Purple Insider - a Minnesota Vikings and NFL podcast - Vikings camp Day 9: McCarthy's best day in pads gets chippy (Part 2)

Episode Date: August 3, 2025

Matthew Coller talks about the Vikings' 9th camp practice, which ended up having several pushing matches break out, one including McCarthy

How do the corners look? Anybody stand out? I mean, day in and day out, Jeff Okuda is having good days. Jeff Okuda is all sorts of all over the place. He blew up a run play today where he got into somebody. I mean, just came in and slammed into somebody, drove him back. Jeff Okuda looks like somebody who could play linebacker in this league. He is just a huge guy and he's got strength and power in the run game, seriously in the run game, uh, and that's shown up in his data before that he's been very, very good when it comes to, um, the run. So actually now that Okuda comes up and look, you know, it's funny is that Isaiah

Rogers has basically not been mentioned at all. Um, and I think he's looked really good. I think he's looked really solid. He, he just hasn't gotten a lot of targets because a lot of times that they're going twos versus ones, how has been struggling so much. Uh, but I think that the movement skill of Isaiah Rogers is really, really special. So speaking of Okuda, why don't we hear from, um, Brian Flores about Jeff Okuda, because he is becoming like, there's no, we need some version of.

Mr. We have Mr. Mankato for the undrafted free agent or late draft pick who ascends, right. And shines throughout training camp, but we don't have any name for the guy that surprises us the most, or is the former draft pick taking his last shot at being a starter? It might be the Jeff Okuda award someday. If you guys can think of other players who are like that in Vikings history, let me know.

Uh, I'm blanking on too many of them because usually this doesn't work out. So here's what Brian Flores had to say about Jeff Okuda. Right. Is a somebody who has always been on your radar or just over the years, have you studied him like? You know, I think, you know, when he was coming out, obviously highly rated. So, you know, I've watched him for a long time. The skills there, the athleticism, the length,

I was excited to have the opportunity to, that we had the opportunity to work with him. And again, I think he's done a nice job and I think he's improving. To answer your question, yes. I think we end up watching a lot of corner safeties, really all positions. And I think that's a good thing. I always tell young coaches, study all the guys

at your position that are at the combine, or have some bug, get drafted. Because inevitably, three, four years down the road, you'll probably end up writing another report on them, via free agency, via trade or whatever, and have a little bit of background and say, hey, I did some work on Okudo or Isaiah Rogers years previous.

Maybe that's my scouting background talking, probably is. But I think that helps to have kind of a history with your own history with a player and that's the case with Okuda. And I'm glad we have him. Again, there's a lot of work left to do still early, but he's off to a good start. How unique is his style of play compared to the other corners you have on your roster? Well you know I think physically he's you know a big, he's got long arms so his ability to you know potentially put hands on on receivers is you know it's something he's he's done well over the course of his career and now, and now it's just, you know, how consistent can we be with that?

So there you go. Uh, mentioning at the end, uh, some of the techniques and being consistent, which I think that Jeff Okuda still has to prove and, uh, Flores was very complimentary of McKay Blackman today. So I don't think that this is, I kind of go back and forth every day. I'm like, is this locked up or not? Because yesterday O'Connell made a comment that made me think that, okay, this looks like it's locked up and it's not going to be that much of a competition. But then Flores kind of left the door open for that a little

bit more today. But, uh, you know, clearly somebody that he's had his eye on for years. And if there's someone who's going to make the most suddenly out of Jeff Okuda, it probably is Brian Flores, but his raw physical skill in a training camp really, really shines. Uh, Carl says, uh, is the backup center looking okay? And Logan Brown or Rouse looking good. I would not say that either tackle for the backups has looked good, but they have been going up against the ones so far. And that's really, really tough. They're just not built for that to go up against Van Ginkle,

Dallas Turner, Jonathan Grenard. Um, so I don't think they've had a great camp, but I wouldn't have expected them to. I think pre-season games are going to be huge for both of those guys. And then as far as Michael Juergens, uh, he got a little bit of a message, I think yesterday where they had some other people take snaps after there was some snapping issues, but he was back in today and Ryan Kelly took one series off today. Didn't look like there was any issue. Uh, just had one series off and Michael Juergens was in there snapping. Um, so there may be some snapping issues. I think Juergens has been okay.

Again, like these guys are getting destroyed by the interior of this great defensive line, which does make it a lot harder. Um, but. Yeah. None of the backups are going to be very good when you get to that point, like backup centers, there aren't very many good ones in the entire NFL. And then you're talking about, they've already got Justin school. So you're talking one level down with an undrafted free agent

and a sixth round pick. I mean, they have some depth, but I don't think it's really exciting as it probably is not in most NFL cities. Mr. Woosh, Woosa. Is it Woosa? Mr. Woosa. Is that Boondocks in your avatar? That's a great show.

Boondocks Saints. Is that what it's called? I used to watch that show in college. Anyway. So anyway, he says I got distracted there. I want to see how against the different defense before I make judgment. I think that you're being fair there, uh, in wanting to see Sam Howell play in preseason games and play more against the twos.

But even when you're playing against the ones, you should still be getting the football out even on seven on seven. So like, okay, yeah, the pass rush has been a nightmare, but seven on sevens, you should be able to get people to football. And he hadn't been doing it, but I thought it was a big day for him today to look like he was actually in a little bit more control of the offense. He threw the ball a little bit better. There's some nice plays by the backup receivers. That's all I'm not asking for much. I'm not asking him to look like a starting quarterback. Uh, but yes, I, I agree with you in principle overall to give him a little bit more time, give him at least a preseason game and some more practices before

we make judgment. But I think we and we're always trying to evaluate what they do and what they say and what they've done is given Brett Ripon some reps with the twos the last couple of days. I think that says something about how they feel. Uh, how has performed so far. Uh, Jack's park says, uh, this Hawk injury shining light on the lack of depth that tight end. Are there any other tight ends other than Oliver making plays in camp? I think Ben Urasek has been pretty decent. He's made some plays. He's made some nice catches.

