Purple Insider - a Minnesota Vikings and NFL podcast - Jeremiah Sirles: Don't rush JJ McCarthy's development

Episode Date: November 12, 2025

Former Viking Jeremiah Sirles joins the show to discuss the Vikings' loss to the Ravens and the ups and downs of J.J. McCarthy's development as a young quarterback. Then, Maggie Robinson joins for this week's Robinson Round Up. The Purple Insider podcast is brought to you by FanDuel. Also, check out our sponsor HIMS at https://hims.com/purpleinsider Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See https://pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Hey, everybody, welcome to another episode of Purple Insider presented by Fandul, Matthew Collar here. And it is time once again for Tuesday morning left guard with former Minnesota Viking Jeremiah Searle. And my friend, everything is out now. So last week, it was great. And the meter was all the way in the red. You were crowning J.J. McCarthy.

You were ready to put them up on your show. shoulders and yell a dog in the street and then now you're completely out it's no i'm just kidding i mean look uh i would but you've been you have been in these locker rooms on teams that were 500 and up and down up and down every single week i think it's hard for everybody to figure out what exactly you actually have here with j j mccarthy and what you have as a team when one week you can look so good against detroit and then the next week you can look so poor against baltimore It goes back to, like I said, last week. I'm not doing the crown kill thing.

Like, I am very much in the camp of young quarterback, got to see what we can get. It's going to be good. It's going to be bad. The problem was I was not anticipating it to be ugly. Right? I did not anticipate this week. I thought that, you know, after last week in Detroit,

you saw some promise, you saw some things, some touch on the balls. You're like, okay, I can see some progress. It's almost like it was two steps forward, three steps back this week. I hate pinning it on a guy because it's never really a guy's fault. But like a lot of that loss falls on nines, shoulders when it comes to it. And so as I'm watching that game and I'm going, okay, things are going around. I am also looking at the team exactly like you said, okay, what else is going on? And I'm reading things like, oh, Justin Jefferson's like, what's wrong with Jefferson?

I'm like, what's wrong with Jefferson? He's a number one wide receiver in this league getting like 50 yards a game. Of course he's pissed. Like that's the way that these competitors go. as good as a teammate as he is, what's going with? Oh, the O line. I was like, some of the best protection I've ever seen out of this group that's finally starting to gel together.

There's just a lot of frustration that builds because losing in the NFL sucks. It is awful. And as you continue to lose and as you continue to have veterans in the room, there starts to be tensions that grow and grudges that become held. And it's just little tiny things that if you're winning, you just kind of let roll off your back. You're like, yeah, whatever, like the extra shove at practice.

So, yeah, we're six and two, who cares, right? But then all of a sudden, you get the extra job of practice and you're five and like, I'll kill you. Like, it just builds. It just builds. And the more you lose, the harder it becomes, the more tired people are, more tense people are. It's very hard to talk about that locker room right now because, like I said, I've been

in six and ten lock rooms. I've been eight and eight. I've been in 13 and three. I've been everywhere. When you're a 500 football team and there's some good, some bad, it's almost worse than being like a two and 14 football team. And this is something about, you know, J.J. McCarthy and the environment is the idea was of bringing in J.J. McCarthy that the environment would be so good that it would elevate what's there for him. As we've seen from Jalen Hertz in the past, as we've seen for Brock Purdy from a young Jared Gough in Los Angeles, you got all the pieces and you have the good coaches and everything else.

But if McCarthy needs more development and is not ready to be where that team needs him to be to actually. win games week in and week out, that's where I think the friction is created. And you can't ignore the Sam Darnold and Daniel Jones element because the players in the locker room and everybody in the franchise, they have eyeballs. They see what's going on with these other quarterbacks that are veterans. And I'm sure someone like Justin Jefferson notices Jackson Smith and Jigba's stat line and understands that Sam Darnold throwing that pigskin is a major reason why he is all of a sudden the number one wide receiver in the NFL. And it's It's not Justin who's being talked about as there were 12 targets for Justin.

One of them we expect him to bring in that he wasn't able to grab. And then at least six to seven that are just so inaccurate that there's not much he can do about it. And just by saying that fact does not mean equal J.J. McCarthy bust. What it mean is that J.J. McCarthy needs development. He needs to play. He's going to have these roller coaster moments in these ups and downs. but I think that they're much harder to deal with than if you're a team like Tennessee. If you're on that team and you know what it's about, you're like, this is a young quarterback.

That's where our organization is at. Let's try to be competitive. Let's try to get the most out of him. This was a team that set the bar so high. And nobody said it's Super Bowl or bust. But also, when you get into three years, you haven't won a play off game. You're in year four here. That's the goal.

That's the bar. And we know this. You know this. you worked for them. The Wilf's never set the bar at, hey, let's just develop, you know, a player for a year. They set it at let's compete for a Super Bowl. And everybody knows that you're coming short of that.

And you're saying, oh, it's the kid who now has to get us to that point. I think that pressure is a difficult place to be with so many expensive players, so much money spent, so much invested, a 14 win season from last year. And I think we knew that if it didn't go super, super, smooth that there were going to be moments like this where everybody's looking around going, all right, what happened from last week? We were just so good on offense last week. It also, but it's, that's the nature of the quarterback position in the NFL. It doesn't matter. You look week to week, even the great teams. When, when the Kansas City chief struggle,

it's probably because Mahomes isn't having a great day, right? When the Buffalo bills get beat by Miami, Josh Allen doesn't look like an MVP candidate. The difference is those gaps for those two guys usually close like this because you're like, okay, well, he was an MVP. He has won a Super Bowl. We know it's in there. When you have the uncertainty with a young quarterback, and you can even say this about Drake May and Caleb Williams and Jane Daniels, it just leaves a lot to be desired of, well, is this who he is? Or is he the guy that I watched there? And it just creates this confusion on the fans' perspective, but then it creates frustration within the locker room because in the locker room every single one of those players is on a ticking clock my career

is on a ticking clock i'm not going to play 30 years in the NFL i'm if i get double digits man i am a special unique individual and so as i'm reaching either the middle part of my career or the end part of my career alan hargrave harry like you start to think is this a wasted year is this a wasted year in my career where i thought i came here because of everything you just talked about with the expectations of, hey, yeah, we have a young quarterback, but we're going to rely on Jordan Mason, who we traded a pick with to run the football, and Aaron Jones, and we're going to rely on this built offensive line with Will Fries and Donovan Jackson and Kelly and Darrison. We're going to rely on running the football, so it's not all going to fall on him,

and then we're going to allow that quarterback to take the shots to 18 and three, and Hawkinson's going to have a big year of a checkdown under the middle, and then it's all of a sudden such a completely different landscape when you fast forward to week 10 that you look around and like, what the hell went wrong? And it's easy to point and go, well, JJ got hurt and now Carson Wentz had to come in and now he's gone. So there's no going back to that. Right. That's a conversation I think is really interesting is now that Carson's gone, there's no conversation to be had of, well, if this goes off the rails with JJ, we can just put Carson back in and we at least know what we're going to get. It's JJ or do we really

want the other kid's kid of Max Brosmer? And so it's just there's a lot of frustration that gets built with inside the organization. I'm not saying it's bad. I'm not saying like people hate each other. But when you're not winning in the NFL, it's just really frustrating on a weekend, weekout basis when you come in, not really sure what product you're going to get out of your quarterback on that week. And through nine weeks, the bigger numbers of this team and of this offense are stats that we didn't think it was possible. Considering all the things that they have to be 27th in expected points added on offense, and the only teams that are worse than you are like the Jets and the Browns and the Titans, teams that are

extremely downtrodden and came in with no expectations whatsoever for this season, just get through it and develop some players and see what you have, whereas the Vikings came in with the expectation of getting into the top half of the NFL offensively. And those games with Carson Wentz, they're a factor here and JJ missing all that time and all that practice. And I think what's really made clear from these two weeks is that if you have certain things fall into place with J.J. McCarthy, at this point in his career, That's not addressing the bigger picture, which, as you said, people want to crown or kill after every single week and decide what he's going to be four years from now or whatever. But if we just look at it in this bubble of two weeks, you get a 61-yard return.

