Purple Insider - a Minnesota Vikings and NFL podcast - What are we looking for during Vikings offseason program?

Episode Date: May 10, 2024

OTAs and minicamp are on the way for the Minnesota Vikings. What are the most interesting things in Vikings land heading into spring practices Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Hey everybody, welcome to another episode of Purple Insider. Matthew Collar here. And you know, there is a little bit of a different vibe here to our live shows than the intensity of draft talk, the mock drafts, the draft sims, all the best, how much it would cost, everybody planting their flags for which quarterback they loved. And now that we have the answer, it's a little bit more chill. So you can enjoy the rest of your spring and summer without stressing about which quarterback the Vikings are going to end up with. But I mean, right off the bat, I really appreciate this, uh, this comment here. Oh, sorry. I clicked the wrong one. This one here. Uh, how's Teddy looking is a great reference. Um, it is a tremendous reference because over the, I think it was off season of 2017 that we were talking constantly about how's he look at practice how's he look at practice

and when is he coming back for Teddy Bridgewater after his injury and that is exactly what is going to happen with J.J. McCarthy including tomorrow when I head out to TCO Performance Center I'll do a podcast from there as always and talk about how J.J. How's Teddy looking? How's McCarthy looking? Absolutely we'll be on top of that for all of you. But I did want to talk tonight about what we're actually looking for from JJ McCarthy. My process in taking in information about the quarterback situation, starting in rookie minicamp, OTAs, and and going forward and just how I'm going to approach the entire thing, what I'm looking for from all of their players, other positions interested in your comments too, and what you guys are looking for from the off season program.

So that to me covers rookie minicamp, because look, we're going to be out there for a couple hours tomorrow. And what I do know from Kevin O'Connell in the past is that the day that the media is out there for rookie camp is not always the most intense day, which is quite different from Mike Zimmer. Mike Zimmer was pedal to the metal, rookies, OTAs, mini camp. It was real practices. And we could take a lot from that with Kevin O'Connell. It's just, it's different. It's a different approach. I think he looks at it as it's a very, very long season. Let's not put

too many miles on the backs of these players in the spring and get guys hurt or wear them down now when we're going to need to do that during training camp. And even during training camp, he has taken a little more of a dialed back approach as far as how many hard reps he asks from his players versus Mike Zimmer. That makes it harder for me to come back and say, hey, rookie mini camp, this guy was out there doing this and that.

I remember very specifically a rookie mini camp where Tyler Conklin had a great day and they were running 11 on 11s and he was making catches all over the place. We were kind of like, who's this fifth round tight end. Whereas there's not much 11 on 11s from the last couple of years in rookie mini camp with Kevin O'Connell, which will be more of a challenge then to say, well, how did JJ McCarthy look? I already could tell you it's going to be hard to come back with some sweeping observation of, oh man, let me tell you, he's the guy. That's going to be a hard thing to do. Maybe I would get more clicks if I made that as the headline of McCarthy shines in rookie minicamp. I don't know, we'll see. We'll see how he looks tomorrow.

But I'm really viewing it more than just that throughout the entire spring where he progresses to to the point of mini camp, because with rookie camp, the biggest thing is just learning a couple of plays. And can you get out there? Can you start to get people lined up? Can you run a couple of plays? And that's like a good start for you. Actually, it was very cool. And you should go check it out after you're done watching the show. Uh, chase Daniel did a breakdown of what a play

is like to learn for a rookie, did a really cool video. And he took you through one of Sean Payton's whole plays. And then he took out his playbook and showed, here's what this is. Here's how you switch from a run to a pass. And you just got the sense of how difficult it is for a rookie quarterback to learn. So if you can even see JJ McCarthy getting a little bit comfortable in rookie minicamp in OTAs and so forth, that's good. That's progress. We're going to be keeping an eye on, of course, the reps. Is it going to be when Sam Darnold arrives? Is it going to be Sam Darnold the entire time? How much McCarthy mixes in? Do they go back and forth a little bit by the time we get to minicamp? So it's really a progression throughout the entire spring,

and it sets the stage for where training camp will begin. So when minicamp is over in June, when we get to the end of that either two or three practice little section, and sometimes it's two, sometimes they cancel the third one, sometimes there is a third practice but if this year with a new quarterback there probably will be so we get through that then we know where everyone is starting when they arrive at training camp the starting point it's kind of like all right this is your qualifying if it's we're making a nascar thing this is your qualifying now take off when we get to training camp.

And I'm sure if you guys are NASCAR nuts, you probably actually watch qualifying. That's what I feel like I'm doing. I feel like I'm watching the qualifiers. And does JJ McCarthy's car look fast is what I'm trying to figure out because we can't overreact to anything that we see during, we're going to come in once a week during these things. It's going to be Friday. And then I think a week from then, maybe on a Tuesday or something in the following week, and then three days in June. So what we're really taking a look at is just how comfortable he looks throwing the ball

to Vikings wide receivers receivers does he seem like he's sort of getting it to start but you also have to have a lot of leeway with all of that because it's just beginning so there will be plays where he threw to the wrong person or the coach is yelling at him or what well they don't yell as intensely as uh as Mike Zimmer used to, but you know what I mean? Like the getting coaching points and having receivers be like, Oh, was I supposed to be over there? Is that where I'm supposed to be lined up? You see a lot of that in OTAs and in training camp. And that's why, or I'm sorry, mini camp. And that's why we don't start giving big reactions until the practices really matter, because this is really an install type of

period. And what Chase Daniel was talking about in his video was your first install happens in rookie camp, then OTAs they install. And what I mean is getting all the language down, what everything means, how you are huddling, how you are calling plays, that sort of stuff. And then you do it again at the very beginning of training camp, where you start to get the wheels really going. And it isn't until a couple of weeks into training camp, I feel where you can start getting that true sense for where someone actually stands on the roster. I'll just give you an example. By the night practice, which may have been maybe the second week of camp last year, we started to get the idea, second or third week, that Ivan Pace Jr. was going to be something. But before that, we didn't know. I mean, maybe they

did inside the building, which guy was getting it better, but it wasn't until the night practice when he was out there, as opposed to Brian Asamoah, where we said, oh, okay, something is going on there. Nice to see you tonight, guard guy. Appreciate that. Please let us know if the rookies can play guard. There are many rookie guards. Michael Juergens is the guy we're going to be keeping an eye on, I guess. One thing I do know for sure, though, about rookie camp, minicamp camp OTAs, I'll just call it from now on the off season program. One thing I know for sure is that you cannot do anything as far as analysis with the guys in the trenches. Maybe it used to be a little bit with

Zimmer and the way he played, but the Vikings now they do not do very much at all with those guys in the trenches during this period because, again, they don't want them to be suffering injuries, to go too hard against each other. And so they're kind of going through the motions a little bit, working on techniques, how to get lined up, where they're supposed to be on certain plays. But they are not going super hard at each other. They will not start doing that until the pads come on at training camp. So how did the guards look? Sorry, guard guy. It's going to be

a little while before I could tell you later in the summer, uh, how that's going to work out. Will the giant bubble helmets be out again? I think they probably will. It looks like that's a standard thing now in the NFL. But I mean, sometimes in these things, they just got a helmet and nothing else on. And I think for all of these mini camps they do, maybe they'll have the helmet bubbles on. I'm trying to think about last year in rookie mini camp, whether they did or not. And in training camp, I'm like, my memory's not working here. If they use those last year or not, it has seemed like the last couple of years that they have. I don't, who would be the most likely player

to use the guardian helmet in season? I mean, I don't think any player would want to walk out onto the field with that thing on. Although it might be at some point that it's so much safer than the current helmet that that's all anybody ever wears is just these bubbly things that have the logo painted on the side. But I don't think that I'm actually going to go about looking for progress with JJ McCarthy and, you know, going for Kirk Cousins is a great answer to that, by the way, that is a good answer. Mark Kelso back in the day, if you are really old, then you remember Mark Kelso was a safety for the bills and they created this helmet. There was like a cap that went on over the helmet. And there was a,

you know, there was kind of a shelf, like it started and there was a line and then it was this foam thing. I don't know if that did anything or not, but it's similar to this. And who knows about the science on it? I guess it must work for all these teams to be using it. So anyway, on JJ McCarthy, I mean, patience is of course, number one,

but more than anything, it's just the overall vibe of how does he interact with teammates? How is he interacting with coaches? How does he look throwing the football? I mean, because we're going to get a lot of looks at him throwing the ball on air not a whole lot of looks at him throwing on coverage they'll do seven on sevens and things like that and just how everybody is interacting with this new quarterback and rookie camp is also hard because you don't have Justin Jefferson out there you don't have Jordan Addison maybe we'll get to Justin

Jefferson at minicamp and we'll talk about that at some point during the show as well. But there are little observations that you can make of how something feels. Does it look like the practice is running the way that they want to run it because the quarterback is doing the things that they want him to do. Even if it's not perfect, even if the rep doesn't go well. I mean, if you go out there and watch Nick Mullins run a practice at no point, will you be like, Whoa, Nick Mullins just ran the bleep out of that practice, but he does do well enough to allow for everybody to get practice in, to be able to run their routes, throw it where it's supposed to be thrown, accuracy be darned sometimes, arm strength be darned sometimes.

