a miracle to get into the playoffs. They need to win every game. And then they might still need help, even if they win every game the rest of the way. There is a real possibility that the bills and the chiefs will not be in the playoffs.

And that is insane. You talk about can't predict what's going to happen in the National Football League. Wouldn't have guessed it in a million years. I think that the regression of Kansas City was coming. And when we talk about those one score games from last year, I think the big difference is that last year they could get a stop on defense. This year, they just can't get it. Every time they needed a stop against Dallas, especially at the end of the game,

somebody's wide open. They don't pressure the quarterback. They're not as good at stopping the run. run last year they had a top-notch defense. So they played this very kind of safe offense. Don't turn the ball over field position. And that just was not the case from what we saw on Thanksgiving Day and really hasn't been the case all year. And if you have to kind of play like that, then you are going to be more vulnerable. And I think what we've finally seen is that the team of the Kansas city chiefs that was surrounding Patrick Mahomes for years has corroded to the point where

they're just a bad roster. And this has happened to other quarterbacks who are at Mahomes's level. Tom Brady even had some years where it wasn't 14 wins. It wasn't 13 wins. And at the end of Tom Brady's time there in New England, their roster had completely come apart. And then he goes to Tampa Bay and ends up winning the Super Bowl with a great roster. So it is true that quarterbacks even at their absolute greatest cannot do everything and circumstances play into it. And there's been a lot of little things. They got a lot of calls against them in this game. Not saying that those calls were wrong,

but a lot of calls did go against them. And they might end up being out. And that just adds a whole new layer of intrigue. But also, I think that if you're the Los Angeles Rams and you're looking over to the AFC and going, oh, no Kansas City maybe? Like that's, you look around and go, well, who's it going to be? Denver, Indy, New England. These teams feel like they're good, but can they really win the Super Bowl?

Can Lamar Jackson come far enough to make things interesting for Baltimore? So much interest in the AFC right now. So let me get to your questions. I got five questions here from Vikings fans that were sent to me, emails, DMs. You can always hit me up. Or if you sign up for the newsletter, submit questions for the Friday mailbag. Love to do those. got one coming out on Friday as well.

I want to throw out Fandul question of the day, which is, so for Sunday's game, I can't say I've seen a number like this. There is not a lot of confidence in the Fandual betting market in Max Brosmer. The over-under for him on Sunday is 169.5 yards, which is much lower than any J.J. McCarthy number has been all season long. What is a reasonable stat line? for Max Brosmer playing against the Seattle Seahawks on Sunday with his over under on Fanduil being 169.5. For me, I would say it's, let's say, 21 for 32 with a touchdown and

an interception and maybe 215 yards. That, that I think is pretty reasonable. That means you played average quarterback, got the ball to some of your receivers, completed 21 passes, move the football, stayed on the field a little bit, but probably were not good enough to defeat the Seattle Seahawks. That would be my expected stat line. Down in the comments, let me know what yours would be. Let's get to these questions from Vikings fans, and then Manny Hill will pick the schedule.

So starts out with James. James says reading between the lines of the athletic article from Diana Rossini, it sounds like there was suspicion in the building that McCarthy might not be ready, So why wasn't there a better backup option? Judd said he, Judd shows up on the show a lot. Judd said that he thinks that they were blindsided by Jones signing with the Colt. So I agree with Mr. Zolgad that they, I think, had an expectation that Daniel Jones was going to sign in Minnesota.

They brought him in last year. He agreed to come to the Vikings, even though there were other teams that would have put him on the field right away. he decided to, after he left the Giants, just all behind the scene stuff, working with Kevin O'Connell, working with Josh McCown, behind Sam Darnold, I don't believe he was ever active for a game. Maybe he was, but I don't remember exactly if he was even active for any games. So Daniel Jones didn't throw a pass as a Minnesota Viking, but the thought was if he forms the relationships, if he's around the building, if he sees how things operate, then he will

want to be a Minnesota Viking. But I think what surprised them maybe a little bit was the opportunity that he got in Indianapolis. And at least from some of the reporting, I think the Vikings actually did put down maybe a little more money for Daniel Jones or maybe it was more guarantees. I forget exactly what the report was, but they made a healthy offer to Daniel Jones. And I think what he was looking at is what's the actual opportunity to start. Daniel Jones is a smart guy.

I mean, he had to be aware that J.J. McCarthy was the golden boy in Minnesota. The way he had been talked about by the coaching staff, the way that the fans last year are wearing McCarthy jerseys in the stands. The fans were certain that that was going to be their franchise quarterback. He was new. He was coming in for the first time. So no one's ever seen him before. But that means a ton of excitement.

It also means he's done no wrong at that point. versus Indianapolis, where that franchise was out on Anthony Richardson. They were done giving chances to Anthony Richardson. The whole tapout thing pretty much ended his time in Indianapolis, and Jones had to know that. He had to figure, I've got a much better chance to start in Indianapolis, and that I believe did surprise the Vikings that they were not able to keep him around. Here's my thing, though, about talking about the backup quarterback situation.

at no point would any of you, fans, if you go back and think about where you were at with J.J. McCarthy before training camp in the offseason when they let San Darnold go. When Darnold left, there was a celebration in Minnesota from Vikings fans. They wanted Darnold out, and I think it was probably 95-5 percent, wanted Darnold out and J.J. McCarthy in. And had they signed Daniel Jones and said it was going to be a quarterback competition, I think you guys would have rioted. I think you would have been like, no way, what are you talking about? There's no competition here.

