Purple Insider - a Minnesota Vikings and NFL podcast - ROUNDTABLE: The Vikings' future at quarterback is....

Episode Date: December 23, 2025

Matthew Coller is joined by Brian Murphy and Manny Hill to talk about JJ McCarthy getting hurt again and what happens next at quarterback? The Purple Insider podcast is brought to you by FanDuel. Also, check out our sponsor HIMS at https://hims.com/purpleinsider Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See https://pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Hey, everybody, welcome to another episode of Purple Insider presented by Fandul, Matthew Collar, here along with our Monday night roundtable of Brian Murphy and Manny Hill. And, you know, doing this with you guys each and every week, which was a new thing this year, I was very excited about it, has really felt like every time we check in with each other that the entire picture of the, the Minnesota Vikings 2025, 2026, and beyond changes. Last week, we're breaking down this really good game by J.J. McCarthy against the Dallas Cowboys. Murph is, you know, still recovering from that trip and working your way through what we saw and everything else. And we're thinking, you know what? They could win out. They could go nine and eight. We could feel really good about J.J. McCarthy. And here we are another injury for J.J. McCarthy hurts his hand there is a chance he did not practice today we're going to hear from

kevin o'connell tomorrow there is a chance that he does not play for the rest of the season which just leaves us in quarterback mystery land once again so here was what i presented to you guys i started a sentence and i want you to finish it and that's where we're going to begin and i also want everybody in the comments to finish it as well the minnesota viking's quarterback situation is blank. Let's start with Mani Hill with your answer. We'll get Burfs answer

and then we'll read some of yours if you guys have good ones as well. So, Manny, the Minnesota Vikings quarterback situation is blank. Up in the air. I mean, let's just not even sugarcoat this. I mean, this is a, this is a major, major,

just let down, a bummer, whatever you want to call it. right now with the situation, just because we just don't, we don't know enough about where J.J. McCarthy is just in his development, where he's headed, what his ceiling can be. I mean, we can speculate about the physical tools and all that stuff,

but the reality is, is we're not really going to know where he's at, unless we continue to see him play. and the problem right now is he is consistently injured and it's hard for me to quantify like blame how much do we blame him for this because obviously he's not trying to get injured I always like to say that when you know when we talk about professional athletes that seemingly get injured all the time I you know I think about Byron Buxton with the twins for many years where the injuries just it seemed like every year it was something and obviously

J.J. McCarthy's not trying to get injured, but we can't just shrug our shoulders at this and just say, well, you know, I just got hurt again, but that's all right. If he doesn't play again this season, that's all right. We'll just reset and get ready for next year and, you know, chalk it up as just kind of a letdown deployment. No, this is, this is serious because this is multiple injuries now over the course of the season. And, you know, I know you've talked a lot about college, sort of the starting and stopping with the development process of J.J. McCarthy. So if this stuff continues, if this is going to continue, I don't know what they're,

I don't know what they're going to do because if you're Kevin O'Connell and you're seeing this happen, you're like, what, I mean, we're talking about trying to develop this guy and get him better, but now the focus is just how do we keep him on the field for a full 17 game season if we're going to hit our wagons to him? So it's up in the air. I think a lot of different options are going to need to be considered for the quarterback position

just because you just don't know if this guy is going to be able to hold up for an entire for an entire season. Murph, the Minnesota Vikings quarterback situation is relentlessly unresolved year after year, decade after decade, it seems to be unresolved. And, you know, I'm never going to, I don't think anybody media fan should ever question NFL players' toughness because they're in the NFL. These are the toughest people on the planet, or among them. So I don't question J.J. McCarthy's toughness.

But it's fair to question his durability. And you have to ask questions, why is this keep happening? How does it keep happening? We're not even sure sometimes when these injuries occur. Is it because he's going off script and weird things are happening? And when weird things happen, you're more susceptible. to injure? I mean, why did kindergarten teachers always yell at you to not run in the hallway because you might get hurt? Somebody might come around the corner and you bang into him and somebody's

hurt. Are these kind of the, you know, the learning curves and the panics and the trying to make something happens kind of plays? It's not illegal for him to slide feet first. He seems to want to put his shoulder down during every scramble. And he's also got four rushing touchdowns. That's part of his his tool set. But it's impossible right now to know what they have and what they may have going forward with him because we've only seen glimpses. And this is four different injuries, four different serious injuries to different parts of his anatomy that have caused mechanical, mental, and, you know, just durability issues

throughout. And, you know, Sunday was kind of a perfect snapshot of what J.J. McCarthy, he is and may be or may never be. You know, he had a nice first half, pretty fine. Vikings build a 10-point lead. I mentioned, you know, the scramble. And then, you know, the arrows pointing up. The confidence is growing.

You can almost hear KOC getting ready to talk about postgame growth or growth in the post-game. But it just right around the corner, there's disaster. And was it disaster because he was hurt earlier and couldn't hold the ball? Questions that need to be answered? was he put, does he, is he reluctant to talk to the training staff or KOC when he is hurt? Are things getting as exacerbated? I mean, there's a lot of things that are on the table and none of them are really good right now.

Let's get the answers from the chat. Let's see. J-U-N-T goes with Terrible. Jordan says our quarterback situation, a nightmare situation. Randy says it's a failure. Adrian goes with a bleep show and a mystery. we've got bring Kirk back be done with it downward spiral is another potential answer here I mean yeah here's when you talk about yesterday being a really encapsulation of what J.J. McCarthy

has been. I would include some of the down moments of yesterday as well. He has Jalen Naylor on an outbreaking route in the end zone and he does not release it when he's supposed to throw it and takes a sack. And then he's got another throw that's high and too hard and it goes off Jefferson's tippy of his hands. And then it gets picked off and take it for six, gets called back because Abdul Carter, I don't know, had his nose hairs lined up over the line of scrimmage. But I mean, that really didn't impact that play at all. It was entirely just an inaccurate, a bad throw. And then there's five or six plays where you're like, whoa, nice job. I mean, the scramble, the throw to Jordan Addison, which Addison usually catches, that one is a, that's a tough call with a drop, but he usually gets that because he had to readjust really nicely.

But that's, I mean, that's Dexter Lawrence right in his face and heaving it up. Truthfully, you know what I thought about that throw, guys? I thought that's the one Kirk didn't make in 2022 when he checked it down to T.J. Hawkinson that he had Adam Thieland or Justin Jefferson deep and didn't give them a shot. and that's the arm strength to be able to make that throw, right? And the athleticism to be able to make that throw. Then there's a deep out to Justin Jefferson where that ball is absolutely cooking to the sideline. He makes the catch and you're like, oh, yeah, that's what we've been looking for with JJ and Justin Jefferson. So you're starting to kind of talk yourself into it.

