Purple Insider - a Minnesota Vikings and NFL podcast - The NFC North Awards!!!!

Episode Date: February 1, 2025

Matthew Coller is joined by CheeseheadTV's Aaron Nagler for the annual NFC North awards. Who was the best QB? Who had the best coaching job? Who was the biggest flop? What was the worst ref mistake of the year? And much, much more. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Hey everybody, welcome to another episode of purple insider, but it's not another episode. It is a very special episode. Aaron Nagler of cheese head TV is joining me and we are not just going to do our usual Vikings and Packers chatter back and forth. No, no, no. Because first of all, there's no football this weekend. And that made me very sad. But also, Aaron, I've taken notice that it is award season.

And so you've got Oscars probably and other award shows that come up around this time. And so I put together my own award show for us called the NFC Northies. And there was only one person I asked to co-host the NFC Northies with me. And that was you, Aaron Nagler. What's going on, man? I'm incredibly honored. I question your judgment. I am very excited to be here.

Let's get to it. Okay. So I have a bunch of categories. We're going to go through it. Some are serious. Some are less serious. And the main goal is for us to make fun of the Bears, but also not too difficult, but also to break down looking back at this season and also looking forward of what is going

to happen in the NFC North. So the only place to begin with an award show is with the obvious types of awards like, and they're not all jokes. The best coaching job in the NFC North is our first award. And I think Aaron, this is a pretty darn difficult one because you have man Campbell getting them to 15 wins, Kevin O'Connell wildly outperforming expectations. And you have obviously Matt LaFleur dealing with a quarterback injury and working through that and Matt Eberflus growing a beard which yeah you as a beard guy right may put him in the conversation may put him in the mix right well you know look I'm sure the expectation out there is for me to say well Matt LaFleur did a much better job than you think but

I mean I do understand Packers fans maybe stumping for Matt given what he did after like you talked about the injury to Jordan Love in week one winning the games with Malik Willis and for a stretch there like a five game stretch they were putting 30 up on everybody like it didn't matter but I think ultimately you see how their season dovetailed they really ran out of steam um I do think O'Connell did a phenomenal job, to your point, definitely much better job than I think the expectations were coming into the season, but I got to give it to Dan Campbell. I really do, and I know people talk about him being a product of his coordinators, and I guess we'll find out, but man, to lose as much talent as they

did throughout this season, obviously starting with the Hutchinson injury, but it was way more than that. To get where they got, to win as many games as they did, to do it decisively in a lot of cases, yeah, I give it to Campbell. I think Dan Campbell is incredibly deserving. I mean, you win 15 games. There's only a handful of times that's ever happened in NFL history. And to do it through the injuries that they faced on defense and to do it through his management style, going for it on fourth down as much as they do.

Like you can see the direct impact from Dan Campbell. Aaron that before this season, Sam Darnold was, I think, 13 games under 500 and had a, I believe a 78.6 quarterback rating for his career this year, 14 and three at the Vegas over under was six and a half. And I think as it went along, we sort of got used to the idea that Sam Darnold was good and like, Oh, he's just their good quarterback. And until until right. And that and that is the tough part about Campbell versus Kevin O'Connell is the week 18 game. The Lions just destroy the Vikings. And that's a one on one matchup. But I don't think it's a one on one matchup of roster talent between those two teams that even with their injuries, Detroit was the much more ready to win the Superbowl team.

And for O'Connell to have more wins than the Vikings had in 2017, more than they had when Brett Favre was here. I think if we do it, which often happens by who exceeded expectations by the most, then O'Connell clearly runs away with it. It's funny too, because the Vikings clearly agree with you with given the extension, he was just handed, right? I don't doubt for a moment. He's going to be a thorn in the side of every NFC North foe, including the Packers. Um, I just, like I said, I think with Campbell,

you look at the talent drain throughout the season and their, their ability still to dominate opponents. I mean, look, we'll, we'll undoubtedly be talking about this all offseason. I think both of them are clearly worthy candidates. And unfortunately, it sucks to say that as a Packers fan, because like I said, I think LeFleur, you know, had a case for a good long while this season, but ultimately they really fell apart down the stretch. And if there is like, you've got to pick between two guys, those are the two worthiest. No doubt. One of the things that you and I,

because we speak to one fan base all the time and the fans and us kind of work with all the same information. We watch all the same games. We nitpick away at every single thing the coach does. I try to pull back sometimes with Kevin O'Connell and say, look, well, I do think that they

should have had a better screen game against the rams or something right we've got to look at the big picture and talk about just how good these coaches are and i see you on twitter with the lafleur and the fans and things like that but i think this is the best coached division in the entire nfl yeah i mean it really depends like week in and week out who's the opponent well how are This is the best coached division in the entire NFL. Yeah, I mean, it really depends week in and week out. Who's the opponent? What are their strengths, weaknesses? How do they match up?

