Purple Insider - a Minnesota Vikings and NFL podcast - Will Kirk Cousins go off in the next month?

Episode Date: October 13, 2022

Matthew Coller answers fan questions, including about what Cam Dantzler's big play on Sunday says about him, whether the schedule is favorable for Kirk Cousins to have another huge month, how Kevin O'Connell is handling it, should the Vikings make a trade-deadline deal? Could any normal guy hold a football for an NFL kicker?  -- For more of Matthew's Vikings coverage, head to purpleinsider.substack.com For bonus discussions, interview clips, and more videos, check out our YouTube channel! Interact with us on Twitter! @Purple_Insider Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Purple Insider presented by Liquid Death. Go to liquiddeath.com slash insider and learn about the Tallboy can, which actually has water. Find out where you can get it near you at liquiddeath.com slash insider. Hello and welcome to another episode of Purple Insider. Matthew Collar here, and this is a fans-only episode. And look, I've got a ton of questions to answer, so I am going to put myself on a clock. I am going to attempt to only spend five minutes on each question so we can get through a lot of them because there's tons that I am really interested in answering that I've gathered over the last week. So let's dive right into it. We'll open the Diet Dr. Pepper here. I went to the store knowing that I had to get a Diet Dr. Pepper, so I would be fueled

to be ready for this podcast. So let me get a sip and then let's go. All right. Let's start off with at Lou dog on Twitter with the weekend dolphins and the meh Cardinals coming up was last week's when the beginning of Kirk Tober fest. Yes, no, I truly was. Yeah, it definitely was because when you look at the upcoming opponents here it's remarkable how bad they are at pass defense so you have miami coming up they are 30th in expected points added on defense against the pass the arizona cardinals are 26th and washington is 27th so they are facing three of the worst pass defenses in a row. And wait, is the game against Washington go into November? Can that still be Kirktoberfest? I'm going to have to check what the date on that one is to be sure. But to your point, yeah, it's November 6th. But to the

real point, they will not face a good passing defense until November 13th, but then they face three of them in a row. They go up against the Buffalo Bills, quite possibly the best passing defense in the NFL, and then the Dallas Cowboys, who are just crushing people on defense with Micah Parsons and company, and then the New England Patriots. You know that on a short week, it's going to be very difficult to game plan against bill belichick and it doesn't get super super easy after that they have to face the jets who are an improved team they go up against the lions on the road that's never easy colts will see what they look like by then but then giants packers and of course

they finish off the season with the chicago bears soldier field. So, you know, it gets harder in the second half of the season for sure. But if you're looking for that quarterback rating of Kirk cousins to start going up and those PFF grades to start improving these next three games, just have it written all over them. And the, the only thing that ever can get in the way is the pass rush. When it comes to a team that's struggling against the pass, the Washington commanders have a decent pass rush. They're seventh in sacks, but these other teams, they just do not. Uh, Arizona has the fewest sacks in the league. They have six, the whole season, six sacks this year. And let's see, where's Miami? Have they been a little better with the Miami dolphins? Maybe they have, I'm having trouble finding them, but

no, they're 24th. They have eight sacks. These teams can't get after the passer. They can't cover anyone. And the Vikings have Justin Jefferson. I mean, this should really be a run where there is a good chance that they get through these next three games, three and oh, two and one would be very solid for them. If they got through the next three games, sitting there at six and two, going into the difficult part of the schedule, they could even lose two of the next three after that and have their ups and downs the second half of the season and still end up cruising into the playoffs and have a great chance to win the division. These next three games give you the possibility of a huge cushion and that all starts with Kirk

Cousins. And I think what we saw last week is a little more progress as far as there weren't receivers who weren't on the same page as much. Cousins admitted that the read that he was giving or that he was using on the throw that was intercepted maybe wasn't right for this offense or was him trying a little too hard to go with the read that he's supposed to use for this offense. So the adjustment period is not completely over, but the first half of that game, they

looked a lot more comfortable. Naturally it is against the bears, but the bears are just as bad on defense as these other teams that they're about to face. So I think that the convergence of Kevin O'Connell and Kirk cousins getting on the same page with very, very poor defenses, it really comes down to, can they win some score fests if that's what they end up with? But even these teams are not scary when it comes to that either. We don't know who's playing as I'm recording this quarterback for the Dolphins still yet. I think we'll start to find that out this week, but any of the options are favorable for the Vikings.

And then, you know, Arizona has just been a struggle for them all season long to produce points and Washington has their head coach blaming their quarterback. So yes, I think it's not only a time for Kirk, uh, Tober fest, but it's also a time for Vikings Tober fast, uh, going into November because these, these teams are, are ones that they should definitely be. Uh, all right. Onto the next question from at rat trapping, a common fans only question, asker friend of the pod, even, uh, let's see, which was more impressive to see against Chicago, the 17 play drive to cap, uh, capped by a near impossible reach for two points by Jefferson or cam Dantzler's best game as a pro to the eye

test going Charles Tillman on a mere Smith Mars set, uh, more impressive. Yeah. I mean the play from Jefferson, I'm just with Jefferson. We just come to expect that everything that he does is impressive. I mean, I didn't even really make a note of that. That's a great observation by you that Jefferson was able to great observation by you that Jefferson was able to reach out and get that two point conversion because after he did it, I was like, yeah, okay. That's just what that man does. Um, but the excellence of Justin Jefferson can't be overlooked. I think with Dantzler, what it really comes down to for me is that he's making the strides he's supposed to make that if you're going to be a consistently good corner in the NFL,

