Rates & Barrels - The Rays add Nelson Cruz, playing matchmaker, and saying hello to the Cleveland Guardians

Episode Date: July 23, 2021

Eno, Britt & DVR discuss Nelson Cruz to the Rays before an attempt to play matchmaker ahead of next week's trade deadline. Plus, the Dodgers' increasing list of needs in the wake of a big series loss to the Giants, and welcoming the Cleveland Guardians into the world.  Follow Eno on Twitter: @enosarris Follow Britt on Twitter: @Britt_Ghiroli Follow DVR on Twitter: @DerekVanRiper e-mail: [e-mail] Subscribe to the Rates & Barrels YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/c/RatesBarrels Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Welcome to Rates and Barrels. It is Friday, July 23rd. Derek Van Ryper, Britt Giroli, Eno Saris here with you. And of course, we are presented by Topps. Check out Topps Project 70, celebrating 70 years of Topps baseball cards. The trade deadline frenzy has already begun. We're one week ahead of the actual deadline. It falls on Friday, July 30th this year.

Got some cool live stuff we're doing next week. We're going to move this episode from Friday to Saturday to wrap up all of the trade deadline action. But the big move that went down on Thursday is the one we're going to start with today. Nelson Cruz is a member of the Tampa Bay Rays. I think if you were trying to predict trades, it was one of the easier potential fits because you could look at the Rays, you could see a team that was floating the DH, one that could use another little boost on offense, and there was probably only one other clear suitor. For me, it was Oakland. So it was between those two teams for where Cruz was going to end up, and it turns out it was the Rays, in fact, who made the deal. Joe Ryan and Drew Strotman go to the Twins, also Kelvin Foucher going to the Rays, but Cruz to the Rays. Let's just start with that. going to the Rays, but Cruz to the Rays. Let's just start with that.

Are the Rays done? Is this their big move, or do you think they're going to keep adding even more pieces here between now and next Friday? So I thought this would have been it, except listening to Eric Neander, the GM of the Rays, talk to reporters yesterday, it seemed like they're pretty committed to kind of going all in,

or I guess as all in as a team like Tampa Bay with that kind of constraints in the or I guess as all in as a team like Tampa Bay with that kind of constraints in the payroll and things, you know, can go. I think what kind of keeps me from being like, all right, they're done. They're not going to make any more moves is that farm system is loaded. I mean, they traded two prospects to Minnesota who has a pretty good farm system. Both of those guys moved up several slots because the Twins farm system, which one has graduated a lot of top guys recently, and two is pretty well respected around the league, just isn't as good as Tampa Bay's. I mean, they can trade away young pitching

and there's 10 more guys behind them. You know, we've talked about this for years, the secret sauce with Tampa Bay. So do I think that the Rays are done? Not necessarily. sauce with Tampa Bay. So do I think that the Rays are done? Not necessarily. If I'm another team, am I hesitant to deal with the Rays? Absolutely, because it seems like more often than not, they get the better end of the stick here. And that stick is the ageless Nelson Cruz, who I think could help a lot of people. What was most interesting today to read is Ken Rosenthal, our colleague, said that the Padres were also interested in Nelson Cruz, which sounds crazy, but sort of tells you a few things. One, everyone wants Nelson Cruz's bat. And if they have to find a spot for him, they'll find a spot for him. And two, how beloved that guy is. And I wrote about this in Denver in the All-Star Week. But Manny Machado told me

he's the best teammate I've ever had. I wish he was on my team. Him and Fernando Tatis are just totally enamored with Nelson Cruz. He's idolized by so many young players. It doesn't surprise me to hear that some of the Padres petitioned and A.J. Preller had legitimate interest in a guy like Cruz, even though it just doesn't seem to fit. Yeah, you got to make room for a guy like that. But the perfect fit was Tampa because they strike out more than anybody in baseball. And Nelson Cruz, there's only like, I think there

was three players that have more power than Nelson Cruz and strike out less. And their names are Vlad Guerrero Jr., Matt Olson, and Max Muncy. So he's a great combination of contact and power, really going to make that lineup better. And somebody else pointed out another thing on Twitter. He murders breaking balls. And that's not necessarily something that Randy Orozarena or Brandon Lau are doing well right now. So really good fit in there between sort of lineup diversity and maybe replacing some of the exuberance and team quality, team leadership that Willie Adamas might have taken with him to Milwaukee. There was, you know, everyone talked about how great a teammate he was. So really great fit. If the Rays have more to do, I would bet it wouldn't be as exciting as this. I think it'll

just be innings. And I know that people are focused on starting pitchers with a capital S and a capital P, but you know how the Rays work. I could see them getting somebody like Chad Kuhl from the Pirates who just give them innings, you know, three or four innings. And they'll figure out, you know, who pitches before him and who pitches after him. You know, I know, three or four innings. And, uh, and they'll figure out, you know, who pitches before him and who pitches after him. You know what I mean? Like, you know, that sort of deal where they, they, they see something they like in a guy, maybe they think they can increase his beneficency or this or that. Um, and, uh, and they'll just get innings from somewhere. I just don't see them paying, uh, for like Jose Barrios. They would have probably put him in this deal and made it

bigger. Or I don't know who are the other frontline starters that are out there on the trade market. It's thin. I mean, I think it's more rental types for the most part. Yeah. Kyle Gibson, Michael Pineda, who also could have been added to this deal if they wanted to go that route. Maybe he traded for John gray i don't know like i i think a lot hinges on how they feel about tyler glass now and his recovery and the likelihood that he's giving them high quality innings later this season i think if they were going to make one more splashy move it would probably be for a starter that we don't expect to get moved right it's not going to be for those rental guys necessarily, but it would be the kind of trade.

So on the athletic baseball show for Friday, Keith Law suggested Sandy Alcantara could get moved because the Marlins have a surprising amount of pitching. He was talking about the connection between the Yankees and Marlins. Obviously, a lot of Yankees front office people, including Kim Eng, have been with the Yankees. They know the system really well. That pipeline has been open for a few years anyway.

