Quick Question with Soren and Daniel - QQ ep 30 - Pinot and Prudes

Episode Date: February 6, 2020

So, hello again and welcome to another episode of Quick Question with Soren and Daniel, the only podcast. I am one half of this show, Daniel O'Brien, writer for Last Week Tonight, writer of books, How to Fight Presidents, and your presidential fantasy dream team, dog owner of Jackson, President O'Brien, and that's it. Those are the only things that I am. God almighty. Soren, what are you? I'm Soren Bui. I write for the show American Dad.

And I'm the proud owner of a wife and son. Oh, whoops. What do you mean whoops? What happened? No, I guess we're going to leave it in. We're going to leave all of it in. This is a show we ask each other questions and give each other answers. And you, our listeners, come back, let's say week after week,

and you have your names that you prefer to be called, and they are, of course, the D.O. Beehive featuring the sore friends of Bowie and all the sons and daughters of baconator now wait a second what what part i mean you have to walk me through that okay so it's do beehive okay that's pretty clear yes got it sore friends of bowie what is that because like Soren is almost a sore friend. But like I didn't want to just say the sore friends because that sounds a whole lot like friends who are in pain. So I wanted to make sure that your last name was in there.

Okay. So it was clear. Got it. Sore Friends of Bowie. And then I originally wanted to do the Baconator Juniors, but I didn't realize that the smaller version of the Baconator was not Baconator Junior. It was the son of Baconator. Is it really?

Yeah, because it's Whopper Junior, and I suppose Wendy's wanted to distance themselves from the Whopper. So their smaller version of Burger is the son of Baconator. That's horrifying though you suddenly there's family involved that's right and they're all dead for our pleasure oh boy um but really i wanted to include bacon in our our fandom because he is a part of it now despite anyone's best efforts including his own he's got he's got a a fan base and and they've decided to call themselves the sons and daughters of baconator how do you feel about that bacon i feel i feel okay about that uh i'm getting i'm i know you guys are joking but i'm getting about one twitter follower

every three days whoa and now when i tweet something occasionally someone will like it and i like don't understand the uh i don't understand what what the people want for me because i don't think they're following me for something it's very funny to me because like people in in our itunes reviews who have given us five stars thank you very much all of you uh there are people who said we that they've they've missed soren and i talking together and that they are now also fans of bacon and it's like that's i i agree i'm also a fan of bacon's but but like in real life because you don't really have an online presence that that that does anything for anyone so I don't know what what what they are hoping to get out of following you on any platform and I'm

sure they're disappointed my Twitter activity is mostly like once every three weeks I'll tweet a George Wallace, retweet a George Wallace joke. That's it. Even all of his jokes, I only really find one of them very funny where he says so on and so forth in something that he shouldn't. It's very funny, but that's basically it. Maybe they're all just fans of George Wallace. That might be what it is. Yeah. If your Twitter handle was a request, Bacon, I feel like we've done that for you we have made you bacon yeah uh hey dan how's it going it's going all right i'm a little bit tired

i took a kickboxing class yesterday and i'm still a little sore and tired from that well i don't want to talk about that i want to talk about something else okay uh you you built some furniture i i followed instructions to build a piece of furniture okay but like what it you Well, I don't want to talk about that. I want to talk about something else. Okay. You built some furniture. I followed instructions to build a piece of furniture. Okay, but you didn't just use an Allen wrench though, right? Like you actually had some tools involved? No, I had some tools involved. And there are a couple of parts of this process that made me very excited. One of them was the instructions said, these are the tools you need that are not included

in the kit. And I was like, you know, I'm, I'm a step above Ikea furniture assembly now where they include all the tools that I could say, yes, I do have these tools that are not included. Don't worry. And not only do I have these tools, in fact, I have a screwdriver that I prefer, which, which felt very good and felt very adult because now I have multiple Phillips head screwdrivers and I can pick based on my mood or what I think the job requires. And that just felt like a very adult thing to do. And the other part of this, there was a part of a piece of furniture that was slightly damaged.

And I was on the phone with my brother, David, while I was assembling it, and mentioned the damaged piece of furniture, like this panel that I thought I was going to have to send back to the manufacturer. And he said, where did it come from? And I told him the company. And he was very excited at the company because he is very familiar with their return policy. And it's a really good one and a fair one and then we both got excited about the return policy of this company and i was like look at us look at how far i've come this is if this isn't being an adult then nothing is two 30 somethings excitedly talking on the phone about how fair this return policy is for this piece of furniture it's uh it's i've seen the piece it's really nice it's

a tv console it's like or a entertainment center and it's uh mid-century modern and it's got some good straight lines very functional yeah it's got it's got a splash of color in it which which is a little bit nerve-wracking to me because because everything in my i'm sorry has someone been dropping a marble for 35 minutes i just a pen just fell apart in my hands I'm sorry. Has someone been dropping a marble for 35 minutes? I just... A pen just fell apart in my hands and it has maybe 40 pieces inside of it. Let me tell you that every time we record, Soren strangles a pen in his hands.

The twist set, usually, he hasn't done it this time, usually he breaks the little cap thing piece off. So you can usually hear in most episodes that thing flies around. But boy, you have managed to unscrew all of the central parts of this pet. I can't put it back together. I'm just going to put it down. But at any rate, yeah, the TV console entertainment center has a splash of yellow in it which is which is uh a departure from my normal design style which is straight horizontal lines in either black or brown with with a wood theme to it and so now i just have

this this this very loud uh like kind of 70s yellow that is in my place and you know we'll see how i feel about it i think it looks pretty cool i kind of like it yeah i think it matches your carpet nicely you got some good contrasting colors you got a blue and blue carpet and yellow on the thing it looks good like a movie poster thanks man uh it it has nothing on the thing that you actually built that you posted on twitter recently oh yeah me yeah build as well no big deal um didn't know didn't know that's where this conversation was gonna go wow yeah much like um one of my heroes jesus christ i am a carpenter of sorts tradesman i i uh i do some wood crafting um right and i like to call it that because it feels more ethereal and like kind of like a witch-like.