and it's always ups and downs with corners no matter who you are, but if you're going to be a reliable, successful, quality NFL corner, then you should start turning the corner in year three. And look, Xavier Rhodes, Trey Waynes, both those guys needed develop. And I think it's a really, really difficult position. You have a bunch of unbelievable wide receivers in the NFL. You have pass interference that's being called constantly. It's not easy, but with Dantzler, I mean, the biggest thing is you can have times where you make technical mistakes and you get beat. If you also have big

plays that you're coming up with as well. And that's what he's done the last couple of weeks. Like, I don't know by watching, they would know much better than me. Was he in the right place? Was it at the right time on X play or Y play, or was it consistently getting this concept or that concept that he's supposed to have locked down? That's going to be something that the coaches would know better than me. But what we can all see on the outside is, does the guy come up with a big pass breakup against the Saints? Which I thought actually was probably his best game as a pro against New Orleans. Because he was really on top of it, seemed to understand where his help was.

And then running stride for stride down the sideline with Chris Olave, that kind of showed you that Cam Dantzler has made physical improvements as well, that he came in so light and didn't run the fastest 40 and all that. But he looks stronger now to my eye and standing next to him than he did as a rookie. Although maybe I didn't stand next to him as a rookie. That would have been 2020 where we were doing everything by zoom, but at least he doesn't look super skinny to my eye when I, when I've talked to him. And when you're talking about those, you know, the play at the end of the game, that was really impressive too, because he

didn't give up on that. It was was he mentioned something that they teach that if you miss a tackle like get back up chase from behind try to make a play on the football and he did what he was supposed to do at that moment and also didn't just sort of throw his hands up like oh no i got beat whatever uh that's a big development for them and it's something that has to continue for this to be a successful defense but it is a really important development because that was supposed to be and still remains a weakness and a question mark but by far their biggest weakness was supposed to be the secondary and if he's solid then all of a sudden it's not it actually becomes the pass rush that has not been all that successful

this year. And that means it's even more important because I don't really see a solution to the pass rush getting way better. That becomes even more important that someone like Cam Dantzler can continue to shine on a weekly basis. So as far as the actual play goes, I think it was an impressive play. It's not a super uncommon play that you see somebody, you know, trying to make a couple extra dance moves and lose the ball. Like that's why they tell you to get down or get out of bounds or don't stretch for extra yardage because that kind of screams fumble, but to take the ball right out of his hands. Yeah. It's an impressive play. So I think I would have to go with Cam Dantzler all around.

No disrespect to the reach for Justin Jefferson to get in the end zone. All right, next question from Luke. This comes via email. For the fans-only podcast, Mike Zimmer's bluntness about players is well-documented and discussed, and Kevin O'Connell is obviously taking a very different approach. Do you think some tough comments are needed by coaches when speaking to the media to maintain accountability or can it all be done behind closed doors?

Asking this based on Ron Rivera putting Carson Wentz on blast and KOC never saying a harsh word about anybody. Yeah, so Ron Rivera, I just don't really understand what he was thinking there. I mean, first of all, he wasn't even really being accurate. Like, okay. Cooper rushes the difference for Dallas. I don't think that's quite it. Jalen hurts has certainly been something in Philadelphia, but the New York giants have the second worst passing offense in the league by yards per game. I don't know what he meant by saying quarterback. It was more of just like he accidentally said it out loud and then was like,

oh no, and then tried to walk it back. I mean, I guess we've all done that in our lives. Just said something blunt and then went, oh, whoops. Maybe I should try to cover that up, what I just said. And he said, well, it's about supporting the quarterback. That's what I mean. Like, okay, pal, we all know what you're talking about. Yeah, that is, and that's honestly kind of rare for Ron Rivera that I think he normally is pretty good at managing those situations. And maybe he just kind of just couldn't help himself. Like what,

why are you not winning? I don't know our quarterback um but i i think that right now kevin o'connell has no reason to criticize anybody though when he did in training camp you could kind of read between the lines on things where he will talk about it through the lens of what we're trying to coach, what we're trying to teach, but clearly behind closed doors in training camp, just for example, what they saw from Kellen Mond was not acceptable. And they must have been like, okay, well, this is over. This is not working.

But there's no reason in that situation to come out like Zimmer did and dunk on Kellen Mond. He's just a young player who's probably not good enough to play in the NFL. And they really needed a backup who could fill in for cousins because they're trying to win. And if cousins were to get hurt for two games, then Nick Mullins can come in, operate an offense, potentially win one of those games. That's what they needed. They were not getting that from Kellen Mond. So there's no reason to come out and say, you know, bleep this young player like Zimmer did on many occasions. I also totally respected that Mike Zimmer thought, you know what, if you're not a veteran player in the league and you haven't proven yourself,

I'll say whatever I want about you. I mean, I like that from just understanding what was going on and also the straightforwardness of it. But from a locker room perspective, you're kind of like punching down. And I think that veteran players probably didn't appreciate that. And then they would get called out sometimes as well, which, you know, there's only so much of that you want. I think the tough love is probably better done behind closed doors, but here's where you do have to deal with it. Sometimes if the Vikings lose a couple of games in a row and certain players are struggling, whether it's his quarterback or not, but if it's, if it's, if it's a real struggle, then you have to admit that it's not going well or you're going to sound foolish if

you pretend that everything is fine then the fans are going to read your comments and be like really man what are you that dog from the meme that's you know on fire and says everything is fine like it's not fine you need to change it so you sound incompetent if you are overly positive. I think Rocco Baldelli ran into this early in his career that he wouldn't even admit that he was upset when they lost or that they did things wrong. Like, dude, you sound like a fool. You have to acknowledge that football fans are smart.