You're in the red zone. You get a big run. Like, you're off and rolling from the beginning. Your first two drives, scripted plays, you get in the end zone. You're playing from ahead. Jared Goff struggling and their offense is struggling and they're getting frustrated. And all of a sudden, you build on that momentum. and you can win a game where you just get a couple touchdowns from McCarthy in 143 yards,

and that's a great way to win a game. This one, you have Miles Price, giveeth and taketh away. The kick return, giveeth and taketh away. Like, with the fumble, that changes the entire tenor of the game. And then all of a sudden, you could feel that they were trying to come back and throw and throw and throw. And even down 19 to 10, it felt like they thought that they had to throw on third and to three. on fourth and two and press, I think, a little too early at that point. And I remember saying to you, maybe it was even last week or when he came back,

no matter what the score is, stick to the script with J.J. McCarthy. And they did not. And look, they had a chance with the ball and down one score to maybe have a chance. So he was able to continue fighting and get them into the end zone and get them within one score. But when they got, it was almost like after that fumble and then they score off of it, that everyone kind of freaked out a little bit and lost the thread of what you need to do to have J.J. McCarthy succeed. And this is where, you know, I think a lot of fans want us to

scream to fire KOC or something and say it's all his fault. When you watch the tape, it's very hard to say it's the guy designing the play's fault because there's so many options there. But I think at this point in McCarthy's career, he's not that guy who can do that. and you have to just stay on the schedule that you want for him and hope that it works out, not just completely abandoned the run game and put that behind and say, all right, well, now just throw, throw, throw, like your Kirk cousins at 32 years old. Yeah, you know, it's for the parents in the world that have the analogy, like I have my three-year-old, right? My three-year-old watches my six-year-old and goes, I can do anything he can do, right?

I can ride the bike without training wheels. I can jump off of the couch and you're like, no, you can't. He can, right? He can do it, but you can. And then he gets like, who's that and freaks out? I think this is a little similar situation where KOC wants him to be six, but he's three in his developing in a quarterback situation, right? He needs the training wheels.

He needs the bumpers on the bowling alley. Like, he just needs those reps in real time with a little bit of protection. And that's okay with a young quarterback. But then the quote that sticks out to me that I feel like KOC misses the point on some, is on third and one, he throws, hey, we got a one-on-one, Justin Jefferson. We're going to take that matchup 10 times out of 10. I go, yeah, with the six-year-old, like, that's great. But with the three-year-old, you hand the ball to 27, you get a new set of three downs to find to go make something happen.

And that's the part for me that's frustrating is because as much as that throw, you can say, hey, Justin fell down or whatever you want to see, why take the risk? The risk reward there is catastrophically far apart, right? The reward, great. Huge play to Jefferson, kickstart things. The risk is bad interception and now we can't even go forward on fourth down. If I'm in that realm of KOC and I see my young quarterback who I know can practice the scripted plays that he's got a lot of reps in all week, stay with that, fight to get another set of three downs to try and make something happen with a matchup. It just seems like at times Kevin just wants to sprint when you got to crawl. And that's just the nature of having a young quarterback. And I think that's hard for, for Kevin being a former quarterback, having some great quarterbacks that have been able to execute his schemes very flawlessly from Kirk Cousins to Sam Darnold, like being able to do some things with Josh Down or Josh Dobbs and Nick Mullins. And then to have this piece of clay that he has to mold into being one of those guys. I think it's the first time his career, he's had to do that. And that's, and again, it's just like everything.

People are human. People make mistakes. People have to adapt and learn. And so I'm not on this fire, KOC. see, I think he's just kind of learning as he goes here. And as things get deep into the game and moments get big, sometimes I forget, I think he forgets that that kid needs some training wheels early in his career here so that we don't have to sit there and go,

gosh, why did JJ throw that ball? The question can become, why was he put in the position to throw that ball? So here's the drive that I'm talking about. They, after they go down 19 to 10, they get a 13-yard run on the first play with Jordan Mason. And then they commit a five-yard penalty, which we will definitely get to. was that we will get to uh all right but then a seven yard completion and then it's pass pass pass and turnover on downs and that was to me where you just got a big run with jordan mason their run defense seems to be cracking a little bit they were actually succeeding with some

of the bigger personnel ben sims got bunched up or bumped up from the practice squad he gets out there and uh hawkinson i think he's actually blocked really well this year not that you know people from the fantasy world want to see that but he actually had some really good blocks in that game and that was where it's third and two and the third and one i understand i've seen a million coaches take that shot before if you're going forward on fourth down i get it you never expect jefferson to to fall but this one was all right you already threw an interception on third and one and now third and two you're going to do it again you're going back to that passing well and this is where it feels like you're asking him to do more than he's capable of doing but i want to ask you

about the technical elements of J.J. McCarthy throwing the ball because I know that you are not a quarterback. You just blocked for them. However, you spent a lot of time in practice with the likes of Sam Bradford, great, great, great, great thrower, Cam Newton, Josh Allen when he was young and eventually developed it to a much better. Philip Rivers, a all-time great thrower. From what you saw from those guys versus where he's at, like what's the, what needs? needs to change there. What's the gap? It's, yeah, and I'm not going to sit here and pretend like I am a quarterback guru, but, you know, you hear about it a lot and it's how quick is the release, right? How fast is the ball from,

hey, I'm throwing it to where I'm going. And then the biggest thing with him is his anticipation. The anticipation in the NFL has to be there because windows close very quickly. And, you know, you have to know if that's an 18-yard dig, I can't throw it when he's open. I have to, have to throw him open, right? I think Jared Goff is one of the best. Matthew Stafford and Jared Goff are one of the best in the NFL right now of anticipation throws, right? Throwing that ball before the receiver is out of his break, right? And as soon as that receiver whips his head around, ball sticks on him, right? Right now, it looks a lot to me. And this is what happened with Caleb Williams last year, too, is he has to see him open before he delivers the ball. And if you

see him open in the NFL, the safety also sees him open. And the nickel and the lineback dropping into coverage also sees him open and they see him open and they close that window very quickly and so now it's hitch hitch hitch or it's throw it away or whatever it might be and again takes time takes reps but he also didn't have to do a lot of that in college right i look i mean i remember watching michigan all it was was throwing it to eight yard wide open wide receivers of roman wilson and all those guys after the play action and the safety's got caught flat footed and he's created a bunch of separation so he's already open when you throw it that just comes with reps and time And the bigger issue for me is why he looks like a big league pitcher at times,

the way he throws it and just swings that leg in front of him. And I mean, it literally to me sometimes feels like he is trying to fastball it so hard that the mechanics just fall apart. And people where I was reading about his accuracy getting worse and worse as the game goes on, I think a lot of that's because he's pressing more and more. I have to make this throw. I have to make this throw. And when the pressure builds like that, I can see for a quarterback's perspective,

of, well, to make that throw, I just got to throw it harder, right? To make that throw, I got to get it there faster, right, and all those things. And I mean, Philip Rivers did not have a laser cannon for an arm by any stretch of the imagination, but he could put the ball exactly where he wanted and that any given time. And so the more that I think that you can rock and roll with him going, okay, that's where he is right now from a mental standpoint. How do I get him early in the game of confidence of good feet fallout? Good feet fallout. And so that's where you have to go as a play calling standpoint.

but KOC can't throw the ball for him. Just like I can't take a rep for my clients anymore. Coaches can't take reps for the players. The guy has to just go out there and trust the fundamentals for 60 minutes. I don't know if we've seen him do that for a full game yet, right? They're just fully fundamentally put together a clean game. And when you're unfundamental at the quarterback, drastic mistakes happen. And seeing the field at this point in his career four games in consistently is a very,

it's a very hard thing to do. And I was watching Melichai Starks talk. about his interception and he said that McCarthy just telegraphed exactly where he was going with the football and he knew and he broke on it and jumped the route and made the play and I think that there is a slow element of this and he's throwing the ball too high he's throwing the ball hard and those things I think could be corrected over time and you saw early Josh Allen well when you played with him he did not throw the ball like he throws that he has shortened that that so much because he used to bring the ball way down and then it would fly on

him too. And I'm sure that that's something that McCarthy with his QB guy and with a full off season, because he couldn't improve these things last off season. He was trying to get ready to be QB1. He didn't end his season in mid-January and then have months and months and months of working on one specific thing of throwing the ball. But when it comes to that decision making, it's so fast out there. And you have to make those decisions. in so quickly and when you are kind of hitching and hitching and climbing the pocket. And this is why some of those balls got batted down because you're getting closer to the offensive line.

So then you're not seeing it as well or having to release it higher or, you know, just throwing it directly into the hands of somebody. And I think it's a lot of things at once, but the biggest is probably if you can see into the future because you've had a lot of throws that you've made over your career. Sam Darnold got way better at this. insanely better at this from early in his career where it was the same sort of thing. And then by the time he arrives here, he's seeing a cross route. And by the time the receiver is behind the linebacker, the ball is already traveling.

