Purple Insider - a Minnesota Vikings and NFL podcast - Football Outsiders QB analyst Derrik Klassen breaks down Kirk Cousins vs. Dak Prescott

Episode Date: October 27, 2021

Matthew Coller gets together with one of the best QB analysts out there, Derrik Klassen of Football Outsiders and Bleacher Report. Derrik talks about whether there's something different about Kirk Cousins this year and what type of offense he best fits in. He also breaks down why Dak Prescott rivals the likes of Tom Brady when it comes to pre-snap adjustments and discusses why the Dallas Cowboys' offense has been so successful with Kellen Moore. Plus he gives his take on Justin Fields' struggles and what's next for the QB rookie class. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Hello, welcome to another episode of Purple Insider, Matthew Collar here, and along with me from Football Outsiders, also working on a huge project with such previous guests on the show as Brandon Thorne for Bleacher Report looking at the 2022 draft. But we won't discuss that right now because we have big things to talk about. Derek Klassen, welcome back to the show, buddy. How are you? Not too bad, man. You know, I get to say this now because I feel like I have to. It was like 110 plus for two months here and now it's not. So I'm doing a lot better mentally because of that. I can go outside without feeling like I'm dying.

Well, it's as we speak, 57 in Minnesota. So I just took the dog for a nice fall walk. I will take the two weeks of fall. But then after that, it becomes truly awful in Minnesota, except for the winter sports people who like to go skiing and everything else. I just stay inside and huddle. But since it is your job to study quarterbacks, and in my opinion, you are one of the best of the best in the internet stratosphere of studying quarterbacks. We got a great matchup to talk about here, Derek.

I want to begin with you on Kirk Cousins because there has been a lot of discussion about Kirk Cousins and his improvements specifically toward the end of games, where this year he's been very good at the end of games. He has not been turning the ball over, which he has had a propensity to do at times during his career. He's not taking a lot of sacks this year. He's getting the ball out quickly. Some of these things are just not Kirk Cousins-y things. In fact, a few years ago, you and I did an entire show about why Kirk Cousins doesn't lead game winning drives very often. We looked at a bunch of them. So what have you made of Kirk Cousins' play so far this year? And by the way, I did hear that dog barking in the back, which means there's a rule on this that you have to make a dog pun. That's the rule.

It happens a lot. You have to make a dog pun in your next answer. So go ahead. What have you made of Kirk Cousins' play so far this year? Oh, that's going to be harder than talking about Kirk Cousins, which is already difficult enough most of the time um I mean I don't know like we were talking we were kind of talking about it leading up to the show like Kirk Cousins just does this sometimes I will say that I think um the way that the offense has opened up structurally um with more receivers on the field

I think has maybe helped him a little bit because I think we saw at times when he was in Washington um he's a better quarterback now than he was in Washington, but a lot of his best moments in Washington were when they had like Deshaun Jackson and they could do a really good job of stretching the field and making those windows over the middle of the field a little bit clearer for him. And I think when they did, even though he's a very good play action quarterback and stuff like that, I think when they were a more heavier team and then they got into drop back when they were a more heavier team and then they got into dropback

when, when they had like more condensed windows over the middle of the field, I think sometimes he could get a little bit gun shy. And now that I think they've opened things up a little bit, I think that's a little bit more conducive to him being willing to pull the trigger and stuff like that. And so I know Harif, Harif Hassan was talking about this on Mina's show.

And the thing is like, when you get into two minute situations late in the game, like that is what your offense becomes no matter what, even if that's not like what you are generally like coming into a game, your offense is going to have to be 1011 personnel, you're throwing the ball, stuff like that. And so he kind of posited the idea that maybe because their offense is a little bit more that way, generally, he's actually just more comfortable in these late game situations when that's what the offense becomes anyway. And I think there's probably some truth to that because I mean, just the more that you rep anything, the more comfortable you're going to get with it. And I

think he's very much a guy who, because he is not very naturally a guy who can just make, you know, he can make chicken salad out of, out of chicken shit. Like I think he's a guy who kind of needs reps and stuff. And now that I think they're doing that a little bit more, he's just gotten a little bit more comfortable. I think part of my theory has been that he also has another guy to throw to. And there's only so much focus the defense could put on, you know, Justin Jefferson and Adam Thielen, but they're going to put all of it on them in those big situations. And KJ Osborne is just, he's a guy, he's a player.

