Purple Insider - a Minnesota Vikings and NFL podcast - How different will the Vikings record be with Jaren Hall and Josh Dobbs than if Kirk Cousins stayed healthy?

Episode Date: November 3, 2023

Matthew Coller and Manny Hill pick the schedule if Kirk was still in and with Hall/Dobbs to see how much better the Vikings would be expected to be with and without QB1. Plus they talk about where Kirk's injury ranks in the most crushing in recent history. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Welcome to another episode of Purple Insiderthew collar here along with manny hill as we always do on monday and thursday nights on the youtube channel and of course all these episodes on the podcast feed as well and uh manny i have never known a bigger now let me hold on i guess i have to amend because our friend chip scoggins is also a huge Tennessee Volunteers fan. I was going to say I've never known a bigger Tennessee Volunteers fan, but let me just say I haven't because you guys are on equal plane of following and cheering for Tennessee as a university. And Josh Dobbs is here. So that's cool for you right i guess yeah it's really cool i mean i would i would give i would give chip the slight nod as a tennessee

balls fan just because he's he's from tennessee and that's the you know he kind of grew up a balls fan my tennessee fandom comes from my dad because my dad was a Tennessee fan growing up. And, you know, when I my dad and I got a lot closer when I was about 12, 13 years old, when Peyton Manning was a quarterback there. And obviously they were really good. And then they won the national championship with my guy, T. Martin, my favorite college quarterback of all time. But, yeah, no, it's really cool. Josh Dobbs, you know, I've watched him a lot at Tennessee. They had a pretty good team in 2016 that I think probably should have gone to the SEC championship game, but they didn't because Butch Jones was their coach and he was not a very good coach. But they had Josh Dobbs and they had Jawan Jennings, who's turned himself to a pretty solid wide receiver in the NFL. They had Alvin Kamara in the backfield who Butch Jones inexplicably just like wouldn't use for like the first four or five games of the season.

And then they're playing Texas A&M and Alvin Kamara goes off and he's like, oh, this guy's pretty good. Maybe I should keep using him. And then he ended up having a really good season and the rest is history there. But yeah, Josh Dobbs was a lot of fun to watch at Tennessee. He's athletic. He's got a pretty good arm. He can run around a bit. Really intelligent.

He's kind of a – we were talking before we went on the air. He's kind of like a rocket scientist, so to speak, with his degree. So, really awesome dude, a lot of fun, really good leader at Tennessee. And it's kind of cool to have him in, have him in purple. Now we'll see how it goes. So we talked to Josh jobs today and he did laugh when I brought up how everyone always mentions that he was a rocket science major at Tennessee and everything else. But then he actually gave a really great answer when it came

to like how that helps him because he said, you know, being a football player, he had to cram for a lot of tests and this is not cramming for any old test if you're taking rocket science. So there is a process to it. And some people's brains just work like this where retaining information and then being able to give it back to you for a test or to go out on a football field, they do it faster than others. I mean, it's just everybody's wired differently. And what he showed by going to Arizona, immediately becoming their starting quarterback, and putting together a couple of good games, I think that shows you that he has a unique capability

because of the way his brain works to be able to do that. And then he is a tremendous athlete. You saw on probably the relative athletic score gets shared around, but he's like a 95th percentile, 96th percentile athlete. He was effective in running the football. He had a game against Dallas where he ran for over 50 yards. So there's something there with Josh Dobbs. How much, I guess we're going to find out.

His circumstance is certainly going to be better here than it was in Arizona. At the same time, there's reasonable expectations, I think, to be had with a quarterback. You're picking up midway through the season and then bringing him to a new team and asking him to save your season. Potentially that's even if he plays depending on, you know, how Jaron Hall goes about things and so forth. But, you know, if you were going to get a quarterback without having to give up a lot, Josh Dobbs is probably the best you could do. Do you think they should have done more though, Manny?

Because it was clear they didn't want to give up a lot. Were you on the side of hey you've got a good team you should go get a Jacoby Brissett or an Andy Dalton and really try to keep this thing going yeah I thought about it in the moment when it happened because you know there was so much buzz around some of the bigger name quarterbacks that may or may not have been on the market and you know when you hear about the bigger names, that's always kind of the first place you go. You're thinking, okay, well, Matt Ryan,

they're going to go get Matt Ryan out of the broadcast booth. Well, he's a veteran. He's been an MVP, started a Super Bowl, had a really nice career. So you're kind of anticipating like, okay, with the way the Vikings have played the last couple of weeks, they've gotten themselves back into the postseason conversation. Maybe they want to really go all the way in on this season just to see what happens without having to give up a lot of, a lot of draft capital for somebody that, you know, somebody like a Trey Lance or something who's

probably would cost you a little bit more. You know, the Mack Jones angle was, was kind of interesting, but it never, never really seemed like the Patriots were ready to move on from him. So that's kind of a, it kind of became a pipe dream type of thing. And then I think when you settle in on Josh Dobbs and you say, okay, well, this guy started, started a handful of games this year and he's been productive in some games and won a lot of games, but that roster is just not very good. So I don't know how much you can really put that on his shoulders. And, you know, he started a lot of games for the Titans last year after Ryan Tannehill got hurt and Malik Willis was just like not good. And so, you know, he kind of had to have the Titans in

the mix there down the stretch last season. So he's got some experience. He's been in the league for a while. He's been in a lot of different locker rooms. So he's seen a lot of different, a lot of different playbooks and that sort of thing. So he's, he's well-traveled around the league and I thought, okay, well, he's got some ability. There's no doubt about that. You know, I watched him at Tennessee and, and you know, he can certainly run around. He's a pretty good athlete, got a really solid arm. So I said, Hey, what, what the heck

