Purple Insider - a Minnesota Vikings and NFL podcast - Do the Vikings have good ownership? Will Mike Zimmer look bad if the Vikings win next year? A Fans Only pod

Episode Date: April 4, 2022

Matthew Coller answers fan questions from Twitter on everything from the Minnesota Vikings' ownership and whether it's still considered a major asset to the franchise, what it means to have a good culture, whether the Vikings should draft Iowa center Tyler Linderbaum and why drafting a QB is still a good idea, even if it can go bad. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Hello, welcome to another episode of Purple Insider. This is another fans only podcast where I answer questions from Twitter. And I have to say big thank you to everybody who has tweeted me or emailed me and said, keep doing the fans only podcasts. And also a huge thank you to the people who sent the questions because they're really good. And we have a lot of fun with topics on the show. And yet you guys always find ways of new things to talk about and great questions about this team.

So I have had a really fun time doing this. So I've got my Diet Dr. Pepper with me and it's a bottle this time. So I'm not going to make the incredibly loud opening sound, but I've got it and I'm ready to go. And I've got a bunch of questions and I appreciate again, everybody who has sent them out. If you're looking for where you can ask a question to get on the show, you can tweet it to me. Or if you send me an email, go to purpleinsider.com. There's a way to email me there. You can just say, hey, this is for the podcast.

And I'll see what I can do as far as getting it on the fans-only show. So let's get right into it because I've got still a ton of questions remaining from the original thread that I put out a week ago. There were 75 responses. So I'm trying to get through all the questions that I can here. All right, let's start out with Warly Owl at Warly Owl, longtime follower and listener. Appreciate him. When the GM search was on, the Vikings were listed in articles as having good owners as a positive that would appeal to strong candidates. Does that assessment still ring true?

This is a very tough one to answer because it's clear from the evidence that the Wilfs have laid out a direction that they want this team to go. And that direction is to do a competitive rebuild, to keep the players that they have. And they were not pleased enough with the potential return for trade ideas. And so they wanted to go this way. And they want to make the playoffs. And every year, including at the owners meetings, and I think there's a question about this later, they say, and this is every time we've ever spoken to them, hey, you just get in the playoffs and then see what happens.

Now, historically, that's not really true. Last year was an outlier to have four seeds and four seeds still took, you know, one of them, the Super Bowl winner, winning 12 games. And when I did my research on what it takes to reach the Super Bowl, even Cincinnati making it with 10 wins was very rare. And think about the things that had to go right for them to get there. Usually the bar is at least 11, but mostly 12 and more wins. And that's what you should really be aiming for. Then if you have 12 wins then i agree that it's get in and see what happens but if you have nine wins you're probably not going anywhere

this seven seed i would be shocked since they've added the seven seed if anyone ever reaches a super bowl from the seven seed because usually it's not a great football team. If you're winning nine or 10 games out of 17, as opposed to 12, 13, 14, there's just a big gap there. But that seems to be the belief of the owners. And that seems to dictate where they want to go with this team. And if you're the general manager, that's your boss. Kweisi Adafo-Mensa said, everybody has a boss. And that's true.

And so no matter where you work, if your boss says, this is the direction we're going and work within those parameters, that's what you have to do. However, I would not say that because of that, the Wilfs are suddenly bad owners. I don't want to say that that's the case because a lot of the things that were hyped up about them as owners and making this job attractive are still true. I mean, they have bottomless pockets, for one, is that when you restructure contracts and when you kick money down the road, that money does hurt you later on in terms of the salary cap, but it has to come right out of the owner's pockets. So they have to be willing to say, here's the cash and you can do this. And they have always done that. They have always been willing to step up to the plate and make sure that the Vikings could keep someone. And a couple of years ago, that was really helpful

because they were going into each season trying to compete for a Super Bowl. But now it seems like it's hurting them in a way because they're not being as shrewd about their direction. And they're just saying, no, no, yes, keep Adam Thielen, even if it's going to be a huge dead cap hit if they have to move on from him next year. Here's the money to do that. Or here's the money to restructure or to pay the $18 million roster bonus for Daniil Hunter,

even though an extension for Hunter or a trade may have been the better direction. So I'm not willing to say, Oh, suddenly they are bad owners because they made the decision to keep Kirk cousins. Clearly it was their decision that was made. Uh, and they have kind of put this directive in to try to win. I also think that

