Purple Insider - a Minnesota Vikings and NFL podcast - Chris Trapasso of CBS Sports breaks down a draft sim with Trey Lance going to the Vikings + talks receivers

Episode Date: April 12, 2021

Each Monday Matthew Coller is joined by Chris Trapasso, draft analyst for CBS Sports. On this week's episode we break down a draft simulation to start the show that has the Vikings landing Trey Lance with the 14th overall pick and whether that would be a good choice for the Vikings considering their present situation with Kirk Cousins's contract. Chris also breaks down the different styles of top wide receivers, including what makes Rondale Moore like Percy Harvin in his eyes. Plus they talk about the all-time great quarterback prospects and how they compare. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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What is up, Chris? We are getting closer and closer and more and more ridiculous with reports and with opinions and everything else. It's been, I'm not going to say relative to real life, it's been tough. But I mean, just in terms of football analysis life, it's been tough. I have a question. Is the Max Jones to the 49ers speculation just not going to die until they're literally they send in their pick because it felt like okay they make the trade up people connect the dots you know he's a Kyle Shanahan type quarterback but this was a month out from the draft five weeks out it's still raging on and I'm like man we're getting close to two weeks away that is like the biggest thing where I'm like, man, we're getting close to two weeks away. That is like the biggest thing where

I'm like, this needs to go away. Like I I'm ready for that. I'm ready to do my final mock draft in two weeks. Uh, that people will say like, I didn't do a good job with my mock draft. Cause if I only get three or four guys, right, I don't care. But really for me, I I'm excited beyond all that ridiculous speculation and mock draft stuff to be done like with my top 250 and have all those grades finalized and send that in right before the draft see it on the site and then just be able to refer to that during the draft and then afterward any post-draft stuff so i'm excited but i do want the mac jones speculation to go away i mean personally i think the only way to look at

whether a draft analyst is good at telling you about hundreds of players in detail is how many picks they get right on draft night in their last mock draft. I mean, that's the only way. So I'm sorry, we were going to go, Chris, like pass the draft for a couple of weeks to analyze and break everything down. But I mean, if you don't get at least half of them right I think we'll just probably cancel that yeah I'll get a lot of questions from my family like how did your mock draft do like my job hinges on that and I'm like two years ago I think I got like seven right and I was like blown away and last year I got like four and I'm like that's stupid anyway Daniel Jeremiah gets like eight and it's like an amazing mock draft. I mean, I'll try to get as many right as possible, but that is like the least of the things I care about, especially that close to draft weekend. And with all the stuff that teams put out to reporters and everything else, I saw a tweet from Greg Gabriel, who has his problems on Twitter sometimes, but he does work for an NFL team. And he was talking about how he would apologize after draft season for all

the lies that he told to people during draft season about what his team wanted. And I totally believe Greg, when he comes to that, to your point about Mac Jones, this is good right here. This is from NBC sports, 49ers,

I guess maybe in the Bay area. Adam Schefter tells whoever their host, he believes the 49ers prefer Mac Jones for now, but are keeping, quote, an open mind with the number three overall pick. You know what I would be willing to bet my entire house and cars on is that they're not keeping an open mind about the number three overall pick. I would put everything on it. They already know exactly what they're doing for the number three pick. They did not sell their entire future, Chris, to be open to whatever could happen.

The only way to interpret that would be maybe they're saying if someone else falls to them at three that they would take, let's say, Zach Wilson Justin Fields, if they're not taking number two, but I just am very, very sure. They're not open-minded about this thing after giving up as much as they did to number three. That's incredible. Yeah, definitely not. And that encapsulates why no one should take anything that they read on Twitter or hear on the radio seriously in terms of

a draft rumor. If that's what Adam Schefter is reporting, the most plugged in insider, then it's just completely foolish to put any stock into any of these things. The 49ers know exactly who they're taking. We know the Jets are picking Zach Wilson. Kyle Shanahan knows that. John Lynch knows that. But let's move past that. I just want that to be done. I don't want to talk about it anymore. I feel like we probably will, again, all the way up until number three overall. And I would actually bet a fair amount of money that Matt Jones won't be the pick there. But hopefully in a couple of weeks, we'll never have to talk about it again. I feel the same way. So here's what is first on the docket today for you. And we're going to talk about a couple weeks, we'll never have to talk about it again. I feel the same way. So here's what is first on the docket today for you.

And we're going to talk about a couple articles that you wrote that are really excellent topics, I think, for the show. But I have to have you analyze my mock first. All right. So I did a draft simulation for the Vikings, and here's what came up. And this is why I was so excited to bring this up right away and not wait till the end Trey Lance is who I took at 14 and then Trey Smith so Trey season in the third round and then Cameron Sample but who cares about those if Trey Lance is on the board at 14 would the Minnesota Vikings take him should the Minnesota Vikings take him? Should the Minnesota Vikings take him? What are the chances that this could happen the way that the draft simulator laid it out for me with Trey Lance available?