And there's a good chance that Daniel Jones, with the experience that he had, would have won the competition, which I think would have driven Vikings fans insane. I don't think they would have liked that at all, the fan base, because they wanted to see J.J. McCarthy. He was the chosen one. He was the draft pick. He was supposed to be the guy that they were going to build the roster around and the rookie contract thing, the playmaker, the Vikings fans were not at all thinking about, yeah, give me

another retread from another team and do that again. No, that's not what anybody wanted. I think Jones knew that. He knew that even if he outperformed J.J. McCarthy, he was not going to be the starting quarterback week one. I'm also not so sure that the season plays out that much differently if you have Daniel Jones because there would have been a lot of apprehension to benching J.J. Carthy. If he played poorly, when was that going to be? Like, he got hurt against Atlanta.

So if Jones played similarly to Carson Wentz or even went three and two, everybody would have wanted JJ back. And then when are you benching him? You would have continued to play him through these last three weeks. I don't think it would have mattered that much, save for one thing. You would have Jones for next year. If you sign him to a multi-year contract, then you would at least have him for next year. And you'd be able to say, all right, well, man, he's, man. competition for next year, but you've got a starting quarterback here and in a game like this against Seattle. I'd rather see Max Brosmer than somebody else.

So I'm not sure that that really makes a huge difference. But to your point about inside the building, here is what I will think about that when it comes to dissension inside the building. Reminds me of a story that I was told by a former scout. He told me about, used to work for the Buffalo Bills about Sammy Watkins, when the bills drafted Sammy Watkins. They traded a first round pick to move up and get Sammy Watkins. And after he was not the receiver that they had expected, there was a lot of, hey, I wasn't on board with that. I wasn't on board with that. There's a lot, there's some leak into the media.

Oh, some people inside the building were not all in on that. Well, he said, I don't remember you speaking that loudly in the meetings. Now, I'm not saying that someone didn't within the Vikings organization, that there wasn't someone who dissented, the meetings usually go this way. Like, you'd be surprised how much an NFL team could be just like an office job. You have a meeting and you have a discussion and then a boss makes a decision. And in this case, the bosses are the Wilf's, Kevin O'Connell, and Quasi Adaf Omenza. Those are the bosses.

Those are the guys who make the final calls. And it is one boss reporting to another boss. So you go into the meeting and you talk about should we get Roger, Should we bring back Darnold? Should we go with J.J. McCarthy? You come to a decision. You go to ownership. Here's our decision.

Do you sign off on it? Ownership says, yes, it's J.J. McCarthy. That's how it works. That's why I say it's everybody's fault. I'm sure that someone in those meetings said, are you guys sure? Because this guy hasn't thrown a lot of passes and, you know, he lost the weight during the injury.

And like, are you sure? And what they would have said back, based on public comments is we believe in what we've seen for McCarthy behind the scenes and in 2024 training camp, and we need to have interior pressure, interior blocking. If we're ever going to really win something in the playoffs, we can't run out there with Dalton Reisner at right guard and just hope and dream that that's going to stop the Los Angeles Rams. I think that the Rams loss really got into their heads, maybe even more so than the Lions game because the Lions game was Darnold just not being good enough and the Rams game was

they're a better team than you and they you were out coach too but I mean I think they were just built to beat you right so they wanted to have a roster that could hey okay they're beating us at this but now we can hand the ball off which they've actually they're actually top 10 yards per carry so they actually have improved the running game it just hasn't mattered that much when you're 31st and quarterback rating as a team but that that was the theory And that was the thought. And enough folks in that building agreed with the leadership and they signed off on it and they're all responsible. That's how I look at it.

I don't look at it as abnormal that there would be someone for such a controversial decision or multiple people inside of a building that were saying, are you sure? But I don't think that if it's being painted as like, oh, yeah, a bunch of people in the building were trying to tell them not to do it. I don't know about that. That just doesn't seem like the right retelling of it. Like, this is the leadership and that's who's responsible for it. And ultimately, the pressure now is on Kevin O'Connell and Quasi Adolph-Mence it to fix it, whether that's with J.J. McCarthy or not. But they're the ones that the ownership trusts.

And, you know, someone also asked me if, you know, the Wilf's, like, are to blame and so forth. Like, the Wilfs are always going to trust their football people. I think that's what makes them good owners is that they should believe in the football people. But here's the reality. The football people don't always get it right. And this one, to me, was a bit of a forest through the trees. You kind of missed what was right there in front of you, which was your quarterback has to be a certain level, which is very high to actually win in the NFC North.

And J.J. McCarthy was not ready to be at that level. And that's what they missed. next email comes from Bryant says how does the guy who says organizations fail quarterbacks more than quarterbacks fail organizations balance that during the off season surely he meant when he said that that there has to be a baseline foundation to start with there's quarterback whisper and then they're sabotaging yourself to prove a point as great of a quarterback guru as KOC is even he couldn't make Jamarcus russell or Christian ponder or Josh Dobbs into a world of competent starting quarterback play.

Does he keep banging his head against the wall next year and attempt to prove that he can create a decent quarterback out of McCarthy or do they draft a quarterback? I don't see any world where they could really draft a quarterback. I mean, in a theoretical one, it's a good idea. Yeah, of course. But 2026 doesn't have time to bring in another rookie and try to figure that out again. 2026, the team is so good, you're actually looking at Indianapolis and going, hey, actually, that's got to be us, where you take a decent quarterback with a great roster and you get a lot out of it, similar to what they did in 2024, where it's not going to be someone who is maybe the most talented quarterback. I don't think Buffalo is trading you Josh Allen or Baltimore is trading you Lamar Jackson, but maybe it is Gino Smith or something.

maybe it is Mac Jones or something and all you're trying to do is can you get good quarterback play great defense the defensive roster can be added to I know the cap situation is tough but when you really look at it they could create enough space to make a move or to there and you draft a top 15 player you stay in the top 15 because that's where stars are taken and you go from there I don't think they're in a position with the pressure that's going to be on them. If they had gone maybe 10 and 7 and McCarthy was this bad, but they eeked out a bunch of wins, maybe they could be like, yeah, we're going to draft another quarterback too. But I just think the roster needs young, talented, cheap talent in a lot of spots.

