Purple Insider - a Minnesota Vikings and NFL podcast - Vikings training camp recap, Day 13: Lucky Jackson joins the show (Part 1)

Episode Date: August 12, 2025

Matthew Coller talks with Vikings receiver Lucky Jackson and then answers Vikings fan questions and recaps a light practice that had a couple developments. The Purple Insider podcast is brought to you by FanDuel.

Hey, everybody. Welcome to another episode of Purple Insider, Matthew Collar here again with you following a training camp practice, although I must tell you that, well, there were a couple of plays to talk about today. The Vikings were in shells because they are preparing to go against the New England Patriots over the next couple of days in joint practices. and should be a very exciting time for the Vikings and for us and for the fans in attendance and the players to actually get out there and have the best simulation that they can possibly have of actual NFL football. And, you know, another thing that I like about the joint practices, other than that the starters don't get hurt like they do during preseason games. And we've seen a number of injuries around the league and Rondale Moore. was a victim of this.

But another thing that I really like is that the other players get a chance to show their stuff more in these preseason games after the starters have spent the entire week crushing each other in the joint practices. So that means that, you know, the guys that we liked from the first preseason game that showed a little bit, now they get big chances. And I will tell you the highlight of the day before I get to my conversation with Lucky Jackson out at TCO Performance Center. Actually, last week, we recorded this conversation. So I'm going to bring that to you in just a moment. But the highlight of the day was a Max Brozmer

throw to Tim Jones, where it's probably about a 40-yard dime up over the top. And they completed it deep down the field. And Brosmer just continues to gain momentum. So he'll have later in the week, the next preseason game, I'm sure a lot of opportunity. And over the next couple days in the joint practices Wednesday and Thursday, it will be huge for J.J. McCarthy to show just how much progress he's made. Because in the preseason, we can always say, well, hey, it's vanilla defense. Are they really pushing it? Uh, you know, of course he should look fine, et cetera, et cetera. But in these joint practices, this is what Chad Graf of the athletic told me earlier today that Mike Vrable was game planning for the joint practice. Like, think about that. He was

actually game planning for the joint practice. He had the players out there in the pennies representing the Vikings players, 22 Harrison Smith, somebody was pretending to be him. Like, that's how seriously New England is taking it. The Vikings did not have as intense of a practice to lead up to that. But there were a couple things to discuss, which we will get to here on the show. But I want to start right out with Vikings wide receiver Lucky Jackson in joining the show. And, you know, lucky has been a guy

that I've followed for a few years because you go back to when the XFL returned. Nobody was more excited than me. Maybe actually I could have been the only one who was excited other than players to get the XFL back because I actually watched multiple weeks of the original XFL. And then when they did that documentary, I thought it was great.

I wrote about it when it came back. I've always been so interested in other leagues because of guys like Lucky Jackson who get their chance because of the XFL, because of the UFL, the UFL, the U.S.FL. And I know they struggle. I know they don't have a lot of attendance and, you know, I know that they don't get a lot of ratings and stuff. But if it even creates a couple of opportunities for guys to eventually get to the NFL, it's great. And Lucky Jackson is one of those guys. And, you know, I wanted to talk to Lucky, uh, even before like earlier this season to just write about his journey and another shot at it for him because he's been a standout

over the last couple years, highly intelligent player with really good hands that's always been pushed off the roster by one more guy, by this guy out playing him a little bit or this draft pick or whatever it might be. And this year, though, with Rondale Moore getting injured and no, I don't have a Rondale more update just yet. We haven't heard anything. Next time we get to talk to Kevin O'Connell, I'm sure that he will update us on Ron. Dale Moore. But that looked like a very serious injury for him. So assuming that he is out going forward, Lucky Jackson is the next guy on the depth chart. And then after the interview, I'll tell you, somebody else got some reps today that caught my eye as well. But the reason I want to talk

with Lucky is because this is a really big shot for him. And he's got an interesting background story. So here is my conversation with Vikings wide receiver, Lucky Jackson. I am standing here with Minnesota Vikings wide receiver, Lucky Jackson, who is having a heck of a camp here, Lucky. It's been very cool to see you get a lot of reps with Justin Jefferson's sideline. Why don't we start by just talking about this year's camp and the opportunity that you have had so far

and how you've been able to take advantage of that? How has that been for you? Honestly, it's been a real interesting opportunity. Whenever someone goes down, you never want that, but the next man has to step up and be ready. So just focusing on being consistent, taking it one day at a time and making the place to come to me. Let's get into it a little bit more.

I mean, you have spent the last two years grind in here, practice squad. And I want to go through your whole background, because it's really interesting and really unique. But to have this coaching staff buy into you, and when Jefferson goes out and you're the guy that goes in, like, why do you think that is? If you say one day at a time, you're off the podcast, you're done. Honestly, just a testament to hard work. I mean, they've seen me come to work for two years being on practice squad, just competing against our defense, which is the best defense in the league last year. Then seeing me through and through day in, day out, just how I come to work, how I approach it, and the things that I'm able to do on the field, I feel like it was a no-brainer for them with the OTAs that I had and things like that. So I'm sure there's a lot of things that went into it, but honestly, just showing up, making plays, man, that speaks a lot of than anything I could do.

So how would you describe this offense in terms of its complexity, in terms of how long it takes someone to completely understand all the intricacies? because it seems like you have to know every single position. You have to be able to line up correctly, get all the motions. I was talking to Keenan the other day, and he joked that you guys call yourself rocket scientists inside the room because there's so much. Like how would you describe that? It's very dynamic. It has a lot of layers to it. Like you said, there's multiple different things that they want to do from different places on the field.

