Purple Insider - a Minnesota Vikings and NFL podcast - Thumbs up or thumbs down to coaching candidates the Vikings have interviewed so far

Episode Date: January 18, 2022

Matthew Coller and Sam Ekstrom get into the candidates that the Minnesota Vikings have interviewed so far and talk about whether they make sense as the next head coach. Matthew changes his mind about having some concerns regarding Kellen Moore after more breakdowns of the Cowboys' loss came to light. Plus they talk about what the next GM and coach are getting roster wise and some possibilities for Kirk Cousins-related trades. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

TD Direct Investing offers live support, so whether you're a newbie or a seasoned pro, you can make your investing steps count. And if you're like me and think a TFSA stands for Total Fund Savings Adventure, maybe reach out to TD Direct Investing. Matthew Pollard and Sam Ekstrom here. Sam, I want to start the show right out. We're going to talk about lots of different things Vikings related, specifically the state of the roster that the new head coach and general manager will be inheriting. But I have to start out the show by saying I kind of changed my mind on something from yesterday's show that I did with Paul Hodowanek. I started off by saying I didn't really care so much that Kellen Moore had botched the final play of the game in the Cowboys game.

That wouldn't really shape how I felt about Kellen Moore as a head coaching candidate. Now, making a mistake at the end of a game and calling something a little galaxy-brained and overthinking it is not that big of a deal. There's lots of people that you could point to one mistake that a coach has made or something like that. And if they had two more seconds, then maybe it looks really smart and they gained 15 yards or if they just hand the ball to the referee or if the players get set or whatever number of things. So I wasn't taking that too seriously, but where I've changed my mind is in reading from some really smart people about yesterday's game plan for the Cowboys. I think that's one that I'm not really on board with, despite how good the offensive statistics have been for the Dallas Cowboys. Is it silly to change my mind after saying yesterday,

I didn't really care that much about how that game turned out in terms of him as a candidate that just after reading today, I've kind of moved away from Kellen Moore as a potential head coach candidate for the Vikings. Um, are you saying that the game plan specifically in yesterday's game is throwing you off or just his game plan in general with Dallas yesterday? Yes. Okay. I mean, it's, it's a playoff game and the other team is good

and they're getting beat up on the offensive line, which doesn't always happen to Dallas. And they just struggled so much to adjust. Uh, Bob Sturm covers the Viking or the, um, Cowboys down there. And he did a whole thread about not being able to adapt when their offensive line was having problems yesterday. I'm watching Tampa Bay have their top two offensive linemen go down and continue to have their offense tick, and they just seem to adjust real quick and float along and kick the ever-loving heck out of the Philadelphia Eagles, whereas the Cowboys melted down when their offensive line struggled,

which will happen to you eventually in the playoffs when you're going to play good defenses. And so even though in the playoffs when you're going to play good defenses. And so even though in the regular season, you're putting up 50 points in the final game against the Eagles who weren't playing starters, which is great. I mean, you should be putting up big totals, but when push comes to shove, you're going to have to beat a good defense. And it felt actually very Vikings-y yesterday of the Dallas Cowboys when it was a good defensive line. And all of a sudden, the way that they scheme it up did not give Dak Prescott a ton of easy options and short throws and things like that to keep them rolling. And I wonder if that's something you're sort of signing

up for more of the same if you bring in somebody who can't adjust when the defensive line is beating your offensive line. Yeah, I think about when I was just starting my career. I was an audio engineer. I had to work with a lot of wires and cords, and I was very unfamiliar with it. But I learned the system well enough that I could do the process in my sleep. But you know when I struggled? If something went wrong, I did not know how to fix it because I had very little experience, and I just't know like what the troubleshooting method was. And I think that's a little bit the young offensive coordinator plight. And it was certainly Clint Kubiak's problem is that he didn't know what to do when the running game wasn't

working or when the interior line wasn't blocking or when the defense was playing a too high shell. He didn't seem to know how to react or design plays to work around those issues. And I think if you hire Kellen Moore, you probably absorb some of that risk in that he's not going to have seen everything. He's not going to understand necessarily every possible pitfall of what's being run. I, for one, don't get totally thrown off by one game plan. I think most coordinators are going to go out on a bad note, particularly playoff coordinators. Pat Shermer, Kevin Stefanski, they both got jobs after horrible final impressions. Awful. I couldn't believe the Browns hired Kevin Stefanski the day after that game against San Francisco, where they had absolutely no answers. Pat Shermer's offense got completely shut down in the NFC championship game,

and they still got hired. I think you look at the body of work more so. But when you're telling more and you're younger, I think that people are more prone to point to, hey, what was that? They're more prone to nitpick. They're going to look at it under even a sharper microscope. Regarding the final play of the game, asinine. Now, I don't know who called that. I don't know if it was an option given to Dak because Emmanuel Acho. Yeah, I've got the answer there. Kellen Moore called the play.