And in previous years, there were times where Cousins targeted Laquan Treadwell on fourth down and it was like, why, what is that happening? Why are you doing it? But also Laquan Treadwell is on the field. And if he's on the field and Kirk Cousins Reed takes him there, he's going to throw the ball there. And it's not Kirk's fault necessarily that they had a well below replacement level wide

receiver out on the field way too often in those big spots because well even last year in big moments they would have BC Johnson or Chad Beebe these guys are barely NFL players who you're having as his third wide receiver and we tore our hair out for the longest time going you know guys maybe should sign one or draft one or do something. And they have sort of hit the lottery again with KJ Osborne. I think that even weirdly, Irv Smith's injury has not allowed him to even rely on a tight end on underneath stuff. It's like, no, you have to throw it to a playmaker in these big spots. Yeah. I mean, and I think there

is some there, I think when you put a quarterback in that situation where he's not naturally super aggressive and you kind of put him into this like ultimatum where it's like you have to start throwing down the field more or you're screwed and the offense can't function especially with some of the running back injuries that they've had like it not that Alex not that Alexander Madison is bad but like he's not Dalvin Cook and so like that kind of forces you to push the ball down the field. I think we're seeing some of the same thing with Derek Carr. Like, he's generally been a guy who's a little bit more conservative.

The offense can't run the ball. Their running backs have been banged up, and their offensive line sucks. So Derek Carr is kind of like he knows that, like, okay, if I don't push the ball down the field, we're not going to get down the field. And I think he's done a really good job opening himself up in that sense kirk cousins has not like his ada is like not nearly as high as cards is right now but i think he's generally been more comfortable taking those those plays when he has to still waiting on that dog punt i will get one by the end of the show i promise you that that is a demand good but it will be there uh well so uh cousins has navigated hairy situations uh so to speak and he

has um left fans drooling for more about the way that he's played at the at the end okay maybe mine won't be so bad compared well i mean hey if you're not going to jump on it, then I will pick up the pun slack. No, but I think you're right that when Cousins is really forced into a situation where he absolutely has to be aggressive and he has another player to make plays for him, he can do it. I mean, that was always the puzzling thing because people always look for these other explanations like, is he just a choker? Does he get nervous?

And athletes do for sure. I think that that happens, but I'm not sure that someone at such a high level who had been an NFL quarterback for so long when put in a situation that's difficult would just be like, I melt. And I think the other part of it too, is that their past protection, well, not brilliant has been good enough to get him time to throw in some of these spots. I also think that, like you said, off the start, this is, this is cousins though. And this is the thing that I think people are concerned about is that so far they've beat the teams that don't have winning records. They've lost the teams that do have winning records. I don't want to talk about this luck, that luck,

because it's gone both ways through six games. And, you know, it feels like this is kind of a, it's like a classic Cousins, but maybe trumped up a little or turned up a little bit on the notch, but it's sort of a classic Cousins season to be three and three. It's got really good statistics.

He's played well. He's had his moments, but then you're sort of holding your breath. Like, wait, is one of those games going to happen? And maybe that was just Cleveland. And then that's the game that was going to happen. But usually out of a 16 or 17 game season, you get 10 or 11 good performances out of cousins. And then you get five or six where you go, I don't know what just happened there. And we lost to Atlanta because why? And that has not happened yet this year. And I wonder if there's anything you see with him where you say, you know, maybe it won't, maybe that shoe won't drop. I don't know. I think he's still kind of is generally the way that he is. I will say, I think I agree with you that the protection has generally been like good enough.