He definitely has hands. Giovanni Ricci got caught a ball. He's bounced around to a bunch of different teams and his battled injuries, but Urasek would be the guy that I would probably point out the most so far. But you know, it is not, it's not as deep as when you have Johnny Munt. I mean, that's just a fact. But I think that if Hockinson was down, they would just play Oliver and play more receivers instead of playing backup tight ends. But you know, it's so funny because Kevin O'Connell loved Johnny Munt and it became a meme. He's the best third tight end in the

league. I think it was a West Phillips who said that. And we kind of all laughed at it like, Oh, that's pretty, you know, that's funny and that kind of thing. But at the same time you're, you're right that you get one guy banged up and then all of a sudden you're talking about playing an undrafted free agent or a guy who's really bounced around who was an undrafted free agent once upon a time. I mean, right now that position is not solved. And the fact that Gavin Bartholomew is out with no sign of him coming back, it does make it very possible that they would go into free agency after cut downs or claim somebody at the tight end position if they're not thrilled with your ASAC. I think your sex been good, but they're going to have a much more detailed evaluation there

knowing what he's supposed to do on a given play. Nathan says wide receiver three and four go well three is clearly Jalen Naylor. I don't think it's been a great camp for Jalen Naylor so far. I think it's been okay. I know O'Connell said the other day that he thought it had been really good and maybe from an assignment perspective, that would be my guess is what he meant is it's not easy to just early in camp switch assignments, but you have to do that in real games. I think from an actual going up and getting it and making plays on the football, it has

not been as good for Naylor, but he's not being unseated. Number four, right now is lucky Jackson and it's on everybody else to go make it not lucky Jackson, Rondale more. I will have a story coming out soon. Hopefully on Monday about Rondale more, I sat down with him for a conversation the other day to write about him coming back from his injury and having a shot here in the Vikings offense, but he has yet to prove that he deserves that. And Ty Felton to me is not really in the mix. So it's kind of lucky Jackson Rondale more for wide receiver for at this moment. Uh, Bob with the super chat. Thank you so much,

Bob. Uh, is there a bigger skill disparity between McCarthy and Howell than there was between Darnold and McCarthy? Oh yeah. Oh, uh, enormous. Yeah. Enormous. I mean, last year, like, so Sam Darnold is one of the most gifted quarterbacks to come out in the draft the last 10 years.

It's very clear from his physical ability. Even when he was drafted, the New York Jets ignored some things about his turnovers and stuff like that based on his physical ability, which is freakish. He is a Darnal is a huge guy, throws a beautiful football. He's super strong. He doesn't need to have any sort of platform to throw the ball off of, just can flick it and it goes miles. He's a greatly talented quarterback. I don't think that McCarthy has the raw talent of Sam Darnold. Um, and again, we're talking about one of the most purely talented quarterbacks, arm strength, accuracy, all that sort of stuff to come out.

But it's not that far away. It's not like you're going from, you know, Darnold to someone who doesn't have a great arm, doesn't know how to run the offense or, or isn't a very fast or, or anything like that. Like, like McCarthy's a first round pick physical talent. There's no question about it. The way he runs the velocity throws the football with, uh, he can throw off platform. Like I was describing the throw yesterday about throwing back across his

body, putting huge velocity. He loves that kind of three quarter arm. I'm on the move, just let it rip type of throw. Trying to think who does that. It's not, it's not like a farve, but there it's just kind of this little, like I'm on the move and I can kind of flip the hips like a short stop and flick it over to first base. It's kind of got that throw the gap between McCarthy and how physically is enormous. I mean, it's a first round pick versus a fifth round pick.

It's a massive difference. Howell doesn't really have anything more than a below average arm. And I think he's like a decent athlete, but he's very small too, which, which matters. He's not very big. Um, JJ McCarthy is big. I think he, I don't know what his height weight would be today, but it's probably six, two and a half, 220 pounds, something like that. And he can really move. So yeah. Um, let's see. Uh, John, John, um, let's see. Uh, John says Blackman. I assume that's a question about Mackay Blackman. Uh, at very least Mackay Blackman was mentioned today by Brian Flores as someone he thought

had had a good training camp that was still getting back into the swing of things coming off of his injury. And I'm going to tend to believe that he's taken a lot of reps. He's been out there. He hasn't looked like McKay Blackman from a couple of years ago yet to me, but this is the first two weeks coming off of a major injury. So does that mean that he starts to ascend as we go forward here? Does it mean that we do see more of a competition between him and Okuda? Um, because Flores at the end of his comment there about Jeff Okuda kind of left that door open to, Hey, I need to see consistency from Okuda.

And that might still allow Blackman to be in this mix. I kind of thought yesterday, um, with Kevin O'Connell's comment, that it's, that's not really the case that what O'Connell said was we see a clear role for him. And when you say clear role, to me, that means in the lineup, playing starting or that kind of Shaq Griffin role from last year. Um, so we'll see how it plays out. I think what might tell us a little bit, little hint will be if Okuda plays in the preseason game along with Blackman, then we might still have some competition there. If one of

them does not play or well, if Okuda doesn't play and Blackman does well then maybe we've got more of an indication of where they stand because it used to be that Zimmer would just show us the depth chart by playing all the starters in the preseason game but now you almost have to judge it the opposite way if a guy doesn't play that means really good things about him. Bradley does McCarthy look as good in practice as cousins did up until this point? Um, no, not, not as consistent, not as consistent as Kirk. I mean, when you've been in the league for this long, um, yeah, I don't have the, uh, I don't have the diet Dr. Pepper today. Sorry.

I clicked the wrong, I clicked the wrong comment there. Uh, I got, I got the Pepsi go, Hey, whatever, uh, soda brand wants to sponsor this show, you'll be the one that I drink during every one of these live streams. So keep that in mind out there, marketing executives, just in case, um, cousins was more consistent at practice where the bad practices were still fine. And the good practices were really, really good where it looked like he could miss. Um, but cousins had spent how many years, you know, 10 years refining his throwing ability and had run many, many practices.