Like I am working real magic with this wood. So to recap, you are idolizing your favorite witch, Jesus Christ. Yeah. Famous witch, Jesus Christ. Famous witch. Yeah. Okay. Great.

Okay. And so I made a hall tree. You know what that is? I mean, I do. I didn't know what a hall tree was either. Okay. Good. I knew that we moved into a new house and we needed an area next to the door where you

could sit down and put shoes on, but we also needed a place to hang stuff. And I thought, I think I've seen in houses before someone who had like a bench and in the back there was like a giant headboard maybe like six feet high and then along at our hooks and that is apparently called a hall tree and uh i found online some diy projects and i found one that i thought oh that looks like something that's in i could do that's there's no like joints or anything like that and uh followed it and built this thing that i think is really cool and neat and it looks beautiful and took a very long time it was very frustrating and at times i wanted to cry and now it's done it really

does i i i'm trying to pull up your tweet now because there's something specific that you complained about that you were going to just have to live with. And I'm so embarrassed that I didn't even know. There are the pocket holes on the sides. Pocket holes, yeah. What do you mean when you say that? To me, it looks like, and Bacon's going to put the link in the description below for this picture of this hall tree that you made. But to me, it looks perfect.

There's a top to it. There's a section that is just for your hats until Colleen finds a better reason for it to exist. There's hooks for all of your coats, this seated platform where you could put on your shoes and then well-organized shoes in this little sub shelf. And meanwhile, you mentioned something, some imperfection that we'd all have to live with,

but looking at it, I can't see what it could be. Yeah, so when you look at it, you don't see, the whole point of like a, if you make really good furniture, you shouldn't see any screws or nails or anything in it. And that's because for a lot of it, you're using what's called pocket holes, which are, you take a Craig jig,

which is something that you push the wood into, and then you can drill diagonally into the wood. So at any point you can drill diagonally so that it will come out the bottom. So if you're putting something together at 90 degrees, if you can put those pocket screws on the back so no one will see it or on the inside, then you can screw in diagonally and no one will see it or on the inside then you can screw

in diagonally and no one will ever see those at all okay and then but this sometimes just because of like the shape of the object or whatever you're making you can't you can't always hide all those and so there's some pocket screws on the side up on the that top shelf uh for the bracer on the side that i couldn't hide and so i had to fill them and i i rushed it and i didn't do a very good job of filling it and you can see that they're there i mean one one could see yes one could see if you're closer you'd be able to see it um yeah there's some there's some things about with it that i that you know you just gotta live with like i had to modify it the the directions online were actually even cooler and i had to modify it because i fucked it up um but it nothing makes

you feel dumber but also like more accomplished than doing a project like this because during it you fuck up in ways where you're like how did i how did i do that i'm such a dummy and then and then when you solve it you feel really good even assembling furniture that has like dummy proof directions just like staring the amount of time that i stare at a thing and hold two pieces of wood in my hand before i actually commit to inserting anything into anything but i'm still looking at it like okay it looks like this shelf unit goes up against this partition unit and i'm pretty sure this is the side that's supposed to be facing me but let me move my body and put the shelf where it would be in my apartment to make sure it still makes sense from this angle before i do anything there's a lot of staring and feeling dumb yes yeah awful out of that and the when i find like directions for these kinds of things

online i'd i won't ever i've figured it out now that i want i go to these sites that are like there's a good these women craftsmen who are like hey i build stuff in my spare time why don't you take a look this maybe you could build something like this probably that probably they're called craftswomen i bet i bet they're called craftswomen i bet craftspersons and uh i love their directions like infinitely more i've tried to follow some guys directions there's like there's a weird ego to it like where they're like they just assume you have these planers and things like that where you're like i don't fucking have that i don't know how to do any or like they'll their directions are not thorough but like the women are really encouraging and want to help you build this thing and that's right where i'm at and that's exactly

what i need and their directions are so vastly vastly easier to follow i came across uh a recipe from like a very male-centric website because normally i i i mean i haven't gendered any of the recipes that i've ever used before but this one it has some kind of name that is like beer and ammo cooking or something absurd like that where it's like aggressive horse shit and uh one of the like they they have the list of ingredients and then you're getting into the recipe of the step-by-step and there's a button you can click that i did not click but it was like this big bold thing that was like you don't need instructions click here and i was like what who's that for like i'm here because i need instructions and like like

i i wouldn't get like an extra level of pride by being like, no, I don't. Now that I have the ingredients, I could do whatever I want. Like you don't need to include the. The button that just says you got it, you fucking stud. Right. Then that's what there's like a weird element to that with the even in the comments, you'd see like somebody, a woman, this woman who I followed for this haltry. She had this great functional halt tree and the directions were easy to follow. And then in the comments,

people were like, I did a modified version of this, did this part with the split the legs instead. And I added another three quarters of an inch on the back of the shelf. Cause I think that's necessary. And there, but there, the way that they're describing it,

like the way that they're giving you their cut list and everything, it's, they're coming from a perspective of you will have the exact same amount of knowledge as I do about woodworking. Yeah. And no one ever has the exact same amount of knowledge. And it's they're coming from from a perspective of you will have the exact same amount of knowledge as i do about woodworking yeah and no one ever has the exact same amount of knowledge and it's like a weird dude thing to do yeah that does seem very male i'm also now i want to talk about i want to talk about a lot of things i want to talk about comments on things like this but i also want to talk about um as you're getting into woodworking are you or woodcrafting or uh witchcraft uh are you witchcraft all right are you in like um woodcrafting twitter

or or podcasting about specifically woodworking or anything like that? Like, are you, cause I'm like fully right. Seeking out fishing subcultures and recipes and like food cooking subcultures. Uh, are, are you at a point where you're digging into this separate culture of the internet? Yeah.

