Purple Insider - a Minnesota Vikings and NFL podcast - Kevin O'Connell wants more run-pass balance -- we good with that?

Episode Date: December 28, 2022

Matthew Coller and former Minnesota Viking Jeremiah Sirles talk about Kevin O'Connell saying he wants the offense to be more balanced. Did the Vikings find something with bigger personnel against the Giants? Why has TJ Hockenson fit in so well with Kirk Cousins? What's it like playing at Lambeau Field and why does the Vikings defense give up so many passes over the middle? Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Purple Insider is presented by Liquid Death, delicious water that's bringing death to plastic. Learn more at liquiddeath.com slash insider. Hello and welcome to another episode of Purple Insider. Matthew Collar here in his Tuesday morning left guard with Jeremiah Searles. And, well, Jeremiah, do you buy that someone can be the team of destiny as they are starting to be called? I feel like we sort of trotted on this ground a little bit maybe weeks ago. Do you think it is some magical cosmic forces? And then they lost the game to Detroit and we went like, no, no magic

doesn't exist. Uh, and then the magic has returned over the last two weeks. Although I do want to, I do want to read your tweet at some point and get your reaction, but team of destiny, real thing or no, it has to be. I think at this point, there's no other choice. There's no other explanation for some of the things that happen besides this team's just figuring out ways to win. You know, I think for so many years, luck was against them that eventually it was just bound to flip all the one score games that they lost at the last minute or the missed field goals of Blair Walsh of the past versus now you're just that you can do nothing wrong. Jefferson could retire today and probably go into the hall of fame. I mean, there's just so many things that are going right for this team right now that it's hard for me to say they're not the team of destiny and why can't they make a run? Okay. I can't find the tweet, but George Foster, who I follow on Twitter, former NFL offensive tackle played for the Denver Broncos. I follow him because he's just super

funny. And he tweeted last night, like, so the Vikings had to come back against this Colts team, huh? I mean, there is definitely, there is definitely a part when you're watching that game where you go, yeah, I'm not sure what happened there exactly. Because I think the Colts have now been outscored 6,000 to zero in the second halves of games. And the Vikings were down 33 points to that team. And then with the New York Giants, Daniel Jones had one game over 300 yards this year

and then had 334 yards passing and had to fumble. So, I mean, there is the, there is definitely the team of destiny argument where you say like, well, look, I mean, they have these players who make big plays and they have an unstoppable force wide receiver and everything else. But I also think that what you said last week does not change after this game where you said, look, they're making me nervous here. And it's like, well, if you thought going into last week's game, like, Hey, this team probably just, you know, it's going to have this luck run out eventually. And then they kick a 61 yard field goal. I understand where you're coming from.

Or if you say, look, that there's something to this end of game stuff with how comfortable Kirk Cousins is more comfortable than he's ever been before in his entire life. And Justin Jefferson, when you need him, he's going to win the game for you. Plus, you know, someone like Patrick Peterson. I mean, this is like, they don't just have like good players here. Zedarius Smith, Patrick Peterson, Justin Jefferson. I mean, these guys are, I mean, I don't know if Zedarius will make the Hall of Fame or if Harrison Smith will make the Hall of Fame,

but these are all pro caliber players who are making these plays. This isn't like a team of triple-A baseball players who came up and sort of knocked the ball around the yard and had every ground ball go for a single. I mean, these are guys who have done it before. I think the problem is, I don't know if it's a problem or just the reality of, you know, you have those all pro level receivers and then you have your young rookies that are up and coming. It's the middle part of this team. That is the weak point. You know, it's the middle part.

It's the, the Jordan Hicks, who's a serviceable often or serviceable linebacker, but he's not great. You know, it's, it's guys like DJ want them who you asked to start for a while and he couldn't do it.

And then now it's like, okay, you're a spot guy, you know? And so that's where you see some of the drop off but it's almost like it's the perfect balance it's like it's the ying into the yang you know you got the old guys out there doing their thing at the all pro level at times you got the young guys that are figuring it out and you got everyone kind of in the middle that either rises to the high level side or kind of falls down to the young guy side

you know and that's been kind of the peaks and valleys at times of the season, obviously more peaks and valleys, but it just always seems like when it's the valleys, the wheels really come off, but this last few weeks, and I know that Colts team is absolutely abysmal. Jeff Saturday, just crawl back into the hole at ESPN and say, this was fun, but never again. But, you know, I think that there's been more climb towards the, okay, we're figuring out how to win games. We're not figuring out how to lose games. And there is definitely something to that. And I feel like I've said that every week on this podcast, but it's true. You know, it'd be so much easier for me to get on here if they lose and be like, this is why we lost.

