Purple Insider - a Minnesota Vikings and NFL podcast - Vikings minicamp storylines that could have been

Episode Date: May 27, 2020

 Would Dalvin Cook have shown up for mandatory minicamp? Would Justin Jefferson be starting on the outside or in the slot? What offensive line combo would have been most likely? Plus Hot Routez returns with questions about the coolest playoff venues and where the Vikings offense will rank in points scored. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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Get Coors Light in the new look delivered straight to your door with Drizzly or Instacart, Coors Brewing Company, Golden, Colorado, and as always, celebrate. Hey, this is Megan Rapinoe. And I'm Sue Bird. Golden, Colorado, and anywhere else you listen to podcasts. All right, welcome into another episode of Purple Insider. Matthew Collar, ESPN's Courtney Cronin. And Courtney, what is going on? You know, Memorial Day has come and gone. I can now wear white without, I guess, causing any sort of controversy because winter is officially over because every run that I go on here, it's about 95 degrees. So hello, summer. Probably a little bit too soon because it went from what I consider

winter spring to 90 degrees every day, but can't complain. Major, major controversies over you wearing white before Memorial Day. Big problem. Yes. You know, all those winter white people and what is it like pearl white, snow white, whatever the colors are that are appropriate before Memorial Day. Yeah, now I don't have to worry about it. I can just go around wearing my white Bermuda shorts. Okay, well, great. Good for you.

I'm very excited for you. But normally you would have been wearing shorts and your big bucket hat out at mini camp during Memorial Day. That's where you and I have spent the last couple of years. We're not at baseball games or we're not grilling. We're out at mini camp with the Minnesota Vikings. And of course this year, because of the pandemic, we are not. And I was thinking about all the interesting storylines that we would have been talking about in OTAs and minicamp. And I know that some people could say, and maybe they'd be right. I don't know. This is our job.

So we're interested in everything like, oh, well, you know, whatever. It's just OTAs, but it really sets the stage for training camp. You get the sense where everybody stands coming out of minicamp and you feel like the position battles are set the storylines are set and we tend to learn a little bit each year i mean two years ago we learned that that offense john d filippo was putting in had some serious humps that they were going to have to get over and there were some problems in minicamp with the offense and then last year xavier rhodes was already looking beat up and injured in mini camp. And we go to the 2019 season and he really struggles throughout. So we can pick

up little things that are going to be relevant for the season during mini camp. But this year, we do not have that opportunity. We get Zoom calls with Garrett Bradbury. You know, I definitely am thrilled that we at least have some availability still. I don't know how every team is handling this situation, but I do think that the Vikings giving us a player or two a week, it's better than nothing. But, I mean, you talk about the things that you can glean from OTAs. And, yes, you and I have both fallen into the trap of, man, another OTA we have to go to, another mini camp. Last year, everybody's talking about the wide receiver competition. And who was that guy, Jordan Taylor? Was that his name? The one from Denver that Gary

Kubiak found? He was apparently leading the competition for the number three receiver spot. Well, he also got cut about like two weeks before cut down day actually happens. So that just shows you how much you can actually take away from OTAs and minicamp. But I think you can learn a lot about the dynamic of a team and some of the issues that might rear their head. I mean, think about what happened two years ago. Anthony Barr misses a day of OTAs because he was taking out an insurance policy on himself because he didn't have the long-term, the new

long-term deal extension worked out with the Vikings. Obviously, he came back in the 2019 offseason, but we kind of had a feeling that he would have been the odd man out, and it turns out for a while he was. Last year, Stefan Diggs misses a day of OTAs for a mandatory minicamp, whichever one it was, he had house problems. That was the excuse that he listed. Well, then we start to find out, putting the pieces together, that, yeah, it's not all happy in Minnesota for Stephon Diggs.

And I think that you can really learn a lot about contract situations, who may or may not hold out, who may or may not be on the team come August or September, whenever they cut down the roster. And that's the best part about it because it is a slower pace, but you can start to see the outliers and start to see what things are not fitting early on. And then you look back a few months down the road and you say, oh, that was a sign that I should have paid attention to or did it matter? I mean, it's, you know, I think that there are a lot of things that you can take away from what happens in these, uh, you know, so-called

practices. And that's exactly what I wanted to ask you was what are we missing by not being there? And I think that you led me into it perfectly with talking about bar and digs and contract situations, because we don't know whether Delvin cook would have shown up or not. And I tend to think that Delvin Cook, without a contract extension, would have been staying at home and not attending OTAs and minicamp, and that would have started a big groundswell if he didn't. I mean, the other guys have. Like Anthony Barr, you mentioned, he got the insurance policy, and then he came back, and Diggs missed a day,

but he eventually came back, and that wasn't a contract dispute. But I think with Delvin Cook, it is a very touchy situation because of how difficult of a spot it is for running backs to try to negotiate their contracts. And they have to use every bit of leverage they possibly can. And so the fact that the Vikings did not do anything in free agency or the draft to add an extra running back and the fact that Rick Spielman said they want to keep their good players, it all points us toward a Delvin Cook contract extension. But since we don't have anything yet, it would have been number one on our storyline list.