But in a very specific medium, like I don't want on Twitter, it's too much. Those guys like that. There's so much I don't know about woodworking. like i have a really good sense of what my ceiling is and it's it's higher than i think a normal person just because i've done it a few times because you built it right yeah but it's not i am uh i'm not there's so much about it that i don't know and i watch other people like i was thinking about making a little buffet table. And when I started to like look through cabinetry

and actually making something that can open and close, I was like, oh, this is, I'm out of my depth. I can't do drawers, things like that. But I will on YouTube, I'm all about it. On YouTube, I just watch a lot of woodworking and I watch people do things that's more like aspirational. Like I could never do. And I'm very excited by that.

But on Twitter, it doesn't, it's useless to me. It doesn't even make sense what they're saying. Yeah. It's just like this whole glossary of terms. I don't understand. Yeah.

Uh, Twitter is pretty bad. Like I wanted Twitter to have like a fishing Twitter in the same way that there's like an NBA Twitter and a comedy Twitter and a politics Twitter, which are things that like you, there's no one link that you can click to, but it's like, there's enough of a community around this that you can add them to your feed

and follow them when something important is happening that is relevant to this particular set of interests. But phishing Twitter, uh, as far as I know, overlaps with hunting Twitter, as far as I know, overlaps with hunting Twitter, which also overlaps in a very strong way with with MAGA country Twitter, in a way that like, I can't, I can't really follow a person who is fishing regularly without also then being exposed to MAGA tweets and stuff that I don't care to see.

Yes. But fishing YouTube is great. That's the thing. I think YouTube is maybe like the watering hole for that kind of stuff. I really love going and watching people do woodworking on YouTube also because I can see it. And I know even if they're not talking about the thing that they're doing, I understand it in a way where like somebody's doing vertical slats on a picnic table, right?

And they're cutting a bunch of pieces of wood all to match each other they're not only cutting it all exactly right but then they're they're clipping it all together and just sanding the top so that all the pieces are exactly the same height in a way where i was like i i would never have thought of doing that i would never thought of putting a belt sander on the end after um clamping all them together like getting exactly the same the exact same height and i was like oh that's that's nice i also wouldn't have thought to do that should we get into the show oh wait no i want to get back to no you're right yeah fuck the show the hall tree that uh that base that's's strong enough to support you sitting down and putting your

shoes on? Yeah, that's... Okay, so the bottom shelf, there's a bottom shelf and then like a seat on the bench. Yeah. And those are both plywood, which is actually a little bit stronger. And it's plywood, but it's on the sides, you can see that you can put this stuff called edging on, which is a little thin piece of wood that just covers the edge and you iron it on. Yeah, no, no, I get it.

Like you almost put the piece of wood on and like you get so close and like any minute now it's going to go on there and like you're fucking sweating. Like just put, you're so close, just put it on there. Just put it on there, just put it on there. And then like desert rain comes on. It's like, oh fuck, it it's gonna be a whole thing now but like maybe the end of desert rain you'll put it on but then you just don't and uh and then and then like the lights come on and it's time to go and like isn't that even better than putting

the piece of wood on there right is that what you're saying yeah yeah yeah yes god jesus dan yes yeah and you have to you have to iron it on yeah so you have like an iron out in your wood shop where you're like ironing on a piece of wood is this iron like the clothes iron that i uh i'm not gonna say i have but i should have uh exactly the same thing kind of thing okay yeah and and then you're just like whatever overhang there is coming off of the plywood you you shave off with a razor blade it's just you're not looking at plywood and if you look at a lot of tables and stuff now and you're just like whatever overhang there is coming off of the plywood, you shave off with a razor blade. It's just you're not looking at plywood. And if you look at a lot of tables and stuff now and you're just in your life, you'll see that it has this banding on it, this edging on it.

So that you don't see that underneath its particle board or that it's plywood. Anyway, pretty great at this stuff. Yeah. I love to hear it. I'm very excited about this. What's your next project? Do you know? Yeah.

I have to build a shop for my tape or a table for the, my now wood shop. Oh, that's fantastic. Yeah. Something I can work on top of that is exactly straight so that when i'm putting stuff together i'm not working on an uneven surface because that's something i realized i'd need i would love to commission a mini shoe shelf from you but uh you're two years behind to give me a birthday present so that's really something to look forward to for 2026 i think uh should we do the show now all right how long has it been 22 minutes yeah let's do the show um hey soren quick question yeah uh you have another baby on the way

you decided to name her danielle and i'm very flattered and middle name o'brien also very very flattered rare to have an apostrophe and a middle name, but, uh, earned, I believe. Uh, what is the biggest lesson from pregnancy number one that you've applied to pregnancy number two? Apart from naming strategy. I mean, I, while I think fuck you um yeah the so the first time that we did it we did it um we uh it was basically we got the the mayo clinic book and like there's these what to expect when you're expecting books that are kind of like the bibles of pregnancy and it's fun because it's like an advent calendar for pregnancy where every single week you check it again and you're like all right well let's see what's going on in there this week

oh she's getting eyelids or like whatever she's the size of some string cheese or like whatever whatever food they equate babies to because for some reason it's always food yeah and the first month it's just a piece of string cheese with eyelids that's right good those are the very first things that come um and uh you're very we're so excited and this time we aren't doing any of that but the things that uh i've tried to be better about is that i didn't realize how much kind of pressure i was putting on her to do these things that i assumed moms were just supposed to do like that when you get pregnant you cut out caffeine that you don't eat uh cold cuts or like sandwich meats uh because the threat of listeria i didn't know about that i

knew about uh caffeine alcohol and sushi but i didn't know about yeah like ham yeah ham soft cheeses like there's a lot of things that you're not supposed to eat and then also um there's there's like what like a mom will do like that you have to maintain like a very specific window of weight gain as you go that's the healthy amount of weight to gain like you're not supposed to under gain you're not supposed to over gain and like these types of things that were created i think with the best interest in mind of moms and for the baby, but actually probably not for the moms, for the baby, let's say. I don't think it was invented with the best interest of moms.

