Purple Insider - a Minnesota Vikings and NFL podcast - Anthony Barr is back with the Vikings and Brian Murphy thinks they can make the playoffs

Episode Date: November 14, 2023

Matthew Coller and Manny Hill discuss the Vikings' move to bring back Anthony Barr with Jordan Hicks injured and Brian Murphy analyzes the moves that brought Josh Dobbs and TJ Hockenson to the Vikings, who now are in a race for the postseason Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Welcome everybody, welcome to another episode of Purple Insider. Matthew Collar here with you, along with Manny Hill. And I gotta tell you, Manny, you know, I was prepping for the show earlier today after I got back from TCO Performance Center. And I'm going through like, hey, let's talk about, you know, Josh Dobbs, of course. And let's try to do some fun stuff. And hey, this Jordan Hicks injury, we might want to dive into that. And then I i you know look down at my phone and i'm like wait a minute is someone is someone trolling me is someone

messing around playing a joke is this a fake adam schefter that says anthony barr is returning to the minnesota vikings because that can't be true right like Anthony Barr coming back but it's true because Jordan Hicks is injured and it sounds like it was potentially very very serious with his leg injury and that just because the training staff was on it and they were able to get him to the hospital he is going to be able to recover but from the medical professionals who have tweeted me today it sounds like this injury is kind of a multi-week type of thing so the vikings go out they get the best available free agent which just so happens to be i'm going to call them borderline viking legend they like to use it for anybody who played for the vikings

when they come back all the legends and everything uh multi-time pro bowler first round draft pick one of the centerpieces of one of the best vikings defenses in team history in 2017 anthony bar welcome back buddy there's a couple people you recognize your reaction manny bust out to Bust out your old number 55 jerseys, man. Get those things out. Remember when Randy Moss came back in 2010, he said, break out your old 84 jerseys at his press conference. Yeah, wow. That came out of left field.

I remember when Jordan Hicks got injured in the game. You know, it looked like I didn't really think anything of it because it looked like he was able to continue for a little bit. He stayed in for a couple of plays and I think he almost, he ultimately came out of the game. So, I mean, that part of it is just kind of surprising that it seems like this is going to be a little bit more of a serious thing for Jordan Hicks. But I guess the question for Anthony Barr now is just, you know, how much does he have left? He hasn't played, hasn't been on a team this year,

hasn't played in a while, kind of bounced around the league a little bit since he left the Vikings. So what, you know, the question now is at this point of his career, at this age, I think he's, what, 31 now. What can he bring to the table? How will he be used? It's a different defensive scheme than what it was under Mike Simmers, so you wonder if he'll be used differently under Brian Flores. And just how much, you know, how long is it going to take for him

to kind of get ramped up, get back into game shape, and ready to get on the field to contribute. Because obviously if they brought him in, they're going to need him at some point to maybe contribute. So interesting, though, surprising. That's one way to put it. I did not see this coming at all. The first thing is it's probably a sign that Hicks is going to be out for a little while and could go to injured reserve. And I think that Kevin O'Connell was trying to be optimistic about his outlook. But probably as the day went along, they got more updates on how Jordan Hicks is doing in his recovery and more conversations with doctors and probably came to the conclusion. Yeah, we better sign somebody because you have Ivan Pace Jr. who called the defense in preseason,

but that was pretty much it. And you have Troy Dye. I mean, there's not a lot of depth when it comes to this linebacker group. Ryan Asamoah is hurt as well. I mean, this is like they are kind of bleeding players all over the place here. K.J. Osborne goes down. Madison goes down. They have to bring in Myles Gaskin.

I mean, of course, the quarterback. They've had all sorts of this rash of injuries going on, but this one seemed like at first maybe it wouldn't be too bad. And then now with Anthony Barr arriving, probably will keep Hicks out for a while. As far as what he brings to the table still, one of the biggest things and I'll tell you what PFF had him for last year when he was within Dallas um intelligence is the biggest

thing Anthony Barr is one of the smartest football players that I've been around he knows the game inside and out and I always believed and Mike Zimmer when he would talk about Anthony Barr in the hidden value of Anthony bar and Zimmer explained it to us, he laid it out like X's and O's. This is why, you know, just a PFF grade does not capture everything. This guy does. Anthony bar was brilliant with the green dot, which is, uh, when you have the headset in your, in your call in the plays defensively. And one of the things that linebackers do is they play these games with checks with the coat or with the quarterback. So the opposing quarterback, he's going to see a

defense and he's going to make a check. All right, we're checking to a run or we're checking to a different pass play. And then Anthony Barr would try to read what they were doing. And he would check out of a blitz into a blitz. He would read how they shifted protections and make checks. This guy was a massive part of the success. And look at how those defenses did. Over the years, he made the Pro Bowl. He was a player that people needed to account for. I think that he was underappreciated because he got a big contract

that they shouldn't have given out. And then we know what happens. The minute you pay somebody, it's like if are not like the best player in the world, then everyone's going to come down hard on you. But I think that that's the biggest part here, Manny, is they don't have anybody with real experience. I mean, Nick Vigil, I don't know if he's called the defense before they don't have anybody with experience where they are doing that stuff that Jordan Hicks was doing reading offenses making checks getting the calls out and somebody told me about Anthony Barr that one of the things that was great was how even keeled he was where no

matter how loud the stadium was no matter what the situation was he was so great at being the even hand of the defense for all those years and they finished top five in either points or yards like every year for a long run with anthony barr so even if he does not have the same physical skill i think that he could come in here learn what brian floris is doing pretty quickly and be that guy who is operating the defense in place of Jordan Hicks? Stability, right? I mean, that's kind of what you need. And that kind of represents what Jordan Hicks is as a player, as a linebacker in this defense too, is just a guy who's been in the league for a number of years now, knows what he's

doing out there, knows how to make all of the calls and keep everybody and put everybody where they're supposed to be on the field. And if Anthony Byer has the experience doing that, albeit a different scheme under Mike Zimmer, that's going to help. And he's familiar with the organization. Obviously, there's still, you know, many guys on this team that were his teammate before during his first stint here. So I think that's going to help matters as well. I, you know, I don't see any downside to it at all. I mean, it just seems to make the most sense. You know, he was in the league last year with the Dallas Cowboys,

so it's not like he's being pulled completely off of the street. So it'll be interesting to see just how much, you know, how long it takes him to sort of get a grasp of the scheme with Brian Flores because it is a different scheme. And, you know, I would imagine it'll go pretty well. It'll be pretty seamless. And he'll step in and he'll start making some plays early on. So last year he graded a 59.7 for Dallas

and in 2021 it was a 62.9 for the Minnesota Vikings and like those numbers are very much average but the thing is that average trying to sign a guy on November 13th is about the best you could ever do. And I don't think, I mean, we'll see like how much of a role you're asking him to take. My guess is that he won't play this week and then next week, and then you've got a bi-week. And then after that, if he's got to be that guy for the rest of the season, that he would be able to play quite a bit. And as you said,

learn that defense and make it a seamless transition because of his football intelligence and that's what you know this front office this coaching staff has really focused on is high iq guys uh but you know the thing that always comes up with anthony bar that i tried to kind of work through uh when he was a viking that still seems to exist is this right here from Todd. Brian Flores will use him as an off-ball pass rusher, unlike Zimmer. Here's the thing. Anthony Barr blitzed as much as any linebacker in the NFL.

I have the data right up in front of me. He was blitzing a huge percentage of his snaps, over 100 pass rushes every single year from 2014 to 2019, except for 2017, it was 99. He was racking up 20 pressures a year. Like for that role, that is one of the most blitz heavy. But the thing is that they would try to put him at an edge rusher position at times in practice

and during training camp and things like that. That really wasn't what he was great at. I mean, he could do it, but in comparison to wearing the green dot and operating the entire defense and being the leader of that defense and being able to shut down running backs out of the backfield, go, I mean, remember, how many swing passes, screen passes, stretch runs did we see him tracking people down? He was incredibly valuable.

I have a really hard time believing that Mike Zimmer misused anybody on defense. I mean, they were a prolific defensive team for his years where he was there. And were they supposed to take Everson Griffin off the field to do this? Like, I never understood. I really never understood that take. Could they have rushed him more? Probably. But, I mean, they were still doing it among the highest in the league.

That being said, if there's a guy who's a fit, potentially, and last year he played 600 snaps. So like you said, Manny, it's not like he just hadn't played in years and is just showing up here. That being said, there might be a fit for him for a guy that does have a ton of experience rushing the passer, knowing that that's really what Brian Flores likes to do. I think so much, you know, and I think early on in the early years of Anthony Barr, you know, 2014, 15, 16, I was a little guilty of this, too.

I think a lot of people were guilty of this. I think sometimes when you look at a player's body type, you just kind of assume, well, he's built like this. He's this tall and he weighs this much. So it makes sense to have him do this. So when you look at Anthony Barr, he's 6'5", he's 250, 255 pounds. like the body of like a 3-4 edge rusher a blitzing outside linebacker like how they're kind of using Daniil Hunter and DJ Wanham and and Marcus Davenport when he's on the field etc etc but to your point he's never really been that Mike Zimmer never used him that way first of all Mike Zimmer wasn't running a 3-4 scheme when he was the head coach here he did a little bit as the defensive coordinator in Dallas but when he became the head coach of the Vikings they weren't running a 3-4 scheme when he was the head coach here. He did a little bit as the defensive coordinator in Dallas,

but when he became the head coach of the Vikings, they weren't running a 3-4, so they weren't using Anthony Barr in that way. And he was being used, you know, as that green dot guy calling signals, you know, and he was great against the run, and he was very disruptive at that second-level spot where he was. So I think sometimes we get so as fans and observers, we get so caught up in like, well, he looks like this, so he should be able to do it this way. And so now we're kind of thinking, well, Brian Flores runs a 3-4, Anthony Barr is built this way. And just throw him in as a pass rushing outside linebacker in a 3-4.