It is such a league of matchups. But yeah, you can't deny the pelts on the wall, so to speak. And we'll see, obviously, with Ben Johnson now in Chicago, where that heads. But I do not doubt for a moment that these teams are going to be kicking each other's butts um real good for these next couple years and we'll see man LeFleur kind of crashing down in the division this season that's a warning shot to me and that's something that's probably a wake-up call as far as you know he had owned the NFC North for a good long while and now it's very clear that the the division not only caught, but is starting to surpass them. So that, to me, is great as a Packers fan because I do think it gives them a little impetus, you know, a little drive,

maybe a little kind of reason to get on board and get ready to face these guys twice a year in a way that maybe before it was like, oh, yeah, it's important. It's a division game, but it's just another game. Like, I think that mentality is definitely going to have to switch at Green Bay. I have two quick Lafleur follow-ups before we move on to our next award, just out of my curiosity. I was saying the other day that I think that with Lafleur, the pressure really starts next year because now we've established the fact that Jordan loves a good quarterback. And once that happens and everyone's like, okay, we've got the answer there now good great wire on that spectrum but we know he's good we know he can

win a lot of games get a team to the playoffs now you better win in the playoffs and it's funny how that switches so fast like last year it's wow look how great he did with Jordan love and then this year's like okay well that was all right but you better win. Is that a fair way to frame that the pressure sort of begins now on Matt LaFleur? Yeah, I think that's not any different than the pressure being applied internally, like by themselves, both Matt LaFleur and Brian Gutekunst. Gutekunst said point blank in his end-of-season press conference, it's time to get back to winning championships or competing for championships. I think that's the expectation. I think people got to remember, you know, when the Packers kind of ripped the bandaid off and

turned the page from Aaron Rodgers, there was an expectation, although people seem to have amnesia about this, uh, by a lot of the national media, certainly a lot of the pundits. Oh, the Packers are entering the wilderness. Jordan loves an unknown commodity and hell, even halfway through his first year as a starter, there was talk of, Oh, the Packers are entering the wilderness. Jordan Love's an unknown commodity. And hell, even halfway through his first year as a starter, there was talk of, oh, the Packers got to look at quarterback in the draft. Now, to your point, that's their guy. They do have that position on lockdown for the foreseeable future. So now you go these past two seasons, nine wins last year, 11 wins this year, playoff berths both times, with both seasons being the youngest team in the league. I think it's fair to say we're talking about surpassing expectations. I think they've done that.

But to your point, a billion percent, yes, the next step, the next expectation is, okay, now it's not good enough to just make the playoffs. It's not good enough to keep saying, well, they've done all this as the youngest team in the league. That is done. Like that kind of part of the phase, that first phase of the quote unquote rebuild, which apparently last six games. That's over. Right.

And now the expectation is, yes, not only are we getting to the playoffs, we're winning the division and we're making a run to compete and or win a championship. No doubt. It is such a difficult division where you have three teams that all now feel this way i mean because the vikings were the the cute story of the league this year but as soon as jj mccarthy puts his hands under that center's butt now all of a sudden it's time to win right i mean that's just that's just how it goes uh speaking of quarterbacks best quarterbacking for this year i don't think think it's the easiest answer other than it wasn't Caleb Williams. That was the not best quarterback.

Very, very easily answered. And look, I'll withdraw Jordan Love's name right off the bat. I think he had a very inconsistent season. I think you saw a really good stretch coming out of the bye week, the back end of the season, except for those final two or three games. He started most of those games really slowly. I mean, you saw the game against the Vikings. He certainly came alive as the game went on, and that has been a bit of a problem for this Packers offense and the quarterback. But yeah, I don't think, I think this is down to Darnold and Goff, right? And for me, I'd probably give it to Darnold simply because of what you

talked about before, expectation-wise, the way he absolutely, I mean, completely turned around his career, obviously, but he was so efficient with the ball up until the final games. Obviously, there's going to be a lot of talk about that this offseason, but man, with Goff, certainly he was efficient. They scored a ton of points. But you do look at their reliance on the run game to set up a lot of what they do. No doubt. Look, man, Goff had a phenomenal year. But he also had games like down in Houston where he threw, what, five picks?

And they still won that game. You know what I mean? Like there's a little support system there for him. Whereas with Darnold, it's not that – of course he's got Jefferson. He's got this amazing array of talent around him. There's no doubt. But you still got to deliver. And he did it repeatedly. And I kept waiting, man. It took a little longer than I expected, but I did keep waiting for the, oh, there's the Sam Darnold we all know and love. And fortunately for Vikings fans, it popped up at the worst possible time there at the end of the year. But on balance,

I don't think it's crazy to say that, yes, he was probably the best quarterback in the game. Folks, I found something that I didn't even know how badly I needed. It's called Rocket Money. Like everybody else, I've got so many subscriptions to different apps and websites that I couldn't keep them all straight. And it takes forever to try to figure it out unless you have rocket money. What rocket money does is organizes all of my subscriptions into one place and allows me to cancel the ones that I'm not using. No more hunting all over the place for things I'm subscribed to or getting charged for things I'm not using. I know I'm not alone in this because I learned that 85% of people have at least one paid

