Purple Insider - a Minnesota Vikings and NFL podcast - ESPN's Kevin Seifert says Vikings shouldn't go crazy with all-in trades

Episode Date: October 10, 2024

Matthew Coller is joined by ESPN's Kevin Seifert to breakdown the Vikings' 5-0 start and how it should impact their planning for the rest of the season, including why Minnesota shouldn't go all-in at the trade deadline. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Hey everybody, welcome to another episode of Purple Insider. I'm your man, Colin Collard here, and joining the show, ESPN's Kevin Seifert. Kevin, you predicted the Vikings would go 5-0. You nailed it. They're 5-0, one of the great predictions preseason, probably in the NFL in recent history. Great job. I mean, you've got to be dancing around the bases for that home run. No, I'm just kidding. You didn't do that. But

how are you feeling, man? How are you feeling about the 5-0 Minnesota Vikings? Well, it's funny. In an alternate universe, I was telling somebody else this, you and I are on a podcast talking about whether this is the right time for J.J. McCarthy to be inserted into the starting lineup. And I think that's where we all thought we would be at this point. Obviously, we're not. And I think that speaks to how surprising, unexpected, miraculous, whatever the word is that you want to use to describe the position that the Vikings are in here in the bye week and really how they're set up for the rest of the season as well. Well, I think you're right that we could also have been talking about Ryan

Tannehill or Jacoby Brissett as the quarterback as well. If the Vikings had made a different bridge decision and whether, you know, McCarthy had gotten hurt or not, we would have been saying, well, now it's time to go to McCarthy if he hadn't got hurt or what are they going to do? Because this quarterback situation is so bad, but the team is so good around him and all that sort of stuff. But quite the confluence of events here across the roster where I feel like every best case scenario has clicked from every free agent signing, working out all the way down to guys

that we didn't even think twice about when they signed them, like Jerry Tillery or Jahad Ward. And on the offensive side, Kevin O'Connell has worked magic as well as the receivers. Aaron Jones has been terrific. A little bit of cracks in the foundation against the Jets and with an Aaron Jones injury, which we're going to talk about, but I want to play a little game with you. I'm going to make some statements to you and then i'm gonna ask am i being crazy and then you got to decide whether i'm being crazy okay good with that okay i usually i have i have a stock answer for all of those for you but we'll we'll go individually

um just to humor you okay would i be and this is gonna go on both sides of things not just always over the top on how good the Vikings could be. I'm going to go back and forth, but I will start out with this. Would I be crazy to say that the Vikings should be expected to finish with 13 wins this season? Am I crazy if I raise the bar in my analysis on this here show to if you don't win 13, then I'm disappointed in you. My crazy. So are you crazy to think that they should win 13? Mildly, I think, you know, they would only need to win.

They got to go eight and four the rest of the way. That's not so outlandish. But it's also like, as you said in your opening, so many things have gone right. Are the chances that this is just a charm season weeks one through 18 high, or is things going to come back to earth a little bit? So I would say that's a reasonable goal, but I do not think that they should be expected to win 13 games. I think so too. But then when you,

it's almost funny. Cause when you go five and oh, if you say, well, they went seven and five the rest of the way, you're like, it wasn't that good then all of a sudden that changes when that would have been a tremendous outcome for them at the beginning of the season, the way we looked at it,

but it'd be disappointing now. If you flip it, if you flip it and you, and you start seven and five and finish five and oh that's people are so excited and like it's how it's all not how you start it's how you finish but you know like the numbers are the same regardless and i think maybe it affects uh how well you might do in the playoffs i don't know but like that's that you know the numbers are the numbers okay so if it is a little crazy and I guess I was talking about it as in, if they win less than 13, then you've disappointed me and some things have gone wrong.

And I, I set the bar higher for this team to be one of those special teams and you didn't quite get there, uh, in a Vikings land. So what, what is then realistic if I am being a little crazy to hold them to a 13 win season or it's disappointing? I think it's realistic to think that, um, you know, as far as a win total, I think, I think at least 10 games, I think they should, uh, they should go at least five and what would that be? Five and seven, the rest of the way like that. I mean, and if we had started off the season and saying that they were going to have a 10 win season, we would have said like, that's I mean and and if we had started off the season and saying that they were going to have a 10 win season we would have said like that's a huge success and so obviously you don't want to finish five and seven but I think if they get to 10 you know in the overall path of their of their

you know program development if they get to 10 wins this year that's a huge win in the overall scheme of things regardless of of when those wins happened, that would probably get them in the playoffs. Maybe not. Maybe they need 11 to get to the playoffs. But to me, I think anything less than 10 wins is a disappointment for sure. Oh, 100%. I mean, anything less than 10 feels like a complete meltdown at this point. And with nine, I remember looking at this,

maybe the NFL put out something of your odds to make the playoffs with X number of wins when they went to that seventh playoff in the 17th game. It's only about a coin flip if you win nine games. And I think it was the 2022 Lions that got to nine and they ended up missing the playoffs. So if you end up there, what is the path there though? I mean, with so much talent on this team, it's the top defense in the entire NFL right now by expected points added. Everybody is clicking on that side of the football. How would they end up at a place where they don't win?

