Purple Insider - a Minnesota Vikings and NFL podcast - Do the Vikings have a desirable coaching job?

Episode Date: December 29, 2021

Matthew Coller and former Minnesota Viking Jeremiah Sirles talk about why the interior of the Vikings' offensive line hasn't come together this year. Sirles breaks down Ezra Cleveland and Garrett Bradbury's game. Jeremiah also talks about whether the Vikings have a coaching job that the top candidates are going to want and what type of coach would find it attractive. Are the Packers going to rub salt in the wounds of Vikings fans. Get football tickets at TickPick.com/insider Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Want to remind you before we get started, the Tick Pick is the exclusive ticketing partner of Purple Insider and the Blue Wire Network. Tick Pick should be your first choice to buy football tickets because they save fans money by never charging service fees ever. What's that sound you hear coming from the trenches? It's former Minnesota Viking offensive lineman Jeremiah Searles. It's time for the Tuesday morning left guard show on Purple Insider. They're too strong, my dog.

We're too strong. From Chicago O'Hare Airport, Matthew Collar, Purple Insider, here for Tuesday morning left guard with Jeremiah Searles. And if you're wondering, hey, didn't they play in Chicago last week? Why are you there again? Well, that is because I'm flying home for my brother's wedding because he decided to have a Christmas wedding, which means me traveling during the holidays. And so I've already been texting you, Jeremiah Searles,

about some of my experiences getting off and on the plane. But I have found a relatively quiet place in the airport and there will be a loudspeaker man at some point who comes over behind me. But other than that, I think I'm just using a little indoor voice, but I'm doing okay. And we're going to make this happen. Hey, I love, I'm sure you love your brother, but I've said it and I'm going to say it forever. If you get married on Christmas Eve or you get married on New Year's Eve or 4th of July, you're kind of a selfish human being. I had my roommate from college, got married on 4th of July

in Kansas, outdoor wedding, light gray suits. And it was one of the more miserable experiences of my life. Yeah. Well, I can't say that it's thrilling to have to go through this travel experience, but hopefully this is the one and only wedding he gets. So, you know, I'm making it back. I'm grinding. And the one thing is you could have plenty of criticisms for the show. You could say, oh, you're too hard on this or that, or I don't like your idea about who to trade for. You can never say this. I'm not committed.

Yes. Your commitment to the grind never stops, Matt. about who to trade for whatever you can never say this i'm not committed yes i am your commitment your commitment to the grind never stops matt that's right to bringing you the takes about what the vikings are going to do against green bay and in the future with you jeremiah so maybe we can start by i just want you to comment because uh you have to since i'm in pain with this travel you must be in pain to tell me what you saw from the interior of the vikings offensive line against aaron donald in the los angeles rams i mean it's exactly what we expected i don't i mean we i we kind of every week we kind of trick ourselves into like well maybe like maybe it maybe it won't be as bad as

we think it is and then immediately it's like nope it's as bad as we think it is and then immediately it's like nope it's as bad as we think it is like there's no aaron donald took it everyone took their turn it really i think that you and i were texting back and forth during the game like we thought it was going to be the aaron donald show and to a point it was but it wasn't like we really were holding anybody down and it showed and we nailed it with well Stafford's gonna give us one which he did but he gave us three but I mean the one that Anthony Barr was just classic Stafford like that's the one where it's like oh I'm running I'm running I think I could float it up in the air to that guy and then he just didn't but the interior of our offensive line is gonna continue to be an issue it's gonna

continue to be a problem and guess what Kenny is equally, if not as talented and in some of the ways that Aaron Donald is in a little differently, but we've seen it now with Akeem Hicks. We've seen it now with Aaron Donald. And I think we're going to see it again this week with Kenny Clark of they're just going to push our three middle guys back as far as they can. Uh, yeah. And we kind of knew that there really wasn't an answer i mean there's always the hey what if they play this guy or what about wyatt davis and sort of here we are again with oli

now on the covet list talking about will they actually use wyatt davis and i think the answer is no because dakota dozier got pushed up onto the roster and i think dozier is probably going to play over wyatt davis uh which i think would if that is the case would say a lot about why uh where wyatt davis is it would be uh very drew samia ish but there is actually a a point here that i wanted to ask you about because ezra cleveland had a 30 pff grade that is out of 160 is average uh against the rams and i understand that anytime aaron donald plays for the other team you're going to be in trouble no matter who you are um but now that the guy in the background is talking i'll just throw it to you to tell me what you thought of ezra cleveland because i think it's been very up and down this year

