Purple Insider - a Minnesota Vikings and NFL podcast - Former Viking Jeremiah Sirles breaks down how the Vikings will look in the trenches in 2020

Episode Date: August 27, 2020

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Matthew Collard here along with former Minnesota Vikings offensive lineman Jeremiah Searles. He's covered in sweat. He's still staying in shape. What's up, Jeremiah? What's up, guys? Thanks for having me back on. Yeah, I still got to get this weight off, man. I'm down to about 280.

I got another 10 pounds to go. Okay, you're not quite Joe Thomas area yet. I mean, he's like a totally different human being. Oh, he's like, dude, have you seen Marshall Yonda? Oh, I haven't. Is he doing the same thing? He looks like 220 pounds. He looks like he's never played a snap football before in his life.

It's crazy. That is insane. Okay, explain to me then, were you a guy that just the weight was on naturally and you didn't have to, like, eat six burritos a day? Because we were talking to Ezra Cleveland about, like, putting on the weight and eating, you know, off the secret menu at Chipotle and stuff. But you were just a naturally huge guy? So, I mean, my average, I think my body sits really well at about 275. off the secret menu at Chipotle and stuff, but you were just a naturally huge guy?

So, I mean, my average, I think my body sits really well at about 275. So I kind of would be there. I'd eat a lot to stay above 300 quite a bit, especially during season. Like when I was rolling during season, I mean, I'd be 305, 310. I'd try to come into camp at like 318 just so I could play at like 310 because I knew I'd lose all that weight. But I'd eat – I mean. But I had to eat. I mean, there was definitely nights before weigh-ins where I was shoving my face full of food just to stay above 300 pounds

because Toronto used to get real pissed. So what did you have to eat? I mean, I'm thinking like even for myself, a Thanksgiving dinner, I can't even move the next day. So is there something that like was your go-to, I have to weigh over 300 pounds? I mean, as terrible as it's going to sound, it is crappy food it is. So I'd come home on Thursday night, it's going to be Friday, and my wife would make dinner or whatever it would be.

And then usually about 9 o'clock I'd order two big hamburgers from Five Guys and hammer those down in the mornings before weigh-in, drink a bunch of water, pancakes, like waffles, some type of carb, and then just blow it up, get on the scale, and then just hate yourself for about the next 24 hours. And then usually you get down to where you need to be to play half per Sunday. You know what, though? Two five-guys burgers can go down pretty easy. I mean, delicious.

I don't know. Like I don't have burger rankings or fight over burgers. You know, it's pizza and wings that are my area of expertise. But I think Five Guys has a very solid burger for that kind of place. Oh, if you're going fast casual, dude, Five Guys is the only way to go. And feel free to advertise on the podcast, Five Guys. Absolutely. Aside from eating habits, Jeremiah, one of the reasons I wanted to catch up with you,

as always, you bring great insight to whatever part of the game we're talking about. But the Ezra Cleveland issue is specifically really interesting to me because he comes out of college as a left tackle, and he immediately is moved inside to guard. But he's been mostly on the second and then even recently on the third team at practice. So he isn't really competing, at least at this moment, for the spot of left guard to start. And I wonder if you could explain, as a guy who could play every position on the offensive line, how difficult that transition is from tackle to guard when you're just coming out of college.

Yeah, I mean, so the transition just from college to the NFL as an offensive lineman is crazy, right? I mean, the speed of the game, the athletes you're facing each and every week, the strength, the speed, like it's all just your spin. And to throw a position change on top of that, like a true, not just like, hey, we're going to try you out here, like a true position change is something that's really hard. People understand like the timing is what's the biggest thing. So if you're a tackle, for instance, you have a little bit of space, right?

You've got some time. You've got at least a second, maybe a second and a half, sometimes before you're making contact with the guy versus a guard. I mean, it's almost immediate. And for a lot of guys, like the timing is really hard for them to pick up because the game is already so much faster than what they were used to in college. And then you throw on the input inside where everything's more compact, everything's tighter, everything happens in a smaller window it's really hard for some guys

to really make that transition of patience to you still have to be patient you can't lunge at guys and do all that stuff but there's a there's a patience and an aggressiveness like perfect tandem of a world that you can find as a guard that it takes time it does and to go against guys each and every day at that position is the only way to do it. There's no secret recipe of how to get that timing. I mean, it really cranks us up even more in a game. And with no preseason games, man, that's going to be really hard for these young cats. Now, does playing guard help you become a better tackle?