No, a woman gets pregnant and it's like, hey, this is your time. You're just eating for you. And a lot of this stuff is just kind of like based on some like bullshit that doctors got really excited about like getting the perfect mom to have the perfect pregnancy. And so like cutting out caffeine, there's not a lot of research around that and whether that's actually damaging or not. And so it's probably okay for women to have some coffee every once in a while. And even with alcohol alcohol there's like if a woman has a glass of wine occasionally imagine seeing a woman a pregnant woman drinking a glass

of wine just culturally hold on let me imagine it let me imagine it hold on okay it's uh let me just set the scene what am i wearing okay you're at a wedding you're there mine it's fun it's a little bit hot out no god damn come on okay you are you're not in the wedding but you were invited uh you were on the second tier so they invited everybody at first they found out who was coming what other empty seats they had then they did a second tier it sounds like no plus you're on that one i don't get a plus one they said you you called you asked they said they'd rather not you said you're seeing this woman and they said begrudgingly accepted that you could bring her okay okay all right you're there with her you look good though man yeah you got on some of the remnants of your emmy uh outfit okay i mean i don't know i don't

know how to take that like i like i wore a tuxedo right oh you've got on the socks okay good pair of socks you got on the you decided to do the same tie that you wore you're feeling good it's hot out and uh you're ordering a drink at the bar and as you're ordering a drink you look over and there's a woman having a conversation with somebody else and she's wearing a flower print dress but it's not doing anything to cover up like this this nine month she's like she's she's due any minute now like she had to buy this dress special to come to this event and she's having a glass of pinot noir out there in the sun and you in your head are thinking a white wine her oh okay that's what i'm thinking okay i imagine i

was thinking uh white wine is more appropriate like maybe no you're right okay let's change it no no no you said she's she's drinking pinot noir in the sun at a summer wedding uh that's what's happening yeah yeah well i mean she's i don't know what's going on the rest of her life that led to this moment um i mean she enjoys the tanning i have an idea of what happened nine months ago but other than that i'm i'm just as in the dark as you are not edging i can tell you that much um so she's uh she's drinking it and like culturally everyone around you is looking at you thinking what the fuck like you're not allowed to do that when you're pregnant you're not allowed to have a drink is she alone at the bar or is she like

talking to somebody i she's talking to somebody is it the bartender or she's talking to somebody else she's talking to your date okay well i was gonna ask like it looks like they're really hitting it off okay i see how this is turned i was going to leave my date for this woman and help raise this child but now i see that uh i i've i've once again been made a cuckold yeah and now oh your your day is tasting the pinot noir and really seems to be enjoying it and thinking this isn't actually that bad an idea on a hot day yeah i mean oh she handed you her wine oh and she's asked you to go take care of it yeah and and i i will dutifully and uh you know i i wouldn't want to be rude but like i have the the the ticket for the coat check for both of our coats and it doesn't seem like we'll be leaving together so how do i coordinate that with her because i don't want to ruin her

night you got to get them right wait yeah i guess have to. I'm going to like like tip the coat check person and be like, look, like I'm going to point to my date. She is the one who is laughing too hard at that pregnant woman's jokes and let the coat check person know that like here is her coat. She won't have a ticket, but remember her face and I will tip you extra for this service that you do. And, you know, please don't be scared that my head is adorned with the horns of a cuckold. It's okay. I'm all right. Have a lovely evening. i'll go home and oh gosh and then what's soaring the coat check person is not paying attention dan they've already they're looking but i just

slipped them a 20s woman this glowing woman they've This woman, this glowing woman. They've taken it. This glowing woman drinking her pinot and handed you two coats. And now you're stuck with these two coats. Okay, so I guess I'll just wait with it then. No, I'm telling you what you do. You can go home whenever you like. Save yourself the embarrassment of having to watch them click the rest of the night. I'm not embarrassed. There's culture thing about other people falling in love

all right tell yourself whatever you need to tell yourself to get through the rest of the night man you want to be on the dance floor while that's happening that's your prerogative you know what just happened sorry you know what happened huh i think i should give a toast i do i think i should give a toast i think it's bad idea. Don't do this. I think I'm ready to give a toast. No, no, no. I think I'm ready to give a toast. You barely know this person. You're a second tier man. I guess I should do it. Yeah, but I feel like if I'm an expert on anything, it's love, and I should give a toast probably. Okay. You asked me a question a while ago.

What the podcast is this? You asked me a question about things that we're doing differently on this pregnancy or the things that we learned from the first one the other one is that you're uh inundated by unsolicited advice from people all over the everyone you meet in the street and we have been and she and i well i think more her because they don't really come up to me and i say anything but they she's been much better about being like, no, thank you. Instead of sitting there and listening and nodding her head to whatever weird shit people have. Right.

