Purple Insider - a Minnesota Vikings and NFL podcast - Who will replace Kirk Cousins at quarterback? Is the Cousins era over?

Episode Date: October 31, 2023

Matthew Coller and Brian Murphy talk about why he's supporting a move for a veteran quarterback and then Manny Hill ranks Kirk Cousins' best games and discusses whether Cousins is done in Minnesota Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Hey everybody, welcome to another episode of Purple insider matthew carler here and it is time for monday morning murph with brian murphy and i'll tell you murph through about the third quarter of yesterday's game i was thinking you know we're really going to be talking playoff race and analyzing where the vikings stand in the nfc and maybe even making an argument that they are one of the best teams in the entire NFC after the 49ers fell again, losing their third straight game, and the Vikings continuing to roll against the Packers. And instead, very, very, very different discussion this morning.

So let's start just with what you wrote, which is making the argument that the Vikings should go out and get another quarterback somewhere, somehow, because they've earned that with the rest of the roster and because of the strength of the roster and the position they've put themselves in to fight for the playoffs. So explain. Well, I look at the resurrection on defense, actually, as the driver of this. There's a, well, there's, I'd say three elements that are really kind of driving my thought process on, because four and four doesn't look the same in every listing of four and four. Two weeks ago, I would have been fine with burning it all down. But now, you know, the way that I'm the resurrection on defense, you know, coordinated by Brian Flores.

I mean, his schemes, his disguises. I mean, he has left some of these quarterbacks that the Vikings have defeated. And granted, there's a lot of inexperience there as well. But I mean, go down the list. Bryce Young, Justin Fields, Tyson Baggett, Tyson Baggin, Brock Purdy, Jordan Love. These guys all look like they're seeing ghosts with the way that the Vikings are playing on defense. You could almost see them making a case, hearkening back to the Zimmer era, where you could stack up a bunch of 17 to 10 type victories over the next six or seven weeks because that's how soft the schedule is as it opens up for

the Vikings before they really have a couple of tough games maybe against Detroit if they matter even by then. I also look at the offensive line. I mean, I never thought we would ever say this out loud on a podcast, Collar, but the offensive line might be the most, if not the most improved, maybe even the most impressively improved unit on this team. I mean, they, Cousins wasn't even, you know, barely breathed on yesterday. And that's what makes the irony so cruel about the way he went down, whether it wasn't a defender anywhere near him. But the way that they've kind of constructed this roving wall of protection, you could make a case that if there's a plug and play option, trading for a veteran or signing a recently retired or recently forced into retirement veteran,

it might be easier to do that with the protection that they have. Now, the running game leaves a lot to be desired, as we know, but it just feels like, you know, that the risk of having an inexperienced or someone who's not familiar with the scheme joining at mid-season, I mean, that's usually a death knell, but there might be some wiggle room for the Vikings to leverage that. And then finally, just the way the receiving core has really stepped up in the apps. I mean, they're three and oh, without Justin Jefferson, let's not forget that he should be back or maybe back in a couple of weeks, but Jordan Addison is the real deal. Obviously KJ Osborne had a great game yesterday as he has as a second and third option over the last couple of years. And of course, TJ Hawkinson is now earning his, his contract extension, just watching cousins, you know,

find these guys and, and, and move the ball the way he was because of his protection gives me a little bit of hope that if you do make a risky move and shove some chips into the middle of the table and mortgage some of the future that you owe it to the other 52 guys in that locker room to do so. So you said there twice make a case and uh that's kind of funny because i mean the last time this happened where a quarterback was playing great and they went down and then backup had to come in it was case keenum in 2017 and that's

where when we bring up ideas like mac jones the pushback if the Patriots would be willing to trade him, the pushback is significant from fans who have watched Mac Jones look bad for the new England Patriots. But I cannot explain to you how different it would be to play for the Minnesota Vikings, except for using case Keenum as the example, because case Keenum was a Houston Texan, Los Angeles Ram. He played for Washington, for Denver, and never did anything like what he did with the Vikings. And the reason was Adam Thielen and Stefan Diggs and Kyle Rudolph. And that year they actually had a pretty good offensive line. And defense.

And a great defense and a very good scheme. And I'm not guaranteeing NFC Championship if you bring in another quarterback, but we've seen this through history with the Minnesota Vikings many times, whether it's Wade Wilson coming off the bench or Gus Farratt turning a season around. We saw Jeff George, who has a terrible career, except for one year with the Vikings where he plays absolutely great I mean Randall Cunningham many times Rand yes I mean at least Cunningham had a great career but we've seen even guys who didn't have great careers come in and you know play great

for the Minnesota Vikings and the reason is that this franchise has always had great wide receivers and then you add the fact that their offensive line is playing well i know how hard it would be for someone else to come in midway through the season but sam bradford showed up what 10 days before the year and then in week two he beats the green bay packers at u.s bank stadium this team is not quite on defense the strength but they are playing very very well and what floris has done is that he's developed players he's got guys playing in the right positions guys are making plays over and over again and then you say well okay they've had an easy schedule of opposing offenses except for

the 49ers but you look at the schedule going forward Murph find me all the franchise quarterbacks and superstars that they're going to face they don't really face hard teams until the end of the year when they get Cincinnati and Detroit. Running out Jaron Hall is, to me, unfair to Jaron Hall because he's just been drafted this year. Fifth round draft pick. That's really tough. Or even if Nick Mullins comes back, is potentially wasting an opportunity here to make the playoffs and do something magical. And then, you know, there are other options that could potentially stretch into next year as well, because it seems like this is the type of injury that would not allow cousins to come back or just based on the situation. So I'm looking at all sorts of options for them,

but I think that they have to do something because the team is just too good to do nothing. Well, and that's the case, I guess, that you make is that what are you telling? You know, we talked a lot about this last week. You know, what are you telling the locker room if you're if you're throwing in the towel and building for the future? Well, now you're not just building for the future. You're giving up on a season that they have really hammered and tonged their way back into contention here. I don't think anybody thought at 0-3 or 1-4 that this was going far. But the way they have, you know, look, I know the 49ers look suddenly vulnerable,

but they handled and manhandled the 49ers on Monday night. And the Packers are a bad team, and Jordan Love is just not ready for prime time. We can see that. I mean, they didn't get a first down yesterday until about three minutes were left in the first half. But you're still walking into a Lambeau, and you're putting down an inferior opponent and making them look bad in the process, and that counts for something to me. And I just feel like this is a team that's coalesced around its, its defensive coordinator and it's got, and it's coming together talent wise. And again, we can't overestimate the impact too, that the receiving core has had on their offense,

considering the running game has almost been non-existent all season. And Jefferson, Justin Jefferson hasn't been in the lineup for three weeks. So I think you owe it to your fans. You owe it to your locker room to do something. Now, keep Josh Freeman out of the conversation. We don't need something that desperate, but something to address the gaping hole now, obviously, of production and leadership that your team has by losing a veteran quarterback like that. The question becomes, you know, they're negotiating

leverage for a trade is basically goo at this point. Everybody knows they're desperate. They're going to have to overpay. So does that, you know, and I'd be curious to hear what your thoughts are on, you know, the recently retired and banished among the veterans that have been out there and been accomplished, I mean, they may be all raking leaves and looking in their investment portfolios, but would it be worth a phone call to a Carson Wentz, to a Matt Ryan? Is plug and play an option eight weeks into a season? Does it matter who you get, who can fit into this scheme and and do something over the last nine weeks? Those are, you know, the fact that this happened two days before the trade deadline is either going to make Kwasi Adolfo Mensah make a an irrational decision or a very rational decision that he's going to have to stand up and own either way. It's going to make for an interesting next day or two no question because there's sort of different levels to their options

there's the trying to find someone who could potentially also be your quarterback for next year so that's you know trey lance if dallas was willing to part ways with him which i i don't know what they're doing with him like they're not using him. And Dak Prescott is having another very good season and they're a good team and going to compete for a Super Bowl. So what are you doing with Trey Lance? And then the Mac Jones idea. These are players who, if they play well, could be your quarterback next year. And you could still draft one because you're not totally locked in.

And I also don't think the price would be high for either one. Maybe you're giving up a third round pick for Mac Jones. Maybe you're giving up a third round pick or the fourth to replace the fourth that Dallas gave up for Trey Lance. Those don't hurt the future. They don't hurt your chances at drafting a quarterback. But they also, if the guy really fits great, then, you know, it might solve that issue.

