Rahimi, Harris & Grote Show - Interviews of the Week on 104.3 The Score: Feb. 23-27

Episode Date: March 1, 2026

In Interviews of the Week on 104.3 The Score, Blackhawks legend Jeremy Roenick joined the Spiegel & Holmes Show to celebrate Team USA men's hockey beating rival Canada to win the gold medal at the Winter Olympics; author Wayne Drehs joined the Spiegel & Holmes Show to share insight on his feature story for Chicago Magazine on Cubs center fielder Pete Crow-Armstrong; and former Bears running back Raymont Harris joined the Spiegel & Holmes Show to reflect on life after football and how he has found balance with his mental health.

And it's Worenski. Now Jack Hughes, pushing around McCaff. United States with Humber's. Black across it comes. Matthew Kachuk. Dad Keith has a silver medal. He was a four-time Olympian.

One silver in Salt Lake, 2002. Matthew Kachuk said, leading up to this game, we aren't playing for ourselves. We are playing for our country. For the guys that came before us, and for the generation

that will come after that. A little sweeter for Team USA when you can beat your arch rival in a gold medal game at the Winter Olympics. Kenny Albert and Eddie Olick on the call there for NBC as Keith Kichuk

is referenced the 2002 U.S. Olympic team in Salt Lake City that earned a silver is referenced and a man who was on that team. time Olympian, the U.S. Hockey Hall of Famer, the Blackhawks legend, and simply put, one of the greatest American hockey players of all time.

Jeremy Roanick joins us right now on the score. It is me, Matt Spie, and him, Ryan McGuffey with Jeremy Roanick on the show. What's up, J.R.? Thank you for the time. My guys in Chicago wouldn't be a celebration without

getting to talk to my guys and talk to my people in Chicago. What a great day to be an American, huh? How, how about it, man. That was so electric to gather, however we all did, and we've been talking about it, and watch that together. We knew it was going to be great because it's the best on the best, but then it was even better than that, wasn't it? That was unbelievable. Where were you watching? What was that like for you? It was better than the best. And I'm going to say it was probably one of the best, if not the best hockey game I've ever seen. And I say that with the speed,

with the playmaking, with the goaltending, with the adrenaline. And unfortunately, or fortunately, I was watching the game from an airport in Canada. Wow. And I can't even tell you. I can't even tell you how uncomfortable I was sitting at the restaurant bar where everybody knew I was sitting there and watching it amongst a bunch of Canadians. And I'm the only one cheering. And that place turned to a morgue after that goal went in.

airport went quiet except for me and I started cheering but I do have to say wait hold on J.R. J.R. Did they know who you were? Did they realize they're with American hockey royalty? I'm in Canada. I'm in Canada. Everywhere I go in Canada, everywhere I go in Canada, everybody knows who I am. Everybody. You know, I had 10 women came up to me and asked me to take a picture with me before the end of the game and then I will say this. They were very gracious in their loss to me. They came out to me and said, congratulations. What an amazing achievement.

I'm sure they said some things under their breath as they left, but they were gracious to me, and it was great. It really was. All right, Jay, so the two of us are watching this game, obviously in different locations. Speeagues is Arizona at the time, and I'm here in Chicago. When Hughes scores the goal, the goosebumps and the emotion that I feel

pale in comparison to someone who's actually part of the bridge that got to 2026. Explain to people. There's so much comparison, and is this team better than that team, and everyone wants to compare eras and teams, et cetera, in 2026. Explain how important it is to someone of your stature, someone who played in the Olympics, someone who chased the dream of winning gold, how important yesterday was. It was as important as 1980 was for me and for the generation that I played.

which really that was the generation that put USA hockey on the world power map. You know, in 1996, we won the World Cup, we beat Canada in the World Cup, and that was really the first time that we beat Canada in the major international event, which literally was the biggest thing since 1980. I know where I was in 1980 when Mike Ruzziangoon scored that goal, and I wanted to be a professional hockey player because of that goal. What happened yesterday, and I should just say in 2022, we were on that world stage again, playing in the Olympic gold medal against Canada, and we lost. In 2010, we were on that stage in the gold medal game, and we lost.

The fact that we were able to pull it off this time, and by the way, I also have to say, we weren't the better team yesterday. We had the better goalie. There's no question, but we weren't the better team. I mean, you look at Canada, they played great. They missed opportunity after opportunity after opportunity. And our goaltender was just, it was his day yesterday. And we found the way to get it done. And that's so special for not only U.S. and for my generation,

but for Mike Ruzioni's generation, who has a lot of satisfaction over where American hockey is today. But the kids that watched that game yesterday and watched how awesome that they were, how they treated the, you know, their comments afterwards, to see their patriotism afterwards. The level of class that not only the U.S. men showed, but also the U.S. women, we cannot take away from the U.S. women in what they did. They were the best, I think that was the best female hockey team ever assembled in the world

was our U.S. women's team. So just a really good thing for American hockey, USA hockey. it shows how dedicated that our sport has been to making America great. Jeremy Roanick is on the score right now, talking about the U.S. winning gold yesterday morning against Canada in the Olympics. I love that whole answer, J.R., because this is the gift of aging. We get to be around long enough to remember how important 80 was, and then you traced beautifully what happened in the 96 World Cup.

And we were talking earlier how good Ryan Miller was when the USA almost got it done of Vancouver, right? In 2010. And your team in 2002, when you guys win silver, were you able to enjoy silver? Or did you feel like, damn it? Great question. What did it feel like to you? Great question. You know what they say if you're not first, you're last, right?