The more the game goes along. He's faced some pressure. He makes some mistakes, but we all still expect some mistakes to be made. and then it's just, nope, it's over, Holt, you don't get to evaluate this entire game and potentially don't get to evaluate the rest of the season. So if it ends here, Manny, what do you do? Because, you know, the chat brings up Kirk, I don't know, it's not impossible. Kirk, by the way, just real quick, I can't help myself.

I was looking up like how he's played in Atlanta because I haven't watched him play except for that one crazy game. And he's 10 in 10 as an Atlanta falcon, which I thought that's just, that's just what it is. That's her cousins. But, you know, like that ends up being on the table. So to what degree are you maybe changed

in any opinions where you stood going into this game? If this is the end of the evaluation, if we don't get to see the game on Christmas, if we don't get to see a week 18 that could potentially matter to the Green Bay Packers and the entire season for J.J. McCarthy 2025 is eight and a half games. What is your thought for 2026? I don't know. I mean, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's an answer as I can give

you in this case because we just, like I said before, we just haven't seen enough of him play to really formulate. a strong opinion one way or the other. If you want to be optimistic about J.J. McCarthy, I don't think you've seen enough to really decide, oh, he's the guy unquestioned, QB1 for the next five years, the Vikings have found their guy.

I don't know how anybody can see what they've seen this season and definitively say that. But we also, I don't know how you can definitively say that he's not the guy, because you just haven't seen enough of him. Now, there's question marks, obviously, accuracy, mechanics, all of that stuff. Now it's, you know, durability, availability, all of that stuff is, are question marks. But it's just frustrating because you just, we just don't know. And eight games, you know, when you're starting and stopping throughout those eight games

because of four, like you said, four different injuries, I don't know how you can determine one thing or another and it's especially a dire situation if you're Kevin O'Connell and Quasi Dofflmenza because, you know, following a disappointing season like this, your seats are, if your seats are not sizzling,

they're getting really, really warm going into 2026. And that has to be stressful for them because if you're wanting to win and knowing that you need to win in 2020, meaning that you've got to make the playoffs and maybe even you're probably going to have to win a playoff game too because you haven't done that yet in four seasons so far. All of that stress and all of that pressure and now the most important position on your team is like I said, up in the air, I don't know what you do. And obviously you're going to have to explore some other options. as, if anything, just an insurance policy,

if this is going to be a thing for J.J. McCarthy, you need to have somebody else that can come in and perform well in 2026 and help you win some games if you're trying to actually win, which they are. It's tough, man. I don't know what they can do right now because the QB options, if we're really being honest for 2026, unless you're trading three firsts and, I don't know,

Jordan Addison or something for Joe Burrow. I mean, outside of that, the options are not really all of that great. Well, you know, Mani, I try to work with and formulate opinions on whatever the information we have is, right? You know this. And that's why I will flip-flop sometimes. I will change my take. I'm not going to stand on a hill and just ride that out forever because I think the league is always changing. People are always changing. And so are situations. And I was really dead set on the idea of you guys picked McCarthy. You guys remember the rant from a couple weeks ago.

You guys picked McCarthy. It's your bed. You sleep in it. It's your job to whisper into his ear and make him into a good quarterback. So go do it. And you're going to feel a lot better about it if he makes a ton of progress in the final weeks of the season and everything else. But like, let's just ride this train and see where it takes us. But the information is now changed with another injury that even when we're talking about evaluating him to the end of the season, every quarter matters, every throw, every dropback, and even missing half of a game is like, okay, now we get another one that we don't get to see. We did not get to see him go out and try to play against the Seattle Seahawks. So, you know, you're talking about, well, he's shown recent

progress. Who knows how that would have looked if he had had to go play the Seahawks. So we have now a stoppage of all of last year, a stoppage for an ankle injury for five games, a stoppage for a concussion in which he ran himself into somebody. We have another stoppage now for a hand injury. You cannot live on just it's J.J. McCarthy or bust because if we go into next year and there's all these veteran excellent players who, by the way, the defense allowed 33 yards passing yesterday and sacked Jackson Dart five times. Like I can't waste these people's time.

I also still feel like the Vikings have a coach that never. goes three and 14 because he keeps everybody on the same bus moving in the same direction, which is a really good thing, even if we can talk about other stuff that maybe we like or don't like. That's number one, right? Mike Tomlin, another winning season. How does he do it? Well, he keeps everybody pulling on the same chain, right? But so I know I've got these things and wide receivers that are absolutely excellent when they catch it, which was not always the case in New York either. But you know what I'm saying. Like they've got a ton of talent. offensive line, probably outside of Ryan Kelly, is all coming back.

And if you bring J.J. McCarthy back in a week one, he gets hurt again and is out for six weeks. And Carson Wentz is your backup. You're wasting another season. You have to do better than that now. I think you have to have legitimate competition for J.J. McCarthy, starting in OTAs, better man wins. Nobody, we are done with, you're a draft, you're a project. He's a kid. He's growing. I am out on all that. Next year, You are a pro quarterback with a pretty bad record overall of passing the football and you're going to compete with somebody who has done this before. Do you agree with that, Murph?

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I do and I think it really underscores how either naive or misguided the brain trust really was going into the season because they did clear the decks for him and brought in Sam Howl, who couldn't even hold down the job in August. So then it's Max Brosmer. And we're actually getting more of Max Brosmer than I think even Gophers fans wanted to see at this point. What I'm concerned about is that they have not they haven't boxed themselves into this situation. Circumstances have boxed themselves into a situation where they're going to have to probably sell a decent backup quarterback. I'm thinking this roster is going to need more than just a backup quarterback, though.

You're looking for somebody like, I'm just throwing his name out there as a serviceable guy, Marcus Marriota, because you want somebody that maybe has to go out and win or play four to six games and get four to five victories in that window like they thought they might squeeze out of Carson Wentz and it didn't happen. Now, the question is, what are you telling that veteran free agent quarter? quarterback when he comes in, that it's a wide open competition, the job's yours, if you earn it. Is he going to be looking over his shoulder on a three-pick game and everybody's yelling for JJ?

Is, you know, the politics of a non-dedicated backup, a struggling rookie now second year slash going into his third year, who's pushing who? What are the defined roles and what's going to happen when adversity hits? with either one of those quarterbacks. And if you're toggling back and forth, you're also risking continuity and you're risking losing the locker room. You're risking having sides being chosen in a locker room.

These are all large issues down the road that they may or may not face, but you can sense this coming where it didn't work handing the job to the kid. You don't want to just bury the kid and tell him it's over, but you need to push him. and you need to protect yourself, as Manny said, not only with an insurance policy, but these guys are now, you know, KOC, the front office, no playoff wins.