Because you were tackling college, right? No, it doesn't. Not at all. Okay. All right. Because that was sort of what I was thinking is like, well, at least you get some experience going up against NFL guys and maybe things slow down when you go back to tackle. Here's how it works.

You can't play tackle. You play guard. You can't play guard. You play center. You can't play center. You sit your butt at home like me. You can always move in. You don't see many guys move out.

Okay, that makes a lot of sense. At least, you know, back when you were pounding burgers, you could play. Right, right. Just not at this particular moment. Not at this moment. Not unless you want to get on the Alex Boone plan and start eating 11 eggs every morning or something. I mean, is he still trying to make a comeback?

He is, yeah. I talked to him the other day. He's still going after it. And now that they can do workouts and stuff, he's hoping to get at least a tryout to show them what he can do. And he put on Instagram him doing like a crazy box jump. Yeah, that was pretty impressive. Yeah.

Yeah. I mean, Boone is always a natural, I mean, heck of an athlete. So, I mean, I think he'll get a shot. If there was a year to do it, this is the one because you're going to need guys that are proven because you're going to really hesitate to throw young guys that haven't been battle tested out there. You need vets that can prove that they've played before which is why i was like i retired when you're too early yeah that's right uh but i'm sure your body is not

oh loving it loving it exactly so um now just back to the the difference between guard and tackle um so it's not going to help him when he goes back out to tackle if that ever happens. Are there things that he can learn from playing guard that just at least in this camp he can get some experience? Yeah, I mean, I think you learn how to become more aggressive in the running game as a guard because you have to. Again, the spatial awareness, right? So, I mean, if you're going against a really tight three technique or a really heavy nose that's literally, I mean, a foot away from you, like you could reach out and touch him, you have to learn how to be more powerful quicker.

You can't get your two or three steps in the ground before you're making contact on a DN. You have to be, like, right off the get. How do you transition your weight from left to right or right to left and straight up from the ground? I mean, you don't have time to cock your hands and come forward. Like, it's from the ground straight to the body. And for a lot of guys, you just have to learn how to transfer power quicker.

So, I mean, that will always be a good thing. That's good at whatever position you play at. The faster you can transfer power from the ground into your defender, that's a great thing. So that's – I think he'll become more of a real great run blocker if he learns and he works at it that way. And then the other piece is learning how to pull. You don't pull a ton as a tackle, especially in QBX offense up there.

There's just not a ton of it. But you're always going to have power. You're always going to have those G schemes where the guard's getting out in space. Just learning how to get out in space and cut or learn how to come out of your hips while you're running full speed. Those are all just good skills for offensive linemen that you don't get a ton of work at when you're a tackle, but you'll get work at it when you're a guard.

Is it just me or have the interior defensive tackles, I mean especially the three techniques, become almost like defensive ends in terms of getting a little smaller, getting a lot faster? I feel like when I was growing up, Jeremiah, there was like three guys who could rush the passer from that position and now there's 30 guys in the NFL. And then think about what the Vikings did last year, rotating defensive ends in over the guards. There's a lot more problems for guards than there used to be, I think. Absolutely. I mean, I used to think being singled up as a tackle like away from the slide was the

hardest position for a pass blocking person. And I, after playing them all, I mean, the hardest is going to get sort of really, really talented fast rushing three technique as a singled up guard. Because again, the space isn't there. If you miss and you miss quick, it's over. At tackle, at least if you miss, there's probably a chance you get the ball off because he's got to run the hoop. You're singled up on a guard

and you know you're singled up. That guy knows you're singled up. You have to make sure you get in that way. Like you said, you're seeing the Aaron Donalds, the Grady Jarrett's. These guys that are just quick twitch pass rushing machines and the difference is now those guys aren't just strictly pass rushers like those are powerful dudes they used to be like okay i know this dude's gonna run around me so i'm just gonna step back off the ball give myself some space and and go but now all of a sudden these dudes can put their foot in the ground and come through your

chest too um and i think that's what makes these three techniques so difficult and it's becoming the new normal in the NFL, finding a true pass rushing three technique where you can have a three headed monster almost and a three technique and two unbelievable DMs. It gives teams problems. Yeah. And we've seen those problems right up close and personal with the Vikings interior of their offensive line.