Ricky Bobby. But listen, it's a little bit different in the Olympics because to win an Olympic medal, whether it's bronze or even silver, is a very, very special honor. It's an Olympic medal. And silver is an amazing accomplishment for me. It was probably one of the best moments of my career. But I will have to tell you, I watched the medal ceremony. yesterday and I watched all the Canadians get their medals and I saw the look on their face of sheer disappointment, sadness, anger, missed opportunity. And I know exactly how they felt because I was

there in 2002 and I could care less about the medal at that time. I especially could have cared less of the stuffed animal that they passed out afterwards. Like, that thing went right into the garbage, and I'm sure it did also with the Canadians. But it was, it's not a great, it's not a great thing, but I have to tell you this. I felt a very satisfying feeling that the Canadians finally felt what I felt and what the Americans have felt so many times at the heels of their, of their wins. It's just, it was just such a gratifying, such a gratifying day for me. Listen, the Canadians are a great team, probably the best team in the world with some of the best players in the world, if not the top three best players in the world. But our U.S. team are grinders.

They show why team matters. They show why determination and commitment to each other. And, you know, you put up in a one game scenario, anything can happen. And you know what? They made it happen. And I'm so proud of them and so proud of our country. and she said just it's just let's just let's just celebrate this as a country you know we need something like this to bond a little bit even though there's some people that are still trying

to take away from it politically let's not make let's make sure that that doesn't happen because I hate the division in our country and this is something that we can all all celebrate I want to you said it great a couple answers ago about the best team on the ice was were the Canadians, but the best goaltender was on the United States. Halebuck, obviously, like, standing on the head to me is an insult to what he did yesterday in that game because he was so

abnormal. I mean, the picture that's going to hang in his trophy room forever of that bird's eye of blocking with the stick, I still don't know. I watch it 300 times, and I don't understand how he made that save, and he probably doesn't either. The problem I had was after the game

when you had the Canadians, when you had McKinnon saying, we were the best team on the ice. There was no mention of Hellebuck. You had Cooper talking about gimmicky three on three. And here's why I have a problem with the JR. Maybe it's just part of the sore losing that comes with it and being shocked and stunned at the end result is that there wouldn't have been those comments had they won the game. There would have been no mention. If Canada won the gimmicky three on three in the Olympic, they won gold, Cooper wouldn't have said a damn word. So I just was surprised. And it goes, to me, it's part of the taste that feels so damn good today. It's 100%. And it's 100%. And

And you have to expect it, right? Because I am going to say this again. You're a hellabuck save that you just said. If Devon Taves has that opportunity a hundred times, again, he makes it a hundred times. If he has it a thousand times, he's going to make it a thousand times. That just happened to be one in ten million that he got it, okay? I'll take it. It doesn't matter.

I will take it. And I also agree with you. Listen, not everybody likes the rules. The rules are the rules because they make them the same for everybody. By the way, Canada had three on three also in the quarterfinal game, and Marner scored an overtime goal then. But you didn't hear them complaining about three on three. Do they want to take back their quarterfinal win and say it really wasn't fair?

No, they're not going to do that. The fact is say, oh, it's three on three. By the way, three on three benefits Canada. with McDavid, with McKinnon, with McCar, with Celebrini that you can throw on the ice at all times. I'm not taking anything away from the U.S. team. They'll even tell you that going against them is the scariest thing in the world. Bulls for your loss. And by the way, McKinnon, McKinnon who was afraid who said that it's three on three, it's BS,

he had a wide open net with four minutes left in the game. And I tell you, wide open net, and he hit the post. he should probably be looking at that mess and yelling at himself rather than complaining about the rules. Jeremy Ronek here on the score with Spiegel and Holmes, Lawrence is off, Ryan McGuffie is in. All right, you guys talk about Hellabuck. I got to ask you, as a hockey player, as a guy who scored as much as you have, JR. You know, that guy, I'm one of those people. I really like hockey.

I like watching hockey, but I didn't watch a lot of Winnipeg Jets games. Man, I didn't. So this guy wins the Vezina. This guy wins the heart. the MVP, so he's obviously unbelievable, but watching him yesterday, who, who, I mean, he's so big and so calm and steady. His presence is just so enormous, but then when he's got a move, he's quick, and he's efficient and it's like elegant. That's, how many better goalies have you seen in your life than the way that guy played yesterday? He's definitely been on a heater

the last couple years, but I will tell you, he has also gotten a bad rap because he's, the best goaltender that hasn't won or hasn't gotten to the finals. And in the Four Nations last year, he was the losing goaltender in the Four Nations. So you take all those things into consideration. He deserved to get the results that he got in yesterday's game. I mean, he, yes, you're right, he's an MVP. He's a Vesna trophy winner. And now he's Olympic gold medal winner because, and I will tell you,

He is the main reason why they have that gold medal, and it couldn't be a better guy to maybe have that bestowed upon him because he's just been so good over the last couple years. All right, so I've got to ask you about 2002 when Keith Kachuk is your teammate, were the boys around at all? Like the two boys. So one was five, one was three in 2002. Tell us what you remember about the Kachuk boys who won gold yesterday.

Well, listen, I played with Keith Kachuk when the boys were born. I was there for six years with Keith. So I was one of the first human beings to meet Matthew and Brady when they were born. I was in the locker room avoiding tape balls getting shot across the locker rooms from these guys, these little guys. And they have been around the game. They were with us in the locker room in Salt Lake. They've been around the history of the game. They've been taught by their father to respect the game and to play the game the right way and to be a good teammate and be a good leader.

And they've done nothing but show that with the teams that they play on with Florida and Ottawa. And they just continue to be the best teammates and the best representation of hockey, whether it's a national hockey or now, today with the USA. I'm so proud of those two boys. I've known them their entire lives, and it doesn't surprise me because their father, who deserves to be in the Hall of Fame, hopefully that happens soon, was an amazing role model for them. Yeah, the beauty of the game. It's the beauty of sports. You get the Kachuk brothers, you get the Hughes brothers. There's so many damn good stories that came out of yesterday, 46 years to the day of the gold medal game. There's just so, there's just, the beauty of sports is everywhere.

