Pursuit of Wellness - The Mind of an Ultramarathon Runner: Matt Choi on Mental Strength and Endurance

Episode Date: November 7, 2024

Ep. # 148 On today’s episode of Pursuit of Wellness, I sit down with ultra marathoner and content creator Matt Choi to dive deep into his journey from childhood challenges to becoming an ultra-marathon runner. Matt shares how he rebuilt his identity after leaving American football, and the powerful influence David Goggins had on his mindset and approach to life. We get into the raw realities of running, from the importance of nutrition and intuitive eating to the unexpected, like pooping your pants mid-race! Matt also opens up about how running has shaped his mental space, his discipline in content creation, and his advice for new runners. Whether you're into fitness or just looking for inspiration, this conversation is full of motivation and insight! Leave Me a Message - click here! For Mari’s Instagram click here! For Pursuit of Wellness Podcast’s Instagram click here! For Mari’s Newsletter click here! For Matt Choi’s Instagram click here! For Matt Choi’s YouTue click here! For Matt Choi’s TikTok click here! Sponsored By:  Visit cozyearth.com/pursuit and use my exclusive 40% off code PURSUIT to give the gift of luxury this holiday season. Jaspr is offering an exclusive deal – get $400 OFF with code POW at checkout or go to Again, that’s code POW at jaspr.co for $400 OFF your Jaspr air purifier! Go to ThriveMarket.com/POW for 30% off your first order, plus a FREE $60 gift! That’s ThriveMarket.com/POW  Head to Manukora.com/POW to get $25 off the Starter Kit, which comes with an MGO 850+ Manuka Honey jar, 5 honey travel sticks, a wooden spoon, and a guidebook! That’s Manukora.com/POW for $25 off your Starter Kit. Cancel your unwanted subscriptions by going to RocketMoney.com/POW. That’s RocketMoney.com/POW. Show Links: Can’t Hurt Me Topics Discussed 00:00:00 - Introduction 00:02:08 - Matt Choi’s childhood 00:04:37 - Rebuilding his identity 00:06:57 - Influence of David Goggins 00:14:51 - Reasons for running away 00:17:09 - Diving into ultra marathons 00:21:55 - Mari doing the milestone 00:23:44 - Nutrition and intuitive eating 00:28:35 - Eating before or after running  00:29:58 - Running locations 00:33:06 - Pooping your pants while racing 00:34:07 - Food during ultras 00:36:58 - Courtney Dauwalter and other big names in ultras 00:38:53 - Content creation  00:40:35 - Maintaining discipline 00:43:57 - How running has affected his overall life 00:45:23 - Headspace while running  00:47:46 - Advice for new runners 00:49:58 - Content goals and evolution 00:54:43 - Behind the scenes 00:58:29 - Fake running 01:00:11 - Austin run clubs 01:04:01 - Wellness to Matt

Running is like a constant learning opportunity. Because no matter what race you do, no matter what challenge it is, even if it's not a race, there's something you can get out of a run because it's gonna hit you in a different way. This is the Pursuit of Wellness podcast and I'm your host, Mari Llewellyn. What is up, guys?

Welcome back to the show. Today, I am sitting down with an Austin local. He's an ultra marathoner and content creator, Matt Choi. You guys are going to love this episode. I've never had a runner on the show before, and there's a lot here that we talk about with mindset, discipline and grit. So whether or not you're a runner, I think this will be a very interesting and motivational episode. We dive deep into his journey from childhood challenges to becoming an ultra marathon runner. He shares how he rebuilt his identity after leaving American football and the powerful

influence that David Goggins had on his mindset and approach to life. David Goggins is also one of my favorite people and one of my favorite books I've ever read. So we talk a lot about that. We also get into the raw realities of running and the importance of nutrition and intuitive eating plus the unexpected pooping your pants mid-race. I had to ask about this guys, so trigger warning if you're triggered by poop. Matt also opens up about how running has shaped his mental space, his discipline in content creation and his advice for new runners. Whether you're into fitness or just looking for inspiration, this is full of motivation and insight.

I hope you guys enjoy it. Without further ado, let's hop into this convo with Matt Choi. Matt Choi, welcome to the Pursuit of Wellness. I'm so grateful to be here. So excited to have you. You are kind of an Austin legend. I've heard of- Don't say that.

Coming out the gates strong. That's very strong. Well, I've heard about you from so many different people and I just told you, you've whizzed past me on the trail so many times. I'm like, oh my God, Matt Choi, hi. But I've never gotten to actually sit with you. So I'm so excited to have you. You are an endurance athlete, an ultra marathon runner.

I know that's kind of the same thing, but I feel like you have to specify because ultra marathons are so cool and a content creator. I want to hear all about your day to day routine, the physicality of it, the mindset, but I'd love to start all the way at the beginning and just hear about your childhood and like what made you who you are today. I love that. I mean, there's so much to unpack. I think, you know, to keep it, I guess, like simpler, like I got raised by a single mom.

I have an older brother and I feel like, like the different adversity that you go through kind of not having like a fatherly figure in your house all the time. Yeah. Played a role, I think, in me really enjoying sports and me really like finding passion and really wanting to pursue that as something that like, I felt like, oh, this is an area where I can get mentorship, I can get find a role model, I can find a fatherly fatherly figure.

And the cool thing having an older brother is you kind of have someone who's like, makes mistakes, you kind of can learn from those mistakes and hopefully not make the same. So it was an interesting like childhood because we always moved a lot. And I think after my parents, but when I was about three, like we lived in Jersey for a couple years, then moved to Las Vegas, then to Maryland. And then I always had to adapt. And I think that's something that as I've gotten older, I've started to appreciate more

because when I go to different events or networking stuff or moving to a new city, like I don't feel a lot of friction when it comes to having to connect with people or meet new people or make friends or like just to communicate and things of that sort. So I think when I was younger, you kind of like, you're always like, mom, but like, I just made new friends here, like, I don't want to move again. And you have that feeling. But yeah, I think over time, I've realized that like, it's almost become a blessing. And I think something I've always learned from my mom was just like, you know, like the price of hard work and like, what it looks like to kind of play that role as a single mom. And

I at the time, when you're young, you don't really appreciate it as much until you get older. And you start to see like, my friends that have kids now and like, how much of a struggle it is to have both parents in the household, let alone just having one. So I think, I know that's a lot I just said, but like that's kind of like a background of like my childhood. I moved a lot, very adaptable. And I think the chip on my shoulder that I've gotten just from being raised by a single mom is definitely something I still hold true right now.

Yeah. I almost wonder if the moving around and changing lifestyle, it adds to your grittiness too, because I know I can relate a lot. I moved a ton as a kid. My dad works for the UN, so we were bopping around all over the place. And I do feel like moving is a very chill thing for me. I don't even think about it twice. And I'm sure it adds to the mindset that you have pushing yourself through these new situations and even like challenges. I know you were a division one football player and now you're a runner. So like what does that shift look like in terms of like as an athlete but also with

your mindset? Yeah, it's completely different. I mean, obviously with like American football, like, American football, so much of what you're doing is around like five to six seconds of effort, right? It's a lot of speed and explosion and power, but in endurance, it's so much more of a sustained effort and you have to endure for a longer period of time. And that suffering is not as like,

it doesn't hurt as much in just like the moment, but like over a course of a couple hours or a marathon or whatever distance you're covering, like there's a lot of mental doubt and insecurities that start to creep in of like, just stop. Like, why are you going to continue? You know? So I think a lot of that adaptation happened

as I one, got out of football and I kind of hung up the cleats and I started to have my own little identity crisis of like, who am I if I don't have this sport that I spent and dedicated my life to? And I think for me, after school, I kind of went through that year and a half, two year phase where I was kind of like, damn, I almost felt like my identity was lost. And rebuilding that back up and I think running was honestly a catalyst in that process of me almost redefining who I am and me being more than just a football player. And I always say this, I was a very poor student and I think it was something that it just like, academics never stimulated me to really want to pursue it and go all in.