I will say too, like Kirk Cousins is his problem against pressure has never really been like being willing to take a hit if he knows where he's going. Like he'll stand in there if he, if he goes like one to two and he's going to take a hit, but he knows where he wants to pull the trigger, he'll still do it and take the hit and he won't shy away from that. The problem has always just been like, if he has to move or reset, things can get a little bit trick away from that. The problem has always just been like if he has to move or reset, things can get a little bit trickier than that. I think with what we talked about earlier with him, maybe trusting these weapons more

than now that he has a third receiver that is like an NFL player that is actually good to have on the field. It's possible that he's getting in those situations more where he's a little bit more comfortable pulling the trigger early in the play because he knows that this guy's open. He trusts him to make a play.

And so even if he's getting pressured, he's not like second guessing or anything he's not like oh god i'm gonna drop my eyes i'm gonna you know take a sack whatever he's just like i think my guy's open i trust him i'm gonna pull the trigger and so i think that's working really well for him pressure stuff is always like can be volatile but i think he's always kind of functioned this way and it's just a matter of like how bad is the offensive line going to get how bad are the receivers going to get I think the receivers are going to be fine maybe the offensive line gets worse especially if they get a guy injured but I think generally he's probably going to be okay he'll probably still have one or two games like that because that's just what he does but that's also like any other quarterback like I mean we

just saw Mahomes completely like die like last week like it's just gonna happen to some guys so um I don't think he's gonna completely capitulate to a level that's like he's unplayable I think he'll probably be fine yeah I think that um the way that they're trying to and I don't mean this is a pun as a reference to the vaccination status but trying to sort of build a bubble around him a little bit where he's getting the ball out quicker. And like you said, his depth of targets gone down, whereas Gary Kubiak's plan. And so was Kevin Stefanski's was to run longer developing routes and have cousins use his deep accuracy to those receivers. And it's interesting that the results are a little different in like yards per attempt and things like that. But the results overall are kind of not that different. I mean, they still have great passing numbers, but too many three and outs and too many long stretches where nothing happens. And it'll still be third and 11 and he'll throw a three

yard pass. And there are still even moments with clock management where you go, you okay? You know, why did you throw like against Cleveland? Like, why did you throw a three yard pass in bounds? Because you do that sometimes and i guess i just wonder like what you think the ideal offense for him is because it's almost like we've declared it whatever we recently saw work so early in 2018 we're like wow d filippo is nailing it and then you know later in the season it comes off the rails stefanski and kubiak with the play actions it worked for a ton of downfield stuff it also got him sacked a lot and he held on the ball a lot and then this year now it's the short stuff and I guess I I don't know like maybe there is no magic bullet answer why don't you just

do this and it will work all the time I don't think there's one that takes him to the next level I think he's very much a guy that who can like be he can fit into a lot of different things like I think you made the joke that like he is kind of just the best offense for him is whatever we saw him in last but I think that's like the thing is he's just kind of adaptable and there's no thing that's gonna like set him over the top I just don't think he has a skill set where you can he's so good at a lot of things but he's not great at any one thing that you can be like, we're going to build the offense around this. Whereas like Cam Newton at his prime,

it was obviously the way that he could run in power pass. You even see with like Ryan Tannehill, it's very clear that like what his skill set is with like the power pass that they do with Derek Henry and stuff like that. I mean, it's just like right. Russell Wilson, the same thing.

Like he's much more of like a complete deep shot guy. And then they're just kind of okay with building the offense for him to scramble and stuff like Kirk Cousins I think is just not a guy who has a trait that is very conducive to building this elite offense you're kind of just hoping that the pieces around him can be elite and then he's always going to be the guy that can like fit it together properly no which is kind of kind of sucks if you're hoping that he's like your franchise changer, which people have been hoping for for three years. But I don't know.

He definitely is more of just like a stabilizer than I think somebody who completely puts you over the top. I was just about to take it there because we're, we're more or less in a contract year in the way that he's not playing with a $45 million cap hit next year. Or if he does, that's not very helpful toward winning the Superbowl. What would you do? Because I saw a tweet of yours and I retweeted it about this upcoming draft class.