It makes perfect sense. But he's never really done that. He's never really been that type of guy. I think it makes more sense to just use him the way that he's always been used because that's where he's been at his best. It makes the most sense to do it that way. And it's a little bit of a complicated issue because it seemed to linger over his entire time here like

why isn't he rushing the passer more why isn't he rushing the passer more and you know there were times where like in 2018 uh everson griffin missed some time in the middle of that season and i think they did dial it up at that point and anthony barr would play into it as well he was very successful in rushing the passer because he was a really good blitzer. And imagine you're a running back and you're like 195 pounds. And here comes six foot five and 260 pounds coming at you at a four six. Like, whoa. I mean, that was really not easy to take on.

And so he had very high pressure rates, a very high success rate. A good part of that was also, I think his decision making of when to do it, that he had freedom of when to do it or when to call, you know, for the double a gap and when they were going to go forward and when they were going to drop back and stuff like that. So I think there was probably opportunity for them to do it more because his numbers were successful and he didn't have the splash plays that I think people saw very early in his career. But then when he would get asked about it, he would say, yeah, I want to blitz more. I think I'm a good pass rusher and so forth. So then it would kind

of gain momentum. And so maybe there was more opportunity, but as far as like, as far as going to make him a pure pass rusher, no, he's not. I mean, they want him to be an all around linebacker to take the place of Jordan Hicks here, presumably. And look, I mean, you couldn't ask for much more from Ivan Pace, but I wouldn't want a rookie to handle the rest of this season by himself. And then you're also looking at, you know, Troy Dye, Nick Vigil behind him. I mean, it's just not a whole lot there in terms of depth. So this to me is another instance of this is about the best you could do. The same with them going to get Josh Dobbs in the middle of the season. Like it's hard to do better than this,

hard to do better than what they got from Cam Akers going out and making a trade. So they are sensing, I think like, hey, we can be in the playoffs and we got to start like replacing these guys with other players who might be able to make a difference. So an interest, very interesting reunion for Anthony bar. And I will be very much intrigued by how he fits into a different defense. But I think Manny, we we've gotten to a point where we're just like trusting Brian Flores with whatever he's doing. Right. I mean, that's that's the way I've gotten to is almost everybody that Flores gets his hands on seems to be consistently improving. Even if you look at the numbers from the Saints game, Caleb Evans is playing well.

Andrew Booth Jr.r hey 2022 draft class you got two corners who have been playing quite a bit and a guard who's shown improvement i guess we shouldn't judge a draft class after one year i don't know but we'll see how that all plays out but it just it just is like to gotten to the point where certain coaches you're like i think that guy will figure it out even though i shouldn't think that anthony barr will come in here make a difference yeah i mean we we saw just from the way that mike zimmer used anthony barr that he's capable of doing more than i think what our as observers what our initial idea of him was. And I think when you put him in a situation with Brian Flores,

who has really taken on a situation where you had a lot of veterans on this team, on the defensive side, that were gone when Brian Flores arrived. And he's kind of come in and he's made the best out of the group that he has. And he's really had a lot of guys show improvement. You know, a lot of the younger players are, are showing that they're developing really well. You mentioned the young corners and how well they're playing. And he seems to be getting the most out of, I mean,

Daniil Hunter has been fantastic. I mean, we know how good he is. And, you know, Brian Flores just seems to be getting just even more out of Daniil Hunter. And DJ Wanham has shown a lot of improvement. You know, I had some question marks about, you know, is he going to be able to kind of step into a bigger role in his defense? And with Davenport being out, DJ Wanham has really stepped up and been a really solid player for the defense. And, you know, I think the safeties have been great. So I think I don't see anything wrong with just adding a guy like Anthony Barr, a veteran player, knows what he's doing, can be used in a lot of different kinds of ways, not just strictly as a pass rusher.

He can do a lot of other things as he's shown in the past. I think this makes a lot of sense, and I think it's going to work. I think it's going to go pretty well, and, you know, I think we're going to see this defense kind of continue to play as well as they have, especially the last couple of weeks. All right, so you and I both made fun lists based on Anthony Barr returning. You've made a list of, I said, anyone from the Vikings that you could bring back and put on this team to make them a Super Bowl contender, except Favre, because that's

not fair. That's like, okay, all-time great quarterback. Tarkington doesn't count either. So you can't bring back two of the great quarterbacks, but anybody else, who will you put on this Vikings team to make them a Super Bowl contender. I made the list of 2017 players to bring back and put on this team. And we will get to those in just a moment. But first, I want to remind you guys about PrizePix. We've been having a lot of fun on the show all season long on PrizePix. It is very simple. All you do with PrizePix is go to their website, prizepix.com,

and you pick more or less between two and six step of player projections. So you have more yards for Josh Dobbs than 215, say, and then or you pick less yards. It's very simple for a number of players. And then you're going. That's all you need to do. And we've been crushing it, actually, so far this year. And there's lots of different categories. There's all you need to do. And we've been crushing it actually so far this year. And there's lots of different categories. There's receiving, there's rushing, there's field goals.

And it's been a lot of fun to play. PrizeFix.com slash purple. Use the code purple for a first deposit match up to $100. And one of the reasons that I like it is that you don't have to take out a second mortgage to play. You could turn 10 bucks into 250 with just a couple of taps uh or a couple of clicks so prizepicks.com slash purple with the code purple daily fantasy sports made easy i'm hoping when we make our picks uh this thursday that they've got a josh dobbs rushing more or less so i can uh make a pick for over for that um all right uh so what would you

want to go back let's go back and forth we'll go back and forth you got five any player who would make the vikings a super bowl contender and i got five 2017 players in the comments would love to see your nominations as well so where do you want to start in honor of anthony bar returning which former vikings would make this team a Super Bowl contender? Okay, so we're going to do one at a time and go back and forth, right? We'll go back and forth. You pick one, I pick one. My list is 2017.

You get all Vikings. Okay, so I'm going to go my number five guy. I'm going to go Kevin Williams. Let's put Kevin Williams on this defensive front. Probably be kind of more, you front, probably be kind of more, you know, it was kind of more of like a three technique guy, but he was also really good against the run, but also a very good pass rusher as well. And I think you and I would both agree if they're, you know, this defense is playing great right now, but I think if you could add

another element, it's a guy who can, you know, be really, really good against the run and also be able to rush the passer as well. So Kevin Williams is a guy that I would take who was really good at that, at both of those elements. So I'd put him right on that defensive front. At some point, Kevin Williams, I think, will end up in the Hall of Fame. There are very few players historically who have six All-Pros that are not in the Hall of Fame. So a very, very good chance that he ends up. Historically who have six all pros that are not in the hall of fame. So, you know, very, very good chance that he ends up.

I mean, one of the great defensive tackles in NFL history, I am going to go with a right guard. And even though there has been improvement for sure with Ed Ingram, I will replace him with one Joe Berger who graded over an 80 in 2017 at the right guard position absolutely terrific a journeyman offensive lineman who came into his own later in his career and was very very good for the Vikings he beat out John Sullivan in a training camp and then had to move to guard and he was excellent this offensive line with a right guard would just be one of the best,

if not the best line in the entire NFL. I think they've already got a case for being up there, even with their one weak point. But Joe Berger, I will take the 2017 version, put him on this team. Love it. Fantastic, versatile guy, Joe Berger. You could really put him almost anywhere on the line.

He was going to be a professional and step in and be just super, super reliable for you. I love that. I'll even go a step further. Same position, but I'll go with left guard. The great, outstanding, one of the greatest, if not the greatest guard of all time, Randall McDaniel, baby. Put him right there at the left guard spot. No disrespect to Dalton Reisner. Dalton Reisner's been fine, but you put in a guy like Randall McDaniel on this offensive line, and it's left tackle. Why am I having a brain fart right now?

I'm a great left tackle. Christian Derusaw. Yeah, my brain's all over the place. But you put Christian Derusaw, an all-pro caliber left tackle, right next to one of the greatest guards in the history of the league. That is an outstanding left side of your offensive line. Give me Randall McDaniel at guard. One of the great players. And by the way, you could put him in the backfield. That would be... I mean, look, you definitely go back a while if you know the reference but if you go back and watch old vikings games on youtube you will occasionally see randall

mcdaniel lining up at fullback and it is the craziest thing because he's as athletic as most regular fullbacks it's wild uh from the 2017 team if they could reach back in time and bring one of those players here i would select for my number four pick tom johnson one of the things that they do not do particularly well is get penetration from the interior tom johnson was always criticized for not being a run stopper but played 60 of the plays that year and they had the one of the top run defenses if not number one in the nfl just a terrific terrific story came from the cfl fought his way up into a role with that defense and if you mixed him with jonathan bullard with harrison phillips and got a guy who could actually get upfield tom johnson would be a tremendous fit for this team also one of my favorite guys ever to cover super super football iq super intense guy as well uh really really appreciated tom johnson so that is my number

four pick i love that tom johnson was uh he was like a godsend man because you know they had sheree floyd in that spot and sheree had the injuries and everything and just wasn't available. And for Tom Johnson to kind of step into that role and be really, really stout, really solid in that position. That was that was a low key game changer for that defense in 2017. Love that. All right. I am going to stay on the offensive side for my next selection. And I had a little trouble with this. You know, I kind of decided, okay, do I want to go with the guy that everybody's going to think of at this position, or do I want to go to a different direction? So obviously everybody's going to think about

Adrian Peterson, you know, at running back to bolster the running game. You can't go wrong with that pick. I don't think at all. One of the great running backs of all time, but I'm going to go Robert Smith. I'm going to go Robert Smith. I'm going to go my guy, Robert Smith, at running back to bolster that line. He was a home run threat every time he touched the ball. Obviously, we know Adrian was too. But Robert Smith just had a way of just hitting that hole right away. Didn't do a lot of dancing in the backfield, kind of like what Adrian had the tendency to do.