And then I feel myself today this afternoon, like post-12. 24 hours going. How do we keep that going? Oh, the Black Hawks. I just feel like I don't, there's no baton to what was going on at the United Center right now. And I just, it just aches me because in 2010, you know, you know the dynasty. And so to not have that right now, a young Hawks team like kind of on the come, it's just, it feels incomplete to me. Do you feel that same way? No. There's nothing that's going to make me. There's nothing that's going to make me feel incomplete. I knew that. And I will tell you, you know, as being a proud Blackhawk, I'm really proud of the way that the team is playing this year.

It's a much better team to watch. It's a much better, much more united team. It's a team that plays hard for each other. They are competitive every single night. This team will be back making the playoffs very soon because of the players that they have and some of the players that are on their way to Chicago. So I am excited about that. But, you know, again, you can't expect more than having the best players in the world on center stage and going to a gold medal. I mean, obviously, anything is going to be less than that.

So you've got to keep it into perspective. But, you know, I got to tell you, in 1989, when I played my first Black Hawk's playoff game, I got my teeth knocked out, three teeth knocked out, and got 15, 16, 16. stitches in the nose in St. Louis and scored the winning goal that game. And I had this biggest smile. It was the ugliest smile of all time after that game. I looked like I just went through a war and I looked at Jack Hughes yesterday and saw the same person, the same look, the same feel, and the biggest smile. He could care less about the pain. He can care less about how he looked. He was so proud. And it just reminded me what hockey is all about. And that is you play for your

team, you play for your country, pain is secondary, the pride is forever, and there's nothing that's going to keep the guys from going out there and trying to win for their team and for their country. And I just, I couldn't be more proud of that kid or that whole team yesterday. I love that you brought up that memory, man. That's amazing. So look at all the levels you were feeling yesterday, JR. Look at all the different ways that that thing was resonating. I couldn't, I couldn't share them with anybody because I was in an airport full of Canadian. I mean, it's kind of beautiful that you were, though. You'll never forget that.

Oh, it was fantastic. It was fantastic. Well, right now, like, I mean, the listeners are enjoying this so much. Texer said the three greatest U.S. hockey players, Ronik, Chelyos, and Kane, and all are Blackhawks. Let's go. I love it. I'm going to have to agree. I'm going to have to agree with that wholeheartedly 100%.

I had a chance to talk to Shelley this morning. you know, we call him the godfather of American hockey. And, you know, to hear his excitement. And, you know, the team FaceTimed Shelley in the locker room after the game to celebrate with him because he's, you know, he means so much to USA hockey. And it just made me feel so good. It's just been an amazing array of emotions today. And, you know, I get to go on podcasts and radio stations like yourself.

I'll be on Fox News tonight with Jesse, Jesse Waters talking about it. I can't. It's just going to, it's just a. really good day to be an American, good day to be a hockey player. And, you know, I just, I'm beaming. I'm beaming. J.R., you're the best, man.

Thank you for making time for us. We appreciate it. I always love catching us. You're the best. And thank you for helping us to appreciate this even more from yesterday. We're going to go get some Aurelio's pizza in your honor. Yes, it's the sauce, man. It's the sauce. Go get it.

I'll go get it. I love it. Thanks, thanks, Jeremy. Appreciate you. Thanks, guys. See you, J.R. that's Jeremy Ronick right there. They facetimed Chelly from the locker room.

Dude, there's so much from that. They FaceTime Chelle. They FaceTime Chelli, the godfather of American hockey. The respect that these kids have for the ones that came before. It's beautiful. It's how it's supposed to be. And the ones that came before have respect for them. They're sending it right back.

That's why. Let's go. I grew up going to Dodgers games when they weren't always good, when they had, like, Manny Wood pop up. But it's like they go in phases. And I remember like, you know, all fans fight and stuff, but like putting the Giants fan in the coma, like that stuck with me as a kid. Like, it's little things, you know.

And sitting in the stands, just nasty stuff goes on. I didn't always experience that at other ballparks. But like I said, that has nothing to do with who's actually on the field for them. I love playing against them. And I just love what they're doing right now because they're creating a dynasty. but I want to take them down too Chicago Magazine has a piece on PCA it's called Welcome to the Show

Photography by Evan Sheehan is really outstanding and you can see some of it online if you want at Chicagomag.com The writer of the piece is our friend Wayne Drey's who joins us now here on the score Wayne thanks for joining us man we appreciate it Yeah, of course. It's good to talk to you guys. Good afternoon. Good afternoon. Yeah, we haven't talked to you since the Connor Bedard piece, which was phenomenal.

But this piece is amazing. There's so much good stuff in here. Like, Pete is really falling for the city. Isn't he? Like, I love Chicago more and more. The people are great. They give a crap, is what Pete says in your article. I feel like he gets us after reading this. Yes, he does. he loves the authenticity of the city. He loves the edge of the city. He told me he's really falling in love with it, you know.

And I don't know if he knew, you know, his dad's from Naperville. You know, obviously, Naperville is we're well-versed. I live there. It's a little different than Chicago. But he just loved the vibe of the city connecting with fans and the bleachers. I'll tell you, it has been so entertaining seeing Dodgers fans twist them. themselves into a pretzel the last couple of days over that quote. I knew when Pete said it, I was like, oh, this is going to rile some people up.

But really, like, I didn't think it would become what it has, in part because the quote was more about how much he loves Chicago than it was a shot at L.A. To your point, Wayne, he finishes by saying they aren't just baseball fans who go to the game like Dodgers fans to take pictures and whatever. They are paying attention. They care. I didn't realize people are running with that. He's just praising Chicago.