Does he participate in OTAs and minicamp? Yeah. And I think that, you know, from stuff that i've gleaned anything that was voluntary i think that he would have been a part of um you know during the pandemic obviously it's thrown a weird situation at us where we don't really know what mandatory mini camp is going to look like i mean at least during otas it's the classroom part to begin with we would have been seeing that had we been out at tco this year or you know seeing guys over zoom once a week um so it's the teaching phase that they're in right now but we don't actually know like how are they going to handle what is considered

mandatory minicamp like would dalvin cook end up sitting out of that if that if it is a thing like i don't know how you have a virtual minicampamp and require players to go to it if it's still the same kind of format as virtual OTAs have been over Zoom calls. But nonetheless, had we been out at TCO the week before Father's Day is typically when the NFL finishes up and wraps up mandatory minicamp. We would have known if Dalvin was going to hold out or not, because I think all the signs point to the fact that he wants that contract, and rightfully so, will sit out if he doesn't end up getting it, because the risk you run with getting injured in training camp or even before that in mandatory minicamp just isn't worth it. So, you know, you don't really get to watch in more of an up-close and personal view what the contract situation is like with Dalvin Cook,

so I think a lot of it you're just kind of playing the hurry-up-and-wait game. It's kind of dragged on probably longer, I think, than most people would have anticipated. I know that they've done some of these extensions in the hours leading into training camp, but for a guy like Dalvin Cook, who is the focal point and centerpiece of your offense, you probably want to get that one done sooner rather than later and I'm kind of surprised

to be honest it hasn't happened at this point well and I went back and looked just to see when did Xavier Rhodes announce his when did Stefan Diggs announce his and both of those were just into training camp so yeah it was like late like late July, late July and early. Yeah. Diggs was right the day before my birthday in 2018. I think he was the 31st, uh, and Rhodes was the year before that, like somewhere late July. Cause didn't they also do Linville and Griffin same year with Rhodes, like back to back to back. Yes. Yes. And I think that Griffin and Linville were on the first day of training camp, but then it was a couple of days in that Xavier Rhodes signed. So no reason to panic, but it was a sign when Rhodes and Diggs showed up for training camp that it was clear, okay, they must be getting very close to this since these guys are here as opposed to holding out when it seemed like both players wanted long-term contract extensions to stay with the Minnesota Vikings.

If either one of them had not shown up to camp, it would have been a sign. Okay, wait, there's something wrong here. There's going to be a holdout. This could get messy. And we might not end up knowing about Delvin Cook, or we might, depending on what happens, because there was some reporting from Charles Robinson that the teams might want to try to put together some sort of mini camp if they're allowed in every state with certain type of health restrictions and things like that. So I guess we'll find out if we do end up having

something to cover. Beyond Delvin Cook, what would be the top of your list for things to watch for had we had minicamp and OTAs? Well, I definitely am interested in Justin Jefferson and figuring out just how quickly they're going to try to incorporate him into that number two role. And also figuring out how does the rest of that receiver room look? And where does Tajay Sharp fit in? I know that kind of randomly when we were on the phone or over zoom with Mike Zimmer he was talking about the receivers uh and he brought up Chad Beebe like out of you know he was the only one that he named by name and I'm curious like Beebe coming off of the season-ending injury last year you know they like him they've kept him around for for several years now and I'm wondering okay what does his role become what is Ola B.C. Johnson is

he the number three and then you know how do they start to reshape that position behind Adam Thielen who is very clearly your number one so you know that's that would probably be at the top of my intrigue list but you know on the other side of that you have a brand new secondary a brand new group of starting cornerbacks like I'm trying to figure out where is Mike Mike Hughes going is he going to start in the slot is he going to be an outside corner you know what do they have in Jeff Gladney I mean I would be looking at the pieces of this team that have been turned over from 2019 to now and trying to figure out what are the early stages telling us about how this roster might look come August and we we're getting down from like 90 to 53. Yeah, let me start with Justin Jefferson,

because is he going to look like more of a slot receiver in the NFL or on the outside? Because if they do love Chad Beebe as much as it sounds like they love Chad Beebe, and it really wasn't his fault last year how he got hurt. It was super random. He was trying to lay a block, which he actually got flagged for 15 yards against the raiders a guy runs into him and just sort of one of those throw up your hands type of things but this is very much his last opportunity with the vikings because they do have other receivers but he's the only guy outside of jefferson that you look at and say is a slot receiver. But Jefferson in 2018 played the outside in LSU and you could see them saying, hey, he

only played the slot because they had Jamar Chase and it found ways to get him open. But we see him as more of an outside receiver because we like, you know, BC Johnson and Chad Beebe to mix into those different spots. I would have been extremely curious just to see the early returns on that. We know that it isn't until a couple of weeks into camp where you really get a sense for what people's jobs are going to be and maybe even two or three preseason games. But what stage would be set for that wide receiver battle definitely would have been at the top of my list.

What you said about corners, I don't know about you, but I would have expected, I would have gone in expecting Mike Hughes to be the nickel corner. Would you agree with that? Same. Yeah. Because I, you know, even if they would have had the time to get on the field and, you know, be molded for, for, you know, lack of a better term by these coaches to, you know, figure like touch them, figure it out, show them how to, um, you know, do, you know, just fix their skillset when you're actually able to like work with somebody one-on-one, it still would take time. I think for, for someone like Jeff Gladney, who probably projects as a nickel just because of his pure size in the NFL, like that's, you already have

Mike Hughes. You've already conditioned him that that's where he was going to go anyways. That's what I would have anticipated in the learning curve to play that position. You know, you could start Jeff Gladney, like, as an outside corner, and then maybe as you get towards training camp, you know, as they get into training camp, move him around a little bit. But to me, the most logical reasoning I could come up with is Mike Hughes is going into year three. Why not start him at the nickel? Because that's his strength.