Cornerback is the one that comes to mind the most for me, where you need to make a draft pick for a player there. And then if it all goes bad, you're probably changing regimes and drafting a quarterback at 2027 anyway it happens fast in the NFL but that wasn't your question your question was well how much is he going to ride this potentially all the way to hell uh or potentially to a massive turnaround and i think the answer is exists in something that kirk cousin said to me one time and i will always bring it up because it really resonated he said in the nfl you have to develop yourself. No one can do it for you. And I think that that is extremely true. Kevin O'Connell has a scheme that works for quarterbacks. We've seen it from Kirk. We've seen it from Sam Darnold.

It works to get great wide receivers, opportunities against any kind of defense. And we know that it could be done, right? And we even saw, you know, we go back to Nick Mullins all the time, but we even saw it work as long as you throw on time into the right places, it will work. for those quarterback so we have enough a sample size to say that when we talk about the quarterback whispering i think that he is very good at that i think they have the receivers to make him look very good at that i think that he is a good play caller for a quarterback overall like just in the in the bigger picture like not picking apart did you run or did you pass there but as in gives them looks that are going to be advantageous against a lot of defenses and a lot of answers with

eligible wide receivers, right? I think that he really does a good job of that. He's going to work extremely closely in the game planning with the quarterback, all that stuff, hand in hand, right? And he's got Josh McCown, a super experienced person working with his quarterbacks, all that stuff. But he cannot go to your house and hold your hand as a pro football player and throw the ball for you and be like, here you go, little Timmy, here's how you throw it.

Like, that's not what an NFL head coach is doing. So I think the quarterback whisperer thing, it's always been a little bit dubious, just in general, because even I like to bring this up, you know, one of my favorite books is Bruce Ariens quarterback whisperer, but he fails to talk a lot about Tim Couch, right, who he coached. He talks a lot about Andrew Luck and Peyton Manning and the guys who worked out. Even if you're great at it, and I think Bruce is the best, there's not a chapter on James Winston. So it's sometimes there's not much you can do. with J.J. McCarthy, we don't have to declare his career over and we don't have to say,

KOC, if you don't quit him, you're a fool. What you have to say, I think at this point, it's gone far enough to say there better be competition in camp next year. There better be other answers and other options because if they do stick with McCarthy and have Sam Howell as his backup next year, then yeah, that would be to me trying to potentially dying on the hill. That's what it would be. Also, as you mentioned, that quote is going to be thrown in O'Connell's face a million times.

I don't think it's really fair. The, oh, well, he said organizations fail. Is he not right, though? Like, is he not right? He said that, didn't he say that in reference to Sam Darnold, who was completely failed by multiple organizations, as has been evidence of gestures at his success. Like, I think that if that's, maybe he said that earlier. I don't know when he said that.

I've seen it a million times recently. But I think that that's generally right. A lot of times young quarterbacks come to bad organizations who then fire coaches. Look at poor Jackson Dart, man. His coach is leaving him out there with concussions, getting fired. Like, it's just what are we doing? And now he's got to learn a whole new system and a whole new coach and all that sort of stuff. Is that good for him?

But there is a baseline. So you can do everything that you possibly could. And I would love to know what they were supposed to do. else for J.J. McCarthy, then spend the by week working on his footwork. I mean, my goodness, right, they've done everything they can. Roster-wise, coaching-wise, he's got to be the one that figures it out. He's got to be the one that develops himself and comes back for training camp and takes that job and wins it and then goes and wins football games. This is how fast it has to happen. And I know there was another quote from KOC about comparing it to, you know, racing Michael Phelps after you

just learn to swim or something like that. And unfortunately, it would be great for Kevin O'Connell if he could develop J.J. McCarthy over the next five years. But that's not how anything works. Because if O'Connell gets to five years without a playoff win, there's not much you can do there, right? If you're the organization, there's not much you could do there. You can't spend a half a decade.

not making the playoffs, not winning in the playoffs, because it's only going to be two out of four years even making it. And both games were embarrassing at the end of the day, losing to a pretty mediocre Giants team and then getting blown out. If you go five, there's just no defending that. So they have to work on a timeline that includes them winning in 2026. So it's up to J.J. McCarthy to be ready. And if he's not, then that experiment is at least over for now.

let's go to Jason's question here. I'm very curious about Brozmer, and I know it's a long shot, of course, there's a reason why it's so rare for an undrafted quarterback to make it in the NFL, but the conversation needs to start on what should be done next year at this point. My first thought is that the team trades for Mack Jones, but then again, I'm hesitant about coughing up too much draft capital. Well, at that point, you need a quarterback so badly. There's no choice.

A third round pick, I mean, you'd love to see those. work out. But I mean, if that's what the cost is, let's just say, I don't even know, if I'm San Francisco, I'm not even sure I'm trading Mac Jones. But let's just say that that's the cost. There's a third round pick for Mac Jones. You might just have to. Otherwise, you're playing Russell Wilson or something, right? Like, you can't get left out of that party to get a veteran quarterback in here. So you have to do what needs to be done. And sorry if you lose some draft capital in the process. That's not where anybody wanted to be, but that's where you're forced to be, which does not feel all that great. In terms of Max Brosmer, one thing I can say about that is

that there is a theory when it comes to kickers that might be applicable here. Kickers who are undrafted free agents, and this does not apply to the Minnesota Vikings because Will Reichert is incredible. But kickers who are undrafted free agents succeed more often than drafted kickers in terms of their field goal percentage. And the reason why that is, is because if you were the undrafted guy and you fought your way all the way through the drafted kickers, the veteran kickers and everything else to win a job, probably means you're pretty darn good. And I think there's something to that with, if you've gotten to this point as Max