And so I know the feel from seeing enough of these practices over the years of kind of how the operation should go. It should have a little bit of a rhythm to it, a little bit of like it looks like he bit of like, it looks like he's completing passes. It looks like he's throwing to the right places. And that's pretty much it for rookie camp and OTAs. What I want to know a little bit more at OTAs is just the rep distribution. Is it going to be entirely Sam Darnold asb1 with jj mccarthy not taking any reps with the ones do they mix in and out is it every other is this a competition from the start

or is this entirely jj mccarthy you know day one is the backup and he is going to be the backup until further notice uh rob how many quarterbacks will they have at rookie camp? Let's see. I mean, Jaron Hall will be there. Usually, I'm trying to think if they have more sometimes. I want to say at some point, Brett Hundley showed up last year. Was it last year or two years ago? Sometimes they bring in a tryout player,

and they have them work out at rookie minicamp, I think think this is where I'm trying to go back like a year of now. Was it, was it then, or was it an OTA practice he showed up at for a day or something like that? There was Brett Hundley something at Vikings camp, maybe for a day may have been at a rookie camp at very least Jaron Hall should be there because even though it is rookie camp, a lot of times there are other players that are younger that show up. Um, so I, I think, you know, there, there were some handful of draft picks from the previous year that were there last year. So it's not just all rookies and that's it. And I would imagine, I mean, if Jaron Hall wants to get extra reps, this would

be a good idea. And he definitely needs that. Hoping that they bring out the pool noodles. I still want to know what they bought online that was supposed to help them stop fumbling. I think it was probably just random that they fumbled as much as they did and they didn't need to be hit with pool noodles or any other apparatus to help them stop. They just needed to like not reach the ball out over the goal line or, you know, maybe go down when you're supposed to go down or sometimes strange stuff

just happens. Am I expecting any UDF phase to pay attention to? I always have a rule on this. Now, Gabriel Murphy breaks the rule, but because Ivan Pace last year was so good, now I do have to pay attention to UDFAs. The previous rule was you have to make me. Somebody has to make me pay attention to them by standing out, making plays,

having a coach talk about them because there's so many undrafted free agents and so few of them actually make it in the NFL that, I mean, I could look at all of their, and I, you know, I peek at it like all of their college backgrounds and whatever, but you really just have to show it as an undrafted free agent. But Gabriel Murphy is the guy who is the exception to that. So I will be keeping an eye on him. Defense, again, it's kind of hard to get any real sense. I do think that the position they don't have many rookies at is actually the easiest, which is wide receiver. That's the one where if somebody is really shining right away in the offseason program, you could be like, okay, this guy keeps making catches. And gosh, who was that two years ago? I mean, now I'm blanking. I'm trying to go

all the way back to last year's offseason program, thinking that there were a couple guys who, oh, was it maybe Tristan Jackson was a guy who really played quite well in the offseason program he ends up making the team and getting in some games and so forth when we never really thought that was going to happen there are some times because you can get those seven on seven reps that you see somebody making plays as a wide receiver they're getting, they're catching the ball. It's the easiest thing to spot. It's much harder to spot, hey, as a strong safety, like, I don't know, rushing the passer. Well, how are you supposed to figure that out when he can't get flattened by a tackle? The only time you can ever be sure is when a coach goes over to them and either high fives them or scowls at them.

That's the only way you can really know if a defensive player in the secondary has made some sort of miscue with them. I guess if they're picking off passes or making, you know, past breakups or whatever, then yeah, I mean, the team is going to look for guys that are making plays in any way. Maybe a running back who's catching the ball out of the backfield. It's a slow process where I kind of compare this to hitting the e-break on the off season where we are in such an intense mode for so long and we're just flying along with the hottest takes at a hundred miles an hour. And then now I feel like, okay,

okay. Resist the urge to overreact to anything from the off season program, because it's going to be a bit of a slow burn and a slow development, but just simply how McCarthy's reps are divvied up will give us a pretty darn good sense of where this thing is going to start when it comes to training camp and even just how quickly he's picking up the offense. Because if McCarthy can get the offense quickly and he can be at mini camp in early June and he's splitting reps with Sam Darnold, then we're going to believe it is time for a QB competition. And if McCarthy doesn't take any first team reps at all through the entire off season program, don't freak out everybody. Stay calm, stay calm. I know that you won't, but you should. But then we'll know, all right, they are being ultra patient. They are not forcing him in

there. They're giving him all the time in the world. And we should really look at it as Sam Darnold. It's his job to lose in training camp and he's going to start way out ahead. So that's going to be something that we look really closely at. The other thing for the rest of the team, of course, there's development who looks a little bit different. You know, somebody like Jay Ward or Andrew Booth Jr. or like Jaqueline Roy, like these young players who show up at OTAs after a year and you kind of look at them like, is that, is that the same guy? Because he put on 20 pounds of muscle and now he looks like he's way more in shape or whatever it might be, but who they're putting out there for certain reps is really the cheat code of reporting on

a mini camper and OTAs. It's just, are they using player X, Y, Z to be out there with the first teamers? Cause you know who the first teamers are. Jonathan Grenard, Andrew Van Ginkle, uh, you know, Blake Cashman. So you're going to know when Harrison Phillips is out there, whoever's participating, when we get to the OTAs, when we get to the mini camps, who's out there with them. And does that mean something or is somebody just not in attendance because these OTAs are not mandatory. It isn't until minicamp that it's really mandatory, but if someone's not in attendance, who steps into their spot? I believe it was Harrison Smith didn't come to OTAs last year, which of course he doesn't need to. I think I don't quote me on that, but somebody else stepped in and it might've been Metellus. And we went, oh, okay. The little Josh Metellus intrigue here.

And that was what set up for training camp when we started to notice more and more and more Josh Metellus. So it's really hints. It's not answers like training camp offers for us, especially when they finally get to those joint practices. Then we really know who they're going to play because they look like games for a certain amount of reps. It is game speed type of action just without the big hits.

But that's really the time where we can get the sense. So now we're just taking these nuggets. But some of these young players, they make their first impressions here. They're going to meetings with the coaching staff and they're learning the, the officer defense. They're learning the techniques. They're doing warmup drills and everything else focused on certain things that the coaches are going to know who's emerging, who's falling behind really, really quick in the off season

program. In those first impressions, if we see certain players getting out there and getting first team reps, even in mini camp, that's a little bit of a raise the eyebrow. Oh, okay. Something might be going on here. And, uh, the other big storyline, of course, as you guys can guess is just Jefferson and whether he signs his contract extension at some point during the offseason program, or if this thing bleeds into the summer. And I think that the data target is mini camp, because first of all, when Kweisi Adafo mentioned, uh, Kweisi Adafo Mensah mentioned that he wanted to clear out an entire week for Justin Jefferson, like birthday week,

which my wife has. If it's not just her birthday, it's the birthday week. So I related to that. But when is the whole team there? When is the whole organization there? When are the legends there? Always at minicamp. That seems like a great time to sign him to his extension and make it a week long celebration of Justin Jefferson long-term contract. I would say that OTAs are Rob are pretty slim and unlikely that he's going to show up at OTAs unless they sign an extension at some point before that. But I think that it would really benefit everybody from Justin to the Vikings to get this done before we get into training camp. The last thing that you need when you're making a big transition of leadership at the quarterback position,

whether it's Darnold or whether it's McCarthy, is to not have your number one guy there. You definitely do not want to have practice after practice where it's Trent Shurfield who is filling in because Justin Jefferson's not there. And the other thing you don't want is the distraction. Every single day is going to be about what's going on with Justin Jefferson, what's going on with Justin Jefferson.

Then you get the feasting NFL insiders trying to get any sort of information out there that they can about the negotiations. This is such a calm time of year in the NFL that you can avoid all that by getting the extension done now. And the fact that Kweisi Daffo-Mensa said that they had been talking and negotiating before the draft gives you a little more confidence that, yeah, this thing looks like it is progressing in the right direction. So when that comes, if that comes, is going to be a huge storyline. And as far as specific players go, in the past, we were able to look at a big draft class

and go, okay, well, I'm really interested at, just for example, how Louis Seaton fits in. And then even last year, hey, is Louis Seaton out there? Is he actually practicing? And players like that. The lack of draft picks has made that harder, but I will say Levi Drake Rodriguez is the one I'm most interested in. How does he look in person? Does he look like he's NFL size in person? Does

he look like he's filling, you know, fitting in and looking like an NFL player? I remember this with the ones that stand out are often the ones that didn't work out more than the ones that did. But Jalen Twyman is a good example of when you showed up and you saw Jalen Twyman, you understood why the NFL drafted him in the sixth round. Cause I know that there were all these comparisons of, well, he got as many sacks as Aaron Donald or whatever it was. And he shows up and I know he had the incident the first year, but even the second year and you go, you know, I don't think that really looks like an NFL player. And it wasn't.