They're not going to have a playoff appearance this season. The seats are getting hotter. The management is getting more difficult. The cap, the payroll is getting squeezed. You've got to make tough decisions on veterans that sometimes worked out, sometimes did work out. Look at them yesterday on the defense. You have to wonder if this was a 17 game.

defensive effort like we've seen the last month or so, what would that have meant earlier in the year? How all of that plays out and you're also trying to both nurture and challenge the guy you've invested so much in. And how does that play out? Because he's really never been pushed and challenged in this market. What's that going to look like in the offseason? And what's that, what are the ramifications for the rest of the locker room and expectations for 2026? So here's my issue with if it's over when because I saw it you know the comment section said oh you know he went five and four like I mean that's true you do get a win for yesterday um I think that the you know okay I don't want I don't want to say he didn't play okay he played fine but it is funny

to get a win for yesterday that pro football reference win loss that does have its little quirks like our friend sage Rosenfelds one time came off the bench down 21 and won the game and he doesn't get a QB win for that because he didn't start. So sometimes it is a little goofy in that way. But, uh, okay, yeah, that's true. They went five and four, uh, but how many of those games were driven by the quarterback to win the game? And the answer is not that many.

And when you look at the bigger picture statistics from J.J. McCarthy, the only two quarterbacks with a lower quarterback rating this season are Jake Browning and Shadur Sanders. That's it. That's the entire. list. You can't win that way over an entire season. And going five and four is, let's call it four and a half and four. What is that? Does that get you the NFC North next year if the performance is like this? And throughout the season, we could say, yes, there was some progress.

They also played the three worst defenses in the entire NFC in succession. And the numbers were fine. But when you look at yesterday, can we go through this? When we talk about what standard is for quarterback play for the Minnesota Vikings. Can we go through what guys did this week in the NFL? Let's, let's do that. Let's take a look at some of the performances around the league. Matt Stafford went for 457 and somehow lost the game. So that's, that's pretty telling. Caleb Williams had to throw for what, 250 against the Packers, come back and win that game. I believe the Vikings had 87 yards the last time passing that they played against the Green Bay Packers.

Remember that Dallas team that JJ did okay against? Justin Herbert, who has no offensive line at all, went for 10 and a half yards of past 300 yards against them. The Bengals got four touchdowns out of Joe Burrow yesterday against the pretty poor defense. That's usually what happens. I mean, the Jaguars, what a showing from Trevor Lawrence against one of the top defenses in the league?

This is the state, I mean, how about Jared Gough yesterday? Jared Goff went for 364, three touchdowns, and lost the game. The standard should just be way higher than we've set the bar from what we've seen from J.J. McCarthy. So where I feel like if we don't get to see these last two games, it's got to be more than just, hey, another guy in training camp. It's got to be someone who can be a serious answer that can win you games. But the problem with that is, Manny, how many human beings can we say who are available

that that could possibly be. It's a very difficult needle to thread. Which player would you be able to bring in that you could, I don't know, either have as a backup or trade, I guess, if JJ wins the competition, but also if the guy wins the competition, you could actually compete in the NFC North. Who is that person?

Is there a person? I don't know. I don't know. Again, it's like, and again, Real quick, real quick, real quick. The comment section, oh, you're comparing him to seven-year starters. I'm comparing him to NFL players who win games, okay? That's where we're at.

Drinking wheels off, okay? Drake May through, Drake May through for 380 in Baltimore last night. Right. These are NFL quarterbacks. Same draft class, guys. Same draft class. Your 600-plus days into being a Minnesota Viking. Throwing for 100 yards in a first half or whatever.

is just not enough to push me over the top of saying, you're good, guys, you're all set. The standard is high to win in the NFL. And we saw Drake May playing a different football game than J.J. McCarthy. These are just the facts. Go ahead, man. I'm sorry. He was so good last night. Oh, my God. Unbelievable.

Yeah, I just, I don't, I don't know, man. Like, again, it's like the only person right now. that I would feel really great about that's slightly possible is Joe Burrow. And I don't even really think that that's, I mean, that's still kind of a pipe dream right now for being honest because the Bengals would be stupid to trade him away because of how insanely good he is. I don't know. Maybe a Kyler Murray, we've talked about Kyler Murray.

Maybe he gives you somewhat of a shot. But again, he's another one of those guys where like when he's good, and he's on, he's really good. But he get, you know, Kyler can give you some peaks in valleys too and maybe a change of scenery, maybe getting him with Justin Jefferson and, you know, in this offensive line,

and this scheme, this offense can maybe get him on a steady, you know, a steady path because it has been a little bit chaotic in Arizona since he's been there. But outside of Kyler Murray, I just, I don't know, man. And even if you were to bring him in, do you still like not have the fourth best quarterback in the division at that point? I mean,

you probably still have the fourth best quarterback in the NFC North if you trade for Kyler Murray. So I don't know, man. I don't know what the options are. As you guys were talking, I was doing a little bit of math because I like playing with, you know, numbers and adding and dividing and stuff like that. If you go back to 2021 when J.J.

McCarthy was. I guess he would have been a true freshman at Michigan. If you go back to then, since then, we're talking about five seasons of football. He has thrown, and I'm including preseason of 2024 and 2025, he has thrown 957 passes. That's not even 200 passes a year. There's just not enough.

We just haven't seen enough. And that is just really what's frustrating. And the problem now that the Vikings are facing is, do you even have enough time to see enough, to get enough out of him to really even know without getting yourselves fired? So now you're in a situation where you really have to explore other options, like you said, that are going to give you a realistic chance to compete

if he's not going to be able to stay healthy in 2026, because if you hit your wagons to him and he gets hurt again, you're screwed. Everybody's getting fired. They're going to blow this whole thing up because the Wilf's, as we know, they do not like losing. They do not like missing the playoffs in back-to-back seasons. They don't like that stuff.

And if this happens again, then you're looking at Kevin O'Connell being out of a job and Quasi possibly being out of a job. They're going to want to blow this whole thing up. And then you're at a point where you're, probably starting over. Well, so the comment section is giving me a lot of, well, he's only played X number of games.

But isn't that kind of some of the points? That's the problem. That's part of the point is that I was certainly willing to see what happened in the last two games. Look at the final picture rather than just saying, well, through this many games, it looks like this. Because in a season, you play a myriad of different types of teams. You play some bad teams.

You can light them up. You play some good teams. They might light you up. And like, that's life, right? So get to the end of the year, bump your quarterback rating up to, and I, look, there's a lot of other stats. They all say the same thing. Even if you adjust the completion of percentage for drops, he's 34th out of 44.