yeah i think anytime you're talking about an offensive lineman, the number one thing you want to talk about them is consistency. You talk about, hey, this guy's a really great offensive lineman in the NFL that are just amazing. To be a good offensive lineman, you just need to do your job consistently. It doesn't have to look pretty. It doesn't have to look picture perfect, but you just got to get guys blocked. And there's been times this year that Ezra Cleveland has looked like that. There's been times where you're like, okay, you can see, okay, he might be a starting guard in this league. You can see it. But then there's other times where you're just like, man, he went off the rails. And a lot of this, I don't know is, and again, I hate saying this, but like, what is his development like week in and week out? I think you have to start asking yourself that question for a guy that's played this much football. What is the coaching and what is the development for him looking like

on a weekend basis? Because I think coaches and even veterans in the room can fall into the trap of, well, he's started two seasons now. He's not a young guy anymore. We talk about it on the show all the time. You're offensive lineman. You don't reach your peak of what you can really be, in my opinion, until year four and five. And so you still really have to coach those guys hard. You still really have to help those guys develop their tools

and how they're going to be on game day on a day-in-day basis. And I don't know what that looks like for Ezra Cleveland right now. And really, that's been an issue kind of as I've been thinking about this topic for a lot of young offensive linemen that have come into the program for Minnesota. I mean, Brian O'Neill is really one of the few that I can say you saw him come in, develop, and get better and better each week, each year. Grant Bradbury, not as much. Ezra Cleveland, you're kind of not seeing as much. TJ Clemmings. I mean, you can go down kind of the names of these guys myself. Shoot. I mean, you can throw me in there if you want to. But I mean, you can see the name of these guys that

guys that come in, are they really getting better as each time? Or are we just kind of moving on from them and bringing other new guys in, right? and i think that's starting to become more of the issue in my opinion of okay it's not as much the players but why are they not developing the way that they need to develop and i think this is a layer of the conversation about the current administration that we just haven't really discussed a whole lot but i mean the development across the roster and i always look at it as like it's on the player. I mean, actually Kirk cousins had a really good comment. I thought about this once I asked him like, Hey, you know, what, what, what do you kind of advise for development for younger players?

And he said, look, you got to put it on your own shoulders. You can't expect any coach to just put his arm around you and say, go do this drill. And that's going to make you better. Like you have to put it on yourself. But at the same time, when you have this repeated issue over and over and over again of it not happening, you have to look at it and say, well, come on, is it, is it just bad process of where you're getting these players? Cause I think that's a huge part of it. Only who don't, I mean, come on, uh, Ezra Cleveland, never even playing tackle and just

say, you know, no, you're a guard. Cause that's where we see you. And then it's, you know, no, you're a guard. Cause that's where we see you. And then it's, you know, sometimes it's been a fit and sometimes it hasn't Garrett Bradbury, I think was just bad process. Let's draft somebody in the first round who is very small. Uh, and just, you know, how many players match his height and weight, uh, what is real height and weight is not what it said at the combine. Uh, there, there just aren't, there aren that many and and is and is reach blocking really that valuable in comparison to pass blocking for

example um there was another thing i wanted to ask you about just curious because garrett bradbury maybe a week or two when he came back into the lineup a week or two ago and i forgot to ask you about this he kind of said that i don't he didn't exactly say complacent that he felt like he got but he looked back at his tape and felt like he just wasn't being attacking enough and aggressive enough and it was far too much um kind of waiting for it to happen or just trying to get a stalemate on a particular block and and he kind of looked himself in the mirror now the play hasn't been any better because he played aaron donald and a key mix the last two weeks and i and i and i don't suspect it is but it sort of reminded me i wonder what you think of that in general for lineman because for for my reporter

perspective it's like oh i know this song this is the laquan treadwell now i know how to run route song where a first round pick tries to talk themselves into not being a bust and it's unfortunate but it rarely goes any other direction than down from here but um in terms of that like attacking mentality things like that like is that there have been little guys who have been incredible centers but they're usually just vicious violent human beings and i just don't really see that from him and i wonder if you think it is just his size or if there is the mentality issue there you know i think it might be a little bit of both i think that the mentality overall as an offensive lineman can't be a comfortable like hey i got my job done like and i know i said that but getting your job

done is because you went all out and got it done even though it wasn't pretty not as much of i i'm okay with a stalemate and if that's your mentality as an offensive lineman, you're beat before it starts. You have to be like, I need to displace this man. This other human being needs to be displaced. Even if it's six inches, I need to move him against his will from point A to point B. And if you kind of lose that stinger a little bit, it's really hard to get back. And the way you lose that stinger is by you getting beat a lot. And I mean, when you get beat a lot, you're starting to focus more on, man,

I can't get beat instead of, man, I got to kick this guy's ass in front of me. And that's just a mentality shift. And so I think Garrett getting, I mean, he got benched. I mean, there's really no way he had COVID. I think he got benched and i think that he did do some self-reflecting and he looked into it and you kind of got to go back and see what made you really who you were i mean every year i used to go back and watch every snap from my year previous and i'd look and say okay what did i do well what didn't i do well what made them keep me on the team and then i'd reevaluate myself every single off season and kind of reinvent myself of okay here's what i need to work on here's what I need to work on.