didn't cost him a lot to get them in. And, uh, and he's young and, you know, who knows if, if he gets in and he plays well enough, then you've got, you know, at least a functioning option going forward into next season. If you decide not to bring Kirk cousins back. Yeah. I mean, I agree with that for sure. Teams should be keeping three quarterbacks in the future. And if the Vikings, because it's not clear what's going on with Nick Mullins health-wise, Dobbs is probably a better quarterback than Mullins at this point. And so maybe you're thinking, all right, well, you've got Dobbs as a potential backup for

the future. You couldn't ask for a better backup from a guy who is just like first class, can learn anything at any time, is going to be good for your team. I mean, somebody who comes in, gets named the starter and handles it the way he did in Arizona. I think it speaks really well of him. And you see guys like Josh McCown who have long careers doing exactly this type of thing. People will make fun of Chase Daniel because he made a lot of money and he only played like five games. It's not easy being Chase Daniel. If it was, a lot more guys would do it

because there's a lot better athletes out there than Chase Daniel, and yet teams always wanted him as a backup because they knew he'd know the offense and could step in and run it if they needed to, which I think is the same thing with Dobbs. And then, you know, it's somebody that's doing a lot of work behind the scenes. And this is what Nick Mullins and Sean Mannion have always gotten praise for, but that matters. I looked this up, Manny, when backup quarterbacks have had to play this year, they are nine and 21. So you don't really expect to win a lot of games with your backups. And that leads me to our next discussion. Here's what I want from you. I want you to pick the rest of the schedule first.

If Kirk cousins never got hurt and then in the current circumstance. So let's run through the final, what do we got here? Nine games. If Kirk had not gotten hurt where you think they would have finished. And now with their situation with Jaron Hall slash Josh jobs, slash whoever else, I don't know what Nick Mullins is deal is, but if he's going to play or not, if they thought he was good, then I mean, good health wise, then he probably would have just been the guy. So, all right, let's, let's just go wins and losses. Let's start with this week against the Falcons. Again, you are picking this first one if Kirk had never gotten hurt. So, do you think they would have beaten the Falcons?

Yes. Yes, I do. I think because of the way they've been playing the last couple of weeks, the way they were really taking it to the Packers before Kirk got hurt. You know, Atlanta has a really, really nice roster. They've got some pieces, certainly on offense. The quarterback position has just been an issue. Desmond Ritter has really struggled. And now we're seeing now on Sunday, they're going to turn it over to Taylor Heineke as

Ritter got benched in the game against the Titans this past weekend. I think with a healthy Kirk Cousins, the kind of role that the Vikings were on at the time that Kirk got hurt, I could totally envision them going into Atlanta and really taking care of business there, even though the Atlanta Falcons do have some nice pieces on offense with Bijan Robinson and Drake London and Kyle Pitts and things like that. But the quarterback position is just kind of an issue right now for them. So I would I would tally that as a win for the Vikings. OK, five and four. And I'm very interested to see who the next

coach of the Falcons is. That's the way I would talk about them right now, because that roster is good and their coach is not all right against the Saints. And for time purposes, we don't need a full breakdown, as much as I like your full breakdowns. But just we'll kind of run through these a little bit on the quicker side. So win or loss against the Saints? I'll call it a win. It's at home. And the Saints are kind of reeling right now, so I'll call that a win.

Okay, so you would have had them to six and four then going out to denver tough place to play i'll call that a loss even though the broncos are not very good that would have felt like a very vikingsy loss to have had like two you know well not just two but you know a real run of great play and then have the letdown. So 6-5. Now let's look at the Bears game. And again, just because people are always joining in and out, we're picking it if Kirk had not gotten hurt. So 6-5 at home against the Bears.

That's a win. The Bears stink. Say no more. 100%. They're not good so seven and five going out to las vegas and a no connell with no offensive coordinator uh that's another win the raiders also stink and they just fired their coach they might stink less because they fired their coach i'm not convinced this is actually good for the bike.

It's kind of like Desmond Ritter getting benched. Like, oh, they benched their starter. Like, that's actually not good for the Vikings because I think Heineke is better. All right. So what does that bring us to? That brings us to seven and five, right? Is that where it was? Eight and five.

Eight and five, right? Okay. right is that where we're at or is it eight and five yeah eight and five right okay and now they go play the Bengals at Cincinnati at eight and five and competing for the NFC North that is a loss I think the Bengals have started to kind of find their groove a little bit I agree so we'll go eight and six home against the Lions this one's tricky what does detroit look like then i will call it a loss okay so they are now eight and seven and now we're panicking a little bit oh they're they're melting down as the packers come to u.s. Bank Stadium on New Year's Eve.

That is a win. The Packers stink. All right. So where are we at? Nine and seven. A classic Kirk record. But he could get to double digits as he goes to Detroit. The final game of the season. Potentially playing for the playoffs.

I will call it a win because I think the Lions will already have the NFC North wrapped up, and I think they'll be resting some starters, and the Vikings will play well enough. And I also envision maybe the Vikings at 9-7 at this point have probably already locked up a playoff spot, at least like the 6th or 7th seed. But I think they're kind of riding some momentum and that they'll play pretty well uh take care of that game because i don't think it'll

mean much for the lions at the end of the day in general nine and eight is like a coin flip to get into the playoffs kind of depends on how everybody else plays there's the way i look at it is there's like eight teams that are trying in the NFC. And so someone's going to get left out of the party. And it kind of depends on who it is. Okay, so I can buy this, Manny. Now let's talk about it. Let's talk about it.

