Purple Insider - a Minnesota Vikings and NFL podcast - How many wins will the Vikings end up with? And Aaron Nagler joins

Episode Date: November 21, 2025

Matthew Coller talks with Manny Hill about the Vikings' outlook for the rest of 2025 and Cheesehead TV's Aaron Nagler stops by to give his take on the Packers. The Purple Insider podcast is brought to you by FanDuel. Also, check out our sponsor HIMS at https://hims.com/purpleinsider Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See https://pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Hey, everybody, welcome to another episode of Purple Insider, Matthew Collar, here. And not a whole lot to update in terms of out from TCO Performance Center today, except for that Jonathan Grenard was practicing today on a limited basis. Not sure if he's going to be back or not. We will find that out tomorrow. But aside from that, mostly status. quo from TCO. Justin Jefferson had an interesting conversation with us backing J.J. McCarthy for all of those who seem to want to speak it into existence with Jefferson melting down or demanding a trade or something. Well, you lost today because once again, he didn't and just

backed his quarterback. So there's not a whole lot to talk about there. And that means it's time to bring in Mani Hill. And a reminder, of course, the show presented by Fan Duel as always and manny is going to pick the schedule but i i had a very brief conversation with a long time minnesota viking the other day manny and uh i i all i said was hey you know you guys are head to lambo how about we keep it normal this time and his response is like what do you mean i was like do you need me to go over the last 10 years of vikings going to lambo so i think we should do that i mean the it's been really weird my My first trip to Lambo was 2000, no, actually, it was not 2016.

I didn't go because they were out of the playoffs and the players had a mutiny. 2017 was my first trip down there and Rogers wasn't playing and the long snapper got hurt, if you remember. And that's what led to the Minneapolis Miracle and the long snapper making the mistake and the block punt and all that. Then 18 is the tie. 19, they come back from down, what, 21 and then throw an interception and the the last play. I think that was also 2019 was when Kirk apologized to Adam Thielen and the

entire world went insane. 2020 was when the Vikings upset them and then they didn't trade away players at the trade deadline because I thought they could come back. 2021 was Kellan Mond and I see him every day in practice. 2020 was the seven studs. 2023. I think Rogers just smoked them in 2023. Is that right? What happened in 23 at Lambo? 23. Why am I blanking on? Oh, no. No, that was the Achilles. What am I talking about? That was the Achilles. That was the Achilles. Kurt was playing great that game too. I remember. Yeah, he's outstanding. It was the best version of Kirk we had ever seen. And he tears his Achilles. And then last year, Sam Darnold goes crazy. But then they come back in the game and they got to close

it out. Actually, last year is probably the most normal game that we've had down there. Let's keep it normal, my friends. Let's keep it normal. Good evening, Mr. Hill. How are you? Good evening. I'm good. Yeah. I mean, just when you're talking Vikings Packers and particularly games at Lambeau Field, there's just always those distinctive games that you remember. Obviously, the Moss Moon game comes to mind from 21 years ago. We've seen these two teams tie twice at Lambeau Field in the last decade and a half as well. And he did what game with Antonio Freeman and overtime on Monday night football. Yeah, I mean, just a lot of

really weird, wild, crazy games, crazy finishes between these two teams at Lambeau Field especially. And who knows? We'll see what happens this weekend as well. So until we pick the schedule, we're just going to talk about stuff because it's been a long week and I feel like I've covered every possible J.J. McCarthy angle, which means if you're tuning in here on a beautiful Thursday night, comment section, questions, thoughts, feelings, throw them in there. We'll answer them. This is more of an open mic night here because we don't have a main topic outside of that. And we're going to pick the schedule pretty soon and have. a conversation about really the playoff races and what we think of each of these teams that the Vikings are going to play, but everything else is on the table. So get questions and thoughts into the comment section and we'll get started on the main question, which is how many games are the Vikings going to end up winning?

And here's your fan dual question of the day, which is the Vikings are plus 175 to win eight games. I want you to give me your percentage chance that they get there. is the percentage chance that the Vikings win eight games? Leave that in the comment section. And if you want to throw in why you think one way or the other, feel free. And we will read them as well. So why don't we get right to pick in the schedule, Manny, for anybody new watching the show,

this is what we do every single Thursday, even going back to training camp as we pick the schedule. And it gives us a chance to talk about the opposing teams that the Vikings are going to play. and also what our expectations are now at this point. And it's been all over the map for this year. I think you started out at 11, maybe as low as eight. I don't know if you've gone lower than eight. So we're going to have to see where this has been the lowest. This has been probably the lowest.

And you know, Manny, I think based on the last two weeks, we had every reason to think that after the Detroit win, look at this team, not just, hey, McCarthy played pretty well in that game, but look at how the offensive line played in that game. Look at how Brian Flores made an adjustment to stop the run and Jemir Gibbs couldn't do anything. Look how he subbed out Ivan Pace for Eric Wilson and then that's working. And, you know, Harrison Smith's starting to look a little bit more spry as he's coming back.

And all those things and they're kicking and punt in well and kick return and well. Like there's a lot of clicking there that you felt like if they could win one out of two against the Ravens and the Bears that we would still be having this discussion of like, okay, maybe this has a chance to get back on the rails. Maybe I always looked at it after the bad start to the season after we washed away the idea of getting 11 wins of if you can play the last week of the season against Green Bay

for something, then you have had a passable season. I don't know if that is going to happen. But those last two weeks took what felt like any air out of the balloon. If they win this week, can they get it back? Do you think? I don't know if that definitely means that they've gotten it back if they win this weekend.

And I actually, you know, we're going to pick the schedule here in a second. I actually think the Vikings have a decent chance of winning this game, mainly because, one, we saw them going to Detroit and in that hostile environment and play well enough and win that game a few weeks ago. But also, I mean, the Packers are a little banged up right now on offense.

There are a lot, I think pretty much their entire receiving core is on the injury report right now. It's a lot of the guys elicit as questionable. So, I mean, is Jordan Love going to have anybody to throw to? Is he going to have enough guys to throw to on Sunday? We'll find that out. But I think if they can find a way to win this game on Sunday, I think it at least makes the season. Seattle game the following week somewhat intriguing because they can then build off of that,

find a way to get another sort of weird, quirky road victory like they did against Detroit a few weeks ago. Then you've gotten back to six and six and now a softer part of the schedule comes up against the, you know, the NFC least, so to speak, every team in the east except Philadelphia at that point. Now you've got maybe an outside chance to make something happen. But they just got to find a way to get J.J. McCarthy playing well and getting this offense and get this offense going in the right direction. And if they can find a way to squeak out a win on Sunday, that's where it's got to start.

It's got to start there. And then you just kind of take it one game at a time. And maybe if some things go your way, you can kind of write the ship. But until they do that, though, I'm going to be very, very skeptical. I mean, that's really the hard part is that if McCarthy had played well in these last two games and they lost on a kick return, then you might be saying, all right, well, win this one and at least it gets interesting. It gets interesting at five and six because you do have those easy games on the horizon. Yeah, you're probably going to have to pull off some kind of amazing upset against the Seattle Seahawks that will not be easy. they are missing some offensive linemen and maybe you can pull something crazy off there and

your season is back on or maybe you can rip off three straight wins against your three maybe easiest opponents on the entire schedule for this whole season in Washington, Dallas, and New York, then you can start working your way into it. But if you don't win this week, it is so completely thoroughly, fully over that we're probably having our first mock draft simulation. I think next week. I will do it. I am ready to do it. I asked today, Trevor Sycambe, who's coming on the show tomorrow, I asked him, I said, is the mock simulator up? And he's like, oh, yeah, it's up and it's ready to go.

I'm like, man, because a lot of fan bases have to start early. And unfortunately, if they don't win this game, then we start in December. If they do win this game, then at least the flicker of hope remains on that you could make something. out of that scenario that I laid out, which is last game of the season, have any chance. Even if you said, all right, these four teams have to lose today in order for, and the Vikings have to win against Green Bay for you to get in, even if it's one of those, I could at least go, all right, well, they did the best you could under the circumstances with the hole that they put themselves in.

But why don't we start picking and see where we end up at the end? So this week against the Green Bay Packers, Mani, I am on record with a 17 to 16 victory for the Minnesota Vikings. And my main reason is that the Vikings have a better kicker. And Will Riker, Will is fantastic. The Packers have struggled. The Packers are banged up. It's the best I can do.

And I feel like it's never a normal result down there. So I'm going 17, 16 Vikings. Will you pick the Vikings to beat the. Green Bay Packers this week. Well, let's see. Romeo Dobbs, questionable. Christian Watson, questionable. Savian Williams, questionable. Matthew Golden, questionable.

Dantavian Wicks, questionable. These are all the Packers wide receivers. They're all in the injury report. Josh Jacobs, questionable with a knee, limited in practice. Do the Packers have anybody on offense? You know, I mean, Kraft is really good. He's fantastic. He's out.

maybe is he oh yeah yeah he's out yeah that's right yeah that's right yeah he's out um so no the answer is no they have no players they have they have nobody so again and we said this going into the bears game hey vikings hey j j j mccarthy here's a real opportunity for you to show your stuff to put together a complete game a really good performance and here it is it's another opportunity for the Vikings to at least, you know, be competitive in this game, get some stops on defense, which they've been doing the last few weeks. I'm going to give the Vikings a win here, just because I'm going to try and wish this thing into existence, collar, just to keep this interest going for the rest of the season, because you're

right. I mean, if they find a way to win this, you're five and six, and then it makes that Seattle game even more interesting the following week. So I'll give the Vikings a win here just for the sake of for you and I to continue to have real strong interest in this team the rest of the season. I know. And I really like breaking down games and looking into key factors and all those things. And if they do not win this game, then that pretty much comes to an end. There's no real point in talking about how they match up against the Seattle Seahawks defensive line because even if they win that game, it's not that big of victory. In fact, it just moves them farther away from draft status. And then we have to have this existential discussion of

about whether, wait, do you want to win the games? But if the, you know, you don't win the games, then that means McCarthy played bad. But if he plays really bad, then that means, you know, he's really bad. I mean, and then it's like all of that is no fun at all. So yeah, I mean, all right. Why not? And I actually think what you said is exactly right. If you're making this case that the Vikings could beat the Packers, we look at their recent performances. They barely escaped against the New York Giants. That's a horrible team. The Vikings have so much talent.