But football for whatever reason, I just like, not that it came easy to me, but I just had like a passion for it. And I think after that was done, like, I don't think humans just lose that fire. Right? Like we have that fire inside. It's just, you got to find the next thing that can ignite it. And for me, like at the time it was like, all right, I wanted to kind of get into personal training and content creation and like, that's the start of it.

And then from there, like the running stuff kind of happened because the pandemic. And I was like, I got laid off as a trainer. I couldn't work at a gym anymore. And I'm like, all right, well, like I had read that book by David Goggins, can't hurt me. And I just wanted to like, find something that I'm dying right now. Yeah. I'm a big Goggins fan and I'm like, he's truly like transformed my life and, and has helped me develop and, and, develop and really build on that mental

callousing. I'm so happy you brought him up. I was going to ask you, have you read the book? Because that book changed my life. I've told the community before, I read it about six times when I was losing 90 pounds back in the day. And it was, it's not so much about like, it's about the nothing can affect me and it's embracing the pain. Like that was a really big learning lesson for me because I also wasn't a good student and I didn't have, I didn't have the most discipline growing up.

Like I felt like I was kind of sort of just floating around being average quote unquote. And this concept of like, pain is good, was like a really big light bulb moment for me. Was it for you too? 100%. And not even like the pain is good, but it's just that being uncomfortable and failing is okay.

Yeah, totally. Because I think for a lot of people, we like a lot of people live through life like being afraid to fail. And like the judgment that you're to get from your peers or your parents or other people of like, oh my god, what makes you think you could do this? See, I told you it wasn't going to work out. All of those kind of voices that pop into our circles in a sense. I think when I read that book, and Goganzis definitely transformed me and you and so many millions of people.

And some people maybe take it the wrong way. They take the messaging almost too harshly, where I think you have to look at the framework of what he's talking about. I think for most people, doing things out of your comfort zone and getting more comfortable with failure, these are things that will be only beneficial

if people actually put into practice. So obviously the distance that he's running and some of the very physical things that he does, it's not gonna relate for a lot of people. But I think you have to look at more how he's seeing these challenges and his mindset around it more so. Yes, and apply it to where you're at.

Period. Totally. No, I love him. Most people won't ever run 100 mile races. No. Ever. I never have, but like- You got something out of it. Yes, and I him. Most people won't ever run 100 mile races. No. Ever. I never have. But like- You got something out of it. Yes, and I kept showing up at the gym

and like forcing myself to do uncomfortable things. Have you met him? I have not yet. Oh my God, I would die to meet him. I would die to meet him. I would be so afraid though. Like I'd be- I think everyone would be like a little intimidated

just because of like his aura. Yeah, his aura, his whole aura is just like. Like I don't think he'd be a little intimidated just because of his aura. His face? Yeah, his aura. His whole aura is just like... I don't think he'd crack a smile. He wouldn't be like, hi, nice to meet you. He'd be like, hello. You know what I mean?

Yeah. 100%. That's so funny. But what an icon. I mean... I agree. I've actually asked him to be on the show and he responded. And he was like, I don't really do that, but if I ever want to, I'll let you know. I will say like to get Goggin, like,

cause he's only done, he's done a few pods. Yeah, but he doesn't like to. Yes, like it's not like he says it all the time when he even goes on them, right? He's like, you know, I'd rather be like in the suffering right now than talking about the things I've done, right? Which I, in a way I do respect, right?

Like I think for him, like he's already summited so many mountains, but yet his constant pursuit of it is something that I truly do respect. And I think it's something that I've also kind of ingrained in myself, where it's like, you know, a lot of people, they'll run a marathon once,

and they'll be like, never again, right? They'll put the 26.2 on their car, and they'll just use that as like the glory day of like, I've done a marathon. But I think there's something to be said about like, continuing to show up even after you've had success. As we've spoken about so many times on this show, your sleep is so crucial for all things, Energy, mood, health in general, longevity.

And I think making your bedroom a sanctuary is so important and that's why I love Cozy Earth Bedding. It was named one of Oprah's favorite things in 2018. Cozy Earth's best-selling bamboo set is temperature regulating and incredibly soft. They also have so many amazing options. They have a linen set, which adds a breezy classic charm to your space. I personally love to sleep super cold. So I love that the bamboo sheet set is temperature regulating. They also have really cozy cashmere blends

and timeless textures. They really have so many options. Whatever is gonna look best in your bedroom, plus help you sleep the best, I think is so, so important. You can really make every night a five star experience with their responsibly sourced bedding. Cozy Earth provided an exclusive offer for our listeners today, up to 40% off site wide when you use the code PURSUIT, 40% off Cozy Earth's website.

I recently had Mike Feldstein on the show and he's the founder of Jasper, which is the world's best air purifier. You guys were mind blown by that conversation. As was I, I think it's difficult to comprehend just how much dirt, mold and grossness is floating around in the air, especially in our homes. He was talking about the things that are found in the air in our bedrooms like insect parts,

glyphosate, pet dander and so much more. I personally have a couple jaspas in my house and they first of all are very sleek and gorgeous. You don't even notice them. But what I love about my jasper is I can see in real time its reaction to toxins in the air. So for example, if I blow out a candle, if you shake out the bed sheet, the Jasper comes on immediately and I feel so much safer about the air I'm breathing. I don't think many of us realize how impactful air quality is on our health in general. Jasper is a commercial grade air purifier, but it's also beautiful and quiet. Hundreds, if not thousands of listeners who recently heard my podcast with Mike

have already bought the JASPERS and are loving them. I've had such great feedback from the JASPER team. You guys were obsessed and they are doing a Black Friday deal. You can get $400 off early Black Friday access to my community. JASPER will be sold out by Black Friday. So I highly recommend you guys hop on this. Investing in clean air is one of the most important ways to invest in your health. Better sleep, more energy and clean, fresh air.

Jasper is the world's best air purifier, commercial grade and stunning. I put them throughout my home and we're also bringing some into the office. Jasper is offering an exclusive deal. Get $400 off with CodePOW at checkout. Again, that's CodePOW, P-O-W at Jasper.co for $400 off your Jasper Air Purifier. Thrive Market is a resource Greg and I have used for many, many years. We've lived in tons of different places, Boulder, Colorado, New York, LA, Austin, and finding those healthy niche

items can be difficult. And that's why Thrive Market is so amazing. It is so convenient and it has trusted ingredients. Over the last 75 years, over 10,000 chemicals have been introduced to our food supply, but at Thrive Market, they bring their members the highest quality brands and restrict more than 1000 ingredients found at conventional grocery stores. Certified Organic is always their first choice and Thrive Market studies every label to search for the best wholesome ingredients so you can easily find better versions of all your pantry, snacking and home essentials without the added junk, dyes or fillers. Plus it's delivered straight to your door.

