Purple Insider - a Minnesota Vikings and NFL podcast - Harrison Smith and Adam Thielen trade rumors and the SKOL Searching QB movement

Episode Date: October 25, 2020

Matthew Coller and Will Ragatz of Sports Illustrated get together to discuss rumors from reports and Twitter searching that point to either Harrison Smith or Adam Thielen or both being traded. Is that a good idea for the Vikings to totally rip it apart? Plus the exciting performances of Justin Fields and Zach Wilson helped us start a new movement of Vikings fans looking for the team's next QB. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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Will, right now I am feverishly refreshing Twitter over and over again because apparently Harrison Smith has unfollowed the Vikings on Twitter. And we know that you do have to pay attention to Twitter actions from Vikings players from the Stefan Diggs saga. Let me just ask you right off the top, do you think that this gets wilder than we expected with this trade deadline? I think a lot of us, including me, thought Ngakwe not crazy to trade away. Kyle Rudolph, Riley Reifif those are the obvious ones

but if Harrison Smith and even Adam Thielen has been rumored then it is on in terms of taking this entire thing apart all the way down to the screws yeah I don't know if it'll get wilder than we expect I mean you've got guys like Riley Reif and Kyle Rudolph who I think are probably on their way out if the Vikings can find a deal where they like the compensation. But it would really get wild if a Harrison Smith or an Adam Thielen or someone like that has been such a key piece of one side of the ball for the last five plus years. In Smith's case, for almost a decade. I think that would get quite wild. I don't know about how much you can really believe the whole Harrison Smith unfollowing the team on Twitter and Instagram. I don't know for sure that he was following them in the first place

or if that was an intentional action. But I don't think you're going to see any cryptic tweets coming from Harrison Smith, but something to watch. And it'll be very interesting to see because Rick Spielman really seemed to indicate during his press conference that this is not a rebuild, blah, blah, blah. But saying things is one thing, and what you actually do is another thing. And we saw him trade Gawkway, and we know he loves to pull the trigger on deals. And Trader Rick is his nickname for a reason.

So we'll see what happens. It's going to be fascinating, and I'm sure people are going to be overanalyzing every little thing on, on social media or every rumor coming out of wherever. So it's going to be an interesting couple of weeks here. So in the past, whatever Rick has said when it comes to trades has been the exact opposite. I think he said famously something to the extent of, we have no intention to trade Percy Harvin and they did.

And Diggs did and Diggs right I asked uh Spielman last year at the combine has Stefan Diggs asked you for a trade do you plan to trade him and it was a flat no that's not going to happen I also asked him on the zoom call I said have any other veterans asked you to be traded and he said no and that was how the whole thing ended and I thought that probably means yes and if I I'm Harrison Smith, I'm saying, let me go. Let me go somewhere where I could potentially win a championship because his talents on this team are being wasted. I think he's had a totally fine year, and he's been pretty much the same Harrison Smith.

But the cornerbacks have just been horrendous and don't even know where to go. If you watch back the Falcons tape, there's some real baffling things where you can tell Harrison is at his wits end with this defense. And if he wanted to be traded to a winner, I think you honor that because of what he's done for you. Not to mention the fact that he needs a new contract. He's going to go into the last year of his deal with no guaranteed money yet,

which is always the sign to sign a contract extension. But are you talking about a guy who's over 30 years old I think that there's been some writing on the wall it's just would they actually get in a position where they could do it I didn't think they would I didn't think they'd be one in five but if there was ever a time to do it it's now yeah and he's a guy who you can get a pretty solid return for i would imagine considering he's still playing at a very high level yes he's 31 years old but he's a guy who could come into any scheme and i think pick up on it really quickly with all the things that he's he's been through and learned in minnesota and just kind of be a leader on on in any secondary in this league and make a lot of teams better. So I think there are plenty of teams out there who could use help at the

