Purple Insider - a Minnesota Vikings and NFL podcast - Let's talk about some Vikings playoff matchups

Episode Date: December 27, 2022

Matthew Coller talks with Brian Murphy about the Minnesota Vikings' playoff possibilities and what matchups might be favorable for them and now suddenly the Vikings-Packers matchup this week is important for both teams. Plus Murph is captivated by the Vikings' kicking and Matthew answers fan questions about their "model" for roster building and success of some surprise defensive players. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Purple Insider is presented by Liquid Death, delicious water that's bringing death to plastic. Learn more at liquiddeath.com slash insider. Hello, welcome to another episode of Purple Insider. Matthew Collar here. It is once again time for a Monday morning Murph. And Murph, after yesterday where the Miami Dolphins lost to the Packers, the Packers stay alive. Now they have to beat the Vikings at Lambeau to possibly make their way into the playoffs, which looks pretty realistic because they just need to win two and then have the

commanders lose one game. But then I had a little cold water poured on me because if the Vikings lose this game and San Francisco wins two, then there won't be a collision course matchup between the Vikings and Packers at U.S. Bank Stadium, which I thought, could you get any more perfect for the drama of the 2022 season? So that is possible. That remains on the table, but San Francisco would have to lose one. And since they are just taking Thor's hammer to every team that they play, that seems unlikely, but not impossible. Now, Murph, we are here in now late December

talking playoff matchups and scenarios. Exciting times, eh? Yeah, I mean, I was thinking heading into this Green Bay game at Lambeau and the Bears game at Soldier Field that, you know, the Vikings were either going to be pretty well locked into a two slash three seed. There wasn't going to be a lot at stake. They're going to be resting starters. You know, I kind of wanted to see, I mean, it seems that Rogers is going to probably come back to Green Bay next year, but there's still that little, like, would this be the final time they'd see each other at Lambeau? Trying to drum up some kind of of interest but I really was worried that we were going to not have anything

to discuss meaning meaningfully for another three weeks and yet Green Bay goes down well you know it snowed in Miami so yesterday I don't know if you saw that so anything is possible this season Green Bay goes down there falls down behind 20 to 10 and then I don't know what happened to Tua. He just decided to become Blake Bortles. You're the backup king. Give me a comparison for Tua's second-half comparison to any other scrub. So, yeah, look, this week is huge for Green Bay, obviously. They're hanging by a thread, and they got their biggest rival coming into town.

I haven't looked at the forecast. I know it's supposed to warm up a little, so it doesn't look like it's going to be below zero miserable, but it's still a mess over there at times. And, you know, look, this is one of the marquee matchups in the league, and it seems like five years ago when they faced each other in week one, and all of the scenario, I mean, no one would have believed that that was going to be the Vikings most complete victory of the season. Cause everyone since then has been a nail biter.

And, you know, a few weeks ago, I mean, Green Bay was, was on a funeral March and now they're sort of revived a bit. So there's some, there's some stakes, which will be enjoyable to talk about this week. And then, you know, even the Week 18, granted the Vikings, I'm guessing they'll have their scenario pretty well figured out by this time next Monday morning. The game in Soldier Field will probably be the JV game in that regard. But for the Packers, they also have the Lions coming in in week 18 at Lambeau,

and that may be the game that very well could determine who the Vikings play in the first round of the playoffs. So plenty of intrigue the last couple of weeks that I wasn't sure was going to be there a couple of days ago. Yeah, it's kind of a weird thing, because if the Vikings win this game, then the two-seed it's not a hundred percent locked up still yet because the Vikings need to make sure they don't tie their record with San Francisco or then San Francisco gets the number two seed. So there's, they could really play almost anybody. But we should go through the teams a little bit, just talk about who you'd want to face. So you don't want to face kind of the state of some of these other teams.

Because, you know, it really changes so much on a weekly basis how you feel about every team. I mean, think about Detroit and where we were at with them a couple weeks ago or even two weeks ago. Like, man, I don't think you want to face Detroit. Like Jared Goff against the Vikings. This guy just like beats them all the time and plays really well against them. And like, they're kind of a motivated group.

They're rolling. And then they go to Carolina and get 7,000 yards run on them. All of a sudden, like the Vikings a couple of weeks ago could not gain five yards against the Detroit lions on the ground. And then Carolina just runs rough shot over them that was crazy uh Seattle just looks like a bad team and they were probably a bad team all along that had a hot quarterback for a little while I don't think they're going to make it uh you'd want to face Taylor Heineke in the current version because he's playing about the worst football in the league not named like Matt Ryan or one of these backup quarterbacks or it might be Carson Wentz which you're totally happy to face Carson Wentz there is an interesting discussion though of

whether you'd want to face the Giants after what you saw against the Giants because it came down to a 61 yard field goal and they allowed Daniel Jones to play very well I still don't think that the Giants are a really good team. I think they have some really good players. You know, Kayvon Thibodeau, Dexter Lawrence on defense. Those guys caused a ton of problems. And Austin Schlotman, I mean, he just got beat up by the interior of their defensive line, but he won't be playing in a playoff game. But then again, Justin Jefferson had no problem getting open making plays and on the defensive side like they're just going to give up yards to whoever they face I mean it could be

almost any quarterback but there was a part of me that thought like Daniel Jones actually looked very comfortable against the Vikings and played really really well and I don't know if they could stop Saquon Barkley so like I think there is something to be said for the Giants are probably a little tougher matchup than some of the other teams that could make it. But I also don't think that they're the scariest opponent that they could face. No, I really do think, and I wouldn't have said this 48 hours ago, but I, and again, this may change again in the next two weeks, but I, I don't know if I would want to face the Packers, even though it would be at home. It's the proverbial, you know, assuming the Vikings, well, this assumes a couple things. The Packers need to win next week against the Vikings to even ensure a playoff berth, so

that would not mean the Vikings would have to beat a team three times. I don't know if I would want the Packers surging, let's say the Packers do beat the Vikings at Lambeau Field on Sunday and somehow become their first round opponent. Granted, you're at US Bank Stadium. I don't know. I just feel like there's some demons there. I think there's still some Rodgers magic that could happen. It seems like Rodgers is going to be coming back to Green Bay next year now, but there's still that sense of this may be a last hurrah kind of moment of these two rivals. I don't, I don't, that's just, you know, the Vikings fans are probably like, yeah, I want to put the, the drive, the stake into the heart of Aaron Rodgers and the Packers at U.S. Bank Stadium in the first round. From an emotional,

psychological standpoint, yeah, that would probably be a satisfying win. I don't know. I would rather see Washington or New York at this point, and maybe even the Lions, although that's a really long shot, and they're not as intimidating as they seemed going down to Charlotte yesterday. You mentioned Washington. I mean, you know, Taylor Heineke, if he even is still the quarterback, even if they do back in somehow, that seems like the ideal matchup. You've got kind of a flailing around team, franchise and chaos.