They know what's going on. They watch every game. They know every player. If someone's having a tough time out there or a certain element is costing you, then you have to address if you are defensive with the media and you're like what you guys don't even know ball what are you talking about like then you come off like you don't know what you're doing uh or like that you're panicking if something is off for now when you're four and one if the question is hey you know what happened in the third quarter on that interception? It could be like, Oh, well, you know, we're working on it and no big deal. But we'll see. We'll see. There'll be plenty of those moments that he'll have to answer for more

difficult things than he has so far, just as the natural progression of football. And I think it'll be a lot of words and in the middle, there will be some truth and there will be a lot of couching around it. And I think that's okay. I think that's okay. If you talk about, here's what we're working on. Here's how we're trying to coach that, that point or emphasize that point. I don't think you can get too offended as a player.

I think it's when you get slammed, like there's just no reason to say that. Think about if you've ever had a boss or a coworker where they could have just said, player i think it's when you get slammed like there's just no reason to say that like think about if you've ever had a boss or a co-worker where they could have just said hey do you have those tps reports and instead they say uh this is like the eighth time you haven't given me the tps reports what is your problem right there's like different ways to approach people and approach subjects and o'connell's is to kind of soften it up with a lot of things before and after. But so far, I think the things that haven't gone well, he has admitted, like, hey, we missed that read in the end zone.

Or even when Garrett Bradbury, who's played well, and I know there's questions about him, even when he was struggling in training camp, that there was a, like, yeah, we've still got a competition there, and here's kind of what's going on with that. So I think that he's really danced that line pretty well, but it doesn't get easier. Usually that usually gets harder and kind of, we're going to have to wait and see, but I think that you see a lot of coaches who are really good at it. You know, John Harbaugh, Mike Tomlin to

where if you're giving some hard love, you're kind of giving it in more of a broad sense. You're not pointing the finger at one person. For example, like when Zimmer said that Barr has a tendency to coast, it seemed like he was just really mad at Anthony Barr. Or he told us that Kyle Rudolph is the block better. Like, yeah, I love to know those things because it can sort of confirm or help us understand better what's going on.

But they don't like to read that about themselves. They would rather the direct and specific criticisms kind of stay in house or the finger pointing kind of stay in house as opposed to doing it out through the media and saying it's that guy's fault. So Kevin O'Connell will have to balance that. But one thing I would say if I were to advise him would just be make sure you're direct when there's problems. Make sure that you're not couching everything too much and you're not being confusing so

we understand what you're trying to say. Because there are times now when I get a little confused in all the words for his longer answers. And I think that when things are hard, you want to fully understand what is it you're telling us is going on. Um, and, and that might be a little bit of a struggle because then if there's contradictions, we're all going to point those out and then be confused, but Hey, four in one off to a great start. And you don't have to deal with these types of things. And already you've bought yourself some credibility with the players by winning these games that helps you in

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could you see them making a trade like the Rams to acquire talent? Is their cap situation a barrier? Could you envision contracts restructured to provide space? What would the positions be that they should target? I would be surprised if they went big fishing in any way at the trade deadline, uh, in the same, well, it was really the Rams ended up getting what Vaughn Miller. So that was their big trade and signing, uh, Odell Beckham. So yeah, I mean, wow, that's quite the improvement for the middle of the season. That's going to be hard to do. That's a pretty rare situation where you can end up with two players of that caliber.

And saying bleep them picks to go get Vaughn Miller, based on the comments that Kwesi made about the Rams in his USA Today article, where he kind of spilled all the beans, I don't get the impression that that's the way they're looking at this is we need to go all in and we need to, to trade, you know, all of our draft capital and so forth. But, you know, I could see them looking for mid or late round deals. And the reason I say that is because of Jalen Rager and where they haven't gotten a whole lot of pressure is up the

middle from the defensive tackle position they did trade for Ross Blacklock that has not been I mean look I'm not calling him Ross Bustlock but he has just not been a part of this defense so far when he was supposed to take Armand Watts's position and maybe we'll see him work in more often as we go along, but he has rarely played an interior defensive pass rusher could be something you'd have to look at. The wide receiver position is hard to improve at this point. I mean, where else do they really need a safety? Probably not. Um, a nickel corner is probably not something you're going to be able to change. That would, I think it would really depend on maybe injuries and if there's another pass rusher.