Boom, boom, boom, boom. But you can point to this is why we won. We were resilient. We converted some big time third downs. We got to stop when we need. We got a turnover when we needed, which is what we talked about last week. This defense has to get turnovers. That's how they won at the beginning of the year. It's how they're going to continue to win. It's how you watch across the league, how teams win. You know, how did Dallas beat the beat Philly? They got 20 points off turnovers and still barely beat them. You know, so there's just so many factors that go into it, but they're playing complimentary football. They're figuring their life out.

If they can not turn the ball over and they can somehow manufacture one to two turnovers a game i really like this team's chances of going deep but as soon as you take the turnovers out of this we don't go toe-to-toe with many playoff teams just being honest i mean we said early in the year that the yardage and the points would eventually start to match up and uh they have it's 31st and 28th in defense and i don't know any way to look at that and go like maybe it'll be fine like i mean that's that is a hard one to justify knowing that the other team is going to be able to consistently move the ball on you and they're going to be able to score if they produce in the red zone and if they other team doesn't turn the ball over, like Detroit or like Philadelphia or

like Dallas, the games that they've lost, it's just going to be hard to keep up. And this is what I wanted to talk with you about, because I wrote an article today after asking Kevin O'Connell about their balance on offense, because there were times during the Giants game where I thought if they run the ball with Delvin Cook like five times in a row there might be no stopping this team I mean they but they just I'll give you an example so they were up 17 13 they've got the ball they have a chance to just put the dagger in a team which they have refused to do this year at any point and they run twice for 19 yards in the first two runs. Madison had a 13

yarder. Delvin cook had a six yarder and then through four straight passes, turnover on downs. And it was just like, like, I, I get why you'd want to throw all the time. Justin Jefferson leads the NFL in what I tried to work around like neutral situation. So I took out the fourth quarter where things are crazy and everyone's throwing, took out third down where you're throwing all the time. And the Vikings are still one of the top teams at passing first, which we wanted. And we said, lean into Kirk cousins.

And it's like, this is what you should do. And look, it's worked year 12 and three. Like this is the thing we were asking for, for years, lean into the Kirk. We've talked about this throw to the number one wide receiver all the time but i do feel like and kevin o'connell admitted

this as well i feel like there's just a little bit of that pass button where he just has to keep hitting it and one thing i would give kevin stefanski where i thought he was amazing at this and pat schirmer as you know if the other team couldn't stop the run, it'd just be like run, run 60% of the time on first down or something, but I think that this is as far as like, what steps can they take to be ever so slightly sharper than they've been to not allow some of this to happen? It's when you get a lead and your offensive line is blocking up the run very well, which they did in this game. PFF had every offensive lineman, except for, I think, Schlotman against the run is being

above average, which he's a backup. But everyone else had a good day. And your right guard, your biggest weakness, like that's what he does. So I think this is a thing for them to examine over the next two weeks of it's not should we be running all the time. But when we push that button and when we stick with it, I think can make a difference to not allowing some of these things to happen like what went down against the Giants. Absolutely. And, you know, you look at a team, I mean, look at like what Buffalo had to do in Chicago this week. Like that's a pass happy offense. They just fed their two running backs. Obviously, the weather played a situation, but you saw some of that out of that offense, too.

It's like, yeah, we want to throw the ball over the yard, but like, let's just keep doing it because it's working. You know, and as you get deeper into the playoffs and as the situations get more and more critical and every second can be the difference between the lead and the difference between like giving up a lead that run game is crucial that 40 seconds that ticks off because you keep the clock running is really really important so i think picking your times when to do that but also i think a big piece of why the running the ball was good for this team in this game and why can is the what we've talked about for a long time is the effectiveness on first down you know if you can be effective and get that six yard run on first down then sure I'm okay with you hitting the playbook more a little wide open you know if

you want to throw it on second and four I'm way more comfortable that than throwing it on first and ten second and ten because you give yourself a little bit more cushion, right? So I think that picking and choosing if it's working to keep rolling with it, but also if you're comfortable and you think it's done really well in practice and it's looked good through the reps, leading with it, you know, leading with it and it being okay of like, hey, we're going to lead with the run. Yes, we're still a pass first offense, but leading with the run to control the pass has really just not been what this team's been about this year it's been very much let's pass and then we'll run you know I think even if it just it doesn't have to flip completely but just giving enough wrinkle to it like you said

enough balance enough ability to just be able to you know throw everything at the kid like throw the kitchen sink at these defenses is really important because if you become one-dimensional especially in the playoffs you're dead you're just dead you can't be one-dimensional in the playoffs any either way about it you know so i think for this team like you said to continue to sharpen continue to get better i really liked alvin cook you're paying him a lot of money man at this point of the year like there's no like let's keep him healthy like now it's no just throw him throw him in there get him going you know especially against green bay right because if we win this game against green bay i don't want to see anyone out there in week 18 i don't want to do it everyone sit your happy butts down on the sideline and take a break but this is really