Well, I think with the Panthers trading for Sam Darnold, it probably eliminates them from a quarterback. I mean, speaking of draft rumors, we've heard that that trade hasn't taken them out of the quarterback market. I think it does. They're not going to pick a quarterback at eight. They need others like offensive linemen. They need defense. That increases the chances. And really, if Mac Jones stunningly becomes a number three overall pick, Trey Lance could be the guy that falls and I mean you could probably tell me if you think the Vikings would actually do it I can tell you as a draft analyst that they absolutely

absolutely should early on in a podcast I think in late January early February when I don't think people thought even Zach Wilson could go as high as he ultimately will and certainly Trey Lance were like Trey Lance to the Vikings at 14. That seems like around where he's maybe going to be picked and would be the ideal situation for him to learn from a Kirk Cousins type. The mobility for the play action bootlegs, the gigantic arm, the rawness. And you would definitely get a redshirt season. I think if he landed like with the Panthers pre-Sam Darnold trade there would have been a push halfway through the season Teddy Bridgewater

get out there Trey Lance is in too early for him with Kirk Cousins his contract the high floor that he presents you would really be in a similar Alex Smith to Patrick Mahomes type of red shirt scenario and that is what I think will be the best for Trey Lance. I don't think all these young quarterbacks need a full season, and it's rare that it happens. Mahomes needed it. And it's funny to look back. We're like, oh, he was this amazing prospect.

Everyone loved him. He wins the MVP in his first year as a full-time starter. But I don't know if things would have gone as well in terms of his development if he was just thrust onto the field right away. He was very reckless and not crazy accurate at Texas Tech. That's why he was kind of viewed as a boomer bus prospect and why on a good Chiefs team that maybe could have been better if they had a higher caliber quarterback in terms of his physical ability, he sat for a full season. So the Vikings need defensive line. They need offensive line. They need maybe a linebacker.

They could go corner. They could go wide receiver. If Trey Lance is there at 14 and he is the quarterback who falls, they need to jump all over that. I think from the Vikings perspective, the owners of the Vikings have put a lot of money into very little success compared to their expectations with Kirk Cousins. Now, if Kirk Cousins had been Washington Kirk Cousins, where he was someone that you drafted in the fourth round, and then he made your team relevant, and you sort of built up with him and then had to make a decision, I think you would look at this through a different lens. But he took over a team that Case Keenum had gone to the NFC Championship with, and the expectations were pushed up to getting back to that level.

And the fact that they have one playoff win in three years, and last year, I mean, you're talking about a 7-9 season where the offense was good, but it wasn't great. And they start 1-5. At one point, he leads the league in interceptions. And each one of these years, if you take his game logs and you analyze them, you see, oh, look, a section of cold play that really hurt you. And then a hot section of play when you got to go against the Lions a couple of times or something. And he wins player of the month.

And everyone's talking about how good he was in the last eight games. Well, last time I checked that there's 16 game seasons. So I think that if you're at the very, very top of this organization, you're frustrated by how much money has been poured into him, and you might be interested in giving it one last shot. And if it works out and you go to the NFC Championship or you go to the Super Bowl, well, then you consider an extension and you probably give Cousins an extension because he proved he could do that. But if you end up 8-9 this year or 9-8 again and you get a lot of the exact same, you're going to want to have another option. And the way that his contract sets up, Chris, I just think is perfect for exactly what you

laid out. And here's the ancillary bonus of taking a guy now, because I can just hear people saying, but don't they need offensive line? Don't they need defensive line? That is true. But if you have Cousins still under contract going into 2022, you can trade him the same way that Kansas City traded away Alex Smith, the same way that Matt Stafford was traded away to the Los Angeles Rams.

You can trade him away. And what you get in return is a bunch of cap space. Huge. Probably a first-round pick. I would almost guarantee a first-round pick. And so you can recoup these things. So you can use the money that you get from Cousins to build around Trey Lance. I mean, it's one of those things that if one of the top five quarterbacks is on the board at 14 and the Vikings don't do it, it's one that we'll go back to constantly of how did you not do that in this

situation with the way Kirk's contract is set up? And if he's great, you can always just keep him and stick with Kirk. I have another question for you. With the Vikings having 11 picks, what are the chances that you think that they could move up a few picks if Trey Lance is there at 10 or 11 and you have to throw like a fourth rounder to a team or a third rounder I think they're in a position where they don't have to fall into this miracle scenario of Trey Lance getting all the way to 14, one pick ahead of the Patriots that you feel like the Patriots would jump on that all day. I think if Trey Lance is the guy, or maybe even if Justin Fields,

but for the sake of your drafts, if Trey Lance is that quarterback that's there 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, the Vikings, to me, again, as a draft analyst, I would say throw them a third round pick or third and a fifth and get Trey Lance for all those reasons that you just pointed out. For short term, not as much because you have Kirk Cousins, but for the long term, it is a good investment. And like you're mentioning, it is a cheaper investment where you can rebuild that team on offense and defense. And by the way, we talked about this, but offensive line and defensive line, defensive ends specifically,

are the positions that take the longest to develop to make an impact. So if you're talking about, oh, you need a defensive lineman this year, so you have to draft one and can't draft a quarterback or a tackle and you can't draft a quarterback, well, the likelihood that that tackle

is good right away for this year anyway is pretty low. And all the offensive linemen they've drafted recently have not been good right away. So year anyway is pretty low and all the offensive linemen they've drafted recently have not been good right away uh so that just put that aside but the question for me chris would be and you're right that the teams ahead of them look like they have their quarterbacks or are not in a position to take one like philly they have so much to rebuild that this is not a great situation to take a quarterback right now i would advocate it for almost everyone, but I think that's how they see it.

The Giants want to give Daniel Jones more time. Carolina is seemingly set. Dallas is definitely set with their quarterback. They just paid him a gajillion dollars. So they could do that, yes. And they have been stacking draft capital for years and taking a bunch of guys in the fourth, taking a bunch of guys in the fifth. Well, can you use some of that to be able to move up?