So if Ezra Cleveland does not start, that would have been really intriguing because he is a freak athlete. And just to see how that went, but I'm not sure when we'll see it, if we'll see it this year. Instead, it's been Avion Collins, who you know, and Dakota Dozier, who's kind of a guy like yourself who can play a lot of different positions, very smart player. But it's hard to feel like, Jeremiah, that the left and right guard positions

have changed a whole lot. player, but it's hard to feel like, Jeremiah, that the left and right guard positions have changed a whole lot. Over the last couple years, it's been one of their biggest Achilles heel, and with Dozier, he's more of a journeyman type of guy. Collins is moving from tackle to guard, and then you move Pat Elfline, who struggled at left guard over to right guard, his third different position in three years. It's just, it's a lot of the same here. And I wonder if they should have maybe taken a different route this offseason at that position. Yeah, I don't know.

I was a little surprised when they didn't sign a big pre-agent guard. I know they don't have any money, so that's part of the issue. I mean, when you run out of cap space because you're paying your quarterback a ton and you're paying your defense a ton, like, a position is going to suffer. It's just the way the NFL is built. And so I think that, unfortunately for the Vikings, quarterback a ton and you're paying your defense a ton like a position is going to suffer um it's just the way the NFL is built um and so I think that unfortunately for the Vikings it's the guard position I mean you spend a first round pick on your center so you know that's solid um you got

an unbelievable I mean one of the top right tackles in the league and Brian O'Neill on the right side and you got Riley Reif who's having the last year of his deal so you have to start thinking about the future of all right we're going to pay a guard this year are we going to save money to pay a big the future of, are we going to pay a guard this year? Are we going to save money to pay a big left tackle next year? Are we going to replay Riley? Or what are we going to do? And so I think that you draft a guy like Ezra and hope for next year we can groom him to be the starting guard because we're going to have to go

buy a left tackle. Or you hope F-line can figure it out and put him in right guard and hope he can be serviceable there. But, again, that's a hard thing to do for those guys to move positions as much. I mean, especially a young player like Pat, I mean, to start at three different positions in four years is hard. Having played yourself next to some good centers and some very smart centers, Joe Berger, a real smart guy that you've been next to.

So take me through what an experienced center would be seeing as opposed to a rookie center, because that's Garrett Bradbury now after a year of experience and many times getting whooped. Um, you know, I, I did a kind of a film piece on him and of course I don't have as good of an eye as you would, but there's some things that you can take away of just, these are, he's going to have to improve the technical element, but I think that having that experience in a full offseason has to help Garrett Bradbury. Oh, absolutely.

I mean, you'll see a big jump in him this year. At least you should. I think one of the reasons Pat didn't take the big jump into his second year is because he had no offseason. He was dealing with a broken ankle and a torn shoulder. So, I mean, he didn't have an OTA, so he didn't really have much of a training camp. And so, I mean, he didn't have his OTA. Garrett didn't have O have much of a training camp. And so, I mean, he didn't have his OTA. Garrett didn't have OTAs, but he's got a full training camp under his belt now.

And the big thing for centers is that the game has to slow down for them mentally in order for them to perform physically. You can't walk up to the ball as a center and start thinking about, okay, I've got to make sure the snap's right, where's the mic point, where's my foot alignment, da-da-da, set, hut. Like, you know what I mean? Like, it has to become so natural that you know the offense, you know what you're looking for, that you walk up, hey, Mike's 52.

This play's on one. We're going left. Bam. And now you can worry about stopping the freak show across from you. And so I think that that's a big piece of it, is if he can really take the next step mentally, he's physically got all the tools. I mean, watching him, he's athletic.

He's strong. Plays with a great base. He's got good hands. But where he got himself in trouble, as you watching him, he's athletic, he's strong, plays with a great base, he's got good hands. But where he got himself in trouble, as you can tell, he was thinking before he was reacting. I mean, offensive line, you should know where you're going 100% of the time. It's one of the benefits we have. But you have to then react to what the defenders do.