So they all say the same thing. But let's just say you go in with the final five games looking pretty darn good. And then you can go, all right, well, that's, that's the guy you're moving forward with next year, crafted a little bit more to what you know he can do now as opposed to last year where it was guesswork and he was running an offense that in a practice and on a whiteboard, McCarthy could execute. But in the real action, he clearly needed a different type of adjustment in a lot of the play action stuff that they did over the last couple weeks was really good and all that sort of stuff. But if it ends here and you're saying, well, May's played a lot more. Well, Williams has played

a lot more. Well, Nicks has played a lot more. Like, that's part of the point because I'm going forward to next year thinking you got to win and we're going to make the cutoff eight and a half games and a performance that is among the worst in Vikings history relative to the season. You are 31st in team quarterback rating. Usually teams win three games, but you just happen to have Brian Flores and Will Reichard so you won more than that. I think the standard now switches to you have to have a quarterback that can win games, a lot of them next year.

when I go through those other quarterbacks, it's funny because, like, you know, well, Stafford even lost that game and threw for a lot of yards. Like, that's the point. You can play like that and still lose in the NFL. And you guys want somebody just who can only run, like play actions and wide open throws and has to have it dumbed down so you can only use one motion pre-snap or whatever. Like, that's, that doesn't work. So I'm not saying, oh, I'm done with him.

I'm not saying give up on him. He finished with a 71 quarterback rating. he's toast. What I'm saying is that now that whole narrative of, oh, well, you know, he's still learning. He's making little incremental progress. He's this, this is this. That is done for me. That's the point. When I looked around the league yesterday at the quarterbacks who are winning games, they are performing at a very, very high level in huge games against tough teams. And if we don't believe that he can get there next year, then he can't be the quarterback. And there has to be another option. So is there something that Murph, you relatively like for an option for next year,

like a, like a just, you know, it's not Burrow, but like Kyle, is Kyler Murray a thing for you? Like, where do you, like, is there someone, Mac Jones that you think is a good idea? I mean, I was only going to say Mac Jones because he's just kind of, you know, parked over there in San Francisco and they seem to know what to do with quarterbacks that aren't even playing. but I'm not over here scouring rosters. I don't know. Marietta is he's a viable backup, but can you rely on him for six to eight games to get four to six wins? And as Manny said, think of the division you're in.

Think of the quarterback play that these three teams above the Vikings have forgotten this season have been getting for Green Bay. It's been 30 plus years of getting that kind of quarterback play. So no, I don't have names just to pull out of a hat. But what I'm concerned about is, as you may, mention that there aren't many people that fit the bill of being contractually friendly, eager to come, if you're talking free agents, easy to sell on the scenario that's here. And what do you tell in McCarthy?

And I'm not saying McCarthy needs to be baby, but what are you, what are you telling him? Because if there's any whiff that the organization is given up on him, that kind of toxic and that can seep into a quarterback and we've seen it as O'Connell has so eloquently stated over and over again, more organizations fail quarterbacks than quarterbacks fail organizations. So they're balancing that delicate act right now too. But the durability, look, the one, you know, there's all kinds of stats. One of the most basic and major stats is availability. And he's not available. And if you're not available and you've literally put eight and a half games together, which is literally a half season. I don't know what you're really looking at and how you can project and build a roster

around that. If you do see plenty of flaws that maybe can be corrected and you're seeing some signs of hope that can maybe be built upon, but none of it matters if you're not available. And if you're not available, whether that means getting banged up in practice or getting banged up in the preseason or throughout the regular season, if you're not available, it is impossible to not only evaluate what you can do short and long term, but it's really difficult to build a roster, build a quarterback room, and build game plans around so much uncertainty. So I don't envy the Vikings. They can clean them up health-wise. They can clean them up technique and mechanics. wise all through the off-season. But he hasn't been able to prove that he's available reliably.

And because of that, he's now going to very likely have stiff competition, if not an open competition. And now that opens up a whole other can of worms of which you could be going a week-to-week saga, who's your number one guy? So one of my, I mean, points about this ending here potentially, we're going to hear from Kevin O'Connell tomorrow is that now we only can look at the sample that we have. We can't make up a sample, which seems to be what people would want to do. It's like, oh, well, he was progressing.

So I'm just going to assume that it was going to get better and better, which we've been fooled on that before with all sorts of players, with cornerbacks, with tackles, with guards, with, you know, lots of them. But the bigger sample size of this whole season, statistically, is, I mean, I wouldn't even say it's within the stratosphere of acceptable, not even close. And when you think about what this offense was doing passing-wise with Kirk Cousins, who is a good quarterback, we all agree on that. Nobody ever disagreed with that.

And Sam Darnold, who before he got here, was not a great quarterback, but had a lot of experience and then stepped into the offense and excelled and through regularly for 250 to 300 yards time and time again last year. And that's the point about what's the standard. here when this is progress, but even compared to last year. And by the way, by the time you've reached your eight and a half the game of your second year, calling him a rookie is just disingenuous. You are just not telling the truth that that's what you're saying.

I know he didn't play last year, but he was on the team in the pros. He had a whole offseason as a pro. And now he's had eight starts and it still kind of looks like a rookie, but you cannot keep calling him a rookie because that's just that that to me. I mean, all these are just sort of coping mechanisms. So, well, he was doing a little better and well, because the other option of accepting that this did, did not go anywhere close to what it was supposed to is, uh-oh, that's really the whole point is the people who said, nightmare scenario are exactly right.

And where I feel like, you know, a Mac Jones or a Mariotta, I don't think you can win with Mario, I think that's pretty clear from what he's done this year with Washington, getting a chance and other teams. He did make the playoffs with Tennessee, but that doesn't get you anywhere. Mac Jones at least gives you a bar, though. Now, the problem is San Francisco, why do they want to help you?

Why does Kyle Shanahan want to help you by trading you Mac Jones? I'm guessing he likes Mac Jones and is saying, why would I give anyone else, you know, a starting quarterback? It does give you a bar to reach, though, and that's the type of quarterback I think they need to have. And if they go any farther than, that. If they go with, you know, a Kyler Murray, a big trade, well, then of course it's over or even signing Daniel Jones back here, which I guess is possible since it's being mentioned by every NFL

insider. But first name, last name says, you know, missing two games changes nothing. Oh, I think it changes a ton. Because think about the percentage that two games is of the season. If he only was going to play 11, two games is a big chunk of that. That's eight more quarters. That's a national television game, sorry Netflix for everything that happened for Christmas Day. And, you know, then the other one could be serious against your biggest division rival, a great measuring stick for you if they're coming in hot 110 miles an hour trying to, you know, win the division or whatever's on the stake, you know, even moving up one playoff spot. Like that those are games that would have mattered a lot to the equation.

