Raging Moderates with Scott Galloway and Jessica Tarlov - What Democrats Still Don’t Get about MAGA (ft. Jordan Klepper of The Daily Show)

Episode Date: March 11, 2026

In a post-Trump world, what will happen to the MAGA base? Jessica Tarlov is joined by comedian and The Daily Show co-host Jordan Klepper to talk through it. Jordan has spent the past decade at Trump rallies, talking with voters on the right about what they believe, who they distrust, and what’s really galvanizing their movement. Jessica and Jordan also discuss White House Press Secretary Karoline Leavitt’s latest attempt to avoid accountability for strikes in Iran, Lindsey Graham’s lust for being close to power, and whether or not Democrats can transform from a party widely seen as feckless and ineffective in opposition to Trump… into a movement inspired by authenticity, community, and even fun.  And, in a media landscape dominated by right-wing corporate conglomeration on the one hand and online creators on the other hand, how has The Daily Show — a thirty-year-old television program — managed to actually gain Gen Z viewers? Follow Jessica Tarlov, @JessicaTarlov Follow Prof G, @profgalloway Follow Raging Moderates, @RagingModeratesPodSubscribe to our YouTube Channel: https://www.youtube.com/@RagingModerates Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Starring Samara Weaving, Catherine Newton, Sarah Michelle Geller, and Elijah Wood. Ready or not two, here I come, only in theaters March 20th. Get tickets now. The thing they get most out of MAGA is not the policies from MAGA, but the identity that they get within their community. And so that, to me, is a very important part of the movement.

That will shift and evolve and break when Donald Trump perhaps leaves. They just want change. And I think that's what gets overlooked when people talk about the MAGA movement when I go to these rallies, especially people on the left were like, I've never been to a rally. What is that like? It's like a parade. It's the funnest thing that comes to your town.

My critique is it is disconnected from the political process, and it is just a party, and therefore that is something that can be wielded to deleterious effect. And yet, what a freaking party. When the show comes to town, you show up. Welcome to Raging Moderates. I'm Jessica Tarlov, and I'm super excited, and you're going to be super excited, that Jordan Klepper, co-host of The Daily Show, comedian extraordinaire, is joining me today. Jordan, thank you for accepting the invitation to moderately rage. I'm so excited to moderately rage. Rage within the confines of moderation is the most fulfilling and responsible way to rage as a 47-year-old.

Probably also the most politically useless at times. It's like we love our name so much and then it gets pushed back sometimes and I'm like, oh, is this actually a mistake? but it sounds good and the branding is good. Yes. I was going to say, like, ineffective blabber, probably not a good name for a podcast. No, we will not be adding that to the Profi universe. I was going to say, but, you know, yeah, moderation, you know,

that's the larger question. Does it move the needle or does it make us feel comfortable in our rational discourse? We will discover. What a plug for the show. We will discuss. Before we start, if you haven't already, please subscribe to our YouTube page.

There's a really fun community going on. We're reading all the comments. We love to hear from you. Subscribe to Raging Moderns. Today we're going to talk about the war in Iran and a lot of White House spin about it. Also what Democrats can learn from MAGA on coalition building. You are a MAGA whisper of sorts. We both have strong relationships with the MAGA coalition in different ways, I would say.

I want to dive right in and start talking about Iran first. It continues to dominate all the headlines. Obviously, I've been seeing that on your show as well. The White House is really struggling to explain some of the more. disturbing moments, even from the first day, that strike on the Iranian school that looks like killed 175 over 100 of them school girls. Here's White House Press Secretary Caroline Levitt doing her best attempt to explain it. On the Iranian school, why did President Trump say yesterday that Iran may have he have

Tomahawk missiles when there are only three other U.S. allies plus the U.S. that have those missiles and therefore could. Again, the president said yesterday he will accept the conclusion of this investigation by the Department of War. I know there's been a lot of speculation in the media about who may be responsible for this. We're not going to get ahead of the Department of War and the conclusion of that investigation. The president has a right to share his opinions with the American public, but he has said he'll accept the conclusion of that investigation. And frankly, we're not going to be harassed by the New York Times, who's been putting out a lot of articles on this, making claims that have just not been very very. by the Department of War to quickly wrap up this investigation because the New York Times is calling on us to do so.