I mean, 13 is too high, but where they don't win 11, 12 at least. Is that entirely just the Sam Darnold question? No, I mean, well, a lot of it would have to be, yes, Sam Darnold and injuries. I think injuries to some key players on defense, while I think they have some depth, there's been some guys who've just been playing lights out and very unique ways that they've played, Andrew Van Ginkle and Jonathan Grenard in terms of how he's gotten pressure, but also been really good against the run. You know,

Harrison Phillips has actually been really important to them. Harrison Smith is obviously very important. So if there's the wrong injuries on defense, I think that could, that could do what happened last year, which is really limit the things that Brian Flores can do. A big reason why this defense has just been so lights out is that they have all their weapons pretty much out there at full capacity from the very beginning of the season.

And I think while Kevin O'Connell was hinting earlier this week that there's some more layers of schemes that they could bust out. But from a personnel standpoint, they would need to have the right guys out there to do those things. And so the path for a meltdown clearly would have to be a large part about Sam Darnold. But also, I think the health of the defense, there's a lot of age there. Um, and a lot of people taking a lot of snaps. And so that's something to monitor as well. How much were you weighing what happened against the jets into what we think is going to be the version of Sam Darnold out of the bi-week?

Because I watched the film back. I broke down some plays. I thought it was a little bit of everything. It was a little bit of, uh, Sam, why didn't you throw the football when the play was right there? And I will cop to being a little overcritical at times of the coach, not giving him enough underneath options because there were some plays where he just didn't throw it and it was right there over the middle. But I also thought he got popped a bunch of times that they had good coverage that it was five different things that led to a bad day I didn't identify one thing that said oh well this means you're screwed for the rest of the season because Darnold's gonna melt down I just thought everything

kind of came together for the Jets and then him being a little off his timing but how did you deal with that I mean I started and I told this to Dan Barrero on KFAN earlier this week is like the Jets defense is really good. Like you can't just view any team's performance or any player's performance in a vacuum. It should always be in the context of who they're playing against. And A, they have a pretty good pass rush. But I think that the unique thing about the Jets defense was they had those two corners who were really, you know, muscling up the Vikings receivers. And Justin Jefferson was not as open as he normally is. And I think Sam Darnold's gotten used to feeding him the ball when he maybe has a step.

But he didn't always have a step. And sometimes he had a step and they were restricting him and they called it a few times and they didn't call it a few other times. So that seemed to set Sam into like a little bit of an uncomfortable world where he had been very comfortable, grown very comfortable, doing the things that he had done in the first four games. And that was really just kind of unique to the Jets defense. Like, you know, I don't know how many other defenses, you know, I know that Lions tried this a few years ago, were just like super physical with Jefferson. You know, if they want to call six illegal contacts, go ahead.

You know, we're not going to get beat. And so that is one way to slow them down. And the to me, the you know, that you credit the Jets defense and you also say, OK, Sam, you've seen how like he's Justin Jefferson's awesome. Jordan Addison's awesome. But they're not going to be you know, it's not every game is not going to be like the first four. And so what do you do in the meantime? Getting TJ Hawkinson back will, I think, absolve, you know, give him a real option there in those situations. Throwing to the running back, hopefully for him, it's going to be Aaron Jones would give him some options, but I think he was kind of locked in on those guys to an adverse point, and the Jets had him, you know, the Jets were playing the type of defense that would

necessitate looking elsewhere, and so I think that was really what I saw there, that, you know, there will be some other teams that have cornerbacks who can play physical. I'm thinking about Seattle and some of the other teams out there that are on their roster or on their schedule. But relatively speaking, I, I, the biggest thing I took away was that the Jets did a lot of things that other teams can't or haven't tried yet. Yeah, they definitely did, which is why they should fire the coach involved, but get rid of them after that performance. but there were plays where also sam darnold's getting pressured very quickly uh one of them jaylen naylor is running wide open on a crossing route but immediately ed ingram gets beat guys right in his lap can't do anything uh christian

derisaw had a great game but his one loss happened super fast he had to bail out and i think the whole rhythm and timing of the offense was thrown off by a great New York Jets performance that, as you mentioned, the Detroit Lions are going to have a pretty tough time copying what they were able to do. So I wouldn't totally panic with that. Am I crazy though, for suggesting that the MVP of the offensive side of the Minnesota Vikings through five weeks is Aaron Jones. And without Mr. Jones, if he is banged up long-term or he's not 100%, that I would not have very high expectations for this offense. Is that a crazy statement to say if Jones isn't himself that I don't think that they can operate at the same level? Yeah, it's not crazy to say he's the MVP of the offense.