Robert Smith would hit that hole and he would go. And if he had a hole wide enough, he hit that hole right away and it was touchdown, baby. It was gone every single time. Robert Smith, outstanding. Put him in that backfield to bolster that running game. I respect this in part because with Adrian Peterson. Now, look, I mean, no one questions that Peterson is one of the greatest running backs of all time. You name the top 10, he's got to be in there, but there was that element of home run or nothing that I think what the Vikings are looking for is

just a little more consistency with that because they want to pass the ball all the time. Now, I mean, like I would take Adrian over Robert Smith. I think most people would, but catching out of the backfield also Robert Smith, pretty darn good at it. Past protection, another very high IQ player. Like I like that fit and I would probably still pick AP, but like, I like the fit. I like what you're going for that. You went a little off the beaten trail here. Now, since I used two of my picks on guys that were more of role players from the 2017 team, there's going to be some other players who are left off. So I apologize to them that they are deserving. They are left off.

But I'm not going to leave off all the greats. Everson Griffin. If you put him back, if you take that version who got a sack, I think in every one of the first like eight or nine games that lightning bolt version of everson griffin with this defense with daniel hunter on the other side and the way that they mess with people coverage wise yeah i like what dj want him's done the couple of games mark stab import was in it looks like there's a chance he could come back but it is even with one i improving, it is the one thing that is kind of missing is when you just rush four, it's pretty much Daniil Hunter still. And if Wanham makes an impact, that's good.

But it's mostly Daniil Hunter. So I will put Everson Griffin there. And this team is going to be super dangerous at that point if he is there and think about how much of just like an emotional leader everson griffin was for that 2017 defense i mean he was kind of the heart and soul of of that unit he had so many great players at every level of that of that group but he was the he was kind of like the face of that defense, so to speak. So, yeah, I love that. Would have been a great fit in Brian Flores' defense.

All right, my next pick, and you're going to love this too because this is your guy. This is both of our guy, Antoine Winfield, baby. Put Antoine Winfield in this secondary as a nickel corner. Just awesome cover guy. Great in the running game. Was a sure tackler as you could find out of that position. And just a guy that just knew football.

Just his football IQ was fantastic. And another guy that was just a consummate professional, just great leader of a defense. Give me Antoine Winfield in that secondary. Be fantastic. One of the all-time greatest tacklers in history, pound for pound. And I don't know if I've ever really told this story on the show. Maybe I have.

Because people will ask me about growing up in Buffalo and like, hey, who are your favorite Bills players? Or do you still root for the Bills? And so here's the thing as they're playing right now and not playing very well, by the way, maybe Denver's going to be a little scarier than we thought. I don't know. They're playing pretty good. But so I grew up and watched nothing but the Buffalo bills every single Sunday and Antoine Winfield became one of my favorite players. And when they let him leave, I was done with the Bills.

I was like, I'm done. I'm going to root for Cleveland. I remember I bought a Tim Couch jersey or got one for my parents for Christmas. I went and got Cleveland Browns football cards. I'm like, I'm done. I was so mad because the Bills were cheap at the time. The NFL hadn't exploded the same way it is now, where the franchise are worth $5 billion. I was so upset that they let Antoine Winfield go,

that I was done. I was like, this franchise is not serious, and I'm out. And it never recovered, because then they missed the playoffs every year after that for 17 or 18 straight years, whatever it was. So it never recovered. And that was when I was, I don't know, like 17 or 18 straight years or whatever it was. So it never recovered. And that was when I was, I don't know, like 13 or something, but it never was the same.

So it was kind of like when I was a little kid, yes. And the rest, I don't know. I just watched the whole league and played Madden with other teams. That's how upset I was. And he came here and became a Viking legend. And then his kid became a gopher legend and should have become a Viking legend. So, you know, just not talk about that draft other than Justin Jefferson. But, okay, so back to my list.

This is where it gets, you know, pretty hard. But the one thing that this team is missing is a shutdown corner, lockdown. If Xavier Rhodes was on one side and the roads were not open, let me tell you, Manny, this defense would be something because if there's one part that I still wonder about, and we saw it a little bit and the other day, Byron Murphy, is it really like making plays on the ball? There was a couple of, I mean, some of them were just insane throws, but he's had, I would say an up and down season. Caleb Evans has been a nice addition. These guys are not shutting down Julio Jones, Mike Evans, Antonio Brown. He was just on one that season. And for probably like three years, two and a half years, he was a premier shutdown corner in the entire NFL.

And as far as I know I'm one of the last guys who would follow the number one wide receiver I feel like offenses switched a little bit to do all these motions and different splits and stuff that made that harder but he would follow that number one guy every single week man if they had that this would be one heck of a defense I would trust them against pretty much anybody. So he is my number two pick, Xavier Rhodes. Yeah, love it. I mean, from 2015 to 2018, maybe 2015 till I think, you know, something something happened with Xavier Rhodes, I think in the miracle game where he landed awkwardly and was I think he was kind of of hurt the second half of that game or something like that.

I don't, you know, I don't want to speculate too much, but it feels like after the, after the miracle game, you know, Xavier wasn't quite the same guy. He was still pretty good for a couple more years, but he just wasn't quite the same like elite shutdown guy he was in 2015, 16 and 17. I mean, he was just amazing. You threw it in his direction, and it just wasn't happening. Whoever his assignment was just was not going to get the football. He was that good, man. You put him on this defense, it would be great. Okay, my number one guy, and I think this guy could play on any defense and just be an absolute disruptor on the defensive front. John Randall, man, John Randall, you could put him anywhere on that defensive front just as a pass rusher, as an interior defensive lineman and just an elite level pass rusher, as an interior defensive lineman, and just an elite level pass rusher. You put him on this defense and that would help tremendously.

And he's a guy that I think is light enough that you could maybe stand him up and have him be kind of an edge rusher in this kind of unit as well. He was that versatile. He was that quick, that fast. Just one of the all-time great defensive players in the history of the league. And another one of those guys that was just a great emotional locker room guy to really kind of elevate the play of guys around him as well. Much like what Everson Griffin was for that 2017 team. So give me John Randall on this unit, too. Would love it.

No question about it I mean you move him around just like a little later in his career when he was coming off the edge as well as moving inside but that's exactly what Brian Flores likes to do and I mean I just I'm envisioning him standing up over a guard on a pass rushing situation and the guard being terrified because of his his get off his his just his quickness his violence it would have been such a great fit for this defense not that John Randall doesn't fit every single defense in history truly one of the greatest players to ever step on a football field and the energy that that man brings I think would really fit with Brian Flores and with this. If you have John

Randall, you are going over the top. And again, just to restate the rules, obviously I said like not quarterbacks because it's so clear, like yeah, Dante and his prime or something like that was so clear. So that was just to clarify on the list. Now, 2017, I debated between a couple of different players because I've used some of the role players. I've used some of the best players. I consider Jarius, right? That was my joke on Twitter. Like if Jerry's right shows up, they're going to the NFC championship game. And so people are tagging Jerry's right. Like, what are you up to, man? Like, are you going to show up here? And I'll tell you another player.

I consider because my trust for Greg Joseph is not very high. High for bath. Iath, I considered. I was like, wait, can I fit Kai Forbath in this list? Because after Joseph missed again the other day, I was like, man, I just, I just don't feel the belief when he trots out into the field. And I don't know if he does either. He, he just pushes a lot of kicks wide to the right. And if you look at his last couple of years in the NFL,

is not one of the higher field goal percentages in the league. So I don't have a lot of trust for him. Kai Forbath will always be forgotten for making a 52 yard field goal to take the lead late in that game in the Minneapolis miracle game. That's as clutch as it gets. So look, I thought about it, but I thought I can't avoid one of the receivers because we could create an all time 3D peer. And everybody knows he's been on the show. I have so much respect for Adam Thielen, but I'm going to pick Stefan Diggs. Minneapolis Miracle Man, unguardable. We have seen this in Buffalo since he went there.

Can you imagine? And I remember when we used to talk about this, like, Hey, if you hadn't manipulated Stefan digs, you could have just drafted Justin Jefferson anyway, and then had Jefferson and digs and imagine how that would have gone. Well, that's what we're doing in imagination land. We're bringing back Stefan digs and it's going to be Jefferson digs and Jordan Addison. And I do have to say, I mean, and that would truly be the three deep. When people are tweeting out, and again, respect K.J. Osborne, like him,

but when people are tweeting out, hey, this is three deep, like Addison, Jefferson, and K.J. Osborne, the disrespect for Jake Reed was just too intense for me. Like, stop, stop. Jake Reed is a thousand-yard receiver like four years in a row. Cut it out. But that would be a true three deep if they were able to bring it in. And I won't even worry about who's a running back.

Cause I also thought about like Delvin doesn't really count. Cause he tore his ACL early in that season. Jarek would be great for this. A great pass protector, good in the passing game. But obviously digs is, is too good for this. So if I were pulling players off the 2017 team, he would round out my top five. So that's fun, Manny. That's a fun list.

But instead, it's Anthony Barr at age 31. And I guess we'll find out what he's going to bring. Now, in a second, because I have another read uh i want to talk about where we rank the vikings in the nfc because i actually think this is a very interesting discussion now as i look at the rest of the nfc and we're seeing a clear just divide right down the middle of the nfc but where we think the vikings belong in that category that category is a debate to be had. So first, I want to tell you all. And now things just got real interesting.

And I got some notes about people buying their tickets to go to Las Vegas. That's where I'm going to be when Minnesota travels to Las Vegas in the second week of December. I will be there at Circa in Las Vegas. And if you would like to come along and escape the Minnesota December weather like me and also watch a team that has suddenly become very exciting, then you can meet me at Circa Las Vegas, where I will be hanging out, doing the podcast there for a couple of days leading up to the game. And you'll be able to find me outside at Stadium Swim, which is amazing. Google it if you haven't seen it before. Watching games on their gigantic television. They've got heated pools out there. So if it's

the cold weather of 70-something degrees, the pools are still heated. And it's just one of my favorite places on earth to go. Then on Friday night before the game, we've got a special party there for Minnesota fans that includes drink specials, two tickets to give away to the game. So you can meet me there at the Overhang Bar, which is inside Circa. You have to RSVP for the party. So go to their website there. Go to where it says Huddle Up at Overhang. Find it there.