Now I've never been a complete believer in there's no quarterback in this draft class because Herbert wasn't supposedly that good and Burrow, you know, it was kind of a one year wonder who emerged and those are two great quarterbacks now so um but you you tweeted about the draft class coming up that's not all that great if the vikings were going to move on they would very likely have to draft quarterback i mean what what should they do here because i mean if he continues to play like this they make the playoffs probably they go like nine and eight or something maybe ten and seven and it's going to be very difficult to beat tom brady aaron rogers and so forth um to win a super bowl right so like what would you do would you kind of say like well the nfc scoreback situation is kind of in flux entirely and eventually brady and rogers won't be here and you're you'd have a chance with a lot of

young pieces or should they take the route of plan on this kind of being your last year of being dedicated to Kirk Cousins I think this is just like I think in a vacuum moving on from Kirk Cousins is maybe the best choice um just because I think ultimately he's not a guy who puts you over the top, like we were saying, like he's good and there's nothing wrong with that. You can win with all the right circumstances. Generally, that's going to happen on a rookie contract, though, and he's obviously not on that. The problem is like, man, this quarterback class really does suck. And I haven't seen a lot of these guys in depth too much, but like like rattler is obviously not who we thought he was going to be sam howell to me is like i mean if he's andy dalton that's that's as best as you're

getting i think with him um matt corral i think is a numbskull even if he's kind of talented like there's just i just don't know who the guy is supposed to be like carson strong nate tice said he can't run out of his own shadow which is pretty good. And I think that's ultimately true with him, even if he's like a decently talented passer. I just there's there. The thing is, there probably will be a guy from this class who turns out to be a top 16 quarterback or whatever, and he's like a functional player or whatever. But there's none of them heading into the draft season into the draft where you're like, that's the one I would stake my franchise on him being the guy. And, into the draft where you're like, that's the one I would stake my franchise on, him being the guy.

And I think, especially when you're in Minnesota's spot where one, they're not going to play poorly enough to be in the fourth overall pick where they can just like freely get this guy. That's not going to happen. So even if you move on from Cousins, you're still having to give up a ton of assets in a class that is probably not good to begin with.

So even if in a vacuum, ideally it would be wonderful to move on from Kirk cousins especially given this contract situation. It's just like, it's just not reasonable in this, in this off season. I don't think. It feels like what you would have to do is find a way to reduce this cap hit and for maybe, I don't know though. You can't like, it's not a video game.

You can't just like extend for a year. Right. You agree to that. Like, that's the problem. Like we ask people ask all the time, wasn't there something they could do? Well,

right. But his side has to agree to it. And I don't know why he would. So that's the thing. Why would he do that? Like, right. It doesn't,

I don't know. Well, and if he puts up the seventh best quarterback rating in the league and they go eight and nine and miss the playoffs by a single game, is his side going to go? No, you're right, guys. We'll take 22 million. No, of course not. He's going to look at Josh Allen's deal and Patrick Mahomes would be like 40 mil baby. Let's go. And I would not blame him for that. Somebody has always paid Kirk cousinsousins. It's just that he's going to continue to up the ante as he plays in the top 10, 12 quarterbacks in the NFL, because look at the bottom quarterback play. You can't really waste a year either with a rookie quarterback. You can't do this Justin Fields thing and just go like six and 11 because you have a rookie quarterback.

Well, Justin Jefferson's on his rookie contract. So it is a very, very difficult needle to thread. Now, the team on the other side, the Dallas Cowboys, they've kind of done this. Dak Prescott, he's got the huge contract. They've paid everybody. And yet they put enough weapons around him to just have this miraculous offense. Tell me what Dak Prescott is doing that has made him an elite quarterback. Because I think even that conversation about signing him, not signing him, even the Cowboys were like, I don't know, is he going to be worth it? And then now he's

playing as good as any quarterback in the NFL. I think the Cowboys trying not to pay him was the dumbest thing possible. He's been a top five quarterback for years. I think he's just unbelievable. I think pre-snap, like outside of Brady, I don't know that there's anybody as sharp as he is. Like he handles so much. He handles all the protection stuff. He's incredible at understanding like where leverage is.