I'm sure the Pete Higgs has stamp of approval is really what's going to define the veracity of that claim. They will not be harassed by the New York Times. You know, they started with a question about who murdered over 100 school children, but they ended with a real defiant, full-throated defense of standing up to the New York Times. And it makes me proud to be an American to hear something like that. Totally. The gray lady turning in her grave. What do you, I mean, so I don't fully buy into the narrative that Caroline Leavitt doesn't wear her cross when she knows that she has to go out there and tell a whopper. And frankly, if I was going to be asked about dead school kids, I would

take off my shield. But how do you see her press secretariness or whatever? Because, I mean, Kelly and Conway is another comp. She was the press secretary. but we had the alternative facts thesis and Kaylee McInney who was Uber prepared, right? Like always had the binders and actually had a pretty good relationship with a lot of members of the press that would surprise you. But what do you make of Caroline Leavitt, especially in these kinds of moments? Well, first, I'm surprised she's she's lasted as long, but she's sort of, she does a good job performing for that audience of one and also not making the news all about herself in the way in which she approaches that fight. Feels like that's always the walk, the Trump walk people have to make in like showing complete deference, swagginess, but not taking away from the ultimate shine. I mean, I hear something like that that, you know, I think that's how we all probably could have written it up a week ago if you had asked what happened with this situation.

How are they going to handle? How are they going to respond it? They're going to defer. They're going to deflect and they're going to point fingers at the person who's asking that question. It just feels pretty par for the course. It seems more heightened and infuriated in times of war where we are, we are more, we want answers and clarity in times now more than we normally do. But it's not at all surprising in hearing how these press conferences going.

Frankly, from the, from a show's point of view, you know, we're always, we're always up on it. We're watching what the spin is going to be. But it doesn't provide much news for us. This is something that is now on the back burner. In the first Trump administration, it was, it was making news in their defiance. their spin. And now it's just, it's reruns. We've seen this movie before or the sitcom. And we didn't like it. But yeah, we voted for it again. And she's not as, she's not as fun a character as Kelly Ann Conway. If we're going to watch

just the reruns of these sitcoms, there's a reason that like Mary Tyler Moore show is still fun to watch again. Cheers is still good. The characters pop. They're wild. There's Woody and Cheers. He's still hilarious and what have you. Kelly Ann Conway. You also had the palace intrigue, what was going on back at home and watching that fight play out. I think in some ways, this feels like a more boring, more derivative at times just par for the course, audacious take at how to spin the Trump administration. It's probably better for Trump, honestly, that it's not as much of a show and that he has some semblance of a professionalization. I mean, you mentioned that it doesn't give you much fodder for the show because this is the expectation. What has been giving you

the best fodder, like when you guys sit down to write or on a week when you're hosting. What are you gravitating towards? Well, I wish we had less and less stuff to talk about, where people often say, like, oh, you must be so happy with all of the ripe comedy that is out there. And quite frankly, I pine for the days of your where the news was boring, as were the characters, and therefore we got to craft a story at a point of view based around some bigger topics that we could dive into and craft over a few days. But now we're just, we're chasing the chaos of the news cycle. What's fascinating about this Trump administration is we internally talk about how there are so many

more characters that are known to our audience, you know, just from a purely functional standpoint when you are communicating comedy to an audience, you're basing also on, like, what is their baseline knowledge of who is in this administration? And everybody knows Donald Trump, they know some of these main characters. But unlike most administrations, and even the first Donald Trump administration, you now have the RFK juniors, you have the Pete Hegseths. You know, it starts to expand into a cabinet where an audience in the older days might know one or two cabinet members, but now they have a working knowledge of the Christie Homes, of the Marco Rubios, of the Higgsets, the RFKs, and therefore it's much quicker