That all makes sense. Maybe they actually give up a piece like Taylor Walls for that. Right. You know, people, we were talking about Taylor Walls for Franco here, but that doesn't make sense because you don't have, you wouldn't have anything beyond this year. It's a rental. But if it's Sandy Alcantara, if they believe in his arm to that extent,

then they could give up Walls franco slides into to shortstop and the marlins have a bit of an issue i mean like miguel rojas is okay but i don't think he's under contract after this year anyway um and uh getting somebody like taylor walls and a pitching prospect might be something that they look into yeah i just i think it could be something unexpected if there's another big, I just I think it could be something unexpected if there's another big move. Otherwise, if they can't find what they like, I think you're right. I think it's just adding some volume, adding some depth and doing what they often do. But that puts a lot more pressure on the young guys there. I mean, especially someone like Shane McClanahan. Like I think they expect quality things from him or at least from Patino. One of

those guys will have to step up if they don't add more to this rotation. And I think Glass now getting healthy is a huge part of the Rays' calculus too. And we'll know a lot more how they feel about that based on the next wave of moves that they make. As far as that return goes, Joe Ryan's a guy that came up on this podcast probably February or so, maybe even before that, in part because he was interesting for really deep fantasy leagues. Just in case the opportunity came along, the numbers in the minors were really good. I think at the time, you threw a bucket of cold water on him as a deep sleeper. There was something in the profile that you didn't like. The results so far this year at AAA have been good. I think the

benefit for him not being in Tampa Bay is that he could have a path to more innings. The drawback would be that if the Rays had kept him, he probably would have had an opener in front of him and he would have been managed very carefully. And the quality of the innings would have probably been higher, but now he's got a clear shot to maybe be a starter in Minnesota, if not immediately, before the end of the season. I mean, the comp for me is Jusmero Petit because he throws this invisible,

and I don't know if I can do this but here on I'm trying to show it on YouTube but like basically when his arm comes through he leads with his shoulder ah thank you I get the hole look at this alright so when he comes through

he kind of leads with his elbow and then the ball pops up and that's what ben lively did and also that's what use merrill petite does and that makes it hard to catch that release point you don't see the ball he hides the ball it comes out in the top so uh and then on top of that it's a it's a high it's like a a very spin efficient release so he's got ride um and he's not super tall I mean 6'2 he's not super short

but like basically it's kind of a little bit lower release point and then a lot of ride so anyway the fastball is great and that's why he has so many strikeouts but the secondaries haven't really necessarily come together so for him to be a starter the secondaries have to be good

and right now he's shown a decent cutter and just flashes on the changeup. Yeah, so still some work to be done, but at least someone who's going to be on the radar in AL-only leagues, I think, with this opportunity. Maybe a mixed-league streamer before the end of the season, but I think Eno did a pretty good job outlining the flaws and the things that might hold Joe Ryan back from being anywhere near as effective in the big leagues as he was in the minors. And of course, the big question for today's show, the meat in the Friday show sandwich, what's next for trade deadline moves, Brit? What's the next domino to fall? Who's the next player to move? I think there's a handful of guys you hear in pretty much every set of rumors you see in just about every trade deadline forecast sort of piece. So who's it going to be? Who's the next big name to go? And where do you think they're going to go? My money's on Trevor

Story. I think that there's little to no incentive to not trading Trevor Story at this point in time. And I think the market for that guy, a lot of teams have checked in. I think the Yankees were the most recent one. And in that move, they would, what, move Gleibar to second, I think I saw, would kind of be the plan for that. The thing, though, is the Yankees lost an absolute heartbreaker last night. I don't know if you guys saw that game

with the wild pitches. And I don't know who had it worse, the Yankees or the Dodgers, losing on that check swing call. There were some really, really gut-wrenching losses around the game last night. But I think Trevor Story is probably the next guy who gets moved. I think a lot of this trade deadline really depends on the Washington Nationals. And I spoke to Mike Rizzo the other day at Nats Park. And he kind of said, and I think this is true for probably a lot of teams right now,

guys, that they have a dual approach right now. They're either going to sell or they're going to buy. And they've got scouts and people and scenarios on both sides. And it depends on what happens the next four or five days, which is why I think, I mean, which is going to, to me, is really going to impact what happens here. Because a few weeks ago, we all kind of thought maybe the Tigers would be

this team that would just roadkill and people would just pick them over. Well, now they're really good and they're in a position where they probably aren't going to do anything and why should they, right? Yeah, and they hired A.J. Hinch, who's a win-now guy. Yes, and the orioles would be an obvious team to be like oh let's feast here well john means hasn't been good since he came back from the il his spin rate has been uh down suspiciously down uh they're not trading trey mancini and they're not trading sedver mullen so where they don't really have

anyone either so where you know obviously the rockies have some pieces that can be moved. Seattle has overperformed. You look at this list and do I think Chris Bryant finally gets moved after three years of trade rumors? Probably. But there just isn't that many teams that are in total, hey, let's sell everything, burn it to the studs mode. I think a lot of teams are in that weird in-between.

And that's why I think that 48 hours before the trade deadline could get pretty wacky as teams kind of have to decide that have been straddling this line. Yeah. I was on the Mets podcast with Ted Berg yesterday, and he pointed out that the Braves come to town for a four-game series that ends on the trade deadline. And the Braves, if they get swept or if the Mets take three out of four, they could really sort of put the nail in the coffin and turn the Braves into sellers pretty quickly there because of just how that division shakes out, how they lost Acuna and so on. So I think there will be a few teams. The Yankees seem like they're kind of in that boat too, where, you know, I think they'll buy, but like the, the extent of which, you know,

do they give up Clint Frazier? Cause that was the rumor giving up Clint Frazier for Trevor story seems like that's an aggressive move for me, you know, cause I think Clint Frazier is a big leaguer. I know that there's other people who don't, and he didn't have a great year or whatever this year, but I think Clint Frazier is a big leaguer and you're giving up a lot of years of a big leaguer for Rental and Trevor Story for a season that may just be a lost season. It's kind of has a little bit of that feeling, even though I've been the one saying the Yankees are good, like that doesn't good teams don't always play well. Good teams don't always win and make the postseason. So I would be cautious about giving up Clint Frazier.

And that's why I thought Story might go to the Athletics just because I was looking at the market and being like, who's going to be desperate for a shortstop? Who wants it the most? And to me, Elvis Andrews is now sort of a bottom five shortstop in the league. And that could be a real easy way for the athletics to increase their run production is to get Trevor Story. And if the rest of the market doesn't pony up, I could see the A's coming up with something that the Rockies like. But if the Yankees are going to go with Clint Frazier, then he's not going to Oakland.

Yeah, I think a lot of the contending teams have needs beyond shortstop. Most contending teams have a good young shortstop holding that spot right now. You could play Story at second base for the second part of the season. I don't think that would be that much of a stretch. But it seems like overkill.

They just pay Lindor. I understand they have a lot of injuries. But I don't know. If I'm the Mets, I'm probably looking at maybe adding an outfielder. Even maybe starting pitching depth. I think pitching. I think what would be ideal for the Mets would be a pitcher that would be useful in your bullpen. Somebody that you could see like you know being

like a four inning starter you know being a guy who can give you innings until carasco and thor come back uh but then also would be a good addition to your playoff bullpen uh so i think that sounds like maybe like a lefty hmm i think they might be maybe kyle. Oh, yeah, maybe, yeah. But otherwise, a lefty might be interesting because I don't think that Penn is super left-handed. Yeah, I think the most prominent lefty available is a short reliever, Taylor Rodgers. Well, with Edwin Diaz being sort of a spin rate problem himself, I would say that maybe Taylor Rodgers makes a lot of sense. Left-handed, could close

for them in the short term. Diaz gets his job back. He's the lefty guy. So I like Rodgers. The one that sticks out for me as being super, super, super obvious and just needs to happen is Adam Frazier to the White Sox. Even with the bats that they're getting back, they're pretty right-handed heavy. Adam Frazier as a left hander that can play second base won't cost, I don't think, a ton and then can play outfield for them next year and just gives him a lefty bat. That's good. And, you know, I don't think he's an amazing player, but a little bit overvalued by batting average. But still, that's kind of what they're missing with Nick Madrigal, right? A guy who will move them along, who will make contact and play from the left side.