And I think at times he was so busy trying to guess where everything was that maybe he wasn't 100% certain on things because he was a young player, but that then made him suffer physically. So I think that this year if he can really understand the mental aspect, safeties, identifying defense, identifying rotations, and then having a guy like Kirk help him with some of that stuff, I think he's going to take a big jump this year for sure. Get back to the conversation in just a minute,

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Okay, I would love to have you, because this is a football-y football show, explain when you get up to the line of scrimmages on an offensive line and what you're looking at in terms of rating a defense. Like you mentioned the mic point, which goes back again to my buddy Alex Boone, who said, if that center doesn't have a great mic point, then I don't believe in him. Right. What? But kind of explain what you're trying to identify.

Yeah, so I'll take you from the center position because I got to play that position. So you're in the huddle, right? You hear the formation. You listen for three things as a center. You listen for the formation that the play caller is going to call because then that's going to tell you where the strength of the defense is going to be as on paper. So you listen for the formation that the play caller is going to call, because then that's going to tell you where the strength of the defense is going to be as on paper. So you listen to the formation, you listen for them to play, whether it's protection or run, and then you listen for the snap count.

Those are your three things. Bam. So you insert, like, okay, say it's trips right, 62, onward. Bam. And there's a bunch of other jargon in there for route combinations, whatever. That's all in one ear, out the other. So as the second you break the huddle, you go, all right,

so it's trips right, which immediately makes you think, okay, the mic points can be to our right because that's where the strength of the formation is. So you walk up to the line, you identify three down or four down. It's the first thing you identify. Is it four down linemen or is it three down linemen? Because that will change again what the linebacker says. Say it's four down linemen. All right, four down front.

So that means it's going to go Will, Mike, Sam. Will linebacker, Mike linebacker, Sam linebacker, two straight. So they say, hey, boom, Mike's right there. And after that is when you start hearing the echo of everyone else start making their calls. Say it's a pass protection. You say, hey, Mike's right there. Then the right guard, the right tackle is saying, all right,

we're now working from this guy to this guy, depending on the protection scheme. The left side is then saying, all right, hey, we're locked up one-on-one. We have no slide because they're sliding at the moment. And so that's going to be if it's three down, you're like, hey, Mike might be backside now because of the way of formation, and then everyone echoes their call. So it really comes up in, I mean, again, all this is happening like that, right? I mean, it's all happening within seconds.

I mean, coming up and identifying, which is why as a center, you have to be so quick on your calls because play clock's running down, quarterback might be wanting to check to a whole different play, and so you've got to make sure that you can do all that. So it's initial, boom, four down, three down front, bam, where's the mic point, bam, echo the rest of the calls to make sure all five guys are on the same page because the one great thing about offensive line is if you're all wrong, you'll probably be all right.

The problem then becomes if you've got three guys doing one thing, two guys doing another thing, and it just looks like, I mean, a heaping flame of garbage, right? So I think that the big thing is, like, again, Grant guys doing another thing, and it just looks like, I mean, a heaping flame of garbage, right? So I think that the big thing is, like, again, Grant Bradbury comes up, identifies the front, identifies the mic, bam, everyone can make the calls off of that. And that really comes along when you have guys that play together for a long time. So that's going to be another piece of, you got moving parts, you got new pieces, like, how do those guys all work together to identify that so it's a very I mean well-oiled

machine you don't have clunks and junks and trying to figure out different pieces all right so let's say you're up there you're identifying the mic and then Harrison Smith comes walking up what's he what's he doing like nobody knows what he's doing because no one ever knows what he's doing but how does that change and also um like is do you just treat the nickel corner like a linebacker is that how you usually do it yeah it depends on so i mean if you know during your film study during the week okay so if we're playing 12 personnel so one back two tight ends does this defense play base defense with three true linebackers do they play nickel defense with two linebackers and a nickel sand like you said like a corner or do they treat like for example

when you were at Buffalo, Jamal Adams, very similar. He played for the Jets at the time. Very similar. He's all over the place, right? You know he's a known blitzer, so you're going to identify him. Same thing when you play the Vikings. You know Harrison Smith is a known blitzer.

You're going to identify him. You're not just going to be like, ah, he's doing his own thing. You've got to plan for those kind of guys. So, yeah, if all of a sudden, say they're in nickel defense, you've got your Mike and your Will and your nickel Sam standing out there, and all of a sudden Harrison Smith starts working down to the weak side, well, okay, so he's probably a known blitzer, which means that the blitz is coming from the weak side.