If they get a B minus performance, if they get a C plus performance out of the quarterback, as long as he doesn't turn the ball over three times, then they've got a chance to stay in this game and potentially win against the Packers. I don't think this is as far away as maybe the records would suggest. So, all right, well, let's call it five and six. And then going out to Seattle for the Sam Darnold,

I refuse to call it a revenge game game. Well, I will give the Vikings a chance to win this game because of their defense and their knowledge of Sam Donald, Brian, Brian Florence, saw Sam Donald in practice every week for an entire season last year. So he knows a little bit about him, knows how to attack him, just going to come down to the defense being able to execute and make some things happen, and maybe for some turnovers, Sam's been throwing some picks the last couple of weeks. So we'll see, but I think it's going to be really tough still.

So I'm going to give Seattle a win here. I think it'll be close. I think it'll be very competitive, but I think that home field edge, and I think Sam Donner will come out and play pretty well. And I think Seattle will take home the victory. Folks, maybe you haven't started your holiday shopping yet, but those holidays sneak up on you fast. So let me give you some advice.

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the FDA does not approve or verify for safety effectiveness or quality prescription required see website for full details restrictions and safety information i also think seattle's got a top five most talented defense in the nfl and uh though i have been very very high on how the vikings have been playing in terms of an offensive line and blocking and pass protection that team is really really talented and will pressure the quarterback that's i think that's what makes it tough even last year, Sam Darnold was talking about playing in Seattle as being really difficult and they had some pre-snap issues and things like that. I mean, I know that McCarthy has been better on the road so far than he's been at home, but that is a tough place to play. And I think that

player for player, they can match up. The only thing, though, is if Seattle has some offensive linemen who are out, their center, who has been very good in past protection is out, Gray Zabel is banged up. I don't know if that's a longer term injury or not, but that's their first round draft pick they feel really good about and if you could stop their run game and then pressure sam darnold this is what we know that he has a pension for turning the ball over he can make amazing plays under pressure but he can also spin backwards and run you into a 15 yard sack uh he could also just kind of blindly fling it up there like he did too many times against the rams and i've also been waiting manny for at some point there is going to be a game where this team

gets four picks or gets three fumble recoveries or something, you just can't go this long with this much talent on a defense and never get turnovers outside of that one Cincinnati game. And I guess they do tend to come in bunches at times. Last year, they're leading the league in takeaways or in interceptions. And this year, they can't get the ball away from anybody. Feels like one of these games, it's this week against love or next week against Darnold. I think that's going to happen. but picking a loss here makes a lot of sense.

So if they go to five and seven, then the commanders come here, presumably with Marcus Marriota as their starting quarterback. And I guess he's a little banged up too. I think they're on a buy week coming up this week and he's a little banged up. I don't know who there. I do. Of course I do.

Of course I do. Okay, I'll get you a guess here. this quarterback has played for almost every team in the NFL, UFO, any other. Josh Johnson. There you go. Josh Johnson. Oh, my God. Yes, it is. He's played for half the league. And it's unbelievable.

It's incredible. Yes. So he can, he can win a game for them. But I think it'll probably be Marcus Marriota. Yeah. And Washington is just kind of a mess right now with the, with the, obviously the injury to Jaden Daniels. and their defense has just been really, really bad this year. I'm going to give the Vikings the win at home. At some point, the Vikings have got to find a way to win a game at home.

They haven't won a Cincinnati. That Bengals game was the only win at home this year. At some point, they're going to find a way to win a game at U.S. Bank Stadium. And I think this will be it on December 7th against Washington. So I'll take the Vikings in a win here. Oh, Josh Hanlon got injured. Please give me an update on that. Are you watching the game, Annie?

did he get banged up i am but i did not see him get injured oh okay commercial break right now okay chat give me a update on that uh chat's not so sold on seattle um justin thinks seattle's a mirage i don't i don't know about that uh their defense is really good the defensive line is really good man yeah Isaiah's got jsn going for over a hundred so does iconic yeah i mean that that's that's the other thing is they're going to have to get on Sam Donald because if they don't, I don't know if the Vikings corners can cover those receivers. Well, right, because they also added Shaheed, Rashid Shahid is very fast and Cooper Cup can still

play. He's not at the same level that he used to be, but middle of the field, you know, those completions, those easy completions that are there against Flores. And the one-on-one is for the issue that I would have with the Vikings beating Seattle is that Sam throws the deep ball as well as anybody in the entire NFL and what has killed the Vikings defense in their secondary this year. It's been when teams have been able to throw deep like Justin Herbert to Ladd McConkey or Devante Smith or AJ Brown. The last time AJ Brown looked happy was against the Vikings. And I mean, you have to say, I really have thought over the years that Byron Murphy Jr. has been a good corner for the Vikings. I think that he didn't just stop being a good corner. But the numbers don't

lie this year. It's been a much more difficult year for him. And I think that some teams have picked on him deep and gotten some big plays against him. Isaiah Rogers really struggles with that with the ball in the air, making a play on it. Um, so having receivers of that caliber, if they could get ISOed, it really is, can you throw Sam Darnold off in terms of changing coverages? That's what we just saw the Rams do. The Vikings can do it. But I mean, I think Seattle falls into the category, manny of just a second tier type of contender where you have, have your Rams and your Eagles and then there's a pretty big drop off. And then it's this is where Detroit is. This is where Seattle is. You know, this is where Green Bay lives. I don't even know if I

want to put the Chicago Bears there, but the 49ers are still in that conversation. Like, there's this big chunk of teams. Tampa Bay, Carolina is probably in a tier right below that. But, you know, they've won some games too. It's a mix mash after that. I think it's a two team league and then everybody else. And Seattle kind of showed last week, they played close against the Rams, but L.A. was still the better team. No question. And the Rams are, I think right now, probably the most complete team in the NFC. You know, Philadelphia has the talent to be a complete team, but, you know, they've had their struggles and inconsistency on offense. But the way Matthew Stafford is playing right now and the, the talent that they have on that defensive side as well, and they

have one of the best coaches on the planet as well. So you put all that together. That's a team that I think is just really head and shoulders above everybody else. Philadelphia is probably that one team that's right on par with them. But everybody else in the NFC is kind of chasing the Los Angeles Rams right now and just kind of hoping that they catch them on a bad day, which they haven't had many of those this season. Isaiah says we got two Isaiah's in the chat. Green Bay Whiteouts drop seven balls versus New York on Sunday. Defense dropped four interceptions. Yeah, I mean, I thought in that game, Jordan Love was really, really, really good. And there's only so much you could do.

Even in the game, was it against Philly, where he kept hitting receivers in the chest and they were dropping the ball. They have sold for years that, hey, we'll draft guys in the second round and we won't invest a lot of money on these wide receivers and they let Devante go and all that. Just has never found that guy that can be reliable for them. and now they're moving, you know, Bo Melton back to wide receiver. He was a corner at any time. And you've been through that. Who was the guy for the Vikings?

Was it Ben Tate? It was the guy that moved back and forth. Was that who I'm thinking of? Who was it? Robert Tate. Oh, Robert Tate. Robert Tate. Robert Tate.

Robert Tate, Robert Tate was the receiver. And I think he returned some punts and kicks. And no, he came up as a corner. And then he was playing special teams. And then they put him at receiver a few times. and it was a whole, yeah, it was a whole thing back of those days. Yeah. And Isaiah one, you're right that the, in the injury report in terms of who's like actually

going to play, yeah, it's only a couple guys that likely won't play, but banged up and missing practice is still of significance. So, yeah, I mean, like the, the Packers will not be playing with a full deck against the, the Vikings team. Plus, they're already missing Elton Jenkins, Tucker Kraft, and Jacob's not at 100%. Like, this is, in terms of. of health. It's a complete mismatch that the Vikings are way healthier and then getting Ryan Kelly back. So I think that that evens things out because Jordan Love, there's no question. He's a lot

better than J.J. McCarthy at this point. But if he's getting pressured all the time and if, you know, his wide receivers aren't getting open, aren't getting yards after catch or dropping balls left and right, well, then, you know, it kind of makes it easier for the Vikings defense. Anyway, so let's see. You had the, did we even pick the commanders game? We got off on Josh Johnson and so forth. So we had them at five and seven. I got the win in that game. Yeah. Okay. All right. So six and seven. Six and seven. Out to Dallas,

who is kind of a mystery this year, I think. They've been at times fantastic on offense. They certainly were the other day. Even if C.D. Lamb and George Pickens were having a nice, quiet meal and missing their curfew, I'm sure that they were just having a good conversation in a quiet casino corner with each other. And that's all that was happening in Las Vegas when they missed their curfew. It did not affect their performance, though, against the Raiders as they won that game. That's been a team that I thought at some point early in the season might just kind of click and break out.

But their defense is still really horrendous. But can the Vikings beat them? because DAC is a guy who has had some huge days against the Vikings historically, and those wide receivers versus the Vikings corners a little bit on the scary side, but this could be the game where J.J. McCarthy has a big breakout on national TV because everyone has a breakout against, except for Gino Smith, but he's been horrific this year. So how do you think it plays out? Do the Vikings get back to 500?

Yeah, this is going to be tough, I think. You know, and I've been picking the Vikings, I think, to win this game pretty much every week that I picked the schedule, mainly because of how bad that Cowboys defense is. But it feels like their offense is going to start clicking here with both of those receivers. You know, CD was a little banged up a little bit for them. But now they've got both of those guys back. And George Pickens is really showing his talent. It's not being quite as much of a knucklehead. as he's been in the past, but it's still in there a little bit.

And when DAC is on, he's one of the best quarterbacks in the NFL. So I think it's going to be a tough matchup. I mean, I think it's, I feel better. I would feel better about picking this game in a few weeks after the Washington game because I feel like if McCarthy can have, you know, a breakout performance against Washington, which the opportunity will be there because that defense is bad too. I feel like if he can break out against Washington, then that confidence will carry over against Dallas.