You handled them pretty well in Landover back in November. I would feel pretty good about that. The Giants a couple of weeks ago, we were talking about how much of a paper tiger they were. They may still be that way, but they do just, you know they they look more for I don't know that was the first full Giants game I'd watched all season and yeah for Daniel Jones to come in and for that offense to put up 400 plus yards which seems to be par for the course against Minnesota anyway yeah I'm you know I would feel okay about that matchup but again what what are these teams going to look like after the next two weeks? Because you're going to have lots of momentum shifts

and psychological boosts and drops based on the machinations here the next couple weeks. And it's probably going to come down to that last Sunday night before you even figure out who you're going to play. As of right now, Monday morning, December 26th, I would not want to face the Packers for a third time, even if it's at home. Give me the NFC least appearances and I'll take my chances. And if you can secure that number two seed for a possible date with the 49ers, which would be a tough matchup either way, but definitely

want that more at home. See what happens with Philadelphia if you even get there. Yeah, I mean, or if Philadelphia even gets there, because if suddenly Jalen Hurts doesn't throw the ball the same way after getting injured, then, you know, who knows? I mean, I think that team's an absolute house and should end up in the NFC Championship game. But we've thought that, you know, many times before about teams that ran into a surprising matchup and how about the Packers last year who were the number one seed and then it was a snowy

game and they couldn't get a punt off at the end and they end up losing to a San Francisco team so kind of anything can happen and the Vikings have to root for some of these matchups to go their way I do think it is a little bit difficult to figure out sort of who's who because the Giants, even though their defense gave the Vikings some problems during that game, overall, the Giants defense isn't all that good. Their cornerbacks aren't that great. I mean, their linebacking core can be taken advantage of. It's really just like a couple of guys on the defensive line that cause problems. I think that Washington has a tougher overall defense and maybe even more scary defensive line with Montez Sweat, Daron Payne, and Jonathan Allen, who just demolished the interior of the Vikings offensive

line. And in that game, I mean, the Vikings struggled for a huge portion of their game against Washington because they couldn't run the ball. Whereas the Giants allowed the Vikings to run the ball in that game, kind of whenever they wanted. I thought that Kevin O'Connell actually got away from it a little too much when it came to running, but in Washington, they couldn't do anything. And I think that is one of the toughest defensive lines in the entire NFL. So there's, there is that, but I mean, if you just start looking at which quarterbacks you'd rather go against, of course, Aaron Rogers is the dead last quarterback you want to face. I mean, because even against Miami, there were times where it looked like,

what is going on with the Packers offense? I mean, why is it just, you know, a failure to launch their red zone offense was bad. Their third down offense offense was bad and yet there were a few times where he let loose that football and it just stuck in a guy it's just like whoa and then Christian Watson emerging is a legitimate weapon that he's now trusting and being on the same page with I mean that's not something you want to face as a defense that allows Mike White and Daniel Jones to throw for 300 plus yards and Teddy Bridgewater earlier this season and lots of other quarterbacks who are not good and have looked really good. I mean, Andy Dalton had a good day against the Vikings defense going back to London.

So they've almost shut down nobody except Taylor Heineke as far as defensively. And of course, you know, Matt Ryan just being a skeleton at this point, but Rogers emerging is not something you want to face. I guess there is a question of like, which is scarier to you, Jared Goff or Aaron Rogers, because I feel like they've had a harder time with Jared Goff in recent years than they even have Aaron Rodgers. And the Lions offense is definitely better than the Green Bay Packers overall. They have tons of weapons. And then there's the Lions defense that could give up 200 yards to Justin Jefferson at any time. So, I mean, the Vikings have an advantage over every single one of these. The most dramatic would of course be the Packers if that could somehow come

to pass. The odds are not super high of it, but just the existence of the possibility is quite interesting. I think that you have to look at just the name of the quarterback. I don't think you'd want to face Rodgers under any circumstances. I'm sure there are Vikings fans who are like, bring him on, bring on the Packers. But it's like, but Carson Wentz or Taylor Heineke is who you really want to face here. So it's interesting that there's so many different possibilities or heck, I mean, to me, Seattle is just like a bad team that was masquerading all season long with a half a season from a guy who's probably a backup quarterback in Geno Smith. So yeah, I mean, it's, it is really interesting all the

different matchups that they could face in the first round. I feel like they should go in as pretty heavy favorites, no matter who they go against, except maybe Green Bay and then onto the divisional round where they're just, it feels like they're going to end up facing the San Francisco 49ers one way or another. That is no guarantee. They could always blow it, but it really feels that way. And that's a team that I think we've been saying kind of since day one is a little bit scary. And the way they took apart that good Washington defense, I mean, my goodness, that is an absolute house of a football team. It is. Everything you said is true. It's factually accurate. It's bolstered by statistics and reason and evidence.

