Purple Insider - a Minnesota Vikings and NFL podcast - Is it the end of Rodgers in Green Bay? Why the Giants are the perfect opponent for the Vikings

Episode Date: January 9, 2023

Matthew Coller and Brian Murphy discuss the Lions' win over the Green Bay Packers, the downfall of Aaron Rodgers and what the future holds for the Pack. Plus the Vikings are officially playing the Giants and it seems so perfect considering the way every win came down to the end, including against New York. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Purple Insider is presented by Liquid Death, delicious water that's bringing death to plastic. Learn more at liquiddeath.com slash insider. Hello, welcome to another episode of Purple Insider. Matthew Collar here along with Brian Murphy for a Monday Morning Murph. And Murph, you know, I know because from the very beginning of the season, you were going to ride this Vikings train all the way down, and it ends with a 13-win season, only the third time in franchise history to do it. But that is not why there's a twinkle in your eye today.

That's not why there's a smile on your face or that you are glowing and that you're jovial. It's because your Detroit Lions eliminated the Packers. And, I mean, if we're talking about is it a successful season for the Minnesota Vikings you could make an argument right there that because the Green Bay Packers went out the way they did and Aaron Rodgers may never play for the Green Bay Packers ever again that it was a successful season I was on the plane back from Chicago and shout out to American Airlines for allowing whatever in-flight Wi-Fi to connect my phone to watch that game. Comes down to the final moments.

They run a trick play. They pound the Packers into the pavement. The Packers are pushing trainers, for goodness sake. They're completely losing their minds. What a moment for the Detroit Lions, start one and six they finish with a winning record and they walk off of Lambeau Field having pushed Aaron Rodgers out of the playoffs I mean that's that is the best moment for the Detroit Lions in a very long time yeah that was uh I got to admit I mean I had a bunch of text chains going with family and friends all day long and you know kind of as we

were I was watching Red Zone toward the end of the afternoon with the Ram Seahawks game, which was its own drama playing out and missed field goal at the end, going into overtime thinking, you know, I really did want that game to at least hinge for both teams, both green Bay and Detroit to, to, to take a winner, take all type stance. But the fact that it was going to be Aaron Rogers, and you knew, and it was true, NBC, Mike Tirico, and Chris Collinsworth, who I really respect and enjoy as broadcasters, I mean, they were all in on the Aaron Rodgers, you know, kiss fest, all broadcast long.

So it just, there was just this sense of, you know, the Lions have nothing to play for really except, and it was kind of funny to see Dan Campbell after the first quarter. I think it was when Melissa Stark interviewed him, said, look, you're eliminated. What do you got? And basically said, we don't want them to go. That's what we're playing for right now. And I think that's why a lot of people like Dan Campbell, because he's the guy at the bar pounding shots with you, screaming at the TV.

I haven't been that invested in a Lions game in like 25 years since I was a season ticket holder before I became a sports journalist. That was as edgy as I could imagine coming down the stretch. You kept thinking, A, were the flags going to tip in the favor of the Packers? And I'm not talking about the obvious calls, but like the marginal ones. Were the Lambeau ghosts going to reach up and tap Rodgers on the shoulder one more time with a golden rod and give him one more moment to walk off a victor at Lambeau Field and take them to the playoffs. And the fact that he threw essentially three interceptions, one which was negated by a penalty, but some awful throws. And to actually watch the Lions milk the last three to five minutes off the clock and steal their souls was quite gratifying.

Again, if anything, it portends to, and look, my friends and family in Detroit are very cynical, as much as Vikings fans in some ways, abused by incompetence and failure more so than dramatic defeat, but sort of in that they're not going to buy into much unless it's, it's, it feels true and they feel pretty good about themselves and they should going into next season. I mean, you got a franchise quarterback, you got some great offensive weapons. You now got the sixth overall pick from the Rams. You got Aiden Hutchinson, who's is, is going to be a superstar. He already is a star pass rusher. You know, Packers probably transitioning. Vikings are going to be in salary cap hell. And now the Bears got the number one overall pick. I mean,