And we saw with McCarthy, he has to wait till he clears the linebacker to start winding up. Then they see him winding up. They see where the routes are playing out. These safeties are freaks with their eyes. They're like eagle eyes. And so they see what's going on. And then they can jump a route there. So I think that there's a lot of development.

that needs to happen. And if this were under different circumstances, I think we'd all be saying, all right, well, this is point A, and he's got the physical tools and the flashes to get to point B. But the pressure on everyone in the organization is now, bro, you better get to point B real, real fast. And I think that's where it's hard,

because you can't just whisper somebody into development. It's going to happen at their own type of speed. And JJ is being asked to go develop super, super, super, super fast. And I guess that always leads us to the, is there something that KOC is supposed to be doing otherwise? Yeah. And that's the thing is development is never linear, right? Development in the NFL is never a linear where you're just like every week, he is exponentially better and better and better. Like development in the NFL, I hate even saying this. And if my buddy, Ike Bucker was listening, he'd laugh me hysterically. But Sean McDermott used to throw the Kaizen chart up in Buffalo all the time,

which is a chart of like ups and downs and like it's here and then it's there. But as long as it's it's still steadily moving in the direction, then we're going to be okay. And we used to joke that, oh, my gosh, it's the Kaiser chart again, right? But that was,

that was when we were six and ten, and a lot of it was about Josh and how Josh is moving, and there's going to be games where he's going to be really good. He hurdles over Anthony Bar. It's amazing. And then we go play the Jets, and he throws three interceptions. You're like,

okay, like, that's just part of it. The problem was, you know, they drafted Josh Allen to save the franchise, right? And so you're going to give that kid a lot of grace early in his career. J.J. McCarthy's linear development is not to happen it's going to be up it's going to be down you can't speed development up development is not something that you can say oh he's going to take a giant jump this week

it's like no he's he's going to take a jump but it might be 10 steps forward eight steps back but at least it was two steps forward at the beginning like that's how development the quarterback position and really any position happens in the NFL I mean my first start in the NFL as a rookie I wasn't looking at safety's rotating I wasn't looking as that linebacker topped over the defensive end I was like that's freaking Allen for his arms are humongous like I better not get bull rushed oh my god that's don terry po right like you there's a lot but then as I get into year six and I go up there and I line up and I go okay safeties are tough to cover one okay where's my d-end like it just takes reps and it just takes time and I think the biggest piece too is after my first year in the NFL I was able

to look at myself and go okay I now really know what I need to work on this offseason right like I got to work on strength and I got to work on my timing with my hands or else I'm going to get cooked in this league. JJ didn't have that. JJ didn't have this year of self scouting to go back and look at his film and go, okay, my first year in the NFL taught me X. My first year in the NFL taught me that I wasn't healthy, right? And so this is where he's going to have to look at all these games. And now it's in my second year. Well, I wasn't healthy for a lot of that too. So how much is making up for the injury or not? It's just a lot of question marks, but we just all have to understand is as a Vikings fan base that this is going to be the long road. And no one wants to hear that.

no one wants to believe that. Everyone wants to think that this kid's going to flip the switch next week and look like Drake May. It took Drake May 20 games, 22 games to really look like, oh, he's got it. Right. Even Caleb Williams, you're like, look in some specialty here. It's just going to take some time. And it's just unfortunate that we built this roster that set an expectation, but then the rookie quarterbacks doing exactly what rookie quarterbacks do. And from a coaching perspective, I think there's a sweet spot there of pushing and saying, we've got to have you do these NFL things and learn how to do them. And in order to succeed, you have to. Like, there's no, you can't just run like a bubble screen. This is an Oregon, right? You can't just

like run a bubble screen every time and a play action and then hand off 47 times if you're going to beat Lamar Jackson and the Baltimore Ravens. It's just probably not going to happen that way. I don't think anyone's actually asking for that. But also, if you're going to say, could you just be Matthew Stafford for me, just like for a few minutes, you know, I mean, that, that I also feel like at times has happened. I don't, I think that when KOC talks, it never sounds like that's his theory, right? And he was saying to about McCarthy on Monday that there were checkdowns that he wanted him to take. But you also, if you dial in five eligible wide receivers and you're like, yeah,

checkdown is like your fifth option so you go one two three four check down it's like that might be a little hard for him right now you might have to make the checkdown the first thing or one of the first things to look for is hey this play is supposed to go underneath even though everybody's running deep because it seems like if you have plays where everyone's running 15 yards plus that's where he's going to keep his eyes as long as he can and try to fire it into those windows and that might have to happen sometimes but you don't have to do that all the time but it's I think it's the hardest thing in football for a coach to figure out how far can I take it with my quarterback because there's also 10 moments this year where they run a complicated play and he makes a fantastic

throw. So it's like when it doesn't work, we say, you know, hey, what's wrong with you? But putting on the training wheels is also not going to help him learn how to play in the NFL. So I, and I also, I don't think it is. Okay. I think I think putting on the training wheels, no one learned how to ride a bike without training wheels. So I mean, well, now they have a strider bike. but whatever. In my generation, like, you didn't learn how to ride a bike before you put the training wheels on. And you got the basics. Like, okay, break, turn. And then you're like, okay, now we take these off and you might fall down. Right. It's like, okay. But at least I have the

structure of how to do this. J.J. was not a polished quarterback coming out of college. Hate me, love me for saying it, whatever it might be. There was question marks about could this dude from my throwing it 40 times a game need to? Could he do it? And so if you want to get him to that point you have to build him to that point you can't just drop him in the fire and say do it you have to build him up to that point so that's where i'm saying with the training wheels aspect kind of like you were saying with the route concepts hey let's build some route concepts that are low to high not high to low right hey crosser first safety jumps crosser now we get to the deep dig right versus a lot of it seems like it's a deep dig first if it's not there then try and get yourself back down to the

crosser right that's training wheels like i think that for me is the way that i view training wheels or hey if it's cover one and you have a one-on-one take the slant it's okay to take the slant instead of trying to take the fade right like those type of things are training wheels in the NFL where you're trying to give answers to the test pre-snap and then letting him then have to figure it out as you go and as he gets comfortable with that then you add more and you add more and you add more that's just how it works and so you can have all these wonderful concepts and awesome ideas and guys running wide open over the field, but if the kid doesn't know how to use the brake on the bike, what's the point? Like, what's the point of putting the training wheels off if you can't even slow it down?

And so there's just a lot going on there from the development standpoint that, again, I think KOC is trying to rush him a little bit, just based on the fact that you need to win. And you can't win in this league. And to your point, you can't win in this league with total training wheels. Right. But you can lose a lot of games with just throwing the guy out there and helping it. So it is a fine line. And that's why you paid and that's why you got your extension.

And that's why you have HBC head ball coach on your hat. you have to make these decisions and then you have to be okay with being chastised for him every now and then and just understand this is just the nature of the quarterback head coach relationship in the NFL for every coach and quarterback that's ever come since the dawn of time. I also want to throw something out there with just the way that we go forward here and the way that we think about this is from a global perspective, Minnesota Vikings, they were supposed to be good this year. And when they lose games and we break down the reasons,

why they lost the game. If your quarterback completes under 50%, I had the stat yesterday. What does this stat mean? This is not a hard one to figure out what it means. The last two years in the NFL, if you're under 50% completion percentage, you win 25% of the time. You can't win by having your quarterback complete that few passes. You can blame whoever the heck you want.

Do you want to know how many times, by the way, I think what did Kirk start? Maybe 80 games for the Vikings? Yeah. How many times do you think Kirk Cousins was under? 50% in his career out of 80 games six or seven for the Vikings one he was under 50% one time so the point is when we evaluate the raven's game the defense gave you a chance to win and the special teams unfortunately screwed you over but the offense did not give you a chance to win the game the quarterback play was not at the caliber to win that football game that is a different conversation

from saying j j j mccarthy will never make it 100% everyone is screwed up everything with J.J. McCarthy in his development. And that's what I wish that Vikings fans would separate is every single criticism of a quarterback in an individual game where he was very, very good against Detroit and not very good against Baltimore is not an indictment on everything that he's going to be in the future, which I guess leads me to ask you, how long? Like, is it by the end of this season? Does it need to be into next season? It's into next year. I mean, I think you have to give because here's the thing he won't even have a full season of starts under his belt by the time 2025 season is over he won't i mean he will not have started a full 17 games and that is just i mean

again i look at the references from some of the young quarterbacks right drake may jane daniel was kind of an anomaly right came took the thing by storm like but he's even struggling this year just take last year's class caleb williams drake may bo necks like all of them had moments in their rookie years and all of them had some like, oh, crap moments as well. But this year you're starting to see some separation. Drake May is starting to really separate himself.

Caleb Williams, but it wasn't until weeks five or six that we started to see that separation. And so for me, I'm not going to render judgment on this guy of boom or bust until probably around week seven or eight next year, but that means he has to stay healthy. Yeah.