I think that's pretty obvious to anybody who's been watching. But in terms of can they function at the level they were functioning at, it's basically been the best offense that O'Connell has had in the three years he's been here. If you look at points scored or you look at efficiency or I think even maybe DVOA, they're just in the first five weeks like it's never. And the big, you know, the big difference is Jones. I think I'd looked at it this morning. I think they've had 31 percent more runs to running backs in the first five weeks of this season compared to last year when, you know, and we've had some

times this year when we thought, well, there seems like they're throwing in a lot of running situations, but on a relative scale, they have really shifted things. And maybe that was a Hawkinson thing as well, but they've really shifted things towards the running game more than they had last year. And Aaron Jones is the big reason. And there's no doubt, like you saw, again, the Jets have a good defense and you have to give some credit to their run defense as well. But there's no doubt that, like, if you had a pick of running back, not only on the Vikings, but maybe even in just the NFC North or in the NFC, who if a play is blocked for three yards,

who's the most likely guy to get more than three yards? You know, he might be it. He just has this really great level of vision and instincts and sort of institutional knowledge of NFL running that he's able to capitalize on because from a physical standpoint he hasn't gone downhill enough that he can't like he can see it but he can't get to it kind of thing which you see with some running backs near the ends of their careers and so he he's not at that point yet, but, um, and it doesn't sound like this is a super long-term thing, but they'll definitely have to make some, some adjustments, um, without him. Are you crazy to think that they

can't function at this level without him? No, not necessarily, but it doesn't mean that they can't play winning football. Yeah. I mean, I think that they most certainly can. And you saw too, that play action will still work to some extent with Ty Chandler, but I noticed a couple of times where it works no matter who the running back is and no matter how good he is, it's pretty wild. Anyway, sorry. Yeah. I mean, there's, I actually talked with your friend, Mike Sando about that the other day about how historically with the numbers play action still works, but I don't know that you have as many opportunities to use it if you don't have Aaron Jones back there and the screen game was just non-existent without Aaron Jones and I don't

know if that's a trust thing for Ty Chandler or not and I guess what I can't quite put my finger on is how much they will trust Ty Chandler if you you have no other choice, do they just do it because they have to? Or every time he gets a two-yard run that he doesn't turn into five like Aaron Jones would, is it going to be, okay, pass, pass, pass after that? That's what we've really seen. And I look back at those two games against the Lions last year

where Chandler's in the backfield and I don't think either one was really special. And he's just having Nick Mullins just pull the trigger over and over. I think that if Jones is out, it will be all on the shoulders of Sam Darnold. Well, and the thing that like to really keep in mind is I think they were really shook by that fumble. You know, I think I got credited to Sam Darnold, but it was clearly Ty Chandler just not catching the pitch like this wasn't like him getting obliterated by somebody's middle linebacker and coughing it up or like some kind of other weird collision where he fumbled. It was just like catching a pitch. And like that's where he's really good on those outside zone runs where he gets a pitch and like makes a move or so.

Or like you wait a second for the blocking to set up. And he's good at that. But like you got like that, like you don't necessarily add a level of trust when you're, when you just, when the pitch goes off your chest, you know? And so I think that shook them a little bit. I was at that point, I was like, oh, they, you know, I didn't know Jones was hurt at that time. Maybe they didn't know either. But like, as the game went on, I was surprised at how often they did give it to Chandler

given that particular fumble because of the situations, all the turnovers they had at the beginning of last year and how dramatically they reacted to that. And so I think that, and O'Connell brought it up again Tuesday during his presser with us. And so clearly that's on their minds. There's no way they trust him as much as Aaron Jones. And if they follow a very similar game plan with Ty Chandler as the primary runner, I guess I'd be surprised. Is it crazy to talk about emptying the bank for whatever they need to make this team the best version and the bank being their draft capital of which they don't have a lot to deal with next year. But is it crazy to talk about trading for a running back

with whatever draft capital you could get trading for a defensive player with a first round pick, potentially? How far is too far to talk about in terms of reaching into draft capital to improve this team? I think they can get a running back for something that's not going to break the bank draft pick-wise. You're right, they only have three or so for next year, and then there's potential for compensatories with losing Kirk Cousins. And so that, but like you think last year, I think the Cam Akers trade was like a swap of seventh rounders or a seventh and a sixth. Like you, but you're not getting an Aaron Jones

when you make that trade, but in terms of serviceable running backs who might be able to, you know, be at least as good as Ty Chandler, like that's a possibility and that certainly wouldn't break the bank. And if you were to ask me right now, like around or ask people around the NFL right now, like who, what do you think is going to happen at the trade deadline?

Like that's already what some people are talking about. The Vikings go get a running back. And that's even if Aaron Jones comes back relatively quickly, just knowing his injury history and knowing where they're at. Like it's now, like if he doesn't play a game, it's Ty Chandler and Myles Gaskin, you know, and Myles Gaskin has not, you know, been a very, has not been a running back that teams have used very much at running back except for one year in Miami, I believe.

And so that is certainly an area that I think they could upgrade. But like, if the question is like, should they recognize this as like a charmed year like it's a one in a decade type of year you're having where everything's coming together um and we've seen teams make runs the super bowl in that situation um should they just go all in uh on it um i would tend to think that would be um over. I'm pretty conservative in those situations. You know, Quasey has his own way of making decisions. I'm sure the coaching staff would love it no matter what.