That's where he projects. They have an opening for it. And it's probably like the path of least resistance, to be quite honest, or path of less obstacles by putting Holton Hill and Jeff Gladney, maybe even a Cam Dantzler, rotating them in on the outside jobs and then keeping Mike Hughes at nickel. And I think if you were planning on playing Hughes as much as you could, them in on the outside jobs and then keeping Mike Hughes at nickel. And I think if you were planning on playing Hughes as much as you could, you could always have him be on the outside in a base defense and then move him inside if you were going

to your nickel, which is where you are going to be most of the time. But if you're just trying to have your best guys and most experienced on the field, funny to say, because your most experienced guy has played under a thousand snaps and is 24 years old still in my cues, but that's kind of the new world we're adjusting to. So even getting a look at how that rotation might be or where guys might line up, or if, like you said, it's Holton Hill or Cameron Dantzler

taking the first snaps, because I really wouldn't be surprised if Dantzler was the guy that they because I really wouldn't be surprised if Dantzler was the guy that they decided on eventually, or that went into training camp as having his job to lose. Um, Holton Hill not getting opportunities last year sort of said, all right, they seem to be on the fence with him, like not totally sold. Cause otherwise I think he would have gotten more chances to get in the game as much as Xavier Rhodes was struggling last season. And, you know, you go into the playoffs and you've got people injured and you still don't

see Holton Hill get any opportunity out there. So it's hard for me to say that he's going to be at the top of their list, even as impressed as we were by him two years ago. Now, what would you have starting five on the offensive line? Like, what would you have expected when we walk out on the practice field for the first time and they take their first rep in shorts out there on the practice field and we'd be sweating like crazy it's really hot and and we're looking out there and there's five offensive linemen who are they I would have kept Riley Reif at left tackle um

Drew Samia say we're gonna put him left guard, even though I think he was a right guard in college. It's just the Pat Elfline at left guard was just not working. So I'm moving Pat Elfline out of the mix for now. I'd keep Garrett Bradbury at center, possibly either Dakota Dozier or Pat Elfline at right guard, and then Brian O'Neill. And I know that you're wondering, well, where's Ezra Cleveland? You know, I think he starts out right now. If you're going on the normal progression path that both Brian O'Neill went on two years ago and Garrett Bradbury last year, you need these 10 weeks of the offseason program to get in a weight training system, to start eating any and everything just to put size

on. Like I remember, and I think you and I talked about this before, think back to two years ago when in minicamp, we're looking at Brian O'Neill, Mike Remmers, and Rashad Hill, the three right tackles at the time on the roster before Remmers got moved inside to guard. The difference in terms of how they looked between the two veteran guys and the skinny rookie, very noticeable stuff. So I mean, that's kind of what I was going to expect

from him to see with Ezra Cleveland. Like I know he's a little bit bigger and he's taller than Brian O'Neill, but he still has to fill out. And I don't think that if you're in a pinch right now, you would be wanting him to start at left tackle right away. I mean, you're already paying Riley Reif a ton of money, and maybe this would be something that we find out in OTAs. Like, is Reif moving inside? Okay, if that's the case, does that mean that he's about to have a restructured contract? Like, you'd be able to put some of those pieces together, but since we can't see that, we don't know that. And obviously, we're not seeing anything because they're not on the field together. So that's the stuff that, you know, I mean, that's my starting five right now.

If you were, you know, normal circumstances, but even under non-normal circumstances, like the ones that we're currently dealt with, I don't see a situation where Ezra Cleveland is your starting left tackle day one. I just cannot see that. I think it would have told us at least what they were thinking with Ezra Cleveland is your starting left tackle day one. I just cannot see that. I think it would have told us at least what they were thinking with Ezra Cleveland, though. Like, do they think that he can compete for that left guard spot? I mean, it's a debate where you could go back and forth, and I'm sure we will much more in training camp of whether it's worth trying Ezra Cleveland at left guard because he's

a far better athlete than anybody else who could be there. And it gets him on the field. It gets him some experience playing against real NFL players. So when he does take over for Riley reef, it isn't just being thrown into the fire as a left tackle. You would have some experience playing next to a guy who's been around for a very long time. So there is a case for that to keep Drew Samia also at right guard and Pat Elfline off the

field. Um, as good as it. Yeah. I mean, that's, that's what you want to avoid Pat Elfline off the field. As good as... Yeah, I mean, that's what you want to avoid, like having him on the field. Right. And I could even see, you know, if you were trying to be like slightly bold, and I don't mean majorly, but I mean slightly, you might say that the starting five would include Josh Klein if he comes back. Yeah, if he comes back, for sure.

It would seem to me that they have some cap space left over for a reason. They just haven't decided what that reason is yet. And maybe they're hoping that things start to open up and they can bring guys in for workouts and look at some other offensive linemen that they could sign to possibly bring in and compete because you still don't feel very good at all about the left guard and right guard positions. But if they signed somebody as a free agent and then Samia was filling in, you might feel a little bit more solid. Or if Ezra Cleveland does look pretty jacked and looks pretty comfortable there

and they're playing Riley Reif at left guard most of the time, I think that combination is one that you would end up liking, is having Riley Reif in at guard because of the division you play against. And some of the players on the interior have just destroyed the Vikings offensive line. And Kirk Cousins does not really move out of pressure when it's on the interior. I feel like if you walk out there in week one with Drew Samia and Pat Elfline as your guards, you're kind of asking history over the last two years to repeat itself.

