Purple Insider - a Minnesota Vikings and NFL podcast - The Athletic's Alec Lewis does not think Vikings should trade Jonathan Greenard

Episode Date: March 31, 2026

In Phoenix, Arizona, for the NFL Owner's Meetings, Matthew Coller and Alec Lewis of The Athletic talk about Kevin O'Connell's comments on how the Minnesota Vikings will handle their quarterback "competition" and whether the Vikings should trade Jonathan Greenard. Plus Matthew answers questions on whether Jordan Addison's fifth-year option changes the idea of drafting a wide receiver. The Purple Insider podcast is brought to you by FanDuel. Also, check out our sponsor HIMS at https://hims.com/purpleinsider Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See https://pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Hey, everybody. Welcome to another episode of Purple Insider, presented by Fandul. Matthew Collar here inside my hotel room at the NFL owners meetings in Phoenix. First, we're going to bring you a conversation with myself and Alec Lewis, breaking down everything that Kevin O'Connell had to say here at the owner's meetings. And then I'll answer some of your questions now that we've heard from the head coach, the general manager, and the owner. So let's get to that conversation first, and then we'll hear from you after that. Well, I don't think he's gotten enough credit for, you know, playing in rhythm.

You know, some of those plays, we all recognize some of the highlight real ability that he has. And Kyler Murray has always had that level of talent. But I think sometimes what we don't recognize is the third and seven right before the huge scramble play on, you know, on the earned first down. But that third and seven where he, you know, hits McBride away from some tight coverage on a rally, you know, that are maybe similar to some of the things we'll do or, you know, watching him play with really, really good technique and fundamentals, either in the dropback game.

The play action game can be done a lot of different ways, offset gun, pistol, and under center. He's pretty dynamic in the keeper game, the movement game, obviously with his natural athleticism. So, you know, I see a lot of ways that we'll be able to continue the evolution and evolve our offense here in year five. What is this place called? The Biltmore.

We're at the Biltmore here at the NFL owners meetings in Phoenix, Arizona, Matthew Collar, Alec Lewis from The Athletic, and we just got done talking with Kevin O'Connell at the breakfast where all the NFC coaches were talking in a circle, and we got to fire some good questions at Mr. O'Connell. You're going to talk about my breakfast? Well, it was a very underwhelming breakfast. It was unimpressive, but I didn't know that you wanted that to be public, that you only ate three slices of bacon and two melons. It was two cantalopes. Canelopes. Okay. Is that a melon?

That is one type of melon, absolutely. I don't know if people specifically needed the type of melon that you had. It paints the picture more accurately. You know that's what I'm all about. It gave us something to make fun of you about, which there's a long list. Sure. So why don't we dive into what we heard from Kevin O'Connell? I am very interested to hear what you think about his commentary, about the quarterback position,

because I started the thing off by asking him about Kyler Murray and the idea of adjusting the offense to Kyler and it seemed like his thought was I'm not sure you're going to have to adjust it as much as people think like what was your takeaway from his answer about adapting the offense to Kyler because he also didn't say that oh we're not going to do anything when it comes to adding Kyler Murray to the mix yeah I think the point it was a good way to start it off and I think the point that he wanted to make and like made it clear that you know that he wanted to use the

time was like anybody who thinks he can't play in rhythm or can't play from the pocket hasn't watched the tape. So I think that that was where he wanted to start with that conversation in the sense that, like, he believes he can play from the pocket, he can play in rhythm, he can go through progressions. But to your point, that doesn't mean they aren't going to have to adapt in some ways. He mentioned a couple times the idea of shotgun, the offset gun, using the pistol. We've seen some of this in the past. But I think the way that I took his comment was, we believe he can. play within the structure of some of our offense, but we also know that we're going to have to

adapt a little bit, and that he's going to have to adapt a little bit, but there is confidence with Kevin and this offensive staff that they can do that. And so I think that's where, like, if those who are listening to the podcast, you've been saying this probably for months. I think it's something that we've written a lot about in recent weeks. He mentioned, I did think it was important to mention to note that he talked about Kyler being really dynamic and some of the keeper stuff on the move. And so I would not be surprised if we see a lot of that. So it was interesting.

It wasn't anything out of the ordinary, but the point that he started with was you can go through the film and find examples of him playing in the pocket. And that is something that they're pretty convicted about. Yeah. What he said was, you know, when it comes to the idea of like him scrambling and making those plays, that those end up as the highlights most of the time. but on a play-to-play basis, he is routinely converting a third and seven by throwing open his tight end or, you know, playing from the pocket. And you've watched the film.

I've watched the film. We've talked about it quite a bit on the show. Like that is very clearly the case under Jonathan Gannon over the last couple of years that there was a change in how Kyler Murray played. I'm interested in just in general how they're going to manage the quarterback competition. Because I think we would agree that it deserves finger quotes. It's not really in my mind a quarterback competition, but if you're Kevin O'Connell, you can't come out at the owner's meetings and say, hey, you know, J.J. McCarthy, you might as well just pack it up right now because Kyler is our QB1. So he's sort of in his comments here doing this delicate dance of like, yes, we're going to really put a lot of consideration into Kyler Murray being our quarterback. But, you know, hey, JJ's in the building as well. How do you think that he will manage it? And what did you make of when he was asked specifically? about the quarterback competition, how he will manage the spring into the summer with these quarterbacks. Yeah, I think like when you hear, when I, probably the people listen, when you hear

quarterback competition, your mind probably goes to like, what is the rep counts, training camp practices with those guys going back and forth and performing. Like, I think the point that he wanted to make today, and that I think is interesting, is when he talks about quarterback competition right now, it is like wanting to infuse the room with motivation and the belief that like the openness of it, the day-to-day work ethic of it can bring the best out of all the guys in the room. And I think part of why he's talked about the competition is to kind of say that it last year, like there wasn't the motivating fuel behind each player to maximize themselves.