that's a lot of owners. Uh, and then you look around the league and you think, okay, is it the absolute best, most perfect situation where the football men can do whatever they want to do and women. Maybe not. Maybe this part of it is problematic that they really want to make the playoffs and they really hold this strong belief that you can get in with 10 wins and then anything will happen. But look around the league. I mean, you have Daniel Snyder, who's straight up just stealing money from the NFL. You have Shad Khan, who's stepping in and hiring Urban Meyer as his coach. I mean, you ended up with a GM who is very qualified and I think has a lot of positives to him, Kweisi Adafomensa, and a head coach that makes a lot of sense that was just on

the Super Bowl team. Like your team is not at the middle of ownership controversy all the time. It's just this one thing of, you know, it could be a little bit problematic as far as the direction. And now Kweisi Adafomensa has to navigate that. Now there is another part of this though, is that Kweisi Adafo Mensah was not, well, he was qualified, but he was not experienced. And there were other candidates who were more experienced in this type of area that you wonder if they heard, this is what we have to do, that they kind of maybe backed off a little. I don't know that that's the case, but it did go through my mind. If the ownership says, this is what you have to do, that maybe some of the candidates said,

ah, okay, I'm not sure that I really want to do that, that I really want to go in your direction. But considering the facilities that they have, the amount that they're willing to pay and step up, and I wouldn't even quite go as far as to say meddling. Meddling is the story about Daniel Snyder, where he would just make all the first round draft picks. I do not think that the Wilfs are making all the first round draft picks, but Rick Spielman certainly made it sound like they want star players brought in here or kept here, which can be difficult. So I guess I, I guess

it's a very tough question to answer, but the perception, here's the, what I'll say about it. The perception has certainly changed since a few months ago when we didn't have any clues about how they had been operating. And then Rick Spielman started kind of letting the cat out of the bag. And then the direction was clearly shaped by them with what Adolfo Mensah wanted to do. So long story short, the perception has definitely changed, but I wouldn't say, oh, wow, now you have garbage owners. I don't think that that is the case at all. All right.

This from Scotty907. Explain how dead cap money works. I've heard wildly different descriptions. I assume a team isn't literally paying a player when they leave in most cases. Okay. Dead cap money is really like getting into how you can form dead cap money is really complicated, but the bottom line of dead cap money is essentially that it's on your books, on the salary cap, even if the player isn't there or when the player isn't there, that's your definition. So for example, when you structure a contract with Kyle Rudolph that is set up, so if you cut him, it goes along with X amount of dead cap money.

Then he ends up still on your books when he's not playing there. So if you cut him, as the Vikings did, then he's still on the books on the salary cap. And that's essentially what dead cap money is. Now, I think it's, is it base salary? Is it roster bonus? Like the details of this, um, uh, you, you have to look up exactly how dead cap money gets created, but what usually goes along with it is you're trying to create lower cap hits instead of having like hockey. If you sign someone to a four year, four year, $45 million deal, it's what like, is that $9 million a year or whatever? No,

that's 36. Uh, whatever it is, let's just say I should have made it easier on myself with the math. So four years, $8 million a year, 36 million overall, and you're paying 8 million each year in hockey. If they're still doing it that way in the NFL, because there's different things you could do with signing bonuses, that can lower the cap hit right away. So Z'Darrius Smith would be an example of this, how it's a low, low cap hit for this year. And then that cap hit jumps next year.

But if they cut him next year, you kind of have to pay the difference. I'm not describing this super well, but a lot of the details really don't matter. When you look it up, as far as dead cap goes it's if they cut him how much remains on your salary cap like how much debt do you owe for the way that you structured this you could structure contracts to have no dead money if you wanted to it would be really hard to fit those in and make those work. And I think players like bonuses because they get money right away. Um, but that's what makes it very complicated. And so maybe I haven't done a great job of explaining it except for the bottom line to it is that you still end up on the salary cap

when you get cut. And so right now the Vikings have $23 dollars of dead cap I mean that is two or three players and that's why you want to avoid it and that's why they've been criticized for kicking money down the road because the void years that's automatic dead cap void years is auto dead cap like unless you extend the player you can't get out of that. So if the Vikings don't have Kirk Cousins on their roster and did not extend him after 2023, they are paying 12 million in dead cap, no way around it. That debt is owed. And that's not very helpful for 2024. And it always feels nice to do it in the moment. Like Anthony Barr last year, Barr's staying. He redid his contract.