Because the more he gets hurt and the longer that timeline pushes out, the margin gets more much smaller, so much smaller. Because now you're going, dude, we're in your three of your rookie contract and we're still trying to see you take that jump, right? So, I mean, unfortunately, it's going to be in the next year before we actually can see, hey, can he stay healthy and can he turn into the guy we hope you all can become? But again, development, you can't speed it up.

It's one week at a time. Explain to me how cadence, snap counts, et cetera, motions. Day one, OTA, install. You ready? You open the playbook. All right. There's a cool little Vikings logo. Okay, next play.

Okay, snap counts and cadence. It's the first thing that you install when you're in day one of phase one OTAs. And that stuff is inexcusable. I don't care if you're a first year quarterback. I don't care if you're a 12 year, 15, 16, pick it. Inexcusable to have cadence issues. It just can't happen. And then you compound it with a young quarterback.

And now you're going first and 10 to first and 15. You might as well punt. like you might as well just punt and so i don't know what the hell happened in that game with cadence and tempo in the whole bit but my goodness son what was it eight it was eight it was eight all start penalties at home yeah i don't even know how you i don't even know how you address that like i really don't like where was i don't know who had the issue i mean i tried to listen like i kind of went back and listened to the tv company like what was and you can't really tell but i think a lot of it was maybe he was checking in the middle of his snap

count or maybe he was just early or late, but you have to have a rhythm and a tempo as a quarterback that your own line becomes very friendly with. Like, think about Dak Prescott, right? Here we go. Like, you get really comfortable with that, or even Cam Newton in his wide 80, 80, hot.

Like, you just get, you get really comfortable with that cadence. And so maybe there's some of that, hey, JJ's first game back was in Detroit, right? And you're hitting the defender and the snender goes like this, then you snap it. And JJ's first game was it. And in Chicago. And that was silent. And then you have the Atlanta game, which was kind of a disaster. And then you have Carson Wednesday. And now you're first back at home. JJ's back. Cadence can be wonky when it comes to just rhythm and tempo and timing of, hey, how does he get through the color number? Color number set hut. Hey, what color number is he on? Are we on one? Are we on two? Are we on the check with me? Where it's, hey, we're going to go through it. And then we're going to have a dummy signal. And there's so many nuances to it. But it's day one install stuff.

day one install stuff. And if you can't get that stuff right, then I don't really have any faith for you as a quarterback. So if that continues, everything I just said about development and all that, I'm going to wash that away. Because if you can't get operation of play call, huddle, snap count, before the balls even snap, you're dead on arrival. So how does that work? First of all, what, what is the color number combination mean? Okay. Yeah. So there's, I mean, I've been on a lot of different teams. So you have your base color number sequence, right? So whites, greens, blues, right? And this is kind of a generic here.

Like, so white, any number, any number set hut is your base cadence, right? So you can go white, green or blue is just, hey, on one, right? White 80, white 80, set hot, you can go, right? And then we have like, we'd have a black, right? And so a black cadence was usually came with, hey, we're going to go black 80, black 80 said hut. And then I'm going to let you know, hey, we're good, we're good, or we're killing it. Right. So that was your double, that was your double cadence.

Right. And so you go, hey, black 80, black, white, white, white, hot. And then you come back up there, okay, white 80, white eight has. You go black to white, right? And then you have your, we had our brown cadence, which was our, hey, we're going to just keep going on Brown and try and get them to jump. Brown 18, Bradty's a hot, hot, hot, right? You're just trying to get them to jump, but Brown told the O line, don't freaking move. Right, like, don't move unless they move.

And then once you hear me say, Delta, which is your hurry up, right, hey, Delta, hurry, hurry, hurry, Omaha, back with Peyton, right? hey delta that was on next sound and so you have these base cadences built in which is on one on two check with me on the hurry and everything in between and so when you have you have to have all those cadences because if you don't those dns are going to kill you right if you let those dns get a like a bead because those guys i tell you this they go listen to the tv copies oh yeah like they all go listen to the quarterback's cadence to go okay if it's on white it's on green which is why we had three colors of on one right so hey white 80 wide a set hut and then we'd switch them with the veteran quarterbacks like when

i was with phil man every week was the first thing you'd hand out to us on wednesday morning was the snap count cadence for that week now hey green is this this this week red is this this week black is this this week and you'd have okay i better not screw this up in practice or phil's going to kill me right and so when you have all those cadences in and then you compound it with young quarterback new center there can be some miscommunication on there but to have eight of them i i i mean i just i don't understand i really just don't understand how that's even physically positive possible in a home game. So what element is the the killing

plays and the motions go into that? Like could they have thought he was saying different stuff when it came to the kills and the motions? Or and this happens a lot too with with young quarterbacks. And this happened with us with Josh a few times is, hey, gun, tricks right, 64 X, Dino Y Cross, kill 96 power. And it's

supposed to be on the black. And he comes up and he goes, hey, and then he finishes it with on the white, ready, break. And so you go up to the huddle and all you heard was on the white. And so then he comes up there and he goes, hey, black 18, he said, hut, but you heard him in the huddle say white. And so in your brain, you're going, well, this is on one.

And so you're already locked into as soon as he gets color number, color number, I'm gone. And then you get back in hudder, you're like, dude, didn't you say that was on the white? And you're like, ah, yeah, that was on the black. Right. And so that communication, just very simple because there's a lot of information that goes into those play calls.

Like, that was a pretty short play call that I just parked out. Like a lot of them are gun, F moves, it trips right, and you're just like okay okay get to the point dude right and we're going there because all of us only listen for two letters in that thing like everyone's listening for different things and if the quarterback has a brain fart and he calls it on the white when it's supposed to be on the black or he calls it on the black when it's supposed to be on the white and all week you work that stuff that's just music communication in the huddle which can lead to disaster playing quarterback's not easy there's a lot going on there's meanwhile you've got someone hammering in your ear for the first

25 seconds, right? Hey, don't forget if the safety comes underneath, like, you've got to throw it here. And like, if the chief techniques watch it in the pitch is up, okay, I can think black 15. Like, it's just it's so much. Being a quarterback is so difficult. It's why they make $60 million if they're really good at their job. It's also why it takes a while to become good at one, which I think we are

watching in front of our own eyes. I need your analysis of the offensive line in this game. Because I was watching and I felt a tad emotional at times because the clean pockets had the quarterback standing there for five seconds. And I thought, we dreamed of this. Jeremiah and I, we saw a utopia where Derasaw and O'Neill, they were healthy and they were dancing with unicorns. And the first rounder, he looks like he can play. And the fat guy on the right, look at him. And even Brandl all of a sudden had a pretty good game. I think it was so by the numbers, they had their second best pass blocking game.

in terms of PFF grade as a team over the last two years. So considering that they were down in the game also, where the other teams pinning years back and running blitzes and stuff, the one thing I think we do know is that if this line continues to stay healthy, McCarthy will have time to throw the football because I've been very impressed when we've seen even four fifths of what this is supposed to look like with this offensive line. Yeah, I thought they played one of their best games of the year.

and maybe their best games is a unit up to this point. And, I mean, it helps when Madabouque is not there. And, like, they're missing some of their key edge rushers. And they don't have a Jadabion Clownie on the other edge. Like, they don't have a key marquee pass rusher. They don't. And that helps because it seems like everyone in this league does. And so when you don't have that, you have to take advantage of it.

And you have to show I'm the better unit, which is what the offensive line for Minnesota did this week. I thought they opened up holes well in the run game when the one game was called. They gave JJ plenty of time, right? so much criticism of his Atlanta game was like, yeah, you see justice school? Get out to get killed. It's like, can't say that this week. Like, Dara saw he eliminated the left side of the front, right side.

And that's why he could step up, step up, step up, and then throw it into the back of the head of Brake Brandel or whatever it might have been. Like, he had plenty of time. And so that's where you're going, okay, that's step number one, is let's make sure he's not getting hit early and often while he wasn't. This offensive line played very solid as a group. I think they're jelling really well together.

Blake has stepped in in a huge way in the front. there and getting everyone settled and lined up and going, heard Kelly might be coming back soon. That's a whole other conversation for a whole other day. I think that with Blake Brandl being there and settling things, that gives us a little more leeway to make sure that Kelly's brain isn't completely broken and make sure we get it out there and treat him respectfully as a veteran that he is. But overall, man, I'm really excited about if this line can stay healthy, they're going to look like the line we all thought they were, which could be a top five offensive line unit in the

NFL. They have moved up despite all the problems on the rankings to the 10. highest graded line. And that's really based on just when they've gotten their healthy guys back because they were certainly nowhere close to that when they had their backups in there, which I think is what we were talking about for the entire times. Like, there's really nothing to analyze here. You need your players playing. And once they have been, they've been the group. And also, this is a group you could build on into the future. As you mentioned, I don't know what's going to happen with Ryan Kelly. Blake Brandl probably isn't a long term answer, but he has played really well over the last couple weeks anyway. are a big part of that. But the other four, Fries is under contract. O'Neill's under contract. Jackson's a first-year player. Derisaw is going to be here a long time. You can build on this in front of J.J. McCarthy going forward. The Chicago Bears are three-point underdogs coming to Minnesota. What have you made of the bears whose record is good? And yet every game, it's like the bears barely escape with victory, which is not usually a great sign for sustainability.