The exception to that would be 2022, uh, where he was learning the new offense and there were some really bad days, 2018, there were some really bad days of learning the new offense. But I mean, McCarthy is just getting his feet wet in doing this. And to be at this point so far, I think is pretty darn good to be at this point with the lack of experience because Kirk had years and years and years of experience. So we should be hitting deep balls. He should be executing. I mean, there was seven on sevens for Kirk cousins where the ball never hit the ground. Every single passes of completion. I mean,

we're just talking about two very different things at this point where McCarthy you're looking for gains time in and time out. When Kirk was the quarterback, I would often just watch other players. Like I knew he was the quarterback. I wasn't really even looking at him a lot of times. I'm watching a receiver. I'm watching a corner. And that's why in years past, I've come and done these shows and I've probably had a lot better information. How does this guy look? How does that guy look like there's so much focus for me on McCarthy. I'm trying to pick up things on other players as much

as I can. Um, but with Kirk, you just knew it was going to be mostly on point except for those two years where there were some rough moments. Uh, as far as the fan dual question of the day, we've got a wide range of answers here. J moles 60% that three NFC North teams will make it. Tim is only 20%. Uh, we've got 70% from Tom, 80% from Bradley, uh, 60% from Aaron, only 33 from, uh, KRAWL. I don't know how to say that. Uh, Northern pride, 33% Julio going 68 Dan, 42.4, three one. Thank you, Dan Ron 65 all over the map, all over the map. Um, three made it last year.

Uh, Brett adds in, but the schedule will be harder this year. I think it's very possible, but I would only do probably a coin flip. I think I would only do probably a coin flip. Uh, first name, last name says, uh, as far as the fan dual question, I don't think it's likely because we aren't facing the AFC South again. There aren't three or four free wins on everyone's schedule. I agree with that. Kirk going 25% Brett with 30.

I think that somewhere between 30 and 50 is the right answer because there is definitely a chance, uh, and yet I don't think it's super likely that all the teams have a lot of things go right for them, including the schedule as they did last year, SWAT nine one, one that sounds like a network TV show says, uh, do you think the Vikings should reach out to Washington to make a trade for Terry McLaurin? Um, look, nobody loves receivers more than me. You guys know that I want more of them drafted. I want more of them acquired.

Every receiver you can get me, go get them. I don't know how that would work. Uh, I don't know. Like, how do you get them the ball enough and how do you get them enough money? You've already got Jefferson making top-notch money. McLaurin's going to make 30 million. And if McLaurin's looking at DK Metcalf and saying that guy got 32, I need 32. That's probably what he's saying. And I just, I just couldn't, can't make that work.

Now, if there is another receiver that kind of ends up on the trade block or something, might be worth looking at just because the confidence is not crazy high in what they have right now behind Jordan Addison, Justin Jefferson, and Jalen nailer. And even, you know, maybe there could be some improvement on nailer, although I don't think there's tons of wide receiver threes who are way better, but, uh, you know, a guy like McClaren is going to be tough to get your hands on cause you're going to have to give them a lot and him a lot of money.

That would be if the Vikings didn't have a wide receiver one or two, then I would say, go for it. But if they did it, I money that would be if the Vikings didn't have a wide receiver one or two then I would say go for it but if they did it I think it would be great like any any the closer you can get to 3d try to do it uh chili willy it's a great name chargers didn't play heinecke the other night they have lance as a backup so uh usually in the hall of fame game, they, um, tend to play the quarterback that they don't like. They, they play the third stringer, the fourth stringer. So Trey Lance, even though he looked pretty good, I don't think he's going to be the backup

quarterback for the chargers. It's probably him as QB three and Taylor Heinecke with a lot more experience as QB two. I don't think Trey Lance is the type of quarterback the Vikings would look at, but maybe they can look at, I mean, I mean, if they love Trey Lance, then maybe they would look at Taylor Heinecke and try to acquire him as a backup because he's been around right now. It's probably better to just stick with Sam Howell because is there a real difference between Taylor Heinecke and Sam Howell? That's the, there probably is not.

I mean, backup quarterbacks aren't going to be good, but you just need Sam Howell to look like he could get into a game and keep you alive if they could run and run some play actions and hit some shots down the field. But to me, the ball is just coming out way too slow. And that we start to understand why there were so many interceptions that Sam howled through like, yeah, he threw a ton of passes, but I think the ball just doesn't get out fast from him. And when you have that kind of delay, now think about what I mean by a delay in real

time, it's crazy fast out there. And if you're just an eye blink slower than NFL speed, you're going to throw five more picks, 10 more picks than the next guy. And that's the difference between a starter and almost out of the league. Bob says, has Brando been mixing in a tackle? No, he is not. Other than one day where someone was out or it was a veteran day and he played at right tackle. But other than that, no, I mean, I think he's the emergency tackle. I don't, I don't think they wanted to play tackle though.

Bitter Bruce. I think Hutchinson was the last guard with this much nasty fries, plays through the whistle on every play. I honestly think you're right and that's kind of sad that it's been that long since we could say someone really brought a nasty presence to that position and was also good. Justin says the starting offense is likely to play in the first game for a little bit. Do you anticipate the same for the starters on defense? Sands hit man. Maybe I don't know, I mean.

Guys like Harrison Phillips, J Van Hargrave, Jonathan Allen. Blake Cashman, Jonathan Grenard, Van Gink. I just, I don't want any of those guys anywhere near a preseason game. So I would say no, maybe for one series just to put the pads on, but I, I don't think that those guys need to play anything. I think it would be good for JJ McCarthy to put on the pads, get out there, run a series and just feel good about it. Go score a touchdown, feel good about it. Go score a touchdown,

feel good about it and, uh, get everybody a little bit on the same page. But even then, you know, you're not going to have Jefferson. I don't know if they want Addison to play in the preseason. Maybe there, maybe it's just that one series. Then you get them out of there. That's my expectation. I am sure we will not be told by Kevin O'Connell until we see it next Saturday. But on the defensive side, I, there's very few of those guys that I need to see on the field. I would like to see Okuda. I'd like to see black men's and Maya Vaughn, Levi, Drake Rodriguez, Jaylen Redmond. I mean, there's a lot of players, Bo Richter, gay Murphy, a lot of guys I want to see. I don't need to see Jonathan. Granard. Uh, he's good. We're all set there.