And those are really the two areas where you could see them looking for improvement. They have to be happy with what they've gotten from DJ Wanham so far. So it really makes it about the interior pass rush. Or if someone gets hurt, if they go out this week in a receiver or corner gets hurt especially corner i mean andrew booth jr is coming off the injury maybe there's a veteran corner who could fill in but i'm not sure i really see it as far as their cap situation it does not lend itself to getting big fish and i think that they've pushed it to the max for how much they can restructure and redo. I could go through everybody's contract at this point, but I'm pretty sure that they

did everything they possibly could to create cap space for this year to even fit the guys in that they have. So you have to do it on the cheap. You can't do it without trading later round picks because if you're trading top draft picks, then you're not really helping yourself on the cheap. You can't do it without, you know, trading, uh, later round picks. Cause if you're trading top draft picks, then you're not really helping yourself for the future. And I think we are seeing that from the Rams now that, Hey, good thing they won the super bowl last year because the roster is pretty darn weak now. And that's what happens when you say bleep them picks for long enough is that you don't have those players that you've developed and that

are first or second round talents. So they don't have to apologize that you've developed and that are first or second round talents. So they don't have to apologize for that. It's just that, uh, it's kind of the result when you have guys retire, guys leave, guys get hurt. I mean, they lost, they had Robert Woods for half the season last year that helped them Odell Beckham. They've lost, uh, Andrew Whitworth, they lost. Right. So, um, I, I think that this team wants to be careful about really going all in, but if they can find something to make them even ever so slightly better for a whatever draft pick for a mid or late round pick, maybe they would have to consider it. But I think that's going to depend on injuries more than anything.

I don't think they're going to do the all in thing. Uh, all right. Next question from at the hill rats on Twitter. I see a lot of 2022 twins in this Vikings team, unless Kirk anticipating better open starts anticipating better open wide receivers. Talk me out of this. Um, so I vaguely know what happened with the twins. I don't really know the specifics, so it'd be hard to make a real close comparison because baseball. Uh, but, uh, my understanding is that they got off to a great start. Everybody thought they were good and then they fell apart. Now, uh, talk you out of that. I think that the schedule is probably too easy to completely fall apart, as in start out 4-1, start out 6-2, and then miss the playoffs entirely. They could disappoint, though, because that's what happened in 2019,

where they got off to a 9-3 start, if I'm not mistaken, and then every time they ran into a team that was good, they flopped and they ended up 10 and six. I know the last week of the year, they, uh, they lost to a bears team with Sean Mannion starting, but nonetheless, it was a six seed that they went into the playoffs with. And there was a lot of tension and there was a lot of questions about Zimmer's future cousins future that, that, you know, nobody was really happy with that team, even though on paper, it looks pretty good. They were like eighth and scoring and fifth and defense.

And yet every time there was an important game, they just did not come through. And that might be what we see here, or it might not. They've only really had two of them and you can make an argument that the Packers are just kind of discombobulated right now. And that win, which I'm not downplaying, it's a big win to have against the Green Bay Packers, but week one with a team that maybe we thought was going to be stronger. Uh, Philadelphia is really the only big test that they face so far and they did not pass that test They will face those tests later But in order to fall off from where they are right now

They would have to I think get worse which could happen through injuries It's more likely to me that they get better if they stay healthy on the offensive side because of some of the numbers I just gave you but also just the scheme is good, I think. And it's all about getting everyone on the same page with it, which they seem to do more last week. And then we're able to turn it on in the biggest moment at the end of the game after they had some inconsistencies there. There's still worries about the defense and you're an injury or two away on defense

from just being really bad as opposed to trying to survive and doing just enough, but like falling apart if you lose a player or two. So that's something to be concerned about. But yeah, I mean, it can happen. It certainly can. We've seen it happen.

But this last win to make them four and one makes it a lot less likely and they're only somewhat of a paper tiger like they're a paper tiger in that they're probably a fringy top 10 offense and a mid-pack defense at best, which doesn't exactly scream, you know, 1985 bears or, you know, a greatest show on turf or anything like that. Like, like it's not a special team. That's too big to fail, right? It's got its flaws. Uh, or if they keep winning, you call them, it's got its character, I guess, but, um, it's, that's a housing joke. It's got its flaws, so it could go sideways. It certainly could, but I don't think that it's built entirely on this foundation of luck because you have a quarterback who is good overall. You have a wide receiver who has just been proven to be

very, very hard to stop, to stop occasionally. And then it's like the apocalypse if he doesn't have a huge game, but just the Jefferson driving the offense, an offensive line. I mean, this is a big point for talking about falling apart. The offensive line has been pretty legit. And if it stays pretty legit, that's going to be much harder for this thing to collapse. If cousins was getting pressured all the time and had some crazy numbers under pressure, then I would say, yeah, but I don't think he's going to get pressured all that much this year, considering who his tackles are. And Ezra Cleveland has shown improvement. Garrett Bradbury has shown improvement. So I don't see the twins thing where they start

off hot and completely fall apart. But if they start off hot and completely fall apart but if they go to buffalo and disappoint you and if they face dallas and disappoint you or they they lose to new england and bailey zappy is playing or something and disappoint you well that wouldn't really shock me based on what they have that there will be some moments along the way where you go are they really for real if that just happened so it's a great question though. I think it is like the question is there's some red flags, but there's also a lot to believe that can stay good. And are they going to be a competitor? Are they going to be a team? We look back on and be like, Oh, remember that double doink? That was fun. Um, I don't know. I don't know. I don't have the answer for you. I think

it could really go both ways. Uh, if I had the answer for you, I would be doing a gambling podcast. Uh, let's see here's a, but that's, what's going to make this season interesting. That's my point. Um, all right. This comes from Paul fans. Only question. I recently read an article noting three major trades for draft picks that worked out well for both teams. Oilers bucks Oilers drafted Earl Campbell bucks, got Jimmy Giles and Doug Williams Falcons chargers. Falcons got Vic chargers, got LaDainian Tomlinson and giants chargers where the giants got Eli and the chargers got Phillip rivers. Where on the list will bills Vikings digs Jefferson end up? I believe that it could top the list with a digs