your this is kind of like the third preseason game right or the second now whatever it is how many preseason games it's two or three or however however they do it now there's three like this is like the last preseason game for the starters before the playoffs right get sharp go out there do your thing get a week off you know and I think a lot of that comes from the run game continue to build confidence in the run game continue to develop with your run game I think honestly getting Garrett Bradbury bats gonna help if he's back this week he should be I don't know getting him back is gonna help but I mean just be complete just be complete and the run game is a big piece of that yeah and this is a an interesting situation with them as far as the playoffs go because the number one seed is still a possibility but it's very unlikely i mean

philadelphia losing both of the next two games would be surprising and i think that after they won against the giants the possibility increased of them still playing those starters but that depends on what happens with San Francisco if San Francisco lays an egg which I mean every time in this league where we think we know everything about a team then we're totally shocked right I mean did you think I knew the Lions defense wasn't exceptional but did you think they were going to get steamrolled for 300 yards on the ground by the Carolina Panthers? Noted running team, the Carolina Panthers, who what is Tony Dorsett, the running back for them? It was like, who? The guy from OK State, Chuba Hubbard or whatever his name is.

Like, it was crazy. So this league is nuts. And if San Francisco were to lose and the Vikings win, then they can take week 18 off. If not, then it's going to be a little bit more tricky. I was impressed by Kevin O'Connell and Ed Donatel working in some guys in situations in the way that they did it. So it wasn't Eric Hendricks taking every single rep, but Brian Asimola got his opportunity to start showing something. And Josh Metellus, I think, has proven to be a competent player. And he's getting an opportunity.

So they are kind of reigning it back but still trying to win. And it's a tricky dance that they're trying to do. But just circling back to the running part of it, here's where it plays in in the numbers, is that actually Kirk Cousins is not averaging more yards per attempt while running play action. And he's one of only two quarterbacks in the entire league to not average more yards per attempt with play action, which is stunning, right? I mean, that almost never happens.

Kenny Pickett is the other because he's a rookie. So I think that where this does become important is you have to make the other team care about your running game. And they really haven't done it. And in those neutral situations that I mentioned, they're 25th since even since they got TJ Hawkinson, I looked at that. So like the version of themselves, they're 25th in yards per play in neutral situations.

They're obviously the best fourth quarter team that has ever existed in the entire universe. Like Joe Montana, can't believe it. But like in the regular run of play of the games, they're not really dominating the way that you would want a playoff team. And I think that getting those play actions, scaring the opponent with the run, and I'll throw one more stat at you, and you can tell me what it means in traditional form of the show. Delvin Cook's not facing eight-man boxes at all. I mean, he is one of the sort of mid-pack to lower end.

So Derrick Henry faces an eight-man box 36% of the time. Delvin Cook's only at like 18% or 19%. That's NFL next-gen stats, which is really interesting because in the past, a lot of teams would load it up, and they did use a little more Johnny Munt, a little more CJ Hamm. I think they listened to the show. He had one of his highest snap totals of the year. I like that strategy to mix that in more often, both for the run game and the play action. I agree. I think the run game though has to come from the shotgun. I think the reason we used to get boxes is because we did a lot of run game under center.

Now, if we have C.J. Hamm in there, obviously you're going to go under center because of the fullback formations. But I think you could even sprinkle in C.J. Hamm from him at a wing and use him as a comeback, like crossback guy to block at the end. There's so much more you can do. But when you're facing light boxes,

and this goes back to why we think the offensive line has struggled at times this year, it should be a check to a run. You know, so many many times you hear and the announcers love talking about right you hear can can kill kill reload whatever it is at the line of scrimmage it's because not only are these quarterbacks reading safeties with a reading box count you know if you come up and it's a five-man box or a six-man box and you have everyone blocked up whether it be hey we're gonna read one guy so we know we got five five guys, and we're going to read the sixth, or, hey, it's a five-man box with a loose overhang. Checking to the run is something that most teams do.

Now, I will say I've seen more teams kind of shy away from that this year, and maybe they check more to an RPO or a wide receiver bubble screen, things like that that are in there. But majority of the time, if you can check to a gun run or even just an outside pitch play or something that's going to get those linebackers moving, that's a really good thing to have. So I think a lot of that is because we just haven't done that. You know, teams aren't afraid to play a light box because we don't check to a run.