Are you now allowed to say like, put up the shield of, yeah, this is our second. So back off. Not back off, but like the shorthand of that. People who you don't intend to burn bridges with. But when it's strangers who are just coming up to you at a wendy's and being like you should never get your legs up over above your belly button because it'll end up being that the child is the head falls backwards and then you have to have a reverse birth a breached birth or whatever the fuck it is like uh reverse birth so there's a thing that happens occasionally where if you if your knees are up higher than your belly, or you're like in that position for long periods of time,

say sitting on your couch with your feet up on a coffee table and like your knees bent, but your feet just up on like flat on a coffee table. If you're in that position for a long time, the, as the baby continues to grow and drops that it can drop without with its head facing the wrong direction. Okay.

And when that happens, like you can have have i think that's the breech birth i can't remember if that's where that when the feet come up first or if it's just the heads backwards but like it's much more painful birth but people and the only reason i know this shit is because somebody comes up to us at a bus stop or whatever and it's like hey here's some terrifying information and uh and she's been much better about just being like to those people who just come up and immediately like they want to talk about the pregnancy she'll say no thank you and you can just watch them blink and and walk away yeah it's wonderful that's great i'm glad that's happening but uh soren real quick question uh you mentioned strangers coming up to you at Wendy's to talk about the pregnancy.

I have a text from you from Christmas Eve. I said, Merry Christmas. And you said, Merry Christmas Eve. I'm at Wendy's. How often are you, have you been going to Wendy's lately?

So like we already know Christmas Eve and another time where strangers accosted you and Colleen about the baby. I've also at wendy's before where ronan was sucking his thumb and a guy was like don't let your kid do that it'll fuck up his teeth the rest of his life um i mean like you know i try not to eat a lot of fast food anymore i would have just been off the rails for the holidays and i have not gotten back on since and it's all been wendy's no but the fact that i'm at wendy's as often as i am now imagine that i'm also other fast food restaurants that often as well the woman at taco bell says what time do you have to be at work one day because i was at taco bell like30. I'm not proud of it. That's all right.

Dan, I have a quick question for you. A thing I also noticed when I was home for the holidays was that my parents, there's still like some cultural stuff that they're not quite caught up on ethically that they just missed the boat on. A good example of it is fat acceptance. I think my mom grew up a little heavy when she was young and then and then really worked hard to thin out she got older she my brother when he was young was uh a little huskier and then she i think maybe in a not entirely healthy way like really encouraged him to get thinner uh in a way that certainly today people would be like oh no don't do that kids are fine kids are fat it's fine um and so well like what did she do just say get thinner or was it specifically like maybe try intermittent yeah she like she started immediately

buying snacks that were all at the time you know you don't know we didn't know that sugar was so bad but dude there's snacks that were fat-freeze we get those snack wells cookies that's like basically my childhood i just those are the cookies we had in the house anything dessert oriented was snack wells and uh when he came home one day from school when he was really young and he told his told my mom olivia called me bubble butt my mom goes well yeah you have a bubble butt and i think that was the first time he'd ever really thought about his own body in that kind of way. And that was not the most nurturing way to do it. And so fat acceptance is not, it seems to her, it's like all the talking points that have been debunked at this point, which is like, well, it's just not healthy for them. It's not healthy for them to be that fat.

I'm basically thinking about it as philanthropically, like I'm doing them a favor. I'm thinking now 2020, no, it's not 2020, 2060, let's say. Am I alive still? Bacon, crunch the numbers for me. Okay. What are the things that I'm going to be, that are going to be like my huge cultural, ethical blind spots?

What am I just not going to be able to abide by at that, at that point in my life? And I can go first if you want. Yeah. I just want to make sure I understand the premise of the question that like when I have to. Oh, that mealy mouth premise. That didn't make sense to you.

No, you did a very good job. But, but just in case, like words that my parents say that I have make sense to you no i you did a very good job uh i uh but but just in case like words that my parents say that i have to explain to them we can't say anymore and they don't know why and my parents like not coming from a place of racism but coming from a place of the past or you know sexism or or uh transphobia they're not coming from those places they're just coming from, we grew up in a different time. And so we don't know why certain words aren't allowed to be said.

And I have to educate them. Your question is, what do I think I will be educated on in the future? Yeah. It's an insensitivity based not on like hatred or. Stereotypes, but just complete ignorance or naivety. Great.

And what, what is that going to be for you when you're old? And for me, I was thinking about the other day and I think it's polyamory. I think that when, if my son comes home in high school and he's got a girlfriend and a boyfriend, wow,

your son's coming home from high school in 2060. What the fuck happened? When, when is he in high school? 20, 40. Fuck. No, I can't be right. fuck happen when when is he in high school 2040 no i can't be right that's 20 years from now all right hold on i'm gonna do this all right so he's four in high school okay so like 2032 all right

2032 he's coming home and he's got um he's telling we're talking about our days at the table um it's a floating table it's very exciting this is a new thing that i've developed as a woodworker it's a table that yeah it's magnets um he's come home and he's telling us that uh he's having trouble with his relationship with his boyfriend but everything's going swimmingly with his girlfriend and i had to be like yeah polyamory everybody's doing it i'm sure it's fine it's great and not think my head, this can only end in disaster. This is going to be awful for you. People have tried open relationships in my time and it went terribly. It's never,

ever successful. You're going to fail. That's where I think I'll stand. And this is based on a thing that you think now that polyamory can't work? No, I'm trying to be. It sounds like I'm throwing you under the bus, but I also quietly think that same thing.

But I also loudly acknowledge that I'm ignorant about this world. I'm confident that it works for some people. And I don't know. In my mind, I think there's no way that works long term. But that's also because maybe I'm just closed-minded and ignorant on the subject. Right. And so, like, it's come up in culture where I'm like, I don't think. All right, Bambi, you can do what you want.