Here's what I can't lose, right? Here's the stuff that I can't just because I'm good at it this year, I can't just lose it and put it away. I think for Garrett, he is an aggressive player. I've seen him play aggressive, running down the field, blowing up piles. Like that is who he was. He needs to get back to more of that and letting the other stuff kind of fall into him versus, man, I can't get beat on this play.

And so maybe I should save a little bit of energy and not do this, not do that. Instead of just letting it go, man, let it go loose and let it go play. Most offensive linemen play so much freer that way. And I was really, I remember that quote that he had. I was encouraged to read that quote and I hope he can continue to develop that because you are right. There's a ton of guys that aren't monster human beings that are good NFL offensive linemen. And I think Garrett still is, I know he's graded pretty poorly, but I still think he has the ability to be efficient. I'm not going to say he's all of a sudden going to be the next, um, who's Travis Frederick, right? But I think that he is very, he's, he's good enough to be an efficient center in the NFL.

He just has to put it all together again. and I think he's kind of lost his self and you can't really find that during season honestly that's borderline impossible because you're just trying to game plan and get through but I really hope this next offseason for his sake he can find kind of who he is and who he is as a player again and get it back out on the field well the thing that's unfortunate about pro sports is they don't give you a whole lot of time to find yourself, even if you are a first round draft pick. And I think the benching really points to the high likelihood that they're going to move on after this year. And I mean, that would make sense. Of course, they're not picking up the fifth year option, but I don't know really how you can roll this out there again, after having to bench the

guy midway through the season, like no matter what he says or how it looks toward the end of the year which it hasn't been good but of course they're playing tough competition there's just no argument for it right so now you're kind of looking at it saying they definitely need a new right guard they definitely need a center i think they'll continue with the ezra cleveland thing and it'll probably uh be this roller coaster that it's been from week to week, but at least he's an average player at that position. But here we are getting to the end of the year thinking at first early on, some of us declared it a good offensive line. I'm not going to say who, but you're lucky you're in Chicago. I can fight you. Well, everybody has

takes that don't work out. But you you know it's just like here we are again saying there's two positions on the offensive line need to be replaced derisaw remains an unsure thing cleveland remains an unsure thing and so you look at the totality of you know the front office the coaching all that stuff and you end up I mean, it's just really hard to say that you could carry on with this when that continues to be the case with the offensive line that we're at the end of the year still saying, yeah, yeah, you're going to have a lot of things to do this off season. That being said, I'm going to go back to who we hire if this staff gets fired. And I know it's an if, but I mean, if they do, who they hire as offensive line coach is going to be really interesting to me because I go back to a name and I think I've said on the podcast before, Wyatt Teller.

I played with Wyatt Teller in Buffalo. Dude was a mess, mentally just a mess, but very talented physically. And he was a fourth round pick, started some games in Buffalo, but just couldn't put it all together. And so they ended up releasing him. He then goes to Cleveland and gets with Callahan, arguably the best offensive line coach in the NFL. And he's now one of the best NFL offensive guards in the NFL. So I do think that you can say a guy like Ezra Cleveland, or you can say who physically has the tools, right? Now, Garrett, we know is hampered by his physical tools. But a guy like Ezra Cleveland and a guy like Derrissaw, who physically I've seen on tape has the tools to be a starter in the NFL,

can really, that development piece I'm talking about, who comes in and coaches them and coaches them the right way, could create them to be good offensive linemen. I don't think we can write those two off yet. Now, I do think there's enough sample size of Garrett to say, okay, he is who he is. The right guard, we have a right tackle or a left tackle playing that position, so it's hard to gauge that, but I do think if you come in and you fix those, you buy one of those guys in

free agency, and maybe Wyatt Davis, too. We don't know. Maybe Wyatt Davis needs a coach that can get him in the right spots, too. I think the offensive line coach is arguably going to be one of the biggest hires for the Minnesota Vikings coming on next year than any of them, because the development of that position is so much more important than any other room in that entire organization. So I was going to mention this, that it's sort of bouncing around as we talk about, you know, who could go, who could stay, that it matters what happens in green Bay or could matter. And, and this always goes back to the, I would never speak with sure things about the Wilfs because they're not Jerry Jones. They don't do radio interviews. They don't text their friends who tweet the whatever they're thinking. But I wonder if you think that it should,

that it should matter what happens in green Bay, because I think that this game sort of has the feeling of the funeral in green Bay, just like being remembered as okay. Any shred of belief that you had left that this group could take you somewhere is going to be put away by Aaron Rogers, who by the way, leads the league now and expected points added by any player in the NFL. So there you go uh that's that sing it sing it in public i'm not saying sing it sing it in public right now matthew you