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17. I mean, his quarterbacking in that game was some of the best quarterbacking you have seen against the mates seem to agree since they celebrated like it was a super bowl maybe that was a mistake i don't know yeah i don't know maybe maybe but the way i mean 377 yards in that game there was one interception but i mean he was just so dominant throwing down the field but also insane insanely tight windows in packers played predominantly zone coverage and he picked them apart and not all of them were layups like obviously the first touchdown this dude's wide open like yeah you should hit that but there are so many throws in that game where i mean it's truly impressive how he anticipated and he did this all year as far as, I mean, the Seattle game,

the way he brought them back for the win in that game. There's little doubt in my mind that, I mean, well, again, the conversation will be about the final two games this offseason, but on balance, I think he was phenomenal this season. I think they asked him, it's weird to say because you think of like, well, the coach pumped him up and so forth, But I think when you look at the numbers, especially, they asked him to do more than Jared Goff was asked to do the average depth of target. You mentioned the screens pushing the football down the field. I mean, I think Kevin O'Connell

said this guy's got a number three overall arm. So let's just lean into that. Right. Exactly. Because if you're just going to run screens and check down with that guy, then, you know, you're not leaning into the right variance. When it comes to Jordan Love, what do you think was the issue? I mean, inconsistency is clear in the results, but why? I mean, it's a lot of factors as it always is. LeFleur always talks about it takes all 11, right? It's never just the quarterback though. I mean, having your knee torn up in week one certainly doesn't help. And I think you saw that linger throughout the season. Their approach on offense really changed comparative to everything they had done down the stretch in 2023 that had helped Jordan Love and made him really successful

kind of disappeared. I mean, obviously you saw the run with Aaron Jones down the stretch where those final six games or so, Jordan Love was on fire. And a lot of that was that zone running scheme and marrying things up off play action. That all disappeared this year. And I do think a lot of it, and LeFleur talked about how successful they were running out of the gun. Well, that was great, except they never really married that with anything legitimately, consistently effective in the passing game. That was a huge weapon in Jordan Love's arsenal, so to speak, last season. That all kind of disappeared this year, and I got it. They'll never admit it, but I have to think the knee played a big part of that. And then on top of that, you had the groin issue a couple of weeks after that. It's, I think those plagued him a lot throughout the season. Now that said, you're still judged by what you put on tape between the white lines week in and week out. And it certainly was not good

enough down those kind of final few games from basically Minnesota on just way too inconsistent, especially early in games. I do think they'll obviously pick apart their offense this offseason, take the good, kind of redo and rework some of the stuff to hopefully recapture that form that we saw from Jordan down the stretch in 2023. But man, it's also on him. He's got to be more consistent. He's got to be better in his fundamentals. And it's not anything, I'm not saying anything he doesn't know or have said himself. Right. But I do think, yeah, there was not only inconsistency within his game, but there was a lot of stuff going around him inconsistently. I mean, the other thing I haven't even talked about is the Packers leading the league in drops. That's something that certainly

didn't occur in 2023. So you're bringing along all these young receivers. There's inconsistency there. It's just this whole year is about, okay, what did we find that works i.e the running game josh jacobs the power game etc how do we build off of that and find something a lot more consistent in the passing game next year i think they do need a guy that can be like his go-to and justin jefferson's hard to find so is they're a little difficult tomorrow chase can't just go down to the store and get one. Right. I've seen, I've seen that in your feed.

We just need like a Justin Jefferson. Yeah, that's true. And Jerry rice, you know, that'd be nice. That'd be lovely. But he probably needs someone that he can lean on a little bit more.

And I also think that there are some quarterbacks who are just going to be high variance, even within a season and what you have to hope for. And I always thought this V Eli Manning and Joe Flacco, where it's like, if he catches fire, you're probably going to go to Superbowl. That's the thing. Cause Jordan has shown through his two years as a starter. I mean, he is a streaky cat, like, and he, but to your point, if he gets on a roll, if he gets finds that groove, he's pretty unstoppable. So it's incumbent upon LeFleur to figure that out and get him in that groove at the start of these games because it was hard to watch those last three or four games of the season.

Okay, what's next year's order when we do the NFC Northeast for 2025? Man, that's a good question. Obviously, I'm saying the Packers on top i think they figure everything out and they go to the super bowl and they win it uh after that it's you know clearly a uh a race for second place i will say though man i gotta like if that's the question i gotta like the vikings in this scenario simply because look everything they did this year was not a fluke and i know there's a lot going to be a lot of talk about one-score games and falling back to the mean and all that.

But, man, the one question mark is obviously a quarterback. Outside of that, if they can bring him along, and it sure looks like O'Connell has that touch, that ability, it's hard for me to sit here and say, well, the Lions aren't going to skip a beat. Losing both of those coordinators, I think they're going to have a ton of talent and i do think dan campbell's a hell of a coach but those coordinators are both such unknown commodities i do wonder what that's going to look like and then then they're the bears like there's ben johnson who man good luck running all that stuff with a offensive line that's way worse. And I know they've got the whole offseason to try and fix that,

but it's such an unknown when you go from calling plays and being a coordinator to running your own program. And that's what it is. It's a program. And putting all those pieces in place with your general manager, it's just a huge question mark. So it's hard to put them in that conversation yet. See, I was thinking quarterbacks, like what the quarterback order is, because I'm not sure what to expect from Caleb Williams for next year.

