Rates & Barrels - The Puzzling Mets & Surprising Journeyman Hitters

Episode Date: September 15, 2021

Eno and DVR discuss the Mets' puzzling plan to retain Sandy Alderson for another year and why choosing a first-time GM makes more sense than pursuing Theo Epstein, before digging into several surprising journeyman hitters, and the massive second half from Red Sox first baseman Bobby Dalbec. Follow Eno on Twitter: @enosarris Follow DVR on Twitter: @DerekVanRiper e-mail: [e-mail] Subscribe to the Rates & Barrels YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/c/RatesBarrels Get 50% off a subscription to The Athletic at theathletic.com/ratesandbarrels Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Welcome to Rates and Barrels presented by Topps. Check out Topps Project 70 celebrating 70 years of Topps baseball cards, Derek Van Ryper here with Eno Saris. It is Wednesday, September 15th. On this episode, we will take a look at the latest surprising turn in the Mets front office. As it appears, Sandy Alderson will be returning for 2022. We don't really know why, but we're going to try and explore what possible reasons the Mets could have for continuing forward on that path. We're going to dig into some journeyman hitters for the bulk of this episode. A lot of interesting names that have been picked up over the course of the season for fantasy purposes. Try to get a sense for who those players are going to be going forward. What kinds of roles they might have.

And maybe figure out some common threads that will help us find players like that in the future. And we've got a few emails we're going to try to get to before the end of the show as well. You know, I think we found out on Monday night after we recorded our last episode that Sandy Alderson is supposed to be returning as the Mets team president in 2022. And when you think about all the things that have happened under his watch with the Mets, the hiring of Jared Porter, Zach Scott's DUI, the Mickey Calloway situation, all of these things he's been presiding over, I would have assumed he was long gone, even if there was time within his contract, long gone at season's end, because I assumed very wrongly that Steve Cohen would, in fact, clean house and start over. But here we are.

And it's not even LOL Mets anymore. It's just, why, Mets? Like, why are you this way? What is wrong with you? Why can't you be even just a little bit decent when it comes to making decisions like this? Yeah. And, you know, I think the first name that got floated, the idea would be the way to square the two information pieces that we got. We got this information that Sandy never wanted to run the baseball operations, the day-to-day operations.

He just wanted to be like a shepherd, bringing the team to its next eventual leader. Shepard, you know, bringing the team to its next eventual leader. Well, the Zach Scott situation doesn't speak well of him of picking an ex-leader in the first place. And then the second name that would make sense is Theo Epstein coming in. I don't know why he would come in at anything less than president of baseball operations. So that's already a problem in your logic is that, like, Sandy's going to stick around as president of baseball operations. So that's already a problem in your logic, is that Sandy's going to stick around as president of baseball operations and then make Theo Epstein a GM? Not going to happen.

Even vice president, I think the only way that Theo Epstein shows up is he's the president of baseball operations and he replaces Sandy. So it's like, okay, good first name floating. Also on top of that, way to float the guy that hired all the guys that got you in trouble. Way to really learn the lesson.

It seems like more of a like F you to everybody to just be like, oh, you think you got me on the Zach Scott and Mickey Calloway stuff? I'm just going to get the tree that created these poison fruits. I'm just going to go right to the source and get the guy that they all studied under. That'll do it. Yep, that'll clean house. That'll

fix everything. That'll change the culture. That'll be the best way forward with the zero tolerance policy that Steve Cohen talked about. I would give theo epstein uh like three weeks in as a as the president of baseball operations in new york before uh some unseemly stuff comes out of his history because a we know that new york has an excellent stable of guys throwing 98 with their pens uh that would that would go hard after this and then b there's enough sort of smoke around epstein if you if you really look for it i mean we were talking before we got on air about there's this piece um from right thompson in espn

the magazine uh that i that i saw j Jared Seidler put it on his account. It's a five-year-old piece and it's, it's called, what's it called? The mastermind. It's like, Ooh, like this is, he's the, he's the mastermind. And it's supposed to be like a fawning piece, but right. Thompson is excellent. I think he's a really excellent writer and he does give you a more holistic way into what kind of situations that Theo Epstein fosters

around and what kind of culture he would foster and there's an anecdote in there it starts out with like oh he creates an atmosphere where the currency is, pardon my friends, shit. Like giving shit and taking shit. As in, you know, giving people crap, you know?

And so he starts like, oh, yeah. He comes in. There's a picture of Jed Hoyer faking a kiss with his brother-in-law. And they blew it up really big. And they make fun of Jed Hoyer faking a kiss with his brother-in-law. And they blew it up really big. And they make fun of Jed Hoyer for it all the time. That's fine. Jed Hoyer at the time of this writing is already kind of AGM, GM kind of, you know, he's an established guy in the game, right? Then it goes on to, you know, how he made fun of a kid coming in on his first day that had green pants on,

and he said he's going to win the Masters to complete the suit. Okay, that's some ribbing. Haha, fun. And then there's a guy now who's the AGM of the Red Sox. Epstein comes and does a dramatic reading of his cover letter that he that he wrote an earnest cover letter that he wrote to to to apply for the job at the cubs and he does a dramatic reading of this of a guy who at that time is more like an intern or a or like just a lower way lower than him on the totem pole just sitting up there punching down at this guy to the point where in the story it says

the guy felt so bad that Jed Hoyer had to come up behind him and make sure the kid was all right. Called him a kid. Come on. I mean, this isn't something that we need to cancel Epstein about. This is not any sort of sort of, uh, skeletons

in the closet I'm talking about, but it points to a guy who is just going to create the same locker room frat house culture that has come before and is not a way for the Mets to kind of get out from these mistakes they've made. It doesn't seem like, you know, you could actually see how maybe, uh, you know, these people that have gotten in trouble came from like you know you could actually see how maybe uh you know these people that have gotten in trouble came from you know from his front offices i mean there is a bit of a line there to draw so i the whole thing is just like what are you doing but i but then there was like the other thing that was interesting was you know we're thinking like who are the other names right like who who are some other names that you would that you would throw out if you wanted to be?