perhaps the NFC North next year flips up and it's a Detroit-Chicago division. But at any rate, I've never felt, I've never sensed as much optimism about the lions going into an off season, uh, in, in certainly a long time. So it was, it was kind of fun to watch the split screen of the, the lions driving, picking up first downs, milking the clock and seeing Rodgers sulking on the bench with his cape and his hat, just knowing that in his mind, he may be thinking, I'm not playing here again. Yeah. And with Aaron Rodgers, I think that over the last couple of years, just, I mean, Vikings fans are always going to despise Aaron Rodgers, but he has done himself no favors in the public. The more times he goes on Pat McAfee, the more arrogant and clueless the man seems pretty much every time he opens his

mouth, he becomes less likable. And, you know, I mean, just even recently, like attacking some reporter and claiming that she had written an article with anonymous sources when there weren't actually any anonymous sources and everyone is quoted on the record because he didn't actually do the reading. Big surprise there from Rogers, like even little things like that on a weekly basis where it's almost like he's gone out of his way. The way that he's acted at the podium, the way that he's acted toward the young receivers, the way that he's acted toward the organization and their decisions, that this man has just seemed like he's been completely miserable and was not fun to watch play football at all this year. And so seeing him eliminated, it's like,

I wonder if he wanted to go home. I mean, I'm not saying he like threw the game, but he just didn't look like he was enjoying playing football at all. And it was not a fun experience, even if you had no skin in the game. If you were just watching as a casual observer, you'd be like, why does this guy look like he's just angry all the time? So, I mean, from that perspective, obviously Vikings fans are going to be thrilled he's not in the playoffs, but it's almost like, yeah, you'd rather see the team that was playing with so much heart and enthusiasm rather than the team that's just sort of been arrogant and almost walks in feeling like, oh, because we're us, we're going to win.

And some of the things that were pulled out by the Lions social media, like all the ESPN people all picking the Packers and things like that. It's like, I wonder, did anyone watch the Lions this year? Because they were a better football team than the Green Bay Packers for 75% of the season. Even when the Packers were winning, there wasn't a lot that that was that impressive, unlike the Lions who could put up 40 points on you in every game. And I was not a Dan Campbell believer. I thought this is kind of fun. It's kind of cartoonish. And like, I love how much that guy loves football because I love football. But after seeing the way that he coached the second half of the season, seeing the decisions that he made at Lambeau going for a couple of those fourth downs, the trick play where they

throw it out to, I think it was Aminra St. Brown, and then he flips it to the running back, like stuff like that, just pulling out all the stops to win that game. And when he gets to fourth down and they could kick the field goal, give it back to Rogers, try to play defense. It's like, no way we are winning this game on the back of our quarterback. I mean, that was, that was just tremendous. I mean, can you imagine being in the locker room after that? Like you, you have to have so much belief in him. And as long as they don't lose Ben Johnson, their offensive coordinator, that's going to be a dangerous team in the beginning or from the beginning of next year, not seven weeks in. And then they become dangerous.

I think they really found who they're going to be. So that was, I mean, a supremely fun game, by the way, to watch the Lions fight the way they did, but to go into that game, knowing that they weren't going to make the playoffs and still do what they did at Lambeau Field in that atmosphere, I mean, you just have to be impressed. You know, you mentioned the trick play and the going for it on fourth down, which he's been doing for two years. I thought there's no way, if you're going for it on your own 30 in week one,

on fourth and eight, and it's fourth and two on Green Bay's, what, 20, 15-yard line with a chance to steal their souls, there's no way he's not going for it. I was a little surprised at the trick play. It reminded me, for those old enough to remember the old classic Chargers-Dolphins playoff game in the early 80s at the Orange Bowl. There was that hook and ladder play with Don Strzok to, I think it was Nat Moore and maybe Tony, I can't, you know,

the names are slipping me, but this hook and ladder play at the end of the half that kind of springboarded them. If anybody remembers, I remember watching that game live as I was about nine or ten years old, the epic in Miami with Kellen Winslow being carried off the field half dead. I just recall, that was a gutsy call because that could have ended disastrously and he would have been roasted if the turnover led to the inevitable Rodgers comeback. But the fact that his sense was, look, if we get, we turn the ball over on downs, he's still got to go 80 yards and score a touchdown.