I mean, Ben Johnson is getting this team better and better. It is a totally different football team than they faced week one, right? And you can't look at that week one tape and think that that's the same team that's going to be walking into the U.S. Bank Stadium. This offense is clicking, right? And it's kind of a flavor of the week, right? Hey, last week it was DJ Moore, it's going to throw touchdown passes and catch it.

And then zero catches this week, but Roma Dunesay goes nuts. And, you know, Colston Loveland started to become more involved in this offense. He was non-existent in week one. I don't even know if he had a catch against the Vikings in week one. And then Colquemette and then this Monongai guy is just, I mean, hammer, nail. Like, everything in his world is a nail, and he's just going to run right through it. And you're seeing the interior start to gel back together with Thuny and Dalman and Jonah Jackson and Darnell Wright's playing at maybe an all pro level right now. I mean, I watched him one hand Brian Burns and throw him into the dirt, which was very impressive.

And so you're seeing this group start working better and better each week. And I really do think Ben Johnson's getting them better on offense because he understands at the weak point of his team right now is his defense is going to get him in trouble, right? They are really struggling to stop the run. They're really struggling to generate sacks and get to the quarterback. And so if I'm Ben Johnson, I'm going, okay, we're going to have to score a lot of points against a really talented Vikings defense, but I'm going to blitz the living hell out of J.J.

McCarthy because I watched him last week, like sit back there and pat, pat, pat. I'd rather make him uncomfortable. I'd rather try and not let him sit back there and see the field, but I'd rather rush him to see the field and maybe he throws a few more to us. But I think this Bears team is a lot improved from week one. Well, the biggest question with Ben Johnson, especially after a very strange training camp at times, although, you know, when they had their full start issues, he went crazy in their training camp. So they, I mean, he knows how important it is to get that down. But what I saw even in week one was the same stuff that we saw in Detroit where guys were open and Caleb missed them and

I think he's hitting them much better and their run game is dangerous. I mean, Malung guy is like a Leroy whore. He's just like running over people. He's, uh, Mike Anderson from the Broncos, you know, just like some big fullback kind of guy. Mike all Scott. Like that's kind of what he is though. Like just this big guy who's kind of run over people. But with him and Swift as a duo, it's a very nice combination. And here's the biggest thing. Caleb Williams is not taking those sacks. And if he's not taking those sacks, he is a much better player. He would have been last year if he didn't take as many sacks as he did. I think their offense is dangerous. I think their defense is porous overall. But if you can't find the guys that you're looking for from a clean pocket, J.J. McCarthy's only completing 55% of his

passes from a clean pocket. The league average is about 72% from a clean pocket. He's going to have time to throw, I think, but he's got to be accurate and we'll see what kind of game plan they have. I do think this is the type of game where he bounces completely back, where it's a defense that is not dangerous. It's not scary. It may be a little complicated with the coverage looks at times, but I think it's going to be, you know, all phasers set to getting him and Jefferson on the same page. That's everything for this week and that they will bounce back. And then everybody doesn't have to fight each other in every comment section for another. seven date. But let's love to see it. I hate to see it before we wrap up here. I'll give you a love

to see it with the Nebraska freshman quarterback. Congratulations. A great win, a great performance from him. Well done. You thought the season was over. Husker football was going down. And I also want to throw out too that Matt Rule and what he said and his speech that he gave after the passing of Marshawn Neeland was really, really well thought out and moving and important. And so Matt Rule, I think has done a really good job overall with that team. And to get a win after that, you know, I thought that was a, it was a really good week for a Husker football. Yeah, we needed that one bad. I mean, now the hard part is, and we've lived this in this show before too, is, well, who's the quarterback of the future off of one game against a bad ass UCLA team,

right? Like, they're not good. And so it's like, okay, let's wait and see what happens. against Penn State here. And I do the post game call-in show. We were on air from one to three. And I made a meme. I'll send you. It's the one where I'm the army guy, the person's sleeping. And I'm like, big red reaction, Dylan Raola. Because everyone was just like, where's Dylan playing next year? It's like, please everyone called out. But yeah, Huskers are seven wins going in before Thanksgiving. Fantastic news there. My hate to see it is Brian Daible getting fired. You know, I think that I've been maybe a dable stand because I like the guy. But, you know, he's just you can't lose football games the way he's lost football games and expect to keep

the job i think he had a really good pitch to go into to joe sheen and the crew be like listen i'm down rb one i'm down wide receiver one like i've got a rookie quarterback that's got a lot of promise that i love and i want to build but you just can't have games in the 90 percentile of winning and then find ways to lose them or let the broncos score 30 points in a fourth quarter like it's just one of those things where i don't think the giants really had a choice but i do think that long term for Jackson Dart's success. Daible probably was the right answer and he'll probably be the offensive coordinator for the Buffalo Bills next year, which is going to be

terrifying for everyone. Yeah, I mean, as far as Daible goes, I think that it wasn't just the losses that piled up, but also the handling of multiple concussions with Jackson Dart and the whole issue with the training staff that first time that they got hammered for and then putting him back out there after it looked like it was another concussion. I mean, those are the things that fall on the shoulders of the head coach. And that's your most valuable merchandise going forward.

So, but you're right. I mean, at the end of the day, you can't have records like this and keep your job pretty much anywhere. Even if he is a good offensive mind. You mentioned the Buffalo Bills. You talk about hate to see it. I hate to see what's going on with their offense. All year, it's basically if James Cook is great, then, okay, it looks fine. But they have no downfield presence whatsoever.

And the greatest armed quarterback in the world, it's not adding up. the receiver thing, you know, their general manager went on my old radio station and screamed at the talk host for criticizing them for not getting a receiver. Keon Coleman is terrible and they can't throw it down the field. And I don't know if you can win the Super Bowl this way. If you can have losses like this one and Atlanta, I mean, the New England loss doesn't look as bad now. But still, like, you're one team one week and another team, another week. And that's not what you're supposed to be when you have a quarterback of that caliber. yeah i mean there's a world in which buffalo misses the playoffs and i'm not kidding like that that is a very

real scenario here with how well new england's got a couple game lead in that division now with the tiebreaker over buffalo you're looking at indianapolis you're looking at teams like jacksonville like i know they just let one slip this week too but you know it's just one of those things we're like buffalo this is what happens when you pay your quarterback 350 million and you don't draft well that that's just what happens if you don't draft a good receiver you can't go four to $30 million Justin Jefferson. Like that's just not how the cap works and they are the most cap-strapped team in the entire NFL and they can't stay healthy.

So yeah, I absolutely hate seeing that because I love that crew. I love what they're doing up there. But nature of the football next man up and if the next man up is a big drop off, then you're in a lot of trouble. I'll throw out one more hate to see it. You know, I feel as a man approaching 40, the age catches up a little bit. You need a little more sleep. Got to go to bed a little earlier.

A long day at the stadium wears me out more than it did when I took over this job at 29, I think. And I feel Aaron Rogers is getting tired as well. That early in the season, you know, he's throwing the ball pretty well. And people are like, yeah, you know, he's looking pretty good. And if he was the Vikings quarterback than this, the other night, he looked like an old man who needs a nap. And I just, when Rogers comes back, you're always worried about. And look, I mean, the whole guy and the Vikings relationship with him, him and all that. But you have to respect him as one of the great

quarterbacks of all time. He has not looked like that in years. And in that game, I thought this, this is where this is Joe Namath playing for the Rams the other night. This is where you've crossed the line to look in 2010 Farvish, where you just don't have it anymore. And he was trying the safety he takes. He's like, I'm going to escape. No, you're not. Not anymore. And it's kind of, I hate to see when age is catching up to everyone because it is B2. Well, yeah, and I'll finish with one more hate to see it as well. Bengals, what are we doing open Joe Burroughs window here?