Mike McCarthy okayed it, basically said, yeah, let's do it. Okay. Well, okay. Yeah, that's a terrible play then because the concept of getting closer for your Hail Mary rarely is effective. I mean, when you've got two shots to throw it up to Amari Cooper, you should probably take two shots and throw it up to Amari Cooper instead of an infinitesimal increase in win probability, taking the risk of not getting the ball spiked, just a terrible decision. And it didn't seem like the Cowboys understood what, like the receivers weren't blocking and they were, seemed disoriented with the whole thing. It just seemed ill attempted from the get-go. So hated the play, but I'm also going to evaluate more, probably more on the body

of work. And what have we heard all this off season? That it's so much more about leadership, delegation, communication. It's not all about the X's and O's. It's a lot about that, but that's not the entire package when you're hiring a head coach yeah i i agree and i think it is unfair to say hey based on this one game that didn't work out for them that you know you're just uh not gonna hire somebody because of that i mean kellen moore has a background in the nfl as a player and then quickly became an offensive coordinator and two of his three years they've been the number one offense in the league in terms of total yards this year number one in yards and in points and Dak Prescott was banged up for some part of the year they won a game I forget against who with Cooper Rush as their backup quarterback and and so clearly what they're doing is working and they have

loaded up that offense with good running backs, good offensive line, good wide receivers and weapons upon weapons upon weapons. And Dak Prescott is a very good quarterback thought after the game, he kind of embarrassed himself blaming the referees at the end there, because he's got to hand the ball to the ref, but I guess everybody's upset after games sometimes and says things they shouldn't. But I guess when it comes to the experience of a coach, that's always a hard thing to weigh, right? Like how many games like that has Kellen Moore been a part of as an offensive coordinator? The answer is yesterday, right? Because a couple of years ago,

they went eight and eight with Jason Garrett and he got all the blame for kicking field goals at the wrong times and punting and whatever else. But they had a very effective offense. And then last year, the DAC injury happens pretty early on. They've got Andy Dalton running out there, so they didn't have a great offense. And then this year they do. And look, if we're looking at what correlates most to winning, it's clearly points and offense. And so the guy dialing up the scheme that's been number one, two out of his three years is something you want to look at and give a lot of praise for. I guess you just wonder about the lack of experience and how that's going to play out for a lot of the candidates that we're talking about. I mean, even for now, Brian Dable has been

in more playoff games and has been up for the task, certainly against the New England Patriots. I never know how to weigh that because sometimes people talk about not wanting retread coaches. And then a lot of retread coaches win. If they pull off that game yesterday, then we're talking about, well, Mike McCarthy really proved everybody wrong by, you know, coming back after he was such a mess at the end in Green Bay and then won, and it's six points away. It's one or two plays away from that narrative being completely different instead of everybody talking about what a failure Mike McCarthy is, although they just were out of their skulls at times in this game,

leaving the punting team on after the fake punt to try and, I'm not exactly sure what that, just put your offense bet. And then they take a delay a game. There were so many things that went wrong in that. And ultimately the head coach is responsible for the game plan, but not having a ton of post-season experience. And then in your first chance out there, you get out schemed badly by San Francisco. Kyle Shanahan got the far better scheme wise of Kellen Moore there. And then having this totally whack a doodle ending to the game that the next day everybody's breaking down. It's not exactly something that makes you say, sign me up today. And so I guess I changed on that after reading some of the stuff about their offense and their scheme and what it needs

to succeed and why it didn't yesterday. So did you have any feelings over the weekend about the Vikings coach search as you were watching other teams? That's a good question. There weren't a lot of positive impressions. Obviously, the Chiefs and the enemy, you know, were extremely impressive. And gosh, the way that they just go for touchdowns at the end of halves. It's incredible. Remind me, the enemy has not been listed on the head coach speculation. There's been like eight head coach rumors and he is not among them yet. Yeah.

As we speak right now, no, they have not had him or Byron left, which or Brian Dable. So three guys that were the most impressive over the weekend, especially Dable. Although, I mean, I loved the ability to adapt to the wind and to the injuries that Tampa Bay had,

but yeah, the guys that were mentioned have not yet been interviewed. And then Kevin O'Connell, that's tonight. So we don't know how it's going to play out with the Rams, although, of course, their offense is really good once again this year. So I guess there were a ton of the candidates where you could just evaluate them in the same way that we could with Kellen Moore. Right.

Well, and the defensive guys, too. I mean, that's just so uninspiring, I think, to the fan base. But they were pretty good. Like D'Amico Ryans was pretty good. He he arguably is the one that foiled Kellen Moore and Bowles. Right. Bowles was on the list. And Jalen Hurts is playing Hurts and they're just way worse than the Bucs. So he kind of had an easy time of it. But, yeah, the defensive guys certainly looked a little bit better dan quinn um was fine i guess it's just it's harder and i think less important to like look at sort of what they did defensively in these games like the off it's easier to analyze the offensive coordinators

the offensive coaches so um again i'm not too caught up in one result, but you never want to hire the guy that everyone's bragging on. I'm sure that comes into the equation. So if they announced Kellen Moore today, it's probably going to get panned a little bit. If they wait a couple of weeks, I think that things settle down and it's probably all right. And you can redeem yourself pretty quickly with a good press conference. Um, but it wasn't, I mean, the fact that left, which is left off the list, that tables left off the list is a little disappointing to me that they're focusing more on the defensive side of the ball in these interviews, even though I agree with the indiscriminate process. And I think it's good to interview a lot of people. I just wouldn't do it

at the expense of some of the sharper offensive minds right now. I just wonder, I guess this would be my theory is if they're getting some interviews out of the way to see if anyone really surprises them or blows them away. And they're waiting until the end to interview the candidates that they really want. Now I could, I could be wrong about that, but the names that are out there right now, I guess almost all of them would surprise me. So let's go through them, the names that are out there right now i guess almost all of them would surprise me so let's go through them the names that are out there right now so doug peterson would not be surprising at all if he became the vikings head coach how about you just yell thumbs up or thumbs down as i go through these because i made the list of the candidates that we've heard about so far so doug peterson thumbs up or down thumbs upumbs up. I would like Peterson, yes.