And then now you're having him on your salary cap for $9 million because you moved money around. Basically, that's why they say kick it down the road. You moved money around to lower his immediate cap hit. But it's sort of like water in a tub, right? If you displace some, it moves up somewhere else. And that's exactly how it works with the salary cap. So it's not perfectly in detail there.

But I think the big takeaway is when your team adds void years, when your team restructures a contract, there is a price to pay. And that's usually in price to pay and that's usually in dead cap. So that's kind of the best I can do in a short amount of time because you could do an entire podcast on every possible way that you could end up with dead cap money. This is from Corey Hermanson. It would be interesting to back test your just draft a QB until you find one theory

to specific draft years, starting with Ponder in 2011. I like the idea, but my pushback is always that it takes multiple years to figure out if they're good, like Tua, Trubisky, Baker, and Allen. Now that is, I think, a good argument, but what is the point? I mean, the point would be what? Don't draft any of those guys. And then you never get the upside of it ever. I mean, what, what do you do at quarterback aside from

waiting until Russell Wilson comes along? Like, I mean, you have to take the risk that you could end up in trouble for multiple years. And I think that what's very, very hard always for these teams is to admit it didn't work. So with Mitch Trubisky, for example, we knew by year three, it didn't work and they didn't move on. They sort of half moved on. They brought in, was it Nick Foles? They were going to sign Teddy Bridgewater, which probably would have been a good move at the time.

And Teddy didn't go there because they said, no, you've got a battle with Mitch Trubisky in training camp. And then Matt Nagy couldn't stand Mitch Trubisky. So they decided that he was going to play Trubisky off the bat to prove a point. And then he was going to switch to Nick Foles. And then that didn't work. So he had to go back to Trubisky it's like if with every other position it doesn't really work this way I mean when I guess they did this a little bit with Laquan Treadwell where they kept giving it shots and they have with Garrett Bradbury so maybe I'm maybe I'm wrong but it feels like

when most positions get drafted if it's's not working, the team just has to acknowledge it's not working and then do something else. You can't just will it into existence. But I do agree that sometimes it takes a couple of years for somebody to get there. The thing is with Josh Allen, even though he didn't peak until year, was it three or four or three, his year two, they went to the playoffs and he was making a lot of plays and he was showing those flashes. And I remember friends of mine from Buffalo saying it's really his leadership, the team's belief in him. Like there are signs, there should

be signs that it's going in the right direction with Christian Ponder. It was quite clear. It was not. I mean, I looked at this statistically not too long ago that in 2012 running Adrian Peterson was gaining more net yards than passing the ball with Christian Ponder. I mean, that should just not ever happen. Even if it's a historically great season from the running back. Like, especially if the running back is that dangerous, not being able to pass at all. Like these are the signs that you should know you have a problem and then you have to make a change quickly. And ultimately they, they, they pretty much did. I mean, like drafting Christian Ponder did not ruin the Minnesota Vikings.

It wasn't that long after that they're in the NFC championship game. It wasn't that long after that they won the division. I mean, they draft him in 2011 and then it doesn't work out. And then by 2015, they have a new quarterback who's won the division. And I think that's the point is now nobody wants to wait through that. I understand. There's just no way around it. There's no way around it with anything.

If you sign Kirk Cousins and make the playoffs once in four years, we can look back and go, well, you just wasted four years. Why is that different from a rookie with the potential risk? There's always going to be a potential risk that you have a couple of years where you're trying to figure out if the guy can play or not. But the thing is that the upside, if he can play by year two or three, you should see signs of it. You should start having success. And then here's where you have to be also smart is if the guy is a Baker Mayfield or a Jared Goff or a Carson Wentz, you just don't pay them. You take advantage of what they do on their rookie contract, and then you move on from them. And if you have this steadfast plan that you have a bar to reach,

if this player is this good, we keep them, we pay them. If they're not this good, we move on. And if they're very bad, if they're, you know, Josh Rosen is the ultimate example, but even like Tua, they should be thinking right now, how can we replace Tua if he's not great this year? And I think what Miami has done is perfect, where you load up, give the guy a ton of weapons, and then if he still can't do it, well, then you really know. And then you have a bunch of weapons and a good situation to go out and get the next

quarterback. I mean, you could kind of look at Denver and drafting drew lock like this. They drafted drew lock. They gave him all the situations in the world to, you know, find people to throw to Cortland Sutton. They drafted Noah Fant. And when it didn't work out, they had a team that was in a pretty good situation to be able to attract Russell Wilson and get him there. So I think that like, yes, there's risk, but understanding the options that you have to work around that risk are really important when it comes to the theory. It's not, sometimes this goes for everything in your life where people will just say running backs don't matter, end of story. And that's it. And you're like, well,