But again, he was going up against a bad defense this past week, and he couldn't take advantage of. He still played very poorly. So I'm not ready to just say, like, oh, J.J. McCarthy is going to have a breakout performance against this bad defense because he had the chance last week and he couldn't do it. So he's going to have to do it. I'm going to have to see it first.

So in the meantime, until I see that, I'm going to pick Dallas to win this game. And, yeah, that'll drop them to $5.8. I mean, this three game runs. So it really breaks up the rest of the way, the seven games break up into two really difficult road games, three extremely winnable games against garbage teams, and then two extremely difficult home games. and if you go one in one, two out of three, and then at least it's mildly interesting at the end. But three out of three is really what you need to get into that conversation again.

It's just hard to see that happening. Like in the NFL in general, I think they're better than all three of those teams as a complete team. And that's why the conversation is always so hard about picking games now is, well, yeah, I mean, they, they could. go three for three. They're way better from player number two to player number 53. But when you talk about the quarterback matchups, Jackson Darts been better than J.J. McCarthy's not even really close so far. And of course, Dak Prescott is better. Now, Washington to

me is a team that season is just completely over. So if you get two out of three, so we've got them now at what, six and eight is where you have them right now. And facing the New York Giants in New York December 21st. So do they get to at least 7 and 8 by Christmas time? I'm going to give them a win here

just because the Giants, I think the Giants are going to play a little better under Mike Kafka than they did under Brian Daible. Yeah. But you know, almost by default probably. But I think

I think this is going to be another one of those games where it's kind of weird again, where they're coming off the loss of Dallas and it's like, all right, they're just probably going to lose out. And then they show up in the Meadowlands and they just take care of business

and win a 28 to 13 or 2817 type of game where they don't really blow the Giants out, but the Giants are never really competitive in the game. And that ends up being one of their best performances of the year. and it'll improve them to seven and eight. Okay, seven and eight. Yeah, I mean, it's so hard with a team like the Giants because sometimes when a team fires its coach,

everybody just is like, pack it in, let's plan the vacations. Where would you like to go? You know, the Cobb always gets thrown out there, but people vacation in lots of different places. I don't know why Cabo gets all the pub. I've never been to Cabo, have you? I have not been to Cabo.

No, I've never, never been to Mexico. ever. What is your, if you were on the Giants, what, where would you be planning your vacation right now? Where, like, what, what place? Because if I was on the Giants, I would have it booked. I'm like, let me get in early. You never know with travel. You know, things could change. Let me get my flight set up to where are you going. Probably, yeah, probably Florida or like Cancun, Cabo, something like that, just somewhere warm, somewhere, you know, outside. of yeah somewhere outside of new york in the wintertime somewhere warm i feel like your creativity was very low on that one man i was but uh maybe that's why maybe everyone says maybe everyone

just wants to get warm uh i was good i mean for me i like going to vegas a lot um which is really funny because i'm not a gambler or drinker but there's a lot to do in Vegas i went to a pen and teller show which was amazing the last time we went i went and saw lady gaga at their arena, which was really cool. I'd love to go to a hockey game. I've been to an ACE's game out there. That was awesome. So, you know, there's lots to do. I'd probably, I'd probably go out to the desert. Anyway, seven and eight. This is where we're at, folks. Seven and eight. And they will play the Detroit Lions on Christmas Day with just, what, three days in between. That could be pretty tough. I imagine Detroit will be jockeying for a position for the,

at top of the NFC North. At that point, can the Vikings get to an eight and eight by the time they head into week 17? Is that possible for you, Maney? I'm going to say no, because I think the, in addition to the Lions,

you know, jockeying for playoff position and, you know, trying to secure the division, I would imagine as well, I think the Lions are going to be really pissed off at the Vikings, that the Vikings came into Ford Field and kind of be,

them up a little bit. That the Lions just kind of strike me as that team that's very prideful, very competitive. They have seized control of the NFC North over the last couple of years. And they don't want any one of these other teams coming into their yard and beating them. So I think the Lions are going to be coming into that game, playing with a purpose, motivated fully. And I think they're going to take it to the Vikings that day. And that will drop the Vikings to seven to nine.

We got some good answers. Bora Bora. Where is Bora Bora? Here's when you guys find out I know about absolutely nothing except for football. I don't know where Bora Bora is. Do you? Let's see. French Polynesia. Did you know that or did you know? You didn't know. I just looked it up. I was going to say there's no way you knew that. So we're talking Pacific Ocean.

It's like an island. Okay. Okay. Now this one I've never heard of Seychelles. Is that how it's pronounced? Is that I, that's that I googled that East Africa. How do you guys know about these places? It looks incredible, though, from the pictures. Okay. I've, you know, the only international travel I've ever done is to Canada, which shouldn't surprise anybody. Hawaii, it's a good answer. Hawaii's a good answer. It's a little long of a trip for me. I don't like to be in a plane for that long. Canada, I guess you could say I guess the Bahamas would kind of count as I've been to the Bahamas a couple of times that would count, that would be the extent that in Canada would be the extent of my international travel bill. Oh, is it pronounced? Say shells.

Is that how it's pronounced? Sorry. Let's see. Has the huts with the glass box? Oh, yeah, I've seen that. Okay, Bora Bora. You know, like where it's, you're in the ocean, It's like crystal clear.

Okay. That seems pretty good for Jackson Dart to go after his team is eliminated from the postseason. I think there was a point there about how sometimes, and we just got off track, but sometimes teams, they dig in. They are like, we are going to prove that it was freak of Brian Dable's fault and that that guy was a joker and we are going to fight like madmen for Mike Kafka. and sometimes they book to Seychelles or Bora Bora and you get an easy win against that team because the one thing that we could be pretty darn sure about is that this team is not going to give up like the Vikings are not going to turn on their coach they're not going to turn on each other like there's just too many veteran players that have way too good of reprepretations

to do that I mean Donovan Jackson I mean that guy's fighting every game to progress and Will Fry's. They gave him way too much money to take it, you know, half-hearted. Brian O'Neill is a warrior, man. He's going to fight through everything to be out there. Derisaw is too good. You know, Jefferson's going to be out there as he was.

Remember what a lunatic he was in, was it week 18, 2023, and he was pissed off that they took him out of the game at the end when it was a 10-point game and they couldn't win and he, like, wanted to go back in. So, like, I think this team is going to continue to just, like, like crazy, which means if the giants are booking, what else we got? We got a New Zealand.

Oh, I, you know, I'd like to go to New Zealand. I know very little. I know very little about it, but I'd like to go there. It looks incredible. I watch a lot of House Hunters International, Manny. And let me tell you, those people are unhinged. Sometimes, sometimes you will see people. We watched an episode the other night, because we'll just call one up every once in a while

and watch it, where the people were moving to, or the guy was moving to like Bangkok and he was moving there with like he had just quit his job and his whole story was that he needs an apartment for like $300 a month and he was talking about how he had been in real estate and had a big house in Charlotte or something and then all the sudden's moving to Bangkok to start his own company and needs it to be like three or $400 a month for the rent and you're like are you a criminal on television? why what did you do in charlotte that made you need to move to thailand or whatever i don't know man better off trying to stay in a hostel or something man so i yeah yeah i think i mean that's those show up

at times uh but uh okay yeah new zealand is nice trained there with the new zealand military that's awesome yeah it looks like a looks like a really cool place to go uh but every time usually the people who are moving to new zealand though my point was on house hunters is that they're normal. They're like, oh, yeah, we got awesome jobs in New Zealand. So that's why we're moving there. And you're like, well, this episode sucks. Move on. I want, I want, I want crazy couples that just met for the first time as they're moving to some random company or country. I want people who start weird companies that seem very fake and might be, you know, money launderers that for some reason decided to put themselves on television. Like,

that's what I'm looking at. There was one, and we'll get back to picking the schedule. There was one where a guy moved to Mexico after he got divorced. And he made sure to mention numerous times that he was dating in Mexico. And then they like showed one girl he's out on a date with. And I'm like, this dude went on TV just to be like to his ex-wife, yeah, I'm doing great in Mexico. Like this show is insane. Tara, I'm not making this up. Tara Reid's sister showed up on Househunter's International moving to the Netherlands. This is. a real episode, moving to the Netherlands to start a company where she

helped people do shrooms safely. Not making it up. That's real. Tara reads. For some reason, for some reason, that does not surprise me. It's hilarious, but it does not surprise me for some weird reason.

Because we were looking at this woman and we're like, she looks really familiar. I mean, she looks just like somebody. Who does she look just like? And, you know, my wife's, I think, like, she looks like Tara Reid. And then we went back to the beginning and looked at the name. Then we looked her up on Instagram and found her shroom company.

And they showed her in the Netherlands, like, doing shrooms with people. It was crazy. And, like, the voiceover lady who's got to be, you know, 75 years old, she's like, she started her company there, you know, helping people do illicit drugs or whatever. It was like so unhinged. It's a great show. Japan. Yeah, you're, you know, you're right about that Hunter that we, you never hear no player ever says or they never even make a joke of like, oh, go see Japan after the season.

I'm sure players do it, though. Like, I would love to go to Japan. My brother's been there. Yeah. Seems pretty cool. Japan's on my list of places that I would love to go to. I've always wanted to go to like Greece and Italy. Since I was a kid, I've always been fascinated by those places.

but, like, Japan is also one of those places where it's like, I want to go over there and just, like, have the food and kind of explore, you know, some of the mountains over there and just the scenery and everything. I'd be really curious about that. I mean, the history's got to be insane, right? Like, I think it's pretty cool to go to the East Coast, D.C., Virginia, and see, like, the Revolutionary War stuff. And you're thinking about, you know, 400 years ago where, how many of her years ago? Uh, 300? it doesn't matter, but when, uh, whatever number of years ago it was, like I said, not a history major, just majored in who was the backup quarterback for the San Francisco 49ers

in 1993. It was probably Elvis Gerbach. Anyway, um, or I guess it still would have been Steve Young. Steve Bono. Well, yeah, it could have been. 93 Niners might have been Steve. Yeah. Just, just pick a chief's quarterback. Anyway, the point is that Japan, I mean, that history goes back so much farther that it would be fascinating to see all the things there. What game were we on? We just, I just picked the lions to get revenge on the Vikings

for beating them earlier. World, World debt now says what did we end up with the Vikings? Yeah, sorry about that. Sorry about that. We just got to a loss on Christmas Day and decided where everyone was taking vacations after. I mean, for me,

I'm serious about me. I'll probably go to Vegas. Like, I'm going to need a week after this for sure. So anyway, you have them at losing to the lions puts them at seven and nine. So that means the last game of the season will be against the Green Bay Packers. And the way it's playing out, Mani, I've got to think that the Packers are going to be fighting for something because they seem like a win one lose one team the rest of the way. They don't seem to me like they're going to just get blazing hot, run through the schedule, win, in a row, get to the last week, and then be resting their starters. I think they're going to be playing for something.