No, sure. I mean, if I could have my ideal offensive line combination where I'm not worried about guys not being ready, of course it would be put your, you drafted the guy to be your franchise left tackle. Go ahead and put him there right now. You know, if contract issues are not a thing and Riley Reif actually wants to play guard, which we've never really heard him say, by the way. I think he's been asked about it. I think he played a little bit of it at Iowa. But he's been a right tackle and a left tackle in the NFL.

So if Riley Reif is cool with that and will take a pay cut, then I could see him moving to left guard and it being easy peasy, essentially, if this is my makeup world. And then you have Bradbury at center, Samia at right guard where he played in college, and you have Brian O'Neill. I think you actually have a pretty decent offensive line and you can look at that and say, hey, the issues of the interior pressure because of how many good interior pass rushers there are that just destroyed Pat Alphline last year.

And Dakota Dozier had to play a lot because of injuries on the offensive line. And Josh Klein was just okay at right guard. I think you'd be in a really good spot. That would be everyone's ideal offensive line, I would think. Because you don't have, like you said, you don't have your biggest liability in Pat Elfline out there. Right. And there was an interesting PFF study about this that kind of found you're only as good as your weakest link

when it comes to the offensive line and the secondary too we found it with the secondary last year with Rhodes where teams just attacked over and over again well it's been the same thing with Pat Elfline over the last two years that even if Reef and Brian O'Neill have played well especially Brian O'Neill last year was terrific and yet they still did not protect Kirk Cousins any better last year than they did the year before. The only reason they had fewer sacks was just because they didn't pass the ball as much. It's like 150 fewer pass attempts.

So you had the raw statistics of total sacks were fewer, but the sack rate and the pressure rate were about the same. And I think that reef in a guard, well, it feels similar to Remmers. I don't think that it is. I think that Remmers had to maximize every ounce of talent that was there to even be an NFL player. Whereas Riley reef is much more gifted and kind of, uh, succeeds by mauling with really strong guys. And that's why we see, you know, Khalil Mack, who's super strong, but we see Khalil Mack beat him along the edge because it's really the quickness and speed that gets him. Well, maybe Ezra Cleveland has the athleticism to, you know, at least go toe to toe a little bit with

those guys who have speed because he has the quick feet. So, you know, that would have been at the very top of my list or very high on the list is who's going out there for those five offensive linemen, because there's about 700 different combinations that we could come up with. Yeah, absolutely. And I think every year this has been such a, you know, hotly debated topic starting in OTAs and then going into minicamp because you wonder about that time in between mandatory minicamp and training camp, how much is going to change in the eyes of coaches, what they saw, how does that foreshadow how the combination is going to change in the eyes of coaches, what they saw, how does that foreshadow how the combination is going to look day one of training camp when all the veterans and rookies are there together, what rookie actually put on weight. I remember with

Brian O'Neill, it was like, okay, is this guy going to be ready to play this year at all? And all of us kind of looking at what he looked like physically at the end of june in 2018 to when he came back and you know two months later for training camp i mean that was that was for me like you know i was looking at that thinking okay we need to track this we need to track his progress because he's probably going to have to play this year and you find out early on in training camp that you know it's all signs are pointing to that because Rashad Hill is probably not going to last long at right tackle um and you know with the injury to Nick Easton and and what that forced Mike Remmers into that situation I mean it was

not good so you kind of you would be watching OTAs right now wondering okay well what situation are they going to get themselves into where the musical chair game is going to pick up again? Okay. In our imaginary OTAs last question slash minicamp is which random either undrafted guy or late round draft pick would we have come out of OTAs slash minicamp going, Hey, keep an eye on this guy last year. No question. It was Davion Davis who is still on the roster, by the way. So good for Davion Davis, but he had an unbelievable day in minicamp just smoking people out there and all of us all of us went into training camp saying hey this Davion Davis guy he could be really interesting so give me your imaginary random guy who we would be talking about buzzing about, if you will, by the end of imaginary

minicamp? Well, they have a bunch of new corners, right? Like, I mean, that's, you know, pick one, pick someone that would be one of the later round corners that they picked up. Maybe Brian Cole, that safety that they got in the seventh round. I'd probably, you know, he seemed very charismatic and, you know, very engaging on the conference call that we had him on right after he got drafted so uh very curious to see you know what he could bring to the table the safety position probably though i'd say i'll keep it on defense is it kenny willikas willikies the defensive end that like was like a you know a kind of a steal for them in the seventh round i think some people thought he might have been a fifth or a sixth round pick

and they got him at 225. You know, he's like the little engine that could. The defensive end out of Michigan State, I'd be curious to see how Andre Patterson would want to work him in because we know with Hercules Mata'afa, they don't mind taking some undersized guys and, you know, moving them into interior pass rushing roles. I'm really curious to see how they'd want to play will it you know i left the door wide open for

you to pick courtney davis i mean come on sure i mean yeah i've written about him and i've talked about him and he's you know in a very intriguing wide receiver pick i mean for the fact simple fact of the matter he he didn't go drafted. He went undrafted, and he had like a day three grade, an early day three grade. So I'm curious why he would have slipped. Maybe we would have found that out when he got on the field, or maybe he would have shot up there and say, hey,