there's always nuances to all of this. And it's not. And you're like, well, there's always nuances to all of this. And it's not that running back performance doesn't matter. It's that a lot of running backs are replaceable. So you probably shouldn't draft them super high and you probably shouldn't pay them a lot of money, right? It's not that it's not that Christian McCaffrey at his best didn't matter or Delvin Cook at his best didn't matter. It's that when push comes to shove and you pay those guys, it's very risky and they're probably not worth it. So everything has nuances. It's, it's not like just draft a quarterback. It's draft a quarterback and then live in reality with yourself because

that's where the bears, I think made the biggest mistake with Trubisky is they just didn't live in reality. They had options to get other quarterbacks and said, no, we're going to keep this guy and we're going to let him be a part of a quarterback battle. And then, you know, it didn't work out and it set them back. And still, even then they end up with Justin Fields, who might not be good, but what if he is, I mean, just a couple of years later, I think that's the whole point. It doesn't have to ruin your franchise. Folks, Minnesota sports teams are competing for the playoffs and it's time to load up on your Minnesota sports inspired gear from SodaStick. Use the promo code Purple Insider for 15% off your wildflower Marc-Andre Fleury design. Or if you're excited for baseball get your fast as buck firing buxton shirt or hoodie go to sodastick.com use the promo code purple insider for 15 off

uh all right this one from melissa meyer 42 on twitter most of the time we discuss skill sets as the most important part of winning would love to hear some discussions around the psychology of winning, what type of belief systems are in place with winning teams, and how do the Vikings get to that place? That's another one like the salary cap that could be an entire podcast. So I will try to, um, you know, whittle that down to the most important points. Uh, I, I feel very, um, lucky, I guess, to have covered a team that was really good and really cared about each other in 2017 with the Vikings that had some very special leaders and personalities in that locker room. So you could see the impact of it. Um, I think that players who care about each other and who care about the success of everyone are always going to push up the performance versus the talent.

That's what it always is. It's here's the type of talent that you have. And let's say the 2017 Vikings had the talent of a 11 winwin team or a 10-win team. If you put a backup quarterback on a team with a top defense and a couple of good receivers, you expect to win 10. They won 13. And I think that some of that is the person that Case Keenum was, Teddy Bridgewater, Terrence Newman. These were guys who really helped other people be the best versions

of themselves. I remember Adam Thielen saying to me that Teddy Bridgewater had as much to do with his success as a receiver as anybody, because he would work with him on the details of what a quarterback saw and was always willing to give him feedback and help him perform better. And there is numerous stories of that with Teddy Bridgewater helping case Keenum in Washington, where he saw something on the sideline. Keenum came to the sideline after a series and Bridgewater said, Hey, I see the way the safeties are playing this look,

let's take a shot there. And it resulted in a, in a huge game. So things like that, where you have players that want to push each other to be the best versions of themselves and not this, Hey, I just work here. I'm just, and I know that sounds like a shot at cousins, but it, I mean, it look, it's undeniable that their locker room has changed since cousins has been here because he's just not that Bridgewater or Keenum type of guy.

And when you look at the expectations, roster talent versus what they've done, I think there's been an attitude shift from a lot of the players to I'm going to get mine. And we've seen that in contract negotiations and we've seen that in the locker room atmosphere. And I think it's played a role in why they, they haven't won.

And I, and I don't think the head coach did anything to help that in Mike Zimmer. And so Kevin O'Connell certainly can. But I always think of it as you're only as good as your best players and your best leaders when it comes to your culture because that's who ultimately determines it. And that's something that they probably won't win until they change, whether that's cousins or whether that's other players who come in, who are kind of pushing that

in the right direction. But I think it takes a very special group to win. And it's usually a group that is constantly finding little ways to enhance each other's game. I'll give you another example is Terrence Newman would go up to Stefan Diggs before games and say, remember you were picked in the fifth round. Remember they thought you were too small or not good enough and just pushing each other in that, in that way. I think it takes some really special personalities because when you think about the gaps between the greatest players in the world on one team and the greatest players in the world on another team, it's not big. So I've always thought that these things matter quite a bit, leadership, culture in the locker