I think Peterson would be a very good hire, not just because he won a Super Bowl, but because his teams routinely had very good offenses and worked with Kansas City before that. Kellen Moore is a thumbs up or thumbs down for you? I'm still going to go thumbs up on that. I'm a little thumbs up sideways after yesterday. Okay, Dan Quinn is a thumbs down for me.

I just don't see it. I don't get it. I think that his defense had a preposterous amount of turnovers this year, which is really unsustainable. He never did it before in Atlanta, and they also never really had good defenses in Atlanta, so I'm not sure that I really understand the obsession with Dan Quinn. Thumbs down. I'm probably going to be

thumbs down on all the defensive guys, but especially Quinn when, yeah, they had one good run. I mean, I think they had singular good defense with some high draft picks, but then that defense just folded fast. I mean, he couldn't sustain anything. So that tells me it was more of an anomaly. I think that I think there's leadership quality there, but I don't I don't really get I don't fall in love with his tactical plan. So I'd go thumbs down. You know who Dan Quinn reminds me of is Ron Rivera. Like he seems like everyone likes him and he's a good guy. But and that's helpful. We've talked about how unhelpful it can be to be on the other side of that with Mike Zimmer, but scheme is King in the NFL. And I'm just not totally convinced that his scheme this year was anything special in Dallas. They just had a

ridiculous number of turnovers. Are you going to have a corner that gets like 10 picks again next year? Probably not. Um um and Micah Parsons was like Lawrence Taylor this year so I don't know I mean like how much credit do you want to give some of these guys in a small sample of success when his bigger sample in Atlanta was them not having good defenses so yeah thumbs down for me Todd Bowles is an interesting one because I think he's been really impressive schematically including what he did in the Super Bowl last year. The sample of him as a head coach, though, with the New York Jets, he was at the helm of the New York Jets, pretty much going down in the tubes after a 10 and six year with Ryan Fitzpatrick. Part of that certainly is drafting Sam Darnold and so forth,

but it was just not a really impressive run in New York when he was a head coach last time. I think he's probably in the right spot as a defensive coordinator. I would agree with that. I'm pretty strongly in the offensive coach camp, so for that reason alone would be a thumbs down. He's got an amazing resume. He's been all over the place, and and he succeeded in a lot of those places. It's just when you put him, if you put an average coach

in a bad quarterback situation, they're probably not going to last. You have to be an exceptional coach in a bad quarterback situation to do anything. So maybe the circumstance wasn't right, but he didn't get the most out of those situations at all. So maybe the circumstance wasn't right, but he didn't get the most out of those situations at all. So I'd go thumbs down on Bulls. So D'Amico Ryan's probably the same thing for you. I think it's intriguing, but I also think the guy's been a DC for one year and that just, that's a lot to ask from somebody

to go from player to linebacker coach to DC for one season. And then all of a sudden into head coach. Uh, I think that's too much. That would be too fast. You agree with that? Yeah. Although, you know, that Tomlin was a, uh, was a DC for one year. I think I'm looking at Tomlin here. Yeah. It was defensive backs coach to DC. Granted, he was in the coaching game for like a decade before that. Ryan's has very little experience as a coach at all. So I'm thumbs down for the defensive reason, but I also don't hate outside of the box thinking. Like, I don't think a young coach is a bad coach, but, you know, if I probably sing a different tune, if it was an offensive guy,

kind of like Kellen Moore. So I, I, I do want to acknowledge that it's not because he has a little experience as much as it is. He's just a defensive guy. Okay. And we won't even talk about Jonathan Gannon, the DC from the Eagles. Cause huh? I'm not sure. I really understand that one, but Kevin O'Connell, the offensive coordinator from the rams and mcveigh gets all the credit there uh when zach taylor was hired in cincinnati and i'm not saying he's a great coach but when he was hired in cincinnati it was oh my gosh they're just hiring everyone that knows mcveigh and yep his team is still alive so what's the thought uh thumbs up or thumbs down on Kevin O'Connell, the Rams OC? I like quarterbacks, right?

I mean, I like guys that sort of know how to work and relate to quarterbacks. And you would probably ensure a decent relationship between your coach and quarterback. I know those things can dissolve. It happened with Doug Peterson. But I'm intrigued enough, at at least to give him a thought. So I'd probably go thumbs up there because I just appreciate what the Rams do offensively. Now, we stretched our head a little bit at their attack against the Vikings, so that was a little bit weird, but I do like sort of the thought of let's get more weapons, right? Let's not limit ourselves. Running back by committee, a lot of fast wide receivers. Hey, we have Woods and Cup. Let's go

get Odell Beckham. So that type of mindset, I would appreciate being brought over. Brian Dable and Byron Leftwich would be at the top of the list for me, but they haven't interviewed them yet. So the only one I think I haven't mentioned is Nate Hackett. So we'll see if they interview those guys. They would be, I'm sure, thumbs up on your end, the way that you've described what you want. But Nate Hackett is the closest one to those guys. So is he a thumbs up? Yeah, I think Hackett is a little bit of a thumb sideways. And I think he's, again, he's someone that would relate well. I think he's got the right bedside manner.