And he gives you more depth next year. We talked about the White Sox back before the season started, and we said if it goes wrong for them, it's probably because their big league depth is very suspect. Surprisingly, they've tapped into it and gotten pretty good mileage out of some guys. Gavin Sheets and Jake Berger more recently.

Jermaine Mercedes back in April gave them some quality for a brief time. Adam Engel, right. By the way, glad that Jermaine Mercedes is not retired and is back in the lineup. I think there's a lot of things that we can blame Tony La Russa for. I'm not sure this one was that.

I think it was, I would say, from the outside, and I don't have inside knowledge, but I have read James Feagin on the issue, so I feel like I have inside knowledge. Sign up for The Athletic for $3.99 a month at theathletic.com slash ratesandbarrels. But I think it was just frustration. He had a really nice taste of the big leagues.

He had success at the big league level and was playing nearly every day. And then he was back in friggin' Charlotte. Which I'm not bagging on Charlotte. I'm just saying, you're like, God dang it. And then they also called up other catchers ahead of him because he's not a great defensive catcher. So he's like, God, they could use me right now, and they're not calling me up. I could see being like, screw all this.

He got pinch hit four in the sixth inning. I could see being like, I'm out of here. Yeah. He's 30. I think because he spent so much time in the minors, there's just level fatigue in place. But he wasn't sent down because someone came back and they just didn't have a spot for him. He was sent down because for a span of two months, he hit 196 with a 264 OBP and a 272 slug.

Bit of a scouting thing. I think they started filling up the top of the zone. He couldn't do anything about it. You're right. And for a contending team, you can't just let a guy like that try and make those top of the zone. He couldn't do anything about it. You're right. For a contending team, you can't just let a guy like that try and make those adjustments on the fly. So I don't know if the Yerminator

really gets another chance with the White Sox barring a couple of injuries. They're going to probably make some deals at the deadline, add some depth, and then add back in Eloy Jimenez. That crowds up left field first base DH

because then Andrew Vaughn's back in the mix with Abreu splitting the other two spots so all of that kind of just leaves him permanently blocked unless there's some team out there that wants to trade for him and if there was a team out there that was willing to trade for him and just see what would happen with those DH at bats that might be gone I would see it as a throw-in I don't think it's a throw-in I think he's closer to a DFA than than anything else at this point which is really kind of a bummer just based on how fun the story was back in April. But at the same time, this is how these types of things tend to go. Defensive value matters.

I mean, it's just if you can't – you have to be such a good bat to be a DH. I think, yeah, work ethic matters. I mean, the Nationals released him because he had a ton of talent and didn't want to work. They had conversation after conversation with him, showing up late, not listening. With the Orioles, he wasn't put on their playoff roster when he got promoted to the Frederick Keys for kind of the same thing. So I think, you know, I talked to someone yesterday who said if he dedicated himself, he could hit for 10 years in the big leagues. And I think what you saw with the I'm retired, i'm not retired still shows a level of immaturity certainly frustration yeah but also immaturity right like this is baseball like you have to work hard no one's going to hand you a

position um there are plenty of guys in triple a who feel like they belong in the big leagues that aren't retiring uh you know i think uh you know it's got a... Sorry. My phone fell. So yeah, that's kind of like my read on that. And I agree, maybe a DFA situation. You know, at the end of the day, I think makeup still matters. But what's interesting is in Chicago, Tony La Russa has shown to be a manager

who can overlook that if you can hit and you can play. And after that great April, what did he hit? Like 148? So he just wasn't getting it done at the big league level. And there's really nobody else to blame. You can't blame Tony La Russa for, in my mind, what happened and what transpired over the last couple days with Yerman Mercedes, really at all. But I do want to get back to the trade deadline stuff real quick, because to me, there's two guys who can change the whole trade deadline. I do want to get back to the trade deadline stuff real quick, because to me, there's two guys who can change the whole trade deadline.

Joey Gallo, Max Scherzer. Now, Joey Gallo looks like won't get traded, wants to stay in Texas, which is unfortunate for Texas because a lot of teams could use Joey Gallo. He's an outfielder. He's an outfielder,

hits for power. A lot of teams, and I think we talked about it on the show. You put him on another lineup, you know, maybe he gets even more pitches to hit. I don't know. And with Max Scherzer. I'd be a little bit nervous about signing him to a long-term extension, too,

with the strikeout rate. It's just that type of strikeout rate just makes me nervous. It just makes me feel like the other Chris Davis, where when it goes wrong, it just goes terribly, terribly wrong. I know that Gallo is more athletic, I think, than Chris Davis, but Chris Davis with a C was a third baseman at one point, and he's not a typical doddering first baseman or anything. People said he was athletic, and he was a great hitter

when they were defending that deal. So I think a long-term extension for Gallo might be a problem for Texas. So then you're stuck. Do we keep him because he says he wants to stay here, but we don't really want to sign him to this deal and we really could use the infusion of talent? Yeah. You trade him.

You have to trade him. He's not a pending free agent, right? He's got one more year left. But you get a lot more from him now than you would in the off season or next next trade deadline i i think that um to me like padres just the padres are big swingers um and getting gibson and gallo um with the ties they have that you know that's an underrated part of the trade deadline is that some people have ties with each other if you look at uh where trades are made like um you'll see certain teams line up a lot and it's because of who has whose phone number and who who's willing to who has

enough of a relationship with the other guy to look past that stupid first offer you know because if you don't have a relationship with another person in another front office and they send you that stupid first offer, you're like, screw you. This is the dumbest thing I've ever heard. No, bye. But if you're like, oh, Joe, never mind that offer. Let's move past that into something that might actually happen. Hilarious.

I don't know why that's funny. I don't know why Joe was a funny name choice there, I guess. Cause I don't, I can't think of one off the top of my head. They're overwhelmingly white males, right? I just picked one.

Hey Joe. I think the other player that's kind of interesting in all this, we'll get to Scherzer in just a second, but I think kind of circling back at Adam Frazier, I think Frazier to the White Sox has made sense for like two months. Ever since the magical injury happened, at least, it made sense. It kind of made sense even before that when they had more needs in the outfield. Whit Merrifield and the Royals' willingness to trade him, I think it makes sense for the Royals because their best configuration in the not-so-distant future is to have Bobby Witt Jr. and Adalberto Mondesi playing the two middle infield spots together. And I know Merrifield could play the outfield, but he's a late bloomer. He's 32.