And sometimes those guys will prove you wrong. That size doesn't always matter, but there is a certain body type of NFL athletes that you recognize pretty quickly. Brian O'Neill fooled us because he put on 30 pounds in the off season in the summer and showed up looking like a different guy. So it does happen. But with a seventh rounder, that's coming along with a lot of intrigue. You do want to see just first off the bus. what does the guy look like when he's standing next to other NFL players? And could this be the guy who is the late round intriguing player for Brian Flores? I think that might end up becoming a yearly tradition of them finding somebody that isn't

that first or second rounder that becomes a piece that maybe we didn't expect. And that makes the off season program a little more exciting to tell you the truth that we're kind of looking for that. Well, who is the next Ivan Pace? Who is the next Josh Metellus? Because they have a coach that has a tendency to be able to find these guys and put them in positions to play some sort of role or succeed. So I'm more apt to pay attention to those types of players, to the Gabriel Murphy, to the Ivan Pace Jr., who last year around this time, a lot of people were interested in.

And I probably said the same thing about, well, let's wait and see. Let's kind of figure this out. And then he became a real star player for them, especially in the second half of last season. So very interested to see how all of that plays out. The last thing that I had written down was just as they get into OTAs and minicamp, how this receiver battle looks because the Vikings did not sign another wide receiver. I don't know if they're going to.

They may go into this thing in total competition mode beyond Justin Jefferson and Jordan Addison. Also kind of intrigued if Jordan Addison looks a little more beefed up. I don't think he has to be 200 pounds, but last year he was super, super skinny. But what do these other wide receivers look like? What is the first impression? Who looks like they're getting it?

I remember when the Vikings signed Kendall Wright. And again, for some reason, the ones that didn't work out sort of stick in your brain. And immediately you kind of knew in that offseason program, it just doesn't look like he is getting a lot of reps. It doesn't look like he's really connecting with what they're doing on offense. And this might not ever come to fruition. Whereas, you know, somebody like Brandon Powell seemed to be in their plans pretty quickly after they signed him last year. I forget when they signed him, but he was somebody that I didn't think too much about when they signed him. Oh, themselves a punt returner and then as you saw in the in the offseason program and into training

camp you went actually this guy gets open and catches the ball and maybe they believe so much in him as wide receiver three because he performs so well that he is that guy. When they brought him back, I thought they probably need a wide receiver three and he can be a depth guy. And they got Shurfield who's played in the league before. They still probably think highly of Jalen Naylor, even though he hasn't been on the field a whole lot the first two years. Last year was bad breaks. He got hurt, I think, first day of training camp last year and then didn't show up until the end of the breaks. He got hurt, I think, first day of training camp last year and then didn't show up until the end of the season, then got hurt again when he actually had a big chance against the Raiders. And that was also playing with Nick Mullins and Josh Dobbs. So

maybe we're looking at a little bit of a different Jalen Naylor than we've seen before. So anyway, that's kind of my rundown of my approach to the off season program and trying to balance patients with also a desire to have takeaways. So you'll probably hear me say a lot of times, like, yeah, this is what I noticed. And it probably doesn't mean something, but you know, this is just like what they're doing. And, uh, we, we will try to avoid the, you know, getting on the hot take bus or whatever when it comes to that. And, you know, I noticed it's kind of funny because before I get to your questions, I noticed that in almost every comment section for whatever video goes up, there's one or two people saying you hate McCarthy or whatever. And it's, it's kind of funny because the whole

time, and I do read the comment section because I'm interested in what you guys are saying about the episodes and everything else. And 99% of the comments are great. And I think it's awesome to get your feedback and see what's on your minds and everything else. But it's kind of funny because throughout the draft season, I said, I'm not, I'm not planning a flag. I'm just asking questions about each quarterback and telling you what I see and bringing on guests and everything else. And as soon as they drafted him, I said that I am moving on from any pre-draft opinion, fresh slate, no previous opinions. I will walk into the first day of rookie mini camp, and that will be my first impression of JJ McCarthy outside of his press conference,

which of course I thought he looked very mature and looked like someone who had been on the big stage before and is a terrific communicator. You notice that right away. He also looks incredibly young and I don't think that's just me. I think that's his actual age. And he's got a lot of growing to do and so forth. But this is the real first impression is when I walk out there for rookie minicamp. And then we'll build on that as we go forward. Whatever I thought going into the draft, who they should pick, how they should approach it.

I'm not concerned about that. So if you're doing that, I'm just going to remove the comment because it's just trolling. It's not based on anything I've actually said. So don't do that because you're just being a troll, but that's, that's how I'm approaching this is I'm not going in thinking, well, you know, I saw on this tape at Michigan that he throws the ball this way and he, you know, he does it, you know, can't throw left or whatever. He's like Derek Zoolander can't throw left. I saw some people, you know, saying that throughout the draft season, I I'm wiping it all away. It's the, if you watch men in black back in the day, it's none of that matters. It's what he

looks like on the NFL field with NFL talent. And that starts with rookie minicamp. So I just thought we'll get that out of the way, just so you know that I I'm not concerned about anything that anybody said, any draft analyst, any guests on the show, anything we were trying to gather as much information as we could about him as a college player and that's all interesting and now it's all gone and we're on to the next thing so uh what it was is there it's a week-to-week league well that's what it is for me with the uh impressions of jj mccarthy it's going to be an ota to ota type of training camp, when he finally gets in games. And we'll just build on this, gathering the information that we get as it comes in and analyzing what we have and not being too concerned about how he played against UNLV or Nebraska like a year ago.

So just figured I would throw out that little disclaimer of that's how I'm going to look at this. So let me get to some of your questions here. JP says, can we expect any changes to the offense this year? Either McCarthy or Darnold shouldn't be passing as much as Kirk was. If we don't improve the running game screen game, we should call old coobs. I know Gary is probably still just hanging at the ranch, watching Sanford and son, as Clint Kubiak told us one time, working on fences and whatever. Gary could come back and run some, some bootleg action. It's funny you say that because I was talking to somebody today about McCarthy and I'll tell you guys a funny story in a second about McCarthy.

But I, and I was talking about this offense and how we are always talking about, Oh, is it pro style? Is it not pro style? What's the, is he, he's more pro ready. He's less pro ready. And I was thinking that the way that they ran the offense at Michigan would have been really ready for Gary Kubiak because JJ McCarthy is extremely good at building the passing game off the run game at turning his back to the defense, which almost no young quarterbacks do rolling out on boots, getting those like flood concepts where you have three guys and there are different layers and you know you can go down the field if someone's open or check down or whatever and he could throw on the run extremely well it's like actually he would have been awesome to implement right away with uh gary kubiak's uh offense so the quick story is i have a friend who used to coach in the chicago area

which is where jj mcc McCarthy is from and played high school football. And so my friend texts me the other day and he says, I've got a JJ McCarthy story for you. So we'll talk later. Give me, give me a call. I got a JJ McCarthy story for you. So of course I'm thinking, Oh, is this, is this juicy? Like what's, what is this JJ McCarthy story? So my friend calls me and he tells me a story about a time that McCarthy had been at a big quarterback camp and they weren't expecting him to show up to a seven on seven event. And he showed up at the last minute, like right off the airport comes out and fires a touchdown right away on like kind of a broken play. And I was like,

that's the story. The story is that JJ McCarthy is good and has been since he was in high school. That was the whole story. So yeah, that's, you know, I'm sure you have people in your life who do that. Friends who are like, oh man, I got something big to tell you. And you're like, oh yeah, what? And then it's, you know, I, I saved money on my car insurance or whatever. And they stop. What is that? Of course, JJ McCarthy was good, but that made me laugh. And I don't doubt it that he was. So to your question, I kind of went off the deep end there, not answering your question.

