Rahimi, Harris & Grote Show - Best of March Madness: Illinois advances to Sweet 16

Episode Date: March 24, 2026

In the Best of March Madness, Illinois coach Brad Underwood joined the Mully & Haugh Show to discuss his Illini advancing to the Sweet 16 with a pair of dominant wins in the opening weekend of the NCAA Tournament; Mike Mulligan and David Haugh detailed how Illinois’ balanced attack sets it up well to make a deep run in the tournament; and Illini Inquirer publisher Jeremy Werner joined the Rahimi, Harris & Grote Show to break down Illinois’ superb performance early in the NCAA Tournament and to preview its upcoming showdown against Houston in the Sweet 16 on Thursday.

Another second half domination from Illinois. And they get themselves right back to the Sweet 16. Illinois for the second time in three years is moving past the round of 32, this time with a 7655 win over VCU. Mully and Haw, 104-3, the score. We are delighted to welcome in. Our thanks to Westwood won for the highlight, but we're delighted to welcome in,

Brad Underwood, the head coach of Illinois basketball. Coach, good morning. How are you? Thanks. Appreciate you having you on. Well, we appreciate you putting on a show for us. It's been so much fun to see you guys get to the Sweet 16, and now you match up with a Houston team that's playing at home, for God's sake.

But we've decided this is. the best matchup of the Sweet 16. It should be a real cracker of a game. Yeah, it should be. You got two teams that, you know, they play great in their two tournament games and as we did. And, you know, a lot's going to be made about them playing in Houston. And I don't worry about that. I think that you've got a win to advance and you know the Ilinei nation shows up so so we'll be there and you know you've got to play well and whatever team plays the best usually gets the opportunity to move on and we're excited about the opportunity and got a great foe a team that was in the national championship game a year ago it would be hard for you to play better it seems and you did in the

first two games against Penn and VCU coach and congratulations those average margin of victory and those two victories, 28 points I believe, and it looked like you were locked in from the get-go. I'm just curious, what was the biggest reason in your mind your team was as ready as it was? Well, I think we've been talking a lot this year about the margins and about playing every play. And we weren't perfect in either one. You know, we had some lapses. We had a lapse. We had a 10, 12-point lead in the first half.

And they made a nice run, which VCU does. teams do, but, you know, we were uncharacteristic with, I think we had seven turnovers at half, and, you know, in the previous game, we turned the ball over three times. So, you know, it's give the opponent some credit, but, you know, I think we're focused. We've talked a lot about playing every play as hard as we can. I think defensively, we've been really solid in both games, and that'll have to continue. Yeah, you guys are so big and so deep, I think. I that you must feel good about your numbers against anyone. Yeah, and every opponent presents different problems and different challenges.

And, you know, VCU is a terrific three-point shooting team and an explosive team in transition. I thought we did a nice job of contesting them at the rim. And then we, you know, we challenged them on the perimeter and held them to a season low, 55 points. and you know I thought it was started with our interior guys. I thought Thomas Law was very good. And Ben Humory Cow is coming off the bench defensively. You know, in a game when David Murkovic played in some foul problems, you know, and Big Z presents a lot of problems at the rim.

So I thought it started there. And then, you know, obviously Kylin and Andres Dwayakovich and Keaton were rock-solid on the perimeter. Mercovich might have struggled a little bit with foul trouble. in the second game against VCU, but against Pan, he made history. He set an Illinois rebounding record in the incident of a tournament game with 17 boards, and he was just seemingly unstoppable. Coach, you have several guys who could carry you at any given point, and I think that's what makes your team as dangerous as it is,

whether it's Merkovich or Wogler or anybody at any given time. That's got to give you some comfort that you are able to maybe, if there is a dry spell, somebody's going to step up, but it might be somebody different every time. Yeah, and I think that's been one of our keys all season. And, you know, Andre comes in and has 16 and half. You know, went on a personal 9-0 run.

And, you know, I thought Tyler did a good job and putting him in positions to score, you know, right there at the end of the half and we get a nice lead and stymie their run. And then we opened the second half on a nice run. you know it's you know Thomas Love was great with the double double you know Merck is his his ability Keaton got going in the second half the other night so you know I do think we have some weapons Kylin's been rock solid Jake Davis Ben can really really shoot it so I think we've got I think

we've got some weapons there and you know we're just trying to find the right ones at the right time yeah you've got a a heck of a team and you're going to face a good team that the rookie freshman guard of Kingston Fleming's is an awful good player and they've got some depth. I mean, this really sets up to be quite a matchup for you guys. Well, their guards are terrific and they've got three guards that can really, really shoot it, can really score. Kingston gets a lot of the attention because he's a, he's a, he's a, he's a, he's a, draft pick. You know, Sharp is a veteran.