to talk about them and get on the same page about those people within that. So we are always looking, we've, I think, expanded more as to what the administration is covering, these other characters are covering outside of just the Trump chaos. And so each day, we sort of take a check in as to like, where, where is the character, where are the characters, where's the chaos? And also, you know, where's the heat of the day? That's, the morning starts with us looking at what the headlines are, what people are talking about, and then approaching it through a comedic lens as to what is it a, what is, what can we actually add to this conversation or have something to say? And then we go from there. Yeah. So one narrative,

at least that feels hot to this raging moderate is watching a fracture, even within the pretty high ranks of Trump's support over this war. So you have like Senator John Kennedy goes and does an interview on CNN where he says like, investigate the shooting, the missile strike on the school all you want. It was us. And I feel terrible about it. And then you have someone like Lindsey Graham, who is always good for comedy, who has. has not gotten the memo about shifting the goalposts. And I don't know if you saw this interview on Hannity, but I want to play you a clip of it and talk a little bit about like the old neocon world in Trump orbit. So let's look at that. All the anti-Seminides to all the isolationists,

I don't believe, forget it. I'm not with you. I'm with Israel. I will be with Israel to our dying day. They're the best ally we could hope for. So we have a commander chief and President Trump, who I think is Ronald Reagan plus plus plus. Oh. You don't say, Lindsay. Have another glass of chardonnay. What do you do with Lindsey Graham? Yeah, I mean, I think you keep pouring those glasses a wine, let him do his thing,

prod him about going to war with Iran. I think that's his happy place. Put him on TV a little bit tipsy, talking about being a warmonger, and he goes. I mean, you saw him on the place. with Trump a few weeks ago, he was so, so giddy. He was frothing at the mouth. And I, you know, he's somebody who wears his biases on his sleeve. We've known him for, for years. It is still so remarkable to see somebody like him and his, his proximity to power is so necessary for his, it's his lifeblood. It's like, it's like his, it's a froto reference in here somewhere that

you take it away and he just withers away and dies. And so to watch him constantly go towards that flame and to do whatever he can to be the Donald Trump lap dog. There's so many people within this administration who find themselves there and just have to be in that ormit and have to talk that talk. But I think you speak to something that is really compelling for us at the show we're always looking at is how is the Republican Party not only spinning this, but where are they landing in both accountability for this war and how they feel about this supposedly America First agenda. We're not surprised about what Lindsay Graham does, but we are surprised by some of the these, you know, the Tucker Carlson narratives, the Ben Shapiro narratives, they're really,

that's been something we've always been watching for a while to see, like, is there actually going to be a shift in this, this MAGA base? There's at least conversation within it. I think right now, you know, I watch that with bated breath. Yeah, I mean, we're focusing on it too here at the show, but also on Fox. You know, we talk about this division with the MAGA base. Does it translate into votes? I mean, as someone who wants to win elections, I'm always like, all right, guys, like, let's not get too excited yet because they would tell you, be the first to tell you, like, if the alternative is Kamala Harris or something like that, that they're not going to go for it. But how much, I guess, do you think that that fissure

has legs going forward in a trumpless world on top of the ticket? Because as Steve Bannon tells me that he's running for a third term, but I'm going to go with, he is not running for a third term. And did you see, by the way, that he's been asking members of the cabinet and influential advisors if they want Marco Rubio and J.D. Vance, and it's like unanimously Marco Rubio. And he's going to hold, I mean, this is, you know, in some ways it's what's going to be beautiful. It's going to be detrimental to his party, but he's going to wait. He knows as soon as he says, okay, I'm not running.