So then, like, you know they have to cover for the blitz. Everyone's got to rotate away, which is what I talk about, like, safety rotation. So say you see Harrison Smith sneaking down on your left, sticking with the trips right example. You see Harrison Smith sneaking down to your left, well, that trips right example. You see Harrison Smith sneaking down to your left. Well, that means that Anthony Harris is probably going to start moving back to the middle of the field to cover for him, which then means, okay, if they're blitzing that way, let's pick it up.

Hey, hey, new Mike. Boom, point to the left. So new Mike's to the left. New Mike's 54. It's 10 drinks. Bam, new Mike, new Mike, or it's 55. And then you're going to slide to the blitz and hopefully pick up the blitz. Well, that then now changes the calls on the right.

They now say, hey, no slide. We're money over here. It's not talking to guys on the left like, hey, we now have three of us to pick up three linebackers. They bring four. The back then has to see new points. It now changes where he goes. And so all that's happening up front.

It's all happening again, bam, bam, bam. But as a center, you're either told like,, hey, you have the new Mike Boyd, or it's all on the quarterback. And I've been places that have been both. A lot of it's how much trust you have in your center to see it. I got to play with Ryan Khalil in Carolina. He had all that on his plate because he wanted it. I got to play with Joe Berger.

He wanted it. Pat Eslein had myself, Joe Berger, and Nick Easton next to him so we could help him and we could have it. But at the end of the day, the quarterback has ultimate trump. I mean, I got to play with Phillip Rivers, who in San Diego, like we make our job, you make the initial mic point and then Phillip's going to change it prompt. So a lot of that all just depends on who's the quarterback, who's the coordinator, who's the center, and how does all that work. So when Harrison comes up on the weak side and looks like he might rush and

you change the mic and then you're assuming Harris is going to take a sort of middle close type of single high look. And then that changes after the snap. Like how much does that mess with you? I mean, it messes with you, but at that point you live with it, right? You made a call to the all wrong, all right thing. So say they fool you, right? And they bring the blitz off the other side.

The great part is depending on the protection, I'm doing a mic-based protection just for ease sake. There's a billion protections we can walk through. But say it's a mic-based protection, the center slides left, they bring it from the right, the back has to go pick up the guy. If they bring one more than we can, then you've got to throw high. And that's where everyone on the same page. So, yeah, they can definitely get you,

but that's when we would spend hours on film study of blitz pickup i mean we'd be in there for on wednesday mornings thursday mornings thursday night all day third down especially third down stuff like you spend hours studying it because the big plays are made when you punch blitz in the face i mean if you see the blitz and you can punch in the face there's going to be holes because there's for a guy and so i mean you take a lot of pride and we took a lot of pride and we were there in minnesota we're going to pick up all these blitzes like and i can i distinctly remember we were playing baltimore in 2017 and we're playing left guard and we worked on this one blitz that was it was just it was a bitch there's no other way to say it like it was just one of those that was like

this is a hard one but we knew like if we, hey, if we pick this up, like, and we knew the formation, like, there's going to be a huge play possible to the ceiling down the middle. And so I was playing left guard. I remember, like, it was on double cadence. So we go, hut, hut, hut. And we look up, and literally, like, all of our eyes just, like, bing. And we all turn around, like, dude, Case, this is it. Like, this is so fun.

So Case, like, audible to play, bam, bam, bam, bam. And hut, and we bam. We pick it up in the face. Huge chunk play. And, like, you see all the offensive bam, bam, bam, and putt, and we, bam, we pick it up in the face, huge chunk play. And, like, you see all the offensive line high-fiving down, like, girl. And that's what's so fun about it is just the chess match between the offensive line and the defensive coordinator of can we pick up this blitz and hit it in the face.

And when you do, it's so much – it's so rewarding. Like, that's like me scoring a touchdown as an offensive lineman. When you recognize a blitz, you identify it, you make the right call, you hit it in the face, and, like, you execute it, like that's scoring a touchdown for an offensive lineman. There's another part of that that comes from a reporter perspective when things go really right or really wrong, and a lot of times you try to figure out why, but you don't always know.

And defensive linemen after games are like, I don't know, I just, you know, just doing my job. You're like, come on, tell me what happened. But I guess you have to wait three years for the offensive lineman to tell you what happened. For me, it's hard, too, because as an offensive lineman, you can only see one thing at a time, right? And so you can actually watch the tape and see what happened.