Brosmer, where they're going to start you, not John Wolford, who's played in the league before, not Desmond Ritter, who's got a lot of starts, and wasn't that bad. And honestly, I'm really surprised that Desmond Ritter doesn't have a backup job somewhere and is still out on the market because he was, he was not great, but he certainly wasn't horrendous. But, you know, maybe the rest of the league's evaluation felt differently about him just from a numbers standpoint. There were times where he was okay. So, you know, the fact that you can be on the team and a better option than the Vikings having a Desmond Ritter or having a John Wolford start who have been in this league a lot longer than you as a rookie, I think that says. something about you as a quarterback and all the things that they've said, all the things that I've seen, it's interesting. It's at very least interesting. And I think that Brosmer will be a quarterback

in this league for a long time. Regardless, like, don't use this one game against the Seahawks, maybe with out Christian Derisaw, or Donovan Jackson, which would just be a nightmare to face a Seattle team. So don't judge him on this. But I think that he has a lot of the check marks of somebody who stays in the league a long time. So at least there's there's some signal in the fact that he's even here and that they're even going with him at this point and not someone like Ritter or someone like Wolford who's started

before. That means something. But to your point, yeah, the list is going to start adding up of what are their realistic options for next year. Mack Jones comes to mind. I'll toss out Gino Smith. Gino Smith's cap hits not crazy for

next year. The Raiders have to be in a situation where they're finally thinking in reality, they're going to have a very high draft pick, Mendoza, maybe Arch Manning. Like, I don't know. I'm not a quarterback guru guy when it comes to the draft. But, you know, there's going to be quarterbacks this year that come out that the Raiders might be thinking about getting and just moving on from Gino Smith.

And if you're talking about a guy who could make all the throws for the Minnesota Vikings, uh, that might be the guy. So that would be, he'd probably be toward the top of my list. I've never been the biggest Gino Smith fan, but he did throw for 32 touchdowns one year with Seattle. He's gotten multi-10 win seasons. So I don't know. If they're moving on,

I guess we'll see he's under contract. There's a lot to be talked about there. But it has to be someone. It has to be someone. You can't just say, no, yeah, this has gone well enough. It's only been six starts. You know, that's getting tougher and tougher because I was looking at adjusted net yards per attempt over the first six starts of guys for the last 10 years.

93 quarterbacks who made six starts through more than 100 passes, and he was 90th in adjusted net yards per attempt through six starts. This isn't your run of the mill. Oh, well, it's been up and down for six starts for J.J. McCarthy. It's been Dorian Thompson-Robinson level of starting quarterback play in terms of all the key statistics. So you need to have somebody else. And I agree that discussion started already. That is something that I was not thankful for it today on Thanksgiving is the fact that we have reached a point where it's already the offseason. Every question is the off season. There's more to learn and there's more games to go. And yet the most pressing question, the one that feels like it needs the most attention for me

is not how they match up against Seattle's D-line or what Sam Darnold's going to do against Brian Flores Blitz is. It's what they're going to do next year. before we even hit December, never saw it coming. This next question comes from Paul, since we're likely to have a top 10 draft pick, maybe we'll see, that's possible. And quite a few total picks, why should ownership have any confidence in entrusting this front office to the 2026 draft? Has any team drafted more poorly over the last four years? So here's what I'm calling Donovan Jackson a big success.

I know he's been banged up a couple times, but Donovan Jackson looks like a third. future pro bowl type of player to me he has been excellent he's got a great mentality he's very mature very intelligent guy i don't know if he'll be you know the next alan fanica but he's he's a starting above average starting guard in the league already he's in the top 20 in terms of pass blocking grade going into last week i didn't check it from last week i can actually check it right now again if you want where donovan jackson ranks uh among pass blocking guards. We can, let's see, 18th, out of 56.

So he is a top 20 pass blocking guard as a rookie. I am very high on where Donovan Jackson is going. Jordan Addison is a star wide receiver. Dallas Turner has shown a lot of progress this year and is trending in the right direction, especially now that we've seen him take over a role that might fit him a little bit better. And then Lewis Seen is one of the biggest busts in team history.

So you've never drafted, and look, that was their fault that they did not draft in the top 15 with Lewis Seen. They decided to trade out of that. But you've drafted, not in the top 15 and landed, and I know they traded up for Dallas Turner. So there's an asterisk on that one. People overstate how much they trade up for them because they got that extra pick just in case the Patriots were going to give them Drake May. The Patriots didn't. So that's why that happened. Anyway, the point.

just being if we look at what they've gotten other than j j mccarthy which is a whole separate beast right they've gotten a star wide receiver a potential pro bowl guard who's on the rise and a starter for sure at outside linebacker in the way dallas turners played the last couple weeks with still potential i believe he's 22 so there's still a lot of potential there with turner who's getting stronger and more experienced and then one horrible bust that's your first round picks and when you think about where they were drafting, I mean, I'm not, that's, that's definitely not horrible. I don't, when you say, like, are they the worst? No, it can't be.

But the reason they don't have a lot of other players that they've picked and they've found a Jalen Redmond, they've developed a Levi Drake Rodriguez, they drafted an elite kicker, you know, so they is because they've used a lot of draft capital to acquire players. I mean, they used another draft pick to get Jordan Mason. They used a draft pick to get T.J. Hawkinson. They used some draft capital to get Thielen, which is a terrible decision now. But, you know, at the time, it seemed like there's something that they really needed to go get another wide receiver. And, you know, they made a move last year to get Cam Robinson.