That's what he's doing. I mean, yeah, with a little knock on L.A., which is fine. You know, I appreciate, I mean, you guys know this, right? Like, in this world, give me the athlete who speaks their mind, who is real, who is genuine, who isn't, you know, sanitized by all their PR handlers. Give me that 10 times out of 10 over somebody who's manufactured. I mean, I just, I wish we had more people like PCA, you know, like Ben Johnson, taking shots at the Packers who say what they're thinking. This is your wheelhouse. These are the types of really incredible interviews that you've done for over two decades in our business.

What made PCA a compelling figure for you? Yeah, you know, Lawrence, when he first came up and I watched him on the field, you know, I think, it's pretty easy to immediately build a stereotype. And I'm going to use his words here that sometimes he looked. So I saw this guy come up who acted that way, and you sort of wonder, is that who he is? And then every time I would see him in an interview or, you know, last fall when he wrote that little piece he did for the Players Tribune, and you hear how incredibly introspective he is and

self-aware he is. I was like, okay, I'm like, there's a great tension here. You know, when I went to Chicago Mag and kind of pitch this idea of like, look like, I think P is a fascinating character, you know, that there's sort of, there's persona on the field and the person he

is off the field and kind of the tension between them. And I'm so grateful. I mean, I love to do these stories. There's, you know, far fewer places to do them now, and I'm grateful that we have, you know, a magazine like Chicago that still invest in these long-form stories, and we still can tell them. It's a good one to have around the house.

I subscribe to the hard copy so I can read stuff like this and take my time with it, and there was a joy to do so. That tension is fascinating. He talked a lot to you about the emotional troubles. A time. That plague him with so much awareness, he says about the emotions and the emotions. anger. The emotions and the anger tired me out. You

could see it in the second half. I know that sets me up for failure, but it's the truth. I mean, that's fascinating to be a young kid and know that and still not be able to stop it. That's relatable. A hundred percent. The question that I asked

him, going down that path, I asked him, how do you balance the way you play the game, your hair on fire, with sort of this laid back, let it go approach that you have to have in a game where you are going to fail far more

than you're going to succeed. And he looked at me and he was like, I suck at it. And then that just opened the door to really kind of dig it in and talking about that. You know, he told me that, you know, he would go home at night and toss and turn and not be able to sleep because he's pissed at himself,

not because he, you know, went 0 for 4 or struck out or whatever. because of the way he would slam his helmet and handle those struggles. And, you know, he goes, I think to myself, I didn't put this in the piece, but he didn't know, I think to myself, there are a bunch of kids that are at Wrigley today watching me play that are big fans. And then they're going to go home to, you know, frigging Winnaka or whatever it is. And they're little league game next week and slam their helmet, you know,

and act like a jerk because they think that's okay. And he's like, I have to figure out how to find this balance. I thought the line that John Maley said to me that he calls Pete the Hulk because Pete's trying to figure out when to be Bruce Banner and when to turn green, I thought that was so spot on. What's crazy is that we did maybe four or five shows

about this last season because it bothered Speaks. Speaks had gone to a game. You were what in the on-deck circle basically sitting, right? Yeah, I was close enough to see it play out the way that you're talking about. and I said something like exactly what Pete said to you. Like, man, there's kids watching this, and they're going to go do it. And we brought it up to Craig Counsel, and counsel was beautiful about it,

a beautiful response saying the same stuff that makes Pete great is the stuff that can get in his way. So how do you work on that if you're a young ball player, Wayne? I mean, I think, you know, if I knew I would be a ball player speaks, but I think that it comes with, I think it comes with experience. I think it comes with having perspective. You know, I think, you know, Nico and, you know, Ian Hap and Dansby and now Alice Bregman are incredible resources. And, you know, we saw last year with Pete and Justin Turner, he kind of globs on to those veterans and tries to learn from them. You know, I think the first step in this is to understand it's a problem and face it.

And obviously Pete is aware of that. And so, you know, the fine line. that Craig is trying to manage is look like you need that energy. He is in many ways the emotional engine of that team. You want him flying out of the dugout to celebrate a walk-off and, you know, pounded his chest when he legs out of triple, whatever the case may be. But finding the line of playing that way and then, you know,

not essentially having a temper tantrum when you strike out in a key spot and understanding, that's the game, right? Like, the key to being a successful baseball player is accepting and understanding that you are going to fail more than you succeed and learning how to deal with that. And at the highest level, he knows he has to do that. And I think him knowing it is a big, big first step. Wayne Dre is joining us here on Spiego and Holmes

as we talk about the piece that Wayne wrote for Chicago Magazine. Please go read it. ChicagoMag.com. you can check it out on PCA. You've done profiles of hundreds of players across a bunch of different sports. And I'm sure that the concept of dealing with failure has come up multiple times. Is there anyone that you can think of that Pete may be comps to, or you think might be a good guiding light on how you should approach this next phase of his career?

Boy, that's a great question, Lawrence. You know, I'm thinking, Pete's a little bit unique in that the time that I'm writing about him is so early in his career. And a lot of the people that I wrote about over the years were further along. You know, I think of, you know, Michael Phelps or Lewis Hamilton, who would have won a lot already, right? But I'll tell you, I have another story coming out next month in Chicago Magazine

about someone you know well, Kelly Amont. Hiller. And I kind of explored the years when Northwestern lacrosse didn't win and what was wrong. And she has an incredible take on the way she had to recalibrate how she coaches. And essentially, she had to learn how to lose in order to get back to winning. And I think there's many parallels there with failure and learning to accept failure. look, you know, I've said to Kelly, it's a lot easier to say it's okay to lose when you've got, you know, eight and say titles on your resume, right?