There is no doubt at all that they have to improve the run game and the screen game, no matter what. If you look at both of those things since Kevin O'Connell got here, and these are freebies for the quarterback, the quarterback has to do nothing on a screen and nothing on a handoff. They were one of the worst teams in the entire NFL at allowing their quarterback to do nothing and profit. And that has to be different. And that's why Aaron Jones is here. That's why they paid him because nobody is going to help your quarterback more than someone like Aaron Jones, who can average four and a half to five yards of carry and average eight yards of screen pass catches

the ball. Well, he really works great in space. He breaks tackles, et cetera, et cetera, all those things. But design has to be better for both of them. Schematics has to be better for both of them. And then the other part of it too, whether it's Darnold or whether it's McCarthy is when you get into the game flow and we should remember that Kevin O'Connell has called some plays before in his career, but not like this. I think that that game flow and game feel thing is still coming along. And it was really thrown for a loop with Dobbs and Nick Mullins. At times I wondered about it with Kirk, but as he went along with Kirk, it seemed to click more and more as they went along. And then it was completely just thrown in the trash when they had to go to other quarterbacks, but you just can't be passing the ball 40 times a game over and over and over, press that pass button over and over and over

and treat the run game like an obligation. If you are going to have Sam Darnold or J.J. McCarthy, especially J.J. McCarthy. Sometimes you might have to just run the ball and punt it away. You can't always go for broke when it comes to dealing with these types of quarterbacks, because Darnold will turn it over and McCarthy might end up a little bit overwhelmed. So they will have to play it a little more old style, Gary Kubiak, I think, but I don't expect huge changes. I do not expect massive changes. What we might see is, I would like to see a little more motion,

which does require more of the quarterback, so that can be a little bit hard, but more motion would be nice for this offense. Just get guys moving before the snap a little bit more to throw off the defense than they did last year. A little more favorable down in distances, but this is going to be an offense that looks the same. I think that Kevin O'Connell really believes,

and rightfully so, as we've seen, they were seventh in scoring from the time that he took over to the day Kirk cousins got hurt. So they were a top 10 scoring offense, uh, since O'Connell arrived when they had their starting quarterback. And I think that he believes in that. He believes in the ways that he's dialed up to get just a Jefferson open to play the other receivers off of them. Here's another thing I'd like to see is last year. I thought that KJ Osborne was used a little bit too much as a complete wide receiver and not enough as a gadget guy because Osborne doesn't have blazing speed, which I think maybe keeps people from using him as a playmaker. Cause he's like a

four, five, four, six type of wide receiver, but he's got great feel and great toughness, like a running back. That's why he was a good punt returner in college. And when they used him, I think it was a key situation against Buffalo on a reverse. And he powered his way to a first down little screens to a number three wide receiver quick stuff. Like there's just not enough easy buttons in this offense that I'd like to see them add, but I'm not convinced that they will. I mean, this is Kevin O'Connell. If there's any coach that he reminds me of, it's probably Bruce Arians as somebody who wants a lot of stuff that goes vertical and then plays off that underneath that it is a downfield type of offense and that's what JJ McCarthy's going to have to learn and we will see because I don't look at it as like all these crossing

routes and things like that I look at it as much more of you got receivers going high and receivers going low little high low type of thing you receivers going high and receivers going low, little high, low type of thing. You're going to have somebody going deep and clearing out and then looking underneath to play off that, put defenders in conflict. And if you're the quarterback, that's what you're reading. And then if that's not there, you go back to the other side of the field. What's maybe underneath is your check down or something like that. But the first option is they want to push the ball down the field and they want to throw a lot. And so that's why with McCarthy, you do have to be patient and allow him to start understanding the feel of all of these things before you can

just send them out there. Because I don't believe it's going to be a pared down dialed back offense that is just given the sort of third grade version to JJ McCarthy. I think they're going to throw him right into the deep end and be like, whenever you don't sink is when you play, which is one way to do it. David says, get the Jefferson done deal done ASAP. So we can focus on the cornucopia of a myriad of storyline. Well done with the SAT words there, uh, David, and you should be impressed too, that I read it on the fly properly. Um, and so the quarterbacks can get on the same page because that is going to be an adjustment for him as well. Oh, it most certainly is most Most certainly is. A friend of mine, I was on in Buffalo Radio,

my old radio station today, and they asked an interesting question regarding Justin Jefferson. They said, with Jefferson not having a proven quarterback, could that be a hold up with the contract situation or how do we think that he feels about it? And what I said as an answer, and I might amend it a little bit, but what I said as an answer is more or less, well, as soon as he signs the contract, you're going to need a couple of years to figure out where this thing is at, right?

They're going to throw him the football. He's going to get his catches. He's going to make plays. He's going to be a great wide receiver as we continue to see, even with Nick Mullins out there, that Jefferson was still great, but we won't really start to find out. I don't think at least for a year, how that's going to work. And Jefferson would know that when he signs, of course, it's majorly beneficial with the CBA. We already know that for him to sign. But I was also thinking about how there were questions of, well, is Jefferson not going to sign if Kirk Cousins goes He clearly did. And they clearly got along and the relationship grew and they had good chemistry and Kirk pumped them the ball.

Unlike any other receiver in the entire NFL, he pumped them the football. So he liked all that. But they also had zero playoff wins during Justin Jefferson's rookie contract. I would have to believe that starting a new, trying to build a stronger roster, signing these other players like Jonathan Grenard and Blake Cashman, that there would be an energizing element to that. And also maybe a challenge of be the reason, like be the reason

that JJ McCarthy is a success, be the reason why people debate. And you know, if you've listened to the show for a long time, that I love thinking of these in this term of, you know, Tua last year's leading the league in passing and everyone's debating, well, is Tua actually good or is it just the offense? And Brock Purdy is putting up MVP numbers and everybody on TV is debating, well, is it him or is it the coach? You want to be there. You want to be the quarterback that is like your team around you is so good that everyone debates. Is it actually you? I mean, that's kind of a Brady thing, right? Where for a long time, is it Brady or is it

Belichick? Like be so good that the people on TV are trying to reach and stretch to find any way they can debate whether it's you or whether it's your coach or whether it's your receiver because you have so many good things going for you on your team that's how the Vikings want it here and they've got a chance to do that I mean even this year with the team they have can compete for a playoff spot. And then it's not that hard to look down the road and see if McCarthy works out, you can legitimately compete like so many other teams have under these circumstances. One thing I know about Justin Jefferson is that he is a happy-go-lucky type of attitude,

but I also think that he's wise, you know, he knows ball, like he knows what's going on in the league. He understands the contract stuff. And I think he understands where the roster is at and maybe they needed to show it to him first, uh, that they could be in a good position by the time he's going to sign. But now there's excitement for a new quarterback and there's an opportunity for them to build a great competing team. So I don't think that Justin Jefferson would say, well, it's not an experienced quarterback. JJ is out. Like, I don't think so. I think he's going to give every opportunity to succeed with him. And then if we're two, three years down the road and it hasn't worked, then it might be real trouble. But I don't think that's something we'll have to be concerned about. I still am sitting in a position of feeling very confident that they'll

sign an extension for him and that whoever's playing quarterback will get the ball to Justin Jefferson, but he's going to want to win. And that's what they have to do. I mean, another year of six wins could be pretty hard or seven wins could be pretty hard. So when they get to that window, you, you got to win. So when they get to that window, you, you got to win. Otherwise you are going to have a very unhappy Justin Jefferson, but that's not, that shouldn't be for some time. Anthony says, run the damn ball coach KOC. I agree. Don't have McCarthy throwing 40 to 45 times a a game even if he is good as we all hope yeah i just i just think that even if you're going to have somebody throw a lot which it is the modern nfl and you are going to do that but um you can also limit how many hard throws there are

how much high difficulty stuff there is. And Kevin O'Connell has a good play action game. As we saw from Kirk cousins last year at times, we've seen it in spurts, but it just isn't really the base of his offense. Can you mix that in a little bit more? Can you get, you know, it's not going to be Hawkinson maybe right off the bat, but can you get Josh Oliver out there and run a little more of that play action stuff? Can you run a little more play fake off of CJ ham out on the field and so forth? Can you run a little more quick slant underneath like easy type of stuff just to help your quarterback on first intent? Uh, and the, the screen, I think it's the most underrated thing in football is how effective

your screens are when delvin cook was averaging nine yards to catch on screens in 2019 it just was a nightmare for opponents just an absolute nightmare you just drop back you dink it off to your great running back and then he's got 20 yards uh what was it the game they played Washington where Case Keenum was starting for the other team and I remember one play maybe at the end of a half they just threw a little screen pass he dodges four or five tacklers he's got 25 yards and all of a sudden the field is completely flipped the quarterback did nothing it's great if I was a quarterback I'd love it I'd be like let's let's throw screens all the time. And Cousins said that the screen game is either outhouse or penthouse, meaning it's either terrible or excellent.

It's been all outhouse the last two years. It needs to be penthouse this year to make it easier. So it's not just the running game. It's also the passing game that doesn't require a whole lot from your quarterback. And then when you get to third down and seven and you're facing a blitz and you got past rushers and you got whatever disguise coverage and all that stuff, you need your quarterback to step up and you need them to understand everything and whatever. But the more times you can set that guy up to not do that, uh, the better. What about Bob says, I really want to hear how everyone is blown away by how McCarthy looked in

rookie camp. Um, you know, what I expect is some good, some bad, maybe one or two wows. Yeah. I I'm curious to see just how many throws and I'll have this answer for you literally tomorrow, but how many throws, uh, how much they're asking him to do in rookie camp. I would imagine it's probably a lot and just the general overall vibe and comfort level of JJ McCarthy is really what I'm going to be talking about after we watch him for, I don't know, an hour and a half or so tomorrow. Just generally, how does he look in the uniform more or less? I mean, a lot of times because they're running so few really, really hard reps, that's what it comes down to is just, hey, does he complete some passes? Does he look like he's comfortable out there?