Every single product is vetted by their expert team of product innovators and category managers. Even if it's the most natural, ethical and sustainable option, they always ensure it passes your taste test approvals. There are so many options. I also love the fact that you can shop by category. I always go in the Paleo section. They also have keto, vegan and more. Do you want to shop at the grocery store that actually cares for your health? go to thrivemarket.com slash pow for 30% off your first order plus a free $60 gift. That is T H R I V E market.com slash pow P O W. Do you think any part of it, and I want your honest answer, like about yourself or anyone else you've met who keeps pursuing these crazy challenges, is any part of it like running

from demons or in a way kind of like trying to heal from childhood trauma or something like that? I mean, I think there's, I guess I'll speak for myself. I think there's elements of running from like, maybe like your trauma. Like maybe it is like, I think 100%. There's definitely elements of that. I think looking at that from like a more positive way though, I think for me, it's always been now,

I've now almost gotten addicted to the feeling of accomplishing something that you say you're gonna do. Yes. Right? So I think at first it was kinda like, oh, let me just, I wanted to learn more about what I could do. Yeah.

And I think running is something that is so tangible. It's like, oh, you say you can't do this? All it takes is some time to then prove yourself wrong that no, wait, hold on. Like I can do five miles. I can do 10. And I think now it's like this pursuit for me is less of it being around like the trauma,

but it's more around like continuing to learn like what I can do as a human. And running is just like this challenge, it's a vehicle for me to almost prove it to myself that like, oh, like I can do these things. I can do hard things. And now what that does to my everyday life, whether it's in content or in business,

it's like, it helps allow me to think that like, like nothing's impossible. Totally, totally. You know what I think? And I think everyone runs for different reasons. So it's like, I think where I'm at now is maybe a little bit different than even when I first started.

Yeah, I think a lot of times, because many people I've sat with like you, who accomplish amazing things and are successful, have a chip on their shoulder and come from a place of like, something happening in their childhood, and maybe that gets their foot in the door, but at a certain point that doesn't take you all the way. Like you need to decide, okay, what is my motivator now?

What is my why now? Like that for me was the case. Like when I started losing weight, it was like, I want to prove everyone wrong. And I want to show everyone that I can do this. And then at a certain point I was like, wait, I think I'm doing it for me actually. So it evolves over time. Correct. I want to talk about ultra marathons specifically, because I am so

fascinated by ultra marathons. Like I've watched documentaries. I'm just, I have a lot of questions. I love it. How many miles does qualifies a race to be an ultra marathon? Anything more than a marathon. So 26.2 miles or 42 kilometers. Okay.

The next closest distance from that is a 50 kilometer race, which is 31.5 miles. What's the longest marathon or ultra marathon you've ever done? The longest I've done in one effort is a hundred miles. Wild, dude. Wild. Okay. Questions about that. How do you decide what shoes you're going to wear?

And like, how do they not fall apart? So it depends on the terrain. So like there's ultra marathons that are on the road, right? Okay. That you would maybe wear like a road running shoe. Then there's some that are like Leadville that you're in the mountain and it's a different it's like a rocky terrain where you're going to need like shoes that have a little bit more durability and grip.

They'll be like legitimate like trail running shoes. Okay. So if you think about like a car, right? It's like if you have like someone drives a four runner, like they're going to have more of a rugged terrain versus someone that drives like a car, right? It's like if you have like someone drives a four runner, like they're gonna have more of a rugged terrain versus someone that drives like a BMW, like something more for the road. So similar to shoes is the same thing.

And then when it comes to like the shoe itself in the distance, like most shoes should have durability to run 300 or 400 miles. Like maybe not in a row, but like over the time, right? Like it can collect that much volume of running. During a course of like a 50 mile race, 100 mile race, like you might need to rotate shoes out because your feet start to swell

and maybe one shoe is gonna be uncomfortable. And there's a whole strategy around like how each human, their foot design, their foot shape, the way that they run will dictate what kind of shoes are gonna be best for them. Like even for me, like when people ask me like, Matt, what shoe should I get? I'm like, well, it just depends, because like it's subjective. Like what I like are gonna be best for them. Even for me, when people ask me, like, Matt, what shoe should I get? I'm like, well, it just depends,

because it's subjective. What I like is gonna be completely different than what you like or what might be good for your foot. So it's really individual. It's like a diet, right? It's like there's always some tried and true frameworks, but it's not a one size fits all approach. I think I saw a TikTok where you actually

changed shoes halfway through. I did. Okay, what was the reasoning for that? Was it an experiment? I think I saw a TikTok where you actually changed shoes halfway through. I did. Okay, what was the reasoning for that? Was it an experiment? Kind of. An experiment in the sense that I started feeling like just some nagging pain in the foot.

So sometimes even just switching out into a different pair of shoes with a different stack height, it can alleviate some of that pain. Because over the course of a hundred miles, like you're just like, you're continuing to step in different rocks on different terrains. So like it can like start to build up on like the pain. And sometimes when you just switch out your shoe, that's a little bit softer.

Something that maybe is a little bit firmer, like depending on what you might need in that moment, like it could maybe alleviate some of that discomfort. At the end of the day, like when you get to mile 60, 65, like you're in pain regardless of what she's doing. Yeah, you're like, it's going to hurt. It's going to hurt. But it's just like you try to get to, you know,

the next five miles, the next 10 miles, and you just keep moving forward. Do you prefer a road or a mountain? That is a great question, Mari. I feel like, and I'm coming from, like, do not deserve to have an opinion on this, but I feel like a road would be so boring. Like when I saw videos of you going through the mountain, I was like, that looks fun, because like the scenery is changing. It's, in the sense of the scenery, it's not even close. Yeah. When you're in the mountain, when you're in the trail, when you're in the trail, you're with Mother Nature.

You look around and it's spectacular. The view that you earn, it's way better than just driving to the summit. You know? In Colorado, you could drive to the top of the summit, but to walk up it, to hike up it, to run up it, that sense of satisfaction of getting to the top and saying, like, wow, I started all the way over there

and now I made it to the top. It's a reward that is, it's hard to quantify how that feels. Equally, New York City Marathon, Boston Marathon, some of these major world road races, the energy that the city provides is also something that's equally as special in its own way.

Like to see strangers, cheer on strangers that the city provides is also something that's equally as special in its own way. Yeah, true. Like to see strangers, cheer on strangers, and a city come together, and especially in a diverse city like New York and Boston, like it's amazing to see people rooting for each other when they don't even know each other. Yeah. And there's something about that

when you look at the human race of like, I think there's so much good in the world, and at times like mainstream media and a lot of people could look at the negatives. But I think when you go to those moments, you're like, damn, it's awesome to be alive in the sense that like, look at this, like you have all these people that are just one 50,000 plus people trying to attempt the marathon. And then all these other hundreds of thousands of other people cheering them on. It's like it's like, how does that not put a smile on your face?

So special. It really is. There was like a little marathon. I don't want to call it a marathon. I forget what it was, but a run in Austin. What was that called recently? Not the 10 K. It was a 10 K. Yeah.

And I think it was like the first sort of run I'd witnessed. And it was like right by my house. So I walked down the street to go cheer people on and I was like, oh my God, this is so cool. And like, I don't know if you know Kenny Hansen. I do. He ran past and he gave us a hug and he was like so sweaty and I was like, go Kenny Hansen. The DeChicos are going past our friends. And I was like, oh my god, like really cool experience. And I've seen the New York City marathon and that was insane. And I could just see the positivity in the running community, it makes me kind of jealous. Like it makes me want to run.

Like the vibes of that. We got to get you into Austin. I know, I'm scared, it's not really my thing. Mari, it's no one's thing to start. I know, I knew you were going to say that. I literally knew you were going to say that. So that's why you and I are going to have to do the, we have to do the miles still.

I know you requested that. I requested that. I'm now like demanding it. You're gonna be really disappointed in me. I have not been disappointed in anyone because every single time I've done that challenge with people who are always like, but man, I'm so slow or I'm not gonna be able to do this.

Every time we go faster than what they think they can do. I'm so slow. Like. Slow is subjective. Okay. We're gonna make that happen. But am I like talking the whole time? You're not talking at all.