And if we don't get to see them, then it ends here. and this is all you have to work with. And it's just not anywhere close with this sample size to the level that you would say, all right, this guy is going to be fine. And I don't think the last three, two and a half games have done enough for me to say, you're all set, you can compete with golf, you can compete with love, you can compete with Caleb Williams. So then you're kind of trying to find either the, yeah,

the Kyle or Murray or the Joe Burrow, who's the classic Vikings quarterback from some other team that's a reclamation project, or it's the bridge quarterback to survive a season with a last place schedule if they get to that last place schedule and then move forward. Okay, here's another question. Are you guys, did Seattle, Mani just end any intrigue for you for Max Brosmer? You're just like, all right, that's just not going to work. Heck of a throw to Justin Jefferson yesterday. If it's Max Brosmer for these next two games, are you interested?

yeah i mean i would i'd watch i mean just because i think i mean we talk about not having not seen enough of j j mccarthy we'd we'd seen one game of max brosmer and it was granted it was awful but you know max grover brosmer grab pick a number like the quarterback play as a whole in 2025 for the minnesota vikings has not been good it's not been acceptable enough if you know you're this kind of team that was built to win right now with all the moves you made in free agency you were expected to you know build off of what you did last year which was a 14 win season by the way in case anybody forgot um so you were expected to compete and the quarterback play has just not been good enough from really any of the three guys

who who played this year for them but with that said I mean I mean, I look at Max Brosmer as somebody that can potentially be a pretty decent backup quarterback in the NFL for a decade. And the only way we're really going to know that is if, you know, we get a look at him maybe in these last two games and see if he performs well enough. And, hey, if he does, then that means, hey, maybe he belongs in the league. He'll be around for a while. And as a gopher fan, for me, that'd be kind of cool because, you know, he's one of the best gopher quarterbacks that we've seen in the last 20 years. So that's that's about it, though, as far as my interest, I'm not looking at Max Brosmer as a real possibility as a long-term starter here or anything like that. I think at best it's, you know, he performs well.

If he does end up playing these last two games, he performs well and he ends up being the backup here for a number of years. What do you think, Murph? I think for Max Brosmer, I think I'm kind of interested in watching, not for anything related to the bike game. or all of the quarterback near-term that we're talking about. I think it would be a good, it kind of would be nice for him to whitewash what happened in Seattle if he can. I mean, that's an awful place to make your NFL debut. Now he's got two home games, no pressure whatsoever, and you can make a mess of things for Detroit and or Green Bay in the friendly confines. So for his sake, if he does at least have some serviceable performances,

whether or not they chalk up victories, it'll go a long way to helping talent evaluators ignore or flush what happened in Seattle and sort of dismiss it as the, you know, the panic of a kid thrown into a situation where he was in over his head trying to do too much. So for his sake, I'm interested. For the future, the Vikings, no. Right now he's just a guy that. that is going to be under center for the next two games because the schedule says you have to play them.

All the intrigue is going to be, again, the diagnosis with the hand. We're not thinking it's serious, but without knowing how much, you know, will this require surgery? Is this something he's going to have to be rehabbing all winter? Is he going to be ready come April and May? That'll be the thing to keep an eye on too.

I'm just more, I really want to see how the roster does respond. I think you mentioned it earlier, Collar. I mean, O'Connell has really done a fantastic job, and this goes to his coaching bona fides of keeping the team together after the Green Bay loss, after the Seattle loss, with such horrible quarterback play, it would have been very convenient for a lot of people in that locker room to check out. I think we know what it checked out locker room looks like. I mean, look what the Giants look like.

Look what Washington looked like when they came in here a couple of weeks ago. The Vikings were teetering on that edge. And I give Brian Flores a lot of credit because he's got his defense up to play. And it does beg the question of what a complementary football team would have looked like this season. From a defensive standpoint and 16, 17 games of McCarthy on the Ascension, would they be in the mix? I have a pretty good feeling they would be. But it's not the season we were dealt. And that's where it's at.

But I do think for this defense, I mean, you're seeing a lot of guys, they're not just playing for pride. They're playing for more than that. And I think that should be appreciated, whether that plays itself out, going up against two teams fighting for their playoff lives and quarterbacks. I don't even know if we're going to see Jordan Love again. But I think it'll be interesting to see if O'Connell can, you know, 9 and 8 does nothing except give you.

the claim that you didn't have a losing record. At this point, you're going to be a mid-level draft pick anyway. I want to see how they respond at home. I want to see how the offensive line can still maybe create some opportunities for Brosmer to feel a little bit comfortable. And it'd be really nice to see Jefferson get his thousand yards as well. There's still some things to watch. Yeah, I guess.

Yeah. I mean, no, I know. What do you want me to say? There's nothing monumental here. No, I know. No, that's where we're at. I mean, this, this is what I want to talk about in a second, but let me answer some, uh, some questions here real quick, uh, or comments. Well, one about Drake May in the 300 yard game, uh, just checked here about Drake May. And if we go over to our friends at Fanduel and we look at the odds for MVP, Drake May is plus 170 on Fanduel, which is the second

highest odds for MVP in the NFL. So my. point is that this is where the bar gets set for seriously winning and chasing a championship is playing at that level. And it doesn't have to be all the quarterback that causes that. Like it could be the supporting cast. Like when I remember the Tua season where the Miami did a great job of setting up Tua for success. And I think we all knew that Tua had his shortcomings then. But they did a good job of that.

They set it up for success and they won a lot of games that year and they deserved credit. They traded for Tyree Kill and everything, right? Brock Purdy, Jalen Hertz. People love to debate. Jalen Hertz. Oh, is he really good enough Brock Purdy? And my thing is, I don't care. Like, you have the goal is to win the Super Bowl not to get on somebody's stinking quarterback rankings the next year.

I've said that a million times, right? But there's also a, you know, when you have that decent or good or great supporting cast, that player has to reach a certain level. in order to get that type of performance. And this year was nowhere close, which doesn't mean, again, I'm not saying that I'm just over him and he'll never be good and everything else.

My thing is that if this is the cutoff, that means you have to go into next year looking at what you have and saying it was horrific. It was nowhere, nowhere close to the performance of players that we're talking about for his first season. So if there's not monumental progress, next year training camp, OTAs, whatever it might be.

And if he can't beat a real quarterback in the league who's played before for a competition and can't show very quickly within the first month that he is now the quarterback you're going forward with, then it is probably cooked, or at least for right now, or it's going to have some sort of stoppage like Anthony Richardson or whatever else it might be. That's kind of the point about why, you know, you bring up. you know, Drake May and that kind of thing. So, and as far as, you know, options, what they do is going to tell us everything. What they do will give us all the answers about how they feel about his 2025.