When the Vikings played him the two games, one of them, he made about 10 plays that made my eyes pop out. And the other, he made about 10 plays that made me think this guy can never play in the league. Right. Guys who hold on to the ball always concern me. I mean, I don't know if they fix it. You look at what Johnson asked Jared Goff to do. I mean, that's the drill, right? Like get the ball out of his hands quickly, early, often,

get him in rhythm doing that, lean on that running game. And I suspect that will be a pretty key component to what he wants to do to try and support his young quarterback. Because, look, people talk about the plays. You're mentioning there the frustrations of holding on to the ball. I mean, Darnold went through that playoff game. He's holding it way too long. Sometimes you do kind of get locked up, but the talent is undeniable.

And I do think Ben Johnson has proven that he is a damn good offensive coach. I don't doubt for a moment that that's priority number one for him, is getting Caleb in a groove and maybe breaking him some of those bad habits. So we'll see. Now, again, so much has to occur throughout the offseason as far as what does the supporting cast look like? What does the offensive line look like? But, man, I ain't going to say it's impossible for him to jump up and become a legitimate problem in the NFC North.

That's certainly a possibility. Yeah, I totally agree. And after seeing him in person, this is how I usually have to see players in person to really have a great feel for him. There were too many times where he made spectacular plays to say, Oh,

there's nothing there. Let us move on to our next award. The breakout player of the year award uh green bay's edgar and cooper uh jameson williams from the lions and andrew van ginkle from the vikings i'll tell you man i didn't know a whole heck of a lot talk about seeing in person about edgar and cooper and then it's like who where did this guy come from where did he come from i and uh i think a lot of people were saying that about andrew van ginkle like van winkle who is this uh and uh jameson williams stopped gambling on his phone in this hotel long enough to make a lot of plays this year uh and no bears just no never just don't

belong here none of your players do i would give this to edgar and cooper if he had played a full season but the combination of his not being able to get on the field early in the season i mean he was playing like a handful of snaps early in the year as far as like 10 11 snaps a game if that um and then he finally did start to get worked into the rotation more one defensive player or defensive rookie of the month won the defensive rookie of the week a couple times. Certainly, you saw the production. You saw it in that Vikings game, the way he really was able to kind of knife through the wash, so to speak, and bring Aaron Jones down for gains that I think if he hadn't been in there, had probably been 20-yard gains, became one-yard

gains because of his ability. I think he's certainly worthy of it, but for me, it's Van Ginkle. I mean, the way he absolutely lit up, not just the quarterback and was able to get, you know, pressure applied to the QB, but man, his turnover rate. I mean, he, he had picked sixes and he dropped two more. So it's to me like, yeah, you talk about really taking that defense to the next level because you remember how it really kind of not fell apart, but kind of got figured out towards the end of last year. The injuries kind of caught up to them. Man, they've been reloaded on that side of the ball, and Van Ginkle was a major part of it,

and he really made that defense a problem week in and week out. I agree. I think Van Ginkle deserves this. He makes second-te pro which is something i'm sure he never could have dreamed of in miami he was kind of like the under the radar player but if you really knew ball right you would be like man that guy's kind of a problem down there but brian floor is taking him from being this versatile interesting player who'd get five sacks a year and be decent in coverage to over 10 sacks a couple of the pick sixes i mean i think about that detroit game he has one in his hands that he's running back for pick six if he does how different is that game

does that kind of spark them yeah for sure uh but he was great in coverage otherwise i looked this up when i was doing a feature on him that there's only a couple guys in the last 10 years who have graded as well by PFF in coverage and had as many quarterback pressures as Andrew Van Ginkle. It was like a season that is super rare. I don't know if you can count on pick sixes year in and year out, but maybe you can for him. And I think Williams is a problem, though, Jamison Williams.

Oh, no doubt. Because he was kind of nothing for his first couple years. This is a top five fastest player in the league, and they seem to know how to use him, which is throw a pass with him. Playoff game. That's how you use it. Well, that's just Ben Johnson. He's like, I've got all sorts of options after this game.

It don't matter. So I'm fascinated to watch how many wide receiver passes he throws in Chicago, but yeah, there's no denying the talent. There's no denying the breakout kind of ability. Um, but comparative to the other two, I'd take the other two over Williams. Okay. I think we agree on that one. Was there anybody from the Packers that I missed? I mean, I thought Cooper was kind of the, yeah, he's, he's the kind of, like you said, easy choice. It makes a lot of sense. But again, he just didn't play enough, I would think, to win the award. All right, let's go to our next award, the biggest flop of the year.