So you can't be a one position guy. You've got to be able to go in the slide, go outside, be able to motion and just do different things to get. other guys open to get yourself open and just play within the scheme. How long did it take you to get it down? I feel like I had it down, year one, year two, but honestly just honing in on the, on the tempo of the game and things like that, just finding my field, not necessarily thinking, playing fast and reaction base is kind of something that I've grown to since I've been in the league. Okay. Speaking of being in the league, you started out, I think, what, CFL first,

then the spring league, which I think most, or is that the opposite order? It was the spring league first. Green League first. And then even before the CFL, I played in the IFL for a week, which most people don't even know. I played for the Vegas nights for one game. So I did that. Then I went into the CFL with Winnipeg for a tryout.

Didn't last after camp. Then I went on to Edmonton when they did the CFL expansion. I was there for about three weeks. I thought it was going to get brought back after that. And then in that meantime, I end up getting drafted into the XFL. And here we are going on year three with the Vikings. And I was an XFL junkie. I was very excited because I am old enough to when the original XFL came out and Vince McMahon did the like, welcome to the XFL.

Like I remember all that. If you've seen the 30 for 30, it's amazing, right? And so when it came back, I was like, this is great. And you were one of the best players in that league. What was it like playing in that league that, you know, kind of just popped up a little bit out of nowhere and probably, I'm guessing for you kind of represented like a last opportunity for you? Honestly, man, I just needed a real shot. You know what I mean? So once I got drafted, man, I knew this was everything that I needed to do to put myself in a position to make it, make it to the NFL.

So I put all my eggs in one basket. I went to work and I made the most of every opportunity that I had there. I didn't take anything for granted, man, and I just showed up and put the work in. So you're here at the sickest facility in the National Football League, but how does that compare to what the XFL was like? Very different, honestly, just being up here at this level, you got access to everything you need. So, I mean, it's a no-brainer for me to come in here and put work in, take the right things, treat my body the right way, and just come out here and put it on the field. Did you get a sense as you were playing in that league for, like, that it might take you somewhere? Because that's always been the allure of leagues like that is, hey, it's your last chance.

You got a shot. You could show the NFL what you're made of. Or were you, I mean, you're just kind of just focused on, you know, the process each day. Because I got to think that you must have sensed that there would be an opportunity there, right? Absolutely. XFL was the league of opportunities, as they would call it. And obviously they said they were working, right, and coincided with scouts and things correlated with the NFL and things like that. So, I mean, just knowing that I would get a chance to play football back over here in the States

and just have a real chance at, you know, playing at the next level. And it was guys that had been in the league trying to get back to the league. So it wasn't any type of thing like that. Like, it was a real shot. You know what I mean? So once I understood all of that, man, I just honed in on the process and really took care of what I needed to take care of. And like I said, it resulted in great things on the field.

Here's what I want to understand. I want to understand why. Like, KOC talks about this all the time. Like the players, why, right? Why did you keep going with this? Because, I mean, look, there's a lot of hilltoppers out there that don't end up in the NFL. There's so many guys who try. the XFL and just you know sort of drop out there's a million guys who come out here and never make

practice squad and then they just go do something else with their college degree like what what was it that kept driving you to try to make it through going through all that I knew I could play at this level and that was more than enough for me just that sense of just pride in humble just not really getting a real shot at it just coming out during COVID but still knowing that I could play at a high level and I wouldn't stop until I got there unless my body told me otherwise. So that was enough for me to go in and grind even after working long shifts

and things like that, just still focusing on where I wanted to be and what I was trying to get to. So what were you doing? What was your job? I worked at a moving company for a little bit. I worked helping at a pharmacy for a little while. I also became a trainer at F-45. I took on some of my own clients.

I did a number of different things, honestly. I worked at McDonald's once upon a time. It's not easy being out there Being a regular citizen That's really cool I'm so interested in stories of guys like yourself That do not ever decide to kind of let it go Until everyone tells you that you don't have a job here

So what was it like for you when you first got here To your first camp And then we're able to make the practice squad Like what was that sense for you Honestly it was just kind of whirlwind Honestly I kind of expected to get picked up after the season I had and just hearing some buzz for my agent and things like that. But I got signed here after my workout.

It was, I mean, not even a week after the season had ended, and I was right into OTA. So honestly, going from a full season into a whole other season was just kind of blur for me, honestly, it was just the whole year of football. But, I mean, it was a blessing to say the least. I was just honestly caught up just in the matrix of it, just being a part of my lifelong dream, but at the same time still having to come to work every day regardless of anything prior to getting here. So I've had a number of conversations over the years with Keenan McArdle. I'm sure if you've Googled him and his career, maybe you don't need to because he's probably brought it up so many times.

It was a heck of a career. He was a 12th round pick because they used to have a 12th round and won a Super Bowl, went to the Pro Bowl, was part of some of the best teams ever in Tampa Bay. He was their leading wide receiver. What does it mean to somebody like yourself who's gone through the grind and seen him in the career that he had that he made? out of a 12th round draft pick? What does that mean to have him in your room? I lean on Keenan, I mean, each and every day. I mean, you can even ask him.

I mean, I ask him all types of questions that I got. I pick his brain. I make him pull up his film and show me certain things that he's trying to explain that maybe I can't grasp, but once he puts it up there, I can visualize it and see it. I make him put up his film all the time. I joke with him about him still having it, putting the cleats on and things like that.