But I think all things considered, they'd probably be – they've already mortgaged their future just about as much as they can. And, like, if you're saying, saying, should they go get another defensive player to put them over the top, to me, that's where you hope Dallas Turner in the second half of his rookie season starts to figure it out and it's almost like getting an additional player. Because right now I wouldn't say that he's made a couple plays, but I wouldn't say he's making a down-by-down impact

of the type you would hope a first-round pass rusher would make. I think they're probably bringing them along and there's no need to, to play them the entire game or to count on him with given the other guys they have. But I would look at it more that way and like, think like if you're believing your player development program and you still believe in Dallas Turner as much as you did when you gave up seven, a total of seven draft picks to get him,

then maybe that's the kind of guy that instead of trading for somebody, you say, well, the second half of the year, maybe we get a bigger contribution from him. Hold on. Let me silence my phone real quick so I can tell you that us days are back at U.S. Cellular again. Exclusive offers just for customers. Just to say,

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Terms apply. Visit uscellular.com for details. I could see them making some sort of argument of, well, we took two first rounders in this draft, so it's okay if we trade the first rounder from next year, I have been on the side of that. They should do it because that they should go all in because I look around the NFC and go, you know, in the future, there's some teams that really could be quite dangerous, including Washington, but also Chicago, two teams with rising star quarterbacks. Green Bay has been put behind the eight ball a

little bit this year, but they've got still a lot of talent. They're going to be in that mix. It might never be easier than it is right now for the Vikings to potentially win. The other thing I think about too is when does not having next year's first actually hurt you? What year? Because you can never count on a rookie to step right in and make a massive impact, especially if it's a backend of the first round. So is it going to really hurt you in 2025, 2026, 2027? And if they are turning things over to JJ McCarthy, they are still going to have all the cap space to continue to go out to the free agent market and add to this team in the places that they need.

I also would add that what places will they need? I mean, maybe Harrison Smith will retire. Maybe Stefan Gilmore will retire, but I don't think it's a team that needs 10 more acquisitions for next year. It's probably like three or four. So if that's the case, then they should still stay in that all in mindset. Plus you could trade for a guy that you extend as well, which they did with Hawkinson. Yeah. And I guess I would just counter with like, from a team building perspective, like they're already on the far furthest side of the range of draft pick contribution versus

free agent contributions or trade contributions like and i look this up and i'll have it in the story um later in the week on espn but like they i think they've gotten three three players have got have started a game this year who have been drafted in the past three years so basically this tenure of this group and that's the lowest in the nfl like they have gotten almost they have gotten as little of a contribution from their last three draft classes as anybody lower than any other NFL team. And that could change, you know, whenever it will change, whenever's no getting around that. Like the general long-term way to best way to build a team is to have it be built on the, on the backs of draft picks and sprinkled in free agent.

This free agent class has been awesome precedent setting, unbelievable. And it's rare. It usually, it doesn't work out that way. So if, if the idea is, well, let's let's go all in and just keep doing it in that direction. At some point you reach a critical mass where maybe not next year, maybe not the year after. Like you've just reached a point where like your drafts have been so unproductive that you have an untenable structure, regardless of whether the quarterback is getting paid a lot. Maybe I'll be surprised and they can basically build a team of free agent acquisitions with a cheap quarterback and then somehow the drafts start coming in behind that. I don't know. But

at some point, they need to draft better. And at some point, they need to have more volume, you know, because that's really the only way to draft better need to have more volume, you know, because that's really the only way to draft better is to have more volume, I think. And so it's a long way of responding to what to and I totally get where you're coming from and maybe that's the right thing. But in my own mind, like I'm just viewing it from a from a larger perspective than just the next few months. Like, I think that would be a big mistake.

So I guess the way I'm looking at it, and apologies for my voice, I've hit that part of the year where I need the bye week, and this team is too exciting to take any sort of vacation. But think about where San Francisco has been at the last few years, where this team did draft many of the parts that are now in their primes and have turned into stars. Jefferson, Derisaw, O'Neill, Metellus over the years. Shout out to Rick, I guess, for putting together a lot of those players. And the final pieces out in San Francisco were your Christian McCaffrey. They were your Trent Williams. And I think, you know, you spend

a second round pick on TJ Hawkinson. That's a good strategy for a team that's in a win now type of situation. And I look at like JC Horn, somebody like that from Carolina, where you're talking about a great cornerback who's young that they might not want to pay that you could potentially trade for. And I also think of everything through windows, just in general, like you only get so many years to win. And I think the bikies with this unit, with the core that they have right now, whether it's Darnold or McCarthy, but especially planning on McCarthy for the future, that they're going to have this core together. And if you're waiting for the next guy

to come around two years from now, three years from now, I think you're not putting everything into this small window. It's kind of like how Buffalo struggling a little bit with their roster at this point, but they had that window and they made all in moves. They got Vaughn Miller, they got digs and they weren't always the smartest moves, but they just sort of went for it and they were able to get pretty far by doing it. That's, that's how I'm thinking of it because rosters just always rise and fall so quickly in the NFL and also coaches get fired quickly in the NFL. So if you're waiting around for that next thing that you're going to go, man, I wish we just got Jeffrey Simmons instead. Maybe I just want to watch Jeffrey Simmons. No, it would certainly