I'm not handing him the ball after a kickoff and hoping my defense, which isn't very good or had, you know, statistically isn't very good. I'm not putting the game in the hands of my defense to stop Aaron Rodgers. I'm keeping it in the hands of my offense to run out the clock and take a knee. And that's how it played out. And it was just, you know, watching, you know, you mentioned Rodgers' arrogance and all that. And, of course, everybody, you know, again,

Tirico and NBC all over the fact, is this going to be the last time? Look at him taking in the sights. Oh, Aaron Rodgers. Oh, Aaron Rodgers. And then he goes down the tunnel. And of course, he swats away a cameraman who has the nerve to chronicle him going back to the locker room. Just the sheer arrogance of don't pay attention to me unless I want you to pay attention to me is pretty nauseating. Look, he's still a very good quarterback. His hand was mangled. He put up a couple of ducks that deserved to get picked last night. My question ultimately is, if he doesn't want to play in Green Bay, that's fine, but then he may not play anywhere at all, and they have all

the cards because they've got him under contract, and they can leverage anything they want out of him. And if he has any whiff of not wanting to be there anymore, I think he even said last night in his press conference, I'm not going to hold them hostage, which is as ironic as you could ever utter for a guy that was always in the shadow of Favre holding the Packers hostage for several years at the end of the last decade. I don't think Rodgers has the Packers interest in mind or Jordan Love's interest in mind or the fans interest in mind. He's got his own interests in mind and he's probably going to see where the coaching changes and the rosters shake out. But I don't think he's going to make a decision before March 1 or at least make it publicly. And I wouldn't say he's necessarily done in Green Bay because, again,

I don't think the decision is all he is. But I think if you're the Packers and you've been down this road before with another iconic egomaniac quarterback, if there's a whiff that he doesn't want to be here, get him out. Get him out. Do a straight- up golf for Stafford type trade. Make, make your move and, or you don't even have to do that with love waiting in the wings if you truly do believe in him. But I, I think America, Green Bay, and just certainly the

NFC North in general is, is kind of done with the world, according to Aaron Rodgers. And I think the Lions and Bears are going to be formidable next year in that division. The Vikings have a lot of work to do to maintain their status, but I think you're going to see a transition. And I think Aaron's going to be in for a rude awakening in the sense that I don't think that many NFL teams really want the specter of Aaron Rodgers in their locker room either. Yeah. I mean, and the trade situation is not particularly easy when it comes

to their salary cap either, because they have pushed around money like crazy to do whatever they could. Of course, they didn't really spend on wide receivers, although I did wonder if wide receivers didn't want to come there unless they were named Randall Cobb, because the best that they were able to do in free agency last year was Sammy Watkins, and they cut him halfway through the season. But the way that Rodgers played this year and just how even his body looked, how his movement looked, how his arm strength looked like that throw that he made that got picked off late in the game. I mean, that probably reaches Christian Watson in years past, and it did not reach him. I don't think that his arm is the same. I mean, when he was at his best, he's got one of the greatest arms in the history of the entire game. That's just really not the

case. I mean, even against the Vikings, there were a lot of just short throws, quick throws, throws to open wide receivers. Like he didn't have in either one of the games, those, whoa, I can't believe he just made that pass type of moments. And if he doesn't have those anymore, he's just not a great quarterback. He's just an average quarterback. If he doesn't have those unbelievable throws that are mixed in or the pocket movement that used to be there. The escapability is not really there anymore.

And I guess if I'm another team, why is that a great option? Like, I don't know. I mean, I guess if you're the New York Jets and you've just been horrendous forever and you want irony because of Favre, I mean, maybe, I don't know. Maybe you make the phone call because you got nothing with zach wilson but does that mean rogers is coming to minnesota in 2024 i mean that's probably uh well it is when kirk cousins contract runs out um vegas you know vegas wants a big show they want somebody like that they wanted tom brady before so maybe they want a washed-up Aaron Rodgers. That could make sense. Plus, all washed-up acts go to Vegas eventually,

so maybe that'll just be their thing. But his future is up in the air, and I think that his future, regardless, as an elite quarterback, is over. Because when we used to joke around, is he washed? It was because he had a little bit of a down year or two. And they're like, oh, is the fade starting? And then he came back in one mvp and had davante adams like okay all right it's it wasn't it wasn't ever that bad but you never really believed it but now like i believe it i just don't i just don't see it ever turning back in the other direction even if he's

given a very good team um and if you're davante ad Adams, you got to be like, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. Don't don't do that again to me. He wanted to escape playing with that guy. So anyway, I mean, that's the as it comes to the future of the NFC North. I mean, it really looks like Detroit and Chicago are the teams of the future and not at all the Green Bay Packers after that. So, I mean, what a night in a lot of different ways for Vikings fans. Let's talk about this matchup, Vikings and New York Giants.