RSVP. And I will be there. So make a whole weekend of it at Circa, located on the amazing Fremont Street. Again, that's one of those things I could only attempt to describe to you if you haven't been there. Amazing to see. So we'll have a great getaway from the Minnesota weather and a lot of fun. And that game is going to have some juice now as well. So book your spot today, circa lasvegas.com.

And I will see you there. All right. So Manny, what are we thinking about the strength of the NFC? I am very interested to hear how many teams on this day you would put ahead of the Minnesota Vikings on a list of NFC squadrons. What do you got? I have right now, I have the Vikings and this might be a little bit surprising to some people, but they've been playing really good football and they've won five games in a row and they're in a really good spot right now. I have the Vikings as the fifth best team in the NFC right now. I've got the Eagles, Lions, 49ers, and Cowboys ahead of them. I kind of, when I was looking over the rest of the conference, I was kind of debating over like Seattle, you know,

Seattle six and three, and, you know, they're tied with the 49ers for first place in the West. But Seattle is kind of, I'm not sure what to think of them yet. Their defense hasn't been quite as good this year. You know, Geno Smith is still playing okay. They've been able to run the ball, you know, pretty effectively still, too, with the guys that they have. But, you know, they were not great against the Baltimore Ravens, you know, two weeks ago.

The Ravens really just kind of destroyed them. And now the Ravens just saw the Ravens, you know, blow a double-digit lead to the Cleveland Browns yesterday and end up losing that game. So you kind of wonder how good Baltimore is. And Seattle did not perform well against the Ravens a couple of weeks ago. So that for me, and considering how well the Vikings have played now with the winning streak of five in a row, I gave the Vikings the edge over Seattle for that fifth spot in the NFC. So I've got the Vikings firmly at number five in the NFC right now.

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INSIDER for $20 off your first purchase. Terms apply. Again, create an account, redeem code insider for $20 off your first purchase. Download game time today. Last minute tickets, lowest price guaranteed. So the Seattle one is the hardest one to figure out. And with San Francisco, they had those injuries that you cannot ignore.

They were missing two all-pro players who are like all-decade team level when they played the Vikings. Not to take away from how great the win was. I'm not. But when you're missing Debo Samuel and Trent Williams in that game, like, okay, well,

that evens the tide a little bit. And then they get them back and they blast a really good Jacksonville Jaguars team. I'm still putting respect on San Francisco as either the best or second best team. The hard thing is how much do we actually respect? So Philadelphia is clearly number one. So maybe San Francisco, number two. How much do we buy into dallas when they play bad

teams they win by a hundred and when they play good teams they seem to you know step on their own feet sometimes uh dallas seems like kind of the same old dallas even as good as dak prescott is playing like their bar is really high six and three is just okay for them Seattle is only hold on I just had this uh hold on I just had this they're only 14th and points scored and 20th and points against to me that's just not great like that just screams they're a middling team there's been some regression with Geno Smith this year that even though he had a game-winning drive against Washington which traded most of their pass rushers he is not as prolific as he was in the first like nine games of last year kind of seems like he's certainly a starter but is he

like an MVP candidate or something no I mean he's still a flawed starting quarterback not that Josh Dobbs isn't and that's the hard thing here Manny is are we overrating what we just saw in that win over the new orleans saints to say okay they're better than seattle right i i'm not i'm not sure though like i don't trust seattle and i don't trust gino to be great through the rest of the season but it's a strong team overall the vikings have a point differential, but they also like don't have their starting quarterback again. And it feels like at any time we could get a four interception game or something like that from Josh Dobbs. And then we'll walk out of that going, oh yeah, that's right. Josh Dobbs is wonderful, but also the same guy that when they traded for

him, you were like, eh, I don't know, maybe. And you love Josh tops. So like, that's the thing that is so hard to figure out here is just what they're going to look like going forward. But getting Jefferson back makes me think that they are better. What is your, what is your order between the top teams? Because Detroit being in the mix here is interesting as well. I think Detroit is clearly better than the Vikings, but what is your exact order of the NFC teams? Not just who is better than them, but like one, two, three, four, five. Yeah. So I've got Philadelphia, your cut number one, I think over everybody, even San Francisco, I got the Niners number two, because I think

like to your point, you know, they get healthy, get everybody back and healthy and get back into the groove. You know, they showed it yesterday beating a Jacksonville team that, you know, speaking of Jacksonville, they better be careful because the Houston Texans are now right on their tail, and C.J. Stroud is playing great, so they've got to be careful. But the 49ers going into Jacksonville and really kind of re-establishing themselves as they're healthy and getting back into their groove again brock purdy looked really

good yesterday so i've got them number two and then i've got detroit number three and you know detroit right now the playoffs are today detroit would be the number two seed uh record wise ahead record-wise ahead of San Francisco. But, you know, Detroit, they've got all the goods, right? They've got the quarterback who's playing well. They can run the football pretty well. They've got a good offensive line. They've got some really nice pieces on defense. But, like, then they go into Baltimore, like, a couple of weeks ago, and they just lay an egg.

And you're just kind of like, just like they're good but is this going to be a situation where like they're the number two seed and like you know if somebody is the number seven and they're playing really well and it's a favorable matchup could they go in Detroit and go into you know Ford Field and win a game there in a postseason probably because maybe the lions just aren't you know for as talented as they are they're maybe not quite ready to go on a deep run yet they've got the goods to do it but you just kind of wonder like you're going to baltimore and you just kind of lay an egg like that like and that could be that could end up being the difference between them getting the number one seed or not, record-wise.

They're only a game behind the Eagles right now. So that's what kind of has me kind of questioning Detroit a little bit. But, I mean, I still think they're good enough. They're going to win the division. I think they're better than what the Vikings have. And I think they're going to be kind of firmly in one of those top three spots. So I got them at number three. and then I've got Dallas number four. Mainly because, you know, they're, they're so talented.

They kind of just, they do these things sometimes where you just have a head scratcher, you know, the loss to Arizona and Josh Dobbs, by the way, who was quarterbacking the Cardinals at that time, just kind of makes you wonder like, well, like, what the hell happened there? You know, it's just kind of the typical, like you said, typical Cowboys stuff where they just have kind of a bad game against a bad team, and you're like, how did they lose that game?

They're not supposed to lose that type of a game. But, you know, it's hard to really take any of the other teams, you know, outside of Philly, Detroit, San Francisco, and put them ahead of Dallas right now, even as well as the Vikings are playing right now. I can't put the Vikings ahead of the Cowboys in the NFC and some of the other teams, you know, New Orleans and Washington and some of these other teams that are kind of hanging around the playoff spot, the playoff mix. I'm not going to put any of those teams ahead of Dallas either. So I've got the Cowboys kind of firmly in that number four spot. The one I'm struggling with to try to decide is between San Francisco and Detroit

because I watched that Ravens game, and it was atrocious for Detroit. I mean, usually if you are that strong, you don't get murdered. But also sometimes teams have that happen. Like it just it got away from them early. They never really recovered. But you watch what they did against the Chargers. And look, the Chargers defense is not special. But I mean, excuse me, that rarely happens.

For as much Dr. Pepper as I drink, you would think I would sneeze on the air more often. Excuse me. But did not lose my train of thought, though, so let me jump back in. What they did to be able to put up the points they did against the Chargers, to lead game-winning drives, to scheme up big plays, and to show their explosiveness as an offense that makes them really dangerous but san francisco's defense really tightening up against jacksonville and maybe getting some things together with steve

wilkes because you know even the way they handled the vikings game was a little suspect so getting it together on defense, their defensive talent is just better than Detroit. And I think they could still score with just about anyone. So I have the same order as you. And I also think that even if the Vikings play well, the second half of the season, we're probably still talking about needing some things to go insanely right for them in the playoffs to be a real contender now i have another question for you but but i don't want to forget to just ask the simple question of your opinion of how many games the vikings will end up winning like how many do you think that they finish with

oh man if you would ask me i mean well we did kind of play this game a little bit after kirk cousins got hurt right and i think i had them um with dobbs started starting the rest of the way i think i had them getting to eight wins eight eight finishing eight nine i think if i remember um and i thought that was pretty generous because that was essentially putting josh dobbs as like a 500 quarterback the rest of the way i think with the way they're playing, if they can keep this going, I think they can get to nine or 10 wins. Now, the latter part of the season is going to get tough because you got Cincinnati and two games against Detroit, you know, in the last four weeks. But, you know, these next three games, Denver, Chicago, you got the bye week, and then you're at Las Vegas.

You know, how much is that stretch you know how much of the next couple of weeks are the raiders going to come back to earth so to speak they've had two really you know nice emotional wins uh to start out you know things for for um antonio pierce but at you know on paper i think at least you look at these next three games, these are all winnable games for the Vikings. And if they find a way to win like two out of those three, now you're talking they're what, eight and five, you know, with four games to go.

And now if you find a way to win, you know, you've got to think, you pencil in that Packers game on New Year's Eve as a win. So then now you get now you're at nine and then maybe you split one of those Detroit games. You know, you lose to Cincinnati, you split one of those Detroit games and then maybe you find a way to get to 10 wins. But I think the way the schedule is playing out, provided everybody can get healthy over the next few weeks, get as many guys back, you get Justin Jefferson back. provided everybody can get healthy over the next few weeks, get as many guys back, get Justin Jefferson back. I think if they keep things going the way it's been the last couple of weeks with Josh Dobbs, I can see them getting to nine,

and maybe you split one of those tougher games down the stretch and you get to 10 wins. And then I think that really puts you in a playoff spot pretty easily. This is the hard thing to decide is now here's what's going to be funny if this doesn't go that way is if just the jefferson returns and they lose some games and then i get more tweets of like they need to trade jefferson the offense oh my god that's oh my god i've already gotten them i've already got they won five in a row with jefferson why they need them? They should get draft picks.