be exciting. And I get it. And like, you know, the bills are a good example, but they also like never made the super bowl, um, maybe because of Patrick Mahomes and they felt like they had to. They had the additional thing of like not only trying to build a Super Bowl caliber roster, but a roster that could beat the best quarterback in the in the in the NFL and for a while just to get to the Super Bowl. And they haven't been able to do that yet. So like that's an additional thing that the Vikings probably don't have to think about. It's like, you know, there's no Patrick Mahomes in the NFC right now that would be in their way to at least getting to the Super Bowl. And so, and certainly, as I said, like, the coaches would be thrilled and probably be in favor of it and not be worried about what the impact

of next year's first-round pick would be. I just think that they're already kind of like they would be in a much worse hole if they hadn't just hit a grand slam on this free agent class this year. And we wouldn't necessarily be having this discussion. So maybe they're just really good at the free agency bit, you know, with the coaching staff being really good at articulating the kind of players they want, in some cases, the specific players they want, and the front office being really adept at going to get those guys. And maybe that's what they're good at, team building, and they should lean into it.

But generally speaking, I think they would be setting themselves up for a lower, I guess what I was, I don't know, like they'd be setting themselves up for a higher floor and a lower ceiling maybe if they, because anytime you're acquiring a player, it's somebody that somebody that another team didn't want for the most part, the best players in the NFL are, are, are were drafted by their original teams and have stayed there, especially quarterbacks. But, but at most positions as well. And so your best chance for getting the future hall of fame type players are, teams and have stayed there, especially quarterbacks, but at most positions as well. And so your best chance for getting the future Hall of Fame type players are always through the draft. That is definitely true. And having those types of players on cheap contracts is you look

over at Detroit and their window and how they've gotten Penny Sewell and they've gotten Amin Ross St. Brown and Jameer Gibbs and those players and how important it's been to being able to build around their expensive quarterback. I also look at it, though, is that other teams are also thinking in terms of windows. And we've seen at the trade deadline in recent years where there's much more sales going on, fire sales, where teams who are in the bottom are willing to say, just come pick off our lawn, take whatever you want.

And even we've seen star players that they're not going to continue to pay. And yes, that is probably for a reason, but also, I mean, if you're a Carolina and you think you're two years away, do you really want to spend all this money on this corner when you're not going to win next year

or even probably two years from now. This is kind of how Chicago thought with giving away a Khalil Mack, who also would be an interesting acquisition if the Vikings could do that to add Khalil Mack to what they have here for this defense. And so I think that there's a lot more availability of good players because I generally agree that, hey, if a team's getting rid of a guy, they're probably doing it for a reason, but somebody like Trent Williams, somebody like Christian McCaffrey, and even the players that the Vikings signed to this off season were just, you know, in some cases teams didn't want to pay them, but they were good fits here. I might, I might trust Brian Flores. If he said, look, I am one this guy away from this defense being one of the best we've ever seen. And OK, well, let's let's do that then.

Let's try to win it now. That's that's that's kind of how I look at it. But I think that the the first round conversation is extremely valid as far as just looking toward the future. Since I think this is OK to do a little bit at the bye week. Absolutely. I have not wanted to because like. I know where you're going. It's still McCarthy, right?

In the future. Yeah. And I assume what you were going to ask before I chimed in there was what do they do about Sam Darnold and McCarthy? And like, I know there's a lot of this talk that's gone on online and social media, and I debated whether to write it this week or not, but I don't know what there is to say yet. And Sam Darnold's last six quarters, the second half against the Packers in the Jets game, took him down a notch probably in terms of where he's at but like there's it's almost impossible to imagine a scenario where J.J. McCarthy doesn't eventually become the Vikings starting quarterback and it

still is the likeliest time as as next year um you know if Sam continues to play the way he is and the Vikings want to um franchise tag him and and and keep him and either trade him or just keep him because they had had a good year this year and pick up where he left off. And then at some point, you have to transition McCarthy. But even then, in-season transition for a quarterback means that things have gone bad and if you're you know it's much easier to do it over an offseason and so like I it's still hard for me to figure out like how they would navigate all of that unless they're you know because JJ was young at the

beginning you know anyway he had just turned 21 when they drafted him and you know do they want to go to have him on the bench for two years like i don't think they do like based on like in this again we talk about alternate universes like he he was he had in there was like a 36 hour period this summer where like it was it had suddenly become legitimately possible that to envision a path for him to be the week one guy and we had been very adamant that that wasn't the case. And I still think like the likelihood of it was way less than the likelihood of Sam Darnold being the starter,

but he had had that great game in the preseason opener. He was going, they were going to Cleveland to have two joint practices that Kevin O'Connell and the whole coaching staff puts a ton of weight into. Then he was going to start that preseason game against Cleveland. If he crushed those practices in Cleveland and crushed that preseason game against Cleveland, the way I think Jaron Hall did in that game eventually, because he wouldn't have been going up against, you know, like that. The momentum would have continued. And so if it wasn't going to be week one it was going to be pretty close and so the the and i guess this long-winded

winded way of saying it that he showed enough this past summer that like it wasn't gonna he was close to being ready if not ready to be a rookie starter and not necessarily to be perfect or having to have the team close to five and oh the way Sam Darnold has, but to be good enough that he wasn't going to be overwhelmed and it wasn't going to be a damaging thing to his career. And so for it to go from that to, I don't know, maybe we bring Darnold Sam back next year and have him be the starter again and let JJ get settled, I really think that, to me, it's hard to imagine it going that way.