And if you have JJ McCarthy's your quarterback and in this scenario, he's gotten it together enough to win some games to beat a Washington, to beat a New York on the road, to beat a Green Bay this week, even if it's with Will Reichard kicking six field goals or something, if they have a chance to get to eight and nine and potentially knock the Packers out of the playoffs and get a good. game from J.J. McCarthy, then at least you can hold on to something for the eight months that we all have to be tortured without football. Do they do it, Mady? Do they do it? Well, the Packers are going to be the fascinating team to watch down the stretch of the season because tiebreakers are basically

not going to mean anything for them because they have like an actual literal tie. So they can't really tie with anybody else i suppose they could they could tie with the cowboys have the same record as the cowboys and that would make things very interesting if dallas somehow finds themselves in into the conversation but um yeah it's it's really going to be you know every game is really going to matter for them i think the rest of the season and i think this is also another situation where they could be looking at a little bit a little bit of payback because i've got the vikings winning at Lambo this coming Sunday and maybe the Packers are

a little bit ticked off that they you know that they also lost to the Vikings at home and I want to take it to them and to your point they're going to be right in the thick of things for a playoff spot even if they've already sort of clinched the spot at that point they might be jockeying for

a higher seed to get maybe a better matchup you know so I'm going to take the Packers to win this game and the Viking season and at 7 and 10, and the Packers will have a little momentum going into the playoffs. I think that's extremely fair. I think it's extremely fair.

That 7 and 10 from here on out means that you went, what, 3 and 4, which is kind of who you've been. And they are healthy right now, but that doesn't guarantee they'll be healthy the whole rest of the season. And if they have some injuries, if they have some struggles, then you could end up with McCarthy's ups and downs. if there are ups, then you still end up with seven wins.

And then I was talking about this last night in the show, Manny, that seven wins are a really hard outcome. It's probably the hardest outcome to deal with because let's just play it out in our minds with J.J. McCarthy. Let's say he wins an ugly one in Green Bay, just like he was in Detroit. And then he has a disappointing one against Dallas or something that lose that game.

And you're going, once again, what is this? right because I absolutely promise you he's going to have one of these games we're like whoa j j mccarthy and uh the quarterback who shalt not be spoke of on this show from the past had some games where he put up some numbers he had a game against the packers where they got into the playoffs that everybody hung on to and and those things and even you know the guy who's never been brought up as a comp to j jay probably because it wasn't the same draft status as Tavares Jackson, but I was looking back at his history, and he started off horribly, and then he had some moments, he had some games, and it just wasn't consistent enough.

So I think if that ends up being the case where you have two or three games from McCarthy out of the final seven that are really good, seven puts you in a spot where, yeah, you could maybe talk yourself into everything will be fine, but it's not good enough to be sure everything will be fine. If you get to nine wins, then everything will be fine. If you get to eight, maybe that means you played well enough to be in a couple of games that even he plays well and loses. But if you get to seven, it's like, what now? How do we even view this thing? I remember that afternoon, 2008, in Arizona, where Tavares Jackson just lit up the Cardinals. And it was the year the Cardinals went to the Super Bowl, Kurt Warner, and the Vikings

went down there and kicked the crap out of them, blew them out. And it was like, oh, maybe they've found the guy, maybe, you know, and then obviously we know what happened the rest of the way. Your good buddy, Gus Farrat could probably tell you a lot about how that whole thing went down, that whole season. Yeah, yeah. I actually did interview Gus once about that season because he kind of was pulling a case Keenum where, you know, he came in and Gus was actually nice enough to do.

the interview, even though obviously he was unhappy about not getting to start the playoff game. And, you know, when you go back and look at Gus's actual performances, he won eight games with like 12 touchdowns and 16 picks. I mean, it was not great, but he did talk about that. And I'm sure that he was still very unhappy that they didn't give him a chance to start. But that's kind of the point, though, right about, you know, Tavares. And look, you know, it's harder to talk about him because he has since passed away and everything I've ever heard about Tavares Jackson was positive from his teammates and so forth, him as a coach and things like that. But if we're looking at it just, you know, from his trajectory with the Vikings, they drafted him. They

wanted him to be their guy. They believed in him. And it just, and he had the moments and it just wasn't consistent enough. And I think he actually had, you could tell me better, but I think he actually had more moments where you thought that than Christian Ponder, right? Oh, yeah, goodness, yes. I remember the last, the year before in 2007, the last game of the year against Denver, he had one of the best games of his career, and it was kind of derailed. Vikings end up losing that game, and it was derailed because Troy Williamson had dropped a couple of really easy passes, a deep pass where Jackson just dropped it right into his bread basket, and Williamson just dropped it.

threw another one to him where it just hit him right in between the eight and the two on his jersey and just, you know, just dropped it. And I remember Jackson led them on a couple of scoring drives late in that game because they were down,

I think, by 16. And why I remember this is beyond me, but they were down by 16. I think he led them on two drives of touchdowns and two-point conversions to tie the game. I think they ended up losing it overtime to end the season. But Jackson definitely had his moments that had you think, okay, there's there's something there's something there. But he just could never really really put it all together.

And obviously they went and got far off the next year in 2009. So, yeah, I think with McCarthy, I think it's where I think at some point the season we're going to see that moment for him too, where he puts on a great performance. but I think we have to remember not just because of history, but I think just because of just common sense that one big breakout game doesn't necessarily mean that he has arrived. It's something that we are going to need to see continue and be more consistent over the course of the rest of this season. And, you know, depending on how things finish out this year,

we'll determine if they go out and get some competition for him next off-season and then we'll see how that plays out. But, you know, I think we're going to need to see obviously some huge strides, some huge improvements from J.J. McCarthy over the course of the season. And again,

keep saying it, there's going to be opportunities for him to have these big performances. But damn it, he's got to go out there and he's got to do it because he had a chance to do it last week and he couldn't get it done. Let me take a look here. I'm curious about remaining defenses, where PFF has them.

Because these are based on the player performance is not numbers. And numbers can be pretty tricky, you know, just with some teams haven't had their buy week, which is ridiculous. And also just, you know, schedule and stuff like that. So this is just grading their performances. Overall defense. So they play the Lions in the Packers,

who are currently third and fourth, and Seattle, who is sixth. So that's not going to be too easy. that he did have a good game against Detroit already. So there is that. And then, though, I got to scroll quite a ways. Washington is 27th. The Giants are 29th.

And the Cowboys are 30th. You know what just popped into my mind, Manny, is a three-game run where J.J. McCarthy is absolutely feeling it. And then we're like, what do we do with this? Because they just played three of the five worst defenses. Where does Chicago rank? Because they had a bad statistical defense. They're in the bottom third, too, aren't they?

25th, yeah, by PFF, 25th by PFF, yeah, which of their grades would have gone up after this weekend. So maybe we can't guarantee anything when it comes to that. But even then, I think that tells you how hard this is. Like when you go back and look at Sam Darnold one of those years, I think it was maybe 2019, he had a great run to end the season. And everyone went, oh, yeah, he's arrived. And then the next year, you know, it just wasn't good enough.

And that's what's hard about trying to figure this out. What I wish we could do, Manny, is in some sort of hypothetical, world take j j mccarthy and put him somewhere else in like 2023 at this age develop him for three years and then bring him back but you can't do that but you can't do that because that's what we all need to know and also how far can you come along i have seen enough for mccarthy in terms of high-end stuff athleticism arm strength and character stuff the way he's handled all of this and he You can make fun of them. All you want, people on TikTok, you're all hilarious, I get it.

But from a reporter perspective of him, you know, giving insight into how he's viewing this stuff and feeling, I think, I just think it's wrong to like, hey, the kid's saying, I've got to rewire how I do a lot of stuff. People are like, oh, man, he's cooked. You know, like, come on. Everyone has to do that. Donovan Jackson told me the other day that college is so much different from the NFL. He's had to change his mindset entirely.

No one made fun of Donovan Jackson. because he could pick you up and throw you over the stadium, but also because he's playing well. And when McCarthy said this stuff during training camp, people ate it up. Oh, that's my quarterback and everything else. So I think that's unfair to him. I think that he's handled all of this very well, considering the weight of the entire franchise is rested on his shoulders.

And sometimes I feel like he feels that when he's trying to make a throw. I thought that the Jordan Addison deep shot to the end zone was either, he's not seeing anything out there and just fires it up. because Naylor is wide open right in front of him, but it also could be, I got to make a play. I got to take a deep shot. And I think the average depth of target stuff, people wanted to put it on KOC,

but I think a lot of it was him just trying, like I'm going to push it down the field, I'm going to make a play, I'm going to get an explosive here. I'm going to come back in this game and I'm going to win this for us. And I think that that's been a little bit to his detriment. But overall, you know, he's continued to go back to work,

and he's had at least from what the players and the coaches have said, good practices and he's trying to make progress, but you can't do what I said. You can't, like, go back in time and uninjure his knee so he develops for an entire year. And the unfortunate part, man, he is that they need answers. They can't just hang around and wait until 2027 and then go, the light went on because then you're going to have seven win seasons of people are going to get fired and then you're

going to be talking about, you know, his rookie contract running out. So the fact that the clock is ticking makes this so unbelievably unfair to young quarterbacks, but that's the reality we live in. No question. And I think about when you're talking about him, you know, almost trying to do too much, always trying to go for the big play all the time. I think about the first pick that he threw against Baltimore, where he had 10 yards of turf in front of him to just, I think it was third and six on that play.