Like, you either know good play or bad play. Like, it's really not as simple as, hey, did it work? But, like, when you turn around and you know that, like, you hit the big play, you're like,'s that's really it's not as simple like today did it work but like when you turn around you know that like you hit the big play you're like okay we did it right or like if the vice versa i've been there many times playing center where like you identify a new mic band and you see the guy drop on your left you're like oh throw it throw it and then you know they're coming and you know you've got one more than you do and hopefully he gets rid of it and you're like survive or bam sack sack fumble, sack, sack, fumble. You're just like, shoot, man, like, that's the one that kills you. And so it's such a definite cat and mouse game,

and the good D coordinators, man, they really know how to bluff it and having safeties like Harrison. I mean, Eric Weddle back in the day when he was incredible at it. I mean, Earl Thomas is great, Jamal Adams. Like, having that rover safety is becoming the cool thing to do in the NFL because you can do so much with them. Yeah, I was going to ask you about, you know, you talk about different defensive coordinators who are creative with this stuff. Dom Capers is here now, and I think we're all trying to get Dom

Capers to tell us what he's going to do with his blitzing, but you know, yeah, he's been around way too long to give up any information. I'm sure the Packers have a pretty good sense for it anyway, but you've gone against those types of defenses before, and he's famous for zone blitzing and things like that. How difficult is that with what Dom Capers brings, and what maybe specifically is sort of a staple of when you go up against his defense? Yeah, I mean, the one thing you knew going up against him is he was going to have what's called, we used to call it the blitz of the week, which is something that you don't see. So you break down tendencies as far as Blitzes are.

You get your third down sheet, like, okay, when it's third in this distance, this is the Blitzes that they've ran all year, right? I mean, by the end of the year, you're like, they've ran this Blitz 40 times, 20 times, 10 times. It's like, okay, well, what are they going to throw at us that we haven't seen on the first third long? Because that's usually when you see it, like the Blitz of the week, the flavor of the day, or whatever. There's a hundred different things. And he always had something a little different for you where you're like,

okay, I haven't seen this before, but, like, trust your rules, trust what we set up. I mean, Sperano was incredible. He'd go back, I mean, years. He'd be like, hey, they ran this Blitz in 2013 when we were playing against Dallas. It's like, wow, how did you find that? And then, I mean,

I'd be amazed to tell you how many times we'd watch one of them and be like, okay, Tony. And then all of a sudden it'd pop up on Sunday like, all right, Tony. But that happens time and time again. You have to find the oddball stuff because those are the ones that happen to be the sack fumbles or the force of interception

or the really negative play where it's third and you gotta have it and they dial this up and you don't see it you don't recognize it and someone doesn't do something there and it gets bad so when you definitely are going to have the blitz of the week but then you're going to have his staples too you know he's a stone blitz guys you know you're going to have to prepare for those things but he's going to be a guy that he'll keep you on your toes and make sure that you're never just going to be able to game plan them up and get the goal. Yeah, it points to also something my buddy Sage Rosenfels has said before. He said the one guy who doesn't get enough credit ever in the NFL is the offensive line coach.

If you've got a good one, then you're probably going to be a pretty good team. Absolutely. So the quarterbacks recognize that too, if you were wondering. So I want to ask you about the defensive side of the ball with Michael Pierce opting out. You know, obviously that was a kick in the gut for them because it was, you know, what's interesting, I looked at how often he either created a quarterback pressure or made a run stop per snap. And it was up there with a lot of the best. I mean, guys who play more snaps than he does, but he's an impact player having him out. And now Shamar Steppen slides into the nose,

a position change for him. Jaleel Johnson was playing nose before. Now he's at three technique and Armond Watts is not very experienced. He's going to get a chance in there. But yeah, I mean, I think that this is a pretty significant loss for them to not have Michael Pierce. I mean, it's a huge loss. I mean, a staple of Zimmer's defense is he can play his true 4-3 over cover two, and, like, that's where he lives in. But the problem is if you don't have a true double team eating nose guard like he did in Linville, like he would have in Pierce, like, it's hard. Because if you have a nose guard that a center says, hey, I got this guy.