Yeah. Your, your goal is to win the Superbowl, not to just beat, you know, Atlanta, New Orleans. The thing is that, you know, Tim is questioning you calling them winnable games. It's, you know, do not call Denver a terrible team right now. They were a terrible team. They're winning at halftime in Buffalo, which is very difficult. And Russell Wilson is playing well in these last few weeks. I know that like, I can't ask many people to pay close attention to the Denver Broncos recent results, but our first impression of them was they were hilarious and a joke. And, uh, that's

changed. Their defense has completely changed. They got rid of a few players and they've turned a lot of things around. You also mentioned, you know, the the Raiders, you got to go to their place. Their defense is playing well. There's there's no guarantees for these next couple of games. You know, they're definitely winnable. OK, Chicago should be. But even even Chicago kept it close with Kirk Cousins in the game. So to me, there's no just like easy cruise. In fact, we'll see.

I might end up being a Debbie Downer and kind of picking against them this week against Denver. They have a short week. That's going to be harder for them. But you're flying out to Denver. It's just going to be a little bit tricky. So we'll see. We'll see what that ends up looking like. Two out of three, I think is a very reasonable expectation for that. All right. The last question I had for you is clearly there's a 2017 comparison. Now this roster is not as

talented as 2017. We just went through it. I stole the all pro players off of that team, right? So it's not exactly the same, but during the midst of that season, Manny case Keenum became a real debate topic. Like, do you believe in case Keenum, you know, and, and you and I were in the middle of that, uh, uh, you know, on, on the radio back then and everything. And I remember talking about how it wasn't sustainable and ultimately in case Keenum's career, it was not sustainable. But I, what I didn't do during that year was sort of enjoy the ride that a journeyman backup quarterback was having because there were so many debates going on all the time. And that's part of our

job is to talk about the sports debates. In fact, it's a very high percentage of our job. And it's a very high percentage of me being a studier and lover of analytics and what they tell us and looking at this guy's history and saying, I just don't think it can continue. With Josh Dobbs, there isn't much to suggest it can continue. Aside from making the case Kevin O'Connell, when Jefferson returns, the offensive line and his running ability, but looking at his priors, there's really nothing there. There's not a draft status. There's not previous games that he beat the Cowboys this year, but there's not a whole status. There's not a previous games that he beat,

you know, the Cowboys this year, but there's not like a whole lot of like information that would suggest, yeah, this guy's just going to win week in and week out. Why does it feel different? If it feels different, it feels like this is not an argument that's going on. And for whatever reason,

I feel differently watching it than I did then about Keenum, where I was like, this is absurd. How does this keep happening? So why do I feel that way? I think it feels different because, well, one, they are going to get Justin Jefferson back pretty soon. And I think that's only going to help Josh Dobbs going forward, you know, at least for the rest of the season. And it, it just, I think it feels different because you have, you know, with Case Keenum, and Case had, Case certainly had a lot more experience as a starter than Josh Dobbs has,

you know, right now. I mean, Case had started games for the Rams and the Texans and, you know, other places that he had been. So, you know, Case had a lot more experience and certainly a lot of experience as a starter in college, too, with the Houston Cougars. But Case, I think with Case, you know, Case was sort of, I think, riding this magic carpet ride, so to speak, of just like how great that defense was. And I think there was a little bit more, I guess, a bigger margin for error for Case to kind of just play like Red Favre, kind of, and kind of reckless. And, you know i mean mike zimmer hated it obviously uh but i think because that defense was so good and so reliable that

you know like case could throw an interception and it was like it didn't really matter because like the defense was just going to stop the team stop the other team like it just it was just just how it was going to be i think with Dobbs, it feels a little bit more like, I think with Kevin O'Connell in place, there seems to be a little bit more of like a, I'm trying to think of the word to describe it. It just feels a little bit different because Kevin O'Connell has a lot of control over,

over the offense, so to speak as the head coach, you know, Mike Zimmer was a defensive guy and that defense and that unit, that was his baby. And, you know, in 2017, you know, he kind of relied on why am I having a blank on names today? Who's the offensive coordinator? It's tip of the tongue. Yes. Yeah. And he's on Dion staff right now. What am I having a blank on names today? Who's the offensive coordinator? It's the tip of the tongue. Pat Shermer. Pat Shermer, yes. Yeah, and he's on Deion's staff right now.

I don't know why I'm having such a blank today. But Zimmer kind of relied on Pat Shermer to kind of just run that offense because he trusted him. And he would go up and rip Case after games and stuff and that sort of thing. But Case could take it, and he just ran with it. Kevin O'Connell is the head coach and being an offensive guy just seemed like he has a full, like his fingerprints are all over this offense, even though he has Josh Dobbs, a completely different quarterback than what he had from the start.

And so I think, I feel like with Kevin O'Connell being in control of the offense, I trust that this is going to continue. You know, I just have I trust that this is going to continue. You know, I just have a feeling like this is going to continue, and Josh Dobbs is going to continue to play well because the head coach has such a significant influence on what they're doing offensively. And the fact that Dobbs just has that ability to escape and make plays, you know, if something is off or something goes wrong, the protection breaks down, he has the ability.

I mean, the one where he rolled out and, you know, escaped a sack and then kind of flipped it over and hit TJ Hawkinson for like a 15-yard pass was just like, I saw that and I was like, oh, my God. Like, I haven't seen a Viking quarterback do that in years. You know what I mean? And then the touchdown run he had where he ran the other way and got to the edge and got into the end zone. I was just like, man, it just felt different, man.

It just feels really, really different. I'm not saying they're going to go to the NFC title game like they did with Case Keenum, but it just feels like they could get to the playoffs. And it feels like they're going to get to the playoffs and they're going to be a very tough out, you know, even if they don't end up winning a game, that wildcard game is going to be really tight and highly contested. And they're going to have a, have a shot in the end. And maybe they just come up short, but I don't think this is a fluke, man.

I I've seen enough now, especially that first half yesterday. I've seen enough to make me think that this is something that could really continue. I'm buying it. I wanted to answer this question real quick. The Vikings beat the 49ers. How can you put them behind a team that they beat? Let me just toss this out there. Kirk Cousins was the quarterback when you beat them.

I mean, that's kind of a big difference. I know Dobbs is playing well, but that was a great game from Kirk Cousins and without Debo Samuel, Trent Williams. Those are pretty amazing football players, like probably two of the best three players they have. So that, you know, those things they play into it. Also, look, let's do it this way. Vegas, not even my opinion, not even your opinion. what would be the line if they played today on a neutral field Vikings 49ers 49ers favored by like what more three and a half four three I mean yeah probably yeah I mean it would it would be it would be leaning toward the 49ers um so yeah that's I mean that's kind of a a big part of it not having your starting quarterback

who was playing great football. But anyway, let me just get back to what you were saying because I think all your explanations were great. The one thing that I think really stands out, first of all, the first impression of Case Keenum was not good. He didn't play well against Pittsburgh. He didn't play well. So he had that crazy game against the Bucs,

but then he didn't play well against Detroit, and they lost 14-7. They didn't play well. So he had that crazy game against the Bucks, but then he didn't play well against Detroit and they lost 14 to seven. They lost, you know, Delvin cook. And then they won a game where they injured Aaron Rogers that maybe they wouldn't have won because they weren't that good on offense that day. And I remember his numbers through like six starts. We're just like, okay, this looks like a backup quarterback. So it was a, that's a different first impression from Dobbs where the guy has a comeback game-winning drive and then plays freaking amazing like right away the physical talent can't be ignored I case Keenum was undersized did not have a big arm and a lot of the plays that happened were just floating little balloons that just came down in the hands of Diggs and Thielen and that's

what Zimmer kept bringing up. It's like, yeah, he's making these crazy throws and we're catching them, but you can't keep doing that. Dobbs has not been making crazy throws. He's been throwing to open wide receivers on time. It looks a little bit different from just, hey, these random throws up in the air are landing in people's hands. I think there's two other factors.

One is in 2017, the Vikings had built under Zimmer and Spielman over multiple years to compete for a Superbowl. And that was the standard. So we were also viewing it through the lens of, can you really win anything with this guy? And eventually he proved that like, yeah, you could win a playoff game against the saints. It took a miracle, but you know, you could, but he also threw a pick in that game that should have lost in the game that Mike Zimmer had had nightmares about. So you can see why it would be different. And, but that's another part of it too, is the standard for that team was you are so good. You need to go deep in the playoffs or this season is a waste. And changed how we felt it wasn't like oh

this is fun like everybody's having a good time it was like no you gotta win because that's where we are in the timeline right now the vikings are in a different place in the timeline everything's kind of fun and interesting it's like ivan pace okay a caleb evans had a 83 pff grade yesterday like look at this thing that's happening and andrew ruth jr played i think 22 snaps and was on the plus side as well so you got all these players who are on the younger side and you got new fairly new coach still who we're still learning about brian floris has been this like exciting you know the guy who's been brought in that has done defense differently than we've seen done

before there's a lot to like look at there's a lot of shiny things to look at like oh look over there look at this and uh that's changed the vibe because we never had the expectation of this team's really going to compete for a super bowl then they went oh and three and then our expectation was they were going to tank and be terrible and so it's like, oh, wow, this happened, this crazy thing. And if Dobbs doesn't keep going, it's not like they wasted the number one defense. They grew a lot. They learned a lot. They found out a lot about themselves. And they found that their timeline can actually be a little quicker than maybe we thought

it was going to be going into next year, even if it falls off the face of the earth. If Keenum had fallen off the face of the earth, it would have like oh my god they just wasted the number one defense and zimmer just went from 15 16 17 these amazing defenses and did nothing with them and so there was more of an urgency but i also think manny at the end of the day it comes back to the guy in charge when the guy in charge and everybody, everybody takes their cues from him, including the fans. And if the guy in charge is like, this is awesome. Love this guy. I'm having so much fun coaching him. This is great. Everybody get behind this versus the coach coming out repeatedly saying it's just getting lucky guys. He's no Teddy. And you're like, and at times,

at times it was uncomfortable. And, you know, Zimmer, Zimmer would give him a weird compliment, like saying he had big balls, which I think it's after nine. So we could think it's weird on the show.