I think that the bar is so unbelievably high for Sam Darnold in this case, it might actually be winning the Superbowl. And even then you might go, well, we won the Superbowl moving on. I mean, there is an instance of that in Baltimore winning with a great defense and Trent Dilfer and then going to get Elvis Gerback it's not quite one to one there but I think that I think the more comparable is actually San Francisco with Alex Smith to Colin Kaepernick I also think that with Kweisi Adafo-Mentz's background and making his bones in San Francisco that there could be a lot of influence to how they've been so successful for so long and him wanting to do the same thing.

And I think that when you're looking around the league right now, supporting casts are just so valuable and determining what quarterbacks do. And if you're Kevin O'Connell, you might look at Sam Darnold and go, this guy was pretty severely flawed and we made him into this 12 win quarterback. Well, gosh, I mean, even the instance of the Vikings sort of thinking the same thing with case Keenum and then going to Kirk cousins. There are so many examples of this throughout history of a team just still trying to see into the future rather than, well, maybe we can repeat that same season with Sam Darnold, even if he ends up with 30 touchdowns, 14 picks, and they win 11 games. It took a lot to get that there.

You're still going to have Jefferson. You're still going to have Addison, Hawkinson, the tackles, the line, the coach, everything is staying together here. And as good as McCarthy looked in the off season and also his character matters to the fact that he sold them on his work ethic from mini camp to training camp. And he took huge, huge strides where we were thinking we'll see in 2026 or something, JJ McCarthy, as bad as he looked at mini camp and then to have him threatening to go to Cleveland in those joint practices and make his

case. All of that is so relevant to the conversation that I don't even think we're at the end of the day, having too much of a deep discussion about this. It's because it's probably JJ McCarthy decided, or I guess I didn't phrase it in the, am I crazy for thinking that, but I don't think I'm crazy for still thinking that. No, no, I don't think so. And to me, like the real discussion is, would the Vikings try to extract some value from what Sam did, has done and ostensibly will do for the rest of the season by franchise tagging him and then trying to trade him? Or they just say you know thanks for the memories now we you know go cash in on what on on the season we all collaborated on and so like that is an interesting discussion in terms of like would it be would they get more than a compensa what the compensatory

formula would bring them and all those sort of things and like what would sam donald's free agent market be in that scenario. He'd be a 28-year-old quarterback in his prime coming off the best year of his career. Like, you know, and I can't say I've even looked at teams who would be looking for quarterbacks, but, like, you know, even the team they just play, the Jets, funnily enough, like how long is Aaron Rodgers going to be there? But besides the point, would the Vikings just kind of, you know, say, OK, great. You know, go hit free agency. Congratulations.

We're on to JJ McCarthy. Or would they try to extract some additional value from the work that they put into him before he moved on to another team? I can't think of too many precedents of teams franchise tagging and then trading. But this also is maybe an instance that doesn't have a whole lot of precedent. It has happened. I think it,

yeah. And, and I'd have to research it, who it's been, but it's happened occasionally. And you don't have to, it doesn't have to be the double first round picks. It can be a negotiated,

whatever you want it to be. If the teams all agree on it, because if you're the Vegas Raiders and you're terrible and you can't find quarterbacks and also your owner has a history in his lineage of loving big armed quarterbacks, uh, maybe there is an opportunity there to trade for something that's a lot more than they would get for compensation back. Uh, this is getting a little uncomfortably too far down the road. How about, what do you want to know from me? What do you got for crazy?

What do you got for a crazy statement that you want me to break down about this team? Is it crazy to think that everyone else cares more about whether Brian Flores becomes a head coach right now than he does right now being the keywords um it is not crazy because I mean the ring will last forever so if he's fighting for Super Bowl on a week to week basis. But I also think that Brian Flores lives in the same reality as me and thinking that he won't get another head coaching opportunity. Last year when we talked to him and I was very curious about what he was going to say when we talked to him for the first time after he got zero head coaching interviews last offseason. And he kind of gave us the, it is what it is. I'm happy to be here, but it also sounds like,

and we get a lot of Brian Flores. I mean, shout out to him. He does 20 minute press conference with us every week. These are marathons. Like I'm, I'm running out of ways to ask him about players and blitzes by the end, but he's also been very open. And I think one of the things he's talked about a lot is his family and their relationship with the team. His kids are Justin Jefferson fans. I mean,

it sounds like it's been a very happy existence for Brian Flores in Minnesota. And that's not that he wouldn't want to go be the head coach of another team. But I also think that it's a good situation for him and this, you don't have to sue the league for this to happen. Steve Spagnuolo is a good example of a guy who had a head coaching shot. He got his one opportunity and then went back to being a DC, which is a good place for him. Brian Flores, his connection with the locker room,