Then there's the other level, which is trying to call Tom Brady, trying to call Matt Ryan. I think Tom Brady is retired, retired. But Matt Ryan, I'm not as sure. I don't know that Matt Ryan wanted to go out with what happened last year with such a miserable, horrendous season that ended when the Vikings had the largest comeback in NFL history against him. And he has to be aware how different being coached by Jeff Saturday and throwing to who knows who and having Jonathan Taylor hurt in their offensive line, no good versus this team and this group. And I'm into that idea. If anybody could come in in two weeks and figure it out, if Matt Ryan has been staying in shape and being ready to play football, it's him. And

I mean, because in this offense, I think all you have to do is deliver the ball to the open wide receivers. And that's not to downplay how great Kirk cousins has been over the last couple of weeks, but my gosh, we're guys wide open on Sunday. K.J. Osborne catches a 32-yard completion on third down in which there was nobody even close. There were tailgaters in the parking lot who were closer to K.J. Osborne. They have receivers who are open, a coach who can get them open. And then there's the other option of trying to find somebody else's backup

to trade for to just survive. That's your Andy Dalton. That's your Case Keenum, whatever he's doing. Your Davis Mills, who's not really an NFL starter, but could probably win a few games with a great team. And I think of all the options because they're the Minnesota Vikings and they have the history that they have, Murph. I like the Matt Ryan option the most. It does not lock you into the future. It would be pretty freaking cool to see whether it worked or not.

And if it works, it's legendary. And, you know, it's just like if you trade for Andy Dalton, you kind of know what you're getting. You're probably getting to 8-9 or 9-8 at absolute best. And it's just going to be like hurting your draft status because you can't really compete. And the other one, you know, I mildly like the idea of trading for a Mac Jones or Trey Lance, but I don't think either one of those guys is actually the future of the franchise that it's probably whoever you draft.

So that's how I would rank those potential options. How would you rank them? If I'm a veteran or if I'm Harrison Smith, I'm going in and with as much, I want as much experience as I can. You make the case for Ryan. Look, the guy played in a super, you know, I don't, is he cursed too at US Bank Stadium? Is he spooked by US Bank Stadium?

I mean, the Falcons blew the largest Super Bowl lead ever in that building. And then, you know, they are, well, he blew that lead to, not in that building, but I mean, he's obviously that meltdown that they had with the Colts, that he had with the Colts last year. You know, you mentioned that that probably left a bitter taste in his mouth as far as how his career ended. He just looked like he was out of sorts. And he didn't look like he felt like, you know, his arm strength obviously is his, his biggest asset.

He didn't have a chance to exploit that. You have a situation here where you've got Jefferson probably coming back in a couple of weeks, Jordan Addison, Osborne, as you said, Hawkinson is a great option at tight end. He seems to have, you know, rebooted his season after some after some early miscues. And then the protection issue, because obviously Ryan's not very mobile at all. The protection that the Vikings have been able to put together the last several weeks as they've gotten healthier, they've integrated Dalton Reisner into the scheme.

It's been pretty impressive. I mean, that could be your selling point. Now, again, where's the running game? Does it matter? Cam Akers has shown some glimpses of maybe being able to take the baton from Madison. But right now, I think your biggest selling point is, look, we got a shutdown defense, and if not a shutdown defense, a fierce defense that seems to be putting quarterbacks at unease and indecision. And you got Flores kind of doing what he wants to do. And by the way,

he's probably thinking to himself, look at if I can build this resume. If this ends up being my team to lead in a way, because my scheme and my personnel are the ones that are going to get us somewhere. I mean, he's also burnishing a resume for a future head coaching position again, too, if he can get through his lawsuit. Again, side tangents here, but so many threads that you pull out of what can happen today and tomorrow and what this bodes for so many different people in that locker room at various stages in their career, both as players and as coaches. And again, the story of grabbing a former star quarterback off the sidelines and putting him in a position to maybe, you know,

rewrite a little bit of history and take a team that seemed to be dead three weeks ago and maybe even on life support again and take them somewhere. I mean, these are intriguing options. If the, if the Vikings are willing to pay for it. Yeah. And I think that the cost of any of these things will not be too much uh if they want to get an andy dalton if they want to trade for a mac jones if they want to sign to matt ryan i mean how much does matt ryan really want and the vikings do have cap space the concern

for the vikings and i'm sure that quesadilla flamenco is spending his monday morning talking about this with ownership and the coaching staff and everything else is that you get to carry over cap space. That's a big deal when you want to sign Justin Jefferson for next year and you want to spend dollars in free agency. And you could say, well, who cares, you know, whatever. But when you look at the difference between signing a decent free agent and a great free agent can be $5, $7, $8, $9 million, which you could carry over. I think they hesitated to sign Dalton Reisner, who's been great, by the way. They hesitated to sign Dalton Reisner because of the price, not because of the player. And I think that was in part because they want this cap space for next year.

And so this is what makes it difficult is there are so many implications to next year that would be positive for doing nothing. Your draft status, if Jaron Hall comes in and he wins two games the rest of the way, and you are picking ninth overall, and you are within shouting distance of picking in the top five where you could potentially trade up with an Arizona, if they want to stick with Kyler Murray or something and that seems pretty favorable or you could trade a high draft pick for Kyler Murray if they want to trade him or whatever you need to do if you

bring in Matt Ryan and you end up winning x number of games then you're picking 17th or 23rd or whatever and then it's a lot harder to get that quarterback and if you're crazy you're picking 17th or 23rd or whatever. And then it's a lot harder to get that quarterback. And if you're crazy, you'd awful mental. You're like, you know, I mean, we got to think about that because we got a whole future to go here.

And if you draft the next borough or, or whoever, a Josh Allen or my homes or whatever, if you hit the next quarterback, you're good for like a decade. So whatever, what a 10 games mean. But at the same time time you're also telling

the coaching staff hey well you know doesn't matter that much for this year we're just going to focus on next year that's where i think quesia da fomenta is in a very difficult position i mean they could trade daniel hunter and think only about the future but then you're giving up on so many people for this year. And then there's the other part, Murph, that I don't think the owners ever like to give up on a season. And I do wonder if as they're pitching their different ideas, well, maybe this, maybe we do nothing. You've got to wonder if the Wilfs say, look, go get somebody. We did it with Sam Bradford. He almost got us in the playoffs in 2016 probably should have we can do it again with quarterback x so I I'm I kind of leaning toward that direction that they will do

something yeah because as you mentioned and we talked a lot about this last week too about what you know what kind of influence and thumb on the scale will the Wilf family have uh before the deadline even with with a healthy Cousins, because we weren't sure where, you know, what kind of mandate this team would have and what kind of projections you could base off of. But the way that they've played in the last couple of weeks and responded to the adversity, the manner in which they've won, again, defense, protection, playmaking receivers. You could make a case to a lot of different quarterbacks, and you can make a case to that locker room, and you can make a case to ownership, and ownership may be making the case to its

general manager that we owe the fans at least a shot at this. We have an opportunity because the NFC, as dominant as we felt it was at the beginning of the season, feels a lot more wide open. Of course, the NFL always feels wide open at mid-season, but the 49ers look vulnerable. The Cowboys look fantastic, but we know their playoff history. The Eagles, yeah, but they've shown some signs of regression here and there as well. You could make an argument that this is an opportunity that it's a little bit more wide open. You could make a case for making a run over the last nine weeks. But now the mandate that Kwesi has is to build for three to five years. That's his job.

That's what he's ostensibly paid to do, is to manage the roster, not just in front of him week to week, day to day, but year to year. And that salary cap space that you were talking about. I mean, as much as you, you know, the more you spend and the more you risk today, the less you have to spend and invest in the future. And what kind of ripple effect will a heightened emotional decision on October 30th or 31st have on what you're supposed to be doing April 25th, March 1st, all of those deadlines? I think the Wolves are probably like, look, we have a fan base that seems to be engaged again with this team and is looking for some direction and looking for some hope. And I don't know if I can sell winning in April over the next nine weeks. So it would be fascinating to see what that, and look, Kevin O'Connell, obviously every head coach is paid to win today and tomorrow. And that's all they're thinking about. Brian Flores is looking at,

again, rebuilding his resume and his head coaching bona fides. These are opportunities that these guys are going to take. They don't want that proverbial rug yanked out from under them by an indifferent management philosophy that may run counter to what their instincts are, which is to win now and compete today. instincts are which is to win now and compete today so i thought that the team was who they were after oh and three and they were just meh and if i thought their schedule was going to be really hard going forward then i would probably say why don't you just ride it out with your backup quarterbacks and see what happens. But the path is right there.