He's got this really team-friendly deal. I think there'd be plenty of teams interested in him. I was trying to find a fit for him, and I thought maybe Oakland would be a good fit for Witt Merrifield. Kind of just a high-contact sort of guy. Plays good defense at second base. Affordable. Ticks a lot of boxes. Not a rental.

I mean, their middle infield is terrible. You could pick either side of the middle infield. And it's not a rental. It's kind of like the A is always going to be in the middle. They're contending now. They're probably going to try and contend again next year. I don't see another really good mix. This is the kind of thing that's worth giving up more long-term value for.

Because Merrifield is a right-hander, right? So I don't think he's a great fit for the White Sox. Looking through the needs for other teams, I don't think second base is a big priority for a lot of other teams other than maybe the Giants. But the Giants seemed really focused, hyper-focused on barrel rate and power and stuff like that. So unless they wanted to just diversify their lineup and have kind of a contact spray guy,

I'm not sure that... Maybe the Giants make sense. But the Giants also, I don't think, care about money in this scenario. I think the Giants would love to do something like the Red Sox did, where they take somebody's high-priced player and don't have to pay much for it. Yeah. Yeah. So the Red Sox did with Adovino.

Like, no, we'll take Adovino off your hands. Could you give us a prospect, too? I think among the sellers, even though the sellers, like the true sellers, the bad teams in the league don't have a lot of players trade away. Saving money is still a thing that all of those teams want to do. So they'll take a little less talent back if they can save a few million dollars at the end of the season. So I think the Giants could be shopping from that bin because I think you're right. I think they've got plenty of room to spend. And as we're going to talk about a little bit, if you weren't taking them seriously a month ago, you're probably starting to take them a lot more seriously right now where

does marty go starling marty is a yankee i'm regardless of whether or not any other deals or any other players are involved starling marty to the yankees makes all the sense in the world and the thing i realized looking at this yesterday is that he has never been in a hitter friendly environment in his career he's a righty who spent his entire career in Pittsburgh, Arizona with the Humidor, and now Miami. And he's aging more gracefully than I would have expected. Some of his OBP, which this year is a career-high walk rate, but some of

his OBP is getting hit by pitches a lot, which is something of a skill and obviously an occupational hazard on top of that, so a little risky. He's on the IL a fair amount. I think it's a skill to get hit by pitches though, or it's just a willingness to absorb contact.

It's like a place you stand in the box sort of deal. I just think that it's interesting because the Astros and the Phillies could really use center field upgrades and the Phillies are talking a big game about being willing to go into the luxury tax

and wanting to go in. And they're in a division that's gettable. Yeah. They're not good, though. It's such a weird... There is that. I think Victor Robles needs to become a Philly someday just to see what happens when those two worlds collide for Brit.

I'm sorry, you guys. Their bullpen is historically, or maybe not. It's off that pace a little bit, but some of the stuff that was going on with that team. Do you guys think they're a playoff team? I think they can be. They seem kind of like a 500 team. No, no, no.

This is a yes or no. Don't dance around in the gray area. Yes or no. Well like a 500 team. No, no, no. This is a yes or no. Don't dance around in the gray area. Yes or no. Well, a 500 team is not a playoff team. Are they a playoff team? Well, I guess I have one question before I answer. No, no, no. How healthy is Jacob deGrom?

If Jacob deGrom is not healthy. He's already throwing. He's already out there throwing. Yeah, but this is like the third little blip that he's had with his arm in the last couple of months. Let's say DeGrom doesn't come back or doesn't stay healthy when he does. No, I don't know. With DeGrom, Thor, and Carrasco, they have enough like, you know, one of these guys will be all right and pitch well. One? One? At least.

One, maybe. Maybe one. I hope for their sake they're all healthy. I want to see all those guys pitching. The Mets should be able to cruise to this division, but if the Phillies actually are aggressive, if they're actually going to make multiple moves, they can be a playoff team. I think, I still believe their foundation is a notch better than Britt does.

Kimbrel, Marte. This was the weakest answer by either one of you guys. Yes or no. I said there were 500 teams and not a playoff team. Derek's been dancing around, probably worried about his Twitter mentions later after this goes live. Oh, come on. My Twitter mentions are garbage anyway. I'll say no.

They're not a playoff team, but they're not total idiots for buying. Your asterisk is if they try and if they make the right moves, maybe they can get in it. And if the Mets fall apart. I hear it. The division is surprisingly terrible. Yeah, and you know what's interesting? Is Rizzo said he expected this. I asked him this week.

He's like, yeah, I thought 88 wins would be like kind of, like this division would beat up on each other. I'm like. That's the projection, the 88 wins. You know, it's also interesting. The Mets and the Yankees have the exact same run differential, the exact same record, and the exact same projection. And just completely different narratives around them.

Partially because of the rest of the division. Yes, but also to me, the Mets are a more watchable, fun, entertaining team when everything is equal. When there's health on both sides. Interesting. I think. Don't you guys? They're a more entertaining team. I want to watch DeGrom.

I want to watch Lindor. To me, this Yankees... Cole, Judge? Cole? When Cole is pitching, the Yankees are a more entertaining team. I want to watch DeGrom. I want to watch Lindor. To me, this Yankees... Cole, Judge? Cole, I... When Cole is pitching, the Yankees are a must-watch. But when he's not pitching, are they your first click? Because, like, you know, you've got the whole world of MLB TV. They're not my first click.

I actually clicked away from the Red Sox-Yankees a little bit last night and back over to the Padres, Marlins. I did a little bit of hopping. Yeah. I watched the Rays a little. Yeah, they're kind of grinded out, see a lot of pitches, foul a bunch of pitches off,

and slow the game down kind of team generally. I think with the Phillies, offense pretty watchable. Bullpen, not watchable. So for the first seven innings, watch the Phillies, offense, pretty watchable. Bullpen, not watchable. So for the first seven innings, watch the Phillies. Once it gets to about the eighth inning, your Phillies fan... Turn on something else.

Change the channel. But they could make the right moves. They could actually do it. I think the Astros is a possibility for Starling Marte is one that I hadn't thought much about. I mean, center field is a clear need for them. It was one that I flagged looking through all the different positions. but I hadn't really thought about

them actually trading for someone there. I think it would be a pure rental. I don't think they'd retain him because I think they see Pedro Leon or somebody internally possibly taking over that spot maybe by opening day of next season. I'm trying to look if any other names could be surprisingly moot.

The Kimbrell situation, there's plenty of suitors for these relievers. Kimbrell, Rodgers, Richard Rodriguez has multiple years of control. Kimbrell has more than one year too, right? Yeah, and he's expensive. So I think that kind of narrows the market down a little bit to more of the big market teams that will spend the cash. Kimbrell to the Phillies or Giants. Yep, those two teams make a lot of sense. Initially, I wanted to put him on the Jays.

I think the Jays are more likely to go get Richard Rodriguez because more years of control and he's cheaper. And I think the teams that are kind of chasing the wild card that are going to buy are looking more for multi-year improvements. Obviously, the Jays are a team on the rise. Make sure you're making next year better too. But yeah, if you're giving up future value for a team that has the up arrow for the next few years, you want someone coming back who's actually still going to be there if you're giving up anyone of significant long-term value. Yeah. Well, what about the twins, though?