You know, and when we do run it into a light box, we haven't had a ton of success. It's not like all of a sudden we're just running the ball for 150, 200 yards a game versus light boxes, right? So defense is no, hey, this team wants to throw the ball over the yard. So we're going to play a light box. We're going to put extra nickel corner in there. We're going to put a more rangy linebacker, whatever it may be. But that's a great stat to look at as a coaching staff as you go into the playoffs. Like what, what can we do to check to these runs what can we do to manufacture these boxes right hey we're going to put the personnel out there that's going to give us a light box by tendency purpose and then we're going to run the ball out of that run the ball out of that run the ball out of that and then we'll take our deep shot

um you know so that that's a great stat to look at and i don't know if it's one that really coaches pay attention to a lot um it's not one that you're kind of looking to but if you can take a self-eval before you go into the playoffs and look at stuff like that that can be a wrinkle that you can sprinkle in that teams now have to start deciding do I put a sixth man in the box so I put a seventh safety do I drop him down a little lower or do I just stay six man and say hey win your one-on-one matchups defensive line and linebackers and go tackle a running back, which is kind of a feast or famine deal. Folks, we had some friends over this holiday and my wife and I cracked open some liquid

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And something that I've seen teams do before, I mean, maybe the Vikings did this a little under Gary, is you put them in the shotgun, but you have like three tight ends out there or two tight ends and a fullback. And the other team's like, huh, excuse me, what are we doing here? And then you can motion people, you know, into different spots. And I think that that causes problems. And TJ Hawkinson is a really

interesting player. I want to talk about him for a bit because he is a receiver. I think when you look at the way that he lines up, it's about 50 50 of snaps where he's in the slot or at outside wide receiver and it was even actually even a little bit more uh for the detroit lions so this guy is basically playing wide receiver two at this point which i never thought i would say this but i'd love to see more johnny muntz because of that where you almost have this like the other team looks at you and goes wait wait wait so you have this tight end we know he's a tight end because that's his official position but he's actually like doing a jimmy graham thing where he's playing wide receiver so who do we put out against you and

then you can change a lot of things with that where johnny month is more of the traditional tight end and he's actually like when they run those little boots or something and dumped it off to him he's been fine like he'll catch it. He's like the David Morgan, so to speak. And I, I think that, you know, maybe there's just something in there to use a little bit more of that and treat TJ Hawkinson at times like he is the number two receiver. And look, I mean, I think they're kind of doing this because they took feeling off the field a little bit this last week. And I, part of that is like, he's been banged up but I also think

this is experimentation to look toward the playoffs and say are there situations where we might want to take one of those receivers off the field and have T.J. Hockinson act as wide receiver too because the trust between him and Kirk Cousins just seems to be honestly unbelievable considering that the guy just got here a few weeks ago you know I think you see it though I think the safety blanket across the league for majority of years and this year's been kind of an exception you know tight end production's actually been really down in the league this year but for so many years and for so long the tight end has always been the safety blanket for quarterbacks which is why it always blew our mind that Kirk Cousins refused to throw

the ball to Kyle Rudolph right we're We're like, what is happening? You know, but you look at like Brock Purdy, right? He gets thrown in there and all of a sudden like the emergence of George Kittle because it's just kind of like, where's the 85? I know he's somewhere out here and I'm going to throw him the ball, right? Travis Kelsey with Patrick Mahomes, you know, Mark Andrews with Lamar Jackson. You know, it's like this safety blanket idea. And I think for Kirk, Irv Smith was never that guy I don't think Kirk had the the the trust to go out there and just

because Irv never really earned it you know I can remember still in my brain him dropping that long touchdown early in the season you know if you don't think that rattles a quarterback's confidence a little bit it does you know versus Hawkinson shows up right away and Kirk starts plugging him and immediately there's that trust. There's that trust. There's that, okay, if I know if I throw it to him, he's going to be in A, the right spot, right depth, right route, all that, which kudos

to him for being able to learn this as quickly as he has. That just goes to show he's a true professional. But he also is a mismatch. And to your point, I think people need to understand, if you say you put two tight ends on the field, we call it 12 personnel, right? 12 personnel, one back, two tight ends. That forces the defense to have to make a decision. A lot of teams versus run heavy teams. For example, if you're playing against the Browns or the tight end or the Browns or the Titans, and they go in 12 personnel, you're going to go what's called base

defense, which is keep three linebackers on the field to stop the run. Now, if you're playing against the Packers, or you're playing against, say, the Saints, and they go 12 personnel, you're going to go into sub defense, which means you take one of those linebackers off the field, and you plug in a kind of hybrid nickel corner, right? And so if you want to do that, and a lot of teams were able to just go base or sub against us, it really didn't matter because Irv wasn't like a scary blocker. But if you can have Hawkinson and Munn out,

Johnny Munn out there, and go into 12 personnel, now the defense is in a pickle. Because if we can have those two successfully blocking, and I think Hawkinson is a big improvement in blocking than Irv Smith was, if those two can block those defensive ends and that nickel corner, if they go sub, there's some huge lanes in the run game.