ring in the next couple of years. And JJ ending up as one of the best receivers in NFL history. Love the show. Thank you, Paul. That's a great question. Yeah. I mean, I think as far as win, win trades that that certainly ranks among the all-timer Phillip rivers and Eli Manning is tough to top because that is two franchise quarterbacks who may end up in the Hall of Fame. I think Eli's got a chance to end up in the Hall of Fame with two rings. And Rivers, of course, I think should be there. But that's hard to top. I mean, if you can get a franchise quarterback and get as many shots at the Super Bowl as those two teams had with those two quarterbacks,

yeah, that one's hard to beat with two wide receivers. As far as the digs and Jefferson trade goes, you know, it's, it's one that you have to kind of expand out when you talk about it a little bit from just player for player. And the problem that I always have with talking about how it's an even trade is that the Vikings didn't have to trade digs if they had handled the situation better. That's where and he kind of made that clear in an interview that he did the season after he was traded. Like it didn't have to go that way. And you could have just drafted Justin Jefferson anyway and put him with Stefan digs and then been Randy Moss and Chris Carter and Jake Reed, right? Like that could have been a strategy that they could have deployed. Uh, and they chose not

to, they chose to not listen to digs and they chose to let him be frustrated with the offensive philosophy and then be traded away. And the other part is not just the offensive philosophy. It's just the overall, like they lost in 2019. Diggs is a very smart guy. He looked at that roster and said, this is not going anywhere in the future. I need a change of scenery. This is just not going anywhere. And he was right. It didn't. And the fact that he was right means you kind of lost the trade. You lost the trade because he was right about the roster. And because for two years, Justin Jefferson played the best football in the league at his position. He didn't make the playoffs. I think that that's why you've lost the trade, but player for player straight up.

Of course. I mean, this is an all timer digs could not be a better fit with Josh Allen. Justin Jefferson's one of the best in the league. Yeah. It's, it's something you rarely run across, but there's so much more context to it that you kind of like cannot ignore when you talk about that deal. Um, but it's, it's a great question. I'm sure that when we get to bills week, uh, it will maybe come up from time to time. Maybe someone will also write a feature about case Keenum. Who's a Buffalo bill as well. I don't know. Maybe. But yeah, I mean, that's the Vikings. Imagine if they didn't have Jefferson. Imagine if that didn't happen. Imagine if they had taken Jalen Rager instead. I mean, this team would have won like what, six games a year and right now would be one of the worst offenses in the NFL.

If they didn't have Justin Jefferson, I mean, they've really run their entire offense through him the last couple of seasons, um, 2021 so far this year, parts of 2020 though, Delvin cook was very good. Uh, that's another part of it too, like not having a complete team and you've used up a couple of these years from Jefferson without being really competitive. And that could be a major reason why they decided to run it back this year. And that was always the one that I accepted the most was we've got this guy who can drive an entire offense himself. Got to lean into that. So I understand it, but that will be, that'll be a hyped up battle for sure. When the Vikings go to Buffalo, uh, this from AJ Rabby, maybe on Twitter, uh, could you, or I become

competent NFL holders for place kicks, given the access to the same coaching, same number of reps that today's holders get. It appears like something that someone with average athleticism could do with enough practice. That's a fun question. I'm going to go with no, I am going to go with, I do not believe that I could do that because of a few factors. Number one, you're underestimating the punters and backup quarterbacks and the size of their hands and the size of the football and how fast that thing comes back there. Like it is moving. I mean, I've, I've stood close enough in training camp to see it. That thing's a bullet. And I know what you're saying. You're saying like, well, you get to practice and you get to be coached up. Uh, it's, it's possible. It's possible. And who did I ask? I may have asked somebody this. Uh, I don't know. I

don't know if it was Sage Rosenfels or someone else because Sage was a really good holder. He's got these giant mitts. I think I asked somebody, maybe Gus Farratt, and he said no, that an average person probably couldn't do it. Punters are usually really athletic people. These are also elite among humans, hand-eye coordinated people, right? So it would be kind of like saying, could you take a ball and put it from four feet or five feet into the hole like a pro golfer does? That's one of the easiest things that they do, right? Just tap it in. You could, and you could probably do it pretty well. And if you practice it over and over and over again, pretty well. But the thing about being a holder is you need to do it every single time perfectly, or you're terrible. And could we put

in that five foot putt every time, even with a lot of practice? I don't, I have really good hand eye coordination. I definitely couldn't no way. Uh, and I think the same thing goes for this. Could you get out there and do one possibly? Yeah. Yeah. If you got it right, if you practice that you got that one, could you do a full season's worth? No way. The other thing is too, if something goes wrong, you could, I mean, and you got guys coming after you with the ball, uh, good luck with that. There's it, but you got to catch it and spin it and you have giant dudes coming at you. And that kicker is, is, is swinging his leg. I mean, it's the, yeah, everything on an NFL field is really scary, basically. I mean, these guys are really

talented. And if you meet Ryan Wright or Jordan Berry, I would say Ryan Quigley was not a physically impressive guy, but most punters like, oh, that's not, that's not average athleticism. That's like 98th percentile athleticism among human beings walking around the earth and hand-eye coordination, everything else and nerves and guts. Because I think a lot of us, you could practice all you want and then you get out there and you're like, I am holding the ball for a game-winning kick and whoops, I dropped it. So I wouldn't trust you or me to do it,

but I think of all the things on the NFL field, that is probably the thing that you could come closest to doing. You're not throwing a 20 yard completion. Maybe you could snap it and pitch it to a running back. Uh, but aside from that, that's the only thing you could really do on an NFL field would just be able to potentially hold. It's a fun question though. I really appreciate it. This from at ICU2Ugly on Twitter. Fans only, which team's record is not real? Last year, the Ravens were 4-1 and ended up 8-9. The Chargers were 4-1 and ended up 9-8.