He had plenty of time to just, you know, tuck the ball and take off and run and pick up the first down. but he was trying to hit that home run because like he wants to try and show like I can make the big time throw at this level and I can show everybody that I can do this. I think for him it's just going to come down to just finding finding a good balance, you know, and that's a hard thing to do because all of these quarterbacks, all of these, the elite ones, the Mahomes, the Jackson's, the Josh Allen's, all of these guys, they all of these guys. all want to make big plays happen. They all want to make that big explosive play to try and help their team win. But they, but those guys understand that sometimes you got to dial it back a little bit. He can't, he can't throw a 120 mile an hour fastball over the middle to Aaron Jones, who's like seven yards in front of you because it's probably going to go right through his hands. It's like it just feels like he's got to just dial back everything a little bit, not just a

physical stuff, but the mental side of it too. And I, you know, he's 22 and I don't know what's going on in his head, but it feels like every, he's just so ramped up and so amped up. And, and I think that just comes from obviously him being physically talented, but him also just being 22 and playing high level competitive college football his entire time at Michigan, just playing big game after big game every single week. So he's constantly in that mindset. and it's not a bad thing, but he's going to have to figure out a way to find some balance and all of this.

And he's going to have to do it pretty quickly because to your point, the clock is ticking and the Vikings as a franchise need to figure out if this kid can really handle all of this going forward. It's all so challenging because the peak for quarterbacks is what, 25 to 32. And let's even call it. I mean, Sam Darnold didn't click until 27.

A lot of the quarterbacks that we grew up watching didn't click until 26, 27, right? And he is four years away from that. How are we supposed to know when that's going to get there? But also, we've seen some other quarterbacks that, you know, they get other chances like Justin Fields, multiple other chances. And the main issue was he couldn't see the field and he couldn't get the timing of offenses right. And it haunts him. And actually, to me, what's more disturbed. than footwork and throwing is timing.

It's the fact that you see receivers flash open. Here is when I think KOC will say like it presents itself. And you can stop the tape. And every one of us, it doesn't take any sort of all 22 genius. You could stop the tape and you could go, this is where the ball is supposed to be out right now. And it's not. And then it's, oh my God, throw it as hard as possible

because I missed my little tiny and this is how hard it is. big league baseball players hit 100 mile an hour fastballs. I don't think anyone could fully conceptualize how fast a hundred mile an hour fastball looks when you're in there. It's the same thing here. Justin Jefferson runs 20 something miles an hour. That is so freaking fast. I mean, so to have, he goes into his break and he hits that thing.

And the ball has to be already there. It's got to be already in the air. And it's got to be floating in a way that he could catch it running into it. And Kurt Warner, I did a really. really enjoyable story with Kurt Warner about, you know, the timing and things like that and the touch throws, I think was the main subject. And Kurt was talking about how he would put the ball into a space. And this is really accuracy. When you think about this, like think Philip Rivers, think Drew Brees, where he would put it into a space where the receiver could run into it.

And one of the things he said was, if I float the ball with a pretty good touch on it into that space. My receiver has a lot of room for error. So, or my throw has a lot of room for error. My receiver can adjust to it. He can bring himself back a few feet. He can bring himself forward a few feet. He can get an extra little edge as the ball is in the air on the corner who can't see the ball, but he can. And completion percentage goes into all these sorts of things. And Drew Brees is famous for this. You know, putting the ball up, Rivers was so good at it, putting it up into an area and the receiver runs into it, but it looks like you are the most accurate person,

the history of the United States of America, when really your wide receiver may have been like, oh, that's like five yards off, but I can come back to the football because I have time. If you are Jordan Addison and you are running 25 yards down the field and someone throws you a howitzer, I mean, you better reach up and snatch that thing out of the air, but if you have it slightly off,

it's going to bounce off your fingers. And I think that we've just not seen that really enough from J.J. McCarthy. And can you throttle it down? Can you put that touch on it? He's had a couple throws, but not enough with consistency and not enough with good timing. That makes me think, oh, yeah, this thing's right around the corner. I think you can fix where your feet are with your shoulders. I don't know if you could fix the wiring in your brain to process at that speed.

Can you hit a hundred mile an hour fastball? I don't know. You mentioned Drew Breeze, and I'm so glad you did because, and you've heard me, you know, off the air talk about this play that I'm going to bring up so many times. It's the Minneapolis Miracle game and the Saints are driving on their final possession. I know what you're talking about. It's like, I think it's fourth and eight or fourth and nine or something like that at like midfield. And Drew Breeze calmly drops back and just drops a.

perfect dime to Willie Sneed on the left side, near side of the screen. And it's just a perfect throw. He threw it with anticipation. He threw it with touch. And it was right on the money. And that is a high leverage, high pressure situation. If you don't execute that throw to perfection, your season is over. Obviously, the season did end that afternoon for the Saints on a later play.

is kind of famous but in that particular situation and that you know i mean drew breezes you know in his late 30s and one of the best quarterbacks of all time at that point in his career but again like that's the type of stuff that like the great quarterbacks brady so brady do it a lot so manning do it a lot just mentioned drew breeze those guys can make those throws and that is something that is going to come with time it's just a i think it's just a The question is just going to be how soon, if at all, can J.J. McCarthy pick up those little things to become a good quarterback in this league. Right. And you're not asking him to be Breeze. Your point is that that's a great example of a very memorable anticipation throw. Bonus points if you know who was covering Willie Sneed. Do you know? Was it? No, it wasn't Xavier Rhodes because he was guarding Michael Thomas most of that game.

Who are the other corner of been? Was that Terrence Newman covering him? It was not. It was McKenzie Alexander. I think that they were in, well, I think, because Sendejo got hurt, I think, in that game. And maybe they were in a dime package where he was in. I believe he was the defender who got beat on that one. So anyway, the point just being that timing and anticipation, it takes a lot of time.

And sometimes there's nothing you could do. Like, this is when we're talking about Tavares. Like, I think that was with him. It was the consistency. He threw rockets. He had a great arm. But the consistency of anticipation is a hard thing to figure out whether it's going to arrive or not.

I mean, I think the actual intellectual part, the off the field, the X's and O's, the way he handled the protections was really good and stuff like that. I think that he gets all that. But how can any of us know if that other part is going to eventually click in or even if it clicks into a certain level. Is it good enough to compete for a Super Bowl next year? Because I want to say this is so much focus on one guy, J.J. McCarthy. And I know there's some lingering, like people hoping it's KOC's fault. It's, it's not. But if you get to five years, no playoff wins, that is a disaster. I don't care how many fun moments you had

along the way. I mean, for every, you know, nice Buffalo win that was memorable, I was there. It was a special time for me to go back home and then have a game like that was incredible, but A, the playoffs. And that's what you're here for. So the pressure is really high on everyone in the organization after this year. And that's not J.J. McCarthy's fault that he got drafted to a team like this with expectations. Also, you're allowed, you're allowed as a young player to have success if you're good, right? So, it really comes down to whether he can get it or not, because I think there's a lot of the rest of the bones of this thing is very good. And that, that's a hard place to be. As a professional conversationalist, it's a hard place to be. Because it's like, what are they

going to do at corner? I don't know. Is JJ good? Like, I don't know. Like, that's what everything is going to funnel back into. Because after last week, I had no more to say about KOC needs to do this. he needs to do that he needs to run he needs to change the offense whatever's like look if he just gave him that many open receivers and that good a running game and it still couldn't execute i think we know he's just got to figure it out or he's not going to and somebody earlier in the comments sorry i lost it said like seven and ten's the worst seven and ten is the worst if that uh ends up happening so i think what you're rooting for is the extremes of this lose the next two games get to what does that put you at four and eight then

then it's just a full on disaster season and you stumble into the end and maybe win five or six you draft really high and you get the best corner out there and you go from there or you get to eight or nine and JJ's played really good and every other outcome is very hard to deal with yeah I mean seven and ten you said seven and ten is kind of like worst case scenario because it's like if you're going to go seven and 10 you might as well have just gone like five and 12 you have a higher draft pick and an opportunity to get an even better an even better player and then maybe you're less likely in a position to build the need to move up a few more spots in next spring's draft to move up to like six

to get a player that you really really want and you're sitting at nine or 10 because you went seven and 10 instead we kind of dealt with that a couple of years ago when they went seven and 10 and they were still trying to, after Kirk got hurt, they were trying to keep the season alive and they put Dobbs in and he won a couple games for them and and it kind of really, you know, it ended up not being the season that that you wanted to have. So yeah, 7 and 10 is not, not ideal. It's kind of what I've got them at going right now, the way things are looking, but it's not ideal because it's already disappointing season because the expectations were very high even with a young quarterback and now

it just kind of puts you in that weird sort of awkward spot because at least if like you said at least you finish eight and nine or dare I say even nine and eight and you still don't make the playoffs that probably means McCarthy played really well and you're feeling really good about you know where he's at and what you've got going into next season but but seven and ten and it's just kind of meh and you're still not entirely sure about the quarterback and then your traffic isn't really all that high either now you're kind of in that no man's land what happened the dog knocked down a bunch of plates or something yeah i'm not sure i'm gonna have to i'm gonna have to see what the i was like everybody okay up there i i am not i'm not alone with the dog

this evening so i'm hoping every everyone upstairs is safe uh sorry about that. But anyway, man, this has been great. I want to answer a few comments and then get to Aaron Nagler on the show, which a lot of people have asked for NAGs to come on this week. So I recorded with him yesterday about where the Packers are at. I want to bring you that in just a moment. But great stuff. As always, my friend, we'll see you on Monday. And the thing about the NFL is it can all feel different in a couple of days. And I really thought that was going to be this week. I really, I really thought I was, I was watching Bears tape. I'm looking at Bears data and I was like, this team's not good. Like, JJ's going to have all day to throw the ball. They're going to win

this game and then like the seasons back on and it will be fun again. And it wasn't. And I was completely wrong. So we'll see what happens against the Packers. Maybe they'll blow them out and then it'll feel very different then. But great stuff. Either way, we will be here with the round table on Monday. So thank you, Mr. Hill. You got it. See you later. Football. All right. Let me get to a couple of your guys' questions, comments. And also, if you didn't answer the fan duel question of the day, Vikings are plus 175 to win eight games. Give me your percentage chance that they get there. I saw a 35% chance earlier. I think that's probably optimistic, I think. Let's see, Mr. T. Greens is KOC is overcoaching guys. It took three games to coach all of Dobbs' best

qualities out of him. Look, for making comps, Dobbs can't be it. Dobbs is 3 and 12 for his career. He's a fourth round backup quarterback. We just can't, we just can't use Josh Dobbs for like weather KOC or even Nick Mullins, who I don't think you could have possibly gotten any more out of Nick Mullins in those games. Mr. T. Green says, I thought McCarthy was supposed to be a dual threat. Seems like KOC is coaching him to ignore his instinct to run. I don't think that that was the case against Detroit, thought they used it quite well. Chicago in the first game, didn't run in the last game, but had plenty of time in the

pocket to not do it. I don't think that McCarthy is a running quarterback. I think that he's a quarterback with the capability to run, which is quite a different thing. There have been a few times, though, that I'd like to see it, even the throw that was dropped by Addison. He had 20 yards in front of him that, you know, he should take off. And I think that that could even out some of the stuff in terms of trying to win games.