My initial reaction, Murph, is that I love it. I mean, I love it for this is a team that you played down to the final wire the last time that it's sort of representative of their season in a lot of ways that game against the New York Giants where you know a lot of things were kind of going wrong and then Justin Jefferson pulled them out of the fire as he has so many times you get another look at Daniel Jones to try to play better against him than you did last time they get another look at you the beat up offensive line like there's a lot here and of course 1997 playoff revenge game

for the giants one of the most forgettable playoff games uh outside of a outside of an onside kick and a final drive one just as a miserable playoff game that the vikings won though and i believe was denny's maybe first playoff win was in 97 so some history 41 donut of course also uh in the last one i remember i don't recall i wasn't here in 97, so some history. 41, Donut, of course, also in the run there. Yeah, that's the one I remember. I don't recall. I wasn't here in 97, so I don't really remember much about that game. I've watched the game back a couple times.

It's a terrible game. But I don't know why. Randall Cunningham was the backup in 97, and Brad Johnson got hurt, and I've just been fascinated by this miserable game in the Meadowlands. But anyway, because of the crazy ending, they kick an onside kick. Cunningham leads them down. They win. That doesn't matter toward 2022.

But what are your thoughts just in general on them matching up against the Giants? It seemed to be trending that way for the last several weeks. It looked like they were going to lock in at the 3-6 seed, especially after the game and on Christmas Eve here. I mean, as we were talking about postseason and potential matchups, I think even a month or six weeks ago, we kept kind of, okay, well, you've got Philadelphia, Dallas, and San Francisco are kind of in that upper tier, although Dallas has stumbled since.

You look at Seattle, Green Bay, Tampa, not very formidable. The Giants seemed, what we were calling them, or I was at least, paper tigers for a while. I think it's a decent matchup for them. I think the one concern is, but it's a concern all the time because the Vikings' defense just gives up yards and points. That's just what they do. I mean, one concern is, but it's a concern all the time because the Vikings defense just gives up yards and points. That's just what they do. I mean, what was the point differential at finding it was negative two. Is that how it ended today at the seat at the end of the season?

Finally? Yeah, I think minus three, maybe minus three. So, you know, again, 36, 33, that's, that's how they got to win games. And I don't even remember what the Giants score was. It was probably close to that. Daniel Jones, not exactly fearsome with his arm. You got Saquon Barkley who can run the ball. Jones can run the ball. Pretty powerful defense. So, you know, it's going to be challenging for the Vikings, and it's going to be challenging for the Giants.

The fact that Jones put up 300-some yards in passing, and I think the offense might have gone over 400. I don't have the numbers in front of me, but that's a bit concerning. But as far as matchups go, I don't think they could pick it any worse. And being at home, obviously, is going to be a big advantage. And I'm not sure which Giants player has already kicked the hornet's nest by saying, you know, the turf wasn't that bad. You know, we don't care about being indoors. It was pretty quiet in there. And these are Midwest folk who aren't very nasty and all that. Well, I think it's going to be pretty, it's going to be a cauldron of chaos, as I used to call it, U.S. Bank Stadium when I was in there.

I mean, you've been in there longer than I have. I haven't been in there in about four years for a game. But even on television, it comes across as it's a heavier noise there. I mean, you've been in there longer than I have. I haven't been in there in about four years for a game. But even on television, it comes across as it's a heavier noise there. It's almost like a din, just this constant, I don't know. There's a difference in the noise that 60-plus thousand can pump up, and it hangs in the air a little more. So it can be challenging.