Does it look like he's working with the coaches and so forth? I mean, if there's some good, some bad, and a couple of wows, that would be exactly what I expect. If there's mostly bad and no wows, I'm not going to say, oh my gosh, what a disaster rookie camp it was because I get to see one day and I'll talk about it and we'll see how it goes, but it's not something that you can really take a whole lot from it. But if look, if he comes out there and it looks like a totally clean operation and he looks like a veteran quarterback, now that's going to be worth noting. So it's kind of, if it's really good, then I will say, oh man, I mean, to be honest,

he looked great. And if he struggles, I will say, oh, well, you know, I mean, it's, it's not the wide receivers he's going to be throwing to in the season, et cetera, et cetera. Not Kevin O'Connell said if they actually almost got done last year with the Jefferson extension when jets didn't need to sign. So we're all going with Jets because this has been a struggle. I used to say JJ a little more, but now that's very confusing. So I guess I feel, I don't know if I feel totally comfortable calling him Jets. I'll just go Jefferson. So anyway, when he didn't need to sign, I'm not worried at all about it getting done promptly. I will worry when it's time to worry is the way that I try to approach everything when it comes to this, when it comes to McCarthy and his off-season program reps.

And when it comes to Jefferson as well, that, you know, there's been a lot of headlines that maybe are designed to make people worry that they could move on from Jefferson. I was gathering a collection of them the other day for maybe a rant when Jefferson signs about the sad state of media and how it's made a lot of content and a lot of clicks for a lot of people with zero evidence, literally zero evidence that Justin Jefferson could be traded or that he doesn't want to sign or anything like that. There has been no indication whatsoever. And yet if you read, if you Google him and you read the articles, you got all sorts of mock drafts that thought he was going to get traded to Arizona. You have people Jersey swapping him because they have no lives,

like all sorts of stuff. Although maybe you can do AI, but now, and those people will have to try some actual art instead of that. But you know, the Jersey swaps and all this, the total nonsense. It's like at this moment, there's no panic whatsoever. And if we get into training camp,

then the panic meter will start. And if we get deep into training camp, then the panic meter will go up. But as of this moment, no. And I just think that there's indications that it should be sometime in the offseason program. Hints, put it that way. What about Bob says, Kwesi doesn't need to pay someone more than any qb ever and make sure it's a week of celebration oh you're talking about uh justin jefferson yeah okay the money

tells the story not a week of celebration no no no no no no no totally disagree totally disagree when you draft a player like justin jefferson i know quacey didn't draft him but you know what i mean when you have a player of justin jeff Justin Jefferson's caliber and you extend that player and you get that deal done, and it's not easy to get the deal done. And you have the guy under contract. It is a celebration. Oh yeah. It's a celebration.

It is an acknowledgement of the greatness that exists on your football team. And we should never downplay that. I mean, you guys are so used to all these great wide receivers. Ah, so what? You know, Jefferson, he's great. Moss was great. Carter was great. Jake Reed was great for them. Sammy White was great. Ahmad Rashad was great. What are you talking about? We just get receivers growing on trees and now Jordan Addison can play. Do not ever downplay how hard it is to have the best player in the NFL at your position. And also whatever it takes to make the best player at his position, especially

a top three, most valuable position on the field, feel appreciated and celebrated. I would do that. As an organization, it's a huge moment when you can sign that player and know that he is a centerpiece of what you're doing going forward to chase the Super Bowl. So I totally disagree. I think that you want to make a whole big deal out of it to sign him for sure. I mean, you don't get too many of those moments. You really don't. Too many moments where you can make somebody the highest paid player at their position in the NFL. That is a thing that does make the cap harder, but trust me, they're going to be very happy to do that because that means you have the best the highest paid player at their position in the NFL. That is a thing that does make the cap harder, but trust me, they're going to be very happy to do that because that means you have the best player

at his position in the entire NFL. Blantos says, nobody wants this JJ contract to happen early more than Collar to avoid JJ questions for the next four months. Well, you could always ask me about compensatory draft picks uh after that so there can be worse things to have to answer questions about um i'm sorry for you compensatory people it's just been a struggle but uh you are right about that that it had for a little while everybody

was hot on the idea of trading je. And then everybody just disappeared on that because you drafted a quarterback that didn't trade Jefferson. And so that's an obvious piece that is going to make your quarterback way better than if you don't have them. I think everybody sort of came to their senses from the immediate boredom that comes right after the end of the season when you didn't make the playoffs. And you just start thinking, no, maybe that's a good idea. It's, it's almost like if you work somewhere and it's a really slow time and you start thinking, you know, what if I brought a basketball hoop in here? And this, I used to work at a grocery store and I, I could just shoot hoops

while there was nobody around. And then you go, that wasn't a good idea. I would just break everything. That's the same way with this, where I think at the end of the season, there's frustration, there's uncertainty. And you go, hey, what if we traded just to Jefferson? And then you wake up the next morning and go, no way. What are you, crazy?

Absolutely not. There are two untradeable Minnesota athletes at this moment. One of them is in the playoffs with the wolves. The other one is here in my opinion, uh, with the Vikings, Justin Jefferson. So you're right that the, should we trade him trade rumors, insiders, all that stuff. It is a slog when you have that going on. It's not fun for anybody. And especially when I think we all know

that the train is headed toward an extension that it's just, why are we talking about it? Why, you know, that sort of thing. It'll get frustrating day after day if it goes into training camp. I'm prepared though. Don't worry about me. I'll be all right.

You just might get more rants than you would otherwise. Anthony says, I want a balanced offense next season. Let's see if coach KOC finally figures out that running game is not a sin. I never expect this team to have a balanced offense. Uh, it, maybe it will. I just don't think that that's how they want to play. And I'm okay with that. But similarly to what I was talking about with Bruce Arians, Bruce Arians was never a run first coach. He was going to throw that football down the field. He had a lot of good quarterbacks that helped, but I think Kevin O'Connell is that kind of way as well, that he believes your quarterback's going to win for you. And he's pretty much right about that. There's not, I like to see, as you said, a really good balanced team that when you can run the ball effectively, I think that defenses absolutely hate it.

I think it drives them insane. If you have a good running game, you just feel like you're being drowned the whole game long and coming up for air when the other team is on the field a lot. We've seen the Vikings on the wrong side of this, where the defense is on the field forever. The other team's running 78 plays. They're handing off. They're getting five yards. They're getting chunks.

They're getting big runs. Drives you crazy. But I just don't think that that's their philosophy. I think if they were crushing it in the run game that they could do that. Look at the offensive line. Do we feel that it's possible that they can crush everybody? It doesn't seem likely. It doesn't seem likely. KFT says it would be great if one or both of the Mercer wide receivers look legit. You're right about that. Having Mercer wide receivers did stick out to me that they went and got both of them. I don't remember their names. We'll see if I have to learn them.

But these little quirky things that happen at rookie minicamp, maybe one of them will. I'm not discounting it. I have in the past maybe been too dismissive of the whole, hey, UDFA, maybe it'll be good. But sometimes it is. Sometimes there's Adam Thielen. Sometimes there's adam thielen sometimes there's ivan pace and this team puts a lot of emphasis into the udfas which means that i need to put more myself uh what about bob says we need another wide receiver the depth uh if jets or addison goes down is suspect uh you are being polite to say suspect There is just not a lot of depth beyond those two guys.

And not Kevin O'Connell says Powell and Naylor at 3-4 doesn't sound too bad. It doesn't unless one of the starters gets banged up for a couple weeks, and then it feels a lot more suspicious than maybe even last year when at least you have KJ Osborne and KJ Osborne did not wow last year, but he's a guy like he's, you know, he's a player in the league who could catch 50 passes. Whereas Naylor hasn't proven anything. Trent Shurfield has kind of been around a little bit, but has not ever been a wide receiver three. Truly. I think his career high might be 30 receptions or something like that. Um, so, you know, that if they're not going to add another veteran, then, uh, it's going to be a real battle and that will be a daily thing. Of course, the

reps for the starters first, but then, uh, beyond that wide receiver depth will be something that we're paying attention to really starting in the offseason program. Dan says, interested to see who is fielding kickoffs and football on a stick appearance. Yes, again, that is an old reference, Dan. And I always appreciate when people throw out things that we joked about on the show like four years ago. So shout out to you, man. But as far

as kickoffs, got to be Kenny Wong Wu to start this thing. It has to be right. I mean, he was already one of the best kick returners in the NFL. And this kick return is really built for Kenny Wong Wu. I mean, get the guy in space and just get him moving. Just get him making plays. He doesn't have to block. He doesn't have to, he might have to do a little reading of blockers, but he, you know, he's going to just get the football and run past people. And that's something he's really excellent at. As we've seen, he has great instincts in the open field and such unbelievable acceleration in the open field. And I was looking

at, uh, hopefully I'll get them on the show. Uh, maybe next week we'll try for Mike Clay of ESPN always does these great projections every year. And so I, I bring them on the show. We taught, it's become like a yearly thing that we do. And so that'll happen at some point soon when he puts those out. So we just put those out. And the first thing I went to look at was how many times he thinks that Kenny Wong will return a kick. And he had it at 60, 60 kick returns. I am so happy about this return thing. Matt Daniels is going to talk to us at some point during the off season program. I really want to know what Matt Daniels has to say that episode right there might do seven views, and it's just me and the six other nerdiest people about the kickoff,

but we will have a lot of fun talking about what the Vikings' plan for kickoff return is going to be. William says, being a Michigan fan, I have been following J.J. McCarthy since high school. Would like to see him sit a year, but knowing his work ethic, he's going to make that difficult for the staff. Yeah. There's a certain point where, and I've thought of this going into this off season program that we won't see it yet, but we might get hints of it.