So then what do you do? Okay, well let's go base. Well, yeah, but then you, all of a sudden you split Hawkinson out of there with a shift motion. It's something now it's like,

Oh shoot, who runs out there with them? Well, that, that big linebacker runs out there with them and that's a complete mismatch, you know? So that's the, that's the experimentation stuff

that you just have to kind of see what teams want to play sub to base or base to sub depending on 12 personnel because it is a nightmare position. It's a nightmare positional group that you'll put out there for defenses. They hate it. They don't want you in 12 personnel

because they can almost never be right. So I really love that idea. You're just full of great ideas today, dude. just you're just on one today i love it but i would be all aboard i'd be all aboard putting the 12 personnel with hawkinson out there as receiver two um and then even motioning him in and checking to one of those run plays like i was talking about if you see hey okay they put sub out here hey can can kill-can, kill-kill, motion them in, go double tight, and go duo straight up the middle or something like that. Well, I also just took what they were doing and said it. So that's part of it, the idea there.

They may have thought of it first, but it is something that worked very successfully in previous offenses that were good, like the Pat Shermer offense or like the Kevin Stefanski when you had Kyle Rudolph and Irv Smith, Irv Smith was an extremely effective tight end too. He's just never been healthy enough to establish himself as tight end number one. I also think that that guy gets forgotten about all the time.

So it's like second and 10 or something. You run a little play action. They're like, okay, we got to. And this is what Kevin O'Connell said. You know why TJ Hawkinson has been so successful in part is every team is just scrambling. How do we put multiple dudes on Justin Jefferson? How do we make sure he's not getting over the top of us?

And TJ Hawkinson's like, over here, I'm wide open. But the thing about Hawkinson that's different from someone like Kyle Rudolph, and I think this speaks to the trust factor, is that he's fast. I mean, one thing Sam Bradford knew was that Kyle Rudolph is so big that he's like throwing it down to like a center in the paint where you could just kind of toss it anywhere and he'll just reach out and grab it with his giant mitts. But cousins never trusted that. And with Hawkinson, you don't have

to trust that because he's usually wide open. And the other thing, too, is if you threw it seven yards down the field to Kyle Rudolph, you gained seven yards. Well, he fell for eight because he was six, six. He was six, six, so he'd fall for eight. Yeah, right. Maybe one more. Maybe you could reach out a long arm. You'd get nine, and it's still fourth and one, and you punt with Zimmer. But TJ Hawkinson, not the case.

Now, there have been times where I've been like TJ end zones that way. Like, you know, he kind of tries to beat people around the edge or something, but the dude can run and you can throw it underneath three yards and get seven yards with him. And it can be a little bit of a pseudo running game. So what he's added to this offense, I think is a totally different element from what they had before. And I can't imagine had the Detroit lions not gifted them Hawkinson what this offense would be if they had to rely on just Johnny Munt. But it does feel like every week what they need is

Jefferson's going to do what he's going to do, but that only makes up 130 to 150 of the 300 yards you probably need. Someone else has to be the man each week. And if it's Osborne one week and Hawkinson the next week and Thielen the next week, then that's okay. But it has to be somebody because when it hasn't been, that's when their offense has looked pretty shaky. Yeah, and I mean, I think the hope is that one game

and all you might need is for one or two games of playoffs that it all comes together, right? And all of a sudden it's like Hawkinson's wide open, Thielen's wide open, and Dalvin's running the ball over and it's kind of you have the defense with just no answers you know and I think that you're seeing a little bit more of the more guys are emerging the more confidence they're building the more Kirk is believing in those guys and it's just going to be an infective thing you know if an infectious thing if everyone's walking into with confidence which this offense should be building confidence, we can get to the defense's confidence here in a

second. But the offense should be building confidence with exactly like you said, guys stepping up and arising to their opportunities. The difference is that's just it's basically a roulette wheel. You know, you're just kind of spinning the roulette wheel and putting all your money on black or red and hoping it doesn't come up green. And the problem with the playoffs is if it comes up green one time, season's over, you know, and I think of the game like Dallas, you know, Dallas, it came up green in a big way. No one stepped up. No one was there. Even Jefferson really struggled at times. I can't remember if he had a huge stat line that game or not, but you know, he, I don't think he did, you know, and all of a sudden it's like the wheels came off. You had no answers. You had nowhere to go.