And you just, with this franchise, really never know. I mean, there's just been so many times throughout the history of this team where a quarterback who is completely unexpected with these great wide receivers shows up and does something spectacular. And I would be willing to want to find out if we get another one of those seasons to add to Vikings lore, as opposed to waving the white flag. And I'm sure Jaron Hall's

biggest fans at BYU will tell us that that's not the case. And maybe it's not, maybe he's, you know, capable of doing it. I don't know. The odds are not particularly high, especially when the head coach who sees him every day is still talking about yeah i think you know maybe we could get nick mullins back like that's not that inspiring but maybe i mean maybe i i just feel like he was supposed to be a guy that was developing over a year to hoping to be a reasonable backup at some point not someone that you toss into a situation with a bunch of superstars on the offensive side and say, hey, go win games for us with all these guys. That is a lot to ask of Jaron Hall. So that's why I tend to lean that direction

and agree with you that these players and their talent deserves someone who can get them the football and try to win some games here. The last thing I want to ask you about, Murph, is just Kirk Cousins. I think we're all feeling the same way about what this means for his future. He does not have a contract going forward and Achilles injury. I'm not going to try to diagnose it at this moment, but this could be like a whole year that it takes to recover. He's 36 years old. I mean,

we're talking about a really difficult situation to ever see him coming back to when they were already kind of ready to move on. Anyway, what what do you think of this morning about the Kirk Cousins era? I mean, I know he just got hurt, but they could be over. So what do we feel about it today? I mean, I don't think it's dramatic to believe he's thrown his last pass as a Minnesota Viking. I mean, you know, Adolfo Mence's decision to not offer a 35-year-old lame duck quarterback an expensive contract extension looks pretty commendable right now in the cold, hard reality of the NFL. But the biggest thing now is

he doesn't have to spend any political capital moving on from an inexperienced quarterback who seemed to be hitting his stride this season, as he usually does in October, and maybe setting himself up for kind of a redemption postseason and even a richer payoff. And then you've got to explain in the offseason why you're moving on from a potential MVP candidate who just put together this fantastic season with this great offensive line and this great receiving core. Now, you know, the MRIs and the extended rehab, that'll take those bullets as far as, you know, the general manager's concerned.

It's so weird because now, you know, and I kind of started off my column like this. I mean, you know, Vikings fans, they're not going to have Kirk Cousins to kick around anymore. And it's kind of a cruel irony. And just about as it feels like he's been taking off that kick me sign from his back, both, but last year, the Netflix documentary and the way he's been able to rebound and, and lead these four, four wins in the last five weeks. I just feel like, I don't know what Vikings fans, a, I don't know who their boogeyman is going to be anymore going forward,

but B, you know, one of the biggest attributes and assets cousins had was his durability and his ability to what what, 140-some starts. Hasn't missed a start at all for the Vikings. Has only missed a couple of snaps, really, despite taking a ton of huge hits. And in the irony of ironies yesterday, you know, he goes down without a defender next to him. And as you mentioned, I mean, these are serious injuries. I mean, I think back to Dan Marino. I don't think he was ever the same quarterback. I mean, he was productive, but I don't think he was ever the same quarterback

after he blew out his Achilles in the mid-'90s. You've got Aaron Rodgers, you know, vowing to return magically from his week one injury at some point this season. You know, I think we can all remain a little skeptical of that. But as you mentioned, these are – I mean, Brian O'Neill on the same field in January suffered a very serious Achilles and ankle injury and was not even full strength until deep into training camp. So Cousins marketing ability, his future, his future, not only with the Vikings, but in the NFL has some serious question marks around it. And I think it would behoove Vikings fans to take a breath, take a look back. It was unproductive in the playoffs, but there were moments of incredibly competent play. There were moments of incredibly frustrating statements and sort of

awshucks and difference that rub people the wrong way. But at the end of the day, Cousins put up some major numbers and showed up day after day. And that counts for something in a league where, you know, there are bodies dropping every week. So it's really hard to kind of wrap it all up succinctly. I think the distance of time will give you a sense of how to assess the Cousins era.

Right now, one and three in the playoffs is what you're looking at. It doesn't look like, you know, I'm not sure he was going to be the answer and bring them to a Super Bowl. But boy, there were moments when he was dialed in that it was really fun to watch. And I think, you know, his toughness and, you know, look, everybody in that locker room gravitates toward him in a lot of ways. And I think that counts for a lot and it's going to be very, very difficult to replace that certainly on the fly, but even long-term you don't have that kind of experience and universal respect handed to you. You have to earn it. And Cousins did that with his toughness and his ability to

show up every day. Yeah. I mean, I'll do a longer podcast on this at some point, but I guess my thought on it as we stand today is there was always one more step to be taken with him throughout the era. There was always the, like, if you just win that one more playoff game in San Francisco, as you mentioned, or if you just throw the deep ball to Adam Thielen instead of checking it down or whatever. And even this feels like just at the moment you are about to take off with this team and have a real chance to do something, as you mentioned with the defense, the receivers, the way Addison's playing, then it's cut short. And that's how it's felt so many times, where you're close and it never feels like you're far away from something special and then never quite got there.

That will be how I feel about the Cousins era through the entire thing. The other thing that's notable to me- What might have been. It just feels like what might have been. Right, right. And even what might have been if they fired Mike Zimmer and had someone else coaching him, if he had been paired with someone else.

I think that's another part of it, too, is that the era in Minnesota can be sliced into two places where it's his time with Zimmer and his time with Kevin O'Connell, where Kevin O'Connell, and this tells you a lot about leadership, he was able to get the entire locker room behind Kirk Cousins. And that was something that I don't think we ever saw before. And, you know, there's probably some regrets there with his relationship with Zimmer and everything else. And of course, he's not completely innocent in that either, about the headbutting, but having a coach fully buy into him, and we saw what that did for him, for his play, for his confidence, for the way the team responded to him, that was very different. a fan base perspective their frustrations from the early part of his time in Minnesota changed as they saw the coach buy in and as they saw the results change last year in the clutch and in the big moments where you came to expect him to come through as opposed to even the head coach on the

sideline wasn't believing in him so there's a lot more to say about that but that's kind of just how I'm viewing it this morning and we will have to see what comes next and, you know, his recovery, the diagnosis, everything that's going to go on. We are still just kind of reacting in the moment here. So Murph, great column. Your reaction column is terrific. People should go check it out, purpleinsider.com. And we will see what the heck we're talking about in just a few days here as

the Vikings have to turn around and go to Atlanta and play a game. Yeah. It's going to be fascinating to watch, you know, Kwesi and what he does and what, you know, what the rationale comes out for the decisions or the non-decisions that he makes and the ripple effects that this is going to have on the franchise, not only in this off season, but the next two to three years. It's really fascinating. Would not be the Vikings if it wasn't.

Thanks for your time, Murph. And we will talk again soon. Sounds good. This show is sponsored by BetterHelp. Folks, if you're struggling with the holiday blues and you're having some trouble getting excited in the same way that other people in your life do about holiday get-togethers

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I don't know how many times it's happened since I started covering this team. That is just like the whole world has been shifted in one moment. It certainly happened when I first moved here and Teddy Bridgewater got hurt. It happened when Sam Bradford got hurt in case Keenum went in. It happened in the Minneapolis miracle. It happened. I mean, there's just so many times along the way where everything that you thought you knew about the Minnesota Vikings, snap of the fingers, and it changed. hobbled off the field with a torn Achilles against the Green Bay Packers amidst playing one of his best games statistically ever. Over 90 by PFF, over 90 by ESPN QBR, a really incredible showing in Green Bay. A lot of big plays on third downs, moving the ball up and down the field. A couple of fourth downs maybe Kevin O'Connell should have gone for, just saying, throughout that game. And then it's over in the snap of the fingers and of course you know we've only got probably hours until they have to make the decision about what they're going to do so we

should start there and then we'll talk about our main topic and then you can give your list of uh Kirk Cousins top games in, which I asked you to put together. But what's your take, Manny, on what you think is going to happen at the quarterback position for the Minnesota Vikings? Well, I think there's two ways you can kind of look at it. You can look at what I think they should do and what I think they actually will do. I tend to think that they're going to explore some options in the trade market as we get close to the deadline. We're less than 24 hours away. But I think ultimately they're going to end up standing pat

and trying to go forward with Jaron Hall. And then if Nick Mullins can come back healthy, I know he's got the back situation. So that's always kind of tricky because those things can kind of flare up. I kind of feel like if Jaron Hall, you know, starts against Atlanta on Sunday and he doesn't play that well, then we could probably see Nick Mullins for, you know, the rest of the season. But if Jaron Hall does play well, there's no real reason to pull him out. At that point, you just roll with the hot hand and you just see where it takes you.