I'm talking to you just to kind of like create commentary. But you're like, I'm talking at you. You're not gonna speak any words. Like I might throw up, but like that's good content. That would be good content. And that would also be the first because no one's thrown up yet. You know what?

I probably won't throw up. You're not gonna throw up. I'm being dramatic. Like that's a lot. Okay. I'll do it. I will. I'll actually do it.

I'll handshake right now. You guys saw that here. I'm doing it. Okay. My other questions. I'm very big on nutrition. Yes. And I'm so curious how many calories you eat every day.

So it's funny. I actually haven't tracked in a very long time. Okay. My buddy, Zach, I actually haven't tracked in a very long time. My buddy Zach who has, he's a macro guy. I actually had a chat with him recently, I'm like, bro, what are your thoughts on like how valuable or important would it be for me to like, maybe just like track for like a little while, maybe during like a training block. And he was like, I mean, it just depends.

Like, obviously for me, like I'm not really really training for, like, aesthetic. It's more for performance. So, like, for me to stress about every single, like, calorie in, calorie out, or every macronutrient, like, yeah, maybe it's just like that extra time. Like, could that be even more stressful than just to be like, hey, like, let me eat off, like, kind of intuitively, you know? Totally. So right now I'm probably eating, if I guessed, anywhere from 3,500 to 4,500 calories probably. That was my guess.

Because I'm burning, I mean, now sometimes I'm working out twice a day, running in the morning, kind of hitting weights in the evenings. And even for me, I've basically been at my weight for the past three to five years. I have not really fluctuated much, even after some of these major efforts.

My body kind of balances itself out. So it's almost like you intuitively know how much you need to be eating. Yeah, like I think I'm looking at protein intake and carbohydrate intake. Those two are the most. And definitely getting a gram per pound of body weight for protein. And in carbohydrates, I think actually recently I've talked to a couple of my buddies that are in the food space. They're like, you could actually probably consume more carbs just because I'm burning so much of glucose when I'm running, especially early in the morning.

Yeah. So now I've kind of like, I just like as I've, I go on it also like how I feel like energy-wise, right? Like working out twice a day and like trying to like show up for content and like doing all those things. Like it does like kind of burn energy quickly. So for me, it's like as long as I'm not like burning out and I'm like, sleeping well, like I look at like a lot of these things where it's like, I want to make sure like every day, like I have high energy without having to need a lot of other caffeine or other

self things that are going to like push that over the edge, you know? Are you looking for something simple and delicious to add to your wellness routine? Honey is the perfect thing to add to toast, tea, protein shakes, salad dressings and more. Manukura puts all other honey to shame. It's rich, creamy and the most delicious honey you've ever had. It's ethically produced by Manukura's master beekeepers in the remote forests of New Zealand. It contains powerful nutrients to support immunity and gut

health. They really say honey is like nature's superfood. I put a little bit on my sourdough toast every day and I see so many benefits. Plus, it's so good. The bees collect the nectar from the Manuka tree in New Zealand. The nectar is packed with bioactives and the honey that is produced has three times more antioxidants and prebiotics than your average honey. A special antibacterial compound called MgO also comes from the nectar of the tea tree. Manukura third party tests every single harvest for MgO and makes these results available through their QR system. All you need is one heaped teaspoon each morning

to get the most out of the bioactives. Now it's easier than ever to try Manukora honey. Head to manukora.com slash pow to get $25 off the starter kit, which comes with an MGO 850 plus Manuka honey jar, five honey travel sticks, a wooden spoon, and a guidebook. That's manukora.com slash pow for $25 off your starter kit. A couple of days ago, Greg decided to take a look

at my subscriptions on my phone. And we realized I'm subscribed to so many expensive apps that I don't use, which was a big reality check and an embarrassing reality check. And that's why I'm obsessed with rocket money. Can you name every single subscription you have? I clearly can't and I know I'm not alone. I just learned that over 74% of people have subscriptions

they've forgotten about. With Rocket Money, I don't have to remember all the subscriptions I'm forgetting about. I can see them all laid right in front of me. Rocket Money is a personal finance app that helps you find and cancel unwanted subscriptions, monitors your spending and helps you lower bills so you can grow your savings. I feel like so many of us are saving up whether it's for the holidays,

for vacation, whatever it may be. And this is such a great way of putting money back in your pocket. Rocket Money has over 5 million users and has saved a total of $500 million in cancel subscriptions, saving members up to $740 a year when using all of the app's features. Stop wasting money on things you don't use. Cancel your unwanted subscriptions by going to rocketmoney.com slash pow.

That is rocketmoney.com slash pow, rocketmoney.com slash pow. Do you eat before the morning run or after? This is a hot take. I eat after. Yeah. Okay. I like it after. I just drink water in the morning and then like I'll have some greens and then immediately when I come back, I don't even drink coffee before.

Like I'm a coffee after the run. I'm the same way. Yeah. I don't know. I just like I wake up anxious. That's why. Really? Yes. I wake up anxious, that's why. Really? Yes. Fair, fair.

I wake up like, oh my God, what's wrong? Cause I need to get my workout in to calm my thoughts and then I can go about my day. I feel the same way. And then do you also feel like when you run, you don't wanna have a full stomach almost? 100%, I think I've just gotten so used to running fasted where it's like, I'd just like earn the calories after.

And it's not even about the calories, it's just like I'd rather like not, I wanna create the least amount of friction before me waking up and stepping out the door. You know? And I think even doing coffee, like that little five minute friction, like making a quick little bite to eat,

like even if it's just oatmeal or something, I know it's quick, but like I'd rather just like consume that right when I get back. And it's kind of like the Huberman thing of consume the caffeine 90 minutes after you wake up. And after my run, it's always roughly two hours after I wake up, so it's a perfect time to get the caffeine. And I like the fact that I don't need a lot to get my body moving in that sense, you know?

Like, it's like, the coffee's not like a motivator for me to go run. It's just like, no, I can earn it when I get back. Yes, it's more rewarding to have it afterwards. 100%. Are you always running on the Lady Bird Lake Trail? Honestly, no. Oh, I thought you always were. No, I live like right, I live in like South Congress.

If you live in Austin, you know. Don't stalk Mount Troy. Yeah, I mean, you might just be able to see my Strava map, which I do. It's probably not good. Nonetheless, but when I run from home, I just run down South Congress and then I come back. On the weekends, I like doing the Town Lake Trail just because it's kind of nicer to switch it up. And it's like, you know, there's loops that I can run. But sometimes even just, it's not like it's a far drive to get to Town Lake,

but I like the aspect like I'm already gonna be so sweaty. It's like, I'd rather just like start my run at home and at home I can get in the cold plunge and like yeah start my morning, right? Okay, so I typically run from home and then on like once a week twice a week I'll do speed workouts on a track. So then I do drive to a track back to the food. Yes and ultra marathons Mmm, how okay from my perception, I'm like picturing you running day and night. And I'm like, when is this guy eating?

When are you going to the bathroom? Are you pooping your pants? Like these are real questions that I have. Legitimate questions. Yeah. For Leadville, for 24 hours and 48 minutes that I was running, I actually did not poop. Why?

I went, I just didn't have to. Okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah, and it's not like I was holding it in. I went right before, and then I obviously just like went to the bathroom to like to pee a couple times throughout the race. Yeah. Do you pee your pants or do you pull over?