But, man, Kenan is definitely a huge resource in this building that we're grateful to have. What do you see in his film? guy that he could track it he could really track it he could track the ball he was very good at the top of his rounds and uh i think i would describe him as one of the tougher receivers for his size you know he's not the hugest guy absolutely but back in the day going over the middle of the field that used to be something they could really uh take you out so well let me ask you one more question about somebody else you're in the room with uh number 18 he's pretty good uh i want to know from your football mind because obviously i've covered justin Jefferson and i've seen everything

that he's done on the field, but I don't see what you see. So when you watch a receiver of his caliber up close in the room with him, what is it that separates him from other guys when it comes to whatever it might be, route running, understanding of the game, what is it that separates him? He plays the game extremely fast. There's not too much that can come in front of him and really throw him off. I tell him all the time that he plays reaction-based football, which is just fast, it's lightning.

The leverage changes, it doesn't throw him off. He can keep playing right through that and still get to where he needs to be there. I think he's got probably the longest stride of any wide receiver, maybe in the entire NFL. What I notice about him the most is that when he comes out to practice, like in the joint practices or something, he wants to leave a trail of bodies behind him. Like the competitiveness of him is just really impressive to me. For sure, playing the wide out, playing receiver at this high level, you have to have that savviness to you. you have to have that swagger and you got to want to beat the person across from you.

Okay. Your outlook here with the wide receiver room is good. It seems like it's a really good opportunity for you that you have worked really hard to earn here as we go into the preseason. I guess what's your mentality going into these big practices with New England and so forth? Honestly, just show up to work. Make the place that come to me be exactly where I'm supposed to be. And I just focus. I keep it simple, man.

Keep stacking days. I don't get caught up in the uncontrollables. I control knowing what to do and going out there and making them play. So I keep it as simple as that. Every single one of those was a cliche, but I'll allow it because it was a great conversation. It's really great to meet you.

And I've enjoyed watching your journey as an XFL nerd, seeing one of the better players, make it here, and get opportunities here where the Vikings has been great. So thanks so much, lucky for joining me. I really appreciate it, man. Thank you as well. And there you go. A really pleasant conversation with Lucky

Jackson. Imagine that that you are in the XFL and you're working as a trainer and you're working at a pharmacy. And then after your long day at the pharmacy, you're going to the arena league to go into the CFL. You're going to the XFL and just trying to live out the dream. And then two years on the practice squad, that means every single week, you know that you're not necessarily going to get in the game. But your best chance is to help your teammates prepare each week, working hard behind the scenes, studying the opposing offense, trying to emulate their receivers so your defense can get the best work. And then every day doing everything you can in practice to get one potential chance day after day after day. And then this year, things are currently

breaking in Lucky Jackson's direction. Now, I don't know. If they're going to sign another wide receiver with Rondale Moore going down, I don't know if they're going to end up leaning with Ty Felton because he's their draft pick or somebody else that might compete at that spot. But I think Lucky Jackson has had a really good camp and you can see the layers that he's built upon. And for some people that have the capability of making it, that's how they get there is you gain more and more technical knowledge. X's and O's knowledge through working on the practice squad, working on the scout team, all those things. And then when your opportunity arises, you're a lot better than when you got there.

And I think that that is the case for Lucky Jackson. I mean, he's not the biggest guy. He's not the fastest guy. It's not like off the bus. Someone's going to say, oh, my gosh, we got to have this player as a wide receiver. But when he jumped into the practices after Justin Jefferson went down, he knew where he was supposed to be. And he got there and he caught the football and then, you know, he gets into the preseason game the other day.

Same deal. He's where he's supposed to be, runs the routes correctly, catches the ball when it comes his way. So we will see if Lucky Jackson really does get that opportunity. But this is, I think, a big week for him if Justin Jefferson does not go against New England, which brings us to the portion where I run down a couple of the notes that I have from today and know there is not an update yet on rondale more we'll see very likely on wednesday when we talk to kevin o'connell unless they put him on injured reserve before that we'll just have to wait and see but as of right now there is not an update um but a couple of things for practice so this was again it was shells

was not the hardest practice that i've ever seen in my life uh because wednesday and thursday will be the hardest practices of the year hands down but there were still a couple of things to note one of those things was that Justin Jefferson was not doing anything in practice. He was typically throwing warmups, which he's been doing a lot, throwing a ball up in the air and catching it, running around a little bit before practice, but he was not participating in any of the seven on sevens or any of the 11 on 11s. So that makes me think that he won't be out there against the Patriots in those joint practices. And I'm a little bit conflicted on this because I know how hard Justin Jefferson

likes to practice in the joint practices. And the answer is extremely hard. Every year I've come out of the joint practices watching Jefferson thinking, my goodness, like let those corners live, my man. Like this is just a practice. It's not the Super Bowl, but that's how he does it when he's going up against somebody from another team. And honestly, guys from his own team as well. well, which from a health perspective is probably better that he does not try to show the New England Patriots who the best wide receiver in the league is, because you don't want him to get banged up with some Patriots corner safety deciding that they're going to show Justin Jefferson how good they are or try to make a name for themselves.

And you don't want him going up to try to moss somebody and coming down awkwardly on the hamstring or whatever else. you would probably prefer from a health perspective that Justin Jefferson not participate in these and just get back when there's two weeks before the season and they really start the ramp up and the game planning for Chicago and go from there. And if he's not participating in those practices, well, then it becomes a concern. But until then, okay, that's, you know, totally fine. However, there is a part of me that thinks, well, if you are calling me,

these the most important practices of the summer, then it would stand to reason that it would be important for J.J. McCarthy to have his number one wide receiver. Now, I think that Jordan Addison can emulate pretty well what Justin Jefferson does is the number one wide receiver, but there's nothing quite like the chemistry that gets built up. And I remember last year in Cleveland, the defense has definitely won the day in Cleveland last year at those practices. But the second day was where Sam Darnold and Justin Jefferson found each other a couple of times. And there was one deep bomb that Darnold let go and Jefferson outraned his man and caught it for a touchdown. And everybody went crazy on the Viking side. And that was one of those

click moments for Sam Darnold and Justin Jefferson. And there haven't been any because Justin hasn't been in there for J.J. McCarthy. You want to see at some point those two have their click moments together. And I do think that keeping guys off the field, keeping them away from potential injury is really, really important. And the fact that McCarthy walked away from the game after just, you know, one series the other day was, okay, I would have liked to see more and you would have liked to have seen more.