I want Marco to be the guy. I want J.D. to be the guy. I want Dod Jr. to be the guy. Whatever he says that thing, the attention moves away from him, so he will hold onto it so long. And it will not be helpful for either of the people that he wants to be in charge. But he will hold on that vanity. Oh, the stupidity and the vanity is the thing that I always hold on to. I've lost clinging for morality or common sense or true belief in the Constitution

as a way to pull us back towards any amount of sanity and goodwill. And I really cling to that stupidity and that vanity as a real. that's the crack that the light comes through more often than not. It's like, oh, they want some authoritarian regime. They want this power. But sometimes that vanity and that stupidity, I don't think if they know exactly how to get there. And I hope that is an American ideal that really saves us at the end. I mean, Donald Trump is the American dream in a lot of ways, right? Like a sad boy from Queens makes good, gets to move to Manhattan and then move to the people's house. But, you know, it has been interesting to see, and I think it is, to your point, part of this reflection on him or his vanity, when a cabinet member or someone in the close orbit goes too far. So, like, Christy Knoem obviously went too far.

He was like, Gryft, that's only for me and my family. Or, like, Cash Patel smashing beers with the hockey team and taking the private jet for that. Those were things that actually upset him. And we even had our first cabinet secretary leave. I mean, this story about the Pentagon spending $93 billion in September on steak and King crab legs. And I get it when troops are going to deploy, you got a nice meal. And you deserve that. Like, thank you for your service and all of the things.

But it was also for furniture. $93 billion in a month, you know, use it or lose it. I'm buying like new cheap readers at Dwayne Reed, right? Like, it's not the same kind of thing. Splurge. Go to Warby Parker. Go, baby. It's a nice middle range. Go for it. You deserve it. But what do you think is the turning point moment for him with these people?

Like, with the Christie Nomes or does Pete Hagseth, I mean, at war, obviously not going to be the end. But like, when do you think it transfers over into the, we can't have you anymore? Pam Bondi, Epstein files, like. I was truly surprised by the Gnome situation because I do think something he has learned, from a political standpoint, again, not from a accountability standpoint, but it felt like Donald Trump's superpower is his lack of shame, and that allows him to act with impunity and not be so caught up in accountability. And therefore, it seemed as if, like, he regretted this first term of being told by some people, this person has brought shame, they've made a mistake, therefore let them go.

in this term, I think that has been a successful game plan from his administration standpoint of of not giving in to Signalgate with Pete Hague Seth, of still standing firm with all this. I think we're seeing it play out now with Iran, like, you know, Levin is kicking the can on what happened with this Tomahawk missile, and I think they will probably kick the can. But it seems from a political standpoint, don't admit wrongdoing, and you admit that by firing. So I, you know, if you had talked to me a week and a half ago, I don't think there was. a line for Donald Trump to truly turn on some of these folks. If the narrative gets so bad, but again, he controls, the people he's talking to,

he controls that narrative. He doesn't want to give them any kind of ammunition to push back on them being wrong about it. And so it is remarkable. I think what I learned from the gnome thing is, you know, she spoke out a turn with whose responsibility it was to greenlight the spending of all of that cash. and I think like her vanity outdid Trump's vanity, you know, it's, I don't think it's going to be reckless, reckless political choices. I think it's going to be getting in the way of the spotlight. For him, he wants all of it. He also feels like a man who knows that the spotlight is dimming, as is the sand and the hourglass. And so anybody who takes away a little bit of that shine puts themselves in a position where they could be crossing that, ooh, that, that tiniest of lies. Implicit in everything that we're talking about is that there is an opposition party. And there's been a lot of criticism.

I think they're more unpopular than AI is right now, even from people who have lost their jobs to AI. So I'm talking about the Democratic Party. More unpopular than AI. But who run that? Whatever AI is. I mean, yes, whatever AI is. And who ran that statistical analysis? You know they ran it through AI.

and AI is putting their thumb or whatever AI has on the scale. So, you know, we take it with a great assault. Okay, you're right. Everything's going great. But how do you think Democrats are handling the moment? I think they're holding on. Not. They seem pretty wide eye.