And so they're trying to essentially, like I'd say, spark that motivational fuel within that room more than anything else. And then, yeah, I mean, he made multiple comments today where it was like, you know, I know everyone wants to talk about the reps and everyone wants to chart threats. I mean, here's how I see it and how I expect things to play out. In the spring, it's a lot of routes on there. So you're going to see all three guys, Carson Wentz, Kyler, Mary, J. McCarty, throw into all different receivers and most of them should be present for the offseason workouts.

Then in training camp, I expected to be a lot of first-teen reps for. for Kyler. I expect there to be some first team res for J. Jan McCarthy. Carson Wentz probably proved last year he doesn't need all of those reps to get by and then you just evaluate things from there. But his idea of not going

down the road and naming someone now again is to give that room motivational fuel for these guys to reach their potential because I think that's one of the key characteristics of what he views as quarterback development. The competitiveness, the

high tide lifts all boats like all of that stuff i think he feels as important and that they and it's something they didn't have last year so they're trying to kind of reintroduce a lot of it and as true as that might be i think kailer murray's going to take every single first team rep when we get to training camp i i mean i wouldn't be surprised if there is some element of mixing and matching seven on sevens of course you're not going to have every single rep going justin jefferson from kailer murray but i'm just not really really buying anything that's said that this is a competition between anybody and Kyler Murray. Like he is such an accomplished quarterback.

And I know he doesn't want a Super Bowl and so forth. But I think that for public perception, he needs to have it be, we're pushing everybody. We're trying to get the most out of J.J. McCarthy. But I also don't buy that last year was actually a problem, that there wasn't another quarterback, I mean, Sam Howell, but there wasn't another quarterback pushing J.J. McCarthy. And if you need someone else in the room to push you, then what are we doing here? This is starting quarterback in the NFL. I think that that's something that sort of sounds good and it's convenient that we need these guys to push each other.

But Murray is a proven NFL quarterback who they went out and got for a reason. So they could have him as their starting quarterback. So two things I'm going to say. The first is, you know, to the point you made about like how last year, you know, it was interesting last year when they didn't sign Daniel Jones. and it became Sam Howell. Then by the fall, a lot of the conversation coming from Kevin O'Connell was like, not having the veteran kind of stopgap has allowed him to find his leadership voice and all that. So you got that.

But I'd say, yeah, I mean, Kyler Murray, and again, you say the accomplished quarterback. Like, I want people to go look at the numbers and the amount of passes and wins and games, all this. Like, he is vastly more accomplished than what J.J. McCarty has proven at the NFL level. I would be stunned at this point if he wasn't the starting quarterback come week one. But I do think that the Vikings are going to do everything they can to maximize J.J. McCarthy with where he is right now. Now, it raises the questions of how much can you really maximize guy if he's not having the reps, all this stuff.

But I mean, I think two things. One, it's going to be about him proving that he is consistent every single day in the work habits and the way he shows up in the way he performs all that stuff and then, you know, can he use that time as trial and error for layering passes for, you know, being able to adopt the footwork the right way?

All that stuff's going to be interesting. But yeah, I mean, look, it's a lot of, you know, we want to have the competition. Kyler Murray doesn't come here if he doesn't believe that that he's going to be playing week one. So, yeah. With J.J. McCarthy, the question is asked, you know, about how he's been doing in this offseason.

and you had reported that they were optimistic about his work with John Beck. Sure. I think that's a more credible person to work with than who he was working with before. And I know he's done some work with Beck, but that's somebody who's worked with a lot of really good NFL quarterbacks. And then O'Connell told us that he's been back in the building working with their strength coaches. They're not allowed to be downstairs coaching. I'm sure if they winked across the room, the NFL might not know about it.

But, you know, I'm just saying that he's back in the building. and so forth. But the rest of the commentary on J.J. McCarthy was just very muted. I mean, there wasn't really a statement of, like, we think he's taking this next big step. We're really excited about X, Y, and Z. It was like, yep, he's back and he's there. I thought some of the more interesting was probably about Carson Wentz, because when they signed Wentz back, I thought the entire reason you do this is because you've gotten to QB3 twice

and four years. So having a QB3 might actually be. a little bit of a hack if you're a competitive team with how often quarterbacks get hurt. I got the impression from O'Connell that Wents is here to break glass in case of emergency. And also, he just really likes him. Like he likes his knowledge of the offense, how quickly he picked it up. He likes his experience, all that sort of stuff. But there's no real discussion of Carson Wence, like being in this conversation.

Now, he might win quarterback too. I think if we're talking about a competition, it's probably QB2. that I could see Carson Wins winning that position. Yeah, I mean, a couple things on that. The first, the JJ, the optimism, I mean, you really can't, with J.J. McCarthy, you've seen a lot of positives on the practice field for multiple years now. And it's really like until he's been in the fire and had to make decisions on the fly, and that stuff has gone poorly or great, like that's really, I mean,

that's where you can establish the most evaluation from what he is. And again, that does bring the conversation of like, well, if he's not playing, then what do things look like? As far as Carson wins, I mean, yeah, like it felt to me when he was signed, everybody wanted to be this referendum on J.J. McCarthy and everything. And I get it in some fashion. But I'd also say, to your point, like, they have had to turn to the third quarterback twice in the last four years when they've done it. It's been guys that they don't have a ton of respect and not respect. excuse me, it's a trust and belief in that those guys can really go out there and shine. So Carson, and Carson's smart.

Carson knows that Kyler Murray has played 17 games once in the last five years, and J.J. McCarthy has only started 10 games. So what is the probability and likelihood that there are two injuries and that he is going to have to step in if that's how the depth chart looks? Like, it's probably fairly likely. So, like, I think that's the one thing with Kyler Murray that I don't know how much you've talked about in your show, but I do think is really important. Just like last year, I thought it was important to talk about the signings of Jonathan Allen and J. Von Hargrave and Ryan Kelly. It could be good with their talent, but the injury risk and the lack of, like,

consistent being on the field is something that has to be discussed. It's really important to talk about. So that's kind of the vein that I view Carson Wentz in. It definitely has to be considered when you're thinking about bringing in a QB3, and you actually can't do much better than Carson Wentz for or a QB3 because almost all of them are undrafted free agents or late round picks or something around the league. I think it just so happens that this really works for him. Like he's from relatively here. He grew up a Vikings fan if you haven't heard that before.