You were saying, okay, not Theo, then who could it be? Right. Billy Bean is the name that people were throwing out there for a while. That seems unrealistic. Yeah. I think Billy Bean will leave to run a soccer team. I mean, he's talked about wanting to do that he's in a an ownership group that's trying to buy the manchester manchester united or bought it or

whatever um so he's in a spac which is like one of these things that they make to like buy a team so he's like soccer is on his radar i think um there's some other names that's like the end of the list for the high profile guys. But then the other thing you can start thinking about is, well, okay, who's had recent success? Well, the Dodgers,

the Rays, the Astros, you could start trying to pick off people from those organizations. It's going to be really hard to pick some of the Dodgers unless you go down a couple of rungs. Like you're not going to get Friedman because he's already, you know, a top,

a great organization with a lot of money that, that wins championships. It's like, what are not going to get friedman because he's already you know a top great organization with a lot of money that wins championships you know it's like what are you what are you going to offer him um so i guess you could go below him and but then you start talking about oh okay david stearns um with milwaukee you know maybe give him a bigger market more money to spend and free agency bigger uh payroll, that sort of deal. You start talking about the same tree that created Elias, who's with Baltimore, which is the Astros tree. So right now there's like an Astros tree and a Rays tree and an Epstein tree. The Epstein tree is not doing so well, I have to be honest.

The Astros tree is doing really well um although i guess the red socks are faltering a little bit but uh but the ask the the say does that the astros tree i said the rays tree is doing pretty well everywhere it's going it's faltering a little bit in boston but it also creates this sort of commodification of the player uh uh we don't keep anyone past age 26 kind of you know everyone is fungible and tradable at any given time the astros seem to uh do some cool things in terms of retaining some players and not just always trading guys um and uh you know, when Stearns went to Milwaukee, signed the big deal for Christian Jelic, which is kind of cool.

Keep a figurehead, a place, a face to the franchise for a long time. But the Astros tree has its own skeletons in the closet. I'm mixing metaphors. Well, sure. I mean, it's a different type of problem altogether, obviously. These things are not all apples to apples, but I think it leads you to this question. If you are in the position of Steve Cohen,

or a rare position to own a baseball team, but if you're hiring someone, if you're even a team president, and you're trying to hire someone to run baseball operations, the Rockies could be an example of this right now. Maybe you want to make a change in Colorado. You're not going to keep your interim GM. You're going to actually hire a different GM. Where do you want to go right now? Who do you actually want to hire in baseball? Thinking about all these different factors that would be important.

Do you go to a current team's AGM, right? If you like Stearns, but you can't get Stearns, do you go to Matt Arnold, who went to Milwaukee from Tampa Bay? A hire like that makes a lot of sense. Is it the splashy, sexy hire that the people following the team on a casual basis want? No, but you know what? Mets fans want to win. Is it the back page winner?

Who cares? You're not trying to win the back page. You're trying to win. This is amazing. They have, I think, nine seasons now since Sandy Alderson was first hired. He was gone for two years. They have, I think, nine seasons now since Sandy Alderson was first hired. He was gone for two years. They have two winning seasons in nine years.

And everyone remembers the one because they went to the World Series that one. Yeah, and they lost to the Royals. It's like, what are you doing? Why keep running it back with someone aside from everything we just talked about? And it's not for lack of payrolls. I mean, even though people were mad

that the Mets didn't pay more, didn't spend more, I mean, they were still spending at 150 clips. Yeah, they weren't living in Piratesville. Right. So I think you have to go more down a path like Matt Arnold. I'm just naming him as one example.

It's not going to be someone who's been a GM before necessarily. I think that's probably the better path for the Mets. That's what I would want them to do. Why do the Rays promote Neander? Yeah. Keep them out of these conversations. Right. to do. Why do the Rays promote Neander? Yeah. Keep them out of these conversations. Right.

And it's funny because the Rays keep having guys get hired from below that position. That's what happens time and time again. James Click, who actually I think, and I've never, I don't spend a lot of time looking at GM Wikipedia pages, but this is like a very thin Wikipedia page for someone who's the GM of a successful ball club right now. I could read it in like 30 seconds. Early life. Click is from Durham, North Carolina. He graduated from Yale University. He wrote for Baseball Prospectus. Career. Tampa Bay Rays. Click joined the

Tampa Bay Rays as an intern in 2005. The team hired him for their front office in 2006. He became vice president of baseball operations in 2017. Houston Astros in January 2020. Click was hired by the Houston Astros as their general manager. That's it. That's his whole page. But that's how long he was with the Rays? From 2006

to 2017? Yeah. Intern in 05, hired in 06, VP of Baseball Operations in 17, GM of the Astros starting in January 2020. Yeah, I remember reading him. That's, you know, that's it.

It's interesting how this Yeah, I remember reading him. That's, you know, yeah, that's it. And it's interesting how this all coincides with title inflation and stuff. And the reason why even, I think that probably the reason why the Royals made, they made him the president of baseball. Dayton Moore, the president of baseball operations, was save jj piccolo maybe because by by making him a gm that means to hire him away you need to offer him vice president of baseball operations at least because you can't really the way that the rules work is you can't really hire someone away with the same title. Maybe they thought JJ Piccolo was somebody they had to hold on to and they didn't want him to be hired away to be a GM. We're not a Mets

podcast. We'd never want to be a Mets podcast, but this is just one of the biggest WTF stories that will not go away anytime soon. We did have a question come in from Josh about what the Mets are doing in the sense of what are they going to do if they let Luis Rojas go? Do you think they should retain Jeremy Hefner as their pitching coach for the new regime? So basically, are you seeing enough good in Hefner's work with the pitchers to believe that he could actually be a holdover if they make a lot of other changes on the coaching staff i mean um it's hard to know where to assign a credit and blame always with coaches and players stroman's having a very good year um he does a lot of his

own sort of self-coaching and and has people he works with um but uh you know who's who's having a really terrible year under hefner i I think Hefner's doing all right. David Peterson did not take a step forward, but to me it's unclear that David Peterson is a very good prospect or anything. Yeah, he's a back-end guy. I don't think there's a massive ceiling there that he's failing to reach. I mean, Tywon Walker has been good. Tyler McGill's been a nice story.

The bullpen, I think, was pretty solid coming into the season, but there's nothing in the overall body of work from the pitching staff that you could say is like, yeah, Jeremy Hefner needs to go. I don't think that's the case at all. It might just be the case. I don't think it's clear that Rojas has to go, but I think there's

a little bit more of just a question of how the roster fits together. It's always been kind of clunky. It seems like they don't really pay attention to defense, especially in center field. They just kind of put guys out there a lot. I don't know. Why are the Mets failing? Why do the Mets fall apart?

Injuries. Consistently, right? Yeah. It's a huge part of it. There's definitely something they need to think about with injury. In fact, one of the secret things that people don't talk about so much here in San Francisco about their success has been a real investment in injury prevention. There's a lot of people around the game who think that's the major sort of money ball, kind of the way that teams can separate themselves.