Now, how much they want to do, I don't know. Like, would they dip into next year to a second-round pick or something? That's where it gets a little dodgy, especially with pressure. And this is where the only holdup is for me for this scenario is the pressure that's on Mike Zimmer and Rick Spielman. I mean, now you could look at this two ways. And since you covered the whole league, tell me which one is more likely, in your opinion.

If you're Rick Spielman and Mike Zimmer and you want to point the finger at Cousins and say, hey, we did a lot of things right. That guy just didn't get over the hump. What we really need is another quarterback. That's what we really need to get us over the hump. We can do it. It's actually his fault. That's one way to look at it, to try and sell if we get to stay for the future.

The other way to look at it is, no, we actually need that edge rusher to pressure the quarterback right now. And if we don't get that, we're going to get fired. So I don't know where that stands, but I think that that might be the determining factor of whether they would do this or not. I think still in today's NFL, unfortunately, for as much as I want this scenario to happen, that you had it in your draft sim for the Vikings to land Trey Lance, it does seem like scenario two is more likely, that even if they drafted Trey Lance, if he never played or he played the last game of the season, like Patrick Mahomes did, a meaningless game,

the Vikings didn't make the playoffs. They're kind of on their last limb. Most scenarios, if you look back, and I don't know if there's any example where this isn't the case, they'll probably get fired, and then Trey Lance is on to his new head coach that has no ties to him, that might not have liked him. It's not the best situation. I know in Chicago, Ryan Pace and Matt Nagy were retained, but there wasn't a quarterback waiting in the wings there in Chicago.

So I think in theory, you would be able to sell that to ownership. Like, hey, we have this young quarterback we're really excited about. Let's move on from Kirk Cousins. Let's start a new era with him. But I think a lot of times, especially two or three years of downturn in play and an expensive quarterback who's aging, an ownership group or an owner will say, we need a new head coach in here. We got the guys. So I think that would maybe make Rick Spielman and Mike Zimmer lean defensive end or whatever. But I think in general, for the betterment of this team over the next two to 10

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Right, so this is a good point, and I think we're just probably too far down the road for that. That if they had drafted a quarterback in 2018, Lamar Jackson, or 2019, I don't know who, but if they had done that, maybe it would be Jordan Love. And then they were saying, oh, we've got to give Kirk this year, but we've got this other guy we're excited about. Maybe you could sell it.

But if you're saying, no, the only way to save our jobs is to take this guy and then wait a year and then develop that guy because there's no guarantee how he's going to play his first year. Like that's pretty tough to sell. Oh yeah. You have to give us like three more years. Um, they are under contract, but in the NFL, I think we know that it's year to year, no matter how long your contract is. So, uh, let me just get your takes on the other two picks that I had, uh, Trey Smith from Tennessee, the guard and Cameron sample. How do you feel about those guys? PFF gave me really good grades. Trey Smith would be an awesome selection for the Vikings in that you've said

that a lot of the Vikings blockers have taken, like, years to develop or just been flat-out busts, that we've said it a lot with their defensive line that they have a type and they like these project-y types, and clearly they like to move around guys position wise up front on offense or they like the really athletic guys Trey Smith doesn't look crazy athletic and he wouldn't be your classic zone blocking guard check out his pro day he had a phenomenal pro day explosive really good in the three cone the broad jump so that to me kind of aligns with we know that the Vikings do prioritize like measured athleticism and Trey Land or Trey Smith from Tennessee has that and he's super experienced redshirt senior like 6'5 225 or 325, very powerful. So I think he would be probably the most NFL-ready blocker that the Vikings have drafted in the last three or four or five years.

And if we're kind of assuming the scenario that Mike Zimmer and Rick Spielman are like, we need someone right now, Trey Smith in the third round would be fantastic. That kind of feels where he's ultimately going to go. There was some early, very early first round buzz for him, but his film isn't tremendous. In round three, though, the athleticism, the experience. He played left tackle. He played center. He played right.

He played like every position up front. I think that would be a really good pick. And Cameron Sample is very fascinating. I think being a later round selection he would fit the Vikings prototype in that he can play up and down the line of scrimmage it's like when I've graded him I was like is he a defensive tackle or an edge rusher he's got a unique body he's like six two and a half like 275 very good with his hands he mostly played on the edge of Tulane but then at the senior bowl he had one of the best performances of any defensive lineman, like facing centers, facing guards, very good with his hands,

and he's a pretty good athlete. So I think he would be that movable chess piece for Mike Zimmer that he seems to like, that if you're not getting a Donnell Hunter that's 6'5", 265, and built like a Greek god, get someone that is truly versatile and is pretty polished. That's Cameron Sample. So I really like that three-round or three-pick draft sim just as much as PFF did. Yeah, they gave me an A. Good job, Matt.

If you draft a quarterback, you usually get an A either way. They love positional value, which I don't blame them. They should. But Cameron Sample, yes, I felt very draft guy being like, I remember him in the senior bowl being kind of a beast. And the Vikings at their best did have undersized three techniques who were getting after the passer, specifically Tom Johnson was about that size and was a similar type of guy. So maybe, maybe that's somebody that they look at. Okay. So you wrote two different things that I want to talk about.