I really don't understand this. Like, unless Joe Burrow can play middle linebacker and stop the run, what is Joe Burrow going to do differently than Joe Flacco is doing right now? Because right now they're scoring 38, 40 points, and losing games. Like, are you thinking, well, if we get Joe back, we'll score 50, so we'll win? I mean, you're risking your franchise quarterback. to come back. And maybe, and maybe this is a, hey, let's see if we can beat the Steelers this weekend, get ourselves back in the divisional race and go from there. And if it doesn't work

out and we lose the next two, then yeah, put him back on IR and tankathon begins. I really don't understand. He's been hurt. He's had the wrist. He's had the ACL. He's had the cap. Why, why even remotely try and rush this guy back? I just really don't understand it. Not only that, but I'm really enjoying watching Joe Flacco play ridiculous football. Let the man, let the old man play. actually, when I saw that, I actually felt bad for Joe Flacko. I'm like, this is his last chance, man. He's having a great time out there. He's having fun.

He's also getting a break from his wife and kids and eating alone and talking about how much he likes that. How much he loves it. I used to think, I used to feel bad for that guy. Now I realize he's in heaven. He's having the time of his life. Don't take this away for nothing from Joe Flacko. I agree with you.

Well, every week is a new journey in the National Football League. So we will be back again next week. And I think we're going to be talking about. like J.J. Fixed everything because the bears can't stop nothing. So I sure hope so. We'll see. We'll see for all of our emotional health. Jeremiah, thank you for your time as always. And we'll talk to you next Tuesday. Absolutely. Football. Football. All right. We welcome in special contributor to the show, Maggie Robinson for her weekly breakdown of what's going on around the National Football League. And Maggie, we're never short on things to talk about and things to react to. The minute we think

that we've got this National Football League figured out. It lets us know that we are nowhere close. So where would you like to begin this week? I want to take us down to Philadelphia, okay? For this kind of bizarre game versus the Green Bay Packers, 7 to 10 win, Philadelphia wins. But it was scoreless in the first half. Both quarterbacks had these really awkward, weird fumbles.

And then Philly kind of got it going. But the player that I want to highlight in this game, the trade deadline was last week. Jalen Phillips was treated from Miami to the Eagles as an edge rusher. And when I tell you, he is the most excited person in that locker room. This man is juiced. He was quoted saying, this is literally the greatest thing that's ever happened to me. Sir what?

You just moved from Miami, Florida, up to Philadelphia, and you're gushing about the fans. You're gushing about the weather, both of which are notoriously not great. Anyway, he was so excited that he had like an insane game, six tackles, two quarterback hits, a fumble recovery, like stood on his head. And I just want to say, I think this is Howie Roseman doing some sort of black magic once again in Philadelphia. It really is. And with Jalen Phillips, he was a guy that just a couple of years ago was one of the best young emerging edge rushers in the entire NFL. And it just hasn't gone the same since maybe I think it was his second year in the NFL, but he was a high draft pick. He is a freakish talent. And adding that to a Philadelphia defensive line

that already has some superstars, but also had some weaknesses, makes them once again one of the more dangerous defensive lines in the entire NFL. But I think for as it pertains to the Vikings, having the Green Bay Packers melting down and asking Matt LaFleur if he's worried about his job in the post game, it has gotten a little bit ugly there. And this is Green Bay without Tucker Kraft. They're leading wide receiver. He was just absolutely fantastic at terms of yards after catch.

and he's out for the year now with an ACL. So that's going to take an adjustment. And then Elkton Jenkins got hurt for them too in this game. And he's going to be out. The Vikings play them in two weeks. That's something to keep an eye on whether they could get it turned around because that offense has been pretty gnarly. So as much as Philly deserves a lot of credit,

it's been ugly for the Green Bay Packers. And there's a pretty clear blueprint now to beat them. So it's on LaFleur to make adjustments in these coming weeks. But I don't know if they can because they just, In terms of receiving options, they don't have the horses, and you probably saw the dropped pass by Bo Melton, who was a receiver and then a corner and then a receiver, again, dropped a key pass in that game that cost the Green Bay Packers. So it's gotten, it's gotten pretty bad there, but there's a reason why Philly should still be considered a top contender for the Super Bowl because they got better at the trade deadline. Yeah, they've just made the right decisions consistently. and I don't really know how they're so good at thinking this far ahead and projecting and picking the right players.

But another guy that they nabbed didn't play in this last game would have been great was J.R. Alexander from Baltimore. And that was kind of a weird one in the off season with him. And we all kind of thought he was going to play in this game versus Green Bay because like, oh my gosh, you were just on the Packers. And then you were with Baltimore. But he wasn't really put on the plane. There was maybe an injury. A little bit of strangeness there. but the internet was kind of going crazy.

Do you think this is overblown or what was it? It might be one of those things. It depends on if we think that they were really playing like 40 chess or whatever. It might be one of those things where they acquired him to get as much information about the Packers offense as they could. And one of the key moments in the game was the defensive tackle for the Eagles yelling out the play call and when they needed a fourth down conversion and it turned out to be the right call and they made a tackle in the,

backfield and the game essentially ended there. They made it a little more interesting than it needed to be. But you wonder how much of a sense or even is it just that they've gotten predictable. But I don't know, Jayaeer Alexander, like a lot of people, age and injuries in the NFL comes for them. And I don't know if that was in particular that, but that would be like next level. Let's just acquire a guy to ask him about the Packers and not ever plan to play him. And I guess that's worth a draft pick if you're the Philadelphia Eagles or maybe when he gets

healthy down the stretch of the playoffs they'll have a little more depth there but their defense looking as good as it did is pretty scary for the nfc that would be a crazy reasoning for how we roseman i feel like and maybe this has been done before chat if you guys know let us know has anyone ever been drafted just because they know the play call of the team they're about to play like is that a reason to spend a couple mill you know i mean there have been players who have been picked up who have been cut that that does happen where somebody is coming out of training camp and they're playing the other team that he used to play for or something and they cut him and pick them up and they'll try to ask him everything they can.

That happens sometimes, but I'll tell you a funny story, Mike Vrable, one time we used to do these coaches calls where we would talk to the opposing team's coach and the Vikings picked up a player for the Titans where Vrable was coaching and he got asked, hey, did you pick up that guy just because, or do you think the Vikings picked up that guy just because he was with the Titans? And Vrable said, he wouldn't know our defense good enough to matter anyway. Oh, my gosh. That was great. That was great.

That was ruthless. I was like, okay, I guess we know why you got cut then. Poor guy just catching strays left and right. Did nothing wrong. That's funny. I want to wrap us up here, though, with Green Bay with some news that came out about Green Bay player, Mike Parsons, all right? So, like, the drama doesn't end here.

He actually, when he left Dallas, had to sign what's called like the poison pill I don't want to say settlement but like in his negotiations he essentially said he cannot be dealt to any NFC East rivals of the Cowboys which I thought was quite interesting and I hadn't really heard of this and the reason I hadn't is because the last time it was used was like Brett Far of an 08 with the Jets so that was kind of interesting to me totally checks out as something

that Dallas Cowboys would do of being like okay fine we'll give him up but we're just going to screw all of you guys over and make sure that you don't get him because we're letting go of him. Yeah, it is a funny stipulation in the contract, but also Brett Farve ended up playing for the Minnesota Vikings anyway, uh, it is a long contract for Micah Parsons in Green Bay. So I don't think it'll be anytime soon that he ends up playing for any other team. In fact, you'd probably guess for a player like that. Most of the time when you get that guy, you just keep it forever.

The Dallas Cowboys chose not to, but that's how Green Bay usually would plan to do that. But that is funny. Like, don't you dare turn around and send him to the Philadelphia Eagles. Maybe that was a hint, Jerry, that he was really good at football and you shouldn't give him up. But now there's going to be a lot of pressure on Michael Parsons because I don't see an answer for Green Bay to wave a magic wand and all of a sudden be a great offense. I do think that with Jordan Love, around every corner is either the hottest game or the

coldest game that you've ever seen. That's just who he is as a quarterback. And people never can get over it. like the media, the fans, whatever, is that that's who he is. But with one of his weapons that kept him on schedule, Tucker Kraft, who only had an average depth of target about five yards and was all yards after catch, taking that guy off, I think makes it harder for him to be consistent. So it's going to be on the Packers defense, which was excellent against Philly.

It's going to be on their defense in order for them to win. And that battle now at Lambo, if they're continuing to play like this with the Vikings, becomes very, very interesting because that one with both defenses playing well and both offenses struggling could be 10 to 7 again. Yeah, that'll for sure be a game to watch. And someone that just let go, got let go of in the NFL, that's not a good transition, but it's going to jump there anyway. Brian Daibel was fired from the New York Giants.

We all saw this coming. This is not shocking. It's his fourth straight loss. They're two and eight. but I think the thing that was most notable here was the Jackson DART concussion. So this is his third concussion evaluation in three different starts,

and he has this reckless style of prey that we've seen. He has like the most rushing touchdowns of any rookie at the Giants ever. And that's awesome, but that's because he makes these runs when they're not necessarily needed, when they're really dangerous, and they're maybe not the right choice.