But okay, well, healthy is the biggest thing, right? Go into the season 100%. That's totally fine. But I mean, with Jefferson and McCarthy, they just have not had any. chance whatsoever to work together in these practices. So maybe he'll come back after the joint practices. They'll have three training camp practices after that. And then they go into regular season mode, you know, after that.

And maybe that's when Jefferson comes back. So we'll see. But him not practicing today was kind of an indicator to me that he's not going to be out there for the joint practices because normally you would have expected a ramp up. you would have expected, like, hey, there's, you know, some seven on sevens that they do some 11 on 11s in shells and then really get going, you know, in the joint practice. The fact that that didn't happen makes me think that you won't see him. However, Christian Derisaw was out there a lot today, not for the entire practice, but he was out

there. If I were to take a guess, I'd say for more reps than he's had all summer long. This was not in full pads. but maybe there is a chance that he gets out there for some joint practice work. If he is there for anything in the joint practices, I think that would be a really good sign toward week one. I've been hesitant to say Christian Derisaw week one because you got to take the baby steps and then you got to get back to game shape, which what's the date today?

August 11th, you're starting to get real close there to where it would be tough to get into game shape. So if he can go out there and practice against the Patriots a good deal, then I would think that there should be optimism toward week one for Christian Derisaw. But if it's all just in school over there, well, it's going to be a little harder on J.J. McCarthy. But it's also going to be an indicator that maybe week one is a pipe dream for Christian Derisaw. But today, at least a positive step for him to get out there. Also from a health perspective, we saw Josh Mattelis for the first time in question. quite a while practicing and he was talking after about being excited to go against the Patriots

and ramping up for himself. So that injury that has plagued him a little bit in this training camp, at least seems like it's in a good spot right now for Josh Mattelis. Something I noticed today also with the first team offense was that J. Sean Jones was getting into the mix. the undrafted receiver from last year from Maryland who made a positive impression last year and then this year got a mention from O'Connell when we first asked him, hey, who's got to step up with Jefferson out? And he had mentioned J. Sean Jones, which I was like, oh, okay, well, that's interesting. And we just hadn't seen him. It had been mostly all lucky. We hadn't seen him take many reps. But today, he was in there taking quite a few with J.J. McCarthy, which makes me wonder,

will he get some opportunities against the Patriots to show that he might deserve to get in the game to some extent? I think that based on what we saw, that's realistic. And that'll be something that I'll be watching for because Jones, he almost had a deep throw from Brett Rippin. He's been a little bit of a victim of the quarterback play, though. I mean, Howl and Rippin have struggled. And Jones has mostly worked with those guys. And there just hasn't been a lot of opportunities where the coaches see a lot more. They say individual. They see the routes.

When they watch back on tape, was the guy open? Should the football have gone his way? So they have better ways of evaluating the receivers than us where it's typically just, oh, that guy caught it. Good job to that guy, right? Production matters. But if the quarterback's not getting you the ball and you're open, then you're still doing your job.

So I will have an eye on Jayshon Jones and all the other wide receivers who get chances. because if you get in the mix of the joint practices, that means there's serious consideration for you for the roster. If you're not one of the main guys who are already locked in, if you're playing in the preseason game, you're kind of trying out for the practice squad or maybe fighting for a last spot on the roster. So J. Sean Jones,

definitely a guy to watch there going forward. I thought Sam Howell looked more confident today. It is possible that Sam Howell turned a corner. we're going to find that out in the next couple of days. But I thought he finally, I would say, had a pretty good practice today. It wasn't the best practice I've ever seen in my life. But it was, it looked like it was good. It looked like a backup quarterback practice, which is just how he looked in the preseason.

And that's why we don't go too far right away early, even if, you know, things did not look so great. As of this moment, Sam Howell to me is still quarterback number two. They don't have to get on the market right now. But these next few days, again, will be somewhat telling. Let's see. I mentioned Brozmer had the throw of the day. He has just always looked good and continued to do that. There's starting to be some questions about Max Brosmer and where he stands.

I still think quarterback three. I've still got him on the 53. I had him on my initial 53 and that hasn't changed. He's done a very good job. But he showed off the arm a little bit today. And the one other thing that I noticed was just that T.J. Hawkinson. Oh, J.J. McCarthy had a good red zone period or at least good enough. So not every red zone period has been bad for J.J. McCarthy during this training camp. You don't have to

completely panic. And he was finding T.J. Hawkinson a lot today, a lot. So, you know, I thought that when we go into week one, Hawkinson is going to be a really big thing for J.J. McCarthy. I think really early in the season, that relationship, that connection with T.J. Hawkinson and McCarthy, I feel like as the summer has gone along, it started to connect more and more. These last few practices, it really has. And we're going to see more of that is my expectation. So there's some of the notes from today. Again, not exactly the craziest updates.

And that means, you know what? I've got plenty of time to answer your questions and comments. So let me throw up on the screen. a little bit of a film that I took from practice today and we'll answer your questions. This is me walking at TCO Performance Center. Hopefully that's not giving you like like nausea or something watching because I was going for cinematic with that. We'll see how you like it.