No, I just pull over. I mean, you're in the nature, so it's kind of like- I know that some people when it's like an intense race, they'll just pee their pants. I mean, Mari, I've seen people pee and poop their pants. Like- That's the detail I want. Like give us the gory- All right, let me give you this detail. When I was in Sydney, Sydney Marathon, I'm mile 23 of 26. And there's this lady that's in front of me. And like, I just like,

maybe she's like 15 yards in front of me and I just start like whiffing like a very bad smell and my brother is typically filming for me on a bike and I'm just starting to whip, I'm like, yo, what is that? And I just look ahead and this lady just had poop literally down her leg going into her like sock and in shoe and she just kept moving like she did not stop. Wow. I literally was like I looked at some I'm a brother I told my brother I look at it's like I pointed I'm like oh my god and

like she's and I had so much respect for her because like she's still like getting after she's moving. That's gritty. It's gritty as hell. Yeah. But like I honestly I ran a little faster so I can get out of like the proximity of that smell. But I've seen so much shit, literally and figuratively, no pun intended, on a course. And I think in ultras, it's even like, it's not that it's worse, it's just that the grit level is higher in ultras. Like I've seen women like literally pee standing up, just like up their leg. Yeah, I think like there's so much more It's just like you're already going through so much suffering. You're in pain. You don't care. You just don't care totally

It's just like let's get this out the way literally. It's that mentality isn't there like a famous My husband Greg wanted me to ask you this there's a guy who ran the New York City Marathon who pooped his pants And it was like a big thing He ran the Boston Marathon. His name is Davis Clark. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah He's a he's a cool dude out of out of Boston actually Massachusetts Um, okay, he's super cool. Like I mean I got a chance to meet him in Boston actually He's a really good dude Um, but he ran a sub 3 marathon and like he pooped him pooped his pants and at the very end He literally goes

Boston Marathon or sub 3 marathon or and I pooped myself. And like he showed the poop, but like low key Mario was kind of like disturbing. Like it was like a little bit of blood, too. I don't know if that was like chafing in addition to pooping himself. But like, honestly, it looked unwell. You're like, it was cool. And then we saw the blood and now we're and then I'm like, I'm like, well, people in the comments are kind of like, are you OK, man?

Like slightly concerned. But yes, he got he's like really popular in the in Boston. You see, I think he's in finance. OK. But yeah, yeah, he's a good. That's so random. It's a good mate. Finance guy. OK. OK. And then food on the go. I did see a tick tock of you like shoving foods in your mouth. I think you were like blueberries. This. Yeah. Yes. Yes. So in Leadville, you know, being at altitude, one thing I found that I struggled with was like eating on the run. So what a lot of runners will do is like every hour you're trying to get like roughly 300 to 350 calories in. Okay. And obviously

mixing that in, whether it's, you know, saltier foods like chips, gels, like performance gels. Honestly, peanut butter and jelly, like literally liquid fluids, like whatever you can consume just to make sure that you're staying on top of nutrition. Ultras are one of those things where you kind of have to find what works for you because your stomach's going to be not loving the fact that you're moving and eating at the same time. I found that I was struggling to consume every hour on the hour while I was running at altitude.

So when you the video that you saw was me at an aid station. So basically, like 100 mile race, like you'll have an area where you can pit stop every seven to 12 miles, depending on the course. So when you that the video that you saw, I was basically with my crew and they had a bunch of options for food. Because like you don't know how you're gonna feel right? It's like you might want something saltier because you're

sweating out so much salt or you might need something that's sweeter. So like people like chocolates or candy like something that is going to like hit that palette from but in that moment, like I was just like I need calories. So like, it was like potato chips like ginger ale, just because soda is a really quick way to get sugar and calories in. And then like peanut butter and jellies, or we had some breakfast tacos, just like a variety of stuff. I want to say something that really got me through was ramen.

Just because ramen high in sodium, high in carbohydrates. And it's just like something warm while you're just like running and consuming like gels. It's nice to have something warm. Like even like bone broth is like a nice thing to have just cause it's like, it's denser. But yeah, food during an ultra is a, it's a challenge for a lot of people. Like I'll say this, like the runners that are winning,

they pretty much only eat gels. Like literally like, you know know like the little gel packets? Yeah, I know what they are but what's in it? It's just sugar. Just straight sugar. It's sugar and like depending on which ones you get like there's different there's obviously some sodium in there as well. You're getting some salts, but a lot of it and electrolytes. But a lot of it's just like sugar.

Does it taste good? I'm assuming yeah. It tastes alright. It tastes okay. Okay. Like it's not like you're not going to be like, oh, midday snack, a gel. It's just fuel. It's literally just fuel. Okay. And typically sugar is the fastest absorbing.

It's like the fastest absorbing. It's like, yeah, you can actually digest that and every hour on the hour or every 30 minutes you consume one of those and like that's how people get like each of those packets are probably 100 calories. Okay, got it. So you need to have three in an hour. Yeah, like two to three of them in an hour Okay, got it. If that's all you consume who is like the top ultra marathon runner. So Courtney DeWalter is one of the top ultra marathons. Is she the Colorado blonde girl Colorado blonde girl

We're super long basketball shorts. Yes She's okay. She's also like the sweetest like I I got a chance to meet her at Running Man and she's so kind. Like just like a sweet. She actually lives in Leadville. So she trains in that town, which the altitude probably helps. Right. It's an endurance. Like it's an endurance runner's dream to basically be able to live and train out of there. She's one of the probably the top female and male on it's like she smashes a lot of the records.

Wow, David Roche who ended up winning in Leadville at 15 hours. Like he's also now kind of coming into the scene as like a bigger name and there's honestly like there's a few others that are like Sally McCray is also a pretty popular ultra marathoner. The thing is Mari Mari, honestly, most people don't really know the ones that are winning. That doesn't surprise, I know. And it's funny that I did because Greg and I went through a phase of watching ultra marathon content,

honestly, and that's how I know who that is. But like, yeah, there isn't much like glory in it or like public celebration in it. It's like very, very minimal. Like even the ones I named, like I only know them because like they also understand that content and media is important. Yeah. And their storytelling around these these challenges that they're doing because ultimately like even marathoners aren't like like if you think about a marathon, like marathoners aren't making a lot of money off of winning. Right.

Like they have to win to then earn a sponsorship. And even then, if they don't value media and content, like it's hard for them to actually build a business around their personal brand. Like they're just trying to win these crazy races to then earn Nike or Adidas as a sponsor. But like, ultimately there's not a lot of money in road running.

I was gonna ask you about this, and for anyone who doesn't know, Matt has a very large platform, big content creator. I feel like content is a huge part of what you do. 100%. Is that how, and I'm assuming this is what you do full-time. Is that how you support your running passion? 100%. It's through the content.

100%. Okay. I always say this, I feel like I'm a media company and then a runner, an athlete. Right. Yeah. Because like if I don't focus on content and like, I'm not going to be able to to do this as like a full time job. People think running is my job. I'm like, I'm not winning races. I go out here just like because I'm like, it's like it's a it's become

an obsession and like a hobby. But like, like no brand is paying me to win. They're paying me for some form of influence to the community of like, hey, if Matt wears a certain shoe or if he talks about a certain shoe, like that is value add for that brand. Right. Right. But for me, it's like I'm not making money because I win races because I haven't never won a race. Right. So I think it's it's why I get a little pushback

from like the elite runners, because there's a lot of elite runners that are some of the fastest athletes in the world that you and I don't know. Because they don't know how to build a personal brand. Well, it's just, it's not what they value, right? Because like they're training 24 seven. And they don't, it's not that they don't see the value.

They might not think that they're interesting. They might not think that people will relate to it. Like, and some athletes, elite athletes have started to do it because they understand or their team does. Yeah. Because realistically, you with with an elite athlete, you they probably need a team. I was going to say someone needs to follow them around.