It seems like maybe they'll explore maybe bringing in some sort of veteran off the street. Matt Ryan is in the booth right now, and it sounds like he still wants to play. You know, Joe Flacco's name, I think, kind of came up a little bit. I don't think that he really has much of anything left. I'm not really sure Matt Ryan has much of anything left either. So, I mean, they could explore that route,

but to me it just kind of seems like here's an opportunity to get a look at a young quarterback that they took in the fifth round, see if they can maybe find some, I don't know, sprinkle some fairy dust, some Brock Purdy fairy dust on him or something. And maybe he gets hot and plays well out of the blue like Brock Purdy did and can maybe lead them the playoffs, to one of those last wildcard spots. We'll see, but it's a dicey situation. I think that Kweisi Adolfo Mensah and Kevin O'Connell should explore every possible solution here, every possible option to try and see, because they are kind of in a unique situation where they're playing really well they

played really well the last couple of weeks and they're right there in the playoff hunt you've got some veterans on this team that i don't imagine will take too kindly to you just kind of like throwing in the towel and and kind of punting on the season and i think you kind of want to if you're if you're kevin o'con, you want to keep winning as many games as you possibly can because it just looks better on your resume as a head coach. You know, the more winning seasons you have, the more times you make the playoffs, the better it is. It just makes you look better.

So it'll be interesting to see what they do. I think that they should really, you know, try and explore some trade options to get a guy in that can, you know, help them now, little bit in the postgame yesterday. That's kind of intriguing. Rather or not, the Patriots really want to part ways with him at this point. Kind of remains to be seen. But I think if they're going to pull the trigger on a trade, it would make sense to do something like that. Because you bring him in, he's got some experience, he's played well at times. You give him this sort of infrastructure and it could work.

And if he plays well enough enough he might be the guy that you have for a couple of years and give you an opportunity to kind of keep this competitive window open uh kyle says i'm currently on the jamis winston train but could be talked out of it easily okay well i'll help you on that for being talked out of it number one they're playing the saints in a couple weeks so i don't know if the saints want to help you on that for being talked out of it. Number one, they're playing the Saints in a couple of weeks. So I don't know if the Saints want to help you out like that. He knows their entire offense and more than the practice squad guy who gets cut and then brought in like he actually knows their entire offense.

And not only that, he's going to be better than Jaron Hall. So why would the Saints in a very tight race want to help you out? And the other thing is too, Jameis Winston has the same career quarterback rating as Nick Mullins. And that doesn't mean that they're the same raw talent, but neither one of them has really ever done anything. I mean, Winston won a couple of games in 2021 for the Saints, but has throughout his career been a losing quarterback. The same with Andy Dalton, who's won about a third of his games since he had that short run with Cincinnati, where he was pretty good at the beginning of his career, where he had AJ green and the best left

tackle in football and, you know, all sorts of weapons there, Marvin Jones. And then after that, he hasn't really been any good either. And it's hard to convince me that either one of these guys are much better than Nick Mullins would be where Mullins had some decent games with San Francisco, probably isn't good enough to get you to the playoffs. And if you spend draft capital on someone who is a middling, mediocre quarterback, who has to come in and learn an entire offense and try to win for you right away and then you go seven and ten or eight and nine i mean then you just look kind of foolish right i guess you gave it a shot but andy dalton couldn't do anything more for you than he could for dallas when they had him as the starting quarterback and they went like six and ten uh in 2020 one of those wins of course against

the vikings but i, that's not a quarterback at this point in his career who's going to bring you a whole heck of a lot more than Nick Mullins when he returns. The Jaron Hall thing, I'm mildly interested in. I mean, we got no sort of sample size in the game. He made one good pass to TJ Hawkins hawkinson it was well done well operated and that's all we saw in preseason he had a decent fourth preseason game against competition that was only slightly better than what we see on saturdays um you know a lot of times so there's no real sample size even in training camp where jaron hall is only getting a handful of reps because kirk cousins is getting all the reps and then now he's got to go play nfl quarterback luckily it's not against

a great team but it still is going on the road against atlanta you get an idea there what you'd love to have is like a three-week sample of jaron hall to be able to say can we stick with this or can we move on but the trade deadline is tomorrow. And then there's no real time for this unless Philip Rivers is packing up the van and bringing all 11 children to Minnesota. And he's on his way right now. And maybe we'll have like the local TV helicopter over Philip Rivers or Tom Brady or something.

But I mean, that's hard to see. I love that option personally, because I just think it would be so thematic to Vikings history to have a random legendary quarterback show up and then who the heck knows after that. But that's a stretch to be pulling people out of retirement, pulling people out of the booth. Hey, I saw Kurt Warner

in the press box the other day and you look pretty good. Like bring Kurt Warner, you know, put him back in. I joked in my article, like, you know, I don't think that Dan Marino or Jim Kelly or Boomer Esiason is available either. So we're talking about bringing in 46 year old quarterbacks to play a handful of games. It all kind of seems ridiculous, but yeah, you never know. I think that you're right, Manny, that the most obvious thing would just be ride this out, but it also feels weird because of how they played recently and how they played recently is so darn good. The last couple of weeks that if you're Kevin O'Connell, you've got to make that argument to the Wilfs. Like, look, if we get someone decent in here, we can make the playoffs.

So we're going to have to see what happens there. And we could debate it all day long, but I think we'll know by pretty much tomorrow what's going to happen there. I will not take my daily nap tomorrow because I usually wake up to some huge Vikings news, but there is another part of this discussion. Kevin O'Connell said today that Kirk Cousins will remain around the team and will continue to be in the quarterback room and be a leader on the team. And then he dropped a little one-liner about Cousins thinking about the future

and how long it's going to take him to get back, which made me go, Oh, okay. Interesting. When it first happened, my thought was Kirk cousins is done as a bike. Like there's no ways coming back. They already didn't sign him to an extension and I have to plug in my laptop. So I'm going to walk around the computer after I ask you this question. Uh, but I'll be back. Don't worry. I'm not just leaving. Cause I don't like your answer. Do you think there is a chance that Kirk Cousins returns to the Minnesota Vikings after he recovers next year? I think there is a chance. I mean, I think even going back to before this injury, I thought that there was an outside chance that they could bring him back, depending on how this season went. I mean, if they had come back and won the division again and maybe made some noise in the playoffs,

I could see how they might, and Kirk has a good productive season again, I could see how they would make that argument of wanting to bring him back, maybe a more short-term type of deal. Now, you know, injury aside, I think the general thought was that he wanted a much more sort of long-term extension when they were having that conversation in the offseason about, you know, he wanted more like a four- or five-year contract extension. They wanted to probably go more like a two-

or maybe a three year type of route more of a shorter term deal um but overall like i always thought okay there there's there's an outside shot that they might you know depending on how the season went they might consider bringing him back um i i don't know it's it's hard to read. I think there's a chance they could bring him back. But my question, though, caller, is just, you know, this is a pretty significant injury. What is he going to look like as a quarterback when he comes back from this? I mean, he's 35 years old.

He's going to be 36 next season. You know, how is his body going to respond to this type of injury and trying to recover from it? And also, is he going to be, are we sure he's going to be ready by training camp next year? I mean, we're halfway through the season now. We're basically at the midway point of the season. And this is a pretty

significant injury. It takes a long time to recover from Achilles. We were talking before we went live here. I mean, Kevin Durant, we saw Kevin Durant tear his Achilles in the NBA finals four years ago, and then he sat out the entire next season. So not saying that's going to happen with Kirk Cousins, but, you know, I think we, that those are the type of things that they's going to happen with Kirk Cousins but you know I think we that those are the type of things that they're going to have to consider if they do decide that they want to bring him back for another you know on a one or two year contract for next season uh they just have to consider okay is he going to be ready to go is he going to be the same guy you know I mean you look at Aaron Rodgers having the same injury week one. I mean, Aaron Rodgers is going to be 40 in December.

What is he going to look like when the Jets bring him back? I mean, I think the thought is that he is going to try and come back next year. But what is he going to look like? It's just hard to read. I know I think about like, OK, what are some previous quarterbacks that we've seen have this injury? Dan Reno comes to mind back in 93. I think that happened in like week four or week five or something like that. Really like the first third of the season.

And he was able to come back in 94 and played all 16 games and played really well. And the dolphins were actually one of the better teams in the NFL the year that he came back. So it'll be interesting. And Marino, I think was only like a year or two younger than what Kirk Cousins is right now. So it that but that those are the things that they're going to have to consider, you know, if they decide that they want to go that route of bringing him back.

I personally think that, you know, at this point, I think you just have to move on because I think the original plan was that they were going to move on and go with a younger option and maybe sign a veteran in free agency for next year. To me, I feel like that's the route that they have to kind of stick to going forward. And, you know, that's that. I mean, we'll see what they do, though. It'll be interesting. Yeah. I mean, for one, they already were concerned about the age issue and that's why they did not give cousins a long-term extension which by the way looks pretty smart right now if we're just keeping a tally on the results from the general manager it's the best move that he made because if he had a three-year contract right now you'd be terrified you'd be like he just tore his achilles and now

we don't know what he's going to look like at all in the future and oh by the way he's got guaranteed money or whatever and this long contract and what do you do now but instead because you did not you know bend to his agent for the first time ever with this team, then now they can move on if they so please. It makes so much more sense to move on because of what you laid out. I mean, people can talk all they want about Aaron Rodgers and how he's selling this idea he might come back from this injury. Good for you. Your throw and pass is standing there doing nothing.