But anyway, so it was a beautiful day out there today. Brian says, feels like we haven't had a pie chart question in a while. I know Brian and whose fault is that? that's that's the chat the chat should be going pie charts and putting me on the spot let's see how about a pie chart of top worries for 2025 after 13 days of camp let's see well that's a little hard to do with pie chart style because I feel like you have to give me the worries and then I give you percentages or something but let me try to work with that anyway how about if there were four four concerns and then we were

weighing them with a pie chart. How about that? So the secondary, the backup quarterback, the receiver depth, and the offensive line. How about those are our four biggest concern? To me, if we were doing just weighted out of 100% of total concern, how much would go to each one of those places, I would go with, even though we just had lucky on the show, receiver depth has to be in the discussion after Rondale Moore gets hurt. And we haven't heard yet what they're going.

going to do about that if they're going to add someone else um so i might put out of the concern they still have just a jefferson on the team hasn't been practicing though and that you know so a little bit how about like 20% concern to the receivers the secondary would be maybe 30% because we're still talking about unproven guys i've liked isaiah rogers he actually was the one who got beat by Tim Jones. But when they're in shells, you can't put your hands on the guy. It's very different from playing in pads. I've liked what I've seen from the secondary group, but there's still questions about sample size. Theo Jackson hasn't played and Isaiah Rogers hasn't played a full season. And Jeff Okuda has not played well in the NFL. So there's still enough concern,

but it's not a wild concern. The offensive line, I might want to give 40, percent here. So I got 20, 30, 50. Yeah, that sounds right. I'm going to go 40 percent and I will tell you why. I think as a whole and as a complete unit, the Minnesota Vikings offensive line can be one of the five to seven best in the NFL. But as of right now, Will Fry's still coming back from his injury. Christian Derisaw, hard to say if he's trending for week one. Ryan Kelly has been banged up a little bit in camp, not too bad, but a little bit. And you still go, you know, is he's going to stay healthy. for the whole year. And I am not freaking out over Donovan Jackson falling down and getting pushed back a little bit in the first game, but it's also happening in practice as well. And it's just a really tough transition for a guard. And this is why when we talk about Jackson and how he looks, which this is a huge week for him, by the way, and how he looks, it's still with, like, hey, I think this guy could be a great player in the NFL. Like, he's got a high upside and he's highly intelligent dude and he's very athletic and all that. But you're talking about going right

out of the frying pan and into the fire. It's not an easy thing. So I guess I would put a little bit more there because they've allowed a lot of pressure. And I didn't think that they played great in the preseason game. And if you're starting just in school week one, again, like there's some questions there. That means your left side is a rookie and a guy that you don't really want to be playing. And then on the right side, Will Fry is playing his first game since missing most of last season. There just, there could be a ramp up period for that offensive line. And backup quarterback, I would go with 10% because I just, you know, I saw Trevor Simions back in the league today, uh, with Tennessee. Maybe he was somewhere else, you know, before that, but I mean, if Trevor

Simeon's still getting jobs and I think he replaced Tim Boyle, think about Tim Boyle still getting jobs. The guy's never won. And he's still out there getting job. Like, that's the status of backup quarterbacks in the NFL. So, I'm not too concerned about that. So that was my attempt at a pie chart. But feel free to toss other pie charts in there. Reconnected would rather see the joint practices televised than preseason game. Yeah, I don't disagree with you.

That would be a pretty entertaining broadcast. And I think that there has been some in the past, maybe not those, but some practices got on TV. I don't know if they've done that at all this year. but I've always thought that they should have the joint practices in the stadium. That may be a lot harder to pull off than I think it is because you have to take all your equipment and both franchises and they got to go all down to the stadium and everything as opposed to just having it all right here for the Vikings. It's a lot of moving parts.

Maybe there's an ordinance of some kind. You have to work around. I don't know if you're going to open up the stadium. But it would be cool if they could fit in more than just, you know, the handful of people who get to come out and see it. I will say that as opposed to a game where you have the pregame presentation and you have the kickoff and the refs and the whole thing, you know, the real game, a practice is probably about 25 to 35 minutes of really intense stuff.

And there's a lot of individual drills. There's a lot of one-on-ones. There's a lot of stuff that the coaches are looking for to get something out of that from the stands, it looks like kind of nothing. And it's like, I'm actually showing you there, the Vikings warm up here on video. And this is what it looks like. I mean, the warmups and the individual stuff and then the one on ones are pretty entertaining with the wide receivers and corners. But it's really only about 20 minutes where they're 11 on 11, 30 minutes, and it's hardcore. We're flying up and down the field. Those are the reps that we care about the most. But I don't

disagree with you. I mean, I think when the head coach of the team, repeat, comes out and says it's the joint practice is the really matter folks so hope you're one of the thousand people who can make it out there you know you wish that there was a little more ability to see in depth what happens with that uh and when with those games maybe their argument this would just be my guess would be hey we're really trying to game plan here and so the handful of fans who take their videos and tweet them out for the engagement or whatever they're not too concerned about that. But if you put actual tape out there, then opposing teams are going to see it.

And in the joint practices, they're actually trying to get stuff done. You know, there might be moving parts. But I agree with you in principle that these are kind of the must see of the summer. And I wish more people could see it. But it's a great reason to watch the recaps on Wednesday and Thursday night. There you go. uh jacob says coming to you from about an hour and a half outside of chicago surrounded by bears fans the amount of clowning they do on jj is absurd and they think that williams is basically

mahomes it's driving me insane well welcome to fandom jacob that is how it works uh the fans of the bears were the same ones that were ready to attack anyone who suggested justin fields wasn't a great quarterback and then when he was traded for a fifth round pick or something they were like oh well next quarterback to defend and then when he busts they'll defend the next one and the next one and the next one on and on forever that's what it is to be a bears fan i'm sure um but you know when it comes to j j mccarthy and how he's viewed from the outside and and i'll tie this into what lucas is saying here that colin coward said the vikings are trying to instill confidence in mccarthy and Lucas asks, does McCarthy seem like he lacks confidence?