that this could actually be somebody who cracks the roster to begin with, but also could have a rotation, some role in the wide receiver room. I want to go with Troy Dye and Josh Metellus both because these guys have hybrid something written all over them. And I would be very interested if they got on the field in that type of role, whether it was like a hybrid linebacker for Dye or Metellus, if he was playing in the box, if he got any reps with you know the first team or even you know really the second team if you get second team reps you've got a pretty good chance of making it so the guys that they clearly aimed and you mentioned Cole they clearly aimed to find a box

type of safety or a playmaking safety with a with a hybrid element and bringing in Dom Capers you've got to think that Mike Zimmer's coming up with some unique scheme things. And I wonder where that plays in. If they could find someone who could do the things they wanted J. Ron Curse to do and maybe not drive Zimmer insane like J. Ron Curse did. So... Yeah.

No, I mean, that's a great point. I mean, I think the safety position too would be intriguing to look at because you're wondering, all right, behind Harrison Smith and Anthony Harris, which would be another thing I'd be curious about like when are they going to get that long-term deal done with Harris because I don't think he's playing on the franchise tag this year especially when they still have stuff that they want to do and they need to clear cap space but nonetheless you have no depth at the position right now or at least no proven

depth so I feel like we went through this last year a little bit um because they were kind of in a similar situation before andrew sandejo re-signed and trying to figure out okay is big nickel going to be jay ron curse's thing is he going to be that hybrid chess piece you can move around well which guy this year out of the you know slew of rookies because they have two safeties they got in the draft and then i believe there's either one or two others that they got in the undrafted free agent market right after the draft ended. What would that look like?

Yeah, and right. I have no idea at this moment until we see. Me neither. I don't even know. Like you said, I don't know who's starting on the second team at this moment because before it would have been J. Ron. It would have been Andrew Sandejo last year when he returned but you know instead we're left to find the next wave of development players that they'll be eventually looking to replace Harrison Smith and Anthony Harrison

clearly they have confidence they could do that because they did not draft anyone anywhere near high at that position so let's take a break and we come back, it is the return of hot routes. I have five questions based on this week's headlines that I need you to answer. Courtney, we'll be right back on purple insider. All right. Before we continue the discussion, I have to tell you about bet online. There is no shortage of action going on right now in our exclusive partner bet online NASascar is back and bet online has hundreds of other games events and sports to get in on you can still bet on simulated nfl nba ufc events 24 7 or you can participate in a ten thousand dollar madden bracket challenge

a march madness style nfl simulation tournament that you can enter for free and live right now on bet online's YouTube channel. You can find an exclusive interview with X Chicago bulls, Ron Harper, Horace Grant, Bill Cartwright, and Craig Hodges to discuss the Michael Jordan documentary on what they are calling the final dance. Visit bet online.ag and use the promo code blue wire to receive your new welcome bonus and check out all the action bet online your online wagering solution okay back here on purple insider matthew collar espn's courtney cronin and we have been away from this far too long we are bringing back all the tradition so on our last episode together you picked the entire viking schedule and now it

is time to bring back Hot Routes. So let's get right into it, Courtney. Here is my first question of five for you. The NBA is going to play its playoffs at Disney World, which is actually kind of cool to have everybody, or at least that's what it sounds like. Everything's not finalized yet, but that's like the plan that they've got going. And so everybody's going to converge on this one place, this one venue, and they're going to play the playoffs. If you could pick one venue for the NFL to play all of its playoffs, what would it be? And it does not have to be a current NFL stadium. It can be whatever you want. Where would you love to see the NFL play its playoffs if it's not in the home team stadiums?

Well, I know that my answer is going to appease a lot of players and coaches who loved where the Pro Bowl used to be played, and then for whatever reason they decided to move it to Orlando. Playoffs in Hawaii, A, you never have to worry about weather being an issue. B, it's warm all the time, and you don't have to worry about, I don't know, being cold. Like that's, you know, playoff weather's January. It's snowing in a lot of these places. The field is frozen.

I'm making the job easier for all the maintenance and facilities people. And three, or C, it's Hawaii. Like, I mean, I know it's a little further away, but you can start games out there earlier so you can get them on normal time in the continental United States. And I don't know, it's Hawaii. I don't have any other reasoning other than it's the best place ever.

And the Pro Bowl used to happen there and people loved going out there for the Pro Bowl. I feel like every NFL coach takes a vacation to Hawaii when the season's over anyways. So you might as well just stay once the playoffs are over if your team's out. Well, I love that you went a completely different direction than I did. You went for where is it awesome? Whereas I was thinking, where is the harshest weather that they could possibly play in America?