sing that stat in public right now what does that mean uh i'm not i thought you were committed to the grind matt i am committed to the grind i'm not committed to making a nutcase of myself. I already look like a lunatic here. The microphone that I travel with does not look like my one from home. It looks like I'm carrying some sort of space equipment or something. I've got a mask on, so that looks even sillier. The camera is pointed up at the sky. From the space station station coming to you live

what does that stat mean there it is so there there you have it uh what was the question you're doing aaron rogers expected points oh yeah yeah yeah well it's just the point that you know you're going down and facing the quarterback who is dominant in his house in the cold i mean it just has everything written on top of it. The attitude of the team after losing to the Rams and no showing the talk of no energy. I mean, it just everything is there that this could be kind of a disaster. But if it is not, would that should that influence what they think of where they stand? You know, I think the NFL is a fickle beast in the fact that you're

only as good as your last at bat. And I believe that like everything is a week to week evaluator. I mean, from a player to a team, everything can change so quickly, right? So you go out there and you perform well against Green Bay. Okay, well, you performed well against Green Bay, but I think it's more about how they finish the season. I think it's easy to get up for Green Bay week, right? Like every Viking can get up for Green Bay week, whether you've been there for four days, you've been there for four years. Like that's a rivalry in itself that every,

everyone's buttholes get a little tighter on Green Bay week. Like everyone gets a little bit more clammed up and everyone, the intensity and the urgency always heightens up for Green Bay week. So when you see that, you can say, okay, this is what the team looks like at their best. And it could be a true evaluator. Like, Hey, if they go out there and play clean and watch what they did to Green Bay earlier in the year, like great. But if they go out there and they play their best and still get waxed, or they still don't find a way to win this game, even play at their best. Then I think that's more of the evaluator that

I would look at. I think that if you can go out there and this team comes out flat against Green Bay, then yeah, I mean, lower, they'll get the funerals going. They had that little meme going, the guy carrying the coffin. Like that's gotta be it because if you can't get this team ready to go for Green Bay, then everyone's checked out. And if you've got a team that checks themselves out on Green Bay week, you're not going to get that team back. Hey everybody, Minnesota football

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And make sure it's TickPick.com slash insider because you can save $10 on your first order for Minnesota tickets. That's TickPick.com slash insider. Well, I would say the same, even though for the Rams, right? I mean, this is a home game. You're at US Bank Stadium. And then the conversation after is about how there wasn't any energy. And I don't think that they meant just from the stands, which there weren't because fans have checked out on this team largely. But I think it's really interesting when you hear players sort of talking about that openly just from the stands, which there weren't because fans have checked out on this team largely.

But I think it's really interesting when you hear players sort of talking about that openly. And that seems to me like they're looking around going, OK, whose fault is this? I mean, is this the leader of the team, the quarterback? Is this the coach doesn't have them ready to play? Is this whatever? And it just it sort of reeks of finger pointing of like well you know certain guys weren't up for this game and that kind of thing and that's this type of stuff you hear from teams that are kind of done with the season and that's the vibe that they've been giving off so i you know i think that the decision should be made already because

if the best you can do is an upset in Green Bay and then nine and eight, yes, somebody's boarding. I'm sorry about that. I'll wrap up again quickly. If the best you can do is nine and eight and then, you know, having a 50% chance on the last day to make the playoffs, then that's just the same place you've always been. And I feel like we've sort of gone past go with that. If they beat the Lions, if they beat the Rams, then we're talking about a team that's in the playoffs at 10 and seven more than likely,

or maybe even 11 wins. I mean, they were right there for them. Um, if we were talking about that, then I would be saying, okay, well, this is a very, very difficult decision. Then when you're right there in the thick of the NFC race, but you're really, you're really just not, I mean, even if you go to an O you still sit with about a coin flips chance of getting in. And if you look at the elite teams in the NFC, right? I mean, green Bay, Tampa Bay, Dallas, like we've kind of hung with those teams at times, but other times we just look so far away from those teams. And again, we, it can be said the same as the offensive line. The great teams are consistently find ways to win each and every single week, even when they're not playing their

best, even when they come out and things go wrong and they're not, they still find ways to win. And the Vikings at times with things haven't gone their best, have just kind of found ways to lose. And again, it's hard to play the blame game. You can say, yeah, well, the players got to come out and play. Yeah. Coaches, coach players play whatever, but it is a collective conglomerate that of the performance that you put out there, right? It's everyone that goes into it from training staff to, um, coaches to players, to equipment guys, right? Like everything has to be put together. And I think sometimes like Bradbury said, he can get comfortable. He can get stale. I think sometimes entire organizations can sometimes just kind of get stale.

And that's why you see turnover. And I love Mike Zimmer. I love that staff. They gave me a chance to play for three years when I was there. But I do think sometimes you just got to say, you know what? It's just time for a change. And that's tough, but that is also coaches understand that. That's part of the business.