Uh, Jack's park says, uh, what a great free agent, uh, signing Mason was quasi nails free agency, technically a trade and a sign, but your point is taken that that one is, I think. Just through the NFL off season, Illuminati conversation, like the national analysts, I think that acquisition has largely been ignored. The fantasy people like it, but as far as the discussion around this team and around what they can be, Jordan Mason might be one that halfway through the season, everyone's going, oh yeah, that's right.

That guy they got who is averaging five yards of carry in his beast. That's how he's looked so far. Uh, Matthew, how many games are we going to win this year? Well, fellow Matthew, uh, I have said 11, I'm not changing from 11, but I will say that the fact that JJ McCarthy has kind of come out of a dip there, um, just like a downturn, uh, in camp a couple of days ago and come back on the upswing has made me more confident. A little event like today of him showing that he's a dog and he wants to fight with this team.

I like that. I mean, maybe it shouldn't be something that raises confidence, but it's, it's sports. It's aggressive. It's violent. It takes guys who want it more than the next guy and you like to see it. So my confidence in 11 wins is pretty high and maybe it could be one less than that. Maybe it could be one more, but I think that's the range that they are in. Uh, Rob says, Hawkinson had 45, 450 yards in 10 games. It was hardly down and made some really

good plays later in the season. Nothing to worry about from him. Well, I mean, today, if there's anything to a groin injury, that would be worrisome if he slowed up from that. But your point is taken. Look, I think that there was, there's always a few moments with Hockinson where he doesn't make a particular catch and you remember it and you go, Oh man, that touchdown that was dropped into the hands of the chargers or last year against Detroit, where Darnold leads them a little too far to the sideline, but he's got on his hands. And maybe if he just brings it in, there's been a couple of those with Hawkinson that I think got some people down on him.

I don't think that he was as good last year in terms of explosiveness. And when someone gets paid, everybody expects you to be different than you were before. And that's just the fact of the matter that any player who, and we went through this with Anthony Barr, any player who gets a contract, there's always going to be fans who say guys overpaid, he's overrated, that sort of stuff. I think Hockinson is a really good player who can be tremendous in his offense with JJ McCarthy, but he's not a perfect player. He's not again, he's not Tony Gonzalez.

He's probably not going to be a future Hall of Famer. He's just a really good solid player who can do a lot of things and Stephanie makes a great point that darn old used Hawkinson differently than cousins. That's that's absolutely true. But it's not like he did nothing. It's not like he never had good games last year. He did have a few where he was a legit impact player. John says, I don't think the fact that his yards after catch is horrible. I don't like that he, I'm not sure what this is supposed to say, but I think you're saying that he doesn't have

good yards after catch. I mean, he had been good in yards after catch when he was healthy. And what he really does, I think here's, here's one of the issues too, with Hawkinson is that to understand why Hawkinson is good is to kind of get where he fits just in general in the, uh, like offense. So you have so many deep zone coverages and what Hockinson is really good at is seeing the defense understanding what is happening defensively and then getting to The right spot for the quarterback to find him as a target there. That is not sexy work It's eight yards a catch. Sometimes it's 15 yards a catch

eight yards a catch. Sometimes it's 15 yards a catch. It's not going to blow your mind. And so I think that we just expect every person to be flashy and to make every single catch, which you know, he's not going to do. But those types of plays, there was a play against San Francisco in 2023, one of Kirk's best games. It was a third down in like 12. Everybody went deep. He dropped it down to Hockinson. He got 14. They go, they score. It was a third down in like 12. Everybody went deep. He dropped it down to Hocketson. He got 14. They go, they score. It helps them win the game. Stuff like that is not that memorable and it's not that exciting. And he's not creating a million explosive plays. But also when you have a tight end who doesn't do that stuff,

Irv Smith Jr, then you really notice it. You really, really notice it. Uh, when you don't have a tight end. Who's great at identifying stuff. So I'm going to continue to feel like Hockinson is set up to have a really good year and be very important this year. And also when it comes to how much guys are paid, I honestly don't care anymore. Like not under these circumstances, when it came to the Vikings from 2018 to 2020, whatever three, it mattered a lot because you were paying the

quarterback a lot of money now. Oh my gosh, someone's overpaid. Does it matter? Has it restricted them from doing anything? The answer is no. Um, so that's different when you have a rookie quarterback contract that allows you to work around. Uh, maybe Hawkinson will be overpaid by 5 million versus his production,

but I'm not that concerned about it because I'd rather just have TJ Hawkinson. Uh, Aaron says, uh, they had eight captains last year and then you named the captains, uh, beside McCarthy being a captain. Who else do you see? Grenard. You know, I've never really paid like a ton of attention to who gets the captaincy, but Grenard to me has been that guy. I think that you are... easily naming him a captain at this point.

That he has done it with his actions at this camp and his words and setting the tone for everyone from day one. But really the actions are what matter the most and come out and practice like a madman and just said, this is how we're going to practice. I honestly think he set the whole tone for the whole camp just, and a lot of it has also been frustrating. I'm sure for McCarthy and how to be like, stop, but at the same time, like it is really been a, I don't want to say a different guy, but somebody

who has taken a franchise and said, this is, this is mine. I'm that dude. I am that number one edge rusher elite player in the league who wants to win and it's been something to see and actually Brian Flores talked about that so why don't we hear from him you come at Gernard earlier I mean he was pretty good last year obviously like how much more do you think he has left in his potential or whatever to ascend and what areas would that be in and I think he's certainly, there's more left there.

I think there's, obviously he had a great year, but he'll tell you and as coaches, it's our job to try to find a little edge or a little space where there can be some improvement. Maybe that's the difference between one more tip pass that turns into something else or one more edge set that turns into, you know, TFL. I think he, you know, he's worked on his pass rush. He's worked on, you know, setting the edge and run game. But also, you know, how do I set somebody else up? You know, and I think he's that kind of unselfish player.