And yet the Vikings are 12-3 because they've had a horseshoe around their neck all season long. And I don't know how you quantify that, but at a certain point, that almost has to count for something, some kind of sliver of the pie, right? You've got defense, offense, special teams, running game, pass rush, pass defense. What do you assign right now? We'll discuss in a second, but I mean, just again, the absolute absurdity week after week, how they find ways to win. I mean, they allow the Giants to come down and tie the game with a two-point conversion. And then even as they're driving, I'm like, well, Joseph doesn't have a very big leg. They're going to have to get inside the 40, at least, right? And next thing you know, he's lining up a 61-yarder. And not only was it good,

it would have probably been good from 65, and it was dead center. We've been discussing earlier in the year, like, God, the guy can't make an extra point to save himself, and yet now he's made, what is it, 15 to 20 in a row? All kicks he's just banged through, and now a franchise record. I kind of made, I tweaked O'Connell back in August when he had the gumption to say, you know, Joseph, I've got confidence from him from anywhere at any time. And I thought, man, don't be kicking

that hornet's nest in this town. You've only been here a couple of months. Has anybody told you about the graveyard of kickers that have been buried here over the last 20 years. Maybe there's something there. At the very least, the confidence level that this team has to escape with a victory in any way, shape, or form, you could argue the biggest play of the game on Saturday was the block punt. So when did the Vikings have a block punt this year? I can't recall them on special teams having one. It just seems like when something needs to happen,

your heroes are going to play well. Cousins, Jefferson. By the way, the TJ Hawkinson acquisition midseason, I tweeted out too, for those old enough to remember Don Baylor coming to the 87 Twins at the trade deadline, hitting a couple of key home runs in the postseason. He might have been responsible for bringing that world championship. I kind of compare that to Hawkinson. I mean, the Lions, you know, had the wherewithal to trade him within the division. And I don't know if Irv Smith's ever going to see the field again, or if he does, he's certainly not going to be maybe targeted as much.

But long way of saying they have found their big players have been coming up with big plays, but then marginal players you've never heard of have been coming up with big plays. And then your kicker, who we all know there's going to be at least one or two playoff games that come down to a field goal attempt. And if I'm a Vikings fan, I got to feel as confident in my kicking game maybe since Gary Anderson in 98 before the Atlanta game. But I'm saying as far as feeling good about Joseph coming out in a clutch situation from 35 to 61 yards. That's a pretty good place to be. So again, I don't know how you quantify all this, but it just feels like no matter what the situation is, what the score is, what the momentum swing is, the Vikings have been able to find a way

to claw back, put themselves in a position, and then execute and come through when they need to. Yeah, I think the way that I would put it is when you have Justin Jefferson, everything is always on the table no matter what, because they get the ball back there after the Giants tie the game. And, you know, it's like, okay, well, if there's 40 seconds on the clock, that's two Justin Jefferson catches and a kick. And that's exactly what they did. I mean, there's just nothing that's ever really out of reach when you have him. And the same goes for the Indianapolis game.

It's like it really doesn't matter how much you're down here when you have a dude that can make plays. And I know K.J. Osborne and Delvin Cook also came through with huge plays in that game. But it just feels like nothing is out of reach when you have that player. And that's why, like after the game, I was talking about how earlier in the week, Justin Jefferson had compared himself to Michael Jordan in the way that the Pistons used to beat up Jordan and saying like, that's kind of how teams are approaching me.

And I mean, imagine being so good at football that you compare yourself to Michael Jordan and we're like, yeah, that sounds about right. I mean, the same, the same thing when, if you grew up watching Jordan and I grew up in the state of New York, loving the New York Knicks as a little kid, and there was no deficit, no, there was no situation, whatever, where you ever felt comfortable if Michael Jordan was out on the floor. And it's the same thing here, where it's like, there's, they're not going to kneel down and take 30 seconds off the clock and go to overtime. If that guy is on your football team, find dial up a play his way. And you have to give Kevin O'Connell a ton of credit, which I want to talk about for really coming through with

just the Jefferson and the number one wide receiver driving the offense in a way that they didn't last year. And think about that. I mean, Jefferson was a whisker away from the franchise single season record last year. And I was sort of like, I don't know how you could do much better than that. And then they have. And when you're going into the playoffs, I don't know how long you can continue to win games versus other teams that also win these types of games, too. Like if you have a team that's 13 and four or something, let's say the Vikings end up with that and you're facing other 13 or 14 win teams. I bet they've won a lot of their close games as well. And I bet that they're pretty experienced in that as well. So it's not like you have the same edge as you might have over the Colts or even over the Giants that have been a pretty mediocre team and have sort of eked out some wins by, you know, maybe luck or whatever else. I mean, looking at their point differential,

they're quite a bit worse than the Vikings overall. But I think too, when I wake up this morning and look at the updated stats of pro football reference, and I see the Vikings ranking seventh in points scored in the NFL. And this is kind of what we talked about at the beginning of the year and it took a while to get there but if they can have a top five to seven offense you have a legitimate chance at the super bowl and i know how bad this defense is it has been chronicled just a little bit on the show and it is 28th in points and 31st in yards against. They are a horrible, horrible defense. But offense is more predictable.

Offense is more sustainable. Offense is what's going to get you the comeback and potentially win you a game at the very end when you need it. And if there's a reason to have confidence that they could go somewhere in the playoffs, it has to be that like, to me, the bars that you have to reach to be a legitimate contender are at least 12 wins and at least the top seven, eight offense in the league. If you want to have a chance at a super bowl and they're there after this week. I mean, I did not know that they would get there midway through the season with the way that their offense was playing, but the fact that they've kind of turned that dial up recently, that Cousins has come with some of the statistics as well recently and is throwing the ball the way he is.

I mean, I wouldn't count it out because of the whole picture, you know, because an offense is what can win you those games at the end. And they have the weapons and they've been proven. So as you mentioned with Jefferson, anytime he's on the field, anything is possible. But because of the attention he's been drawing, both physically and just in personnel, there's always somebody else to be targeted.

Now TJ Hawkinson has kind of moved up that ladder. Every time they show Adam Thielen on the sidelines, it looks like he sees his moments slipping away literally in real time. You have Kevin O'Connell like trying to reassure him, look, all boats rise with the tide. It's all good here, but it's becoming more difficult because even Cook had a couple moments out of the backfield, certainly against Indianapolis, where he was, you know, targeted and made some plays in space. You know, we mentioned the defense, yes, as awful as they are. Patrick Peterson got picked on pretty early by the Giants and Daniel Jones and was exposed as a 30-plus cornerback for a bit. But then what does he do? He tightens up and he comes up with a key interception late in the game,

which is not going to help your defensive ranking, but these are pivotal moments in games. And that's where it just feels like somebody's going to step up at any time. The pass rush, which had been vacant for a while, I know there had been some pressures and whatnot, but we had wondered where Daniil Hunter had gone. Well, I don't know, in the last two or three weeks, he's been back to the Daniil Hunter weapon that we thought he always was. So where was that? How did that become

suddenly a new, it's not a new angle with them, but it just feels like as certain things go awry, other players step up again in key moments, making key plays, third down stops. I mean, how many times have they gotten a key stop when they needed to? Maybe they did in the other day when Jones drove them down for the eight-point conversion. But, you know, I just watch, and they're the kind of team that if you're busy on a Sunday, and like me, you're just sitting at home and watching,

you can kind of go do things for a little while, and maybe you miss some ugliness. But you're always going to be able to come back and see some kind of seminal moment, big play. It really is only worth watching maybe from about the eight-minute mark of the third quarter on, because that's where the true entertainment value is of this club. We keep saying it's not sustainable in January.