But like, dude, what? Like you're saying this in public. It was just bizarre. Right. So I think that everybody's taking their cues from the coach. They've sort of said, we didn't really expect to be here anyway. So off we go. And the expectations are different. I think that's

why it feels different. It also feels like this guy has the physical talent to keep doing it and potentially be interesting for the future, but we will see. Do you agree with all that? That was a lot. Yeah. I mean, like, like, you know how I feel about Josh Dobbs. I mean, I was skeptical of the move, you know, just wondering, like, how much of a difference was it going to make to save the season. And now I'm, you know, just as a Vols fan, like, I love to see this. I love that it's at least so far in the last couple weeks

it's been a really cool story. So I'm with it. I'm behind them. I hope it continues. I hope they run the table the rest of the way. Not likely, but this is fun, man. I'm, I'm enjoying it. You know, this is, this is a lot more fun than it was when they were oh, and three or one and four. And you're just like, this thing is over.

Let's trade everybody and look to look to 2024. And so I'm, I'm just going to enjoy this and just see how it turns out. I'm excited. And I'm also glad for everybody who watches because, look, everybody knows the stance on tanking. And I'm not trying to like – I know that Carolina looks bad. We'll see where that goes over the next few years. They need a lot. Houston probably doesn't regret playing Davis Mills all last year

and ending up with CJ Stroud at the top of the draft. So, yeah, by the numbers, had you taken one and four and made it two and 15 and potentially drafted Drake May, who I think is amazing after watching him the other day and throughout the season, your chances for being a great team in the future, probably a little bit higher than they are right now. At the same time, the way that this has come together has told us so much about Kevin O'Connell and Brian Flores and what they have for the future. I'm sorry, you're right, Scott. I forgot to mention Makai Blackman has been playing well as well.

That it's hard to give back, right? It's hard to say like, oh, I would give this all back. I would give back the development of all these players, including Jordan Edison and Kevin O'Connell being a really good head coach. I would just give it all back to draft high. Like that's hard to do. That's an interesting trade. That's probably, maybe that's Thursday's discussion because we've gone longer than usual and I want to get back to the game here. But this suddenly just is fascinating and energetic

and I see it in the numbers and I see it in the comments and I see like everybody being sort of given new life by what's going on here. And that is different from before. That is another part of this. Why I think Dobbs is being met with less skepticism and more like, let's see what happens, baby, because the world is wide open at the quarterback position. It all, it felt like a little bit dark in 17 that because of Teddy, that the position was wide open. Now it feels exciting. So there's a different vibes in a lot of ways.

Manny, you are the best. And I appreciate it. You did to purple purgatory. No, the headline is not clickbait. Anthony bar plays for the Vikings. Again,

that happened. That's what I figured that might happen. If people logged in late and like, hadn't been looking at the news and they'd be like, are you guys messing around? Is this like, no, it's that actually did happen.

So 25 minutes, we covered it. So anyway, but you're the best. I appreciate you, Manny. Thursday night back here, eight o'clock. And we've got a big game to talk about and lots of potential options for top Broncos of our lifetime. So we will see you all then football. It is time once again for a Monday morning Murph joined by Brian Murphy,

who wrote mostly focusing on Kweisi Adafo Mensah's last two trade deadlines, which combined for what? 134 yards through the air, a touchdown pass to TJ Hawkinson, and a touchdown run as well from Josh Dobbs. The Vikings now sit 6-4 and are in prime position to race toward the playoffs, just as we all thought was going to happen when Kirk Cousins went down. Oh, yeah, 6-4, playoff run, town on fire, smiles all around. That's exactly the vibe that was coming out of Lambeau Field two weeks ago.

I mean, it is incredible. Whoever said first, it's a week-to-week league, was the most right person who has ever spoken anything. Because just two two weeks ago it really felt like if the vikings get to seven and ten that would be a surprise and we're starting to look at tankathon which is a website that tracks draft status for everybody where their draft position is going to be and then now suddenly the vikings feel like a dangerous team but I do want to focus with you on those moves from Kweisi Adafo-Mensah because as we start to gather more and more things that he's done, a bigger sample size of how the team is built, which players have been put into positions to get opportunities,

and then these two deadline moves where last year they sort of sensed the moment. They go out and get TJ Hawkinson from Detroit, a former first round player. He immediately fits with this team. He ends up signing the contract extension, which turns out to be a very reasonable extension in the off season. And over the last five weeks, I don't know if anybody has been bigger for this team than TJ Hawkinson. Then you combine that with a pick swap, which got them a quarterback that now we're looking at and going, wait, could Josh Dobbs be more than just some sort of guy that they sort of settled for, which is how it felt at the time. But I don't think any of us realized that there

was so much more to Josh Dobbs. These moves have now come up really in spades for Kweisi Daufelmensa. Yeah. And the timing of them too. I mean, mid-season trades were sort of a relic of a time past if they ever existed in the NFL at all. I mean, we know the other sports, there's always a frenzy of mid-season trade deadline acquisitions and who's in position to make a run, who's in a position to offload. That hadn't been the case for the NFL for a long time. But now I think GMs are realizing you can strike gold if you're aggressive and you have a target in mind and you're willing to spend draft capital in October and November instead of March. And it's impressive to see because, you know, there's been a lot of eye rolling and for good cause too about, you know, what Kwasi was doing in his first draft

in 2022. Obviously, the Lewis sign hasn't, you know, really panned out yet. I mean, you know, what Quasey was doing in his first draft in 2022. Obviously, the Lewis sign hasn't, you know, really panned out yet. I mean, you're looking at, you know, moves moving down, accumulating picks, gathering, you know, capital doesn't really excite the fan base. And the jury's still out on some of the picks that he also made in later rounds that year. But what I've been impressed with is not only recognizing a moment in the middle of the season to go out and get, like you said last year, TJ Hawkinson, you know, former first round talent. The Vikings were doing just fine without him. Cousins was doing just fine without him, but it was immediate, the impact that Hawkinson had getting into the lineup at midseason last year, just as Dobbs has this

year. I mean, he was learning things on the fly as well. Not as extensively, of course, as a quarterback, but it's not easy to leave a division rival in the middle of the season and walk in and not only acclimate, but become an impact player. Hawkinson was an impact player that last season. And then you look at the offseason, it was kind of curious. People thought, well, you know, I know it's a reasonable extension. You're not breaking the bank, but you are investing in a guy that just got here about a half hour ago, and you're still not dealing with the elephant in the room on Cousins. And then, of course, Justin Jefferson doesn't get signed during training camp and goes into the season looking for an extension as well. Boy, look at those moves now. I mean, you've got, you know, nobody could have predicted Cousins would have been lost for the season, but

it looks pretty prudent that they didn't try to sign him long-term, despite the fact that he was putting up big numbers that could leverage a big deal as a lame duck free agent this offseason. You didn't make the move on Jefferson. He gets hurt. I don't know what, you know, look, we know he's a superstar and an impact player. I don't think it's going to harm his value in the offseason. But it does show you how vulnerable the Vikings could be without a star. And what does he do? He goes out and gets Dobbs to salvage the season, not just to get through and limp to the finish line, but bring in an entirely different dynamic. And, you know, now you've got a creative play caller in Kevin O'Connell, let's say,

who's really got an entirely different sandbox in which to play. And that's kind of been exciting both for him and for Dobbs and for what the team has been able to do just the last two weeks, not only winning in two different ways a little bit, but also opening things up for Dobbs. And also look what the threat that he can run, the threat that he poses to wreak havoc on the defense, to ad lib on the fly when a play breaks down, to spin out of pressure and not just pick up a couple of yards and avoid a sack,

not just pick up a first down, but avoid a sack, not just pick up a first down, but find your way to the pylon for an impact score. I mean, these are things that the Vikings couldn't do with Kirk Cousins. They could do a lot of things with Kirk Cousins, but they weren't as dynamic or as diverse. And look at that receiving core yesterday as well. We can go into who was in the lineup, but more importantly, who wasn't in the lineup. And yet they were still able to take down one of the toughest defenses in the league and do it in surprisingly easy fashion to where they kind of drifted into a win. When we look at last offseason, my feeling was that the decisions that were made last offseason sent them in the right direction for the future by moving on from players who were expensive. And had they redone Delvin Cook's contract, had they redone Adam Thielen's contract,

they would have had to push a lot of money down the road into the future in order to do that. And had they signed Kirk Cousins to a massive extension, we would be looking at a 36-year-old quarterback coming off an Achilles injury with probably a $45 million cap hit for next year. They could have done all of that. And with Kweisi Adafo-Mensa and the plan and the competitive rebuild plan that has been brought up so many times and, you know, we kind of snark about it and everything else at times, but they stuck to that plan through the off season. And I think that that is starting to sort of bear the fruits right now, not in just the way that they have flexibility at the quarterback position, and maybe it is Josh Dobbs in the future. And

that's a great trade to, if you get your future quarterback for a pick swap from the Arizona Cardinals, I mean, that'd be like one of the best trades anyone's made in many years. But also the way that they've allowed a lot of players who we did not know were going to be good to get opportunities rather than keep the same players in position. Thinking of like Ivan Pace Jr. playing linebacker. If you bring back Eric Hendricks, then he's not there. They draft a wide receiver to replace Adam Thielen, and Jordan Addison is on his way to start him and made a couple of catches yesterday that were just absolutely huge in that win,

and he's carried Justin Jefferson's load this entire way since Jefferson has been out. That's a draft pick that they spent to move on in the future to give Kevin O'Connell another weapon, but also to replace what they were losing with Adam Thielen. There's a lot of these moves that are sort of thematic, I think. And when a front office is not good, everything seems haphazard. And the way that it had been going from 2020 until Kweisi Delmensa got here seemed very haphazard let's just try to acquire this one player to to bail us out let's just last minute we'll bring in Sheldon

Richardson Bashad Breeland and just hope right and and it doesn't seem like there's been a lot of that it seems like it's been very much stick to the plan and even Dobbs fit into the plan of we're not going to spend huge draft capital to go get an Andy Dalton or a Jacoby Brissett. Rather, we're going to find someone who kind of has an intriguing skill set that might work and might not work. And I also think from Kweisi Adafomense's perspective, acquiring a player of Josh Dobbs' intelligence, I don't know that it can be totally random. This is the Princeton and Stanford general manager known for his educational background. He goes and gets a guy who's able to mentally handle such an incredible amount of information that's been poured on him and sort through that and operate the offense looking like he knew the entire thing on Sunday.