But I do think, like, there are parallels there in the mental approach. She's incredibly well-versed in that, but understanding the mental approach to the game and how you have to deal with that is so critical. Wayne, we know you love baseball, and it's that failure piece, man. And I'm thinking about so many different things. I always think of a, Ted Williams asked about it after he had 400. How do you feel? He said, how would you feel if your boss gave you 10 jobs to do and you did six of them wrong?

You know, it's like these guys torture themselves. Does anybody torture themselves more than baseball players among athletes? No, I don't think so. I mean, I don't think that there's a sport where you fail as much as baseball, right? I mean, I've coached both of my daughters and their softball teams. and, you know, that is the biggest challenge of teaching kids that in early age is like, hey, like, it is, you are going to strike out, you are going to fail. You just said, right, Sir William is going to be the greatest sitter of all time, and he failed six out of ten times, and that's the best to ever do it. So, no, I mean, that is the sport to me where failure is so prominent, and you know what, I mean, you know this, Speaks, but it is a team sport.

that is individual, right? It is ultimately a pitcher and a batter in an individual moment, one versus the other. And yes, you've got teammates, you have people trying to catch the ball and whatnot, but it's a team sport that's individual, and I think that is the unique challenge, because when you fail in that individual moment,

you feel that you're letting your whole team down as opposed to if you fail in a golf tournament or a tennis match or a more, individual, individual sport. So for people who don't know, and you were nice enough to talk about this on Hal Sevel, will you explain to people how you enjoyed the 2016 World Series and the choices that you had to make as an individual? Yeah, of course. I found out, gosh, sometime that fall, as the Cubs are marching to the World Series,

and I had an aneurysm in my heart, I didn't have any symptoms or anything. and basically was told that you needed life-saving open-heart surgery to be able to continue to live essentially. And so the fine folks at the Cleveland Clinic told me I needed to come there and have this procedure done. And I told them, that sounds great, but I'm going to wait until after the World Series. And they were like, well, I mean, how do you know the Indians are going to make it? And I was like, oh, no, oh, no, no, no, no. This is about the Cubs, right? And this is before the playoffs even started.

And so, yeah, so my doctors, you know, gave me the blessing that I could wait until the World Series was over. And my wife, God bless her, reluctantly agreed that we could do that as well. And then you watch the most stressful World Series in history. Oh, my God. I mean, like, yeah, game seven, I was an absolute disaster, right? Yeah, absolutely. And then, you know, they won on a Wednesday, and then that fall – So they went on Wednesday.

That Sunday I flew to Cleveland, and then Monday morning, you know, got rolled into a surgery suite at the Cleveland Clinic. And this very nice South African man cut open my chest and saved my life, and I've been fantastic ever since. So was the fear that if something went horribly wrong, you would not be around for this series? Or was the fear that you would miss maybe go into games? Like, what was the process here? Here, the deal, my thing was, it wasn't that I would miss it. I didn't love the thought of having, like, recovering from open heart surgery while watching the World Series.

Like, I wanted to be comfortable, and I'm like, I don't want to, like, have to, like, hold a pillow or I can't cough or cheer? Like, I don't know what the rules were going to be. But I was like, can I just watch this, like, a game or person? I couldn't handle going to game. I mean, I stayed on the couch the whole postseason. I couldn't even get. we're close to Wrigley.

But I wanted to be comfortable. Well, that is insane, but it also makes you the right guy to write this piece on Pete Krollarmstadt. A hundred percent, it makes way in the right guy. Before we let you go, one more personal question. Boob Shambi's going to be on the show at 525. And I have dubbed you both the guys I know that have the most pair of Jordans. So how many pairs of Jordans are you up to now? Oh, no.

I mean, I've been a Jordan. I've kind of expanded also into like the, the, dunk world. I would guess I'm probably somewhere around 50 or so. That's a good number. Probably more than me.

I don't know. That's a pretty solid number. 50 is a lot. I've seen the booge collection. It's impressive. I think I'm like, you know, I teach journalism at the University of Iowa, somewhere around college kids all the time, and I'm realizing now that the sneaker game

has become an old man game. Oh, yeah. And none of the kids wear shoes like they're all wearing these like second julya sandals or something I don't know what they're wearing and I'm walking around and he's like beautiful Jordans and nobody's like hey like nice shoes or anything like where are your sandals

it's like dad rock you know you might as well be wearing a Wilcoe t-shirt that is a man in the 40s right there wearing Jordan 100% Wayne as always man you're the best great piece on PCA and we look forward to the Kelly Amate Hiller story that's going to be major.

I appreciate you guys. Thanks so much for having me. Good to hear your voices. Thanks, Wayne. That's Wayne, Drey's. He's awesome, man. Yeah, man. That article is killer.

Go check it out. I don't care what backs are healthy as long as Raymond Harris is healthy. He's the guy that runs after contact. He'll run over here after he did, and he's what changes the birth. Raymond Harris. Let get him spin. Two-yard run for his first NFL touchdown. Big Day for the rookie from Ohio State.

Second and two, Ramon has his way, man. That's the point. beauty of Braymond Harris. That's the dual powers of a guy who can run like a halfback, hit like a fullback. He runs right through the big linebacker Pepper Johnson. He's heard and goal. Harris, sliced down. Oh, nifty piece of running there.

That wasn't power running. He just saw a gap planted his right foot and sliced him. And right now the Chicago Bears, you can say aren't acting like two touchdown underdogs. And the Packers aren't acting like two touchdown favorites. Bears are kind of embarrassing these Super Bowl champions. This is right started within their own 15-yard line. They did a little bit of everything in route. At the 13, it started an 87-yard drive.