And the nominations are Matt Iberfluss' makeover, Sam Darnold in the playoffs, and Matt LaFleur in every big game. Man, that's unfair to my guy, Matt. A lot went on there. There's a lot that goes beyond just LaFleur. I mean, how do you not give it to Darnold in the playoffs? How do you not give it to Darnold in those final two games? That final game, everything in hand, first seed overall,

and he was off that whole, I mean, right from the jump. I mean, they had open touchdowns he's missing in that game. I mean, you talk about, I joked about it earlier, but that was the moment, right? The, oh, there's Sam Darnall. It took all year, but there he is at the biggest moment. He desperately needed him to step up. He absolutely lost the plot. And then to do it again in that playoff game i just yeah i look i'm not saying the floor

was awesome this year even fluce is a bit of a joke but yeah darnold you talk about the expectations everything he had built and then to just have it all fall apart in a two-week stretch that's pretty hard to beat yeah and i think that people have conflated those two games as being the same but they're really not in the way that they played out. No, I agree. The Rams game. We saw Justin Herbert lose that game in the playoffs.

We saw CJ Stroud. If you're getting pressured every single time by beast defensive lines, you're not going to have a lot of success. And I didn't think that he was given options or a run game or a screen game or whatever. It seemed weird, right? Rams.

Yeah. As that game goes along and I haven't rewatched it, options or a run game or a screen game or whatever it seemed weird right against the ramps like as that game goes along and i haven't re-watched it but everything i kept i kept feeling like okay at some point o'connell's going to adjust he's going to have like easy flare routes or like some screens for his running back or whatever but it kept being like we're just going to run everybody like 20 yards downfield and don's going to have to sit back there. And I know there's the Paul Allen radio call, like, you got to throw it, man.

Like, it's like, yeah, but to who? Like, it did feel like there was a great adjustment from O'Connell in that game. And two of the biggest sacks that he took were cornerback blitzes out of condensed sets, which it seemed the Rams knew exactly what to attack there. The Spag special. Yep. Yep, exactly. I mean, that's exactly what Spags special. Yep. Yep. Exactly. I mean, that's exactly what Spags did on that big play against Buffalo. Absolutely.

If you get the receivers close to the line of scrimmage, you're bound to face that, and they weren't prepared for it, which to me was on coaching to some extent. And the fourth and two that they failed on, they tried to go for fourth down, kind of a big moment in the game. There's one receiver that's within five yards of the line of scrimmage everybody else is at least 10 to 15 yards downfield on fourth and two we call that the mccarthy special that was it was like watching mike mccarthy all over again that was how we always used to talk about that with

rogers because the knock on rogers is always he holds the ball too long well everyone's running 25 yards down the field and he's got nowhere to go with it. So yeah, sometimes it's not all on the quarterback. So Sam Darnold did flop in that game, but the lions game, the throws were there. The guys were there and he just didn't make it. That was, that was a really poor performance and a shocking one. I will say it's so weird that like, I was surprised watching it live. Like these are throws he made all.

I mean, just the week before he's carving up the Packers with these insanely laser guided throws. Where was that? I needed some of that against Green Bay. But then he does it out there in Detroit. I don't know, man. But it was it was shocking. Maybe if the entire world said to you, hey, Aaron, your next podcast, if you're good, you got 50 million on the line. And if you're bad, are you going to be a little nervous?

Maybe a little bit, a little tight, a little, yeah, no doubt. No question. That could be. How about our next award? The getting owned moment of the year. This is okay. So here's the nomination, right? Tyreek Stevenson taunting the fans as the Hail Mary is going on behind him. And then he's the one that tips it to Washington for the Chicago Bears to lose that game. Dan Campbell pulls in Kevin O'Connell. We'll see you in two weeks. Like he's Jesse Ventura or something. Not while they did see each other, maybe on vacation. Maybe in Cancun, right? And Matt Iverflus' Thanksgiving meltdown and then instant firing.

All you got to do is this, my friend. Just form a little T. Chris Webber did it. Just like that. The getting owned moment of the year. You know, I can't give it. The Iverflus thing just feels like... By rote.

Like, it's just what I expect. Like, there's nothing surprising about it. Like, yeah, you told me before that game, guess what, it's going to come down to this and Iberflues is totally going to freeze up and completely blow the game. I'd be like, yep, makes total sense to me. And the Campbell thing, it's like,

I didn't read that as Ventura. I read that as, eh, I'll see you in two weeks. Like, it was a throwaway. Like, of course it was caught on camera and got blown up because of it, but, like, I didn't read that as Ventura. I read that as, eh, I'll see you in two weeks. It was a throwaway. Of course, it was caught on camera and got blown up because of it, but that didn't feel like, yeah, they didn't end up winning their games in the playoffs, but whatever. That was nothing. The Stevenson thing, that is hilarious.

And the fact that that was the swing of their entire season. I mean, remember, they were in a really good spot. If they just knocked that ball down, they have, they're at five and two on the year. It's unbelievable to me how you can delineate, you can draw a line to that play completely blowing up their entire season because you had the game one. Yeah. To me to me, there is no competition here. It is definitely Tyreek Stephenson. And the narrative coming out of that game would have been like, hey, Caleb Williams had a bad game, but pulled out a great drive.