I think there seems to be a decent amount of attempts as to how to frame this. I mean, look, politically, they all seem to be getting the same memo of we need to put the focus on kitchen, like stop the culture wars, let's talk about affordability, let's focus on these kinds of things. I don't know. If we're talking about what they need to do to actually build trust and belief in the Democratic Party, like, the only place I've seen that in the last two years is here in New York and Zoran. Like, I think that has felt authentic. It went against what everybody and also the money was telling you what happened within this town. And I saw people actually energized. Again, I live in New York City, so I am biased by what I see around me. But the Democratic

Party and humans in general are in need of authenticity. I think it's less an argument about how far left are they. What should these tactics be? I think it's authenticity. Who's somebody who gives a shit? Who is somebody who will fight on their own terms and be able to articulate it to people who are actually in this morass that we are in. Like we feel like the sky is falling. We feel that things are unaffordable. And we think that there's too much of the chaos being fought on strictly a political level.

We want somebody who can connect to us and articulate that. That can come from the political class, definitely. But I think the deeper you are into the political class right now, the less and less you lose the shine of authenticity and by necessity and just by the reality of exposure. We live in a time right now where people get exposed and burned out within six months. We want freshness. We want newness.

And I think the Democratic Party, I've seen cracks of it feeling like the Democratic Party people want when you see young faces come onto the scene and articulate something authentic or the very old. Bernie Sanders is the one example, too, of somebody else who's like, oh, there's still a resonance there. And I think that's because authenticity is the king of the realm. A coin other realm. Whatever. Some realm. There's a king, there's a coin. Non-binary.

There's money involved in it. I know. There's a lot of money. There's always money. That's for sure. Grassroots or corporate pack money. But that's, that point that you're making is a bipartisan one because Trump has that too, even though it's a scam.

And you're very much the Mago whisperer of the Daily Show, always fingering the pulse for us. Love what you did there. Do you, what do you think? going on like in their heads, like the people who you've met at all these rallies. And I was watching old clips prepping for today of, you know, everything from around 2020, you know, running after people in the insurrection. And the theme is, even though you often give them their own rope to hang themselves, right? Like, you're not actually making fun of anyone. You're letting them speak their truth. And then hopefully getting to that moment of realization where they say, like, you know,

read the transcript and you're like, did you read the transcript? And they're like, somebody I know read the transcript. This economic populism, this desire for authenticity, is it going to just be the way forward for politics generally? Or do you think that there are still going to be those that are itching for the old mold? It's always curious. We're always wondering, is there, is there a line with the Maga folks as to when they will let go of what this movement means to them and look at their pocketbook and change parties or vote in a different direction. And I think in some ways, that is that is a fabrication of what is actually happening out there. A lot of the people that I talk to are in the MAGA movement because it is their identity. And that is more important to them

than what politics means to them. In fact, like, it's almost insincere to debate politics with so many people who are in that MAGA movement because the politics is just almost the almost the gibberish used to to portray and perform their allegiance to an identity, to being a part of something. And so whether or not little moments have changed and gas prices have gone up, I think they will earnestly feel that, but their experience of being a MAGA supporter is actually separate from the effects of government. They don't see those as connected.

In fact, the thing they get most out of MAGA is not the policies from MAGA, but the identity that they get within their community. And so that, to me, is a very important part of the movement that will shift and evolve and break when Donald Trump perhaps leaves. But the economic reality, I think, is very true and real. And a lot of the people I talk to outside of the more extreme MAGA folks, they just want change. I think that is so American. I think seeing incumbents win is a thing of the past. And, yes, we will get into the weeds of what is this party going to do or what have you.

I think more often than not, Americans feel like they don't like the status quo. They don't get what they want. They deserve more that they are not getting, and the people in power are failing them and letting them down. And more often than not, that is a selfish pursuit looking at what their economic problems are, and therefore they vote from that perspective. And so I do think there will be a continual cycle of going back and back to these economic populism talking points. but I also think the American public has constantly frustrated with those who are in charge outside of this charismatic authoritarian figure who has sort of swept up in this.