Ramon Harris showing some very decisive quickness in finding the hole. This is Raymond Harris. Just like that. I mean, he hits the hole quickly. He's a slasher. But even more important than that, watch how he finishes a runoff. I mean, he's going to start right here, and he's going to come straight up the middle.

and watch how quickly he'll get to the hall right there it's a little counter move quick to the hole right through and then watch right there at the end boom he unloads on the tackler instead of the tackler hitting him and knock it back he takes the blue jersey and knocks him backwards yesterday when we talked to him he was so sore and so beat up he couldn't even shake hand so his whole right-sighters was bottom this is raymond harris he's in the end zone touchdown there Afternoons on the score. What a great soundtrack to your career. Wow. It's Pat Summerall and it's John Madden just saying all the nice things about you. Loving all over Raymond Harris as a blocker, as a football player, as a tough guy, and then calling a touchdown. Sir, that's why he was the ultraback. Thank you.

It's very important. Raymond Harris now joining us here on the score. former score contributor raymond harris what's up sir how are you lorne so i'm doing well man how are you guys doing man happy honored excited to be back on the show today man love this we're excited to have you and if i if i may say that was the greatest intro i've ever had right there that right there man playing ultra magnetic mc's in a bunch of like clips by like john madden and pat summerall come on man that's the that's the way you bring me back right there That's our guy, Chris Tannahill, and you are among many who have pointed it out, and we love it.

We have a little list going, Tanny, who's the best person on the list? Is it Ice Cube? Are you most proud of Ice Cube? Well, Raymond knew it was Ultramag, so it's got to be him. He's number one. I mean, come on, man. I hate that question you just had to do right there. It's got to be me.

That's right. My bad. My bad. It's got to be Raymond. That's for sure. So, listen, before we get into all the incredible stuff that you're doing, and the work that you're putting in as a motivational speaker and helping out young people,

what was it like as an ex-bear to watch this latest bear season? Oh, my God. It was, I'm sure there are all kinds of people who are saying that, oh, they knew that they could do it. I don't know anybody that thought that they were going to play that well. So just like everyone else in Chicago, I'm a huge Bears fan, and I've been struggling with the team for a year after year,

year after year. And to be honest, I mean, I was happy and excited about Ben Johnson taking over the helm. I wasn't sold on Caleb Williams. I wasn't sold that they took Coast in with the first pick. So I went in, you know, I came into the season, you know, not necessarily a believer. And then after the first game, I went to the first game and they lost in a spectacular fashion like they had been doing in the last few years. So I felt like, damn, this is probably going to be another season like that. And for them to catch fire, flip it around, and start winning not just, they weren't blowing

people out, they were winning, like, the tough games. And then they would win them in, like, really spectacular fashion. It made be super proud to be a bear stand, my guy. So, yeah, I'm all in right now. Oh, Ramon, it's so nice to imagine you watching the games and being at the first

game, yeah, that Minnesota game, they should have won it. We were worried. We were very worried after that. But, like, and then the Detroit game, game. Who are some of your former teammates that you're still friendly with or in touch with? It's nice to think about you

maybe texting some former teammates as you guys all watched Bears games a little bit this year. Curtis Conway, I'm still down with Seaway. Probably one of my best friends in the world is Duane Joseph. We came in together and then DJ ended up

working in the front office to the Bears. But to be honest, man, like, yeah, Like, you know, the thing about the professional leagues, man, it's not like college. Back in those days, you know, we stayed at school four or five years and you end up building like these relationships with guys that you end up lasting for a lifetime. But when you get to the league, man, it's mercenaries. Like, these guys are, they got families. I mean, you may know somebody for one year and you're not as close anymore. And then, boom, you just keep it moving.

So, um, Lewis Tillman, I just got them talking to talk about. to him a couple of days ago. He was my OG. Meryl Hodges, I still keep in touch with him as well. So, I mean, here and there, man, I'll pop in with a couple of guys here and there, but not a lot. All right, so to keep living inside of this season, because we love to get

reactions from people, as you're watching the playoff game with the Rams, and Caleb drops back 20 yards, and then does a Tecmo Bowl throw to the end zone for a touchdown that seemingly ties the game

up. Walk me through what that was like for you watching that play out in real time. Okay, so first of all, like, they have had one, I don't know the exact number, I'm sure you guys, but then they get the fourth down and I'm watching

it, I'm like, eh, this is unlikely now, and he drops back and then he starts running back further and further, 10, 15 yards. I'm like, it's over. It's the classic no-no No, no. Yes, yes, yes.

So as soon as that all started happening, man, my son is Eli. He's the best in the biggest Chicago Bears fan. Man, we were jumping up and down. Congratulations, you know, man, we thought, you know, this really may be a chance. These guys don't go to the Super Bowl. So, yeah, real time, that's what my feelings were like, man. I love that.

Raymond Harris with us here on Spiegel and Holmes, when you think of your favorite moments as a bear, Raymond, I mean, a major contributor in the two playoff games in 94, but it's the 97 season where you break out with 1,000 yards rushing. Like, what are, what's a game that comes to mind for you when you think of being on at Soldier Field and just having a day and looking around and wanting to remember what it was like to be a bear and play in this town?

honestly like my my favorite game did not happen in Soldier Field it was my rookie year we we stumbled into the playoffs for some reason

we had lost the last two games and we kind of backdoor our way into the playoffs and the Minnesota Vikings they had beat us up twice that year and I think they were like double digit favorites

and no one gave us a chance and we went into the to the dome and we pounded these guys, man. And it was like my first time ever having, you know, playing in a playoff game. No one gave us a chance. So, you know, that immediately builds like camaraderie with the squad. And we were beating like guys that like were really good. I mean, we Hall of Famers on the other side, Warren Moon, Chris Carter. And to beat them up the way we did in spectacular fashion.

and then for me to also be like a leading rusher and score like a really long touchdown. That's my favorite moment as a bear. Now that you've been away from the game for a while and you've built like this whole other life, what was the hardest part? Because you go from being a star at Ohio State to having what a seven year career in the league.