So I was thinking if um, if we could bring back old three river stadium in Pittsburgh with the gross carpet and just like this dungeon looking outdoor place with no heaters underneath the field and make it as awful conditions as humanly possible. Uh, Lambeau field came to mind. Soldier field came to mind. Like let's give these people the full footbally football experience. I even thought of Latrobe, Pennsylvania, which is where Pittsburgh Steelers training camp is. It's in a field. It's sort of Mankato, but there's less things around. I went there once and it is the most footbally feeling you've ever had walking through a field. And then you kind of come over a little hill and

there's the players down there playing it's like how awesome is this how football is this I don't want them to have nice conditions this is football I know but how much better would the play be if you're not worrying about rain or snow sleet negative temperatures I mean are we going to be seeing better football? I think so. Well, probably better football, but I say that in finger quotes, like more entertaining football. Let's make it difficult. Like thinking about how about Patrick Mahomes in the snow and he's just like sliding all over the place, making crazy throws. People are falling down. Like, I don't know. That seems pretty awesome to me like they would have to play more ground and pound do we not want more ground and pound more fullbacks in the

game I mean you can still do that type of stuff in warm weather it to to utilize a fullback it doesn't require you to have sub-zero temperatures I know that we like to think it does because I only I think you can only wear a neck roll when it's cold out. I think that's actually required. And there's a certain temperature. It's like, oh, it's above 15 degrees. Got to take the neck roll off.

It's too warm. So yeah, no, I mean, I get it from that perspective. But if I can go warm weather, I know that all the football purists out there are gonna think that you know that's a it's a lame answer it's a soft answer but whatever Hawaii's amazing I want to go there and plus maybe I'm just a little like vacation depressed right now because all of our plans are ruined for the next few months uh that you know I just I would like to you there, Mexico, the Caribbean, find me an island wherever Dana White had that island ready to go for you. Buy an island, NFL island.

Yeah, I mean, heck, put a reality show on it. You can make a lot of money off that thing. Well, what's the coolest stadium in the playoffs? I think it's Kansas City. Kansas City or Green Bay. I think Green Bay is an awesome playoff environment as we, you know, have seen in many, many times over the years. It's got to be super loud and it has to be, like you said, frozen, open to the elements. The Patriots and Kansas City AFC championship game from what, 2018, was one of the coolest atmospheres of any playoff game in a long time. So, all right, well, we've got very differing views

on where the NFL should hold its one-time playoff hub. On to the next question. Matthew Stafford says he wants the Lions to have a great offense this year. Breaking news, he wants them to be good on offense. Let's say Matt Stafford, Kirk Cousins, Nick Foles, and Aaron Rodgers, let's say they all stay healthy they all play all 16 games I want you to give me the rankings where do their offenses rank Detroit Chicago Minnesota and Green Bay well I mean we're trying to predict this without knowing

are they going to add any other pieces so I'm going off of this today thinking that Aaron Rodgers has no more help at the wide receiver position than he did at this time a year ago. So I look at Green Bay and think, okay, they have, they clearly are going to run the ball a ton this year. They're going to try to, it seems like they're trying to build their team like San Francisco or Minnesota. So maybe those two are kind of more even keel than they were a year ago at this time.

I don't know. But are we ranking them in terms of the division only, like 1, 2, 3, 4? Or do you want me to rank them like top 1 through 32? Go 1 through 32 is harder and more fun, I think. Well, I think that I'm going to put Cousins, or I'll just go off Vikings and Packers, assuming Cousins plays all 16 games, which he has for many seasons in a row. He's very durable, and Rodgers has not. So assuming they're all healthy, I'll say that Minnesota will probably have a top 11 or 12 offense.

I'll say Green Bay at 10, Vikings at like 11 or 12 offense. I'll say Green Bay at 10, Vikings at like 11 or 12, Stafford and the Lions maybe somewhere like 28. Oh, 28? You really think that? You and I, wow, talk about thinking completely differently about this. You think the Lions offense is going to be awful? I don't think it's going to be great. I really don't.

I mean, it's 28. I mean, that shows you. I really don't. I mean, it's 28. Like, I mean, that shows you where I'm putting Chicago. Like I'm not putting them dead last because they're not Jacksonville, but Chicago is probably like 30 in my opinion. Yeah, no, I, I don't disagree with Chicago, but I think of Detroit as being completely different because one, Matt Patricia is not involved in the offense as much. That's Daryl Bevel. I'm thinking a healthy Stafford for 16 games that the Lions have the best offense in the division. That doesn't mean they're the best team, but I think that they have the best offense when you look at their weapons and TJ Hawkinson, really TJ Hawkinson going into his second year.

They've Galladay and Jones are one of the best wide receiver combos in the league. Danny Amendola's there too. DeAndre Swift can impact the team right away. Sure, sure, of course. You know, they finally have like a running back room with him, Scarborough, and Kerryon Johnson. I don't know. I just don't have any, like, faith in Detroit whatsoever. I mean, these guys are coaching.

Those two, you know, Bob Quinn and Matt Patricia are coaching for their jobs. It's a tense time. I think that, you know, they're going to start out – what did they start out last year? 1-0-1 or something like that? 1-1-1? Like, you know, it takes them three weeks until the wheels fall off, which happened last year, and they only walked away from the 2019 season with three wins. So I think it'll end up being a very similar situation, maybe maybe seven and nine this year I don't think they're going to

be very good so I'm putting them I'll put them at like 27 28 like bottom tier of the NFL wow so can I both think that their offense will be good but they won't win anything because that's that's kind of where I'm at it's kind of like there was it last year of Jim Caldwell, where they ranked seventh in scoring and he got fired, even though he was an offensive head coach. I kind of look at this the same way that Daryl Bevel will do his job, that their offense will be good. I was going to say they're going to be ninth in the NFL. I'll go 12th for the Vikings, 18th for the Packers and 26th for Chicago. Cause I just don't think Chicago is going to improve a whole heck of a lot because of Nick Foles. And I also don't think that the Packers are going to put up huge scoring numbers if what