the ups and downs if he did take off a little bit more. But I don't think you want him running a lot and taking a lot of hits because he's also kind of a crazy person when he gets outside of the pocket and he took a couple of huge hits against the Detroit Lions that I wouldn't want him taking. I want him playing and throwing footballs. We don't need to see if he can run or not. You need him to throw the ball. So I'm not really into, hey, they should start doing the time for they need to take drastic

measures to eke out wins is gone for me. Just run your offense and see what happens. That's where I'm at right now. Walter says some of the media have Brozmer needs to play more than J.J. McCarthy. Well, I mean, look, when it comes to the JJ or with, you know, JJ and Max Brosmer, there was a point in the last game where I thought put in Brosmer. Like I felt the same way as you guys. It was going so badly that Brosmer would have given them a better chance to win,

possibly just by, hey, he can see it and get the football out. But you also have to understand, you know, Max has not been taking first team reps. You saw how hard that is from Shadur Sanders. He has not ever taken first team reps. And you're asking him to go in and try to save a season against the Chicago Bears. It's kind of too much, too much to ask to just pull your starting quarterback at that point just because you don't like the way he's playing. What I would like to see with Brosmer is, hey, look, if, you know, if JJ gets banged up and he goes, and plays, then we'll all find out.

But what I'd like to see is another full off season of building on this. And then him as part of a competition next year, whether it's backup behind McCarthy or as a part of a competition, I mean, I guess to start, depending on how it goes, probably not, probably is a backup and see where his career takes him from there. He's a rookie. Like, I think that there's some desperation to just see something different, anyone different. That's where the most popular person on the team is the backup course. quarterback. Let's let Max Rosemur develop too. He's an undrafted free agent. He's shown a lot of

talent for seeing defenses, understanding how offenses work, throwing with good timing and rhythm. And I like them as much as everybody else. I don't think it's a good time to toss your first round draft pick who has all these great physical tools onto the sideline for the undrafted guy because you don't like how the first round pick is playing through five games. But I mean, look, I would not count Max out for anything. I wouldn't count him out for eventually becoming a starter for having a really good career. I think that's all on the table for him, from what I've seen. He had a really, really good training camp and practices from what I saw.

And as far as his intellect and his ability to understand the game, it's elite. He's as good as it gets when it comes to that. He's going to be in the NFL a long time. Let's see. Do you all think the way McCarthy throws for? from a wider stance is affecting his accuracy. Oh, there's no question. There's no question that it is.

When you slide that foot out there, then where does your head go? Like your head for throwing the ball, think about this. I mean, if I'm going to toss you a ball from 10 feet away, if I look at you and toss it to you, or you shake me around like this and then I throw it, like which one's going to be more consistently accurate? If you are sliding way out, I mean, you are taking,

you are taking your head down with you, most of the gray passers, they're rotating almost, this is why it's so similar to a golf swing, they're almost rotating around as if there was like something straight up the middle of them. Like it was sticking you in place and they're rotating around it, right? As opposed to sliding forward like you're out of the stretch as a pitcher. Like, that's not how you want to do this because you're talking about why. wanting to keep that head as stable as possible to hit your target. I've learned a lot about these quarterback mechanics lately,

but, you know, that's one thing that I've definitely taken away from. I also think that if he was timing things better and throwing with better touch, that he could have some inaccuracy issues because of the mechanics, and it would still be okay. But it hasn't been because the timing is, is way off. Hunter says tired of people coming up with BS excuses for why this season and his QB play is an utter disaster. Well, that's right. I mean, if we're, if we're living in,

if we're all living in reality, we can both say two things are true. J.J. McCarthy's career is not freaking over. He's not a bust. People love that word. They love to say it. They love to just slap a label on something. He's a bust, move on, don't know, whatever. And that's been the wrong way to approach a lot of quarterbacks historically. There's way too many quarterbacks who start off their career is tough and then got better for me to say, oh, bust, see ya, don't even talk to me about J.J. McCarthy, it's over. But also, in the other hand, it's been a disaster. You didn't expect to be four and six.

You didn't expect to be talking about the guy's wide base, 10 games into the season where he was supposed to take him to the playoffs. No, that is nowhere close to it. And they need to make sure as they talk about this season going forward, any leadership, coach, players, GM, that they are straightforward with the fans about that about that this is a big disappointment from where it was supposed to be because I know you'll hear that from the wolves when we talk with them. So I don't want to hear anything else because to me that would be disrespectful to the fans to have anything else. It was a,

it has been a massive disappointment. And unless they turn it around, they will have missed big time on what the timeline was supposed to be with McCarthy in his development. So there's no doubt about that. And I know that I think last week was where all the excuses sort of ran out. The maybe it's this, maybe it's that, maybe it's not running enough and all that sort of thing. World debt now says, I've been, I've never really believed in elite wide receivers. QB's make receivers. And I don't agree with that. I mean, Justin Jefferson. I know Mahomes won after Tyreek Hill left. But no, I think. think that receivers have a lot to do with their quarterback success. You can't just grab the

best quarterback of the generation and be like, see? I mean, that's like, people did this with Brady, but then Brady got Randy Moss. And by the way, the production for Mahomes since then has not been the same from Tyree Kill. Tom Brady was going along, going to Super Bowls, throwing 20 touchdowns. Then he gets Randy Moss and throws 50. So I've never really bought that. uh hunters best case scenario they win four and 13 yeah i mean losing the rest of the way and drafting really high is the best go check on i think everyone's okay i didn't hear any screaming from upstairs but maybe it was uh maybe it was the dog need flaco to compete with mccarthy hunters giving it 35% that they can win eight games uh last samurai you're probably right that

about the bears not being good because if they were they would have beating us by 40 they had the opportunity to you're right about that viking's defense gave him a chance uh i did not have cubies neurological pathways i know that's why he says stuff like that that you know people will pick on but again if he said that after he had won the game and said he was getting his neurological pathways figured out like he's not he's not wrong like i don't really know anything about neurological pathways but it's just i think that he's i think that he's very earnest when it comes to that like what's on his mind how he's feeling what he's thinking about those things

and I don't ever want to penalize somebody for just being themselves when they talk to us and what's what they're thinking and if they're thinking about their alter ego when they cross the white lines and they're they get amped up then like okay that's fine that's fine but you know the internet's gonna mock just about anybody

so it is what it is uh Brosbra Brady or Purdy I mean what are the odds of that very very low and this is coming from day one go back go back day one rookie minicamp listen to me talk about brosmer been impressed since day one is he brady probably not purdy maybe is he more likely a very very good backup quarterback for a long time probably that's probably the most likely um feel bad for our quality receivers yeah and they need they need to help he's brady yeah of course that's it yep he's brady

um yeah i've i've felt the same way at times and they need to help a little more, too. They need to make some plays this week. And I think that there's some regression stuff coming. Turnovers, drops are not going to continue at this rate, that they could win some games. I still think they could get to eight. I think they can get to eight because those teams from the NFC East are just garbage.

So I think eight is possible. I'd give it like a 58% chance that they could get to eight. That's my answer to the Fandul question of the day. okay uh great stuff from uh you guys refuse to believe anything else uh great stuff from uh you guys and manny i really appreciate it and uh i had a chance to catch up with my friend a ran nagler cheese ed tv covers the packers he is the uh packers analyst that vikis fans love to hate but he's always a fun time when he comes on the show so here is uh that conversation and just a reminder tomorrow there's actually a lot on the channel a conversation with ben

Gessling, breaking down the McCarthy situation. Trevor Sycambe of PFF drops by to talk about he's their draft guy. And we talk about looking back kind of at the draft and what we saw from McCarthy and what we've seen in terms of his development, where can it go? And then the hardcore breakdown is always on Friday night with Andrew Kramer. So tons, tons here on the channel. I've given you everything I got this week. It's been a long one, I think, for everybody following or covering the Vikings.

but, you know, we push forward. So here's my discussion with Green Bay Packers analyst, Aaron Nagler. All right. We welcome back to the show, a friend of mine, but not of Vikings fans, Aaron Nagler from Cheesehead TV. And, you know, Aaron, actually, I've had a few fans reach out and say, hey, I hope you're having Nagler on this time when the Vikings play the Packers. So that speaks to you as a reasonable analyst of the Green Bay Packers for a cheese.

she said TV at times. I appreciate it. Maybe your Twitter isn't always, but when I listen to your show, I think, all right, I get it. I get it from Nagler. Here's my question. When are they firing Matt LaFleurre because Vikings fans cannot wait for that, get him out of there.

You know what they should do? Every week, Jordan Love doesn't play well. The Packers fans want him out to trade your quarterback and coach that keep winning a lot of games. Just get rid of everybody. I think that's the plan, right? Yeah, I'm telling you, man. And it's wild in these internet streets because there are a number of Packers fans.

And look, I can kind of dismiss some of it as maybe they're trolling, maybe they're rival fans saying stuff. But, man, it is some Packers fans who, for whatever reason, none of it is good enough. Every week, there's something else that they're completely up in arms about. And as you point out, these guys, I mean, whether you're talking about LaFleur or Love, have won a bunch of football games, you know. And is it always pretty? Is it always perfect?