Would you throw that one back? I mean, Robinson until the end of the year played well enough to get them 14 wins. Like, you had to do stuff like that. So when you're winning, when you're getting 13 and 14 wins, you're trading away draft capital. you're signing players so you're not getting comp picks. They haven't had a lot of draft picks. And with the first rounders, they've done, at very worst, I'd say, okay, you might even say if Jackson is as good as he looks, that it could end up turning out really well.

That to me is not enough to say how they cannot use these people in-house to draft. The other thing is too, the top 10, top 12 is usually pretty straightforward. It's the easiest place by far to draft. It's all the best players. it's not like 24th where you're trying to weigh like okay positional value and are we getting you know somebody who's one of the better players at a position that's less valuable and you know the back end of the first round look at look at any of the charts pff had one the top five top seven is like a 60 70 percent hit rate and then it plummets by the middle of the draft

by the middle of the first round of the draft it plummets to 50 40 percent of success rates. It's not unique that, you know, the Vikings wouldn't get four Hall of Famers with these draft picks, even though they do have some good players. So my point is that when you're drafting it that high, you're getting elite talents and that's who you're going to pick. It's not going to be some, like, shocking mystery or crazy evaluation of what

they're going to do here. I also think that just the idea that someone can't draft is pretty foolish because we're only judging it on a handful of draft picks in general. and they haven't been high and they haven't been the highest rounds or even not very many second round picks. So don't, yeah, don't start me on that one. It's fine. If you are saying that everyone is under pressure to draft an immediate impact player in the top 10, you are right.

That's where you're right because they need 2026 to succeed and get in the playoffs and win. That was the promise that this is the window, 2025, 2026. So then didn't happen this year, next year, a lot of pressure is on. But saying that they can't draft, like, that doesn't make a lot of sense to me. Last question comes from Kyle. Do you think that Jonathan Grenard is a potential trade candidate in the offseason, a lot of cap savings? It appears Turner would fit that role, not the Van Ginkle role. He showed this year that, well, he's a really good player.

He is not an upper echelon, edge rusher. Turner has looked decent enough in that role. same sort of thing about 2026. I just don't think you're in a position to do that unless you're talking about something crazy in terms of return. So if you love the way, let's say Dallas Turner is absolutely phenomenal in these next few games and just crushes it.

He ends up with 10 sacks. I don't know, right? He's a beast. Now, first of all, I would say, well, maybe you just rotate and have a lot of edge rushing talent and that seems good for you. But even if that happened, if you got an offer for, you know, I don't know, a first and a second or something for Gernard from another team and you were that confident in Turner, then okay. But in 2026, you're still talking about needing to win, needing as much talent as you could possibly have.

And I do think that we've learned something about Dallas Turner, but I also don't think that he's been so good that you could just say, all right, Jonathan Gernard, see you later. and well, I do agree with you that there is a very clear, when you talk about echelons of pass rushers, there is a very clear top of the top. And those players are Micah Parsons, Miles Garrett, Aidan Hutchinson. I would probably throw in DeNeal Hunter, Will Anderson, Max Crosby, like those guys, Jared Verr's, you know, they're probably the best of the best of the best. And I don't know that he can quite be on that same level, considering that, you know, last year he was really great in terms of pressures. This year he hasn't finished sacks.

But I would put him not that far away from that conversation. I would put him not far away from that because his pressure rates, his win rates are still really, really good. And he plays every snap. You go back to last year, he's one of the tops in quarterback pressures. It's not, he's not going to get 20 sacks like some of these guys are capable. of. But I also am not pushing him out the door and especially, you know, with his leadership and his toughness and everything he brings to the locker room. I think he's a very important player there. And as of right now, he's not that expensive. And the thing is that a down season in terms

of sacks probably prevents the Vikings from having to give him a massive, massive raise on the contract he signed. Now, they may rework something for his deal. But if he had gotten 15 sacks this year, then he'd be demanding $45 million a year, and that would be really challenging for them. I don't think he's in a position to do that after this season. So I would just prefer that they rotate with Grenard and Dallas Turner. And I agree with you that Turner should be rushing. I think off that side, he's clearly better.

But I think actually it's probably also just Dallas Turner growing and getting better, which is what we expected to happen from him and why we shouldn't call people busts after like a couple games. Anyway, great questions, great stuff. I hope that we are in some position to care about any of these games enough to talk about them. But really, it seems like a preseason. The preseason that we missed, a preview for next year is what the final number of games here will be. That's why I elected initially, I was going to go to Seattle.

I elected not to because that's kind of where we're at right now. but there are games left to play, and Manny Hill is here to pick the schedule. So why don't we get to Manny here? A reminder about that Fandul question of the day. The over under on Fandual for Max Brosmer is 169.5 yards. Leave it in the comments. What stat line would you consider good for Max Brosmer in his first NFL start? Thanks again.

Happy Thanksgiving, everybody. Check out the newsletter for the Friday mailbag, Purple Insider. Football, and on Friday, we'll have a Black Friday sale if you have yet to join the Purple Insider subscribers on the written side. So thanks again. And we'll see you for the hardcore breakdown of the Seattle Cawks in Minnesota Vikings matchup with Andrew Kramer. That will be on Friday night. So once again, happy Thanksgiving, everybody. And here's Manny to pick the schedule. All right, no matter what the circumstances are, whether it's holidays or the team being four and seven,

Mani Hill will pick the schedule. Even if it had been the blizzard of the century, Mani Hill would still pick the schedule. So that is what we do. We've done it all year long. We topped out at 11 wins. And whatever we bottomed out at will probably be right now. But welcome, Mani.

I appreciate you taking the extra time on this holiday week to still pick the Viking schedule. Good day, my friend. good day happy thanksgiving um just wild times in the nfl wild times in college football and it looks like we're going to see a local college folk hero i guess uh former go for max brosmer start for the vikings on sunday and uh it'll be very intriguing to say the least yeah i mean i do think that there's more interest in this game than there has been even the last couple of weeks uh because The way that they performed, the way that J.J. McCarthy performed, I think people had gotten to a point of watching Vikings football was more painful than interesting.