And if you look at the way the Giants run their rosters out, I mean, I don't know how many times I've looked and been like, where's Chris Bryant? The Giants run their rosters out. I mean, I don't know how many times I've looked and been like, where's Chris Bryant? You know? And they're just always, there's healthy scratches.

They made such a big team and made such a good bench, so there's just always healthy scratches, and it's always because of something they've seen or something they've spotted or something in the numbers that tells them that this guy's a little bit fatigued. The Mets don't seem to be doing that. They run a guy out there until he's done, and then they put him on the... And then they wait too long.

They do this thing with the IL where they're like, oh, no, he's out for a couple games because he's hurt. We'll get him back in here soon. And then four days into it, they'll put him on the 10-day IL. And you're like, dude, it's just 10 days, man. You could have... If you'd just done that from the beginning, it would have been in better shape than continuing to show up at the ballpark and

trying to get ready for the game. So I definitely think there's something to be said here for how they treat injuries. Their offense is kind of woefully underperforming. I could see, I could see looking at the, you know, I know I like Hugh Qualabama, but looking at the hitting coaching process or looking at the hitting the players, there's an obvious paucity of power. Ooh, you like that? Paucity? Very good.

And let me do them by barrel rate. I'm assuming this is going to go poorly for them. 23rd in barrel rate. I'm assuming this is going to go poorly for them. 23rd in barrel rate. If you said guess based on the WRC plus, they're 96 in WRC plus, so they're tied for 15th. Actually tied with San Diego.

And Philadelphia is just a tick behind them at 95. I don't think of those three offenses being the same. I definitely think of the Padres and Phillies as having better offenses than the Mets, but all three of them seem like underperformers. I mean, they have one really good barreler in Pete Alonso, and then J.D. Davis is decent. Baez is good, but he's a short-term player. And then everybody else is pretty bad at that really kind of important skill.

Yeah. Conforto, actually. Decent barreler. else is pretty bad at that at that really kind of important skill yeah confordo actually decent barrel there then there's to some extent just the down year syndrome right like to some extent lindor mcneil and confordo all had down years at the same time right i mean that's that's absolutely a part of it so it the common threads are recurring problems with injuries and Sandy Alderson. That's it. Yeah, shooting themselves in the foot with messaging, with PR, with front office personnel. I mean, that's not a good sign. No. That doesn't suggest to me that they're also then going to do a really good job with other things. That means they're going to be spending a lot of organizational energy dealing with whatever their most recent mess up is.

Yeah, I think it just creates that cloud over the organization that we've talked about before, where players are answering questions about ridiculous things that shouldn't have happened that become huge stories because they just keep doing it over and over and over again. I think we should talk about some of these journeyman hitters because I think there's a lot to kind of pull apart in that conversation. You put together a group of bats that I think every one of these players has played for at least two different major league teams or in two different major league organizations. Most have played in even more than that. And I'm curious, what got you thinking about this group of players in particular?

Well, there was a conversation that I was having with Dennis Lynn about sort of the differences between the Padres and the giants. And one thing that the giants have done the entire time they've been there, that Farhan Zayedi has been there at the helm is keep like a roster slot or two open in the 40 man right just to be able to make waiver claims and they've used it you know at the beginning it was a joke right and uh and interestingly one of these guys on this list um that maybe we can share in the notes or whatever is Connor Joe.

And at the beginning, it was kind of a joke. It seemed like a joke that people were just running through. I actually asked Mike Jastrzemski at some point, like, how does it make you feel that, like, everyone seems to come in here and have, like, two weeks, you know, to prove themselves before they're gone, you know? Because he would just kind of cycle through these guys. Connor Joe was their opening day left fielder in San Francisco, and then he was gone like three weeks later, it seemed like. So just by keeping that spot open, they've done things this year like Jose Quintana. I think that they, and they also, what was it?

It was like they did this thing where they claimed Wandy Peralta on waivers, pitched him in the bullpen for two weeks, traded him for Mike Tauchman when they had an injury problem in the outfield, played Mike Tauchman for two weeks in the outfield or three weeks in the outfield, and he had some pretty good defensive plays, then DFA Tauchman and claim the next guy. You know what I mean?

They just have these high-velocity spots, and they have an eye out for claiming guys. And I think better teams need to do that. What you'll see here, for the most part, is either bad teams, because it's easier for them to open up a spot. So Connor Joe ended up on Colorado. Ramon Urias ended up in Baltimore. Lane Thomas is the only one on this list that wasn't a waiver claim, but I just felt that he belonged.

He was traded for John Lester to the Nationals. Yoshi Tsutsugo is on the Pirates. Patrick Wisdom and Frank Schwindel are on the Cubs. Anna Duvall is on the Braves, I believe. Yes. Yes, he's on the Braves. Tyler Naquin is on the Reds. And all these guys other than Lane Thomas were waiver claims at some point. All of these guys other than Lane Thomas were waiver claims at some point.

And it's just interesting to think about how much value these teams could benefit from picking up these guys and giving them a long chance. You know, I think a fair amount of these could end up into at least three or four year players. Right. Three or four years of a guy you just picked up off a waiver. You didn't spend a draft pick. Like you didn't you didn't spend the you didn't give him a draft bonus. You didn't give him a free agent deal. Like you just you just picked him up.

And so I wanted to look at this list and see, like, you know, first of all, why would you pick these guys up? What, you know, is there a common thread? And then second of all, for us, like which one of these guys do we think is most likely to stick, um, and, uh, provide value to us and to, to, to fantasy teams and to their teams, uh, going forward. Yeah. And I would say that while Patrickdom probably gives you just a little something to be excited about if you're a Cubs fan

still watching games at this point in the season, 26 homers in 96 games, he's running a K rate just under 40%. That probably disqualifies him from being someone we're talking about in the future, even though the barrel rate and the hard hit rate are off the charts good. When he connects, it's great.

He just doesn't connect nearly enough. And a player like that, even on a rebuilding team, even with those home runs, they're going to look at that profile and say, thanks, but we're going to try somebody else. Or maybe you're our opening day third baseman while in the rebuild, but we're looking to upgrade to that spot kind of deal. Not to laugh at Wisdom.