He's the reason that they can go to as much drop back as they can. Like he just, he can do everything, man. Like I is he's the reason that they can go to as much drop back as they can um like he just he can do everything man like I think he's he's incredible he can throw to all three levels of the field um he oddly will have like one or two throws in the one to ten yard area that just like hit the dirt for no reason like that's like his one really weird blemish I don't know why he continues to do that um but I think otherwise he's just incredibly accurate and I think why he is so good and like i know um seth galena has kind of talked about this on his show a lot but like their offense can be like three different offenses because of the way that he can function they can be this like empty spread everybody out because he can read everything they can go into um tighter

formations a little bit and get into like true you know like under center play action stuff they can go to gun and play action they can go to gun and drop back they can do literally anything because he can make every throw on the field he can get to his backside if he needs to like he can do all the full full field read progressions like you don't have to you don't have to just roll him out to make sure that he's making all the right throws and stuff like he just everything is on on the board for him and like he's probably the best passer from the pocket in the NFL except for again maybe Brady and he's still good enough outside the pocket that you know he's not like Pete Mahomes or Allen or whatever but like he's still really really good outside the pocket it's

just that he's made such a concerted effort and done such a good job at being a inside the pocket passer that we don't really think of him as a playmaker, even though he's still one of the best at that, too. So I just think he's been incredible. And to your point, like they've surrounded him with just unreal talent at every position, really. And even the offensive line is not 2016 levels, but it's pretty damn good. Yeah, I was thinking about this, too, because when Mike McCarthy got there, it was natural to go. Oh, no. What did you just do? The guy who ruined Rogers, which, you know, maybe part of it was their roster falling apart too in green Bay. But Kellen Moore seems to know what he's doing.

Give me your, your kind of feeling on him because it's so funny every week. I'll run across something of somebody calling joe brady a genius in carolina and talking about how oh he's a head coach candidate can't wait till joe brady's the head coach and i'll go what why i don't understand what what is happening kellen moore on the other hand i look at his offense as having open receivers for dak prescott a lot and like you said having a lot of different layers to it. And he's a guy that I think people should be talking about as a future head coach and not so much Sam Darnold's offensive coordinator.

I mean, I agree. Like I just said that like the, the reason they can get to four different offenses is because of Dak and because of the talent that they have. But like you still have to have a guy who can put it together and make sure that it works together and it functions together and I think Moore has has generally done that I think when he first took over play calling duties last year or two years ago or whatever it was he did a really good job early on of like

doing a lot of shifts and motions and giving Dak Prescott a lot of, because the thing is like shifts and motion stuff to me can be kind of overrated. You need a quarterback who is smart enough to understand where the moving pieces are going, but Dak is obviously that. And I think for whatever reason, after Kellen Moore's first couple of games when he took over a while ago, they had gotten away from that and gotten more static. But this year I think they've done a really good job at getting back to that.

Maybe part of that is they just feel like their tight end group is a little bit more versatile than it used to be. I know it's the same guys that they used to have, but they're healthier now. And I think Dalton Schultz in particular looks better than he had before. So they've been comfortable moving those guys around. CeeDee Lamb obviously has another year in the system. That's going to help. Like Tony Pollard, another year in the system.

They've done a really good job of splitting him out wide as a receiver a little bit so like i think he knows that they have all of these moving pieces um and he's just done such a good job being able to move them all around and that is obviously a smart enough guy to understand all that so i think more just the fact that he can make these two or three completely different styles of offenses still flow together um especially the way they tie their run game to the play action game man it's really incredible like there was a sequence against the chargers in the first quarter um that actually ends up throwing a pick on the play action because uh uh who was it i think asante samuel just makes like an insane

play on the ball but like the way that they got to that and it was open um before samuel made a crazy play i mean just the way that they can sequence stuff is really incredible so I think Morris definitely better than Brady at this point I think Brady's still good in his handcuff by an idiot quarterback I think Morris definitely the guy who should be getting uh head coaching stuff folks football season is in full swing but we've got basketball and hockey getting rolling as well and soda stick has got you covered you have to see the Moose t-shirt designs for Marcus Foligno. You could also get your hands on the very popular Dollar Bill Kirill shirts as well.