No, he does not. In fact, that I think is one of J.J. McCarthy's best traits is his never-ending confidence in himself that is so obvious to people who have actually attended practice, which does not include Colin Cowherd. Okay? So, I mean, look, I'm not saying he has to come out. He can if he wants. He can drop by my house for dinner.

We'll have pizza. But, you know, it's his job. job to go on TV from LA and just throw out whatever he thinks. That's what his job is to just have takes. He's not a reporter. I'm a reporter. It's different. I have to deal in facts. He has to deal in takes. Those are two kind of different things. I meld them sometimes because I do this show and I have some opinions, but they always are rooted in reporting, which is going out to 13 straight practices in a preseason game and 13 practices or whatever it was last year that he participated in along with OTA's mini camps and everything else and gathering as much info as I can and

bringing it back to you on a daily basis. That's my job. His job is takes. So what he's going to try to do is have a little bit different spin every day on J.J. McCarthy because he's become the anti-McCarthy guy. He was pro Darnold, loves Darnold, thought Darnold should have come back to the Vikings. That's his take. That's his job is to give that take. So I just think, you know, as you're making your choice as a viewer, as a listener, how am I going to spend my time listening to somebody who is there or somebody who is not there? I mean, that's, that's up to you. But since you're asking the question, I see you've made the right choice. Anyhow, when it comes to Caleb Williams, skepticism is is reasonable.

But, you know, it's reasonable for both quarterbacks. It really is. Like, when it comes to J.J. McCarthy, if you're in the Vikings building right now, And you've watched all these practices and you've been around McCarthy and you've seen his work ethic and you've seen how players connect with him and what they've got to say about them and all those things, you're still not 100% sure that it's going to work. I mean, because until we actually see it, nobody can be 100% sure. This is why it makes for a great debate topic for television because no one can really know

what J.J. McCarthy is going to be or Caleb Williams is going to be until they actually get out there and play. And, you know, we've seen enough of Caleb Williams, I think, to have a lot of doubts about whether he could see the field, whether he can handle the strain of playing quarterback in the NFL, whether he can play in structure. And, you know, I was having a conversation with a friend of mine who works for SI, Matt Verderam, who has been on this show before. He will be definitely, again, he's in, he's a Kansas. city guy. So he started his career with covering Kansas City. And we were talking about the Caleb Williams Mahomes thing. And what he was saying is that, you know, he's watched every throw of

Mahomes career covering, you know, Kansas City and then at the national level, but still staying close with Kansas City. And he does a podcast with them. And his point was most of Mahomes throws are in structure and on time. It's the ones that are insane that everyone sees in the highlight reel. That's where I think there's a little bit misunderstanding. understanding of like Michael Jordan didn't dunk from the free throw line every single time. Michael Jordan mostly went down the floor, back somebody down and took a high percentage jumper. But every once in a while did something, holy cow, you've got to see that for the rest of your life on the highlight reel. Caleb Williams seems to me like a guy

that wants to dunk from the free throw line on every play because he's not seeing the field very well. And he reminds me a lot more of Kyler Murray than of Patrick Mahomes. Because neither guy is very tall, both can make breathtaking plays, but in a down-to-down basis, I don't like what I see, especially with the sacks and just the wild throws. But their highlight reel will be exciting. And every once in a while, if that guy clicks, it's going to be really good. As far as JJ McCarthy goes, the things that I've liked about him have just been a little more, a little more subtle.

You know, a scramble for four yards on a first down or whatever, five yards is not that exciting, but it's a really good decision and getting the ball out on time. It's a really good decision. It's a good little anticipation throw to Addison or over the middle today to Hawkinson. It's not like that sets my socks on fire, right? But like that's a good decision. And being a good decision maker does not get you very high on people's

quarterback rankings. We know that from Jared Goff, who does not get celebrated by most people, but he's the guy. going back to as you can win a lot with good decision making. And then obviously McCarthy brings more in terms of mobility with the receivers that they have with the offense they have. And then we'll see where the rest goes. I think he's got a really strong arm. And I think he's got a mentality to make plays out of structure, off balance, maybe a little bit too much at times, but you like that. You really, you really like that about him. And then we're going to have to,

then we're going to have to see where it all goes from there with j j mccarthy but no one really knows and so as of right now what we're doing is all trying to kind of gather as much as we can to figure it out and this week will be really big for the evaluation because if mccarthy goes out there and looks pretty competent and strong against new england's defense which is good i think the confidence goes up and it goes and it goes up a lot the confidence that he can come right out and be a good quarterback. But we've got an accumulation of a pretty good evidence, though, that this offense works for quarterbacks, this coach works for quarterbacks, the receivers work for

quarterbacks, the tight end. They've got a better line. They've got better running. I mean, there's just a lot of things that line up to me logically. And there's nothing, I'll keep going back to this. There's nothing I've seen at training camp that would make me say, I don't know, guys, I don't think it's going to work. And I've said that to you before about other people, you know, Kell and Mon specifically. That was the one where it wasn't going to work. And we saw him practice

enough. And I turned into Mike Zimmer. I see him every day, a practice guy with Mon. It was just clear it wasn't going to work. He worked with Kevin O'Connell. It didn't matter. That wasn't, it just wasn't going to happen. Wasn't accurate enough. Couldn't throw on time, couldn't see the field, couldn't execute. I mean, he couldn't even execute a snap sometimes. I haven't seen anything like that for McCarthy. But figuring out the high end is so much harder than figuring out the floor. Like the floor is the guy's a starter and he wins games and it's okay. And the ceiling is what?