Do you guys think Donaldson or Jose Barrios gets moved? Because the twins have already dealt in Olsen Cruz. Do they just go all in and trade everyone who they think... Because this was unexpected. They weren't supposed to be bad. So now that they've pivoted... Who's going to take on money like that, though? Yeah yeah i don't know like i could say the giants but longoria is gonna be back at some point phillies have bone uh yankees josh donaldson to the mets maybe and then davies davis goes the

outfield yeah i think that would be maybe one of the fits. That might be all right. That's not too terrible. It is a weird position. Not a ton of teams contending need a lot of help at third base. You can shuffle some things around. Plus, you got Chris Bryant out there, too. But the benefit of trading for Bryant instead, you can move him around a little bit.

You can at least feel good about playing Bryant at the infield corners or the outfield corners compared to Donaldson, who plays one spot. Even center. They asked him on MLB Network what his favorite place was to play and he said center. I think Bryant's a big piece here but circling all the way back

now to the Max Scherzer possibility I can't believe this is going to come down to these last couple days. I mean I can but it's a three game series at Baltimore starting tonight and then it's a four game series on the road against the Phillies, and then on the trade deadline, back home for Victor Roble's bobblehead day.

Britt, I will not have any of my collectibles after I move. If you happen to be at the park that day, and you happen to trip over a pile of Victor Roble's bobbleheads on your way out of the stadium, which you will because the fans will not want to bring those home. Please be kind enough to pick one up off the ground and drop it in the mail for me because I will cherish it for a very long time.

It'll be the first one in the background at the new place. Might be the only one. All right, all right. I'll see what I can do. If you're going to be there, don't make a special trip. Oh, I'm going to. If I'm here in town, I can do. If you're going to be there, don't make a special trip. Oh, I'm going to.

If I'm here in town, I'm going. Britt has me convinced, though, that Rizzo is not going to sell. You think he's not going to sell, so he's going to try and actually add because he sees a path to possibly hang around? I think he'll do the lamest of adding where it's just like a rental reliever that costs him very little, you know, some little thing. Yeah. I mean, guys, they did this in 19.

They were like flirting with contention, added a bunch of meh guys, Hunter Strickland, Ronas Elias. There you go. Daniel Hudson. That's it. Nobody thought it was sexy. Daniel Hudson ended up – Rizzo himself said this is not sexy. The Braves made all these splashy moves. And Daniel Hudson obviously ended up being the last guy on the mound in the World Series that year.

I'm really interested in somebody getting Michael Givens. He's a rental reliever. He has a really weird arm slot. And if you haven't seen Michael Givens a lot, he's really hard. Once you've seen him a ton, then some of that deception goes away. But if you brought him to a new division, people would be like, what is this? Yeah. I mean, people keep asking me about Scherzer.

And as we've mentioned, he could change the whole trade deadline. And Rizzo didn't totally say that they were opposed. If they sell, anyone's on the table. I'm just curious what it would take for them to sell, given what's going on in front of them with the Mets and the Phillies and the Braves. Given what's going on in this division, would they have to lose every game to say we're definitely sellers? It kind of seems like it, doesn't it?

I think they'd have to lose every game or at least drop two of three to the Orioles and then maybe split that second series against the Phillies prior to the deadline because that would put them about seven, depending on what happens up top. They're five below 500 as we're talking right now, but all but one team in that division is below 500 right now.

And it doesn't look like a division that's going to produce a wild card, right? No, no. It really looks like the West is going to take both wild cards. Yeah, I mean, the Padres have 57 wins already. They have seven more wins than the Mets, and the Mets are controlling that division. So it would take a lot for the NL West teams to fall back to the pack and not claim both of those wild cards.

Yeah. The other thing that makes me hesitant about the Nets going into sell mode is, one, they don't really do that. Two, Steven Strasburg threw a bullpen when i was there the other day and they allege he's coming back this season which if he does come back and he is healthy and these are all like ifs and ands and buts and maybes but um it's a different team yeah they're a very dangerous team right adding steven strasburg is a hell of a boost in a very mediocre division so if they're within sniffing distance

and they truly believe that Strasburg's coming back, why deal Max Scherzer, right? Why deal the Hall of Famer on your staff when you actually could still win? I just, I don't really see a scenario where they fall out completely. And even Rizzo alluded to the fact that, like, it's going to be very hard to convince them

that all of a sudden they're sellers, right?'re preparing they've got a you know a separate channel there but i think if you're in the nl east it's just i mean it's really tough to look at the mets and say well we can't beat them because they can and i guess that's the you know i made fun of the phillies but hey they could win the division too and and would it really surprise anyone? No, because that division is just such a mess. Such a mess. But Scherzer, would Scherzer net them prospects? Would he give them enough? Probably not, because you're looking at a rental.

Here's the thing people have kind of mentioned that's just a non-factor here, is him having veto power. Max Scherzer wants to win more than anyone I've ever been around. If he's going to a team that has a chance to win, he's not going to veto it. He's not going to require a contract extension. His agent, Scott Boras, did walk that back after initially saying that was like a mandated thing. So you're looking at a rental here. Do I think it's worth it for the Nats to trade a Max Scherzer?

No, I really don't. Their system's not very good. They're not going to get this like horde of prospects for two months of Max Scherzer? No, I really don't. Their system's not very good. They're not going to get this horde of prospects for two months of Max Scherzer. I'm just looking at the cost-benefit analysis and I don't really see it. Do you guys? I mean, only if you get like two or three major league ready pitchers and

who has that lying around? No one. No one has that. You'd have to think that you were revamping your rotation or something. The closest thing you could do, I think, if you were going to do that, would be a deal with the Rays because they've got depth that's knocking on the door. They're not giving up Shane Boz as part of that deal, right? That's not going to happen.

They're not giving up the clan ahead. More likely they give up something like Yarbrough or something. Yeah. You'd be digging into the next level pitchers in that org, which could be great, but at the same time, is that really what you want to do to put yourself out of the playoff race? Because you're waving the white flag

if you get rid of Max Scherzer. You're not going to win a World Series without him. And that might have some ramifications for fan attendance. Yeah. Yeah, and I guess that plays into it too. It's another way to not lose money. You make some money by keeping the team competitive you're definitely giving scherzer the qualifying offer i know the cba makes everything weird so i guess there may not be a qualifying offer but uh if the cba retains that portion then you would give him the qualifying

offer and you would get some sort of pick for him. So if he left. I almost see him extending in Washington. Yeah, they really like him. He's closing in on 3,000 strikeouts. I mean, you could make the case. You could get a Hall of Famer with your hat on. That's what I was going to say. You could make the case that he's going to wear a Nats cap

into the Hall of Fame. That would be the first. So I don't know. It's a little bit like the Bumgarner thing, but not quite the same because Bumgarner was more obviously not as good anymore. Here's one last thought,

I think, for me on the trade deadline. I don't know if it's the last for us all. There's a rundown. I should follow it. But, what if the Red Sox go all in? Rizzo, Kimbrel, Scherzer, you know, starting pitcher. Scherzer too? Wow. But what if they did that?