I always have just a bit of skepticism when they have a Hall of Fame quarterback, like how much of this is you, how much of this is just crazy talent. That's probably a little bit of the enemy's problem because for the enemy, it's both Andy Reid andrick mahomes are sort of overshadowing you um and with hackett you know he's he's been fortunate to be attached to like some of three of the greatest quarterback seasons of all time obviously makes him look very good but um i think i like the packers are not as modern of an offense as you know what some the other more successful offenses are doing, but they're still finding a way to produce pretty well. So I appreciate that.

I think I'm more of a thumb sideways, though, just because of the Rodgers caveat. Folks, we've got an even better offer to tell you about from SodaStick. If you use the promo code PURPLEINSIDER, One word, you can get 15% off your purchase. That's right. At SodaStick.com, your place for Minnesota sports-inspired apparel. You can get 15% off just by using the code PURPLEINSIDER. I've told you about all the great football designs, but they've added a few more, including the Axe is Back for Minnesota football fans.

You can get that on a shirt, on a hat. And also, Randy Moss is the GoAT, the Purple People Eaters, Bud Grant designs for the old school fan. Plus, the hockey and basketball teams are both actually exciting this year. And SodaStick has you covered there as well. Go to SodaStick.com, that is S-O-T-A-S-T-I-C-K.com, and use the code P use the code purple insider for 15% off. Well, I think from some aspects that they are running the ball, maybe more than you would expect them to run the ball with Rogers, but also something that stuck out to me was the last two years Rogers has been in the top two when it comes to quarterback rating when using

play action. And that's really Lafleur's thing is designing the bootlegs, the play action, things like that, where they've taken some of the elements that work for Kirk Cousins to make his life easier. And they give them to Aaron Rogers and he's of course better. Although Cousins has always been very good when it comes to play action. But I kind of look at that as a little bit of a test case because a lot of the best coaches in the league are succeeding by using play action a lot. This is McVay, this is Shanahan, and this was Kevin Stefanski when he was here. And then the play action percentage went down over the last two years after Kevin Stefanski left. And that's how, in part, he had a great year with Baker Mayfield two years ago, running the ball, using play action. I think that that could

still be a very, very effective tactic. And then when you have a great quarterback, that's where you could take it to the complete next level. And the reality is, when I look at these guys and these coaches, they've all worked with great quarterbacks. You also have to, there's just no other option. Like let's look at the future of the football. Okay. So Rogers is going to retire eventually. Roethlisberger is retiring, but look at these gentlemen playing in the playoffs. There are just great quarterbacks everywhere. It's Joe Burrow. It's Patrick Mahomes. It's Josh Allen. I still think Dak Prescott is a great quarterback, even though he didn't play well and then made a jerk of himself later. But like,

he's still putting up number one offenses in the NFL, the Rams and Matt Stafford. He's probably going to play for a few more years. You're going to have to continue. And there's, there's always quarterbacks coming out and rising. There were five first round quarterbacks last year. There's probably three of them who become very good. Like it's not going anywhere that the best quarterbacks in the NFL are going to win. So if you're going to win, you have to have one of these quarterbacks. And if you give now, they did have a top five offense with Blake Bortles somehow made Hackett in Jacksonville. But if you give any of these geniuses a bad quarterback or a mediocre quarterback, you're probably going to get just mediocre performance out of them.

So it's always the plan that you have to pair them with someone who's really good. It's can you maximize that really good person? And that's why I like what they've done in Tampa Bay with Tom Brady. When Brady left New England, he had an 88 or something quarterback rating. And then he's been an MVP candidate the last two years, won a Superbowl, a top passing offense in the league, just totally dominant. And I think that their game planning and working around him has been great. And I think the same thing for Aaron Rodgers. We were jokingly, but like not a hundred percent is Rodgers washed just a couple of years ago when he was with McCarthy. And then I think that their

offensive scheme has really helped maximize the last couple of years ago when he was with McCarthy. And then I think that their offensive scheme has really helped maximize the last couple of years of his career. Yeah, you're not wrong in that he does look like a different guy there. And then you look at what emerged too out of this new regime. The Devontae Adams that we're seeing now

is one of the best in the league, maybe the best in the league. He's in the top three probably, and that's sort of aligned with this new offensive system that got the most out of him. And they have handled a very good running back in a really efficient way. Aaron Jones runs for efficiency, not for quantity. They don't run him into the ground.

I think another team in the NFC North should have taken cues from that, but they didn't. And they seem to get the most out of their depth tight ends. They use fullbacks now and then. Alan Lazar, their depth receivers. There is a lot to like about what Green Bay runs. And this is probably about 5% of the equation, but you're also weakening a competitor, which is not, it's not a bad thing for the Vikings.