And the building, you know this. I mean, everybody who comes into this building and works with O'Connell and works with Josh McCown, who he's very close with, they end up enjoying that experience. And I also think if you're Wentz, you're probably saying, who is it that gets to play when the starter goes down, is it the person with more talent at the moment or the person they trust more? And I think the person they trust more as of right now. Now, that's where JJ has to prove. He has to prove he can actually be trusted to run the entire offense, not a truncated version of it,

where you're jumping offside or you're trying not to false start eight times in a game with too many motions or whatever. Right? Like he, what comes through loud and clear is Carson could run my offense. And that's what I want for somebody if Kyler were to go down. I want to, I want to shift gears, though, because I want to ask you about the Jonathan Grinard situation where when Schaefter puts it out there, I think all of us are like, dude, he's getting traded.

But now my read on that situation is when by the time we've reached Schaefter tweeting it out, they've probably already done their attempt, their first wave of trying to get someone to trade for Jonathan Grenard. And that is a bat signal to anybody who may have not noticed that they're trying to trade Jonathan Grenard. Hey guys, we are still open for business. But I have been told day three picks are being thrown at them and not anything of substance for Grenard. Because if you are on the other side of that, a new contract is what he wants, didn't have the sack production. for last year. He also is coming off of an injury that sounded from what O'Connell said

might limit him in the spring. That doesn't seem like something you trade a second round draft pick for if you are on the other side of that. If you just take the player of Jonathan Gurdardt and the production, it's pretty clear how great of a talent he is and it's not

easy to find that level production at edge rusher, regardless of the sack production, regardless of injury. Usually teams that are competitive and contending want to acquire players like that. The complication comes with the contract. He, at this current value, there probably would be teams willing to trade some great stuff for, but part of the reason that Schaefter tweet exists is because he and Drew Rosenhouse's

agent are pursuing an increase in contract, and the Vikings haven't been willing to do that and go down that road to that ultimate degree to this point. And so being malleable with the player and the agent, the Vikings are like, look, if you can get what you want from another team and that other team is willing to pay us in draft capital, but what we feel like is worthy of asking for, then we'll listen. Other than that, like we want to keep this guy we think is really valuable and important into our defense. And if that ultimately does happen, if, you know, Drew Rosen, now Jonathan Grenard, can't

find another team that's willing to trade the draft capital and pay him, then we'll see what happens as far as later in the spring, later in the summer, to, you know, training camp, can they come to terms on some type of, you know, deal that makes sense for both sides? I think, like, that's the path that you're looking to go down unless there is a team like a Philadelphia or like an Indianapolis that just decides, like, you know what, this is our, we couldn't get our guy in the draft, this is our best option, so let's swing for it right now. That's kind of the nature at which I feel the situation is when the tweet first comes out, everyone thinks, oh, it's really imminent. But the contract.

and the reworked contract has been a big hurdle for the biggest hurdle for other teams and conversations that I've had, just like it was the hurdle here that led to the idea of trading him even coming to fruition in the first place. Let me ask you a tough question here, because sharing your reporting versus your opinion is the thing on the Alec Lewis show that you got to navigate it. Most tilted toward reporting, whereas the Purple Insiders a little different. What is your opinion? Do you think that they should?

Will they? We don't know yet, will they? But do you think that they should trade Jonathan Granard? No, I don't. I don't think they should trade Jonathan Grinard unless you can get a first round pick, which I don't expect them to be able to get. So I just think, again, the SAC production in 2025 is what it is. But you look at all of the advanced metrics, and I like doing that, and I also like watching the film. And you look at pass rush win rate, you look at quick pressure rate, run, stop rate. All of those numbers were higher than they were in 2020. I also think, yes, did Dallas Turner take a big step over the back half of the 2025 season? Absolutely he did. Can't wait to see how he builds on that in 2026. But to expect him to have the level of production Jonathan Granard has is lofty.

And I do think it's important on a defense where the only other, you know, besides Andrew Van Ginkle, the only other reliable defensive lineman right now is Jalen Redman. And so I just think he's too important to this defense. and this defense is too important to being competitive to move him for anything other than something real premium. So that's where I'm at. What is your thought? So the minute that they got Kyler Murray, my thought was you really should not trade Jonathan Grenard because what you're trying to do here is win. And if you had gone and gotten, say, I don't know, Marcus Marietta, and then really the story is you're trying to find out what J.J. McCarthy is and thinking,

a little bit now and later. Well, from a now and later perspective, it makes total sense to trade Jonathan and Grenard because you get the cap space, you get the draft capital. We all agree this team has to be rebuilt through the draft. No doubt.

Rob Brzynski said it at the Combine. You can't just keep doing it this way where you have to luck into a Grinard Van Ginkle. Stefan Gilmore shows up and plays really well. Shack Griffin. They hit the home run of all home runs in one year to build much faster than you thought. But that doesn't happen all the time as we learned from last year.

So yes, it does make sense to get more draft capital, be in a better cap space situation down the road. But when you have this group altogether, when you've kept T.J. Hawkinson, when you've kept Aaron Jones, they have not really gone full into, hey, the future is what we're looking at. It has been very minor as it pertains to that. It's like, oh, a couple of defensive tackles that you couldn't really pay anyway. I mean, that's not a, we're going to really truly look toward the future. If they had gotten rid of T.J. Hawkinson, if they had gotten rid of Aaron Jones, then I would have said, yeah, I mean, they're on to 2007 and beyond. If they had gotten a mediocre fill-in quarterback, that's not what they did. They went and got someone who's had seasons in his career where he's every bit as good as Jordan Love, every bit as good as Jared Gough, or what Caleb Williams was last year, he can have those seasons.