It's not sustainable in the playoffs. I don't know. Maybe every game they play is going to be 36-33. And if every game is 36-33 with the Vikings and Jefferson's on the field and Joseph can hit from 61 yards, as you said, nothing's off the table. Folks, we had some friends over this holiday, and my wife and I cracked open some Liquid Deaths at nine in the morning. And let me tell you, that drew some strange looks, but it was also delicious and refreshing. The Liquid Death

Mountain Water and Sparkling Water comes in a tall boy beer can, and that'll have people asking some questions sometimes, but it's also saving the environment. Liquid Death gives 10% of profits to bring an end to plastic bottles. So every time you're drinking from the can, you're doing a little bit of good in the world. So go to liquiddeath.com slash insider to find out more or get Liquid Death at Target, Hy-Vee, 7-Eleven, or Whole Foods. Again, liquiddeath.com slash insider. Daniil Hunter against the Giants had seven pressures. So that is very much of the ilk of the Daniil Hunter we expect.

But really, I think he's been that for quite a while now. I mean, if you look at the week-to-week PFF grades, he's been one of the most consistently excellent players. I think that, you know, we really just over judge stuff on sack totals. Sometimes that's just a matter of, did you get home? But are you, are you impacting the game consistently? And he has really done that recently. So him peaking at the right time matters, but I don't think there's any taking away from how absolutely horrendous this defense really is and how much they need to go right in order for them to even be competitive because they had Brian Asimola make an unbelievable play. And what an impressive player the other day. I mean, I thought that he did a great job and he should be on the field in

the playoffs rotating in with those other two linebackers if not playing over someone like Jordan Hicks but you know he makes an amazing play to cause a fumble you get an interception you get some penalties and when you look at the Vikings penalty differential opponents have been penalized 106 times the Vikings 74 how the Vikings 74. How the Vikings never get penalized, I don't know. But this year, sorry Vikings fans who really like to talk about how the refs screw you all the time, and I get it. Indianapolis, they made some bad calls, and that's going to happen along a season. But the totality of this is, holy cow. I mean, you have three games worth of penalties difference between you and the

opponents. Is that going to happen? Yeah, that could be narrowed at Lambeau though very quickly. Well, that's what I mean though is that just in the playoffs in general, we know that they love to put the flags away and they just like to let them play when it comes to the playoffs. So is that going to be a little harder on the Vikings defense that they don't get holding calls that help them out like I don't know um so there's a lot of these things where you can swing back and forth on this team where you I mean even like every game is sort of like one of those blot tests where it's like what do you see Murph uh what do I see you know because you could look at that I I got a message from a friend who just

said like, I mean, this defense is so bad. I don't see how we could ever win, but then you see them win and you see the offense being what it is. And I guess it's sort of up for your interpretation almost every week of whether this is a legitimate contender or not. Now, when I looked back historically, having this bad of a defense usually precludes you from that. But a lot of times I feel like even in today's game where everything has become closer than it's ever been, I'm not willing to count it out. But I also don't think after this, I don't think there's any solution defensively. Murph, it's just like, that is is what it is if they had found all the solutions against Indianapolis I think they would have carried over against the Giants but that's

not a great quarterback and he just kind of did whatever he wanted to do so I I wouldn't feel confident at all going into the playoffs with the defense except to say they somehow figure it out anyway and then sometimes the offense compensate overensates for whatever the defense can't do. The defense will give us one short field a week, and we take advantage of that. Patrick Peterson will come up with the key interception. They'll come up with that key fourth down stop. They'll come up with that random turnover by some random guy. There will be a flag that you can't count on it, but it does seem –

I didn't realize the margin was that much on the penalty. I don't think they're that disciplined. Are they that good of a disciplined team, or they just happen to not get caught all the time? You're right. You can't rely on any of this, and yet they're 12-3. So I'm kind of done trying to explain my way out of, I don't know. I like, I, I can't remember what,

I think it was after the lions game in week three when I kind of said, I don't know, there's something weird, there's something special here. And I I've just been kind of hanging onto that because it's just been convenient and it's only gotten more and more and more pronounced as the season's gone along that there are just a lot of horseshoes and unicorns right now, and that's very rare in this town. And, I mean, I was at a Christmas Day gathering with my wife's family yesterday, and, you know, people were coming up, and they're just,

they're like agonizing. They're conflicted. They're wringing their hands. It's like, I don't know. I watch it, and I enjoy it all, but there's been at least two or three games they shut off in the middle of the game, disgusted, only to come back and go, what the hell happened? You know, they look around, and they're like, we're 12-3,

but it feels like, you know, 4-11. I don't – what do I do? Like, they're coming to me for, like, you know, solutions. Like, I have all the answers. I'm like, I just – you know, I i keep saying lean into it enjoy the ride you'll probably get crushed but at least you know what's coming and in the meantime the next few weeks will be very entertaining that's the best i can give you i don't know what else to say well i was gonna say murph we come to you for answers here and uh you're just shrugging your shoulders all season long you don't know uh but at least hey i mean you were the guy who was on top of it for sure uh and here here i

am with looking at the statistics and everything else all season long debbie downer every week no i have not been debbie downer every week that is not true well what i've continued to say was that i thought they needed to get better and I don't know that they've gotten better overall but I do know they're more dangerous on offense and that's what matters the most and that's at the center of TJ Hawkinson as you mentioned I think that TJ Hawkinson alone has really emerged as the guy who makes this a different football team than it was before because it was so much Justin Jefferson jefferson and justin jefferson only that having this second weapon who can catch 13 passes in a game and kurt cousins basically only threw to jefferson or hawkinson in that game against

the giants but at least you have that guy because earlier this year was jefferson or kind of nobody and so now it feels like he's become very, very comfortable. And the, I mean, the jump ball that he throws to him, there's no better example of feeling comfortable because he's not open and he just says, go get it. And, uh, you know, that's something that he wouldn't do for a receiver that he didn't really trust. So, uh, let me ask you this before we wrap up, Murph. I want you to tell me where the Giants win would place for the best endings or best games of the 2022 Vikings season. Because I think that that game right there and that ending would rank probably number one for a lot of teams for an entire season, even when they're