There will be a point where we say it's time that if it's training camp and he's just playing better and he's got it and he's got the offense and he's running it confidently, there it is. And if it's not in training camp, then maybe it will be in the season. If Darnold is struggling or just if they decide, Hey, this is the week that we're turning to McCarthy. But it's, I guess I wouldn't even say non-zero. It's like a 25% chance that he just gets it. And then he just starts. And then we'll deal with the ups and downs that come along with that. But if he gets it, that means that he has really captured that playbook.

And that's the number one thing. And when Chase Daniels going through what a play looks like and you go, Oh, remember that fourth string quarterback that played great in the preseason and everybody wondered, well, why didn't he make the team? He was great in preseason. It's because of that playbook. It's because you have to be in total command of every detail of that playbook. And if you're not, then you can't play in a game. And unless I guess you're Josh Dobbs and you scramble around one time against Atlanta. But even then, Josh Dobbs is unbelievably intelligent, smarter than anyone you've ever met, and still a struggle to get it all down.

So with McCarthy, I do think that he's had elements of this that are NFL ish, but the workload, the amount that you have to capture in that first year after you've been through so much, it's not easy. It's very difficult. So we do need to give them time. Dustin says, do you think Casey is doing something new by bringing in so many UDFAs the last couple of years, or is this something most teams do? Most teams do bring in a bleep ton of UDFAs, uh, for their rookie camps for the off season. They're sort of casting a wide net where it is legitimately different is when it comes to the amount of money that they're spending on the UDFAs that each of

the last few years, somebody has done an article ranking the top UDFA signings and the Vikings always have, or at least the last few years, two or three of those guys are theirs. And my suspicion is that Kweisi Adafo-Mensa identifies targets through the draft along with their scouting department. And they have a good sense for who the top players are going to be that they've identified as maybe higher on the board than the rest of the NFL thought or better fits specifically. And then they run out there and they call that agent and they say, we'll give you the most money, just get here. And that's a testament to the Wilfs too, because you're spending their money, that they're sort of allowing that to happen. But I just, I think that like, if you're looking at, well, they don't have fifth round picks, they don't have sixth round picks, but they got the number one UDFA. So how different is that really teams in the sixth and seventh are drafting

players from Australia and Germany and punters and whatever. And you know, you get a linebacker who's maybe a potentially good UDFA, or you see as some sort of fit that might be one of the reasons that they feel like they can move on from their fifth and sixth and seventh round draft picks because they are going to spend that on the UDFAs. So the quality of UDFA is higher. Now, I mean, the Vikings got a few of those guys in years past. Tashaun Bauer was one of them. There's been a handful through the years, but I think this is a serious effort to be able to do that. Not Kevin O'Connell says it would be derelict of duty to not run more Kubiak style plays with McCarthy. Yeah, I agree. I agree. I mean, he's going to want McCarthy to run the Kevin O'Connell

Vikings offense, but what Kubiak style does is simplifies the game for the quarterback in a way that what Kirk Cousins was running would not do last year. Kirk Cousins standing in the shotgun, having to identify a bunch of stuff, make checks, changes all over the place. I think it took a while to get all of that down. And sometimes every blade of grass is accounted for in an NFL offense. And sometimes there are windows that are very tight and very difficult to see. And you need to identify based on the footwork, the read, everything else. There's so much going on where what Kubiak was

able to do a lot of times was he would build these play actions off of the run game. So he just had the whole defense going one way. And I remember it was against Philadelphia, 2019. They absolutely slaughtered the Eagles just running like deep crossers all day long. They were drawing in the linebackers because they were terrified of delvin cook and it's so easy to play quarterback when the entire defense is going that way although the nfl has adjusted a little bit to some of that stuff but i'm not saying that they need to just run the boots all the time uh just that those parts of the offense that make life easier on the quarterback they're they're pretty helpful they're there for a reason there's a reason why brian greasy j Jake Plummer, Kirk had his career year playing with Stefanski and Kubiak, uh, his

best quarterback rating of his, his career. So there's a reason those things work and, uh, they do need to, to work on that and have that as a bigger part of the offense than it was with Kirk. David says, I think this kid is an athletic mix of Brad Johnson. And I think he has leadership skills, emotional intelligence, competitiveness, football IQ, and no fear of ripping it of a young Tommy Kramer. You missed our, or maybe you caught our comparisons or QB comparisons episode in which I said, Brad Johnson and people got upset, but I didn't mean, I didn't mean Brad Johnson's actual like velocity on the football, which when he put his back into it, he could get it. He could ramp it up a little, but he was more

of a, we'll call it a touch thrower for Brad Johnson. And he was humongous. So he wasn't super fast, but when you watch Brad Johnson and what, whatever, I've watched a bunch of Brad Johnson games. He actually is kind of a playmaker. Like he doesn't just drop back. And if there's a little pressure, it just checks down. And sometimes he'll throw picks because of it, or he would in the nineties or early two thousands, but in, especially in the early parts of his career, he would have pocket presence. He would move and make some plays as this big giant dude because he was a basketball player and he was nimble on his feet more than his size would have indicated. And not a runner, just like had a little shake to him.

And I think McCarthy has that same thing, except for just much faster, much faster. But he will move and slide in the pocket and definitely doesn't have a fear of letting it rip. But he's going to have to decide when the right times to do that are. And that's not an easy thing to do in the NFL. Anthony says, have a feeling that we'll see a much improved Ed Ingram this season. We'll see. Usually takes offensive linemen three to four years in the league until it starts to fully click. I do agree with that. And the second half of last year, Ingram was better. I just don't, I don't, I just don't know. It's like, I still see some of the same mistakes that

he was making in year one, but he did make progress in year two. If you can have, if you drafted in the second round, a starting guard who is average to a little better than average, if that's what he becomes in year three, then it's a successful draft pick. And we could actually mark down one successful draft pick from 2022. If they can get average play out of him last year. It still wasn't average. He was still up in the top of centers allowing pressure last season, but it did appear to make gains. Still not a super consistent run blocker. It's like sometimes it's a bulldozer and sometimes it's pretty flimsy. The consistency has to be better and we'll have to find out. I mean, that's going to be something that even through training camp will be, hey, how's the interior of the offensive line look?

I'll be focused more on Blake Brandel if he's starting on the left side because he's not been a starter before, and we won't really know until, you know, it's a couple weeks into the season about Ed Ingram. What about Bob says, how long until McCarthy knows the code words year two or three? So glad we're not talking about cousins and his excuses. Another throwback, shout out, what about Bob for that? That goes all the way back to 2018.

But with McCarthy, there is a question though, because the reason, the reason that I had that rant, that was maybe my first viral thing that ever happened of three ever. It's, it's not a goal of mine, but it got like put out there and then picked up by people and so forth. Just that little clip. Uh, but the reason that I went on that rant about Kirk Cousins was because they had had such high expectations. And when he said, Hey, you know, next year it'll be like the real first season. I was like, what? I mean, you just had huge expectations for this season. Some of the highest in this franchise's history going into a year and you laid an egg in the final week of the season. And then you're telling us that next year it's going to be code words. Like, are you crazy? And, uh, I know that there were a lot of people who, um, agreed with the rants

and did not take that very well. Uh, so with McCarthy, the, the tangential angle there to me ranting about this is what year, what time, what day, what week is there real expectations? And I'm going to put that on next year. And I did something fun. If you want to check it out over at the website where I did a, instead of a way too early mock draft for like the NFL draft, because those are insane. I have no idea why they get done, I guess, just click farming, but I did a mock free agency looked at who's going to be a free agent next year. I know some of them will sign with their teams,

but who's going to be a free agent next year and how the Vikings could improve the team then. So once they get all that cap space, once they have McCarthy developed for a year, that's when real, um, you know, expectations would be on their backs. That doesn't mean that if they don't win a championship in 2025, that it's a bust or anything. It just means that's when we start going week to week and saying, all right, you're supposed to win this next year. This will be a delicate dance because when they lose games, what seems always right in that moment is to just be like, everyone fired all of you. I hate you. What are you doing? They did everything wrong. And the other team did everything, right? That's always the reaction to every loss, but we will have to balance that with, well, what did it mean?