He's a very smart player. You want to talk protections, he's good. You want to talk run game, he's good. You want to talk some pass coverage, he can do that too. So I think there's a few different way spots in those areas where he can make some improvements, not just for himself, but to help the team. And we've had those conversations

and he's rushing great right now. And I think that's the thing that everybody goes to immediately, but he's certainly gotten better in a lot of other areas, along with the pass rush, which is very important. So there you go, Brian Flores on Jonathan Grenard, who it's been, everybody has taken note that Jonathan Grenard has turned it up a notch in this training camp. Uh, Melkill, I love the Randall Cunningham award for Jeff O'Cuda, the random guy

who shows up, former fairly high draft pick. There's one in almost every training camp that then all the sudden, you know, turns into, uh, a significant player for the team when maybe he was left for dead somewhere else. So I like that. I like that a lot. Um, let's see here from, uh, Mo Mo Savage, great name. Are you a linebacker? Uh, says, uh, what's stopping JJ McCarthy for being a superstar? He's six, three, two 20 strong arm can run high four or five. Seems like he has insane drive to get better and

compete. I think that you're probably given a little bit of extra credit on maybe the height, weight and speed there. But when you think about the supporting cast, the situation that he has, I think there's two different conversations with JJ McCarthy. The first conversation is what are our expectations this year? So I just did a podcast with Kevin Seifert that you can go and listen to. And I was laughing, looking at the comments because Seifert is talking about how much he's enjoyed covering JJ McCarthy, but doesn't really know how to project him just yet. And is trying to figure that out as we go forward. And every single comment is JJ McCarthy is going to be the greatest quarterback of all

time. Why are you so negative? And he's not negative at all. Like in this podcast. And yet there's just all of this sort of why, why aren't you saying he's going to be the goat? Right. Um, but I remember last year in the middle of training camp where he had really shown some exceptional ability to throw the football and velocity on the ball and athleticism that you were talking about. And he is a five star prospect from Michigan.

This is not, you know, a two star from Toledo who's just out there trying his darndest like this is a guy who's supposed to be that, uh, he's supposed to be this good. So, yeah, I mean, I agree that the ceiling is higher than people made it out to seem. And, and I talked about that last year that he was talked about as a Matt Hasselback kind of limited ceiling, but he's going to try hard and be real competitive and all that. And I think the ceiling is higher, but this year that's not the

conversation of the ceiling. He's 22. When does a quarterback hit his ceiling? 25, 27? We're a little ways away from that ceiling for JJ McCarthy. So there's setting expectations that are reasonable based on his first year ever starting. And then there's ceiling. Like ceiling by the end of 2026. Could JJ McCarthy with his skillset in the supporting cast and coaching and physical ability be a top 10 quarterback?

Yeah, he could. Is it likely that he will be a top five quarterback today? No. Is it likely that he'll ever reach Josh Allen or Lamar Jackson? No, I don't see that happening, but he could reach the levels of other quarterbacks that we've talked about a lot on the show that we see reaching NFC championship games, Super Bowls on the right team, things like that. When I say Dak Prescott, Jared Goff, Brock Purdy, Jalen Hurts, it's so funny to me when the comments are like, those quarterbacks are terrible. He'll be better. Like what I just named you the last two quarterbacks with the top offenses in the league and the other two went to the Super Bowl. So I think he can fit into that tier of quarterbacks.

That's not an alien, but under the right circumstances has a chance to go compete for a Super Bowl. Brahmi says his buddy named after, you guys saw buddy stick his nose in here. He is, he's getting much more comfortable with live streaming. Now we had a snafu the other night where he ripped all my wires apart and that did inspire me to change the camera angle and situation a little bit to make sure that that couldn't happen again. But he has gotten very comfortable with it. He's got his bed to my left. He gets up and sniffs me from time to time.

We just adopted him last week. He's a Greyhound. He is a very, very good dog. Very loving, very playful, and a little mischievous, I would say. Little bit mischievous. Kind of gets into stuff a little bit, but he has been a lot of fun to have around. Antoine wants to know about Ty Felton.

I think we need to give Ty Felton probably time to develop. I don't think that he's there yet. I see every day something with Ty Felton that I like. And I see something with Ty Felton that makes me think, um, it's going to be another year until he's probably able to step into a wide receiver three type of role, uh, Arizona's sky. Think about the timeline of McCarthy. Um, McCarthy's money.

Kelly becomes Juergens. Hawkinson becomes Oliver. Addison becomes Ty Felt. I'm not really sure that I follow along with what you're, what you're saying there. Um, do you mean like, as McCarthy gets older and then eventually has to sign a contract that those other players, is that what you mean? Um, that those other players are the ones that would have to play instead. Uh, if that's, if that's your point, like it's something that we can never, ever, uh, forget about the team build here and the way that it's

been built so strongly is that rookie contract is so important. And it, but if they get to a point where they're paying him 150 million and fifty million dollars or I don't know Maybe it'll be four hundred million dollars by then. That means that that's great. That means he's played well enough to deserve it Totally disagree with this William Peyton Manning didn't have the best arm, but that never slowed him down. I Completely disagree. I think Peyton Manning had a freaking unbelievable arm. What? had a freaking unbelievable arm. What? Uh, no, Peyton Manning had an amazing arm.

Peyton Manning was six foot five, 240 pounds and could throw it like an, a rocket and was unreal, accurate, insane, insane, insane accuracy. Let's not be talking about Peyton Manning. and last night somebody was into the Tom Brady or something So, you know, I like this is what I'm saying is when I start talking about these other quarterbacks Well, I think McCarthy will be in the bucket of you guys want to say Peyton Manning and Tom Brady And also, you know McCarthy does have a good arm. I don't think arm is holding him back. Uh, Dino says, uh, how is the rookie, uh, defensive tackle Dawkins Tyreon Ingram Dawkins? Well, getting in the first team today, I thought was a really good sign for him. And he's just gotten more and more action out there.