Right. Because like it's something that they they're not going to prioritize filming themselves while they're running. Right. It's distracting. Gets in the way. It impacts performance. Bekkah Yeah. And I also, what I love about your content, and I think it's really interesting, is you would assume that your content has a lot to do with the physicality of being a runner and the athleticism, which it definitely does.

But I also feel like you're so big on mindset. And I definitely want to talk about mindset. Yeah. What are some things you do every single day to hone in on that discipline and keep yourself going? I think the first couple things like in the morning, like I started doing the Wim Hof method about two years ago after I read his book and that's been like a practice now, like even before I touch my phone or like before I brush my teeth, like I literally do three rounds of the Wim Hof. And that I think is just like it grounds me in the sense that like, I think it's so easy in our world now where it's like, everyone wants to get stimulated. There's devices, there's TV, there's so much things that are distracting most humans.

And I think when you start just like focusing on your breath and your own inner voice and following a daily discipline, something that you can continue to do no matter what the environment is, that has been something that has been profound in my morning routine. I think as I've gotten further with even my own mindset, I think the more now as I go on pods and I talk about, because people always ask me,

I feel like, and what people think about me like, like you, I feel like, and what people think about me is like, like how do you like seem like you're so positive or like so like optimistic? And I think for me, a lot of it is grounded in gratitude and knowing that like, the fact I get to do this is like a blessing, right? And I honestly like try not to like forget about that.

Like if you look at a marathon, there's so many people, especially towards the middle and the back half, that whether they're in wheelchairs, or whether they're blind, or whether they lost a limb, the fact that we have bodies that are capable of even just walking and moving is such a blessing. And then for me, I never feel like I work.

My work has become so much of a blessing where it's like, I get to kind of just live and document the things I'm doing, and then that becomes the quote unquote work. But I think not stressing too much about getting validated from other people has also helped my mental sharpening. Right. Because I think at times when people especially getting get into content, like, it's almost like you're putting yourself out there. And if you do it for the wrong reasons, you seek validation from the wrong places. And for me, like when I go to a race, when I do a challenge,

it's not necessary to prove people like, oh, Matt can do these things or Matt could run a sub three. Like I'm just genuinely curious if I can do it. And if I can't Mari, like I'm not beating myself up, like you're a failure. How could you like, oh my God, like your training program was F'd up

or you didn't follow this. It's like, no, it's like, sometimes it's your day or sometimes it's not. And I think the fact that we can continue to take that lesson, even if it's a failure or not, and then go try it again. Like, you have nothing to lose. Like, I get so like, I tell people, I'm like,

don't get so caught up in like running such a fast time that you forget the fact that like you're doing a marathon. Yeah, no such a big point. So many people get caught up in it. I'm like, dude, you did a freaking marathon. Like who cares if you were off your personal best time by three minutes. Right. Like don't be so butthurt about it.

Like I think showing up lightly and not putting so much pressure on yourself. And like, like where like that's not pressure, right? Like running a fast marathon time. It's like, I think sometimes people get too caught up in that. Such a great lesson. And I think that could apply to so many different things. What about running has changed the way you live your life in general? Hmm. I think. Well, one, it definitely like it.

It gives me something that continues to help me learn. Yeah, because I was such a poor student, I found that like, gives me something that continues to help me learn. Yeah. Because I was such a poor student, I found that it was just the fact that I was not interested or I wasn't stimulated in the things I was learning. Now, I feel like one of my biggest missions is just to always be a student. And it's why when I'm in rooms with people

or I have conversations with people that like, and it doesn't even have to be someone that's more successful or less successful. It's just like, we can learn from anything from anyone as humans. And I think the thing about running is that every time I do it, I'm able to take something out of it. And even if it's like a glimpse of like, oh, the fact that this morning I felt a little bit stronger

because it's starting to get cooler in Austin, and it's not as hot and humid. Today was nice. Today was beautiful in the morning. Yeah. Even something as small as that, it's not as hot and humid. Today was nice. Today was beautiful in the morning. Even something as small as that, it's like, oh, running is like a constant learning opportunity. Because no matter what race you do, no matter what challenge it is, even if it's not a race, there's something you can get out of a run because it's going to hit you in a different

way, no matter how many miles that you've done. So I think that has then translated into, you know, the business or content and other things where I'm like, oh, like, just because you've had some small successes, or you've put some wins on the board, like, like not to get comfortable. Yeah, no, I love that. And I would imagine when you're running as much as you do, do you kind of get into a head space, like a meditative place where you're kind of running

through your thoughts or what you're going to do for the day or kind of sorting things through in your mind. A hundred percent. Yeah, I've rarely ever bring headphones and listen to music. Huh? Yeah. So it's like it isn't it's exactly that where it's like, it's my first meeting with myself. Right? Like I think like, I mean, I pretty much live off the Google Calendar, but like that meeting

to me is the most important. And it's, to your point, an opportunity for me to think about what is, what's the focus for the week, or what do I have to tackle? What's important, what's happening in this week that I might need to put some more creative energy into? And also, even just on the content creative side, it is an opportunity for just to flush through ideas. And then you go on a run with someone, it's like it is an opportunity for just like to flush through ideas. And then you go on a run with someone, it's like you have that opportunity where you're like, you can mingle with them and like you can chat with them.

Like most people that I meet now, it's like if someone wants to meet with me, I always say like, you either come run or you come sauna. Like those are where like I have meetings with people is like, and it's somewhat of a challenge for whether someone has their fitness to do that or not. But it's cool because it creates no friction for me. I'm already going to be doing this.

It would help me and serve me better if you can actually fit it into this thing. And obviously I still have meetings where I'm not doing that with some people. But that's always a fun one when people know, if I can run, then I probably can run with Matt. You know, at some point, it might not happen every day, but there's an opportunity for it in the future. Totally. My husband does the same thing. He's very routine. He's the CEO of Blooms. He's super busy.

And he's like training for two hours. He's more of a bodybuilder. He doesn't really run as much. But he is actually a pretty good runner. He's like 220 pounds. I think I've seen him before. Yeah, he's jacked. Large man. Like sometimes he comes back when he tries running and he's like, I don't think I'm built for this. It's like probably not, but it's awesome that he's doing it.

His little arms, not little arms, his big arms are like dinosaur vibes, but he likes for people to join him for a workout or sauna with him or just like be a part of his routine that exists already. Because when you're busy and your performance focus, like you kind of need people to do that for you. Yeah, it's like it creates the least amount of friction. Yes, totally. So advice for people who, I mean, kind of like me,

who are like, I could never run, I can't even do a mile. How do I get started? Like, what would be your piece of advice? I mean, kind of like me, who are like, I could never run, I can't even do a mile. How do I get started? Like, what would be your piece of advice? The first advice I would say is never say you can't do anything. I think that would like truly is like the start, right? It's like, if you keep telling yourself that, then you're right. It's true.

It's the reality of what you're telling yourself. And it will be the reality of your ability to do that or not. So I think it starts with the mindset around like, oh, just being curious enough to try. Right? And I think then the next step is like, okay, someone's actually like,

all right, man, I'm willing to go do it. Then it's a matter of like, not biting off more than you can chew. So many people get excited and they're like, oh my God, I wanna go do this thing now. I wanna go do this half marathon. and they probably train too aggressively to start without Allowing their body to adapt to the stimulus of running Hmm

so I think a good thing to do is like maybe ask yourself like what can I actually like stay disciplined and consistent to it? Let me just try to run twice a week along with the other types of forms of fitness that someone is doing but like if you've run twice a week, along with the other types of forms of fitness that someone is doing. But like, if you've run twice a week, maybe three times a week, like, not going crazy with how much you're going to run, but maybe just setting a goal of like, can I just try to do like two to three miles? And maybe that's extreme for some. And then it's just saying, can I just do one mile? Like, for some people, you might just have to

walk jog, or like one mile, and then maybe you walk for a minute, you jog for a minute. Yeah.. And like that could be a great starting point. And now like from there, you can progress it as much as you need to based on how difficult that one mile is or that two to three miles. But I would say start small, reassure yourself and change the way that you speak to yourself. Because I think that's really important,

not even in just running, but in life, right? I think it's super critical, and it bleeds into so much else of who we are. The more you remove can't or never in your vocabulary, the quicker you realize that these things are possible. Yeah, speak it into existence. 100%. I like the baby step method.