with the players, the scheme, how he's created this environment of everybody sharing ideas and making it this, this moving target for offenses. It's really special. I mean, the scheme, how he's created this environment of everybody sharing ideas and making it this moving target for offenses. It's really special. I mean, it's something that I haven't seen too many times. Maybe Rex Ryan had this for the Jets when they went to AFC championships or a handful of other situations, but it's really something special that I don't know that he's sitting here thinking I'm playing for a head coaching job. I do think, and we've seen this before, shout out to John D Filippo. We have seen coaches arrive here

that were basically like, how can I do enough to get myself a head coaching situation? He may, he very well may have emotionally moved on from that. And if it happens, it happens. But I just think that the league is always and forever from here on going to be looking for the offensive head coach who can pair with the quarterback and go for their Andy Reed style or what the Vikings want to create with Kevin O'Connell. I just don't know that the league is looking for the hardest nosed type of defensive coach that Brian Flores is. And there's always hot candidates that are popping up everywhere.

But that is another one of those big picture discussions that if they're able to keep Flores long-term that extends that window and, and takes away a huge question mark, because even if you look at someplace like Buffalo, they lose Brian Dable and they've never really been the same since losing Brian Dable. And I think, tell me, I'll throw this back at you. Is it crazy to talk about this is the best other than the Chiefs complete coaching staff, offensive defense in the NFL? Yeah. And no, it's not crazy. And I, and I was thinking earlier, you know, who is, you mentioned Aaron Jones is the offensive MVP, but who's the MVP of the team. And I would say

like the coaching staff, like, and that's not to take anything away from the players and specifically O'Connell and Flores being co-MVPs, like there is not an NFL team that is running circles around their opponents for the most part, whether it's offense or defense, or in this case, both as consistently as the Vikings have. And whether it's all the different things that Flores has done to opposing quarterbacks, and the way he has implemented personnel and deployed personnel, or the ways that, and this is not new to this year, but the way there's almost always multiple people open in Kevin O'Connell's passing schemes, and it's just up to the quarterback to see them, or the adjustment he made towards the running game that I mentioned earlier, the 31% more rushes by, um, by running backs, like, and you just,

you just look at the game management and there's no big complaints there. Like he, they, they, you know, they don't, Kevin O'Connell doesn't create problems for himself with poor game management. And sometimes he helps himself. His challenges have been good. But, like, that's been, you know, and I know players execute and we always give credit to the players. But, like, let's just be real for a second and just note, like, how organized the team is, like, how they came out of the gates just, you know, wailing away on both sides of the ball, how they pulled the right strings on special teams in terms

of the kicker, you know, like, and that's, I did a story in training camp on how rare it is for rookie kickers to have good seasons, basically, or even an average season. And this guy has been perfect on extra points and field goals, and not all the field goals are easy ones either. And so just in terms of scheme, in terms of management, in terms of keeping the players motivated, in terms of being several steps ahead of most of their opponents, this has just been a dominant five-week coaching demonstration on both sides of the ball.

And I think they're getting plenty of credit for it nationally. I think basically O'Connell's established himself as like, you mentioned every team wants the head coach with a quarterback bent like that. Everybody wants Kevin O'Connell, you know, basically. And defensively, like every single time a defensive thing happens positively for or negatively for the Vikings and the rare occasions it has the discussion nationally has been, is this help Brian Flores get a new, get a head coaching job? Is this going to hurt his chances? And, and, and occasions it has, the discussion nationally has been, does this help Brian Flores get a head coaching job?

Is this going to hurt his chances? And that was sort of the reason I asked you the question I did, was that I don't think every little step or moment in the Brian Flores experience needs to be judged only through the lens of whether he's going to get a head coaching job or not, because I think you can step back and say there's not an assistant coach in the league, coordinator or otherwise, who's having a better year than he has, and it's not even close. And O'Connell's right there as well. And something that I would think that they could build on for the future is their bets have

just paid off. I mean, when it comes to the roster, like here's Brian Flores watching tape of Blake Cashman at the suggestion of a former gophers coach. Yeah. And then being like neighbor, I think, I think I will. I think I will suggest that we get Blake Cashman, the Andrew van Ginkle and his,

he was obsessed with Andrew van Ginkle. And here's a guy that most of the world had never heard of. He's getting pick sixes and is such a valuable piece for them stefan gilmore the last second clearly the coaches were pushing hard for that yeah um to get him and on the offensive side the belief in somebody like jaylen nailer who i think we all kind of went i don't know he hasn't been healthy and even he has said i don't know he hasn't been healthy so it's not like he knew that the ankle was going to be fine or whatever but he trusted nailer's talent through this entire time and bought into him there's very few personnel things where we could go you guys know what you're

doing uh because i think not all this is maybe one of the most underrated things in football not all coaches are great evaluators and if you have two that are and especially at the quarterback position and this Darnold is a Kevin O'Connell plan and a belief from Kevin O'Connell and Kweisi Adafo-Mensa is going and getting the groceries and it's all working the way it's supposed to work yeah one more thing I wanted to ask you is so this is their 5-0 I've had a lot of fun covering the minnesota vikings over the years the five and oh start 2016 i arrived teddy bridgewater got hurt the next day or maybe the same day they trade for sam bradford i'm meeting patrick royce for the first time on the air as he's asking me to break down the bradford trade like i just got here i don't even know the roster really and like i'm breaking down this trade

with the legend, Patrick Royce at the fair, like what a whirlwind that was. So I'll always remember that season as being crazy. And the five and O start so fun and the Minneapolis miracle 2017. But I think as far as the energy from the fans, the team that we deal with on a daily basis has so many great personalities watching how they've done it. This is some of the most fun that I've had covering a team so far. I would like to know of your years covering the Minnesota Vikings, your number one or two, I think there's one that's probably going to stand out above the rest, but one or two favorite seasons that you've ever covered. Yeah. Some of those years, I mean, I started covering in 99.