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Go to SodaStick.com. That is S-O-T-A-S-T-I-C-K. Check that out today. Use the promo code Purple purple insider for free shipping and also follow myself and soda stick on twitter for our giveaways uh yeah i'm not convinced that joe brady was much more than jamar chase justin jefferson joe burrow but you know i guess you're right it's's hard to find out when you have Sam Darnold just being super bad and his receivers don't like to catch the ball either.

But to your point, doesn't it feel like and tell me if you disagree that Sean McVay and Kyle Shanahan start running the Gary stuff and the Shanahan, the Mike Shanahan stuff, and they start really whipping people with it. And then everybody starts to pick it up. So, okay. It's in Tennessee. It's in Minnesota that Minnesota brings in Gary. Now it's in Cleveland was the fanski. And so it's kind of spreading all over, but I was looking at even Cleveland's offense and they're mixing power runs with outside zone runs. And they're mixing short stuff and screens with deep stuff. And it seems like every one of the best schemes there's no real label that you

can slap on it anymore it's like it's almost remember how they used to talk about with belichick where he didn't really have a scheme it was just every week how he would play to the other team's strength and try to stop them it feels like the best offenses in the league are doing that and then there is this other form of offense in the league that just stinks and everyone can stop it. And it's the sort of this, a team that feels like, oh, we need to be our identity. At least that's how I felt watching the NFL this year. It seems like there's just been a step forward schematically in the NFL. I think it's kind of been like, not a long time coming, but a few years coming. Like when we, everyone, everyone knows this, but if you go back to like the bears game in, I think 2019 with the Rams, like when they really

started like getting five and six guys on the line of scrimmage and they were just not going to let you play outside zone, like they just weren't going to give you that. Cause the way to beat outside zone is to just get everybody in one of the gaps immediately. Because the way, the reason that outside zone works is that if you're playing like a typical four down front where there's um bubbles and a couple of the gaps like naturally when you're getting some of those double teams like something's going to to pop open in one of those bubbles that's just the way um that outside zone is designed to work um you're kind of playing to what how the defensive line is going to play you well if they're putting a guy in every gap what's supposed to come open nothing like you're just hoping that your guard just kills a guy that's really all that you're hoping for and

that's not a sustainable business model um in the nfl it might be fine if you're alabama playing against um you know kansas or whatever the hell like but in the nfl it's just not a sustainable business model and so i think a lot of these teams that were even known for doing a lot of outside zone stuff where there's kyle shanahan um Sean McVay, even now with the Cowboys, with Kellen Moore, like they're doing a lot better job of mixing in gap runs and stuff like that, whether it's, you know, some teams prefer duo, where you're just getting immediate double teams, some teams prefer power, counter, whatever it is, they're just doing a lot better jobs to make sure they're getting immediate double teams that push guys up the field. And I think that that's why you're seeing some of these things work the way that

they are. Because if you're going to go to, especially what these teams are doing now with three down fronts, where you're seeing a lot more like typical three, four, where you're going to have five guys directly on the line of scrimmage, like the way to beat that is to just take that, you know, five sec or four or three, whatever they're playing is to just immediately get a garden, a tackle on him and just push him out of the play and have a fullback or tight end or whatever sprint into that gap and lead block. So I think that's why you're kind of seeing this evolution the way that it is. And to your point,

the offenses that are stuck behind are the ones that are still stuck trying to, Oh, we just, you know, two years ago, we saw everybody was doing outside zone. So we're going to keep just doing outside zone. It's like the lead changes, man. Like it can change very fast and you've got to keep up. And I also think the teams are smarter about when they run and how, and what they use their running game for that. Okay. If you're, you know, up 14 and you're trying to grind the clock out, then, you know, that's when you want to use it. Or if it's second and short to get yourself a first down, then use it. But I just, when I look at the expected points added from the running game from even five years ago to now, I see teams just