They're the great choice. We can give him that. He's going to put it all in the line, for his team, but he's also putting his body on the line. And I think Brian Dable, in my opinion, did not do a good enough job of managing that and kept giving him plays in which he could get injured.

And that, after seeing him go into the concussion evaluation tent, try to get him out early, just felt a little murky there with all that. Right. Because this was not, as you mentioned, the first time that they've already dealt with an issue with Jackson Dart and him going into the tent earlier this year was

a fireable offense in itself. and then not dealing with it correctly this time. Although I will say, I mean, in some ways in Dable's defense, there's supposed to be somebody watching at all times for concussions that can signal down and have the player pulled off the field. And was that person eating a sandwich at the time? I mean, it seems pretty clear that he needed to be evaluated. And it's always difficult with quarterbacks because you take them out

and Russell Wilson has to go play. Nobody wants that. But they have not done right by Jackson Dart this season. and that was a fireable offense, but also a just shocking number of times where they were ahead in games, had chances to win. And in this one,

they had a great chance to beat the Chicago Bears, completely fall apart. The one against Denver was one of the craziest losses I've ever seen a team have. So it was obvious that Dable had lost control of this. It was not able to close out games. I saw that they kicked a field goal at the one yard line. Are you serious?

So in the year 2025, and Roger Goodell's National Football League, you're kicking an 18-yard field goal. Like, what are we doing here? So, you know, he, I think was looked like a little in over his head these last few years and didn't have plans that worked for the quarterback. The only unfortunate part of that is, and the bears have screwed this up, many of teams have screwed this up. You should fire him before you get your quarterback so you can pair the new coach with

the quarterback, not. And this just goes on the long list of coaches who have, they've, drafted a quarterback to save the franchise. The kid can't do it right away and the coach gets fired. Then he's got to learn a whole new offense and everything else. Not very good management, not very good timing. And I remember saying when last year, John Mara said, well, they have to win next year. Everybody's going to be gone or whatever about dable. It's like if you're thinking about breaking up with somebody, just break up with him because you're eventually going to get there anyway and they finally did. Yeah. You got to rip the bandit off. And if he sounds like he knew

earlier on. And I did read a quote from Mara where he was saying, yeah, in 2022, Daveo was coming off coach of the year. He was riding really high. But especially in a place like New York, you cannot ride that high because you are going to fall off that cliff just as fast as you got up there. And that's exactly what happened. He had that outstanding 2022 season and then just couldn't find the pieces again. And there was some back and forth with Mike Kafka. Like, you get played calling responsibilities. No, you don't just get in there back to me. that's confusing. That doesn't put a lot of trust in your staff. Also, your staff is up and leaving because they don't like working with you. That feels like a telling sign of maybe there's

some personnel issues here. Yeah. And I think that there are some people, Josh McDaniels is this way, who's having a ton of success again in New England, who are made to be coordinators and not made to be head coaches. And it's just such a different job. It's not just pick up a, you know, the whiteboard marker and draw plays and install offenses and things like that. It's managing and being the CEO of an entire franchise. And it did not seem that that was really dable's strong suit. And I've also never seen someone squeeze so much goodwill out of a nine win season, which is what they had in 2022.

They beat the Vikings of the playoffs. But I believe they were nine, six and one. And he probably should have won coach, should not have one coach of the year in that season, And considering that the Vikings won 13 games that year with new coach Kevin O'Connell. So, yeah, I think Daible kind of showed that he will be an office of coordinator, I'm sure again. But head coach, I'm not so sure about that. And just to add one more layer of speculation onto this. So they kept the GM, Joe Schoen.

They came in together, Daible and Schoen. Is that someone that you see sticking around or is he getting the boot soon too? So I actually think that from a perspective of team building, They've done a good job. They have a young quarterback to work with. Clearly, Dark can play. I don't know what his ceiling is, but he can play. They've drafted some defensive players high.

They've built a really excellent defensive line. They made some key signings in the off season. Malik Neighbors has been out. That's really tough for everybody. But they have Malik neighbors to build going forward. Cam Scadaboo is going to come back. They've got a lot to work with with the roster. I think that this is actually, despite being New York,

I think it's actually a favorable job to take over for a head coach. who do you think in in the the sphere of coaches who are floating around is going to get that job it's obviously bill belich no i'm just kidding um oh my god i i don't know uh i i think that when you start to look at which teams are succeeding this is always the pretty clear model to be able to do it who's succeeding whose offense is good and then higher from there and uh i don't know like who's working on the staff of the Indianapolis Colts. Let me look this up. Who is the Indianapolis Colts offensive coordinator?

Because that might be somebody. Who is that? That is, oh, actually, that's Jim Bob Cooter, probably unlikely to be. He's been around forever and has the funniest name in sports. Is that actually his name? You're kidding. That is truly his name. His name is Jim Bob Cooter.

He used to work for the Detroit Lions for a while, probably more of a coordinator type of guy. Maybe I don't even know who's doing the Rams. who's doing the Rams, because everyone loves higher in the Rams offensive coordinators, as we've seen here. Michael Flore, okay, maybe, maybe, I don't know. Usually that's how, what you're going to do, could be Michael Flore. I wouldn't be surprised by that. What you're going to do is you're going to look for somebody, just like the Bears did

with Ben Johnson, to lock in with your young quarterback and have those two go forward together. So whoever it will be is going to be an offensive coordinator, a QB coach or something that's going to work really closely with Jackson Dart. Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. And let's actually look to the L.A. Rams in the NFC West. We had a NorCal SoCal showdown with the San Francisco 49ers in the L.A. Rams. And the Rams beat the Niners pretty handily.

4226. Now they're sitting at 7 and 2 second place in the NFC West. And player of the game, Matt Stafford, maybe having his best of his 17 seasons, dare I say? You're not crazy. Right now, I think if you were doing MVP, it's Jonathan Taylor and it's Matthew Stafford, where, you know, I've covered a lot of Matthew Stafford games against the Vikings. And for him to progress the way that he did into his 30s, I mean, I don't know if that speaks to McVeigh or it speaks to just him getting, I think a lot smarter. Or actually, the funny thing is now that he doesn't want to get hit as much, I think he makes much better decisions. I'm sure in his older age where he's got, you know, the spinal issues or whatever it is with the back, that,

He doesn't want to get knocked down all that off. So he's getting rid of the football and making good decisions where he used to try to scramble around and be hero and make all the plays and get sacked and throw a lot of picks. Now he's playing extremely safe. And right now on Fandul, the Rams are plus 700 to win the Super Bowl, the third highest odds of anybody in the NFL. I might pick them today to win the Super Bowl. I think they are top to bottom, the strongest team right now in the entire NFL.

And also shout out to Kyle Shanahan for getting this. much out of Mac Jones. That defense is completely crushed with injuries and it's really hard for them to be competitive with half their players out, Bosa's out, Warner's out. But the fact that they were in that game competitive, he went 33 for 39. They've done a really good job there with him. But I think the Rams, they're a beast and they're going to be really, really tough down the stretch and into the playoffs. That is high praise. But I do think it's warranted. And that is a good out this is not the full strength 49ers team by any stretch they're kind of limping along with the crutches on right now just throwing together whatever they can and it is mac jones

who none of us really thought had that much going for him and he's turned out better than expected so you know both those head coaches doing a great job with the players they have namely the quarterbacks i did read a quote from someone at the ringer and i apologize forgot his name he said watching Matt Stafford is like watching Adam Sandler play pickup basketball. He's an older white dude who's bawling out. I thought that was hilarious, so I had to share it because that's a great

analogy. I was struggling to figure out what the punchline was going to be there. But as far as from a statistical perspective, Matthew Stafford is currently the highest graded PFF passer. 67% of his pass is complete

25 touchdowns, two picks, and he has 23 big time throws to only eight turnover worthy plays and 14 sacks. The fact that he just isn't having negative plays anymore is wild to me after watching him with the Lions and right now pass a rating of 114.8 only behind Jared Goff and Sam Darnold. It's, yeah, he's playing great football and it's so funny because in the off season, there was a very real discussion about whether the Los Angeles Rams could trade him and then

maybe they would have signed Sam Darnold and things could be, you know, much different than they are now. But Stafford, when I thought, I actually thought he was going to retire. I was like, ah, come on, man. You know, it's probably over. I was definitely wrong about that because he's playing amazing football. He's getting the last laugh for everybody. And honestly, good for him. Well deserved. He has four kids. He's a full family. Like, he can pack it up whenever he wants, but he's still going and still getting better. So whenever he leaves, he's going to leave on the highest note versus a lot of people leave when they're forced to. I feel like he's going to leave when he wants to. Yeah, it does look that way. The fact

that he cannot take hits like he used to, I think extends how long he could play that maybe it's not even just this year. Although if he wins the Super Bowl, he's got to pull a John Elway or Peyton Manning, I think. I think if you win the Super Bowl now, you've got to say, all right, that's two Super Bowls that would lock him into the Hall of Fame. And that's actually a funny thing about Stafford is that when he went to Los Angeles, I thought, I don't think he's a Hall of Famer. And even when he won the Super Bowl, I was like, I'm not, like, he's a great quarterback, but I'm not fully there yet. Uh, if he could, continues this way and is in the MVP discussion.