It can be intimidating. You know it's going to be rocking there on, on Sunday afternoon. I think they're, you know, they're, they're positioned to win. Losing a first round playoff game. I don't want to say it's disastrous, but it would be awful. And it portent, it may eradicate some memories of what's been a really magical season, but I would encourage fans. And I have been all along,

to just take this in its proper context, which is 13 wins, 11 in one score games. You saw things this season you will never see again in your lifetimes, or maybe one of these things in your lifetimes heading forward. So it's been successful. You have a first-year head coach who gets 13 wins. The locker room is cohesive. Not a ton of, you know, no off-field problems that I can think of. You know, a couple injuries here and there. You mentioned the offensive line, which seemed okay

yesterday, but then again, that was a junior varsity team they were playing um i feel pretty good about their chances it just feels like this is where the gravy train will end i i don't see anybody going into san francisco uh and and beating the 49ers and that defense in san francisco so i see seattle uh getting rolled pretty good and if the the Vikings win, they're going back out there for a divisional challenge, just like they did a couple of years ago. We'll assess the season afterwards if they do end up losing. But I think, you know, you got to feel pretty optimistic about their chances going into Sunday.

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I'm sure maybe gambling people could tell me that I'm a little bit wrong on that, but that's just kind of the way that I view it, is that there's upsets all the time with teams that we think are juggernauts. I mean, look at Dallas last year and Green Bay. I mean, that's who San Francisco had to beat after they won what, like 10 games, Jimmy Garoppolo was injured. I don't think anybody with the 49ers thought we're going to the NFC championship game and we'll have the lead and we'll be one floating pass away from catching it of going to the Superbowl. Like, I don't think anybody thought that about San Francisco last

year, but they end up pulling off a couple of upsets and then all of a sudden they're there. So I don't want to like look forward and say, well, they're going to lose to San Francisco. I mean, I guess we'll cross that bridge with San Francisco when we get there. And they still do have a rookie quarterback. And I think that even though they have a great defense, it is flawed enough to have one bad day where they shockingly lose to a Seattle team. So I'm not calling it. I'm just saying that I'm not there yet. I'm living in the moment, Murph, as I want to do.

I've been preaching for a while. I guess I should heed my own words, huh? Well, yeah, because I don't want to look at it like that because everything is just one game. And we've just seen so many times where one game can swing one way or the other even on a Minneapolis miracle or a coin flip in 2019 like most of these games even when they are mismatches I mean I thought in 2019 they were going to their funeral in New Orleans and that was going to be the end of the Zimmer era and they fumbled on the first drive and it was like oh my gosh this is going to be miserable isn't it and they fumbled on the first drive and it was like, oh my gosh, this is going to be

miserable, isn't it? And they found a way to win. So, but as it pertains to the Giants, what I like about it is that the opposing quarterback is a decent player. Like Daniel Jones, we saw him in person. He can play like he's not some disaster joke quarterback. This isn't like, oh, the Vikings lucked into this easy matchup with a terrible quarterback. They have a good young coach who is an excellent offensive mind and has gotten a ton out of Daniel Jones. They've got a superstar running back receivers who clearly can get open against the Vikings. Not that that's a huge challenge and a defense that is both flawed enough to where the Vikings should win and should get the ball to Jefferson and should make plays, but also challenging enough to where it's not like, again,

oh, you lucked into some easy defense with a bunch of injuries or something. This defense offers a ton of challenges. And I'm sure that Vikings fans would prefer that they got the easiest matchup in the entire world and that Daniel Jones gets a turf toe or something this week and can't play. So of course you just want your team to advance. But from the perspective of the discussion surrounding the Vikings and what kind of matchup gives them a chance to kind of prove it a little bit. I think this is good. It's not the, it's not the toughest team in the world because they earned that by getting the three seed, but it's also a formidable opponent that if you beat, we can be like, okay, all right, that's a good win no matter how it happens because that team is not some sort

of laughingstock that backed its way into the playoffs. Right, and hey, any playoff win is house money. And look, they get another home gate too. But for the Miracle, I mean, they would not have won their home game against the Saints a few years back. So I I'm looking forward to, I think it's going to, I don't want to say it's a track meet cause you don't think of track meet with the giants, but I think it's going to be high scoring. I just,

that's how the Vikings play. That's that's how they played the giants three weeks ago. Their defense, the Vikings defense is bad until it's not at the right moment. And I think you're going to see big plays. I think you're going to see turnovers. I think you're going to see a lot of sacks. I think you're going to see Daniel Jones running. I think you're going to see, I think Jefferson's going to shake himself loose. I don't know if Joseph's going to be able to kick another 61-yard field goal if it matters at the end, but I think you're going to see some randomness