If you do that, I wouldn't use it as your decision, but as a tiebreaker, Hey, if we can like rob the Packers of this weapon, then Hey, that's not a bad thing. Well, for me, having covered him just a little bit, I was just starting to break in, in Buffalo when he was the offensive coordinator. And so I was producing or doing something while he was doing his interviews. He is about as enthusiastic and upbeat as you're going to find. And I think that that is something that might be quite attractive to the Vikings is somebody who brings a completely different demeanor to football than Mike Zimmer. So we'll see where it goes. I would expect that there's more interviews and things. They just started talking to general manager candidates yesterday. So we've got a little ways to go here. I would expect maybe we're getting closer, not after this week, but into the next week is when we start to understand where it's going.

Greg in the comments asked about Josh McDaniels. That's just a big thumbs down for me because of what he did with Indianapolis and his tenure in Denver. He could stay in New England. Just I don't want any part of that. You agree? I'm probably a little less thumbs. I'm more thumbs sideways on McDaniels. I mean, if you get him to commit to your team and not like do a U-turn

at the 11th hour, having someone that and not like turn do a u-turn at the 11th hour having someone that's not like overly committed to an offensive scheme and is very adaptive is you know appealing to me and and i while i don't want to i don't want you know the whole dynamic he had in denver but i also don't want to be afraid of a retread just because of one, one bad experience that he got attached to the wrong quarterback. Tebow was not, you know, very good. And, uh, and that didn't work out. McDaniels probably handled himself badly too. I think there's red flags, but I wouldn't mind interviewing him. My thing is you just can't have an egomaniac. And I think he's an egomaniac. It just comes off that way. Uh, came off that way in Denver. How does someone come up with a power struggle?

I was reading back on McDaniels, a power struggle in the first year. Usually power struggles take a while to develop, but no instant power struggle with Josh McDaniels. And it seems like the demeanor of people that Belichick has around him. Yeah. Doesn't always fit so good with um other organizations even with the brian flores thing like look i think that miami has no idea what it's doing but it certainly makes you wonder like why did that happen because it wasn't how they performed they were a decent football team two years in a row with meh talent um so it was probably joe judge right getting

along with that would really concern me. And then there were reports a couple of years ago. And this almost, I mean, it's the funniest thing in the entire world that, uh, I think it was Seth Wickersham when he wrote his big report about what went wrong with Brady and new England at the very end and the tension and everything, which is how it always goes. But he wrote that some on the office of coaching staff, wink, wink, thought that they could plug in anybody else to the system and it would have the same results as Brady and I'm like that is the peak arrogance maybe ever that I've ever heard in my entire life of the most arrogant thing you could

possibly say so if McDaniels thought that I've got zero interest in him because it's Brady, folks. It's Brady. While we're talking about the demise of the Patriots, let me just ask you about your opinion on Buffalo's performance. Being from Buffalo, I would just love to know your thoughts on what the city of Buffalo, the euphoria that they are experiencing today and this week. Yeah, I think that there's something to be compared with Vikings fans, except for they weren't mediocre and in the playoff race for a long time.

They were horrendous. They were an absolute laughingstock armpit of the NFL. Like when Stefan Diggs is traded there, the Vikings fans who just agree with everything the team does, we're like, ha, Diggs, that'll show you. You get sent off to Siberia, right? Like, yeah, I mean, that's, but that was the reputation of the team for so many years. It was just misery. And this is what, this is what a quarterback does.

I mean, it's truly like the reason the Vikings don't have a Superbowl ring is the quarterback end of story. They have never had one, never had one, like aside from far for a year, never had one like far, never had one like Rogers, never had one like that guy. The closest they got was Dante. And then it ended quickly and the team was a disaster. But even then, you know, it wasn't like true franchise quarterback for a long period of time. So Buffalo did have this before with Jim Kelly, and this is what it looked like. And so, I mean, that's how much, I mean, Buffalo before Jim Kelly is a disaster. Like this is how much one player, if you hit on that guy can transform an organization. So what you're seeing as euphoria wise and Ryan Fitzpatrick was in the stands with no shirt on that happened, which does not surprise me at all. Just knowing Fitzpatrick a little the stands with no shirt on that happened, which did not surprise

me at all. Just knowing Fitzpatrick a little and how funny that guy is, but also like he loved Buffalo. It became really his home when he was there. Yeah. I think that if you're a Vikings fan, you're looking at it with jealousy saying like, that's what we want is this one person to build the organization around to feel feel like you're a real Super Bowl contender, which is something that those people have not felt

for a very, very long time. So yeah, I mean, it's cool to see. We've seen a bunch of other teams go through it though when you get that person. It's like the Indianapolis Colts when I was growing up were so bad. It was like Jim Harbaugh, Paul Justin. Like they have these ridiculous quarterbacks in there

jeff george they drafted him number one overall he's bad and then peyton manning so they're a laughingstock then peyton manning then their premier franchise it's just like that new orleans uh you had jim everett you had um danny warfel all these a couple of billy joes mixed in there it was and then all of a sudden, right, the light goes on and, and now New Orleans, a premier franchise, like that's how it goes. So anyway, that's, that's kind of how I've been viewing Buffalo. And I'm going to have a guest on later in the week to talk about their perspective of rebuilding their team the way that they did. So I want to ask you about like, give me a one to 10 here, since we're doing thumbs up and thumbs down and different