I think it's much more approachable for people. I say that with weightlifting too. Just show up a couple times a week and add to it from there. I want to talk about your content because as you said, you kind of are like a media company also. What was your goal when you first started making content? Was it just like, I want to document the running, I want to give like mentality advice advice. What was the goal? The initial goal, Mari, was, I was still working corporate at the time,

I had this sales job, and I was reading a bunch of Gary V. Oh, yeah. I read the book, Crushing It. So the initial goal, Mari, was just like, I liked the thought process of, oh, the attention is on these platforms and on the devices, and that you could potentially get paid for doing something you enjoy.

That was the initial just very broad thought of, oh wait, I love football, I love training. If I could make money doing that and making some videos online, shit, that would be the dream for me. And that's kinda how it started, I then built an online training business and I started training local football players

in the area that me and Piana grew up. And then from there, I was like, okay, like, oh, like let me, now I just started getting more comfortable with the idea of what it means to be a creator, what it means to produce content, not just to consume it. As that kind of went further on, I then understood like, okay, I understand media at some capacity. At that point, Mario, I had like maybe 2,000 followers.

I didn't really understand it. I was just doing it though. Yeah. It's like someone that doesn't know how to go to the gym. Like they don't know what they're doing in the gym, but they, for whatever reason, keep showing up. Yeah, I think that's the most important part. 100%.

Genuinely, even if you're making crap content, just keep going. Because you're over time, we'll learn. Yeah. And you'll start to see different trends or different ways for you're over time will learn. Yeah. And you'll start to see different trends or different ways for you to communicate what you want. Yeah. And for me, that was the initial goal.

And then when the pandemic hit, I got laid off as a trainer. So then I'm like, you know, originally my goal is I wanted to have a gym. Like most trainers, they're like, I want to open up a gym and have a facility. But then I quickly realized, I'm like, there's probably not,

that's probably not the best business model. If you want to think about like overhead or minimizing risk. And I'm like, Oh, I can create an online business where like, I could just have content be the distribution and have that be what generates income. And I'm like, okay, so then I went into let me start doing different challenges and document that. And that's how I got into the running. So like now, even with my content now, like I think my goal is to share case and document my lifestyle and have that be what then generates revenue. And for me, that's what I've done the past couple years.

Now, granted, like there's still more things I want to accomplish. And like even looking at what you've done with Boom, like there's like, obviously ambition. I would love to have a product in the future, but in the current state, it's not my main priority. Like I want to grow my distribution and build trust in my audience and keep building it in that fashion. And down the line, like I think the beautiful thing with content, even with your question, like for a lot of people, you're not going to know exactly what it is in the beginning.

Yeah. But you have to have enough confidence in yourself to just get the ball rolling because the opportunities and doors are gonna start to open that you never could have thought. I never thought Austin was gonna be a door, you know? But me just kind of working through that muscle the first couple years of just continuing to show up, then kind of created this door to open. And I think for a lot of people,

they think that they need to have A through Z planned out where if you actually realize even the most successful people in the world don't even have A through F, like so at everyone's trying to figure it out. So I think, yeah, 100%. Starting is the hardest thing. And it's what most people need to do. Yeah. It's the moment where people get intimidated. I was at Harvard this past weekend, and these young women who are interested in business, a lot of them were asking me, how do I start posting content? Like, how

do I know if people will like it? How do I know if this and I'm like, you got to stop asking permission, like, you know what value you have to add. You don't have to be super qualified. Just start talking about it. Like, you know what you're good at. You know what you have expertise in. The only reason I have a business is because I just started talking on a camera, literally, and sharing like, oh, I'm really struggling with this. Oh, I figured out this. This is a recipe for this. Like, my content was so crazy. Like, I look back and I'm like, what? I was going through it on camera.

But like, that's what worked. Like people were listening and could relate to me. And then I made a PDF guide for $5 and that escalated from there. Like you really never know. And I think, as you said, I think people get intimidated by successful people and thinking they have it all figured out.

Most people don't even know what they're doing. They're just kind of like throwing it at the wall and being like, I hope this works. You know what I mean? 100%. And it's just about the people who are willing to like push through the embarrassing hard part. 1000%.

You know? So now with your content, I have like detail questions. Like, because guys go look at Matt Choi's content. He's like running. There's like a lot happening. You're doing boobies on a track like there's so much going on like who is Filming and it's your brother, right? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah a lot of the running like it's running content itself

Like I've been super fortunate to have my brother and you know in Austin actually he's recently gonna move So like now I need to find someone who's gonna kind of replace that. Where's he going? He's going back to Virginia actually because he's got a new job in Virginia and him and his girlfriend are gonna move so like now I need to find someone who's gonna kind of replace that. Where's he going? He's going back to Virginia actually because he's got a new job in Virginia and him and his girlfriend are gonna move there so it's like a really good opportunity for him. It's kind of like a for me it's like a little bit of a hit too but like I also knew that it wasn't gonna be a forever thing for us to kind of you know keep doing that. So you got to find someone fit to keep up with you and film and with a steady hand. Correct. So like the thing is like we have an electric bike and that's actually how my brother is able to record a lot of it

Okay, because obviously when you're running like to your point if you if someone else is running like the camera super shaky If someone's on an e-bike, there's a little bit more stabilization. So the shot is more sharper. It's cleaner So to your point Yes like I'm gonna have to find now kind of like that replacement. And my brother will still come on like bigger trips if we plan it accordingly, where like he has enough time in advance to kind of schedule it out.

But it's obviously been, he's been a serious weapon for me in the media side of just having someone that's like available to do that. But yes, it's typically on a bike as I'm running around. That's how I'm able to capture the shot for the media. For an ultra marathon where you're like in the mountains for hours. Are you just doing it yourself at that point? Yeah, it's just a little bit more challenging. I mean, I'll definitely just go POV and just kind of film it myself, whether

it's for YouTube or Instagram. And there's certain parts of the mountain though that like my media team came up and they also climbed, which like praise all of them because like obviously that's a physical challenge and they're bringing all their camera equipment. And I mean, Mari, when you're climbing this is mountain and it's called Hope Pass and it's about it sits at like 12,500 feet of elevation. So you're at the summit of this thing and like you have guys that are like bringing their backpacks full of gear and like cameras and like they're struggling to get up to the top. Wow. And obviously, we got the shot that we needed. But like,

yeah, I gave them a big pat on the back. So I'm like, I know that it's it's it's a suffer fest. It's like filming a movie. Legitimately. And like you have to earn it right? Because like to get that shot to be up there, like, you can't just like send a There could be a drone, but you need to have other shots. And the best way to get up there is by foot because you can't bring a bike up there. It's too steep. How big is your team? The team now on the media side on YouTube, we have two people on the YouTube team. When it comes to shorts, it's just me and one other editor. And I still honestly push out a lot of content on myself. I really believe in just staying as lean as possible, right?