If the Vikings had turned around in 0-3 season to make 10-7, what do we think would have happened at that point? Like, I still don't think that they're a strong enough team to run through the NFC. They might not be a first round out team, but I don't think they're a Superbowl caliber team. And I think that we would be talking about Kirk cousins play after the second half of the season or after they had gone to Owen three and why they probably are set to extend him after he throws for 43 touchdowns, career high, 4,900 yards, all those things.

I think a lot of big stats would have had to been put up along the way. If we were talking about them making 10 and seven, I also think what you lay out is to go 10 and seven, you really could have only afforded one botched game where you're supposed to win, but you actually lose. And you know, that could be a challenge for the Vikings potentially. They would have really had to win almost every game they're supposed to win to even get to 10-7, which shows you how hard that road is

when teams go to 0-3. Yeah, absolutely. And you're talking about essentially after an 0-3 start, if they finish 10-7, you're talking about a 10-4 finish. I mean, and that's a 10-4 stretch for any team is that's a pretty damn good stretch. I mean, you're talking about a lot of teams that, you know, are winning divisions if they have that type of a stretch or better over the course of the season. So to recover after an 0-3 start, that would have been the finish. That would have been pretty impressive and yeah i think the conversations about you know is kirk cousins

going to get an extension that i think that conversation would you know would rear its head again after us kind of going into this season thinking okay well this is going to be it you know but i think a lot of that was you know the the the idea that this team was going to kind of regress back to you know being kind of a 500-ish team um as they you know had won those 13 games last year so yeah I mean it would be interesting to it would have been interesting to see how that would have played out if they would have gotten themselves back into the playoff hunt made the playoffs won double digit games. You know, Kirk is putting up the great numbers because, you know,

he's got Justin Jefferson back at some point during this stretch. And then Jordan Addison at this point has really kind of hit his groove and he's, you know, really ascending into, you know, a star as it appears that he's going to be here going forward. So yeah it that would have been something that would have been something to see how they would have played that out now if they had gotten to that final game lost gone nine and eight missed the playoffs then we might be talking about a whole different discussion with the quarterback and that's how for so long it

has felt like the razor's edge of this decision of which way they're going and it still feels like that is very much undecided let's now pick it under the current circumstances so you thought they would have gone 10 and 7 had kirk cousins not got hurt i'm not going to fight you on that i think it probably would have come down to the final week against the lions to whether they would have gotten into the playoffs. And then we're watching scenarios and everything else. And I also think there would have been some Kirk roller coaster there as well, because, I mean, you don't have to go back very far to where he was not playing as well. Like he if he if he had gotten hurt in the Carolina game at the end of the Carolina game, we might be going like, well, you know, he's, you know, doing his Kirk stuff, but he got hurt at one of his best games. So that's like the last thing

you remember. Anyway, now the current circumstance, Jaron Hall starts this week. Let's just roll under the expectation that Josh Dobbs will be the starter the following week against a pretty good New Orleans Saints defense, but not a great overall team. So let's go back. Do you think this week with Jaron Hall that they beat the Falcons? I don't. And that's just because there's just so much unknown with Jaron Hall. He's a fifth-round pick.

We only saw him for a handful of plays in Lambeau on Sunday. I just don't think we know. And so going into Atlanta, it's a road game. It's Taylor Heineke, which who, you know, somehow, you know, if he's going up against, you know, an opposing quarterback that's not very good, somehow he can kind of find a way to pull it out. He started a lot of games, started a playoff game for Washington a few years

ago. So I would call that a loss if Jaron Hall is starting on Sunday, which he is. This show is sponsored by BetterHelp. Folks, if you're struggling with the holiday blues and you're having some trouble getting excited in the same way that other people in your life do about holiday get togethers, and all of that just sounds stressful to you, then maybe it might be helpful to add something new in your life to help deal with those feelings. That's where therapy could be a bright spot for you. It can help give you the tools to manage stress and help you feel more grounded. If this sounds like something you'd be interested in, check out BetterHelp. It's entirely online, convenient, and suited to your schedule.

Just fill out a brief questionnaire to get matched up with a licensed therapist, and you can switch therapists at any time for no additional charge. Find your bright spot this season with BetterHelp. Go to betterhelp.com slash insider to get 10% off your first month today. That's betterhelp.com slash insider to get 10% off your first month today. That's better help.com slash insider. I agree with you, even though I don't really know what to expect from Jaron Hall. It's just that my sample size of seeing him in training camp and preseason does not give me a ton of confidence. I mean, I think the difference between at least that version, and it could be different

when he's playing with the first team. I don't know. But that version versus Taylor Heineke, who has won a good amount of football games in the NFL and played really well, really well for Atlanta last week, I think, well, not only that, but they have a good defensive coordinator. They have a ton of weapons and an offensive line that's really going to test the Vikings.

And going on the road as well. There's a lot of roadblocks there for Jaron Hall. I think it's a lot to ask for him to win like this when he wasn't even QB2 to start the season. That was Nick Mullins. The only reason he's QB2 is because Nick Mullins got hurt. So I will agree with you there that this is a tough one to ask. So now we're talking four and five.

How about home against the saints? And we're anticipating that Josh Dobbs is starting this game, right? In theory. Let's let's just assume Josh jobs the rest of the way, but you know, who knows if Jaron Hall plays great, maybe it's him. Yeah. I mean, I I'm excited to see what Josh Dobbs can look like in this offense.