Since we just talked about quarterbacks, let's save that until the end because I think it's kind of fun and I want to harass you about it. Okay, let's hear it. Wide receivers, though. You wrote about wide receivers, and as conductor of the wide receiver three train for the Vikings, I am also realistic about the fact that they probably wouldn't take a wide receiver in the first round if Trey Lance isn't there we're we're talking about the heavy heavy favorites being offensive line and defensive line but as we get into the third round I think that there could be a lot of different types of receivers for the Vikings so I want to talk about the top guys first and then we'll talk about down

the board players who could fit into more role players. So when you compare your Jalen Waddell and Jamar Chase and Devontae Smith stylistically is what you wrote about, what is the difference between these three guys who are all considered the elite prospects? Just the fact that they are truly elite in all of the areas that I think are super important to be a good wide receiver in today's NFL. They're twitchy. They, for the most part, can beat press at the line. College receivers don't see it nearly as much as they do in the NFL. They play much bigger than their size, elite verticals, ball tracking ability. And then I think with Waddell, what separates him for me

is I think he's an easier projection after the catch. Jamar Chase kind of is that A.J. Brown type that's going to be tough to bring to the turf, but Jalen Waddell is like electric in terms of his, I mean, he's a great returner. So you know that he's very good in space. That really is what separates them is they, I've said this 50 times during the pre-draft process, they check all the boxes. They're a little bit different though. Like I think Jalen Waddell is actually very similar to Tyreek Hill. Speed, plays a lot bigger, will go up and get it. Devontae Smith is this flexible, elastic guy that's always open, plays big. And then Jamar Chase, AJ Brown, Chris Godwin type.

So the top three actually are a little bit similar stylistically. And that's why they're all, you know, just a clear head above everyone else in this really good wide receiver class. If you're ranking the things that you look at, and I know that you have an actual ranking for how you do your grades. Give me like your top three things that you weigh the most when you're trying to figure out, is a guy going to be you know a next level top-notch player is he going to be just okay maybe you don't really see it like what what are your skills that are most translatable in your opinion my heaviest weighted category for wide receivers uh is a category that's called releases and separation so that's kind of two things tied

into one but i think you need to be able to get off the line of scrimmage. And the one thing, and probably it's super nitpicky, but probably why Jamar Chase is my number two receiver right behind Jalen Waddell is when you watch Jamar Chase in 2019, his main method to beat press is like he literally bench presses the cornerback. Like he's so strong. And to do that in the SEC to do it against Trevon Diggs from Alabama it's like wow like that you never see that do I think he's

going to be able to do that as much in the NFL probably not I think Jalen Waddell is better beating press and then just being able to create separation and that can be with quickness that is kind of baked in if they're really fast and they can create vertically. That's the most important. We know that in today's NFL, it's transition to a separation-based league. After that, yards after the catch. Even if you can't really separate a ton, if you're dynamic after the catch with your athleticism, with your vision, your contact balance, we've kind of seen with, again, to reference A.J.

Brown, that's kind of the new age, the Debo Samuel, the D.J. Moore. They're not like crazy, crazy separators, but once they get the ball, they truly are running backs. That's my second highest weighted category at wide receiver. And then I still think ball skills matter. I still think the ability to track the football, contort your body on a back shoulder, go up and get it in those contested catch situations. I have that as my third highest or heavily weighted category, just ahead of speed. Like I think speed's important, but it's kind of a luxury. If we would have had the combine, we would have heard all about receivers and corners that, hey, if you're going to go in

the first round, you have to run like sub 4-4 in today's NFL. I think it helps. And that's, I mean, I have Jalen Waddell with the highest speed score, but that's actually my fourth highest graded. And then size. So that's like my whole gamut of the grading system at the wide receiver spot. Releases, then yak, then ball skills. Yeah, I think the releases to me are incredibly important because the NFL does play so much press

and because the corners are also technicians and their minds work as quickly as their bodies and they all run four threes and they're all strong and everything else. So unless you're Julio Jones' size or A.J. Brown or D.K. Metcalf's strength, it is really tough to just push those guys off the spot. And usually they can recover too because usually they're technically very sound too and so if you can create any sort of separation at the release this is what makes Stefan Diggs great this is what made say someone like Doug Baldwin really good if you are not that

freak in terms of strength releases right up there and that kind of goes along with just foot quickness and I have a bias here having seen Justin Jefferson, Stephon Diggs and Adam Thielen. I would have the ball skills second because those guys have tracked down more footballs that they shouldn't have caught over the last five years that I've been covering this team and maybe it is just because those guys are special but when I watch someone like Rashad Bateman I know we talked about him a bit last week but I see a special ability to track the football in the air where you are adjusting yourself before the defender is adjusting himself because you understand where that ball is coming down and the all-time greatest at this who always got most credit for his speed but his ball tracking ability

was the all-time great is Randy Moss. That Randy Moss knew how to make it look like the ball wasn't even coming his way and then just reach out and snatch it. Like he was so confident in where that ball was going to be that he didn't have to turn his body all the way around. He could just peek back and then reach out and grab it. And it was unstoppable. I think it was one of the best parts, if not the best part of his game. So that's very high for me, recognizing that part of it is shaped by watching these wide receivers. Yeah, you've definitely had quite the wide receiver experience covering the Vikings recently, and then obviously with the legend Randy Moss. The one thing I will say, like the last thing about ball skills, is that I think it's easy to think like,

oh, ball skills for a wide receiver just means like, can they go up and bring down those rebounds in the contested catch situations? A lot of what you just said, I think, hits a nail on the head that how I look at it, while that's important, while that's flashy, it's the ability to just track the football and make like difficult catches. Maybe not where a corner is draped on you, but it's a little bit low. You're running an outbreaking route. You're waiting for the football and you see it's low. You need to dive for it. You need to get your feet inbounds while you're catching a pass that's above your head where you have to extend your arms. Ball skills, I think, are pretty natural. I think you either have them or you don't. And just literally tracking it, being aware, like, oh, that ball is right here. it's on me as I turn my head around some receivers