That's part of being a coach. That's part of understanding that five, six, seven years in a place is a pretty hell of a good run, but sometimes all good things must come to an end. If you're not putting up Superbowl banners like Bill Belichick does. Okay. So tell me this, uh, if that does happen, if it ends up being a funeral at Lambeau and that's it, and they lose 38 to 10, whatever, right. Uh, You know, I mean, they're playing for the one seed.

They are, yeah. They got a lot to play for. And I think that even though they beat the Packers at U.S. Bank Stadium, a lot went right for them that day, including Cousins throwing a pass that Rasul Douglas, who all of a sudden picks off passes all the time, like wasn't looking, fell out of bounds. I don't know what happened on that play, but there were lots of things that could have gone wrong for them that day.

The referees actually helped the Vikings that day. I know Vikings Twitter won't necessarily acknowledge that because they do tend to help the Packers quite a bit. But how attractive do you think for a head coach the job in Minnesota is? I think for an offensive head coach, it's extremely attractive. I think for an offensive-minded head coach, you look at the weapons and the pieces that you have and you're getting Irv Smith back next year, right?

I mean, that's another big weapon. Tyler Conklin's had a pretty dang good year at tight end for us. You're getting him back. You have one of the best running backs, pro ball running back in Dalvin Cook. You have the best emerging superstar besides me. Jamar Chase and Justin Jefferson are the two best young receivers in the entire NFL, and you have one of them. You have a veteran in Adam Thielen, and you look at this offense and go, okay, we get a couple pieces on this offensive line and come in and pound the table and say, hey, we need offensive linemen. I think it's really

attractive for an offensive head coach. And then you bring in a really quality defensive coordinator and say, Hey, we have a lot of veterans on this defense. A lot of guys that have played a lot of football, just kind of help put the scheme in and the kind of let these guys do their thing. Right. And then get a pass rusher, get to Neil Hunter back and go find another pass rusher on the other end. I don't think this team's super far away from being in that elite echelon of the nfc if you get kind of some new blood in there and you get some new theories and gets everything kind of just refreshed and you add some really important key pieces i think as an offensive head coach i look at minnesota and go i want to go turn that place because there's other head coaching vacancies that i think

teams are a lot further away from being really good than the Vikings are. All right. So what if your coach candidate X and you're meeting with the Wilfs and they say, look, we're moving on from Kirk. All right. That's just the reality of you taking this job. We have written far too many checks and no hotel that we build is making enough money for us to keep paying the guy when he's getting paid for us to win eight or nine games. So what do you want to do at quarterback coach candidate X? And yes, they are boarding in Philadelphia now. So anybody who's around me get moving. You know, that's tough. I do think you, if you move on from Kirk, you have to go find a quality.

I don't think you can go buy an elite quarterback. I don't know if you can buy an elite quarterback. I think you need to find a serviceable quarterback to come in, and then you've got to draft. And again, I'm not super excited about this draft class for quarterbacks. I think Kenny Pickett's pretty good. The kid out of Liberty's okay. Again, but that's the hard thing is can Kellen Mond,

can you get him where he needs to be to be a guy? I doubt it. I mean, I don't think he's shown enough that he can be the guy, but you have to, you can't just say, okay, we're going to go buy another elite quarterback and then let everything else suffer. I think that the smart thing to do would be to build your team and then wait until

the guy you want at quarterback comes available in the draft and then work your way from there. Maybe not this year, but maybe next year. But I think there's something to be said. Everyone says, well, build your team around the quarterback. I think it almost needs to be backwards. I think you need to build your team and then find the quarterback. Novel concept. I know. Build your team. Build the O-line, build everything around them, have maybe a down year of, a normal year of going 500

and then find your quarterback, whether free agency or whether it be in the draft and then plug him into an already established team so that you don't have the Jacksonville Jaguars or the Zach Wilsons

where you're watching these young quarterbacks get their teeth kicked in because the team's not ready to support a young quarterback either. And this is a situation where I think the offense for the Vikings is very ready to support a young quarterback. In fact, the receivers that they've had here,

and even the system, if they wanted to stay with whoever comes in playing a Kubiak-Shanahan-style system, I think is very friendly to quarterbacks, and I'm not sure why more teams with young quarterbacks don't use it. You're talking about a lot of boot legs, a lot of sort of easy reads that are created for Kirk cousins and then shot plays, which if the guy's drafted at the top, he probably is good at throwing the ball down the field. Like that's probably the one thing that you could translate pretty easily is just leading a wide receiver 30 yards down the field. And yet you see Trevor Lawrence and Justin Fields, let's put them in the shotgun all the time. And I know like being

under center can be hard for young quarterbacks, but like put them in the shotgun, do this read this read this read. And you saw with Ian book, trying to play football in the NFL on Monday night football, just how impossible it is for young players. So I think that if I'm that, if I'm that new coach, if I'm Byron Leftwich or Doug Peterson or something, I'm saying, look, I'm not going to have Justin Jefferson be mad at me because we drafted a quarterback who wasn't ready to play. But I need, I need to get him someone who's a playmaker with a big arm. I think that's really important to be able to go off schedule and imagine how many more catches Justin Jefferson would have if Kirk Cousins didn't check it down every time there