But I think that first start against the Saints team that I don't think is very good, but it's a defense that I think can cause some problems. I think the Saints right now defensively are ninth in scoring defensively right now. So it's a pretty good unit on that side of the ball. And I think the first start for dobbs would be a little bit troublesome and i think the saints would eke out a win you know kind of a low scoring type of game yeah i think um brian flores's defense versus both of these offenses gives the vikings a chance for sure uh at the same time i think that we if we going to call things on luck, bad luck, good luck, whatever else, I mean, the Josh Metellus interception, he took it right out of his hands.

You know, they returned a fumble for a touchdown. They got a couple of interceptions where San Francisco and a fumble recovery. And what happened last week against Jordan Love? Like, I don't know if every week you could just count on huge turnovers like that. So I understand. I think they could win either one of these games but I understand you picking them to lose both now they go out to Denver again presumably with Josh Dobbs well I mean I picked them to lose here if Kirk Cousins was playing so I guess it would only make sense

that I would pick them to lose here if Josh Dobbs is playing as well so I'll call that a loss too and now they're now they're at four and seven for some reason i want to say this one's a win like because it's it's sort of like what we have to kind of vikings it right like if they had won two games in a row we gotta say there's gonna be that game where they but then and by the same token once we think that they're out of it completely and we're going like ah well the season's oh oh they won like that that's just too vikingsy okay but i'll i'll roll with your picks here and that puts them at four and seven and now it's a rough road uh to compete for the playoffs they face the bears at home on november 27th yeah that's still a win the bears are just i mean it's just bad in chicago i don't i mean i think even

if jaron hall is starting this game i think the bear or the uh the vikings have a decent shot of winning being at home and the bears are just not the bears stink man they're just not very good at all and so i'll call this uh i'll call this a win i always feel a little sad when they have a national game and it's like a backup quarterback. Who's definitely not good. Tyson Bajan. And they put all the effort into it.

They're telling his life story. They're talking about how his dad's an arm wrestler. They're doing the sit down interview with him. He's talking about, you know, all this stuff. It's very, very special.

And what a great opportunity. And then he just gets pummeled. And like, you just, like that just so, so awkward to be like, oh man, this is going to be so bad. And that's exactly what it was. I listened to the game, uh, on the radio coming back from Lambeau. And I was just like, I would have really enjoyed the entertainment of this being a closer game, but unfortunately Tyson Bajan. So that puts us at five and seven onto the raiders seems like a game that they could potentially win oh did you freeze manny did everybody freeze or is it just manny

somebody let me know if ever if i froze as well or if it's just man oh wait okay you're back you're back okay uh anyway um i don't know what that was about. Yeah, I think this is a win. It's coming after a bye week, too. So it's kind of an extra week for Josh Dobbs to even get a better grasp of the offense at this point. And I think he's starting to pick up momentum and start to play better. And like we talked about, the Raiders stink, too. And I think this will be a win as well. Yeah, I think so. The Raiders, yeah, I mean, the only scenario is they get super motivated by Josh McDaniels not being there. But what usually happens is there's like this little burst of, we fired our coach, everyone's excited. And then they remember that they're a terrible team. And this happened with the Indianapolis Colts.

It happened with the Falcons when they beat the Vikings in 2020. They had just fired their coach, and they came to Minnesota with their hair on fire and just beat the hell out of the Vikings. Kirk had a tough game there, and eventually that wears off, though, and they're still a truly, truly awful team. That puts them at six and seven kevin o'connell presumably getting praised for turning things around and then they go to cincinnati i just there's no way you can call this one a win no no not at all i called it a loss if kirk were healthy

and so yeah they're gonna lose that game uh that puts them at six and eight lions at vikings i'll call that a loss as well because i think the lions are at this point they've got the division locked up already but they're trying to jockey for maybe a higher seat in the nfc and i'll call that a win for detroit so the vikings would drop to six and nine a not so nice six and nine and uh then you have green bay and detroit probably a chance to beat green bay and maybe a chance to finish out with a win against detroit because if they're not playing for any position you could end up at you know maybe what do we got them at we got him six nine you could

finish up at eight nine here potentially yeah because i i think at point, if Dobbs is still the starter, I think he's playing really well and the Packers are not any good and you would have them at home. I think he would play well in that game and get a win. And then, yeah, like you said, if Detroit, again, like the last scenario, if Kirk were still healthy, if Detroit has the division locked up, they've got their seating locked up already in the NFC, they don't have much to play for, and they'd be resting their starters.

And I could see how the Vikings could eke out a win there in a game that doesn't mean much. Absolutely. And speaking of the schedule, by the way, regardless of who the starting quarterback is, I am going to Las Vegas in December, and you can come along as well. So you get a chance to escape the weather, and look, if you make it to the game,

you make it to the game. I'm just kidding. But I will be at Circa in Las Vegas, where I'll be hanging out there, doing the podcast for a couple days leading up to the game. So you'll be able to find me at Stadium Swim, which is a gigantic video board, watching the games on their gigantic tv and spending time relaxing in their heating pools and by the time we get there you know i'm gonna need i'm gonna need a little relaxation man it's been a stressful season

uh it is one of the coolest places on earth at circa and the friday night before the game we're gonna have a special party for minnesota fans that includes drink specials, two-ticket giveaway to the game. So you can come meet me there, talk football. It'll be great. It's at the Overhang Bar. So if you go to CircaLasVegas.com, you can find where to RSVP for that party there at the Overhang Bar and make a whole weekend out of it at Circa. It's located on the amazing Fremont Street street which is really a sight to behold and we'll