And that's been really good to see from him because he was talked about as really just a project type of player great athlete didn't play a lot of football at Georgia just starting to get his feet wet but playing a lot with the second team like the way that it works out is if you're playing with the first team there's a great chance that you are a real starter come the first day of the season. If you're playing with the second team, they at least think that you would be worthy of getting in the game if they needed you. And if you're not on the first or the second, then you're fighting for a practice squad spot. And the fact that Ingram Dawkins is getting more and more with the second team says to me that they think that he might start out as somebody who's I don't know like inactive on game day and then works his way up and up to maybe being active and then we'll see these project players usually take more than just one training camp.

But there is a possibility and we've seen other guys carve out a role for themselves as a rotational D line player. Uh, Julio says no one's talking about Blake Cashman. How is he doing? I mean, Blake Cashman is just a great NFL player. Uh, Cashman's one of those guys that you just don't talk a lot about because he's so consistent and solid and good. Um, uh, this is funny. I'm sorry. Yeah. Blake Cashman's fine.

I mean, he's been really good. Uh, he's blitzes. He makes plays and coverage. This, this is great. This is great. We need, you know what we need? We need a scouting school. We need Matthew Coller scouting school so we could talk about how to

evaluate talent. Uh, I don't know how to pronounce your name. The something says, uh, you saying Darnold is a, is the most talented quarterback to come out in the last 10 years is preposterous. I was with you until that. So I did not say he was the most. I said he was one of the most talented quarterbacks to come out. And that is an absolute fact.

My friend go look at any scouting report of Sam Darnold. Also, I watched Sam Darnold play in front of me, like literal feet in front of me during all of training camp and every single game last year. Did we watch the same football? You saw the throws, right? You saw the arm talent. You saw when he could run and move and throw on the run. Some of his throws were absolutely breathtaking. That doesn't mean he's the best quarterback. Do you think I meant he's the best quarterback? I mean, raw physical talent, the ability to throw a football, the, the rushing, the athleticism, all of that stuff.

Darnold had everything. That's why he was taken number three overall. He had everything of a franchise quarterback for physical tools. His decision-making I think was a main reason why he didn't become a great quarterback. And then what happened was, uh, he was helped along by Kevin O'Connell, a great offense, great wide receivers, all of those things and a lot of, a lot of confidence. And he played with a ton of confidence, but still at the end of

the day, what happened was his shortcomings still arrived on the scene in the biggest moment, which was being indecisive, being a little inconsistent at times and getting rattled, things like that. I mean, but as far as again, go look this up, go look at the comparisons that Sam Darnold was getting when he came out just based on his arm talent and his, his actual physical skills. Phenomenal, phenomenal talent. Uh, echo warrior. Thank you so much for the super chat. Appreciate you.

Uh, did I miss you talking about the scuffle? Echo Warrior, I spent like 15 minutes on the scuffle to start the show. You gotta go back. Rewind Echo Warrior. Sounds like Batty had a nice day trending toward making the roster. I don't think so.

I'm not sure it was a nice day. I mean, this play, he came untouched and then crushed Aaron Jones when you're really not supposed to do that. I'm not sure how good of a day that was that he, no one, they just missed him. It was a missed assignment. They were probably thrown off by something that Brian Flores was doing. Uh, baddie has not stood out a lot to me so far.

Um, could be a guy that's on the practice squad. That would be my expectation. He was playing a little more inside today, which I thought was interesting rushing from inside cause he's very much a tweener as far as those outside edges go bad. He was with the second team on the first day of camp and since hasn't been in that role. Um, so he has not been someone who I would say, wow, he's the UDFA to make the roster.

Excuse me. I do think with his athleticism that he could be someone they put on the practice squad. I wouldn't be surprised there, but it's also not a good idea to hit Aaron Jones in a practice where Aaron Jones, the thing, the reason about not hitting people is not because they can't be hit. Jordan Mason got hit yesterday and looked like he was the easiest person to knock down ever. It's because they're not ready for it. You're not expecting to get hit in training camp. So you're like, you know, even today, Josh Oliver caught a ball and then it was kind of cruising after and someone knocked it out of his hands.

Like you're not expecting someone to come whack the ball out of your hand or whatever in practice. You're not expecting to get hit in practice like that. So Tyler Batty doing that, I think was kind of weak, honestly. Like I didn't like it. Um, and neither did JJ McCarthy. And that's why he went after him. Uh, but he has not been a guy who stood way out to me. I think Bo Richter, Gabe Murphy have been better in those outside roles. Hamza says, remember Brandon Thorne saying on your show that he thought Fry's was even more nasty than Quentin Nelson, who's a monster. I really think Fry's has a chance to be one of the best. Even if, but even if Fry's is, I mean, let's just say that, let's say that Will Fries is like the 16th best guard

in the league. So he's, you know, above average out of what, you know, 64 guards. Let's say he's, I mean, let's even say he's 20th best in the league by PFF or something like that. But when push comes to shove, he's the one pushing when they're down at the goal line, he's the one pushing. When they're down at the goal line, he's the one pushing. When they're running a screen, he's the one out in front just burying some dude to open up a big play. That's going to be worth it, even if he's not a flawless player. Tom says, Theo and maybe Dallas Turner get some preseason time makes sense

I think it does for both of those guys. They're in new roles Or yeah, I mean Turner is really in a new role as well Theo Jackson is in a new role wouldn't surprise me, but if they didn't play those guys That's okay. The joint practice is really their preseason and I think they might play them a little but I wouldn't want to see them a lot because both of those guys are going to be big time players in the past. Most of these guys who are any type of player for the Vikings

do not get action in the preseason. They just don't like, and that's a Kevin O'Connell philosophy. I think it comes over from the Rams and that is perfectly fine with me. Uh, Julio says, uh, what do y'all think about trading, uh, for Jake Browning? Bring back Jake Browning. Um, now we've probably gotten a little bit too far down the exam. How's struggling. Let's look for anyone.

If you're talking about Jake Browning, but you know, at least he did prove that he could get into some games and win howl so far has not looked like he can get into games and win. Who do you think will win the super bowl? I haven't decided yet. I've thrown out some ideas and some teams, you know, Buffalo is certainly up there, Baltimore is up there for, I mean, you talk about winning the super bowl. But I'm not re I'm not ready yet.