in this game because these are not two well-oiled machines. They're two teams that kind of play a little bit on emotion. Wild momentum shifts. I think you're just going to see another entertaining NFL showcase. And, you know, the fact that it is the Giants, you know, you're going to have a lot of attention on the game. It's the later game Sunday afternoon. So people should be fairly well lubricated getting into U.S. Bank Stadium next Sunday. I think it's going to be a very, very entertaining matchup. And look, Kevin O'Connell has pressed all the right buttons this season. He said all

the right things at the right time. I hope he doesn't try to change things up a little bit this week or try to be somewhat cute and creative with the messaging or the scheme or reinvent the defense a little bit. I know he's been on Donatel before. This is who they are. They're a very loose, fluid defense, an opportunistic offense, an opportunistic special teams unit. You can't really – I don't see him doing this,

but I just would hate to see him make the mistake of saying fat cats get slaughtered or try to do some weird motivational thing, some kumbaya thing this week, or try to do some sleight of hand with the media about matchups or who's injured, who's not. Just be yourself. You've been very successful all season long. Don't try to reinvent the wheel in five days before this matchup. I don't suspect he will. I'm just saying you can see a little bit of temptation to be like, okay, that was just the prelude. And now I'm going to be the real mad genius here that I think I am. And I'm going to put in a bunch of trick plays early on or just try to be something I'm not, or try to make the club something they're not just,

you know, lean in and embrace who you are, which is a momentum seizing, big play moment, big players stepping up at big times type team. And, you know, walk out with your 31,

28 win. I think because Kevin O'Connell played in the league, I don't see him being the galaxy brain guy who just comes up with – I think he is capable of that week-to-week type of approach. And also the fact that he was on a staff last year that won the Super Bowl understands what an incredibly long road it is to actually get there, but also how you need to coach to get there, which is a benefit in my mind that he's been there before. How about we do this little rapid fire to wrap up? Belief-O-Meter. Okay, so why don't we

start there? Let's go just one to ten. Your Belief-O-Meter score on Kevin O'Connell coaching in the playoffs. An eight? You're talking about like his acumen, his, his, help me with the Belief-O-Meter. Do I believe in Kevin O'Connell? Yes. How much do you believe in him? How much do you believe he's going to do the job well? Give him a chance to win. 8 to 8.5. I mean, you know, nobody's perfect. And I haven't seen him get too overwhelmed by the moment or be, you know, driven by motivation or crowd noise to go for it when he shouldn't or two points chasing point.

You know, I haven't seen a lot of that. So, as you were mentioning, you know, with the experience that he had last year in L.A., yeah, I'll go with an eight. How about the Vikings defense? 3.5 and not fatal, but don't rely on your defense to win this. You're going to have to score more points and overcome, you know, you're going to be giving up a lot of yards. And I just think it's going to be high scoring. And that's, again, who they are. And maybe it's a Patrick Peterson interception or a key third and short stop at the right moment that could sway things.

Greg Joseph. On extra points, I'll give him a 7.5. On field goals, I'll give him a 7.5. On fuel goals, I'll give him a 7.6. There's still a little bit of tre a kick in some capacity, there's going to be a lot of people like squinting through fanned fingers at that moment. But I would feel pretty good about Greg Joseph having the game on the line. So I'll amend that. I'll go 7.5 on extra points, and I'll go 8.8 on field goals. Wow. Wow. Am I allowed to use decimal points?

You make your own rules. It's Monday morning Murph. You can do whatever you want. But I could just hear Vikings fans going 8.8. Like, what about negative zero a million? Like, when it comes to trusting kickers in the playoffs. Yeah, as far as fate goes, sure. But he's also put a, you know, he's also hit a 61-yard field goal

when it mattered against the Giants. So, you know, that's pretty solid. I don't remember Kai Forbath or Daniel Carlson really coming through in those kinds of moments. Well, Daniel Carlson got cut after two games. So that was, he's come through in those moments. He. Well, Daniel Carson got cut after two games. So that was, he's come through in those moments. He revived himself in Vegas pretty well. Yeah.