have a great time and get away from the minnesota weather which i'm already very much ready to get away from the minnesota weather now's fine but i'll wait until december when we go and uh play against las vegas all right so i got a question from our friend Josh Smith, who's getting two straight shout outs on the show. So I can never mention him again. I have to pull it up here. Josh is a fellow journalist, actually covered the area where Jordan Addison went to high school. So he's on a subscriber to the Purple Insider sub stack, which all of you, if you want to check that out. But he sent this message. He said, here's a potential talker. Rank these devastating ends to a quarterback tenure for the Vikings. What would we rather do? Dante Culpepper, Teddy Bridgewater, Sam Bradford, Kirk. How would you rank those, Manny, from, well, how do we want to rank them? Number one is most devastating, I guess, right? So most to least devastating?

Man, Josh, but we're going to do it anyway. Okay, so that's a great question. Great talker. Shout out to Josh for that. I'll go number four, Sam Bradford. I think the reason why is because, you know, Sam was playing great that first, that first did when he stepped in and they still won 13 games and went to the NFC Championship game. So I guess, you know, for Sam, it was probably pretty devastating. But as far as the impact it had on the Vikings, I'm not sure it was as devastating as, you know, potentially the other three above it, just because of how well Case came in and played and the way the team was still able to really have a really nice season, despite Sam being out.

Number three, I'll have Kirk, you know, if this is the end of the road for Kirk. Just because I think with them, you know, even though I had them kind of going 10 and 7 if he had been healthy, I still don't think like long term. This is the right direction to go with Kirk Cousins continuing on, and it's no disrespect to Kirk. He's had a pretty solid run here, but I think it's just like we've been saying for weeks now. It's time, I think, to move on, to think about going with a younger quarterback.

You're really trying to build this thing for a long haul to kind of have a long-term window open to compete. So I think that's kind of why that that's probably number three. Number two is Dante just because Dante was just never the same after that. I mean, that injury happened in Carolina, Chris Gamble hit him in the knee and it was just over. And Dante kind of bounced around the league a little bit. He got traded to Miami. You know, Nick Saban didn't Nick Saban kind of rushed him back, I think, from the from the injury kind of early because he didn't really have a quarterback at that time because he thought he was getting Drew Brees and then we saw Dante kind of bounce around in Detroit and Oakland and and whatnot and it just it just was never really the same and he was coming off of a season not the season he got

hurt but the year before where he was just great one of the best quarterbacks in the NFL and he was only like 27 28 years old at the time he got hurt. So that was a tough one. And then Teddy's number one, just because we just never got to see how good Teddy was actually going to be. And that, that August, that preseason, it looked like he was really going to take that step in his third year as a starter and really ascend to a really good quality starting quarterback. And then it was just so shocking. It happened in practice. It was a non-contact injury.

It was just devastating. And the fact that Teddy was so popular and so loved by the fans here, and I know you were very high on him. I was very high on him. And Mike Zimmer absolutely loved him uh for that to happen the way it did and the fact that you know they made the trade for sam but the season ended up not really finishing all that great for the vikings that year at eight and eight um so that's why teddy i think teddy's injury is probably number one for me

um my list is a little different i i think you justified yours uh very well and uh let me just i guess i'll just jump off of each point that you made there for mine i went with kirk fourth uh in part because i mean this team was still 4 and 14 and even though what we just saw was fantastic the best case scenario probably for the season is 10 wins unless they just went blazing hot like they've never, ever been before. But that's hard to project. He's also had a long career as Minnesota Vikings quarterback. If this had happened in 2018 and we never got to see him as the Vikings quarterback, really, then I would feel differently. But there's been a lot of opportunities. He's played a ton of football games for the Vikings.

The thing that makes it very sad is just how he was playing over the last two weeks and how the locker room that once I think did not do this, galvanized around Kirk Cousins over the last two years and really came to believe in him, care about him in ways that I don't think he had seen before in Washington or Minnesota. So that makes it, that makes it tough. But I still think that this would have been like a nine or 10 win team that does not go

much farther than that. Just based on everything they have in the roster. Maybe, you know, who knows, like we'll never find out, but that was my impression of it. That's kind of what all the metrics say about them. I think they're like 15th and DVO way. And a lot of different numbers say they're more of an average team overall that was playing really great. The last two weeks,

Sam Bradford, the thing about Bradford that I'll always wonder is if case Keenum goes 13 and three, what is Sam Bradford do? Because even, even Bradford, you remember when we talked to him when we had him on the show that one time with Alex Boone years ago and he said it still keeps him up at night to think about that first game of 2017 that man again with the team the team had

bought into him during training camp he was throwing the football incredibly well he was just locked in at the beginning of that season. And I'm not saying they go undefeated, but man, if everything plays out the same, if Anthony Barr still hurts Aaron Rodgers, I mean, they could have won potentially 14. And they go into the playoffs. You probably don't need a miracle to win against the Saints if you're given a 17-0 lead because he didn't throw many interceptions. And then you had to fill it all with a legit chance to beat that defense with someone who's more physically talented.