He's made over 300 threes in his career. He's their record holder for that. He's got just incredible range and the ability to score it. And then he's on the returning starter. So, you know, those three guys are very good. McCarty's coming in off the bench and playing great. And then you've got a front court guys. And, you know, the Senat kid is a freshman that's a projected first-round draft

pick. and 6-9 and versatile, and then Tuggler's been around forever. You know, he's just one of the longest, most athletic players in the country. And so there's a lot of weapons there and a team that can really hurt you on the offensive glass. They shoot and miss it, and they go chase it. And we've got to be really solid with on that side of the floor and try to limit them the best we can to not get a bunch of second-chance points. And you've got your own lottery pick and Keaton Walser.

And certainly people who have watched the Big Ten and your season understand what he brings each and every game. As the stage gets bigger and more people watch him, what do you appreciate most about your freshman? Yeah, nothing seems to rattle him. You know, the other night against VCU, and, you know, he picked him up full court. He had kind of an uncharacteristic passing turnover in the back court. But, you know, he had one at half. and he just took what the defense gave him. And every time somebody tries to take him really out of it,

the rest of our guys just step up. And they kind of changed their scheme a little bit in the second half, and then he gets going. And he ended up with 14 and 13 of them in the second half. And it's just nothing gets to him. He's very stoic. He's very composed, no matter what the stage is, or how much attention he's getting.

He just seems to play under control, and that's very unique for a freshman. Can't help but wonder what your thoughts are with so many Big Ten teams playing as well as they are, and so many now in the Sweet 16, and goodness gracious, I mean, you know, your regional has three of them of the four. That's pretty awesome. Well, we've said all year that the league was loaded. And, you know, obviously you've got, you know, Purdue was pick number one preseason and had some ups and downs in the league, and we all did. And Michigan's the number one seed for a reason.

They're the one team that may be skated through the league, the easiest. And yet, you know, you've got, you've got, Purdue got hot and is playing great. And, you know, Nebraska's been there all year. And you've got Iowa as a nine seed that just beat a one. So the league is very, very good. It's got very good guards. It's got positional size. And, you know, that's playing out very well thus far through all the tournament.

One of the underrated things about your team, I believe, Coach, and maybe you could expand on this, as hard as you play defense against VCU, you kept them from going to the foul line. Yeah. And I think they were averaging like 25 free throws a game, and they might have shot maybe six against you. How delicate is that balance between getting your team? to play hard defensively without fouling? Yeah, it's something we emphasize from day one. You know, it's some hard lessons learned in the past.

You know, it's very challenging to not want to use your hands. We start really in June in the summer about, you know, teaching our guys to chest and hip and not use hands and, you know, and play defense without it. And there's a reason we're toward the bottom of nationally in terms of steals is because we're not very handsy, but yet we also don't foul a lot. So, you know, it was nice. They didn't have a free throw attempt in the first half in the VCU game.

And, you know, you just, you know, it's a testament to our guys and their ability to take what they practice and carry it over. When you think about this particular matchup, we know that Houston under Kelvin Sampson is going to come at you with a lot of different players and they're going to try to press the entire game. And everyone knows that they are a team with a great reputation defensively, whereas maybe, and I don't want to oversimplify, but you guys are the great offensive team. offense, defense. Is it as simple as that, or do you think that you guys don't get enough credit for what you managed to do on the class and with your defense? I think that works both ways. I think that, yeah, there's going to be obviously some conversation about their defense

and what they do. And at the end of the day, the great appreciation for Coach Sampson and Kelvin, wherever he's been, he's won because he gets guys. to play really, really hard. And they play with a nastiness and a grit. And we like to think we're doing the same thing. But, you know, everybody talks about their defense, but they're an elite three-point shooting team.

They're very good offensively. They'll punish you on the glass if you don't. And that goes unnoticed. And coaches, we're not letting that go unnoticed. I mean, they're good offensively. but because of how hard they play and, you know, they're going to trap ball screens and hardhead you and do those things. That gets a lot of attention, rightfully so, but it's the most important thing this time of year is you have to play really hard. You have to be gritty, nasty, understand it's a street fight, and not back down, and the person who flenches usually loses in these games.