So if you're going to roll the dice and say, we got a quarterback, It's top 15 that if it really clicks, you can actually win. Do you want to be going into the trade deadline saying, oh, man, now we have to trade a second round pick to go get somebody else's pass rusher? You're robbing Peter DePay Paul in that situation. Why not see by the deadline where you're at? If Kyler Murray gets hurt week one and they play Carson Wentz and you're two and five at the deadline, well, then sure, trade Jonathan Grenard. It's not the last day that you can possibly do this, but I think you need them to win. I agree with, you know, of course I agree with the metrics.

I think last year was a lot of bad luck when it came to the sacks, but it does hurt how much a team would trade for him. So if you're not going to get the value, then just keep him, do everything you can to win right now and see how it plays out. I think like there's a couple things for me, you know, people are always like, you know, trade this guy, get a third round pick. I'm like, do you recognize the probability of hitting on a third round pick? it is like a 30% chance proposition that you hit on a starter in the third round. Right. So, and Howie Roseman says this all the time.

Like, we're not in the business of trading really good players away. And Jonathan Gernard is a really good player. I mean, he is. Now, just like with Kyler, like the injury stuff with him has been a frequent theme within his career. Finishing, like, as much as I just mentioned the advanced production, there's probably people here talking about how he didn't finish sacks. That is an important thing to talk about for 2026. But I think everything you said there is correct. If you were going to, like I think they've kind of with this offseason straddled the line in some ways of like we just like they typically do under this ownership is like we want to be competitive enough to get in the playoffs every year.

But this off season, they also don't want to hamstring anything out in front of them. If they have to pay, let's say Kyler is a phenomenon of year. They want to pay Kyler. If they don't want to pay Kyler, but they draft a bunch of guys and need to fill holes with free agents, they can do that. Like, they have flexibility in the future, but part of the getting in the dance for 2026 includes having a Brian Flores defense that has been as good or close to as good as it's been. And I'm not sure you can do that if you don't have a guy like Jonathan Grenard in the mix. So again, like it's going to be interesting to see if we get to training camp, have they reworked the deal? are they going to? What does that look like? I mean, I think, you know, it's, it's, it's, um, something

we'll probably monitor through the draft and then beyond, excuse me, beyond that. Folks, as you know, Purple Insider is always growing and changing and I'm looking to take steps forward in 2026, just like your business. Now, I'm lucky to have a great crew, but as a business owner, I am well aware of the challenges of trying to find quality people to add to the roster. So if you're hiring for your company in 2020, Let me give you a little advice. Check out ZipRecruiter with new goals in 2026. You may be looking to add to your squad. And thankfully, there's a place that you can go to help conquer these challenges and achieve your hiring goals.

And right now, you can try ZipRecruiter free at ZipRecruiter.com slash audio. This is not some run-of-the-mill job website, my friends. They have tools and data that separates them from the pack. ZipRecruiter's matching technology works fast to find top talent. so you don't have to waste your time and money. And you can find out right away how many job seekers in your area are qualified for your role. Let ZipRecruiter help you find the best people for all of your roles. Four out of five employers who post on ZipRecruiter, find a quality candidate within the first day.

See for yourself. Just go to the exclusive web address, ZipRecruiter, and try it for free. ZipRecruiter.com slash audio. that is ziprecruiter.com slash audio. ZipRecruiter, the smartest way to hire. All right. We got to go do some stuff. What other subject would you like to hit on?

We got a draft. Oh, okay, the draft. All right. Like, I just think this is a fascinating one for me. So what do you do at 18 and then all the positions you need? How do you hire hierarchy? Like, which ones are the most important? Which one are you spending number 49 on number, you know, like I think the draft

me is really interesting. This one's really interesting. It's also interesting because it's being run by a general manager who's not yet officially the general manager, which I don't know what's happened before. And Rob Brasinski deserves all the trust. He's been in a hundred draft rooms. He's seen it all. He's going to every draft meeting since he's been with the team. And I did joke with him at the combine like, hey, as long as you make the pick, then it's better than what happened with I'm sure he loved that. They got Kevin Williams out of it. All's well that ends well with missing the draft pick. But as long as you get that in there, then you're going to be fine. But I see it's like there's been this one opinion on who they should draft.

It's crazy to me. Which is crazy. I mean, I started adding it up. Vikings.com did a good recap of all the mock drafts. And it was like 80% had one player, Dylan Thineman, from Oregon. And I just don't see it that way. And I said to you after they talked about Darisaw today and where he's at, and it was, it wasn't inspiring. It certainly was, like, like not sound the alarms, like this is a big problem. But it also wasn't like, hey, you're crazy for asking this question. You know, he's going to be perfectly fine forever for the rest of his career. It's sent up a flare to me that if you picked edge rusher, it makes sense. If you picked offensive tackle, it makes sense with even they haven't extended Brian O'Neill yet. If you pick

wide receiver, I have and will continue to make a case for wide receiver once again. It's your favorite case to make. Because it's right. It's like the attorney that like is just a bread and butter case. And it's their go to. Certain people made other cases for other quarterbacks outside of Kyler Murray. I stuck to that. No. But I could see so many different positions making sense. And this might be the first time in a very long time that you draft for 2027 and not right away immediate. This is what we absolutely must have right now. Well, it's funny because someone asked me the other day, like what is the deepest position? group on their roster and what is the thinnest position group on their roster? I was like, man, the deepest might be quarterback with what they've done, which is, I mean, it would speak to the strategy being executed because that's what they wanted to do. But like thin, you could talk about,

well, T.J. Hawkinson is the final year of his deal. So tight in. You could talk about defensive tackle. Jalen Redmond, Levi, Drake Rodriguez, Teryon, Ingram Dawkins, Elijah Williams. All those guys might have upside, but like, I don't know. None of them were really highly selected plays. A cornerback, we could always talk about. Safety. What are you going to do at safety? Jay Ward will probably have a bigger role, but I mean, you know, again, receiver. Lose Jalen Naylor, Ty Felton, you might have some optimism in, but you probably need receiver. Running back. Aaron Joe, I mean, like, you can literally go down the whole roster. So for me, again, like last year at 18, there was a lot of safety mocks. You'd saw a lot of Eam and Worry. And for, I felt really the whole time, like, guard made sense. Interior offensive line. made sense. And so with this one, and really compared to even the last three years probably, and I've only been covering the teams of 2022, like this, I think it's been the hardest for me to really peg. And I think that is because it would be sensible to go all different routes. And that makes it interesting to me. I mean, if Spencer Fano dropped to the Vikings, I think you just have

to take him. I haven't ripped the tackle tape yet. I think you have to. I might. Like Francis Mauano or something, I'm going to be, but no, like, even, you could even argue, like, the Penn State guard. Yeah. Everyone loves that guy. If he falls to 18, you could argue, like, Will Fries, you know, the year in 2025 was, was up and down. He played every game.