things. Like we've talked about up and thumbs down and different things. Like we've talked about this as an attractive job for coaches. Cause you get Justin Jefferson and you get to pick your own quarterback with the salary cap situation with a difficult decision on cousins with a fan base. That's antsy. I think that the GM job is attractive, but I also think that it's, it's got landmines like if you get the quarterback thing wrong you just blow up and get fired right um if you lock yourself in and end up in a place

of mediocrity you blow yourself up and get fired right like that that's the way i look at it is even though the wilfs are patient i also think that the Wilfs have things that they need that like they, that they want, that they're going to tell the next general manager, we want you to do X, Y, or Z. Even though they're going to say they're not, I don't believe that. I think if I owned a billion dollars, something I would have a say in it too. I guess I just wonder how you, you look at that, like on a one to 10 scale of how good this job is for the next general manager. Yeah. And just to further your point, I mean, Rick Spielman claimed to have daily dialogue with the owners daily. If you don't care about the day to day, you aren't having daily dialogue, right?

So there's that. And I assume that would be the case with the next GM. There would probably be daily dialogue. There'd probably be a lot of communication, especially as the ownership sort of vets out this new person. But I still think the ownership is a plus for this job. I think the facilities are a plus. I think the offensive talent is an enormous plus. I guess most GMs don't inherit a good quarterback situation. So with the Vikings, the worst position you could be in would be locked in financially for multiple years to the wrong guy. The Vikings are locked in financially to the wrong guy for one year and that's okay if you can get rid of that if you can eliminate that financial problem that albatross one year in and then build the team around someone cheaper and younger that's a pretty good situation um

and you still have the offensive talent around them. You don't have to like spend that much money on the offense. Um, you have to on defense a lot, but the offense is in a good place. So I think it's actually pretty attractive. I'd go like 7.5. Yeah, I think that that's right. I think that it's attractive because you can pick your own quarterback and also because at this point, and I know that maybe some circles of the internet would make it seem different than this,

but I think at this point, moving on from cousins would be a highly popular move. So if you can come in and it isn't like Detroit when they move staffer. And I think Detroit fans are pretty sad about that. It's more of, well, this hasn't worked at all. This strategy of paying this guy

this much money. And so it would be really exciting for the fan base. I think 90% of the fan base or more would look at it as Matt Corral or Sam Howell or Malik Wilson. Yeah, these are our guys. These can be our Josh Allens or our Joe Burrows that completely transform franchises. And even that possibility would be very exciting. So your first move as GM, you could have most of the people saying, all right, let's go. That's the thing we wanted all along over the last two years. So that's a good thing. Where I think it's difficult is you look at some of the older players' contracts here, and there's a case to move on from a lot of them i think that adam phelan is much more of a rework that deal lower the cap hit type

of guy because i don't think you want a different quarterback coming in here without him as a receiver still very good this year the rest of them though harrison smith delvin cook like you're talking about a lot of reason to move on they're very likely to move on from anthony barr those would not be popular moves to trade away harrison smith or to trade away um delvin cook i remember two years ago our friend eric eager who did the reaction with us to the uh firing of zimmer and spielman which by the way quickly became our most listened to episode ever and it was on this stream. So I was very excited about that.

Yeah. Thank you. Just a little side note, according to charitable, which tracks podcast rankings, downloads popularity. We are 25th in the world among football podcasts today. So not bad anyway,

very excited about that. So I appreciate everybody pumping us up there. I'm sure it helped to have them fire the coach. Thanks guys. Catastrophe is good for business. I forget what point I was making, but I think it's a, so you have this balance though, of some very difficult contracts to deal with, but Oh, Eric Eager had mentioned two years ago that it might be time to trade Harrison Smith. And of course the responses to that were, what are you thinking? It was like, it was a very unpopular comment by Eric. And I think that the appreciation for Delvin cook, the appreciation for Harrison Smith and Adam Thielen would have a lot of people going,

what are you doing? I have this guy's Jersey. We love this player. He's not the problem. Why are you moving on from him? And also you have owners who are saying it's not a rebuild. So even though it would be maybe smarter to move on from a running back who had his worst year by PFF grade. And of course the plus 27 thing. I mean, once you get to 27 to beyond for running backs, it's scary out there. But if your ownership says, no, actually, we love Delvin Cook. So we want the offense still involving him a lot. We want him here. We like that contract. Like that's where that's one of, I think the trickiest things that they're going to have to deal with is that there's a good case to reset some of these things and get draft capital back. But you have the owner saying, no, no,

we expect to be in the mix next year. And then maybe a Superbowl contender two years down the road. It's you both have time and not a lot of time, if that makes sense. Right. And we don't know how, you know, mandated that win now statement is. That could just be something to not use the tank word that fans don't want to hear and keeps the fan base appeased. And I think that, yeah, I think they will be in the hunt as they always are. I think that that's totally realistic. I think the Cousins move, the timing

is everything. Because if they make that when the Colts and Eagles did the Wentz trade in February, well, that's huge. Because then you go into free agency knowing you have money to spend, and you go into the draft with that capital potentially, probably a high round pick. you know april or even worse in like june well then all of the offseason has passed you by so you made moves in free agency assuming a shoestring budget you probably didn't bolster your defense and you might you know not have gotten the quarterback you wanted either because you didn't have the extra draft capital so the timing is huge and whoever is the GM, if they're named, let's say it's like the 25th of January. I think they've got like four weeks to figure this quarterback thing out. They've got to move. That's got to be the first order of business. If they want to make that deal, they got to get on the phone. They got to talk to the Steelers. They got to talk to the Eagles. They got to talk to the Dolphins and see who's got the cap space, who's got the draft capital, who likes Kirk Cousins, anyone, anyone, and see if that will happen.