react a tick late and they drop a lot of passes and then guys like you mentioned Randy Moss, Diggs, Thielen that they are just naturally comfortable when the ball is arriving and can contort their bodies and they just come down with the football in any situation. I think it's what's made Adam Thielen a star because he's not that fast. Even his separation ability, he's a route running technician, but I don't think it was on the level of someone like Stephon Diggs. But if you throw the ball anywhere, we talk about catch radius. This is what really falls into catch radius for me is how much you can change what your body needs to do. And even the location, like if you just run the routes, how they're drawn up, you're not going to catch that many footballs. Like no one is that

perfect as a quarterback, even Tom Brady, where you don't have to start adjusting your body. And I think that, you know, that's what makes the best of the best really, really good. Now let's talk about the next wave after that. So we discussed Bateman and we both like Bateman quite a bit. He does a lot of things really well. Who else is in that conversation? I will admit that after watching Rondell Moore and then looking at his pro day numbers, I'm really excited about Rondell Moore, even though he's five foot tall. But there are few players who are that explosive even at the NFL level and I think

that he sort of tops this list of the next level beyond the elite guys yeah I agree I think that next year I have Rashad Bateman and Rondell Moore like squarely inside my first round totally different receivers the point about Rondell Moore when I graded him I was like this is a top 25 talent in this class like I wasn't factoring an injury and I'm not going to factor an injury because I don't know anything about his medical history. I'm not going to be a projecting of injury proneness, whatever that is. Once he gets to the NFL, he is five foot seven, but you're right. He is arguably, he's up there very close close if not just as good in terms of his explosiveness with Jalen Waddell like he catches a football and he is shot out of a cannon

what I like about him and anyone that is concerned that he's Tavon Austin 2.0 he's like 5'7 like 185 he's built like just a like miniature running back and he doesn't just win with his explosiveness he is amazing with his contact balance you can watch any season 2018 2019 or 2020 you can watch any game with rondell moore in it and you'll notice man this guy's fast he's twitchy but like he is like a pinball out there and that's why he's graded so high for me because i have yards after the catch second no he doesn't have a big catch that's why he's graded so high for me because I have yards after the catch second. No, he doesn't have a big catch radius. I think he's got pretty good hands.

But being able to get open and create after the catch and not just turn a 5-yard gain into a 15-yard gain, but turn a 5-yard gain into a 45-yard gain. That's why I think Rondell Moore will still probably go in the first round. And if he gets into the second, any team that picks him there, I think would be very smart to do so. And that would represent gigantic value.

So I think for as much as the top three are really, really elite, and there's a decently large gap, I think Bateman and Moore, and then even Elijah Moore from Ole Miss, I think are in that next tier. Totally different receivers, but can be like instant impact. And then just really good for the first three to five, seven seasons that they're in the

NFL. What do you think about the playmaker as where they stand in the NFL now? Because that's how I look at Rondell Moore. And I feel like it's something that gets talked about a lot, but there are very few people who can really make a difference with it. And yet I still believe that he is so unique and special that he can make a difference with it, where you're not going to necessarily put him at X wide receiver and run deep posts with him. You got to get the football in his hands, which requires some creativity from an offensive coordinator,

some specific planning to get the football in his hands. But I also think that I mean maybe is there like a Percy Harvin type of comp here I mean Percy Harvin is maybe an all-time explosive talent but I see a little bit of that when it's just that special he immediately just blows everybody else away with his quickness and speed around it yeah I think the offensive weapon or the gadget type is in a better spot than it was five to ten years ago. Do I think a team is going to just totally focus their offense around Rondell Moore? Not necessarily, and probably not.

We've seen a lot of teams that have one explosive player. They get some touches. They're low-volume but high-efficiency players. You still need to be able to run routes, and I think Rondell Moore can just because of how explosive he is even if it's from the slot he can get open on maybe not 15 different routes but enough where you don't have to just give him a jet sweep it's funny you bring up Percy Harvin because I think with the Jaguars second pick in round one I think that that Rondell Moore Urban Meyer Percy Harvin connection would be tremendous. They have LaVisca Chenault, who's not quite as explosive, but he's kind of a contact balance

running back type at wide receiver. He could fill that Percy Harvin role under Urban Meyer, but I think Rondell Moore landing there with the Jaguars would make a lot of sense. And I do see a lot of Percy Harvin in his game. And I do think one last thing, the fact that the Chiefs have shown with Tyreek Hill, that you can have a player that is a high volume part of your offense that is getting the football on jet sweeps, on screens, you're throwing deep to him just on a simple go route. They certainly have Travis Kelsey.

That's why the offense is so good. But as the Chiefs, especially in the second half of 2020, started to use Tyreek Hill as a gadget type more than, hey, run these seven routes this game. They were just getting him the football and letting him create. That's the blueprint for someone like Rondale Moore. Hey, everyone. Anybody who listens to the show knows that Sam and I may

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and I really do mean it when I say friends. They are fans of Purple Insider over at Scout Logistics, and since they reached out wanting to support this show, I want to tell you about what they do. Scout Logistics is just-in-time transportation for full tractor-trailer loads. And if you're wondering what that means exactly, well, if you own or work for a company that needs shipping solutions, they are the preferred carrier of Fortune 500 companies across North America. And we have quite a few of those in Minnesota, right? They can ship perishable, non-perishable, FTL or LTL,

and they have on-time delivery rate of over 99%. So if you're like them and you enjoy the show and you have shipping needs, check out ScoutLogistics.com or call 855-217-2688, extension 232, to connect with them directly to find out how Scout Logistics can minimize risk and overperform and go the extra mile for your company. I also don't think it's crazy at what are they picking winners Kansas City 31. Kansas City is also maybe on the board there for Rondo. It's sort of weird to say, oh, they have these elite playmakers. Well, two of them.