We're talking with Elinai head to coach Brad Underwood here on the score. you look at yesterday's box score and watch that game, and you see Andre Suryakovich lead the way with 21 points. And he's had an interesting season because coming off the bench, he's given you a spark, but he's been able to come off the bench after starting a little bit. How impressed have you been by his ability to play whatever role you've asked? Yeah, you know, part of that was just injury.

And it was timing, and he's an unbelievable human being. He's just such a great kid. he's so excited to be here and being a part of it. And when he had the high ankle sprain and we were without him and Boswell for a little bit, it was just a challenge to get both of them back into the starting lineup. Jake Davis, Ben Humorick Cowls played very well in their absence. We put Bam in and left Jake in the starting lineup, which has been great for us. and now we've got just a very, very solid defender of 6-7 and Stoyakovich,

but a guy who can change the game. He's opposite of Jake. Jake's a spacer, a shooter, and an elite shooter, and Dre's more of that downhill driver and slasher and finisher at the rim. And it's just given us nice contrast. It's just been a really, really fun thing to see, and he's just, he's been phenomenal in that role. Coach, I know that out of the Big Ten tournament, you talked about how important it is to be physical and dominant,

especially with the size you guys have on the front line. I'm just wondering, could that be an advantage in a game like this? When you think about Houston, they've got solid post players, as you pointed out, but if they have one sort of area of weakness, they can be vulnerable. the times when they go against really physical fronts, is it more important than ever to really have that kind of power up front against the team like this? Yeah, I think that you've got to have a certain level of physicality and everything we do, and it's not just, it gets magnified because it's front core guys and size and everybody thinks

big guys, but it's also on the perimeter. And you look at, you know, Houston's Guard Sharp is a big, physical guard. I mean, he's going to, he'll hit you. And we want to do the same thing. But there's got to be, there's going to be a lot of bodies hidden. You know, there's going to be a lot of bodies flying to the glass. There's going to be, there's going to be some of that. And if you don't bring physicality, they'll just walk all over you. And, you know, it's a mindset as much as anything. And we have to be strong in our conviction and know what we do every day and how hard we practice and know that we're going to face a team that does the same thing

and like I said, you can't blink or flinch, otherwise you're going to get beat. Before we let you go, Coach, we're really enjoying all this success you're having. You look at the women's team as well. They win a tournament game. Illinois is the only school in the country to have won a bowl game, a men's and women's NCAA tournament game in each of the past two seasons.

It must be a lot of fun to be in Champaign right now. No. I didn't know that. I knew we did it last year. I didn't know it was two years in a row, but no, it is spectacular. And all the credit goes to, you know, the administration and Josh Whitman and, and, you know, you don't do this alone. And, you know, it's, it's, it's, uh, there's a lot of student athletes walking around with their heads held high on campus and enjoying the moment. And there's, there's students here that, you know, can say they've been here. at an unbelievable time. And, you know, it's Brett's done an incredible job on the football side of stabilizing that and continuing success. And Sean is obviously in the midst of a great run. And, you know, it's just, it's just a wonderful place to be. The university's booming.

There's cranes everywhere. There's new buildings going up. And, you know, we've got the best fans in the country. And it's just a, it's just a. unbelievable time to be here and especially, you know, on the basketball side right now with two teams still playing. Great stuff, Coach. Congratulations. We're really looking forward to the game coming up. It should be a great one. Thanks, Coach. Appreciate it. Thank you. That is Brad Underwood. It's done a great job. We forgot to ask him about the start time and can he move that up for us.

You think you can do that? I don't know. I don't know. They're probably willing to play a 505. I mean, are you kidding me? Could they do that for us? 505. Could you imagine that? That would be perfect. Just as soon as the Cubs game ends, they tip off. If life could only be played on our terms.

Why can't it? Start of the first half. He went right down the left alley, missed it with the right hand inside. And then the rebound finally claimed by Jennings of ECU, left to right. Oh, look out. Lazare Djokovic was trying to catch a body. Had it blocked by Evasus. Who runs the floor and posters a man.

Big Z with big plays on both ends. Defense to offense. Illinois leads 4632. Mully and Haw. Wow, Illinois, that is compliments of Westwood One. Both those highlights compliments. They were emphatic. They were ready and good for Brad Underwood that the line eye had no letdown.