So what was the hardest part of walking away from football and then saying, okay, now I'm a citizen. How can I make a difference? Yeah, that's a good question, my guy. It's, like, the transition is really difficult for NFL guys. And it makes sense now. At the time, I didn't realize and didn't understand it. But we put so much energy and effort and time into, and sacrifice into being like the

possible football player that we can be. Whenever I try to draw like a parallel to help explain it, just imagine you're a doctor and you go to undergrad for four years and then you have to go to medical school and then you got to do your residencies and then you got to do these other things and you do all of that and you finally get to be a doctor and then you get to practice for three years and then they say, nah, you can't do that anymore. So immediately, all of a sudden, the thing that you have been known for, the thing that you have been celebrated for, it's gone.

It's taken away. And as a man, especially black men, back in the 90s, we didn't have therapy or any of that kind of stuff. So we had to just kind of deal with our trauma. So now I lose my identity. And I also got to deal with this trauma that I kind of compartmentalized because I didn't have to worry about it. And it turns into being like the most difficult transition. leaving the game that you love, then to be like, quote unquote, a civilian. And people are calling you, like, washed up and has beens and that kind of stuff.

And, yeah, man, it's, it was, it was something that really required me to have to, to take a true deep inner look at who I was. Who helped you? I, uh, I had to go to therapy. I had to, I had to do, uh, some mental health work. And I'd love to, you know, sit here and act like, you know, it was my decision that I needed to go and do that. But to be honest, man, like my behavior, the things that I was doing, the way that I was showing up in life, it really wasn't like in line with like who I had always been. I had started turning out.

I had never drank. I was drinking all the time and gambling, chasing like the high. I love when, like, you know, people would like recognize me and celebrate me because it helped me feel like I was, I still had it. So like when you are dealing with like those types of issues and difficulties like in your life, man, yeah, it started to act out in my life in my everyday life. And my wife at the time, she was like, yeah, this isn't going to work unless you go get some help. And thank God she did that. Thank God I follow through on that. Man, we appreciate the realness.

And a lot of us have been there. I've been there. You know, it's like, we're like, oh, this is not how I'm supposed to act. This is not going to work out for the rest of my days or my marriage. And then you kind of get to know yourself a little bit. I've always been struck by the weirdness of having to be a pro athlete. And how old were you when you were done with the Patriots was your last team, right? Yeah, 30.

30 years old. 30 years old. It's like most people are just trying to figure out still what the career is going to be, what the identity is going to be. And you're dealing with all of that on the back end. So what has given you purpose and value since then? Well, since then, you know what? I bounced around and tried to figure out like especially what it would be for me. I did radio and TV broadcasting for a while. I love that. But it's a lot. It's a lot. It's a lot. It's a lot. It's It wasn't feasible like in my life. I started doing mortgages for J.P. Morgan Chase. And then I became the director of development for my alma mater, Ohio State University. And I did that for 15 years. And then like the question that people would always ask me is like, man, when people found out about like my real story and who I was,

how did I make it from like those crazy, ridiculous childhood circumstances to levels of success that people could only draw? dream of. And the truth was I took an evaluation of my life and what really happened to me. And I identified like these eight controllables and I created this framework. And I started being a public speaker and I spoke on the framework. And from there, I flipped it into a book. And that's where I am right now, man. It's called control to controllables. And it's about mindset. It's about pressure and it's about the power of control and it is it is the biggest thing like in my life right now if i may if i may oh absolutely control the controllables you can go out there and buy

the elite mindset performance let's get it he's holding up the book folks for those of listening that's tremendous yeah no i mean look the uh controlling the controllables is big but how about not trying to control the uncontrollables. That's hard too, isn't it? Well, it's difficult, man, because, you know, you think about it, like, you just, you want to kind of wrap your hands around any and everything that you can. Yes. But the truth is, right? But the truth is, like, the things that you can't control, you just are never going to be able to control them. And I am one of those people that believes that, uh, I don't think we just have infinite amounts of control. Yeah.

I think we have a certain amount. And, it's, that's, you know, that's, you know, that's, we have for like a day or a week or however long. And then eventually it runs out. And when it runs out, you then start showing up as someone that you do not want to be. So I think the key is managing that pressure and being able to control the things that you can actually, you know, absolutely control. And that's something so good about this book is like it identifies those things. And then you're able to show not only through my story, but I also try and make sure that I'm able to like let any reader that that would pick up and buy this book for them to

be able to see themselves in the same in the same scenarios. I got to say there's a reason the serenity prayer is so popular. You know what I mean? It's like yeah. Seriously the wisdom to know the wisdom knows difference. Ramon Harris has has some acquired wisdom. This is nice to catch up man. So Raymond, when you're out here talking to to younger people and I'm sure you're talking to to groan folks too. But what's the question that you get asked most frequently? And do you ever have to redirect and go, that's not the question that you should be asking. You should be asking this other question of yourself.

Yeah, normally people are, to be honest, it's not directly related to like the control, the most, the thing that I'm asked most. And truly, it's, when I normally show up, people see me as like this former NFL player. and they see that I have, you know, contributed to the world in this really special way that's celebrated. And that sometimes, like, when people see that, they think that that's, it's not attainable. So they kind of think that maybe, maybe I grew up with a silver spoon or I had a bunch of trainers and I had like this real complicated diet routine and exercise. But in actuality, I break that down immediately to let them. know that yeah I did these things but this is where I have come from and typically what I believe

is I think we're all we're all connected by our journeys and when I break my journey down any and everybody is they're able to see their themselves in that journey and then once they see themselves in the journey it no longer becomes uh aspirational anymore it then becomes inspirational oh you know why tell us it I wanted to ask but I don't know how to how to even brook the subject, RIP Rishan Salam. Like, how did you process that when he passed in 2016, Raymont? Spiegel, that was tough. It was really, really tough.