safety position. So it'll be really interesting. I don't know with the safety position for the Vikings. I mean, there's a lot of ways that it could unfold going forward. You've got Smith and you've got Anthony Harris, who's a couple of years younger, but also not a young player and hasn't been quite as good as he was the

past couple of years to start this year but nothing too concerning there so what do you do I mean you have nobody after those two guys depending on how you feel about Josh Metellus which I don't think anybody's anointing him as a successor as a starting safety without having seen anything from him yet you could draft one soon but if you trade Smith then maybe you're probably looking at trying to extend Harris. You probably wouldn't franchise tag him again because that's going to get expensive. But it's always kind of seemed to me like maybe they'll pick one of these guys to keep in the future. I thought it was going to be Smith.

I think you could extend him even with how old he is. I wouldn't be too worried about a major drop off in his play over the next couple of years, although it will happen eventually. But maybe now if they trade Smith, then Harris becomes the guy that they kind of say, OK, we are going to keep you around. Obviously, he's a little bit younger and maybe once the secondary is good again, hopefully with the corners developing, he'll still be there and he'll still be in his prime enough to to come out of the other side of a rebuild. And this sort of circles back in a way, if you start trading players like Harrison Smith to the Mike Zimmer conversation of, like, is Zimmer going to want to be a part of this, or would he ask even himself to be traded if they're starting to move out all these guys that have been with him for so long? But also, a trade of Harrison Smith means we're not even sure we're going to be good in 2021.

I mean, I remember going back to the beginning of the season saying, you know, this might be an 8-8 type of year. It might even be worse. Eric Eager for Pro Football Focus on the show predicted 6-10. He's kind of on par right now. But I think we all looked at it and said, well, right, but, you know, you've drafted all these guys and you get some cap space after 2020 so 2021 should be your goal but when you're moving out

potential hall of fame level talents like Harrison Smith and you're moving out other guys who are staples and veterans that's going to be so many things to replace in one offseason and you already traded away your second I mean how much more draft capital can you get that's going to allow you to rebuild all of those things by 2021? I think it would be a sign him or Adam Thielen are both moving that this is a long-term thing, and then it almost guarantees that you'd be drafting a quarterback and thinking much more out toward the future. Yeah, I know we're probably going to talk about some of the quarterbacks here, but yeah, there's two ways you can kind of approach this. You can do sort of what the Vikings did this offseason and go for kind of a short rebuild and think that, hey, maybe we don't need to

drastically overhaul this thing. We were a playoff team last year, two of the past three years. I mean, you can trade guys like Kyle Rudolph and Riley Reif and guys who aren't necessarily I mean Riley Reif's having a good year and Kyle Rudolph's still playing a lot but things that wouldn't make you too much worse and when especially when you have those immediate replacements in like Ezra Cleveland and Irv Smith and whoever it may be, that you could still realistically compete for a playoff spot in 2021 if you kind of overhaul a minor overhaul and build with some young players developing. Or you can do and maybe there are people who argue that this is what they should do is that they shouldn things down for lack of a better term and and look to build for 2022 or 2023 and clear out future salaries and accumulate draft picks and draft that quarterback bring in a couple young quarterbacks maybe for a competition

and just kind of give up on this current Kirk Cousins thing but as I know you've discussed on on the podcast before I mean can you do that as as Mike Zimmer and Rick Spielman without the assurance that you're still going to be there and if you don't have that assurance that hey build this thing for the next three years you're good then you're probably going to go for the former option which is trying to sort of do a slight rebuild more of like a retooling thing is the word that we would use to describe what they try to do this year and try to compete in 2021. So which direction they go, I think we're going to find out a lot about which direction they go in the next 10 days or so for that trade deadline. The initial reaction that I had to the idea of trading Adam Thielen was,

I don't think you really want to do that because, A, I think he's a receiver that can age pretty well. He wins with his route running, his hands. You know, he can still get down the field pretty well, and he could be good for the next five years. I mean, I think receivers go into their 30s. Larry Fitzgerald, you know, look at him. He was able to succeed for a very long time, and I think Thielen is kind of similar in the fact that he's not a 4-3 burner who relies entirely on his speed. It's more of he can get open, he's smart, he understands how the offense works, and he's going to make every catch that comes his way.