Chiefs were 2-3, ended 12-5. Dolphins 1-4 and ended 9-8. Bears 3-2, ended 6-11. Cardinals 5-0, ended 11-6. Are the Vikings and Giants like Arizona that started hot and then ended up bad? Or are the Chargers that ended up mediocre after starting out? I think if you had to guess, if we had to pick the schedule, we'd probably still end up in the same spot that I thought they would be. Right. So let's, let's even do this little exercise here

real quick. So we got the rest of the games up here. So they're four in one right now. This dolphins game feels like a loss. I know that the quarterback situation is messed up going to Miami, the heat, the London, the win against the Bears, it was tough. It feels a little bit like a loss. Now, if they play Skyler Thompson, then it should definitely be a win. And Cousins should play well against the mediocre defense.

But it just has that feeling of this is the letdown one right there. So let's say you get a loss. You go to 4-2. You feel pretty good. Come out of the break. Get a couple of wins against Arizona and the Commanders. So now you're looking at six and two. But you probably lose two out of the next three to Buffalo, Dallas, and New England.

And so then you're talking about being, what, six and two, seven and four. Jets, Lions, Colts, two out of three, nine and five. Giants, Packers, and Bears. That's probably, you're looking at 10 or 11 wins is kind of where you're at. That's the most likely scenario to me is that they start off really hot and then they have their moments where it's not as good against the tougher competition. They fade back a little bit. Maybe there's a disappointment in there somewhere. So that's the thing that I can't factor is like, is it a Colts loss at home?

It like, where's the disappointing factor somewhere? Gosh, they have so many home games toward the end of the year though. Uh, Cowboys, Patriots, Jets, Colts, Giants. I mean, they are home every game except for one from November 20th through December 24th and then they have to play the division games on the road, one of those will be a loss so you know I look at it like that

that that's the most likely scenario and then it really depends because I believe this team is fragile right now, 11 or 10 is the number that I think you can easily put on them for the current version of themselves and what we can project to get better, but they are fragile and we don't know what's going to go wrong. And if we did, it would be way less fun, wouldn't it? Or interesting anyway, maybe I shouldn't say fun.

What's going to go wrong way, uh, way more boring. If we already knew from right now, that's what's going to determine it. Like if they lose two games in a row, do the wheels come off and they lose four in a row because they just sort of fall apart. Is there a key injury or is there not? And they end up winning 12 because they just stay healthy all year, which I've seen them do for multiple seasons. It happened in 2017 where other than the quarterback and running back, but the rest of that season, once Case Keenum got in, they didn't lose anybody. And 2019, they didn't lose anybody either. So it is possible to stay healthy for a whole season, and that kind of is what it rests on.

But having this 4-1 start sets you up to hit bumps in the road and still end up being pretty good. I think if they win this game at Miami, then it kind of becomes you are so far ahead that it would have to go horribly wrong. And by horribly wrong, I mean Baltimore last year, you mentioned them, but they lost their quarterback. And that's the point. If you get to 5-1 or 6- one, you're talking about having to lose your quarterback to have a

chance to fall apart. Um, yeah, I mean, that's, that's kind of the way, the way that I would look at that is this one is it's not a swing game necessarily, but it's one of those that you put so much padding between you and a falling apart that it's, it becomes not quite impossible as we've seen them do in the past, but much, much harder to see the odds are very much against it at that point, if they can get this win in Miami. So that might even make me push it to 11 wins. I've been kind of not willing to do that yet because the wins haven't been as impressive, uh, as you would expect against the bears when you're up 21 to three. Um, so yeah, I mean, but you're to your point, things change. A lot of things change. It's a

long season and there's a long way to go. Uh, this comes from Kel Krieg on Twitter. Uh, what are your thoughts on Ezra on the Ezra Cleveland experiment? You had deemed it a failure. What are your thoughts now? Um, haven't quite deemed it a failure. I think that when Jeremiah Searles and I were talking about it, I may have even said it's been a failure. It's a little bit different than deeming it a failure because I think that has like finality to it. It's a failure. It's over. Uh, I wouldn't say that. I would not say that it's over because I've talked about it many times on the show, but that development curve for offensive lineman

is just ridiculous. It's very, very hard to be an offensive lineman in the NFL. That's why it's kind of absurd what Christian Derrissaw is doing right now and even what we saw you know Brian O'Neill do like that's special for those guys to you know kind of jump to the front of the line at their position very early in their careers because you don't see that a whole lot normally it takes two three years before an offensive lineman becomes who he's going to be in the NFL we've seen that from Andrew Thomas is the best example with the New York giants, but Cleveland had a really rough game against the saints. And I just couldn't help, but wonder like, what is up with this? And then he had a great bounce back game. And so is, is he ever going to lock himself in as a great guard? I think that's to

be determined. It has not worked so far the way that they expected it, which was, I think, taking his athleticism and transferring it over to the guard position and just being a great player at his position. The numbers do not suggest that he's been a good player at his position so far, but he does have the athletic skill to make it happen. And I also think that these units, they just work together. If Garrett Bradbury's playing better and Christian Derrissaw is a freak so far, like that helps that player in between them in Ezra Cleveland. So maybe that's part of it. Maybe there is some system element to it. Maybe there is some teaching element to it. I do tend to think that, you know, this team has had some volatility at