room. And that's kind of the way that I would describe what a winning locker room looks like. It doesn't mean everyone has to be friends. It doesn't mean everyone has to get along. It just has to mean that everyone's sort of pulling in the same direction and trying to make each other better. All right. This comes from a very long Twitter name, Khan, which is said in the Star Trek-y type of way, TK421. If you were to make a Vikings breakfast cereal, what would it be called? What would it look and taste like? And who would be on the box? I mean, I'm going to have to think about this one to try to

be the funniest version of myself. I might have to come back. I might have to come back to that. Oh man. I mean, is it, uh, you know, I don't know. I mean, like how, how ruthless do you want to be here? Should it be like some sort of, Oh, because that's how many Superbowls you have. Like, I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I had to say I had to make the joke. Right. Yeah, I guess I'm going to have to think about that. It has been tried a couple of times.

I believe that Justin Jefferson has a cereal and Kirk Cousins has a cereal. There's also a way that you could say, you know, Kirk Cousins is cereal is kind of bland or it's like Rice Krispies. It lacks any pop. You know, there's lots of different ways you could say, you know, Kirk Cousins' cereal is kind of bland, or it's like Rice Krispies, it lacks any pop. You know, there's lots of different ways you could roast the Vikings with this question, but I think I'll just leave it at that. All right, this comes from at Tiger Choo Choo. It's becoming apparent that a top three cornerback will be off the board by pick number 12. Adam Thielen's contract in 2023 and 2024 is

crazy high. Do we need to grab one of these top five wide receivers in the draft, possibly trade down and gain capital, or maybe help us get Cam Juergens? Now, speaking of food, Cam Juergens was the one where in the NFL combine, they obsessed over the fact that he brought jerky for everyone, which, you know, he's an offensive lineman, great athleticism. He destroyed the combine, but they couldn't stop talking about how he brought jerky, which means that he is very high on my draft board. Um, you know, I, with the cornerback issue, we think we know this happens every year where we think we know going into the draft based on the mocks and we think okay sauce gardener's going to be gone derrick stingley's going to be gone

so we're not going to be able to get our guy there and we have to think about something else but we don't really know that right so you kind of have these different avenues depending on how the board falls. Assuming they're not drafting a quarterback at number 12 and your main positions are wide receiver, defensive end slash whatever, outside linebacker, pass rusher, and cornerback. If those are the positions that you're looking at the most and not linebacker, running back, so forth, then I think you can just wait and see as I've looked at the history of those picks that are just outside the top 10. There's a lot of really good players who go just outside of the top 10. And I, you know, I, I think that the farther you

trade down, the lower your odds are of getting a great player. And it's really important to get a great player for this team or get the best prospect that you can. I'm not against trading down. They need multiple positions for the future, but 12 is not a bad spot to get a star player. And so I think that you can take those three positions, pass rusher, corner, wide receiver, and say the best player that's there, take that player. And that can be your plan. As far as wide receiver goes, I think it's a really good idea, short-term and long-term. Let's say it's Chris Olave from Ohio State, who I like the most of these receivers, but you know, I don't know

who, who knows ever. Right. But I like Chris Alave. So let's say it's him and he's there at 12. You take Chris Alave, you put them in at the number three wide receiver, number four, kind of shifting in and out with KJ Osborne. You use a lot of three receivers, a lot of four receivers. And if someone gets hurt, if Jefferson goes out for a few weeks or if Thielen gets hurt, you're in a much better position in the short term by having someone like Chris Olave, if he can play right away. And he's also so quick and explosive that you can find ways to use him in year one that maybe you might not be able to do with other

receivers who are more limited in terms of their physical ability or quickness or something like that. So there's just a really good argument here for taking a wide receiver. And then long-term, if it's Thielen moving on after 2023, then you have a guy in his third year, Jefferson's getting paid, and you still have one receiver who's very expensive and one receiver who's not expensive. That is the ideal scenario. And I just also feel like wide receivers a little bit more predictable for what they'll become than a corner. There's a really good argument for it.