I just don't think that any of this is sort of by accident that it's worked out this way to feel like this team is in a prime position, not only down the stretch this year with all these players emerging that have gotten opportunities because they moved on from the veterans, but also the flexibility at the quarterback position. It seems like this was the idea, even if they didn't know that Kirk Cousins was going to get hurt. No, and I don't think you can overstate to, you know, the educational background and the rocket science. You know, it's a cliche, but the rocket scientist in the room is not going to be overwhelmed by the moment. I mean, this is somebody that has achieved academically what only us, you know, Neanderthals here talking sports could only dream of. And, you know,

he's not a kid, you know, he's already in his late 20s. So this isn't somebody that's, you know, going to be overwhelmed by a change of scenery, a change of coordinator, a change of uniform, a change of rosters. This is what he's been living for the last three months, but also the last seven years. So he's been able to acclimate and find his way. And what I find is that you can almost tell there's, you know, everybody in the crowd obviously is excited. Everybody in the fan base is invigorated. But you feel like in the locker room, people want Josh Dobbs to succeed, not because it makes them better and salvages their season. But this is somebody that is easy to gravitate toward and rally around. And, you know,

he's been nothing but humble. I mean, just reading the quotes from the podium yesterday about him spending so much time in the facility, in the hotel that's on the campus, you know, riding the elevator with Vikings legends who are in town to honor Steve Jordan, and just sort of absorbing the moment, absorbing the skull chant, absorbing U.S. Bank Stadium, what it means to kind of step in in this moment. You know, he could have folded like a house of cards yesterday, and there may be moments in the next several weeks where he does look like he's overwhelmed, and he does throw the bad pick. I mean, his first few series in Atlanta could have really, you know, not only

put the nail in the coffin of the Vikings season, but really, you know, a younger quarterback might not have been able to kind of overcome or at least assess that kind of adversity in a hostile environment in an impossible situation. But he didn't let that affect him. Turnover free ball yesterday. They finally got the running game going, which I think took a little bit of pressure off as well. His offensive line, we've been talking about that for several weeks, is really sort of galvanized as a unit. I think they're almost overly protective right now of Josh Dobbs because they know the stakes. They know what he's trying to do on the fly. You just get the sense that there's a real,

this is kind of a galvanizing moment. It was a galvanizing moment coming out of Lambeau where you kind of felt like the love and appreciation and respect that this team has had for Kirk Cousins, which also carried over into the pregame t-shirts they wore in Atlanta. But you can definitely feel like, you know, they're not shunning Cousins, but they are embracing Dobbs. And I think they're embracing the moment. And I think what makes it the moment. And I think what makes it exciting is obviously we don't know how he's going to continue to develop. We don't know

what his entire learning curve is going to be, but you can see the possibilities and you can see, I think somebody like Kevin O'Connell, who's not only done a great job of getting him coached up to perform. But I think you can see the real beginnings of a quarterback-head coach relationship. He's in his ear. He's trying to build up his confidence. He's trying to make him understand either just through verbal or nonverbal communications on the sidelines throughout the week that he's got his back. He's going to be able to be creative. He's going to put him in positions to succeed. And I think that's what's, you know, what's great is the possibilities, because we don't know exactly if this playbook is going to completely morph to Dobbs,

if they're going to be able to retrofit some of the schemes to him as he picks up more knowledge of the roster and gets more comfortable. And all of that being said, now they're in a position, too, with Jefferson where they don't have to rush him back. I don't feel like they need to rush him back, and I don't think they feel like they have to, whereas if the season were closer to 500 and still teetering and there was a vibe that,

you know, if Jefferson could just come and salvage the offense and salvage this team's hopes, there may be a temptation to get him in the lineup sooner. It doesn't feel like that's the case right now. And again, they're going to Denver, they got the Bears at home, and then they've got to buy. That's pretty good situation to be in uh to keep padding confidence and also you know stack up a couple of victories because they should be in positions to win these next two games i think with dobbs i don't know that i've ever seen and yes his rocket science background does play into this a more impressive mentally put together athlete because he does have the the capability to retain all the information that he has to cram throughout a week but also the way that he handled the entire

thing all right so maybe you get thrown into a situation you kind of black out you kind of go nuts we've seen it before backup quarterback comes in finds a way to win a game and it's like whoa okay and then the next week the crash comes down. And I think that he understood that there was no way that that was going to be able to ever happen again. It was like one of those total aberrations, once in a blue moon type of things. And then studied like crazy throughout the week to understand the full game

plan. And that was what Kevin O'Connell said. We installed a full game plan for him. Do you know how much that asks of a quarterback who just got here, who doesn't have the base stuff? He doesn't have the base knowledge, so he just has to take on the entire game plan and learn it all from scratch.

But also, he talked about his quarterback coach saying, hey, take a moment, take it all in. This is great, right? This is fun, which I think is great coaching. And it feels like the coaching staff and management look to acquire somebody that fit with them personality wise. And I was thinking about this story from years ago with Daryl Morey, who studied his own scouts. And what he found was that his scouts looked for players like them. So if the guy was

a three and D he always overrated three and D type of players, obviously this is basketball. And I think that with Kweisi Adafo-Menson and Kevin O'Connell looking for players who match their energy and you know, this goes for Brian Flores as well. It's really playing out well. Like the team has become their team. It's become a reflection of who they are. And I just couldn't think of a quarterback who would fit better than that. Then, then the way Dobbs is not just from an educational standpoint, but also from a mental toughness perspective that he just, you mentioned Atlanta where there were times where he could have just completely melted down. This guy is, is even as you'll ever get. I mean, yesterday after the win, I mean, he was very calm.

He was very matter-of-fact about everything that had happened. He was obviously smiling at the win. But this wasn't a guy who was like, woo, you know, like over the top, I just, you know, whatever. He is not a rollercoaster type of person, and I feel like that fits really well with Kevin O'Connell. And so as everything is, you know, Kevin O'Connell. And so when, as everything is, you know, pushed forward in the NFL with the discussion, is it going to continue to me,

that synergy right there between those two where Kevin O'Connell basically called it like a really fun week to coach Josh Dobbs, you could sort of see it galvanizing in front of our faces. And I always want to be skeptical about a career backup and say like, Hey guys, you know, something bad might be coming around the corner, but with the way that those two have instantly connected, it feels like this should continue, especially when they get Justin Jefferson back. Well, at least it feels like it's going to continue, uh, that you're not going to see a lot of ad-libbing or, you know, off-page or off-script. I don't mean what he can do in the pocket. I mean, just in terms of what

he and O'Connell are trying to do together. I don't, you know, a lot of times you can bring in a very athletic quarterback who's bounced around and, you know, it's almost like the head coach wants to put some reins on him and kind of, you kind of bridle him a little bit more to fit that scheme. And it doesn't sound like O'Connell has any desire to do that, and it doesn't sound like Dobbs, at least in the first week and a half that he's been here, is going to try to pull away from that and revert to what he knows best, which is pull the ball down and let's play in the backyard.

There are going to be moments that he knows best, which is pull the ball down and let's play in the backyard. There are going to be moments that he does that, as witnessed yesterday, and that's going to create excitement, opportunity, opportunities for mistakes, opportunities for big plays. I think the Vikings are prepared to roll with that. But you don't get the sense that either one of them are going to revert back to their comfort zones and not embrace the idea of connecting and improvising together, growing and learning together. The other thing, you know, you mentioned Brian Flores and it should not go unnoticed or undiscussed that, you know, Dobbs doesn't have to do all this by himself. He knows at some point he's going to get Jefferson back. He knows he's got good protection. There may be a little bit of ice breaking in the run game,

at least to keep defenses a little more honest. But he doesn't have to go out and throw for 358 yards and complete 94% of his passes. As the first half indicated yesterday, if they can keep opposing defenses huffing and puffing and guessing and put up some points, the Vikings defense in the last, you know, three, four, five weeks has really kind of reinvented itself almost in, in Flores's image. And I mean, I think Kevin Seifert had a VSPN tweeted out where they've ranked since this

winning streak has begun and every major offensive or defensive category, their top five. So this is not only a completely different team with Josh Dobbs, but it's a completely different defensive team than what we saw the first three or four weeks. And, you know, I'm sure there were a lot of fans, and I was among them, who thought, you know, this game is going well past three hours. The Saints are getting yet another possession. This is going to bite them at some point. They could not get a first down and snuff that beaten team yesterday

until Jameis Winston threw up a couple of balloon balls that, of course, were going to get intercepted. They can't count on that again against a Detroit or a Cincinnati who they're going to be facing in December. So it's interesting to watch, though, that this defense, again, never seems to fail to rise to the occasion, you know, and that's whether it's with their pass rush, whether it's linebacking play, whether it's against the run or certainly in the secondary coming up with a key turnover at a key moment. This team has really turned a corner defensively, and that may be as much of a reason that they get to the playoffs

and maybe have any kind of success than what Josh Dobbs can do offensively. I think defensively this team has forged a new identity that is as much and being led as much by their defensive coordinator as O'Connell is leading Dobbs. I don't know that I have ever seen a team or a unit, I guess, on defense grow so quickly as much as they have. And yes, I am aware that when you play Philadelphia, they're one of the best teams in the league.