Like there's obviously certain things. Like I knew early on that like YouTube production wasn't gonna be my thing. So like that was one of the most important finds for me was like having someone that can handle that workload. Because like I'm okay making a quick reel. Like I could take making a quick reel. Like, you know, I can take like a quick 30 second. Cap cut. Yeah, really quick.

But like, to work through a whole YouTube edit is like. It's a lot. It's a commitment that, it's a lot. It's a lot. I did it for a while and I actually love editing. Do you? Yes, but the YouTube videos, I would, let's say I filmed for a day.

It would take an additional two to edit it. 100%. It's a bigger beast to tackle. But yeah, and then I have a ghostwriter that helps me with the written word and stuff, and just some legal account members and things like that, but media-wise, I'd say it's about a three-person team. I just thought of something I really wanna ask you.

Please. It's a little bit controversial, guys. Actually, it's not controversial. Have you seen this like, um, exposure on TikTok of people fake running? What do you mean fake running? Okay, so it's good. Not just girls. I'm sure it's like all types of people, but like, they film themselves and they're like mile one, and then they're like mile two, and they get to mile 10. And they're

like, Whoa, that was hard. And then they go inside and everyone's like calling people out for fake running. I've heard and seen some of this. Is that real? Like, are they actually fake running, you know? I don't, I can't, I'm not gonna speak on it because I don't actually know more, but like I can imagine, because like low key,

like some of the videos that popped off for me to start was that, it was that concept of like like Mile one and then the time yeah, but like obviously if you go on my Strava and like that's like truly the best way to kind of like cross like a Examine I guess if like someone is BSing or not. Yeah, but like It would be so easy to do that technically, right? Like one all day to mile 20 and then you only ran like for 10 minutes. I would feel so shitty doing that.

I agree. I mean, it's like, I think it's because we're like disciplined and committed people, but like some people probably don't care. They just want views. Yeah. They're like, yo, if this is going to get me virality or if this is going to get me followers and people. I mean, nowadays with social, that's the one thing that kind of does suck is that people

will do anything for virality. Yeah, that's true. And like that's, I guess like a gift and a curse when it comes to the landscape of how developed social is now but um Yeah, what can you do? I know I just saw that the other day and I was like wait, that's crazy Yeah, I can see that happening. Yeah, it's a huge controversy on tiktok and they're in the running community that I'm in. Yeah Okay, wait, I do just want to touch on before we I know I have so many questions for you, but Austin run clubs have become this like sensation. And I kind of like I see them around like I knew it was a big deal.

Honestly when I moved I moved to Austin in March, I haven't been here that long. And when I first got here, I was like, damn, everyone is really in shape, like really in shape, especially on the trail like, damn, everyone is really in shape. Like really in shape, especially on the trail. Like, oh my God. So these run clubs though have become like dating clubs. Like what's the vibe with their Austin run clubs? Well, there's a variety of a lot of them. Okay. There's obviously the massive one, Raw Dog,

which is kind of like a dating club. Kind of like more for social. Raw Dog, Stop. Okay. I know the guys, they're good lads, they're good kids. I mean, they're super young. I mean, they've like, I think they've captivated an audience and I think it's great. I think to answer your question,

I mean, there's so many run clubs, there's a variety of them. It's kind of like different gyms, right? Like every gym has its own kind of style, right? So there's certain run clubs that are maybe more for the social aspect and truly just to meet people. Then there's other clubs that are like more serious about like, yeah, we're gonna do some proper workouts. Like this is really more for the love of running.

And then there's some that are kind of in between that like they run hard and they party hard, right? So I think now, and honestly, Austin has, I think there's like 70 to 80 different clubs. All of them will be different. They're not all dating clubs, but Rawdog, because of like the name and the exposure that it got, because some of the guys are creators, I think it's created this allure. And I know Chris Williams had that clip that kind of went crazy where everyone's like,

he said it's like, oh, wrong clubs are just a mask for dating clubs. I mean, there's truth in that, and there's also not some truth in that, in the sense that there's a lot of clubs that are truly just for the community, right? That it's a way for to meet people, yes, but it's also a way to get better at running, right? Because a lot of run clubs too is like,

it's a way to, if you're a beginner runner, to go maybe meet people that are more experienced. That if you do have these questions where like, man, I'm keep getting hurt, like I don't know what's wrong with my foot, or like I don't know how to like progress my long runs, or whatever questions like runners have. It is a good way to go meet someone

who's more experienced and learn from them. So, but the thing is Mari, like those clubs aren't as like sexy, right? Like people wanna go to the club where they're gonna see, like they might meet their future husband or wife or like they might go meet someone that they can become a good friend with. So I think asking yourself,

what are you looking for out of a run club is probably gonna be the important factor before you decide what run club you wanna go be a part of. And in a city like Austin, where there's so many options, if you go to a different city, Mari, like you might only have like five options. Yeah, Austin's kind of wild. Austin's wild in the sense that like everyone's so focused

on fitness and wellness and obviously running is so available here because of the weather. Yeah. We're almost, we're in October and it's 85, 90 degrees outside, like you go to, I'm going to Chicago this weekend for the marathon, like. You are? Oh my gosh. It's gonna be freezing there.

So exciting. It'll be fun. I'm just spectating, so I'm not gonna actually run. I'm just gonna, I'm gonna be chilling on this one. Interesting. Yeah. Cause you're recovering. I'm recovering and also I don't have a bit for this one, but I also like, you know,

I've now done so many of the majors, but you know, I'll say this, like the majors kind of for me are like, it's kind of like the Super Bowl. Like for runners, like Chicago, Boston, New York, these are like, and like the ones overseas internationally, they're major events. And it's good for me from a media standpoint to go out and just get content. Right.

So it's not a good point. It's not always about me running it. It's like the fact that I can go to a race and even like switch up the storytelling and change up the dynamic of like, oh, I can go get content and I don't have to physically put myself through a marathon is a major win. That's smart. That's really smart. And you can kind of really focus on one thing. 100%

Okay, final question. Love it. This is what I ask every single guest. What does wellness mean to you? Wellness to me means creating a sustainable lifestyle that could be repeated over time. And I think it's enjoying the process of it, right? I think for me, so much of my journey has been about like, not any one race or any end result, but like the process of it and enjoying that. Because I think if you don't enjoy that, like, wellness will be really hard to attain. It's something that should be sustainable and something that can be repeatable because truly like my goal is like I want to live as long as I can and to be able to

function and move my body as long as possible. So for me, a lot of wellness, I think if I put in one word is longevity. Such a great answer. Love it. I agree 100%. Matt, where can everyone find you online? You guys can find me on TikTok and Instagram, Matt Choi underscore six. And if you guys want to follow the YouTube, just Matt Choi. I want to follow the YouTube. You got to watch it. I want to get your feedback on the Leadville video that we produced. I didn't know about the YouTube, so I got to go find it. Yeah, check it out. I want to get you and your husband, your husband's take on it. Oh my God. Yeah. So we love ultra marathons. Thank you so much. This is a pleasure. Thank you so much.

Thanks for joining us on the Pursuit of Wellness podcast. To support this show, please rate and review and share with your loved ones. If you want to be reminded of new episodes, click the subscribe button on your preferred podcast or video player. You can sign up for my newsletter to receive my favorites at marielawelland.com. It will be linked in the show notes. This is a Wellness Lab production produced by Drake Peterson, Fiona Attucks and Kelly Kyle. This show is

edited by Mike Fry and our video is recorded by Louise Vargas. You can also watch the full video of each episode on our YouTube channel at Mari Fitness. Love you, Power Girls and Power Boys. See you next time. The content of this show is for educational and informational purposes only. It is not See you next time.