So my thing was I don't know if you want to try to replace that because if you look at free agent receivers year in and year out, yikes. I mean, I think the best guy last year was like Bashad Perriman and there were too many super Robbie Anderson's having a good year yeah Robbie Anderson yes yes good point good point but even Robbie Anderson is that's rare a notch way below and it's not like you get these guys on free agency all the time and then with the draft you hit a home run with Justin Jefferson. You'd love to take one of the receivers in this next draft, but you might have to spend that draft pick on a quarterback. So I think you get left in a pretty difficult position. He is expensive, but I guess you'd really be projecting a ways out. Like, is he going to fall off after two, three years? That one is much tougher than

the Harrison Smith idea because he's already plus side of 30 and he's going to be super expensive if you re-sign him where Thielen is still under contract that one is much tougher for me to say oh yeah definitely trade away Thielen too yeah I agree and I just think you can look at a few I mean wide receiver is a more important position than safety I think it's more valuable overall in the grand scheme of things. Also, Adam Thielen, I mean, you look at the Vikings wide receiver depth right now, and they don't have much at all. I mean, B.C. Johnson was a nice little story last year,

but he's been pushed out of the depth chart by Chad Beebe. You don't have, I mean, Alexander Hollins isn't even on the active roster. There's nobody really down there under Thielen and Jefferson that you feel good about going forward. So if you trade Thielen, you're down to Justin Jefferson and basically nothing else. So you would have to look to, like you said, maybe draft a receiver early. And I think you can consider drafting a receiver early even if you keep Adam Thielen. But getting rid of him then creates a ton of question marks at that position.

And you don't want Jefferson to be the only guy. I mean, teams can constantly be giving safety help over the top against him and identify him as that one option that they're not going to let beat them. I think that can potentially limit some of his effectiveness. So I think if you get a really, really, really good return for Adam Thielen, it's something you should consider just because of the way this season's going and things like that. But I think I would try to hold on to him because like you said I agree that he can be a guy who remains effective uh coming out of the other side of a rebuild like

I mentioned earlier kind of with Anthony Harris someone did give up a second round pick for Mohamed Sanu last year I mean so sure there are teams that get desperate and if that happens and someone says you know what how about that late first round pick for Adam Thielen that's going to be really tough to pass up because I think you need multiple firsts and multiple seconds if you're going to rebuild to be great as they go down the stretch here but boy I mean this team could go from hey you still got some of the bones of what you were and some exciting players that are young that are mixed in there, to all of a sudden, oh, my gosh, this is an entirely new franchise that you are putting out on the field as opposed to having the longtime stars.

And like you said, if you move out Kyle Rudolph, okay, well, that's all right because Irv Smith is right behind him. Even if you move away from Reef, it's either Ezra Cleveland or I would even say that Rashad Hill has a chance to play and show them that he could potentially be a starter I know that they were ready to do that anyway so maybe if they see Ezra Cleveland as a long-term guard which again Spielman would not say anything about when he was asked is Ezra Cleveland a guard or tackle? And he said he played good against the Falcons. Okay, that doesn't answer the question. So I don't know for sure. I would

like to see Ezra Cleveland play left tackle if they move out reef. But those are kind of no big deal types of moves when it comes to Thielen and Smith, who would have still been impact players in 2021. Then it becomes much bigger. All of this in some way or another circles back to the quarterback position. Because if you are in a massive rebuild and you are moving out parts and people are calling about Harrison Smith and Adam Phelan, then why do you need a quarterback who is making oodles and oodles of cash? And also, I think that people have really come around to the idea that Kirk Cousins peaked in 2019, and that's about as good as it's going to get as a 10-win quarterback. Not terrible, not going to destroy your franchise at his best, but at his worst, as we've seen,