And I'm not saying Shemar's not that guy. Shemar's a hell of a a center says, hey, I got this guy. And I'm not saying Shamar's not that guy. Shamar's a hell of a player. I've played against a strong, physical guy. But he's not Michael Pierce and he's not Linda Joseph. That's really hard. It's going to make Tim maybe have to think twice about, hey, can I call this blitz because I don't think that this guard or this nose is going to be able to eat up this guard and this center.

Like this guard might get a free release or this guard might just chip and get out of there. Like they're not going to have to spend extra time or this nose is going to be able to eat up this guard and this center. Like this guard might get a free release or this guard might just chip and get out of there. Like they're not going to have to spend extra time on this nose because they know that if they don't double team him for half a second, two seconds longer, he's going to split and make the play. So, I mean, that's a huge loss for that defense. If you think back to what Zim had in even Cincinnati, he's always had that dominant nose guard. He had Petko there forever, right? I mean, so he's had those dominant nose guards and a really good three technique. And so I think that they're going to be doing a lot of plug and play.

I don't think you're going to see just a true guy that plays every base snap for when the base is in there for defense of true nose guard. I think you're going to see a lot of guys get chances and rotate in until they find the hot hand. We'll get back to the conversation in just a minute, but first got to tell you about TheraOne CBD. From tight muscles, tough workouts, signs of aging, to simply making it through each busy day, everyone understands what it feels like to be tense and sore, so everyone can benefit from TheraOne's CBD products.

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bluewire. Only until Labor Day. Go right now, theragun.com slash bluewire. Sunday, Sunday, Sundays are coming back in the NFL with NFL Sunday Ticket dot TV. You can stream every live, out-of-market NFL game every Sunday afternoon on your favorite devices,

plus Red Zone and DirecTV Fantasy Zone channels. Never miss your favorite team and favorite players. No matter where you live, NFLSundayTicket.tv is your key to the most glorious Sundays ever. Use the promo code BLUEWIRE at checkout to get 15% off your subscription. Visit NFLSundayTicket.tv and use promo code BLUEWIRE. I agree with you that it's going to be a little bit shuffling around early on to figure out how they want to handle that. The thing about Pierce and even more so Linval at his best

was those guys can take up those blocks and stuff, but they can also penetrate. Linval Joseph was putting a lot of pressure on the quarterback for a guy who is usually handled by two people. If he was handled one-on-one, he's picking up his guys, moving them back. He had some pass rush moves to him, and Pierce was kind of sneaky with that sort of thing too. And, of course, you know, and maybe you can explain a little bit,

but the three-technique position, Tom Johnson was hugely, hugely valuable for this team in 2017 and before that for a couple of years as well. To not have that rotational rusher who can come in and cause major problems for a guard, I think they need to find that guy or it's going to be difficult, especially when it's like third and ten and you want to play a lot of guys back. And it's great to have before, Everson, Tom Johnson, Linval, if he's in there, or B-Rob rushing over the guards. I mean, that was just a nightmare for opposing offensive linemen,

and now there's a lot different. Well, I mean, the big thing you're going to see is Zim didn't have to blitz. If you can create pass rush ability with your four down, like, it's hard on a team because, again, like I said, the big plays happen against the blitz, right? I mean, but at the same time, the big plays happen if the quarterback's got four or five seconds to sit back there. So I think that, I mean, if you don't find that natural four guys that can get to the quarterback, well, I mean, think about how Seattle won their Super Bowl back in the day, right? Cliff Averill. They had Michael Bennett.

They had Bruce Irving. I mean, these dudes, they didn't have to blitz. And, I mean, that's the key to winning is you don't have to blitz. And so you can't find guys. I mean, I think Hercules is a guy that you kind of look at and you're like, is he even still there? Hercules is still there, right? Yeah, he's still here.

But that's the thing. Like, you expected that kind of out of him last year. You didn't really get it. Is that a guy that maybe can take that jump into that next year here? I mean, the fact that I don't remember if he's even there shows you how much I really pay attention to what he didn't do. But, I mean, you knew, like, okay, when you're playing the Vikings in 2015 through 17, like third down is going to be Daniil Hunter, Everson Griffin, Brian Robinson, Tom Johnson. I mean, and all three of those guys could be double-digit sack guys at you.

You don't have that anymore up there right now, and you're going to be searching for it until you do. But the problem is all those guys were old Wiley bets, and now you've got one Wiley bet. Maybe you can call Daniil a Wiley bet. And you've kind of got a bunch of young, unproven guys around. Daniil's still younger and always will be than Afadi Adenabo, actually. So we're talking about Afadi as like, oh, this emerging young player.