He might be in for the rookie of the year. But another thing that comes to mind when I look at Wisdom, he's 29 years old. This is also relevant, I think, to Adam Duvall, who's 32 years old, is that Jeff Zimmerman recently looked at aging curves again, and he split the aging curves into 2005 to 2012 and 2012 to 2019. So he had these two seven-year groupings, but the second grouping, 2012 to 2019, is kind of modern baseball, right? That's stat-cast era for the most part. That's where the strikeout rate exploded.

That's what we're looking at and so he looked at aging curves and overall batters are aging a little bit worse now than they used to um but when he looked at the components he was like well power is actually aging better now than it used to um batting average on balls and plays aging about the same uh walk rate is aging about the same oh look it's strikeouts that are aging much worse than they used to. And in fact, the line after the age of 30 is about twice as steep now in terms of aging. A batter between his age 30 and 34 seasons used to add one percentage point to his K rate. Now he adds two percentage points. And I think of that when I look at this listing

and I see Duvall, I love the power. He's been surprisingly useful. I think he will be a waiver claim, late season trade, righty platoon mostly for the rest of his career. I think he may have one more year of kind of full-time play, but with a K percentage of 31, being 32 years old, you can already kind of push that to 32, 33

in the next couple of years. That's going to put a lot of pressure on his lack of walk rate. It's going to put a lot of pressure on his lack of walk rate. It's going to put a lot of pressure on his already 285 OVP this year, and he's going to have to hit a ton of home runs to make that work. So I don't think Duvall is going to be a great pick next year, and I think that's a problem for wisdom. But Schwindel right there is kind of interesting. Not a very good barrel rate uh very good strikeout

rate not a very good uh eye at the plate in terms of he doesn't walk much and he doesn't discern balls and strikes very well he's 29 years old so you could say he could add strikeout rate but at 16 strikeout rate he can add strikeout rate and still be an asset there. It's just a really interesting profile all the way through where it's like, okay, good-ish power. The LBP could be much worse next year. I don't know. What do you think about Frank Schoendel? Would you draft him next year?

I think it's more likely that he stays on the Cubs roster for all of 2022 than Patrick Wisdom does because of the way Ks are the problem here. It's weird to me. I would have guessed if you said, oh, yeah, Frank Schwindel, he's got a dozen homers in 47 games. What's his barrel rate? I would have said, I don't know, 10%, 11%.

No, 8.7%. It's a little lower than you'd expect. It's really strange. Looking at the O-swing percentages for all these players, he's at the higher end of the range, kind of closer to a Duvall, even though he strikes out less than Duvall. So that lack of discernment with the strike zone is pretty unusual. It's like he can, I don't know, it's like he can hit balls that he shouldn't hit or something, and that's why the K rate stays down. But he's not

doing enough damage because he's hitting balls that he shouldn't hit. You don't want to make a career out of hitting balls outside the zone. We've talked about how poor that age is, and he's 29 already. Right. So I don't – this is not me saying, oh, yeah, he's going to be great for a long time. It's just that I think there's a better reason to stick with him than there is with wisdom if I have to choose between the two. The Duvall thing, though, is kind of interesting because this is one of his good years. His range seems to be that of about a one to two and a half win player.

When he's good like he is right now. Extremely not valued by the market. Right. He's exactly the kind of player that will get non-tendered, probably get a major league deal, probably end up playing more than we think. I think he could end up being a decent fantasy option. It kind of just depends on price like it always does because he's such an accumulator. It's sort of like Randall Gritchick, too. does because he's such an accumulator and there's there's kind of like it's sort of like randall gritchick too i don't actually think i want randall gritchick on a team if i'm like running a team and

trying to win a world series obviously he's on a team that could win the world series but they've got a bunch of other guys who are a lot better than him in that lineup that's that's how it all works but from a fantasy perspective you look at guys that just pile up numbers like that randall gritchick's gonna finish this year probably with about 25 homers 90 plus rbis 65 to 70 runs scored and a 251 average in a league where you had to start five outfielders that absolutely plays from start to finish throughout the season i think duval's got 35 homers and 100 plus rbis yeah like duval is kind of a similar a similar profile where that that it's not like a keeper profile or a dynasty profile but it can be a good like a nl only three dollar

player profile yep because it's not pretty and it doesn't look good through the sabermetric lens right both these guys i don't walk nearly enough i just could see him hitting like 180 next year and dropping out of the lineup i don't know. I mean, yeah, that's definitely part of the doubt. That's why you're getting them for three bucks. Right, right. But yeah, there's always some shots to take there. I think if Schwindel costs the same, I would go for Schwindel, but I think maybe Schwindel will cost more because he's hitting 335 with 12 homers. I mean some of the the top line stats

are great and then people will also see that strikeout rate and like him for it um the uh the there there is one thread that that connects all these guys uh to me and it's not barrel rate because you have a barrel rate that ranges from 6.4 at Lane Thomas on the bottom end to 15% or 15.9 with Patrick Wisdom. So it's a fairly wide range of barrel rates. It's not strikeout rate because you've got Frank Schwindel from 16 to Patrick Wisdom at 39.8. The same team claimed both those guys, right? But here's something that Schwindel and Wisdom have in common. both those guys, right? But here's something that Schwindel and Wisdom have in common. Schwindel,

who has half the barrel rate of Wisdom, has a 112.5 max EV, and Patrick Wisdom has a 114.2 max EV. And the range for all these guys is 109 to 114, which might sound kind of large, but it isn't because 108 is where plus max EV begins. So every single one of these guys has plus max ev it's the question of plus max ev or elite max uh exit velocity um and so i don't know man that looks like a reason to pick somebody up it's kind of like what farhan zaidi said about uh picking up uh I forget who it was, Drew Pomerantz or somebody. He said he saw the pitcher throw 94, and that was good enough. They picked him up, and they said, well, he threw 94, he threw 96.