My whole point is just that we can't now move goalposts to, hey, well, he had a good game against the Dallas Cowboys and say, oh, it's all said, it's all said. Let's give them a million years. And, you know, you bring up that organizations fail quarterbacks, more than quarterbacks fail organizations, well, I think that all of Kevin O'Connell's quotes from last offseason are being very tested now because sometimes quarterbacks can't stay healthy and aren't good enough. And it's nobody's fault. That just sometimes happens. You draft one and it might not work out and that very well could be the case for J.J. McCarthy. And just guys, for my standpoint

on Max Brosmer, I do think he can play quarterback in this league. I don't think there's a starting quarterback there. But you'd like to see him prove that he's a guy you want on your roster for a long period of time. But the position that J.J. McCarthy has put them in is not one where you could say, Brosmer, you're the QB2 for next year. It has to be a Tray Lance, Brock Purdy, and Sam Darnold type of situation from a couple years ago with the San Francisco 49ers. So Murph rattled off a few things to watch the last couple of games. Ryan Wright's put together a good season.

Maybe they'll get some decent punts, Murph, a couple of good kick returns. Maybe the pregame. Any kick return. Yeah. Yeah. Any kick return with no penalty. Snoop dogs playing at halftime. Like there's a couple things to watch, I guess.

But Mani, I think something to watch here. I brought this up earlier with Jeremiah Searles. I'm curious about your take is that now with the quarterback situation being, my answer would just be completely unclear. I don't know if I answered it at the beginning of the show, but that's where we land after, you know, hollering for 45 minutes is just completely unclear. But I think it's also completely unclear

whether Brian Flores is the defensive coordinator for the Minnesota Vikings next year. If you were in Brian Flores' shoes, Manny, would you want to remain a Minnesota Vikings, D.C.? Oh. That is a great question. I think if I'm Brian Flores, I am wondering about the quarterback position

and what it's going to look like in 2026. Because if I'm Brian Flores, I'm thinking about, you know, can I, are we going, as the Minnesota Vikings, are we going in the right direction to where we're competing for a championship? And the only way we're going to get there is if we solidify this quarterback position.

position and it's not completely unclear, as you said, or up in the air, as I said, Murph, I'm sorry, I don't remember exactly what you use, but it's kind of a similar thing where it's just, it's a huge question mark. Now, if I'm Brian Flores and the Vikings decide to just say, we're going to roll with J.J. McCarthy in 26, we're going to put all their eggs into his basket and we're going to, he's going to improve because we believe that he's going to improve because that's what we do here. I have some real serious questions if I'm Brian Flores, and that's what the plan is going to be.

Because the way that he has coordinated this defense this year, especially the second half of the year, this defense has been fantastic and really has not been talked about enough because for obvious reasons, we've been talking so much about J.J. McCarthy, but that defense has been outstanding, really, the second half of the year, and Brian Flores deserves all the credit of the world for that.

if you're some of these other teams in the league and you know that Brian Flores, correct me if I'm wrong, not under contract for next year, you're right, going to be a free, going to be a free agent from some of these other teams. First of all, I might be looking at looking at him as a potential head coach and that's obviously complicated with the lawsuit and everything. But even if he wants to make a lateral move as a defensive coordinator and go somewhere elsewhere, you know, that team might be ascending more. back position is a little bit more solidified, and he can get a long-term contract with a little bit more security and feel really good. And, you know, if anything, kind of maybe have kind of a pet project of trying to improve a defense that maybe has struggled over the last couple of

years. Maybe the Cincinnati Bengals are a team, but Mike Brown historically has not really spent a lot of money. But in theory, if you're the Bengals and you're trying to improve your defense, Brian Flores is the perfect candidate to be able to do that because you have the established quarterback with all the weapons on offense. All you got to do is just get that defense to being mediocre. And boom, you can possibly go back to the Super Bowl as they did four years ago. So, yeah, I mean, if I'm Brian Flores, I'm exploring all options, man. And if it looks good for the Vikings to stay with the Vikings in 2026,

then obviously, you know, I think. think it makes some sense for him to stay. But if another opportunity presents itself, that's better and might make more sense for him, just from a stability standpoint, I think he has to explore that, and I would not blame him. I agree. Your thought, Mark? Yeah, what an indictment that would be if you're all-star defensive coordinator and free agent to be decided, you know what?

I'm not even going to go for head coaching position. I'm going to make a lateral move that's probably going to position me even better for greater success because I don't trust what's going on here on the other side of the ball. That would be, that's going to be interesting to watch and, and what's also going to be interesting to watch because it's impacted Flores the last couple of hiring cycles is the, the outcome of this discrimination suit that he had filed against the NFL and its owners. It's been a couple of years now. I don't know where that litigation is.

The NFL does not, you know, it's a country club. They don't like it when, you know, some of the help is coming after them or accusing them of problems. There's a quiet sense of maybe we're just not going to hire him until this is resolved. Because if he does get a head coaching position, it is going to impact that litigation. I mean, obviously he was suing because he felt that there was a ceiling keeping him from doing that or he was getting token interviews, the Rooney Rule. All of that is in play. But it's interesting, you know, he does have a lot of cards to play because he's had an excellent defensive unit. And any broadcast that goes in, any Vikings broadcasts, they're talking about O'Connell, they're talking about quarterbacking.

But then it's how exotic Brian Flores' defenses are going to be, how it's going to befuttle this quarterback, what the opposing teams had to say about Brian Flores and the blitzing, the not blitzing, the looks, aggressiveness, the sound technique in the defensive backfield, you know, the way he's been able to really play the risk-reward game pretty well. And as Mani said, it has quietly flown onto the radar here because so much attention has been paid to, you know, the offensive ineptitude with every quarterback that the defense, which had its issues early on and couldn't really hold fort while the quarterback play went downhill has really turned it around once it got healthy. And some of those free agent signings we were questioning earlier in the year, granted they're getting older, but they've come to play. And even Dallas Turner looks like he's turning

a corner. So yeah, it's going to be interesting to see what teams, if any, are going to be interested in Flores, not only for a head coaching position, but if this litigation still needs to play out, he maybe can find himself a safe spot. to really, really build another defense and maybe take it deep into the postseason. And then he's the ultimate free agent if that litigation is resolved. Well, I also think, and this is why I'm going to keep bringing up Dallas for him. They have endless dollars and they also have the biggest platform. And finishing in fourth place with the Minnesota Vikings as the defensive coordinator

does not get you a whole lot of run in the national media. finishing in first place next year with a top 15 defense that you've completely overhauled, turned around in your vision with Brian Schottenheimer, who I think has proven to be a pretty good head coach down there. That's going to put you on every single day, Stephen A. Smith is going to be saying, when will Brian Flores? Because have you heard a big voice like Stephen A. Smith or, you know, whoever else, Adam Schaefter, you have not heard them come out and say, hey, this guy should be a head coach. again. But if he starts winning games with Dallas Cowboys who can offer him whatever amount of dollars exists in the United States of America, they can offer him Fort Knox. And if that's the case, then it's going to put you in the limelight to be a head coach again. If you turn around that defense, it'll be one year. If they won the division next year with him as their defensive

coordinator and they were in the top 10, he is a head coach the next season. They will, teams will just say, all right, this man is way too good. He'll get way too much pub. Some owner will say, I'm going to break rank. Or, as you said, Murph, this thing might just get settled. And if it gets settled, then it's gone. It's off the front page. And then he can become a head coach again,

which is going to be his goal. And to that point that too, as well, if one owner is going to go rogue, it would be Jerry Jones. Yeah. Yeah. But this is not even going rogue. This would just be moving him into a defensive coordinator position. But we will see on that. I just, I