But after Sammy Watkins had his injury issues and his inconsistency, I thought that that hurt them, and especially in the Super Bowl, which is they view everything through the lens of how can we win the Super Bowl, needing another guy who could create explosive plays consistently, unlike Hardman who doesn't really doman, who doesn't really do it. Robinson doesn't really do it for them. Not consistently like a Rondell Moore potentially would. Now, move me down the board a little bit here,

because I think that the Vikings' most possible thing to do is take defensive end or take offensive tackle in the first. But in the third, it's very much up in the air. They literally could go best player available here and they could look at it and say we really can't have Chad Beebe as our number three wide receiver we don't want to spend a first on this but it's a deep class so who's in the third and so so give me your sort of sense for the late second third round wide receivers And if anyone there could be special, I'll give you a name to start with that I like, which is Jalen Darden from North Texas.

Because you know why, Chris? And this is draft season for you. His highlight reel is fun as hell. That's why. That's the reason. Yeah, he kind of is a Rondell Moore light type of prospect in that he's small, but he's a gadget type. They threw him, they use like really wide splits at North Texas and just literally like

threw him like a 15 yard pass across the field and then just let him run down the sideline. He's that fast. So are you, like, let me ask you, are you thinking that that's the type of player that the Vikings want? Because the recent article that I wrote was like different types of wide receivers. And there are like, there's bigger types. There's Nico Collins from Michigan who's 6'4", Tamorian Terry from Florida State. Diami Brown from North Carolina is kind of the more highly sought after

vertical threat. Not going to run a lot of routes, not a lot of yak. But then there are those, Jalen Darden kade johnson from south dakota state duane eskridge from western michigan uh even shy smith from south carolina those are all the types in my favorite daz newsome from north carolina that are all like in the slot get open in a hurry short underneath which i think would be good for Kirk Cousins so it just kind of depends on what type you want especially if you're picking in the third or the fourth round going wide receiver there you're right I got overly excited to talk more about Jalen Darden but a good point

that you know there are plenty of different types and I'm not sure exactly to tell you the truth Chris I mean because do you want somebody who could take over for Adam Thielen or Justin Jefferson in case of injury? Or do you want somebody that specifically has a role? This team has not really had a spot for a playmaker since 2016 with Cordero Patterson. They have just not had that type of guy. But I wonder if that's because they didn't want to spend a draft pick on them and couldn't afford them in free agency. I mean, once upon a time, they picked up Kendall Wright. Last year, they tried Tajay Sharp. Like, these guys are just, they're not even really a type.

They're just not good. So I don't know. I don't know which one fits better. I feel like the playmaker guy, the guy who can either be a deep threat or the end-around type of guy, is a better fit for them. So, like, those guys, I think would be something that they could use maybe 50 targets a season for until, you know, we go forward and maybe Adam Thielen falls off or something like that. Okay. So I do have that exact type in the article and the type is explosive gadget types with downfield appeal. I try to get really creative

with those titles. I'll give you four guys. You already listed one, Jalen Darden, and that is a player that Vikings fans need to familiarize themselves with. But three others that I think are very similar but fit exactly what you just described. A lot of people know about Tutu Atwell from Louisville. He's tiny, and I don't really even think he's that sudden and he's not going to juke out and tell your defense down the field. But he is super fast.

Like get him on a decently well-blocked jet sweep or a play where the defense just isn't ready for that. He will score a 90-yard touchdown. He didn't actually have a crazy pro day, but he is one that's like faster on the field. So I think if you want to create that Corderell Patterson type, not the same size, of course, 2-2 Atwell, third, fourth, fifth round range, he would be a target. And then a similar player who's actually a tick bigger, Marquez Stevenson from Houston. He's slender. He's not, again, someone that is a jump cut kind of guy, but crazy fast. And I think he's a little bit more well-rounded of a wide receiver than Tutu Atwell.

He's graded a little bit higher for me. Got injured a little bit at Houston, but another one that can take the lid off the defense. And we know, despite not having a big arm, Kirk Cousins has been one of the more accurate downfield passers. So if they want to dink and dunk and dink and dunk with Thielen and Jefferson and then go over the top, Tutu Atwell or Marquez Stevenson or Jalen Darden would be good. And the last one, Amir Smith-Marset from Iowa. I don't think he's quite as explosive. Maybe just playing in the Big Ten. Iowa is not surprising, but was actually used a lot on jet sweeps, go routes, bubble screens.

I think he actually is more creative after the catch than Stevenson. And, well, he can make some guys miss. And then he has that extra gear down the field. They're all like 5'9", 185, which I'm completely fine with that size at that gadget or explosive playmaker type. So those four, I think round three to round five should all be on the board. And it wouldn't shock me because I know that you know exactly what the Vikings needs are and the type if one of those receivers ultimately get drafted by the Vikings in this draft. And I'm not sure how much it matters to them how tall the guy is. I mean, Chad Beebe is five foot 10 and he's the guy who's their current number three wide receiver.