And I think the great thing for KOC right now is when he's needed someone, he's been able to continue to go to that well. You know, hey, we needed Dalvin. Let's just keep feeding Dalvin. Hey, we needed Hawkinson. Let's keep feeding Hawkinson. And then we'll just continue to have our constant, which is Jefferson. I just worry about when you hit playoff time,

if a team literally just goes, we're shutting down Jefferson. I don't care what we have to do we're shutting him down you just kind of hoping and praying right now someone else steps up and maybe here in the next week we can see hawkinson or dalvin or someone consistently perform over here the next two weeks in a row to have that guy going okay now we have two guys but if i'm walking into this team first round of the playoffs I'm double teaming 18 100 percent of the time and making someone else be the guy yeah and the funny thing I mean the funny thing about Jefferson is just how good he is at beating those double teams it's incredible it's amazing I know if a bunch of people have tweeted out the clip of his touchdown um that put them ahead by eight

but it was like he had the the wrong leverage situation that you'd want for an in-breaking route. So he just sort of went, whoop, I'm going to go around the guy. And then the safety's stepping up to stop him. And I'm just going to break in front of this safety. And then the ball's going to be a little out in front of me. I'm just going to scoop it up. I watch other games, and I see receivers drop passes. And I'm like, oh, that's right.

People do that. Because we haven't seen it at all. I mean, when Irv Smith dropped that pass, it was like, are the Vikings capable of dropping a pass? Like I'm not really sure. Even Laquan Treadwell, if you got him the ball toward him, he would actually catch it, but there was no reason to ever really throw it in his direction.

Absolutely not. So when you look at Daniel Jones' stat line, but you also look at the guys that they had healthy which is everyone and an improvement i think we're right about duke shelly that they're just going to stay with that and they should yep and you go like okay well why why and and this is this is what i want to understand is, so we thought maybe they found some things against Indianapolis, but whoa, Indianapolis is just a truck fire. They didn't carry over all of that. You know, it didn't seem the aggressiveness was there a little bit, but what I don't understand is how receivers are open in the middle of the field just for the whole season.

All the time. Like if you run a slant out of the slot, they, you know, whoever the quarterback is, whether it's Daniel Jones or a washed up Kurt Warner or Carrie Collins or Dave Brown or Kent Graham, whoever you want, that guy can make that pass to that receiver because there's no one around him. And I just want to understand, I just want to, I want to go to Ed and we've asked them a million questions and everything else in these press conference, but I just want to be like, Ed, explain it to me. Like I'm five. Why is Richie James wide open?

Like every time I am kind of at a loss at this point. I mean, if you're an opposing team game planning, you're like middle, just everybody in agreement in the room we don't really have to game plan anything except for all the slants and then hope that and then the vikings just hope that someone undercuts one of them which is almost always patrick peterson i i agree with you i watch this defense and i'm i have more questions than answers every single week because every single week it's something new except for the one constant which is the middle of the field and you know i don't know if that's because you're asking guys like Eric Hendricks and Jordan Hicks to try and do too much of,

hey, keep your eyes on the backfield for the run game. And then all the cake, make sure you get back to your depth and your spots. And then you're telling your DBs like nothing behind your head. So they're backing up and your linebackers are stepping forward. And then all of a sudden there's just this huge void in the middle. But, you know, I think of the game like Miami this week. They threw a quick slant to Jalen Waddell, and the dude goes 98. We haven't had a ton of that this year,

but those are the kind of things where it's like, yes, keep everything in front of you and rally and make the tackle, but you're one missed tackle away from those slants becoming huge plays. And when the middle of the field is open as much as it is, like you said, the law of numbers is eventually one of those is going to pop um you know and so just continuing to play that but i don't have a great answer for that either now i think the improved play of daniel hunter and making them get the ball out a little bit more a little faster is another reason why those slants are so wide open

because they're kind of keeping those big deep breaking routes again in front of them so it's kind of like okay taking what the defense gives us which is the middle of the field which if i recall back at the beginning of the year that's kind of what they said they wanted to do in a weird kind of like no no it's okay we're just gonna bend but don't break type of thing so it's almost like yeah we're just inviting that and we're just gonna keep everything in front of us now that anything over our heads and nothing in the outsides and just everyone rallies to the middle right it's like where's the most focal point middle all right everyone rallied in the middle and make the tackle, but I don't love it.

I don't love it because A, you're letting them continue to make first downs. You're not really forcing negative plays. You're not putting much pressure on them in second and six, second and four. Or if it's third and six and they're completing a seven yard slant route for a first down over the middle field again,

you're just kind of like, what are we doing? And again, it's not going to get fixed. I think that's the thing we all have to keep telling ourselves too. Like there's not going to be a magic pill that in the next two weeks, we're like, got it. We're good. We're back to a top 10 defense. We never have been a top 10 defense. You know, we are who we are at this point on defense. It's just a matter of controlling the bleeding and not letting it get too

out of control early in the game. Right. And you could say like, well, they have to, you know, just try to keep everything in front of them, but they've given up some of the most explosive plays in the entire league. It's like, that's not really what they've done. And they did not actually ramp up the pressure against Daniel Jones. They blitzed a total of 12 of his dropbacks out of 49. So they went right back away from the blitz.