I think of what's going to come down to because this organization has been great for Brian Flores. He has really, I mean, gone from a guy who was just helping in Pittsburgh and was on bordering on out of the league to someone who is now sought after. And he played it brilliantly by not signing a contract extension last year to give himself all sorts of options. But if he doesn't come back, you are exactly right, Murph. It is an indictment on where he thinks this team is. That means that maybe the smartest X's and O's guy in the building does not think that this team is headed anywhere where he wants to go. And that would be another body blow to a really brutal last, I don't know, 12 months or so. Randy asks, aren't they better off rolling with McCarthy back out there and maybe he fixes it or maybe they end up with a top five draft pick?

The answer is absolutely yes, Randy. You are absolutely correct. in a theoretical world, and that was my take a couple weeks ago. And it's still my, like, official Purple Insider take is, sorry, live with it. But when the information changes, that was the point from earlier in the show. Then we have to kind of adjust to be realistic because asking them to just roll out with a guy who can't make it through nine games is maybe not fair to the people inside the building that are trying to play to win for next season.

So let me just give you guys one more thing here before we call it an evening. Usually we take a look at what happened over the last week before we sign off. But we would need another couple of hours to do that, I think. After all the craziness of the last week, I would just want you to give me your favorite thing that happened. Favorite game, favorite moments, just most compelling. don't make it favored from a Vikings perspective, but most captivated over the last week as the NFL has cranked up to 100 miles an hour

over the last few days. Mani, where would you like to go with that? I'm going to go with the guy that I mentioned earlier, Drake May and the New England Patriots, man. I mean, just for him to put on that kind of performance and it wasn't perfect, you know, he's, Drake May is not perfect. still young and growing and developing, but he's been really good, and he is, like you said,

you know, the second best odds to win the MVP. He's been fantastic. That team is, you know, they're 12 and 3, and I know people have kind of knocked them for, you know, the soft schedule and all that other stuff, but look, man, 12 and 3 is 12 and 3. And their young quarterback is playing his ass off. He's been fantastic. So I, I don't, there's, there's not going to be anymore Drake May Slander from anybody. I don't want to hear any of that stuff anymore. He's been awesome. They've been awesome.

I tip my hat to Mike Frable on the job that he's done. And Stefan Diggs is really kind of reemerged as still a really viable number one option in the NFL, even at his kind of his older age now. That's what really stood out to me

is that they were down by 11 late in the game and they hadn't really played great up to that point. And they just had the stones, the wherewithal, the coaching, the leadership, the intangibles, all that stuff to come back against a Baltimore team that is fighting for their playoff lives right now with a two-time MVP on the other side of quarterback. And obviously Huntley came in later in the game for Lamar. But that was just really impressive stuff that stood out to me with New England, what they did last night. Real quick, Adrian says

Collar comparing JJ to Lawrence Borough, May, Stafford, Herbert is an all-time low. In order to win the Super Bowl, who do you think you have to beat? Murph, go ahead. Are you asking me with your favorite, your favorite moment? I just, I just wanted to bring that up because I, that's okay. Look, I know that he hasn't played as many games, which is because of his injury history. And I know that those other players, I know those other players have. That's part of the point.

Part of it. But the gap between where you stand right now and the level of the real quarterbacks of the NFL that win games and compete for Super Bowls is so massive. That gulf is so massive. That's the point of comparing it to the quarterbacks who performed yesterday at that level. That when we've been grading on a curve and the curve is over with, there is no more grade on a curve. He's just a kid.

He hasn't played that much, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. I get it. I get why we've done that. I've done that all year right along with you. But I'm done doing that because look at what the quarterbacks of the NFL do that are the best in December that you have to beat. So if you don't believe you can get there, then you have to look at other people. There, I laid it out perfectly for you. Go ahead, Murph on your favorite enjoying football of the last week.

Denial ain't just a river in Egypt, right? I have to say the, I'm happy that I didn't give up on the Bears Packers. game. I was very, very close with two minutes left to just checking out, but I thought I'll just keep an eye on it. And to actually see the conversion of an onside kick, which is a lost art because of safety issues, was quite impressive. Romeo Dobbs, I mean, you're on the hands team for one reason, just make the play. But what it did allow is to keep this game alive. And I'm not necessarily, I don't have a rooting interest against the Packers for the Bears, for the Lions, against the Vikings, whatnot. I'm always there for entertainment. The Bears seem like

that team that has the Golden Horseshoe a bit. And I don't know how long that lasts because you can't sustain playing from behind like that as much as they have. The Vikings learned that in 2022. But the Bears are the team that I want to watch the most in the playoffs because they just seem like a wrecking ball. And they, they're playing free. They're playing, they're playing sort of for themselves and they believe in themselves after last season's just awful meltdown and coaching malpractice. It's been kind of interesting to watch Caleb Williams and Ben Johnson kind of playing this tug of war of who's in charge and who, how much is he going to give the quarterback? How much is Williams going to take from him? How much is he going to go off script? But

Those throws that he made when it mattered at the end of that game, I mean, those are the throws that everybody in Minnesota is craving for J.J. McCarthy to make in those kinds of moments. And I think all the reason that everyone's so much in denial and so much wants that to be the case, they feel like any criticism is kind of putting up a roadblock to that when it's really not. It's just speaking hard truths. And the hard truths are there are three teams, well, at least two teams in the NFC North that seem to be on the quarterback scale up here and the Vikings just can't seem to get out from here. And that's kind of what I'm taking away from the weekend. I will say that, you know, there are plenty examples of quarterbacks who have looked

like and walked up to the edge of bust land and turned around and figured it out or found it. Man, a lot could change in a year. We've certainly found that out this. year. But you mentioned Caleb Williams. And look at that Tyler Dunn article about what happened with them last year and their coaching staff. And then they found the right coach. And they built up the roster and they spent money and their offensive line and their running game and all those things. And they had a coach who actually like really taught Caleb Williams how to play quarterback. And all of a sudden, you're in a different world there 12 months later. And I would say that for Carolina, beating the Tampa Bay Bucks and taking a hold of the reins with the

potential to win their division, where Bryce Young, a couple of different times. It's felt like this thing is over. Bryce Young is not the guy. There were times last year where you wondered about CJ Stroud, and now Stroud has turned it around with a great defense and a little more help offensively, a better offensive coordinator, Trevor Lawrence, has been cooked numerous times. Now, the difference is that some of those guys, Lawrence Stroud, they had peak moments. so you knew it was there, but their organizations had to work through things.