You know, full transparency, Rashon and I, we weren't like close, like close friends where we would talk on the phone or anything like that. But there's a brotherhood that you have. and, you know, we played for three years together in the same room. And I was like a big brother to him, like more of a mentor. And it was, he was so talented and he was so gifted, man. And he had so much pressure and he had so many things on his shoulders that would tend to just kind of get the way. And I was so shocked and sadden when I saw that he had lost, he took his own life, man.

It's, it's, it just kind of reminds you about how mortal that we really are, and especially like the different guys that you, we've had a chance to play football with, man. I think the ugly side of the game is, you know, there's a lot of brain injuries, a lot of concussions. And I've had people were surprised and shocked by this, but I've had 18 grade 3 concussions. Wow. Yeah. And I know what it has done to me,

and I've seen what it has done to other people. And it just, it saddens me, man. It breaks my heart. It speaks to the importance of the work you're doing, Ramon. They're like, because there's players after they get out, you know, got to find, some way and purpose

to move forward. We had the great pleasure of having Matt Forte on this show every week during the season. And talking running game with Matt Forte like we got so much smarter and it gave me even a further admiration

for what it is that you did to work with an offensive line and have that kind of chemistry with an offensive line. How special was that to experience with great teammates when it would be going so well in a given week ramont well yeah well i didn't have the same kind of things that it wasn't going as well as matt forte let's just say that

me clear about that matt fortier is one of the greatest uh all around uh running backs ever um but like when you're in that zone and things are clicking like first of all like when you're a young guy, you got to earn like the trust of the veterans because you learn very quickly that this is a business and this is their livelihoods. And these coaches and these players, yeah, they want people that are going to be foxhole guys. So once you establish yourself as worthy and then also that you're good enough there to make things happen, it's like a really supreme kind of feeling to feel that you're in your groove and it's working in tandem with all of your offensive line as well as like your fullback or your receivers and quarterback.

Honestly, it kind of goes back to that my favorite game. Like that game felt like that playoff game against the Vikings in 94, 95. Like that was one of those days where it felt like we were all in sync. My favorite. Raymond, before we let you go, you'd probably be interested to know this. For about 22 weeks out of the year, Dave Wonstadt is on our show once a week. And we have him here. We usually give him a bourbon to drink while he is doing the segment with us.

What are some of your favorite things about Wani? You know, Lauren, you know what's crazy? I was randomly in Naples, Florida last year. here randomly. And one of my buddies was like, hey, guess who I ran into at this place over here? So we go over there and I have lunch with Dave Wonstead. I haven't seen him in 15, 20 years, however long it was. And it was the very first time I had like really talked to him.

Yeah. And I'm talking about we had I was, he drafted me. we spent four years together. I was a four years starter. And I talked to him more in that hour and a half lunch than I had ever talked to him in total as a player and coach. So I got a real fondest for him now. Back then, he was always like a nice guy, but he was a defensive guy. So, you know, we didn't have a lot of interaction.

But man, you talk about like a good guy with some great stories. Dave wants that, man. No doubt about it. Raymond, thanks for all of the work that you're doing to better yourself and to help other people, continued success and continued good health. And we appreciate you jumping on with us, man. It was really good to talk to you. No doubt, man.

I appreciate that. Just so your listeners know, you can go to raymondherst.com. And then you can also go to anywhere they sell books like Amazon and Barnes & Noble. And one little quick tidbit. I'm not sure you guys know this. I just released the book a month ago, and for three weeks it was the number one football biography on Amazon.

So, yo, go get control the controllables. You know what I mean? Yeah. For some reason, it's blurry. Yeah. There you go. But you know what it is. Go get control the controllables.

We already have a listener inside our Twitch mob who's gone to Kindle and bought that. It's already done. Let's go. Yeah. We're selling books, Raymont. That's what we're doing. That's what we do.

Just need a cut. That's what we. That's what we do. Just need a cut. Thank you. Stay well, Raymond, man. We'll talk to you soon. Thank you, bro.

Be good, man. Man. That's Raymond Harris. Amazing. Can I just add this to the conversation, too? I don't know what it is, but if you're a bear's running back in your post life, you're very handsome. Like, this is the thing. And you're an author.

And you're an author. And you're making us want to do another book signing. That would be awesome. Because think about it. You got Raymont. And we want to hang out with you. You got Maph. Forte.

Thomas Jones is literally in movies. Yeah, he is. You're right. Yes. Yeah. So if you want to be handsome, when you're done with your career, you want to be a Bears running back. Can't wait for Khalil Herbert's book to come out.

You know what I'm saying? That's going to be a hell of a read. What about Valis Jones? No, I'm good on that. No? Super Bowl champion. You can kiss his ass. How about that, Spiegel?

Yeah, he'd let me. He'd probably, he's going to tweet at us now with laughing crying emojis. My goodness. That's right, champ. He got you, champ. That was amazing. That's that good stuff. And Raymond is a real dude, man. He has been for a long time. He always has been. I'd love that

he's shared about the struggle that can take place and how you got to, it comes out in your behavior. And you need somebody sometimes to help you catch that and you realize, wait a minute, what are my values here? What do I actually care about? Who am I? Yeah. Some of us deal with that in our 40s or our 50s

or whatever. So, good for him for finding a way through.