one in five is where you end up when he doesn't have everything working around him. And with the contract, it really points to the Alex Smith chief situation good not great this is the time to draft a quarterback this year so here is what I have started Will and I love that you got right on board that you were on Twitter watching college football and you jumped right in so I was happy about that that's why I wanted to do this podcast with you i'm calling it skull searching i put it out there to twitter we need to name this thing where we look and track very closely the draft eligible quarterback so if you're a twitter person if you search the hashtag skull searching you'll see vikings fans talking about future quarterbacks so give that a try and

i'm also making it a part of the website as well that we're going to have to follow these guys really closely every week. And I have at least the top three on the Skoll Searching Leaderboard. And I think we can extend this even out a little bit more. But right now, Will, my Skoll Searcharching leaderboard is Trevor Lawrence, number one, Justin Fields, number two. And after last night, Zach Wilson is number three. And I think we need to talk about Justin Fields and Zach Wilson. So give me your take yesterday after watching Justin Fields. I think he incompleted one pass yesterday in complete dominance over Nebraska.

Yeah, he had one incompletion, and it was a drop touchdown in the end zone. I mean, Justin Fields, and we knew this coming into this year, he is really, really good. He doesn't look like the prototypical quarterback in terms of the build and height and all that like Trevor Lawrence does. But he's one of these guys who is becoming more and more the new flavor in the NFL, a dual threat guy who he had a spin move running yesterday that was really impressive. And the thing about him is he's not too quick to take

off or anything like that. He's not super jittery in the pocket. He's got good pocket presence and he's got a great arm. I mean, he made a couple of throws yesterday that were just very, very impressive. So the thing that I'm starting to think about Justin Fields, even after one game, and this was probably true coming into the season anyway, is that he's the number two overall player in this draft class. I mean, there are just too many teams who need a quarterback that if you find a team at number two that doesn't necessarily need a quarterback, say that's maybe the Dolphins with that Houston pick or the Bengals who just got Burrow, I think they might look to trade that because there's just so many.

This is going to be an arms race for these top few quarterbacks. So I think Fields goes too. And from what I've seen from the Vikings, I don't think they're going to get that high in the draft order. I was following on Twitter and just watching today some of the bad teams and kind of the tank watch for the Vikings. And I think like three or four of them were leading at halftime. And then all but the Washington football team, which blew out the Cowboys, then blew those leads in the second half.

The Jets were up against the Bills and lost because they're the Jets. I think they had four yards total in the second half. Yep. The Falcons were leading the Lions and then found a way to lose by accidentally scoring a touchdown. Todd Gurley couldn't stay out. So these teams are bad, and they're going to find ways to lose games. I do think the Vikings are bad enough to,

especially if they trade some pieces, be in the 5-10 range or maybe even the top five. But you've got to look at, okay, is there a chance they can get Fields? And then after that, I think more realistically, you're talking about guys like Zach Wilson, who you mentioned, who has just been a star so far. This year is Joe Burrow. I'm not saying that he's going to become the number one overall pick

because last year there wasn't a Trevor Lawrence or a Justin Fields. But Wilson is working his way up the draft boards with a really strong start for BYU. Granted, they haven't really played anybody, but you can still see the flashes of NFL talent from him. And then Trey Lance, who is a weird prospect to evaluate because he was so good last year, but North Dakota State had one game this year as a little showcase thing, and he wasn't even that great. So that's going to be an interesting conversation for that number three spot assuming fields keeps playing at a really high level go to sodastick.com to get your original minnesota sports inspired goods if you have not seen this stuff yet and you've been listening to this podcast what are you doing

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That's SodaStick.com, S-O-T-A-S-T-I-C-K, original Minnesota sports-inspired goods. Code Purple Insider for free shipping. Right, and Trey Lance, for me, is right after those guys. And then we've got kind of a different level of say, like your, your Kyle Trask, your Brock Purdy guys that might not be necessarily early first round picks, but maybe later first round picks,

second round picks. And those are the ones that shuffle around a ton. I think the guys we're talking about, they're going to be up in, in the upper echelon. They've already established that like Justin Fields. But the Trey Lance thing is fascinating because there's now buzz that Trey Lance could be the second quarterback off the board.