He was let down. Which he did, by the way. Yeah, he did. They tried to hand it off to a guard. And so they let down Caleb Williams there. Yeah, that was insane. And then Tyreek Stevens. And if it's just a regular Hail Mary, I think if it's just a regular Hail Mary,

you'd be like, wow, that was so random. Right. But the fact that he was taunting the fans first, and then he tips it up in the air like that. And also the subsequent, all the players going to the media being like, Eberflug sucks. Like them all blaming him instantly for that's what I mean the cascading from that moment is just incredible to behold no and then it not

that he was ever good at managing a game but it almost felt like after that that Eberfluss became worse because it was like he was sort of dealing with everybody watching like everyone's paying attention to me in these last moments and froze up. I don't know. That was one of the great moments of the NFL season for 2024. The not great moments are next award. The worst refereeing mistake of the year. The nominations for this are Sam Darnold's face mask on Thursday night football in which his head nearly came off of his

body eight feet away from the referee official who's looking right at it the non-fumble recovery by the packers in which the gentleman falls directly on the ball has it in his hands and is down and somehow that football belongs to the phil, who, side note, have one of the easiest runs to Super Bowls two times. Whether it's Brock Purdy getting hurt or whether it's facing Washington instead of Detroit getting a fake fumble. So that played a role. And the non-face mask in the Lions and Washington game in which the player clearly just grabbed the shoulder of another player 15 yard penalty 15 yard penalty it didn't end up impacting the game but i was gonna say like it's it's horrible you hate to see it but again i did just that i and that happens

like that's i get it like you you saw the motion of the player and you threw the flag whatever like that happens i can't get too worked up about it. I'll ask you this, sir, because I know you're probably going to say it's the freaking Vikings call, but let me ask you this. What have the Vikings done all second half in that game other than butt kiss? And then now you're telling me Vikings fans just cried all week. Oh, they didn't throw the flag at the end zone. Because what? What was going to happen?

You had no time. You're going to what? Go down the field and score which you hadn't done all half? Like, yo, I understand. It was an egregious miss. The player himself puts his hands up like, oh, I didn't touch him even though we all saw you did. But give me a break like anything

was going to happen even if that gets called. it's clearly awarding the eagles that game fumble it is so obviously that because who knows how that game goes if the packers are able to march down the field even get a field goal rather than seven seconds into the game the eagles have the ball in the red zone and they score a touchdown to make it seven nothing it's what's atrocious to me is that the clear video evidence which is what they always talk about shows Keyshawn Nixon with the ball so what are we doing here oh by the way and that's a hit that was illegal that the NFL touted

on their Twitter channel oh look at this this is how. And then that dude, Oren Burks, gets fined for said hit. Everything about that play was garbage. At least you're not holding on to the anger about it. No, I'm not bitter at all. Not at all. Okay, so I'll try for you, even though I agree. I'll try. I once covered a game, Vikings and Carolina Panthers, where Sam Darnold was playing against the Vikings.

The score was 28 to 20, and they had the ball at the two-yard line, game Vikings and Carolina Panthers where Sam Darnold was playing against the Vikings the score was 28 to 20 and they had the ball two yard line and Sam Darnold led all the way down the field and tied that football game in about a minute and a half time it could have happened you get a 15 yard penalty all of a sudden maybe it starts rolling I'm not saying that I disagree though, because so clearly was he hit illegally. So clearly did he recover the football and was on top of it. And then someone else just came and took it off of him. And the amount that it changed that game, the Vikings down 28 to 20 with the ball, even on the 16 yard line, probably have about a 5% chance to win.

If even that, cause you have to score, get the two point conversion conversion and then win in overtime so it's pretty low at that point they got outplayed they deserve to be where they were and then they get screwed by a call had it been on the final play of the game where he's throwing it trying to throw a touchdown maybe it's different but it's in the end zone you know it's just not the same no but uh and from the perspective of where i was sitting i was thinking you know if the packers and washington both win we get a home playoff game and i don't have to fly anywhere would have been amazing would have been incredible that's that the ones that are the worst are where it's reviewed and it's still a billion that's the work that's the thing when new y York is taking an elongated look at it

And they still get it wrong That's what blows my Why do we even have replay? What is the point? I will agree with you Worst reffing mistake of the year At least in the NFC North Goes, I'm sure there are plenty others

There are plenty more I'm sure people will dominate several others In your comment section Two more Two more awards for this show uh one is our second to last gonna definitely be better next year award and the nominations go to dallas turner lucas van ness and caleb williams which one is gonna be yes good next year i hate this so much because i gotta say caleb williams i really do and i i hate saying it i i want to say van ness but i've seen absolutely nothing

to indicate that as far as dallas turnery i think there's a decent chance he's better next year but for me it's caleb williams like you talked about before you certainly saw the flashes this year and now he's got a legitimate offensive coordinator to put something together that really helps him I hate to say it but we you know hell we got to throw the bears a bone at some point and for me it's in these are the nominee nominees it to me it's Caleb Williams I think there's no question it's Caleb Williams. And you mentioned Ben Johnson building a program, yards, a carry with Jameer Gibbs, even if they run for four and a half and quarterback in a good position. Exactly. Exactly.