So there is that. And that also applies to Bridgewater as well, that if Bridgewater is the quarterback and he's at his prime and they've won all those games with that great team, either one of them probably gives you a better chance because they're more talented than Case Keenum. Yeah. And on top of that, if if you add one more win to the 13 and three season, maybe you're hosting the NFC championship game instead of having to go to Philadelphia, because I think the Eagles were 13 and three as well. But they had a tiebreaker over the Vikings

at that point, which is why they were hosting. yeah maybe you're you're hosting the eagles instead and maybe things go a little bit differently so i will go with teddy as number two uh as as much as i think that i mean and also consider this that sam bradford was fairly expensive at the time on the salary cap you would have had teddy and like 2020 million to spend on a team that was already good enough to go to the NFC championship game. They would have been even better. And Bridgewater, I think was coming along not to mention that Bridgewater never saw the version of digs or Thielen that everybody else got. So there's a lot of reasons to think.

Plus they improved the offensive line in 2017 with Riley reef. Mike Remmers played pretty well that year. Joe Berger. So, you know, Elfline, before he got hurt, was playing well. So, I mean, think about that. And, you know, so, of course, there's always going to be that wondering if Teddy would have stayed healthy as your franchise quarterback and all that. And plus, the injury was so horrifying.

Like, it was, you know, going in an ambulance being told, we're not sure if we could save the leg, like, holy cow. Um, with Dante though, I think Dante had a chance as the league changed, as the situation changed. Uh, I think he had a chance to be one of the most dynamic quarterbacks in the NFL for many years. And I think that as they were building that roster with a new ownership, remember how bad the ownership was with a new ownership, Randy, you know, maybe Moss stays around. I don't know. Like, I mean, who knows? Like if they had a different ownership at that time, there's a lot of what ifs with Dante, right? Like if the Wilfs had owned them

when he was drafted and as opposed to whatever. So there's a lot of what ifs with him, but it's specifically though, is you go into the future. They're only a couple of years later, they're in the NFC championship in 2009 and they were a pretty good team in 2008 as well. So like, if he is there for the build of that team, the defense that they had, I mean, you could, you could have been talking about year in and year out with Dante

Culpepper as they pay for coaches, maybe like keep an offensive coordinator, all those things, having the potential to compete for a superbowl year in and year out. There is probably some question with Bridgewater, like what the ceiling was. Maybe it would have been like a one year thing and maybe it didn't have that big of a, of a ceiling. I don't know. Of course, anytime Bridgewater gets mentioned, someone in the comments has to insult Teddy Bridgewater and his arm strength. But I'll tell you the thing that I noticed, because I got the job right before that happened. And what I did was I studied Teddy Bridgewater a

lot to get ready for the job because that's who I thought I was covering. And one thing that I really noticed was that his arm strength seemed to be improving, which we've seen from multiple quarterbacks in the league, from Tom Brady to Joe Burrow. There were some throws in the preseason where you went like, okay, there's some zip on that fastball that he had seemed to put in the work to improve that. And again, throwing to the prime digs. Where does digs rank among receivers in the NFL right now?

Top five? Prime digs. Adam Thielen was at least the top 10 receiver in his prime. He would have had the benefit of that and, you know, some money there to maybe spend on the offensive line. So there you go. If you were feeling good on this Thursday night, you're not now. Um, but we will see, uh, what happens here, um, going forward with this situation, which I guess i have to get your take on as well manny because i haven't asked you that and that is the the question du jour of the week

uh what do you think what do you think is going to happen i mean what do you think happens after this long term i think they're gonna i think they're gonna draft somebody uh next spring i think they're gonna use a first round pick and they're going to I think they're going to draft somebody next spring. I think they're going to use a first round pick and they're going to draft one of these quarterbacks. Don't know who it's going to be. You know, rather or not, they trade up is obviously going to depend on, you know, where they finish this season and what spot they're going to find a way to get one of these young guys because I think for as much praise as we've heard Kevin O'Connell give Kirk Cousins all this week since the injury, and I think it's all legitimate praise. I don't think it's BS.

I think he means everything that he's saying. I think him and Quasey both understand the opportunity here with this roster going forward where you've got a lot of really young pieces on offense you've got a really terrific offensive line now that's playing really well and gelling and getting better and better you've got two really young great wide receivers one who's already elite and another one who might be elite a year or two from now you've got a really good tight end who I think has really settled in.

TJ Hawkinson is playing a lot better. You know, I know he had kind of a rough start to the year, but he's playing a lot better. And I think you've got a defense that is showing some signs of life and improvement, even though, you know, they're dealing with, you know, injuries and different sort of things with Davenport being out and missing time. And you've got a really good defensive mind as the coordinator running that show. So I think Kwesi and Kevin O'Connell see the big picture here.

I think they recognize it. And I think they're going to go the route of taking a young quarterback in the spring because I think it just makes too much sense. For as well as Kirk has played, you know, this season, especially the last couple of games. I think there's a real opportunity here that they can't pass up on going forward. I think so too. And suddenly Saturday has got more interesting for me.

And I know that our friend Jonathan Harrison on the social media side has been putting out a, like, here's when all these prospects play if anybody wants to watch them on Saturday. And so I guess I'm going to use that as my viewing schedule for each Saturday is that list of quarterback prospects and trying to just parse through and guess like which one would the Vikings like, you know, and then there's lots of other discussions to be had off of that. And I want to ask you in moments about. So think about this as I do the read here. What we're looking for now outside of Dobbs, outside of Jaron Hall, who's playing quarterback and so forth,

presuming that we're not looking at this through the lens of, is this the next Vikings quarterback? Just for now, until we have to have that conversation, we'll assume we're not. What else are we trying to know by the end of the season? Put that in your brain. And I want to give out my prize picks for this week. We always have each week a segment where we give out our prize picks on prize picks.com. It is very simple. You go to prize picks.com. You type in the word purple and

you will get a deposit match of a hundred dollars, which is very nice up to a hundred dollars, of course. And then all you have to do is pick more or less on yardage totals, touchdowns. And I am including a field goal kicker this week, Manny, in my prize pick. So here it is. I've got Alexander Madison with more than 40.5 rushing yards. And I am also including Cam Akers with more than 28.5 rushing yards. I think these gentlemen are going to get their workout in, even if they are not the most efficient,

they will be handing off the ball to Alexander Madison and Cam Akers and Atlanta's kicker. That's right, Manny Atlanta's kicker, young Hoku with more than 1.5 field goals made. So we'll be tracking that one extremely closely. Again, prizepix.com. The best part about this is in order to earn $100, I got to get these right, and the entry is $20. So that kind of tells you what we're talking about here.