really good. It'd be like, remember that time where we hit the 61-yard field goal? And it sort of just goes like, oh yeah, they just did it again. So where would you, what would be like your top five for Vikings endings this year? I mean, that one barely gets into top five Saturday, I would say. Clearly, the Colts game, they'll be talking about that in 100 years. Buffalo, for how absurd it was and the level of competition and that it was on the road. Then maybe I'll go Joseph on Saturday. Let's not forget the double doink with Joseph back in London,

which feels like five years ago. But, I mean, that was another key game at a key moment that, you know, another inch or two later, who knows where the psyche of that team is. Help me out. What other – what am I missing? Double doink. Well, Detroit, the game you referenced. Week three Detroit, which was more Dan Campbell stepping all over himself.

But, yeah, I'd put Joseph there at three. And I'm going to go Colts, historic comeback, the absurdity in Buffalo, Joseph from 61 yards, double doink in London, week three Detroit, where maybe it all began. Maybe that's where all the magic really did happen. I mean, I think they felt good about themselves hammering Green Bay in week one, but, I mean, Green Bay was not a decent team then and still might not be, but they're a little better today than they were then.

How's that for a top five? What am I missing? What have I forgotten? Well, you've got the cam dantzler strip of amir smith marset against chicago where they blew the lead against the bears and then had to get that at the end uh yeah will lutz and the double doink was pretty compelling um but also you know the harrison smith causing a fumble from jaylen waddle in miami that's a pretty good one it's not a last-second victory against Washington,

but the interception of Taylor Heineke, not quite as compelling as some of those. But the Jets, the goal line stands against the New York Jets, also have to go into that because Mike White is moving the football at the end there, and they get a couple of pressures on him and find a way to stop him there. But also they needed that Justin Jefferson toe tap. I mean, yeah.

I mean, that's the thing. You forget so many games that could be in the top five. I think I would have Buffalo number one because of where they were and who they were playing. That game with the stakes, I think, and who they were playing and actually what it meant at the time for them to win that game. It was like, that's the moment where we pushed the Super Bowl contender button because we were not willing to push it until then. And then after getting that win. So I would probably put that at original Lions game was even more compelling because they were down in that game the whole time and they needed such a spectacular end, a fourth down stop, a throw.

Well, I guess it was a third down stop that caused the field goal. So, yeah, it has been as crazy as it gets, man. But, you know, somebody asked like, oh, are you going to write a book about this season because of all the crazy endings? And my answer, Murph, is depends on how it ends. Yeah, I was just going to say, we've talked about this top five. You know there's going to be another entry in there between now and whenever this ends. Either misery or glory.

There's going to be another top five finish that we haven't even discovered yet oh for sure yeah and the play the playoffs have just screamed that in recent years uh look at last year's games they all came down to the final moment so uh well we'll be here to chronicle it all so brian uh thank you appreciate your time uh your column's going to go up soon on purple insider.com so i appreciate you and uh we will see what madness awaits for the next year and then oh yeah the new year yeah maybe when the calendar turns they that's where it's gonna end yeah i don't know i'm not gonna say it uh probably not though i still don't think green bay is that good but anyway all right well uh we will talk again soon all right let's get into some fans only questions. And I have to send a quick shout

out to Joe W on Twitter. If you listen to yesterday's fans only episode, I referenced the question that someone had asked back in October about the Vikings being reflective of the 2019 Packers. And I couldn't remember who had asked it and it was Joe so he sent me a tweet and I appreciate the loyalty of listening and catching that part of the episode so really appreciate that and it was a great question sort of making that comparison between the 2019 Packers and what we've seen from the 2022 Vikings of teams that didn't have maybe the most impressive point differentials or big stats but sort of came together as the season went along under a brand new coach a culture change all those

things that had gone along and of course I kind of went I don't know they had Aaron Rodgers so a little bit different but Rodgers came through in a lot of big situations, but didn't have MVP stats in 19, just the same way that Kirk Cousins has not had MVP statistics this year, but has come through in all the situations that they needed. Of course, we know how 2019 ended for the Packers and we do not yet know how that will go, but I appreciate Joe for his loyalty as a daily listener. I mean, to be listening back then to send the question and still be listening now. Um, that's awesome. So really appreciate you, Joe. Okay. Let's get into the questions. This one comes from Jeff. Is it possible that Minnesota has found a new formula for success, a smattering of aging yet capable former all pro players mixed in with some hungry

kids topped off by a couple of rising superstars. You rely on veteran defensive players to make game-changing plays, lean into the style of your solid veteran quarterback, and you make some luck and fall ass-backwards into some lucky situations, and hardest of all, have your best player blossom into an MVP. Let's see someone try to copy this formula. I think that everyone kind of tries to copy this formula in one way or the other. I mean, there's only one formula that's going to win all the time.

And that is you draft Patrick Mahomes or you land Tom Brady or you get Peyton Manning. I was just poking around Patrick Mahomes' pro football reference page the other day, and he is 62 and 16 in his career in the regular season. That will win you all the time, games, and compete for championships and everything else. Aaron Rodgers, Brett Favre, you've seen it just to our east here in Wisconsin, there in Wisconsin, with those teams winning year after year after year. But if that's not going to be the case, if you don't have an all-time great quarterback, the other way to do it would be to have a veteran team

that has some players that might be over the hill, but also has some players that are in their prime because in general, older teams are the ones that win. I mean, that makes a lot of sense, right? Everyone wants young players in their prime, but experience matters in the NFL. And usually if you're older, that means you're probably good that you've, unless you're washed, that you have been around. And there's a reason that you're still in the league and you're still being paid to do this is because you're probably a quality NFL player still. And if you even look at the Los Angeles Rams from last year and the makeup of their team, it's very similar to what the Vikings have now. They had some better looking statistics in certain areas than the Vikings do this year.