Kai Forbath, though, one of the biggest field goal makes in Vikings history that no one remembers. That's right, because of the miracle. Yeah. I think it was 51 or 52. And then for some reason. Well, and the game's going to be indoors, so you don't have to worry about Blair Walsh going wide left

from 25 yards or whatever. but i fit 27 but you're testing fate just a little bit by saying indoors because gary anderson was indoors i mean we could go all day uh but i i i am uh i i'm a little lower but i also think that greg joseph is a good kicker so like i i don't think just by he's not going to shrink in the moment yeah by proxy of being a vik good kicker. So like, I don't think just by proxy, he's not going to shrink in the moment. Yeah. By proxy of being a Vikings kicker, he won't just start like kicking it all over the place. Um, unless he's possessed by the, I don't know, football devil. Uh, okay. So one more, you know what it is. It's Kirk Cousins? That's a great question. He's done so much this season to really turn around my opinion of him as a big moment kind of quarterback, as a tough competitor. He's taken a lot of shots in the pocket and stood in there and delivered. The team has galvanized around him.

And it's not, that's Kirk Cousins, my quarterback. It's now, he's one of the guys. And I didn't know that was going to be possible. His relationship and the trust that O'Connell has with him, calling the plays in his helmet all game long. I think he's, you know, he's risen to the occasion and become, he's earned his paycheck this season. So I wasn't sure that was going to be feasible.

I'll give him an 8.0. I'll give him a solid 8. Because what was the question again? It was the belief matter. I mean, I don't believe, Cousins is not going to lose the game for them. I think the defense is going to lose the game for them ultimately if it comes down to that. So there's nothing this season that I saw out of Cousins

that would give me trepidation about him shrinking in the moment. So it's also his first home playoff game in Minnesota as well. So he's going to benefit from playing at home as opposed to, you know, he went, look, he went down to new Orleans three years ago and won in a very difficult environment and delivered in the fourth quarter of force overtime and find found Kyle Rudolph in the end zone for the winter looked awful the next week in San Francisco. But then again, the whole team did,

they were out schemed outmatched all of the above. I don't think they're going to be out-schemed or out-matched, certainly not in this challenge. So I feel as good about Kirk Cousins as I have since he's been in the market, and I think fans should too. I like the matchup for him. I think if there's one thing he is good at, it's diagnosing when defenses are sending pressure where the weaknesses are things like that he's very comfortable playing at us bank stadium i mean i don't they they are getting their top cornerback adori jackson which is a big deal because they didn't have him in the last game but i don't think the giants have ways to shut down justin jefferson the way that green bay did where they, I don't know, made their field very wet and he used the wrong spikes.

Like, I don't know. The games that he's been slowed down have been kind of weird. Usually it's only the pass rush. That's the only thing is that there is no real answer if they can't protect him at least enough. So, you know, I assume that's going to be a huge part of the game plan is trying to get the ball out quickly. But the believable meter in Kirk Cousins going into the playoffs, say like in even in 2019, because he came up short in a lot of key moments that season was probably pretty low.

And then after he won in New Orleans, it went up very high because we just react to everything we just saw. And then they, you know, did nothing against San Francisco. And then it went up very high because we just react to everything we just saw and then they you know did nothing against san francisco and then it went right back down to where it was but i think that this season has gone a long way for the belief-o-meter in the locker room for kirk cousins which may not have exactly been there in previous seasons when they didn't find ways to win a lot of those late games um so anyway well uh, I, you know, I'm not going to challenge any of any of your numbers there. I mean, I think that I throw out a few numbers for comparison, like I'm out on a limb here.

Aside from the kicker, maybe. Let's see. Well, with O'Connell, I will go. I will go a seven with O'Connell, which is a little bit lower than you, but it is his first playoff game. And I do think that there have just been some times with the play calling and with the in-game decisions where I just feel like, you know, maybe they don't run the ball enough against the Giants in the last game. And they let the Giants hang around because they were dominating in the run

game, but he just can't really stick with it a lot of times. And sometimes it feels like with his play calling, everything just goes to Jefferson. And then when it doesn't, they just punt. So I'm not like completely sold on him, just scheming up 40 points. But, you know, I think he's done a great job this year, obviously it's just that sort of nitpicking, but I'll go with a seven there because I'll need to see his first playoff game and how he handles that. With what was the next one? The defense.