But quarterbacks have to drive the football from their base, from their right leg. It's a pretty big deal. It's not just the running or the mobility because Kirk Cousins doesn't have any of that anyway, but it's, it's driving the football and that's a big deal for Kirk Cousins. This is one of the reasons that he could still put enough juice on the ball. I don't believe that he's ever had a strong arm and I don't think it's gotten stronger as the years have gone by. I don't see too many balls with him where I'm like, Whoa, that was pure arm. And he just whipped it. It's mostly here's how he's driving his right foot into the ground and torquing his body off of that back foot in order to be back to 100%.

I mean, that thing's got to be pretty stable for him to play. And trying to guess how long it's going to be right now is really difficult. But what we know is of all the injuries that can happen to a football player, if you rank them for longest timelines, regardless of improved science, the Achilles one is the longest outside of some career ender, but ACL or what happened to Teddy, which is a total freak thing where a bunch of different stuff got tore up. But for the most part, Achilles is the one that keeps guys out the longest. And you do not heal the same when you're 36 as you, as if you tore this Achilles when you were like 24 or 22 or

something, this is going to be really hard for him. I don't think that's really a bet you can make. I think he wants to come back. I think he loves Minnesota, loves Kevin O'Connell, loves Jefferson. The locker room has totally turned over the last two years in favor, in very strong favor of Kirk Cousins. When the older leadership moved out and the new leadership came in, these players care a lot about Kirk Cousins when the older leadership moved out and the new leadership came in. These players care a lot about Kirk Cousins. And we saw that yesterday with how heartbroken they were. And I mean, they had seen how well he had played so far this year, but they made the cold, hard calculation after last year, winning 13 games, not to extend him. How would they come back and say, no, actually come back on another contract, even if it's one year.

Now, maybe they could argue they could draft a quarterback and have him, but I don't know why you would want to hold back the drafted quarterback. Cause if you bring back cousins, he's got to be your starter. So it, it just seems unlikely that that will end up happening. Plus there's probably going to be a quarterback desperate team that will pay more than the Vikings. And what we learned last year, last off season is when Kwesi Adolfo Mensah sets the price, he's not changing it.

And it's gone that way for every player. And so they'll have their price and I don't think it will change, but I mean, we can't count it out because he's always found a way to come back. But I think that that was his last drop back as a Minnesotanesota viking yeah it it feels like it and and again i keep going back to do we know we just don't know how long it's going to take for him to get back i mean maybe there's some sort of a miracle surgery that goes really well and his body heals from it and recovers from it the right way and he's ready to go by training camp in 2024 maybe but i just don't know if we i mean we

certainly don't know that and i'm not even sure the vikings know that so it's it's kind of like he's got to have the surgery and then there's got to be some sort of prognosis on like how long it's going to take him to recover and then you you know there's still there's still going to be so many questions of just like what is he going to look like when he comes back i mean it's you brought up teddy bridgewater i mean that was the big reason why they end up letting teddy go because they just didn't they couldn't you know Teddy. I mean, the whole locker room, the organization was on the side of Teddy Bridgewater, much like they are with Kirk Cousins today.

But the reality was, was they just weren't sure that Teddy's knee was going to be able to, to hold up. And, you know, to the Vikings credit, to the, to the leadership at that time, it ended up being the right decision because Teddy, while, you know, it's great that he's still in the league and that he's been in the league for almost a decade now, but he's certainly not the same guy as what we saw, you know, back in 2016 in the preseason

before he had the devastating injury. So it's just, I think there's just way too many question marks about Kirk's overall future to really go down that route of exploring, you know, giving him a pretty hefty contract with with multiple years on it. And like you said, he's going to have to be the starter. He's going to have to play. And we're not even sure if he's going to be ready to play right away at the start of the season. I'm sorry. I'm trying to pull up the pizza read, but I, and I was also trying to think of a transition into the pizza read for that, but I'm just going to read it because nothing feels appropriate there. Uh, you folks should make little Caesars, the official pizza sponsor, the NFL part of your game day order online during their pizza pizza pregame one hour before NFL games and get ready for football and fun

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scores with convenient delivery or their in-store pizza portal pickup so grabs of friends enjoy a few slices during the tastiest hour before kickoff pizza pizza folks i hope you've enjoyed listening to us talk about prize picks this year but if you've missed it here's how it works you go to prizepicks.com and it is simple you pick either more or less between two and six player stat projections and that's it now you're playing so if it's x number of yards for a quarterback you just decide are they going to throw for more or less than that number of yards but it works with lots of different options receiving yards touchdowns even goals, all sorts of sports as well. prizepicks.com slash purple. Go there, use the code purple for the first deposit match

up to $100. One of the reasons I like PrizePix, it is very simple to use. You'd see how we do it on the show real quick and easy. And then we talk about our picks and also not expensive either you can turn $10 into 250 by nailing just a couple of picks so go to prizepicks.com slash purple the code purple daily fantasy sports made easy here's what i wanted to bring up so i i agree with all that i think um it it just has to be a cold calculation of this even if kevin o'Connell and Kirk Cousins have become close, even if the locker room cares about him. I think Teddy Bridgewater is a great example. Yes, it was a little more unclear, but when someone is in their mid thirties, there's always so much excitement because he's a star and they love him and everything else goes for running backs like Delvin cook as well. But it can fall off at any time.

And sometimes it's when the guy's playing great and then it's just over and it's happened to so many players. That's what made the Teddy thing and the Dante call pepper thing. So crazy is that those guys were not on the older side. But when someone is, you can't make any bets to what they're going to be in the future and when they recover. But here's what I wanted to bring up. Kyle says, who do we think texted Kevin O'Connell? And why would we not believe it because Kevin O'Connell said today in his press conference, you wouldn't believe that to the people who are blowing up my phone over the last 24 hours or whatever, since

cousins got injured. And this is a great question for the chat is who do you think texted Kevin O'Connell, both serious and unserious answers are welcome. Who you got like who's who's your serious and unserious person who texted kevin o'connell about becoming the quarterback of the vikings uh serious one would maybe be sean mcveigh maybe to just kind of like i don't know text like some i don't want to i feel like condolences are a little bit too, cause Kirk didn't die or anything like that. But just to kind of say like, Hey, sorry to hear about, you know, losing your starting quarterback, that type of thing. Man, a crazy one. Wow. I meant, see, I meant for like actual quarterback options.

When you said McVay, I thought you meant like to trade them, Matt Stafford or something sure um well crazy one would be like i i mean tom brady would be pretty crazy just tom brady just reaching out saying hey maybe hey why not but like i can still play my arm still feels pretty good although that's more of a Brett Favre thing. Yeah, I don't know. That would be interesting. Maybe, you know, I don't know. Would the Patriots inquire about moving Mac Jones?

I don't know. I'd be intrigued by that. I would be in favor of that. I'd give up like a third round pick or something for Mac Jones just to see, you know, get a look at him and see if he could fit in and he's young enough to where, you know, that could be, you know, a multi-year type of situation for you. And you just kind of put them in a situation that's a little bit better than, or I guess a lot better than what's going on in New England right now, because that's a train wreck out there in Foxborough. So, yeah, I don't know. It'll be, it'll be interesting. I'd,

I'd, I'd be curious to know who, uh, who reached out to Kevin O'Connell though. That'd be, that'd be, I'd like to be a fly on the wall in that conversation. Your serious answer. People hate the idea of Mac Jones, but I keep coming back to how simple life would be for Mac Jones if he had receivers wide open and pass protection. And think about even when he won 10 games as a rookie, their supporting cast was just OK. It was far from great. Any kind of game managed his way to 10 wins. It would also give them something for next year if they drafted a player which they would still obviously do they would draft a player have them there and if they didn't look good in training camp or they didn't feel like they were ready or even if they wanted to develop that rookie for a year they could have mac jones still in the mix and you at least have an answer i've liked that

idea it's not buying fully into him but people get very upset when you bring that up which is weird to me manny because we've seen so many quarterbacks over the history of this team who you would not have thought at all would be good and then they are with this team because of the receivers and the offensive mind who's running things and now the offensive line who you know is blocking excellently in pretty much every game that would give him a chance i'm not sure i i think it's just entirely like results based from what they've seen that he doesn't do anything super spectacular and that's been the mo since he came out as well he doesn't have a big arm he's not a great athlete why do i want that any and the