But when I watched Justin Fields yesterday, he did a few things. I mean, one, he throws a touchdown that was just a laser beam, like special arm talent that gets you drafted super high. In that same play where he threw the touchdown, the thing that I loved about it was there was pressure up the middle and he did a thing that is actually allowed in the game in the rules i checked the rule book he moved and then he threw it he didn't stand there and let his guard get run right back into him he sensed the pressure and he slid and then he fired it and then another thing he took off and he had a spin move at the goal line to score a touchdown and that's

what you're talking about with kind of a dual threat type of thing that the NFL is going toward with a lot of their quarterbacks. Even Burrow can move and be mobile, even if you're not a running quarterback. Wilson is really fascinating, though, because arm talent just threw the roof. He had a play for BYU where he rolls out right and throws it 50, 60 yards left all the way across the field for a touchdown. And you just went like, okay, wow. And what we're seeing, I think, with Patrick Mahomes and Lamar Jackson and Deshaun Watts and some of the great younger quarterbacks in the NFL is it's got to be special.

Like there has to be either the special arm talent, the special athleticism, the special processing because, you know, when we see these quarterbacks who are kind of in the meh with a lot of decent skills and maybe he's pretty accurate or something, they just haven't really worked out recently. And you see that from Josh Rosen. You see that from Sam Darnold. Darnold was supposed to have great arm talent, but that's never shown up really for the Jets consistently for them you know to win like

he never gets any blame for losing but he has not been good either and he hasn't elevated them either so anyway Wilson you mentioned that the quality competition he's completing 76 percent of his passes though like this is the Josh Allen thing where he didn't rip up bad competition well that's what Zach Wilson is doing and I think he's been really really fun to watch his emergence because that arm is something special yeah it is something special and there's a little bit of kind of a Mahomes like quality almost to him where he is not afraid to to throw the ball downfield I mean I mean, I can't even name any of BYU's receivers, but he trusts them and he steps up in the pocket and makes plays.

He makes plays on the run, that one you were talking about. It was like an off-balance throw from the right going back to the left. That was crazy. I know it was against Texas State, but at a certain point, you can still evaluate what he's doing as a player and kind of ignoring the competition to a degree. And he looks really, really good. 16 touchdowns, one interception so far this year.

So he's a guy, like I said, just rocketing up draft boards. And there's going to be a lot of conversations, I think, about that Fields-Lance. And now Wilson, I think, is moving into that tier. The thing for me about Trey Lance is we're talking about the running with Justin Fields, but Trey Lance is also a very, very gifted runner. And the thing about him is he's bigger than Fields. So he's got almost the – and, again, these comparisons I don't think are

super accurate, but just trying to get a general sense. I mean, I think Trey Lance has a little bit of Cam Newton in him with just the size and the running ability. Like early Cam Newton was – Cam's still a very, very talented runner. But Trey Lance, the upside is through the roof just with the build, the arm talent, the running ability. And in that showcase game against Central Arkansas, he threw a pick, which he didn't do all of last year, and didn't look fantastic as a passer, although he had some good moments. But he looked really, really good as a runner.