That's where it's hard to figure out because we are just in practice. We are not in a live situations where our quarterbacks differentiated. The situations, right? the final two minutes of a drive, the one time that somebody breaks through free and you make a crazy play and you see down the field and make a throw, those winning type of moments for quarterbacks.

Like, it's hard to simulate those in 11 on 11s in practice, even joint practice. It's a little easier with joint practice, but it's just hard to simulate. That I don't know where it is. But there's nothing I've seen to this point that would make me say they should have regrets, especially when I look at the rest of the roster

and go, look at all the talent on this football field. And that happens in a lot of ways because of the contract that he carries. So I wouldn't say they should have any regrets to this point. And as far as building their confidence or building JJ's confidence, I mean, what would you prefer they do, not build his confidence? I mean, personally, so we were talking with Josh Mattelis after practice today. Dane Mizatani and I were having a conversation with Josh. And what he was saying is I wrote it down.

He said that, oh, yeah, he said that like J.J. McCarthy, you know, playing against even in preseason, like a normal defense is almost jarring to him because of how much Brian Flores throws at him in practice and how much they're changing and tweaking and all the guys at the line of scrimmage and dropping back. And Josh was saying, you know, when he goes against Chicago and those guys just stand there before the snap, it's going to be like, oh, it doesn't have to be this hard. and ultimately he said he thinks it's a positive thing. But that could that could break a guy for sure. The floor is defense and it hasn't. I mean, there's some things that I can buy that could be issues for McCarthy. And there's some things that I just have to roll my eyes at. I mean, a lack of confidence is an eye roll for that guy.

I mean, five star IMG champion, national champion with Michigan. I don't know. I mean, he's come in right from the outset and acted like the franchise was his. And I mean that in a very positive way. not an entitled way and you hear it from players all the time so i don't think confidence is an issue if you told me though that accuracy and sharpness with the timing of the offense was an issue early on i'd say okay i could buy that if you told me that the red zone was an issue i could sell i can buy that because everything happens super fast down there and it's he has never played

at this full speed at true full speed so there's things that i think are reasonable to question and you know i was reading and i'm going to to try to get Mike Sando on the show from the athletic. I was reading the quarterback tears and I want to do a whole entire show on the quarterback tiers because I love that article. Sando does an incredible job of that he has for years. It's awesome data points to look at through the years of how much that changes. But what was interesting was that several people brought up like him being injury prone. Like one injury? Like I don't know. It just feels like nobody knows what to say about J.J. McCarthy. So you kind of either say,

I don't know, I guess we're going to find out and we're learning every day or you just make something up. And those are your two options. So, you know, I, but if, if anybody wants to come to practice and watch, they are welcome to do so. Brad says, what does Brosmer do that JJ can get better at? Comparative evaluation of them. Yeah, I don't think there's a lot that Brosmer does that J.J. McCarthy can get better at. You know, McCarthy's just a much, I mean, Brozmer's played more football. So maybe there's that. I don't know.

I mean, JJ's better in a lot of areas than Max Brozmer. That's why one is the 10th overall draft pick and the other was undrafted. McCarthy has a huge arm in comparison, much more mobile, much more athletic. The upside is enormous where I think Brosmer is at his upside right now. but my thing is for Max Brozmer, I think this guy's going to have a career in the NFL. I think he's going to be in the NFL for a long time. He's going to be a journeyman. He's going to play for five different teams.

And that probably starts with next year as him being the backup quarterback for the Minnesota Vikings. I think I could see that. What you don't see very often from undrafted quarterbacks is really good decision making and accuracy. He's got enough velocity on the ball, but he's also accurate. And when you see that day in and day out, it's not just in the fourth quarter of a preseason game, but day in and day out, I mean, you got to be impressed. And this was the second or third time that he's hit a deep shot accurately down the field. He gets rid of the ball on time.

I mean, there's, we're, there's no, we're not evaluating McCarthy versus Brosmer. That's not at all any type of thing. Like, Brosmer has to beat out Brett Rippin first. And he's not beating out Sam Howell. So, like, we know where he's going to be this year. But that doesn't mean you can't be impressed. But McCarthy is franchise quarterback type of material from a physical perspective from a, you know, they both have great mental makeup.

They both seem to have really great minds for the game, great attitude. When you hear either one of them talk, you think, is this guy related to Kevin O'Connell? So I like a lot that I've seen from Rosemary, though, a lot. Really from day one. I mean, I wrote about it after mini camp. And I talked to his trainer, Quincy Avery. I talked to his offensive coordinator, Greg Harbaugh, Jr. Over there, Purpleinsider. Football, make sure you check that out.

And I realized today that in some web browsers, you have to write www.purpleinsider. Dot football. Who knows why, but try that. Anyway, Anthony over under on a brawl day two. I don't think so. I don't think these teams are going to brawl because Kevin McConnell has put a ton of evidence or emphasis on not fighting. He wants nothing to do with the players fighting. He wants these guys to run a practice and anybody, and if I remember

correctly from Vrable, it was Tierre Tart who got into it with somebody the last time these, these two coaches held the joint practice. And then they made Tart play in the preseason game because he got in a fight and got thrown out. I don't. think they want any part of that, you know, maybe pushing and shoving a little bit, maybe it gets a little tiny bit heated. But I mean, they wounded their coach the last time they got into a brawl. I think that O'Connell wants nothing to do with that. But is there a chance? Yeah. So, I mean, I would go, if you were asking me over under, like, what does a brawl mean, though? Pushing and shoving is not a brawl. Guys kind of getting together is not a brawl. That means like all out,

fist thrown, pushing, maybe a helmet gets swung. I'm, going to say, I'm going to say no. I'm going to say that doesn't happen. Bitter Bruce, any chance Jefferson and McCarthy will work on timing away from practice. Probably not. I don't think when you're putting your body through training camp that you're going outside the building and then throwing more. There's only, I mean, he's going to throw in this next week a hundred times. So I don't really think that they do that very much during the actual season because it's structured in a certain type of way. What it really is, is, that they're going to have a chance is probably the week after there's three practices.