No, of course not. But, man, I really think they found a little something there in New York, beating the Giants, a different way of working on offense because the last couple weeks prior to that had been a little hard to watch. But some of that is driven by personnel and injury and whatever. But yeah, man, I don't know. It just maybe it's the internet age we live in. Certainly I don't remember people being this kind of hot to go about firing everybody off after every play at this point. And, like, it's not even after a game. And something I keep kind of reiterating at, she said TV, is you can just watch the game and enjoy it and then talk about it, analyze it throughout the week.

But not every play needs to be a referendum. And it feels like, especially in this kind of social media age, it's every play. If it's good, then, oh, well, they got lucky. You know, I've seen that thrown about quite a bit this week. And then if something's bad, well, that's proof that this guy stinks and he needs to go. rather than okay can we just let the game play out and i think if people were able to do that they probably enjoy it a lot more well that's uh that is for sure although i i could say that about viking's 24 not so much 2025 where i can't blame fans for having that reaction you guys are going through it

no doubt a little bit tough over here but you know what i think has broken people's brains a little bit other than just the internet and you know we want to react to every single thing like overreact to every single thing, is quarterback play for a couple years there, maybe 2019 through 2022 was just out of this world. And I feel like the defenses have said, give me the power back. And you have crazy, you know, coverages, crazy blitzes, some absolute freaks of this. Absolutely. And some of the freakiest freaks of all time are in their primes, including Micah Parsons.

And I think that it's created a little more inconsistency for quarterbacks. I think that coaches have had to adapt a little bit. And when it comes to how aggressive you can be and things like that down the field. And I look at a bunch of different quarterbacks through the league and where Jordan Lov ranks, you would think by reading some people about Jordan Love that he's had like, oh, man, he's just, he's just not the guy. And then I sort, you know, by PFF passing grade. And he's third in the league.

Not too shabby. Right. And, you know, top five and quarterback rating and all that. And it's like, this offense for the Packers. Number one in EPA at the moment, you know, it's like he's putting together a really good season. I wish more Packers fans appreciated it. But I think that when people watch every single play of every game of their own team and aren't watching every play of every game. There's some of this, yes.

You start to over break down every single up and down moment and don't maybe even realize this is some of the better quarterback play. but I think that watching like Mahomes do what he did for a couple years there and a lot of quarterbacks thrived and it seemed like quarterback play was getting easier now it's swung back the other way well and to your point you talk about 2019 through let's say 21 or 22 man you had Brady was still in the league right and Rogers was winning MVP's right and you had Mahomes right they were like yeah there was a ton of really fantastic quarterback play at a very high level from some vets right now you've got a new guard coming up. And I do agree that defenses have certainly changed as far as how many Sundays do you sit

here and watch. I mean, hell, you can just go through red zone and you see so many drives that have to be nine, 10, 11, hell, 12, 13 play drives. Man, it's tough. It's real tough to put those together consistently. Like, yeah, you can do it maybe once and score a touchdown or get in field goal range. But to do that over and over and over again, that's asking a whole lot. And eventually, yeah, these defense, they have these freak athletes, they have these incredible kind of coverages and disguises and ways that, you know, really weren't happening even five years ago. I think, yeah, there's a lot to the idea that these quarterbacks are up against a very different challenge.

Now, football is cyclical, as you know, and the best way to go about this is to run the ball, right? And you've seen teams kind of lean into that. And the Packers tried to do that. They just can't do it, you know? So that, to me, is the A number one thing I'm going to be watching for on Sunday because for all the kind of flowers, I want to give Jordan Love, he has struggled against this defense. Like, it hasn't mattered. The one game, I think, where he kind of really came to life was that New Year's Eve game a couple years ago.

But even then, you guys were starting a, what, a rookie quarterback. And the game script played more into that than anything else, right? So, I mean, one billion percent, the Packers are going to try and run the ball. And I know Minnesota hasn't had a lights out run defense. But this is a defense that has given him in particular. the floor a little bit, a bunch of problems. And it's definitely improved over the last few weeks when Brian Flores switched to playing an old school three, four, with three defensive tackles out there. And they were very good against Jemir Gibbs. They were very good against Derek Henry.

And then overall against Chicago, even though Chicago controlled the score, the entire game, they finished with 3.8 yards per carry. So it wasn't like they were hanging on to the ball. They had one long drive. And that was kind of it for Chicago. the health is such a factor here for Green Bay as well. And I know the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the,

it's not an excuse. But it's a reality. That's the thing that no one wants to acknowledge, right? Like, oh, the next man up. It's not an excuse. But it is a reality. It is something you have to deal with. Like that is 100%.

And how are they working around Tucker craft? Because I mean, Jacobs, I feel like they weren't really running anyway. So yeah, whoever is back there is probably, uh, it's going to be what Wilson is going to be most likely Wilson and Chris Brooks kind of mostly probably on third downs due to past protection but here's the thing we're recording this

on Wednesday morning I do know that the reports on Jacobs were that there was no long term issue with the knee it's structurally sound it's about swelling and dealing with the swelling we'll see he may go on Sunday I'd be surprised but there is an outside chance that he might play

but regardless I mean to the point they can't block anybody up front. And Tucker being in there helped a little bit. But even when he was there, it still was a slog to trying to get anything going on the ground. I mean, they'll stick with it just because you don't want Jordan Love dropping back 45 times against this defense. But yeah, man, it's rough without Tucker Kraft because he was their main yards after the catch guy. I do think they could get something going with Matthew Golden if they ever got him involved like that. But as far as like trying to generate any kind of offense through the air down the field,

obviously you saw Christian Watson really kind of put his stamp on that game here in New York. I suspect that's going to be a focal point for Jordan Love, for the Packers. And hopefully I would think maybe on early downs as well because Matt has been, Matt LaFleur has really leaned into running on early downs, trying to stay ahead of the sticks. But again, it hasn't been very successful. And we saw a little kind of break from that in New York. And I suspect that probably continues a little bit against Minnesota. With Kraft, it was almost like a running game through the air at times.

I mean, I think his average depth of target was like five yards. And then he was averaging. Well, tons of like dart route stuff in the flat that he just turns upfield and turns into something. And you saw Musgrave get some of those here in New York on Sunday. And it was ugly. I mean, they're just very different players, right? And I think Fitzgerald, maybe Wiley, they can do. those types of things. But Musgraves are receiving tight end. He is not your classic inline guy.

They are undoubtedly going to still try to get him the ball at times, but it's going to have to be vertically. It's going to have to be down the field, down the seam on a corner route, something where he can use that athleticism because it's just not going to happen if you're asking him to catch a ball in the flat and break a tackle. It's just not his game. So why hasn't it clicked for Golden the way that maybe some expected? Because I saw a lot of great reviews. coming out of training camp for him he was phenomenal in camp the problem of course is that there are a number of guys ahead of him who's been in the program for a while right and it's just you have to earn those opportunities and i think golden's done a good job but if you talk to people inside

the building there's certainly instances where he runs the wrong route and that was kind of peppered throughout the early part of the year in fact it kind of manifested itself in a kind of amazing way in that dallas game i think it was the opening drive but it was an early drive where he takes is not his route at all. He just takes it up field because he sees green grass. The problem is he runs legit right into Dantavian Wix's route. And the two guys are right there together like 40 yards down the field. Now, Golden ends up catching it. Big play, very exciting. But that's an example of, they can't trust you to be out there, you know, 30, 40 snaps a game if you're going to be breaking things off and doing things incorrectly and running the

wrong routes. I mean, you're trying to, you know, put concepts together. But I will say there was a moment in this game in New York where, you know, Jordan kind of got off schedule and was fleshed out to his left. And Golden did a phenomenal job of kind of scramble drill, getting off his coverage and making himself available to the quarterback. A few more of those, they, you know, he'll probably get a few more opportunities here this week. But it's really just been, it's about the pecking order. And they'll continue to bring him along. That's kind of always been the way in Green Bay. This is not new. It's not surprising. I know it's probably frustrating for him and I know it's frustrating for

fantasy owners because I am one but you know it's this that that is the way that the backers have always operated I think that it's probably the way most NFL teams operate if you can't get the routes and the distances and everything right and then fans because we all play Madden will be like well there's no way

to just like get him the ball my favorite is just spam him like great yeah let's just throw away possessions or downs that sounds great right that's it yeah that's hard and he's got to learn and develop And I think that they knew that when they drafted him, that the four, what was it, four to eight, four to nine, whatever it was,

was not a finished product yet because he didn't completely run away from everyone in college. So there's work to be done. But it feels like the same sort of discussion with the group of weapons that you and I have had for a few years now. It's like everybody has their thing that they're pretty good at, but nobody has the effect of I am going to be the one each and every week. And it felt like you had that with Tucker. craft where it was going to be each and every week and now the whole kind of you have to distribute where the ball is supposed to go but it's not as consistent as when you can have an

Aaron Rogers and Devante Adams. I do think there's a decent chance that Christian Watson develops into that over the course of the back half of the season. Don't forget, I mean, here's what's wild. To see him catch the two touchdowns that he did and a couple other catches he had against the Giants, man, he is coming back from an ACL injury that he suffered this year. Yeah. It was in January when he got hurt, right? And he is back out there in November scoring touchdowns. That's insane, right? And the idea of being from Packers fans that I've heard a lot is like he needs to get the ball more, he needs to be out there more. And I very much agree. But I have to think there's still a pitch count, still working him back, making sure he's, you know, responding well each and every day, each and every week. I do think, though, that as this season rolls along, Watson is going to get more and more opportunities.

opportunities. Maybe not like a classic number one wide receiver, but he will be, I would think, the focal point of the offense, at least through the air. So how will they block it up against Brian Flores as many looks? I mean, Jenkins being out is huge. Yes, it is. Although Sean Ryan acquitted himself pretty well in New York. He had some rough moments against Dexter Lawrence, but man, Dexter Lawrence has made a lot of people look bad throughout his career. I just talked about this yesterday, actually. It led my daily chat with this is a much stiffer test as far as just the communication, right? And you do have a new center and working in concert with Jordan to try and ID things pre-snap and try and get a handle on who's coming, who's dropping, and things like that. And again, I'll say it. I have no problem saying it. I mean, Florida's got love good a couple of times in Lambo last year and a couple times out there in Minnesota. I would suspect you're going to see, you know, maybe an attempt to get some screen type things going,

not a classic half-back screen because Matt, for whatever reason, doesn't love that play, apparently. But, you know, some of the wide receiver screen stuff that I know Packers fans are sick of, but I do think the big key this week is going to be getting the ball out of Jordan's hands as quickly as possible, you know?