It seemed like the only reason they did it against Matt Ryan was just that they were down by so much. They knew they needed to try to turn the ball over in order to win that game. And like, ironically, they did it against the run play with a fumble there, but with Daniel Jones, they only blitzed him 12 times. He went eight for 11 passing and average 9.5 yards per attempt. So even the blitzes that they did send were not that effective. And you mentioned

Daniel Hunter. And I think about what this would be without him. There was an early in the season thing where we wondered what's going on there. I'm not sure if he's like really getting it, but second half of the season, this man has been an absolute monster in both parts of the game against the run in the past. And he had his best game, I think, for this one. And when they pressured Daniel Jones, he completed six passes on 19 dropbacks. So when they were able to pressure him, he really struggled, including that interception. He was under pressure, but it always comes back to, you can only pressure him with those two guys. And it's kind of remarkable to me, the seasons that Zedaria Smith and Daniel Hunter have had

overall, they're both hovering around the top 10 by PFF at their positions, which I think as far as PFF stats go, there are some that don't tell the whole story, but pass rushing really does. I mean, it's just like, it's very easy to watch a guy every play and go he's winning or he's not, he's creating pressure or he's not. And I think that really does tell the story with those two guys. But the question is like, okay, but what else? And if your blitzes aren't getting home against the team that doesn't have Matt Ryan playing quarterback, I don't know that there is an answer other than hold on for dear life and respond as an offense. Just keep responding as an offense. And the one thing I would say is if you're going to have one side of

the ball be bad, have it be the defense because teams have gone all the way through the playoffs with bad defenses. The nine and seven giants that Eli Manning took there did not have a very good defense in the regular season. And maybe the best example is the 2016 Atlanta Falcons where Matt Ryan won the MVP. And, you know, they had a defense that probably was like 25th or something. And they got there because their offense was able to step up. So I think after this game, if you had any shred of like, but maybe like, no, no, I'm sorry. That's probably not going to be the case, at least with this defensive coordinator and some of these guys who've gotten worn down. I wanted to ask you, though, about playing at Lambeau.

You have suited up in purple pants at Lambeau before, which must have been cute, I'm sure. January, Lambeau doesn't get really any more epic than that. What is that like for a play? It's so cool. That field, that stadium, everything is just so neat. doesn't get really any more epic than that uh what is that like for a play it's so cool that that field that that stadium everything is just so neat you know from the walk through the skinny hallway out into out into the frozen tundra you know and you kind of just think to yourself of all the great

players that have walked through that same tunnel and all the great games that have been played on that turf and even the viking green bay games i mean i won the north there twice which was really fun to win on their home turf um you know and and just the ability to go out there. And I think we played Christmas Eve and it was like eight degrees and it's going to be cold. And the atmosphere is always great because Packer fans, as crazy as they are, they're, they always show up, you know, and the fact that the Packers are still in it by the grace of God himself are still somehow in this playoff race. You know, the environment's going to be electric. It's going to be a fantastic place to play. It's going to be a hostile place to play. There is no love for the Vikings in that stadium, you know, so it's going to be a fantastic

game to, to be a part of as a player, a fantastic game to watch. And, you know, I, you can never count Aaron Rogers out. You just can't. And I mean, as bad as they've been at times this year, as long as 12 still back there slinging it, you're kind of one of those things where it's like, we still have to make sure we're firing on all cylinders here or else this guy can make you look silly. I do think it's an interesting test for them because, I mean, I'm not saying Justin Jefferson can't run on grass.

He's good at football no matter what. But it's cold. It's the grass. It's the atmosphere. It's the atmosphere. It's all those things that they have in their advantage. And like you said, you guys went down there in a similar situation in 15 and came away with a win and the defense completely shut down Rogers. Well, it does look like their offense has kind of gotten back on track from where it

was. And I know Miami's quarterback concussed apparently, which put that under hate to see it. Come on, Dolphins. Real quick, the awkwardness of people being like, well, it's his second concussion officially because they lied about the first one, but I think it's three. And you're like, okay.

But I do think that the Packers are still flawed enough that this is a game where you're like, okay, make it happen here. Get that two seed on lockdown or at least take another step toward it. I mean, go win this game in the toughest environment against the team that's actually favored, which finally we've gotten to a point where Vikings fans aren't mad about it anymore when they're not favored. It's like, well, you know.