I think he's got a great chance to go to the Hall of Fame. Yeah. I mean, what a way for him to write his own story towards the end of this. Let's look at someone who's in his rookie year. This is kind of shocking to me. They always put up rookie of the week and you get to vote on it. It's like a Pepsi sponsored something through the NFL. All right.

Dylan Gabriel was nominated as one of the potential rookies of the week for a loss to the Jets. I'm really confused on the panel that selected him. for this he completed 17 of 32 passes for 167 yards like yes two touchdowns but but like worst game arguably of their season what yeah i mean there's a lot of nominations for worst games of their season uh 53 percent completion percentage for 167 yards is not what i think of when i think rookie of the week uh so i don't know i don't know i mean look j mccarthy and it was exciting for him to come back against the Bears. But he won player of the week,

offensive player of the week in week one. There's no way that he played a good enough game to win that award. I don't know, you're the one who used to work in the NFL front office. I don't know how any of this works. I just assume, here's what I assume, that they have a sponsor thing,

and the sponsors are very, you know, a big deal to make sure that they hit those. But they've got a lot of other things to do when they're running the nation's largest sports league. So they're like a couple of interns. Who do you think? I don't know. And then one of them may be a Browns fan and says like,

let's just give it to Dylan Gabriel or something. I really don't know. It feels like it's pulled out of a hat or the fact that, you know, that they're really, I mean, this year haven't been a ton of explosive rookie performances. Cam Ward has really struggled. Travis Hunter is out for the year. I don't think Mason Graham has been special for Cleveland. Maybe they're just struggling to find rookie performance.

that's the best I could do because that is insane to have a terrible loss to the Jets and not play well and then be named rookie of the week. It's got to be somebody better. That's going to be like my next investigative piece. It's like pulling back the crew. Yes. Who's making these decisions. Who do I need to contact and figure out? That's really funny. But on this list of people for potential rookies of the week is Trayvion Henderson. And I think he gets my vote. Oh, yeah. 150 scrimmage yards and two rushing touchdowns for the Patriots. I think that's got to be the guy. The rest of people not see it.

Tyler Shuck is on here. I mean, he won, I guess. How well did he actually play? I didn't even really look at that game because Panthers. For a 70% passing rate 200, almost 300 yards. Oh, that's pretty good.

Yeah, that's pretty good. I would say that's, yeah, 128 rating. Yeah. I mean, Trayvion Henderson probably had the most exciting game. but Tyler Shook with that performance is deserving. And, you know, I'm sure that they'll be declaring him to be like the guy in New Orleans now, just like they did Spencer Rattler a few weeks ago. But at least that gives them something to be interested in for Tyler Shook.

With Trayvion Henderson, it was fascinating that they weren't playing him at all in New England. And suddenly they get some injuries and they're forced to play him. And then, oh, he's amazing. Like, were you guys missing something there? that actually, if he continues to do stuff like that, makes New England even more dangerous. But hey, good for, good for New Orleans. I would just suggest to all their fans, soak it in

because next week your young quarterback could throw three interceptions and then you'll all hate everything again. We're kind of dealing with that here, Maggie. Yeah. I mean, it's a roller coaster, isn't it? You can never relish the good moments for too long because you know the other shoot is about to drop. It's like that with good quarterbacks,

much less young quarterbacks, but we ride that roller coaster here for sure. So, yeah, no, I mean, look, for those guys, for those two, neither one of them had done much to this point. And then having breakouts, it is really worth watching for New Orleans because if, if Shook can look good, they're a rebuilding team. They're probably going to have the number one, two, three, four pick. They might be a team that's trading out of that if somebody else wants to trade up

and try to get a quarterback, though I don't know who that is in this year's class. that's a good point i had not considered that yeah if they like who they have then they just build and find the personnel around him versus being like we need a replacement we didn't give him enough of a shot there have been a lot of quarterbacks who come out of the draft and we're like they're not that great and then they turn out to be the really good ones and the overhyped guys are exactly that they don't deliver on what we've expected of them in the college game versus the pro game it's just so different so maybe he's one of those sleeper picks i'm not going to say that Or maybe he just played the Carolina Panthers.

It's just so hard to know. Let's jump now to someone who's won a lot of awards in his career and is actually extending his career. So Rob Runkowski just signed or is about to sign a one-day contract to retire as a Patriot. If you remember, he retired and then unretired, followed Tom Brady down to Tampa Bay on a Super Bowl. And now he is retiring as a Patriot, which feels very fitting. It does. And I know some people get cynical about these, like, oh, it's just a cheap PR or something for the team.

Look, I mean, give your fans an opportunity to celebrate that player one more time and have them do a press conference, get them in the news and that sort of thing. I've been a part of a number of these types of press conferences when a player officially retires a Viking like Kyle Rudolph for Brian Robison. And I think it's great for them. It also, it gets hard to have your career end. Even if Rob Grankowski is doing other stuff, it's difficult for them. And I think for the player themselves, it can offer a little bit of closure, which not everybody gets. In fact, very, very few people get to sort of go out.

I want to, no one ever goes out on their own terms because their own terms would be playing forever, right? Right. But just go out in terms of being able to go back to the franchise that loves you, the fan base that loves you. So I will always be a massive appreciator of Rob Grancowski. think he's the best tight end in NFL history considering his receiving and is blocking his impact on that offense. So good for him. And I also want to add one thing that I don't know

if your audience will know. He's doing this because one of his mentors, he was very involved in the community and charity space in New England, did a lot of volunteer work. And a philanthropist that he worked with just passed away from cancer. And she was the one kind of talked to him about this. So he's doing this in her honor. Oh, that's really nice. Her name is Susan Hurley. And it's just a very feel-good story of like, wow, this guy is doing something very impactful and he's done a lot of work in New England community. That's awesome. We should recognize that. And I think that's that's gronk too. I think that's who he is, which is a really nice thing about him, like the big over-enthusiastic type of character, I think is a big heart with him as well. He comes from

Buffalo and so do I. So I followed his career very closely. That's, yeah, that's a great story. I did not know that before you said it. So I'm really glad I wasn't like, screw him. Who needs a one-year, one-day contract? But that's very kind of him to do. Yeah. And then not to end this pod on a down note, but I do want to take a moment to acknowledge Commissioner Tagliabu and just how much he impacted the modern national football league as we know it. He grew the league from 28 to 32 teams. He was commissioner for 17 years. He helped negotiate a new CBA. There were no player strikes underneath him. He had a very good relationship with the players association and with everyone he worked with in the front office implemented the Rooney rule was big

on diversity. He just did a lot to shape the NFL as we now know it and we view it. You remember NFL Europe? That was all him. And now the NFL is playing its final international game in Madrid this week. And who knows what's coming next? He just had such a big impact and no one's down playing it. But I just wanted to take a moment that the NFL as we know it today would not be the same if it was not for him. I totally agree. And this would be like my childhood commissioner. Can you have a childhood commissioner? But he was, uh, the commissioner of the NFL as I was grown up and watching the league and to see the, the steps that it took. I think Pete Roselle will always get credit for taking the NFL from where it was, which was kind of in the background in comparison to another sport like

baseball and then emerging as America's game. But then taglibu picking up on that, moving the game forward, getting into the place where Roger Goodell took over was a massive accomplishment for him. And I think that in terms of its national popularity, it started to reach its peak where it has remained under Paul Tagliabu. So rest in peace to a great commissioner of the NFL. And there you go. I mean, it's it's the NFL, I don't think gets to this point without him. Absolutely not.

I mean, his handprint is all over. that front office and it was a sad day. Did we really need the Jaguars though? No. Could we have to take them? We have enough teams in Florida. Come on now. We just didn't.

We just didn't. No one needed that. We've never needed that outside of when Mark Brunel was playing there anyway. But something we do need on the show is you each week dropping in with your look around the NFL, Maggie. So great stuff as always. And we'll see you next week. Sounds good.

See y'all. Football.