The fun cat and mouse at the line of scrimmage is, like, really enjoyable for me. But I can't fathom being down there in the offensive front trying to sort through. Like, you see Harrison Smith fall down and you're like, okay, he's coming, definitely. And then all of a sudden, he's sprinting back 20 yards to be the, you know, the middle of the field safety in a cover three. Like the Packers have done some of that with Evan Williams.

But to see that again and again and again, again, the football nerd in me loves it. But I can't fathom having to sort that out up front. And last week, I don't think we'd ever really seen Brian Flores run corner blitzes. And then all the sudden there was seven or eight corner blitzes, but that was against Caleb Williams, who obviously scrambles all over the place. Jordan Love does not. The one thing that I am super. super impressed with Jordan Love is that he does not take sacks. And to me, those are the hidden yards and the hidden EPA in the National Football League. It's like, I know everyone in Denver

is now defending Bo Nix with their life. And he's not perfect, of course. But one thing, one thing you got to give Bo Nix is that he doesn't take 15 yard losses. And Jordan Love, what, 16 sacks all season long. And I think that even if he is getting pressured, he is going to get rid of the ball. I think the key for the Packers is probably to make the Viking secondary tackle because that's where they've been not the best. Colston Loveland ran through them. Oh, my God, that clip of Loveland and the two dudes like just bouncing off of him short of the sticks, by the way. If they just make that tackle, he's down before the sticks. I know I'm not saying anything your audience doesn't know, but watching them just like pinball off of him, I got to admit, that was pretty

hilarious. Yeah, it was. I mean, well, the thing is that that that's really been an issue. The entire season long, is that if you could get into the secondary, Isaiah Rogers weighs 170 pounds, Harrison Smith isn't the tackler that he used to be, Theo Jackson, Jay Ward, different guys that they're mixing and matching there are just not the same. So what is the expectation now with some of the injuries and that you've gotten this far into the season? Because I feel like you mentioned Christian Watson, this is where we're in the back half, like coach is coach, right? If you're going to make changes, then this is the time to do it. And I do think that the criticism that Lafleur could be predictable,

though that's kind of a platitude. I mean, I don't disagree with it totally. So what changes do you expect down the stretch here? Well, we started to see a little bit of it, I think, against the Giants, where traditionally LaFleur has really not called or looked for a ton of, kind of, outbreaking routes, especially in the intermediary areas. And that is something you saw quite a lot. a bit of, actually, against the Giants. And you also saw some bootlegs, some stuff that, you know,

I know there are a few film nerds who have been calling for this stuff because so much of the offense had gotten horizontal. And as you say, like pretty predictable. And not just for fans, but what it had been really frustrating for the last couple games prior to the last Sunday's contest is, man, if I know this is coming, I know defenses understand your solves. And that's the thing, because you talk about Tucker Kraft, it's great when you have Tucker Kraft and he can, and turn it up field because the defense packed the box, right? And Jordan knows he's got a run-pass option, throws it out to Tucker, the guy's outside block, and the way you go.

The problem is, is that works once, but if you run it 10 times, the defense understands what your solutions are. And the defenses, the last couple weeks, have really understood what the solutions are. So it was heartening to see a little bit more kind of, I don't even know how it's any downfield passing, but attacking the intermediary areas and really get in love on the move a little bit. But ultimately, none of that matters if the Packers can't block it up. And the offensive line is in for the biggest test, I think, that they faced all year

because what we were just talking about. But if they can block it up, yeah, there's probably some areas they can take advantage. On the other side, you know, Micah Parsons seems like he's worth talking about here. It's pretty good. The Vikings' offensive line is playing the best football. I've seen them play since I know I hate it I hate it man I've been watching I watch Vikings clips probably you know

every week I watch the condensed version of all the you know divisional opponents but man it's it's viscerally made me angry to see how well the offensive line is played because so for so long you could count on the line being a mess in Minnesota but it certainly doesn't seem to be the case so how

will they align Micah Parsons because you know do you want them just one on one with Christian Derisaw like best on best or Or do you move him around? Like, he's one of those guys that you feel like you could do anything with that game against the Steelers where they just kept sending him up the middle time and time again. What is your expectation there? I suspect he'll start on Derisaw and try, like, he'll want that, right?

You know, he's been really open about the fact that he wants to go against the best, right? He did it against Sewell. You know, every week he's talking about wanting to be against, you know, the mono-a-mono, the big kind of heavyweight fight, so to speak. I think he'll start there, but I don't doubt that they'll move him around. You know, some of it will be context-driven, play, you know, as far as what they suspect Minnesota's going to do, what their tendencies are. How can we try and take advantage of that? Let's move him around. I don't doubt for a moment that Parsons will be a problem for Minnesota, like no matter where they line him up.

But the issue is everybody else because right now, at the start of the year, guys were eating because Parsons was getting the attention. Rightfully so. But man, Roshan Gary, Devante Wyatt, Kingsley and Iqbari, maybe they get Lucas Van Ness back this week, maybe. All of these guys need to step it up because right now Parsons is doing everything. I mean, he is killing it and he's getting a lot of attention. But man, these other guys are playing patty cake. It's hard to watch. So it doesn't really matter where they line Parsons up if the rest of the guys don't do their gig.

And that is something that is pretty damn noticeable the last couple weeks that has to change, starting Sunday. What happened to Gary? I mean, I feel like he was elites a couple years ago. It's wild, man. He hasn't come back. He's,

what's funny is that he started on a bit of a heater like this season. He really came out the gate taking advantage of the fact that Parsons was getting all the attention. But I'm telling you, over the course of the last three weeks, it's been hard to watch. And some of it is he's just not on the field. He's,

he's taking himself out. You see him call for a breather. I don't know if it's conditioning or what, but man, he's just, it's so funny because like just the other night, you're watching the Raiders game on national television. There's Max Crosby playing, what, 98% of the snaps or whatever it is.

And Gary's playing like half, maybe three-fourths. I just, I don't get it. I don't know. I'd love to know. And now maybe the weather starts changing, tracks get a little slower, maybe he takes advantage. Maybe that happens. We've seen that through his career early in his career. He certainly came on down the stretch early in his career.

And that's something Kenny Clark used to do all the time. He would kind of disappear in the middle of the season. and then really turn it on once the weather changed. Maybe that occurs. But right now it's a pretty big mystery. And they're not going to do anything they want to do unless he gets turned out. When they made the Parsons trade, Vikings fans were saying they still don't have a secondary. Do they have a secondary?

They have a secondary that's way better than people give it credit for. Certainly they're going to give up completions at times. And so I know Kishon Nixon is kind of the popular whipping boy, but I think he's coming off a game where he played pretty damn. well and they're way again way better than people give him credit for i think carrington valentine has been a revelation he's been the guy who's really stepped up and seemingly the one guy in that secondary who understands the assignment as far as parsons and company are going to get home parsons in particular is going to get home right the ball has to come out so you need to be breaking on the football you know that ball is going to be out within three set less than three seconds

Valentine came this close to a couple of interceptions that he broke on against the Giants. There were two others that were literally in his hands that he dropped. I mean, he's that close, but he's the one guy who's really seemingly taking advantage of Parsons' kind of presence. But overall, yeah, I mean, the corners are way better than people think. And, man, I love watching McKinney and Evan Williams together at the safety spots. They do a lot of work pre-snap, kind of disguising, trying to keep the offense guessing. about who's coming, who's dropping, what kind of shell they're going to play. You saw Evan seal the deal against the Giants on Sunday.

They're both playing extremely well. And they've started just a little bit to utilize McKinney a little bit more down by the line of scrimmage, blitzed him a couple times. Like they blitzed Evan Williams this week. So they're starting to kind of mix some of that in, whereas early in the year it was very much kind of keeping their shell and keeping it all in front of them. Okay, finish off with the kicker's going to miss at Lambo here. lose to the but no i'm just i'm just kidding god the kickers you had to ask about the kickers you had

uh hey the how the turn tables the vikings have right exactly no here's what i here's what i really want to want to wrap on is just uh what will the feeling be in green bay if they win what will the feeling be if they lose oh you know if they win it'll get picked apart and all the problems and all the issues you know it'll be great to win and they'll be happy for like 30 seconds And then it'll be everything that went wrong and all the bad plays will be magnified and fire Matt Lafleur. If they lose, it'll be fire Matt LaFleur right away. And then we'll be on right now with the rest of the week. Exactly.

I mean, look, it's a, the Packers are entering. And I know most of the North is like this. I mean, that back half of the schedule is brutal as far as it's completely packed with divisional games, right? The Packers are going on a gauntlet right now, starting with Minnesota, but they have three divisional games in a row. you know so yeah this is a this is a obviously important stretch and I think getting off on a good foot with a win over the Vikings would I think buoy the feeling the vibe around the team and around the fan base but man like we said at the top it's just I'm just going to try and enjoy the game but this is the best time of year this is the best kind of moment as a fan where you're back half

weather's turning you're at Lambo let's get after it I mean I when I saw this come out November 23rd I was excited. Like, oh, I'm going to Lambo in November, the crisp air walking into that stadium. It's, it should, that, that part should be fantastic, how it goes from a Minnesota side. Who knows? The thing with the Vikings is that they could play with the defense the way it is. They could play with anybody. Right.

Exactly. So you feel like, I feel like every week for the Vikings is going to be on a kick return, on a field goal. Right. Or a flip pass, right. Some kind of fumble, whatever. Yeah. They've had five tip passes that have. and right in front of defenders and they haven't been able to catch it or, I mean, last week, Caleb fumbles and nearly kicks it in the end zone, but he gets it.

You know, like there's been a lot of that in this game. So we will see how it goes. Cheesehead TV, Aaron Nagler, you are the best, my friend. Thanks for popping on. Really appreciate it. Thanks so much for having me.