I'm not ready to make like an official pick, which has been wrong every single year, like everybody else's pick, but I'm not, I'm not, I don't feel fully, um, complete yet with the off season to decide who I think is gonna win the Super Bowl as if that means Something of me picking like I'm not any better than at picking games than any of you Let's see Yes, some of you want to trade for Trey Lance after the that's that's where you just need you really really need after the that's, that's where you just need. You really, really need, uh, more football because preseason in the hall of fame game, they're not even playing third teamers.

They're just, they're entirely playing insurance salesman. Uh, Jim says, um, you feel like the quarterback position is still the weakest and unknown I'm rooting for Okuda unknown. Yes. Weakest. No, I think that the cornerback position has been pretty good. The way I'm looking at it right now is that there is the potential for it to be very good. Byron Murphy's a really good player. So you start there, like you've got your guy. And then Rogers to me has looked very much like a starting outside corner.

Those two are going to play the most by far. Those, those are going to play the most. And then Okuda mixing in is kind of like Shaq Griffin last year for 500 snaps or something. If he's that guy in that role. And there might even be more McKay Blackman and Okuda depending on the situation, if they like what they see eventually from McKay Blackman. So I do feel like they are a better version than I had in my brain from what I've seen in front of me. The D-line has also been killing it.

So that's another part of that as well. That's made things easier and will ultimately make things easier for them in the regular season. I mean, if they had gotten Jalen Ramsey, that would have been pretty cool and made this defense really, really good the fact that they didn't I Think at this moment is okay, and it's gonna have to be proven out So I'm still not clear on it, and I still have questions about it, but the early returns are quite good What happened with Bartholomew a back injury yeah, Yeah. And just have not seen him at all. He's on the pup.

No word in whether he's going to come back anytime soon. Uh, 17 McMullen, did the defense play a little more vanilla today to give the kid a break? They did not know. I mean, look, they, they were out there, you know, throwing punches at each other and pushing each other around. It was not one of those days. It was not give the kid a break day. Definitely not. Conrad does today's practice mean that McCarthy has a second career in WWF after football? Seriously though, who in your opinion are the top three potential

quarterbacks that we could reasonably sign? It's not a great list, man. I mean, it's, you know, it's your Ryan Tannehill. It's your Joe Flacco, man. I mean, it's, you know, it's your Ryan Tannehill. It's your Joe Flacco. If he gets cut, um, sounds like Dylan Gabriel is doing pretty well in Brown's camp. So maybe they'll keep, you know, three quarterbacks of picket as the starter and then cut Joe Flacco. I could see him being the backup here. There, you know,

if it's not Carson Wentz, then it's, you're, you're kind of bringing in other guys that you're not super thrilled with. I mean, if you're bringing in Joe Flacco, he didn't exactly look like a world beater last year when he was playing for, um, you know, the Indianapolis Colts. He looked pretty rough. So nobody is going to thrill you when you were talking about backup quarterbacks, but they do need somebody who could at least execute to some extent. Uh, Brett says Joe burrow isn't an alien either.

See, I think that a lot of, a lot of what you guys have been doing on a nightly basis is trying to set the bar like all the way at the top. Joe burrow is, is an alien. Yeah, he is now he's not an alien in the same way as Lamar Jackson, but he is an alien. And the way it is, is his accuracy is absolutely insane. I mean, it's drew breeze. It's Joe burrow with throwing the football accurately anticipation, It's Joe burrow with throwing the football accurately anticipation, the leadership command of the offense, like sees the matrix, all that stuff. He is, he is a freak.

He is a freak. Um, it's not that McCarthy can't be great at seeing the field and throwing accurately and all those things, but I do think that that, that bar is just a little bit like I'm uncomfortable saying he's going to be burrow. I'm much more comfortable saying that there are really, really good quarterbacks who are not perfect and not aliens in any particular way that win all the time in the NFC with great teams. But for some of you, it's like, that's not enough.

You got to say he's Joe burrow, um, Peyton Manning's accuracy. But here's the thing about Peyton Manning. If we were doing Madden ratings for Peyton Manning, he would have had like a 94 arm and 99 accuracy and 99 awareness. And I mean, he's one, there is a great argument to Peyton Manning is the best quarterback in history. When you look at the regular season statistics, we all know Brady and the playoffs and all that he is the best quarterback ever in terms of regular season

play. Yeah. I mean, so his his ratings, you know, that kind of way. I actually do like this comparison. I actually do like this one because I grew up watching this guy. Maybe JJ will be the next Jim Kelly and for all those listening who are under 40 years old. I'm sorry because you probably didn't watch Jim the next Jim Kelly. And for all those listening who are under 40 years old, I'm sorry, cause you probably didn't watch Jim Kelly. Jim Kelly is bigger.

The Jim Kelly is huge, but he might not have been, he might not have been like six, five. He might've been like six, three. So I guess, you know, but huge in terms of massive arms, chest, Jim Kelly did have an all time great arm, absolutely insane arm strength. And Jim Kelly was probably one of the smartest quarterbacks of all time. Like Peyton Manning ran no huddle offense. So he was calling his own plays out there. That's something we're not going to see from JJ McCarthy, but some other elements,

the, the it factor, somebody left this in the comments the other day, and I appreciate that the it factor of the Jim Kelly had, the toughness that he had, the leadership, all that stuff and the way that people bought into Jim Kelly, that, that I can see it, that I can see it. Um, let's see Arizona sky suite on Dawkins hadn't really heard anything. Yeah. It looks like he is starting to carve something out for himself. And then we'll see how it goes from there. Um, but it's, it's, it's just like Felton where a lot of times it takes until the next year. Uh,

let's see Kit Fisto's dental plan. I'm going to have to Google that and understand if I'm saying something weird, uh, how would you handicap brosmer's odds to be on the 53? Um, you know, I'd give them like a 50% chance right now to be on the 53. I still think it's up in the air between him and Rippon. Uh, when they had a chance to give some second team reps to somebody that wasn't Sam Howell, they gave them to Brett Rippon. Um, but Brosmer has been getting a lot of work and I think that they do like Max Brosmer quite a bit. So whoops, click the wrong one. Uh, Kirk, Kirk is