was a little bit of pressure and extended plays like Aaron Rodgers can or somebody else. I think he'd have even more. And you talk about some big plays with Russell Wilson or things like that, that he's been able to figure out with Tyler Lockett. And just to finish the point, actually, this is helping me be concise because every two minutes or something, so sometimes I have a tendency to just keep talking. But if you were to bring in, is it a crazy idea? And I know we've got lots of time to talk about this, but it's kind of where we're at right now.

Is it a crazy idea to have someone like Ryan Fitzpatrick and then draft Kenny Pickett and then just sort of go that direction? Because I feel like this is a good model. And even like Tua now has what, eight wins in a row. And you get that guy a little bit of experience. He steps in and then, you know, you've got a team around him. It seems like this doesn't, there's almost an impression for people that if you move on from cousins that you have to be like horrendous or something and I just don't agree with that at all I think next year you could still be exciting and then the year after that you're talking about being a legitimate contender if that draft pick works out for you no I completely agree with you I think it's really important that you bring in and you're right just because you go from cousins

doesn't mean we're gonna go pick up Mike Glennon right like that's just not how this works like we're still gonna find a quarterback that can win football games there's enough good quarterbacks out there i mean look at taylor heineke the dude's not the dude's not trevor lawrence talent or anything but he's winning some football games and that's a bad football team too i mean the skins are not a good the was Washington football team is not a good football team, you know, but I think that there's enough quarterbacks out there that have enough game experience that you can say, okay, we can go get one of these guys that's serviceable. And then the biggest thing is I think that whoever they bring in as the veteran quarterback,

if they do go young and draft a young quarterback high, there's something to be said about having those older quarterbacks really mentor these young guys about what it means to be a pro and that's really when you look at some of these often or these quarterback rooms that these young cats go into they don't really have a true veteran leader in that and i think that's really important and the vikings did it with teddy bridgewater with sean or with sean right i mean you had sean in there the the old man. I mean, he was like 40, had like four kids, could barely walk, ultimate dad bod. But he was really good for the mental development of what Teddy Bridgewater went through. And I think that that's a really important piece to this too, is just because you're signing a veteran quarterback doesn't mean that he's going to be

your starter, but you need that peer relationship in those rooms to help these young guys grow. And I just think that that'd be an important piece as well. I don't know off the top of my head who that could be, but as free agency starts to pick up, as you see guys start moving on from certain other teams, there's going to be quarterbacks available that have won football games in the national football league. Folks, it's that time again,

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Isn't it the funniest thing in the entire world that Sean Hill could competently play NFL quarterback, but Ian book who's like an elite athlete played for Notre Dame and everything else just looks like me out there running around, just like getting sacked every play. That's that's's how, I mean, that's how, like when people talk about, Hey, you know, maybe they should give Mond a look or give whoever like, no, because they'll just die. I mean, if you're, if, if, if, if you're the fourth string quarterback on a team, the likelihood that you could play at all is so small. And I'm actually shocked that

Taylor Heineke has been as good as he has, but you know, that's kind of a different point from the one you're making. But if there is a sort of a transition to a new era with a different quarterback, but it takes a year of having a veteran, I just feel like there will be patience for that as long as it can still be fun and competitive, which is why I said Ryan Fitzpatrick because I think it realistically can be. But I wanted to ask you about something completely different because, you know, we've got lots of time for future talk and all that through the playoffs that we

probably won't be covering. This is going to annoy everybody. Do you think the Packers are going to win the Super Bowl? I that they really really could and the reason i say that is because the emergence of their run game you know every year it's always been like look at aaron rogers just slinging it for a zillion yards and he still is but the difference is look at aaron jones look at dylan look at these dudes pounding the rock and you know what's been amazing they've been able to do it with a patchwork offensive line. That's the thing that is most amazing to me. And then they have really good pass rushers on the end, Preston Smith, Kenny Clark.