All right, before we finish this Chris Trapasso draft show presented by Victory Home Team, let's talk about your article about the all-time great quarterback prospects. And I'm just going to spoil here that you had Trevor Lawrence at the top of the list, which makes you a crazy person, I think. So you're going to have to explain that. The all-time quarterback prospect list, this guy this year, Trevor Lawrence to the Jacksonville Jaguars is at the top. Explain it to me, Chris.

Okay, I'll explain by going backwards. I had Peyton Manning at number four, and I did the cheesy proverbial Mount Rushmore of quarterback prospects apparently in like 1971 like Jim Plunkett was like the guy but I didn't want to go back to 1971 the league has changed too much and I haven't really heard that name continued on as this legendary prospect I went Peyton Manning at four because even reading and I found this amazing Peter King profile of the 1998 draft, where like Bill Walsh and I believe Mike Shanahan and one other guy, like he just asked them what they thought about Manning and Leaf.

And it was crazy that like they were like, it was not exactly a toss up, but it wasn't like 90% Manning, 10% Leaf. It was like Leaf could be better than Manning. Obviously, there was off-field and mental stuff that went into that, but Manning was, even for 1998, was not considered a great athlete for the quarterback position. I know it was more of a pocket-passing league, and even from that article and doing other research, there were some critiques about his arm strength. Like he super cerebral, super accurate, but he was like middling as an athlete and not,

and didn't have a great arm. So he was four because of those reasons. Number three, I had John Elway. And that was because of all the diva stuff off field. Like all the, I'm not going here. And it looks like I'm going to have to play for the Yankees because the Colts picked me the injection of his dad kind of being even more of an a-hole like hey we're not going there we're not playing for the Colts and that rubbed people the wrong way

apparently like that 30 for 30 Elway to Marino was tremendous and right in that I couldn't find I couldn't find it but in that documentary there like, it would be insane to hear this now, an interview of Terry Bradshaw, who was a quarterback in the league then, and was just like, I don't like this Elway kid. Who does he think he is? I think he's going to be terrible. Just super candid. So I think for everything that Elway brought from his athleticism, which obviously translated to the baseball field, how quick he was, his rocket of an arm, pretty accurate. That's why he was number three. Because, number two, Andrew Luck did not have any of those concerns.

And I think stacking up, especially from the same program, Elway raised the Stanford Cardinal program in the early 80s Andrew Luck did the same thing with that program 25 years later 20 whatever it was didn't have the off-field stuff was a great athlete we saw at the combine that after the year after Cam Newton like had a crazy workout like Andrew Lux was like as good as Cam Newton's and he was very big and I went with Trevor Lawrence at number one because no off field or diva concerns whatever you want to call them and this was like super nitpicky I almost went Luck number one because again he was a great athlete I think Lawrence is actually a more sudden athlete than Andrew Luck Andrew Luck was bulkier and that probably played into it.

But a couple of those long runs that Trevor Lawrence has had in college, like against Ohio State two years ago, it was like, wow, like that was a 60-yard touchdown from the number one overall pick. Like that was insane. And the fact, and this is the ultra nitpicky draft analyst thing, Trevor Lawrence is a full year younger than Andrew Luck was when he entered the NFL. Like Luck turned 23 in his rookie season. Trevor Lawrence is going to turn 22. So we know that even after 2011, which would have been crazy, Andrew Luck could have left Stanford and would have competed with Cam Newton to be the first overall pick. Who knows what would have happened? I think Luck probably would have gone number one overall to the Panthers.

But we're kind of comparing somewhat apples to oranges because Trevor Lawrence was like 18, 19 years old when Andrew Luck was red shirting. So that was like the two things, a little bit more suddenness and a little bit younger. Maybe Luck was slightly more polished as a passer, but I think a lot of what Lawrence does on the field as a passer, you're not going to really nitpick that too much because the ball placement, the arm talent, the big game throws, tight window throws as well. So I went into it not sure what I was going to do. And after research, I'm like, I think actually Trevor Lawrence is the best quarterback prospect the last 40 years. So tell me why I'm wrong well uh mike renner also said since he's been doing this uh friend mike renner from pff that he's by far the best prospect

that he is also analyzed trevor lawrence so i don't think you're completely on an island um well the only thing that i was going to say is just like with peyton manning but there was competition in ryan leaf no question with peyton Manning there felt like an inevitability that he would be a great quarterback like there was maybe I don't know maybe I'm too young to remember some of the questions that were brought up at that time I just remember feeling like even NFL broadcasts were talking about my gosh when when Manning gets to this league he's just gonna completely take it over and second year in he did and never stopped pretty much even when he was garbage at the end he still wins the super bowl right so um you know

here was my question though did you consider including anybody who was not good because mel kuyper when the demarcus russell thing was calling him the best prospect that he had ever seen. And now there's also the other one that I would have maybe considered on my list because of his athletic ability, Michael Vick. That is the guy that I remember watching in college thinking, I can't believe what this guy is going to do to the NFL. Like I've never seen someone with the combination of Barry Sanders speed and God arm who could throw it out of the stadium, right. In that commercial, uh, which I know was not real, but I'm just saying, I, I, those were my two things. Like did Mike Vick come into your mind here? And did you consider anyone who actually didn't work out? I didn't. And I should have

my editors kind of pitch it to me. Like, how does he compare to Elway, Manning, and Luck? And that's kind of what the low-hanging fruit has been, like, how does he compare to them? But I probably should have considered some, like, prospects who didn't work out. And that's the thing. On this, on Twitter and stuff, which I'm fine with getting any comments, people, like, are using hindsight. And it was really, and I put it in the intro like this is just how they were as prospects but you're right to marcus russell i even think robert griffin the third was super hyped he just happened to be in that same draft class as andrew

luck like accuracy arm strength super athletic fast like was a track guy. I could have included someone else. Like, and I think Mike Vick probably, or RG3 would have been that guy. But I think the one thing with Vick was that I, if I remember correctly, I was, let's see, he was in the 2001 draft, was 13 years old. Was that like, people knew that he wasn't that great of a passer. Like he was not very accurate. Like he could throw it 70 yards on a dime for a big play, but like a dig route, he would two out of three times, you know, throw it over the guy's head.