results haven't been that good but i also think like you saw there's so many examples of this there's some extreme ones though like nick full steps into a team and starts winning games with the philadelphia eagles or jeff george had a pretty terrible career and then comes in with the vikings starts launching balls to randy moss and all of a sudden he's a good quarterback and most recently recently, depending on your age, that guy who threw the Minneapolis miracle, go check his stats before he got here. Look at his stats here. Look at his stats after here. And why is that? That's because he had great receivers. And I think there would be a chance to make the playoffs with him. And then at very least have an, in case of emergency, in case you got screwed out of quarterbacks in the draft or

in case your your rookie quarterback wasn't ready i don't mind that but you mentioned the price matters a lot so i could see like bill belichick showing up on his phone and o'connell be like bill belichick like wow okay that's interesting uh i i have about a hundred funny answers like kellen mond you know just be like bring me back like Kellen Mond, you know, just be like, bring me back. Like I know the offense, you know, there's people have mentioned Kyle Slaughter. That's a very common name that still gets brought up. So, you know, I, I don't know that there's, there's lots of funny names. I mean, Stan Humphrey, someone said yesterday, and I almost started laughing hysterically while doing a very serious podcast when someone said that um he did lead a

team to a super bowl so uh but uh yeah colin kaepernick tom brady rg3 brett farve all these are good names uh uncle rico oh actually you know i thought of this one and i started laughing when i thought of this one donovan mcnabb that's that is the funniest answer the funniest answer by far is donovan mcnabb i think thanks yeah shane felco yeah you guys are really in your bag now it's shane felco uh mike white continues to get brought up since we're going the route of movies willie beeman why not oh well i mean you're winning an championship with willie beeman yeah yeah he's mobile he can run around and extend plays good athlete the kyler murray thing's not gonna be a thing it looks like arizona's just gonna stick with kyler murray doesn't it it kind of feels that way like i mean and and i think if you're them why not you know i mean

you know give give him an opportunity to have a full, you know, well, it wouldn't be a full season this year, but, you know, just to get some more reps with, you know, with Gannon there as the head coach out there because, you know, Cliff Kingsbury was just such a disaster of a head coach. And, you know, that might have had to do with some of the lack of success that, you know, or some of the struggles that kyler murray had uh late during that time so i you know if you're arizona i don't think you're in a huge especially if we're hearing things like caleb

williams might not want to play for you and i don't know how much how much of that is actually true but if you're hearing stuff like that maybe if you're arizona you you want to stick it out with kyler murray who's still young who still has a lot of upside a lot of talent i mean they've they paid him that happy contract already so you might as well you know give it a go for a couple more years or maybe at least one more year to kind of see if you can get that turn around because you know just a couple of years ago with cliff kingsbury as the head coach kyler murray was playing really well and that team was pretty good you know they kind of fizzled down Just a couple of years ago with Cliff Kingsbury as the head coach, Kyler Murray was playing really well, and that team was pretty good.

They kind of fizzled down the stretch, but I think he's still young and there's still a lot of upside there. I think it would be wise for Arizona to kind of see how that plays out. Contract for him is a tough element of that. Arizona, if they play him, though, are probably going to play themselves out of that number one pick and then not get Caleb Williams or maybe even not get Drake May because it's a scrappy team

that has terrible quarterback play. If they improve their quarterback play, they might be able to win three, four games. And I know Carolina just got to win. I don't see Carolina winning a ton of games. Bryce Young played well, though, which, you know, you like to see him bounce back from it looking so hideous earlier this year for Bryce Young. But that team is still in line to give Chicago an extremely high draft pick.

And Arizona might play their way out of it. Or Arizona might be showcasing Kyler Murray. Like, look, he's back. He's good. Why don't you guys trade, you know, several first round picks for him, eh? Because if you trade him right now, then Kyler Murray has almost no value. If Kyler Murray comes back and he wins a couple games and he looks really good and his knee's good to go and he's still just every bit as quick and he's getting along with the team and showing any sort of leavership in a tough season, they can up that price. I've still been intrigued by it for the Vikings.

But again, every time you bring up Kyler Murray, people remember the last thing that they saw, which was it not going well as that team completely fell apart. Their GM was a disaster. Their coach was a disaster who, by the way, nobody hired and now is some sort of assistant for a not good college program at USC. And we're also seeing Caleb Williams play his worst football there. I don't know. It's not Cliff Kingsbury's fault.

I just don't think he was really an NFL head coach and Murray spent the entire time with him. But go look up, as you mentioned, 2021. That idea has always rested with me kind of as under the, like, I'm really intrigued. And if you're going to have something fail, have it fail with one of the most exciting quarterbacks, exciting receiving cores, good offensive lines, good offensive mind, head coach. I don't know. Whoever comes in here gets the best situation in the dang league. So I always take whatever I've already seen. And then I up it because I'm telling you, if Kirk cousins is playing for the Arizona Cardinals, it's not going to look good. Like, or if he's playing for the Patriots, it's not going to look good. He's better than,

you know, someone like Mac Jones. I don't, I mean, he's probably better than what we've seen at times from Kyler Murray, but situation matters so much. We see this all the time. So Tim asks, why are we suddenly acting like we've lost the greatest quarterback of all time? Well, I was acting that way.

Definitely. He has one playoff win. That's true. It's never been brought up on the show. So that is true. I'm just picking on you, Tim. And we know who Kirk is and it's not enough. Anyone adds more intrigue.

Well, not anyone. Colt McCoy doesn't add more intrigue than Kirk Cousins. But to your point, the reason why we are acting this way is because as information changes opinions change when they were oh and three if they lost kirk cousins you'd be like all right well tank to glory here's drake may look you threw another great pass retweet right but they have won four out of their last five they beat the 49ers in a big stage and then then they did not just beat the Packers. They whipped the Packers and cousins was playing. I think over the last several games, but maybe even the accumulation of this year, the best looking football he has played as a Viking. There have

been games where he looked like he was going to have one of those Kirk days early on. And then he didn't. And there were times where going to green Bay in the past, Manny, I might've said, Kenny Clark plays for that team. Kirk's going to freak out and get strip sack three times. He didn't, he played one of his best games. He was so comfortable with this offense that he was pulling puppet strings. And what we've always said about cousinsousins is if you had everything, then there's a chance to win a lot of football games. And he's never been closer to having everything on the offensive side than he is right now with Jefferson coming back.

So to have that happen, and no, I don't think he's going to change, but circumstances change. They're blocking people. That matters. The receivers are better than they were last year when Adam Thielen was here. That matters. The line is better. That matters.

And his connection with O'Connell matters. And also the schedule matters that they're playing. They don't play an above 500 team, Manny, until Decembercember 17th that's a long time from now it was all laid out that's why no one says he's joe montana but the season was just getting exciting and then it was taken away from you that's why everyone's upset yeah and it was just so sudden and the fact that they were playing well in that game yesterday, like you said, they were kicking the crap out of the Packers. And then it just, that injury just happened.

And it's like, oh my God, it was just like the shock factor, I think, too, of that injury. And by the way, this is a quarterback that, for all of the criticisms that I've had of Kirk Cousins over the last five and a half, six years, staying healthy has never been all of the criticisms that I've had of Kirk Cousins over the last five and a half, six years, staying healthy has never been one of those criticisms because he's always been healthy. The guy never gets injured. And so for that to kind of happen the way it did under those circumstances, it was, I think, just the overall shock value of that happening, I think, is a big

part of this too. And like you said, he was playing really well, playing some of the best football of his career. And, and the team had just come off this big win against the Niners last week. And then they're beating the division rival, getting themselves right back into the conversation. And like you said, with the schedule, what happens if they, if this was kind of the start of you know a really impressive five or six game winning streak and now all of a sudden you look up and they're like seven and four and they're right there in the conversation maybe Detroit loses a couple games I mean we were kind of uh mildly joking about this a couple weeks ago when we were talking about like well what what's

Kevin O'Connell gonna say at the trade deadline? You know, well, you know, we're still, Hey, the Lions might lose a game or two and we might be right there for the division. Now you look at the way they played over the last couple of weeks and the schedule ahead, you run off five or six games in a row. You're right there neck and neck with the Lions possibly to still win the division. And that's a big deal too. So, yeah, I i mean there is kind of that like what was how was this going to turn out you know if kirk cousins had been able to stay healthy stay on this role um it would have been i'm gonna be curious to to that you know i'm just gonna take it to my grave kind of just like always wondering like how would this season have turned out if Kirk Cousins

hadn't gotten injured you've also got a list we need to get to and we'll get to that in a second but first it is important to remind you that uh you guys can join me in Las Vegas and as soon as I scroll up to find that read oh yes there it is. We're going to Las Vegas in December. It doesn't matter who's playing quarterback. I will be there at Circa in Las Vegas in December for the football game, obviously. So if you want to escape the Minnesota weather, which has already turned not so nice, come join me at Circa in Las Vegas. We'll be hanging out there doing the podcast for a couple of days leading up to the game when Minnesota is there. And you'll be able to find me at stadium swim,

which you've never heard of it. Just Google it. Just look at it. It's incredible. It's a giant humongous screen that however big you're imagining it, it's bigger and you can spend time outside. They've got heated pools, even if it's a little bit on the cooler side,

but 70 will still feel like 90 to you. But literally one of the most awesome places on earth. We're going to be there the Friday night for the game for a special party, just for Minnesota fans. That includes drink specials and they will give away two tickets if you don't already have them before the game. So come meet me there at the overhang bar in circa. You have to RSVP for the game. So come meet me there at the Overhang Bar in Circa.