We know he has that in him, right? So Maxie V is, we know he has that in him. Yeah, I think the other interesting thing here is that when you hone in on the same skill for players to be picked up like this, you can almost predict a little bit more of who's next to bounce around, right? I mean, if you're me and Mercedes had a position, he's 13th in max exit velocity. If you lower the batted ball events down to 25 which makes that a massive group of geez that's like several hundred players 553 players qualify on that list and he's where you know what is to sue does susugo have a position and he he got claimed

right yeah you know he has a lower max ev i don't know there's i think there's another chance for your mean out there right i think it goes back to finding value don't know. I think there's another chance for Jermaine out there. Right. I think it goes back to finding value in a place where there's not a lot of risk. And if you find that in a minor trade, which was the case with Lane Thomas since he went back to Washington in the John Lester deal, or you get it as part of a claim, or it's like a throw-in player in a trade, or it doesn't matter how exactly you get these players. throw-in player in a trade or it doesn't matter like how exactly you get these players but finding two or three years of someone that plays a lot is actually a pretty big win from like a scouting and ops perspective so satsugo i think is is just it's hard to figure out because came over from japan had some playing time issues like the rays were somewhat patient with them early on last year if i remember correctly and then they tapered off we're still playing them even though he was yeah for a while yeah like they gave him a good look he ends up with the Dodgers gets regular run at AAA for a while

this year which I almost wonder in a weird way if that helped him kind of just get some things back in order because the hardest thing for all these guys as journeyman types is up and down players usually between AAA and the big leagues. I don't know how you get better at hitting big league pitching when you're not seeing it regularly. So like the Frank Schwindel problem is, okay, yeah, he's 29. How many chances has he had to see big league pitching and to adjust to big league pitching? Very few, right? Very few.

What is this? Before this year, he had 15 career plate appearances in the big leagues. So you can't look at him and say, well, this is absolutely who he is because he's 29. I realize there's less growth potential for a 29-year-old, but if you want to see more than 194 plate appearances before you decide a player can't hack it, I would agree with that. You want to give him more time. So I could see him at least getting a couple of months to

begin 2022, depending on how thrifty they want to be and who else is out there and a bunch of factors that are way out of his control. They're not going to spend money on a first baseman unless by some fluke they get Rizzo back. Yeah, I don't think that's going to happen. I think that bridge has been crossed.

Thomas and Connor Jill are probably the two most interesting players that you've flagged for today. Thomas is the youngest. I just wanted to point out, you're talking me into Schwindel a little bit, but that low bail rate, Bat-X projects him to be an 89 WRC+,

which is terrible for a first baseman yeah it doesn't stick very long that's not and that and that's only with going the strikeout rate going to 19 it's just not giving him enough power and it's not giving him any obp so it gives him kind of uh duval with less power kind of deal even though he doesn't strike out so i don't know it's a i'm a little bit on the fence with schwindel and Sutsugo. I'm in the tank for three of these players. I like three of these players. Connor Joe, Ramon Urias, and Lane Thomas.

Those are the three I like. They all have decent barrel rates. They all have manageable strikeout rates. They all have good walk rates. And they have the three best eyes in this group in terms of reaching at pitches outside of the zone. I think that's going to give them... The nice thing is when you have an eye is it gives your team value when you're in slumps. I'm wondering... You're still getting on base if you're in a slump. I'm wondering with Lane

Thomas too, from a fantasy perspective, if part of the added appeal is that he has a few different ways that he can help us. I mean, he can run a little bit. We've seen stolen bases from him throughout his time in the minors. He's four for seven at the big league level so far this year in 60 games. That could be a dozen or maybe 15 steals over the course of a season, especially if he's on a team that doesn't worry too much about success rate because they're just trying to manufacture runs a bit

younger than some of the other guys here. K rate's not bad. I think he projects by the bat to be closer to just a league average sort of hitter. So then you start looking at things like, okay, does Lane Thomas have defensive value? Some of these guys don't have any, right? I would say that Frank Schwindel doesn't really have any defensive value, but if you can play

all three outfield positions capably, even if you're only good in the corners that matters too that kind of factors in to how teams are going to view you as a player I wonder here's who I think Lane Thomas could be I think Lane Thomas could be like another Austin Slater which maybe that's not the most exciting thing in the world but that plays and sometimes guys like that yeah someone gets hurt and a guy like that plays more and they do a little bit more than that yeah yeah also what i like about thomas urius and joe is they play in good parks so you know in shallower leagues if you had them if it didn't turn out to be the best outcomes for them they could still be home away platoon bench bench pieces for you where you pay you play joe when he's in colorado you where you play Joe when he's in Colorado, you play Urias when he's in Baltimore and Washington is sneaky homer friendly

so Austin Slater in Washington would also hit more homers even if the comp holds in a true talent sort of sense he might get to 18 or 20 homers just because of Washington and the name we haven't mentioned is Tyler Naquin

who just he has the worst eye on this of this grouping like gonna be one of the worst walk rates and so probably one of the worst walk rates and so probably one of the worst OBPs going forward. But the barrel rate is good,

the max EV is good, and the park is good. I have like Tyler Naquin for a buck in auto new and I'm going to struggle with it because he could be a useful bench piece as a $3 outfielder in Cincinnati. Yeah. My projections don't think it's a fluke

because you see the 113 WRC plus this season, the Bad Axe has him at 108 the rest of the way, so it doesn't look like a crash is coming offensively. They like the batted ball stats. I can see that. The barrel rate and the max EV are good. I think that Naquin and Thomas are probably second level. Joe, I think that they're just going to run Joe out there.

I mean, he's not going to hit a ton of homers, but he's a professional hitter in a way that they don't have. Right? And they're going to be kind of a rebuilding squad. I think they're going to run Joe out there, and he's going to have a great OBP and hit 18 to 20 homers and probably have a great OBP, and hit 18 to 20 homers, and probably have a decent average because he doesn't strike out that much.

I think Joe's a really hard player to project because he's been old for the level. He's a great story, by the way. The power looks legit even though it's been old for the level, and I think you're right. The plate skills, he's not only drawing walks but he's also controlled strikeouts everywhere he's been i'd be stunned if the rockies didn't want to keep him i mean they've made they've made bad decisions before they should they should keep him and they should give him 500 plus plate appearances and see what happens and in that park especially. It could be kind of a special year for him.

Fantasy wise in 2022. He's like the opposite of Sam Hilliard. Yes. Yes. If only you could smush those. Yeah. So many times I thought. If only you could smush these two players together.

You'd have a really awesome one. But no. I think Connor Joe could be the best of this group um urias though uh i think you know it's the same thing as with baltimore with with baltimore as it is with colorado which is they just kind of need players you know and he looks like at least a league average player i think you know and they probably can't say that about a lot of the other guys. So they're going to have a need either at shortstop or second base or third base or whatever, and he's going to be able to fill it and he's going to do it better than Michael Franco. And even if the bad X projection is only for 95 WRC plus, that's going to be maybe that

has something to do with the Baltimore, you know, park factors and stuff, and it's still going to play well in Baltimore. park factors and stuff, and it's still going to play well in Baltimore. So for me, next year he's like a 250 hitter with like 20 homers and pretty decent runs in RBI. With the time. Yeah, assuming they give him the regular time. I think they give him the regular time. I think he's a really good deep league player.