But I do remember feeling the exact same way you did and being like, oh my God, this guy is going to run for a thousand yards every season. And he was an insane runner. And I do think that there is something that speaks to the fact that Vic played as long as he did and had the layoff with the dogfighting thing and came back and then played for like 10 more years after that was really remarkable. So he would probably be up there in the top five to seven quarterback prospects of all time.

I think maybe Jermarcus Russell too because there certainly was insane hype for him, but I didn't consider that. Maybe if I have to write this again, if like Spencer Rattler is this huge prospect in 2022, I'll say like, okay, a few of these prospects were bad, but before the draft, people adored them. Yeah, there was a couple other that came to mind for me. Jameis Winston had the clear off clear off field issue but everything not off field remember him being talked about as a generational talent and they even talked about i mean this has not come to fruition at all but they talked about all his x's and o's ability is unbelievable he sees the game unlike anybody else and i mean hey like you're an nfl quarterback still but you also threw 31 interceptions so that's not the case.

But when he – think about how good you have to be for teams to overlook his personality off the field to still take him number one overall. I think that says a lot about him as a prospect aside from that off-field part. Yeah, Jameis would have been a good one too. And there was so much to, even though that was kind of at the precipice of when we were getting away from pro-style offense in college, but I think back in 2015, it was like, yeah, like you want someone from Jimbo Fisher's like dropback system that's read the whole field. So there definitely was. And that was kind of like

a weird conundrum that like oh he's this immature kid but like on the field he's like even further ahead of where Andrew Luck was in terms of the mental side and then he had the physical makeup and to check a Trevor Lawrence box he was amazing as a freshman like just exploded onto the scene and was a marquee quarterback for those two seasons at Florida State. So yeah, Jameis probably is up there too, top five to seven to eight, somewhere in that range. And I think he was a deceptive runner too. We know he wasn't a crazy athlete, but he could get out of a jam and pick up a third and six with his legs. So yeah, Jameis was definitely a very highly touted, guaranteed to go number one overall

prospect for many years when he was at Florida State. The one other one that came to mind was Carson Palmer, where USC was at the absolute top of their game. And he was just unbelievable with the arm strength, the size, the prototypical quarterback, everything you dream of. And he would be that. So yeah, I mean, I think that your list is the guys that immediately come to mind and it's a really interesting comparison of how trevor lawrence

doesn't have some of those red flags uh that even the greatest quarterback prospects of all time had uh which hey you know jeremy schapp is right about one thing that they don't always work out that is true i saw that video what are you doing man if if you didn't see it don't bother it's ridiculous so anyway you should just pick a linebacker at number one overall i don't know i think you should just draft only quarterbacks who are in the sixth round named tom brady and that's the only way you should go about it i think anyway well that's uh that's draft season for you anyway chris for passive draft show another great episode your podcast is the prospect podcast your work is at cbssports.com and it is terrific so we will do this again next monday and we will

be one week closer to the actual nfl draft happening Thank God. One last question. Do you think the Vikings make 11 picks? I think they make more. If I had to bet on history, they usually make more picks than they have. They usually trade down in the middle rounds and they'll get, they lost a pick from screwing around

with a practice squad player or something last year. They'll get that pick back so we're gonna have a lot to talk about after the draft oh yeah it's gonna be a blast oh yes oh yes whether they take somebody who's really really exciting in day one or whether they take 15 guys on day three that you need to explain to me who they are because this always this always happens where i'm like lance zierlein didn't even profile this guy. How am I supposed to? There's not even a YouTube highlight. Is this guy real?

Well, that's the thing. I'm doing the live draft grades for CBS Sports for the third year in a row, like from rounds two to round seven. And for me, it's like nervous time once we get to round six. And the Vikings and the Patriots are like the two teams where I'm like, they're about to draft some guy where I'm like I didn't scout this guy like I've watched 300 plus guys write-ups grade my grading system weighted all that and I'm like who's that like the Vikings are a team that I've pegged along with the Patriots that are notorious for picking like a Wyoming linebacker that no one knows or a off the draft radar offensive lineman or a wide receiver

in the seventh round and I'm just like oh man I need to like scramble to get something out there for a grade so you didn't have Kyle Hinton toward the top of your I did not have Kyle Hinton last year that was one and I just was looking at the Vikings draft history and saw I was like man that pick was like oh like wasn't it one of the last picks in the draft last year? That was like off the radar. And that's one where are the Vikings just like, hey, where's an offensive lineman? Just pick one.

They have a little dropdown on their computer. Kyle Hinton. Okay, let's pick him. Like hopefully that doesn't happen too much. And hopefully there aren't too many prospects that I have not watched or graded, but we'll definitely have a lot to talk about, even if it is only 11 picks, but if it's 12 or 13, plenty of content possibilities. Oh yes, yes, yes. Prepare yourself for specialists as well. There will be a kicker. There might be a long snapper. So we'll see,

uh, Chris, great stuff. And we will talk again soon. Thanks, Matt.