And I think that a lot of these, sometimes with these teams, they get a young quarterback with a lot of talent and they go, Oh, I need to do everything with him. I need him reading this, that this is where Cliff Kingsbury was honestly brilliant this year with Jaden Daniels. That offense for the first half of the season was pretty straightforward for him. And even in the playoff games,

getting rid of the ball quickly and so forth, and then they layered on as they went along. It seemed like they wanted Caleb Williams to just learn everything in training camp, be a franchise quarterback right away. And I think Ben Johnson Johnson play actions, screens, getting the ball out of his hands has a great chance with Dallas Turner. There was flashes this year.

He just didn't get to play a lot because they had two guys that were all pro caliber. Yeah. And I, you know, I think if Patrick Jones leaves, he'll kind of slot in. He's got to put on some weight. There's still plenty of room for that. What's the deal with Van Ness? That's a great question. Everyone in Green Bay would love to know. I mean, they did fire their defensive line coach after this season.

Rebovich got the boot because, I mean, he is certainly not developing the way they had hoped to a point where, and here's the concerning part. It's not so much like, yeah, he's not really productive and yeah, didn't put up huge stats. He certainly wasn't putting great tape out there, but he couldn't get on the field. The fact that they have former undrafted players, there's a guy in Brenton Cox Jr. who was inactive for nine weeks and then they trade Preston Smith and then he's getting on the field more than the former 13th overall pick? That's concerning to say the least. My one caveat here, and I keep saying this on my chats, is

he is still a very young player. The Packers took him as a project. He is now going to be, for the first time in three years, in the same defensive scheme as he was the year previous. Who knows how he comes along as far as maybe he quote figures it out that is the hope but man the early returns so far have been less than promising let's put it that way with any top draft pick it's such a hard thing from our seat because you want to give patience and you want to like point out all the hundreds of examples of players who struggle for Sean Gary is one of them and then broke out Khalil Mack got four sacks his first year and then the next year he's got 12 there's so many players at every position that their first year we all went what the heck is up with this guy and then he becomes really good but there's always that

tipping point of and you brought it up like trying to read what the coaches think of a player. And I think at least what we saw from Dallas Turner, him playing 25, 35 snaps in the last five, six weeks told us that he was impressing the coaches behind the scenes because he would not have been on the field otherwise, if they didn't want him to be. So I think there were enough signs there that pointed to it, but he can't win this award because I think Caleb Williams has a better chance to break out the Dallas Turner. But if Turner breaks out though, and they have Grenard Van Ginkle and Turner,

it's going to be pretty, I don't want to live in that world. I'm not living in that world. Nope. Refuse to. All right. Best podcaster of the NS. No,

this is a joke. This is a joke. It's clearly me. Obviously not even, not even close. That's a runaway.'s clearly me. Obviously. Not even close. That's a runaway. Hey, I will say, before we get to our last award, I am happy for you with Cheesehead TV. You're a great guest on this show.

You do great work. You're one of the only ones that I check in on to see, especially when things go wrong. Yeah, well, naturally. If it bleeds, it leads. No doubt. I mean, that's not unlike when I was living in Chicago, man. Listening to Bears radio after they lost was like one of the best times in my life. So, yeah, no doubt.

No doubt. I feel you. All right. The real final award is Best Outlook for 2025. Which one of these teams has the best outlook going forward for next season? I don't think it's the easiest question because the Lions are bringing back Aiden Hutchinson for that defense. The Vikings potentially going to a young quarterback. That means cap space spending, improving.

They've got the coaching staff. Flores is coming back. The Packers, you've got've got hey it's been mentioned every once in a while on broadcast that it's a young team maybe like every quarter it gets brought up that it's a young team are they gonna spend money by the way they don't like to do that in free agency are they gonna get like t higgins or something i don't i don't think it'll be t higgins but they've got more maneuverability now than they have in the last like five years essentially and that's due to you know obviously trying to kick the can down the street trying to get back to a super bowl

with aaron rogers clearly that didn't occur but they've been dealing with the dead cap from that for the last couple years now they have some ability i don't think they're going to go hog wild um but i do think they're going to be better and i do think if you're looking at these four you know these teams in the nfc north i think are all going to be better. And I do think if you're looking at these four, you know, these teams in the NFC North, I think are all going to be better next year. But to me, you're talking about best outlook sitting here today. Yeah, you're right. They're the Vikings are turning to a young quarterback most likely. And that does give them, you know, a QB on a rookie deal, which allows you maneuverability with the cap, but man, they got a boatload of free agents coming up a bunch of guys to resign or not resign,

figure out what to do. It's a pretty significant transition. I would think personnel wise in Minnesota with the bears, you got Ben Johnson, who knows? We've talked about a lot of unknowns there. Defense, who knows what to expect there? Although I think there'll be good. They got a lot of talent and I do think there'll be productive on the offensive side of the ball, but Ben Johnson is an unknown commodity as a head coach, right? With the Lions, they got the coordinator drain. Like you talked about getting Hutchinson back, getting a lot of those guys back. I still think Dan Campbell's a hell of a coach.