You have to RSVP for the party. So go to CircaLasVegas.com where it says Sportsbook. Click where it says Huddle Up at Overhang, and you can RSVP there. Make a whole weekend of it. That's what I'm doing at Circa, located on the amazing Fremont Street. Again, a must-see place if you've never been there, and have a great getaway from the Minnesota weather.

Again, CircleLasVegas.com for details. Book your spot there today. And I wanted to add real quick that Kirk Cousins statistically was having one heck of a season. I mean, 103.8 quarterback rating at the top of the pff rankings espn's qbr he was up in the top 10 and i'm sure it went up after yesterday we have to always judge these things by what's happening and what we're seeing and not just and this happens all the time in sports because of the i don't know skip baylessification of sports where you decide that you're going to be anti LeBron when he's 21 years old. And then no matter how many championships he has or establish

himself as the greatest player ever when he's 37, you're like LeBron stinks. Like, but that's not how it works for normal people. I think we move with the information when you're all in three, it's like, ah, this ain't working. But then when you're four and four and you're now moving up that scoring list and everything else we're going to evaluate it differently and when you're playing this type of football we're going to evaluate it differently and it just it had the potential to be his best year as a viking and like you said a lot of people are going to be thinking about this for a long time of he, he was finally kind of having that year, even last year was wonky and he had to win at the end all the time he was having that year. And then it was taken away and that's terrible. And that is terrible for him. And so amazingly we can criticize cousins through his

time here because he's the quarterback of the football team. And we can be harsh about that based on the decision that they made to bring him in and take him to the next level, which he did not do. So we can criticize that harshly, but also always be evaluating what's happening in the moment and not try to take away from a guy when he just played one of his best games. That's that's all. But, you know, I mean, what cousins turned into is what every quarterback turns into. A lot of Vikings fans think that they're unique, but I follow a lot of writers from other teams and the Bears fans spent all summer fighting over Justin Fields.

Are you a Fields believer, a Fields hater? And it's very boring. The same thing with the cousins thing. That's one of the things I'll remember is how boring and silly all of that was from people who were deciding to be haters or believers. It was just like, okay, like we were grown up enough to be more nuanced about sports at this point in our lives. So we don't really have to act that way, but you know, some people do anyway, Kirk cousins has played a lot of great games in the NFL, and he's played a lot of great games with the Vikings.

So I gave you the task to rank the top five games, and hopefully Kirk will watch and this will make him feel better. How about that? In his recovery. His top five games as Minnesota Vikings quarterback. So count us down, Manny. Do your best. All right. I'll start with number five and then obviously count down to number one. Number five, I'm going to go with last week against the San Francisco 49ers. Kirk played really well. I think

when you consider that the way he's played the last couple of weeks without Justin Jefferson and, you know, opening things up now for Jordan Addison to really emerge, TJ Hawkinson is playing better. And I think that really allowed for Kirk Cousins to settle in and play really well. He was I thought he was excellent against the 49ers. You know, that's a really good team that is contending for a Super Bowl this year with a rock star defense with just mean, nasty monsters on that defensive front that we're going to try and get pressure on Kirk Cousins. And he stood in there. He went through his progressions really well. He got rid of the ball. There weren't really very many instances where he was holding on to the ball too long, which has always kind of been a criticism of Kirk cousins. And it was kind of the same thing yesterday in green Bay too, before he got hurt. I just thought he played really,

really, really well. So that's number five, number four. Can you, can you, can you just allow me to, to comment on them before you go all the way down the list?

Because I actually agree with you that that was one of his best games. And I wrote about the game and how he was still self-critical and how I've just always been fascinated by this with Kirk Cousins, that he was criticizing the throw to Jordan Addison. That was the one where I wanted to give him so much credit because he had to just fling it up there to his guy. And he did that. And he was playing so confidently, even in the face of the rush like believing in his his pocket and not getting skittish as we've seen before and one of the things that's always agitated me is that they bang that monday night football drum uh his record on

monday night football and this and this and this like well he might have played a monday night football game in like 2013 i don't know what this has to do with today. And that's also been dispelled a number of times with Monday night wins by the Vikings since he's been here. And it's probably like three and three or something since he's been here. But that's not the point. I looked this up once I tried to make something of it. There's nothing there's nothing there.

And so to do it on Monday night football, despite that whole thing that keeps coming up over and over again, it added extra layers to it. The prime time Kirk, the, well, if he doesn't play at noon, it's this and that. And the other thing. So there was all those forces pushing against them. And he played that game. It was the the 10th most yards he's ever thrown for in his career as well so i i think it's a great pick it's not prisoner of the moment it was a great game from him all right number four number four is uh 2021 week 11 and this was a game that when we were talking about the packers last week great vikings packers games that you've covered in your career um this is one that I, that I thought of the 34,

31 win at us bank stadium over the Packers in 2021. It was such a wild game, kind of a crazy finish or the Packers and Vikings are kind of going back and forth and Kirk cousins stood in there and, you know, he made some big time throws the touchdown to Justin Jefferson was, was really clutch to give the Vikings the lead to put him back up. And then Greg Joseph had the field goal at the end as time expired to win that game. But Kirk played really well that game.

You know, unfortunately, that season didn't finish well. That was the last year under Mike Zimmer, and the season kind of ended with a thud. But Kirk played really well that game against a really good Packers team, Packers team that was supposed to go to the Superbowl, you know, and, and with Aaron Rogers being the MVP of the league that year. So 2021 week 11, 34, 31 Vikings win over the Packers is number four. That was a great game in general.

The thing about that game was that there were so many distractions for that season. I have less recollection for some of those 2021 games than almost any other season because we had the Everson Griffin thing, the Delvin Cook thing, the Zimmer kind of versus everybody as it was slipping out of his hands. But that one specifically, there's the throw to Adam Thielen where the ball looks like it's going to kind of get picked off and then he catches it and runs it. But one of the things about Cousins that always amazes me is no matter what is going on, he would just put the horse blinders on and go play. And at that point, the world was collapsing.

We're talking about firing the coaches and everything else. And there was the head butting between he and Zimmer. And there were a number of games, including I think it was the Lions game where he had to come back and they kicked the game winning field goal. And then he shook Mike Zimmer where he kind of had this a little bit of a fight in him. And that was one of them, because that's certainly one where when Rodgers is striking back and striking back and striking back, it's easy to give up on that one or to have that three and out or whatever, as opposed to the game winning drive. Yeah, that's a good pick. That was one of his better games. Number three. Um, this one's kind of a weird one because the Vikings did not win the game, but I'm going to go with week three,

Thursday night in Los Angeles in 2018 against Sean McVay and the high powered Rams offense that obviously went onto the super bowl that year with Jared Goff and Todd Gurley and those guys. Um, that was, especially it was the first year with Kirk Cousins and it was a primetime game. Everybody in the country is watching. And I'm watching Kirk Cousins and this Vikings offense go toe-to-toe with the best offense in football. They're just trading blows. And, you know, unfortunately it was a strip sack on the

last possession. The Vikings are driving for the tying score um and then uh I forget who it was that came off the edge and hit Kirk from behind and knocked the ball out and the game was over at that point but we were watching Kirk make some big time throws to Stefan Diggs to Adam Thielen um and then who was the um who was the other receiver that they had got that caught like a touchdown? I admit the guy who only caught touchdowns, which was Aldrick Robinson. Aldrick Robinson, yes. Yep, yep. What sullied that game, unfortunately, was the ending.

And then there was some sort of debate between he and John DeFilippo of how many yards he was supposed to drop back in the pocket and we knew at that point all right this d filippo thing is a little weird like something's going on there behind the scenes that's not quite right when these two and press conferences can't even decide how far he was supposed to drop back and then after the game we asked like what happened on that play and he said well what do you think happened or whatever like that there's there's been an attitude change i think for cousins and this might be because of mike zimmer not being here but i'm not so sure it's entirely that uh maybe just maturing in the role or being more

comfortable or whatever at the way that he talks publicly and the accountability factor and everything else, because you and I, we talk a lot about how in that locker room, they would feel like Cousins was an independent contractor and not that he had just signed, you know, whatever. And I think over the last two years, he's really galvanized the locker room in part because of O'Connell, in part because of winning, in part because a lot of the old leadership left and he was able to become truly the leader of the team and it wasn't Kendrick's team anymore and it wasn't you know whoever else's it was his and that mattered um but early on that kind of made that one like oh man Kirk really with the ending but he played a tremendous game lit up the scoreboard and you you know, battled back and forth.