Like, what did it mean to their overall longer term progress? Was it the, I don't know, cornerback who's not going to be here who blew an assignment. And you sort of say, uh, like last year when Alexander Madison fumbled against Denver, I remember saying, I don't know what to say. They just fumbled. Like it was a guy who hasn't had a good season and that was the reason you lost. And I don't know what else to say about it.

There will probably be games like that this year, but once we get to 2025, then it's going to be a much closer microscope on week to week and more intense for demanding that you win. So, but this year we'll kind of ping pong back and forth. I mean, if McCarthy's playing, it's everything is about just how he played. That will dominate the discussion. What did we learn about him this week? What did he do specifically that was right, wrong? Was he the they won was he the reason they lost etc but if he's not playing then it's weird then it's like well you should win and i'm not going to give you a free pass

for losing ever as you guys know uh i don't not going to make excuses if if they don't win but also sam darnold starting. So what am I supposed to do with that? We're just sort of waiting around if he loses games, that that'll be interesting. I'm looking forward to that. I'm looking forward to that little kind of back and forth of finding out about a team, but also like how much can they actually win if they get hot to start the season? Do we change the expectations?

It's, you you know exciting times uh dan says one thing i'd like to see is turner immediately uh one of those rookies that look different oh i think that's gonna happen yeah i think that's gonna happen you're right delvin cook percy harvin we've talked about that on the show i i think that is one of those off the bus guys who you go, Whoa, okay. Unfortunately, he's not going to hit anyone for quite some time, but the way he moves, I mean, the thing is he doesn't have unbelievable size. So different from Daniil Hunter, where you go, Oh my God, Daniil, look at that guy. How is that real? How can someone have muscles that grow extra muscles that have houses on their muscles and apartment complexes of muscles? I don't think Dallas Turner looks like that exactly, but you know, he is strong and super athletic. Maybe it's just the way he moves.

Percy Arvin and Delvin cook. It was just the way that they moved was totally different. Anthony says my hot take for the season is that we will be top five in sacks this season. Brian Flores will have the defense flying around for sure. He has more talent to work with now. Top five is a high bar, uh, better though. They will be better and not so reliant on just one person to do all of the sacking. Um, Craig with a challenge here for me, we haven't had a solid guards and Steve Hutchinson. Let's see. Joe Berger. How about that? Uh, Berger, Joe Berger. How about that? Uh, was it 2017 Joe Berger played guard and, uh, Pat Elfline played center. And who was it? Left

guard, um, 2017. They, I think the left guard position was kind of banged up a little bit that year. Why am I, why am I blank on that? Oh, that was when, uh, that was, um, Nick Easton and he got hurt late in the season. Yeah. Right. So Nick East's, it was okay, but I wouldn't say he was a true difference maker. He just screwed up the operation when he got hurt, but Joe Berger that year was good. It really is kind of sad that that's where we have to go to in order to come up with quality guard play

over the last few years, really. Anthony says, I hope the light finally turns on for andrew booth jr i still believe he has talent to succeed tired of seeing a caleb evans out there a caleb evans is much more of a kind of is what he is type of guy i think he could play in the league i think he could be a backup depth player special team or like that's where he's most, most fit. Uh, Andrew Booth jr has legit talent, but he's gotta be something that he has never been before in order to succeed with Flores. And namely that's just tough. Like that's physical tackling physical, the line of scrimmage,

all these things that, that just not him. and then you have the injury history that goes along with that maybe surviving last year was good for him he was an off corner who was dropping back mirroring the receiver trying to make a play on the football now sometimes that happens but a lot of times it's you if you're playing off you gotta attack to contribute in the run game and you oftentimes got to get up on the line of scrimmage with a receiver be physical get your hands on them and if you're not like that Brian Flores probably isn't going to be your biggest fan and so I think that's what happened to him last year so this year he has to come in and say like I'm going to be a lot more physical to make a difference but I agree I would not give up on that idea we saw Ty waynes come around year three corners a hard position uh not kevin o'connell says um maybe i'll just call call you not kevin so no one gets confused uh make sure we get a look at will reichard and the kicking competition that may or may not be fake

as far as well yeah we'll see i mean does john parker romo even make it to training camp or is it just reicht's job? But if we get any look at those kickers, you're going to know about it, man. It's big, big time. Aaron says, what is the chance Darnall is a hero with great coaching and weapons? It's not high, but there's a difference between hero and, um, like good or decent or playable or can win with it. Does he become a superstar? No. Uh, unlikely. I should say, I shouldn't say no. I should say unlikely that the guy completely changes his stripes. It just doesn't really happen all that

often happened with Gino Smith. That's true. You could say it did with Baker Mayfield. He was kind of an average quarterback last year, but the standard had dropped so low for Baker Mayfield that average was good and got them to the playoffs. If you say Darnold could be Baker Mayfield, Okay. Baker Mayfield had played better in the league ever than Sam Darnold did, but I can buy, I can buy. I don't think, I don't think it's going to be based on what I went back and watched for Carolina. I don't think it was going to be awful. I don't think it's going to look terrible. I just think that there's going to be too many mistakes, too many like locked onto a read

through interception, too many flung it sidearm out of panic type of thing for it to be great. But I think it could be good. I think it could be good enough to compete for the playoffs. If you played all season long, uh, Rob, what's your take on Alec Lewis's article regarding Jefferson's contract situation? I did not see it. I played golf today. And so I got a little, got a little wind burn. I think it was, it was terrible out there.

The temperature says 60 degrees. It felt like it was 45. It was awful. I was going to play 18, but it was just too cold. I know I'm not tough tough i only talk about tough football people but me no very soft especially if the wind throws me off too i'm already bad enough i don't need that distraction um so you'll have to let me know what he said in the article i haven't read it

yet but you know to me the the everything that i feel like is going on here with jefferson is leading toward this road of they get it figured out sooner than later and we go forth uh ty says uh you really hate those jersey swaps correct what's the point? I mean, I understand. I understand if like you're a social media manager of a team that signs a player. So then that's like your job is you have to put the new player in that number 18 Atlanta Jersey and post them on the internet. I get that. But if you do it for fun, I just wonder why you're not spending your time in a different way. You're just like, I don't know. You get retweets.

I'm not really sure. Anthony Carter disrespect. Absolutely never. Absolutely never. Anthony Carter disrespect. One of the goats. That's what I'm saying, man, is that like this franchise has so many all time great wide receivers that you just sort of used to that and you think oh then well you know trade him away the next guy will be on the way like not always man so always

appreciate you should always appreciate how great the receivers have been in this franchise's history because that is just not it would be like if the chic Chicago bulls had gotten the next Michael Jordan. Like that's how, that's how this team has been the digs Thielen combination where both of them are really, really good. And neither one of them is as good as Jefferson, but together they're virtually unstoppable. I mean, not there are teams that haven't had good wide receivers before Devante Adams. Like who was the last good Raiders wide receiver? I don't even know. Yeah, they just went a long time.

Tim Brown and then Darius Hayward Bay. There are teams like with quarterbacks that just have no good wide receivers as opposed to the Vikings where it's been the other way around. Alex says, Quacey deserves praise if Jefferson's contract is at least four years, three years is the new hotness. Then you have a less flexibility. Four years makes the most sense to me. That feels like a good compromise because the Vikings, I know always want five. If they get them for five and they push up the dollars a little more, that might be a good way of doing it because you get that extra year of having him.

And look, I mean, Amazon is buying more football. They're not buying less football. More money is coming into the league, not less. And that salary cap is just going to keep going up. And as it keeps going up, the deal looks better each time the salary cap goes up. If you have them for five years, then every one of those years, that looks a little better and a little better. But if you're Jefferson, you probably want to hit the lottery twice

in your main prime of your career. Four years makes the most sense that you sort of split the difference in the middle, give them a four-year extension. Alex says, cornerback position is intriguing as hell this year. A lot of answers need to be provided. Moving into next off season for the future at that position can Booth step up a la Trey Wayans. Yeah. You and I were thinking along the same lines of that. Yeah, that's the thing about the cornerback position. That's a little difficult for me is the guys that they have are young, but it's also other than Booth, hard to see some next step. Like for Caleb Evans, it's hard to see a next step. He's an NFL player. So he's here, he's on the roster. Okay. You need guys like that who can play when you need them.

But is there another step where he suddenly plays the football better? Probably not. Is there another step for Booth? That could be reasonable. Not for Shaq Griffin, not for Byron Murphy. Everybody is who they are. Murphy could move inside more and they could get more out of him, but he is what he is at this point.