He's probably not a great 12-team player. No, I don't know if we'll get to him in 12-team or really at any point next season. But for your AL onlys and for draft and holds, which I think we'll probably do a draft and hold strategy show sometime around November. Because those launch, I think, either before Thanksgiving or just after Thanksgiving, early December. It's a fun format if you haven't played it. It makes guys like Ramon Urias very draftable because you know if he doesn't play every day, he's probably going to play at least semi-regularly, and job security ends up being huge in a format like that. Just having options, especially guys

that can play multiple spots. So I love digging in on these players because they will pop up in a lot of our leagues, if not right away in 2022 at some point because they they will pop up in a lot of our leagues if not right away in 2022 at some point because they they're showing something it is interesting too just going back to satsugo for a second i i think there was a lot being made maybe on this show and a few other places just about how hard he was hitting the ball in j. And I think that does matter. And we're still talking about a guy that's only had 379 plate appearances so far in the big leagues, and half of those came in a pandemic year,

which, I mean, talk about all the adjustments that players coming from any other country are trying to make when they get here anyway, but then, you know, tack a pandemic on top of that. It seems easier than ever to give a player in that situation a pass for what happened in 2020 at any point. I know this year looks very similar on the surface, but the way this year is ending does give me just a glimmer of hope that Sosugo could maybe be a good part of the hitter we thought he was going to be when the Rays signed him. But I don't know if he's going to get that chance. The contract was a two-year deal.

We'll see if he actually finds a taker in North America or if he ends up going back and playing in Japan again. Yeah, and the offers may be competitive. When you're talking about that sort of player, he may be looking at around a million bucks either way.

Yeah. So he may end up going back which is too bad because we wouldn't have gotten to see the whole the whole shmuel the whole wish from the meal that's a word that came out of my mouth um Jake burger baby have we already done that we did do a Jake burger saying yeah okay well I just wanted to point out a good MaxEV guy. What about this Justin Williams guy? He's popping. He's been hurt

I think all season. I have him stashed away in NL labor on my IL. I feel like I haven't seen any updates on him coming back or anything. Oh, man. He's one of these guys where he's humming along with 15-18% strikeout rates in minor leagues and then gets to the major leagues and all of a sudden he's a 30% strikeout guy.

That's crazy. I've got to write a piece about that at some point. He's played a little bit at AAA this year. He's got a hamstring injury again now. He's got really nothing left to prove at AAA at this point. Another guy that just needs an opportunity. 115 max EV is pretty impressive. 11% barrel rate. What's his eye like? Not good.

Not a very good eye. Andrew Young, David Bodie. Andrew Young can't make any contact. No, but you know who's starting to make more contact and he pops on this list is bobby dahlbeck i saw the the tweet i think it was jason master donato threw this out there he's like i'm trying to understand the last five weeks from from bobby

dahlbeck i just retweeted it and just wrote same because yeah i thought i had him sort of figured out as just the guy that wasn't going to make enough contact when he makes contact he does damage story is pretty simple to figure out but he's showing us in these last few weeks, maybe there's just a little bit more there. I think if we go back to even the beginning of August, Dahlbeck is hitting 314 with a 391 OBP and a 735 slug. That spans 35 games, 11 home runs during that time. A 27% K rate works when you hit the ball as hard as he does 9.6 walk rate just enough in the walk rate category are you buying the late season adjustments that you're seeing from bobby dahlbeck because he does a lot of things that we like dude he has a strikeout

rate in the 20s for like the last 20 games i i graphed uh you know they they have this graphing tool on Fangraphs where you can do by game rolling stats I graphed O swing against K percentage and I was expecting to see more of a improvement in his reach rate but I don't see it so I don't know exactly what it's coming from

it would take a larger deep dive I think in terms of maybe it has something to do with what he's coming from and take a larger, uh, deep dive, I think in terms of maybe, uh, it has something to do with what he's swinging at. Um, he probably, uh, has identified some sort of better strategy at the plate, um, in terms of maybe just honing in on, on certain pitches, uh, that he can actually make contact with. So I don't know. Yeah, I guess, you know, he's always, this type of player always represents the kind of biggest boom bust ability, you know,

where, you know, you look at it and you say, oh, I don't want to be, I'm not into that because of the strikeout rate. It's probably not going to work out. But if it does work out, he's going to hit 250 next year with 40 bombs. That's the kind of skill set he has. Arguing against myself, if I think we need to see more Frank Schwindel before drawing a conclusion, we're talking about Patrick Wisdom

as a guy that has had fewer than 100 career big league plate appearances before this season. So maybe the Cubs are doing their due diligence and letting him play as much as they've let him play so far this year. I just wonder, at what starting point with K percentage are we high enough where the big step forward that we would like to see is still not enough to be sustainable? That's kind of the concern. Dahlbeck is projected for a 35% strikeout rate.

If he takes a big step forward, he strikes out 30% of the time next year, and that's doable. Right. Projecting more than a 5% change, he's at 39%. And what's he projected for? Oh, he's got him projected for something close to that.

Okay, it's not that much different 36 percent yeah but the likelihood that dahlbeck in terms of probabilistic thinking the likelihood that dahlbeck takes a three percent increase a decrease in the strikeout rate is way higher than it is for wisdom by the way bobby dahlbeck is 26. I don't know why in my mind I thought he was 23. Oh, good Lord. Thank you for pointing that out. Why are you 26, Bobby Dahlbeck? It's still true. It is.

But a little bit less true. But he started at 42.4. Even with the new aging curves, usually people's strikeout rates improve only until about 26. But I think that's also kind of like what does one player who plays a lot in one season do the next season right that's not quite the same thing as dahlbeck right because you you're still trying to figure out what his true talent strikeout rate is yeah and again it came up in the pandemic year played 23 23 games, had a 42.4% K rate,

so this is already a pretty big improvement, and I don't know how much we can use 2020 as a starting point for any player with our analysis for a number of reasons. Yeah. But I think it's fair. He still sort of generally belongs in that wisdom bucket where I'm like, yeah, some of these guys work out, but it's a little bit like the kind of crazy wild pitcher that has no

command. I'm like, yeah, okay. Maybe. I mean, it really could. If he,

everything comes together, he could be Tyler glass. Now. Sure. Who's the first picture that popped into your head when you made that description? Because the first picture that, okay.