And at least with Brosmer, his reputation is a guy who gets the ball out quick, super good at processing. And these are things that we saw out on the practice field. And he's had my attention since really day one. So I think that we all realize, and Nick Mullins taught us this, that if you throw it on time into the right place, even if you don't throw it good, you could still have an exciting offense generally. So that will be the challenge for Max Brosmer. Not an easy one, though, against a top 10 defense in the Seattle Seahawks.

So let's start out there. Do the Minnesota Vikings shock the world and beat Sam Darnold and the Seahawks this week? I'm going to say no. I think the Seahawks are just a far superior team. They seem to be clicking on all cylinders. Even when Sam Donald has a bad game, they still find themselves in a position to possibly win like they did against the Rams a couple of weeks ago

and the Rams are clearly and obviously the best team in football right now. So, yeah, Seattle's really good. That defensive front is just monstrous. And I think that's going to cause some problems for Max Bros. I think he'll play all right. You know, I think the biggest thing with him is he does get rid of the football. Now, if you look at a lot of the tape and the film, from the gophers last year.

Gophers had one of the better offensive lines really in all college football last year. So Brosmer had a lot of clean pockets, but he still was able to deliver the ball on time. The ball came out. He didn't waste a lot of time sitting in the pocket, waiting for

the guy to be perfectly open so he can throw the perfect pass. He got the ball out quickly, and he's going to have to do this on Sunday to have a chance. I think he will, but I don't think it's going to be good enough, and I think Seattle's going to come away with the win. I'm seeing something like a 2414 where, hey, he hangs in, has a couple of good drives,

make some good throws, maybe a mistake mixed in there, but doesn't take too many sacks, doesn't take too many big hits, and it looks like he's in control of the offense, which would be a pretty big upgrade, but it's just really hard. I mean, they're a 10.5 point favorite. It would be kind of ridiculous to pick them. They won against Detroit when they were a major undergraduate. dog, but that seems like a once in a decade type of thing to win when you are this big of an underdog.

So we will see how Max Brosmer performs, but if he is competent and he does run the offense fairly well and they do move the ball, there could be a possibility of the, my dog just walked downstairs with his favorite toy. Excuse me. Oh, now he wants to play. he wants to play now now we're playing okay uh well i'm going to play with the dog with one hand this is where we're at folks play with the dog with one hand and uh podcast with the other so max broszmer has a chance to continue to stay in if he performs even halfway decently does he play well enough

to be the starting quarterback when they face washington is a the question before you even pick the game i think i think he does i mean because when you look at what has happened with J.J. McCarthy these last couple of weeks. We talked about the Bears game against that really bad defense, and he really wasn't, say for that last drive, he really wasn't able to move the ball against them at all. And Green Bay was just a, you know, total colossal disaster. I mean, from start to finish, really that game was not good at all.

And, you know, in theory, if McCarthy is able to come back from this concussion and be ready to go against Washington, Yeah, I guess you do have to put him back in there because he's still in the long term, or at least right now in the long term plan to be your starting quarterback, and you still have to see more and see how he develops. But the question is going to be, if Max Rosmer throws from like 250 yards in this game, how do you, and he plays well, he doesn't turn the ball over, he handles the pressure okay,

and the Vikings compete, how do you go to him and tell him, hey, we're going to stick with JJ? here based off of what we've seen from McCarthy, really all season, but particularly the last two games. Well, the big thing for me would be this is about Justin Jefferson as much and the other players as anybody else. I mean, Jordan Addison being shut out of a game is absurd. He is one of the best wide receivers in the NFL top 25 and he can't get the football to him at all. And here's a Jefferson who expects to be getting 90 to 150 yards per game. and he can barely sniff 75 yards with J.J. McCarthy in there. If those receivers are getting the football, and poor T.J. Hawkinson is either being ignored or

murdered, depending on the way that McCarthy is progressing so slowly. I think for those guys alone, if he plays well and runs the offense with any sort of efficiency, you just have to stay with him. The other thing is, too, that NFL history shows there's enough guys who have been undrafted or late rounders. They're major outliers, but they have happened. And I think if this organization is going to say to every other player, hey, if you come here and you're Jalen Redmond and you play well, then you're going to get a chance or your Miles Price, you're going to get a chance. Well, I think you have to treat it the same way here as the best player has to play,

regardless of the future outcome and trying to develop J.J. McCarthy in real time, because you can't even evaluate the rest of your team when you have a performance of 87 yards from the quarterback position. So I would guess that Brosmer plays. This is just a total guess because we have no idea, but that Brosmer plays well enough to start again against Washington at home. And there is a good chance that he could play really well in that game because you're talking about a team that's given up and has a horrible,

horrible defense. So do they win against Washington at home? Yes. I'm going to say that they do. I think that Washington, to your point, is a team that's just not playing well. They've kind of punted on their season. Their defense is just awful,

which is kind of weird to see a Dan Quinn coach defense not be good at all. And that team's kind of falling apart a little bit. And obviously, the Jaden Daniels injury has really kind of affected that and impacted that because who knows how many more wins they would have if he were just simply healthy and playing. But it's just a bad team right now.

And you've got them at home. And again, I keep saying this. Vike's got a fine way to get another win at home. I mean, they're what? They're one and four U.S. Bank Stadium this year. That's not good. That's typically a place that's always been an advantage for them. And the fact that they haven't won a home game since Cincinnati,

that Bengals game feels like ages ago. And that was the last time they won a game at home. So I think this has got to be the time for them to get that because the last two home games, the last two games of the season, it's going to be hard to win those. So you better, if you're going to win another home game, you better get it here.