But, like, you could argue maybe you replaced that. You could draft a guard and move him to center. Like, there's a lot of possibilities. And so that, I mean, I just think, I think it's very, I keep saying it. It's fascinating to me whether it should be or not. Well, when you try to make an argument for Guard, you could say that Will Fries' contract really only runs through next year. I mean, what it looks like on paper, five years, whatever huge amount, that is just not what it really looks like. When we look at the actual guarantees, what it would cost to move on, the dead cap, it's really much more of a, if he doesn't play well in 2026, which I thought he was fine this year.

It wasn't $18 million a year worth. but the cap hit goes way up and you end up with a scenario where that does make sense. And that's my point about if you look one year into the future at almost any position, then you can make this argument hands down. Especially, I mean, okay, make fun of me for wide receiver, but like we don't know what they want to do with Jordan Addison. And that was a question we, you know, might be able to ask it a different time. But yeah, like we don't have that answer.

And losing Naylor, it matters for the immediate. So I feel like this is the most wide open. and yet, well, as fit, go ahead. No, I'll say this. Like, as far as the guard thing, I think, like, that would be pretty low on my list. But, again, if a great player falls, that would be hard to pass up. But I, I would be pretty surprised if they don't come away from the 2025 draft with a center. 26.

With the receiver. 2026, excuse me. I mean, we're going through. It's hot out. Receiver, center, potentially a running back. I think they got to have a running back. What other position? Defensive tackle I would be pretty surprised by and then safety probably.

And then you're just talking about like what are the best players we can get at each range? And I think that's how you go about it. I mean, I know this about me. I've written about it in the past. Like I love trade downs because I think the probabilities just go up, the more bullets you have to fire. So I know it didn't work in 2022 and Quasito Fomintza traded down way too much for not enough, but in return, but like if the Vikings traded down from 18 to 25, picked up another day two pick, we're able to get all these positions that you need.

Like, I'm not in, I don't hate that strategy at all. Peep fans might, but that's kind of my view of it. I feel they almost have to if the offers are there. That is the trouble with this draft, though. Like, is there a player? But look, how it goes every single draft is someone drops and we don't know who it's going to be. We don't know why it's going to be.

there was uh was it will johnson who was supposed to be a top 15 pick last year michigan corner we didn't know that he had an issue with medical situation he drops into the second round like there can always be scenarios that play out i think that acquiring as much draft capital as possible my you shouldn't be scared off by it's like oh don't draft another player from georgia ever because that guy didn't work out like you just can't no you can't deal with oh a failure of the past it's like blackjack if you hit on uh 14 or something and and went busts you're never going to hit again on 14? Like, come on, you can't play it that way.

And I'm not always Mr. Data Analytical guy. Sometimes I am. Sometimes I'm not. But, like, I, the probability, you get, I think everyone gets so caught up in the emotions of the draft. But, like, you have to be very realistic of, like, what are the probabilities of these things? And I think, like, I think you also have to talk about two things.

One, where have the Vikings been best at developing players and which coaches are the best of developing players because that's that's the other component of this that I think often goes way under discussed. The draft process is a two-prong thing. It is selection and then development. And I think focusing, we focus always on the selection, but I think the part of this draft is going to have to be how do they maximize these players that they bring in. And again, it's not maybe the most headline generating subject, but I'm not sure we talk about it enough. And some of the best staffs in all sports at all levels. Like they maximize development.

So it's something, you know, I think we should talk about. Alec Lewis, we're inside the owner's meetings at the Biltmore. It's beautiful. We got like a rose garden right here. I mean, it's Mark Davis was walking by, the Raiders owner, like in a, he just worked out or something. I mean, I got bothered by that. We were, we were just doing our little type in right next to Drew Rosenhouse.

and this is kind of weird. It's a weird scenario. It's almost like a fever dream where you're, we're doing the same things we always do. Just like going, reporting, writing on our little laptops, doing a podcast.

And then just like McVeigh walks by. And you're like, wait, is, I don't know. Everybody's here. I was just talking to Jordan Rodriguez, my colleague,

and she's like, oh, introduced me to this woman. I'm like, who was that? Less needs wife. Okay. Like,

that's just how it kind of goes. So it's fun. It's relaxed time of year. It's good. I think, again, this draft cycle is interesting. And I'm fascinated. Like the fan perspective has been interesting to me too.

So the Dylan Dinaman, either everyone knows that the Vikings are going to do something or everyone's just doing it because everyone else is doing it. And I would probably lean towards the latter being the case. This time last year, I think a safety was probably the most mocked position, and that's not where they went. But if you're not drafting for direct need or you directly need almost everything, then it opens the door a lot wider. Thank you for your perspective, sir.