It wasn't even close. They took care of Penn handily in round one. And all the people that were wondering if VCU was going to be the Cinderella story, the team that ousted North Carolina and set Tar Hill Nation into chaos over the weekend, wondering if Hubert Davis will return or not. VCU didn't have it. They weren't good enough to stop Illinois that looks like a team on a mission. Unfortunately, that mission runs right through Houston and is in Houston's backyard. and Kelvin Sampson, their team is going to be ready defensively. Illinois will be at its best offensively, and you have strength on strength.

Illinois's offense against Houston's defense, and it's going to be worth waiting up for because you're going to have to stay up late Thursday night to watch it. Yeah, I mean... 905 tip, Molly. It's easy for you to say that, buddy. I'm not laughing. I'm laughing because it beats crying because it's bad for us. Oh, that's not easy for us.

We're looking at it through that prism. Yeah. But good for Illinois. Good for Brett Underwood. We'll talk to him in the 9 o'clock hour. Yes. And this is exactly the kind of first weekend in the incident of a tournament they needed to have. And they envisioned having, they were ready for this moment.

Yeah, they were. And, you know, when you're in the best conference in basketball and you're playing the best teams in the country weekly, you are going to be ready. And they've gone through really a half. heck of a year and I think everybody from Illinois feels pretty good about the representation of Illinois. They should. They're deep.

They're talented. They've got contributions from almost everybody in the starting lineup. Now, when they say deep, we're talking about seven or eight players. They don't go much beyond that. But they have what the beauty of Illinois is, I think this tournament and this season is that they have several players that could lead them any night. You look at Wogler. He is the guy that was, he's the lottery pick.

He's probably the face of the team in terms of just being the guy's most dangerous. But you also have Boswell. You like his experience. And then you've got the Murkiewicz. You've got I've got Stoyakovich. You've got the, I loved Bill Raftery. Take me to the Balkans. Raff was great.

Ralph was great. And you have a lot of different. options. And I think Brad Underwood has done a terrific job just every year it seems like there's a different mix of talent. And Illinois right now feels like there's 16 teams left. You could make the argument for how many of them are final four caliber teams. I would think between 8 and 10, legitimately have a shot. Well, I mean, you know, there's one top C. that's out. All the two seeds are still in. I'm just, I got to glance at the three seats.

All right, Iowa, they may not think their final four, really. But, you know, Nebraska, that's going to be a fun game. That's going to be a fun game from a Big Ten perspective because they have split the first two. Iowa won at Iowa, 57 to 52. That was a court storming. Yes. That Fred Hoeryberg cut. Fred had to get people away from me.

Get away from my heart. Yeah. Get away. Get that phone away from me. and he had a reaction and then an apology or an explanation. And so that was the first time they played. And then Nebraska got the best of them in Lincoln, 8475. This is the rubber match.

And this is the fun one. So this will be in Houston as the precursor to Illinois, Houston after that Thursday night. Why is that game so late? There's nothing we can do about it. I know. Take a nap after the socks game. It's damn rude. Watch the Cubs, listen to the Cubs, watch the socks.

Yeah, no, I know what you got to do. When I understand, we got a weekend to recover and I get it. It just stinks. You're taking it personally. I'm pretty. You're back from vacation. You're taking it personally. Yeah, well, so what's the point?

Because I took some time I had come in, I'm not allowed to take you personally when I lose. No, no, but you should be rested up. We should be rested up for Thursday night. Yeah, but by Thursday night, I won't be rested up. You certainly won't have a restful weekend. But that's going to be a fun night of basketball. Yes. Because in the South region, you've got, I would say three of those teams conceivably could legitimately say their final four caliber teams.

I would hope. But probably more likely to. Yeah. Illinois Houston, the winner of that game will likely be a final four team. I think the Nebraska part of it, I am convincing myself because I like the story. I like the success of Fred Hoeryberg He's had You like the story a little too much

Why? I don't know Why would you got against Hoyberg? Well, I mean His kid won the game I know His kid's a great story He's 23 years old

Celebrated his birthday With a tip in How old is he? 23 I think Yeah How old are you supposed to be in college? You look around college basketball I understand

These guys are They're long enough to get tenure I got it So I just saying I don't think it's a lot easier Why do you not like Hoiberg? It's a lot easier to be 23 and make that play than if you're 19.

If you're an actual college student. Hoyberg had a tough go with the Bulls. I know he did. I was around. Tough go. He did. He had some really strong-minded, strong-willed players. He was so riveting, though.