I think they are one of the top three complete teams in the NFL. Anytime you're a top three complete team in the NFL, you're going to give yourself a chance to win the Super Bowl. And for me, Tampa Bay has kind of skidded out a little bit here. And I do think that Green Bay and Arizona for me is kind of a toss-up every now and then too but I think Green Bay is absolutely the best team in the NFC and if the road to the Super Bowl goes through Lambeau good luck anybody that shows up there in January yeah which again is why Green Bay is going to be given at 110 when it comes to

facing the Vikings on Sunday night. I was having this thought the other day watching them play the Browns, and I know they let Cleveland back in that game, and Cleveland ran over them, which is always a possibility for the Vikings to beat them, by the way, that the one world where they beat them is the one where Delvin Cook comes back. Those legs have a little pop in them, and then he runs for 200 yards, and they win, which is basically what happened last year, so it's not impossible. I don't want to say that i'm certain that they're just going to completely melt because delvin you talk about somebody who brings energy brings kind of a different kind of juice if things are working for him uh but when you look at the overall

strengths of the nfc teams and how many you just don't believe in i mean tampa bay their two top receivers not named antonio Brown are dinged up. Mike Evans is hurt and on the COVID list. Antonio Brown is a lunatic who might be off your team at any time. I mean, just depending on whatever he could get suspended for and such, but their defense and their secondary has also been very banged up this year. And last year it felt like they went into the playoffs playing incredibly good football and it does not look like that's the case, Arizona. I don't think Cliff Kingsbury

can coach a team deep into the playoffs. It just seems like as they go on teams, figure out what they're doing. And then that's kind of the shortcomings of former college coaches, the Rams. Oh my gosh, no, it's not going to happen. I mean, first of all, I don't think that their defense is great. Like the Vikings had lots of chances in that game to move the football. But then, you know, McVay made some very strange decisions in that game. And Stafford will absolutely throw a game away. There's no question about it. There's just no doubt about it.

Maybe I'll be wrong. And that's all takes exposed. But like from what we saw, big games, he will do that. So there's almost nobody you trust. It's kind of Dallas and green Bay for me. And then if it comes down to that, it could be Dallas traveling to green Bay and I would give the edge still to green Bay. And I,

and I feel like this is the ultimate salt in the wounds and I should apologize for it. But I mean, I mean, wouldn't it just be sort of the perfect end to the era here with the Vikings? If it was Zimmer Spielman cousins gone, to the era here with the Vikings if it was Zimmer, Spielman, Cousins gone? Like, is Aaron Rodgers raising the trophies? Like, yeah, the guy that you were chasing, you never caught him. You signed Cousins to catch him. You hired Zimmer to catch him, and you didn't catch him.

We beat him twice when I was there. When I was there, we won the NFC North twice when I was there. So we caught him a couple times in the in the mid the mid-decade i'm referring to the second half there's really a line you draw in 2018 isn't there i mean there's the there's like the 2015 where you win the division with teddy and 2017 is the best year hands down of the zimmer era and those teams were competing for playoff super bowl and since 2018 it just hasn't been that way and they paid her cousins for it to be that way to be right there neck and neck and instead it just really hasn't been yeah and no i think you're right and the problem is you're always searching for the aaron rogers you're always searching for the tom brady and they're hard to find and i think that kirk was at the time

the best available option right i mean if you want to flashback to 2018, we had convinced ourselves in 2017 that we were a quarterback away from being Green Bay. We were. We were a quarterback away from being the runaway. The NFC North was ours for eternity and good luck, right? The problem was you're not going to be able to beat Aaron Rodgers like that consistently and

he's just that special and so for that to happen I agree with you but then you flip it on the other side I don't know if anyone beats the Chiefs Matt um the way that they've been playing football here the last six eight weeks has been kind of what we assumed that they were going to do the beginning of the year and then they stumble out the breaks and this has everything kind of remember I don't know how many years back where Aaron Rodgers the beginning of the year was like relax like relax like this is exactly what happened in Kansas City relax we'll get it figured out and then they do they're by far the best team in the NFL right now Green Bay Dallas kind of behind them but you talk about good football happening in the NFL right now holy crap the Chiefs are playing out of their minds and i saw a stat that they are now gaining the

highest percentage of first downs on plays where they get too deep coverage maybe you saw that that's i did see that i know i know what that stat means it means that andy reed is an unbelievable football coach who adapted to what the defenses were trying to do to him and now is whooping ass also the other thing is too that there was some crazy other stat about how like 90 of the homes interceptions hit somebody's hands uh you know so early in the year so uh byron pringle couldn't catch the football and now they're just like now we're just gonna throw a tyree kill all the time um so yeah no i agree with you the kansas City to me is the favorite with Green Bay right behind then Dallas right behind them and Dak looking like he did the other night if they have it all going with their defense uh they can go to

the Super Bowl and and you know if you're the Vikings like you want to be in this conversation but then you start talking about the strengths and weaknesses of these teams that are Super Bowl contenders you go you're just you're just not in And you, and that's always the goal is to be here and have people saying, well, Hey, look, the Vikings, if this goes right, they're in the Superbowl, which we did have that conversation earlier in the Mike Zimmer era, but it's just been such a long time. So let me wrap with this. I want to know, and I love to see it, hate to see it from you. Ridiculous things version, because the reason I want to talk about that hate to see it from you, Ridiculous Things version.