the offensive line coach position and they had a pretty good offensive line in 2019, but then you had the COVID stuff. Then you had the dude wouldn't get vaccinated stuff. And so now you've got a former NFL player in here coaching them, which might be a difference because that's one coach that I think that if he can get those guys playing all kind of as a unit, that guy can have an impact. Um, so yeah, I mean, I I'm, I'm willing to give that time and see how he develops before deeming it a failure. I think it hasn't worked so far, but maybe it's in the process of working. Uh, this comes from Robin Derp on Twitter. Uh, let's see from every meaningful PFF stats through five games, DJ Wanham appears to be playing markedly better than Daniil Hunter.

Do you think this is just rust from Daniil? I do think Wanham has stepped up his game this year. I agree. And, and, you know, with Wanham, the whole deal with him from day one was kind of that he was more of a three-4 outside linebacker, that he was more of a stand-up guy. And I know that I've said that there's not a ton of difference, and there isn't, but there is a bit of a difference about where they line up in their techniques, as opposed to always, you know, hand in the dirt, right over the tackle. They have them line up wider, which may not be actually as good for Daniil Hunter.

I've never looked at Daniil Hunter. I don't know. I've never looked at Daniil Hunter as a quick twitch player, which means that the second the ball is snapped, the guy just blows up off the line of scrimmage like a track runner. That's Everson Griffin. That's Vaughn Miller. That's Micah Parsons. I've never seen that with Daniil Hunter as much as it is when he gets his momentum going he just sticks his giant long arms out there and drives somebody back um and and if really if he

could get his hands on you he's so strong with his arms and they're so long that he can drive these tackles back right and then drop in a move at the last second so it might be an adjustment that has to be made with him. But I think at the same time, Wanham is playing better and maybe he is more quick twitch and it wasn't working for him to be lined up right over a tackle where he's making contact with that tackle right away. Right. I mean, these are the nuances that can make the difference between someone having a good PFF grade and not getting pressures and not and when you go year to year you see a lot of situations where it's like oh um yeah so that guy was bad in this team and then now

he's good what the heck happened and it might just be a better fit or a worse fit and with hunter it seems like it's a worse fit uh for his for his skills. And I think that you also have to wonder about the rust part of it. Is he going to get better as we go along, or is it going to be a year where we just get to the end and say, you know, where, where was he, you know, did this really work or is, is, you know, those injuries taken their toll. He's played a lot of football. And I remember looking at this when the Bills signed Mario Williams way back when. And I split it at age 28 for pass rushers.

And certainly this is not a thing where you're talking about like a sure thing when it comes to age. But I looked at age 28, 29 for pass rushers. And then what they did after that. And there were guys who had some great moments after that. Bruce Smith, what Julius Peppers played late into his career. And there were 30 year old pass rushers who were great. But there were also a lot of them that started to fall off. And I imagine at that time that people were confused.

Like, what's going on? This, you know, this guy's only 28 or 29 and, you know, Daniel Hunter has been playing football since he's 20. So there, there might be some part of that. But it also very well could be just the adjustment period or a change that needs to be making made by the coaching staff. One of them is probably more in on situational stuff as well, which always boosts the numbers a

little bit when you can just throw a guy and say, okay, well, this is a pure pass rush situation. Go in, just rush the passer. That's going to help with some of those things, but I would not have expected the metrics to be higher on DJ want them through any section of games than Daniel Hunter. And that's something to keep an eye on throughout the season, because if that does click, this non-existent pass rush could improve quickly. If Daniil Hunter clicks in, if it doesn't happen, I don't know that DJ Wanham is good enough as a situational player to move the needle and make this a good pass rush. But I think this is a mix of development and fit. And when you draft somebody in the fourth round, that's really what you're looking for is for them to grow over a couple of years.

And it looks like that's the case with him. I like to see that. I like to see when players get better over the years, because last year it was a lot of cleanup sacks. This year, it hasn't been this year. He's been beating people. Uh, let let's see here this comes from at corporate wade for your fans only segment have we seen the end of hall of fame running backs is adrian peterson frank gore the final hall of famers at running back there's no currently active running back that i believe is worthy of hall of fame consideration but most other positions have people oh that's that is a really good question. That is a really, really good question.

I don't ever want to say we've seen the end for sure, because look at the way that the league, even this year, has kind of made some changes and has shifted, and people are playing those two deep safeties and giving up the run and so forth. I have trouble also seeing Derrick Henry as a Hall of Fame player. The weirdest thing about the running back position, though, is that you have Terrell Davison based on four really good seasons. And based on that, Derrick Henry would only need one more really good season

to be in that ballpark with the 2000 yards, led the league in rushing in 2019. But he's been sort of the undisputed best running back in the league for a couple of years from maybe 2018 to 2020. Pure running back, not complete player. And yeah, there's no way he's going to the Hall of Fame, even though he was offensive player of the year. He only has one all pro two pro bowls. Oh, I've got a great idea. Let's take a look at the hall of fame monitor. It's time to pull out the hall of fame monitor. If you made it this far, you've got time for me to go find the hall of fame monitor. So let's see here. Running backs. Yeah. I mean, it doesn'trick henry anywhere close to that active players though that could go to the hall of fame i mean marshall lynch is the closest he has a hall of fame monitor level that's similar to jerome bettis so i think he's got a chance i know he's

not active of course but i'm looking for anybody that's even all that recent. Oh man, not many at all. I mean, I'm scrolling folks and I am not, I mean, I am at, uh, Chris Johnson here, like that level, Le'Veon Bell, guys who had short runs as being great Garrison Hurst. I've still not seeing guys that are playing, um, DeMarco Murray. Okay. i've gotten all the way down to mark ingram and elvin camara ezekiel elliott todd girley like these are nowhere near hall of fame running backs their comparison players are somewhere in the ballpark of like a levion bell that's an elvin camara right now or arian foster being compared to mark ingram which which I really like. DeMarco Murray being a Todd Gurley. Yeah, that's about right.