That's the point. This from smakulla5, another person who's followed me for a long time and always been very, very supportive. So I appreciate you, Scott. Adding void years to a contract has become the new in vogue cap wizard move. When did this become so common and why do teams think this is a good idea? So the 2011 CBA, I don't know if that's exactly when it started, but that CBA has really shaped the way things work now with the salary cap and the rookie draft model and all that sort of thing, where when you're picked in a certain slot, you get a certain

amount of money. Because I remember back in my day when the rookies used to hold out and there would be these long negotiations that went throughout the summer and things like that. That has nothing to do with the void years, but that's just how the league has changed since that 2011 CBA. But where I started to see it way more, I wouldn't say it was incredibly rare, but it was not something you heard of a ton until the pandemic,

because when that happened and all the fans came out of the stadiums and they lost a lot of money and they knew that the fans would ultimately be back and they would get their money back. It seemed like it was a way to set up these contracts so they could kind of not have to pay everything right now. And that's when it started to become a lot more popular. And the other thing too, is there's just been this shift from, you could call it the NBA-ization or whatever, but I think that this exists in all sports where teams are either trying to win the Superbowl or they're trying to rebuild. And if you're trying to win the Superbowl, then you're using things like this. You're using things like void years to

make sure that you can get that player who is the final piece to your puzzle and you can make that push. And that's why when the Vikings are doing it this year, you question it because are you really competing for the Super Bowl? By the Vegas odds, the answer is you're really not. You're in the mid-pack on the lower half of teams, odds-wise. So the objective people out there putting their money on this stuff or the oddsmakers who are the sharpest people are saying, no, this team isn't really a Super Bowl contender, so you shouldn't be doing things like this, tacking on void years.

And that's why it seems their goal is really to just make the playoffs. But the point just being that, you know, if you're New Orleans and you have Drew Brees, you have to do everything you can to keep Drew Brees. You can't let him go and play for the Vikings or something. You have to keep him, but you also can't lose a bunch of talent because of him.

So this is your option tack void years on spread the cap hits out pay the bill later who cares um but i think it's a very recent thing because even like five years ago i don't think teams were as much in this mode of all in or nothing i think that there was much more of like what the Wilfs are doing. Let's make the playoffs and maybe we'll be the giants. So it's been the last couple of years where we've really seen it. Uh, let's see this from Jesse CA and a bunch of numbers. Uh, if this year is successful, IE 13 ish wins in an NFC championship experience, uh, appearance. How does that affect Zimmer's reputation and higher ability moving forward? Well, you know, I think Mike Zimmer will be back.

I don't think as a head coach, I think he will be back as a defensive coordinator, maybe next year somewhere. And I also think that's, that's very deserved based on what he's done throughout his career. And I'm not saying they had a good defense last year. Of course they did not. Their defense was a struggle last year for the most part. Still, they were able to be the fourth best team on third downs in the NFL. That is Zimmer scheme. That's not just, you know, based on the players, which everything always is forever based on the players. I don't, I still don't think anyone around the league would tell you Mike Zimmer doesn't know

how to coach defense anymore. Um, I think that the roster fell off, but what Mike Zimmer gives you is the potential for a top five defense. If you have good players and that's not something that's true of all coordinators. So I do believe he'll be back to your question. If they were to completely turn it around, I think a lot of people would say, see Zimmer was the problem. It was all Mike Zimmer. It was his bad culture. It was his bad game management.

It was his wanting to run the ball all the time. That is the bad man. What I would say, though, is that, I mean, every season is just so different. It's like you're running out a different team every single year. If you go to the NFC Championship and win 13 games, but Aaron Rodgers got hurt in week one and was out for the season. And so you got two wins there. And the Lions and Bears both tanked and won four games each. And you got two two wins there and the lions and bears both tanked and won four games each. And you got two more wins there, two more wins there. And in the NFC East, Brian

Dable's a disaster. Jalen Hurts falls off from where he was last year. Carson Wentz is Carson Wentz, but like even worse. And you get a bunch of more wins there because of the way that your schedule played out. I mean, I think that it will be said that it was all Zimmer's fault, but it's always circumstance. Like every year is such a small sample. Imagine if any other league played 16 games and how ridiculous that would be. Like what would people's batting averages be after 16, well, 17 games? Everything is a small sample and a replaying of last year. Maybe you win half more than half of those, uh, those games that are close as a replaying of last

year and you win 11 instead of eight. And then we would be saying, what a great job by Mike Zimmer, who turned around the defense and everything else. Like our narratives are always shaped kind of after the fact. And I like to kind of focus on what the reality is of somebody before we get into this is everything that it means. But if they win 13 games, it will say this, that Kevin O'Connell did have more answers than anybody else has had before for Kirk Cousins and for the offense and that the culture changed and that a lot of players that we didn't expect to step up did, which is always in the realm of possibility that Cam Dantzler shuts everyone down and Kene Wongwu becomes a huge part of their offense and so does Amir Smith-Marset and this offensive line competition works out perfectly. Like these things do happen. To get to 13, it's tough, but like these things do happen to get to 13. It's tough, but like these things do happen where everything just falls into place. I don't think