I mean, I'd heard from one industry insider that they thought that could happen. It doesn't seem like Heimblum to do something like that. Well, yeah, but we also. It but we also bigger team bigger market team maybe he thinks we've got other prospects coming up if i can do it without giving up you know duran or you know whoever else he wants to protect i don't know i think to make that many moves cassis or downs or some of those top end prospects would have to go. Somebody would have to go, right? I would think so. But what if you could pull it off?

Because there's a fair amount of rentals in there, right? Rizzo's a rental. Scherzer would be a rental. Kimbrel's high priced. I think you could maybe. Maybe the Cubs give him up for less than you expect because he costs money. Yeah. Well, yeah, because four months ago, if someone had said, oh, Craig Kimbrell's going to be someone that a lot of teams

want at the deadline, you would have had pushback on that based on what had happened in the previous two seasons. Volatile season to season. Maybe you just let him go. I bet you could. I think you might be able to get Rizzo a rental starter and Kimbrell

without giving up downs or casses. I think you might be able to do it. Maybe without giving up a top five prospect. But a Scherzer? I don't know. If the best player you give up is Tanner Houck. Once you start talking Scherzer, I don't know. If it's Tanner Houck plus depth, maybe you do it. Because that's

a huge windfall. That'd be a good get for the Nats. If we were going to trade Scherzer, if we were going to trade Scherzer, if we were going to trade Scherzer, I think Tanner Houck fits the bill of big league ready starter who's really interesting. Again, it's a white flag move for the Nationals, but he's a guy that's in the rotation next year.

I think he might need to include the bat too, maybe Cassis or something. I don't know. It's hard to imagine what that trade would really look like. It's really hard with the high name rentals. Nelson Cruz is a great bat, but he's a rental, and he got back two guys who might be relievers. He's a rental DH.

Yeah. He's also a rental DH. He's also 41. Hey, he told Eno and I he takes a lot of naps. That was his big secret. That's his key. There's no secret. That's his key to staying young. Well, hey, look, there's obviously a lot that's going to happen

here in the next week. And we're as excited as anyone to see how it plays out. And like I said, we'll talk about it in greater detail again after it goes down next Saturday. So no Friday episode next week. We're doing some live stuff on Friday afternoon. But Saturday will be the release of the trade deadline recap show, which is one of my favorite shows each and every year. All right, we mentioned this a little bit earlier. The Giants-Dodgers series this week was a big one, pretty wild turn of events, especially in the final game of that series on Thursday night.

Dave Roberts ejected for the second night in a row. Another blown save for Kenley Jansen. Circumstances in this one, though, Dave Roberts was right to be heated. He was right to get tossed from that game. The Dodgers rightfully won the game. There was a very close play at second base. It was a forced play that would have ended the game.

After review was overturned, runner was called safe. That extended the inning. And then Darren Ruff did not hold back on a check swing. Even on appeal, he was still deemed to have not swung the bat. Roberts lost it. Kenley Jansen's meltdown continued. The Dodgers ended up losing 3-0-4 to the Giants.

So I hinted at this a little bit earlier, you guys. I think we all kind of expected the Giants in the second half to softly kind of fall to the third position in the NL West. And our question at the time was more, are they a playoff team or are they going to be the first team out of the playoffs? Like that was sort of where we're at. If they're going to add, if they're going to spend money, if they're willing to keep building on this roster, I think given what's happening with the Dodgers up and down that roster right now, the window for the Giants to actually win the NL West has opened. And I did not expect this to happen, but plenty of reasons to believe in it now.

So how much has your perception of the Giants changed just over the last month or so, Britt? Just over the last couple nights, I feel like it's changed. Just watching those games, it's interesting. I'm with you, Derek. I kind of expected them to fade i think we kind of all did to some extent uh but you know whether they should have won last night's game or two nights ago we can sit here and debate the fact of the matter is they found ways to win

and i can't tell you how many times we've seen these teams who have no business winning games winning those games right like it happened all the time in 19 with the Nationals. It happened back my first year in 2008 with the Tampa Bay Rays. They would literally just like steal wins from the throes of defeat. And that's what this Giants team is doing. Like that play at second base, the check swing. I mean, Dave Proppers has gotten, got thrown out. He's not like a typically boisterous guy, right?

He's not an Ozzie Guillen. He's not like, you know,ous guy, right? He's not Ozzie Guillen. He's not like, you know, he's not going to go out there and argue every second. He got thrown out now in back-to-back games. And I think it shows you a few things. One, that there were a lot of bad calls, but you know, two, that this Giants team is just going to take every break and turn it around. I mean, nobody asked Kenley Jansen to implode after those calls went against them. I think if you're the Giants, you win these kind of games, and you're like, man, we could beat these guys no matter what. We could beat these guys even when we should have lost to these guys.

And there's no real way to quantify that. So to me, this Giants team is playing with confidence. They're playing with a lot of ability, and they're a team that, as we've talked about, is an older team. They're not going to all of a sudden panic in September and and be like oh no we shouldn't be here um they've got a lot of veteran guys and i think that division now to me belongs to the giants or the padres um i see la especially if they don't go out and make these moves um really needing a starting pitcher i see them kind of fighting maybe for that third slot.

Yeah. Giants, a couple of things stand out for me, Buster Posey's leadership. There was this whole thing about Bud Light and Tyler Rogers. So Tyler Rogers blew the third game in the series on a, on a big home run by Will Smith and said, I'm just going to, you know to have a Bud Light after the game and try not to think about it.

And then it was like Bud Light got involved and things got corporate. But the thing that I saw that was pretty cool was when Tyler Rogers stepped to the mound the next night, Buster Posey came out. And I don't know what he said. It probably wasn't nuts and bolts. It was probably just some sort of pat on the ass type of thing, you know, but he, he somehow, you know, he has that kind of leadership and Buster Posey has been, uh, I think he's already a hall of

famer and I think he's a big part of why this team is great. Um, and then the other thing that I think of is just depth, uh, You know, Farhan, when you talk to other executives about Farhan Zaidi, and you talk about, oh, like I was talking to an executive and I said, you know, oh man, Farhan must just have a guy who just works the waiver wire. You know, like just a guy who is like trying to claim players out there, trying to keep one roster sought clean, one 40-man roster sought clean so he can just always just claim people. Because that's what the Giants did for like three years up to this year. And the guy, the exec turned to me and he said, no, that's Farhan. Yeah.