doing it more efficiently, gaining much more expected points out of when they run the ball and then how they tie that together to their play actions and create deep shots down the field. I mean, that was sort of the McVay and Shanahan thing is tie those two things together. But now they're being tied not just on are we running an outside zone or not, but all sorts of different looks, formations, motions of, oh, that was my key this week if I'm a linebacker. And, oh, my God, that's not what's happening. And I also feel like this is why Eric Hendricks is so good and so valuable, because there are five linebackers in the league who can deal with all this stuff. What was it? The pick he had against like the lions or something like that.

Or I don't know if he's the one who picked the ball, but like, yes, he had a ridiculous play where he jumped into like an RPO window, which is obviously like not the same as play action, but it was just like, dude, that's why this is a mini like side rant. But like, this is why I hate the devaluation of linebackers because if you have one of those guys the entire nfl passing game now is designed to beat linebackers so if you have a guy who cannot be beaten as easily that's pretty dang valuable man like it's really nice to have one of those guys it changes like structurally what you're allowed to get away with on defense yeah and last year uh with kend's, they were sort of hanging on, on defense. As soon as he got hurt, they started giving up like 50 points. That's, that's his value. And, and I, I mean, I've seen him do it. I don't know how many times,

but the interesting little wrinkle to that was he said that he intentionally crouched down. So he thought, cause he's already kind of short that he thought that golf like wouldn't be able to kind of spot him where, where his read was taking him. So even there's like little things that he does beyond that. And then he makes a one-handed interception. I mean, he's an incredible, incredible player. Let me ask you before we wrap up just about the quarterback play in the league with some of these young guys. I've enjoyed watching Mac Jones play. Cause he looks like an NFL quarterback right away. Like, wow. Okay. Making reads and delivering the ball on time. And also a fearlessness to Mac Jones that I really like. And I tend to look at a lot of things that go for young quarterbacks that go beyond statistics, PFF grades, whatever.

Joe Burrow, for example, last last year getting whipped in in games just offensive lines horrible not even sure their scheme's any good and that dude just kept coming back and coming back and coming back did not see that from justin fields have not seen that from justin fields haven't seen it from zach wilson really i i wonder what you think about judging the young quarterback class even just beyond like the numbers they've put up because i after what i saw about justin fields on sunday i was like legitimately concerned you shouldn't look like you're giving up at the end of a game when you're losing to tom brady you just you have to keep fighting right and it just looked like he had completely said somebody take

me out of this football game and i thought man i don't know I just don't know if that's gonna play um so give give me your kind of feeling on on that I mean with Fields like we saw him beat Clemson with like a broken rib so like I I don't think that this is like a thing that I don't think it's like an entirely that he's like not a fighter or whatever I also think like a lot of these guys have bad offensive line but uh I think next gen stats tweeted something that like the Bears are giving up the highest like probability of pressure like per like whenever you're at like 2.5 seconds in the pocket or whatever they are the most they're the highest probability of giving up a pressure which doesn't have anything to do with fields that's just their offensive line sucks that bad so I do think it was a little

bit concerning that he kind of checked out a little bit um but I don't know it's like his fifth start so I wasn't and it was against the Todd Bulls defense like it was just a horrible situation for him he has not looked particularly great though he's had like moments against um the Lions and the Raiders where he looked okay. He looks honestly really good on a lot of their play action stuff, but his drop back game has been pretty suspect, which is partly the offensive line, but also partly like we knew coming out of college, even for as much as I liked him, like the drop back one to 10 yard area was just not typically where he shined.

Not that I thought he was horrible at it coming out of college, but that's probably where he was going to have his roughest, like, come to Jesus moments in the NFL. And we've seen that. Like, that's been the case. And so I think it's just kind of a mix of him of being in a really bad offensive line situation for a guy who likes to hold on to the ball. Hopefully they can fix it. Hopefully they get their, you know, their tackle back that they had. So I don't know.