they really want to do is hand off and run all the time. And the Vikings should be similar. Like maybe their path is a little bit more challenging with the schedule than last year. And you are missing Stefan Diggs. So I don't expect it to be way better, but I also don't expect it to be worse. The Lions one is really interesting here because last year, Stafford and Bevel seemed to really click. And after seven weeks, Stafford was one of the best quarterbacks in the NFL. And then he just gets hurt. Yeah. And I mean, it's like, you're looking

at like two of the least durable quarterbacks in the division right now. Aaron Rodgers at where he's at and the injuries that have taken their toll over the last few years. And Stafford playing through a broken back and has not played a full season in a couple years. So it's unrealistic for us to think that either of those guys are going to play a full 16 game slate, but given where the league is going and what teams are now starting to like jump onto the San Francisco train and try to build teams that way. I wouldn't be surprised if we see a quote unquote balanced, i.e. more, you know, bigger prerogative to run the ball type team being a top 10, top 12, top 15 offense. I're going to have your Kansas City's and those type of teams, Baltimore, any of those teams are going to be your top 10. No way that any of these teams in the NFC North are going to crack the top 10.

Maybe 10, that would kind of be my borderline, but probably closer to 11 through 15. But I like my outlook for this now because I think the Vikings and Packers are going to be closer to a winning the like both of them going back and forth for the division and b you know how they look offensively going to be a lot closer than it has been in years past no I agree that I think that they're sort of mirror images of each other and if the Packers had gotten another wide receiver, maybe then I might've changed my mind, but I think that they're very, very similar. And I could see them being right next to each other in the rankings.

It's just, you and I are way off on Detroit, which is interesting. Okay. Next question. Joe Flacco is now a jet. How funny is that? Like, hang it up, Joe Flacco. You got a Super Bowl ring. You've got unbelievable amounts of cash.

People thought you were good at one point, probably better than you were. And now you're going to be a backup for the Jets. I don't understand that, but it is not uncommon. There have been many all-time great random endings for previous franchise quarterbacks. So I want you to give me one or two of your favorite random ending locations for quarterbacks who spent time with mostly one team. Well, I think it's my examples aren't going to be like super obscure. I mean, I think Brett Favre ending his career with Minnesota. I love when that happens, when a quarterback you never thought would be playing for a certain team based on the rivalry that were, you know, years and years from 92 to 2007.

He played with Green Bay. Like, I don't think anybodyning retiring as a Bronco after winning a Super Bowl in a year that, you know, was filled with a ton of what the hell is happening type moments. Those are probably my two. So there are, of course, hundreds of examples that you could use here. But I went to Vikings related examples. Warren Moon actually finished his career with Kansas city as their backup at age 44. I mean, what? Like he played for the Vikings and he was ancient then. And then he goes to Seattle. It actually is pretty decent. And then Kansas city signs him as a backup when he's 44 years old. I

love that fact that he was there. And Jeff George goes eight and two for the Vikings. Then Washington signs him. He's a complete disaster in Washington. He gets cut early in the season and then he signs with Seattle, but never plays for Seattle. So there are pictures and maybe football cards out there of Jeff George wearing a Seattle Seahawks jersey, even though he never actually played for the Seattle Seahawks. And then an additional one of a quarterback that I just really loved growing up was a Bernie Kosar ending his career. I believe with Miami, I did not look this up to see if he ended up somewhere else, but as Dan Marino's backup, you know, longtime Cleveland star and another guy who just stayed in the league and decided he wanted to be

a backup for Dan Marino. And I think he was actually a backup in Dallas too for maybe he won a Superbowl as Dallas's backup. I think that's possible. Pretty good list. So I know like Bernie Kosar ending up with these random teams, so many great examples of that. Those are my favorite. And now Joe Flacco being a jet is on the list of being my favorite. Uh, Carson Palmer, who, you know, would definitely know about this type of situation said that fans need to be patient with Joe Burrow, considering that the Bengals had the number one pick for a reason, like they're bad. That's the reason. So I want you to give me Joe Burrow's stat line for this year. He actually is not on a bad offensive

team. Their offensive line is bad, but they have good receivers. If AJ Green comes back and Joe Mixon is a great player. I mean, I don't think it's crazy to think that Joe Burrow could be good in his first year, but what do you think his stat line will look like? T Higgins too. Like AJ, aj if aj green's there if he signs that tag um you know and then they've got t higgins starting opposite him at the other wide receiver spot i think you're probably in a good situation and boyd being the slot guy he's really good yeah um like i looked up the numbers for this stuff like yes they've made a lot of upgrades to the bangles offensive season i mean you mentioned too with like their um their

offensive line still kind of a work in progress progress i don't think they're going to be 2 and 14 again next year um i think when our espn nfl nation team picked the schedule i think ben baby who covers the bangles for us picked them with five wins i think five six seven wins is probably the right the right spot um for you know a rookie for a team led by a rookie quarterback that's still in this period of transitioning um i would say it's probably you know 20 i'll say like probably like 2010 and 2010 and like seven uhs, interceptions, and what's the other thing I'm looking at? Touchdown, interception, turnovers, other turnovers.