Um, so, you know, I, I don't know like how intriguing it's going to end up being unless somebody surprises us there. Ty says, uh, what's the line on JJ's new contract? How much is too much just for fun? We have months to kill here. Yeah. Yeah. You're right about that just for fun we have months to kill here yeah yeah you're right about that um we have months to focus on the vikings off-season program is what you meant what you meant right not time to kill um i would go 33 and a half. I think that's right for the, if you're talking about average annual value and maybe 70, no, let's go. Um, let's go 85 and a half for the guaranteed money. So will it be more than 30 and we're assuming four years, I guess. Will it be more than 33 and a half per year and more than 85 and a half for guaranteed money? And I probably might take the over on that.

Freedom Thinker says biggest sleeper UDFA Trey Knox. We need a better catching tight end while Hockinson is out. All right. Keep an eye out for Trey Knox. He was the only guy that they a better catching tight end while hockinson is out all right keep an eye out for trey knox he was the only guy that they brought in a tight end i thought they might bring in another one uh a lot of you very excited about the kicking competition me too uh reconnected what are the odds that j uh josh mccown is the offensive coordinator in 2025 possible it's possible.

I don't know what Wes Phillips' plans are. I think that O'Connell is pretty loyal to him. I also think that there's – and McCown might have that as his goal. So it's hard to know. And we don't want a co-anything. Co-defensive coordinators was a bad plan. Co-offensive coordinators when Brian Flores was the coach in Miami, also a bad plan co-offensive coordinators when brian floris was the coach in miami also bad plan so you don't want co-offensive coordinators but so i i don't know like is west

phillips gonna get some interest if they're really good on offense for head coaching positions not sure about that but uh mccown has his role as i think QB developer is really his role where his effort needs to be JJ McCarthy and mastering the techniques and the details and everything else of the offense. Whereas Wes Phillips is more along the scheme and the implementation and the install and all those things plays a very valuable role as the offensive coordinator. So they're working in like different little roles there, but if they feel like it's either make McCown something else or they lose him, I don't know. That might be a tricky situation if they love him in the building, but I don't think so. I think that they'll probably keep the staff together. We've seen a lot of loyalty from KOC when it comes to the staff, except for the obvious Ed Donatel, but he was actually too loyal to Ed Donatel even throughout the season. What are you 12? 98 team, even the kickoffs were exciting with David Palmer. I cannot wait

to have kick returners back. I really can't. I really cannot wait. Kick return specialists were stars when I was growing up. They were stars all the way through the early Madden video game era. Hester is more of a punt returner, but kind of the last great star is Cordero Patterson of this. You had your Josh Cribs, your Dante Hall.

These were guys that you want to play with on a video game that you want as big stars in the league. And then they just poof disappeared. And now maybe they're back. JP Powell has been in the league a while, looks fast and seems to have great hands. For me, he's wide receiver three to beat. They do have a huge list of wide receivers on the roster. Yeah, no, that's true. I like Brandon Powell. I just, from a physical perspective, the undersized element, like, is he a guy that you want catching 30 passes or 50 to 60 kind of prefer along the lines of the 30 passes? You want a little more of a difference maker, but it's more about who can step up. Brandon Powell having to step up to wide receiver two over any period of time is,

I think, difficult. Not that he's not a good receiver. I think he really showed last year that he was deserving of that playing time. Let's see. Let me scroll a little bit here, answer a couple more questions before we call it a wrap really appreciate everybody checking in i'm kind of a random night hopefully you're watching some basketball at the same time i have not had the tv on in here uh let's see uh kft says rooting for drake rodriguez but looks like an uphill battle to make the team lots of competition um so the defensive tackle position is deep but one thing that happens a lot of times is some you know veterans will get signed and then you think well he must be on the team he was a veteran who was the guy was it dorante no daytone daytone jones Durante, no, Dayton, Dayton Jones. Like they signed Dayton Jones.

We went, oh, okay. Well, they got this pass rushing three tech. Then he just didn't fit and they got rid of him. So they signed a couple of guys, Jerry Tillery, Jonah Williams. If one of them doesn't fit, then, you know, or if Levi Drake Rodriguez plays really well and they think that he could be immediate depth is hard to expect that. But in other teams, uh, I guess had interest in Levi Drake Rodriguez, but he was a seventh round pick. If he was a seventh round pick, even if you have to cut him and put them on the practice squad, are, are you really going to, um, you know, like, are you really going to, uh, worry about losing him?

I'm not sure. I don't know how much the interest was in the NFL about, uh, Levi Drake Rodriguez, but you know, I usually with seventh round picks, you can cut them and it's fine. They get to your practice squad. No big deal. Uh,, had high hopes for Brian Asamoah. Looks like he has talent to work with. Can't seem to put it together. Yeah, that was an interesting one because last year around this time, we would have been talking about, oh yeah, Brian Asamoah is going to start. It's going to be him and Hicks.

And he was, I'm sure if I did, I know I did, 10 most interesting players for training camp. Asamoah would have been near the top of the list. And then he just had his job swiped out from under him. But the fact that they brought in Blake Cashman also tells you that it wasn't just, oh, well, Pace outplayed him and they felt good about him. There's something else there. He is uniquely undersized

in a different way than pace. So Ivan pace is a tank. I mean, for his height, he weighs a lot. He's just, he's like a, well, I guess what is a, I mean, a pit bull is like this where their whole body is just muscle. And so that's him. Just like, he's just a fire hydrant. I don't know that Brian Asimov is that way. When he would get out there against offensive linemen, they moved him pretty easily. But with pace, he's super crafty.

And he also like initiates the contact. So he goes and hits people first. It's kind of a psycho out there. And like, that's what you need. I don't know that Asimov was psychotic enough for them, but this is a big year for him. We can't, after one or two years, we can't say, oh, well, let's not even talk about those guys.

Still something to discuss. Is he the backup linebacker? Is he just a special teamer? Could he have a role? We saw other guys who we thought were pure backups who ended up with a role and that might happen for him. He was also banged up a little bit throughout the season. So I don't want to count anybody out just yet. Not, not until year three in training camp is where we know pretty well, uh, what's gone on with the guy and where he stands. What about Bob says, how about letting the chat vote for a press conference question? I don't trust you guys.

That's funny though. But yeah, I don't trust you guys. That's another part though, of the whole off-season program is just listening to everybody talk, you know, listening to them talk and what they say about the progress. And sometimes you take it seriously. And sometimes you do not take it seriously. Like when Mike Zimmer seemed to pick a random guy every year and say, the guy stood out maybe just to see if we would actually believe him. I don't know.

KFT says I've read former NFL scouts say that quarterback coach doesn't spend much time working with quarterbacks, improving their deficiencies. They spend most of the time implementing the game plan. That is what, yes. So this is an interesting point because Chris O'Hara stayed on the staff. He's going to do that. And that's why McCown is here, because McCown is going to do that stuff. He's not just going to be a game plan guy. He is going to work directly with the quarterbacks in a different way, I think, than your typical quarterback coach.

Because if you think about Kirk Cousins, Kirk Cousins doesn't need you to teach him, hey, on this route, you want to turn your hips that way to throw. He doesn't need that. He's been doing it forever. He's not going to change. So what Chris O'Hara was doing is working with Cousins on the schematics. Hey, when I see this, do I throw it there? And then on a week-to-week basis, scheming up. So trying to get it into the head of the quarterback is something the quarterback coach usually does. But in this case, Josh McCown, I believe is going to have a different role based on everything that they've said

than your traditional quarterback coach. Anthony says Dallas Gant is going to beat out Asamoah potentially should be a fun camp battle. They did bring in a bunch of UDFA linebackers, probably a good, good position to bring in for undrafted free agents. That's an intelligence position. So a lot of times and toughness, a lot of times if somebody doesn't really shine from certain, you know, athletic markers, uh, you can get a deal on them because it's not just a pure athlete position. So anyway, well, it should be fun times. Should be fun times. I can't wait to react to what I start to see here

with the off-season program. And we'll have some fun. I have some ideas for some fun times for all of you to participate. Maybe not voting on questions for press conferences, but definitely on a lot of other things that we'll come up with throughout the rest of the off season. And we'll be reporting on the off season program,

maybe a Justin Jefferson. Hey, we'll celebrate it for a week, right? Like we'll have a week's worth of Justin Jefferson content if they sign it, because he'll be celebrating being very rich. I'll be celebrating not having to talk about trades with Justin Jefferson. So, all right. Thanks everybody for joining. Really good time as always. Really appreciate all of you in the comment section. Great questions.

Great comments. I have come to expect nothing less from you good folks. So keep your eyes out. It's going to be a little more sporadic. I am catching up on the golf, you know, uh, coming out of my, like a hibernation draft draft hibernation, essentially a little bit. Um, but, uh, I'll definitely be doing a lot of these chats. So thanks everybody. And we'll talk to you all again, very soon. Football.