But I think almost more powerful than that is our inability to trust that the people in charge are looking out for us. And that just keeps getting, that story gets told to us over and over again. And I do think that was more baked into the initial story of Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton than we give it credit for. I think that was sort of the sense. sentiment of what was happening. There were so many things about Donald Trump at the time, and looking back on it, they continue to be, but more often than not, there's people who want

change, and that really, to me, is more often than not the conversation that I hear out there whenever I talk to people. Yeah, change in community for sure. I mean, I remember Mom Donnie's scavenger hunt, which was just such a wildly fun political organizing tool. And especially for young people who are suffering so much from too much screen time, right? And the loneliness epidemic, it gets the old and it gets the young. Fun, fun is a big word, too. And I think that's what gets overlooked when people talk about the MAGA movement when I go to these rallies. Especially people on the left who are like, I've never been to a rally.

What is that like? It's like a parade. It's the funnest thing that comes to your town. The R&C was like Disneyland. Mm-hmm. Yeah. For these people. It is, you know, my critique is it is, it is.

disconnected from the political process and it is just a party and therefore that is something that can be wielded to deleterious effect and yet what a freaking party when the show comes to town you show up and again you are a part of something you put on a hat you get to play a game you get to sing along to the chorus of the song you've heard before and more more importantly you meet other people who like something that you like it's a thing that we all search for constantly and you are right like like, I'm going to make a game. Will you show up and meet other people? Dear Lord, I want anybody in my life to give me an opportunity right now to go meet strangers

in my community who I share one thing in common with. And I think that's such an important part of politics. And so few people know how to wield that. And again, it comes through authenticity. And Trump knew how to do it. He's a showman. Absolutely. It does make me think about the playground, right?

Like you're, you talk to the parents, right? And you just want to see your kids having fun. It's the same thing. and that no one gets hurt. But one of this... Yesterday, yesterday, we are... We have time. I have time off this week.

And all I want is like, somebody just tell me one place to be that I can take my family to. We can meet other people and we can spend three hours. And I will pay whatever you tell me it costs. I will vote against my own interest if you give me a mission and a purpose

right here and now. Take away my health care if you give me a zip line. A hundred percent. You can have it all. Let's take a quick break. Stay with us. us. Support for the show comes from Seoul. It's hard work to build up healthy habits and the strict schedule that you have to keep isn't making it any easier. But when you find the time to unwind,

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Getting ready for a game means being ready for anything. Like packing a spare stick. I like to be prepared. That's why I remember 988, Canada's suicide crisis hubline. It's good to know just in case. Anyone can call or text for free confidential support from a train responder anytime. 988 suicide crisis helpline is funded by the government in Canada. Welcome back.

I want to talk to you before I shift gears a little bit about a particular community within the MAGA base, and that's the QAnon folks. And you've spent a lot of time with them, and I am probably going to regret saying this. But was Q&ONR right about the Epstein files? I realize it's going to get clipped up and will live with me forever. But, I mean, they had the Hillary Clinton pizza place wrong. But it seems like they have been pretty vindicated on the Epstein files. And it's just had this knock-on effect that they now see some of them Trump as actually part of the Epstein class, right? Because he is the one who is blocking the release of these files.

So what's your take on current day QAnon? They also thought Donald Trump was the savior who was going to come forward and continue and reveal himself. And that's the thing with Qaeda. They threw a thousand things at the wall. you know, 990-some-od continued to be disproven or pushed to it. It'll happen next week. It'll happen next week.

But I think the underlying distrust of those in power is palpable and real. And the Epstein Files is a great example of, again, I don't give this to QAnon, but their distrust is something that is being realized by the masses of, of, of, of what the powerful do, what the powerful are capable of doing, and how they associate with one another.