Yeah, I think that's probably fair. You know, maybe throw for, since he's got Mixon, probably I'll just try to keep it a very even 3,000 yards passing, 20 touchdowns, 10 interceptions and father, you know, five other random turnovers. I was going to say, I love that. You're trying to pick like the fumbles too. I'm trying to, yeah. Well, I mean, ball security, like, I mean, he was so, he was so freaking perfect at it at LSU.

So I'm like, okay, well, you know, behind that offensive line, since you kind of jogged my thinking with that, I'm like, all right, well, how many times is he going to get hit and then cough up the ball so well I think he throws for more yards uh I'm gonna go with he's over 4,000 just because it's not that hard to get over 4,000 anymore but I like your touchdown to interception ratio I would not expect it to be some mind-blowing 40 touchdown season or something right away I do think he has an opportunity to adapt pretty quickly because of the offense that he played in, uh, the talent that he

has, especially accuracy is really going to help. Weapons are really going to help. I might go something like 23 touchdowns and 14 interceptions. I think there's a few more mistakes mixed in there or a few jump balls that he throws that end up being picked off that did not get picked off at LSU. Cause he certainly did a lot. That's what got Justin Jefferson, uh, a first round draft pick by the Vikings is throwing the ball up to him and letting him go make those plays. Um, but I, my expectation for Joe Burrow is that he's good right away. Um, I mean, I think that what he does well translates well to the NFL and that rookies are better now than they've ever been, unless they're a garbage heap that like Kyler Murray

last year can step into a really atrocious situation and be halfway decent because he probably is a good player, but also you can design offensive systems. So that is where, uh, their young offensive Sean McVay wannabe head coach is going to be really put to the test. Last one for you. Tiger Woods and Peyton Manning played golf against Phil Mickelson and Tom Brady. And turns out that Tom Brady is not great at golf. So that was fun to watch. And he also tore his pants. So I want you to give me the foursome. You and three NFL people that you want to play golf with can be anybody you want well i thought about this and i'm like do i want to be the worst player a part of my foursome

or do i want to kind of have you know some good golf some good golfers out there and then maybe somebody who's you know really really bad so i thought back on this and usually another thing that we have at this time a year that we don't get to do this year is the charity golf tournament that um the media media members who cover the team get paired up with a bunch of front office people for nine holes in the morning and then the vikings players come out and someone pays a thousand dollars to um you know go around with uh josh Klein on a golf cart. Yeah, right.

So we've been out there, and I've seen some of the Vikings players and former Vikings players play golf, and some are good. Kyle Rudolph plays a ton. He's a very good golfer. And then you have others who look like they've never swung a club in their life or trying to hit the thing like a baseball and kill it. So I kind of went, you know, all around the board here. Adam Thielen would be part of my golf foursome.

He was a state champion golfer, I believe, when he was up in Detroit Lakes. Larry Fitzgerald is also a part of my golf foursome because he's excellent. And he has his own golf tournament every year. Hopefully he and I can become pals, and then I can get invited to go play in Arizona at his golf tournament. And then Latavius Murray, who I don't think I've seen a worse golfer ever in the history of golf. Great guy, though.

Wonderful human being. Arguably one of my favorite athletes I've ever covered, period, regardless of sport. Like, just a genuine gem of a person. But I still have video of him trying to tee off and getting so frustrated that he threw his club. And it would at least make me feel better. Because I can, you know, I'd be out there, we'd be having fun, listening to music maybe. I mean, Thielen's a very, very good golfer.

For those who don't know, he's excellent. And it would be cool to kind of, like, pick up on, like, him and Larry Fitzgerald. maybe I mean Thielen's a very very good golfer for those who don't know he's excellent um and it would be cool to kind of like pick up on like him and Larry Fitzgerald and maybe I could get some tips and then they'll just you know all of us would laugh at Latavius when he went up to tee off okay so you want at least one person who's worse than you at golf yes gotta make me feel better yeah that's a good angle well since you went Vikings related I'll go Vikings related as well I'll go Alan Page first because I want to hang out with Alan Page. If Alan Page wants to come on the podcast, someone tell him that he needs to come on

our podcasts and talk Vikings football because spending four hours with Alan Page, I think I would be a much better human being. So he's number one. Number two is Jarek McKinnon because Jarek McKinnon is hilarious. Like he has the funniest laugh, like this really high-pitched, loud laugh that I miss in the locker room that you would hear every day. On every interview in the background of my recorder, you would hear Jarek McKinnon in the background laughing super hard. And the third one, you know what? I might want to see what Case Keenum is like when he's out there on the golf course. Is he like a gunslinger out on the golf course?

He's like taking risks all over. It's either like on the green in the hole or it's 50 yards out in the water or something like that. But I would love to spend 18 holes talking about 2017 with Case Keenum, who seems like when he was away from that locker room situation, he would be a pretty cool guy to just play golf with. So that's going to be mine. Justice Alan Page, Jarek McKinnon, and Case Keenum. I mean, that's a very diverse and eclectic group of, you know,

the type of talent you have and type of people. That's a pretty good foursome. Thank you. I'm going to try to put it together, actually. So anyway, well, that's Hot Routes. We're back with Hot Routes. It feels really good. And we'll do this on a regular basis, put together some fun questions from the news

headlines and give our spin. So a reminder to go to purpleinsider.com, subscribe for all of my written work. And if you have not rated and reviewed this podcast, please do because it helps other people find Purple Insider. So Courtney, we will talk to you again soon. Thanks for having me.

All right. And thanks everybody for listening to purple insider. Thank you.