I mean, one, you know, I think Matt Stafford led the NFL in passing yards and they were a pretty solid defense, but they really relied on their superstars to make big plays on defense. Aaron Donald, Jalen Ramsey, they weren't a number one defense like they were the previous season when Jared Goff was still there, but they were capable of coming up with sacks. That's why they got Vaughn Miller or interceptions or big plays at big times. They did not rank where the Vikings rank in terms of points against, which is 28th or in yards against, which is 31st. So those things leaves a lot to be desired in comparison to the Rams, but the roster construction was largely the same.

They had the number one wide receiver Cooper cup.'s a little bit older than just a jefferson but jefferson is no longer a young player necessarily he's i mean he's young in the in the from the way that he'll be around for a long time but not young as in he doesn't know what he's doing like he's a third year player he's got the whole nfl thing and superstar thing down just like cooper cup so there are a lot of comparisons there between the two teams and how maybe you wouldn't make all the bets on their depth, but they have some players who have filled in as good role players. I mean, last year was A'shaun Robinson in the middle of that Rams team. He's their big defensive tackle. You've kind of seen that with some guys who have emerged this year.

The reality is you need a complete football team from top to bottom with lots of good players and usually depth. The Vikings haven't needed too much of it, but hey, Duke Shelley has stepped up. Kyrus Tonga has stepped up and a few other guys. We saw Brian Asamoah. Cam Dantzler made a couple of plays this year earlier when he was healthy. I mean, you, you always need somebody to step up and do something big, um, from your team. And if you have half a roster or if you have an all young roster, you probably won't get that. But I think that what the Vikings have done is, is not unique really in any way. I mean, when you draft guys like Derrissaw and Justin Jefferson, you're looking for superstars in the first round.

And that's what they landed twice. I mean, you don't always get players of that caliber where you got a top five left tackle and a top three, if not number one, probably number one wide receiver in the entire NFL. I mean, that just, that's some, some pretty good favorable luck there that they had in the draft to get those couple of players. So yeah, I mean, what you need is a quarterback who's very good superstar receivers, superstar defensive players who can make big plays for you like Daniel Hunter, Zedarius Smith, Patrick Peterson, and then things to go your way. And that's how you end up with a 12 and three record

taking it into the playoffs and deep into the playoffs might be a little bit of a different story. I guess we're going to find that out as far as what you need, because even I remember Kweisi Adafo-Mensah saying it's the superstar quarterbacks who usually win, but that's not always the case. I mean, Jared Goff being in a Superbowl a couple of years ago, I just got done watching Nick Foles this evening and that guy won a Super Bowl somehow. So it doesn't necessarily have to be Peyton Manning or Drew Brees or Aaron Rodgers. I mean, a lot of times those guys win one or two championships in their careers and every once in a while somebody else pops up and wins one. So, you know, as we go into it, you know, that'll be interesting to see because I think a lot of people are still looking at this roster saying, is it deep enough, especially

on the defensive side? But offense is more predictive of where you're going to go than defense. And the Vikings have moved themselves up into the top 10. I think more than anything, if you're trying to find like what is repeatable, it's keep drafting wide receivers until you get one. And the Vikings drafted Laquan Treadwell. It didn't work out. Oh, well, draft another one in Justin Jefferson.

And they had to do it because they traded Stefan Diggs. Had they not traded Stefan Diggs, they probably wouldn't have drafted Justin Jefferson. And, you know, I mean, he's then he's somebody else's and then they're doing a lot of these same things like receivers are worth it in the draft. It should be quarterback number one, wide receiver number two. And you do have to wonder if that things would have been a little bit different in the past had they acted this way towards Stefan Diggs. So that might be another lesson learned from this is when you get one of these elite wide receivers, build everything around that player. Tyreek Hill has done it for Miami.

I mean, we saw it with Devante Adams and the loss of Devante Adams in Green Bay and what that has meant to them. So if there's anything to kind of copy copy it's not that you can just create someone else as justin jefferson he is certainly in rare air even all time as he continues to put up huge numbers but i don't think it's unique in the way that one player can have the entire offense centered around him i mean jefferson still has to have two good weeks to catch cooper cup from just last year uh you know because because that's what Los Angeles did. And it can be effective. It can be a winning model to get you deep in the playoffs if you build everything around one guy. So that's probably it more than anything. And then you're trying to just

get great players, but maybe not being afraid of the older veteran. That's a, that's always a tricky dance though. I mean, because you get a Jordan Hicks you get a Patrick Peterson and if one of the guys that's a veteran or Zedarius Smith ends up being washed or ends up being hurt it just punches a huge hole in your roster I mean even like Buffalo got Vaughn Miller who's been banged up a lot throughout his career and he was great to start the season and then he gets hurt now he's out for the year and sort of like okay well now what are you doing and then they have some guys they've drafted who can rush the passer to take his spot but when you rely on that it's always tricky the Vikings have just like everything else this year had that go really right for them but yeah I do think that picking up

veteran players at cheap prices is generally a decent plan to fill out a roster if you're in win now mode. So I should say that, that, you know, Philadelphia, I remember picked up, was it Patrick Robinson who got the big interception and he was a veteran player who'd been around, was inexpensive. Ron Darby was the same kind of guy for them in Philly when they won the Super Bowl. And you can go through almost every team. They usually have some guys like that. So, yeah, it's an interesting thought.

Like, is there anything to be learned from this? I don't know that there is, aside from if you have someone with the capabilities of getting open all the time. Don't mix them into the offense. But, you know, most teams aren't at this point. I think that the lesson is just maybe the TJ Hawkinson thing would be the lesson, but we've already kind of learned that from the Rams. When you have a chance to go for it and be great, then send a draft pick to somebody. Otherwise, probably not like don't do it to save your, your butt at the beginning of the season or

to create hype. But when you've realized, all right, we're a real contender, go try to make a trade because teams are going to be tanking more often. They're going to be loading off assets, even if they're in your division, apparently. So there's some things to be taken away for sure from this team. I don't know if it's a model, but there's little individual things you can kind of pluck from it. Folks, if you didn't get thenesota sports attire that you need for the playoff run for christmas go to sodastick.com that's s-o-t-a-s-t-i-c-k.com and check out all their great football designs for hats hoodies t-shirts and use the promo code purple insider at checkout uh all right next question here comes from at john juno on twitter uh how lucky were we with the duke shelly and kairos tonga pickups could they stick around for 2023 and beyond love to

hear your opinion on them i know teams find gems that other teams overlook fairly often but to find two on the bears in the same year that end up being pretty big roles here is something else shelly keeps making splash plays it could be a great depth player to keep around. And Tonga could take that third interior defensive line spot in the base 3-4 front if he keeps playing like this. Yeah, I agree with everything you said. It's two great finds. I mean, when you hear those guys getting signed, and I actually said this to Kyrus Tonga when I was talking to him the other day. Like when you hear they signed someone off of a practice squad from another team,

you just don't ever expect that guy to really play much less to play 30 snaps a game. Or when somebody like Duke Shelley, had they picked him up in, if they had signed him originally, he would have been cornerback number five or something. He would have been behind someone like Perry Nickerson on the original depth chart going into training camp. And here he is. And if they take him out of the lineup, I think they'd be completely foolish to ever put Cam Dantzler back in to the lineup, considering that the way