And yeah, it is remarkable. I'm sure they feel right now in their basements somewhat vindicated. It's curious. When I go out, it's hard to. QAnon also morphed into just a symbol on the road. And so it is stuff you see on bumper stickers and what have you, that became something where some people would be all in when I would talk to people on the road. Some people would just be using it sort of as a moniker for, like,

like screw the man, like this is their own punk rock element. And for many as well, this was just their hobby. I talked to so many people who were, I talked to grandmothers who were into this Q world because it provided them space to put their distrust and their ample amount of free time into trying to discover something. And so that was always, always fun for people

to try to uncover some sort of mystery, that they could be sort of a part of this, you know, only murders in the building moment, but for themselves and on the dark web. So I understand the pull and the draw to it all. I haven't seen where it has evolved to, but I think a lot of those themes have sort of spilled over into this mainstream conversation. Yeah. And I am full of regret that I said was Q and on, right?

You are, that's, it's going to honcho. It's a cancelable offense. Or an opportunity. Trust me, there's, you know, there are a lot of people. There's money to be made. in Russia and Qatar if you go with a certain line of argumentation.

Also, let me say, if you are a progressive and you want to make money quick, a progressive who quickly turns and says, you know what, I think progressives are wrong. All hail the far rights. You can make a quick book so quick. I know the fuck out of me. And they're always like, oh, why don't you want to come on? I don't

want to call people out, but you know what I'm talking about. Oh, you don't want to come in and debate them? I'm like, no, it's completely bad faith. It's like what the right is supposed to be doing. I hate it on my side of the fence. But that also comes down to economic insecurity, and I see it, and I feel it, and I know people where we are, we all feel like we are on such a razor's edge of finding a way to support our families and the people we love in the upcoming months. And therefore, if you find something that works and that pays you,

you retroactively create a mind space where this is the righteous choice. But you are still, you know, at my most empathetic, I understand the choices being made to take care of yourself. You found a way to pay the rent in America. God bless, that's harder and harder these days. And you see it. And right now, to do that, you become an influencer, you become a publisher in some sort of way, whether that is on a podcast, on a Facebook feed, in some sort of public manner. And you find the point of view that will reward you financially as fast as you can. And then you figure out morality afterwards. And I see it happening in so many places. It dictates the conversations we have. I think sometimes we just need to stop and say, like, the whole system is set up for this conversation

to be done in bad faith. And that is what we're taking a part of right now. It's actually a perfect segue into what I wanted to talk about next, which is kind of the state of media and the state of news. Obviously, the independent factors are big. You know, we're talking on a podcast now, which is owned by a media company, but we can still say fuck and do what. what we want. And, you know, there's been a lot of eyes on the Ellisons who own Comedy Central. They're probably going to own a lot more soon. What do you think that merger means for the future of news? And kind of how are you thinking about the landscape? Well, it's so interesting from a daily show perspective. We've gone through a lot of changes in the last 10 years. For me on the show,

I got on the show and then John left and then there was a search for a host and then Trevor came out on the show and then Trevor hosted and then there was a there was COVID that we got off the air and we started doing stuff from our homes and then there was a writer strike so there was six months where we weren't doing shows and then Trevor left and then there was a host and so we tried to figure out who was going to be the host and people were auditioning and then John comes back and now there's this now there's a handful of us who are hosting the show. We have sort of lived in this world of uncertainty at the Daily Show and just plowed ahead where I have felt lucky in that we have not felt the hand of someone telling us what we can or cannot say. And actually, I find a lot of pride in my late night brethren in being very vocal about the BS, wherever you see it, and whenever we feel that outside pressure from conglomerates and big organizations, like I think late night has been pretty vocal about that. So that I take a lot of pride in and feel confident about. But I'm always worried about anybody consolidating power

and always worried about where the limitations on speech are. And watching any kind of corporation having to count out to an administration who wants to put their thumb on the scale, you have to watch that incredibly closely. I feel very lucky that we get to say what we want to do. And when that becomes limited and changed, like, that's when it's time to step out or to make a stink. And so, yeah, we are in perilous times. And I hope that those who have the opportunity to speak to that and are in positions of power continue to do so.