But then if they trade Cousins to Collar, then you're not as pressed to get rid of some of these beloved veterans because you've got suddenly over $20 million, I think, in cap space at that point. You can restructure Cook without cutting him. It doesn't really make sense to cut him this year because his cap hits too high. You could cut Michael Pierce and save $6 million. Restructuring Daniil Hunter, giving him an extension would save a lot of cap space there. So maybe we're talking one or two cap casualties, but if you get rid of Cousins, suddenly the pressure's off and you don't need to have that massive exodus on defense if you don't want to. Yeah, the Cook thing is kind of a post-June 1st that's much more beneficial, or even if it was a post-June 1st trade, hard to pull off. Not an easy thing to move on from, which is the reason that we wonder when you sign

him to the contract like if he falls off and he has injury problems or whatever else this is not going to be easy for you to just snap your fingers and move on from for a couple of years and unless they do the post june one thing even next year it's not super easy and who's trading draft capital for a running back like you're probably getting what third round pick back a fourth round pick back. Like it's not going to be someone like back in the day, giving you the franchise for Herschel Walker. Unfortunately, the league has figured out that was a bad idea. I agree with you that it's going to happen fairly quickly if they're going to move on

from cousins with the new GM. My guess is that that is question number one, two, three, and four from the owners is what are you doing at quarterback? Now, I got something in the mail yesterday. It's a little bit of a problem for this. Jury duty on February 14th. There is no question in my mind that as soon as I walk into that room, they trade Kirk Cousins. There is no doubt.

I now know the day they trade Kirk cousins. It is February 14th. I think when that is when I was 18, I think that would be right in that week. It is going to be that day. There is no question about it. And I already put this off before it was supposed to be during training camp. And I basically said like, look, this is a really bad time for me. And so they bumped it back. Now we know the exact date because I'm going to have jury duty so that's really unfortunate you're gonna be on this the scranton strangler trial they're gonna trade cousins oh man uh so i got an interesting tweet from somebody about cousins

trades we might as well go down the road as we're trying to put ourselves in the shoes of new GM X about trades involving cousins that also involve another quarterback. So the proposed trade from the listener was what about Wentz and then their 2023 first round draft pick? So you have a bridge quarterback. To me, that's a no, because I want a quarterback this year to get started but is there anybody in the league that you would be interested in trading for their quarterback as long as it still came back with a first round draft pick for Kirk Cousins or maybe a second if no one else is giving you a first um how much of a problem do you think Deshaun Watson is because it's a big problem I I think he's a big problem too but I also looked at his dead cap and it basically goes almost all the way down after this season. So if you wanted to take a one-year gamble on Deshaun Watson and get rid of cousins in the process, and maybe Houston is like so sick of the headache that

they'll give you a pick as well. Um, then you're still in cap hell, but you might have an asset, but he also has legal problems hovering over him. It's a crazy move, but I just happened to look at his cap hit. And the fact that you can get out after one year is probably appealing to whoever does acquire him. I assume it's not going to stick around in Houston. Yeah. It seems like Carolina has also been buzzing around this. Miami has been buzzing around this. My thing here, it's like, this is always a struggle. How soulless do you want to be? Because I watched a little bit of the game last night until it got out of hand with Pittsburgh. And so I didn't see this live, but I saw the screenshot of the ESPN broadcast, or was it NBC? Whatever one it was.

Michaels and Collinsworth. Okay, so NBC broadcast, putting up a word cloud of all these ways to describe Ben Roethlisberger and Family Man was the top one. You're like, wait, accused rapist multiple times? Isn't that actually what Ben Roethlisberger, like Ben Roethlisberger was suspended and came back and was a, like a good heartwarming story to some people. And I, he went on and won a lot of football games and everything else. Michael Vick came out of prison to the Philadelphia Eagles, had them in the playoff game. Again, they just turn it into a comeback story.

And with Watson, there's a part of me that says, and I know how bad this sounds, that says, I don't know, man. He's really good at football. And that's all that anyone will ever care about. But then there's the other part that you go, also, how does that look though? Like, how does that look to your fan base?

How does that come across to half of Vikings fans are women for one, which shouldn't be the reason, but also like, holy cow, that looks pretty darn bad. And also the possibility that he does it again. Think about their recent red flag guy with Delvin Cook, who we were told, no, no, there'll never be any problems ever again after college. Well, you know, there's a lawsuit that says that, you know, maybe different. It's a very hard one because teams have so often benefited from taking the guy that has huge problems and i don't know how to

deal with the part that would put you immediately as a super bowl contender with deshaun watson but the other part where you think gosh bringing that guy into your community is not something you necessarily want to do teams keep signing james winston and making him their starting quarterback you're like uh that guy antonio brown gets gets a job every year right tyree wins the super bowl he won the super bowl he was great did anyone care like that's i don't know it's like do i want to do i want to sign off on how soulless we are about this like i don't but i also recognize that we are like Like we should recognize that Deshaun Watson probably at some point will be a starter in the NFL again.