And it's like, actually, Daniil's about a year younger than him. Well, I remember when Daniil got in the league, he couldn't even drink a beer. Four years old. That's right. Yeah, it is remarkable that he is still that young. And a mature fellow for only being 25 years old. So before I let you go,

Jeremiah, as always extremely insightful, give me a big picture on this team, because for the first time you and I are talking and it's a lot of different people than from what you played with. And that's got, it's a weird feeling for me. I have to have a roster out there.

Can't be like, who, wait, who's number 17 it's not jerry's right you know like who are these wait who's number 20 it's not mckenzie alexander or something um so you know i guess what what's your feeling or do you have one uh on this team with the remaining players that they still have and then the new guys mixed in yeah i mean i think you and i maybe talked about this at the combine or not like we knew we knew this team was going to have to blow up eventually because of cat

problems and that's part of the nfl george payton's one of the smartest guys around and figuring that kind of stuff up rick does a great job too um but you knew this was going to happen this year um you knew when they signed kirk to that deal they were two years lightning in a bottle right like okay we got two year run of this they made a couple good runs and one not-so-great run. But I think now you look at it as, is this a rebuild or is it a reload? I think it's a little bit of both. I think on offense, you got a little bit of a rebrand, maybe. Kubiak year two, you got Dalvin Cook,

still one of the best running backs in the league. So I think offensively we'll be okay. I worry a little bit about people aren't really talking about our corners. I know I say our. I'm still a Vikings fan at heart. But I think that you look and you're like, no Trey Waynes, no Xavier Rhodes, no Mackenzie Alexander. Like, people, like, this is going to be a problem.

Like, it really is. And, again, you talk about, okay, well, okay, we'll be all right at corner, but great corners are great pass rush. And it's really that simple. Like, your corner's going to be all pros if you've got great pass rush because you're going to get high balls if you got great pass rush because you're going to get high balls you're going to get balls that are misthrown you're going to get balls that are like tipped all that stuff and so now you've got maybe a mediocre pass rush new back end like I think defensively we're going to see a lot more struggles than we're used to seeing out of Mike Zimmer defense I think offensively we'll put it

together a little bit more we're going to have to rely heavily on Dalvin I mean you got a lot of you got a staple of pretty solid running backs. I think that – I mean, you've got Dalvin, you've got Alexander, you've got Amir up there. You've got a stable of guys. I think offensively we'll be better than we were last year. I think defensively it's going to take a while to find their stride, and I hope that they find it before they really – it's too late.

And they will have to be better offensively to get the same results, I think, in terms of, like, wins and losses. Yeah, if you want to be the same as last year, I think you're going to have to average 28 points. Yeah, yep, I agree. And with the corners, it's like they can look good in camp, but you've got to come right out and face Devontae Adams, and then you've got to face Aaron Rodgers, Phillip Rivers,

right off the bat, you know, Russell Wilson, Deshaun Watson. These guys are all pretty fast. Absolutely. It's going to be figured out quicker. It's going to be ugly. For sure. Well, Jeremiah, as always, great to catch up with you. Incredible insight.

Maybe the first guy to fully explain the mic point on the show with that much depth. So I appreciate that. That was extremely cool. Hey, man, that's just one of literally I could go through every single protection and we could get way more in depth than that. i love the x's and o's of it all protection of the week should be a bit that we uh that we do to really explain you know it's i always say like it's one of those things with a lot of players if the guy is smart you know tom johnson i always say this about Tom Johnson, nobody realizes how smart that guy was.

And so, you know, if you're smart, you could be a, hey, look at yourself, a guy who's not a high draft pick or Tom who's a CFL guy. You can make it if you can figure out all the things you're supposed to do. So most people can't. Anyway, great stuff. And you can always say we referring to the Vikings because you have a jersey there in your house that says Searles Vikings. So you can do that. You get promoted. Fair. Great stuff. And you can always say we referring to the Vikings because you have a jersey there in your house that says Searles Vikings. So you can do that. You get promoted. Great stuff. Super fun to talk with you. Let's do it again soon, man. Absolutely. I appreciate you guys having me on. Hi, my name is Bobby Peters, and I've recently written a book titled the 2017 New England

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