You may be in perilous times, or we may be, I should say. But your show is doing astronomically well. And there was a piece last week about how you guys are kind of the only ones that are, gaining Gen Z viewers that are actually, I mean, your YouTube channel is massive, but even watching the show, finding a way to a television, or at least, you know, streaming it. What's the secret sauce you think to getting young people to engage with an old school television format? We stumbled on a way to make it work for us in that, like I said, we've had such unique iteration

over the last five years. Trevor came in and immediately brought an interest in going digital in a way that The Daily Show didn't have before. To be clear, The Daily Show is an institution. We've been around for almost 30 years, so it's important to have a brand that people can turn to,

but then we had this injection of fresh eyes to go digital. And then we also had all of this changeover that forced us to sort of think modularly. And what I feel really lucky about is, like, I get to, I get to reach people on three different levels at the daily show. When I host, I get to sort of control news of day of the day,

jokes on that point of view and craft an eight-minute monologue that can also be clipped up into something that young people will see in 20-second clips or four-minute clips. I also get to go out into the field and do four-minute clips that are based on one experience in the world. I also get to do 30 minutes specials that people can sit down that can do deep dives into what's happening with Russia influence on American elections. All very different ways in which people can engage with this content. But I'll run into people on the road and I always laugh when people recognize me.

If they're over 50, they'll say, I love you on the daily show. If they're between like 30 and 50, they're like, oh, I love your YouTube. And everybody under 30 is like, I love your content. And just the broad category of content. The broad category of content. And at first I used to bristle at that. And you have to always be careful in this media landscape. You're losing context all the time.

Especially when I did a show that was a satirical show that leaned into character. You have to be careful because context is being stripped away on all of these platforms. And yet I think the daily show has figured out a way to do stuff for people who are watching at home. And we still have a really loyal fan base of people who, want to check in every night and we're watching on cable television. And I think that will exist for a while. The numbers are not necessarily growing, but they are strong. It looks like it is.

We have had linear growth, which is such an anomaly in this day and age. Yeah. I would lean into it. I think, I mean, I'm also, you know, desperately try to hold on to my own job. But when everyone's like, cable is dead, I'm like, not really. I mean, some people are dying, which means there will be less cable news. but your viewers are younger than my viewers on the five. I think we have young people who will watch a clip on on YouTube or TikTok and get a sense

and then go for the whole show on YouTube or then want to check in because we're talking about a day of at 11 o'clock. And so we really have lots of different access points that has that has connected because people always tell you about the death of media in this way and that way. There had never been more people who have wanted to connect with late night shows and to hear that point of view. And in the world that we're in right now, people are, are contacting and connecting with comedians who are talking about the news more than ever. It's just about figuring out the best way to deliver that information and that content to them. Content, you hear me saying it? It feels weird

to say content, but it is content. We're all just creators, Jordan. We're all just creators. Yeah. This was awesome. Thank you for your time. I, you know, I'm a huge fan, obviously. Scott is, too, that you got him to cry like that when he came on. It was beautiful, wasn't it? I know. He's such a softy. Yeah. And I mean, the book is great.

And obviously when you're writing essentially about your sons and a love letter to your sons, it's going to get you emotional. But it was a very sweet, whatever, you had eight minutes together. He was, I think that is a lovely book and an important book. So it was wonderful to get a chance to talk to him. And you always, you want to crack that shell. If you can get tears. I get bonuses.

If I can make people cry. or storm off. Oh, is that the secret formula? 10 grand. Just like that. Oh, I like it. I'm just going to start crying on air and see if I can get money. Maybe it'll go fund me to save my little liberal soul. Jordan Klepper, you rage beautifully and moderately. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you, Jessica.