And whoever is his employer will probably have success. That's probably what's going to happen. There haven't been a lot of rumblings lately about the legal stuff there, but as Mike Zimmer so famously said about Dalvin Cook, it's a civil matter. And I think teams kind of draw the line there. The investigators, from what I've read, are reading into this, trying to see whether it's going to become criminal or if it stays civil, and that matters to teams. We got way down the Watson road here, but I think that in any

conversation you have about quarterbacks, you at least mention him. You bring him to the table. People can shoot it down. The ownership can shoot it down. I know the Wilfs would prefer probably a little more of a clean cut image for their face of the franchise, but I think you have to have that conversation. Does anyone else around the league strike you, Matthew, as a potential bridge? Yes. Tua and Daniel Jones. And I'll tell you why. Neither one of those guys are franchise quarterbacks. And I think we know that, but could they be good, competent, cheap, and, and bridge you to the next level. And maybe they play better than they did before in their other teams. I mean, Daniel Jones is paired with the worst head coach in the league or whatever urban Meyer got fired, but like beyond urban Meyer, the worst

head coach in the league, their weapons got hurt their offensive line. They drafted a complete bust. It seems like it left tackle and Andrew Thomas fourth overall, you know, that kind of thing. So he's had this really bad situation. He's shown some flashes. You bring him in. He plays okay, or maybe even good, but you know, he's not your guy. You know that he is not like dead set. Daniel Jones, our future quarterback.

This can be somebody who's a bridge quarterback to your next guy. But if your rookie quarterback isn't ready to go, Daniel Jones, and then you just move. Mariota is the same way for this. Mariota competent quarterback. You can't have a team that has Justin Jefferson on it. That just plays a rookie. Who's not ready or just plays some quarterback. Who's terrible. You can't have Geno Smith playing with Justin Jefferson. Then it's going to be extremely miserable for an entire year. And you're going to waste the year of his rookie contract with someone like Tua or Daniel Jones. I think that they can be competent with everybody being on the same page

that this is not going to be your franchise quarterback. It's Matt Corral, Sam Howell, whatever other quarterback, Kenny Pickett, whatever other quarterback you draft. Yeah yeah I can't remember the Giants cap situation but I know Miami who you brought up has a phenomenal cap situation and they could absorb Cousins extended or even Cousins without an extension too because I think whoever gets Cousins takes on 35. 10 of that stays with Minnesota. 35 gets shipped off. Or you could also negotiate some kind of split. But either way, Miami, super logical. A roster that has won without great quarterback play, add in Cousins to the mix. Maybe you can convince yourself that you're right there. And then you've got Tua and Collar.

Failure, if you fail on a quarterback on a rookie deal, that's cheap and does not have to be devastating. If you take a shot on Tua, there's not a lot of bad that can happen. All of the risk, the actuaries in Miami would be saying, don't do this guys, because the risk is pretty enormous. For the Vikings, that would be great.

Daniel Jones, it's hard to get on board with that. It kind of feels a little bit Darnold-y, you know, trying to resurrect a New York quarterback in a new home. But I appreciate your logic. And I could see that as a one-year trial. Yeah, I think he was a lot better than Darnold. Let me see, where did he rank this year? He was 19th this year by PFF,

right around where Daniel Jones and Teddy and Tua were. So I think at least he's got some physical gifts. It's a little Tannehill-ish, although Tannehill was better in Miami than Daniel Jones has been so far. But if it's good and he plays really well, gets you to 10 wins or something, but then you just move on after that. And you're like, great, we had a good season and we were competitive. And then you can actually trade him. Maybe that's

another part of this. Really? I mean, the Kansas city chiefs got a good return for Alex Smith. So if you took another quarterback, play them for a year and sat your quarterback Really? I mean, the Kansas City Chiefs got a good return for Alex Smith. So if you took another quarterback, played them for a year and sat your quarterback and they got eight, nine, ten wins, somebody else is trading for them and you're breaking the game. The only there was one more that I thought of. I'm not so much on the Wentz side. I don't really have any interest in that happening because I think we just know exactly what he is. But anyway, so that's, that's sort of, there's so many options here for what they could do. And I know that people in the comments are mentioning Russell Wilson. I just don't know that Russell Wilson wants to come to another team that looks just like his team. That's in the middle of the pack. They have great receivers, two of them Vikings have two great receivers.

Defense is a complete mess. I think if you're Wilson, you want to go to a team where you're going to be able to win like next year. It would be my thought, or he's just going to stay in Seattle. So anyway, well, we do this every week, sometimes on Monday, sometimes Tuesday, depending on how the schedule goes here, streaming on Bring Me the news so uh everybody who watched this if you want to hear more you can check out our daily show purple insider if this is the first time you're checking us out we talk vikings football every single day and uh read our written work too we got lots happening at bring me the news and purpleinsider.substack.com is the newsletter and we're also building a new website which i'm excited excited about. So good stuff. Sam, thank you for your time and much more to come, my friend.

Thanks, Matthew. Thanks for watching, everybody.