He's such a great leader and it meant everything to the Bulls. I don't know. I'm just not a Fred Hoyberg guy. I don't know why. Frankly, I'm uncertain as to why you are. I think Iowa is a better story, and the guy that's the Division II champion is a better story than the Brath game.

Ben McCollum, the coach, and Bennett Sturts the player? Well, Sturt's another guy that started at Division II, right? He was from that North Coast Missouri. Okay, let's face it. You want to call up my bias for Hoyberg? you just like the Missouri Valley Conference aspect of Iowa. The influence. Oh, you mean the fact that he came from Drake?

Yeah. That's what I like. No, I like the fact that the guy was born in Iowa. Isn't he from Iowa? And the fact that he's a fairly young coach, he's a hell of a coach. And he kind of brought himself up by the bootstraps and went from Division II directly to, to Drake and had a pretty good team.

Matt McCollum is very impressive coach. No doubt about it. He is. He's 44 years old. He's from Iowa City. He's a native. Yeah. And when you see him, when you see him, when you see their team in the layup line before the game, they don't look big enough to actually win a game. No, they don't. It's pretty extraordinary. It looks like Hickory. It really is. So that, I like that little visual a lot more than

I like the Holy Burke story. All right, that's fine. But they're both good stories. They're both good stories, but I think they will come to an end. I don't think that either one of those teams has a realistic shot at beating the winner of Illinois Houston. I do think the Illinois Houston But Iowa did beat Florida.

And I would not have thought, again, Florida is a giant team. I wouldn't have thought they had a chance to beat Florida. I thought Florida really didn't. They're shots selection left a lot to be desired. No doubt. And I think that they just ran into a team that was the one thing about Iowa and Nebraska, they do make a lot of good decisions with the basketball.

Yes. And they're smart teams and they don't tend to beat themselves. Right. And when you run up against teams like that in the tournament and if they can hold their own defensively, then offensively they will probably be good enough. Now, I don't know if that's going to be good enough against the team like Houston that I think it has final four potential and could get to the final game. But they do have enough to be where they are right now, which is... I agree. I agree. I like Illinois.

I thought Florida was going to be the team as well. I thought Florida was going to play Nebraska, and then they were going to prevail, and that Florida Houston game was going to be a fun one. And the Illinois VCU game, VCU has... I can't think of the guy's name. The player, he's always on the free throw line. They kept him off the line. line. What they did is they did not foul him. So here's a guy that like leads the nation

in free throw, a number of free throws and they didn't send them to the line. They're smart defense, good defense. And yeah, Illinois has done pretty much everything right in this tournament so far. And you like the way that they're trending. You like the way that they're dunking. They're playing a little bit of defense and they're spreading the basketball around. And Wogler is doing just enough. He's an impressive young man. Whether it's on the court, certainly, which we all can appreciate, or handling himself in these interviews, which the NCAA tournament

puts these guys front and center. You can't hide. You can't go to a locker room. They're front and center. And Keaton Wogler has represented himself in this program quite well. As for the Illini and our guy, Jeremy Werner, Jeremy, what I like about these first two wins,

for Illinois, although there were some stuffy moments in the first half of both of these games, like a 10-0 VCU run in the first half when the Illini were starting to run away with it. For the most part, no funny stuff. The Illini were supposed to win these two games, and they did it in grand style in both cases. Yeah, they won by a combined 56 points against these double-digit seeds. They out-rebounded these teams by plus 39. Yeah, this is what you want. You want to physically impose your will, and they got a break.

VCU beating North Carolina. Now, I didn't think North Carolina was going to be much of an issue for Illinois either, but obviously a little bit more talent on that North Carolina team. But this is what happens when you get number three seats. Sometimes you get a break in front of you in the bracket. It happened two years ago for Illinois. And both those years, Illinois has dominated the pod to advance to the Sweet 16. And that sets them up to, you know, potentially make the Final Four. Their biggest test of potentially getting there is the Sweet 16 game, which is basically a final four caliber showdown between Illinois and Houston. But, yeah, Illinois was physical. I thought they set the tone from the start.

And even though they had some wolves in the first half, they quickly put those away and just had dominant second half. So that's the kind of mentality you wanted to see. It's kind of the physicality. It's kind of the roster flex that you wanted to see Illinois impose on lower level opponents. and it's something they've done all year. Against teams outside the top 30 of the Ken Palm ratings, Illinois went 20 and nothing this year. Now you get your chance at a premier program in Houston. Jeremy, play time over.