And we'll see you back in Minnesota. Looking forward to it. It's golf season, almost. Football. Folks just wanted to pause real quick and point out that over on Fanduil, there are a bunch of new options for the NFL draft, including odds all the way through pick number six. One stuck out to me, though,

there is odds for a team to draft quarterback Ty Simpson. And the Minnesota Vikings are listed at plus 1900. That is the six. highest odds to draft Ty Simpson. So here is the Fandul question of the day. At what point in the draft would it make actual sense for the Vikings to pick Ty Simpson? Remember, we've seen a lot of quarterbacks that aren't drafted exactly where draft analysts

think they're going to go. So at what point in the draft, would it just make too much sense for the Vikings to take Ty Simpson? That's our Fandual question of the day. Now back to the show. Folks, have you noticed that social media has now been around long? enough to the point where you can see old posts of yourself only with a better hairline. Well, unless you're one of those genetically gifted few people with amazing hair for life,

you're probably dealing with that pang of frustration that comes along with seeing your old self. I have been there, but it doesn't have to be that way. These aren't the old days where there were no good answers for hair loss. These days, we've got hymns. They make it so simple for you with a 100% online access to personalized treatment plans that put your goals first. They use doctor-trusted, clinically proven ingredients like finestried and monoxidil

that stop further hair loss and regrow hair within three to six months. For simple online access to personalized and affordable care for hair loss, ED, weight loss, and more. Visit hymns.com slash purple insider. That is hymns.com slash purple insider for your free online visit, Hems.com slash purple.

Insider. Individual results may vary based on studies of topical and oral monoxide and finestriide. Feature products include compound drug products, which the FDA does not approve or verify for safety effectiveness or quality. Prescription required. See website for details, restrictions and important safety information. All right, before we wrap up here from Phoenix and I fly back to Minnesota, let me answer a couple of questions that were sent to me on Twitter about the Vikings following our discussions with the head coach, the GM, and the owner. So, uh, Maz sends this one in. Let's say hypothetically, and unfortunately, they aren't considering a pass catcher at number

18 and Thineman is gone and Banks is medically off their board. No trade down to be had. Gut call who's the pick? So after talking with Rob Brzynski, it's, it feels so wide open. It feels like there are many different positions that they could consider. and, of course, you know, the trade down, you mentioned not being an option. It feels like if their first couple of guys are off the board and they're not taking our pass catcher that we want, then that would be something that they'd be looking into.

But since that's your stipulation, I ran a draft sim just before trying to answer this to see who was on the board. And a couple of names that pop up, Jermad McCoy is one. I mean, Corner makes a lot of sense for this team. Because when you look one year down the road and it stuck out to me, how often Rob Brzezinski mentioned 2027 as being a factor in their thinking, sure, they have Byron Murphy Jr. and Isaiah Rogers right now. Do they have them in 2007? I mean, if Byron Murphy Jr. plays the same way that he did this year, then that cap hit is going to be pretty hard to justify.

And with Isaiah Rogers, he's going to be a free agent. If he puts together a similar performance, then he's going to go elsewhere and get a pretty big contract, I would expect. Now, they might be able to extend him, but that's always a possibility of losing him in free agency if he has another good season. So cornerback is a now and later type of position where you could certainly use another one for depth. I don't think James Pierre at age 29 and having never played 400 snaps of defense is going to keep you from taking a first round corner if you like that player. Avion Trell is also another one. Colton Hood is another one that could be mentioned. So at least several guys in that ballpark. If they like one of them in particular, you could have a training year for that

guy or their depth. I mean, who knows with corners, they do get hurt a lot, even though they've had some good luck in that area over the last couple years. You never know, right? So if someone gets hurt, then you're throwing in the rookie right away. So it's automatic depth and then longer term. Normally, when it comes to corners, it's like a lot of other positions, but you can find them for sure it will cost you in free agency, but can you find the great ones? Can you find the guys that you have for eight or nine years? I think that's a lot harder. Usually those do come at the top of the draft. I know, like shocker, right? The best players are at the top of the draft, but corners are another position where teams rarely let them hit the market. Every once in a while, you'll see

Jaylon Ramsey or even this Trent McDuffie. It was a deal that they couldn't turn down the Kansas City Chiefs, but it took a lot to pry him away from Kansas City. So it's almost getting to be a little bit like that wide receiver discussion of it's hard to find the really good ones. You can find a lot of average ones, which is not true for wide receiver, but you cannot find the good ones unless you draft them. So I would go probably with Germad McCoy out of Tennessee missed last year, but is a really, really good athlete, very physical. Seems like he would be a fit for Brian Flores. But man, the number of options here, especially when we start to look down the road a little, would they think about a tackle? Would they think about a T.J. Parker, the edge rusher out of Clemson, if he were available, or a Cassius Howell, if he were available.

I also think, you know, Peter Woods, the defensive tackle from Clemson is very interesting here as well. I mean, this feels like I could go on with five, six, seven different guys, which is why trade down is such a reasonable option. but it's a great question because this is probably the first year that, I mean, in a long time, where you could look at the draft board and you can't really whittle it down to, hey, they're either going to go with this position or that position. I think we had that last year with guard or safety. Those are the ways they're going. This year, I don't know about that.

And I don't think that you spend the 18th overall pick on Emmanuel McNeil Warren. I think that's much more of a second round type of decision. So I did not really definitively answer your question, but I think Corner would be the way I would be thinking with that. Graham sends this in, what's the score with Demetrius Washington and Ryan Grigsen following Quasi's departure? Will there be a shake-up in the Vikings' scouting department? I think this is one of the biggest questions facing the Wilf's

as they make this decision at General Manager. If they haven't already decided to go with Rob Brzezinski and then this is sort of a, you know, I mean, I think it's a real. GM search. But if they ultimately land on, we're comfortable with Rob Bersinski, they're going to talk to a lot of different people, I would imagine, and cast a wide net. And if I'm a candidate, so let's just say that they're not going to go with Bersinski, they're going to go with an outside candidate. And they're telling me, hey, we love you. We want you to be our GM, but we really want you to keep a lot of our people in place. Now, Washington and Grigsend, that I don't know, it might depend

on how they're viewed internally. If they're viewed as important people internally to the process, then they might stay despite the fact that Quasi did bring those guys in. But if you're a new general manager, I think one of the things that you want more than anything is let me bring in my guys. And if it's an experienced person who's been in the league for a long time and has been at a high position for a long time, they're going to have people that they are comfortable with, scouting wise, personnel wise, that they want to put in those certain positions. I mean, think about the Denver Broncos when George Payton got hired. He took some people from Minnesota out to Denver with him.