Yeah. I don't know if you guys remember this piece. There was a piece about him. It was a piece about, I think it was the Giants. No, it was the Dodgers front office fantasy football league. Maybe some players were in it. He churns his big league roster the way that a dedicated fantasy player churns a fantasy roster over and over and over again, finding pieces, finding pieces, trying to get better, just out hustling people on the margins, which if you're a small market team, you have to do it. If you're a big market team and you do that and you scout well and you develop

well and you spend money and you're good at trades, which all of those things I think are things that we can start to say are becoming true about the Giants if they weren't previously true, you're in a really good spot to have a lot of success. And I think it's funny that he's doing it himself. It's not a lieutenant. It's not a second of success. And I think it's funny that he's doing it himself. It's not a lieutenant. It's not a second in command or third in command who's actually burning through all those players who are available. Just kind of pushing this toward the trade deadline for a second. From the Giants' perspective, they can trade for almost anything, and it helps them because so many of their guys move around, right? I mean, a healthy Brandon

Crawford only plays shortstop. But you look at guys like Wilmer Flores and Lamont Wade and Donovan Solano, some of the guys in the infield right now, they play all over. If you trade for a corner outfielder and you play one of whoever's playing worse, Dickerson or Mikey Stremski less, okay, you made your offense better. You can get away with that. If you added a center fielder and you wanted to play Duggar a little bit in right field instead of center, that would work too. There's so much flexibility because the team is not so established

that you can basically go do whatever makes sense and have it make your team actually stand out more. And they foment that. I mean, the minor leagues, everybody has to play multiple positions, um, you know, coming up, that's an edict from the front office. And then you just, you see that the players he acquires, even a guy like Tommy La Stella, or I mean, Donovan Solano, these guys, like, you know, they may not be so amazing that they will lock down one position, but they are good enough to play wherever every night. And I thought a bit about a little bit in the ninth inning last night when the Dodgers were up, usually the Dodgers have that, right? Usually the Dodgers had that

same idea going where you're like, wow, how'd they get this guy? And how do they turn Max Muncy into it? You know, how do they do that? And why is it like every time it's the bottom of the ninth, like three good batters are coming up? Well, I don't think that was necessarily true last night. They didn't put together super competitive at bats in the ninth inning, at least.

And that was something that I thought about during the series for the Giants was just like, wow, every inning there's at least one or two good hitters that come up. I think some of the other flaws for the Dodgers right now, I mean, Cody Bellinger's first half injuries and his overall struggles this year are a surprise. Mookie Betts hasn't been himself. Clayton Kershaw is on the IL. He has started playing catch. There are some key pieces that are either not doing what we expected.

We can say the same of the Giants. Longo's hurt. Crawford's hurt. Belt's hurt. Sure. I'm not saying the Giants have avoided that, but the step down from the Giants starters to their backups is smaller because the ceilings are not as high for those players the dodgers have the guys the dodgers have had underperforming right are supposed

to be like mvp caliber players you know not necessarily like two and three war sort of guys but like seven plus war guys and i think that's a huge part of of why this division's been so close and so entertaining yeah bellinger's is surprisingly related all the way back to that shoulder injury he had a an ongoing shoulder injury that like sort of really uh became a problem when he did that celebration move uh and popped his shoulder out in the in the world series um and that didn't allow him in the off season to bulk up so he's at the skinniest he's ever been. And I think that's a bit of a problem for him. Already a skinny person. And that might be part of why the power hasn't been there for him this year. I still think he'll bounce back, but it may not be until next year.

Yeah. And then you can't rely on them having Trevor Bauer back at any point this season either. So to me, there's just been a lot. The Dodgers have been hit with a lot of key guys. You guys are missing. And they just haven't been able to fill in and have these depth guys step up like it seems like they have in prior years. Where you're like, who even is this guy? All of a sudden, he's inserted in the Dodgers lineup and he's great.

Really haven't seen that at all this year. And I think people forget like Dustin May. These are guys that they missed, that they relied on, that they counted on. Their starting rotation has really taken a lot of hit. I don't know what other team could survive the kind

of depth issues that they've had. What do you guys do about Jansen? I think the timing for this is very fortunate for the Dodgers because they can do something about it. They can be players for some of those relievers we mentioned earlier. They can go out and get any one of those guys if they want to. If they want it to be Kimbrell, they can afford Kimbrell.

If they want it to be Rodgers because they want another lefty they can throw out there, it could be Rodgers. I think they have to add something. I think making that final call really hinges on who that someone is. If they're the team that gets Richard Rodriguez, it's a little harder to finally push Kenley Jansen out of that role for a guy who's only held that role for like a year. But you're the Dodgers.

You can't afford to dink around anymore. You don't have the luxury of just coasting to the division title. So you can't lean on the past success that you've had in that late inning role for Jansen and just say, well, he usually works it out and it's going to be fine. Like this is probably the last straw. The walk rate's way up.

The K rate is down. I think for all the times we have wondered, is this the end for Kenley Jansen? This is the end of him as a dominant late inning arm. We just saw it. Like he was pitching over his skis up until recently. And now we're at the point where he's probably more of a 6th or 7th inning guy

than the guy that you want in the highest leveraged spots to finish out a game, which is really disappointing. We've been here. We've had this conversation. It seems like on and off for what? And he's risen from the dead before, is all I'm saying. He's like the Undertaker. He's got nine lives.

I think he's gotten away from his bread and butter. Uh, you can see it last night. There was a lot of four seamers and he can't command the four seam and he throws it harder. So you're wow. Like Jansen went to 96 on that strikeout.

Yeah. But it was like way outside the zone and it was a sinker. Why is he throwing sinkers? What is going on? And so I, I think he's kind of lost, uh, you know,

throwing all these four-seamers, the sinkers, losing the command of them, throwing really hard but not having command. And I understand why he's doing it, because if it's just the cutter and it's just 91-92, then maybe he's more hittable than he's been in the past. So he's trying to find some way out. And I feel really badly for him. But I don't have an answer for you, actually. I don't have an answer for you, because. I don't have an answer for you because I think he's a foundational part of your team. I think your team might actually be mad if you took him out of the role.

I think the team probably supports him. I doubt there's many people on that team who are like, oh, we got to take Kenley Jansen out of this closer role. I think they're mostly saying, like, attaboy, get him back in there. He'll be fine. Like, he's our boy Kenley.

Don't you think? I think that's probably how the sentiment, attaboy, get him back in there. He'll be fine. Like, he's our boy Kenley. Don't you think? I think that's probably how the sentiment in the clubhouse is right now. I think what you could do, get the help, get someone that you trust in that role if he continues to falter, see how August goes,

and be ready to make that move. Right. In the middle of blowing a save, you have another guy that you can bring out? Don't push this all the way into September. Don't let this be a question that's hanging over your heads if you do make it to the postseason. And, you know, if in October we're talking about playoff shows.

It's like they want a World Series with who's their closer. Try to get away from that as best you can before you get to that part of the year. And by doing something about it now, you put yourself in a much better position because you've added resources. You've added options that you feel better about. That's some of the young guys.