You said they got the break and took advantage of it. The breaks are clearly over having to go against a two-seat in Houston, in Houston, which is insane, except for this is kind of a thing that they have carved out for themselves, by the way that they played over the last month or so against top teams. and now I just have one question. Is this game going overtime? Because that's usually how this goes. Well, hopefully not for Illinois because they went over and overtime this year.

So their record has not been very good there. But listen, I thought Houston was the best team in this bracket. All kudos to Florida for their season. But I just didn't think the SEC was all that great. And Florida took advantage of that. And they were the best team in that conference. But Houston, what they've done through in the Big 12, clearly one of the best teams.

They returned three starters in the back court from, last year's NCAA runner-up. So this is a really good team and just the style they play. Illinois hasn't faced this all year. The good thing is you got a little taste of it with VCU, with the pressure that they play at, forcing turnovers, but it's nothing like the athletes, the quickness, and just the pressure that Kelvin Samson's program puts on.

This is, I think, could be their biggest test until potentially a national title game. I think Houston is so, so good. So I really respect what they do because Duke's the other one seed that they would play potentially in the final four. Michigan State they've played already. So I just think Houston is a national title caliber kind of team. Kingston Fleming's is a kind of quick guard, a top five pick that Illinois struggled to stop all year. But I also think Illinois poses some problems from Houston. Illinois does pass well out of these traps.

Illinois has got big guys who can really spread it around as passers. it really well over this pressure when they play in rotation. And then Illinois's got better size than Houston. This is a bigger team that Illinois has rather than Houston. So Illinois has a chance to beat them up on the glass. But you better bring it mentally because Houston wants to make this a boxing match. And at times, Illinois has struggled with that with teams. But I do like how they played the last couple games.

But they got to bring their A game from the start. Otherwise, Houston's a type of team that can bury it, can force turnovers. and make you question yourself. So if Illinois comes out with the same mentality they did in Greenville, they'll give themselves a chance. Absolutely. Can't wait for that game on Thursday, Houston. And the Illini, as Jeremy Werner,

just telling us here, the publisher of the Aligni Inquirer.com on Rahimi Harris and Grody. And you wrote about it a little bit. And, you know, just doing the research on Brad Underwood, credit where credit is due, it's easy to forget that there was an eight-year tournament drought for the fighting Alinai. And this man has restored order.

What kind of credit does Brad Underwood have? Because I think sometimes it's easily taken for granted because we expect like the signature college in the state of Illinois to thrive. But that's not always the case. No, it wasn't, Mark, for years, for a decade. It wasn't the case. Bruce Weber was great in leading Illinois to the 2005 national title run. The next year, James Augustine and D. Brown were still here. But he just did not maintain that.

And that's a credit to what Bill's self, Lon Kruger, you know, Lou Henson before them had built. but after that 05 run, this program was a middling Big Ten team for the most part and then fell during John Gross's tenure to a bottom half Big Ten team. So the fact that Brad has built this from his first two years in that rebuild, losing more games in a two years stretch than Illinois has ever had to a point where now the expectation is to get to a Sweet 16, like that is the bar he is set. And credit to him, he said that needs to be the bar. We should be competing for national championships here and Big Ten championships here.

But it shouldn't be overlooked that, you know, Illinois fans now can complain about not making elite eights or final fours or winning Big Ten championships. Because Brad Underwood has lifted this program from the bottom half of the Big Ten to one of the best programs in the Big Ten, one of the best rosters. Illinois is now an NBA factory. That's all because of Brad Underwood. And his hires, his ability to change scheme, go to an NBA state. offense and get the guys from overseas, find guys like Keaton Wogler, and develop them into NBA players. So he deserves all the credit in the world. I think he's building something similar to what Lou Henson is doing. And Lou Henson got to one final four. That's the next

check for Brad Underwood is to get there. He's got a huge test in front of him. But if you're able to beat Houston, set up a game where you would be the favorite over Nebraska, Iowa, for the chance to get to the final four. I think that would solidify Brad Underwood is one of the two best coaches to ever be at Illinois because Bill Self was only here three years. But that would solidify him

as one of the nation's elite coaches. I think he's already been kind of in that conversation beginning of the final four. He gets there. There's no doubt he's one of those guys. I love hearing that. He is on the right trajectory.

Jeremy, thank you so much. We always appreciate your insights. Love reading you. Love hearing you, man. Thanks, Jeremy. All right, thanks, guys.