Cause I thought Daniel Cabrera. Yeah. Well, that didn't work. No. And the other name that always because i thought daniel cabrera yeah well that didn't work no and the other name that always comes to mind is henry rodriguez oh yeah yeah that's a good one too everybody probably had a different name they'll pop into their head i wonder the range of positive points so that's why glass now came up but yeah if you yesterday i actually uttered the name henry rodriguez so yeah and rodriguez is my first in the other way yeah you know it's just it's funny how that works we just have these memories attached to players and sometimes it's uh for a particular reason

we had this email come in from one of our listeners and comes from long email andrew and we were talking about joshmenter on Monday's podcast. We got an email and the subject line was Josh Kalmenter award story. I'm like, what on earth is this email going to be? It's a cool email. I'm going to share it for everybody here. Hi DVR and Eno. I was listening

to the podcast but never email in. Since you brought up Josh Kalmenter on Monday, I wanted to share my Kalmenter story. Honestly, I didn't know where this was going to go. A friend of mine and I both ran fantasy baseball leagues, and they were both losing some members, so we ended up combining the most active members to form a new league in 2014. It is a pretty normal keeper league with four keepers. I like to give my trophies a name, and this one is the Josh Kalmenter Championship Trophy.

Why, you ask? And yes, I was very curious. I will pick up the story on the Wednesday before the 2014 season ended when I dropped Josh into the free agent pool. On Friday, I was in first place in the standings when the second place team outbid me for Josh by $1. That was the last wafer period of the year.

Then came Sunday when Colmenter started against the Cardinals. Early in the day, the Pirates lost, securing the division for the Cardinals and causing them to bench all their regular starters. The hangover lineup. I was still in first place by a half point in the standings while Kalmenter was 7 2 3rds innings

into the game. With the last out of the 8th, the second place team's ERA dropped to 3.56468 with the next highest ERA being 3.56470, moving him up one point in ERA by.0002, thus propelling him past me for the 2014 inaugural championship by one half point in the standings. Our champion was basically decided by one out, and it was the last out Josh Kalmenter got in 2014, so of course we named the trophy after him. In the offseason, I sent him a letter explaining the story

with a ball in hopes to get it signed. For some reason, my return address got lost, but I had my email on the letter. Always a good idea to include the email on the letter. Josh actually emailed me and thought the story was really funny. After I gave him my return address, he signed the ball and inscribed it with our league name, BABIP. I have a picture attached of the trophy. I've still yet to win the league, although I'm back in second this year.

I will need a lot of things to go right to win my first. Love the show, but miss beer of the week. It's from Andrew in Aurora, Illinois. What an amazing story. beer of the week. It's from Andrew in Aurora, Illinois. What an amazing story. Maybe he could take over first on the last day of the season with a start from like Jesus

Lizardo or something. Oh, yeah. We actually had a Lizardo question on Twitter too from Lot49 on Twitter. And I believe the question was, what do you believe Lizardo needs to do to be a long-term number three starter?

I'm pulling this off of memory, so if I'm paraphrasing incorrectly, I'm sorry, but I think that was the gist of the question. We've talked about Lizardo a few times on this show, and I think I talked about him on the Athletic Baseball Show with Keith Law a couple of weeks ago, too. The fastball hasn't been good for Lizardo.

The velocity's good, but the pitch isn't good. Bad shapes on both of the fastballs. Now, we've talked about some guys who've had fastball problems recently on this show, and it made me wonder, could the Lozardo secret also be possibly working in a cutter instead of leaning on that four-seamer? Yeah, I mean, the cutter is a solution for some of these guys, but I think maybe there's a chance for him a little bit like Ryan Weathers, which is another person we've gotten a question about somewhere, where I think that the solution for both of them,

I think what's happening right now in the game is that people have been told to throw their four seams. There was a three, four, five year period in the minor leagues where everyone was like, oh my god, high four seams, high four seams, everyone, we need to throw high four seams. It's all about four seams and low in the minor leagues where everyone's like oh my god high four seams high four seams everyone we need to throw high four seams it's all about four seams and and low in the zone breakers like like look at the raise they're doing this like and so everyone was told

to throw their four seams including people that had better two seams and better sinkers and so they were kind of forced into this thing where they're like throwing four seams look at logan webb he's throwing four seams actually his, his two seam sinker is way better. Oh, let's just lean into what's better. You're way better as a sinker guy, even if the league is prioritizing four seamers. And so I have a feeling that chasing after four seam spin efficiency has led Lizardo to a below average four seam and a below average sinker where he might have a chance because the velocity is good he might still have a chance of an above average sinker so I think I would lean into the sinker usage for both him and Weathers because both of

them have similar concerns about fastball shapes and then once you kind of reprioritize yourself as a sinker guy then you can think about shapes that fit better with the sinker and kind of revamp your other pitches as well but it'll all start with finding a fastball that works that's why i'm agreeing with you that a cutter could be it uh i think in this case maybe in weathers and lazard's case it's actually the sinker but either way it's like finding a fastball that works. I mean, that's what Burns needed to do, right? He threw a poor foreseam. He actually did go to sinker, but he also went to a cutter. He went from foreseam, cutter as a slider,

to cutter as a fastball, sinker as a fastball, foreseam as an afterthought. to cut her as a fastball, sink her as a fastball, force him as an afterthought. Should we head off the impending Mitch Keller questions at the pass? Would that also work for Mitch Keller? I don't know. But do you have any of those sort of Colmenter-type stories where you won on the last day?

I missed out on the Ras Ball-B best ball this year by two points. They happened in the last game of the day, but I don't know that I know exactly what play did it to me. I just know that I was refreshing a lot and was like, ah. I'm trying to remember if there are any last plays that put me over the top for either a season-long win or even like a big DFS win, that'd be amazing. I think the one play that almost cost me a league was a Jake Cave.

I think it might have even been a game 163 situation where I want to say Cave. You're like, I have this one won. What? There's another game. I think I had left Cave in my lineup, and if I remember the story correctly, I'll try to dig this up. I think I left Cave in my lineup,

and he was in for game 163, and if he did nothing, I was fine. As long as he didn't, like if he didn't play, I was fine. But if he went 0 for 4, I think it was going to be a problem. And there was some, I'm probably botching the story because

I should have dug this up before we started recording, but there's something there. It's one involving Jake Cave in Mixed Labor, where it was a weird one. It was definitely not like, oh, he hit a home run, so I won. Those stories are somewhat more common, but seeing the very granular,

oh, and that guy got one more out and I lost my league because of it yeah that is incredible uh that's like uh you know jake cave went over three instead of over four so i won right they pulled him you know they pulled him in the seventh and it may have been there may have been like a scoring related decision there like a like a fielder's choice or in an error or something that actually did come into play that was pretty bizarre that kept it from working against

me. I love the idea of when something odd like that happens, reaching out to the player and getting a cool signed baseball back. Josh Kalmenter's got an 80-grade signature, by the way. It can also kind of go in any direction.