Free love, fine. Do what you want when you're young. But, like, you can't. How are you going to have a relationship like that later in your life? Right. How do you keep to have a relationship like that later in your life? Right. How do you keep that up? Yeah, it's ignorant without the negative connotations of ignorant. And it's only because you're ignorant because we grew up in a world where polyamory either wasn't discussed or didn't work or was restricted to fringe members of society

and like like pointedly in separate groups that were just like not discussed and uh that doesn't make you ignorant because you were like closing yourself off from the knowledge of how it might work. You're ignorant just because it wasn't part of the reality that you were fed, I guess. Yeah, I guess so. I also, there's such a close attachment in my mind between emotion and sex that I can't understand why you wouldn't immediately feel competitive against somebody else who is also dating your significant other or a hatred for them or even

just like you feel like you're not enough for the person that you're dating in that circumstance that they'd have to also satisfy themselves with somebody else as well it just seems like there's so much emotional baggage to it that it, it, I can't, the people who can do it. I'm like, well, you're a bigger person than I am. I don't understand how it works.

Fine, man. That's so interesting. And this podcast requires someone who is not me to talk about this. Like, like even when you say like, how are you not competitive with this person or feel hatred? I think someone who is steeped in this lifestyle probably has something to say about that

and yeah bacon yeah i just i it's something that i that i'll continue to try to be open-minded about with my children but that i just don't totally understand and i'll try to i guess yeah if it ever comes up but i think it'll like like certain uh aspects of future modern sexuality will absolutely change in our lifetime in ways that are are going to be great and in ways that will also alienate you and I from the culture. And who's to say if it's good or bad that we're alienated, but certainly it's going to happen. I can already see that watching shows like Sex Education, which just had its second season on Netflix, and The Polit the politician and also on Netflix and, uh, the, uh, daybreak also

on Netflix. Uh, just these, these shows centered around teens where, um, gay sexuality, bisexuality pansexuality are all uh expressed and accepted by everybody this is we're already moving towards uh a world where this exists in the culture in ways that didn't when we were growing up so like like the the sexual future is going to be a very different landscape from the one that it was when you and I were coming of age. And I'm really curious what that's going to do and what it's going to mean. And, and, uh, I, like, as I, I, I sit here now, I'm like, oh, I'm, I'm glad that, that this show is normalizing bisexuality. I'm glad that it's normalizing asexuality and pansexuality and everything else that is being normalized right now i i hope that i can hold on to that as i get older and older and new things show up uh historically people don't hold on to those kinds of things. So I know there will absolutely be a thing when I'm older,

uh, that, that seems as alien and confusing to me as asexuality seems to someone who is 50 right now. And just like culturally, even now, and certainly when we were growing up, a group of people living together who all claim to be in love and are having

sex with each other. That's, that's Mormonism or that's a cult, like a fundamentalist Mormonism or like a cult. Like that's, those are the only ways that those are presented to us at this point. Or when we're certainly when we were more formidable. And I guess that's changing now.

And maybe that will have an impact, impact on the people who live in the society in which that's like the mirror that's changing now and maybe that will have an impact impact on the people who live in the society in which that's like the mirror that's held up to them but i yeah i mean it's just like a hard time with it yeah it's very difficult to it's difficult to change and it's it's difficult to be open to a thing that uh doesn't seem worst word in the world normal to you based on your upbringing like i i uh have been very lucky that that homosexuality has been normal to me for as long as i can remember so when it it showed up in a real way with like gay people that i met it wasn't strange to me it was like yeah no no of course i don't i don't need met, it wasn't strange to me. It was like, yeah, no, no, of course. I don't, I don't need to be, I don't need to be taught that gay people exist and that

lesbians exist, that, that trans people exist, that queer people exist. I don't need to be taught these things because it seemed like a thing that I grew up with. Uh, yeah, but there are people older than me who didn't grow up with it in as meaningfully communicated a way as, as I did. And as you did, and it must seem as strange to them as it seems to you to hear that. Like, Oh yeah,

it's, it's a, this is my husband and this is my boyfriend and this is my wife and this is my sister wife. And we all live in a house and it's normal to us and you should just accept it like it it's right it's difficult for you to accept that because you grew up in a different time i guess so yeah and that's that that's the that's the i guess so part where i'm like or is it difficult to accept because it's...

It's not going to work and my kid's going to get hurt. He's going to get heartbroken. No. Do you have one? I mean, I have one that is not as real or pressing. Yeah. I feel like the god willing knock on wood hopefully we will be better about the environment

decades from now and we'll have made a bunch of changes and in a way that preserves this world for for generations after we're all dead and it'll be a positive good thing my thumbs are up you can't tell but i also know that probably means that i will have to make a bunch of small changes in my life that i i know i will resent like even the news today when people are like oh you, you shouldn't have, you shouldn't do straws anymore. We shouldn't do straws or you should like buy a metal straw from Starbucks that you wash and you use over and over again. Cause the straws are something,

something, something, the turtles, something, something, something. And I'm rolling my eyes about that. Uh,

I think there will only be more and more of those things. Like you, you've, you brought a peanut butter to my attention about how i shouldn't be using skippy or jif because they're i'm sorry gif because they're they're uh farming the peanuts in a way that is destroying rainforests and hurting orangutans is that right yes it's the it's the oil specifically the oil that they're using in it is a palm oil and that palm oil is derived from a tree that's in the

habitat of the of the uh orangutan and they're doing a lot of deforestation to get it and it's destroying that right so the correct thing for me to do to preserve the world and also orangutans is uh use a peanut butter that i like less that has this layer of fucking juice on top of every jar and it's not as good as the peanut butter that i prefer but i'm supposed to do it because it's better for the world fine i'm doing it but i'm mad about it i think that is only going to increase in in my lifetime in ways that i will try to keep up with as much as i can but i know i'm going to reach a point where someone's gonna be like uh you shouldn't eat red apples because uh if you eat red apples um uh these farmers in indonesia fucking die so you have to eat these apples that are smaller and worse. And it's the only way to keep the world going.