that automatically means that the last coach was just the worst coach still. I mean, if you've listened to the show, you know, that I felt they desperately needed to change there. It's just, there's been a lot of, Hey, this was all Mike Zimmer. And now we're going to do everything different from Mike Zimmer. And that's what, uh, is it that that was the whole problem. And I just like fundamentally reject that because Mike Zimmer's past was mostly very successful, um, before 2018. So, all right, this from Andrew Bowers, how many years of eight and nine, nine and eight records will the Wilfs ultimately allow before a full teardown is mandated? That is a, that's a hard one, but I think that things like that have to just happen.

So here's another world. So we just presented the, Hey, what if they win 13 games? And this is the thing about this team. I don't think 13 games is exactly the ceiling, but there's maybe 11. And then there's a floor that's much lower than it would have been with Mike Zimmer because it's a new coach, because we knew what Mike Zimmer would bring. And we could project that, but we don't know what Kevin O'Connell can bring. The Detroit lions at one point got rid of Jim Caldwell because they said, Oh, you know, he can only get us to nine and seven and their next coach again, not calling Kevin O'Connell, Matt Patricia. Uh, but their next coach did not do what they thought he was going to do. He didn't take him to the next level. And we see a lot of that. Um, Dan Quinn being fired in Atlanta, they bring in a new coach. Oh, this is the guy who's

going to do everything right. The last guy did everything wrong. And then they're basically the same team. So, um, but the natural part of this, what I mean is if this team wins six games and it just is a disaster of falconsy fashion that this next year, then I don't know that there's any choice. Like there isn't an argument at that point to say, all right, no, what we really need to do is just move more money and add, you know, middling free agents, another Harrison Phillips or another Patrick Peterson. Like there's, I thought we would get to the point where we'd say that about this off season, but it might take, I guess, one more of then Kweisi Adafo-Mensa can say, okay, now you have to let me do it my way. Uh, you know, I, I think that that is assuming that that was his way, but now you have to let me build

this roster in the shape that I see it because the way of bringing everybody back did not work. So I really think that there's that scenario. Now, if they go nine and eight again, you're probably doing the same thing next off season. I don't know if that there's any way around that, but it would really depend on who makes them nine and eight. Like, is it the older players still getting them there? Or is it the younger players stepping up? Because if it's the younger players stepping up, then it's a very different scenario. Then it could be an exciting nine and eight and

an interesting nine and eight, as opposed to feeling the same way that everybody did after last year. So it's a complicated question, but I always think that like the sports world just forces you eventually to live in reality. Like even the Los Angeles Lakers eventually were just forced to live in the reality that you can't throw together Russell Westbrook carmelo anthony and lebron james and the washed stars of seven years ago lebron is still very good but the rest of them just washed with no other good players it's falling apart after they won the championship and there was nothing that they could really do about it and now they have to reset it it kind of comes for everybody eventually and i think that if the vikings don't have that scenario where they draft extremely well

this year and then have a lot of guys who are younger on the roster rise to the challenge, if we have a lot of the similar things with the drafts gone wrong of the past, then you're probably ending up being forced into that teardown mode because eventually Harrison Smith and Adam Thielen, Eric Hendricks, these guys just won't be able to play at the same level in the NFL anymore. All right. This comes from TJ. We'll call it Reum. I'm not sure how to pronounce your last name, TJ. R-H-E-A-U-M-E. Playing around with overthecap.com, how many and which ones of these guys will be on the roster in 2024?

Cook, Kendricks, Hitman, Thielen, and C.J. Hamm. Well, first, C.J. Hamm will be on the roster for the rest of time, and you can't tell me any different, okay? That's one. But 2024, Delvin Cook is a very big stretch to think that he'll be here. The money and the age of the running back, it feels like this year, next year, that that's it. And I think they can move on from him much more easily after this year. Kendricks is another one that's hard to see because you're talking about being 32, 33 years old at that point,

needing a new contract, Harrison Smith. I mean, the answer could be none of these. Like every one of them that I'm going through, my answer is it's hard to see. It's hard to see. And that's why I was saying just naturally, based on the ages of the players, not what they've done or how good they've been.