That's how it usually works. The fact of the matter was, Quasi Adolph-Felmenza didn't have a lot of people. I mean, he was in San Francisco. They're going to keep their people. He was in Cleveland for a fairly short time. And then he brings Grigsin with him. But it wasn't like he brought this army that he had built over 50, years in a high position in the NFL with him that he had picked up in a lot of different spots.

And he was hired to come in and it seemed keep the same group. And if that's going to be the case with what they want from the next general manager, then I don't know where these two stand. Maybe they're highly regarded internally and they'll stay. If they are saying, hey, you have carte blanche to pick whoever you want for the front office. We'll revamp it if you want to. I wouldn't mind that. I mean, I think you want to give your new general manager as much power as they can and also not have to win over a bunch of new people, but rather come in with backing in their front office from the people that they are hiring.

Or maybe there's kind of a mix and a mash. When it comes to the scouting department in general, I always get a little bit itchy when I talk about that because I think that there's a little bit of a maybe misunderstanding about how the scouting works. oh, they failed on this many draft picks recently. There's no doubt that they did. And we've talked about that a lot. So they must have a problem with scouting, right? I don't think that that's actually necessarily the case. Now, it might be, but I don't think that it necessarily has to be because the scouts,

they go out and they gather information. And they are looking for things that they're directed to look for from their coaches and their general managers. So here is your directive. Here's what you're supposed to go out and look for. and find and get background information and gather and gather. Some scouts have joked that they're private investigators as much as they are talent evaluators.

And then you bring that information back to your coaches and your general manager. And they're the ones that make the decision. So you could have the best scouts in the world and they could scout 50 potential first round draft picks and you still end up coming out with Lewesene because someone at the end of the day makes that decision. That's why I always brush back a little bit on, well, do they need a new scouting department? I honestly don't really know. Is it possible?

Yes. But is the recent draft record an exact correlation to you must not have good scouts? That I would not exactly say. But this goes to if you have a general manager who does things a certain way and wants certain information from scouts, it might be easier to bring in some of your own people rather than, you know, than trying to teach the old dog's new tricks, which I think Quasi Adafo Menza was put in a disadvantage by having to do that when he got here. So I don't know how it's going to go. There might be no change at all. And it might be Rob Brzezinski.

There might be a whole new front office that we see pretty soon. This question comes from Matt, says, does the Vikings picking up Addison's fifth year option affect the odds of them taking a wide receiver in the first round? Is the train running out of steam? Yes. I mean, I think that the odds of them totally agreeing with me on the first round wide receiver were about as high as they were last year because they have Justin Jefferson and at least for now the next two years are guaranteed of Jordan Addison with his fifth year option. I mean, I guess nothing's actually guaranteed because they picked up if I, let's see, I'm trying to, oh, George Pickens was a second round draft pick, but after, so they didn't have a

fifth year option, but the Steelers traded him before his contract. was up. So we have seen this where, you know, the Vikings could always trade Jordan Addison if they weren't comfortable with where things stand. I would also argue, and I look at what the Tampa Bay Bucks did in drafting Amika Igbuka, that, you know, sometimes you can't always anticipate what's going to happen next down the road. But more weapons is better for your quarterback. I'll continue to argue that. And having a weapon who's even a number three guy that catches 50 passes, who costs you $4 million, sounds like a great idea to me for a first round draft pick, and that's someone who will enhance your quarterback for many years to come.

You also can't guarantee, and I know this would have to be a total meltdown, everything else, but you can't guarantee that Justin Jefferson is totally happy with how things are going at the end of next year either. They probably won't think of it that way. They'll likely only draft a receiver when they need it down the road. But giving Addison a contract extension, that I think is. is something they cannot do. Fifth-year option made a lot of sense one way or the other because you pick up Jordan Edison's fifth-year option. It guarantees you that he's going to have a very

reasonable price. And imagine if things go great for him. And he catches 85 passes for, I don't know, 1,200 yards. Well, instead of having to pay him $30 million right away, you get to pay him 17 to 20, whatever it's going to be for that fifth-year option, they're, they're pretend. protecting themselves in that way and pushing a decision a little bit down the road. I get it. But yes, I think to your question, the dream is probably dead, but it's only dead for the first round. Second round does feel like linebackers, maybe a running back if Judarian Price ends up there, center. I guess if they really, really love one of these guys in the second round, it seems like they're going up and down in terms of their projections. Now it feels like most of the centers are

being projected into the third round. But I think that wide receiver is going to happen because when you look at the roster right now, Ty Felton, a lot of you have questions about Felton. I do too. I think he has exciting speed and playmaking ability, but we just don't know yet. And we didn't know yet on KJ. Osborne. We didn't know yet on Jalen Naylor. And both of those guys turned out to be very good wide receivers. The case could be true for Felton or if they're not that confident, they might or even if you are confident, you should just draft another one anyway in the third round because this receiving class, I think, has a lot of guys into the third round. Like, we might see a receiver like Zachariah Branch, for example, very explosive wide receiver

from Georgia. We might see him slip through the cracks or Skyler Bell from Connecticut might slip through the cracks. There's going to be one or two that end up, and I'm remembering Amunra's St. Brown being a fourth round pick of a lot of people were projecting him higher. and it just nobody took them and it worked out. So that might be what they do here. I think wide receiver should be on the docket, but when we start to go through these needs,

defensive tackles a little bit more desperate right now. Center, I think you want to have somebody to train for an entire year. We just talked about cornerback. We've looked at the safety position. Running back is something that, you know, they might take in day two. I think I almost have to take in day two. So where does wide receiver fit into that? do they have a plan for wide receiver three?