Because the reason I want to talk about that is because of Brashad Breeland. So he gets in a fight apparently with Delvin Cook at practice, and then he gets released after that. He goes onto Twitter and discovers that a local reporter has been tweeting about his PFF grades. So then he calls out said reporter on Twitter, the Arizona Cardinals call and decide that they're going to sign for shot Breland because what a great idea.

And then he shows up to Arizona with COVID. I mean, now I, I, as a holiday traveler here, I have my own concerns, but I mean, in terms of hate to see it, most ridiculous just implosion of a Viking signing. I want to give it to Bashad Breeland.

He wins that award for this year. Absolutely. You want to know my favorite love to see it is a stat that I saw today that Notre Dame now has lost 20, Notre Dame quarterbacks have now lost 24 straight starts in the NFL. Four by Brady Quinn, four by Jimmy Clawson, 15 by Deshaun Kaiser, and one by our man, Ian Book. I hate Notre Dame. I'm a Notre Dame hater through and through.

And so I woke up and this was one of the first stats I saw this morning and it just brightened my entire day because I just everyone just always blows Notre Dame he just loves them and to watch them just get to the NFL and just implode all over themselves is one of my favorite things of all time I felt sad though I mean watching Ian book you just he's terrible he's so he should never start an nfl game ever again i'm sorry after that performance you shouldn't i hate writing guys off but my gosh that was atrocious that's uh that's so far away from being anything that it's supposed to look like that there's really nothing you can do and uh i don't care how good of a coach you are how good your scheme is your system you if you're gonna get sacked on every third time i mean there's nothing but i mean i i do um i only i only love to see it because we talk about

journeyman quarterbacks on the show and sage rosenfels comes on and i always try to tell people like you don't understand how great sage rosenfels is playing quarterback like you have to understand this for someone to go six and six in their career and he also had a relief appearance where he won a game where his team was down by 20 I mean that means that he is in the one percent of one percent and when you see somebody who's not ready and can't play you're like oh yeah that guy who you know played really well in a handful of games in the NFL had to be really talented so I love to see it from that perspective we kind of like pull back and go wow Ryan Fitzpatrick is really amazing in football actually. And that's why we do give our respect always to Kirk Cousins and his talent, because to be a top

10, top 15 quarterback in the league, you're just a complete freak show. So in terms of love to see it, I just love December football because of how hideous it is. And it's been even more hideous recently because of all the COVID stuff, but it always gives me a throwback. And you and I grew up in a similar enough era to where scores of games were 14 to 21 folks. They were not 38 to 34. It wasn't all this throwing everywhere. No, I'll tell you,

you really see, I think great quarterbacks emerge during this time of year, beginning of the year, everybody's got their new schemes. Everybody's healthy. It's like, Oh, we can do whatever we want. You get to the end, you see the great coaches, the great quarterbacks. And I wanted to mention love to see Joe Burrow sort of throwing his name. Is there beeping in the background? I'm sorry's probably horrible i apologize for that uh i love this i'm in an airport what the hell i just that's the last thing just i'd love to see joe burrow emerging as like the next wave of quarterback because i think it's just really fun when you find one of those guys you're like wow like what can this guy be

in the future yeah also love to see it i don't have a hate to see it this week love to see it joe burrow's gift to his offensive linemen he got him those g-force watches which are nothing more than like a specialty they're like a specialty like sports watch but then he crusted them out in diamonds i thought that was just an ultimate it's just kind of like hey i know you guys aren't flashy and just want your normal digital watch here but bam diamonds and again he gets take care of your big fellas man that's the part that's also another thing i love to see is the gift the gifts that get given to each other in the nfl just the elaborate absurd things that everyone's just like oh you wanted a 1200 pair of shoes merry christmas like i think that's that's, that's fun to see. That's fun to watch

how quarterbacks take care of their supporting cast. And you can kind of always tell the culture of an organization with some of that stuff that goes on too. And then I guess I do have one hate to see it. The hate to see it was the poor, poor, poor Washington team the other night, just 42, seven and a half. And just Ron Rivera, love that guy. Love him as a coach. He's battled through so much. And I love that he still goes up in bats for his players on the press conferences, but hate to see that, but you just can't,

can't have that happen. Yeah. I hate to see dudes swinging on each other. Yeah. Yikes. Well, Jeremiah, we'll see what happens this week.

We may be talking about playoff scenarios next week if the Vikings pull out a win. And if they don't, then more offseason discussion, I think, starts to get underway. And we start to talk seriously about coaching candidates and what's going to happen and everything else. But I always appreciate you. Merry Christmas to you and your family. And, of course, one more time, the guy from behind me. What is he saying? He wants everybody to wear a mask.

I mean, look, I am. Okay? more time the guy from behind me what is he saying he wants everybody to wear a mask i mean look i am okay i i can't wait to listen back to the audio and just be like oh good you couldn't hear anything i was saying but uh thank you for doing this and working around my crazy plane schedule and we will talk soon absolutely guys appreciate you and uh go bikes