A lot of the guys in that bullpen are either injured guys that they got from other clubs or they're very inexperienced guys that they don't necessarily, maybe they don't want to put those guys in the highest leverage spots yet for one reason or another. But clearly a team that will be active at the deadline and has more needs to fill than we ever would have expected back when the season started. I would say comparable to Atlanta in terms of the players lost. And I think the difference is Atlanta's depth has never really been quite at the same level as the Dodgers, right? It's a big part of why the Dodgers are still hanging around a little closer to where they need to be compared to where Atlanta's preseason expectations were.

We had a big announcement on Friday. I want to get to this. Say hello to the Cleveland Guardians, if you're watching on YouTube. Look at that. Look at that logo. What's the first thing you think of when you see that new Cleveland Guardians logo, Britt?

Well, you've kind of ruined it for me already, Derek, by saying it was the 1990s Angels, and now that's all I see. I'm sorry. That's pretty much what it looks like. It's a little bit more blocky. I guess. I'm not crazy about the font on the G.

How about you guys? I'm a big font gal. I'm not super crazy about that. I think it's supposed to... So the Guardians are these Art Deo sculptures that are on the bridge. So I think it's supposed to be kind of an art deco-y font. Oh, like the guardians of, I get what it's about, right? The guardians of transportation.

Like literally people were talking about the guardians of traffic. I hope that's a colloquial thing. There's got to be a fancier name for them somewhere. Yeah, I guess I have. We named our team after the guardians of traffic. It does got to be a fancier name for them somewhere. Yeah. I guess I have a... We named our team after the Guardians of Traffic. It does seem to me like a money thing a little bit. Guardians and Indians are similar. They don't probably have to spend as much money

changing over the G and the C. Like, that's a very easy thing. You know, I don't know. Also, I think they probably brought in... They always bring in consulting firms, right? So the consulting firms say, well, you know, we polled some people and some people really hate spiders and are really afraid of spiders. We can't do that. And then we asked some people what Cleveland Rocks meant and they didn't get it.

They didn't know if it meant rocks or music. I personally like the music angle. Oh, yeah. I agree. I like the spiders a little bit, but there's some nefarious history with the spiders, too. And I thought they should lean

into the music thing. They have the Rock and Roll Music Hall of Fame there. You could have a whole season where only Rock and Roll Music Hall of Famers threw out first pitches. Yeah. They're pretty throughout first pitches. Yeah.

They were pretty sick, actually. Yeah. And I think the cool thing... You could have a ton of postseason concerts and just lean into the whole music angle. Yeah. Yeah. This is what we...

I think this was our favorite idea, I think, when we first knew they were going to make a change. I think what's surprising to me is that we had a bracket on The Athletic for fans to vote in, for readers and subscribers to vote in and guardians won it won the whole thing it won over the commodores in the finals with like a 56 43

edge and the cleveland commodores at least you have the alliteration there right two points in categories always nice to get that but does the most boringest thing always win because those are the two most boring. I agree with you. If Rocks was confusing, they could have been the Rockets. There's no Rockets in baseball. Could have been the Cleveland Rockets. Rockers. Rockers.

Here were the options in the bracket. Here we go. Top to bottom. It was Spiders and Comets, Rocks, Red Tails, Rockers, Clash, Guardians and Greys, Blue Sox and Blues, Baseball

Club and Captains, Walleye and Buckeyes. The Buckeyes, I mean, with Ohio State, you just couldn't do it. And then the Cuyahogas and the Commodores. The Cuyahogas does not roll off the tongue at all. It the Cuyahogas and the Commodores. That's the county. The Cuyahogas does not roll off the tongue at all. No, but it's Cuyahoga County is the... All right.

Yeah, you might be familiar with Cuyahoga Falls from the movie Tommy Boy. Yep. Yeah. Walleye. Yeah. I don't know. I still like the rocks-based ones.

I like rocks. I think leaning in... Okay, I am not from Cleveland. I am not from Ohio. So maybe I'm the wrong person to put this out there. But like Edo, the first thing I think of when I think of Cleveland is the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. That is the cultural aspect of Cleveland that pops into my head. I do not think of the Guardians of Traffic.

But maybe if I lived in Cleveland, I would think of the Guardians of Traffic. Also, I don't know. Maybe LA needs a Guardian of Traffic. I don't know why it's a big Cleveland thing all of a sudden. They need an angry god of traffic to smite them down. I think this mostly boiled down to what doesn't offend everyone and then also what is similar to the original name so that they can keep it money-wise.

It's very easy to change things over. No one's offended by Guardians, which is obviously obviously key it's always good when you can change you kind of want to keep the color scheme right yeah that's really deeply embedded you know you also want when you look out you want to see old hats next to new hats and not have it like you wouldn't want to completely change color schemes or something that'd be weird then you'd have like weird red and green or whatever it is. So like, yeah.

So I kind of get, I think it was just the path of least resistance, right? Like you knew that it had to go. That's the, that's the, that's what I get. Yeah.

I mean, clearly it was long overdue, a name that needed to be changed. I think we were all just hoping for something a little more exciting in the final selection. It could be worse. There are absolutely worse names. But exciting is not what people do with teams. Like, if you

think about it, 80% of the league is red and blue. Yeah. Yeah, a lot of teams are birds for mascots. Are birds really that exciting? No. My question, I guess, is what's their secondary nickname? You know, like the Orioles are also the birds. The Nationals are the Nats.

Are they going to be the Guards? The Gs? What? Probably the Guards. The Guards? Yeah. The Guards. I think it's the Guards.

That's all right. At least it's not basketball. We'd be like, do they have any centers? I think you should run this by your kids, you know? See what they think of it. See if they think it's cool. Because that's all that matters. I did run it by them.

They didn't ask me what a stolen base was. I'm lagging. I'm lagging, I guess. Eno's dogs are fans. We somehow got into fantasy. We got into fantasy, and so I had to explain them fantasy baseball, which is not the first time I've ever explained them fantasy baseball,

thank you very much, but it was the first time maybe they were listening. Shut up. Eno's dogs are listening. They're letting us know the Guardians is just not their favorite. No, they are not happy about it. Aspiring good boys upstairs, not happy about the name, but it's not. Not quite yet good boys.

Yeah, soon to be good boys. With enough treats, they can get there. If you want to read more about that name change and all of the things that went into that, you can check out the stories on The Athletic. Check out all the great reporting that Brit is doing, all the great writing that Eno is doing, all the fantasy football stuff that's going out with the draft kit, all that for one low price.

Oh, new ranks. That's right. New ranks. Three 99 a month is the price at the athletic.com slash rates and barrels. As always, you can drop us a line via email rates and barrels at the athletic.com. You can also tweet at us.

She's at Brit underscore Jiroli. He's at, you know, Sarah's Irels at theathletic.com. You can also tweet at us. She's at Britt underscore Giroli. He's at Eno Saris. I am at Derek Van Ryper. That is going to wrap things up for this episode of Rates and Barrels. We are back with you on Wednesday. Thanks for listening..