And also you shouldn't eat beef, like period. You shouldn't eat beef anymore. Right. And also if you're going to eat French fries, they should be tater tots. And everyone who is saying these things will be correct, but I will be wrong and be fine with being wrong. Like these are the things that my grandkids will, not my grandkids when it's uh you know 20 34 and ronan comes home from school to talk to soren and then soren talks to me about how we shouldn't be eating french fries anymore i'll be like i i'm just gonna do it i'm just gonna keep eating french fries i fought hard when i was younger for the environment

and that was before i knew that french fries were on the line if i'd known that i was younger for the environment and that was before i knew that french fries were on the line if i'd known that i would have put a stop to that very early on right yeah society is so big the population of earth is so big at this point that even the tiniest little thing that you do has these huge huge consequences somewhere else in a way that it's like it's very exhausting to think about and you kind of have to pick and choose your battles a little bit and i could totally see that happening in the future where you're just like especially the fishing you're not gonna be allowed to fish like 20 years you're not gonna be allowed to fish i know there's no way anyone

will still be doing charters and you're just allowed to go out there and catch whatever you want i'm already on the train right now for um uh we should just stop eating octopus and like that's not the reason that i picked that is because it's not as large of a problem as um like beef because if you say hey like you've tried this to try to get america to stop eating beef or not even to stop but to eat less beef you're met with so much resistance no one wants that kind of encroachment on their freedoms so i'm starting very small with octopus because that is a problem that um only impacts like markets in affluent areas so like the opposite of a food desert these areas that are the communities where people want to eat octopus as a delicacy.

And because octopus is wild caught and not farmed, the yield is inconsistent every year. And so there's a lot of money being poured into research, into creating octopus farms, which could only negatively impact the environment there's no way to make this sustainable and good for everybody and uh it's also like there are ethical questions if you want to do this to yeah octopuses because we agree that they're smart and they feel pain and regret and uh it's also like the only reason right now to make an octopus farm is to meet the demand, which is being made by the most affluent parts of the planet. And do we really need to destroy the world further to please the richest people on the planet who just decided that octopus is nice and they want to eat more of it and so that's the bell that i've been banging on right now and i'm passionate about it and i

support it i believe that one day 25 years from now someone's like we also shouldn't be even eating crabs anymore and we're like well fuck you i like crabs yeah yeah there's gonna be a lot more of that i think and it won't just be dietary it'll be like in the future you're gonna be showering in gray water there's like no reason not to and we're gonna be like no that's gross give me only the freshest cleanest water to touch my skin for a fraction of a second before it slips down the drain forever or like into our toilets the fact that we have like fresh water going into our toilets is is crazy um but i like it it's the way i grew up i don't want an ugly toilet um yeah oh what time is it bacon we're basically done we're done okay so let's let's do a little longer is that okay yeah whatever you guys want uh i want to talk about um something happened

today while we were recording kobe bryant and his daughter were killed in a helicopter crash and i know that this dan and i are not, not super big on the Lakers. It hasn't meant much to us in our entire life, but I know for bacon, like the Lakers are an important team to you and your entire family. And well, how weird that is when somebody famous that you've never met, but that you've been following your entire life dies.

And, and what that, how you feel that loss more immediately than even like a family member because you know that quadrant of your life that they filled, it's so easy to see the room that they used to occupy in your heart. And then like when they're not there anymore,

how hard that is. And it's different than like if a family member dies because they run through so much of your life that it's hard to quantify right away. But with something like this, it's immediate and it feels like kind of like a bomb goes off. I just want to say I'm sorry to you, Bacon. Thanks, Oren.

And as a, you know, I was also really happy. We recorded a couple of these today. And it's been a, I thought we weren't going to do it, which is such a weird thing to also like grapple with that, you know, we have to do this stuff. And if they're going to go out um we have to do them on a certain schedule which we're not always great at but uh but i was like i can't cancel this because of that i didn't even know this person um but it's really good to it was really good to like laugh about stuff today and i thought everyone was uh the jokes like super

funny during the other podcasts um So that was really good. Yeah. And I had conversations with you guys. I mean, Gabe got here too about how it's a weird feeling to feel silly about grief sometimes. You know, and you don't like, I felt like I kept having to justify it to people. And then sometimes they like, I had this girl reached out who I was friends with in high school who I had said so many big life events happen, um, in the last 15 years of her life. And I haven't talked to her since then, but in high school, we were both like really big Laker fans and, and loved watching Kobe play and her family had a similar thing as mine.

And she like found my number and texted me today to find some sort of like shared space or shared grief, which I thought was like such a, it was really nice, but it was also a really interesting thing that you would like, you know, that there's also someone else that is probably experiencing this in the same way as you. And you want to like not have to explain why you're feeling that way. You just want to kind of talk to someone about it. And it's interesting to see everyone else around the world have their own level of interactions. He was obviously a really complicated guy.

Lots of people are having mixed feelings about because some of the stuff he did was bad and rightfully so. But also, he represented a lot for a lot of people around the world. So yeah, it's interesting how you feel that way about someone you don't really even know. Yeah, it adds another layer to the grief that is really difficult because you said you felt silly about it. And I think that's a very common reaction to something like this and not something that gets talked about really where like it makes sense if I cry at the funeral of a relative and uh it makes less sense if I cry when Robin Williams dies or Kobe Bryant dies or or some other figure that I've I've never met you feel, no one would be upset if you called into work and said,

I can't really come into work today because this important relative passed away. No one gets upset about that. But if you said, I can't really come into work today because this basket, yeah, like this, this, this fixture in my life, whom I've never spoken to passed away like the it feels like an additional punishment to to feel silly to to grieve for someone you don't know and i don't think you should make yourself feel silly or that society should make you feel silly, whatever it is, I think. You know, you're sad about a person. You're also sad about the loss of this thing that bonded your family and made up your childhood.