And I've brought up the stat before, though, 10 out of the 14 teams of the playoffs, drafted their quarterback and had to work through some tough times with those quarterbacks. So ultimately, it's way better if you could do that with J.J. McCarthy. The Super Bowl odds right now on Fandul, the Rams plus 450, the Seahawks, plus 600. And then Buffalo and Philadelphia are still the next teams plus 800 plus. 900. Seattle and Los Angeles, one of the most ridiculous games that I've ever seen in my entire life. 20 years from now, go back on YouTube or whatever it will be by then. And I will

definitely be watching that game over again. And the Jacksonville Jaguars, I want to give credit to them for their coach, Liam Cohen, who is another guy from the McVeigh tree, who has designed a great offense for them and has gotten Trevor Lawrence to play as confidently as possible. In that game was a slug fest between Jacksonville and the Denver Broncos wasn't a national TV game, but it was a really, really good contest between those two teams. So a lot to be figured out. We will sit on the sidelines and watch it, which is very frustrating. And especially if McCarthy is not playing in these last two games, it will feel like, you remember I said like the lowest point or whatever when they were four and eight? I don't know if it feels that low if he's not playing,

but it hasn't it hasn't gone back on it had a blip there it was like a dying animal that's like no i'm okay no i'm actually dead and that's what this season has been and i think let's just end on that dead animals dead animals go i want i want you got just complain just because i did it earlier with the show jeremiah surreles this tell me where this ranks manny you're mr history guy for not just disappointing seasons but seasons where you felt like what was that like just what what was any of that there weren't good games it wasn't exciting any tiny flicker of hope turned quickly to frustration what is this compared to for you as far as past viking seasons i think about uh 2013 was really annoying

um the year leslie fraser got fired uh they got out to a terrible start um we we kind of started to realize that christian ponder was not the guy and was not going to be the guy um and things just kind of fell apart and they had that was the that was the offseason in 2013 where they had the three first round picks in the 20s that ended up being Xavier roads cordaro patterson and um who's the defensive tackle from florida that i'm that i'm surey floyd yes um and there was a lot of and they were coming off of a playoff year where adrian ran for 2100 yards and they made the playoffs and so there was a lot of optimism going into 2013 and just everything fell apart it was awful to the point where josh freeman is starting on a monday night game at the meadowlands

of all places ironically um yeah this this kind of feels a lot like that where there's just it's just kind of a calamity of just endless you're just looking around left and right and it's just like come on what now what's the next thing that's going to drive us crazy that's kind of what this feels like 2010 I think is the ultimate sort of like what's the next

ridiculous thing that's going to happen to this team yeah that's that's kind of where I'm at with it this has been a frustrating year man it's been a really trying year Murph Yeah, I think You know, what's 2010 was such a mess Because there were so many things that happened

That was out of their control off the field Weather in general, you know, destroying the stadium But I feel kind of cheated a bit misled I've been saying it throughout the season I think we were sold a lemon I think we were sold a bill of goods that We didn't need Darnold We didn't need Jones.

JJ's our guy. We know he's our guy. We love him. This is why we drafted him. We got the full off season. He's ready to roll. Stam Howl, you know, there's an arm in camp. And next thing you know, it's week to week.

What about JJ? What about JJ? When's he going to be back? How bad was he hurt? When did he get hurt? What happened while he was hurt? What was he doing when he wasn't playing? Where are his mechanics?

What are you going to do about his mechanics? If you can just strip them down to this and it's become exhausting. I mean, that's kind of what I wrote about is he's the only narrative that matters. He's the only really story that matters because everything else, depending on what they do with him, how they proceed in this offseason and what they build around him is all about him. And it's been all about him. And it just doesn't feel like we were really given a real transparent. I think either they miscalculated his durability and his ability to pick up the NFL game quickly or they were unprepared for if things didn't work.

And I think both cases played out. I think we were sold. We were oversold on McCarthy and they were underprepared for what would happen if he couldn't play physically or if his play was so poor, it was impossible to win. that's what I give O'Connell a lot of credit. He has managed a sinking ship for a long time here and still kept it kind of above water. I don't know if that's going to make any difference going forward for him because, you know, so much of this decision is on him. So much of McCarthy's future is tied to hit or his future is tied to McCarthy. So it may not buy him much grace with the Wilts, but if anything, it might be one of his most impressive coaching jobs along with

the quarterback carousel of 2023. Yeah, yeah, I don't know if I would, I don't know if I would go as far as saying it's been impressive. But I think, you know, the way I've thought of it all year, Murph is when you plan a trip and you think, oh, well, we'll just fly at this time and then we'll get a bus and then we'll go there and we'll pick up an Uber and then we'll do this and that and it'll be perfectly fine. And this is where we'll stay and we'll enjoy Bermuda. And instead, your flight gets delayed and the bus isn't real and your Uber driver crashes into a telephone pole. That's been this

year. Like, you can lay out the plans the best you possibly can. But if you give yourself no fallback option whatsoever, this is what you end up with. And sometimes it is just bad luck. but I also think that there was a hubris element to it of we've got all this stuff. We could just coach it up. If we just put our guy there, it'll work out just fine. And I know I get your point about keeping the band together and, you know, not having guys quit. I also think that Brian Flores has won them most of the games that they've won this year. So I don't know.

Yeah. I wanted to answer one more comment because I'm in that mood. Whoever it was said about Caleb Williams that I had brought up in the pre-draud. which, I mean, I guess if you're listening for that long, then I really owe you. Thank you for doing that about talking about how at USC he had problems every time adversity showed up. And then when he came to the NFL, and I brought it up a lot, believe it or not, he had a lot of problems when adversity showed up. And this year, there hasn't been a whole lot of adversity.

His team leads the league in takeaways and he's made some super high-end plays. He's had some frustrating games that he's been bailed out of. I think they have five games where they had less than a 25% chance to win late in the fourth quarter that they've won. So, you know, I mean, I think that those concerns were certainly justified last year and that it has been a magic carpet ride from him. And I'm interested to see where it goes. People change. Information changes. Stuff throws us curveballs that we never, ever expect like a freaking hand injury against the New York Giants.

And we just move forward. with our football talk and again like you said this two years ago okay well a lot's happened since then anyway manny hill brian murphy it's a lot's happened since last freaking week uh we will do it again next monday and we will find out where everything stands with the quarterback situation with the christmas day game against the detroit lines what they're looking at who's playing quarterback for the Green Bay Packers by the time they arrive in the final game of the season. What's left to discuss then? And also, who knows what else could happen. So thank you, gentlemen, for all of your time. And we will talk to you guys next week.

All right. Merry Christmas. Football.