And I think that's the thing that for guys who are good at that that's always going to be there I mean we've seen with Kyler Murray this year he has not been great as a passer and the accuracy he still needs to improve he went 9 of 21 last Monday night against the Cowboys I believe but the running floor is there he's had like 70 yards rushing something like every week and he's getting in for for rushing touchdowns all the time so when you can do that that gives you just another way to move the ball to sustain drives and to create big plays so that's something that's really appealing to me about about fields and Lance and I think Wilson can move a little bit too he's he's not a he's not a running quarterback per se but uh he's got some ability he's a good athlete he's a byu qb which makes you think he's probably like 28 but he's not he's only like 21 yeah he is

a normal prospect age so yeah those three guys i think are the ones to watch the rest of the year and then you do also uh have to talk about the next year if the vikings aren't able to get one of those top guys like the Kyle Trask and Brock Purdy and Tanner Morgan did not have a great first game for the Gophers last night against Michigan although a lot of stuff was weird on special teams with that game and Northwestern quarterback Peyton Ramsey looked quite good I don't think he's much of a draft prospect but I will say Cats looked pretty good last night in a blowout win over Maryland who I think is just terrible but yeah there's a lot of quarterbacks in that

next year that could maybe be day two guys or even late first but I think Wilson is kind of solidifying himself as he's no longer in that tier he's making this a top four I think you were suspended from this podcast for Northwestern bias once before. So you're going to be going to be flagged for that one. I'll tread carefully. So skull searching is what we're calling this. Whenever we give our update, which I'm going to make a thing on the podcast all the time, is to talk about what we saw for the previous week's quarterback. So look forward to that. I have a game for you as I always do. I always have something for you because you enjoy this.

So here's what I've come up with. Hilarious wet blanket criticisms of draft quarterback prospects. Okay. So just since I started skull searching and talking about these quarterbacks yesterday, these are all criticisms that I got of Zach Wilson or Justin Fields, who were kind of my focus in watching yesterday. Okay, let's start with Justin Fields. I want you to rank them. So Fields is not big enough, is the first one.

Ohio State quarterbacks have not worked out recently, is the next one. And he cannot win unless the Vikings get an offensive line. And he has so much time to pass with that Ohio State system that he won't possibly do that in the NFL. So there is your four hilarious nonsense criticisms of Justin Fields. Rank them one through four. Okay. So I think the top one is the size thing because I think that's just kind of

a pointless thing I mean you don't need to be six seven to play quarterback in the NFL number two I would say is that he's not going to win because until the Vikings get an offensive line I mean yeah the Vikings should get an offensive line that's completely separate from their pursuit of a quarterback any quarterback they take is going to benefit from having a good offensive line, but that doesn't mean you don't take that quarterback. Just because you don't have a great offensive line doesn't mean, okay, we're just going to keep trotting out a lesser quarterback who will perform worse than a better quarterback and is unable to make up for that offensive

line thing, which you mentioned with Fields having a good ability to move around in the pocket and step up and avoid pressure. So I'd say that's number two. Number three, the system thing with Ohio State. Those other two kind of go hand-in-hand with the Ohio State offense and the recent Ohio State quarterbacks. Is the only example of that Dwayne Haskins or their other? I can't even I guess JT Barrett was never really a prospect. Cardale Jones was never much of a prospect.

So I think it's pretty clear that Justin Fields is on a different level from all those guys, even from Haskins, who's had a great college career at Ohio State. Fields is on another level as a prospect. And the system, yeah, I mean, he looks good in the system, but he should look good in the system. That doesn't mean he can't thrive in any kind of offense. See, I think the funniest one is the Ohio State quarterbacks haven't worked out. Like, what does Terrell Pryor have to do with Justin Fields?