And that's a fair thing. It's not, you know, you're not, no one's weeping over the loss of a fictional character. It's like, this, this, this means more than that. This is a person that, uh,

united your family and like bonded you to people you didn't know throughout your life. And, and now they're gone and you're, you shouldn't be made to feel silly about that. Yeah. And it's interesting too. I mean, you see like the internet is Twitter, especially as such a new, like new way to experience this stuff.

And there's a lot of people calling out, you know, rightly so like, you know, his daughter passed away too, which was horrible. And, but there's, I think it's still new, but there's I think seven other people on the helicopter and people are rightfully like calling out that that you know they deserve yeah uh focus and attention and it's just all these little cuts of it it's it's such a weird thing to try and apply like morality to or what's right or what's the wrong reaction to have. But it's also really comforting. I've been checking Twitter all day to see that other people that I care about or have an opinion

on also are feeling hurt by it. And I think that's probably good. It's like the sharing the load of grief just feels nice. And it's what you naturally do in a circumstance where a family member dies. That's the reason everybody gets together and celebrates their life. It's not just to remember them and to send them off to wherever they go but it's also like you are splitting it up among you so that you're not no there's only one person who's carrying it or you don't feel like you're the only person who's carrying it and so in a circumstance like this like you feel less like you're entitled to that but it is really nice to go on social this is like the times when social media i feel like So in a circumstance like this, you feel less like you're entitled to that.

But it is really nice to go on social. This is like the times when social media, I feel like, is very, very valuable. Because you actually have the people out there who you get the same, you scratch the same itch with that community. Where they're feeling the same thing as you. And as long as you can block out the noise of the people who are like, no, fuck him. Think about what's going on in Iran right now now like what how many people are starving to death in venezuela like that they're trying to equate it to these other people who they're just they haven't been a part of your life in a way where like if you were to think about them exclusively you would never think about anything else in you ever and so you just a group of people that have

all got like a communal idea of what kobe was in their mind and reminiscing about what he was to them. It's okay to grieve in that way and to share that with each other. And I don't think anyone should be made to feel bad about that. But I appreciate you guys bringing it up. Yeah, it was a big deal for me. And I think for a lot of other people. So I hope anyone else that's feeling sad, I hope they think it's okay to feel sad.

And I would encourage them to check out some of the other really nice things that were written about them and are written about Kobe and how maybe it represented some stuff that wasn't directly tied to him, but things that you see in other people that you want to emulate or those are the shinier, brighter spots of this.

So I would encourage everyone to do that. They're feeling bummed out. Are you guys still going to do that thing where you make each other say something horrible? I mean, I could, but it's, Oh,

we are. Okay, great. And thank you, bacon. I will close this out by tracking down all the social accounts. But before I do that, this is very off topic. Soren, you remember, we got together on Christmas and we watched Little Women, which I loved.

You wrote a review of it that you don't mind if I just like quote your review, right? Is that okay? I'd love to. I don't have this platform i used to have this is great you wrote quote in your review of little women bob odenkirk was great but underused timothy chalamet he's a bona fide star tracy letts shined in his brief supporting role as the publisher and i like the scenes where the girls were being polite like when the one girl asked permission to go to a party or when that other girl said thank you when the man let her play piano greta gerwich should be proud and also smile more i am proud of her end quote you've seen it again since christmas i think uh have your thoughts evolved in any way hold on i'm just i'm looking through all the reviews I wrote this one you pulled this one

from tumblr I assume okay so this yeah this is the one that I put up on uh on bright part okay you rated it so yeah you this one on tumblr uh you said this was a c man movie and a woman movie because yeah because of the curve so here's the deal. Or you say you grade them on a curves and then you do like an hourglass thing with your hands. Right. I think that's a fun little thing that I do. So it's like shoe sizes, right? So you can't put a woman in a nine

because that's ridiculous. Yeah, how's she going to fill those shoes, right? And so you can't expect a woman to fill a man's shoes you understand so you rate them on a different scale woman's a man's nine is like that's like a woman's 14 so uh as far as women go like the fact that these women were in this movie they memorized their lines like that's a pretty big triumph i think and so i'm giving them i'm giving them a good grade and the men i mean forget it the part the real parts like the meaty parts in this those are wonderful they really came through in every single respect and they did a really good job

of negotiating around all the um not like props i I don't want to say props, but like the other characters, the other characters. And just sort of like telling a true story that felt very real around them. You also said your favorite part is how after the movie came out, how kind and diplomatic the women were by not saying anything when Joker absolutely destroyed them in terms of Oscar nominations. You said it was really great that... I'm going to say Saoirse,

but you said Sarah Ronan just smiled politely at Joker's 11 Oscar nominations. Yeah. And they didn't raise a fuss. Bacon, do you have something to say? What are you mumbling over there? Mumbling an agreement?

I'm trying to walk out of the room. You can find Bacon on Twitter at Bake Me Bacon please PLS or Soren at Soren underscore LTD or me at DOB underscore INC or the show at QQ underscore Soren and Dan or on Instagram

probably you can find our engineer and producer Gabe at Gabe Harder dot com probably and hire him for things. You can email the show at QQ with Soren and Daniel at gmail.com. We have a Patreon that you can find if you Google. I will be a special guest on the daily Zeitgeist live podcast show here in New York at Brooklyn at the Bell House Theater on February 12th. Doors at 7, show at 7.30.

You can also find that information if you Google or if you look at the notes on the bottom of our website that will direct you there. I think that's it. I think that's everything I think that's everything yeah alright bye Dan