Pretty rough situation for him. Zach Wilson. I mean, Zach Wilson has just not looked very good either. Yeah, he has. Zach Wilson, to his credit, has like two or three insane plays outside of the pocket again, which is obviously what we expected. It's just that everything else has been horrific. I think it's got to be a pick and choose when it's who to sit and who not to sit.

And Zach Wilson was a guy, an obvious, you should sit him. I don't know that Justin Fields was an obvious one, but. Honestly, I've said this before. And like, the reality is just that these guys are going to play because GMs are playing for their, their, their job security. And they want to prove like, no, this guy is totally worth the pay, blah, blah, blah. And they can't maybe waste a year of having a guy on a bench because they might get fired in that year but like I would argue 90 percent of quarterbacks should sit like Mac Jones maybe

uh Mac Jones obviously has been good enough that it seems like he doesn't need to be but we kind of knew that coming out of college he was a guy who was really smart really accurate really tough in the pocket so it kind of makes sense that he had a lot of the high floor stuff that would be conducive to him being competent early on. And then obviously Trevor Lawrence, like he's the prince who was promised he was obviously going to be fine. But I think for all the other guys like Lance in particular, like they just were probably going to it probably would have been nice to see them sit a year, even if they maybe could play year one and still be fine down the road. It would probably have been nice for them to sit. Like that's just the reality, I think, for most quarterbacks. And with fields, I mean, it's just time to fire their coach and general

manager. I mean, how, how do you bring in a quarterback who's known for holding onto the ball too long? And you say, we're going to get rid of offensive linemen. Like this is our plan, right? Like it's like the opposite of it just structurally just didn't make any sense with them. And then especially even they've been better about it. And they've been better about their game planning over the past few weeks now that Bill Lazor has taken over. But like that first start where they was just like all gone, it was all empty. It was all like spread everything out.

It's like, do you think you drafted Mac Jones? Like what, like, what are you like? This is not, this doesn't make any sense. He seems to me like if he, if he gets through this, cause I guess that's where I was going with it. It's like, I'm, I'm concerned that they're just beating them down. And I think we've seen this before where quarterbacks entirely lose confidence in what they're doing. I think that's a real thing. He struck me as a guy who could be like a faster Ryan Tannehill where he runs bootlegs and throws it down the field when you give him time and could be incredibly accurate deep. And I don't understand why Matt Nagy last year used bootlegs with Mitch Trubisky.

And it actually worked and he played somewhat competent football and then said, no, no no no no back to my back to my shotgun stuff like i don't understand it it just doesn't make any sense with the guy that they drafted to your point like it's just i don't know man i don't i really don't understand what the plan for them was and then i don't know if you saw this you might have there was a thing on twitter where like i think it was fields's first interception he threw a bad bad ball. Like, it was a bad ball, like whatever. I think he was like, he kind of scrambled and threw one to Allen Robinson. He kind of threw it behind him.

It was not a very good ball. Probably should have been picked the way that it was. But I think what the tweet said was like one of the B writers said that the coaches had told him in his headset that he had a free play. And so, of course, Fields is just going to be like, I can do whatever I want. And then he throws it and it's a pick and it that he had a free play. And so, of course, Fields is just going to be like, I can do whatever I want. And then he throws it and it's a pick and it's not actually a free play. It's just like, what is he supposed to do?

If you're a rookie and your fourth start or whatever, fifth start, and your coach tells you you have a free play, you're going to go do something crazy. Of course you are. Aaron Rodgers does the same thing. It's just a bad situation there. It is not. Of course you are. Aaron Rodgers does the same thing. Like, it's just a bad situation there. It's not.

The Vikings will find some way to lose to Andy Dalton in December at Soldier Field, though. It will happen. So, at QBKLASS on Twitter, one of the best Twitter names. Football Outsiders, doing things for Bleacher Report as well. Always one of my favorite guests. Derek, thank you for coming on, sir. I appreciate your time.

It's always fun, man. I'm glad to be here. It's always a blast.