These are, I mean, hey, you know what? All those Miami of Ohio quarterbacks that followed Roethlisberger, man, they just, you know, didn't work out. Why? How about all the great quarterbacks at Cale before Aaron Rodgers and then after Aaron Rodgers? How about Auburn? Are they quarterback universities since Cam Newton,

or were they before Cam Newton? Jason Campbell worked out out so that's why they drafted like the perfect example of that is the texas tech thing how everyone's like oh we play in the air right offense like it's it's inflated numbers graham harrell blah blah blah and then patrick mahomes is the best quarterback in the world so right the college that they went to does not matter you got to evaluate the prospect and what they do as an individual. Even though sports took a break, your business didn't. You have to keep moving and that means hiring is more important than ever. Indeed is here to help. Indeed.com is the number one job

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uh he is not dual threat enough and he's just another Kirk Cousins those are the and I mean he needs guards pretty much always shows up no matter what you're talking about. But, like, rank those, that he is very young looking, he is just another Kirk Cousins, he isn't dual threat, and he isn't accurate between one and five yards. He's completing 76% of his passes, by the way. I'm just editorializing a bit there.

Those are all quite good. Not good, but funny. They're all pretty ridiculous. I guess I'll start with last. I think the one valid-ish one there is saying that he doesn't have the same rushing ability as some of the other guys. I think, yeah, he's not a complete dual threat don't you don't need to be I think he's athletic enough but I think that's the one out of those four that you could actually have a real

conversation about the I'll for number one I'll go with the he's just another Kirk Cousins because I'm almost positive that was just some bitter Vikings fan who thinks that every quarterback the Vikings get is going to be Kirk Cousins. Like, there aren't any real comparisons there. I mean, they're very different players from what I've seen of Wilson. So I would put that at number one. Number two is, I guess, just that he looks 13 years old. I mean, it's funny, and he does look quite young, but not a real thing. What was the other one?

You should be sensitive to this personally because you look way older than you are, so you have the exact opposite problem. We had dual threat, and we had he couldn't complete passes accurately one to five yards. Yeah, I'm sure if that is any sort of real issue, which I doubt is, that's probably like he missed an easy throw one time and somebody saw that and made a bold proclamation about it but if that is true at all I'm sure he will be fine improving on the screen game and the short

passes and things like that because generally if you can throw the long ball well which we know he can and he's just dropped some absolute dimes in the intermediate and deep areas of the field this year, he'll probably be fine on the short yardage. I mean, those passes are the ones that Sean Mannion can make. I mean, that's like being inaccurate on those. I'm not saying it's impossible, but if you are an NFL-level prospect who, like you said, can drop dimes 25 35 yards down the field consistently you're probably not going to have this problem that's so huge with

one yard passes like I'm sorry I can't draft I mean that'd be like what Chuck Knobloch yips where he just throws it in the ground like what uh and you know pro football focus has looked at this when it comes to the short passes and more or less found that Drew Brees and someone of Sean Mannion's level are no different when throwing a bubble screen. It's really the intermediate is what separates the great quarterbacks. And then, you know, the deepest part of it, but as we've seen with Cousins, you only get so many chances at those deep ones.

It's really when it's third and seven and you need to throw a dime for 10 yards, that's where the quarterbacks separate themselves. And if you search by who has the best third and long performances, it's all the best quarterbacks. So that's what I look for. And the difference with Wilson and Cousins, like, okay, the size isn't that different, but the arm talent is outrageously different. Like, Cousins is very accurate and can throw it down the field pretty far, but he requires this big windup to do it.

He needs time to be able to do it, and I think it's one of the reasons why he doesn't throw the tight window throws all that often is because he just needs this windup up and he needs to be on a perfect platform to see Wilson roll to his right turn his hips and fling it the other direction 50 yards like that's just not possible for Cousins there was a play and I'm sure you noticed this uh I believe against the Falcons where Cousins rolls out and Justin Jefferson is coming across the field wide open but he's like 30 yards down the field and Cousins just like throws it out of bounds or something. Like, I can't make that throw with what I have for arm talent, so I'm sorry, Justin Jefferson. And he did the right thing for his talent,