Duke Shelley has played and these are a hundred great finds for them and yes the defense is still struggling it's far from perfect but I've been impressed with both players Kyrus Tonga has strength that is pretty rare and you know what we've really seen from him that I didn't expect is the guy actually creates pressures I think he was registered with three pressures from PFF against the Giants. I think that's nine on the year for him in mostly a run-stuffing role. And I did ask Kevin O'Connell about him the other day, and he said that that's what he's actually been impressed with. When it's not a run play, to just turn into the mode of chasing the quarterback

is not the easiest thing when your job is to be a run-stuffer, and he's done very well with that. And Duke Shelly, I mean, sometimes, and anybody who's ever played pickup basketball knows this. Sometimes somebody's just a baller. Sometimes somebody just knows how to play ball. And I think that Shelly's physical limitations, his size, his length, all that stuff, it's going to be hard if he faces elite receivers to be able to make plays on the ball the way he has at the same time.

He's like the guy you run into the gym. That's like five foot eight and maybe has a beer belly or something. And you're like, okay, well this guy, you know, whatever, doesn't look all that imposing, but then he's just got handles and he's got a jump shot. And you're like, what? Uh, or he's the person that plays you super hard on defense and you can't really figure out why. Like, stop. Like, relax.

But that's Duke Shelley. I mean, the guy just plays hard and he makes plays on the ball. And I agree that these aren't like foundational pieces for the future, but these are nice finds. And that has been really one of the biggest issues with this defense over the last couple of years is that they just do not have depth players. And all of a sudden you kind of have a couple here. They're still going to want Andrew Booth Jr. If he can get healthy to be that starting outside corner, eventually, uh, I imagine Patrick Peterson comes back. We're getting kind of far down the road to, you know, as far as next year's conversation, if they win the Superbowl, he might retire. Like, I don't know, but, um, you know, as far as next year's conversation, if they win the Superbowl, he might retire. Like, I don't know, but you know, Andrew Booth Jr. is a guy they're going to want to start. So where

would Duke Shelley fit in? Maybe he moves to the nickel. He's kind of got that size and aggressiveness of a nickel player. And Chandon Sullivan has had some moments, but hasn't really worked out overall. And if not, it's just very good depth, which again, they have just been lacking over the last few years. So those are, those are good finds by the scouting staff to be able to pick those guys up when they weren't even on the original training camp roster. And now they're playing and making a difference. You don't see that all that often, but you definitely need that if you're going to be

a good team. All right. Let's see one or two more here. Let's go with from at Terry, Terry Rowell on Twitter. Let's see. Fans only topic from in a form of a friendly challenge. You often gush about the 2017 Vikings defense. Yes, it was ranked number one, but consider how one fourth of the schedule was against Brett Hundley and Mitch Trubisky. Other guys included Winston, Kaiser, Dalton, Breeze, and Foles exposed them. Defense was good and not great. No, I don't agree with that.

No, no, I don't. I think that, well, for one, every defense, every team will face team quarterbacks that aren't that good. You could go through every number one defense in history and look at the quarterbacks that they faced, and you're going to find a handful or a number of them that were not that good because the NFL doesn't have 32 good starting quarterbacks. But when I look at the 2017 Vikings defense, I mean, first they started off the season against Drew Brees, held them to 19 points and 344 yards so right off the bat of that season they had a good defensive game against Pittsburgh and Ben Roethlisberger

the next week they didn't do anything on offense but that was 335 yards I'm looking trying to find a 400 yard game I can't find one the 2017 Vikings did not give up a 400-yard game to their opponents the entire season. This year, they've done it, what, like six out of the last seven weeks, and the only time they didn't was against Indianapolis that just played the worst football game I've ever seen. They held Matt Stafford, who had a great 2016 season, to 14 points at home in that game that they lost 14-7. Yeah, there's other games mixed in here. I mean, there's two, there's a three game stretch that's really, really impressive

from the Vikings defense that year. They beat the Rams who had the number one offense in the NFL, 24 to 7 in that game and only gave up 254 yards. The next week they went to Detroit, gave up 289 yards, won that game 30 to 23, and then gave up nine points to the Falcons. And Matt Ryan was not washed at that time. He had won the MVP the previous season and they only put up 275 yards. And in the Minneapolis miracle game, a blocked punt played a pretty big role in them coming back in that game. Also an injury injury to Anderson Dayholt was a big deal in that game as well, if I remember correctly. And they were up 17-0 at the half. I mean, against one of the greatest quarterbacks ever, who was still playing incredible football at that time. So, yes, they did play some bad quarterbacks.

But let's just compare this year. So, this year, they've played some bad quarterbacks, but let's just compare this year. So this year, they've played some bad quarterbacks, and they've allowed Daniel Jones and Mike White and Andy Dalton to have big games. When they played bad quarterbacks in 2017, they beat their face in. When they played Brett Hundley, they gave up 10 points. When they played Deshaun Kizer, 16. How about when they played against Andy Dalton late in that year, seven Brett Hundley in, in green Bay, zero Mitch Trubisky 10. I mean, yeah, like you can't control

your own schedule, but even Winston was still putting up big statistics and stuff. They gave up 17 to him. I, I, yeah, I, you're not, you're not gonna get me to downplay the Vikings defense from 2017. It was legit. They allowed a third down conversion percentage of 25%, which was number one in the league that year. And the roster matches up with that. I think that the, the final game really changed some people's perspectives on that defense because of the way that it went against Philadelphia in Philly. And so a lot of people wanted to say, Oh, it wasn't, it wasn't that good because of the way that it went against Philadelphia in Philly. And so a lot of people wanted to say, oh, it wasn't that good because of that one game.