You could play without putting down huge dollar figures. And look, I just did this in five minutes, so you can do it quickly as well. So prizepix.com daily fantasy made easy okay you've had 47 seconds to think about what you want to see the rest of the season from the minnesota vikings go i want to see how kevin o'connell can hold this group together after the devastating injury to Kirk Cousins. When you look at how they were playing leading up to the injury, I mean, something like that can really deflate a team.

And as you mentioned, you know, that locker room had really come around to really galvanizing around Kirk Cousins and getting behind him as kind of the leader of the football team. And then when something like that happens, it can really take the wind out of your sails. So now I'm looking for how can Kevin O'Connor sort of keep this locker room together, keep them competitive, keep them wanting to kind of still, you know, win and try and get a playoff spot, even though the quarterback situation is what it is right now. So I'm looking for that.

I'm looking to see if, if this defense can get even better, you know, we've seen them, you know, be very opportunistic with forcing turnovers and we haven't really, I mean, the,

the, the Eagles game wasn't great because they just couldn't stop the run. We haven't seen that really, really awful defensive performance yet. We've seen some, we've seen a couple of bad ones to start stop the run. We haven't seen that really, really awful defensive performance yet. We've seen a couple bad ones to start out the year, but we haven't seen anything like what we saw last year at times with Ed Donatel. And hopefully we don't see any of that.

And I think if we don't, that means that Brian Flores is really continuing to do a nice job with what he has because I think that's where he deserves a lot of credit for. He doesn't really have a lot on that defense. There's a lot of guys with, you know, that are just kind of okay players. He's got a couple of nice players, but for the most part, it's just kind of a meh defense when you look at the talent top to bottom. And they're, you know, statistically, they're kind of middle of the pack right now and i think that's that's a credit to him i want to see if he can kind of continue that uh kind of going forward for the season and yeah i mean it'd be interesting to see what we see from the

quarterbacks the rest of the way if we see something out of either one of them jaron hall or josh dobbs that can make you kind of you know, one or both of them being on the roster next year in some capacity. Yeah, for me, there's, I think, a list of players that all of a sudden become relevant that I wouldn't have been thinking so much about week to week development. What's the bigger sample size say when they were fighting for a playoff spot it would have just been all right this game means this and here's why they need to win and here's how they're going to do it and everything else uh the right guard is a big one because this year we have seen a better performance from ed ingram the bar was literally on the ground so it's been raised a little bit and he has not been a disaster week to week. But if you go back and look at the Green Bay game, not good. So there was a little bit of a stretch

where it's like, oh, Dalton Risers here might take my job and now I'm playing better. And then even last week as 49ers, I thought it was okay. And then it goes to Green Bay and then has a lot of trouble. And is that going to be who you are? Or can you get to a level where you can be trusted going forward into next year? Or do you have to replace the right guard position? And then we're not sure about left guard, which also is another thing to watch. Though Dalton Reisner is not young, how he fits in with this thing and gels on the offensive line. How much do you have to replace by the end of the year the running back situation is cam acres going to be a dude that you keep for a while

is alexander madison gonna shake off a bad first half of the season and get rolling or is it going to be at the end of the year hey maybe you need to spend a third round pick maybe you need to go out get a veteran running back next year maybe whatever whatever where do you got to spend there i think the same thing goes for the defense the corners right now not grading particularly well uh i think that they've shown reasons for me to think that someone like a caleb evans mckay blackman and even andrew booth jr like could be a core group how much do you have to add to that though and And then buy them and Mattel has to be great. Do they carry it on? Ivan Pace jr. Was sort of the hot player early on. Hasn't played as much recently, but I still think he's been fine when he's been out there. And, and is he, you know, a guy for the future is Jordan Hicks going to continue

to play as well as he is where you have some confidence and does anybody else emerge on the defensive line? You know, DJ Wanham. So there's kind of like a whole laundry list of guys that I'm watching. And I'll give you another thing. How many sacks does Daniil Hunter end up with? Because if this dude ends up with 18 sacks, I don't know how you're going to be able to find the money in your wallet to be able to give Daniil Hunter because it's not going to be enough.

Yeah, that's, I could totally see that second half of the year. We're just like counting sacks. It's just like, Oh, there's another one. And then all of a sudden, you know, we get to, cause what, what does he have eight now or nine or something like that at this point? He's got 10. So like we, we get to the Denver game and all of a a sudden he's got, I don't know, 15 or something. You know what I mean?