Some of those years did not. I wasn't the beat writer necessarily. And I don't know if you're referring to the five year of 09 as being the one you thought I would mention. Is that the one? I was thinking that. Were you not on the beat at that point? I was on the beat, but I was in the NFC North blog. So I was around for all of it. And so that was just the fact that it was the end of like a two year,

you know, or a 12 or 13 month process of Favre wanting to get to the Vikings, the Packers trying to keep him from getting there. And then him finally getting here. And just the fact that my beat was the NFC North. So a lot of my things I wrote about were the interaction between the teams and the fan bases. And this was very, you know, if you're into drama, there was plenty of drama involved in just getting him there and then to watch what he did that year and the impact he had on the team and the impact that was going on behind the scenes in a lot of cases

that was not as smooth as people thought. So there was a lot to write about. What I would say, so that was, I mean, that's just like a legendary, that'll always be a legendary Viking season in terms of how well, how things went. But like, what I would say about this season is that it's like the most positive, you know, start to a season that I've ever covered. Even some teams that also started very well had a lot of negativity or a lot of adversity that happened behind the scenes. I think back to like the 2000 season when they started off in a similar way, but Dante Culpepper was the starter that year for the first time, and a lot of the media didn't think he was going to play very well,

and there was a lot of I told you so. So it was sort of a tense, not necessarily fun, and certainly not positive overall coverage of the team. But in terms of things just going well, and certainly there was a little bit of adversity, or there was adversity this summer with Kyrie Jackson's death and a few of the injuries and obviously the McCarthy thing. But since the season has began, it's just been a very positive, happy place to be. And that's certainly a rarity in my time covering the Vikings.

I know even just questioning the last six quarters of Kevin O'Connell and some of the play calling and letting the two teams back in the game. I've had to stop myself and say, listen, I know how silly it is that the biggest criticism of the first five weeks of the season are you almost blew leads of 28 and 17, but that really, that really shows you where it's at. And I actually, you know, I started the show by joking with you about predicting 5-0. But I do think that the people who were around this team saw more than a six-win team, which is what most people projected. And I'm always kind of, as I'm going through training camp, trying to check myself with, well, Vegas wins. Like, they know what they're doing.

Always. wins like they know what they're doing always but but what i'm seeing on a day-to-day basis what i'm seeing in joint practice is what i'm seeing in the way this team is coming together is not a six win team at all and i think a lot of us are it's like are we local yokels by picking them to win nine or ten but in this case it really wasn't i i think we did see that there was more here maybe not five and oh but we did see that there was more here than the outside perspective was looking at which maybe has helped the coaches and players respond to us positively. I don't know. Yeah. Like nobody, yeah. Nobody here was saying, I mean, what I was saying, and maybe this was just like hedging it. I was saying like, I think this is the most talented roster that the Adolfo Mensah O'Connell tenure has brought, but it's just entirely dependent on what they get

from the quarterback. And the quarterback to this point, to that point in his career has had never been good for an extended period of time, period, hard stop, no, no, you know, other way around it. And so this has been the best five games, you know, I guess I haven't looked at all the five game stretches in Sam Donald's career but I think we'd be hard-pressed to find one that's been better than this and whether it's him or the scheme or the or the players or the surrounding him or the all the above which is the likeliest answer like that was and that's and a quarterback is the most severe question in position to have a question at and so like to me I was combining that combining

that with the schedule they had the the division they were playing in and saying like this is a really tough year to be to have a good roster but a complete question mark quarterback and he has answered enough of those questions and they have supported everything around him to the point where that was has not been something that's dragged him down uh the competition has been good but that's why you know you don't you know that's why the results are not listed until the game is over um and so and to me it's just a lesson and and i wish i you know frankly wish i trusted my gut more than i did when i was continuously being asked, how do I think they're going to be? And I was saying, you know, I don't see how they, you know, I can't see right now how they're better than any of the other teams in the NFC North,

given the quarterback situation. Well, still a long way to go with that. And maybe I'll turn out to be retroactively right. And we can delete that last few sentences from this podcast and, and we'll go from there. Well, it is kind of classic Vikings that their division is the best in football in a year like this. So, Kevin Seifer, it should be a fun rest of the year that you and I will cover together. And I'm looking forward to that starting outside of the bye week.

So thanks so much for your time. And we will see where it all goes. I appreciate it, man. Okay, thanks for having me.