Got to think they're going to be really good again, no question about it. But to me, how is it not the Green Bay Packers? Not only have they been the youngest team and now are maturing and growing, they have practically no one to worry about re-signing. I mean, they have a few guys here. I mean, TJ Slayton is probably their biggest concern when it comes to their own guys to sign back in free agency. The Christian Watson injury makes things interesting because, to your point,

maybe they get a little more aggressive in free agency, bring in a receiver or what have you. But, man, they're set on both sides of the ball as far as Matt LaFleur on offense, Jeff Halfley sticking around on the defensive side of the ball after a phenomenal first year as their defensive coordinator. So much has to play out this offseason, but they have the quarterback. Their guy is set. There's no mystery there.

And hopefully, I mean, just give me a year where our quarterback isn't hurt in week one. I'm bullish on the green bay packers in 2025 in brazil of all places i mean can i tell you sitting in my hotel room after that game a bunch of packers fans that i had met in brazil the night before had gifted me all sorts of stuff including one big bottle of alcohol that was basically brewed in the amazon and all this stuff and i'm telling you i cracked that thing open that night and and had a big old swig because i thought jordan love was done for the season after one game the fact that he wasn't was great obviously but man i just can

we avoid that next year because that sucked yeah i mean nobody nobody wanted to see that nobody wanted to really see a game in brazil but, I mean, it sounds like a good time. I had a great time. I had a ball until that play. That sucked. I think when it comes to the Vikings for this, and we did a fun exercise the other night where we picked the 2025 Vikings schedule

that I made up with their opponents. I love that. But I'm sure you've had the same observation. That's peak content right there. I love it. Yes, and we also don't. That's peak content right there. I love it. Yes. And we also don't know who's playing quarterback, technically. So we did it if McCarthy was playing quarterback.

And I think you've had the same observation, I'm guessing, is the opponents for next year look a lot harder than facing yourself. It toughens up. Oh, yeah. Big time. So we came up with maybe 10 wins for the Vikings and that means they got to pull a few games against some really good teams. And I think that you are looking at kind of a transition of Rogers to love where maybe the first half of the season, it could be a little bit slow. You could fall behind a little bit in that race as JJ McCarthy figures out how to play football,

which ultimately can work out fine for them in the long run as it is with green Bay. But there is no way of avoiding the Rocky transition of a young quarterback, unless Patrick Mahomes arrives at your doorstep, which is always possible, but unlikely. Who knows? I will say, I mean, look, the thing with the Vikings or the Packers or any team, really, you want to win the division, obviously. But it's not a death knell if you don't. You know, the idea, something which is probably more important is how you're playing down the stretch. And that's why it was really hard to get excited about the Packers' chances this year because they were playing so poorly. You know what I mean?

And if you get hot in December going into January and you're on a run to the playoffs, that's what you want ultimately. So, yeah, if your quarterback struggles a bit out of the gate, yeah, that's probably expected. But it doesn't mean that the season's over or it's a failure or whatever. It's just as long as you're playing better ball, your best ball, December into January, then you've got a fighting chance. So who do we decide has the best outlook? You're going with the Packers.

It's the Packers easily. Come on. It's easily the Packers. It just feels like i'm really i'm really giving you you take the vikings out well so it says for 2020 it says for 2025 i'm gonna go with the lions i'm gonna say i'm gonna say i know that ben johnson was good i know that aaron glenn improved i think during his time but just roster they realize they can just give the ball to Jameer Gibbs that they don't need David Montgomery to get three and a half yard carries. They could just have the best player. They're really losing nobody.

And they've got cap space and they've got a great general manager. I think he's done a good, a really good job. No doubt. Would you be surprised if next year they only win 12 or 11, but they end up in the super bowl? Like I would know if it's Detroit. That would be surprising at all.

And probably the most predictable quarterback, really, of all of them with golf's history. So I'm going to go with the Lions have the best outlook for 2025. If we're doing maybe longer term, maybe we could argue the Vikings on that one. So let's give ourselves a round of applause. Absolutely. Congratulations to all of our winners, especially Tyreek Stevenson. The award is in the mail.

It'll be arriving at your doorstep momentarily. And I cannot thank you enough for doing this. This was really fun, and you did turn out to be the perfect person to co-host this award show, Aaron Nagler. Though I can never truly suggest she's had TV to a bunch of Vikings fans, it is very well done.

Honestly, it looks good. It sounds great. I think you're really good and detailed in your commentary. So I do enjoy watching you to see what's going on over there in Wisconsin. So thank you so much, Aaron Nagler, for joining me. And this was really fun. Thanks so much for having me. And hopefully we can do it again next year.

The 2025 Northeast will be wonderful well up the budget it'll be amazing thanks so much