And that's the 11th game of the season. He has 15 sacks at that point. Yeah, and then you start looking at, is he going to get to 20? Did he get to 22? Can he break the straight-hand record? Like that sort of thing too so that'll be kind of fun to watch uh those little things if if your team is out of it which obviously right now the vikings are not out of it completely yet but if things start to kind of

spiral out of control a little bit where they find themselves on the outside looking in with not really much of a chance then there are those little things like, Hey, can Daniel Hunter get to 20 sacks? That'd be kind of cool if he did, you know, it would, like you said, it would be very expensive to try and retain him at that point, but it would be kind of cool to kind of watch that and see that play out. I waited until it was almost nine o'clock to ask you this question. Will Levis is a 12 for 17, 153 yards. That's nine yards past attempt.

The Titans, who are vastly worse as far as talent goes, are winning this game against Pittsburgh Steelers. He's getting the ball to DeAndre Hopkins and someone named Phillips, who he's throwing the ball to as well. This is a bad team. They're not even running particularly well in the game. 45 yards rushing. If Will Levis is good, what are we going to think?

I mean, because I don't really want to give up Jordan Addison. I mean, Jordan Addison is really, really good. At the same time, a quarterback is worth five times what almost any wide receiver is worth. And the Vikings clearly evaluated him probably would have looked really, really closely at Levis and decided that's not our guy. And he's off to a great start here. That does not mean he's going to be a great player, but I mean, I don't know. What are we supposed to think about this? Like at what point, I mean, is it, if he's great the rest of the season or even as he's shown enough that he could have been good here or who cares because you got Jordan Addison and the next quarterback

is going to come in and get him. So I'm, I'm not sure because I feel like, uh, this one's going to be at least worth keeping an eye on over in Tennessee. Oh, absolutely. I kind of look at it the same way we kind of looked at the back Jones situation a couple of years ago when he was there for the taking and the Vikings decided not to go that route. I think they ended up trading out of that spot and then taking Christian Derrissaw later on in that first round. And as we can see now, a couple of years later,

Christian Derrissaw is pretty damn good. He's one of the best left tackles in football. And, you know, there's nothing wrong with having one of the best left tackles in football. It can only make your team better. You know, I think it's just going to have to play out. You know, Will Levis is looking pretty good so far in this first, you know, game, the half of, of game action. But how's he going to look later in the season when teams start getting more, more looks at him, more film on him. Cause I don't think he didn't play at all in the preseason, did he?

Cause I think he was injured, right? So teams really haven't gotten a chance to look at him at all. And to his credit, he's taken advantage of that and he looks pretty good so far. What's he going to look like later in the season when teams have tape on him and how is he going to be able to adjust when teams are throwing different looks at him but it will be a talker it will be fascinating to see how it plays out if he ends up being kind of a meh type of guy then you know I think you look back and you say yeah Jordan Anderson was the right pick but if he turns into a stud and he's a superstar,

then that question is going to be there for a really, really long time. The fact that they got hits on those other picks with Derisaw and with Addison certainly softens the blow. I would tend to think that Mac Jones, he's going to go somewhere else and be a different guy if he gets a different, decent situation. I still think when I watch him, this is the worst setup in football. They have no receivers, no line, a senile coach. I mean, bring him back, you know, Bill O'Brien, who had been out of the league or out of the NFL.

Like, what are we doing here? That's a terrible, terrible situation, but I've seen him be good before. And who knows what it would have looked like if he was brought into a spot where, you know, he would have had Justin Jefferson and so forth. But, you know, it's always interesting to kind of replay those scenarios because, yeah, I don't want to give up Christian Derrissaw. So it's very possible that being patient ends up playing out in their favor, even if Will Levis is good, if they end up with a guy that they could put into a spot that has Jordan Addison, that improves the chances of him being good as well. And I understand why they

didn't go for Will Levis. The thing that I'll always come back to is if Kevin O'Connell is not sold on a quarterback, then you can't really take them. But that's the trouble with this next draft is if Kirk's money is too big and he's going to go somewhere else. And then you're left with either some veteran or, you know, drafting someone that may be like, you're not a hundred percent into, then that's going to be tricky because I think crazy Adolfo Mensah would be like, we just got to take a guy in hope. And maybe Kevin O'Connell wouldn't, uh, Joseph, the prize picks promo code is purple. Uh, by the way, that's being asked in the prize picks.com slash purple match your deposit.

So if you do that, then they see that they did that and they want to keep sponsoring the show. So that's always cool if you want to play there. Anyway, complex season just got more and more complicated as the Vikings want to do. It feels like we kind of flipped the switch from fighting for the playoff mode to we're all now evaluators, front office mode. So that's what we're all now evaluators front office mode right so that's what we're doing now but no matter what mode we're in mondays and thursdays we'll be doing the show here at eight o'clock so if you're joining for the first time or whatever that's what's going on and then uh various other

days as well so that's how it's going to go but uh manny any final thoughts before we sign off for the evening uh really i'll just be watching sund Sunday and see how things play out in Atlanta. You know, maybe Jaron Hall kind of shocks us all and he turns into Brock Purdy 2.0 or Case Keenum 2.0 and suddenly he goes on a little bit of a run or, you know, maybe Josh Dobbs steps in a week later and does the same. So who knows? I'll be very intrigued to just see what Jaron Hall looks like with a full week of, you know,

practicing with the number ones and going into a game against a team that I think is beatable. I'm not super confident, but Atlanta is beatable. They're just kind of an ordinary team with a coach that's not that good and a sketchy quarterback situation.

So I'm excited for Sunday, sketchy quarterback situation so i'm excited for sunday believe it or not i'm excited to see what this team kind of looks like with a with a different quarterback it's so unusual now i mean i've just covered so many kirk cousins games and now here we have one with him not starting uh so thanks for your time as always manny thanks everybody for watching and we will talk to you all again very soon