And I just can't agree with that. I think they were the best defense in the NFL that year, but that's how defense works in football, because it's not the year 2000. That sometimes if you have a great offense with an amazing offensive line, you get out-schemed in a game, you need to be able to match up. And even Mike Zimmer said it after that game. That's the reason

that they signed Kirk Cousins was because they felt like even if you have the best defense in the league in the modern NFL, sometimes you're going to have to match back and forth. And also, you know, one of the reasons they gave up 38 points in that game and the defense was certainly not good, but because the offense failed so much in that game as well. They failed to go back and forth with Philadelphia, but they also failed to have long drives to control the ball. And so Philly was just getting it back over and over. And that's a, you know, defense for the Vikings that had been worn down and then had to travel, tough environment, played on grass, all that sorts of things. But no, when you take the number one offense and allow seven points,

and then the MVP from the previous season allowed nine points, I'm not going to say that you were overrated. No, I think they were very good. Okay, last one. This one comes from at DPpt kll on twitter it appears to me that there's a trend of being coached hard by defensive many defensive coordinators and secondary coaches to be handsy and be grabby it seems that many dcs are willing to take the occasional penalty knowing that the officials aren't going to throw the flag the majority of the time especially if your dbs are doing it every play.

I started seeing this during the Detroit game, where it appears they're grabbing Adam Thielen as much as possible as part of their game plan. Am I crazy or onto something? If true, what will the NFL do about it? Yeah, no, it's interesting because last year the NFL thought they weren't calling enough. What is the penalty? It's not pass interference, but it's illegal contact. They weren't calling enough. What is the penalty? It's not pass interference, but it's illegal contact. They weren't calling enough illegal contact. So this year they pushed more illegal contact button. They said, ramp that up. We want to see you call that more often.

And just like every other rule change in the NFL at the first month of the season, they go kind of crazy with it. They call it all the time, but then it just gets into this mode where they kind of go back to who they are as referees and they don't want to call it on every play. I think that if it was really working, we wouldn't see Justin Jefferson thriving the way he is though, and other receivers thriving the way they are. And I'm not saying that the referees are doing a good job. I don't think that they are, but I mean, when you look at the penalty differential for the Vikings, one of the reasons is that Justin Jefferson's being grabbed all the time and they're throwing flags when Jefferson's getting, you know, mauled by the opposing cornerback that, yeah, I'm sure they could make an argument that he deserves 10, 15 more flags than he's even drawn this year. But opposing

teams have committed a lot of penalties against the Vikings in the passing game. And I think as referees too, you have to use some common sense where, you know, I totally get where they, when something doesn't affect a play, they kind of hold onto the flag because if you throw it over and over and over and over again, I mean, you're going to be talking about four hour games, 15 penalties, then penalties are affecting the game all the time. So they have a tough job when it comes to that. But I do think that what defensive coordinators are teaching very closely is exactly how to

walk up to that line, how you can get away with as much as you could possibly get away with. Because if you don't, then no one's ever going to be able to stop anybody. And we've kind of seen this. If you have an elite receiver, if you have an elite passing game, it's very, very hard for these cornerbacks and these defenses to slow you down. So I get why the strategy is what it is and why a lot of corners have to take that approach. They basically have to hold on for dear life and hope that they don't get caught in a lot of incidences. But if

you're the NFL, I think you want to continue to kind of push your referees a little to call those pass interferences, but you also don't want to be calling them all the time. And you don't want to seem like, oh, well, this team got penalized 14 times and this team two times and something's going on here or whatever else. So it's a tricky little dance that they have going on. But I think that a few years ago, Seattle pushed this to the absolute limits

with their corners playing super insanely physical. And it's kind of like some of the rules in basketball where if you called moving screens all the time, you would have less scoring and you'd have a lot of frustration of the people watching it because you would ruin the flow of play. You would ruin a lot of fun plays and possessions if you called moving screens. But man, they happen all the time, constantly. Every single possession is a moving screen.

So just like this, just like holding, these things kind of even out. It's not something that enrages me. I think where I get frustrated is when it comes to really obvious ones, like what happened to the Giants or in the Giants in Washington game a couple weeks ago, the guy jumps on the receiver's back. Like at the point of the ball coming in, if the receiver is just getting mauled and isn't able to make the play and they don't call it because they feel like they want to let

them play. Okay. That's a little too much. I think I have always had a problem with pass interference and how subjective it is. Like, what do you do with that? I don't think the NFL has ever had an answer and people will say, well, they should go to the college rule. The problem with that though, is that every deep pass, because corners run close in the NFL

with receivers, every deep pass, they would just tackle the guy. The reason, I mean, the receivers are so much better than the corners, especially the good ones in college that they usually don't have a chance to pull them down if the ball's coming their way on a 50 yard pass, but almost always the corner would be able to do it in the NFL, and they would just do it constantly and take 15-yard penalties every time someone was going to catch a 50-yard bomb. That would really just be terrible to watch, so I've never bought into that being the answer, but I really did like the general concept of reviewing it, and I just wanted to get them right, or them to get it right in reviewing it. And I just wanted to get them right or them to get it right in reviewing it. And I remember talking with Stefan Diggs about this one time, like he,

he was saying that he loves the idea of reviewing pass interference. Cause a lot of times receivers get interfered with and no one can see it until you look at the back view or whatever, but where the referee is, you can't see it. But they were so inconsistent with it that they couldn't get it right upon review. So if they could do that, I'd like to see that come back. I'm not sure there's a lot of people pining for it, though. I just don't, there's no, like, outrage. People aren't bringing pitchforks over pass interference

not being called enough, so I guess we'll just complain about it here. Anyway, well, the Vikings certainly do have a lot to be annoyed with when it comes to their receivers being grabbed because nobody is taking more of that than Jefferson and that's not going to change anytime soon, but he's got a chance to break the all-time receiving record. So has it hurt him a lot? Maybe, maybe not so much anyway. well, thanks for the great questions. Appreciate everybody.

And I remember the other day, I mentioned that I wanted to get Aaron Schatz on the show from Football Outsiders. He is going to come on later this week to talk about how crazy this year has been in terms of analytically in compared to their expectations and where they stand. So that'll be fun. All right, thanks everyone.

We'll talk to you later.