I mean... You're taking a chance. I think I asked... Who was it? I asked Carl Crawford. Oh! I did! I asked Dexter Fowler why he

didn't steal more bases for my fantasy team. He didn't like that, did he? No. No, that was a bad idea. It didn't go that badly. He just didn't like the question. So I was like, I know.

I'm just kidding. I don't really care. But you are a really fast guy. You know, do you think about stealing more bases? Because remember Dexter Fowler, he stole like you know 15 or so or right he's always the kind of guy who stole a few we ended up salvaging it and having an okay conversation but did not like that framing so i mean it comes back to that whole like you know let's not refer to it as as owning the players and and it's a little bit weird to like then talk to a player about owning them in your fantasy league.

It kind of borders on that, like, you lost my team to game. They don't want to hear that. Don't go search out. Someone searched out lucas giolito's wife don't ever do that and and dm'd her saying uh you need to venmo me some cash because giolito's blow up today cost me a parlay yeah never ever ever ever ever ever do that like under any circumstance there's no reason to do that i just can't even the mental hurdles there like is there some sort of entitlement thing there or like what i i don't know what drives people to choose to do that but if you've ever thought about doing that the answer

is to not do it yeah it's amazing oh anyway on that note well send us your josh call mentor uh award type stories i mean yes that one turned out really good and and and and the the best part of it is it's a positive thing they do they don't it's fine it's fine to tell someone that they won you some money or that they won you some money or that they won you a fantasy league. I think that they... Because in the end, you're saying something positive. The opposite, it's not really their fault.

They're trying their hardest. They're trying to win. They're trying to play. They're not trying for you. They're not. They're trying themselves. Is that the weird thing that people don't get? It could be. They're not trying for you. They don trying themselves. Is that the weird thing that people don't get?

It could be. They're not trying for you. They don't even know you exist. They don't even know you exist, yeah. I'm sorry to burst the bubble on fandom like that. Jake Cave doesn't know that he's a part of a mixed labor situation. He doesn't care. He's just either trying to win or trying to pad his stats at that point.

He's just trying to make the roster next year yeah right so yeah if he cost me a labor title i wasn't gonna go tweet at him like hey thanks jerk it's like why would why would i do that why would you send us your good stories uh rates and barrels at theathletic.com on twitter he's at you know saris i am at derrick van riper we've still got that 50 off deal going at theathletic.com on Twitter. He's at Saris. I am at DerekVinRiper. We've still got that 50% off deal going at The Athletic right now. No more emails about the giveaway. Thank you for those emails. I will try to get back to you,

but if I don't get back to you, it's just because I got too many emails. It was a poorly thought out idea that I did by the seat of my pants. I will send out 10 to the first 10 who responded it's the only sort of equitable thing I can come up with and

if you don't hear from me I'm sorry I didn't get like 80 cases of beer so thank you so much for everybody who did reply. And I'm excited to have people try it. It tastes to me, for a little mini beer of the month thing,

sticky stuff by full tilt with my face on it. Tastes beautiful because I'm beautiful. But also, it tastes a little bit like a Union Jack, which is an old Firestone Walker West Coast IPA but it's sweeter. It has like a lemon, kind of a hardcore lemon taste to it. So it kind of reminds me, it's kind of a blend of new school and old school because it's got this lemony sweetness to it that they didn't used to have back in their old kind of malty West Coast IPA.

It's not as bitter as it was, but it is a little bit more malty than you might expect. So it's kind of a blend of old school and new school West Coast IPAs, I would say. So I'm going to co-sign on the Eno recommendation, even though I haven't had it yet. I thought you were going to co-sign on me being beautiful. Sure, yeah. I can do that too. I thought you were going to co-sign on me being beautiful. Sure, yeah. I can do that too.

But I'm sorry to whoever number 11 would have been because I'm probably getting the beer that would have gone to number 11. We will try to make it up to you. Maybe we need to do some merch or something. I don't know. People seemed really excited about that. That's an awesome thing. To be honest, I've never actually drank a beer with my friend's face on the can before, so that'll be a new achievement for me.

I never thought I would be on a can. The other thing is, give us ideas for merch. That could be a good thing to email us. Yeah, what would you like? If we had Rates and Barrels logos or funny things we say or outlines of our faces. Yeah, what would it be? Yeah, you know.

What's that site where you can do the, you can do like a greeting? You know, like a 30, like a cameo. Oh yeah. Do people want cameos? Like a rates and barrels message? I've done one of those. I recorded something for somebody who won a league

and I gave them a congratulations. But I also, in order to do it right, I asked for a couple of less than stellar stories or adjectives. I kind of roasted them a little bit. You've got to add a little

bit of roasting because otherwise it's just all fun and games. I think they liked it. It seems to be the spirit. Those are kind of fun. Yeah. Someone tried to use a cameo

from a major league player to break up with his girlfriend. Did they just reject it or they do it and then they sent the cameo and the break didn't happen? and roasted the person that hired them.

Deserved. Absolutely deserved. Which is probably pretty hilarious. My Twitter feed is too full. No, I mean there are certain things you should not do with the cameo and ending a relationship is one of them.

I'm sorry. Do you think people have used cameo to quit jobs? I bet that's something people have done. Hi, this is Hino Saris. Brad will not be coming back to work on Monday. Brad won the DraftKings special. Brad hit the Millie Maker this weekend. He's not coming back to work.

He says, in conclusion, F you. Right, yeah. And I'm sorry, I'm going to curse here. I'm sorry. This is not me speaking, by the way. I F you. Right, yeah. And I'm sorry, I'm going to curse here. I'm sorry. This is not me speaking, by the way. I love you. Brad, however, doesn't. We have gone too long. Our heads have swollen

in size, but let us know. If there's merch or something that you would actually be interested in, I don't know, mugs, beer glasses, shirts, hats, we'll try to make some stuff if people actually would buy it. That's sort of the key thing. If we're going to go to the trouble making merch, we just want to make sure people actually want it. There should be

a little bit of demand before we make a supply. At least that's what I'd hope. But on Twitter, as I mentioned, Eno Saris, I'm at DerekVerniper. That's going to wrap things up for this episode of Rates in Barrels. We're back with you on Monday. Thanks for listening.