We saw the Vikings for years get away with Thielen and Diggs and not really have a wide receiver three option, but can they do that now in this offense and they don't have a fullback at the moment, huge factor in their potential success, but they don't have a, you know, a fullback, like what, how it's going to play out will be very interesting of where you add a receiver because I do think that it's necessary even if they signed somebody like DeAndre Hopkins. One more from Rob says, I do believe that Kyler Murray can run an offense that will be much better than last year. In the 10 to 15 range, however, I have real concerns about Cashman, Van Ginkle, Wilson, all being critical to the success of the defense,

and the first two always missed time in a given year, talking about Cashman and Van Ginkle. They are all over or near 30. If there is regression, no matter how much of a wizard Brian Flores is, the defense will take a step back. is this really a roster that can compete in the NFC? Even a great draft won't really bear fruit until 2027 or 2028. Well, a great draft might, it might not bear its full fruit, but you might get players who are contributing. So, for example, 2015 they draft, and I know I go to the best draft they had in 20 years or whatever,

but just for example, you know, they draft Eric Hendricks, they draft Stefan Diggs, and those guys contribute right away. They weren't the full versions of themselves. So I think that you can get contributors right away on the defensive side. Even Dallas Turner, for as little as he played, still had a couple of key plays as a depth player in 2024. But to your point, it does feel like, yeah, they are teetering or rickety on the defensive side because of the age, because of the injury history of some of these players, that you are one injury away. But I would also look around the NFC North and say that the same thing is kind of true for a lot of other teams, the NFC North.

It's definitely true for the defense of Chicago that didn't improve anywhere near as much as I thought it was going to. And Green Bay, I mean, they lost Micah Parsons and fell completely apart. They're not even starting next season more than likely with him. And on the defensive side of the Lions, it feels like every year they lose half their team to injuries. I do agree, though, in terms of being a legitimate, serious. Super Bowl contender, they're going to have to have great injury luck unless they can find a handful of players. But here's what I would maybe compare it to is in a worst case scenario, it might look like it did in 2023. When you go back through that 2023 roster and look at

some of the players that they were playing a fairly significant amount of time, you'd kind of go, wait a minute, that defense was pretty good, actually. It was not great, but it was pretty good. and if you can be in the ballpark of a top 10 offense and in the ballpark of a top 10 defense, that puts you in the conversation. I think you need better than that on one side of the ball, if not both, to be a serious Super Bowl contender. But last year, I mean, they were in games where they had lost a lot of their players. I think the depth is even a little more shallow this year and your point is correct. But Flores has always seemed to find a way to hang in there, to give his team a chance.

and you might have a meltdown game like they did against the Chargers. But overall, even when they had a rough go at it early in the season with all the injuries, they were still pretty competitive on defense and needed some help on the offensive side. It is a little bit of putting that trust in or faith in Brian Flores that he can figure out some ways to get the most out of some guys to squeeze on the scheme. And then when they play great quarterbacks, it'll probably collapse. I mean, that's just the reality. if you end up with injuries.

But we've sort of run to the point in this roster build that this is how it has to be. I mean, they've stacked up these players who are veterans. Some of them do have injury histories. And now you're at a point where this is it for this group. And I think it really speaks to 2027 beyond why they need to stack draft capital, why they need to find younger players and have a future plan because you're right that some of those guys might not be here longer. term. So is it a concern? Oh, yeah. I mean, it's absolutely a concern. But I also, when it comes to

talking about injuries in March and April, I just always have a tough time with that because, well, you know, we don't have depth. I don't know who really does. I don't know what team has tons of great depth that they're rolling out there on a week-to-week basis. As of right now, with the starters, I think this is a top 10 defense. Can they add some contributors somewhere, maybe in June or wherever else that could beef it up a little bit more. But I think as long as they have most of the core players that they've had these last couple years, we can project them to be pretty good. It's just what degree of good is the big question. One more that I got. Let me see here. This was from Wakaba. Sorry if I'm pronouncing that wrong. Interested to hear some of your thoughts

on the latest PFF news. So as you guys know, I wrote the book, Football. is a numbers game, which was about the history of pro football focus. And feel free to get it on Amazon. And it came out on, well, at the owner's meetings on Monday, that PFF is selling its data side, data collection side, which is the side that works with NFL teams to a company called TeamWorks. And Aref Hassan reported it was somewhere in the range of $100 million or something in that ballpark. And they also laid off a lot of the people on their content side that you might know. And it's unclear exactly what is going to happen to the side that puts out the premium statistics that we use so much and all that data that we discovered that

Kyler Murray actually was under center quite a bit. And, you know, things like that, right? So it's unclear what's going to happen to that. And a lot of people, unfortunately, lost their jobs. In my book, I laid out the potential track for this to happen, and it's a complicated road that it took to get to this point where PFF was selling and where people were losing their jobs and things like that. I would just say that it's really unfortunate because it probably could have been prevented by taking a different route with the company, and instead some of the decisions that they made and risks that they took led them to this point. And I also wonder very much about the future of the PFF data collection side, because I think grading is something that teams are

interested in and they want to know for sure how their players are being graded. And Kuesiodafelmenta told me that the Vikings use their grades as a comparison tool to look at, hey, if there's somebody grading a player this well, then, uh, and we're not like, what's the difference? or things like that. I know of other teams who certainly will say publicly that they never look at them. No, I would never. And they absolutely do. And their analytics departments do.

And they present them in meetings and things like that. I don't know where that's going to go. But I do know that AI can do a lot of the things that really made PFF so popular, which is tendencies. I mean, it was a total game changer to have people tracking coverages in different situations and personnel groupings and motions and all these things that coaches could look up in an instant. And then when they paired it with the video, that's when it totally blew up behind the scenes in

the NFL and every team was using it like crazy. But AI might end up changing how all of that is done and might be able to use tracking data to paint the same pictures as PFF has been able to do. So I feel very sad that the company has kind of gone this way. extremely curious to know where analytics go from here because it's mostly been a lot about PFF and they really changed the way we look at football with a lot of data that they gathered and studied over the years and wish for the best for the people who lost their jobs and the people who are still working for them as well. So there you go. All right. Anyway, this is

me from the owners meetings here in Phoenix. Got to go catch a plane back to Minnesota and we'll have all week to break down a lot of different stuff that was said by the Vikings head coach, owner, and general manager. And it is now draft freaking season, everybody. We're all in. All right. We'll see you all very soon. Football.