I like where you had it, like a three and a half. I think they can turn over Daniel Jones. That's the biggest thing. That this guy will throw into traffic sometimes or just throw an inaccurate pass sometimes. And their run defense against really good running backs has not been that good um yeah i don't i don't really trust them but i trust them to make a play like i think a huge sack from zadaria smith a huge interception like there's a big mismatch with daniel hunter and their right tackle so i'll give it i'll go

like yeah i would go like a four um and I think Duke Shelley is going to have a moment. Duke Shelley has had some serious moments. I mean, he got the game ball against Chicago. And Chicago saying they were disrespected by him, like, jumping on the logo or whatever. Like, you don't get to be disrespected with the number one pick, man. No, you started Nathan Peterson or Peterman at quarterback, and Tim Boyyle came in

for something too so yeah i don't that's that's not the card you're going to be playing you don't get to be disrespected when no one showed up to your stadium because your team is trash uh anyway earn that um let's see the the the other one was the the kicker right yeah you didn't get a number on it joseph yeah i'll go like a six i'll go a six i mean i think he's a good kicker but i also don't trust almost any kicker uh because kicking is so weird and random i mean where the best kickers can miss four in a row or the worst kickers can make 10 in a row like you just don't really know like nate kating had some key misses in the playoffs that dude was one of the best kickers of all time the same with with Gary Anderson. So I don't know if I trust any kicker more than probably a six or a seven, but I do

think he's good. I got a follow-up question on the belief meter on kicking. What is the belief-o-meter on the fact that this game will come down to a Vikings kicker? 10 out of 10. And that means what, a game-ending try, overtime, or a key missed extra point in the first quarter yes all of it potentially right like there is there is no question in my mind that there is a kick somewhere in here that ends up making a difference or a special team's play like even think about the Minneapolis miracle game and how they missed the field goal at the end of the half. They had a punt blocked that allowed the Saints to score quickly and come back in that game. Like special teams.

And think about this year against the Patriots where they get the kick return for touchdown against the Packers where they give up the kick return for touchdown. Where they block the punt against who was that was against the Giants they blocked Giants yeah yeah I mean like special teams will play into this 10 out of 10 absolutely guaranteed and I would say nine and a half out of 10 that there's a final field goal from somebody whether it's was their kicker Graham Gano Graham Gano or Greg Joseph and as far as Kirk Cousins goes if we're just talking about against the Giants, Belief-O-Meter this week, not like all the way to the Super Bowl,

I'd probably go like seven, seven and a half. I mean, I just, I think that he's played well, mostly recently, the Green Bay, obviously notwithstanding. He seemed a little more comfortable in some of these games with the offense and he's got irv smith coming back they've got the full bevy of weapons and he just at us bank stadium is pretty comfortable there most of the time it really just comes down to can you block it up just good enough for him to get the ball off because he's taken a ton of hits this year. And so,

you know, he's going to stand in and make the throw if it's there and, you know, he's going to throw it accurately if it, if he, if it's there, but it's gotta, it's gotta be there. Right. And if it's not, then it's just going to be a problem. That's the thing is like, it always kind of comes down to if there's an answer from the other team, you don't usually win. It's not like Patrick Mahomes where if the other team has a great scheme, he just does something magical. So I can never go all the way to a 10, because you kind of know the circumstances under which this has to happen.

But I think against this team, it's a pretty favorable matchup for him. They don't have a great secondary. And normally when teams don't have great secondaries and receivers can get open, he is going to deliver the football. So I'd say between seven and eight. We're in the same area for almost every one of them. I think you made good picks. Let's wrap it up with numbers.

I know it's only Monday, but we're not going to talk before the game. Score prediction? I will go 28, 26 Vikings. I don't know why I've been saying this the last few weeks. I don't know if they even won a game by this margin. It just feels right to me. 36, 33. That just seems to be their signature type win. And there will be double digit deficits on one side or the other during this game, I think.

I like it, Murph. I'm excited. You excited? Hey, free football, right? Free football? Free football. Not for people that are going there, obviously. Well, and for people- Another week of gouging, but- For people who are going there, though, I mean, it's just been a while. It's been a long time since they've had a home playoff game. So this is big.

And you're right. When that stadium gets going, and it will be from the very start, and that's why I think the Vikings will win, is I just think that's going to be a lot for the Giants. But anyway, well, it's been such a fun season breaking down all these games on Monday morning with you, Murph. We will have at very least one more and maybe more than that. Yeah, let's keep it rolling.

Great to talk with you again, and we will do it again next week. Sounds good.