And when you play the Los Angeles Chargers, that's a little bit different than the opponents that they faced. I also feel like if you were to copy and paste this defense, the current one that we just saw on to week two, on to week, was it three or four against the, must've been three, against the Chargers, that the results are different. Doesn't necessarily mean they win, but they, I think, have found what these players do well over the weeks, and they have adjusted and whittled down the scheme to what they do best and mastered what Brian Flores is asking them to do because the players have bought in, but also because he is finding himself in this scheme and discovering what he has in some of these players that maybe he didn't know before. Well, you know, we see Jonathan Bullard on the field a lot now making a difference like that guy. I don't even think anybody thought he was going to play hardly at all. And then, you know, now he's playing all the time. I think they are a different unit the way that they have grown.

And this tell me how much it meant to you to be the Saints, because to me, it meant a lot. Like if we're going to talk about them as a team that can really contend a team, that's super interesting in the NFC down the stretch, you have to beat new Orleans with Josh Dobbs and you have to beat Derek Carr because he's not a joke quarterback. He's a good quarterback. He's not a fantastic, but he's a pro NFL can drop back, deliver the ball. And he looked out of rhythm, out of sorts. He was getting pressured a lot. He seemed a little bit flustered and frustrated.

So it's not just Jordan Love. It's not just Tyson Bajan. It's also somebody who is a proven good quarterback with a lot of weapons. You saw how good Chris Olave is. We know how good Alvin Kamara is. And yet they were finding ways to get after him and then, and cover the receivers to the point where even when Derek Carr did leave the game because of an injury, his stat line was terrible. He was averaging like four yards

per pass attempt. So to perform the way they did against that defense and that offense, again, they're not the Eagles. They're not the 49ers. They're not one of the best teams in the league. But to me, that said, all right, after beating the 49ers and the Saints in this run, this isn't just like you got lucky because of the schedule. Like this is a legit five game winning streak that to me says we should talk about you in that same conversation and start comparing you to how you match up with the other teams in the NFC. Yeah, and I mean, the 49ers finally look like they're well again after a little bit of a hiccup that the Vikings contributed to. The Eagles are still the class of the NFC, but boy, every time I seem to watch the Cowboys, I wonder what they're going to, you know, is this going to

finally be the year that they break through in January and put together a championship run? It looks like the Lions are really the class of the NFC North, and they're positioning themselves for a home field advantage fight to the end as well. But you're right. It still doesn't feel – I mean, it feels like the way these teams are kind of reinventing themselves as the season goes on, I don't see how the Vikings really can find themselves in a position where they're going to plateau. I mean, they may only win 10 games. They may only win nine. But I feel like they feel better about themselves. And they're showing that they can win in some different ways. And that to me is what's going to differentiate them perhaps in the post

season is that they've got a lot of scar tissue. They've got a lot of adversity that they've, they've overcome. They're getting a lot of hard nose kind of experience. And you really can't put a finger on that, what that means, overcoming injuries. I mean, every team does it, but the way they've been able to rally, overcoming injuries. I mean, every team doesn't, but the way they've been able to rally, not just around Dobbs, but the way they've become, as you mentioned, you know, they've kind of, especially on defense, they've adopted the identity of their

defensive coordinator and the aggressiveness and, you know, really sort of the relentlessness that it takes to not only survive a game, you know, a 60-minute game where there's so many momentum turns and so many adverse conditions that you're put into. I'm sure the defense was exhausted at the end, thought if we could just get the offense to get down the field, we can survive this. But, no, they had to come back out to the very end

and come up with stop after stop. Now, granted, it was against, you know, New Orleans' backup quarterback, Jameis Winston, who was, you know, at times dangerous, but at times, you know, a loose cannon and a liability, and the Vikings made him pay for that. But that could have easily, again, been a situation where all it took is one broken coverage at the wrong time, and we're talking about how close it would have been and what opportunity was lost for the Vikings to continue this momentum. But instead, they came up big when they had to. It was important, I think, to get another home victory under their belt. I mean, the last two

home games, they've looked really dominant at times in that home crowd. Look, everybody that comes in here, Dobbs included, talks about what a unique atmosphere it is. And we know they don't have a lot of home games remaining. So it was important for them to, I think, put that one in their back pocket as well. There's a long way to go. There are some hiccups along the way. And as we mentioned, you cannot count on Dobbs to play mistake-free football the rest of the way. But at least now you have the confidence in him.

You also have the confidence in your defense that if there is adversity along the way throughout the course of a game or even a week-to-week basis, I feel like they're in a position where they're not going to let that implode. I mean, if you've lost your starting quarterback to a season-ending injury, you've started the season 0-3 and 1-4,

and you've somehow managed to be part of the NFC elite playoff pursuit conversation. That's going to carry a lot of weight along the way. I don't see the Vikings somehow folding either in an adverse situation in the game or at an adverse spot in their schedule. If they were, say, to go out to Denver and come up with a dog, they're still going to be able to respond. I just feel like that this is a locker room that's not going to allow things to get away. I think the way that I would put it is, well, one, I'm always fascinated by how our feelings and opinions

are shaped so much by what just happened. And there's always this, hey, don't overreact, don't overreact. But also how much do I weigh a win like that? Which, yeah, I understand they got ultra conservative in the second half. I would have done the same thing. I mean, I just did not believe that the saints were going to be able to score that many times. And I understand why Kevin O'Connell did it. I probably would have gone for it rather than kicking the field goal because I just don't trust Greg Joseph still. At the same time, I mean, I think forcing the Saints with their offense, their backup quarterback in to score a bunch of times against you was a bet that they were willing to take. And that it ended up paying off with one of many Jameis Winston wild throws and interceptions. But I think what

I'm trying to do is say, well, how much does this really matter? How far should I push them up into this discussion? The answer is definitely not in the same range as the Philadelphia Eagles. You brought up the 49ers. I know they beat the 49ers. That's still a tough argument for me to say, oh yeah, well, they're better than the 49ers in a playoff game where you'd have to go out there. Like, I don't think so, but you know, a team like Seattle, are you neck and neck with Seattle? You're probably, I mean, you're ahead of anybody in the NFC South. You're ahead of anybody else in the division. The Packers lost again yesterday to Pittsburgh. So we've sort of cut down the NFC into these three teams that are behemoths in Philadelphia, San Francisco and Dallas. And then a couple of teams that should

be right behind them where it can be scary in the playoffs and could pull off an upset in the playoffs. And that's where the Vikings sit right now. If they lose the next two games and melt down against Denver and Chicago, then we'll say, I guess we'll remember the time that playoffs. And that's where the Vikings sit right now. If they lose the next two games in meltdown against, uh, you know, Denver and Chicago, then we'll say, I guess we'll remember the time that I thought they were going to be much better than they were. I just don't feel today like that's going to be the case. So let's wrap up with this Murph. What's the Vikings final record. I think I've kind of spitballed this. I think they can get to 10. I think 10 and seven is, is about right. I think I look at them as you know,

I think there'll be able to take care of business in Denver and at home against Chicago that gets them into their buy feeling pretty decent at eight and four. You know, I know Cincinnati, you know, took it on the chin against Houston yesterday, but I still don't see them walking into Cincinnati and taking down Joe Burrell. So I'm looking at that as a loss. I'm guessing they're going to maybe split the two games against Detroit. So I mean, that gets you to 10 and seven. But again, how are they playing getting into that moment? What's their opponent going to be? I think 10 wins after a one and four start is pretty much a, that feels like one of their NFC championship seasons, you know,

where they're double digits and they feel confident going into the postseason that something special is going to happen. 10 and seven doesn't exactly give you a warm, fuzzy feeling, especially if you're going to be going on the road against some of these elite teams but I just feel like they're they're playing for each other not that they never have in the past but it just feels like after you know sort of the sour ending of the of the Zimmer and Spielman era you've really had nothing but pretty good vibes for the last year year and a half uh in that that building. We all know about the golden horseshoes of last season, but I think what they're putting together here after just such a tough start and losing, you know, your starting quarterback to a season-ending injury and getting

a guy that, you know, seems to be fitting in well, but it's always a wild card when you're bringing in somebody in from five different organizations. The fact that they've been able to rally around Dobbs and Dobbs has been able to inject that locker room with confidence and just kind of a new attitude. I mean, these are rarities in the middle of an NFL season. That doesn't happen too often. You generally are who you are, personnel, identity, scheme-wise. But this feels like a completely different team that broke camp on Labor Day weekend. And it's a completely different team than the one that came off the field against the Kansas City Chiefs. So that's what makes it most exciting. And I just feel like I see this

as a 10-win team that maybe is a team nobody wants to face, but I don't see it being a 10 win team that is guaranteed to run roughshod unless they can find a way and prove that they can not only compete with, but defeat an elite team very likely on the road as well. I think you can use the word contenders without using the two other words in front of them. You are contenders in the NFC. Are you Superbowl contenders? Let's wait because there's a lot more to prove beyond just this. So yeah, well, that kind of gives you the status of where we stand though.

A remarkable turn from a couple of weeks ago when the Vikings lost Kirk Cousins to an Achilles injury. If they win 10 games, I think Kevin O'Connell has a great, great case for Coach of the Year, by the way, to overcome losing his quarterback. But we're a long way from that, and they have to not, as you said, have those meltdown games as they head out to Denver this week. So we'll see where we're at next Monday when we speak. Brian Murphy, great column. Go check it out on purpleinsider.com

where you focused on those mastery of the trade deadline moves that the Vikings made to get themselves in this position. So go check that out. Thanks for your time, Murph. And look forward to talking to you next week. All right, folks.

Enjoy the ride.