They had got any sort of stop. They probably win that game. So number two, I'm going to go 2022 week 10 Vikings, when 33 to 30 in overtime over the Buffalo bills and just a wild, crazy, incredible game. Justin Jefferson the the catch of the century on i think what was it was it fourth and 16 or fourth and 18 or something like that was some weird 18 yep yeah and and uh i mean that's that was the ball game right there jefferson doesn't make that catch the vikings lose that game um and i and i give k Kirk a lot of credit for that game because, you know, when they were down 20, I think it was 27 to 10 in the third quarter.

I mean, that there were a lot of times where we saw Kirk Cousins, when that team got down big, it was kind of like the game was kind of over. And then, you know, he'd pick up some, you know, some garbage yards or whatever, and it's stat line would look pretty good. And the Vikings still lost. But the fact that they got back into that game and made it a game again and ended up winning it, and he was making some really terrific throws, particularly late in the fourth quarter, to kind of propel them to that win

was really impressive. And it was just a fun game. It was just a wild game. Now, the game that proceeded to happen after that, the next week kind of took the wind out of the sails a little bit, but it was a huge moment for them to win that game against a really good team on the road and it moved them to 8-1. And there was that thought like, okay, this team might be serious about going on a deep run this might be a serious thing so just a just a really impressive game for for Kirk Cousins to kind of overcome that that deep

deficit and get them back into that game and eventually winning it and that's one of course being my hometown as well that I will never forget having been there for that game another one where you want to give him credit for just heaving the ball up to Justin Jefferson, you know, as it was always a critique about his game, but he certainly did it in that moment. That game, you're right, they got down and he did not play well early on,

but the amount of resilience required, you could say that against, okay. So there's a game against Denver that someone brought up where stat lines amazing. And they had to come back and win. And Brandon Allen's the other quarterback. They were at home. They got down by 20 and I'm like, I don't know. Good. I mean, good for you. You, you know, whatever it was snowing in Buffalo, that defense is good. That defensive mind who runs that team is good.

That's one where it is about as easy as it comes to pack it in. That team was being talked about for the Super Bowl. You're down whatever number of points. I remember in my article about the game writing about their win percentage being like 5% or 3%. I mean, if there was ever a time to just start checking down, that was it. And that was where it started to shift truly with Cousins, that feeling, I think, within the fan base because there wasn't the 23-play drive of checkdowns that ran the clock out on himself to make sure the completion percentage was high. He was making plays.

He had a run in that game that was pretty impressive where he kind of put his head down. So, I mean, that's a great pick. Absolutely one that I would include. And number one is, going back to the Mike Zimmer era, 2019 NFC Wild Card, Vikings 26-20 over the New Orleans Saints. The touchdown to Kyle Rudolph to win it in overtime just stat line for kirk not great in that game but i think just the the the toughness of you know overcoming sort of that crowd that's it's such a difficult environment to go down in

new orleans and win against that team drew breeze and Sean Payton and Alvin Kamara and Michael Thomas, that high powered offense to, to go down there when, you know, so many things happening going on, you know, behind the scenes with the Vikings leading up to that game. It's like, if they lose this game, is Mike Zimmer going to be fired? Is he going to go coach the Cowboys? Like all of this stuff just kind of circulating, and I remember that. And to go on the road, make the big throw to Thielen

to set up the Kyle Rudolph touchdown in overtime. And it was Kirk's first playoff win, and his only one to date, by the way. But still just an overall impressive performance when you're not really getting along with the head coach. The head coach very clearly wants to, you know, conduct his offense around Dalvin Cook. And Dalvin Cook not really having a super productive day in terms of, like, yards per carry.

I think he only averaged, like, three and a half yards per carry that game. But Zimmer wanted to keep feeding Dalvin, keep feeding Dalvin in that game. And you're watching and just like, no, you got to let, let Kirk Cousins throw the football. You've got Thielen, you've got Diggs, you've got Kyle Rudolph open up the offense a little bit. And when they did, you know, Kirk made some throws and, uh, and they got a win against a really good Saints team on the road in a really tough environment so that's number one I think that's the only pick for number one because he was big in the biggest moment there that they had with him as a Viking and I don't disagree that when anybody talks about the Kirk Cous cousins era in Minnesota as a team,

like, did it work? Was it a success? The answer cannot be yes, because you did not get to where you set the bar of where you were supposed to go. And now that they're going to miss the playoffs, potentially, if they have Jaron Hall in or whatever, you're going to talk about six years as a franchise with two trips to the playoffs and he leaves you at four and four and not eight. No. So it's not like you could just get there. Now you're playing a bunch of other teams with questions about their quarterbacks, but you're in the same boat, at least until Tom Brady shows up. And then, yeah, the accumulation of the whole thing was not a success. And I agree with what Tim is saying in the comments that if you had to guess

how this thing was going to play out over this year, you can lay it out. You can say that they weren't going to be strong enough as a, as a whole to either get to the playoffs or get through, or eventually that was going to run out. It's like when a basketball team gets down by 30 and then they cut it to nine and the announcers would be like, what resilience they cut it to nine. And then it'll be like a 20 point win at the end because they run out of gas. Like they just, and that could happen.

That could have happened that at the end of the year, when you play Cincinnati Detroit twice, you could have run out of gas and gone eight, nine. And that's not, that's not an unlikely scenario based on what we've seen in the past. You could say that and also say the way they're playing right now is the best football they've played,

weirdly better than at almost any point last year. It is the best football they've played probably since 2019 over this winning streak. I wanted to see how it was going to play out. I wanted to see how the whole thing was going to go. I didn't want this to happen. Nobody wanted this winning streak. I wanted to see how it was going to play out. I wanted to see how the whole thing was going to go. I didn't want this to happen. Nobody wanted this to happen. And he's played so well over the last few weeks that it's been better than at

many times in his career and his comfort was there and his accuracy was there and everything was clicking for them. The locker room coming together. It's a terrible time for this to happen. And I think you can say both of those things. them the locker room coming together it's a terrible time for this to happen and i think you can say both of those things i would like to nominate one other game for your list by the way philadelphia 2019 vikings win 38 to 20 kirk goes 22 for 29 four touchdowns 138 quarterback rating in the game. Stefan Diggs just roasting people in disturbing ways during that game, pushing the ball down the field, the play actions.

Stefanski was in his bag that game, deep crossing routes, bootlegs, all sorts of things happening. That was an incredible game. And that was a team that did make the playoffs, had a good defense, had a good defensive line, and they end up making it. So a great list, though. That was pretty much it for me, like nominations that belong in the top five. I thought you absolutely nailed it.

There's a couple others that are like, he beat Detroit 42 to something. Matt Patricia was the coach. Like, I don't know. It's like, that's great, but it doesn't belong in that upper upper echelon so we'll see Manny we'll see what happens with uh Kirk Cousins here going in the future if it's Jaron Hall the rest of the season and then we're we're trying to figure out what's going to be next for you each week selfishly if they brought in Matt Ryan or something it adds a lot more juice to the rest of the season that's all i can say i mean like there's a i don't think it's irrational to want

that but there's just a part of me that wants to talk about that instead of each week going like is it going to be manion or mullins or hall this week or maybe jaron hall will surprise us it's the vikings you never really do know. So great list, Manny. And do you want to put down the prediction before we close it out? Because we'll know by tomorrow what's going to happen. So you might as well throw down the prediction. I think nothing's going to happen. I think we're going to get to the end of the deadline tomorrow, and it's going to be Jaron Hall set to start on Sunday.

And then, you know, Nick Mullins or Sean Mannion will end up being the backup and we might end up seeing Nick Mullins or something play at some point this season. All of the other stuff seems exciting and I would be all for it no matter what they do really, but it just kind of seems like they're going to stand pat with what they got and just see what they can get out of Jaron Hall. I will make a very hot trade deadline prediction that the Vikings will make a huge trade and send Ezra Cleveland somewhere. That's my guess.

I think they're good with Dalton Reisner. He's been a great fit. And they also like Blake Brandel. So they're going to see if they can get something from a desperate team who needs a guard for Ezra Cleveland. And that will conclude all of the happenings at the deadline but uh yeah I don't think Daniil's going anywhere maybe they'll do something I don't know maybe I'll just because you said it I'll put the official prediction in that there is another quarterback here and I just don't know who and that's the way I can hedge it. So I could try to be right. Thanks for all of your time,

Manny. Thanks everybody else for watching, commenting, listening, however else you've engaged with this wonderful product. And we will talk to you all after the trade deadline. We'll see you then football.