So if they get a victory with Max Brosmer, quarterback against Washington, that means they are five and eight. And I would imagine he's going to play again, Dallas Cowboys on December 14th at Dallas. This one, I don't know if they can adjust this game. I think this is set for a national TV game. I'm not sure.

But as of right now, national TV game for the Vikings, do they have a chance against the Dallas team that seems like they're starting to turn it around? I think they, you're dog playing with the true toys, hilarious. I think they have a chance because the Cowboys defense is still really bad. But then again, they kind of held their own against Philadelphia, the second half of that game. And they got enough stops to come back and win that game. So who knows, and they did make some moves at the trade deadline to kind of bolster their defensive front a little bit, which, you know, you could have just kept Micah Parsons. But, yeah, so it's a defense that's playing a little bit better. It's an offense that has a chance to put up a lot of points when Dak Prescott is on.

So I think it's going to be a tough one for the Vikings to go into that facility, the Jerry World. and win. So I'm going to give the Cowboys the win here. And that will drop the Vikings to five and nine. Yeah, my thing is George Pickens and C.D. Lamb. If C.D. Lamb can remember how to catch the ball. It's going to be really, really dangerous. And George Pickens right now in terms of receiving yards is number two in the entire NFL. And I think everybody knew that he had superstar potential when he came out. It was always what's his mentality, what's his emotional stability. and in Pittsburgh, he drove them crazy, and that's how Dallas ends up with him. But it's one of, this is the thing about Jerry. Like, Jerry, if you do enough crazy stuff and aggressive stuff, sometimes it works

and you're a genius and sometimes it fails and you're a fool. But I think he's actually on the plus side of crazy stuff because you get Quinn and Williams and you get George Pickens and they look really dangerous because of them. But of course, you don't have Michael Parsons. So anyway, I think they are a much. stronger team than they've looked in recent weeks. And those receivers, based on the Vikings and their secondary, I think it's going to be impossible for them to stop that passing game.

Plus, DAC is fantastic at picking defenses apart, reading blitzes, throwing with anticipation, like all those things. I don't like to disrespect Dak because he's been great against the Vikings historically when he's gone against him. What was that? The one game he threw to Amari Cooper like 15 times in, I think it was 2000. 19 must be. I mean, so, look, they're usually very good. Five and nine makes a lot of sense here.

I do think that Brosmer could continue to play well. And now we're going way far down the line on Max Brosmer starting many games for the Vikings. But they go to play the Giants after that. Do they have a chance against the giants in New York? I think they do have a chance. And I'm going to give them a win here. I think, I think especially if Rosemmer's, still playing he's still playing well i think this is the type of game that that he can go in and

and pick apart that defense and you know the giants have some talent on offense is james winston still going to be playing is jackson dark going to be back by then who knows um but the giants just kind of seem like a really weird wonky operation right now and you just don't really know what to expect from them so i'm going to give the vikings a win here it might be kind of a weird, fluky type of win, but I think the Vikings were going to New York with, you know, a better overall roster. And I think if Rosemary is still playing then, he's, you know, running the offense with efficiency and with competence. I'm going to give the Vikings a win here at the Meadowlands. It's very possible that we've gone way too far down the Max Brosmer line. And this

could all be J.J. McCarthy. And we just don't, you know, we're not going to pick separate schedules based on that. So we really have no idea. But even if you're McCarthy and you're back playing by this point, if you can't go in to New York and put together a competent, functioning, efficient offense and get a win against that team, what are we doing here? What are we doing here?

So this is one that you, I mean, it's like, come on. It's like this is the one. If you're going to win a game, it's like Washington. and New York, these are the ones that, it's like, come on, Vikings. These are the ones that you got to get wins. I'm in a tough spot with this because I think that it's better to be sure than to have the water be muddy with your quarterback.

So there's a part of me that says it would be better if Brozmer was just really good. And next year, the quarterback competition is random veteran X, Brosmer, and McCarthy and may the best man win. The thing that could happen here, though, with Washington, Dallas, and New York is if If Brosmer starts one game, it goes really poorly, they go back to McCarthy, then he plays well against these really bad defenses and teams that have kind of given up or fired coordinators or whatever, then you could get talked into, well, actually, he just needed to fit, you know, he just needed this and that.

It just needed that one week off. And then it clicked back in and whatever. In reality, it was because he was playing the worst teams, the league. But as of right now, you've got them at six and nine going against. the Detroit Lions week 17 on Christmas Day. Merry Christmas, everybody, a game that we thought would matter and does not. But do the Vikings shock the lions again?

Certainly won't matter to the Vikings, but it might matter to Detroit. Yes, that's true. It might matter to Detroit. Yeah, I just, I don't see really any scenario unless like Jared Goff, Jemir Gibbs, and Amun Rae St. Brown are all, like, injured. I don't see any scenario where the Vikings

when this game. I think the lions are kicked off that you went into Ford Field and beat them, especially when you factor in how things have gone for the Vikings since that game, where they haven't been good. And the lions are going to be, I think, fighting

for position in that division. You're going to be chasing the bears. They may have caught the bears and may be trying to sort of hold them off at this point. And then they got Green Bay also, you know, right there in the mix for the division as well.

So the Lions are going to take this game very seriously. They're going to come in with a purpose. And I think this is going to be a pretty, pretty ugly game for the Vikings. It feels like the end of 2023 where they were starting Jaron Hall and maybe, you know, whoever's playing quarterback will have played better the previous couple weeks. And clearly the Lions defense is not special from what we saw against the New York Giants, although they had to throw a pass to James Winston in part to make that happen. But they're not special, but you're right.