still available. Yes. Yes. Uh, that, that comes up from time to time. Uh, Susan says, have you seen McCarthy ever get rattled during camp? A couple of days ago, he was not too high on himself. I think there was a lot of frustration, but in terms of rattled, no, I have not seen him get rattled. He has a confidence that just doesn't seem to ever stop. And it's one of the reasons that you draft them where you draft him is that he, he has that, um, R. Emmer says, uh, feels like Baker plus depends

on what version of Baker we're talking about, but I get what you're saying. Uh, in terms of skillset, uh, actually, you know, Baker was super accurate in college, but in the NFL, he kind of sprays the ball a bit. And I think that it's a similar type of throwing. Um, it's not the hugest guy in the world. I think Baker's a little smaller can certainly run for first downs and scramble, which we're going to see JJ McCarthy do. But, you know, Baker did throw 40 touchdowns last year and 4500 yards or something.

So he kind of raised the bar for himself last year, but I get what you're saying. Yeah. Um, like maybe a little earlier Baker is kind of what he looks like right now. And then you're seeing the upside. Let's see. Hamza says, do you expect there to be a drop off in receiving production from Jefferson Addison Hockinson with JJ's a first time starter? We know they want to run the ball, but KOC loves passing. I would expect that the touchdown total isn't as high because they're going to run for some touchdowns. That it was inflated last year

with Sam Darnold's touchdown total because they just had to pass every single time that they got into the red zone. Not that he didn't earn a lot of those touchdowns, but it certainly helped that they would get in the red zone, couldn't run, and then had to resort to passing. So I don't expect that. I don't expect 4,500 yards or anything from McCarthy because I think they will throw less, but there's no world where they are just saying, let's hand off and run a few play actions. Uh, they're, they're going to pass the ball.

There probably will be a little bit. I mean, when you say drop off, it might be a little less, but one of the things about a year, like 2022 is that they were passing all the time because of the game situation. What often dictates is the game situation. And that's something that we can't know right now, but if they are playing, uh, these knockdown, drag out 17 to 14 type of games where they're running a lot then Yeah, I mean You're not gonna throw for

4200 yards doing that if they are playing in a lot of games where it's back and forth and You got to throw the ball a lot So a lot of that is dictated by just how the game goes when we come to like the fantasy stat type of element of it. Let's hear for Jared Allen yet right before the show I was watching all of the hall of fame speeches loved Sterling sharps loved Antonio Gates and the way he talked about Philip Rivers. I'll keep making that comparison personality wise. I don't know.

I mean look McCarthy is already on track to have 10 kids. I mean he's starting at 22 years old with his first kid, so maybe he could catch Philip Rivers. I think their personalities are pretty similar. Philip Rivers and JJ McCarthy, and it certainly showed it today. So congratulations to Jared Allen for going to Hall of Fame. There's some other Vikings that are deserving as well. Jim Marshall, of course, Kevin Williams, I think is deserving and maybe Harrison Smith one day as well.

Expose. Are there any camp favorites from last year looking like they could be contributors? Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I think Levi Drake Rodriguez is at the top of that list. Levi has been in every single day with the twos. He's gotten a ton of reps. Sometimes he's been a little bit too much when it comes to the physical play, but he's brought a lot of energy there and power and it looks like he's bigger to me. He's been really the main camp darling from last year. Who's been better. Tyler says, heard that Ty felt in has struggled during camp. Would it be too far fetched to suggest he's a practice squad candidate?

No, they're not. No, no, no, no. They're not, they're not going to cut up. No, I don't like struggled with Ty Felton struggled to me means they're putting them on the third team and they just like out of sight, out of mind or dropping everything today, he had a great catch up over his head that dropped kind of in the basket from Sam Howell. Great play. He was back there. Kick returning. I mean, I think that Ty Felton is a guy who you want to see contribute a little,

get his feet wet and then be prepared to take over wide receiver three next year when Jalen Naylor hits free agency. There's nothing I've seen that would make me go, Oh, Ty Felton can't play or whatever. It's just that he looks so young and inexperienced and like he needs to put on 20 pounds of muscle in the next off season, learn a lot about the NFL and, and get a little bit more coordinated on some of these plays and just just understand football a little better The raw skill is definitely there

For him. It's just gonna take some time Yeah, so they're definitely not gonna cut him anyway Brett says or sorry that's Preston over 800 viewing live. Thank you so much, everybody. The crowds have been growing. I feel great about that. And, uh, Brett says, uh, going two hours after covering training camp, not just today, it's every day, Brett, it's been two hours and it's been awesome because of all of you, a reminder to all of you watching the replay, throw it in the

comments, fan dual question of the day. Reminder to all of you watching the replay, throw it in the comments. Fan dual question of the day. The, uh, the NFC North plus three 60 to have three teams make the playoffs this year. What's your percentage chance that three teams in the NFC North make the playoffs for me, I went 45%. But the answers were all over the map. We got as high as 80% and as low, I think it's 20%.

So very, very interesting. Um, but yeah, thank you all for watching again today and listening as so many of you have, if you didn't catch the conversation with Kevin Seifert, check that out. There is a plan right now as of this moment to have a Minnesota Viking on the show tomorrow, one-on-one with me. Hopefully things change, stuff happens. That is the plan that tomorrow night's show will include a one-on-one out there conversation with a Minnesota Viking. I will not ruin who it is. So thank you so much for everybody for watching slash listening. And, um, we will be back.

The plan is tomorrow. What I'm going to do, what I'm going to do is I'm going to put together a 53 because it's not going to be a hard practice because it's not gonna be a hard practice. It's gonna be a walkthrough. So I'm gonna put together a 53 and then we'll see and make sure you check out the newsletter. That's what I gotta go do right now is write the newsletter for tomorrow over at purpleinsider.football. So thank you all so much and we'll catch you very soon. Football.