I think they close it down for fans. They're usually pretty serious practices. And then they go into full season mode. And I assume Jefferson's going to be back at that point. If he's not, then I'm going to be raised in an eyebrow. We're not in official freak out mode until he misses real practices. But, I mean, I'd like to see him out there at least for a couple leading up to the, real season structure of here's how your week works, your game plan, everything else like

that. But if he doesn't practice in these joint practices, that's okay. That just means Justin Jefferson stays healthy. At some point, though, they've got to get on the same page with stuff. Paul says the Vikings should bring back Tristan Jackson. He's with the Cardinals, but had great chemistry with McCarthy last off season. I don't disagree with that take, Paul. The one thing I wonder about with going out to get somebody, and I assume they're going to sign another wide receiver once Rondale Moore goes on IR, if he goes on IR, is the punt returning aspect. How important is that to them? In the past, they have treated it not so important.

It's basically been, hey, Brandon Powell, catch the ball and don't look directly at us in the eyes. Just catch the ball and pretend you're not on the team otherwise. So if they wanted to be that way again, well, they could throw back there, Isaiah Rogers to catch it. They could throw back there, Silas Bolden to catch it. It looks like he's fine at catching the ball. So if they want their receiver to have punt returning experience, so it might be different.

I don't disagree on Tristan Jackson, though. I mean, he's somebody who knows this offense. He's actually a lot like Lucky Jackson, where they're both kind of quad A type of guys, which just means they're on the fringe of not quite getting their opportunity to play in the NFL too much, but definitely good enough to be in this building. And it's somebody who, I'm sure, you know, remembers enough of the offense and had enough chemistry with McCarthy to step in. So they might, they might wait till cut down day.

I would think, though, you have enough time that you might go and look for somebody else. I just don't know if they're going to pick up somebody else soon. Are they going to do it with somebody who's more of a big fit? someone who has had experience, the names that we've mentioned, the Amari Cooper's, the Tyler Boyd's, the Adam Thelins, or are they going to just bring in somebody else that they've liked who is an undrafted free agent or whatever, just another name to throw in the pool?

That's what I don't know and then wait till cut down and see if anything interesting happens. That's what I don't know. You would think that they would want more than just the cut down day, the, you know, week and a half before the season or something to get someone ready and that they would want to do that fairly soon. We will see. We will see. Kit, any targets on the Patriots to watch for cut down time. Seems like they've historically picked up guys that they've gotten looked at. I'm remembering a Jags tight end and maybe Theo Jackson. Was Theo Jackson the same

year? Trying to remember. Was Theo Jackson? I don't, I'm going to say that Jackson might not have been the same year. Was that 2022? Who did they? No, it wasn't the same year. They had joint practices with the 49ers in 2022. And it was 2023. So, and they picked up Jackson in 2022 when Lewisine got hurt off of the Titans. So, so they didn't. But I know what you're saying. I look at the Patriots roster and go, uh, I'm not sure any of those wide receivers is all that attractive. I'm, I'm really not sure that, you, there's anybody that is going to be an upgrade off of their roster. Son of Beaver says every beat reporter had me fooled about Howl.

I wouldn't count the chickens before the hatch with Sam Howell. He looked pretty decent in a preseason game where the defense is playing the second teamers or in Houston's case, third teamers, because they didn't play any of their starters really. And, you know, made a couple of plays. but and then had an okay practice today. I would not put that together and say, wow, they're super confident in Sam Howl.

It just maybe seems like there's a little turning of the corner. Oh, is there a Fandual question of the day? Actually, thank you, son of beavers, for reminding me. Appreciate that. There is. Here is the Fandual question of the day, my friends. Drake May's coming to town. Will Drake May or J.J. McCarthy pass for more yards in

2025. And interestingly, Fandul thinks that it will be McCarthy who passes for more yards than Drake May. So do you agree with Fanduel for the question of the day that J.J. McCarthy will throw for more yards than Drake May. And if you want to toss a Drake May projection in there, please do. And also appreciate the reminder because the show has some sponsors. And I want to tell you about one of them, that would be ZipRecruiter. I know of a lot of you out there on your own business or you're in management position where you have to hire people and it can be a pain. So you have to go through all these resumes and a lot of people who aren't qualified,

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that is ziprecruiter.com slash audio zip recruiter the smartest way to hire thank you for that reminder uh beavers brands is uh finding hawk a lot will be very good for j j this year he should do more of that i totally agree i totally agree and you know hockinson is another one that i'm going to be watching close this week because i want to see if when there's pressure and when the Patriots are showing stuff that, you know, maybe he's not so comfortable with if he's able to find T.J. Hawkinson quickly. Today, they looked really locked in. The other day they looked really locked in in their practice right before the preseason game. And it feels like that's starting to come along. And you don't need McCarthy to have perfect chemistry right

from day one with everyone. But I think the guy that you really need other than Jefferson is Hawkinson to be able to find him because that means you're dropping back, you're under pressure or they're double teaming Jefferson. You can't go there and don't go broke taking a profit. Like there's a reason they say that eight yards, 10 yards, 12 yards. Heck, even when Josh Dobbs got in there, who did he look to? He looked to T.J. Hawkinson because that's your safety outlet all the time. So I agree with you.

I think that he should be in for a big recovery year. from last year where I didn't think it was terrible. But Sam Darnold just didn't lean on him much. I think McCarthy really can. Yeti, is there any possibility that the Vikings look for another DB, the safeties and corners still kind of worry me with the talent in those rooms alone?