Makes sense. I mean, it does make sense why you're not, though, because they're not favored it was like well you know but uh makes sense i mean it does make sense why you're not though because they're so desperate you're already in but i think it could say something about the team just in where where they're at their headspace going into the playoffs and also like green bay's defense is still but man it's still not good like they were giving up before tua got concussed and started throwing in the ball they were just giving up huge gains like that defense is bad and the Vikings could do a lot of the same things they did in the first week against them yeah I think the quick passing

game is an Achilles heel of the Green Bay Packers you know they don't play press coverage you know Preston Smith can get after the quarterback fairly good, not great. But I think the biggest thing with the Green Bay team is if Christian Watson's healthy or not. He has really figured it out, which him opening it up has opened up Robert Tunyon, it's opened up Al Lazard. Once this Green Bay offense found their number one receiving threat, they've gotten so much better. And it's really, you've seen it since Watson's been back healthy is when they've kind of started figuring it out

I know he's dealing with a hip injury now so he might not be back but you're right this is a game from start to finish on offense at least that Kirk and company should just handle drive the ball down the field mix and match of run and pass and I think the only way they stop get stops is they stop themselves penalties turnovers drop passes you know those type of things are what will stall this offense against this team but it's still the NFL it's still the craziness of a desperate team like they're going to come out blitzing they're going to come out with everything this is an empty the chamber type of game for Green Bay so you know you have to kind of weather the initial storm at the beginning of these games you You know, when you go on the road and you have a team that's desperate, you know,

they're going to come out firing on all cylinders. It might not come, it might not go your way right away. You know, I've been part of these games where it's loud, it's environment, you might start a little hectic, jump off sides, fire the crowd up, you know, just weather the initial part of the storm and eventually the talent will take over. You know, so I can see things, even if they don't go off through like a great start in the first this is a game that could take three four quarters but i i think the vikings should win this game pretty easily where do you rank go pack go for most annoying things that home teams do to uh irritate the opposing team number two behind the northwestern and kansas. That's another wildcat. First down.

Those are by far the worst. And then Go Pack Go is a close second. It's very weird in their press box. When they shoot off fireworks, they shoot them like you're at the top, so it's right over you. It's just like, boom, boom, boom. It's like, oh, my God. The first time I was there, I i was like did we get hit by a

missile like it's it is so loud when they do the go pack go thing and they do it all game long oh that's yes dude just a hundred times a game i mean uh buffalo has the train whistle um and then you know with the vikings it's that low gala horn so i kind of i kind of don't notice it that much i mean maybe i've just heard it a million times but i feel like oh it's not that bad it's like burn you're like okay but the go pack go every first down or whatever like stop it you lunatics it's literally like and the packers broke the huddle go back go like it's just it's they celebrate everything with it it's so so annoying and what's my favorite part is the fans just love it like they just i think they go home and just

practice it fans just they just sit at home and like their wife puts the dinner down and they're like go pack go like they just can't help themselves well you know that's uh that is their fandom which is a little bit different it really is it's like a college town though i mean it's it's the most unique i think in the nfl them in buffalo where you're like whose idea was this to put a team in this city but here we are um so that's why you know when buffalo they're going to build their new stadium i'm kind of sad that the taxpayers are paying for it but like thank god they're going to build their new stadium. I'm kind of sad that the taxpayers are paying for it, but like, thank God they're not going anywhere.

And there was conversations about green Bay before those quarterbacks showed up of like, how is this team even going to stay here? So I, I love that it's there. And I hate the listening to the, it's just distracting when you're trying to work, but I won't complain. They feed as well in the press box. So instead of a love to see it, hate to see it. I just want to say to end the show that my dog passed away today, unfortunately.

And everybody who listens to the show knows or follows me on Twitter knows how much Nora meant to me. And I am completely heartbroken to have lost her, but also extremely, extremely thankful for the six and a half years we had with her after adopting her. She was a race dog. So adopt pets. If you're interested in getting a dog, look into greyhounds because they need homes after they're retired racers. And I think people have some misconceptions about them. She could not have been sweeter, more loving, more perfect of a dog. So if you're thinking of it, look into getting a Greyhound. I'm going to

miss her forever. And it's an incredibly hard day for me, but I'm glad we could kind of get my mind off it doing a little football here. But I just want to thank everybody who's reached out over the years, sent me their pets or favorited pictures or videos or whatever that I've put out of Nora. So, um, yeah, a tough day at purple insider industries, but, um, but you know, very, very, very, very thankful, uh, that I was able to have her. So anyway, and thanks for your time and your readjustment, uh, based on what we had to do scheduling wise. So I, I appreciate that. And, and we will do it again after green bay jeremiah absolutely man and again i'm sorry to hear about your pup i've had to put dogs down lose dogs it's

never it's like losing a family member so i'm sorry for you and for the household over there and we'll just try and beat the packers for nora we're gonna beat the packers for nora i appreciate that man and uh thanks everybody as always for listening