When you say, well, he's not going to be here. I mean, there's sort of a natural pushback of, well, yeah, well, you want to keep this guy. You's sort of a natural pushback of, well, yeah, well, you want to keep this guy. You want to keep that guy, but age football, like that's how it works.

And it's actually kind of hard to see them. Any of them there. That's why the time will force you to eventually rework this roster. And whether they find people in the draft or not will determine how they can replace those guys. If they, if they develop a linebacker, if they find their next safety, if they find their next wide receiver and the most important part, finding the next fullback, all of those things will really matter. But yeah, it's hard to see any. If I were to guess right now, I'd say none. I don't think any of those guys are on the team in 2024.

This comes from North Stars NHL. Answer maybe two more questions here. Has ESPN replaced Courtney Cronin with a new Vikings beat reporter? Not like they could replace her. Just fill the role. I agree. Irreplaceable. She'll be on the show later this week again.

And is Garrett Bradbury the starting center or is there a legit steam that they could take Linderbaum from Iowa to replace him? Uh, well, there is not really steam that they could take Linderbaum. I think it's possible that they could, but I also think it's a little bit of a, if you're trying to replace him right away, we saw this development on the offensive line. It takes several years for these guys to be the peak versions of themselves. And even someone as good of a prospect as Linderbaum, if he hits, is that a position that you really want to spend your high draft pick on, even if he's really good?

Because this year going into free agency, it's like four or five guys who are centers that were quite good. And there's still veteran centers out there who could play the position and give you halfway decent play. So that would have been a better option. It seems that they are just saying, let's get our look at Garrett Bradbury. He's under contract. Why not?

And then go from there. And no, ESPN has not replaced Courtney with a new Vikings beat reporter yet. I would guess that that will probably happen maybe before training camp. I mean, it doesn't seem like it's going to happen before the draft. And I think Kevin Seifert, one of the old school goats has been, uh, covering some Viking stuff in the meantime. So, uh, hopefully we see Kevin out there at the draft, but, uh, you're right. Courtney irreplaceable, but I'm looking forward to having someone new come into the beat.

Uh, all right. Another center question. Um, why can't I buy in? Why can't I get buy in? This is from Scott Wilcox 101. This one might be harder than the serial question. Why can't I get buy in to Garrett Bradbury moving to tight end in the Patrick Ricard Klein saucer mode?

I know you're not keen on first round centers, but draft Linderbaum to play center, and then the O-line becomes interesting in a much better way than we're used to. Plus, we salvage the Bradbury pick. Rick Spielman has hired you for the scouting department. Moving offensive line players' positions is their specialty, and they love it. No, I don't think that Bradbury will be playing tight end anytime soon.

That would be a really wild thing. But playing tight end, I had this conversation with a tight end prospect at the Combine who was at a place that I was at, you know, whatever, 11 o'clock at night one night. And I just started. He's a 6'7 or 6'6 guy. So I was like, okay, what position do you play? And why is it tight end? So we started chatting. Tight end is the hardest position, I think, on the field that is not quarterback to be really good at.

How many good tight ends are in the league? Probably fewer than quarterbacks because you have so many different things that you have to do. You have to block. You have to catch. You have to know a route tree route tree yards after catch is important with today's tight ends. Like there's just so many things there that, um, are really difficult. And, uh, you know, I, I, I don't think that they're doing that, but replace the center with a veteran who doesn't cost you that much. That's the right way to replace a center. I think unless you're getting them in the third round and then you develop them.

I mean, Pat Elfline is, it was a guy who I think was on pace to become a pretty decent player and then had that injury that set him back and he never really became the same after that. But yeah, that that's more of the, the of the way you should go is with that position than drafting someone that high. And also Linderbaum is like 290 pounds. And there's no one concerned about this with the way that the league is rushing up the middle. I just, I just questioned the overall impact of a center, unless the guy is great. And also how generally easy they are to replace. They are the lowest paid position that is not kicker or punter. And I think that's for a reason. So we shall see, but I don't guess that Garrett Bradbury is going

to be moving positions anytime. All right. So I've got plenty more questions to answer, but I don't want to make these episodes two hours at a time. So we'll spread them out. We'll continue with our fans only. And someone suggested for subscribers to the newsletter that we create a phone line. So I think I'm working on that. Maybe we'll have some call-ins to the show. We'll see. So thank you all for listening. Really, really great batch of questions. Hopefully I answered them effectively and we will do more fans only purple insider podcasts here in the near future. Thanks for listening.