but I think that Zach Wilson can make that throw, and like you said, a lot of the elite arms can't. Yeah, I think that's a perfect example, because I remember we had a good angle on that one in the press box where you had Jefferson breaking open on his deep crosser and Cousins just has a guy in his face. And if Zach Wilson does what he did on that play that we're discussing and just kind of gets the quick release, knows he's going to take a hit, but knows that he can make that throw on the run, he can get it off in time and still get enough power on it despite having the guy in his face, that could be a huge play. And Kirk Cousins just made the correct decision that he wasn't going to be able to get it off

because he doesn't have that kind of a lightning quick release like that or the power to make that throw on the run. And he's actually – Cousins has been better this year in terms of making some plays on the run and off script and even scrambled a few times early on, then I think he's given up on that but um but still he's not nearly on the same level as some of these really elite quarterback like we've seen Justin Herbert doing it a lot uh throwing on the run and throwing some dimes and just having a guy like that with a big arm but an arm that's accurate and can can throw from from really any angle and

from any part of the pocket or outside the pocket just makes such a big difference especially when you don't have a great offensive line so that's something that really stands out to me about Wilson and I'm excited to keep watching him all year now I said on a different podcast somewhere along the line I don't remember when that people could send me their Kirk cousins trade ideas. One that I thought was actually sort of intriguing is kind of off the table. I think after the way Baker Mayfield played today, I don't think that they would trade you straight up cousins for Mayfield,

but I kind of loved it. Like, Oh yeah. Send them back to Stefanski. He's probably better than Mayfield. Then you could just cut Mayfield after this year if you don't like them. But that one might be off the table. Now we'll let's wrap up with this.

People want him traded to Dallas after Andy Dalton is injured and Dallas is a complete disaster. So analyze a trade of Kirk Cousins to the Dallas Cowboys for me. Well, I think it's worth talking about because you never know with Jerry Jones if he's going to want to do something bold like that and try to save their season. And really, I mean, it's not going to take much to win that division. So I think Kirk Cousins could win that division with the Dodgers. With those three really good receivers and with Zeke Elliott,

who I know has had some fumbling issues and I think like tipped the ball for an interception in the end zone today or something like that but I don't think it's really that realistic at all just because the Cowboys from what they've said they they had they expect Dak Prescott to be back next year they still like him as their future guy and with Kirk Cousins contract it's not ideal to just take him in and say okay you're going to be the guy for the rest of this year. And then what do you do with him going forward? So that's why I don't think that'll happen. You can't count it out, like I said, because who knows with Jerry Jones.

But, yeah, the Cowboys are a mess. I don't know if Mike McCarthy is going to last the entire year there. That's kind of a separate discussion from the Kirk Cousins trade stuff. But that team is an absolute mess right now. And now, yeah, if they don't have Dak or Dalton, is what, Ben DiNucci a quarterback? Yeah. We'll see. I mean, they could just get desperate,

but there are probably quarterbacks that they could trade for or pick up off someone's practice squad or something like that that aren't going to sell you with a contracted and a player like Kirk Cousins. Josh Johnson's season will arrive again. You know who they should trade for? They should trade for P.J. Walker. He's big in Houston, right? XFL legend.

Texas. Yes, XFL legend undefeated in the XFL, P.J. Walker. That's who they should get. But the Madden trade that you make there is Riley Reif packaged with Kirk Cousins to Dallas for a first round pick. And Mike Zimmer. And Mike Zimmer. You send them all to

Dallas and I don't know what you take back. I don't know what you get back. Maybe Lamb or something. I don't know. They probably wouldn't do that. Nah. Their next two first round picks. And then it makes up for the Hchel walker trade entirely easy to figure out man do it spielman so all right well will this was super fun i hope we can uh continue to catch up from time to time on our skull searching because you

have as much joy for watching these college quarterbacks as i do and i'm gonna maybe struggle to find other reporters who are as interested in this as me. I'll be here. I appreciate your time, and we'll do it again soon, man. All right. Sounds good. Thanks for having me.