Wow. There is no one in the league with a case. I mean, Ezekiel Elliott even fell off so quickly. And when you go up to the top of this list, I mean, it's incredible. Walter Payton, Jim Brown, Barry Sanders, Emmitt Smith, LaDainian Tomlinson, Eric Dickerson, Marshall Falk. Players just don't play long enough at the position or at the top long enough to have these careers. I mean, Barry Sanders was a 10 time pro bowler and six time all pro. And as far as current players go, I don't know if you could find anything like that.

I mean, I'm going to scroll here and try to find who's got the most All-Pros as a current player. I'm going to have to, yeah. I mean, the answer is no one has two. Wow, no one has two. Oh, Todd Gurley. Yeah, Todd Gurley has two. No one has more than two for All-Pros.

And that's probably probably you need at least two but probably a little bit more uh unless you have a ton of pro bowls or wow yeah so uh to your point you might be right Adrian Peterson's going in the hall of fame I don't know about Frank Gore it's possible after that though I think someone will come along. Here's my guess. Someone will come along who is the player we've sort of been talking about that we haven't really seen, which is the Christian McCaffrey for a long time. That's what I think. That at some point we're going to have that player come along and the guy will catch 75 passes a season and he'll just last longer than Alvin Kamara or Alvin Kamara could kind of bounce back here and have some great

years and it'll just be looked at as a lull. And then he could have a shot later on, but they are just getting banged up too much in their late twenties to the point where it's hard to see anybody going too long. But that, that's the only thing I could think of is that someone would play a really dynamic role in the passing game and maybe only carry the ball 125 times a year and make it because of that and have an incredible career, or there will just be a resurgence at the running back position. It just doesn't seem that way that the best athletes and here's, here's maybe part of it. If Walter Payton came up now, he's a quarterback. He was a really good thrower

of the football. He's just playing quarterback. And if Thurman Thomas came up now he's playing wide receiver because Thurman, I mean, he could catch 60 passes at 10 yards to catch. He could go downfield. He's playing receiver. That's a, that might be a major part of it. Um, but man, that's a really good question. I, they can't just leave out a whole position though. Right? Crazy. Yeah. Crazy how that's changed. It hasn't just been devalued by teams. It has been, you know, just kind of wiped off the map. Um, all right, let's see. We've made this an epic episode, so we might as well ask one more question. And if I always feel bad at the end of the pods answering questions, cause I hope people get to them. Uh, but this comes from at Farrah Nate on Twitter. Let's see. Um, this defense doesn't look much different without Harrison

Smith, meaning when they played, um, Josh Patelis. So unless you're going to use them for blitz packages, I don't see the point of paying him so much money to the salary cap. Do you think the Vikings would cut him after this year and have Lewis seen in his place? I personally think, uh, that if you're going to pay him that much money, you need to have a blitz more like Mike Zimmer did. Um, yeah, that's a good question. I have felt that way a little bit myself with Harrison Smith this year, that if you're just going to use them as an over the top safety, then it's not worth paying that position. And I think that Harrison Smith, though, if I had to guess, I think they want him to retire a Viking. I think the ownership wants him to retire as a Viking based on the contract, which was

just patently absurd and in no way like dealt with comparisons to other contracts and everything else. That one screamed. The ownership said, just get it done. Now I think now we can start like speculating on those possibilities when it doesn't make sense otherwise. So however, they want to use Harrison Smith. He's going to be good. Like there's no way that they can use Harrison where he's just going to be terrible. And you saw that last week, he made an incredible play against the bears. He'll keep being good. Um, but yeah, I guess unless he has major injury

issues or falls way off, I would expect him to retire as a Minnesota Viking, even if there's some logic to it. And I'm not disagreeing with your point about it. I totally agree with your point about it. I just think he's one of those guys that they want to stay. And they've extended guys' contracts and tried to keep them around on multiple occasions in similar situations. But I think Harrison's even a little different than someone like Kyle Rudolph because he's all pros or all pro. And, you know, because he does have a chance if he continues to play like this at making the Hall of Fame, if he had another all pro, had a couple more Pro Bowl seasons, has a year where he gets five or six interceptions, he's got a chance.

So I think they want him here. Um, but by the money, uh, yeah, no, I, I agree with you. So great episode guys. Great episode. And I still have a few fans only questions left over. What I'm going to try to do is maybe tag them. I actually still have quite a few, so I'll make another episode for sure. I'll make another fans only episode this week. But man, like we went this far and I thought I did a pretty good job of staying to about five

minutes of question that tells you. And there, look, there was no repeats. There was great, smart questions the whole way. Great stuff, guys. Really appreciate it. We will do it again soon.