I think this is going to be two teams in very, very different spots. And then week 17, a noon game here against the Green Bay Packers who similarly may be playing for the division, may be playing for their playoff lives, depending on where this goes. And the Vikings will be planning those vacations to warm area spots. But if it's still McCarthy, I mean, you're playing for something. or even Brosmer, just a valuation. And, yeah, I don't know. Like, this feels like I used to do minor league baseball and they would have the getaway day.

So it would be like a Sunday early game and then they would have the next day off. And it was an hour and a half baseball game. I was like, let's get, let's get, let's get going. Like no pitch at 12.05. Yes. Yeah, exactly. Like, everybody, get into that box, get ready to hit. Like, that's how it's going to feel like this year.

but do the Vikings get to a remotely respectable 7 and 10 or is this a 6 and 11 football team? I think this is a 6 and 11 football team. I think Green Bay is going to be in a similar situation as Detroit where they're going to be sort of jockeying for playoff position. Now they've got that tie, so there's not going to be a lot of tiebreakers that are coming to play for them. But, you know, the difference between them finishing, you know, 11. and five and one versus 10, six, and one might depend on rather than out they win the division or, you know, just a matchup in the playoffs that might favor them. So I think they're going to come in much like Detroit with a purpose and a desire to really

take this game seriously and win and put the regular season away with a victory. So got the Vikings dropping this one as well and finishing six and 11. All right. What we always do after you pick is we talk about what it means if this happens. So the way we played this out, Max Brosmer plays a lot of football in the second half of the season and they end up six and 11. To me, this will be in the annals of Vikings history is one of the worst, most disappointing, most frustrating, infuriating seasons to watch if they finish six and 11. I think this is the saddest football that I've ever. seen from this team since I've covered them and probably some of the saddest of the last 25 years considering what the quarterback play has been and what the expectation and the bar that they set after winning 14 games with the top 10 offense that had so many exciting moments. This season has just been almost bereft of exciting moments. Opening night touchdown for McCarthy, a win against Detroit and that's it.

Feels very 2010-ish because at least it in 2018, they went into. to the last week of the season with a chance to make the playoffs. In fact, we were all booking our trips. And then they couldn't beat, you know, the bears benching their starters and the whole meltdown there. But at least they were in that conversation. I think it was a very disappointing season, but nothing in comparison to this where everybody walked into the locker room saying more is required after a 14 win season.

They were very confident in what they could be. And this isn't even, it's not even in the same continent is where. they expect it to be. And I also think, Mani, that your outcome here is very realistic. Yeah. I mean,

I just think with the way everything has gone and the way these games have played out. Again, the Packers game was bad, was just brutal, start to finish. But the Bears game to me is what really kind of showed me like, yeah, this is just not happening for this team this year,

because you had an opportunity, against a team that is certainly better and more well coached this year than they were under the previous head coach and sort of leadership last year, but that team is still not very good. Their defense is really bad. You had a chance to really, you know, J.J. McCarthy had a chance to have sort of his breakout, real breakout performance against that team, and he couldn't do it. And that to me kind of showed like, yeah, it's just not happening this year. And, you know, I think the Packers game just really kind of put a stamp on that pretty much. That was just the dagger right there to really kind of end things. And,

you know, so it, it, they're going to be limping to the finish line here, I think, rather it's Browsmore or McCarthy starting the rest of the way here. And it's, it's a disappointment. All the, all the money they spent in the offseason, you know, and they, you and I both and a lot of people were praising the moves that they made because it made a lot of sense. You're going to go to your young quarterback that's on the rookie quarterback deal and you're trying to bolster the roster around him to give him the best chance for success. And it's ultimately come down to the quarterback play for the team this year. It's just been awful no matter who's been in there.

It just hasn't been good enough. And now you're back to the drawing board and trying to figure out now what do you do? Because if McCarthy comes back and plays at any point, the season and he doesn't play well, now you're really like, oh, bleep, what do we do? We've got a lot of self-reflections and looking in the mirror of what we need to do going forward here. But if Rosemary plays and plays well, then at least, I think, at least in the off-season, it becomes really intriguing because now you at least have another option, potentially. And then, like you said, you go get a veteran in the off-season, too, to kind of

have a have a three-way competition and just see what happens i may end up sounding ridiculous i think max will play well uh and we'll see where that takes them if i think right now and the goalposts have been moved 5,000 yards at this point if they got to seven that means it went pretty well the rest of the way regardless of who's in a quarterback but as we know for many years of you and i having conversations to me that's a bad outcome like a bad a bad outcome for the long term of the franchise, what they need is elite talents on rookie contracts. And I think they've gotten very close to that with Donovan Jackson. And Dallas Turner has been better.

So at the very least, like you're getting production out of someone who is on their rookie contract, who is playing a lot of football for you. They need somebody in the top 10, maybe a cornerback, somebody who can really be a game changer for them that is not expensive because everybody else is expensive. and the only way to get there is to go four and 13. That's the best outcome. That's as sad as it is. The truth is the best outcome is that you don't win another football game the rest of the entire year.

And I don't know if there was ever a scenario where they could have traded everyone at the deadline. And I know like there's there would have had to have been buyers for different guys and there's contracts. It would have been impossible. But knowing what you know now, you would have moved some guys. and once again, it feels like, you know, they kind of, well, I guess that came after the trade deadline, the Lions win. But, you know, against Green Bay a few years ago, they get a win and they sort of convince themselves and I don't know. So that's the best outcome, sadly. The second best outcome, I think is that McCarthy would come back and show enough that at least makes it interesting for

next year, but, or that Brosmer's just the purple party and here we go. So we'll see. Still a lot on the table. Still a lot on the table, but it all becomes through the lens of the future and no longer the lens of this year. Mani Hill, thank you so much on Thanksgiving week for making the time to still pick the schedule. And we'll talk to you on Monday, sir. Sounds good. Football. Football.